[0:09] is

[0:19] [Applause]

[0:24] [Music]

[0:28] Sy

[0:57] I'd like to call the ordance conected

[0:58] city council committee meeting for

[1:00] Monday December 18th 2023 and the first

[1:03] committee is Public Safety Mr Willams

[1:05] I'd like to call order to the Public

[1:06] Safety Committee we have one item on the

[1:08] agenda tonight and that is a

[1:09] presentation for brink uh Jerome as a

[1:12] first

[1:23] responder very much uh good evening uh

[1:27] city council uh mayor and happy holidays

[1:31] to everybody um thank you for having us

[1:33] tonight I'm going to hand out a uh take

[1:36] one pass it around a handout um I just

[1:39] want to introduce um members of the

[1:41] company Brink that are here tonight with

[1:43] us the the reason that we're before you

[1:45] is that we'd like to enter into a

[1:47] contract with Brink and they they're

[1:49] bringing a platform of technology to our

[1:51] disposal some which is tactical which we

[1:54] would like to implement right away

[1:55] others which is more strategic and we'd

[1:58] like to implement that over the next

[1:59] years year the um the Drone as a first

[2:02] responder is a is a is a concept that um

[2:05] we've looked at for a while and we'd

[2:07] like to implement it a lot of the

[2:09] reasons for this is that I've heard what

[2:11] each and every one of you has said

[2:13] specifically Mr mud and response times I

[2:16] know are very important to you and

[2:18] they're important to the city council in

[2:20] addition to um having the ability to

[2:23] deescalate situations uh in a better

[2:27] capacity without having to go handson uh

[2:29] and then providing officer safety which

[2:31] is important to all of us so these are

[2:33] some of the reasons why um we started

[2:35] looking at this concept and I thought it

[2:37] was important to bring um the the

[2:39] experts here to speak to you have a

[2:41] brief presentation for uh to for Don

[2:45] Redmond who's a friend of mine he's a

[2:47] retired captain from schul Vista Police

[2:49] Department he'll do the presentation his

[2:51] colleague uh David flowers is here also

[2:54] um to answer any questions that you may

[2:56] have so without any further I'll pass B

[2:58] to take it over thank you very much I

[3:00] guess I'll stand here thank you very

[3:02] much for having us um as chiefer said

[3:04] Don Rond retired 10 months ago I wasent

[3:07] 26 years at the J dist Police Department

[3:09] which is in San Diego California down

[3:12] Southern California um it came to Brink

[3:14] really with the idea is Brink is a

[3:17] public safety specific Drum company we

[3:19] just build drums for Public Safety so

[3:21] came here to build out a solution um

[3:24] specifically called drum as a first

[3:26] responder and I'm going to give you a

[3:28] presentation on that so what as a first

[3:30] responder is for those of you don't know

[3:31] JIS the police department is the first

[3:33] in the world to start launching drones

[3:35] in October 2018 from the rooftop of

[3:38] their Police Department so in October of

[3:39] 2018 we launched our first drone off the

[3:41] rooftop of the police department to

[3:43] respond to emergencies not just to to

[3:45] patrol or anything only for calls for

[3:47] service for emergencies um over the next

[3:51] 5 years the programs been in in

[3:53] existence now for 5 years uh we expanded

[3:55] the program to four launch locations in

[3:57] Citywide coverage um about 30 times a day flying um to calls for

[4:02] service and I'll give you some um some

[4:04] examples of that the whole whole idea

[4:07] was we wanted to reimagine how we

[4:09] respond to poer service we heard the

[4:11] national message that then police

[4:13] departments need to do different things

[4:15] differently and so this was one of the

[4:17] steps that we took um just just so um

[4:19] you know is the first but right now

[4:22] there's probably

[4:24] 40 um police departments within the the

[4:27] country that have either began their dfr

[4:29] progr or in the early stages of it but I

[4:31] would say only about eight 8 to 10 um

[4:34] departments have what is really the kind

[4:37] of the the model that chista has so with

[4:40] that um just understanding why dfr was

[4:43] important um police uh helicopter have

[4:46] been around for for many many years um

[4:48] and they're very beneficial for for

[4:50] police departments we um I don't think

[4:53] there's a police chief in the nation who if we had the opportunity to have a

[4:57] police helicopter they would say sure we

[4:59] would love to have them because of the

[5:00] idea that it gives you firsthand

[5:02] experience has a a trained Observer

[5:04] who's relaying information back to to

[5:06] ground units they're they're able to do

[5:08] this um safely but what is the challenge

[5:11] with the police helicopter it's cost

[5:13] it's huge it's interesting um they just

[5:15] did an audit from for Los Angeles Police

[5:17] Department I thought I'd throw this in

[5:18] here that they they said $3,000 an hour

[5:20] for their police helicopter program it's

[5:23] very expensive um but can we use do

[5:26] something differently and this is where

[5:27] we we come in with utilizing

[5:30] so with drones um probably I I would the

[5:33] dawn Redmond estimate I would say

[5:34] probably 85 to 90% of police agencies in

[5:37] the country have a drone program of some

[5:39] sort um and but the tripical typical use

[5:42] is um they put a drone in a police car

[5:44] in the trunk of a car um an officer is is certified to fly the ground call

[5:49] for service comes out maybe it's a

[5:50] burglary alarm at 2:00 in the morning at

[5:52] a business they get there this the

[5:54] business is secured um but they want to

[5:56] launch the Drone to check the rooftop to

[5:57] make sure that the person didn't make

[5:59] entry in in into the rooftop or maybe it

[6:01] was a foot pursuit now there's a

[6:02] perimeter set up can we launch the Drone

[6:04] for for safely to do that also indoor

[6:07] operations now we're able to fly a drone

[6:09] indoors and and communicate with people

[6:12] indoors for a safer um resolution that's

[6:15] the challenges with that though the

[6:17] police officer is flying the Drone so it

[6:19] really takes that officer off the

[6:20] streets because they're they're not

[6:22] flying to drones so this is um a case

[6:24] stud this is kind of what TR list is

[6:26] doing hopefully

[6:28] it

[6:33] everybody wants deescalation it's not

[6:35] just a buzzword anymore it's become a

[6:38] part of our everyday vocabulary

[6:40] everybody wants it to be safer everybody

[6:42] wants everybody to survive and Live

[6:45] Another Day our drone as a first

[6:47] responder program is in my opinion the

[6:49] number one tool for deescalation that we

[6:51] have so for our party1 calls for service

[6:54] from the moment we receive the 911 call

[6:57] to the moment the Drone is overhead is

[6:59] about 2 and A2 minutes as the officers

[7:01] are responding to this call the drone's

[7:03] already been overhead for about 3

[7:04] minutes and the to operator has been

[7:07] relaying information to the responding

[7:09] officers in real time having a tool that

[7:13] gives us the ability to get to the scene

[7:17] as quickly as possible is critical

[7:20] because when you are able to provide

[7:21] your officers with realtime information

[7:24] they can make better informed decisions

[7:27] there's no other source of information

[7:29] you can give me that would be better

[7:30] than a live video feed on what you're

[7:32] about to walk into so in terms of

[7:34] deescalation it gives us a couple of

[7:36] extra moments to look at a situation and

[7:38] find out are they armed are they not

[7:40] armed do they need our help do they not

[7:43] and that's invaluable when that officer

[7:45] makes their final turn onto that call

[7:47] for service they have every bit of

[7:49] information that they need to be

[7:51] successful and resolve that situation in

[7:53] a calm and safe matter the last thing we

[7:57] want to have to do is use any level of

[8:00] Force if we can deescalate and we can

[8:03] use these drones to give our officers

[8:05] better information it just makes no

[8:07] sense not to use

[8:09] it so um so CH Vista one of the first

[8:13] things that we did at CH Vista and this

[8:15] what we're nimi at at Brink is doing a a

[8:18] transparency portal so if you go on the

[8:19] tra website um the police department

[8:22] website there's a dashboard that's

[8:23] updated every single day of the flights

[8:25] um that they I just uploaded this a

[8:28] couple of days ago they at um they're

[8:30] getting close to 18,000 flights U with

[8:32] their dfr program there's nobody in the

[8:33] world that flies Dr going to this and

[8:36] the interesting thing about this the

[8:38] this um the data that we're getting that

[8:40] we found is that almost 25% of the time

[8:43] when we launch the Drone we don't have

[8:45] to send ground units we have um the

[8:47] Drone is able to clear those calls for

[8:49] service so unfortunately for Chula Vista

[8:51] just give you an example we have um

[8:53] we're authorized 281 officers we can't

[8:56] very difficult to get past 250 so we're

[8:58] down 30 officers red um so using dfr as

[9:02] a force multiplier to clear out calls

[9:05] for service and I'll give you an example

[9:07] of this is um we had a 7-Eleven clerk

[9:09] called in said hey um I've got two it

[9:12] calls 911 says I've got two customers

[9:14] fist fting in a parking lot you send officers and unfortunately we

[9:18] didn't have any officers available the

[9:20] Drone launch gets overhead within a

[9:22] couple of minutes the Drone pilot says

[9:23] he looks he doesn't see anything he has

[9:26] the the clerk's phone number via CAD Wes

[9:29] up the phone calls and says J Police

[9:30] Department I'm an asent artisty I'm a

[9:32] drone pilot overhead um where's the

[9:34] fight and he relays the information that

[9:37] the the clerk comes out with cell phone

[9:39] looks waves to the Drone and he goes oh

[9:41] they just left he goes okay do you need

[9:43] our assistance he's like no thank you

[9:45] very much you know I appreciate you

[9:46] getting here so quickly and wasted the

[9:48] Drone and off we went so within a couple

[9:50] minutes we had that that that customer

[9:52] service that we were able to get there

[9:53] as opposed to maybe an hour later we

[9:55] would have driven by and not given them

[9:57] the service that they want um you know

[9:59] road hazards traffic um issues we're

[10:01] able to get the Drone out there

[10:03] immediately to evaluate our priorities

[10:05] on there and then to still provide that

[10:07] customer service with with our drone

[10:10] program and the important thing is to

[10:12] note that through the through the data

[10:14] we we've seen that the Drone gets there

[10:16] in half the time than the patrol

[10:17] officers um there the ground officers

[10:20] the officers um from the moment that we

[10:22] hit um launch it takes about 97 seconds

[10:25] for it to be on scene um which is is

[10:27] very quick um and in that um the

[10:30] fortunate thing is and this is a case

[10:31] study I don't know if you if you want to

[10:33] watch this it's about um 3 minutes long

[10:35] it's a a domestic violence there be some

[10:38] interest in seeing it yes okay let me

[10:40] cck on it make sure it

[10:43] works see if it

[10:58] works

[11:03] so this was just a couple of months

[11:05] after we implemented our drone program

[11:06] and and what you'll see a common them

[11:09] through some of these case studies is we

[11:11] just

[11:14] didn't I want to report domestic

[11:16] violence and are you involved or are you

[11:17] witnessing this no okay what what

[11:19] exactly is

[11:21] happening um a male in a female and

[11:23] wanted the motorcycle and they just I

[11:26] don't know they're just going to hit

[11:29] other with a car or something I don't

[11:30] know you said trying to hit each other

[11:32] with a car yeah get with the motorcycle

[11:36] just

[11:41] s white

[11:48] sedan so

[11:51] we1

[11:57] on the white vehicle

[12:00] continuing so little backstory U

[12:03] boyfriend girlfriend girlfriend's in the

[12:04] car the boyfriend's on a stolen

[12:06] motorcycle she's upset he's

[12:10] Ryle she actually chases him through the

[12:12] city this point they go

[12:16] [Music]

[12:19] around s is pursuing

[12:21] motorcycle

[12:27] break right uh we need a un looks like

[12:30] the sedan is trying to Ram the motorcycl

[12:32] to pull in behind the

[12:42] business conf the

[12:45] alley in alley Street in a 415 31 can

[12:50] you start for the

[12:53] zo be white Hyundai alantra

[12:56] four like

[13:00] call so we didn't have no idea they had

[13:05] left

[13:07] Alleyway South alley 54 still

[13:12] 415

[13:17] 1

[13:19] [Music]

[13:21] mcycle he is away from the

[13:27] bike

[13:31] she warns him not to get on the

[13:33] motorcycle he doesn't listen

[13:35] motorcyclist is back just R so

[13:43] we arrested them um we arrested both of

[13:47] them for um her for the domestic

[13:50] violence him for the stolen motorcycle

[13:52] what was interesting is the district

[13:53] attorney said that had he not had that

[13:55] drone video he would never have issued

[13:56] this case and when he did Issue the case

[13:59] both both of them played guilty didn't

[14:01] go to trial because they had the video

[14:02] it's hard for them to argue otherwise

[14:04] our district attorney loves having e Dr

[14:06] videos it really assist stem and

[14:08] prosecution other thing um for CH Vista

[14:12] understanding that in 2018 is where we

[14:14] started um we um try our our mandate at

[14:18] CH is to try to get you our Priority One

[14:20] responses within six minutes and our

[14:21] priority two within 12 minutes we

[14:23] weren't making it but over the years

[14:25] that we've implemented dfr we've um we

[14:28] dropped our response times we've

[14:30] improved them quite a bit um and really

[14:33] for the first time we've been able to

[14:35] meet our response times I haven't I

[14:37] haven't seen what 2023 is out yet uh

[14:39] this is for the last time so very very

[14:41] important on response times this one's a

[14:43] real short one another minute or so I

[14:47] want to be very respectful of your time

[14:49] um so this is an interesting call

[14:50] there's no there's no audio on this but

[14:52] it's a m only one call that comes into

[14:53] our Bayside I one call says hey there's

[14:55] a red vehicle parked in our parking lot

[14:58] in this parking lot lot and there's

[14:59] three subjects in there and are passing

[15:00] around a handgun inside this this

[15:02] vehicle this parking lot there's one way

[15:04] in one way out so the officers are able

[15:07] to watch this video on their in their

[15:09] police cars either via their NPCs or

[15:12] their cell phones so they don't make

[15:13] entry they let the Drone do its thing

[15:15] fortunately and in this day it's only

[15:18] one red vehicle in the parking lot so

[15:20] he's able to to zoom in he he Zooms in

[15:23] on the license plate gets the license

[15:25] plate and when he zooms out this is what

[15:27] he sees

[15:33] that's kind of an uh oh Factor right and

[15:35] now you can imagine your police police

[15:37] department your police officers rolling

[15:39] through the parking lot and seeing this

[15:41] we can imagine what a national tragedy

[15:43] would happen right under these types

[15:44] this type of a situation but fortunately

[15:47] we had our drone overhead the officers

[15:49] um could see what is happening in real

[15:51] time and so it was great now instead of

[15:54] the two officers maybe just driving

[15:55] through this parking lot and just kind

[15:57] of stumbling upon this vehic vehicle and

[15:59] this this female with the handgun they

[16:01] come in with a game plan they come in in

[16:03] force they know who's who's going to be

[16:05] the primary officer who's going to be

[16:06] the secondary officer who's going to

[16:08] have best people where's the canine

[16:10] going to be who's going to block the

[16:11] exits they know ahead of time what's

[16:13] going to happen and they take control of

[16:15] the situation to try and um resolve it

[16:21] peacefully so I always say it's a it's a

[16:23] great hot stop if you see all the hands

[16:25] coming out at the same time so it's you

[16:27] know you know they're they're following

[16:29] directions there's no doubt

[16:32] [Music]

[16:48] there so they take everybody out

[16:50] peacefully they search the vehicle and

[16:53] what do they find they find this

[16:56] handgun which is actually an Soft pistol

[17:00] so it's not a real gun she's 17 if you

[17:03] can imagine your officers getting into

[17:05] an an officer involves shooting on this

[17:07] situation how tragic that would be any

[17:09] shooting is a tragedy right but under

[17:11] this that way this was this was

[17:13] addressed peacefully so um this is the

[17:17] last one if you want to see this one you

[17:20] know it's it's up to you um this this is

[17:22] another one where this this subject it

[17:24] was a 91 qu he's waving around a handgun

[17:27] and it happens to be a lighter um if you

[17:29] want me to stop shirt

[17:41] [Music]

[17:57] okay

[17:59] [Music]

[18:01] the 911 call he overhead with a

[18:04] drum one and 12

[18:07] minutes

[18:11] seconds the subject sitting

[18:16] there so he's got this gun in his hand

[18:20] right and we actually have multiple

[18:21] calls what's also interesting is since

[18:23] the officers can see this also they see

[18:27] he's sitting on the bench and facing

[18:29] southbound so the offic know how to

[18:31] approach from the south so they have

[18:33] actually approached from behind him and

[18:34] they're actually parted in a in the

[18:36] business right behind him he doesn't

[18:38] know that they're there but they're

[18:39] watching this right they don't want to engage with him they

[18:42] don't want to have any have to use any

[18:43] force or anything he's not it's not an

[18:45] active shooter he's not threatening

[18:47] anybody even though we're getting

[18:48] multiple calls on this so they're just

[18:50] watching

[18:51] this you see him actually grab it and he

[18:54] kind of puts his hands up and says you

[18:55] know don't want any any any trouble here

[19:00] so when you see the true value of dfr

[19:03] and drone drone as the first responder

[19:05] here is what does he do here he just lit

[19:08] his cigarette with that gun right so now

[19:11] we're fairly confident that this this

[19:14] gun is a lighter and not a something

[19:17] else the officers make their approach

[19:19] there's no no guns drawn no forces used

[19:22] they take him into custody he had some

[19:24] on him and he he was arrested so pretty straightforward on that so where

[19:30] we're looking for applications is um at

[19:34] Brink we really want to bring drums

[19:36] first responder to to connected to

[19:40] really on a number of different things

[19:41] so when I say we we launch and I I talk

[19:44] in the Wii at youis we launch for all

[19:47] calls for service what we feel that the

[19:49] drums is is of value to the First

[19:51] Responders so you saw the domestic

[19:54] violence but we get those suspicious

[19:55] persons you know the person you get the

[19:57] 91 call hey somebody's acting crazy on

[20:00] the corner there he's yelling at at cars

[20:02] driving by and we know what could happen

[20:04] the officers arrive they contact him

[20:06] maybe it escalates with the Drone we get

[20:08] overhead we see no crime is occurring

[20:11] he's not a danger to himself or others

[20:13] we don't have to even make contact right

[20:15] so it's not illegal to yell at cars

[20:17] those type of things so when you talk

[20:18] about deescalation what's the best

[20:20] deescalation tool when officers don't

[20:22] even need to contact the person traffic

[20:25] collisions we'll get overhead let our

[20:26] fire department also see the video when

[20:28] they're responding if you're trapped in

[20:30] a vehicle that's and the vehicle's

[20:32] leaking fuel you want the fire

[20:33] department to know that it's leaking

[20:34] Fuel and to hurry up and get there and

[20:36] have a game plan on there house fires

[20:38] we'll turn on the thermal camera um so

[20:40] the fire department can see where the

[20:41] hot spot is if your house is on fire you

[20:43] want the fire department to know

[20:44] immediately where they need to put the

[20:45] water on put

[20:47] your house out the fire out search and

[20:50] rescue missing kids um anybody who's you

[20:54] know that that type of thing will will

[20:56] do that also medical delivery we're um

[20:58] our payload that we're developing will

[21:00] be able to deliver aeds um Naran EpiPen

[21:04] you know maybe a flotation device I

[21:06] don't know how many Swift water rescues

[21:07] you do here in the in the in the area be able to to deliver a Halo on that

[21:13] where I really want to finish off is

[21:15] when we talk about dfr is it's not just

[21:18] for those high high dangerous situations

[21:21] this was an example of we get a 911 call

[21:23] of um the middle of the day of some kids

[21:26] gang members is what the call came out

[21:28] um and they were graffiting this

[21:30] Alleyway so what they were doing is they

[21:32] were putting their these stickers all

[21:33] down this Alleyway and they were

[21:34] graffiting them they were putting their

[21:36] gang monitors on there drone gets

[21:38] launched common thing here we didn't

[21:40] have any ground units available the

[21:42] Drone P gets overhead he actually sees

[21:43] them doing it um they're not stopping so

[21:46] he actually lowers the Drone down to

[21:48] about 100 feet so these kids can see the

[21:50] Drone that there's actually they're

[21:51] being watched the kids see the Drone

[21:54] they give a hand signal that they're

[21:55] number one right you know and and they

[21:58] continue doing what they're doing um and

[22:00] then they kind of realize that it's

[22:02] probably the police strugle and they all

[22:04] start fting well kids being kids what do

[22:05] they do they run together and so the

[22:07] Drone follows them they actually get

[22:10] tired they sat down right here and they

[22:12] waited for the police department to show

[22:13] up and arrest them so where we show the

[22:15] value is is we recognize that graffiti

[22:18] in the community is a high priority

[22:20] right graffiti and vandalism hity is

[22:23] very difficult for law enforcement with

[22:25] all the other um culer service that they

[22:27] had have have to handle this was a

[22:29] perfect example of why dfr was very

[22:31] beneficial at at that moment and so with

[22:35] our solution we could build out a

[22:37] transparency um dashboard for your

[22:39] community one of the biggest things I'll

[22:41] leave you with is this is the the flight

[22:43] Telemetry um in my three years of

[22:45] managing our dfr program um I had two

[22:48] complaints um both of them were similar

[22:50] a woman called me and she said hey why

[22:52] was your drone over my backyard watching

[22:53] me yesterday I said well I don't know

[22:55] where you live um can you log on to Tris

[22:57] do you have a computer she said yes I

[22:59] said log on to julus website she does

[23:01] I'm I'm kind of going through click here and I said you know this

[23:06] wasn't that one I said what time she

[23:07] said 2:00 and I said well at 1:50 we

[23:09] were in your area because it was a Solen

[23:12] vehicle the person bailed out and we

[23:13] were looking for this person in

[23:14] backyards who was running she's like oh

[23:16] is that why the police officers were in

[23:18] my neighborhood I'm like yeah and she

[23:20] could see why we were there her

[23:22] temperature immediately went down she

[23:23] understood why we were there and it

[23:25] changed her whole perception of why we

[23:27] were doing so with that um I'm happy to

[23:30] answer any questions that you might have

[23:32] um about the program thank you so much

[23:34] for that um presentation any questions

[23:36] or comments from Council

[23:39] [Music]

[23:40] Members M yeah so this is really for the

[23:44] CH so how would this impact response

[23:47] time for for offices

[23:51] locally well we're looking to implement

[23:53] it um you know once it's up and running

[23:55] we're we're we're going to have to have

[23:57] internal ation about what calls we're

[23:59] going to be sending it to but um when

[24:02] fully deployed I think it's going to

[24:04] increase our response time

[24:06] significantly um as Don mentioned we're

[24:09] going to be able to get technology above

[24:11] a situation start collecting video

[24:13] evidence right away it's going to help

[24:16] with solving crimes Prosecuting crimes

[24:18] holding people accountable um and and

[24:21] we're going to consider the Drone being

[24:23] there um a response time because because

[24:26] we are responding it even though

[24:28] remotely we can then better communicate

[24:30] with the officers on the scene you know

[24:32] whether they get there sooner or whether

[24:33] they have to go at all so you know I see

[24:36] you know it's not going to be on day one

[24:38] we improve our response but I see very

[24:41] quick a very once deploy very rapidly

[24:43] our response times improving I don't

[24:46] think it's going to take us five years

[24:48] to see the Improvement that true Lista

[24:49] did I think they did the hard work for

[24:54] us

[24:56] chair thank you may uh I have a few

[25:00] questions so uh out of the 40 uh

[25:03] Countrywide um weather is is our

[25:05] Northeast weather a deterrent in using

[25:08] these drones efficiently so the drones

[25:11] can be launched in in inclement weather

[25:14] the challenge right now is with the FAA

[25:16] because um you have to have visual

[25:18] Observer um meaning you have to be able

[25:20] to see the airspace a mile around the

[25:22] Drone so if you have a thick Cloud layer

[25:25] that you don't have clear unobstructed

[25:26] views it it it limits your your flight

[25:29] time so whether is it really a concern

[25:32] for us right now do you anticipate as an

[25:35] industry ho for the FAA to um really in

[25:38] the next 12 to 18 months figure out a

[25:40] clear path that we can no longer use

[25:43] visual observers on that and we would

[25:45] work with the police department to

[25:46] implement that ni uh my second question

[25:49] would be um I think you answered it um

[25:51] whether it detour crime once people know

[25:53] that we're using that obviously we saw

[25:55] that with the with the taggers there if

[25:58] I could use one just one little um story

[26:00] uh U Santa Monica minut our drum program

[26:04] and there's some graffi on an Alleyway

[26:06] and they took a picture and it said um

[26:08] look up the police department has drones

[26:11] right you know it was like the word get

[26:13] once the word gets out it

[26:15] it's um this might go for chief so uh

[26:18] the Drone gets released um obviously the

[26:21] dispatcher the Drone sees there's

[26:22] nothing going on but still us here um in

[26:25] the neighborhood are concerned would you

[26:27] find follow up um anyway absolutely I

[26:31] mean I I I would say that it's there's a

[26:34] twofold response is that we would be

[26:36] there collecting that evidence we would

[26:38] properly communicate with the

[26:39] complaintant person calling whether the

[26:42] Drone response is sufficient speaking us

[26:44] over the phone or whether they would

[26:45] still want to see an officer setting

[26:47] that expectation it might be a lot

[26:49] before we get there and my last question

[26:52] so um if we know of um areas um where

[26:56] there's been uh gunfire and things would

[26:59] we fly drones uh at random kind of in

[27:03] that area like U maybe

[27:06] nighttime establishments or things where

[27:08] there's been previous problems or would

[27:10] we wait for a 911 call before we

[27:12] dispatch

[27:14] a well for for right now my thought

[27:16] would be would be only to respond to

[27:18] calls for service potentially we would

[27:21] look at Trends so such as if we saw a

[27:24] spring of uh car laries or burglaries

[27:27] area we may

[27:29] proactively uh look at a certain time

[27:32] frame that's that's that's that's

[27:34] reflective of the information the data

[27:36] that we have but we would not we don't

[27:38] have any ples to proactively control I

[27:40] do believe some neighborhood there's

[27:43] subties that are doing that yeah there's

[27:45] one agency Beverly Hills Police

[27:46] Department they're patrolling with their

[27:48] drones um 7 days a week 10 hours a day

[27:50] and I asked them directly and they said

[27:53] I I know their Lieutenant he says Don

[27:55] our community is more worried about

[27:56] their money than their private

[27:58] and that's bever Hills so it's a little

[27:59] different right so um but to my

[28:02] knowledge every other agency um this is

[28:05] something that we would work with with Chief glipper and you know

[28:08] developing um um policies as to why you

[28:12] know when you would utilize the it would

[28:15] be something that the community would

[28:16] have to ask for before we do that thank

[28:19] you Mr caner to C um I just am wondering

[28:25] um timeline wise I see that the contract

[28:27] the at least the estimate that we're um

[28:30] seeing tonight expires I think on the

[28:32] 31st of December um that that quote um

[28:36] so if approved um what's the timeline in

[28:40] terms of training in terms of getting up

[28:43] and actually using um the drones the way

[28:46] you want to do that so so year one of

[28:49] the contract is for us to procure the

[28:52] Tactical drones those are ones that we

[28:54] would once we receive them we would

[28:55] start using them immediately and those

[28:57] are for for emergency situations indoor

[29:00] use and then the timeline on the the dfr

[29:05] we would PR plan to use 2024 to start

[29:07] building up the program but we don't

[29:09] expect to actually have that dfr until

[29:12] 2025 late 2024 with with the potential

[29:15] to get it early in 24 but um we're

[29:20] really talking about a re a reality

[29:22] deployment of early 2025 possibly end of

[29:26] 24 thank

[29:28] you uh going with the mayor's Trend I

[29:31] had a few questions myself um how many

[29:33] instance kind of speaking towards the

[29:35] capabilities of the Drone uh can the

[29:37] Drone respond to before having to return

[29:39] back to space that's a good question so

[29:42] um our drone um solution we're looking

[29:45] at a 45 minute to 60 Minute um air time

[29:48] on that um I I'm speaking from

[29:51] experience at Jula Vista uh we had about

[29:52] a 30 minute flight time um for Jula

[29:56] Vista typic Al a um when the Drone gets

[29:59] overhead a incident will stabilize be

[30:01] found in about 15 20 minutes to figure

[30:03] out what what's happening so most of the

[30:06] time the Drone was able to handle a

[30:08] situation and return back to base where

[30:10] we want the longer flight time is

[30:12] because if it's handling one incident

[30:14] and another incident happens it wants to

[30:16] be able to we want to fly it over to

[30:17] there without having to to land it so um

[30:20] we're we're estimating 45 to a 60 Minute

[30:23] flight time and then I'll follow up I

[30:26] see the inv or the improved response

[30:28] times does that reflect mastering of The

[30:31] Craft or does that reflect having

[30:32] additional drones additional so uh 2020

[30:36] I 2019 I added a second launch location

[30:40] um 20 end of 2020 to 2021 I I added two

[30:44] more launch locations for four launch

[30:45] locations Citywide so it um expanded for

[30:48] Citywide coverage and that's why it

[30:50] impacted because this is all of the

[30:51] response times for the for the average

[30:53] for the

[30:56] Department yes um so Chief how many

[30:59] drones do we plant to purchase two just

[31:02] two okay and um the person that would

[31:04] the people individuals that be um doing

[31:06] these would they be civilians or would

[31:08] these only be sworn officers we're

[31:10] looking these civilians as the as The

[31:12] Operators of them for the Tactical ones

[31:15] they would be officers for the for the

[31:17] dfr working at civilians but that that

[31:20] decision hasn't been made yet but that's where

[31:23] we're and um so you've outlined a little

[31:26] bit but can you kind of just go the

[31:27] timeline of this and also

[31:30] cost the

[31:33] [Music]

[31:37] U

[31:38] [Music]

[31:43] the the uh contract that we're going to

[31:46] be asking the council to allow us to

[31:48] enter into is a six-year

[31:50] contract and year one we have funding

[31:53] through our FEMA

[31:55] Grant and that will cover cover um the

[31:59] first year one payment with the

[32:00] exception of I think

[32:02] $10,000 that we have within our budget

[32:04] to cover that year two is when we will have the two dfr drone sites up

[32:11] and running and that is the $880,000

[32:14] p and then year three four five and six

[32:18] it goes up to $130,000 a year and within

[32:23] this six years every other year um Brank

[32:27] is going to uh provide us with the

[32:30] updated equipment on each level of our

[32:33] service whether it's the Tactical drones

[32:36] or the dfr

[32:38] drones and they and they're also

[32:40] providing us with a a warranty where if

[32:42] anything happens to that mechanically or

[32:44] accidental damage that they are replaced

[32:47] or repair yes it's it's an allinclusive

[32:50] so there's no nickel Diamond if you need

[32:52] more batteries more props an operator

[32:54] does something to it it drops it in a

[32:55] pool or something we you get you get

[32:58] another one there's no questions asked

[32:59] on that so

[33:02] set so so the first year is 49,000 or

[33:05] 50,000 50,000 and then that's that's

[33:08] what Fe will pay and then the rest 0,000

[33:11] comes come back to the city

[33:14] yes any other question the

[33:18] mayor just a call to C president

[33:21] warfield's question on response

[33:24] times I believe it's going to improve

[33:27] response times and also the quality of

[33:29] response we had a lot of priority three

[33:32] calls

[33:35] classify noise complaints like fireworks

[33:38] complaints we'll get noise complaints

[33:41] that will come in and oh it's over in

[33:45] the next block they're playing the music

[33:47] too loud or they're setting Fireworks

[33:51] off down at the corner or a block over

[33:54] and so the dispat SC doesn't have an

[33:58] exact location to send a police officer

[34:01] to and the reality is I've seen

[34:04] sometimes they get backed up 15 calls I

[34:07] see as many as 30 calls backed up in the

[34:09] queue with this it would allow us

[34:12] to

[34:14] deploy device validate the initial call

[34:17] and identify where the location is

[34:19] sometimes with loud music we might be

[34:22] able to avoid sending a car to the scene

[34:25] you could look up a phone number

[34:27] identify the residents just make the

[34:30] call uh to them saying you've got a

[34:33] complaint you got to turn your music now

[34:37] uh the same thing with

[34:39] fireworks we all know we get the

[34:40] complaints on those when they go off you

[34:45] know people are smart enough they set

[34:46] them off and then they run so the

[34:48] fireworks are there and the kids say

[34:51] it's kids a lot of times now it's adults

[34:53] they have moved down the block into

[34:56] somebody else's back backyard or

[34:57] whatever and they set them off again so

[35:00] it becomes more of a convoluted fact

[35:04] pattern for the police to try and track

[35:06] down who is doing it and this Theory

[35:09] will allow us quicker response the

[35:11] ability to document what is happening

[35:14] and then hopefully create a level of

[35:16] deterrence so that we're not dealing

[35:18] with some of these uh again priority

[35:21] three calls now which affect the quality

[35:23] of life and affect uh our overall

[35:27] Staffing to appropriately respond to

[35:29] more serious

[35:31] calls and to the mayor's point I think

[35:33] what's happened and I have conversations

[35:35] with Mr Cen part of the issues with

[35:36] noise complaints is getting someone to

[35:38] put forth the complaint or to go on

[35:39] record U to to initiate that can you

[35:42] speak to this this evidence being

[35:44] permissible in court or has it been

[35:46] applied in the framework that the may

[35:47] have recommended with specifically with

[35:49] noise complaint respons um noise

[35:51] complaints so typically what we would do

[35:52] is we would launch for it it's usually a

[35:55] party complaint allow we would get the

[35:57] drum overhead and then evaluate as to

[36:01] the how large it is um to the mayor's

[36:03] point we have like identified what

[36:06] residents and pilot just please turn the

[36:10] music off or we're going to have to send

[36:11] units and it's it's interesting a lot of

[36:13] half the time Polie they'll say please

[36:15] send officers this part's gotten way out

[36:17] of hand typ type of thing so we would

[36:19] know even from that aspect of it to send

[36:21] more officers to to Really handle it but

[36:23] then we're like oh okay yeah not a

[36:25] problem we'll turn it down thank you

[36:26] very much was called and not

[36:27] embarrassing us type of thing um as for

[36:30] the other question all of the the videos

[36:33] are uploaded and stored in digital

[36:35] evidence um and so any case that gets

[36:37] issued to the case that's part of the

[36:39] case where the diser attorney would

[36:40] review it as like your body War camera

[36:42] or

[36:44] something any other questions Mr yeah

[36:46] you you mentioned that this these drone

[36:48] can be used in door U would we need a

[36:50] special legislation to allow that zo me

[36:54] that to allow these drones or indor

[36:58] so anytime um a drone is used indoors it

[37:00] would have the police department would

[37:02] have to have the legal authority to be

[37:04] inside there so if an officer was not

[37:05] legally so um typically where you're

[37:08] seeing is is like a um a tactical

[37:10] situation a barricaded subject or

[37:12] something um I can't speak for the chief

[37:14] but I know at our agency we would get a

[37:15] search warrant um and then we would have

[37:18] that warrant or under certain

[37:20] circumstances we can send the Drone in

[37:21] but you couldn't just send the Drone in

[37:23] if the police department had no right to

[37:24] be

[37:25] there

[37:27] points out most times you would have to

[37:29] get warrant or permission there would be

[37:32] exent circumstances where it's uh

[37:35] somebody's life is in immediate danger

[37:38] where access could

[37:40] be gained and again most of those are

[37:43] going to be highrisk situations so

[37:47] you're not going to put a police officer

[37:49] in there and put the device in with the

[37:52] intent of creating an atmosphere that's

[37:54] going to have to stabilize it as opposed

[37:57] to again something that might escalate

[37:59] it or require the use of some level of

[38:03] physical

[38:05] Force M Mr oh Mr yeah so thank you for

[38:10] this demonstration as I'm looking at

[38:12] this um you know I can't help but think

[38:14] back of things that have happened in the

[38:15] community you know such as like you know

[38:18] kids going missing things like that

[38:19] where this would be you know I'm sure

[38:22] that this would have been a huge help to

[38:25] our First Responders um um and and so I think the applications for this even

[38:30] are far beyond what you probably even

[38:33] were able to demonstrate um or with the

[38:35] brief presentation

[38:38] um with that said we're all always going

[38:41] to have to balance the tensions of

[38:43] safety and privacy and so I I I guess my

[38:47] question would be I have a few questions

[38:50] but the first one would be I'm

[38:52] like what type of uh uh for lack of

[38:56] better term um review process around um

[39:01] Effectiveness or Community impact or

[39:04] like um you know I guess with new

[39:06] technology we have to start asking new

[39:08] questions so I was wondering like what

[39:10] are like some of those things that we

[39:13] probably looking to implement from our

[39:14] procedural standpoint to ensure that um

[39:17] this is you know giving the best benefit

[39:20] to the community and not adversely

[39:23] affecting a up we did yeah yeah sure um privacy absolutely uh we met

[39:30] with the ACLU and we started our program

[39:31] actually J Stanley who's um with the AC

[39:34] I had dinner with him a month ago in in

[39:37] Seattle talking about VF and everything

[39:40] um so the idea of um very respectful

[39:43] privacy obviously you know we don't want

[39:45] those drones so um launching the Drone

[39:48] there's two trains of thoughts you know

[39:50] um do we record all the time or do you

[39:52] only record under certain circumstances

[39:54] for me personally I say we record all

[39:56] the time because I want that review if

[39:59] there is a complaint I want to make sure

[40:00] that it's being utilized properly if I

[40:02] don't have that video on so how we do

[40:04] that is we launch the Drone um typically

[40:06] you launch the Drone you know the where

[40:08] the location is you're already zooming

[40:09] in you're focused on that area that

[40:11] you're attending to once you handle that

[40:13] situation and we return to home the

[40:15] Drone video the camera automatically

[40:17] goes horizontal so when it's returning

[40:20] it's not inadvertently follow looking at

[40:22] the ground looking at people's backyards

[40:24] it's just looking straight ahead into

[40:25] the sky it's also safety issue that the

[40:28] other hazards that are out there um

[40:30] having that public transparency

[40:31] dashboard is also a situation that if a

[40:35] um a Community member was concerned

[40:37] about the Drone being used wrong you

[40:40] know against what the community wishes

[40:42] they can go on the website and see why

[40:44] the Drone was launched what was the call

[40:46] for service and the Telemetry of that

[40:48] drone at that point or we've been

[40:50] working into um having the the the

[40:53] camera where you could see where the

[40:55] camera was pointed wallet was flying so

[40:57] you have that even additional we don't

[40:59] want to upload videos because then it's

[41:02] I feel like we could potentially violate

[41:04] people's privacy we actually look the

[41:05] videos go up there so we don't want to

[41:07] do that I don't know if that answer your

[41:10] question and on our end we've already

[41:12] started uh attending neighborhood

[41:13] association meetings asking the

[41:15] community their thoughts on it we've

[41:17] also started that uh conversation with

[41:19] the New York civil Li Li to assist us

[41:22] with creating our policy um so that

[41:25] meets their standards and their approve

[41:26] of it um so that we want we want we look

[41:30] at them as the threshold of of

[41:32] acceptance and if it's okay with them we

[41:34] feel it should be uh acceptable to the

[41:36] community and we want to be open and

[41:38] transparent with the process that where

[41:40] we get to on that I guess

[41:43] uh followup question would be to that

[41:46] same point but you know will we you know

[41:49] maybe consider I know we have our police

[41:52] Community review board um but mainly um

[41:55] I don't know if there if there's even a

[41:57] subcommittee or something I just think

[41:59] that when we're talking about uh

[42:03] technology this great which I'm really

[42:06] you know quite honestly I'm suppor of

[42:07] this um but I really want to make sure

[42:11] that we're uh really intentional around

[42:15] what a review process could look like so

[42:17] you know maybe a subcommittee of the

[42:20] police uh review board or maybe even a

[42:24] another committee made up of people um

[42:26] in the community with law enforcement

[42:28] because we so much working together you

[42:31] know kind of hiding in that direction

[42:33] anyway uh to kind of just review uh you

[42:37] know the effectiveness and you know

[42:41] just good things and maybe some of the

[42:43] negative things um that have going on so

[42:45] I just don't know if you would be open

[42:47] to something like that Chief I would be

[42:49] you know the U the review of the video

[42:52] would have to be non evidentiary but

[42:54] certainly um I seen reason why that

[42:56] would be a

[42:58] problem any other questions come just um

[43:01] I think to that point also that um I

[43:03] think I saw in the materials that um

[43:05] part of the contract is also um bring

[43:08] assisting Us in terms of um helping to

[43:11] educate and involve the community and um

[43:15] help the community understand um the the

[43:18] practice I just have one other small

[43:20] question which is have you spoken at all

[43:22] with our um da to you know get a sense

[43:25] of the extent to which um we'd be able

[43:28] to use I mean obviously we can use it

[43:31] but I mean is there um what's the word

[43:33] I'm looking for like acceptance

[43:35] or um is is our court system would they

[43:40] be likely to to want to be able to use

[43:42] this I saw obviously looked like it was

[43:45] used successfully in many times but I

[43:48] can't I can't speak for for your

[43:49] jurisdiction I know in in California

[43:52] it's it's digital evidence it's just

[43:53] like body warn camera it's it's

[43:55] submitted that the district use that

[43:58] just like any other digital gotcha okay

[44:00] thank you any other questions or

[44:03] comments just generic comments chair

[44:06] people have to remember talk about one

[44:07] item here but this is to integrate it

[44:11] within the other sensors that we have

[44:14] deployed whether it's body working

[44:15] cameras in car video uh Optical sensors

[44:19] on like post uh other devices

[44:25] so looked at the law enforcement

[44:27] component there's other aspects of just

[44:29] managing and delivering public services

[44:32] that uh as we look at things are going

[44:35] to become apparent and we're going to be

[44:37] able to get better value for the

[44:40] residents in terms of the overall

[44:42] delivery of

[44:43] services well actually that's kind of my

[44:45] question I wanted to know how this

[44:47] interacts with you know we have axon

[44:50] with body cameras and all that goes with

[44:51] it in Kardash we're talking about Patrol

[44:54] finder so I was just wondering how this

[44:56] all intersects and works together um

[44:58] because they come they seem like they're

[45:00] different platforms they come from

[45:01] different organizations and agenes so

[45:03] how do we how do we here in conect have

[45:06] this all working together that's a good

[45:08] question and we thought about that I

[45:10] don't really have a specific answer to

[45:11] give you but I could see a day where they all they are they all work

[45:17] together um where potentially um you

[45:21] there's there's

[45:22] uh things that are on patrol finder we

[45:26] want to follow up on and instead of

[45:28] having an officer do that we have a

[45:29] drone do it let's say that there was a a

[45:32] burglary at 3:00 in the morning at your

[45:34] home and and you ask for extra attention

[45:37] so we we put that drone out there with

[45:39] the Drone operator saying okay there's

[45:41] six houses I said we're going to give

[45:42] extra attention to so we're going to

[45:44] send them out their proac give extra

[45:46] attention to that's just kind of what I

[45:47] see where we could go with this um you

[45:50] know I think the the possibilities are

[45:53] endless as far as where they interact

[45:55] with ACC on we would we still have the

[45:58] evidence.com platform for cloud-based

[46:00] storage so any evidence that we would

[46:02] collect through these would be put into

[46:04] that to store our evidence um and then

[46:07] anything that um was not evidentiary

[46:10] retaining for a certain period 30 or 90

[46:13] days be deleted thank you Mr yeah just a

[46:18] question um have you experienc any

[46:20] vandalism

[46:22] using these drones using drones um it's

[46:25] funny um indoor yes we've um we've known

[46:29] we've had a couple of our indoor drones

[46:31] um in one was in Las Vegas um it was a

[46:34] arrest warrant to go arrest somebody and

[46:35] they shot the Drone in in their in the

[46:37] residence to my knowledge there's only

[46:39] been one documented incident of a drone

[46:41] actually being shot out of the sky which

[46:43] was in Florida um and that person was

[46:45] prosecuted for federal crimes CU

[46:46] shooting aircraft on it um at for Vista

[46:49] would it never has happened we had

[46:52] people we had somebody who kept trying

[46:53] to throw oranges at it um um but they couldn't couldn't reach to it so um

[46:58] but if somebody shoots a drone out of

[46:59] the sky um that's that's something law

[47:01] enforcement we want to know if they're

[47:03] willing to fire a weapon the air that's

[47:05] something that we it's definitely we'

[47:08] love to

[47:10] investigate Mr so uh this question goes

[47:13] back to like some of the training like

[47:14] so what is kind of the training to I

[47:16] know you said that um for the

[47:18] non-tactical drones we're talking about

[47:20] using civilians um so like what could

[47:23] you give us an idea of what like that

[47:24] training program looks like and is

[47:26] something that you maybe be looking to

[47:28] partner with like

[47:30] our maybe local uh community colleges is

[47:34] it is it different from because I know

[47:36] that there's some drone drone training

[47:38] programs that are existing so I guess

[47:40] the more clear way to ask that question

[47:42] is tell us a little bit what the

[47:43] training looks like and is this

[47:45] something for at least the non-tactical

[47:47] drones is this something that you know

[47:49] the existing drone uh training would

[47:54] suffice I give my answer and then I'll

[47:56] turn it over to Don for what the

[47:57] training looks like but I I can I can

[48:00] definitely see us wanting to partner

[48:02] withy Community College or any college

[48:04] that offers a criminal justice program

[48:06] and an aviation program because what

[48:08] we're seeing is a lot of students that want to be working in the criminal

[48:13] justice field but they don't want to be

[48:14] police officers they want to be analysts

[48:16] or something else behind the scenes and

[48:18] this could be a perfect Avenue for that

[48:20] is to get that training criminal justice

[48:22] but then also Lear learn fly a drone

[48:25] part of that solution as a civilian as

[48:28] far as the training goes there's a lot

[48:29] to learn and I can tell you what that is

[48:31] yeah and um one of our launch locations

[48:34] with our community college and they have

[48:36] a drone class and every semester they

[48:38] come through our department and they sit

[48:40] along with the Drone Pilots to learn

[48:42] about the the drum technology so that

[48:44] thing as for the training um it the

[48:48] training is is really on how to launch

[48:50] the Drone via the computer and some

[48:52] different information as to like you

[48:54] know how to how to handle the Drone

[48:55] because it's a different way it's

[48:56] basically a keyboard you're flying it

[48:58] via keyboard and a mouse on that and

[49:01] then how to how to um the the base

[49:04] station how to maintain the base station

[49:06] all of the training is included we would

[49:08] provide all the training um you know for

[49:10] safe use for the job like what have the

[49:12] time like from start to finish you know

[49:16] I anticipate about a week to get

[49:17] somebody truly where we would be sitting

[49:19] with somebody to to findly they'll pick

[49:21] it up the first day it's it's not that

[49:24] difficult you know you just if any of

[49:25] these officers are Gamers where they use

[49:27] the keyboard to play video games it's

[49:29] really the same thing they're just

[49:30] playing a real drone from from a

[49:32] distance so um but the the things is to

[49:35] understand is to get them comfortable in

[49:37] flying the drones and turning the gimbal

[49:39] cam it's hard if you're it's easy if

[49:41] you're just looking at something and

[49:42] it's not moving but if it's a vehicle

[49:44] driving it just takes a little bit of

[49:46] time to really get comfortable with

[49:49] it thank you yes so Chief based on so

[49:53] let me for both of you based on on the

[49:55] population is that how you determine the

[49:57] number of drones because two do we have

[49:59] a drones right now and we have one we

[50:01] have we have drones that we deploy out

[50:03] of Dr okay so so two based on our

[50:07] population is in your mind sufficient

[50:09] and this two will be through the life of

[50:11] this grant there won't be any increase

[50:13] in the number that we get over the six

[50:15] years uh for the contract is just two um

[50:18] I actually thought three but then when

[50:20] Don came here he felt that with our line

[50:22] of sight and and the size of our

[50:24] jurisdiction we could we could make it

[50:26] make do with too yeah and where we would

[50:28] really we I don't know if we we said

[50:31] this at the beginning but we want to be

[50:32] partners with SKC it isn't for us to to

[50:35] look at SKC as a customer we want to be

[50:38] true Partners to build their program out

[50:40] to be a ro robust which helps us to go

[50:43] to market with this right so where we

[50:45] would look at it and this is what I did

[50:47] at CH Vista is I started with one launch

[50:49] location figured out where would be a

[50:51] second good La launch location get data

[50:53] to show the value like okay where are my

[50:55] calls for service where's the heat map

[50:57] could a third fourth fifth location

[51:00] really benefit the community and that's

[51:02] how we developed it so where we would

[51:04] work with SK is to to show the return

[51:06] and value on this and you may get to a

[51:09] point where like we we we like having

[51:12] two but we feel like a third one would

[51:13] be even better because those two are

[51:15] utilized so often we could use a third

[51:17] one th those are some things that we

[51:19] would we call it a crawl walk run right

[51:21] let's let's start show the value of it

[51:24] and then you you as a Community say or

[51:26] not you need additional launch

[51:28] locations and then then I think in kind

[51:31] with that comment and I appreciate your

[51:33] training or your um uh presentation for

[51:36] identifying it everybody imagine would

[51:38] prefer a helicopter however there are

[51:40] Financial limitations to that similar to

[51:42] our budget uh as a whole and I don't

[51:44] think it's a coincidence that we're

[51:46] going to have a budget conversation

[51:47] thereafter uh unfortunately that still

[51:49] going on um but uh with respect to this

[51:52] I truly want to commend you uh chief uh

[51:55] in kind to similar Chief Marino's U

[51:58] intentions with trying to look at the

[52:00] limitations of our current Staffing and

[52:01] how do we apply technology in a way

[52:03] where IT addresses uh where our city is

[52:06] and definitely response times as you red

[52:08] to Mr M comments are an issue then how

[52:10] do we respond to those uh unique

[52:12] circumstances specifically around our R

[52:14] complaints so that we aren't just

[52:15] telling the community for prioritizing

[52:18] calls but looking at putting in place

[52:20] actual U measures to to help lower that that threshold of extended response

[52:26] times so I don't know if you reached out

[52:29] and looked for this resource with that

[52:31] thinking in mind but regardless I

[52:33] definitely wanted to say thank you and

[52:34] I'm looking forward to where this

[52:36] conversation goes um with that being

[52:38] said Miss Patrick highlighted that uh

[52:41] deadline of December 31st I know from

[52:44] myself I thought this was a presentation

[52:46] so are we have a you need an answer from

[52:49] the council and then miss P respond to

[52:51] yeah uh so as as you call if I could um

[52:55] this was going the chief was going to

[52:56] bring this up two weeks ago and at that

[52:59] time he also provided us with the all

[53:01] the information so and during that

[53:03] discuss the chief asked to remove it

[53:05] from the agenda so we could have um

[53:08] someone here from CH Vista but we also

[53:10] have that two weeks to review all the

[53:12] information so I'm assuming everyone did

[53:14] that so at this point in time you are

[53:16] asking for us to to uh take action on

[53:19] this in order to get the contract signed

[53:20] in time is that correct that's correct

[53:23] okay so I'm happy to move that that um

[53:26] I'm happy to move

[53:27] the apologize just one quick comment and

[53:30] follow to Mr Farley

[53:33] in careers and job opportunities with

[53:36] this you New York State Governor hok who

[53:39] put money in the old griffus Air Force

[53:42] Base outside of Rome where that is

[53:45] becoming a Statewide and I should say

[53:49] nationally internationally recognized

[53:51] Center of Excellence for drone

[53:54] technology and so

[53:56] we're doing a

[53:58] small project here that

[54:00] will in theory complement some of the

[54:03] development that's happening there but

[54:06] and we're looking the Staffing one drone

[54:08] but these are really career

[54:09] opportunities that are emerging in like

[54:14] a field that people never thought of

[54:17] before and so yes we're taking some of

[54:21] the baby steps here but uh you know just

[54:24] down the road there's a center of

[54:26] excellence in uh we have to look at our

[54:28] community college other educational

[54:30] opportunities and even kids in high

[54:32] school to make them aware of these

[54:34] scenarios and possibilities for

[54:37] opportunities as they become

[54:40] adults thank you Mr Mayor so there are

[54:43] any further questions or comments uh

[54:45] there's motion on the floor I second all

[54:47] those in

[54:48] favor thank you thank you thank you very

[54:51] much any other it follow Public Safety

[54:54] hearing on have motion to so move

[54:57] [Music]

[54:59] second thank you I'd like to call the

[55:01] finance committee to order the first

[55:04] item is ly firefighter Foundation Grant

[55:08] Chief

[55:21] Marino

[55:24] everybody we can't do

[55:28] that um so in

[55:33] 2012 uh

[55:34] Governor excuse me passed in the law

[55:37] that every fire department that has

[55:40] elevation in their jurisdiction would

[55:42] provide their members a descending

[55:45] device of some sort either a device or

[55:48] ropes whatever they s that and they

[55:51] would uh give them give their members a

[55:53] training to operate what

[55:56] 2014 we purchased

[56:00] 43 uh what was called dat it was a day

[56:03] descending

[56:06] device top top of the line back then uh

[56:09] you could do a lot of a lot of nice

[56:11] things uh with your firefighters with

[56:14] civilians getting people out of

[56:16] heightened

[56:17] areas that D system that we own now is

[56:20] approaching 10 years old still works um

[56:24] but it's it's kind of out of favor in

[56:27] the fire service now for a few reasons

[56:30] it's buy uh maintenance is expensive and

[56:34] whatnot so we want to move to a more

[56:38] convenient more efficient a more

[56:41] practical device and we're looking at

[56:44] something called a a a petzel I want to

[56:48] say pretzel a petel it's a a fraction of

[56:52] the size and it it uh very efficient and

[56:55] it does what we need to

[56:58] do so uh we had some money from our

[57:02] radio FEMA cran that we're going to use

[57:05] to purchase devices to um to replace the

[57:12] DAT right now the dat we have one per

[57:14] position not one per person one per

[57:16] position on our rigs so with this extra

[57:20] money we're going to purchase devices to

[57:22] replace that in the meantime we applied

[57:26] to the Larry

[57:29] foundation and we were awarded a grant

[57:32] for

[57:33] 25,000 and whatever $245 52 and that

[57:39] amount would allow us to purchase enough

[57:41] devices so each member of the department

[57:44] would receive one instead of one per

[57:48] position that be one

[57:50] p which to me is very important because

[57:52] that's a safety device I feel lot more

[57:55] comfortable than it's mine and it's not

[57:58] Jimmy lier down the road I don't know

[58:00] how he what he does with it and when I

[58:02] get it you know I feel more comfortable

[58:04] it's fine so it it's a safety issue so

[58:08] from the Larry Foundation $4,5 152 we're

[58:11] going to purchase 44 units the great

[58:14] thing is there's no um City commitment

[58:19] there's no matching points it's just

[58:21] here you go do what you got to do thank

[58:25] you very much

[58:26] so that's what I got question go ahead

[58:30] please uh thank Mr chairman when we

[58:33] purchased these devices originally in

[58:35] what

[58:37] 2014 uh made available to the council we

[58:40] did a demonstration was the first time

[58:42] we had him into the fire tower and

[58:45] offered and the city council members who

[58:47] wanted at that time put one on and jump

[58:49] out of the four story we would do it I

[58:51] would make that available to council if

[58:54] you want

[58:55] go up and test one of the

[58:57] devices I'll go out

[58:59] first we're not allowing that no I don't

[59:03] know any other questions I'll move it

[59:06] second second all in favor I thank you thank you thank you J the next

[59:12] item is amend the city city code section

[59:15] 2341 to modify the annual income among

[59:19] for the tax exempt we had a public

[59:21] hearing on December

[59:23] 11th

[59:25] and I'm going to hand this over to the

[59:27] sponsor for this um change legislation

[59:31] change Mr

[59:38] Williams Oh for the U tax exemption yes

[59:44] uh would say any other further updates I

[59:46] think I was very pleased to to hear the

[59:47] full support from the council um

[59:50] although we didn't have an overwhelming

[59:52] response from the community uh I had the

[59:54] council meeting uh I myself received a

[59:56] few followup messages from some

[59:58] residents saying that they were

[59:59] definitely pleased to hear that we were

[1:00:00] taking action um I think taking into

[1:00:04] consideration also the comments from on

[1:00:06] the table I wanted to make sure we

[1:00:07] weren't doing so at the expense of that

[1:00:10] Revenue stream uh I think increasing it

[1:00:12] based on Miss neoy I think it's

[1:00:15] important to take those gradual steps

[1:00:17] and then as we all stated we just um

[1:00:19] look forward to evaluating that

[1:00:20] information and if we see so uh needed

[1:00:24] to increase further we will although I'm

[1:00:26] hope it's not

[1:00:30] required any other

[1:00:32] comments so may have a motion to V

[1:00:35] this

[1:00:37] do all in

[1:00:41] favor all in

[1:00:43] favor wait I'm sorry um I don't think we

[1:00:47] have a piece of paper in terms of what

[1:00:49] we're I mean do we have the um yeah it's

[1:00:53] is it I am I missing it

[1:00:58] leg is anybody not seeing it or is it

[1:01:00] just me it's not CU I I know obviously I

[1:01:05] think we all did come to agreement but I

[1:01:06] just want to refresher on the amount of

[1:01:08] money that we're raising it you know

[1:01:09] that kind so miss

[1:01:13] uh m m said she go and print it

[1:01:18] okay yeah we did have it before heing

[1:01:21] all the

[1:01:22] Dr I know I just

[1:01:27] public just so we're clear on the number that we're talking about okay

[1:01:32] right I mean absolutely

[1:01:35] no she needs any

[1:01:43] [Music]

[1:01:45] help sometimes I don't know if just not

[1:01:50] see a few things I

[1:01:53] asked

[1:01:57] something

[1:02:23] go

[1:02:42] [Music]

[1:02:53] for

[1:03:23] ass

[1:03:26] [Music]

[1:03:53] that's

[1:04:16] impressive

[1:04:40] [Music]

[1:04:46] that

[1:04:53] and

[1:04:57] it's

[1:05:23] amazing

[1:05:50] yes

[1:05:52] me going out two

[1:05:58] houses said sawday he

[1:06:17] [Music]

[1:06:23] said

[1:06:40] next the

[1:06:53] mar

[1:07:16] [Music]

[1:07:22] you

[1:07:37] [Music]

[1:07:52] for

[1:08:11] the should

[1:08:12] be should be

[1:08:22] Tuesday

[1:08:35] the changes that are Incorporated in

[1:08:37] here um there are other changes that

[1:08:39] were made uh for the purpose of

[1:08:41] consistency with the state legislation

[1:08:45] um section 467 um we had left out tax in

[1:08:49] the code that's why I got added uh and

[1:08:52] then the there update since the city

[1:08:55] council last changed this section of the

[1:08:57] law at the state

[1:08:59] level husband and wife has now changed

[1:09:01] to married couple um that's why it's say

[1:09:05] spouse in other sections there's also

[1:09:07] very specific language or by siblings um

[1:09:11] I spoke

[1:09:12] to assessor Maly H

[1:09:16] to making these changes she agreed that

[1:09:19] those changes are consistent with what's

[1:09:22] in the state level but the U the dollar

[1:09:25] amount is same the dollar amounts are

[1:09:26] based on what Miss maoy gave me um the

[1:09:30] amount was up to

[1:09:33] $4,400 um then she gave me the breakdown

[1:09:36] that's in here the way we had previously

[1:09:38] done it we did it we kind of staggered

[1:09:40] it in over a period of years that's no

[1:09:43] longer necessary to be in our code it's

[1:09:46] going to be as of you know assessment

[1:09:49] year 2024 and subsequent assessment

[1:09:52] years that's what it will be

[1:09:55] so it's in two different spots so

[1:09:56] obviously on that first page um that's

[1:09:59] for the senior citizens and then if you

[1:10:03] turn

[1:10:04] to

[1:10:07] the the back of the second

[1:10:11] page um you can see the changes for

[1:10:14] persons with limited income who are

[1:10:19] disabled it follows the same

[1:10:22] schedule

[1:10:24] thank you go ahead please is there any

[1:10:27] chance we could get the legislation

[1:10:29] without without all the cross outs

[1:10:31] without instead of husband and wife

[1:10:33] married

[1:10:34] Papa it will look like that for the

[1:10:37] purposes of the so when we do a um an

[1:10:42] ordinance we have to essentially the way

[1:10:45] we do it we strike out anything that's

[1:10:47] going to be removed and um generally we

[1:10:51] would italicize anything that's going to

[1:10:53] be added um so because there is a lot

[1:10:56] that's being removed because we had done

[1:10:59] it over a series of years staggering it

[1:11:01] in to what it is now all of those

[1:11:04] sections are now obsolete which is why

[1:11:06] they are cross out um hopefully it will

[1:11:10] be clearer once it's drafted for the

[1:11:12] purposes of the

[1:11:13] ordinance this is a reflection of what

[1:11:16] it will look like subject to the coun

[1:11:22] appr

[1:11:26] any other

[1:11:41] questions any other questions what this

[1:11:44] presented to us here I think we had a

[1:11:47] motion for a second I just need a call

[1:11:49] all in favor I thank

[1:11:52] you

[1:11:55] the next item is discuss this 2024

[1:11:58] operating budget once again discussing

[1:12:01] the budget as everyone is aware the May

[1:12:04] has VTO the second budget that was

[1:12:06] presented to him and I'm going to hand

[1:12:08] this over to miss P you the part of this

[1:12:11] session all right thank you everyone so

[1:12:14] as m m said we did present two budgets

[1:12:16] to the mayor the mayor has be both

[1:12:18] budgets um and you know our goal

[1:12:22] ultimately is to pass the budget we

[1:12:24] understand that there was a timeline

[1:12:25] December 1st however the excuse me

[1:12:27] November 1st but the charter does not

[1:12:29] speak to what happens if the budget is

[1:12:31] not pass at that time um we have been

[1:12:34] there have been

[1:12:35] conversations with the mayor regarding

[1:12:38] what we can do to get to umet where

[1:12:42] we're uh both have agreeable that not

[1:12:45] everybody gets everything that they're

[1:12:47] asking for but it's an agreeable um it's

[1:12:50] agreeable budget to to all of us uh the

[1:12:53] last time time that in the discussion

[1:12:54] was my my I walked away with the

[1:12:56] understanding that the use of arpa funds

[1:12:59] to cover the waste was something that

[1:13:01] was acceptable but um having made that

[1:13:04] particular change which to me was pretty

[1:13:06] significant it was covering a $1.7

[1:13:08] million deficit um that that that was

[1:13:11] not acceptable so there um for that

[1:13:13] reason the

[1:13:14] um the veto the budget was vetoed so um

[1:13:19] my understanding is that the mayor does

[1:13:21] not wish to use arpa funds for or that

[1:13:24] particular issue or to to plug the

[1:13:26] budget um on on a major level this year

[1:13:31] because arpa funds are something that

[1:13:32] we're not going to have forever so if um

[1:13:35] the mayor would just like to speak to

[1:13:36] his concerns about the arpa funds I

[1:13:38] think that's a place we could um just

[1:13:40] maybe have that start that

[1:13:42] discussion can uh think the arpa funds

[1:13:47] were inappropriately thought was being

[1:13:50] applied to that in some of the research

[1:13:53] search that Mr Cen had done recently

[1:13:57] this yesterday this morning some of the

[1:14:00] case law that's out there uh I'm more

[1:14:03] comfortable taking a position that the

[1:14:06] council has probably waved its Authority

[1:14:09] your opportunity to make modifications

[1:14:11] to my budget by not adopting something

[1:14:15] by November

[1:14:17] 1st and so that in fact that my budget

[1:14:20] is presented stands and would be

[1:14:23] operting budget for

[1:14:25] 2024 becomes you know how do we come to

[1:14:29] that agreement whether you know starting

[1:14:31] action tomorrow Supreme Court and

[1:14:33] article 78 proceeding and Su the city

[1:14:36] council and the finance

[1:14:38] commissioner uh initiate that uh want to

[1:14:43] do it still in a friendly way so that we

[1:14:45] end up with a product that uh is there

[1:14:47] but it may clear

[1:14:49] up any of

[1:14:51] the the unknown which is been there if

[1:14:56] the council doesn't take an affirmative

[1:14:58] action that there are consequences there

[1:15:00] are things that you have to do where the

[1:15:03] statute says things are supposed to

[1:15:05] happen by a certain date and they

[1:15:08] didn't so um Mr B yeah so I

[1:15:13] think uh a good place to start would be

[1:15:16] to kind of recognize that um throughout

[1:15:18] the process you know um there's been a

[1:15:22] lot of you know back and forth

[1:15:24] conversations and certain members um

[1:15:26] have had you know uh critiques on the

[1:15:30] mayor's proposed budget um and I think

[1:15:33] that and and the mayor has questions and certainly some critiques around what

[1:15:38] the council has presented for him and I

[1:15:41] think it kind of Falls in two buckets if

[1:15:42] you will that there's some where I think

[1:15:46] uh we need to be really honest about the

[1:15:48] fact that I think some decisions or even

[1:15:52] questions on um you know might have been

[1:15:55] motivated by um you know kind of the

[1:15:59] political climate um that we're

[1:16:02] in and I think the danger of that is

[1:16:05] that when that happens then when you

[1:16:07] have

[1:16:08] uh uh critiques or questions that have

[1:16:12] some degree of level of Merit to them

[1:16:14] which I think I heard a lot of that it

[1:16:16] kind of colors everything um um for the

[1:16:19] latter and I just think that you know

[1:16:22] that's a good place to start where we

[1:16:24] acknowledge that now I did receive the

[1:16:27] email from uh Mr Golden today um and I

[1:16:31] look forward to hearing what is you know

[1:16:33] kind of more of his uh interpretation of

[1:16:36] that is but I think it's important that

[1:16:38] we recognize that prior to this even

[1:16:41] before um uh Mr Cen uh presented us with

[1:16:45] the information that he did I have been

[1:16:47] talking with with members and I have

[1:16:50] been talking with the mayor um and those

[1:16:53] conversations to me seem to be happening

[1:16:55] in good faith and I would uh even uh

[1:16:59] classify them as fruitful conversations

[1:17:01] where we were able to move the needle

[1:17:03] and I and I think that the best course

[1:17:05] of action um would be for us to continue

[1:17:08] to do that um I I think

[1:17:11] that we have this it has revealed that

[1:17:15] we need to look at the charter um to

[1:17:17] look at you know what are you know

[1:17:20] what's the consequences of if we don't

[1:17:23] uh if the city uh does not adopt a

[1:17:26] budget within the a lotted time frame

[1:17:29] and I think that's something that we

[1:17:31] should you know the decisions we make

[1:17:32] today aren't just for today we're we're looking down the road so I think

[1:17:36] that this kind of um open that up for us

[1:17:39] to say let's examine that I think as a

[1:17:41] matter of uh uh procedure we should look

[1:17:44] at that and res revisit our Charter but

[1:17:47] I also think that we need to I don't

[1:17:50] think that this uh the situation that

[1:17:52] we're in now is going to um lend itself

[1:17:54] to us having to find out that the quote

[1:17:56] unquote hard way um I you know we have

[1:18:01] to based on new information I think it's

[1:18:05] I think we're obligated to um make

[1:18:08] different calculations and be willing to

[1:18:11] make concessions um especially uh based

[1:18:14] on new information when we receive it so

[1:18:17] I think we should be strong in our

[1:18:19] opinions um but hold them Loosely enough

[1:18:22] um to where if a new information is

[1:18:24] presented we can move so I I think that

[1:18:26] what we that there was some of that that

[1:18:28] was happening based in my conversations

[1:18:31] um and I you know want to appreciate um

[1:18:35] the

[1:18:36] mayor as well as our council president

[1:18:38] and members of council that um I was

[1:18:40] able to talk to um and I think that we

[1:18:43] just keep heading down that that uh

[1:18:46] headed in that direction so we can

[1:18:49] um we can get this done so do you want

[1:18:51] to outline that the conversation

[1:18:54] well I mean I can I can say like some of

[1:18:55] the key things um you know that I spoke

[1:19:00] with de Mayon and um

[1:19:03] I uh you know either agree with or think

[1:19:08] that um it's not outside the realm of

[1:19:11] being reasonable to be agreeable too um

[1:19:14] is that we are going to have to

[1:19:17] increase rates that's the reality and I

[1:19:21] don't think anyone here is excited about

[1:19:24] that no one is looking forward to doing

[1:19:25] that but I think that the reality is P

[1:19:28] that that needs to happen um and I

[1:19:32] appreciate the fact that the council

[1:19:34] isn't just first looking for you know

[1:19:37] when we need to close the cap let's look

[1:19:39] at you know to try to burden um uh the

[1:19:42] residents of the city that we also look

[1:19:44] at you know efficient systems or

[1:19:47] effective systems and other ways to

[1:19:49] increase Revenue um but I don't think

[1:19:51] that it's either or I think it's a yes

[1:19:52] answer so you know the conversation that

[1:19:56] um I had with the mayor and some of my

[1:19:58] takeaways that I want to share today

[1:19:59] would be like I would suggest that we um

[1:20:04] meet uh the mayor's uh original proposal

[1:20:07] around uh water and sewer fees increase

[1:20:10] um to at least uh 75% of what he was uh

[1:20:16] originally

[1:20:17] proposing and I think that we also uh

[1:20:22] meet uh the the the trash the

[1:20:26] residential uh trash uh fees

[1:20:30] increase to the tun around 50% of what

[1:20:33] he proposed originally and I'd like to

[1:20:36] look at you know kind of if we could see

[1:20:39] like what those numbers would look like

[1:20:41] uh and what some of those adjustments

[1:20:44] would be made I also um wanted to

[1:20:47] highlight that we have a lot of work to

[1:20:49] do in our code enforcement that's

[1:20:50] something that we talk about often um I

[1:20:53] think that uh returning um one of the

[1:20:56] jobs to the code enforcement would be uh

[1:20:59] act a good faith and step in the right

[1:21:01] direction

[1:21:04] um and I you know those are just some of

[1:21:07] the things that I think that would

[1:21:08] really help us get much much closer uh

[1:21:12] and I think that there's that that's

[1:21:15] justifiable action uh for us to to make

[1:21:18] those

[1:21:21] considerations but I definitely welcome

[1:21:24] our council members

[1:21:27] input so Mr go ahead please so I just

[1:21:32] want to clarify with the mayor so at

[1:21:33] this point in time you're saying you're

[1:21:34] not willing to entertain anything else

[1:21:36] you're in the council I just want to be

[1:21:38] clear I think you know we've gone

[1:21:40] through this it's gone down the road and

[1:21:42] to clarify not only for us now but going

[1:21:45] forward so the question isn't there is

[1:21:49] to do an article 78 proceeding and just

[1:21:52] have the uh budget uh implemented as

[1:21:56] submitted to the council I told has

[1:22:00] any comment on that thoughts and don't

[1:22:04] he's represented both of us in this so

[1:22:07] might actually become a conflicted

[1:22:09] positions I like to bring in outside

[1:22:12] Council on that so so if if when you

[1:22:16] file that the council has to own also

[1:22:18] get their own outside Council I can't

[1:22:21] tell you what to do or not to do okay

[1:22:23] well let me just tell the council

[1:22:24] members if it comes to that we also have

[1:22:25] to get our own outside Council as well

[1:22:27] so I just wanted to make it clear for

[1:22:29] you you're not open to any further

[1:22:31] discussion regarding this you're you

[1:22:33] want to go down the road of a lawsuit I

[1:22:35] just wanted to just make it

[1:22:37] clear options that are being presented I

[1:22:40] feel hind my ability to manage the city

[1:22:42] going forward in the fiscal position is

[1:22:45] less than optimal and so this point

[1:22:49] to from an operational Point going

[1:22:52] forward and then just a policy

[1:22:56] perspective going forward it will clear

[1:22:58] up what the respective roles are and

[1:23:00] what the timelines

[1:23:04] are Mr up Mr Mr would you I want to

[1:23:08] speak it's going to be subject to

[1:23:10] attorney client privilege um so the

[1:23:12] council would either have to wave that

[1:23:14] privilege um or not if you're going to

[1:23:17] wave that privilege I would speak openly

[1:23:19] about it if you're not going to wave

[1:23:20] that privilege and you want me to speak

[1:23:22] um have to go and close the doors and

[1:23:26] have everybody leave so I can speak to

[1:23:28] the council

[1:23:30] s so it's up to you Mr move there do we

[1:23:33] do that now or do we recess and then go

[1:23:36] an executive session at the

[1:23:38] end that's teic be outside of executive

[1:23:40] session B pardon uh attorney client

[1:23:43] discussions are outside of executive

[1:23:45] session it's just not even part of the

[1:23:46] meeting okay

[1:23:50] so are we goinging way of that or we

[1:23:53] just would we like to going to Executive

[1:23:55] session it wouldn't be executive session

[1:23:56] it would just be uh attorney attorney

[1:23:59] but but the public would have to leave

[1:24:01] okay so we would have to finish our

[1:24:03] agenda before that or or not but that

[1:24:06] would make sense because I think there's

[1:24:07] somebody here who wants to uh who's here

[1:24:09] for something on the agenda

[1:24:12] so so it seems like

[1:24:15] we so it seems like I

[1:24:17] mean the course of action would be to uh

[1:24:23] recess Finance get through the rest of

[1:24:25] our agenda and

[1:24:28] then um turn to finance and talk with

[1:24:33] Corporation counsel was

[1:24:37] that I think based on the gravity of

[1:24:39] just the circumstance that we're now in

[1:24:41] I think that that is a prudent action

[1:24:43] the council should take

[1:24:47] okay any other comment go ahead again I

[1:24:50] just in case I wasn't clear I think that you know the conversations that

[1:24:55] I've had with the mayor and other

[1:24:56] members over the past couple days have

[1:24:59] been happening in in in good faith um

[1:25:03] and we were moving uh a lot closer to

[1:25:07] something I think that we were going to

[1:25:08] be agreeable on that would work for the

[1:25:10] residents of the city is concy and I

[1:25:12] would just encourage all of us to to

[1:25:15] continue down that uh path because I uh

[1:25:19] I I think we're really seeing some

[1:25:21] daylight there so I just want to be

[1:25:23] clear that would be my recommendation to

[1:25:27] the mayor and

[1:25:29] councel I want to just kind of

[1:25:31] appreciate Mr parley's effort to

[1:25:33] dialog to just bring

[1:25:36] a clear closure to it as opposed to a

[1:25:42] negotiated settlement which still may be

[1:25:44] subject to additional

[1:25:48] review just set the record going forward

[1:25:52] make it a lot easier for any individual

[1:25:54] sitting our respective seats

[1:25:58] down you what was that he the end

[1:26:02] it when somebody else will be mayor

[1:26:06] other people will be on the city council

[1:26:08] they'll know that they have to adopt a

[1:26:09] budget by November

[1:26:13] 1st so so just to recap so your

[1:26:16] suggestion on the proposal on the table

[1:26:19] is to

[1:26:20] increase the m already bring it up to

[1:26:23] 50% water and sewer so you're asking

[1:26:26] bring that up to 75% water and sewer and

[1:26:29] residential Wass you're asking to bring

[1:26:32] that proposal on the table to 50% and

[1:26:36] one

[1:26:37] position in

[1:26:41] C right and I think that that is right

[1:26:44] that's my position and you know and not to use AR funds you know I think

[1:26:49] that you know we

[1:26:51] can

[1:26:53] go ahead please yes um what council

[1:26:56] members have you reached out to I

[1:26:59] so so I um spoke with uh the mayor I

[1:27:04] spoke with uh count our council

[1:27:07] president um and I've reached out to a

[1:27:10] couple other council members

[1:27:15] um I reached out to me so I just

[1:27:18] wondered who who you reached out to

[1:27:20] regarding this so we want that needle to move but again was no one reached out

[1:27:26] to me to even miss Patrick well I did

[1:27:30] speak with you miss Patrick I'm sorry at

[1:27:32] the last meeting regarding before that I

[1:27:34] did speak with you about the

[1:27:36] um the money in terms of ARA you did you

[1:27:38] said you wouldn't proberly support it

[1:27:40] and you didn't which is fine but that's

[1:27:41] okay but I did we were right here in

[1:27:43] this room was right and and just yeah

[1:27:47] and I think that it's so you know really

[1:27:50] what I was trying to do um my uh

[1:27:53] strategy here was to really um talk to

[1:27:57] people who have uh to me seemed um that

[1:28:01] they were uh furthest apart um and I

[1:28:05] think that once we kind of were able to

[1:28:08] close the gap there I think that it

[1:28:09] would be naturally we progress naturally

[1:28:12] for us all to be in a better place so

[1:28:14] please don't take that as like an you

[1:28:16] know excluding you from any conversation

[1:28:18] I was just um there there was a method

[1:28:20] to what I I was trying to operate with

[1:28:21] them

[1:28:22] and then I I truly think it's worth

[1:28:24] noting so don't want us to to lose this

[1:28:26] in semantics Mr Tor with all the respect

[1:28:28] your position has quite honestly been

[1:28:30] the clearest of supporting the mayor's

[1:28:33] proposed budget and I think in kind to M

[1:28:37] Mr Farley's uh comment is trying to

[1:28:40] understand where the adjustments could

[1:28:43] be made and trying to understand how we

[1:28:44] can best our work with the mayor U to to

[1:28:48] meet our our uh depleting uh timeline

[1:28:53] I just to clarify that with regards to

[1:28:54] arpa funding no arpa funding was used

[1:28:56] for water and so it was only used for um

[1:29:00] the

[1:29:03] ways go so do you want to talk about

[1:29:05] this now or are we going to move forward

[1:29:07] with um the other question before we

[1:29:10] talk about specifics because

[1:29:13] iess finance committee we don't need to

[1:29:17] recess because it's basically client

[1:29:20] well uh client lawyer privilege so

[1:29:24] that's not necessarily finance committee

[1:29:26] that's a body as a whole but I think

[1:29:29] that recess just to get through the

[1:29:31] agenda I think that's what we're saying

[1:29:32] and then so the people that are in the

[1:29:35] room I okay you make sense I understand

[1:29:39] go ahead my understanding of the recess

[1:29:40] process is we recess let's say during

[1:29:43] that discussion we come to some

[1:29:45] understanding then we've only recessed

[1:29:47] we have the opportunity to pass the

[1:29:48] budget out so I'm not saying could

[1:29:51] happen but we're leaving that room we're

[1:29:53] leaving the room for that to happen so

[1:29:55] recessing would allow that yes I

[1:29:57] understand that but that question was

[1:29:58] about the lawyer yeah two things could

[1:30:01] be true seems like they're

[1:30:04] both so are we

[1:30:08] recessing I make a motion to recess

[1:30:11] second all in favor the finance

[1:30:14] committee it recess thank you I'd like

[1:30:17] to follow order City development and

[1:30:18] planning we have eight items on the

[1:30:20] agenda the first first item is to

[1:30:23] request for the authorization purchase

[1:30:24] of chlorine gas 2024 for the water

[1:30:27] department Mr

[1:30:36] lefon tonight is to purchase replenish

[1:30:39] of supply of coring gas for the

[1:30:41] treatment of drinking water at the the W

[1:30:43] fields on Rice Road SP out every year

[1:30:47] this year's bid U if approved will be

[1:30:49] awarded to um jci Jones

[1:30:52] um in the amount of $91,200 which is

[1:30:55] $250 per cylinder which is roughly 365

[1:30:59] cylinders one cylinder per day um that's

[1:31:03] a slight decrease from last year how

[1:31:06] much those decreases $50 per cylind so

[1:31:09] we have to do the math

[1:31:11] 18,250 okay that's providing we use one

[1:31:15] per day and that varies it depends on

[1:31:17] how much water is the demand for and how

[1:31:19] much we treat so it's just a rough

[1:31:21] estimate usually about

[1:31:23] 365 that's our average so we would be

[1:31:25] saving around

[1:31:27] $188,000 okay are there any questions

[1:31:30] I'll move it second all in favor our

[1:31:33] second item is request to uh for

[1:31:35] authorization to purchase sodium

[1:31:37] hydrochloride 2024 for the wastewater

[1:31:39] treatment plan again um that is for

[1:31:42] disection of the waste water prior to

[1:31:45] entering the river um it's roughly uh

[1:31:49] 21,400 gallon or

[1:31:52] uh it's a slight decrease over last year

[1:31:56] 80 per gallon versus

[1:31:58] $24 last year we bid twice because of

[1:32:01] the demand for fing we did a six-month

[1:32:03] bid it came down a little bit more and

[1:32:05] this time we bid out for full year and

[1:32:07] the price should come down a little bit

[1:32:10] I do the math but oh I'm sorry it's

[1:32:12] $24,000 roughly in

[1:32:15] savings any questions I'll move it

[1:32:17] second all in favor thank you thank you

[1:32:21] we can save money we're

[1:32:23] happy um the next item on the agenda is

[1:32:26] for arbura contract update fortunately

[1:32:29] um Miss haror had a family um emergency

[1:32:33] that came up uh so she had to go take

[1:32:36] care of that and so she's ask that we

[1:32:38] just put that off pull that put that off

[1:32:40] for two weeks and she'll be here to

[1:32:42] um give us those

[1:32:46] updates okay um the final five items are

[1:32:50] for ex executive session for sale of

[1:32:54] properties so I would ask to go to the

[1:32:56] executive

[1:32:57] session so second all in

[1:33:00] favor okay we'll be going to Executive

[1:33:03] session so members of the public will

[1:33:04] have to

[1:33:06] leave and then and then we'll

[1:33:09] recom I think we're going to go through

[1:33:11] the then we' Rec combine no but I mean

[1:33:14] after that we Rec just so they

[1:33:20] know

[1:33:21] [Music]

[1:33:50] think

[1:34:20] for

[1:35:20] e

[1:37:50] for

[1:38:50] e

[1:45:49] for

[1:46:19] e

[1:58:48] for

[1:59:18] e

[2:01:30] you can

[2:01:31] see yeah there

[2:01:33] are what's that laptop what

[2:01:38] about oh all right okay so i' would like

[2:01:41] to reconvene the finance

[2:01:45] committee and just proba you want to

[2:01:48] take this back and

[2:01:50] just yeah proposal is yeah so as I

[2:01:54] mentioned earlier I think that um it it

[2:01:57] the best course of action is uh continue

[2:02:00] uh on the progress that we made um and

[2:02:04] get something agreable uh so we can pass

[2:02:06] a a budget for the people of city of

[2:02:08] connec um I I would like uh the

[2:02:12] council's favorable consideration of

[2:02:15] meeting um the mayor's uh water and

[2:02:18] sewer a rate at 100% of what his

[2:02:21] proposed rate was

[2:02:23] um as well as I know that Mr Mayor there

[2:02:26] was um uh one of key position in your

[2:02:30] staff that you

[2:02:33] uh wanted us to

[2:02:40] ad

[2:02:41] adjustment from the Cil perspective and

[2:02:44] just ask that that be put back to my

[2:02:46] recommendation what's can you can you

[2:02:48] tell us what the adjustment

[2:02:52] is so it's a position in your office

[2:02:55] correct yeah so I I uh I would ask the council

[2:03:00] to consider that uh as well

[2:03:05] um and also I'd like the council to

[2:03:08] consider uh um putting back a job one of

[2:03:12] the positions to our code enforcement um

[2:03:16] because

[2:03:17] uh

[2:03:20] we know that we need to uh do some work

[2:03:22] around that area with our code

[2:03:23] enforcement as we're trying to work to

[2:03:25] strengthen um The Code Enforcement here

[2:03:27] knowing that we just unfortunately um

[2:03:30] lost somebody out of that department we

[2:03:32] want to make sure that we have enough

[2:03:33] opportunity for people uh to apply and

[2:03:37] so I I think that that would be a good

[2:03:38] course of action as

[2:03:42] well just before I I just want to make

[2:03:44] sure we get the notes right so you're

[2:03:46] asking now that you're changing your

[2:03:48] previous proposal

[2:03:49] water 100% SE is 100% the W at 50% 100%

[2:03:55] of the of the mayor's uh proposed budget water for for water and

[2:04:00] sewer for water % for for Waste

[2:04:03] residential yes and you 75% he's

[2:04:07] changing it back to 100% instead of for

[2:04:09] the waste for waste down no 50 50 said I I I I said uh

[2:04:19] originally I said 50% Mr Mayor did you

[2:04:22] think that

[2:04:24] uh5 I think that

[2:04:26] um interesting how when you think you

[2:04:29] never think in a way that goes this way

[2:04:30] right but um uh again I I I don't think

[2:04:34] that that's um going to be a deal

[2:04:36] breaker for me I think that

[2:04:38] um I'd ask the council to consider that

[2:04:41] as well um and the small M very minor uh

[2:04:46] budget adjustment um for uh

[2:04:49] staff in the mayor's office and I think

[2:04:52] that if we can get there then we can get

[2:04:55] it

[2:04:56] done well I ask also the assistant

[2:04:59] Corporation counsel go back they need

[2:05:03] that code enforcement to do some of the

[2:05:06] revenue generation

[2:05:09] and Beyond Mr fr I appreciate this

[2:05:13] dialogue and thought this is then you

[2:05:16] put on the ballot in November an

[2:05:19] amendment to the Charter take to the

[2:05:20] voters and say that

[2:05:24] if a budget is not reached by November

[2:05:27] 1st it the mayor's budget is adopted

[2:05:31] there's other versions where it says it

[2:05:32] goes back to the prior year budget or

[2:05:35] some scenario which I'm open to the

[2:05:38] wording on that so it clears up uh again

[2:05:41] any question about what the process is

[2:05:43] with the outcomes so how many

[2:05:45] Corporation Council are there current

[2:05:47] how many assistant Corporation curent

[2:05:49] are they

[2:05:51] current positions I know they're not all

[2:05:53] people there but positions I don't so we

[2:05:56] asking just for

[2:06:02] one one slot in my budget dropped to

[2:06:06] $60,000 position and then the council is

[2:06:09] looking to take

[2:06:12] 82,000 I'm just asking that be

[2:06:14] reinstated so so how many so how many

[2:06:18] Corporation Council positions are there

[2:06:19] current we can look it up oh

[2:06:22] okay before we made our

[2:06:26] changes just got to find the right pars

[2:06:30] okay

[2:06:31] oops

[2:06:35] um looks like

[2:06:40] the in the do you want me to say this

[2:06:43] out loud yeah yeah okay so we have sheet

[2:06:46] of paper yeah pass it around um

[2:06:48] basically we had uh three assistant

[2:06:52] corporate councils but we only in the

[2:06:55] 2024 proposed mayor or a budget two of

[2:06:58] those would be um and there wasn't

[2:07:00] anybody in a third one before so two of

[2:07:03] them would would be uh in the mayor's

[2:07:06] budget and the Council budget was

[2:07:10] removing one so we would be coming back

[2:07:11] to

[2:07:13] two and it is true that that um position

[2:07:16] I believe in conversations I've had with

[2:07:18] the mayor is really important in terms

[2:07:20] of some of the um closings on on the

[2:07:23] property on the property

[2:07:27] Sal residential component of the homes

[2:07:31] progr yeah so it can help generate

[2:07:34] revenue and also like so we all because

[2:07:36] we all know that Mr C will not be with

[2:07:38] us at beginning of the year

[2:07:42] so we

[2:07:46] adding yeah

[2:07:56] so let so let me just be let me just

[2:07:58] recap just to make sure I'm getting it

[2:08:00] right because I've got a lot of C outs

[2:08:01] here so you're asking for Corporation

[2:08:04] Council me too that was in your proposed

[2:08:06] budget assistant assistant Corporation

[2:08:08] Council that was in your proposed budget

[2:08:11] the changes from what is basically the

[2:08:13] last version from the counil would be to

[2:08:16] reinstate one more Code Enforcement

[2:08:20] Officers

[2:08:21] the system Corporation Council and the

[2:08:26] minor adjustment to one position in my

[2:08:31] office um and then in s water you're

[2:08:35] saying 100% And then

[2:08:37] waste

[2:08:40] 50% 75 but if

[2:08:44] we went to the

[2:08:46] 50 not happy with but we had they're

[2:08:50] talking about putting the $100,000

[2:08:52] number for

[2:08:55] jackpots uh I

[2:08:58] would go with that and then just need

[2:09:01] from the council that early in January

[2:09:04] we'll look at oh yeah the jackpot

[2:09:07] component the fee on that so that in

[2:09:10] fact that becomes a realistic number

[2:09:12] because today I can't even though we

[2:09:14] agree to it there's no way for me to

[2:09:16] actually implement that in the field

[2:09:19] right and the then oh I'm

[2:09:21] sorry B chair's over there b CH please

[2:09:26] Sor no wor wor thought trying to put

[2:09:29] everything and also the nature I think

[2:09:32] uh to the nature of that Jack Pot fee if

[2:09:35] you will is that once we start to

[2:09:39] implement it then we can kind of expect

[2:09:41] for it to start to decrease cuz people

[2:09:43] will start to will start to deter people

[2:09:44] from putting that much garbage out so we

[2:09:47] can kind of have an expectation for that

[2:09:48] Mr

[2:09:50] leond late today sent me around notice

[2:09:54] of some of the fee adjustments and I

[2:09:55] think it's we estimat about

[2:10:01] $138,000 above what our assumptions were

[2:10:04] when we put the budget forth it's just

[2:10:07] Cost going

[2:10:10] up the

[2:10:12] reality get rid of the

[2:10:16] garbage so I just want to clarify

[2:10:19] that you're saying you'd go with 100% of

[2:10:22] what the mayor was suggesting for water

[2:10:24] and sewer that's correct and 50% with

[2:10:27] the Wass and

[2:10:29] $100,000 for the

[2:10:33] jackpot but the jackpot won't be a part

[2:10:36] of the suspens that's we put we would

[2:10:38] put a line in the budget for $100,000 in

[2:10:42] revenue for Waste we have to go

[2:10:45] back as quick as we can actually put the

[2:10:50] mechanism in for the jackpots in for

[2:10:53] that so in the revenue line okay so

[2:10:57] that's always nice that's Mr go ahead

[2:10:59] please um but so that still means this last dated 127 the last Council

[2:11:06] budget M was was at 50% of the waste uh

[2:11:11] charges as uh projected by the mayor so

[2:11:16] we would still be down 1.7 million in

[2:11:19] Revenue if we went with 50% of the waste

[2:11:21] fee I think but that was on residential

[2:11:23] was that's residential um no was it

[2:11:27] commercial no the commercial um you

[2:11:29] didn't do anything with resal commercial

[2:11:32] yeah it was all commercial I thought

[2:11:33] that um the majority of the council was

[2:11:35] trying to reduce the mayoral project the

[2:11:38] mayoral um request for refug this is my

[2:11:42] last go ahead try to put um instead of

[2:11:46] the budget that the mayor proposed of6

[2:11:48] 959

[2:11:50] 273 um the council was proposing U minus

[2:11:54] 1,732

[2:11:56] 990 no it has to do with um commercial

[2:12:00] we didn't touch anything on residential

[2:12:02] for

[2:12:03] we yeah I thought you were cutting all

[2:12:06] three fees by 50% in what you were

[2:12:09] trying to

[2:12:11] project

[2:12:12] then yeah could could

[2:12:17] be here to kind of give us the number so

[2:12:21] therefore we're not so this is the 50%

[2:12:24] commercial we didn't touch on

[2:12:25] residential so this 50% that is proposed

[2:12:28] by Mr Harley is that new for residential

[2:12:32] 50% and 50% for commercial that was

[2:12:36] already incorporated into these

[2:12:40] changes yes and now we're 50% that is

[2:12:45] new that is completely new Patrick we

[2:12:49] said no increase for waste that

[2:12:52] was any document you have in front of

[2:12:54] you show no increase for

[2:12:56] res 50% but it was only for the

[2:13:00] commercial res so could we get the

[2:13:03] numbers so so and then we can no we

[2:13:07] don't talking Mr Mr M so what's go ahead

[2:13:11] please no I don't have a question I just

[2:13:13] want to so if everybody understands the

[2:13:16] agreement there's no more questions at

[2:13:18] this point in time we would have to have

[2:13:20] um Mr ho run those numbers

[2:13:24] and Y and excuse me bring that back to

[2:13:29] the

[2:13:30] um finance committee so go ahead please

[2:13:33] well but except that there's still out

[2:13:35] there is the overtime um for the police

[2:13:37] and fire we haven't talked about that I

[2:13:39] mean I I guess I understand what you're

[2:13:42] saying about the fees so I guess

[2:13:43] although I think I was operating under a

[2:13:45] different idea all the way through all

[2:13:47] of our weeks of discussions in terms of

[2:13:49] what you were suggesting with those fees

[2:13:51] um but I still would like to talk about

[2:13:54] the overtime for the police and the and the

[2:13:57] fire um I think there were and then I

[2:14:00] want to go back and look at these

[2:14:01] positions as well um in terms of you

[2:14:06] know I mean there you know I don't know

[2:14:08] there's still things that I was in

[2:14:10] disagreement with I think my colleagues

[2:14:11] are as well but I don't know we haven't

[2:14:13] had that conversation

[2:14:16] but

[2:14:19] so I'm not ready to vote until we you

[2:14:22] know look at this so what happens

[2:14:24] tonight is comes out of Finance so the

[2:14:26] finance committee would voted out

[2:14:28] whatever whatever we discuss tonight I

[2:14:30] see but I thought but then and then we'd

[2:14:32] have to have a special meeting again to

[2:14:34] try to vote on the budget we can't vote

[2:14:35] on the budget in other words we can't

[2:14:41] vot I would

[2:14:44] suggest people are in agreement with

[2:14:47] that General

[2:14:50] package people aren't necessarily 100%

[2:14:52] happy is that and president either you

[2:14:55] or one of the members of the council

[2:14:57] call for a special meeting on

[2:14:59] Thursday we'll have the numbers worked

[2:15:02] up tomorrow morning send out to the

[2:15:05] council doesn't have to go through the

[2:15:07] finance committee there'll be one item

[2:15:09] on the agenda for Thursday if we vote on

[2:15:13] a new

[2:15:16] budget so we we will not have to pass

[2:15:18] the start of

[2:15:20] Finance if you're calling for a special

[2:15:23] meeting we call for a special meeting

[2:15:24] you don't have to have an amendment come

[2:15:26] out committee

[2:15:31] process but the notice has to say I'm

[2:15:33] sorry but the notice has to say what the

[2:15:36] special meeting is for what youve done

[2:15:39] before

[2:15:41] than just so

[2:15:46] very

[2:15:53] let's see so we we can get any number to

[2:15:56] work I know stand your point very TR to

[2:15:59] come to see where we are in terms of

[2:16:00] these changes in terms of moving to 100%

[2:16:03] on water SE moving to 50% on residential

[2:16:07] wayte with 100 100,000 for jackpot code

[2:16:10] enforcement position going back and the

[2:16:13] mayor's office the $3,000 production and

[2:16:16] the assistant cooperation one position

[2:16:18] go that um and and would we keep the

[2:16:21] commercial um waste feed increase that

[2:16:24] we discussed yes the commercial will

[2:16:26] stay at the same

[2:16:27] 50% for

[2:16:30] Le uh go ahead please so um are we going

[2:16:34] to be asking the finance department to

[2:16:36] work of what we discussing that's I was

[2:16:37] going to

[2:16:38] ask have that in front of us I mean a

[2:16:43] few we're in conceptual agreement can

[2:16:46] put the numbers

[2:16:49] together first thing tomorrow morning

[2:16:51] and get them out to you by the later

[2:16:53] part of the

[2:16:54] morning I'm AG for resolution that would

[2:16:58] be acted upon on Thursday Mr to get to

[2:17:03] miss patri point I mean there will not

[2:17:04] be an opportunity to discuss some of the

[2:17:06] things you are talking about I'm feeling

[2:17:08] like there were discussions that

[2:17:09] happened that I certainly was not a part

[2:17:11] of I don't know if any of my colleagues

[2:17:12] were a part of it it sounds like Mr

[2:17:14] Farley I'm H I'm fine that you know Mr

[2:17:16] Farley seems to have talked to the mayor

[2:17:19] but I'm just wondering if other people

[2:17:20] have also had any conversations I'm

[2:17:22] feeling a little as though um you know

[2:17:25] some stuff has happened that I just

[2:17:27] wasn't aware about because it did so

[2:17:30] okay just wanted to make sure but but I

[2:17:32] think it's really important that um you

[2:17:34] know I didn't I didn't have to have any

[2:17:37] special permission no I know I tried I

[2:17:40] tried to go see the mayor myself any

[2:17:42] other members right so I think that you

[2:17:43] know um just didn't so you for as well

[2:17:47] taken and understood so um I would uh

[2:17:52] move for with that course of action

[2:17:54] of give those numbers to us first St in

[2:17:57] the morning call a special

[2:17:58] meeting I'm Happ the scenario but the

[2:18:02] other option is start an action tomorrow

[2:18:05] I hear that in Supreme

[2:18:07] Court have resolved and I'm also going

[2:18:09] to start lay off notices I shouldn't say

[2:18:12] layoff but fur notices where won't be a

[2:18:15] budget in place don't be you expend any

[2:18:18] funds and

[2:18:21] so people aren't going to get paid so

[2:18:23] you get a whole level of Havoc as

[2:18:27] opposed

[2:18:29] to a less than optimal scenario from

[2:18:33] everybody's perspective in the agreement

[2:18:36] that we put something on the ballot in

[2:18:38] November that will clarify this

[2:18:42] for individuals in the future I'm

[2:18:44] completely in favor of that by the way

[2:18:47] the charter thing we wouldn't be in the

[2:18:50] trouble we're in right now please and

[2:18:52] I'd like to know what what everyone's

[2:18:53] opinion is on on bringing back the

[2:18:56] police uh refunding the police overtime

[2:18:59] the uh police detective over time the

[2:19:03] fire department over time the additional

[2:19:05] jobs that were taken out of the budget

[2:19:08] um that we need

[2:19:10] to I mean we if fin I talked about some of those

[2:19:19] [Music]

[2:19:21] positions and at this point we're doing

[2:19:24] recruitment if during the course of the

[2:19:27] year I have to come back to the council

[2:19:30] for authority to follow those I will do

[2:19:36] that I just feel like we're being held

[2:19:39] hostage

[2:19:40] without oh yes I feel

[2:19:46] the

[2:19:48] okay okay so when first come sorry

[2:19:51] Mr it's truly important to identify that

[2:19:55] if you are now indicating that you are

[2:19:56] interested in negotiating it is truly

[2:20:00] beyond that point and I think at this

[2:20:02] current juncture I truly appreciate Mr

[2:20:05] Farley for taking it upon himself to try

[2:20:08] and identify best means that gets a

[2:20:10] budget pass for the city I can

[2:20:12] specifically speak for myself these

[2:20:14] numbers definitely transition greatly

[2:20:17] from what I was open to however

[2:20:20] understanding how do we present a budget

[2:20:22] so that the mayor does not have to

[2:20:23] proceed in the manner that he is

[2:20:25] indicated at the beginning of our

[2:20:26] meeting is important so once again no

[2:20:29] one is leaving this process entirely

[2:20:31] happy that is honestly the definition of

[2:20:34] negotiating I hope that next year we can

[2:20:38] have a more uh clean and productive

[2:20:40] conversation from the onset because we

[2:20:42] had time uh that that that that is where

[2:20:46] we currently are go okay I am somewhat

[2:20:49] offended by Mr Williams remarks and I'm

[2:20:52] sorry uh to say this but I think that we

[2:20:54] were open to negotiating I think we've

[2:20:56] spent hours and hours and hours trying

[2:20:58] to negotiate so I I think that we've had

[2:21:02] negotiations at every single one of

[2:21:04] these budget meetings um we just

[2:21:06] couldn't come to agreement over some of

[2:21:09] the things sometimes that's what happens

[2:21:11] in a negotiation I certainly don't have

[2:21:13] to be taught what a negotiation is at

[2:21:16] this juncture in my professional uh

[2:21:19] career so I do want to just

[2:21:21] unfortunately that just raised my eye um

[2:21:25] that you don't often see here at this

[2:21:27] table um but I I do need to at least be

[2:21:30] clear about that um I think I you know I

[2:21:35] think we absolutely have to do something

[2:21:37] to the Charter um because clearly you

[2:21:42] know something has to be fixed in the

[2:21:44] future so that a a future city council

[2:21:47] will not have to get to this point that

[2:21:49] we have gotten to um but I do think that

[2:21:52] uh and I also want to go back to what

[2:21:54] you were saying Mr farle earlier I think

[2:21:55] there probably might have been some

[2:21:57] political kinds of things that were

[2:21:58] happening I didn't feel that they were

[2:22:00] on my end certainly but I did feel that

[2:22:03] those of us that were up for reelection

[2:22:05] actually might have been targeted um by

[2:22:08] some of the I'm just being completely

[2:22:09] open and honest now um that we were

[2:22:12] targeted before the election um with

[2:22:15] these budget negotiations um however I

[2:22:17] was I actually felt that after the

[2:22:19] election was over perhaps we were going

[2:22:21] to be able to come to more um compromise

[2:22:24] which did not happen right after the

[2:22:25] election so I was I was somewhat shocked

[2:22:27] by that um so you're hearing a lot of

[2:22:30] anger at this point that I have been uh

[2:22:33] holding in um but I do agree with the

[2:22:36] charter piece um from from both parties

[2:22:39] here um and I do think that there's

[2:22:41] other positions that I feel badly if we

[2:22:44] don't um have them back into the budget

[2:22:47] um so and I think there's things that

[2:22:50] are in this Council budget that we don't

[2:22:53] need to be spending money on so there's that as well so I've kind of

[2:22:57] kept my silence uh previously but that

[2:23:00] just really upset me go ahead please

[2:23:03] thank you f so like I always say how you

[2:23:05] see it depends on where you sit and I

[2:23:07] think that I don't believe that any of

[2:23:08] us feel that we're walking away with

[2:23:10] everything that we would have hoped for

[2:23:12] and um and I'm not angry at anyone just

[2:23:15] to be clear because about this is about

[2:23:18] us as a council working together to get

[2:23:20] to a place where we can agree and we're

[2:23:22] not 100% there but we're at a place

[2:23:24] where we can pass the budget out and

[2:23:25] that's that's been our goal and I um I

[2:23:28] think it's unfortunate that it took

[2:23:30] someone saying something to to for for

[2:23:32] us to speak out about what's um what

[2:23:35] your what you were feeling it would have

[2:23:36] been ideal to hear those things so I

[2:23:40] don't want this to get to a place that

[2:23:41] we're Guided by our emotions you know we

[2:23:44] should be guided by what is the best um

[2:23:47] for the residents connected I think

[2:23:48] we've come to a place that's not ideal

[2:23:50] has been stated numerous times including

[2:23:53] by the mayor but again what he's also

[2:23:55] said and with everyone a council member

[2:23:57] know is that if it comes time that we

[2:23:59] need to amend the budget reappropriate

[2:24:01] it's been done throughout the years so

[2:24:04] it is something that we can do so at

[2:24:06] this point in time we're at a position

[2:24:08] where we can um not have an IDE have an

[2:24:11] idea but be able to move forward and

[2:24:13] pass the budget I it's up to you Mr M I

[2:24:17] hear what you're saying I think that all

[2:24:18] of us probably understood that we could

[2:24:20] have made amendments um and we could

[2:24:22] have solved this budget issue you know

[2:24:25] weeks ago um so I hear what you're

[2:24:28] saying but we we I think we all knew

[2:24:30] that um so back to what Mr Farley said

[2:24:34] um you know why why didn't you do it

[2:24:36] weeks ago so yes I've usually tried to

[2:24:38] keep myself very calm and you're right

[2:24:41] emotion is coming in tonight because um

[2:24:45] yeah got let me just address I mean yes

[2:24:48] at the beginning everyone was some of us

[2:24:50] participate you participate then next

[2:24:53] day you came back with a statement

[2:24:55] prepare statement and read it yes so the

[2:24:57] council and then you dug your heels in

[2:24:59] that we should support the mayor's

[2:25:01] Budget on the and the time so I'm not

[2:25:03] sure how can you have a true negotiation

[2:25:06] when you're stuck in you know the

[2:25:07] mayor's so you score the mayor's budget

[2:25:09] right so then how can we have a fruitful

[2:25:12] negotiation or discussion with regards

[2:25:14] to how we move forward Okay so I want to

[2:25:17] address that because we're not open to

[2:25:19] negotiation if you says well I support

[2:25:22] this well I was trying

[2:25:24] to I will say in in defense of myself

[2:25:27] that I was trying because I remember all

[2:25:30] these things has happened so so at this

[2:25:33] point I think it's important that I'm

[2:25:35] not going to invalidate anyone's

[2:25:37] feelings at the table okay I think that

[2:25:39] we all care about our city greatly and I

[2:25:42] think that so when you care about

[2:25:44] something you love something when you

[2:25:46] feel that something's is happening

[2:25:47] that's not right it can it can you know

[2:25:50] produce some emotions so I'm not going

[2:25:51] to validate anybody's experience but I

[2:25:54] will say that right now the conversation

[2:25:57] is becoming a little circular and we

[2:25:59] might start to try to relitigate things

[2:26:01] that have have have happened and I think

[2:26:03] that the best course of action is to uh

[2:26:07] kind of be more Mindful and and and be

[2:26:10] intentional about creating space for

[2:26:11] people to make sure that they're sharing

[2:26:13] their opinions and being heard moving

[2:26:14] forward and at this point I would really

[2:26:16] suest that we

[2:26:19] um move forward with some action

[2:26:22] and so question question for May the

[2:26:25] mayor you're okay with the discussion

[2:26:28] proposal on the table going 100% with

[2:26:30] your fees of water so 50% as the

[2:26:34] discussion with you Mr Harley for

[2:26:35] residential ways $100,000 for a jackpack

[2:26:39] and the revenue line and you going to do

[2:26:41] the in andout code position the mayor's

[2:26:44] office to fund that position back to

[2:26:47] where was proposed from the mayor and

[2:26:50] the assistant Corporation

[2:26:52] Council I'm trying to to make sure

[2:26:56] [Music]

[2:27:02] that no no no no

[2:27:08] information I think we can make that

[2:27:10] work get numbers not going to ask D put

[2:27:14] together tonight but have it first well

[2:27:17] you want tonight back to have that in

[2:27:21] place and then again the

[2:27:26] understanding I think we'll come

[2:27:28] together and be all semiha happppy we

[2:27:30] only slightly irritated the real point

[2:27:33] of negotiation still BEC comes with the

[2:27:35] jackpot which sounds like a simple thing

[2:27:38] but the mechanics ofing how much we're

[2:27:42] going to classify the jackpot how we do

[2:27:45] the accounting how we do the billing how

[2:27:47] we document that is not a simple process

[2:27:52] and so it's going to require everybody

[2:27:54] looking at it keeping an open mind

[2:27:56] working with the staff uh there may be

[2:27:59] scenarios there where we could get more

[2:28:02] Revenue out of those uh sites that

[2:28:06] generate more cost and it's we all know

[2:28:10] it's out there we have a great

[2:28:12] system really a very

[2:28:14] efficient uh

[2:28:17] operation in terms of waste collection

[2:28:19] but there are some people who drive a

[2:28:22] very small component of the cost and

[2:28:25] there's other people who drive a much

[2:28:27] larger component with the cost and how

[2:28:29] do we again

[2:28:33] allocate the fees to reflect

[2:28:41] that so what I'm hearing is that we

[2:28:43] can't get this tonight so we'll get this

[2:28:45] done tomorrow to the council I'm still

[2:28:48] like I understand your pointment where

[2:28:50] we um we don't I'm thinking of we should

[2:28:52] still resets finance committee so once

[2:28:55] we have these numbers we can look at

[2:28:57] some of the other

[2:28:59] stuff there is there it's the tax bills

[2:29:02] have to go up component of the charter

[2:29:06] which you post the tax it only applies

[2:29:09] to the upcoming year so I would again

[2:29:14] look for a Thursday meeting that's

[2:29:17] one when you prepare the notice you let

[2:29:20] me know I'll have the police department

[2:29:22] deliver the

[2:29:25] notice

[2:29:28] got yeah

[2:29:30] so yeah so I I we can lower that

[2:29:33] overtime

[2:29:35] budget well we're getting Dron so that's

[2:29:38] going to help tremendously all right let

[2:29:39] not let's this this a serious business

[2:29:42] here so let's work those numbers up um

[2:29:45] get it back to us tomorrow

[2:29:47] um by 11 as early as you can let's look

[2:29:51] at all these changes that was proposed I

[2:29:53] just want to confirm changes they

[2:29:55] discussing 100% uh water and silver the

[2:29:58] budget uh 50% waste uh you want to um

[2:30:03] bringing back a code enforcement officer

[2:30:05] um bring back the original salary of the

[2:30:09] mayor's position his uh budget um add

[2:30:13] assistant Corporation Council back uh

[2:30:16] Bara there any changes in the Council

[2:30:21] salaries that's I'm just the way it says

[2:30:23] residential we can leave the proposal

[2:30:27] that for the council

[2:30:30] salary

[2:30:36] um support the

[2:30:39] pay but so okay go ahead please so now

[2:30:43] I'm really confused so are we going to

[2:30:45] come back on Thursday today but we're

[2:30:47] not going to discuss this budget any

[2:30:48] longer we're just going to come back and

[2:30:50] vote it's on whatever the numbers are

[2:30:52] coming in tomorrow to us but that's what

[2:30:55] I was proposing just that I think that I

[2:30:57] we should recess the finance just for

[2:30:59] the sake of in case we need to meet and

[2:31:02] be other the safe side Mr because it

[2:31:04] sounds like I mean just hearing that for

[2:31:06] example it sounds like some of these

[2:31:09] other things are still going to be part

[2:31:10] of the numbers that we're going to see

[2:31:12] tomorrow right Mr well that is part of

[2:31:15] the original change of

[2:31:16] yeah yeah the only the only changes we

[2:31:19] making the code enforcement the mayor's

[2:31:22] office change and the assistant change

[2:31:25] in terms of positions Mr a

[2:31:29] question during city council meeting

[2:31:32] presumably you'd be doing aoll call vote

[2:31:35] You' have an opportunity to discuss

[2:31:39] items um during that special

[2:31:45] counil to discuss whatever you receive

[2:31:49] from the finance um department and you

[2:31:52] know you that's your time to do it

[2:31:54] during that discussion period and Hammer

[2:31:57] anything out and make any changes you

[2:31:59] know through a motion um if

[2:32:04] necessary so there I can understand why

[2:32:07] you may feel a need to recess when

[2:32:10] people get the numbers want people to

[2:32:13] look at now there still may be what I

[2:32:15] call them dime

[2:32:18] adjustments I'm open to those hope

[2:32:21] council members would keep an open mind

[2:32:23] to it but the option is that the police

[2:32:27] department fire department that we're

[2:32:29] moving down the path of shutting the

[2:32:31] city down and if I don't have an

[2:32:33] agreement tonight I'm going to start

[2:32:36] supreme court tomorrow which is not

[2:32:38] going to happen overnight you know be an

[2:32:42] expedited case but to litigate it and in

[2:32:47] scenario of just putting it out the

[2:32:48] ballot November is simpler and gives us

[2:32:52] something to work for it that we in all

[2:32:55] likelihood are going to be back here

[2:32:57] next year talking

[2:32:58] [Music]

[2:32:59] about garbage fees because our costs are

[2:33:03] up

[2:33:04] and they're always there

[2:33:09] so so I guess one more question in this

[2:33:13] one would be for Corporation Council so

[2:33:15] um special meeting but then we have our

[2:33:18] Monday council meeting and that's where

[2:33:20] basically I mean this budget doesn't

[2:33:22] have to pass unanimously correct what's

[2:33:24] the number of people four four

[2:33:27] [Music]

[2:33:32] okay I don't believe you have a council

[2:33:34] meeting

[2:33:35] on Tuesday the day after Christmas is Monday we're not coming vot

[2:33:41] for it well there's there's seven of us

[2:33:44] three of us probably

[2:33:50] right oh go ahead please we be able to

[2:33:53] uh because we had this circumstance with

[2:33:55] Mr P um would we be able to explain our

[2:33:59] vote when you will explain there

[2:34:02] discussion we'll discuss it and then we

[2:34:04] then we'll go to voting so you'll have

[2:34:06] you can take as long as you your

[2:34:08] positions are right read whatever that

[2:34:09] you have and then any discussion on

[2:34:14] Section we're still to discuss it to to

[2:34:18] explain our vote when we vote that's not

[2:34:20] in the

[2:34:21] charter Mr F can you address that I

[2:34:25] think um I our code adopts the Rober

[2:34:30] schools of order unless is an exception

[2:34:34] right right so if there's nothing in our

[2:34:36] code that says what happens during the

[2:34:38] roll call vote we fall back on Rob schs

[2:34:41] Council can suspend the rules we have an

[2:34:43] agreement tonight that everybody can

[2:34:45] talk as long as they want we routinely

[2:34:47] don't the problem but well we all right

[2:34:51] let's let's have a so Mr what Mr colini

[2:34:54] wants is to not have his discussion to

[2:34:56] wait until it's time to vote when so

[2:35:00] hope we're voting part of everybody will

[2:35:04] so I'm requesting we go by what the code

[2:35:06] says and we follow the Roberts Rules of

[2:35:07] Order and if we haven't it's because

[2:35:09] we've been able to to have these

[2:35:11] discussions in a very amicable way and

[2:35:14] since that has we moved away from that

[2:35:17] then we should be following Robert rules

[2:35:19] of orders and we're quickly returning to

[2:35:21] that let's go so just move there you

[2:35:26] want to wrap this up well then you can't

[2:35:30] just going forward you can't just sit

[2:35:33] there and say we're going to file

[2:35:35] Robert's rules on this time but this

[2:35:37] time we're not no that's not what that's what's happened for years

[2:35:41] well we're going to change that that's

[2:35:44] all I'm saying okay

[2:35:46] go ahead please no I was just looking

[2:35:48] for you to go ahead and wrap up the

[2:35:54] business so it seems like we already got

[2:35:56] the uh the notice of a meeting so then I

[2:36:00] guess you would just be so so so you

[2:36:03] don't need to recess so then we just

[2:36:06] need to adjourn according to okay I'm

[2:36:08] sorry yeah you know that's that's my

[2:36:10] question I'm just yeah that's what I was

[2:36:11] thinking about recess or a jar and me go

[2:36:14] straight to the special council meeting

[2:36:16] and present the numbers at the council

[2:36:20] meeting next

[2:36:21] Thursday and if there's any changes

[2:36:24] we'll do

[2:36:25] amendments from the floor so I'm going

[2:36:29] to send out all the

[2:36:32] changes so if anybody has any questions

[2:36:35] when they see it hopefully by consensus

[2:36:39] we could

[2:36:44] agre

[2:36:48] I'm

[2:36:52] sorry we need a position in terms of

[2:36:54] who's going to support um what is on the

[2:36:57] table right now is

[2:36:58] that I mean that's what I'm trying to

[2:37:01] conceptual support for that among the

[2:37:03] council as a

[2:37:04] whole I would support it I support it no

[2:37:10] I don't even know what I'm

[2:37:11] supporting so until I see those

[2:37:14] numbers

[2:37:17] I'm not I think

[2:37:20] that's so but I don't think it really

[2:37:22] matter I guess what I'm trying to say is

[2:37:24] I don't really think it matters honestly

[2:37:26] and um because you

[2:37:28] only you only need four votes so I think

[2:37:31] um you know I'd like people

[2:37:35] to think about their

[2:37:37] position

[2:37:39] and taking me big effort to come to this

[2:37:44] point MH

[2:37:47] would appreciate a 70

[2:37:52] vote I mean my position was very clear

[2:37:54] from the beginning of this budget that

[2:37:56] in terms of fees and taxes increased um

[2:37:59] toward works and taxpayer has to Bear

[2:38:01] the BRS of it it is no secret that I

[2:38:03] made objection to that from the

[2:38:04] beginning all the way to the end of it

[2:38:07] um I sticking that in terms of what but

[2:38:10] at some point we need to compromise and

[2:38:11] that's why we need budget negotiation

[2:38:13] compromise we can't dig our HS in the

[2:38:15] sand and say

[2:38:16] I support this I'm not going to do any

[2:38:18] single thing I mean

[2:38:20] I appreciate Mr Farley and discussion I

[2:38:24] was expecting so much of increase I

[2:38:26] thought maybe you would you know meet to

[2:38:28] the

[2:38:29] middle in the sake of compromise but we

[2:38:33] all should do going forward I am going

[2:38:36] to We Up support

[2:38:38] this I don't like it but I have to

[2:38:42] support it so that we can move

[2:38:44] forward

[2:38:47] I guess um I appreciate that we're

[2:38:50] keeping the fees uh at least two of the

[2:38:52] three fees um because you know I can't

[2:38:56] tell you how many times I heard well

[2:38:57] we're going to have to increase Revenue

[2:38:59] well the reality is that how you

[2:39:01] increase Revenue in a municipality is

[2:39:03] through these fees um I've been

[2:39:06] maintaining right from the start that

[2:39:07] the fact that the council wouldn't

[2:39:09] raiseed the fees last year to what uh

[2:39:12] the mayor had um and the finance commit

[2:39:15] commissioner had asked for is what put

[2:39:17] us um behind the eightball in starting

[2:39:19] these negotiations this year um so I

[2:39:23] just want to be clear about that but I

[2:39:24] also still feel that we're affecting

[2:39:27] Public Safety um without U reconsidering

[2:39:31] the overtime increases for the police

[2:39:33] and fire I think especially when I think

[2:39:35] about the reality of um Chief Marino's

[2:39:38] budget just in particular I'll just

[2:39:40] throw out there that I know he gave us a

[2:39:41] very realistic figure um it's true that I I I just have to say that we'll

[2:39:48] be back here in April um basically

[2:39:51] making an amendment to put more money

[2:39:53] into the overtime if we don't pass the

[2:39:55] overtime now um you know it's going to

[2:39:59] we're going to need it um so you know I understand compromise I definitely do

[2:40:05] um but I just have to State for the

[2:40:08] record that this process

[2:40:12] was incredibly flawed um um

[2:40:17] and I don't know well I mean you can

[2:40:21] this PL I

[2:40:22] mean we all as a council should get more

[2:40:25] involved we we had some meeting here and

[2:40:28] there's maybe zero communication from

[2:40:30] some members that no participation was so minimal in terms of

[2:40:35] what presented what you wanted to offer

[2:40:38] is there any anything so we talk about

[2:40:40] that yes we increase fee but we got look

[2:40:42] at the tax pays we cannot continue we

[2:40:45] can I just continue to say okay we're

[2:40:47] going to increase you know maintain

[2:40:49] service increase service and pass it on

[2:40:51] to the back of taxpayer we have to look

[2:40:53] we as a counil have to look how do we

[2:40:55] expand our Revenue look at fees the all

[2:40:58] fees that we have structur look at how

[2:41:00] we go back and look at the pilot project

[2:41:03] I don't know we need to discuss that how

[2:41:04] can we able to address some of those

[2:41:06] things expand our Revenue we as a counil

[2:41:09] should do that then we we got

[2:41:11] to stop looking at passing down tax pay

[2:41:14] tiing my b we need to talk to department

[2:41:17] heads not we I'm just making a statement

[2:41:20] department head need to look at

[2:41:21] tightening the belt we cannot have

[2:41:22] outter control spending year after year

[2:41:25] how do we CL and that and let say let's

[2:41:27] be

[2:41:28] accountable those are the things we have

[2:41:30] we here as a council represent our

[2:41:34] taxpayers and we cannot continue to do

[2:41:36] that over and over every year where what

[2:41:39] is the purpose

[2:41:42] of so I just want to say that again I think that the conversation is

[2:41:46] starting to become a little circular and

[2:41:49] I think that um I don't want to

[2:41:50] invalidate anyone's feelings or

[2:41:52] experience that they have gone through

[2:41:54] at the table otherwise but at this point

[2:41:57] I think that there's a reasonable action

[2:42:00] to be taken ahead of us I would just

[2:42:02] urge the council to let's move in that

[2:42:05] direction and there will be time for

[2:42:08] discussion um and I think that we

[2:42:11] discussed it at that time but at this

[2:42:12] point I would just urge us to um call

[2:42:15] our adjournment um allow this uh

[2:42:19] gentleman here to do uh his job and then

[2:42:21] let's uh

[2:42:23] reconvene just want to analis before we adj please so the public is

[2:42:32] aware thank

[2:42:34] you so um we will adjourn um finance and

[2:42:39] then we will call for a special city

[2:42:40] council meeting on Thursday December

[2:42:43] 21st at 5:30 right here at City Hall

[2:42:46] 105j Street room 110 and the purpose

[2:42:49] would be for the SKC city council to

[2:42:51] pass 2024 operating budget and capital

[2:42:54] budget for the city of skincity asking

[2:42:56] that all City Council Members be present

[2:42:58] do you have any uh questions or you want

[2:43:00] additional information about this you

[2:43:02] can uh contact our city clerk Samantha

[2:43:04] Miku at 518 38251

[2:43:08] 95 okay motion toor finance committee

[2:43:13] second second all favor all

[2:43:18] [Music]

[2:43:29] all when

[2:43:44] you

Schenectady City Council Committee Meeting, December 18, 2023

Transcript