[0:25] Reply to statements made or answered questions raised answered questions raised during public comment, but may during public comment, but may add items present you to a add items present you to a future agenda. Does anybody future agenda. Does anybody have any comments that wish to have any comments that wish to make? Not seeing any.

[0:35] Moving on make? Not seeing any. Moving on to our consent agenda for 26 to our consent agenda for 26 Captain Bangs Road, AR 2677. I Captain Bangs Road, AR 2677. I get a motion. get a motion. Uh, move to approve item five A Uh, move to approve item five A on the consent agenda.

[0:45] on the consent agenda. Second. All those in favor? Second. All those in favor? Aye. Chair. Votes. Motion Aye. Chair. Votes. Motion passes unanimously. Next passes unanimously. Next request for determination of request for determination of ability for 21 High Point ability for 21 High Point Drive.

[0:52] Vicki L Weber, trustee, Drive. Vicki L Weber, trustee, and David E Berman, trustee, and David E Berman, trustee, proposed, in addition to a proposed, in addition to a single family dwelling within single family dwelling within the buffer to land subject to the buffer to land subject to flooding. flooding. Yes. Yes. Hi, I'm Vicki Weber.

[1:09] This is my Hi, I'm Vicki Weber. This is my husband, David Berman. husband, David Berman. Just go over the project you Just go over the project you have before us. have before us. Um, sure we are. Um, renovating Um, sure we are.

[1:24] Um, renovating a 1963 house that's had some a 1963 house that's had some awkward renovations in the awkward renovations in the past. And as part of that, past. And as part of that, we're building a new entryway we're building a new entryway that faces the driveway, which that faces the driveway, which will add about 150ft. It'll be will add about 150ft.

[1:35] It'll be a small mudroom with internal a small mudroom with internal stairs leading up to the main stairs leading up to the main floor of the house, which will floor of the house, which will allow us to get rid of some allow us to get rid of some external deck stairs that are external deck stairs that are now used as the main entry, so

[1:44] now used as the main entry, so it'll be easier and safer. And it'll be easier and safer. And then, as part of the, um, due then, as part of the, um, due diligence around getting the diligence around getting the permit, it was discovered that permit, it was discovered that the FEMA flood map indicates

[1:58] the FEMA flood map indicates that there is a flood zone that that there is a flood zone that comes up about three quarters comes up about three quarters of the way up and 85 foot tall of the way up and 85 foot tall slope.

[2:10] Um, and so the buffer slope. Um, and so the buffer for that, um, goes to outside for that, um, goes to outside the bounds of the addition, the bounds of the addition, which is what brings us here which is what brings us here tonight. tonight. Okay. All right. Bill. Yeah. Okay. All right. Bill. Yeah.

[2:22] Um, Gaby was interacting on Um, Gaby was interacting on this one and did a very nice this one and did a very nice job. Um, what, um, what Vicki job. Um, what, um, what Vicki is saying is all correct. I is saying is all correct.

[2:30] I just wanted to add in a couple just wanted to add in a couple other things to. There was one other things to. There was one permanent structures that we've permanent structures that we've talked about, and the talked about, and the commission knows about, and commission knows about, and that will come in and roll in

[2:37] that will come in and roll in on good time and so on. I just on good time and so on. I just want to pick up a couple other want to pick up a couple other things that do not affect this things that do not affect this project.

[2:43] But down the road they project. But down the road they might. So I just thought I'd might. So I just thought I'd bring them up so we could use bring them up so we could use dimensions in general on the dimensions in general on the projects. Uh, Commissioner projects.

[2:50] Uh, Commissioner Slovak has asked for that in Slovak has asked for that in the past. Doesn't affect this the past. Doesn't affect this particular project, but going particular project, but going forward, the impervious is only forward, the impervious is only 467ft. So it's under the 467ft. So it's under the threshold for a minor threshold for a minor stormwater permit.

[3:01] So that's stormwater permit. So that's great. And that was on the great. And that was on the plan. Um, there's a small plan. Um, there's a small discrepancy between the discrepancy between the delineation date that Paul delineation date that Paul Shea, um, provided, which was Shea, um, provided, which was ten 21 2025.

[3:11] And what's on the ten 21 2025. And what's on the plan? No big deal. But plan? No big deal. But sometimes that matters. Um, box sometimes that matters. Um, box B was not checked, so they're B was not checked, so they're not asking for the delineation. not asking for the delineation.

[3:21] Um, the site plan also should Um, the site plan also should include priority habitat, but include priority habitat, but in this case, the priority in this case, the priority habitat as well. Down gradient habitat as well. Down gradient of the proposed work that might of the proposed work that might affect some of the other work.

[3:30] affect some of the other work. Um, and that's all I have. I Um, and that's all I have. I would suggest approval. Um, would suggest approval. Um, this one is a little tricky this one is a little tricky because it has a very unique because it has a very unique thing.

[3:40] Um, this is a bylaw only thing. Um, this is a bylaw only jurisdiction. So a positive jurisdiction. So a positive five, a positive six for the five, a positive six for the work under the bylaw only and a work under the bylaw only and a negative number three in the negative number three in the buffer zone. Okay. Most any.

[3:49] buffer zone. Okay. Most any. Moved sorry questions from the Moved sorry questions from the commissioners. No hearing any. commissioners. No hearing any. Then I get a motion. Then I get a motion. Move to approve a positive Move to approve a positive determination. Number five for determination. Number five for the bylaw.

[3:56] Positive the bylaw. Positive determination number six for determination number six for work and bylaw only. And a work and bylaw only. And a negative determination number negative determination number three for work in the buffer three for work in the buffer zone to land subject to zone to land subject to flooding for the construction

[4:03] flooding for the construction of an addition at 2001 High of an addition at 2001 High Point Drive with standard Point Drive with standard special conditions. special conditions. Second, all those in favor? Second, all those in favor? Aye. Chair votes. Our motion Aye. Chair votes. Our motion passes unanimously. All right.

[4:10] passes unanimously. All right. Thank you. Good luck. Thank Thank you. Good luck. Thank you, thank you. All right. Next you, thank you. All right. Next we have a notice from ten for we have a notice from ten for one, 45 Chapman Lane, rear. Get one, 45 Chapman Lane, rear. Get down. To share with.

[4:41] down. To share with. Of last year. Of last year. Okay. Evening, John. Okay. Okay. Evening, John. Okay. Good evening. Uh, for the Good evening. Uh, for the record, I'm John O'Reilly. Back record, I'm John O'Reilly. Back again with me tonight. Tonight again with me tonight. Tonight is attorney Riley from is attorney Riley from Norcross. Riley.

[4:56] Norcross. Riley. Good evening. Good evening. Good evening. Good evening. Um, we met two weeks ago. Um, Um, we met two weeks ago. Um, board authorized staff to board authorized staff to generate draft conditions, generate draft conditions, which we got today. Um, Theresa which we got today. Um, Theresa Spray is also on the line.

[5:13] Uh, Spray is also on the line. Uh, she wasn't able to come in she wasn't able to come in person, but she did provide a person, but she did provide a up to date and up to date, um, up to date and up to date, um, restoration plan.

[5:22] Um, which I restoration plan. Um, which I think addressed the 2 to 1, uh, think addressed the 2 to 1, uh, requirement that the commission requirement that the commission asked for. And I also revised asked for.

[5:33] And I also revised the plan to eliminate all the plan to eliminate all reference to pathway and then reference to pathway and then revise the bank dune revise the bank dune delineation as was narrated delineation as was narrated last time around. Um, so with last time around. Um, so with that, that's what the changes that, that's what the changes were, as requested by the were, as requested by the commission.

[5:46] And, um, I'm going commission. And, um, I'm going to leave it. I turn it over to to leave it. I turn it over to Bill to talk about the orders. Bill to talk about the orders. So. So. Uh, good evening. The, uh, so Uh, good evening.

[5:57] The, uh, so the biggest question I have is, the biggest question I have is, uh, on the on the one at ATF in uh, on the on the one at ATF in paragraph number five, and I paragraph number five, and I haven't had a chance to talk to haven't had a chance to talk to Bill about this at all, so.

[6:09] Bill about this at all, so. Could I intervene real quick? Could I intervene real quick? Um, I've got a couple comments Um, I've got a couple comments that are technical for the blue that are technical for the blue flag stuff. Do you want me to flag stuff.

[6:17] Do you want me to do that later or now? do that later or now? Know. Why don't we hear from. Know. Why don't we hear from. The good? Yeah. The good? Yeah. The applicant first. The applicant first. All right. Thank you very much. All right. Thank you very much.

[6:30] So, uh, paragraph five, talks So, uh, paragraph five, talks about proposed vegetative about proposed vegetative management, including invasive management, including invasive control and associated native control and associated native plantings. Is sequence to take plantings. Is sequence to take place after the restoration, place after the restoration, plantings have achieved 100% plantings have achieved 100% succession and five years of succession and five years of annual monitoring have been annual monitoring have been submitted.

[6:47] So, uh, that means submitted. So, uh, that means the vegetative management can't the vegetative management can't begin for at least five years begin for at least five years after the date of the order, after the date of the order, which, uh, Teresa Sprague, who which, uh, Teresa Sprague, who hopefully will be able to speak

[7:01] hopefully will be able to speak to this, is indicated that she to this, is indicated that she doesn't think the trees will doesn't think the trees will succeed unless she does. The succeed unless she does. The vegetative management. Uh, at vegetative management.

[7:17] Uh, at the outset of the of the the outset of the of the process, I don't know that we process, I don't know that we have any specific objection to have any specific objection to any of the conditions, but, uh, any of the conditions, but, uh, you know, typically orders have you know, typically orders have a life of three years.

[7:32] Uh, I a life of three years. Uh, I mean, this this order could go mean, this this order could go on for a long time. And. on for a long time. And. You know. You know.

[7:45] We're not necessarily objecting We're not necessarily objecting to that so much is just to that so much is just wondering why the proposed wondering why the proposed vegetative management can't vegetative management can't begin. Uh, now when we start begin. Uh, now when we start all the work. And why would it all the work. And why would it have to wait essentially five have to wait essentially five years? years? Okay.

[8:00] We want us to talk about Okay. We want us to talk about it. Or do you want to whatever. it. Or do you want to whatever. Or whatever. Or whatever. You want. All right. I mean, I You want. All right.

[8:07] I mean, I don't personally I don't see don't personally I don't see why they need to plant and then why they need to plant and then wait five years before they can wait five years before they can start any of the work on the. start any of the work on the. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Uh, it was my understanding, Uh, it was my understanding, unless I missed something from unless I missed something from the last meeting.

[8:17] the last meeting. There were two issues. The path There were two issues. The path and the trees. and the trees. Right. Right. And that was it. And that was it. So. And this is new to me, to. So. And this is new to me, to. Uh. Uh. Theresa has to guarantee it. Theresa has to guarantee it.

[8:28] Right? Right? So whatever protocol she wants So whatever protocol she wants to follow is fine with. to follow is fine with. Me, right? I don't see why we Me, right? I don't see why we need to make the put the plants need to make the put the plants in wait five years before you

[8:36] in wait five years before you can start any of the invasive. can start any of the invasive. Through the chair. Could you Through the chair.

[8:44] Could you want to ask Theresa if she has want to ask Theresa if she has any input on that? any input on that? Well, I mean, can we just Well, I mean, can we just remove that five year? remove that five year? Yes you can. You can cut and Yes you can. You can cut and paste. You can do what you paste. You can do what you want. You have two options. You want. You have two options.

[8:52] You have sort of standard and you have sort of standard and you have the ATF which has have the ATF which has everything in there. everything in there. All right. So why don't. All right. So why don't. We have enforcement kept as We have enforcement kept as close as possible? close as possible? Okay.

[9:00] Let's scratch that one Okay. Let's scratch that one out and put the regular one. out and put the regular one. Okay. Five kills okay. Good. Okay. Five kills okay. Good.

[9:15] So everything related to that So everything related to that within the orders, sequencing within the orders, sequencing oriented would go, okay, I can oriented would go, okay, I can find all that. I think then find all that. I think then that becomes more like the that becomes more like the standard one. standard one. Any other. Any other.

[9:25] I think we're objecting to the I think we're objecting to the five years and the fact of five years and the fact of waiting. waiting. Right? Oh, yeah. Right? Oh, yeah. It's embedded in a couple of It's embedded in a couple of places and I understand what he places and I understand what he wants. Yeah. wants. Yeah. Right. Right. I think we're scratching that. I think we're scratching that. Waiting for five years.

[9:36] Waiting for five years. That'd be. That'd be. Great. Great. You know, I don't think we have You know, I don't think we have an objection. an objection. Or any other. All right, Bill, Or any other.

[9:46] All right, Bill, is there anything else you want is there anything else you want to go over? to go over? Um, I just would like to make Um, I just would like to make sure that we have a couple sure that we have a couple things on the plans. And at things on the plans. And at least covered by the least covered by the commission.

[9:55] Um, so let me grab commission. Um, so let me grab some notes. I didn't get a some notes. I didn't get a chance to share this with John chance to share this with John nor Theresa. So sorry. nor Theresa. So sorry. I see the plan. I see the plan. I was not able to. Um.

[10:02] All I was not able to. Um. All right, so the inference, right, so the inference, anything off rights or access anything off rights or access for access documentation? for access documentation? John's plan shows that the path John's plan shows that the path that was previously shown off that was previously shown off site is now not going offsite.

[10:16] site is now not going offsite. So we need that to be balanced So we need that to be balanced out with Blue flax. Blue flax out with Blue flax. Blue flax has the walking plant, uh, has the walking plant, uh, walking path going off site.

[10:24] So walking path going off site. So that would be best to have that that would be best to have that eliminated because the three eliminated because the three documents that are going to get documents that are going to get called out in the orders will called out in the orders will be the John O'Reilly plan.

[10:32] The be the John O'Reilly plan. The Blue Flax plan, and then the Blue Flax plan, and then the land management narrative. So land management narrative. So they should be consistent. So they should be consistent. So Blue Flax still has. Blue Flax still has. The walking path. The walking path.

[10:44] Oh, you haven't seen the most Oh, you haven't seen the most recent blue flax plan. They recent blue flax plan. They they're following. they're following. Yeah. Yeah. The most recent site plan done The most recent site plan done by John. by John.

[10:53] What's the date? What's the date? The, uh the date that you have The, uh the date that you have is, um, revised August 26th. is, um, revised August 26th. Okay. 2026. And they they do Okay. 2026. And they they do have some shading on this side have some shading on this side where the path was, but the where the path was, but the path itself is not on. Okay.

[11:07] path itself is not on. Okay. Blue flax plan. Blue flax plan. Okay. Okay. There's a line I thought There's a line I thought proposed. Let's see. Matt's proposed. Let's see. Matt's proposed footpath to beach. It proposed footpath to beach.

[11:19] It says on this 826 I'm going to says on this 826 I'm going to show it in a second. show it in a second. On the label is there. On the label is there. Yeah. So I would say that can Yeah. So I would say that can just get stretched out. just get stretched out. That's an easy to be taken off.

[11:25] That's an easy to be taken off. So, um, I'm having a time of So, um, I'm having a time of the life trying to figure out the life trying to figure out where to go zoom in on this where to go zoom in on this thing. All right, here we go.

[11:32] thing. All right, here we go. All right. Very good. Okay, All right. Very good. Okay, okay, so that would be one okay, so that would be one thing that I think maybe nobody thing that I think maybe nobody disagrees with. Um. disagrees with. Um. We can correct. We can correct. That.

[11:44] But, John, your plan, That. But, John, your plan, only one tiny thing. On, um, only one tiny thing. On, um, under the reference to the under the reference to the Epsilon um, under wetland note Epsilon um, under wetland note one. Yeah, I see the plan. The one. Yeah, I see the plan. The report. 11 1420, 25.

[11:57] But he had report. 11 1420, 25. But he had two others. He had one on April two others. He had one on April 2nd, 2026, and he had an August 2nd, 2026, and he had an August 11th, 2026, I think for the 11th, 2026, I think for the full delineation, it would be

[12:07] full delineation, it would be good to have that on there. good to have that on there. Yeah. Okay. No problems then. Yeah. Okay. No problems then. Um, so coastal wetlands order. Um, so coastal wetlands order. You checked the box on the NOI? You checked the box on the NOI? I didn't see that commission.

[12:18] I didn't see that commission. Do you want that in any way, Do you want that in any way, shape or form? Please tell me. shape or form? Please tell me. Because if you don't, that's Because if you don't, that's fine with me. Okay. All right. fine with me. Okay. All right. Um, so let's skip that one.

[12:28] Um, Um, so let's skip that one. Um, now down to Blue Flax. Um, the now down to Blue Flax. Um, the plan, um, number four one, two plan, um, number four one, two three. This one right here. three. This one right here. Sometimes when I highlight Sometimes when I highlight this, it messes it up.

[12:41] But at this, it messes it up. But at least I have it. It says least I have it. It says invasive plants will be invasive plants will be selectively treated with an EPA selectively treated with an EPA approved systemic herbicide and approved systemic herbicide and remove mechanically or by hand. remove mechanically or by hand.

[12:53] Um, typically the commission Um, typically the commission says, um, cut and sweep. And says, um, cut and sweep. And that's the end of it. So is that's the end of it.

[13:01] So is that what the commission wants, that what the commission wants, what they have there, or do what they have there, or do they want cut? they want cut? And I thought it says on our And I thought it says on our order of conditions, just cut order of conditions, just cut and swipe.. and swipe.. It does. Um, we could leave It does. Um, we could leave this alone. And then that this alone. And then that would.

[13:08] would. Mean that covers it under the Mean that covers it under the order of conditions. order of conditions. What he's saying is that their What he's saying is that their vegetative management plan vegetative management plan continues to say foliar in continues to say foliar in several places. several places.

[13:16] It's going to come up a couple It's going to come up a couple of times. But I do agree with of times. But I do agree with the chair that the language in the chair that the language in one of the conditions is one of the conditions is modified, which will modify modified, which will modify everything, including John

[13:24] everything, including John O'Reilly's plan and Teresa's O'Reilly's plan and Teresa's plan. So we could leave it, but plan. So we could leave it, but I'm bringing it up. Okay, so I'm bringing it up.

[13:32] Okay, so it's covered under the okay, so it's covered under the okay, so we'll put that down as covered we'll put that down as covered under. I think it's a 16. I under. I think it's a 16. I believe. Let me just verify. believe. Let me just verify. Okay. Okay. Yes A16 covers that. Um, now Yes A16 covers that. Um, now let's see bullet 12 down here.

[13:47] let's see bullet 12 down here. It would be 56789 1012 okay. It would be 56789 1012 okay. Two native trees will be Two native trees will be planted right here. Um, to planted right here. Um, to replace the previously cut dead replace the previously cut dead trees, etc..

[14:03] But the table trees, etc.. But the table shows down here for, um. That's shows down here for, um. That's going to be a little confusing. going to be a little confusing. Should that be changed to four? Should that be changed to four? Okay. So that one gets changed. Okay. So that one gets changed. Teresa. Yep. Number 12.

[14:13] Um, Teresa. Yep. Number 12. Um, changed to for. Trees. Okay. changed to for. Trees. Okay. All right. Got that one. Um, so All right. Got that one. Um, so Teresa, next thing here is John Teresa, next thing here is John O'Reilly's plan, which I'll go O'Reilly's plan, which I'll go to now matches with, um, the

[14:30] to now matches with, um, the Epsilon plan on the coastal Epsilon plan on the coastal bank. See how it closes off bank. See how it closes off right here, hovering right right here, hovering right below the word dune. And this below the word dune.

[14:38] And this was picked up at the last was picked up at the last meeting, and John has closed it meeting, and John has closed it off to match Epsilon. Yours off to match Epsilon. Yours stays open. Um, my stays open. Um, my understanding is that, um, Jack understanding is that, um, Jack Vaccaro is.

[14:48] Epsilon is the Vaccaro is. Epsilon is the driver here. So this area here driver here. So this area here should close off. Okay. should close off. Okay. We'll get the updated plan from We'll get the updated plan from John O'Reilly. John O'Reilly. Okay. You could do that. But Okay. You could do that.

[14:58] But consistency is a beautiful consistency is a beautiful thing. And I would recommend thing. And I would recommend that it gets closed off. that it gets closed off. Yeah. So that's what I'm Yeah. So that's what I'm saying. We'll have to get an saying.

[15:06] We'll have to get an updated, um, CAD file from John updated, um, CAD file from John O'Reilly. Our plan basically O'Reilly. Our plan basically uses John's plan as our base, uses John's plan as our base, so we might just need to update so we might just need to update a line from John's plan. We can a line from John's plan. We can absolutely do that.

[15:15] absolutely do that. Okay, okay. The next things Okay, okay. The next things are, um, let's go through them are, um, let's go through them quickly. So I'm looking at I quickly. So I'm looking at I got to get out of this one got to get out of this one here. Stop the share.

[15:23] This is here. Stop the share. This is going to be fun. And let me go going to be fun. And let me go back to here's the documents. back to here's the documents. Let's get your on land Let's get your on land management plan. Here we go. management plan. Here we go.

[15:35] We'll we'll remove all We'll we'll remove all references to Foley or based on references to Foley or based on your, um, order of conditions. your, um, order of conditions.

[15:44] We can do one of two things I We can do one of two things I can read, um, what looks like can read, um, what looks like 12 bullets, or I'll just send 12 bullets, or I'll just send them to you and you take care them to you and you take care of them. Um, yeah. of them. Um, yeah. They're all in the. They're all They're all in the. They're all in the timeline. I'm looking at in the timeline. I'm looking at them right now.

[15:49] I just did a them right now. I just did a quick search. Um, so we can quick search. Um, so we can certainly change that language. certainly change that language. Basically, we we call it foliar Basically, we we call it foliar spot application because we're spot application because we're dripping onto the foliage.

[16:00] But dripping onto the foliage. But we will remove that if that's we will remove that if that's the that's what's required in the that's what's required in your order condition. your order condition. All right. So there's a All right.

[16:06] So there's a reference to a skid steer on reference to a skid steer on page six of this. Um, and this page six of this. Um, and this is a sensitive habitat. is a sensitive habitat. So there's no there is no the So there's no there is no the only mechanical removal would only mechanical removal would be pruning.

[16:18] So and that's of be pruning. So and that's of any native of any existing any native of any existing native vegetation that needs native vegetation that needs regenerative pruning. Um, I, we regenerative pruning.

[16:28] Um, I, we do have a note that washed up do have a note that washed up wood stairs and fencing will be wood stairs and fencing will be cut into pieces with a small cut into pieces with a small saw carried up by hand of the saw carried up by hand of the path loaded into a truck and path loaded into a truck and disposed off site.

[16:37] But I will disposed off site. But I will search, and if there is a search, and if there is a reference to skid steer, we reference to skid steer, we will remove it, because. will remove it, because. It's on that first paragraph. It's on that first paragraph. Fourth line. So it's right Fourth line. So it's right here.

[16:44] here. Oh, so so I think we do have to Oh, so so I think we do have to clarify that we will have a clarify that we will have a brush can stationed in the brush can stationed in the driveway. And in order to get driveway.

[16:54] And in order to get the debris that's being removed the debris that's being removed from the eastern side of the from the eastern side of the coastal bank, which is the coastal bank, which is the debris that was dumped over debris that was dumped over time, we're going to need to time, we're going to need to have a small skid steer in the

[17:03] have a small skid steer in the driveway in order to load the driveway in order to load the brush can. brush can. In the driveway. Okay. Um. In the driveway. Okay. Um.

[17:10] So which do you want me to So which do you want me to clarify that in the land clarify that in the land management plan, that a small management plan, that a small skid steer in the driveway will skid steer in the driveway will carry to a brush can stationed carry to a brush can stationed in the driveway for removal? in the driveway for removal? I would like that it would help

[17:19] I would like that it would help the agents out and everything the agents out and everything coming forward. Yes, that would coming forward. Yes, that would be great. Um, if the commission be great. Um, if the commission objects, that's fine. Okay, objects, that's fine. Okay, just put it in.

[17:27] It's in the just put it in. It's in the driveway. That makes it a lot driveway. That makes it a lot better. Okay. The chainsaw better. Okay. The chainsaw cutting down in, um, the cutting down in, um, the resource area, typically on, resource area, typically on, um, the construction of stairs,

[17:38] um, the construction of stairs, the resource area is a no no the resource area is a no no for cutting the 0 to 50. And for cutting the 0 to 50. And oftentimes the 50 to 100. Um, oftentimes the 50 to 100.

[17:47] Um, what could be an alternative to what could be an alternative to that? Or does the Commission that? Or does the Commission worry themselves with this at worry themselves with this at all? all? It's either that or get a It's either that or get a machine down to remove those machine down to remove those stairs so I don't have a

[17:52] stairs so I don't have a problem. problem. We carried out like they did an We carried out like they did an ocean. ocean. I just cut them up and carry I just cut them up and carry them out. them out. Yep. Okay. Yep. Okay. So carry them out okay.

[17:59] So carry them out okay. Yeah. That's what would that's Yeah. That's what would that's what we were imagining based on what we were imagining based on not first of all, not having not first of all, not having access to bring equipment down access to bring equipment down there.

[18:07] And secondly, um, there. And secondly, um, knowing the commission does not knowing the commission does not want us to bring nor do we want want us to bring nor do we want to bring equipment into that to bring equipment into that sensitive area. So we'll use a sensitive area.

[18:14] So we'll use a sawzall, cut them into pieces sawzall, cut them into pieces very quickly, and then just very quickly, and then just until they're manageable size until they're manageable size to carry out by hand. to carry out by hand. Okay. Is it. Okay. Is it. Going to be. Yeah that's fine. Going to be. Yeah that's fine.

[18:21] I don't know how you would do I don't know how you would do it. All right. it. All right. We'll cut and carry. All right. We'll cut and carry. All right. Um, the resource areas, um, you Um, the resource areas, um, you don't have dune and bank under don't have dune and bank under 310 CMR.

[18:35] Um, we've called out 310 CMR. Um, we've called out 10.57, which is boarding lands 10.57, which is boarding lands subject to flooding, not the subject to flooding, not the land. Some of the coastal storm land. Some of the coastal storm flowage. And then I don't see, flowage.

[18:46] And then I don't see, um, chapter 172 203 Dune or 205 um, chapter 172 203 Dune or 205 bank in the and the document. bank in the and the document. I'm sure it's compatible and I'm sure it's compatible and intended it to be, but it's intended it to be, but it's just not in there. So, um. just not in there. So, um.

[18:54] Is this on her or John Is this on her or John O'Reilly's plan? It does. O'Reilly's plan? It does. This is all on the blue flags This is all on the blue flags and. and. On the blue flags plan just has On the blue flags plan just has to match up with John's.

[19:00] And I to match up with John's. And I thought, we've already. thought, we've already. Well, I'm not sharing okay. I'm Well, I'm not sharing okay. I'm sorry about that. So sorry. Um, sorry about that. So sorry. Um, yeah. yeah.

[19:10] We do address some of the We do address some of the performance standards in this performance standards in this particular one. I see that he's particular one. I see that he's addressed the riverfront area addressed the riverfront area and coastal beaches, and you and coastal beaches, and you want us to add the coastal dune want us to add the coastal dune and the Brewster Wetlands

[19:19] and the Brewster Wetlands regulations. This is 310 CMR. regulations. This is 310 CMR. And you want us to add And you want us to add Brewster's. Brewster's. Yeah. Yeah. I can give you a list. I mean, I can give you a list.

[19:25] I mean, I think it would be good to I think it would be good to have that. You know, it isn't have that. You know, it isn't in there. It's been delineated in there. It's been delineated through epsilon but all three through epsilon but all three should have it so and. should have it so and.

[19:35] So we'll, we'll, we'll, we'll So we'll, we'll, we'll, we'll include um, BWR for Coastal include um, BWR for Coastal Dune and um, we've got Coastal Dune and um, we've got Coastal beach lands, um, beach, coastal beach lands, um, beach, coastal storm flowage, coastal um, storm flowage, coastal um, coastal beach and coastal bank.

[19:47] coastal beach and coastal bank. Right. I'll tell you the list. Right. I'll tell you the list. So you have and you'll make it So you have and you'll make it easy. It sounds like a couple easy. It sounds like a couple of commissions. Been, um, of commissions.

[19:53] Been, um, comfortable with a couple of comfortable with a couple of things. You said the skids here things. You said the skids here in the driveway. No problem. in the driveway. No problem. The soils all down in the area, The soils all down in the area, cutting and then carrying out. cutting and then carrying out. No problem.

[20:00] Those are the big No problem. Those are the big ones. And then everything else ones. And then everything else is just housekeeping. is just housekeeping. Okay. Perfect. Okay. Perfect. Something you want to say? No. Something you want to say? No. Oh. Anybody else? Any questions Oh.

[20:13] Anybody else? Any questions or concerns? Not hearing any of or concerns? Not hearing any of them. I guess we're looking for them. I guess we're looking for a motion. Well. a motion. Well. Are we just let me just double Are we just let me just double check for a second. Are we check for a second.

[20:20] Are we looking for our motion to looking for our motion to continue or a motion to close? continue or a motion to close? Okay. We can we close? Okay. We can we close? Can we close? Can we close? We've agreed on everything. We've agreed on everything. Yeah, I thought that was the Yeah, I thought that was the whole.

[20:27] I thought that's what whole. I thought that's what this meeting was about, is to this meeting was about, is to come to terms with the. come to terms with the. Yeah. The, the the special Yeah. The, the the special conditions are adequate. If you conditions are adequate. If you kill those sequences. kill those sequences. Yep. Okay, fine.

[20:35] Yep. Okay, fine. Yeah. Um. Yeah. Um. We're happy to close. We're happy to close. Okay. Okay. We're thrilled to close. We're thrilled to close. So do you want these changes by So do you want these changes by noon on Friday. noon on Friday.

[20:43] 12 noon? We can have these 12 noon? We can have these changes to you by noon on changes to you by noon on Friday. Friday. Okay. All right, so move to Okay.

[20:51] All right, so move to close the public hearing for SE close the public hearing for SE nine, 2000 for DB BB Brewster nine, 2000 for DB BB Brewster LLC and JB dream LLC at 145 LLC and JB dream LLC at 145 Chapman Lane. Mayor. And, uh, Chapman Lane. Mayor.

[21:07] And, uh, instruct the conservation instruct the conservation administrator to finalize the administrator to finalize the orders of conditions uh, to orders of conditions uh, to include uh, changes to the Blue include uh, changes to the Blue Flags plan and vegetative Flags plan and vegetative management plan, as well as management plan, as well as minor changes to the plan of minor changes to the plan of record by noon on Friday the record by noon on Friday the 11th. Uh, Friday, September 11th. Uh, Friday, September 11th, 2026.

[21:21] 11th, 2026. A second. All those in favor? A second. All those in favor? Aye, aye. Sign motion passes Aye, aye. Sign motion passes unanimously. Thanks, guys. unanimously. Thanks, guys. Okay. Very good. Thank you. Okay. Very good. Thank you. Very much. Thank you very much. Very much. Thank you very much. All right. All right. Thank you.

[21:30] Thank you. Okay. Next we have 199 and 283 Okay. Next we have 199 and 283 Hamilton cart with Colin Nayak. Hamilton cart with Colin Nayak. This is Gary. This is Gary. And. Bravo. And. Bravo. Good afternoon again. Good afternoon again. Good evening John. Good evening John. The record I'm John O'Reilly.

[22:07] The record I'm John O'Reilly. To my right is Karen. To my right is Karen. Malpass. Benjamin. Malpass. Benjamin. Miss Benjamin uh, who's one of Miss Benjamin uh, who's one of the owners down in this neck of the owners down in this neck of the woods.

[22:16] Also with us is, uh, the woods. Also with us is, uh, Paul Shea, who's been with us Paul Shea, who's been with us since the beginning of the since the beginning of the project, uh, flagging wetlands project, uh, flagging wetlands and so forth and observing, um, and so forth and observing, um, so we're here tonight to start

[22:27] so we're here tonight to start the process of permitting and the process of permitting and after the fact action of a after the fact action of a partial culvert replacement on partial culvert replacement on Hamilton Cart Way. Um, the work Hamilton Cart Way.

[22:44] Um, the work was done, uh, to in an effort was done, uh, to in an effort to improve access. Um, down to improve access. Um, down Hamilton Parkway. Um. let's Hamilton Parkway. Um. let's make a difference. At the make a difference.

[22:55] At the request of fire department and request of fire department and some other people in town, some other people in town, including the owners who were including the owners who were concerned, Karen brings an concerned, Karen brings an excellent wealth of experience excellent wealth of experience and history from the area. So and history from the area.

[23:06] So if you have any questions on if you have any questions on past practices and conditions, past practices and conditions, you can certainly ask the you can certainly ask the question, um, we engaged Paul question, um, we engaged Paul to flag the wetland, and I'll to flag the wetland, and I'll turn it over to him in a few turn it over to him in a few minutes to talk about the minutes to talk about the wetland and the planting plan

[23:15] wetland and the planting plan in general. Um, but what we've in general. Um, but what we've ended up doing is we have been ended up doing is we have been watching the culvert through watching the culvert through the winter and spring, and this the winter and spring, and this spring there was documented

[23:25] spring there was documented flow through the culvert, uh, flow through the culvert, uh, once the once the spring, once the once the spring, spring waters, if you will spring waters, if you will reach a certain elevation that reach a certain elevation that allowed water to go from allowed water to go from Greenland Pond into the ditch

[23:35] Greenland Pond into the ditch and then ultimately, uh, to and then ultimately, uh, to Long Pond, um, right now, I Long Pond, um, right now, I believe the ditch is dry. Bone believe the ditch is dry. Bone dry, bone dry. Um, so, um, so dry, bone dry.

[23:48] Um, so, um, so we're actually leaving it we're actually leaving it basically as you see it today, basically as you see it today, uh, with the improved width, uh, with the improved width, that address of the fire that address of the fire department's concern, um, we're department's concern, um, we're not planning to do any work on

[23:57] not planning to do any work on the culvert itself, since it the culvert itself, since it appears to be working, but we appears to be working, but we are proposing plantings. Um, are proposing plantings.

[24:09] Um, and how Karen and Paul came up and how Karen and Paul came up with the planting plan was we with the planting plan was we tried to put species that were tried to put species that were already growing out there. Um, already growing out there.

[24:20] Um, because of some success, and because of some success, and also position them to allow also position them to allow fishermen that use this ditch, fishermen that use this ditch, if you will, conduit between if you will, conduit between Long Pond and Greenland Pond to Long Pond and Greenland Pond to bring fishing, you know, kayak bring fishing, you know, kayak or canoe or small skiff, uh, to or canoe or small skiff, uh, to fish in Greenland pond and back

[24:30] fish in Greenland pond and back again. So we felt it prudent again. So we felt it prudent not to put plants all over the not to put plants all over the shoreline that will ultimately shoreline that will ultimately get trampled by use. Um, so at get trampled by use.

[24:41] Um, so at this point, I'll have Paul this point, I'll have Paul bring up the, um, the wetlands bring up the, um, the wetlands and what he found and, and, and and what he found and, and, and we can take any questions. The we can take any questions. The commission has. commission has. Uh, good evening. Paul. Shea Uh, good evening. Paul.

[24:54] Shea with independent environmental with independent environmental consultants. Um, I think I was consultants. Um, I think I was brought into this project back brought into this project back in December 2025. Um, what we in December 2025.

[25:10] Um, what we have is we're Hamilton Parkway have is we're Hamilton Parkway is the northern boundary of the is the northern boundary of the current wave borders right on current wave borders right on Greenland Pond, which is a Greenland Pond, which is a great pond. And there is the great pond.

[25:23] And there is the position of the new culvert, position of the new culvert, uh, under the roadway, which uh, under the roadway, which then discharges into a ditch on then discharges into a ditch on the southern, southern side or the southern, southern side or southern. Uh, yeah, southern southern.

[25:36] Uh, yeah, southern side of Hamilton Parkway, where side of Hamilton Parkway, where there's a there's a low lying there's a there's a low lying area that was once a cranberry area that was once a cranberry bog on the southern side of the bog on the southern side of the roadway. It is grown back now roadway.

[25:49] It is grown back now to be a watering, vegetated to be a watering, vegetated wetland, fairly straight ditch, wetland, fairly straight ditch, running right through it all running right through it all the way to Long Pond. So it the way to Long Pond. So it connects into Long Pond. Um, connects into Long Pond.

[25:59] Um, that area would be a boring that area would be a boring vegetated wetland and an vegetated wetland and an intermittent stream which flows intermittent stream which flows out it. It goes dry every out it. It goes dry every summer. Uh, as they just summer. Uh, as they just stated, it's dry as a bone stated, it's dry as a bone right now.

[26:11] Um, they so we have right now. Um, they so we have basically a edge of a great basically a edge of a great pond. We have a intermittent pond. We have a intermittent stream. We have a bordering stream.

[26:24] We have a bordering vegetated wetland, which was vegetated wetland, which was once an old cranberry bog, and once an old cranberry bog, and production. And my production. And my understanding is the actual understanding is the actual straight intermittent stream straight intermittent stream was actually put in by mosquito was actually put in by mosquito control a long time ago, like control a long time ago, like back in the 50s or early 60s.

[26:37] back in the 50s or early 60s. Um, and, uh, we were originally Um, and, uh, we were originally had more plantings on the had more plantings on the northern side of the roadway. northern side of the roadway.

[26:52] Uh, Hamilton Parkway in the Uh, Hamilton Parkway in the area where I guess that's where area where I guess that's where the fishermen put their canoes. the fishermen put their canoes. And, uh, runoffs or whatever. And, uh, runoffs or whatever. They. So we noticed that a lot They.

[27:03] So we noticed that a lot of the rock was actually moving of the rock was actually moving down slope, chipped rock into down slope, chipped rock into the pond, because the dragging the pond, because the dragging in there. So we just decided to in there. So we just decided to take the plantings out in that take the plantings out in that area.

[27:11] Uh, we only have a couple area. Uh, we only have a couple on the south side, but there is on the south side, but there is room if we need to, to do more room if we need to, to do more on the south side. Uh, it it on the south side. Uh, it it was just a question mark.

[27:21] I was just a question mark. I know that, um, Chris Miller had know that, um, Chris Miller had brought up in one of the brought up in one of the conferences that we had the conferences that we had the issue of trying to provide some issue of trying to provide some sort of access for the

[27:30] sort of access for the fishermen. There was a question fishermen. There was a question of whether we were going to of whether we were going to maybe even try to create a maybe even try to create a small pathway for them to do small pathway for them to do it, but I believe they've been

[27:40] it, but I believe they've been sort of using that area, the sort of using that area, the bank, for a long time to access bank, for a long time to access to put in canoes and so forth. to put in canoes and so forth.

[27:49] So that's, you know, pretty So that's, you know, pretty much why we took the plantings much why we took the plantings out of that area. I'm happy to out of that area. I'm happy to answer any questions. I mean, answer any questions.

[27:59] I mean, everything in this project is everything in this project is either in, you know, resource either in, you know, resource area or buffer zones to the area or buffer zones to the boost of Conservation boost of Conservation Commission. Uh, of course, DEP Commission.

[28:10] Uh, of course, DEP wetlands and uh, natural wetlands and uh, natural heritage, I believe John just heritage, I believe John just got a letter from Natural got a letter from Natural Heritage at the end of that Heritage at the end of that last week, stating that they last week, stating that they don't have any problems with don't have any problems with the project, that that that the project, that that that should be in the, uh, the

[28:19] should be in the, uh, the Conservation Commission files Conservation Commission files at this point. And I believe at this point. And I believe we're still waiting for we're still waiting for feedback from, um, Division of feedback from, um, Division of Marine Fisheries and also, um, Marine Fisheries and also, um, I believe we've got a file

[28:31] I believe we've got a file number from DEP. I could be number from DEP. I could be wrong on that. wrong on that. We actually did hear from We actually did hear from Division of Marine Fisheries. Division of Marine Fisheries. You folks should have received You folks should have received letter of some sort.

[28:43] letter of some sort. All right. Bill. All right. Bill. Yeah. They sent an email, which Yeah. They sent an email, which I forwarded to the commission, I forwarded to the commission, and it's in the record. They and it's in the record. They don't have any specific don't have any specific requests.

[28:53] Um, they'd like to requests. Um, they'd like to see to be a fish passage, but see to be a fish passage, but that is a whole different that is a whole different project. So they didn't want to project. So they didn't want to go into that. And Natural go into that.

[29:01] And Natural Heritage said no adverse take Heritage said no adverse take and no, uh, adverse effect on and no, uh, adverse effect on the resource areas, um, leaving the resource areas, um, leaving it down to the, to the local, it down to the, to the local, um, back in 2025. Um, I asked um, back in 2025.

[29:13] Um, I asked around the departments if they around the departments if they would give feedback. Um, the would give feedback. Um, the fire department did give fire department did give feedback. They had a concern. feedback. They had a concern.

[29:21] Um, they were not sure that Um, they were not sure that they were able to service the they were able to service the area. Their letter is dated area. Their letter is dated October 27th, 2025, because it October 27th, 2025, because it was, um, not supportive was, um, not supportive potentially, of their equipment potentially, of their equipment and their larger vehicles for and their larger vehicles for life safety reasons.

[29:37] Um, the life safety reasons. Um, the police department was in kind, police department was in kind, matching up with the fire matching up with the fire department. DPW did the same. department. DPW did the same.

[29:46] The town engineer said that The town engineer said that they needed a stamped plan by they needed a stamped plan by an engineer, that they now an engineer, that they now provided that, um, and then the provided that, um, and then the question is, um, you don't question is, um, you don't necessarily have public safety, necessarily have public safety, but typically you get comments but typically you get comments from Natural heritage, mass,

[30:00] from Natural heritage, mass, DMF, different town DMF, different town departments, and the one that's departments, and the one that's sticking is do you have that sticking is do you have that safety element. And so, um, uh, safety element.

[30:14] And so, um, uh, I appreciate the engineering on I appreciate the engineering on this and the, uh, the planning this and the, uh, the planning approach and so on. It didn't approach and so on. It didn't need to be extensive because need to be extensive because there's so many plants in there's so many plants in there. You actually have to cut there.

[30:20] You actually have to cut them back along the road them back along the road constantly. Um, but the fire constantly. Um, but the fire department's component is, is department's component is, is important. Um, and I think that important. Um, and I think that that's something the commission that's something the commission should review a little bit more should review a little bit more and take into consideration.

[30:33] and take into consideration. Um. Um. I just have one question. This I just have one question. This the fire department was 20 the fire department was 20 October 27th, 2025. When was October 27th, 2025. When was the work done? It? the work done? It? Um, it was done. before this Um, it was done. before this September 2025.

[30:46] September 2025. I thought it was after that. I thought it was after that. All right. All right. So this kind of followed suit. So this kind of followed suit.

[30:52] Um, and it's taken a little Um, and it's taken a little while to get the NOI going, but while to get the NOI going, but they did it. Um, there was they did it. Um, there was another, um, recent culvert another, um, recent culvert that was done at two, six, two that was done at two, six, two eight Main Street. Um, it was eight Main Street.

[31:03] Um, it was pretty rigorously reviewed and pretty rigorously reviewed and rebuilt to meet the rebuilt to meet the Commission's requirements. Um, Commission's requirements. Um, both the fire department, the both the fire department, the building department were building department were consulted by David Schlesinger consulted by David Schlesinger to determine if they had to determine if they had comments, and neither had

[31:12] comments, and neither had comments. So compared to here, comments. So compared to here, we had comments fairly. Didn't we had comments fairly. Didn't I just want to point that out? I just want to point that out? Um, so it makes me wonder if Um, so it makes me wonder if something maybe equalized might

[31:23] something maybe equalized might be helpful and perhaps annual be helpful and perhaps annual monitoring reports signed by monitoring reports signed by original professional engineer original professional engineer stating that it's functioning stating that it's functioning as designed, etc. might be as designed, etc.

[31:38] might be helpful to the commission helpful to the commission because the fire department was because the fire department was worried, obviously, and I'm worried, obviously, and I'm just throwing something out. just throwing something out. It's just something to solve It's just something to solve that. Um, that possible? Um, that. Um, that possible? Um, possible consideration for the possible consideration for the commission.

[31:51] So, um, again, you commission. So, um, again, you don't have public safety yet, don't have public safety yet, but it should be in there. My but it should be in there. My personal opinion and personal opinion and regulations. But that's down regulations. But that's down the road. So you have the the road. So you have the department's comments.

[32:01] Um, it department's comments. Um, it has been engineered that meets has been engineered that meets the town engineer's the town engineer's requirements. Um, I haven't had requirements. Um, I haven't had any engineering. Look at it, any engineering. Look at it, John. Solid. So what am I doing John. Solid. So what am I doing there? Right. So.

[32:13] there? Right. So. Okay. Yeah, I got a comment. Okay. Yeah, I got a comment. Oh. Oh. The pipe that's there now is The pipe that's there now is the same pipe that when the the same pipe that when the yours. originally did it hasn't yours. originally did it hasn't been. been. Changed.

[32:24] Changed. No, it's a, it's a, it's a clay No, it's a, it's a, it's a clay tile pipe. That's that's there tile pipe. That's that's there still. still. Okay. Okay. Because when I first went down Because when I first went down there to see. there to see.

[32:32] That, I looked in both sides of That, I looked in both sides of it, I could see no, no daylight it, I could see no, no daylight on either side. It's not that on either side. It's not that big of a pipe. So I couldn't big of a pipe. So I couldn't see anything coming through.

[32:39] So see anything coming through. So how much, uh, how much water how much, uh, how much water was going through that? was going through that? It was. There was a. It was. There was a.

[32:48] I have a video if you'd like to I have a video if you'd like to see, but it was enough flow see, but it was enough flow that there were fish in there, that there were fish in there, not alewife. It was too early not alewife. It was too early when there was water, but there when there was water, but there were fish. They were small. were fish. They were small. Yeah.

[32:56] And, uh, I would say at Yeah. And, uh, I would say at least 4 or 5in. least 4 or 5in., because my concern is, um, it , because my concern is, um, it wasn't done properly. And why wasn't done properly. And why do we leave it like that? It do we leave it like that? It should be.

[33:07] It should be at should be. It should be at least something in there that's least something in there that's not going to collapse if not going to collapse if there's still clay pipe in there's still clay pipe in there. I know how some of us, there.

[33:16] I know how some of us, uh, the ads and the other half uh, the ads and the other half is the old clay pipe on one is the old clay pipe on one side, which is going to it's side, which is going to it's failing. It's going to continue failing. It's going to continue to fail. It should be, you to fail.

[33:25] It should be, you know, constant through the know, constant through the whole thing. It's something we whole thing. It's something we know that's not going to, you know that's not going to, you know, crush and that that old know, crush and that that old clay pipe doesn't have any clay pipe doesn't have any weight rating on it.

[33:33] So the, weight rating on it. So the, you know, the ads is has a you know, the ads is has a weight rating. So you have you weight rating. So you have you have no, I mean, I don't know have no, I mean, I don't know how you can engineer that.

[33:40] how you can engineer that. There's no how do you engineer There's no how do you engineer something you don't have something you don't have unknown. unknown. Well, the only thing that we Well, the only thing that we could add to that, Mr. Keyser, could add to that, Mr.

[33:51] Keyser, is that, you know, since this is that, you know, since this repair was done in August, repair was done in August, September of 2025, there have September of 2025, there have been oil trucks, propane tanks, been oil trucks, propane tanks, several emergency vehicles down several emergency vehicles down through here. Um, the fire through here.

[34:04] Um, the fire department has come down department has come down because of an emergency. Passed because of an emergency. Passed this culvert. Um, so, you know, this culvert. Um, so, you know, we did talk about, you know, we did talk about, you know, looking at the structural looking at the structural integrity of the, of the pipe.

[34:15] integrity of the, of the pipe. There really is no way to There really is no way to qualify it without pulling it qualify it without pulling it out. And look, you know, out. And look, you know, uncovering it. So we kind of uncovering it.

[34:25] So we kind of let, um, you know, time answer let, um, you know, time answer some questions for us. Wherein, some questions for us. Wherein, you know, it has flown it. you know, it has flown it. Water does flow through it. So Water does flow through it.

[34:35] So it is it is producing flow it is it is producing flow when, when the water levels are when, when the water levels are at the correct height and it it at the correct height and it it hasn't collapsed in the last 12 hasn't collapsed in the last 12 months. Um, so this permit is months. Um, so this permit is good for three years.

[34:46] And I good for three years. And I think part of a closeout could think part of a closeout could be a, a, an inspection of the be a, a, an inspection of the culvert. Uh, maybe not every culvert.

[34:56] Uh, maybe not every annually, but at the completion annually, but at the completion of the permit, as part of the of the permit, as part of the closeout, um, that, you know, closeout, um, that, you know, you take a look at it another you take a look at it another three years, that's all I can. three years, that's all I can. Yeah. Yeah. No, that's a response to that.

[35:04] No, that's a response to that. Yeah. And my my thought process Yeah. And my my thought process is, well, everything's been is, well, everything's been disturbed. Why don't we. What disturbed. Why don't we. What does it get fixed. Right. And does it get fixed. Right.

[35:12] And it's not really going to take it's not really going to take that much to, to fix it. Right. that much to, to fix it. Right. And put another piece of adds And put another piece of adds and couple it to what, what and couple it to what, what they put in there.

[35:19] I mean, they put in there. I mean, that's I hate to just leave that's I hate to just leave something like that. And next, something like that. And next, you know, a few years later we you know, a few years later we have another problem. It's have another problem.

[35:26] It's like, why don't we fix it, like, why don't we fix it, right? So it's not going to right? So it's not going to cost that much money to do it. cost that much money to do it. I mean, that's my my thought I mean, that's my my thought process. Maybe it would be process.

[35:34] Maybe it would be everybody's best interest, not everybody's best interest, not the leaves. An uncertainty like the leaves. An uncertainty like that because but that's my I that because but that's my I could be wrong. I'm not an could be wrong. I'm not an engineer. But that's my thought engineer. But that's my thought on it. on it.

[35:45] The only thing I'd like to add The only thing I'd like to add is, um, Eversource came down is, um, Eversource came down and worked on the road for and worked on the road for three years or three days, three years or three days, rather felt like three years. rather felt like three years. Three days after the blizzard.

[35:52] Three days after the blizzard. And they had the biggest spool And they had the biggest spool truck I've ever seen, and it truck I've ever seen, and it successfully went up and down successfully went up and down the road for those three days. the road for those three days.

[36:00] So it did bear the weight of an So it did bear the weight of an incredible load. Even just the incredible load. Even just the Eversource trucks themselves Eversource trucks themselves were amazing. So we were pretty were amazing. So we were pretty impressed and glad that it held impressed and glad that it held up.

[36:11] Yeah, so it was sturdy for up. Yeah, so it was sturdy for at least that experience. at least that experience. But wouldn't you agree with me But wouldn't you agree with me that you should be able to see that you should be able to see daylight looking through on daylight looking through on that short little run?

[36:17] that short little run? To be honest with you, we play. To be honest with you, we play. In the old days, the kids would In the old days, the kids would go and play. We never could see go and play.

[36:22] We never could see through, as far as I could through, as far as I could tell. I mean, like, we would tell. I mean, like, we would lie down in. lie down in. Right. And I understand that Right. And I understand that that's what that's exactly what that's what that's exactly what my why I'm bringing this up.

[36:29] my why I'm bringing this up. Because it's it's it's failing Because it's it's it's failing or it's clogged or whatever. My or it's clogged or whatever.

[36:39] My guess is it's failing like so guess is it's failing like so many of these other clay pipes many of these other clay pipes and I, I, like I said I would, and I, I, like I said I would, I would fix it because the I would fix it because the biggest thing is every time we biggest thing is every time we talk about wildlife and all talk about wildlife and all this stuff, those culverts are this stuff, those culverts are an important passage for a lot

[36:47] an important passage for a lot of turtles and all kinds of of turtles and all kinds of stuff go up and down. Those stuff go up and down. Those those culverts, invertebrates those culverts, invertebrates and everything else. And if and everything else.

[36:55] And if they can't get through there, they can't get through there, then they go over the road and then they go over the road and they get they get run over. Um, they get they get run over.

[37:02] Um, I just, I just think that it I just, I just think that it should be it should be at least should be it should be at least fixed properly. That's my fixed properly. That's my opinion. opinion. Just one question. Did did you Just one question.

[37:11] Did did you ever have a chance to go ever have a chance to go through there with the camera through there with the camera to see if any of it was being to see if any of it was being crushed? A simple drain company crushed? A simple drain company could go in to find out. could go in to find out. We didn't. Camera though. Yeah, We didn't. Camera though. Yeah, right. right. Okay. Okay. We had talked about one time We had talked about one time lining the pipe. Uh.

[37:22] lining the pipe. Uh. We have to camera it. Before We have to camera it. Before that. that. We met very informally and We met very informally and quite frankly, this small quite frankly, this small section of pipe, uh, it wasn't, section of pipe, uh, it wasn't, wasn't available to them.

[37:32] And wasn't available to them. And quite frankly, lining the pipe quite frankly, lining the pipe does nothing to the structural does nothing to the structural integrity of the pipe either. integrity of the pipe either.

[37:42] No, that wouldn't, but, uh, it No, that wouldn't, but, uh, it that does bother me that you that does bother me that you can't see daylight from one end can't see daylight from one end to another. I was out there to another.

[37:48] I was out there during the winter when I looked during the winter when I looked at it, you know, but I couldn't at it, you know, but I couldn't look down through it. And if look down through it. And if Gary had gone down there and Gary had gone down there and can't see daylight, it's either can't see daylight, it's either going to be blockage or a going to be blockage or a flashlight at the other end to

[37:55] flashlight at the other end to see what's going on. You know, see what's going on. You know, I just don't feel comfortable I just don't feel comfortable unless you have a camera or unless you have a camera or find out if it's crushed. find out if it's crushed.

[38:07] I'll be honest, this, um, you I'll be honest, this, um, you know, given that we're know, given that we're conservation, this feels a conservation, this feels a little bit out of our little bit out of our wheelhouse. Um, you know, we wheelhouse.

[38:14] Um, you know, we have a letter from the fire have a letter from the fire department saying they have department saying they have concerns, and I get that large concerns, and I get that large trucks have passed over this, trucks have passed over this, and, you know, it's it's it's and, you know, it's it's it's sort of like saying, you know, sort of like saying, you know, there's going to be a straw

[38:22] there's going to be a straw that breaks the camel's back. that breaks the camel's back. We don't know when that straw We don't know when that straw is coming or what that straw is is coming or what that straw is going to be.

[38:28] But this feels a going to be. But this feels a lot like I mean, Gary lot like I mean, Gary thankfully brought up what the thankfully brought up what the conservation interests are in conservation interests are in this, but this feels like it's this, but this feels like it's a bit out of our jurisdiction.

[38:36] a bit out of our jurisdiction. Is the engineering of this. Is the engineering of this. Maybe I'm wrong, but I'm Maybe I'm wrong, but I'm thinking in terms of yes, if thinking in terms of yes, if something collapses, obviously something collapses, obviously that becomes a conservation that becomes a conservation issue.

[38:47] But but whether this is issue. But but whether this is is strong enough for a is strong enough for a particular piece of equipment, particular piece of equipment, I don't see how that's I don't see how that's conservation. conservation. Yeah. My other question was I'd Yeah.

[38:57] My other question was I'd like just to find out if it is like just to find out if it is collapsed. collapsed. Yeah. I mean, that makes sense. Yeah. I mean, that makes sense. Absolutely. Going back to Absolutely. Going back to Gary's point about about Animal Gary's point about about Animal Passage and that sort of thing. Passage and that sort of thing.

[39:05] Um, but that seems to feel like Um, but that seems to feel like that's where the conservation that's where the conservation interest is and everything else. interest is and everything else. The engineering piece is way The engineering piece is way beyond me. So I'm not sure what beyond me. So I'm not sure what our role is here exactly.

[39:17] And our role is here exactly. And making any sort of decision making any sort of decision from a conservation perspective from a conservation perspective on whether this is a adequate on whether this is a adequate structure. You guys know all structure. You guys know all that stuff. I don't. that stuff. I don't. Chris. Yeah, it's Chris.

[39:30] Chris. Yeah, it's Chris. Miller, natural. Miller, natural. Resources director. Resources director. Um, to Kim's point. Um, to Kim's point. One thing you could do is talk One thing you could do is talk about either ongoing about either ongoing maintenance or the life of the maintenance or the life of the structure.

[39:39] So if they come back structure. So if they come back next year and it's totally next year and it's totally failed, what is the commission failed, what is the commission going to expect? Are they going going to expect? Are they going to expect a minor repair or are to expect a minor repair or are they going to expect more like

[39:45] they going to expect more like what DMF says, where you what DMF says, where you actually do some evaluation of actually do some evaluation of what the structural load should what the structural load should be, what the wildlife passage be, what the wildlife passage size should be, those kind of

[39:54] size should be, those kind of things. So you could put that. things. So you could put that. I mean, it's special conditions I mean, it's special conditions can talk about those kind of can talk about those kind of things for expectation. If this things for expectation.

[40:03] If this is only a one year fix, that's is only a one year fix, that's much different than like a much different than like a typical road crossing that typical road crossing that you'd hope to have a life of you'd hope to have a life of 30, 50 some kind of years. 30, 50 some kind of years.

[40:12] Do you think that, Gary, do you Do you think that, Gary, do you think that, um, for lack of a think that, um, for lack of a better term, end of scoping the better term, end of scoping the pipe, um, would be a valuable pipe, um, would be a valuable piece of information from the piece of information from the conservation only perspective

[40:22] conservation only perspective at this point. at this point. I would think it would be like, I would think it would be like, like a ready route or just. I like a ready route or just. I mean, everybody has these mean, everybody has these cameras. cameras. Flashlight. Flashlight.

[40:30] These cameras are readily These cameras are readily available. Yeah. I mean, you available. Yeah. I mean, you could it's not a lot of money could it's not a lot of money to have them see what what the. to have them see what what the.

[40:38] I just I'm it just bothers me I just I'm it just bothers me that it's, you know, I think that it's, you know, I think it's clogged. It could be it's clogged. It could be wrong, but I just you should be wrong, but I just you should be able to see light through that able to see light through that thing.

[40:45] And, you know, I thing. And, you know, I couldn't I laid down, I laid couldn't I laid down, I laid down on both sides and looked down on both sides and looked in there. And it's just, you in there.

[40:51] And it's just, you know, I just think it's a shame know, I just think it's a shame I'm not going to keep harping I'm not going to keep harping on it because I may. Well, can on it because I may. Well, can we make that? I don't know, is we make that? I don't know, is that something we could request that something we could request that photos of.

[40:58] that photos of. The commission. The commission. Discretionary authority, the. Discretionary authority, the. Special conditions modify Special conditions modify everything else. Everything. everything else. Everything.

[41:09] But really, just from the But really, just from the concept of of conservation, concept of of conservation, not, you know, we're not here not, you know, we're not here to judge the integrity of the to judge the integrity of the structure or its future or structure or its future or anything like that, but really anything like that, but really just from the narrow just from the narrow perspective of conservation. I perspective of conservation. I think.

[41:18] think. This.. This ends this, this, This.. This ends this, this, the pipe itself ends is from the pipe itself ends is from the inlet and the outlet. It's the inlet and the outlet. It's really non jurisdictional. But really non jurisdictional. But on both sides it's right there.

[41:28] on both sides it's right there. And so you're in the 0 to 50 on And so you're in the 0 to 50 on both of them for the variance. both of them for the variance. And um you know it's also the And um you know it's also the floodplain I believe.

[41:35] So it's floodplain I believe. So it's in the resource area. And that in the resource area. And that has bearing with regards to uh, has bearing with regards to uh, compensatory storage and all compensatory storage and all kinds of things, which I hadn't kinds of things, which I hadn't thought about just yet.

[41:45] So they thought about just yet. So they put fill in and it's looking put fill in and it's looking like it was in the wetlands. like it was in the wetlands. It's usually in the buffer zone It's usually in the buffer zone that you tiff. You take the that you tiff.

[41:55] You take the buffer zone and it's in the buffer zone and it's in the floodplain. Then you have to floodplain. Then you have to provide compensatory storage provide compensatory storage somewhere else. And potentially somewhere else. And potentially they've done that. they've done that. Well, this was a pre-existing Well, this was a pre-existing structure. That's just been.

[42:02] structure. That's just been. They put a lot of new material They put a lot of new material and and then Commissioner and and then Commissioner Kaser, in an earlier meeting, Kaser, in an earlier meeting, asked him to take out an apron asked him to take out an apron on the Long Pond side.

[42:11] So they on the Long Pond side. So they took a lot of the material out, took a lot of the material out, but that would have been in the but that would have been in the resource area because the resource area because the wetlands were upgrading of wetlands were upgrading of that.

[42:20] So it's the buffer zone that. So it's the buffer zone and they probably put some in and they probably put some in the buffer zone, took up the buffer zone, took up storage, and therefore there's storage, and therefore there's a need for compensatory storage a need for compensatory storage potentially. So we haven't got potentially. So we haven't got into any of that.

[42:29] into any of that. Ron. Yeah. Ron. Yeah. Yeah I remember this was a Yeah I remember this was a complaint okay. The work was complaint okay. The work was done by a contractor partially done by a contractor partially and then filled. I don't think and then filled. I don't think John or engineer looked at it.

[42:45] John or engineer looked at it. Uh, so it is what it is. It's Uh, so it is what it is. It's an old clay pipe that failed. an old clay pipe that failed. What's left is probably going What's left is probably going to fail.

[42:52] I agree with you 100%, to fail. I agree with you 100%, Gary. Ian. Joe. It stinks. But Gary. Ian. Joe. It stinks. But I'm going by what John says. I'm going by what John says. And for now, okay? And he And for now, okay? And he should take a look at it.

[43:03] should take a look at it. Engineer's report at the end of Engineer's report at the end of three years. And he's got to three years. And he's got to sign up. He's got to guarantee sign up. He's got to guarantee it. Not us.

[43:09] So we can talk it. Not us. So we can talk about cameras. All this other about cameras. All this other stuff we want. stuff we want. That's not a guarantee. That's not a guarantee. That's not going to. That's not going to. Be a guarantee. That's not a Be a guarantee. That's not a guarantee. No, it's not Brian.

[43:16] guarantee. No, it's not Brian. That's that's at 2028. John That's that's at 2028. John O'Riley looked at the pipe. O'Riley looked at the pipe. Water was flowing. Water was flowing. Exactly. Exactly. That's what that is. That's what that is. Yeah. It's not going to predict Yeah.

[43:27] It's not going to predict the future life of the of the the future life of the of the structure. It's going to really structure. It's going to really be just an evaluation that day. be just an evaluation that day. Here's what we saw. Here's what we saw. I mean, what their I mean, what their conservation. conservation.

[43:35] We just want to make sure the We just want to make sure the water flow we're not the water flow we're not the integrity of the pipe is. Yeah. integrity of the pipe is. Yeah. You're we're more concerned You're we're more concerned about is the water. I know about is the water. I know you've seen the pictures.

[43:43] We you've seen the pictures. We don't know what's going on in don't know what's going on in the middle of the road. If it's the middle of the road. If it's so I guess that's the question. so I guess that's the question.

[43:54] Do we want to see it cleared Do we want to see it cleared out, or do we want to see out, or do we want to see pictures of it, or do we just pictures of it, or do we just want to? Where do we care? I want to? Where do we care? I look at it this way.

[44:01] If they look at it this way. If they come and look at what happened come and look at what happened with Mr. Schlesinger, if they with Mr.

[44:08] Schlesinger, if they came and they wanted us to get came and they wanted us to get a permit, we would have gone a permit, we would have gone through the whole thing and we through the whole thing and we would have made sure everything would have made sure everything was working properly. We would. was working properly. We would.

[44:17] There's a lot of different There's a lot of different things on streams that they things on streams that they want today, and we made sure want today, and we made sure everything was right and we everything was right and we don't have any of that. So I don't have any of that. So I just, I feel that things total just, I feel that things total failure. That's my, my opinion.

[44:27] failure. That's my, my opinion. So I mean. So I mean. Chris thank you. If I could Chris thank you. If I could just make one other comment to just make one other comment to Kim's point about we're not Kim's point about we're not here looking at the structural,

[44:37] here looking at the structural, I think you can look at the I think you can look at the structural from a conservation structural from a conservation viewpoint. Are they going to be viewpoint.

[44:45] Are they going to be bringing in tons of material to bringing in tons of material to fill sinkholes? Is the material fill sinkholes? Is the material spilling into the resource area spilling into the resource area over time? Is it having any of over time? Is it having any of their impact to the direct end their impact to the direct end of the resource area in the of the resource area in the buffer zone over time? So is

[44:53] buffer zone over time? So is this going to hold up? You this going to hold up? You know, if this was on a coastal know, if this was on a coastal bank, you'd want to make sure bank, you'd want to make sure the bank isn't damaged. When the bank isn't damaged.

[44:59] When you walk down the stairs, those you walk down the stairs, those kind of things. So there is kind of things. So there is some input I think the some input I think the commission can have on whether commission can have on whether it's going to be structurally it's going to be structurally sound for a period of time, or

[45:07] sound for a period of time, or if it's going to require if it's going to require ongoing maintenance. And you ongoing maintenance. And you could talk about what that could talk about what that maintenance would require. And maintenance would require. And your special conditions. Are your special conditions.

[45:17] Are they allowed to fill potholes they allowed to fill potholes with additional material and with additional material and resource area? Are they allowed resource area? Are they allowed to grab the rocks that we heard to grab the rocks that we heard are being knocked down into the are being knocked down into the resource area and replace them?

[45:25] resource area and replace them? Those are the kind of things Those are the kind of things you can put in here to allow you can put in here to allow them to keep this functional. them to keep this functional. Everybody wants the road to Everybody wants the road to work.

[45:32] Everybody wants equipment work. Everybody wants equipment to get through without having to get through without having to come in and do a new notice to come in and do a new notice of intent. Every year. of intent. Every year. So I heard I heard a lot of So I heard I heard a lot of stuff that was great.

[45:40] Um, it stuff that was great. Um, it was a good conversation between was a good conversation between Gary and John O'Riley about, Gary and John O'Riley about, um, the wage and the unknowns um, the wage and the unknowns and so on. We need a known. And and so on. We need a known.

[45:51] And I heard the camera multiple I heard the camera multiple times, and that provides some times, and that provides some level of data about the level of data about the integrity of the pipe right integrity of the pipe right now. So if it can handle all now. So if it can handle all this stuff, that's wonderful.

[46:00] this stuff, that's wonderful. But like anything, it's going But like anything, it's going to slowly get crushed. So there to slowly get crushed. So there needs to be established a needs to be established a standard. And I don't think standard.

[46:08] And I don't think just having it at the end of just having it at the end of the three years, because it the three years, because it could go and get extended, and could go and get extended, and now it's another three years now it's another three years and it could get extended and it could get extended again, and now it's another

[46:14] again, and now it's another three years. So I think a game three years. So I think a game plan of either if we don't do plan of either if we don't do it every year, maybe every it every year, maybe every year, every even year or every year, every even year or every second year, have some

[46:23] second year, have some reporting on this, because reporting on this, because they're probably going to they're probably going to extend it or try for ongoing extend it or try for ongoing conditions. There also should conditions.

[46:33] There also should be something written in based be something written in based on the standard that okay, now on the standard that okay, now it's failed. Now you do have to it's failed. Now you do have to repair it. And we have a repair it. And we have a workable permit that we can workable permit that we can work with. And going back to work with.

[46:40] And going back to what Commissioner Keyser has what Commissioner Keyser has been saying and do it right. So been saying and do it right. So in other words, you're patching in other words, you're patching it together, setting the boat it together, setting the boat sail, and then suddenly in the sail, and then suddenly in the middle of ocean and you're

[46:47] middle of ocean and you're overwhelmed on the top. Your overwhelmed on the top. Your engines are out. engines are out. Oh, we can put in the water Oh, we can put in the water conditions if it fails in the. conditions if it fails in the. New. New. The notice contents. The notice contents. I think.

[46:53] I think. That's a good one. That's a good one. That's that's a really good That's that's a really good one. one. Right. So. Jesus, John. Right. So. Jesus, John. I have a comment. but the I have a comment.

[47:04] but the original reason why we repaired original reason why we repaired the road was because the, the the road was because the, the backings have were like worn backings have were like worn off by the dragging of the off by the dragging of the boats. So it was very, very boats. So it was very, very narrow. It got down less than narrow. It got down less than nine feet.

[47:14] And that's when we nine feet. And that's when we had an emergency and thought we had an emergency and thought we needed to repair it and did it needed to repair it and did it inappropriately. We apologize inappropriately. We apologize for that, but it was about the for that, but it was about the safety of the edging.

[47:22] And since safety of the edging. And since Covid, there have been this big Covid, there have been this big influx of people coming through influx of people coming through and dragging boats through the and dragging boats through the air. So it is, um, the, the air.

[47:32] So it is, um, the, the banking that I'm worried about banking that I'm worried about protecting, too, from a protecting, too, from a conservation point of view, conservation point of view, because there are these big because there are these big aluminum boats. And when the aluminum boats. And when the ditches dry, they go through ditches dry, they go through the middle of the ditch.

[47:40] That's the middle of the ditch. That's okay. When it's not dry, they okay. When it's not dry, they drag them right along the drag them right along the banks. So I want fishermen to banks. So I want fishermen to get in there, and I portage. I get in there, and I portage.

[47:49] I guess it's fair, but what we guess it's fair, but what we were worried about was how we were worried about was how we manage the resource as a safe manage the resource as a safe road. And also with this road. And also with this traffic of people damaging the traffic of people damaging the bank, that was a problem.

[48:02] And bank, that was a problem. And and actually the fire and actually the fire department asked us if we could department asked us if we could not make the road wider. He, not make the road wider. He, he, Mr. Varley or Chief Varley he, Mr. Varley or Chief Varley thought it had gotten narrow.

[48:10] thought it had gotten narrow. It actually had gone from nine It actually had gone from nine feet to 11. I think that's what feet to 11. I think that's what it is now. But he said ideally it is now. But he said ideally it would be 20.

[48:17] And so I don't it would be 20. And so I don't know how that that would not know how that that would not work very well either. So that work very well either. So that just part of the reality of the just part of the reality of the road. road. Okay, Ron. Okay, Ron.

[48:27] Well, you know this, I Well, you know this, I understand the sorry part, the understand the sorry part, the real culprit is not even has it real culprit is not even has it involved the guy who did the involved the guy who did the work. You can't tell me someone work.

[48:38] You can't tell me someone next to the pond doesn't know next to the pond doesn't know to call conservation. And to call conservation. And through the whole process, we through the whole process, we haven't heard a word from them. haven't heard a word from them. It's. It's. All right, so going forward, All right, so going forward, where.

[48:59] Where do we stand? Well, where. Where do we stand? Well, um. um. Okay. So, um, I heard that Okay. So, um, I heard that there's a need for more data. there's a need for more data. That's one thing I heard. I That's one thing I heard. I heard that reporting could be heard that reporting could be done. Maybe not every year.

[49:11] I done. Maybe not every year. I suggested every other year to suggested every other year to give the commission give the commission information. And the information. And the homeowners. homeowners. But what if by reporting, you But what if by reporting, you just want to make sure that just want to make sure that water is flowing well on the.

[49:20] water is flowing well on the. I was trying to find a I was trying to find a standard. I'm not really a pipe standard. I'm not really a pipe expert. I don't have the fish expert. I don't have the fish experience you have. experience you have. Here through the chair.

[49:27] I don't Here through the chair. I don't think it would be unreasonable think it would be unreasonable for have call somebody, just for have call somebody, just have them evaluate the pipe. have them evaluate the pipe.

[49:35] They can move forward with They can move forward with stuff, but evaluate the pipe stuff, but evaluate the pipe and the pipe is is clogged or, and the pipe is is clogged or, you know, majorly clogged. And you know, majorly clogged.

[49:43] And we need to not taking a look at we need to not taking a look at it, but let them go ahead and it, but let them go ahead and do it what they want to do. But do it what they want to do.

[49:49] But one of the stipulations is have one of the stipulations is have it's not a lot of money for it's not a lot of money for somebody to come in and somebody to come in and evaluate the pipe. evaluate the pipe. Like John isn't guaranteeing Like John isn't guaranteeing the pipe. the pipe. Well, of course not. Nobody can Well, of course not. Nobody can guarantee. guarantee. No one's going to guarantee. No one's going to guarantee. It's like you go to the doctor.

[49:58] It's like you go to the doctor. I can't guarantee you're not I can't guarantee you're not going to drop dead in the. going to drop dead in the. Park if it's. Park if it's. You just got this. It's it's You just got this. It's it's prefab.

[50:05] But he went through the prefab. But he went through the pains of doing this in a pains of doing this in a proposed fashion, and he's got proposed fashion, and he's got a guarantee because it was a guarantee because it was engineered to do what it's engineered to do what it's supposed to do.

[50:13] And it's all supposed to do. And it's all built in. John is picking. built in. John is picking. Up. Up. Here. I know John is picking up Here. I know John is picking up a severed situation, one of the a severed situation, one of the best he can and can't really.

[50:20] best he can and can't really. He's wise to put up to the He's wise to put up to the separation, okay. And let you separation, okay. And let you know that. know that. Is there some. And I honestly Is there some. And I honestly don't know the answer to this.

[50:27] don't know the answer to this. Is there some, um, regulatory Is there some, um, regulatory authority that that, um, authority that that, um, evaluates the safety of, of a evaluates the safety of, of a structure like this from a structure like this from a regulatory standpoint, like regulatory standpoint, like there are standards that they

[50:38] there are standards that they have. have. There's the streams, there's There's the streams, there's the stream standards, but the stream standards, but that's under perennial stream. that's under perennial stream.

[50:45] And David went through that And David went through that too, and he kept it out of that too, and he kept it out of that so that he would have the so that he would have the flexibility, but he would meet flexibility, but he would meet the commission standards. the commission standards. Part of the way. Part of the way. So no. So no. You can't wait. You can't wait.

[50:51] So even the the fire So even the the fire departments is really just a. departments is really just a. Suggestion just to finish that. Suggestion just to finish that. So the commission didn't have So the commission didn't have the perennial stream, didn't the perennial stream, didn't have the stream standards. So have the stream standards.

[51:01] So the question was, okay, but you the question was, okay, but you will meet the Commission's will meet the Commission's requirements, which is where we requirements, which is where we are right now. Okay. are right now. Okay. Chris. Chris.

[51:11] Um, once again, we heard some Um, once again, we heard some comments that some of the comments that some of the damage to the bank is being damage to the bank is being done by others who are visiting done by others who are visiting the site, dragging boats and the site, dragging boats and things like that. So the things like that.

[51:18] So the commission could also allow commission could also allow perhaps some split rail fence perhaps some split rail fence or something else to direct the or something else to direct the activity to. The one area where activity to.

[51:26] The one area where you didn't put the plants, you didn't put the plants, rather than have them pick all rather than have them pick all these others. I'm not sure these others. I'm not sure you'd want to put a split rail you'd want to put a split rail fence to stop all the boats, fence to stop all the boats, because they'll just break the because they'll just break the fence at that point, but you

[51:33] fence at that point, but you might want to somehow direct might want to somehow direct the foot traffic to keep it in the foot traffic to keep it in that one limited area, or at that one limited area, or at least put it into the into this

[51:39] least put it into the into this order that they're allowed to order that they're allowed to add some split rail in this add some split rail in this general vicinity. It doesn't general vicinity.

[51:46] It doesn't have to necessarily be have to necessarily be engineered in, but it might be engineered in, but it might be something to allow some something to allow some permission to keep it to the permission to keep it to the one area that you. one area that you. Can maintain about. You that Can maintain about. You that makes sense. makes sense. All right. All right. I just have.

[51:57] I just have. Yeah. I mean, I basically what Yeah. I mean, I basically what I'm hearing is that the I'm hearing is that the commission just wants to make commission just wants to make sure that that water is flowing sure that that water is flowing through this culvert. Mhm.

[52:03] through this culvert. Mhm. Yeah. Yeah. You want, you want Yeah. Yeah. You want, you want some kind of evaluation to what some kind of evaluation to what commission. commission. Is to be confirmed. Yeah. You Is to be confirmed. Yeah. You know right. Unimpeded flow and know right. Unimpeded flow and capacity to be confirmed.

[52:12] capacity to be confirmed. That's all. That's all. It did comes down to what It did comes down to what Commissioner O'Leary saying he Commissioner O'Leary saying he needs. And I think Commissioner needs.

[52:21] And I think Commissioner Keyser and I think Commissioner Keyser and I think Commissioner Pearson and you Chair Tobin and Pearson and you Chair Tobin and you, Commissioner Sloan, need you, Commissioner Sloan, need clear and convincing clear and convincing information. And there's, um, a information. And there's, um, a valuation by a pipe valuation by a pipe professional would provide professional would provide better clear and convincing better clear and convincing information.

[52:33] We can also think information. We can also think about and maybe establish about and maybe establish special conditions that would special conditions that would allow for the maintenance allow for the maintenance component. And then if, if, if component.

[52:43] And then if, if, if there was a problem and it fell there was a problem and it fell below the standard, whatever it below the standard, whatever it is, then it has to be repaired is, then it has to be repaired per what Commissioner Kaser per what Commissioner Kaser stated. stated. Okay. Okay.

[52:55] That strikes a balance because That strikes a balance because it really should be maybe it really should be maybe started from the start, but started from the start, but they didn't come to the they didn't come to the commission first and we don't commission first and we don't need to go back. Everybody's need to go back. Everybody's been through that right? been through that right? Okay. Okay. I just have one final comment.

[53:03] I just have one final comment. If I may. Mike, you, uh, I'm If I may. Mike, you, uh, I'm looking at this, John, do you looking at this, John, do you plan to add any more stone? No. plan to add any more stone? No. To what's there? Oh, okay. Just To what's there? Oh, okay. Just some loam.

[53:13] some loam. What loam? For planting. That's What loam? For planting. That's the idea. Using the loan for the idea. Using the loan for the planting. the planting. I only mentioned that because. I only mentioned that because. And actually, Kim and Bill. And actually, Kim and Bill.

[53:22] Yeah, we were out there several Yeah, we were out there several weeks ago to a site. What's weeks ago to a site. What's happening is when they're doing happening is when they're doing the filter fabric and they're the filter fabric and they're putting the crushed stone down, putting the crushed stone down, they're just putting regular

[53:30] they're just putting regular stone down. They're not doing a stone down. They're not doing a double wash. So what's double wash. So what's happening is the filter fabric happening is the filter fabric is clogging up. It's filling. is clogging up. It's filling. No filter.

[53:38] The third one this No filter. The third one this year we've been to, but. year we've been to, but. It's choked completely. It's so. It's choked completely. It's so. The filter fabric. I know. Where was the site? I know. Where was the site? Uh, you know, it's your sister. Uh, you know, it's your sister. It's it was one of Vesper.

[53:49] And It's it was one of Vesper. And then there was one in Greenland then there was one in Greenland on the other side, right? on the other side, right? Yeah, there was another one. Yeah, there was another one. Yeah. Yeah. I do it was near one of those I do it was near one of those town circles.

[53:58] town circles. Yes, we I just mentioned it. Yes, we I just mentioned it. Thank you. Thank you. Three one more years. John. Three one more years. John. I thought you were talking I thought you were talking about at Hamilton County. And I about at Hamilton County.

[54:08] And I can only think of one other can only think of one other project out there. So I was project out there. So I was like, no, I think all the like, no, I think all the gravel out there, no, no, no. gravel out there, no, no, no. Okay. Okay.

[54:16] Um, so, Billy, do you want to Um, so, Billy, do you want to continue? continue? I think that would be wise. I think that would be wise. Continue so that you can ride Continue so that you can ride special conditions. special conditions., and then they want to provide , and then they want to provide a, um, pipe condition. Um, and, a, um, pipe condition.

[54:26] Um, and, I don't know, maybe I don't know, maybe Commissioner O'Leary, you can Commissioner O'Leary, you can help me with that. I can send help me with that. I can send it along. What they're looking it along. What they're looking for, he's got. for, he's got. Well, it's not really the pipe Well, it's not really the pipe condition. We're looking for.

[54:33] condition. We're looking for. The pipe condition will be The pipe condition will be indicated if it's blocked up by indicated if it's blocked up by clay, the pipe is failing. clay, the pipe is failing.

[54:41] Yeah, if it's blocked up by a Yeah, if it's blocked up by a leaf or a branch or something leaf or a branch or something like that. With the camera, you like that. With the camera, you can just push it right through. can just push it right through. I think right now, because I think right now, because we're not. We're not pipe we're not. We're not pipe experts. experts. Right.

[54:50] I think a camera of the Right. I think a camera of the line, as long as it's not line, as long as it's not underwater, which it's not underwater, which it's not right. right. Now, it can be underwater. Now, it can be underwater. Well, the camera doesn't really Well, the camera doesn't really work. Once it gets underwater.

[54:57] work. Once it gets underwater. It works fine. I push it It works fine. I push it through. Anything. A human can through. Anything. A human can push it out of its body. push it out of its body. Pushing it. If the line is Pushing it. If the line is fine, you can't.

[55:04] You lose your fine, you can't. You lose your your picture. Once it goes your picture. Once it goes underwater. underwater. That's why I'm surprised. That's why I'm surprised. But anyways. But anyways. It's. It's. Dry right now. Dry right now. Okay, yeah I will, I will get Okay, yeah I will, I will get someone to camera for them and.

[55:12] someone to camera for them and. That'd be great. That'd be great. Okay. Okay. All right. So, um, camera. So All right. So, um, camera. So move to continue the public move to continue the public hearing for SE 920304. Oh, hearing for SE 920304. Oh, sorry. Never mind.

[55:26] I'm sorry on sorry. Never mind. I'm sorry on the wrong page. Page five I got the wrong page. Page five I got it, got it, got it. Sorry. Uh, it, got it, got it. Sorry.

[55:34] Uh, move to continue the public move to continue the public hearing for SW nine 2029 for hearing for SW nine 2029 for Kolb and Nayak at 199 and 23 Kolb and Nayak at 199 and 23 Hamilton Cart way. Um. And um Hamilton Cart way. Um.

[55:49] And um or pending arrangement of a or pending arrangement of a inspection of the clay pipe inspection of the clay pipe remaining in the culvert as the remaining in the culvert as the culvert. Uh, and, um, in the culvert. Uh, and, um, in the meantime, would you like to meantime, would you like to begin working on the special begin working on the special conditions? conditions? Yeah. Yeah. I can. I can. Do that.

[56:00] And, uh, to have the Do that. And, uh, to have the conservation administrator, uh, conservation administrator, uh, begin and hopefully complete begin and hopefully complete the special special conditions the special special conditions for the project. for the project. Second, all those in favor? Second, all those in favor? I chair votes. Aye. I chair votes. Aye. Motion passes unanimously.

[56:12] Motion passes unanimously. Thank you very much. Thank you very much. All right. Next, we have Sea All right. Next, we have Sea Pines Drive and Hollow Lane. Pines Drive and Hollow Lane. Sea Pines condo association. Sea Pines condo association. Keep your eyes, big. Keep your eyes, big. Guy. That's good job. Nice job.

[56:28] Guy. That's good job. Nice job. Okay. Okay. Good evening. The record. I'm Good evening. The record. I'm John O'Reilly. With me tonight John O'Reilly. With me tonight is Phil Cheney, the landscape is Phil Cheney, the landscape architect. And Scott Anthony in architect.

[56:51] And Scott Anthony in the back row, uh, from the the back row, uh, from the management company. Uh, we were management company. Uh, we were here a couple weeks ago. Um, here a couple weeks ago. Um, the board, the commission had the board, the commission had asked for three pieces of asked for three pieces of information.

[57:01] The notation of a information. The notation of a vernal pool of the vernal pool vernal pool of the vernal pool on our site plan. And with on our site plan. And with Bill's help, we were able to Bill's help, we were able to kind of get a shape of it.

[57:09] Um, kind of get a shape of it. Um, uh, shown on the plan, uh, the uh, shown on the plan, uh, the spec sheet for the infill, uh, spec sheet for the infill, uh, which you did receive. which you did receive.

[57:20] And then the notation on Phil's And then the notation on Phil's plan regarding the treatment of plan regarding the treatment of the locust trees that came up, the locust trees that came up, whether we were going to treat whether we were going to treat them or remove them. And I them or remove them. And I think Phil was. think Phil was. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I.

[1:10:14] I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I. I.

Conservation Commission 09-08-2026

Agenda

Transcript