[7:32] We recording?

[7:34] >> All right.

[7:35] » All right.

[7:35] >> This meeting is being trans.

[7:37] » This meeting is being trans.

[7:37] >> I'd like to call the regular city

[7:38] » I'd like to call the regular city

[7:38] council meeting of January 6 to order.

[7:40] Would you please call the role?

[7:44] >> Gage here. [clears throat]

[7:46] » Gage here. [clears throat]

[7:46] >> Ziggy

[7:47] » Ziggy

[7:47] >> here.

[7:47] » here.

[7:47] >> Matani

[7:48] » Matani

[7:48] >> here. Bradbury here. Gas

[7:50] » here. Bradbury here. Gas

[7:50] >> here.

[7:50] » here.

[7:50] >> Finnegan

[7:51] » Finnegan

[7:51] >> here. Severson

[7:52] » here. Severson

[7:52] >> here. Please rise for the pledge of

[7:54] » here. Please rise for the pledge of

[7:54] allegiance.

[8:01] » And to the republic for which it stands,

[8:04] one nation under God, indivisible, with

[8:07] liberty and justice for all.

[8:11] [clears throat]

[8:13] >> Thank you.

[8:15] » Thank you.

[8:15] The Ketchan City Council would like to

[8:17] respectfully acknowledge the traditional

[8:18] first people of this land in Ketchan,

[8:20] the Tongous Clankish people. Under

[8:23] communications

[8:25] uh lay on the table, we have a updated

[8:29] 3B

[8:31] uh which is updated 7F in regards to um

[8:35] ordinance number 26 2015 amending third

[8:39] positions of the Ketchan missile code

[8:42] water rates. We have an update

[8:46] uh 3C. It's a agenda item uh the cost

[8:52] per eru by increasing sewer rate by 8%

[8:55] and providing for effective date.

[8:59] We have uh 3D D which is um uh agenda

[9:05] item seven provide the title of motion

[9:07] of ordinance 2617

[9:10] and it has levy of tax uh in regards to

[9:14] sales tax. Uh

[9:17] we also have a revised motion for item

[9:21] 5e authorizing procurement replacement

[9:23] of fire department command vehicle.

[9:26] Uh one

[9:29] we have a request to withdraw item 7D

[9:32] employment contract uh city manager

[9:35] general manager.

[9:38] We have a request to withdraw item 15A

[9:41] with the request of the executive

[9:43] session negotiation of city manager

[9:45] employment contract and then we have a

[9:48] calendar for upcoming

[9:50] events.

[9:53] So with that brings us to persons to be

[9:55] heard. We are going to have a threeminut

[9:57] rule tonight. Clerk will be keeping uh

[9:59] the time on that. And so madam clerk who

[10:02] do we have in front of us first?

[10:04] >> Steven Reeve.

[10:06] » Steven Reeve.

[10:06] Hey

[10:10] Hi, Stephen Reed.

[10:13] Um,

[10:14] I want to be brief. You have a lot on

[10:16] your agenda tonight, but and I it has to

[10:19] do with restrooms. I want to comment on

[10:21] the proposal before you want to thank

[10:24] public works for their initial effort.

[10:27] Uh, but my main point tonight to you is

[10:30] going to be to slow down. Uh, restrooms

[10:33] are complicated projects. They're

[10:35] difficult. They're expensive. they often

[10:38] fail and we need a much better process

[10:41] for succeeding with this project that's

[10:44] before you. Um

[10:47] I

[10:49] there hasn't really been any public

[10:52] process yet. There was a meeting on the

[10:53] 19th uh that most of us had already had

[10:56] holiday plans and couldn't attend. And

[10:58] that's the only I'm aware of. I've only

[11:00] learned in the last few days of the uh

[11:03] two sites that are being proposed to you

[11:05] and the uh drawings of those sites. Um

[11:09] in some rabbits support either one of

[11:11] the sites or the design program that

[11:13] we're that we're uh moving toward. Um

[11:18] there are a lot of other sites that

[11:20] should be considered. I personally don't

[11:22] think we ought to be looking at large

[11:25] restroom facilities like eight, nine

[11:27] units that are expensive, difficult to

[11:29] police and and manage. Um the sites that

[11:36] are before you I wanted to quickly

[11:38] comment on one is uh at 217 Steman next

[11:42] to the New York Cafe.

[11:44] Uh that is very problematic. Um it takes

[11:48] away a net of five. I'm very familiar

[11:51] with the parking spaces there. It takes

[11:52] away a net of five parking spaces in an

[11:55] area that's really overburdened in the

[11:57] summertime because of the harbor and

[11:59] other things. We don't have public

[12:00] parking on Seventh Street. That would

[12:02] really exacerbate that issue. Um also uh

[12:07] we uh have long wanted to provide access

[12:12] up the hill to city and lands that hotel

[12:15] has up on top of the hill. This would

[12:18] prevent that access. So we that that's a

[12:21] serious issue. Um there's no way to de

[12:26] develop those lands. We have a proposal

[12:28] for public works now to be able to do

[12:30] that. Um the other issue there are

[12:34] adjacent property owners that has a big

[12:36] impact on both of the properties on

[12:38] either side of of that site. Uh and it

[12:43] just can't work there. the other site

[12:46] that's before you as I understand it and

[12:48] as I say I'm not totally fluent with

[12:52] everything that's happening but it's

[12:54] next to Dolly's house. Um that also is

[12:58] problematic especially for a proposal

[13:00] that has like nine units. We don't need

[13:02] nine units there. Uh there are

[13:06] property owners on the creek and

[13:08] business on the creek would like to have

[13:10] two maybe four units on the creek to

[13:12] supplement what some property owners are

[13:14] are willing to do within their own

[13:16] premises. Uh we don't need a facility

[13:20] this big and it's hard to it's hard to

[13:23] manage a facility like that and all the

[13:26] policing of it that's necessary u when

[13:29] it's up the boardwalk like that. It also

[13:31] provides a another destination

[13:35] attraction which we don't need on the

[13:37] creek. Uh given the carrying capacity

[13:39] right now with the the boardwalk, um we

[13:44] people who really aren't that interested

[13:46] in the creek but want to use the

[13:48] bathroom would uh would come there and

[13:52] that's that's one of the most crowded

[13:54] spaces we have.

[13:55] >> So in wrap up, Steve, are you asking us

[13:57] » So in wrap up, Steve, are you asking us

[13:57] to have another public meeting in regard

[13:58] to all these sites? Yeah, I think we

[14:00] need to review uh I think what I think

[14:03] we really need to engage affected

[14:05] property owners too. For example, on

[14:08] that particular site, I'm doing a

[14:10] contract right now for the city on uh

[14:14] Creek Street Historic District and other

[14:16] historic districts and neighborhoods in

[14:17] the downtown. And one of the things we

[14:20] thought would be great on the site would

[14:22] be a presentation of the indigenous use

[14:26] of Creek Street for the tens of

[14:28] thousands of years before white folks

[14:30] came. And maybe they could maybe that

[14:32] presentation the panels we imagine could

[14:35] coexist with a much smaller um much

[14:39] smaller

[14:40] restroom unit there. I'm not sure. But

[14:43] no one has talked to affected

[14:45] propagators, the groups that represent

[14:47] places like Creek Street, and uh we need

[14:51] to slow down a little bit and get their

[14:53] opinions. We'll do

[14:56] >> we'll put that on our list.

[14:57] » we'll put that on our list.

[14:57] >> Yeah.

[14:57] » Yeah.

[14:57] >> Thank you.

[14:58] » Thank you.

[14:58] >> That's all. Any questions?

[15:01] » That's all. Any questions?

[15:01] >> Question.

[15:03] » Question.

[15:03] >> Yes. I just have one because uh you know

[15:05] » Yes. I just have one because uh you know

[15:05] we hear from people who are very

[15:07] passionate on this issue that have said

[15:09] I think rightfully so that we've drugg

[15:11] our feet and postponed and canceled and

[15:13] delayed for a long time. So while I hear

[15:16] you on slowing down, I guess my question

[15:18] would be do you have an ideal location

[15:21] you would recommend? Have you thought of

[15:23] any yet or

[15:24] >> I I have three or four other locations

[15:27] » I I have three or four other locations

[15:27] in the proximity that I'd recommend? I'd

[15:29] be happy to provide all of those. Um I

[15:33] also think that we shouldn't give short

[15:36] thrift to the notion of a mobile unit

[15:38] initially. Uh that could have a lot of

[15:41] benefits to the community. Uh I don't

[15:44] think we should take that off the table.

[15:46] The other thing is I think we ought to

[15:48] work constructively with property owners

[15:51] to see how many units we could pull

[15:53] together within their businesses. It's

[15:55] worked in a lot of communities like ours

[15:56] across the country and I think we I

[15:59] think we need to consider that. Thank

[16:01] you.

[16:02] >> I'd be happy to work with That's why I

[16:03] » I'd be happy to work with That's why I

[16:04] think we just need to slow down. I think

[16:06] a lot of us would be happy to work with

[16:08] public works on on the site and and on

[16:11] the other issues that face us.

[16:14] >> Okay.

[16:16] » Okay.

[16:16] >> Dalton Arnold.

[16:25] » Hello. Um, last time I was here, I gave

[16:27] everybody a word doc on how to move more

[16:30] agriculture here to Alaska because

[16:33] there's food shortage. I'm apparently

[16:35] experiencing a food shortage.

[16:38] Okay, so we do have mountain lines. I've

[16:41] had very close encounters. I spend a lot

[16:43] of time these days. Um, they do exist

[16:47] and I did speak to Saxman and he also

[16:50] said there's mountain lines. So I don't

[16:52] know exactly how many there are. I can

[16:54] verify two between 70 and 130 pounds.

[16:58] So, and Paul Hamilton, my boss, has one

[17:01] off game camera. So, they do exist. And

[17:04] I was running around and seeing

[17:07] everybody during deer season. And we

[17:09] don't have a lot of big game bucks. So,

[17:11] right now, it's just a slaughter for the

[17:12] deer. I've been throwing crab pots these

[17:16] past couple nights. The crabs are small,

[17:18] so we can't supplement with crab right

[17:20] now. at least for the next four years.

[17:24] And uh been trying to network with

[17:27] everybody out here in the harbors

[17:29] because we got a bunch of broke down

[17:30] boats. My boat's broke down. I currently

[17:32] just got a uh

[17:35] they're going to impound it within the

[17:36] next 5 days.

[17:39] My ID I'm actually I'm a Missurrian, but

[17:42] I have a Texas ID and it's broken and

[17:45] I've had two birth certificates not show

[17:47] up to me in the mail. So, I still

[17:49] haven't been able to become Alaskan

[17:51] citizen here and my votes going to get

[17:54] packed.

[17:56] Very problematic. Like to work together

[17:59] with everybody.

[18:02] » Thank you.

[18:04] >> I'll be back at the book,

[18:12] » John Flora.

[18:19] My name is John Flora. I live at 1127

[18:22] Woodland and as most of you know, I'm

[18:24] also the owner of Yellow Fac. I'm here

[18:27] tonight to discuss the need for changing

[18:32] the requirements for a person to obtain

[18:34] a taxi license and catch a taxi industry

[18:37] is probably about 40 people short of

[18:40] being properly staffed. the the current

[18:43] system we have is too restrictive and

[18:45] more importantly it's too antiquated.

[18:48] The time frame is too long. Um

[18:51] everything that has to be done to get a

[18:53] cab license in in catch can has to be

[18:55] done or virtually everything has to be

[18:58] done in Ketchacan. Right now there's

[19:00] people down south starting to think

[19:02] about summer jobs. I have no way to

[19:04] recruit those people. I have no way to

[19:06] sign them up. Um, and by the time they

[19:10] do get here, they either have a job or

[19:12] they're not they don't want to wait the

[19:14] 10 days to two weeks it takes to get a

[19:16] taxi license. They go get another job

[19:18] out of the thousands that we have here.

[19:20] So, my ask is that we change the local

[19:25] ordinance

[19:26] to pattern itself after the TMC law that

[19:29] was passed six, seven years ago that

[19:31] allowed Uber. What that would involve is

[19:34] the companies would do most of the work

[19:37] to vet the drivers, both criminal and

[19:39] driving record. That information would

[19:41] make its way to the police, so the

[19:43] police would have it in their records,

[19:45] but there would be no longer a citysued

[19:47] cab license. We would issue a company ID

[19:50] that indicated we vetted these people.

[19:52] The crime report would be on file, the

[19:54] driving record would be on file.

[19:57] uh we can put in periodic updates of of

[19:59] those information of that information,

[20:01] but if we don't change something fast,

[20:04] and I I know speed isn't necessarily you

[20:07] folks's problem, but um I I probably

[20:10] should have started this three months

[20:11] ago. That's my fault, but uh anything we

[20:13] can do this quicker than later, uh would

[20:16] be great.

[20:18] Um, I should mention I met with the

[20:19] chief yesterday and I feel that went

[20:21] really well and I certainly don't speak

[20:23] for him of course but I do believe he

[20:26] expressed a willingness to go forward

[20:29] you know look at this concept obviously

[20:31] the devil's in the details but he was

[20:33] willing to discuss it further with

[20:35] whoever was wanted to look into it with

[20:37] him. So, I guess my ask is please direct

[20:40] staff to whatever you I I've never been

[20:43] in non-aggenda items, so I don't really

[20:44] know how to move forward, but [laughter]

[20:46] please direct staff to however you

[20:48] direct them. And uh I know at the end of

[20:51] this meeting there's future agenda

[20:52] items. If I could please be added to

[20:55] hopefully the near future agenda item,

[20:57] I'd certainly appreciate it.

[20:59] >> Thank you.

[21:01] » Thank you.

[21:01] >> That's it. Ryan

[21:02] » That's it. Ryan

[21:02] >> Ryan, could you uh elaborate a little

[21:04] » Ryan, could you uh elaborate a little

[21:04] bit? You mentioned that uh Uber, as I

[21:07] say, we now have some Uber cars around

[21:09] town. They do a

[21:11] >> uh for to basically summarize what you

[21:14] » uh for to basically summarize what you

[21:14] said, they do the vetting of their

[21:17] licensing themselves. And that is that

[21:19] what I heard and that's basically you're

[21:20] asking for a similar uh process to what

[21:24] they have

[21:24] >> pretty much identical to them. They they

[21:26] » pretty much identical to them. They they

[21:26] you can sign up on Uber completely

[21:28] online. Um they pull your driving

[21:31] record. They do a criminal background

[21:32] check. We'd be using thirdparty

[21:34] services. We're not going to be doing

[21:35] the criminal. We will hire somebody.

[21:38] There's different uh businesses. You

[21:40] hire somebody to do the criminal. So,

[21:42] it'll be some kind of professional

[21:44] background check done by a third party.

[21:46] Same thing. Well, the MVR, the motor

[21:48] vehicle records, some of those I can

[21:50] pull myself from other states. Others

[21:51] you have to hire a service. Every

[21:53] state's different. And

[21:56] that's kind of the point. It was like

[21:57] right now if somebody from Texas showed

[21:59] up and wants to drive a cab, they got to

[22:01] send an affidavit clear back to Texas,

[22:03] wait two weeks for the DMV to mail them

[22:06] their driving record and by that time,

[22:08] you know, they've long lost interest.

[22:11] >> Your honor,

[22:12] » Your honor,

[22:12] >> yes, I needed clarification from the

[22:15] » yes, I needed clarification from the

[22:15] clerk. Can this be done online?

[22:18] >> The this application for the drivers

[22:21] » The this application for the drivers

[22:21] >> not right now. No. can be converted in

[22:23] » not right now. No. can be converted in

[22:23] some way so that

[22:24] >> well we would have to bring back an

[22:26] » well we would have to bring back an

[22:26] ordinance for revision.

[22:27] >> Thank you.

[22:30] » Thank you.

[22:30] >> Thank you.

[22:30] » Thank you.

[22:30] >> Thank you all very much. Appreciate it.

[22:35] » Diane Reed.

[22:42] » Good evening honorable mayor city

[22:44] council members. I'll pray five minutes

[22:47] [laughter]

[22:49] but uh thank you very much. I'll try to

[22:51] go as quickly as I can. I was kind read

[22:53] 16 Water Street. Um, a little bit

[22:56] background really quickly about me. If

[22:58] you don't know me, um, I I did work on

[23:00] that. I put together that uh the lose

[23:03] blue bathroom years ago. Um, so I've

[23:05] gone through the bathroom process. Have

[23:06] some familiar background. I was the

[23:09] planner from the burrow years ago. I'm

[23:11] the manager of the transit system now,

[23:12] but I also own property and businesses

[23:15] directly abuing and adjacent to both the

[23:17] spots that you're considering.

[23:20] for bathrooms. Uh so I basically would

[23:23] echo everything that my dad said over

[23:25] there, Stephen Reed, but I would also

[23:27] like to add for the the parking loss of

[23:30] parking there that that it truly is a

[23:32] net loss of five. If you go in there at

[23:34] any time, you can see that there's six.

[23:36] We use the ramp on the end. There's a

[23:38] actually a two-hour meter made parking

[23:40] sign up there and historically there's

[23:42] always been six if you've been in there.

[23:44] So obviously there's a net loss in it

[23:46] because you've gained one on the on the

[23:47] street there. I think more importantly

[23:48] as he said uh it's really an economic

[23:51] development thing. I mean there's tax

[23:52] based potential there's real estate the

[23:54] city owns private sector owns there's

[23:56] possible for parking up there. We've

[23:58] done planning in the past that

[23:59] identifies parking up there. So by

[24:01] landlocking all those lots up there I

[24:03] get it's a horrible economic decision in

[24:06] turning and losing those that parking.

[24:08] That parking is two-hour parking. It

[24:09] plays a big role to support the the

[24:11] marina. I mean the the the space bas

[24:15] it's it's it it's an anchor parking lot

[24:16] for Creek Street. As you all know, you

[24:18] can't drive on drive cars on the creek.

[24:19] So, we rely heavily on that two-hour

[24:21] parking to support the businesses on the

[24:23] creek and all alongside the street. So,

[24:25] I I think it's a horrible idea there. I

[24:27] think there's some significant flaws in

[24:29] the design of the bathroom. And the

[24:30] reason I say this is because I spent a

[24:32] year and a half. I've been to so many

[24:33] city council meetings as some of you

[24:36] know might have been around. We spent a

[24:38] lot of time putting that blue together.

[24:39] And it was because we we actually had a

[24:41] traditional plan that was identified in

[24:43] the neighborhood uh revitalization plan

[24:45] for for Ketchacan. There were

[24:48] traditional bathrooms there much like

[24:49] the ones that that were designed by

[24:50] public works now, but we moved away from

[24:53] those because of the safety and

[24:54] security. And that's why we ended up

[24:55] with the Portland concept, right?

[24:58] Unfortunately, I know there's flaws with

[24:59] it, but you'll see that in cities,

[25:01] states all across the country. We were

[25:03] the first city in the United States, I'm

[25:04] proud to say, and they're all across the

[25:06] country. New York just did five this

[25:08] last year. So, and they're

[25:10] internationally used as well. So, that

[25:12] sort of model, if you don't have

[25:14] supervision, the concierge or the

[25:15] attendant model, it's going to be

[25:17] critical uh to to look at that type of

[25:20] stall. The stalls that were designed,

[25:24] you know, adjacent to New York, for

[25:25] example, they had an open area where you

[25:27] walk in and then close the door with

[25:29] multiple stalls in there. We failed at

[25:31] the airport parking lot. We called that

[25:33] the Golden Loop, right? The one that we

[25:34] had for two hour or two years, I think

[25:36] three years that were at the airport. I

[25:38] think you might all recall we tore that

[25:40] one down, right? Partly because we

[25:41] didn't plan ahead for the G4V. We didn't

[25:44] plan ahead for the airport. We also made

[25:45] an unsafe uh an unsafe restroom there.

[25:48] So, I highly encourage you to uh to not

[25:52] place the restroom there. Um I would

[25:55] recommend the mobile solution as well. I

[25:58] would recommend Whale Park as a good

[25:59] solution to minimize parking loss.

[26:02] Discovery Center that you've already

[26:03] identified would be a good solution.

[26:05] Those are both great interim solutions.

[26:07] In the meantime, let's put together a

[26:08] comprehensive plan. We're looking at

[26:10] public amenities. We can't gate up our

[26:13] bus stops. We can't gate up our shelters

[26:16] at birth three. We can't remove all the

[26:18] benches in town, right? We have to come

[26:19] up with a plan to manage public

[26:21] amenities. I think part of that is going

[26:23] to be working with your legal

[26:24] department, with your police department.

[26:26] We have to figure out a way to not to to

[26:28] enforce these laws and make safe places

[26:31] for people to use the bathroom and use

[26:33] public amenities. Before we spend any

[26:34] more public money, let's figure out that

[26:37] stuff first. Let's figure it out. Mobile

[26:39] [clears throat] solutions is a great

[26:40] one. Spend a couple hundred thousand

[26:41] dollars. You can always move it. You can

[26:43] sell it. You can rent it. You can use it

[26:45] for other civic opportunities. I think

[26:47] the mobile solution is an excellent

[26:49] first phase, first step, safe step, and

[26:52] you don't risk wasting taxpayer money

[26:54] like we did at the airport with that

[26:57] one. So, anyways, thank you very much

[26:58] for your time. If you have any

[26:59] questions, be happy to answer.

[27:00] >> Any question?

[27:02] » Any question?

[27:02] >> Thank you, Stephen. Thank you,

[27:06] » Thank you, Stephen. Thank you,

[27:06] >> Andrew Zinc.

[27:11] » Hello, Andrew Zinc. Uh, 25 Jefferson

[27:14] Way. And, uh, one, I'd like to start and

[27:17] say I'm really glad that the Reeves

[27:18] showed up before me because I think they

[27:19] made a lot of great points and I also

[27:22] agree with a lot of those. Um, as a

[27:24] business owner on the Creek at 21 Creek

[27:26] Street, Fernick's general store and also

[27:28] Ketchan Dry Goods, which is right next

[27:30] to the lot. Um, I think both uh spots

[27:32] prevent or pro have issues. One is

[27:36] taking away a little bit of green space

[27:38] on the creek, but also adding in extra

[27:40] traffic in a really narrow boardwalk

[27:42] seems like a bad idea. Um, the second

[27:45] one, taking away parking spots, I think

[27:47] will be an issue. Parking is already

[27:49] limited. Um, locals use those, staff use

[27:52] those, and so taking away parking spots

[27:54] right next to the building is an issue.

[27:55] Um, and so those are my concerns with

[27:57] those two locations. When I thought

[27:59] about this project, um I think there are

[28:01] some opportunities for actually

[28:03] encouraging development in the town.

[28:05] Placing bathrooms um further down Steman

[28:08] Street towards Salvation Army will help

[28:10] drive some foot traffic that way. That

[28:12] will help with getting foot traffic to

[28:14] the businesses that are already there,

[28:16] but also give an incentive for the

[28:17] buildings that are currently empty or

[28:19] underutilized. Um and so I think that's

[28:22] actually an opportunity with this

[28:24] project to actually have some extra

[28:26] benefit to the community.

[28:28] Thank you.

[28:29] >> Thank you, Andy.

[28:32] » Thank you, Andy.

[28:32] Any question?

[28:34] I don't see any.

[28:34] >> Great.

[28:38] » Hamilton Gellar.

[28:40] >> Yeah, I sent an email earlier today to

[28:44] » Yeah, I sent an email earlier today to

[28:44] you guys. I don't know how many you guys

[28:46] had received it, but it was this.

[28:50] Let me start it over because it's very

[28:52] important. The first part is what? What

[28:55] do you see? Creek Street. That's my

[28:57] property there being advertised on

[28:59] social media to sell cruise ships.

[29:02] Expected to get 1.75 million people.

[29:05] That's biking. They make a lot of money.

[29:07] Okay, here's MSC cruises. New to catch

[29:10] can advertising what? Creek Street.

[29:14] That's what they're advertising. Both in

[29:17] both ads. It's the only human

[29:19] settlement. They're advertising bears,

[29:22] whales, Creek Street.

[29:25] Two years ago, you guys hired this

[29:27] person. I think she's here in the

[29:28] audience. I called her earlier today. I

[29:30] asked her what she had accomplished in

[29:32] the last two years. She proceeded to ask

[29:35] me which organization I was

[29:37] representing. I thought I would you

[29:40] would know that

[29:42] I'm in tourism.

[29:44] You guys hired a tourism manager and

[29:47] nobody knows who she is. And that's why

[29:49] we're here today talking about

[29:51] bathrooms. That's why Steven's up here

[29:53] opposing bathrooms, saying that there's

[29:55] not enough time to discuss this issue.

[29:58] Some plans have been proposed by the

[30:00] city, not by any citizen, but by the

[30:02] city. The city came up with these ideas

[30:04] or ideas. Two were selected. He doesn't

[30:07] like them because they're both next to

[30:09] his properties. I wish they weren't next

[30:11] to your property, Stephen. Sorry about

[30:13] that. [snorts] So, the city of Ketchan

[30:16] tourism manager Ro created man. So she

[30:20] took this picture on Creek Street. I

[30:22] Nobody on Creek Street knows who she is.

[30:25] So you guys want to raise the taxes, but

[30:27] we see these government the manager. Why

[30:31] not just cut her job? Cuz she's not

[30:33] doing any of these things that are on

[30:35] this board. She is a liaison for the

[30:38] community and industry and develop

[30:40] sustainable visitor strategies. What you

[30:43] guys have coming in this summer is not

[30:45] sustainable. It's not at all. like the

[30:48] boardwalk is too small. There's there's

[30:50] like it's the same infrastructure as

[30:53] there was in 2008. There's nothing

[30:55] really changed.

[30:57] She's reporting directly to the city

[30:59] manager. She has extensive Alaskan

[31:02] tourism experience. Not sure what that

[31:04] is. I don't know. Can any I I've asked

[31:07] you guys a lot of times what what that

[31:09] is or why she is still in this position.

[31:14] Uh, she focuses on balancing community

[31:17] needs with the visitor economy. I don't

[31:20] think that's been done. I have one of

[31:22] the most successful businesses on Creek

[31:24] Street. That's not the case. The tourism

[31:28] manager position was established to

[31:30] address challenges arising from high

[31:32] visitor volumes. If she would have been

[31:34] doing that, we would have been

[31:35] discussing bathrooms in 2003, right

[31:38] after she was hired. She would have come

[31:40] down and talked to every one of us.

[31:43] because she says she is a it's a

[31:45] liaison. This is straight from the

[31:46] internet. I'm not making this stuff up.

[31:49] It says she's a liaison. So, how does

[31:52] that work out that we're discussing two

[31:54] years later that we need bathrooms on

[31:58] Creek Street? And also, I asked her what

[32:02] was discussed here on October 13th in

[32:05] this meeting with Clea. Uh Clea meets

[32:08] with uh the city of Ketchan it looks

[32:11] like annually. So I looked up what is

[32:14] CLEA? I don't know how many people in

[32:16] Katchetan know who Clea is. I I know a

[32:19] lot of people don't know who it is. So

[32:21] this is their background information

[32:23] that I got from their lawsuit when they

[32:25] sued Juno in 2016. [snorts]

[32:30] I don't know a lot of people know but

[32:31] they sued Skagway last summer too. Clea

[32:34] did uh the plaintiffs. CLEA Cruise Line

[32:37] International Association of Alaska is a

[32:40] non-forprofit association of 12 cruise

[32:44] ship lines which works to build positive

[32:46] relationships with communities and

[32:48] government agencies in Alaska. I don't

[32:51] think they're doing that. I don't think

[32:53] we have a positive relationship in

[32:55] Ketchan with the locals, with the

[32:58] businesses, with cruise ships.

[33:01] I don't know. Maybe you guys can say

[33:03] there is but I don't think there is and

[33:05] I'm in tourism.

[33:08] Uh so the next this is very important.

[33:12] Um and to protect its members legal

[33:15] interests. That's what is being done

[33:18] here. Clea is basically a gold miner

[33:22] manipulating

[33:24] the local economy, taking all that money

[33:27] out of here, not building like if Cleo

[33:30] was had wanted to to to make and develop

[33:34] strong partnerships. Couldn't the

[33:36] tourism manager just call up says

[33:39] there's 12 cruise lines. Couldn't she

[33:42] just make a phone call and say, "Hey,

[33:43] Norwegian, we got a problem. We need we

[33:45] need the bathroom." bad.

[33:48] Hey, Viking, we see you're advertising

[33:50] Creek Street. We need a hundred

[33:51] thousand. Like to them, that's nothing.

[33:54] They make billions. Billions.

[33:57] They make like [clears throat] I don't

[33:59] know how many billions, but you guys are

[34:01] getting screwed. You guys make like 12

[34:03] billion. And a lot of locals are

[34:05] wondering where does that money go if

[34:07] you can't even decide to build bathrooms

[34:09] on the most visited street and catch

[34:12] camp.

[34:12] >> Thank you.

[34:13] » Thank you.

[34:13] >> You have any questions?

[34:14] » You have any questions?

[34:14] >> Any questions?

[34:17] » Any questions?

[34:17] Yeah, good.

[34:18] >> Thank you for asking me a question. I

[34:21] » Thank you for asking me a question. I

[34:21] must say that when somebody comes up

[34:22] here, I feel like you guys should always

[34:24] organize so at least one person asks a

[34:28] question and makes it feel like the

[34:30] citizens are actually being listened to.

[34:32] So, thank you very much, Riley.

[34:33] >> No problem. Uh, so I don't want to try

[34:36] » No problem. Uh, so I don't want to try

[34:36] to read your mind. Just to be clear, you

[34:38] are in support of choosing one of those

[34:40] two locations for a bathroom. Is that

[34:42] correct? And if so, which one do you

[34:44] prefer? I would prefer Dolly's House. I

[34:46] mean, it makes sense. It's the only

[34:48] Bordello museum in Ketchacan. It's It's

[34:53] a very prominent location. Maybe Steven

[34:57] would prefer a scaled down version. I

[35:00] personally don't know if it needs to be

[35:03] six bathrooms with a family bathroom.

[35:06] All I know is we need a one bathroom.

[35:09] Like one, just make it one. Doesn't

[35:11] matter if there's two, one, at least

[35:13] one.

[35:15] one for each

[35:17] and to send somebody from [snorts]

[35:20] the like say they're by the tram and

[35:22] they are where's the bathroom? They have

[35:26] no idea. They think catch can's big, you

[35:27] know, they've never been here. So you

[35:29] send them down the boardwalk, there's

[35:30] people taking pictures of the Creek

[35:32] Street sign all the time. That walkway

[35:35] is only like 48 in wide. If you were in

[35:38] a wheelchair, if you had a walker, you

[35:40] wouldn't be able to pass that person

[35:43] there because it's so limited in space.

[35:45] You'd actually just have to pull over to

[35:47] the side and wait. And there's an

[35:49] overabundance of people in that entrance

[35:53] area by the bridge and they just come on

[35:55] there. I feel like that's a great

[35:56] location for a bathroom. I thought maybe

[35:58] it would be a good location behind the

[36:00] Star building either. There's limited

[36:02] space, but I mean the sewer is just all

[36:05] right there.

[36:07] Um, personally, Stephen is not in

[36:10] retail. Neither is Cayenne. Um, I'm in

[36:13] retail. No, I'm telling you, I know all

[36:15] the retail people on Creek Street. And

[36:17] there's not one single person that would

[36:19] say, "Yeah, let's just have everybody in

[36:23] and in in my bathroom." Then we're not

[36:25] even re retailers. That would hinder my

[36:28] economic development. I wouldn't even be

[36:30] able to sell stuff. I'd be like

[36:32] maintaining a bathroom. I mean, if y'all

[36:35] want that to happen, buy my building.

[36:39] I'll sell it. Like, if a bathroom's too

[36:42] expensive by Dolly's, I'll sell you

[36:44] mine. It'll be great. And I'll go away

[36:46] and shut up.

[36:49] >> Thank you.

[36:49] » Thank you.

[36:49] >> Can I get five more minutes?

[36:52] » Can I get five more minutes?

[36:52] [laughter]

[36:53] >> If he wanted economic development,

[36:55] » If he wanted economic development,

[36:55] develop develop his place on

[36:57] >> Hey, that's enough. He's got undeveloped

[37:00] » Hey, that's enough. He's got undeveloped

[37:00] places. All right.

[37:01] >> Thank you. Anybody

[37:04] » Thank you. Anybody

[37:04] else?

[37:04] >> Yes, there is one other uh person and I

[37:07] » Yes, there is one other uh person and I

[37:07] cannot. It's Carari.

[37:10] >> Oh, no. I had Sorry, I thought you have

[37:12] » Oh, no. I had Sorry, I thought you have

[37:12] to.

[37:13] >> Oh, with that. Oh, okay. Okay. Thank

[37:15] » Oh, with that. Oh, okay. Okay. Thank

[37:15] you.

[37:16] >> We have Mary.

[37:17] » We have Mary.

[37:18] >> I was coming if I could.

[37:20] » I was coming if I could.

[37:20] >> Let me get you the microphone. Hey

[37:22] » Let me get you the microphone. Hey

[37:22] there, Mary.

[37:22] >> Oh,

[37:28] everybody's got a little flyer. Mary,

[37:30] it's been a couple of weeks. day and

[37:32] night on my nomination is going to be

[37:35] the married man's

[37:38] restroom there at Creek.

[37:41] I

[37:42] really laid out a nice uh coordination

[37:46] of information about the building goes

[37:49] back to the 1920s.

[37:51] What is this building used for if not

[37:53] for a restroom? We don't need another

[37:56] gift shop and maybe not another

[37:58] restaurant. I'd also like to take more

[38:00] time with the other handout is that we

[38:04] are recruiting, we should be recruiting

[38:07] u more restrooms as I'm calling it, more

[38:10] Johns. Uh following the template of

[38:13] Sitka, it's been brought up a couple of

[38:15] times. There is their agreement on that

[38:18] flyer there. I've stolen a couple of

[38:20] their words of of it. Um but I but by

[38:27] they failed

[38:28] um were not happy with. They did get

[38:31] good turnout for merchants as I

[38:33] understand, but Sitka came up with a

[38:36] stipen of $2,000.

[38:38] There's [snorts]

[38:40] 53 days

[38:43] in our season and that boils down to $13

[38:46] a day. Those people were getting paid

[38:48] for, thank you very much, to leaving

[38:50] their bathroom open. I maintain, as you

[38:53] will see, we offer two opportunities.

[38:57] grant a

[38:59] which

[39:00] set up an RFP and you find your uh

[39:04] janitorial service that will go out

[39:07] service these merchants who have said

[39:09] yes we'd like to participate and uh the

[39:13] CPV fund would have paid for a daily

[39:16] visit and um the paper supplies that's

[39:20] grant A grant B is where you model after

[39:25] the Alaska a heating uh assistance

[39:28] program in which uh it's a stipen of

[39:32] $750.

[39:34] Uh it's given to directly if I qualify,

[39:37] which I do, it's given directly to uh

[39:40] KPU and they will cut a check for my

[39:45] utilities until that $750 is exhausted.

[39:50] It's about two and a half months. So in

[39:52] grant A, uh if that business owner says

[39:55] yes, they're going to get services. Uh

[39:58] and B is um a stipen. Now business uh

[40:03] wastewater and water averages about $37

[40:07] a month. So when we crunch the numbers,

[40:13] um this is a very nice package that

[40:17] we're reaching out to those businesses

[40:19] on the front line to come up with one or

[40:22] two of their bathrooms. And there is a

[40:25] criteria which stated right at the front

[40:27] that the business has to post a sign

[40:30] we're open. They must stay open the

[40:32] entire um day for the whole season.

[40:37] and there's a certain agreement of it.

[40:39] Now, I maintain we have to do a

[40:41] marketing effort. Uh the visitor center,

[40:45] the chamber of commerce, the city itself

[40:48] puts out a blitz in its marketing and

[40:51] says we're looking for a few good

[40:53] businesses and get them signed up and

[40:56] get it ready by April, pushing it by

[40:59] June 1st. And I think you've got four,

[41:02] not five bathrooms located throughout

[41:04] downtown that's ready to go. and that's

[41:07] going to carry us over through uh the

[41:10] summer. If you feel you've got to spend

[41:12] $200,000 for a mobile unit,

[41:16] okay, but I think that I know of three

[41:19] businesses who have told me four years

[41:21] ago when I did this effort, I've been

[41:24] championing this cause for four years

[41:27] and I know there's businesses ready to

[41:29] go. They've always said no because the

[41:32] of the water three $400 bill uh and also

[41:37] the supplies and and the whatever. But

[41:40] we've got the talent. We've got CPV

[41:43] funds ready to go and you've got five

[41:46] bathrooms. It's a no-brainer. Thank you.

[41:50] >> Thank you, Mary.

[41:53] » Thank you, Mary.

[41:53] There. Anybody else that wish to speak?

[41:54] Council tonight.

[41:59] [clears throat]

[42:03] Um,

[42:05] we do have a presentation

[42:08] um from Jagan

[42:11] shipyard. The council wish to do it

[42:13] before consent or after? Before after.

[42:21] » All right. So, we're going to move that

[42:22] item

[42:24] ahead of consent. So, Berg,

[42:29] >> thank you for the choice of before. Good

[42:30] » thank you for the choice of before. Good

[42:30] evening, honor mayor and council.

[42:38] » Bergman Wheeler, uh, 17 Shoot Street.

[42:40] So, not speaking for the city, um, but

[42:42] speaking as the giant catch can general

[42:44] manager, and I have a presentation to

[42:46] display when it cues up.

[42:50] Yes.

[43:03] So, while that gets loaded, I'll let you

[43:05] guys know. Um, Jag has taken over

[43:07] custody of Ada shipyard, Ketchan

[43:09] shipyard. We are the new operators

[43:11] there. And there was a meeting uh

[43:14] between ADA city members, public works,

[43:17] power uh bureau members, ADA, local

[43:20] delegates and delegation. So some of

[43:22] this information was presented there.

[43:24] I've updated some of this information as

[43:26] well. So for those that you saw, those

[43:28] of you that saw that or were at that

[43:30] meeting or read the newspaper articles,

[43:32] there are some regurgitated facts. Um

[43:34] but as I hadn't gotten before the city

[43:36] council yet, I wanted to present these

[43:37] facts to you all and those listening and

[43:39] watching as well. So, as you'll see

[43:41] before you, um, you'll see our our

[43:43] paradigm of, you know, five key

[43:44] components to success. Um, this is

[43:47] JAG's,

[43:50] let's call it, their their guide book,

[43:52] their playbook, per se. Um, each one of

[43:54] those components works towards success

[43:56] of a business unit and overall the

[43:58] entire Jag Marine Group. Uh, speaking of

[44:01] Jag Marine Group, I I'm remissed to say

[44:03] Tim Jigelski wanted to join me here

[44:05] tonight, but he was unable to make the

[44:07] the flight down to catch because he had

[44:09] other pressing business matters that

[44:10] came up and he is the co-owner of Jag.

[44:12] So, I'm not just standing before you

[44:13] only representing a company as a local,

[44:15] but also he wanted to be here in person

[44:16] in a tent. So, as you can see, the

[44:18] shared vision of these different key

[44:20] elements are with our customers. This

[44:22] really combines to make a successful

[44:24] business enterprise whether it is at an

[44:25] industrial shipyard or a retail store on

[44:28] Creek Street or any type of you know

[44:30] type of situation like that. Um at the

[44:32] top of it you'll see work safely and

[44:34] that'll be covered in ne the next slide.

[44:36] Uh safety is paramount at a heavy

[44:38] industrial shipyard. Safety is paramount

[44:39] of course anywhere in your guys' houses

[44:41] anywhere around town with our tourist

[44:43] incumbents and of course at a heavy

[44:44] industrial type of place. It is each and

[44:47] every second uh critical there. So um

[44:50] execution of these you know objectives

[44:53] brings uh a total coefficient of loyalty

[44:55] and repeat customers um best value to

[44:57] our customers which our customer base

[44:59] has expanded in the recent uh last 3

[45:02] months four months um and then expansion

[45:04] of opportunities because customers want

[45:05] to come back. Next slide please.

[45:11] Like I said safety is the forerunner and

[45:14] most focal point thing at the shipyard.

[45:17] Um it has to be Jags. Uh so you guys

[45:21] might have seen in the paper previously

[45:22] that we had uh we have been recognized

[45:24] at our shipyard for multiple safety

[45:26] awards uh year-over-year for excellence

[45:29] in safety which is based on a um a

[45:31] recordable rate. I won't go into all the

[45:33] acronyms but Jags rate exceeds that even

[45:36] as you'll see there. uh the rate when

[45:38] this slide was pulled was 0.5

[45:41] which means it's an exponentially low

[45:42] and that 0.5 is a it's a mathematical

[45:45] equation means amount of injuries

[45:47] calculated into the amount of hours

[45:49] worked so I won't go into the minutiae

[45:50] on there but it's it's an industry

[45:52] standard and we're quite quite below the

[45:54] industry standard um which is a it's a

[45:56] very good thing for anybody listening

[45:58] who wants a job there that's a good

[45:59] thing because that means we're very safe

[46:01] so along among other things that I'll

[46:02] get to as we go along in this

[46:04] presentation um and let's roll to the

[46:06] next slide

[46:10] So, as you'll see before you, the base

[46:12] trajectory started in 2017 at the Jagen

[46:14] Marine Group during the acquisition

[46:16] right before this acquisition of the

[46:18] Seward Shipyard. This is just a 10-year

[46:19] span approximately. Obviously, we're in

[46:21] 26, not 27. You can see the exponential

[46:24] growth that has been projected along the

[46:26] lines of this company. The acquisition

[46:27] of Seward Shipyard was in 2018 and 2019.

[46:30] You can see the increase there. Um, and

[46:32] additionally, the catch can shipyard was

[46:33] added in Q4 of 2025.

[46:36] the overall trajectory is based off of

[46:38] the revenue and the plan for the you

[46:41] know the actual company. So it's uh

[46:44] growing exponentially and there's a lot

[46:46] of uh potential and a lot of tangible

[46:49] gains that'll be made throughout these

[46:50] next couple coming years and into the

[46:52] future beyond. Next slide please.

[46:58] » Um did you skip over or just double

[47:00] click?

[47:04] » This is the next one. Perfect. Sorry.

[47:06] >> Um, no worries. Saw the flash. So,

[47:08] » Um, no worries. Saw the flash. So,

[47:08] before you see the headcount,

[47:11] everyone always wants to talk about the

[47:12] labor. Let's talk about what how many

[47:13] people are working at the shipyard. Uh,

[47:16] the headcount graph before you also

[47:17] shows the exponential growth of the

[47:19] catch shipyard, but I wanted to put some

[47:21] different facts in there. The

[47:22] presentation that I made to the burough,

[47:23] no disrespect to the burrow. Uh, I have

[47:25] modified the slide. So, the presentation

[47:27] for all those you watching, the slide is

[47:28] slightly different. So, pay attention

[47:29] please. uh because you had some of these

[47:31] questions along the lines and I put that

[47:32] in the final slide as well not to dis

[47:34] diminish the city of court council of

[47:35] course. So when Jag took over the

[47:37] custody of the shipyard, there was eight

[47:38] souls that are working, myself included.

[47:41] Um, as of 15, the total count is 173

[47:44] people that are working there. Now, of

[47:46] course, some of those are traveling

[47:47] people. Again does not have 173 people

[47:50] that are going to work in industrial

[47:51] trades, but we do have 90 full-time

[47:53] residents at this point and bringing in

[47:56] more, constantly hiring more people. um

[47:58] whether that be drivers to the vans

[48:00] around town, people that are laborers, I

[48:02] need an admin. So if anybody wants to be

[48:03] an ad and really love one of those, Evie

[48:05] Bermudas would appreciate you greatly

[48:07] and lots of other type of roles. So when

[48:10] I built the slide just two weeks ago, we

[48:11] actually had more traveling personnel

[48:13] versus Alaskan personnel. So that

[48:14] paradigm, that 4% metric is actually

[48:17] shifting and it's constantly evolving

[48:19] towards the heavier to Alaskan

[48:20] residents, which is our purview. It's

[48:22] our goal. It's more economically viable.

[48:24] It's more efficient for the city, for

[48:25] the bureau, for our business. to have

[48:28] people living here, staying here, you

[48:30] know, eating, spending their money here,

[48:31] which are traveling people do as well,

[48:33] but that way we're not paying them for

[48:34] DM and lodging. Um, and above factors do

[48:37] not include all the other things I

[48:38] listed, which is the vessel crews. I

[48:40] mean, both those Noah ships that are

[48:41] down in the shipyard right now have 20

[48:44] 30 people, um, plus the subcontractors,

[48:46] the tech reps. I mean, there there's,

[48:47] you know, the shipyard is quite busy and

[48:49] full of people right now. Next slide,

[48:50] please.

[48:53] >> Your honor.

[48:55] » Your honor.

[48:55] >> Yes. Thank you, Brian, for presentation.

[48:57] » Yes. Thank you, Brian, for presentation.

[48:57] I have a question.

[48:58] >> Yes.

[48:59] » Yes.

[48:59] >> Uh you're talking about employment with

[49:01] » Uh you're talking about employment with

[49:01] 48% uh travelers and 52% uh Alaskan

[49:06] residents. Have you thought of any

[49:08] apprentice program so that you can

[49:10] incorporate kids from within the state

[49:11] and within the city and borrow district?

[49:15] >> Yes, we've uh discussed that with

[49:17] » Yes, we've uh discussed that with

[49:17] leadership in Jag. Um they did a bring a

[49:20] person along for a summer in Seward. I

[49:23] don't have the exact facts ironed out at

[49:24] this point in time, but it's been

[49:25] discussed. It's on my workforce

[49:26] development notebook that I've been Yes.

[49:29] moving forward. Um was contacted by the

[49:33] Southeast Island School District

[49:34] yesterday about some kids who wanted to

[49:36] potentially come work at the shipyard

[49:37] when they get out of school. I'm touring

[49:38] them on Friday. So that's 16 youth who

[49:41] want to come look at the shipyard. And

[49:42] so to the exact tangible answer to your

[49:45] question, I do not have an

[49:46] apprenticeship exactly at this point in

[49:48] time. It is, but I am working to develop

[49:50] something along those lines. I just

[49:52] don't fully know what it is yet because

[49:54] I'm still learning what work for and how

[49:56] it's all going together.

[49:57] >> Thank you.

[49:58] » Thank you.

[49:58] >> Good idea.

[50:01] » Next slide talks about historical

[50:03] utilization. Of course, all these graphs

[50:06] are similar. You'll see a very, you

[50:07] know, similar line between them. Um,

[50:10] increased occupancy of the shipyard,

[50:12] increased staffing of the shipyard, and

[50:14] increased work at the shipyard. over the

[50:17] previous five years, the catch can

[50:18] shipyard um basically we say the book

[50:22] business it shows 2.7% growth compared

[50:24] to the pre prior five-year average.

[50:26] You'll see the graph I took out 2025

[50:28] because that was a slightly skewed year

[50:30] due to all the events that went on. But

[50:32] the uh forecast of 2026 and 2027 the

[50:35] booked is in the let's call it orange or

[50:38] yellow. The known and highly likely is

[50:42] in the green and then the potential

[50:43] would be in the red. So you can see that

[50:45] we're at a 400% potential uh increase in

[50:49] overall utilization of the shipyard

[50:50] compared to what was um previously being

[50:54] utilized at the shipyard. So uh it's an

[50:57] extreme upside and there will be an

[50:58] answer of why we are so much more have

[51:00] so much more potential when I get to the

[51:02] question slide. Next slide please.

[51:10] So off to the races. 919 we got the keys

[51:13] and had a project on day one. Uh this is

[51:16] a question that came up. So I wanted to

[51:17] throw this slide in there. Um

[51:20] we had initial projects that have

[51:21] already been completed. It's the circle

[51:23] eye that grounding. We did not do the

[51:24] grounding repair but we supported that

[51:26] project allowing them to get out of here

[51:27] uh down to their their winter harbridge

[51:30] and would have happy would have happy to

[51:31] [clears throat] support that project but

[51:32] it was we already had vessels up on the

[51:34] dry dog. Tasine has been performed.

[51:36] Latuya, Oral Freeman, which I know is a

[51:38] sticking point uh a sore spot, I'll say,

[51:40] with the ongoing events of everything as

[51:43] the shipyard evolved to where it is

[51:45] today, and also a couple other AMHs

[51:47] vessels. Uh underway, we have the Noah

[51:50] Reineer, the Noah Okianos Explorer, uh

[51:53] the ADFG Kestrel, which has never been

[51:57] performed at the shipyard, and neither

[51:58] has Norah ever been Noah ever been

[52:00] docked at the shipyard. Um so that these

[52:03] are major successes straight out the

[52:04] gate uh getting awarded those Noah

[52:06] projects and this ADF and Jeep uh

[52:08] vessel. We've performed work for the

[52:10] state in Alaska Park and fishing game

[52:11] prior to but that vessel has not been

[52:13] awarded here. Um additionally we also

[52:15] have the fair weather project which just

[52:16] started on Monday doide availability

[52:18] down at the base. So we currently have

[52:19] three Noah projects

[52:22] and as of 6 months ago we never had a

[52:23] Noah project this shipyard. So uh those

[52:26] are very good things. Um, additionally,

[52:29] we have a couple AMHS vessels, Laconi

[52:30] and Colombia have come in. Um, since the

[52:33] Kenny cott's back online facility

[52:35] projects, I wanted to touch on this and

[52:36] I was remissed in my last presentation.

[52:38] The receiving slab at the shipyard has

[52:40] been a point of discussion. We have

[52:42] completed the operational repairs. It is

[52:44] not a permanent repair. Permanent

[52:46] repairs are also being assessed and

[52:47] discussed with DOT and ADA. But as you

[52:49] can see, that picture drastically shows

[52:51] that there is a vessel on that receiving

[52:53] slab. So, we performed the repairs

[52:54] immediately. We were breaking concrete

[52:56] within the first week of occupancy and

[52:58] or reoccupancy. I never really left. Um

[53:01] but I basically sleep there. Um and so

[53:04] that way we could get the first vessel

[53:05] across which was the rainer which is now

[53:08] inside the assembly hall and then get

[53:09] the kestrel right behind me. So that's a

[53:11] huge huge uh milestone and um yeah

[53:15] there's still an ongoing underlying

[53:16] issues with the slab but it is safe for

[53:18] utilization and economic development at

[53:21] the ship or economic revenue at the

[53:23] shipier.

[53:24] Additionally, transfer card overhauls

[53:26] about $110,000 in bearings. And I didn't

[53:28] want to put a giant list of other things

[53:29] we fixed, but that was a big thing that

[53:31] the community talked about. People had

[53:32] asked me about and so the transfer slab

[53:35] is in full operation at this point in

[53:37] time. Next slide, please.

[53:42] » Q&A real quick. How did JAG immediately

[53:44] double triple the amount of work in the

[53:46] catch can shipyard? Um, we aggressively

[53:48] target a broader spectrum. uh whether

[53:51] it's you know United States Coast Guard,

[53:53] we are JAG is one of the most premier

[53:57] and prime contractors for the United

[53:59] States Coast Guard in the entire

[54:00] country. We are a mobile shipyard. We

[54:03] secure approximately 30 to 40% of all

[54:06] bids on on a lot of the cutters. We um

[54:08] we also bid aggressively and further

[54:11] abroad. The Noah Okianis Explorer that's

[54:13] here is homeported in Hawaii. So we were

[54:14] competing against the entire West Coast

[54:16] and Hawaii and we won and we have that

[54:18] vessel here. So it is a lot broader

[54:20] spectrum. Um the MSSE, the US Army Corps

[54:24] of Engineers, um those vessels typically

[54:28] go to facilities in um along the West

[54:32] Coast and so we're also bidding in

[54:34] aggressively after those vessels to pull

[54:35] them here as well. Um you know, we we

[54:39] just we have a very lean overhead as

[54:42] well. um that at times comes into a more

[54:45] constrictive fashion, seeing as how you

[54:46] don't have the overall structure as

[54:48] well, but you have very competitive edge

[54:50] when everyone is actually out there

[54:52] performing work on the vessels or able

[54:53] to lift up something and do something um

[54:55] productively for the project overall.

[54:57] Not saying anybody does didn't, but it

[54:59] allows for better competitiveness.

[55:02] Next question that you might potentially

[55:03] have thought, how's Jag dealing with the

[55:04] employee lodging issues? Because we

[55:06] always talk about housing. I've always

[55:07] talked about housing and sat here before

[55:09] you and said we need more housing. Well,

[55:10] we bought housing. Uh, Jag did. We did.

[55:13] And so we closed on the, uh, Trident

[55:16] Cape Fox bunk house. I was actually

[55:17] walking through it and figuring out

[55:18] outfitting. And then I'm walking through

[55:20] with Mar a contractor here shortly

[55:23] tomorrow to start remodeling it to add

[55:25] more occupancy rooms. So, we're working

[55:26] on that for transient and also people

[55:29] who want to stay there or in people.

[55:31] somebody wants to move up here and

[55:32] figure out where they want to go and

[55:33] they want to rent a room there in

[55:34] company um you know or get a room there

[55:38] that's that's also something we're

[55:39] trying to work on there so what can you

[55:41] guys do single family housing of course

[55:42] is always an issue here in Ketchan

[55:44] whether it's just opening up more land

[55:46] working together I have reached out to

[55:48] Deborah and her and I'll meet up again

[55:50] later uh Jag also looked at acquiring

[55:52] land seward and making a big housing

[55:54] development for single family housing

[55:56] single family housing um because we've

[55:58] already brought people up here who want

[55:59] to move here and want to live here, but

[56:01] finding housing effectively and

[56:03] efficiently is a little difficult when

[56:04] you're new to catch can. So, this covers

[56:07] our transient need, diminishes the load

[56:09] on Ketchan during the summer occupancy,

[56:11] and also helps us with short-term

[56:14] lodging for anybody in our organization

[56:16] who needs it. Long-term, like I said,

[56:19] family homes, you know, it's the most

[56:21] critical thing that I could say, and of

[56:23] course, all of you could potentially

[56:24] agree. Um, so moving on that.

[56:28] >> Yes, please.

[56:28] » Yes, please.

[56:28] >> I have a question. Um, so my

[56:30] » I have a question. Um, so my

[56:30] understanding is so you have a spot in

[56:32] Skagway

[56:33] >> Sewart.

[56:34] » Sewart.

[56:34] >> Sewart, excuse, sorry. Um, and then

[56:38] » Sewart, excuse, sorry. Um, and then

[56:38] >> I don't know why Skagway is on my mind.

[56:40] » I don't know why Skagway is on my mind.

[56:40] Um, maybe it's the snow.

[56:43] >> I heard you're also looking at wrangle.

[56:46] » I heard you're also looking at wrangle.

[56:46] So, what's the commitment and like

[56:48] what's the work?

[56:50] >> I I just can't even

[56:52] » I I just can't even

[56:52] >> You don't see the amount of workload

[56:53] » You don't see the amount of workload

[56:53] because I've stood here before you and

[56:54] told you there's not enough workload out

[56:55] there. [laughter]

[56:57] >> I have a

[56:59] » I have a

[56:59] That's that's perfectly honest and and

[57:00] and fine question. Um Seward has plenty

[57:04] of work right now. I can't fit more

[57:06] boats right now. And there's other

[57:08] shipyards that are about 6 and 700 miles

[57:10] away that I know the amount of work they

[57:12] go after, bid on and also compete with.

[57:14] And none of those ships have ever came

[57:16] to the Alaskan waters nor bid be bid for

[57:18] the Alaskan waters. there is a large

[57:20] market share for some other potential

[57:23] our potential competitors that are

[57:26] nearby that we could compete with all of

[57:28] the vessels that they currently also go

[57:30] after. So I would say there is plenty of

[57:33] work if we even had the wrangle shipyard

[57:35] in full operation catch shipyard and

[57:38] sewage shipyard. [snorts]

[57:39] >> Nice. Nice

[57:40] » Nice. Nice

[57:40] >> because we are competitor now. We're not

[57:43] » because we are competitor now. We're not

[57:43] Yeah. Anyways um additionally

[57:45] >> being more aggressive.

[57:46] » being more aggressive.

[57:46] >> Yes. Yeah. that and also catches can

[57:49] » Yes. Yeah. that and also catches can

[57:49] shipyard doesn't have the capacity for

[57:51] our ice breakers. So there's also

[57:52] conversations with uh federal delegation

[57:55] to potentially put a third dry dock in

[57:57] South Birth. The DOT is also in that

[57:59] conversation. There's not a slide on

[58:00] that, but that would increase our

[58:01] occupancy here, but that's only one. If

[58:03] we get four to six ice breakers in

[58:04] Alaskan waters defending American

[58:06] waters, then we'd have a rotationary

[58:08] budgetary cycle for I think it's $1.7

[58:11] billion as defense for the ice breakers

[58:14] alone. So I mean, you're going to need

[58:15] more shipyards in potential. So if we

[58:17] have the ability to bid and execute

[58:20] because we get all the Coast Guard, Jay

[58:21] gets all the Coastg Guard icebreaker

[58:22] work. So you need more occupancy. So

[58:25] Wrangle will be a prime site for that.

[58:26] There's also MSC which is military seal

[58:28] of lift command. All those ships are

[58:29] service down south

[58:31] >> and right and in Hawaii. Yes.

[58:33] » and right and in Hawaii. Yes.

[58:34] >> We also talking 6 700t ships.

[58:36] » We also talking 6 700t ships.

[58:36] >> Uh we were aggressively going after a

[58:38] » Uh we were aggressively going after a

[58:38] tao or the ketchan shipyard potentially.

[58:40] We were entertaining it and looking at

[58:42] it and I believe we're submitting on it.

[58:44] Um that vessel is

[58:47] Um it's large I'll put it that way. It

[58:50] requires a lot of power and a lot of

[58:51] service that is not it we can do the job

[58:54] but you know being able to catch only

[58:57] has so much infrastructure. Same thing

[58:58] with sewart. So this would add that max

[59:00] cap. It would be putting you know cruise

[59:02] ship dock in per se allowing you to

[59:04] perform on vessels that size. So

[59:06] >> So you're looking at extending that that

[59:09] » So you're looking at extending that that

[59:09] pro or the the shipyard or too.

[59:13] >> We'll extend everywhere we can.

[59:16] » We'll extend everywhere we can.

[59:16] Yep.

[59:17] Did that answer it clearly? Excellent.

[59:19] >> Thank you.

[59:21] » Thank you.

[59:22] >> Um, next one is what problems getting

[59:25] » Um, next one is what problems getting

[59:25] skilled employees? Uh, we have an

[59:27] unlimited supply of skilled workers.

[59:29] They are traveling workers. So,

[59:30] apprentichip programs, that's a great

[59:32] thing. Hiring people in, putting them

[59:34] beside somebody and getting them to

[59:36] learn and work their way up is something

[59:38] that we're a severe advocate of and in

[59:40] the process of. um been hiring in plenty

[59:44] of people who are not top tier qualified

[59:45] but are willing to work hard that is the

[59:47] first I mean if anybody listening if you

[59:49] want to pee clean and work your butt off

[59:51] and make a lot of money there is an

[59:53] excellent opportunity there you will

[59:55] work a lot though um because we like to

[59:57] work a lot at a ship it's a good thing

[59:59] so um you know problems getting skilled

[1:00:02] employees isn't the exact thing it's

[1:00:04] it's if we want to bring them and have

[1:00:06] them live here in Ketchan we want to

[1:00:07] grow our base here in Ketchan so that

[1:00:09] goes back to the housing piece that

[1:00:10] we're also working on and also the

[1:00:12] pipeline with high school with uh KIC

[1:00:15] with the local community college or

[1:00:16] local college, excuse me. Um yeah, what

[1:00:20] resources explored to build Alaskan

[1:00:22] resident employee base? Uh like I just

[1:00:24] talked about all those. We're also

[1:00:25] bringing in I just brought in somebody

[1:00:26] from ABTE which is the technical school

[1:00:29] in Seward. So working there. Uh I

[1:00:31] brought a guy down off pipeline. Usually

[1:00:33] loose people up there but I actually

[1:00:34] brought one in. I'm also flying people

[1:00:36] up from down south um that want to move

[1:00:38] here. Uh currently two uh marine

[1:00:43] contractors closed their doors in the

[1:00:45] last couple weeks and so we've been

[1:00:46] working with their former employees as

[1:00:47] well to see if they want to come up to

[1:00:49] our great catch again camp. Excuse me.

[1:00:51] And last but not least question uh what

[1:00:53] can you all do to help right um you

[1:00:57] already do enough of course we all do

[1:00:58] but there's lots of things that can be

[1:01:00] done of course additionally. So I'm

[1:01:02] going to start in the bottom and just

[1:01:03] talk about the hub zone status we've

[1:01:04] submitted for hub zone status for catch

[1:01:06] can which we for our shipyard. What that

[1:01:08] means is it allows us to be more

[1:01:10] competitive and have a percentage uh

[1:01:12] advantage for bidding. Um catch scan in

[1:01:17] the summer is not economically

[1:01:18] depressed. Catch scan in the winter is

[1:01:19] economically depressed. So hub zone

[1:01:21] status would be applied if approved

[1:01:23] through the the

[1:01:25] department of commerce would allow us to

[1:01:27] be more competitively bid. So when

[1:01:28] somebody asks you about that, if you are

[1:01:30] in favor of it, please verbalize that.

[1:01:33] If you're not, of course, that's your

[1:01:34] own prerogative and I respect that as

[1:01:36] well. But um this would benefit the

[1:01:38] economy of catch can and benefit putting

[1:01:40] more jobs here as well and bidding more

[1:01:41] jobs. Um and then identifying additional

[1:01:44] opportunities is always a thing. Um if

[1:01:47] you guys come up with something or want

[1:01:49] us to look at something and be happy to

[1:01:50] look at it, please shoot me an email or

[1:01:52] get a hold of us in any way, shape or

[1:01:54] form.

[1:01:55] And I took more than three minutes. I do

[1:01:57] apologize. And any questions? Next

[1:02:00] slide, please.

[1:02:02] >> I have one about the Can you explain the

[1:02:03] » I have one about the Can you explain the

[1:02:03] hub status?

[1:02:05] I don't have an extreme understanding of

[1:02:08] it. I have a general understanding of

[1:02:10] it. I haven't read into it in depth. I

[1:02:11] know I put it together. It's based on

[1:02:13] the amount of residents that we have

[1:02:15] working here and we meet that

[1:02:16] qualification. It's based on it allows

[1:02:19] us to

[1:02:21] and I know if my boss is watching

[1:02:23] wondering why I'm not, you know, saying

[1:02:24] so eloquently because I usually have a

[1:02:26] very articulate answer. um it allows the

[1:02:29] government and other competitive

[1:02:32] um solicitors, people putting out jobs

[1:02:35] to give us an advantage to bid on that

[1:02:37] work. So I've sat here before you and

[1:02:39] talked about small business set aside

[1:02:41] being a problem. That's actually a

[1:02:42] benefit now. So I mean we get the small

[1:02:45] bit business jobs. The fairweather

[1:02:46] that's down there was one of them. Um

[1:02:49] the Kestrel is not a small business, but

[1:02:50] the hub zone jobs, those also add that

[1:02:53] additional layer of those who are not in

[1:02:55] a hub zone cannot bid on them. So,

[1:02:57] >> um, it adds a additional insurance to be

[1:03:01] » um, it adds a additional insurance to be

[1:03:01] able to compete in those areas.

[1:03:03] >> Thank you.

[1:03:04] » Thank you.

[1:03:04] >> Yeah.

[1:03:05] » Yeah.

[1:03:05] >> Uh, thank you, Mr. Willer, for your

[1:03:06] » Uh, thank you, Mr. Willer, for your

[1:03:06] presentation. Uh, first I want to say I

[1:03:09] know you said it's a temporary fix, but

[1:03:10] I'm really impressed that you got that

[1:03:11] slab issue addressed because I know when

[1:03:12] we had that meeting at that very civic

[1:03:14] center, that was one of the topics of

[1:03:15] discussion. It didn't sound like an easy

[1:03:16] solution. I know there's a larger fix

[1:03:18] that needs to be made over time, but I'm

[1:03:20] really glad you have that working now.

[1:03:21] Uh, in the interval between Bigger's

[1:03:23] operation and Jags, you said you were

[1:03:24] down to eight people working on site.

[1:03:26] And I'm just curious, and you may not

[1:03:29] have the specific numbers, and that's

[1:03:30] fine, but I know there were a lot of

[1:03:31] employees that were part of the previous

[1:03:34] operation who were concerned about their

[1:03:36] jobs, their future, etc. And I wondered,

[1:03:39] you might be able to speak to what

[1:03:40] percentage of those individuals you're

[1:03:42] able to rehire or retain.

[1:03:44] >> So far, I've gotten about 68% of them

[1:03:47] » So far, I've gotten about 68% of them

[1:03:47] back.

[1:03:48] >> That's a pretty great specific number.

[1:03:49] » That's a pretty great specific number.

[1:03:49] Okay. Thank you. That's

[1:03:51] >> I didn't add it to the slide, I ran out

[1:03:52] » I didn't add it to the slide, I ran out

[1:03:52] of room, but yeah.

[1:03:53] >> Yeah. [laughter] Okay.

[1:03:54] » Yeah. [laughter] Okay.

[1:03:54] >> It was originally I as it was estimated

[1:03:56] » It was originally I as it was estimated

[1:03:56] 80 with a lick of the thumb in the wind,

[1:03:58] but when I actually got a couple months

[1:03:59] in for overall statistics, it was

[1:04:01] approximately 68%. And that's not

[1:04:03] because of any any

[1:04:06] issue. We offered them all jobs back per

[1:04:08] se. Uh it's just or you know, it's

[1:04:10] people found other employment and other

[1:04:12] other avenues of their own passion,

[1:04:14] whatever that may be. Sure. They're

[1:04:15] >> not worth that many hours and work.

[1:04:18] » not worth that many hours and work.

[1:04:18] >> All right. Anybody else? Thank you.

[1:04:21] » All right. Anybody else? Thank you.

[1:04:21] >> All right. Thank you guys for your time

[1:04:22] » All right. Thank you guys for your time

[1:04:22] and have a good evening.

[1:04:26] » That brings us to consent.

[1:04:30] I have a motion.

[1:04:31] >> Move to consent.

[1:04:32] » Move to consent.

[1:04:32] >> Second.

[1:04:33] » Second.

[1:04:33] >> It has been moved and seconded.

[1:04:36] » It has been moved and seconded.

[1:04:36] Um

[1:04:39] clerk, would you read the item? Approval

[1:04:42] of minutes, special budget meetings of

[1:04:43] December 8th, December 11th, December

[1:04:46] 15th of 2025, and a special meeting of

[1:04:50] December 13, 2025, and the regular

[1:04:53] meeting of December 18th, 2025, purchase

[1:04:57] of Palo Alto Network Security Appliances

[1:05:00] with 5 years of support, Compunet, Inc.,

[1:05:03] Procurement of Microsoft Office 365

[1:05:05] subscription licenses and support

[1:05:08] services Microsoft Corporation via SVR

[1:05:12] Compunet Inc. billing software and

[1:05:14] annual maintenance support comproc

[1:05:22] uh utility equipment and uplifting LLC.

[1:05:26] A council review of liquor license

[1:05:28] renewal application endorsement inside

[1:05:31] passage brewing company DVA Boden Street

[1:05:33] Brewing Company.

[1:05:35] >> There were some items that there was

[1:05:37] » There were some items that there was

[1:05:37] questions on uh item B Lacy the purchase

[1:05:41] of the Palato network security.

[1:05:45] >> Sure your your honor and members of the

[1:05:47] » Sure your your honor and members of the

[1:05:47] council. This is one of the capital

[1:05:49] improvement project items that the

[1:05:52] information technology movement put in

[1:05:55] their uh capital improvement program for

[1:05:57] 2026. This is one of the items per a

[1:06:00] budget update that I recommended um

[1:06:03] remain funded and that I wanted I had

[1:06:07] directed the IT director to move forward

[1:06:10] with in 2026. Um what this particular

[1:06:13] project is um what the council's

[1:06:16] authorizing is year three of a five-year

[1:06:18] contract agreement for these services.

[1:06:21] This is essentially our um it's our our

[1:06:24] firewall. It's our security system for

[1:06:27] our network. Everybody within the city

[1:06:29] utilizes this particular um piece of of

[1:06:33] software and infrastructure. If we were

[1:06:36] not to renew this license, um, as I

[1:06:38] explained earlier, this would have

[1:06:40] immediate and devastating consequences

[1:06:42] for the city. Um, we would essentially

[1:06:44] come to a screeching halt in a number of

[1:06:46] departments. Um, again, this is a 5-year

[1:06:48] agreement. So, all that the council is

[1:06:50] authorizing is the purchase price, um,

[1:06:53] which was agreed to upfront. Um, but

[1:06:55] because of its value, it needs to come

[1:06:57] to the city council, but we have entered

[1:06:59] into a five-year agreement, and so to

[1:07:01] not continue with that would be a breach

[1:07:03] of that contract. But again, I can't

[1:07:06] stress enough the importance of this

[1:07:07] particular project um to the operability

[1:07:10] of the city going forward.

[1:07:13] >> Happy to answer any questions in the IT

[1:07:15] » Happy to answer any questions in the IT

[1:07:15] here as well.

[1:07:16] >> Yes.

[1:07:17] » Yes.

[1:07:17] >> U through the mayor. Uh is this project

[1:07:21] » U through the mayor. Uh is this project

[1:07:21] doesn't the telecom division have

[1:07:24] something similar? I mean what my

[1:07:26] concern is at the budget meetings we

[1:07:29] said that let's get an analysis of what

[1:07:31] is being duplicated what can be done

[1:07:34] between the two departments.

[1:07:36] >> So council member Vatani at the time

[1:07:37] » So council member Vatani at the time

[1:07:37] that this particular software was

[1:07:39] purchased we consulted the

[1:07:41] telecommunications division and they

[1:07:43] were not able to provide this service.

[1:07:45] Yes they do have their own software

[1:07:47] services in place. Um but again right

[1:07:50] now start of the year we are obligated

[1:07:53] to move forward with um with this

[1:07:55] contractual agreement. Um the analysis

[1:07:58] that the council had asked for is going

[1:07:59] to take some time. Um we don't have the

[1:08:01] time right now to not continue with this

[1:08:04] agreement again without having

[1:08:05] consequences for the operability of the

[1:08:07] city. We can continue having discussions

[1:08:10] with telecommunications on if what they

[1:08:12] have in the future might work well for

[1:08:14] the city. Um, but again, I'd have to

[1:08:17] look at that five-year agreement that we

[1:08:19] agreed to um for the Pelo Alto security

[1:08:23] appliance system um and see what

[1:08:26] consequences there may be if we were to

[1:08:28] pull out of that contract prematurely.

[1:08:30] >> Thank you,

[1:08:32] » Thank you,

[1:08:32] >> Abby.

[1:08:32] » Abby.

[1:08:32] >> Thank you for those comments. Those are

[1:08:34] » Thank you for those comments. Those are

[1:08:34] obviously my that comments as well. Uh

[1:08:37] my only thing is I I do want even though

[1:08:40] we go forward with this purchase, I

[1:08:41] don't want it to drop off until January

[1:08:43] next year, but I would really like us to

[1:08:46] start now. You said year

[1:08:48] >> three of five.

[1:08:49] » three of five.

[1:08:49] >> So we have technically three

[1:08:51] » So we have technically three

[1:08:51] >> two more approvals, but we should start

[1:08:53] » two more approvals, but we should start

[1:08:53] looking now at what options do we have

[1:08:56] internally for this because as I know

[1:09:00] it's not you turn off this switch and

[1:09:01] start this switch on something of this

[1:09:03] nature. it is a progressive

[1:09:06] uh switchover to make maintain security.

[1:09:09] So if it's you know if there is

[1:09:11] something internally that does meet the

[1:09:14] criteria and save money I want to start

[1:09:17] getting the move on that now so that we

[1:09:19] have a proper handover to make sure that

[1:09:22] the it is secure that's the whole point

[1:09:24] of the system so just because this goes

[1:09:26] forward I still wanted to include it in

[1:09:29] the process doesn't see

[1:09:30] >> thank you

[1:09:33] » thank you

[1:09:33] there was also questions on item C Jay

[1:09:38] >> did you have a for that. I just wanted

[1:09:39] » did you have a for that. I just wanted

[1:09:39] to explain.

[1:09:40] >> I mean, just need explanation so people

[1:09:42] » I mean, just need explanation so people

[1:09:42] know what's going on.

[1:09:44] >> This is the office uh 365 subscription

[1:09:47] » This is the office uh 365 subscription

[1:09:47] license support services.

[1:09:49] >> Yep. So, um Council Member Matani, um

[1:09:52] » Yep. So, um Council Member Matani, um

[1:09:52] the city has for quite some time been a

[1:09:55] Microsoft products user. I think in 2024

[1:09:59] is when we migrated to a subscription

[1:10:01] service um rather than an annual um

[1:10:06] don't know what you would necessarily

[1:10:07] term it you might have to help me out

[1:10:09] here um but we we switched over from um

[1:10:12] essentially purchasing that software and

[1:10:14] having it physically installed in the

[1:10:16] city to doing a cloud-based subscription

[1:10:18] service. Um again this is something this

[1:10:21] is a um for for cities our size and for

[1:10:24] a lot of businesses having Microsoft

[1:10:26] Office 365 is essential for all manner

[1:10:30] of of operations within uh government.

[1:10:33] We use it for email. We use it for um

[1:10:37] word processing. We use it for Excel

[1:10:40] spreadsheets. We use it for Microsoft

[1:10:42] Teams. Um we use it for a whole host of

[1:10:45] different services that it offers. Um,

[1:10:48] so again, when we made this we made this

[1:10:51] uh this leap over to a subscription uh

[1:10:54] purchase rather than having it kind of

[1:10:56] part installed, we still have a cost

[1:10:58] associated with it no matter what. Um,

[1:11:00] it's just how we're delivering the

[1:11:02] product. Brock, do you want to add any

[1:11:04] more detail to that?

[1:11:06] >> Um, we did an analysis uh during the

[1:11:08] » Um, we did an analysis uh during the

[1:11:08] initial discussions of moving to a

[1:11:09] subscription service uh kind of pros and

[1:11:12] cons. Um if you if you look at it, it's

[1:11:16] about a three-year break even uh for

[1:11:18] updating your software inhouse versus

[1:11:20] going subscription. Um if we drag it out

[1:11:23] longer for the non-subscription

[1:11:25] licensing, we have to go, you know, we

[1:11:28] start saving money, but we get far

[1:11:30] farther behind and it's a larger jump

[1:11:32] for staff to get up to date. Um the

[1:11:34] subscription service also gave us uh

[1:11:36] quite a few additional features that we

[1:11:38] didn't have. multifactor authentication

[1:11:40] was the big one that brought us into

[1:11:42] compliance having that MFA on your phone

[1:11:44] before you could hook up to your email

[1:11:47] account. Um that just prevents the bad

[1:11:49] guys from getting into the accounts with

[1:11:51] just a username and a password. Um that

[1:11:53] was huge. We couldn't do it on premise.

[1:11:56] We had to go to a hybrid solution. Um

[1:11:58] there's definitely a cost associated

[1:12:00] with it. Uh we try to keep our license

[1:12:02] counts as low as possible but um again

[1:12:04] it was if we're upgrading our on-remise

[1:12:07] software every 3 years it's almost a

[1:12:09] dead even match for what it would cost

[1:12:11] us and that's what we have been doing.

[1:12:14] Um it's a big number but it's uh

[1:12:17] essential for operations for every

[1:12:18] department.

[1:12:21] >> Follow up.

[1:12:21] » Follow up.

[1:12:22] >> Yes. So I mean getting it done in-house

[1:12:25] » Yes. So I mean getting it done in-house

[1:12:25] or collaborating with KPU you said in

[1:12:29] the long run it might be a saving but

[1:12:31] right now it is not.

[1:12:33] >> This is correct.

[1:12:34] » This is correct.

[1:12:34] >> This is not a thing that you would

[1:12:36] » This is not a thing that you would

[1:12:36] collaborate with KPU. They pay the

[1:12:38] subscription price for their Office 365

[1:12:41] the same as us. Um there's there's no

[1:12:45] savings except you take the I guess the

[1:12:48] ownership of the management of that

[1:12:50] software away from it. Um it means we

[1:12:53] have to call somebody else when we need

[1:12:54] to do something and wait for them to

[1:12:56] take care of it. Um we have the staff

[1:12:59] inhouse trained. We did our own

[1:13:01] migration to the platform. Um it's not

[1:13:04] really an in-house or not in-house

[1:13:05] thing. Um that goes for a lot of things

[1:13:08] we do in IT. I mean we

[1:13:11] you know we're we're proposing these

[1:13:13] things that we manage and take care of.

[1:13:15] Um if we can do it in the IT department

[1:13:18] we do. We don't hire outside contractors

[1:13:20] to manage things for us. This is a

[1:13:22] subscription license that would cost the

[1:13:24] same price for us to get it as it would

[1:13:26] KU to get it and they would have to

[1:13:28] resell it to us. So they'd have to

[1:13:29] actually tack on something to make a

[1:13:31] profit.

[1:13:33] [clears throat]

[1:13:33] >> Yes. Just to follow up. So if you

[1:13:35] » Yes. Just to follow up. So if you

[1:13:35] combine both, wouldn't the subscription

[1:13:37] be cheaper?

[1:13:38] >> Not necessarily. Um we are using a

[1:13:41] » Not necessarily. Um we are using a

[1:13:41] government contract pricing. So we've

[1:13:43] gone from the street price down to a

[1:13:45] much lower negotiated price the state

[1:13:47] got. Um keep you might actually save

[1:13:49] some money going with us. Um they might

[1:13:51] not. I don't know exactly what pricing

[1:13:53] they have negotiated with their vendor.

[1:13:55] They go through a different vendor and

[1:13:56] management for that. I don't know if you

[1:13:59] have specifics, Matt, for that.

[1:14:02] >> I don't have

[1:14:03] » I don't have

[1:14:03] >> Okay. Um but yeah, we we found the

[1:14:06] » Okay. Um but yeah, we we found the

[1:14:06] cheapest price we could which is

[1:14:08] government state of Alaska government

[1:14:09] contract. So

[1:14:11] >> yeah, I'm just concerned about duplicity

[1:14:13] » yeah, I'm just concerned about duplicity

[1:14:13] between the two departments.

[1:14:14] >> I agree. I don't think there's

[1:14:15] » I agree. I don't think there's

[1:14:15] duplication happening here. We just use

[1:14:18] similar services that have pricing. If

[1:14:20] we combined them, it would be about the

[1:14:22] same cost. It it either way um they have

[1:14:26] different internal requirements for

[1:14:27] their 0365 deployment for kptel us than

[1:14:32] we do for catch.gov. Um we've been

[1:14:35] working with them for the last couple of

[1:14:37] years to create a protomain trust with

[1:14:39] those two units so that we don't have to

[1:14:41] have duplic duplicate accounts on either

[1:14:43] side because one thing they did when

[1:14:46] they moved to their own uh email system

[1:14:48] it was originally Gmail and then they

[1:14:50] moved 0365 uh slightly after we did um

[1:14:54] because Gmail was there was some pricing

[1:14:57] changes there um they wanted to have

[1:14:59] their own email system for their own

[1:15:02] keeput [clears throat] less

[1:15:05] uh customer base I guess is what it was

[1:15:08] and um yeah we're trying to combine them

[1:15:11] so that we don't have to give catch.gov

[1:15:13] domains to their users but we trust

[1:15:15] their accounts they can trust ours and

[1:15:17] kind of share those resources so we're

[1:15:18] working very cooperatively trying to

[1:15:20] make that happen.

[1:15:21] >> Thank you.

[1:15:23] » Thank you.

[1:15:23] >> Then [clears throat] we have item D and

[1:15:26] » Then [clears throat] we have item D and

[1:15:26] building software maintenance support.

[1:15:30] That's a end of thing, Lacy.

[1:15:33] >> Yes, this is an annual um expenditure

[1:15:36] » Yes, this is an annual um expenditure

[1:15:36] for the KP telecommunications division

[1:15:38] for our billing software system. This is

[1:15:40] just the annual maintenance and support

[1:15:43] um for comoft which um is proprietary

[1:15:47] system. So um we need to go with them to

[1:15:50] provide that annual maintenance and

[1:15:52] support service um to ensure that the

[1:15:54] software um which again we use for for

[1:15:57] billing continues to work and is

[1:15:59] receiving the proper upgrades that it

[1:16:01] needs.

[1:16:02] >> Thank you.

[1:16:04] » Thank you.

[1:16:04] >> Thank you. Bring us to item E

[1:16:05] » Thank you. Bring us to item E

[1:16:05] procurement and protecting the fire

[1:16:07] department.

[1:16:10] Do you have questions? Yeah, my question

[1:16:12] is on the second portion the 43,000

[1:16:17] and one uh it is this command vehicle a

[1:16:21] second uh used vehicle or is this brand

[1:16:24] new and why do we need that 43,000 if we

[1:16:27] can get explanation from the fire chief

[1:16:29] on that.

[1:16:31] >> So I'll I'll start um Matani. So um the

[1:16:35] » So I'll I'll start um Matani. So um the

[1:16:36] this is a new vehicle. It's replacing a

[1:16:38] vehicle that we currently have in the

[1:16:39] fleet. So it's um it's a replacement.

[1:16:41] It's not adding to the total number of

[1:16:43] vehicles that we have. Um the additional

[1:16:46] the 43,000 is for upfitting costs for

[1:16:49] the vehicle. So while there's a vehicle

[1:16:51] price that's just for a stock vehicle in

[1:16:53] order to just as we do for a lot of

[1:16:56] specialized vehicles, be it for fire or

[1:16:59] police or other vehicles. Um what we

[1:17:01] take off the assembly line is not

[1:17:03] entirely what we need for operation. So,

[1:17:06] um, the quote that is included with this

[1:17:08] agenda item includes all of the

[1:17:10] upfitting costs to upfit the vehicle to

[1:17:12] be a fully functional command vehicle

[1:17:14] for for the chief and the fire

[1:17:16] department. Um, but Rick, do you want to

[1:17:19] talk more about anything specific to

[1:17:21] those up?

[1:17:22] >> Any further questions?

[1:17:24] » Any further questions?

[1:17:24] >> No.

[1:17:25] » No.

[1:17:25] >> Okay. Thank you.

[1:17:26] » Okay. Thank you.

[1:17:26] >> Anybody have any questions?

[1:17:28] » Anybody have any questions?

[1:17:28] >> Thank you.

[1:17:30] » Thank you.

[1:17:30] >> Thank you.

[1:17:32] » Thank you.

[1:17:32] So with that, we have a motion on the

[1:17:34] floor for the consent. Any

[1:17:36] [clears throat] other questions?

[1:17:39] Hearing seeing none, we please call the

[1:17:40] role.

[1:17:40] >> Bradberry,

[1:17:41] » Bradberry,

[1:17:41] >> no.

[1:17:42] » no.

[1:17:42] >> Gage,

[1:17:43] » Gage,

[1:17:43] >> yes.

[1:17:44] » yes.

[1:17:44] >> Zingy,

[1:17:45] » Zingy,

[1:17:45] >> yes.

[1:17:48] » yes.

[1:17:48] >> Matani,

[1:17:48] » Matani,

[1:17:48] >> no.

[1:17:49] » no.

[1:17:50] >> Gas,

[1:17:51] » Gas,

[1:17:51] >> yes.

[1:17:52] » yes.

[1:17:52] >> Finigan,

[1:17:53] » Finigan,

[1:17:53] >> yes.

[1:17:54] » yes.

[1:17:54] >> That passes 42.

[1:17:56] » That passes 42.

[1:17:56] >> Thank you. Bring this. There are no

[1:17:57] » Thank you. Bring this. There are no

[1:17:57] unfinished minutes. turning to new

[1:17:59] business item B 2026 funding agreement

[1:18:02] between the city of Ketchan and Ketchan

[1:18:04] Visitor Bureau Inc. Do I have a motion

[1:18:05] please? [clears throat]

[1:18:07] Your honor move the city council

[1:18:09] authorize the 2026 funding agreement

[1:18:11] between the city of Ketchan and the

[1:18:13] Ketchan Visitors Bureau Inc. at a cost

[1:18:15] not to exceed 30

[1:18:19] sorry my thing cut off on my computer

[1:18:22] $36,000

[1:18:23] authorizing funding in the amounts of

[1:18:25] 101,100,450

[1:18:32] and 1 104550

[1:18:36] respectively from the civic center

[1:18:37] tourism management and port department's

[1:18:40] 2026 other contractual services account

[1:18:43] number 635 5.14 and direct the acting

[1:18:46] city manager to execute the agreement

[1:18:48] behalf of the city council.

[1:18:49] >> Second move second. Abby, anything?

[1:18:54] » No, I was just [laughter]

[1:18:56] making the motion.

[1:18:58] >> Any other comment?

[1:18:59] » Any other comment?

[1:19:00] >> I guess I'll throw something out there.

[1:19:01] » I guess I'll throw something out there.

[1:19:01] Um, and not for to to change this today,

[1:19:04] but something to be thinking about. Um,

[1:19:07] I'm wondering if there's a way that we

[1:19:10] could move our designated funding for

[1:19:13] wayfinding signage

[1:19:16] to um the KBB to and give them like a

[1:19:20] scope of work for that. Um, I just know

[1:19:24] they move at a lot faster pace than we

[1:19:28] do and they also work alongside Historic

[1:19:30] Catch Can and and a little they have

[1:19:33] they're just working a lot more project

[1:19:34] of advertisement marketing and they

[1:19:37] could possibly create more of a

[1:19:39] consistent

[1:19:40] signage way find wayf finding signage

[1:19:44] across the community. So, um, again, not

[1:19:46] for today, but just something to think

[1:19:48] about as we go through just to start

[1:19:50] getting these projects. That's been on

[1:19:52] the list for a while. The burrow is

[1:19:53] wanting to help with that as well. And

[1:19:55] so, I think, um, might be a great

[1:19:58] opportunity for them to kind of lead

[1:20:00] that obviously with the scope of work

[1:20:02] from the city on what we want and they

[1:20:05] can work alongside historic catch and

[1:20:06] make sure we're

[1:20:07] >> Thank you.

[1:20:09] » Thank you.

[1:20:09] >> Anybody else? [snorts] Hearing seeing

[1:20:12] » Anybody else? [snorts] Hearing seeing

[1:20:12] none, would you please call the RO?

[1:20:14] >> Gage.

[1:20:15] » Gage.

[1:20:15] Yes,

[1:20:17] >> Zingi.

[1:20:18] » Zingi.

[1:20:18] >> Yes.

[1:20:19] » Yes.

[1:20:19] >> Matani.

[1:20:20] » Matani.

[1:20:20] >> Yes.

[1:20:20] » Yes.

[1:20:20] >> Gas.

[1:20:21] » Gas.

[1:20:21] >> Yes.

[1:20:22] » Yes.

[1:20:22] >> Finigan.

[1:20:22] » Finigan.

[1:20:22] >> Yes.

[1:20:23] » Yes.

[1:20:23] >> Bradbury.

[1:20:23] » Bradbury.

[1:20:23] >> Yes.

[1:20:26] » Yes.

[1:20:26] >> Thank you. Brings us to item C. Use of

[1:20:28] » Thank you. Brings us to item C. Use of

[1:20:28] CPV funds for public restroom in the

[1:20:30] downtown catch can joint cooperative

[1:20:32] relations committee recommendations. Do

[1:20:34] I have a motion? Your honor, pursuant to

[1:20:36] action taken at this December 19th, 2025

[1:20:39] joint cooperative relations committee

[1:20:41] meeting, I move the city council direct

[1:20:43] staff to develop cost estimates for the

[1:20:46] proposed public restroom location number

[1:20:49] 224 Creek Street and location number 3,

[1:20:52] 217 Steedman Street for presentation to

[1:20:55] the joint cooperative relations

[1:20:57] committee at its February 27th, 2026

[1:21:00] meeting.

[1:21:02] >> Is there a second?

[1:21:04] » Is there a second?

[1:21:04] second.

[1:21:05] >> It has been new second. Riley, you have

[1:21:07] » It has been new second. Riley, you have

[1:21:07] anything to add?

[1:21:08] >> Oh, I don't know if we're going to dive

[1:21:10] » Oh, I don't know if we're going to dive

[1:21:10] into this again or not, but I think uh

[1:21:13] this is something we've all been

[1:21:15] wrestling with for quite some time. As

[1:21:17] I've said, I think we as the council to

[1:21:20] have a a fair bit of responsibility to

[1:21:23] take for past,

[1:21:25] you know, lack of action for whatever

[1:21:28] the reason, cost, location, and as we've

[1:21:31] heard tonight, there's never a perfect

[1:21:33] solution. You're never going to find

[1:21:36] 100% of the people happy with a location

[1:21:38] or an idea. But uh I think we have been

[1:21:42] hearing a pretty unanimous

[1:21:45] uh message from the public who's

[1:21:48] involved with tourism and with downtown

[1:21:50] that we need to do something. So it's

[1:21:53] going through the process. It's gone to

[1:21:55] the cooperative relations. It's going to

[1:21:57] the different departments and things and

[1:21:59] professionals and uh as was said by some

[1:22:02] people. I mean, I certainly encourage

[1:22:04] members of the public if they have ideas

[1:22:06] to engage and submit, but at this time,

[1:22:11] I know how slow things move and I think

[1:22:13] it is prudent to at least continue the

[1:22:16] process and push it to that meeting and

[1:22:18] see what the the committee thinks on it.

[1:22:21] So, um, I definitely hear everybody's

[1:22:25] concerns and adjacent property owners,

[1:22:28] but at the same time, I do think it's

[1:22:30] prudent to continue moving forward

[1:22:32] because I worry if we don't, multiple

[1:22:35] more years are going to go by and

[1:22:37] nothing's going to happen and we're

[1:22:38] going to have more people who need a

[1:22:40] bathroom and we'll be stuck right where

[1:22:41] we are now because it's been quite a

[1:22:43] while we've been talking about

[1:22:44] bathrooms. So, that's my take on it.

[1:22:49] We also uh have had uh comments tonight

[1:22:52] asking that we probably hold some kind

[1:22:54] of a public meeting in regards to other

[1:22:57] sites uh an overall plan for the

[1:23:00] downtown area etc etc and I know we've

[1:23:03] talked about a tourism uh committee that

[1:23:06] can help within those processes.

[1:23:09] Um so I think that uh when do we have

[1:23:11] our next cooperative relation?

[1:23:13] >> It's January 30th actually. January soon

[1:23:16] » It's January 30th actually. January soon

[1:23:16] >> and it'll be here at

[1:23:18] » and it'll be here at

[1:23:18] >> Yeah.

[1:23:18] » Yeah.

[1:23:18] >> So this memo is incorrect. It's not the

[1:23:20] » So this memo is incorrect. It's not the

[1:23:20] 27th.

[1:23:21] >> Well, it we do have one Jan at the end

[1:23:24] » Well, it we do have one Jan at the end

[1:23:24] of January.

[1:23:25] >> Yeah.

[1:23:25] » Yeah.

[1:23:25] >> So, your honor and members of the

[1:23:27] » So, your honor and members of the

[1:23:27] council, so the next cooperative

[1:23:29] relations committee meeting will be

[1:23:31] January 30th. Because of the timing of

[1:23:33] the last meeting and each body's ability

[1:23:37] to have a discussion about this topic

[1:23:39] and give direction to staff, it wasn't

[1:23:42] it wasn't clear that we would be able to

[1:23:45] talk about this particular topic at the

[1:23:47] January 30th meeting. We'll provide an

[1:23:49] update, but what was requested of staff

[1:23:51] was to develop a cost estimate. That's a

[1:23:54] pretty short turnaround time. So more

[1:23:57] than likely a more robust discussion

[1:23:59] will take place by the cooperative

[1:24:00] relations committee meeting in February.

[1:24:03] There was discussion about it being on

[1:24:04] the 27th. This is my fault for putting

[1:24:06] it in the the motion because it hasn't

[1:24:09] been set yet. We'll first have a

[1:24:10] discussion on January 30th.

[1:24:13] >> Abby,

[1:24:14] » Abby,

[1:24:14] >> to follow up on that, um we asked for

[1:24:16] » to follow up on that, um we asked for

[1:24:16] updates to be brought back. If a cost

[1:24:18] analysis could be a rough cost analysis

[1:24:21] could be completed by that meeting, then

[1:24:23] we could talk more in depth of is it

[1:24:25] realistic or not before spending more

[1:24:29] time in February working out the details

[1:24:31] between both both governments to bring

[1:24:34] back to the prospective bodies. So just

[1:24:35] want to clarify on that one.

[1:24:37] >> Thank you. Um and what we're really

[1:24:39] » Thank you. Um and what we're really

[1:24:40] asking here that we can use uh CPV

[1:24:42] monies to to go through that process and

[1:24:44] I think that's fine. Um, I just want to

[1:24:46] make sure that some place staff have the

[1:24:49] ability to put together a public meeting

[1:24:52] uh in regards to through the tourism

[1:24:55] department in regards to um other sites

[1:24:58] and other issues and mobile bathrooms

[1:25:01] etc in the downtown area and have a

[1:25:02] larger discussion about that. Ken Lee

[1:25:05] then Riley

[1:25:06] >> I don't think there was a second.

[1:25:08] » I don't think there was a second.

[1:25:08] >> Yes,

[1:25:11] » Yes,

[1:25:11] I'm sorry. I just wanted to clarify.

[1:25:15] >> I do when I looked at this the I did

[1:25:18] » I do when I looked at this the I did

[1:25:18] have I see I see that I thought the spot

[1:25:21] by the New York was problematic myself.

[1:25:25] Um I think having a meeting with the

[1:25:28] people in the area would be good. Um,

[1:25:31] honestly, I think

[1:25:34] what I see when I I mean I and I haven't

[1:25:37] been down in a while, but I think the

[1:25:40] something within the near the dollar's

[1:25:43] house would be more

[1:25:45] um but I also see the option of

[1:25:48] something further down um to get people

[1:25:51] moving into the Salvation Army. Um, but

[1:25:57] I also I think I know that we move slow,

[1:25:59] but at the same time I also think we do

[1:26:01] need to get it right. Um, because of the

[1:26:04] way that the way the flow is there. It's

[1:26:08] just

[1:26:10] um, Creek Street One, I can see that

[1:26:13] being problematic because it has stairs.

[1:26:16] So, people who can't do stairs, you put

[1:26:19] an ADA bathroom up there, it's

[1:26:21] completely useless to anyone in there

[1:26:23] that has mobility issues. Um,

[1:26:28] the number two, I see that actually

[1:26:30] being

[1:26:32] a good option except you have the museum

[1:26:34] there. So, I think they're just spacing

[1:26:37] them out so they're so further down the

[1:26:41] creek. But I really I see it being very

[1:26:44] problematic sticking it between the New

[1:26:46] Yorker themselves. So

[1:26:49] >> right

[1:26:50] » right

[1:26:50] >> just to clarify on what we were talking

[1:26:52] » just to clarify on what we were talking

[1:26:52] about a minute ago. So this motion says

[1:26:56] that this cost estimates will be brought

[1:26:59] back for presentation to the cooperative

[1:27:01] relations committee on in February

[1:27:04] whatever it is 27th or 30th. Just to be

[1:27:06] clear because I just heard quite a few

[1:27:07] different ideas bounced around. That's

[1:27:10] what we're voting on.

[1:27:12] >> We're voting on those direct staff to

[1:27:14] » We're voting on those direct staff to

[1:27:14] bring those estimates prepared for the

[1:27:16] February meeting. Right.

[1:27:17] >> And we can do meetings in between, but

[1:27:19] » And we can do meetings in between, but

[1:27:19] still that's what we want to do if we

[1:27:20] process.

[1:27:21] >> Okay.

[1:27:21] » Okay.

[1:27:21] >> Anybody else want to talk to them?

[1:27:23] » Anybody else want to talk to them?

[1:27:23] >> I'm just very brief. Uh I mean obviously

[1:27:26] » I'm just very brief. Uh I mean obviously

[1:27:26] the need is clear and Mr. G made a good

[1:27:28] point. We've hashed a lot of this stuff

[1:27:29] out already. I'm certainly fine with

[1:27:31] getting a cost estimate. I do think the

[1:27:32] idea of a public hearing is a very good

[1:27:34] one. Uh I I do want to make note of the

[1:27:36] fact though that it's very seldom that

[1:27:37] we hear members of the community ask us

[1:27:39] to slow down on anything, reconsider

[1:27:41] something. Usually it's very much the

[1:27:43] opposite. Why did these things take so

[1:27:45] long? Here, uh we've heard several

[1:27:47] voices ask us just to take our time and

[1:27:50] make this the right approach.

[1:27:51] Personally, uh I'm I'm still in favor of

[1:27:54] a mobile unit just for the flexibility

[1:27:55] that provides. uh especially if having a

[1:27:58] mobile unit with some flexibility

[1:28:02] buys us the time that we need to

[1:28:05] determine how best to proceed with a

[1:28:07] permanent structure. So I'll support

[1:28:08] this motion because I do want to see the

[1:28:10] cost estimates and an evaluation of

[1:28:12] those sites. U but I do want to make

[1:28:14] note of the fact that we've had several

[1:28:15] members of the community express both in

[1:28:17] person and in correspondence email. I'm

[1:28:19] sure some of you have gotten phone calls

[1:28:21] as I have. Um, just to make sure that

[1:28:24] we, as was mentioned, do this, right?

[1:28:27] >> Yeah. Abby,

[1:28:28] » Yeah. Abby,

[1:28:28] >> I do want to just make clarification

[1:28:29] » I do want to just make clarification

[1:28:30] notes. Um, at the And then I have

[1:28:33] something prepared to talk to you guys

[1:28:34] about. Um, the 24 Creek Street was the

[1:28:38] or 26

[1:28:40] that location by Dolly's house. Um,

[1:28:44] that's really the property that the

[1:28:45] cooperative relation had focused on. The

[1:28:48] reason we brought in Steman lot was a

[1:28:51] temporary

[1:28:53] option to help us close the gap because

[1:28:57] we weren't going to be able to build

[1:28:58] something in the next

[1:28:59] >> I can't hear you

[1:29:00] » I can't hear you

[1:29:00] >> in the next three to four um months on

[1:29:03] » in the next three to four um months on

[1:29:03] on that piece of property. Um so Steman

[1:29:07] they when we talked amongst the count uh

[1:29:10] the two or community or councils

[1:29:13] assemblies

[1:29:15] it was more of Steman being used as a

[1:29:17] temporary solution to get it up and

[1:29:21] moving something now while we build

[1:29:26] long-term at a potential location on

[1:29:28] Creek Street. So that was the

[1:29:30] clarification of what why there is two

[1:29:32] pieces of property on on that. Um, but I

[1:29:35] then prepared something that I would

[1:29:36] like to talk about. I gave some examples

[1:29:39] to the council members here as well. Um,

[1:29:42] first off, I strongly support continuing

[1:29:43] moving forward with the restroom project

[1:29:45] near 26 Creek Street in cooperation with

[1:29:47] Burrow and historic catch can. And this

[1:29:49] is a solid long-term solution and would

[1:29:52] provide much neededed restroom access at

[1:29:53] one end of our busiest and most visited

[1:29:56] attraction. However, this project alone

[1:29:58] will not fully address the restroom

[1:29:59] demand on Creek Street or in downtown.

[1:30:02] Creek Street experiences heavy uh

[1:30:04] concentrated food traffic. Relying on a

[1:30:07] single restroom location will continue

[1:30:08] to create congestions, long lines, and

[1:30:11] accessibility challenges, especially

[1:30:13] during peak visitor hours. For that

[1:30:15] reason, I encourage the city to explore

[1:30:17] additional restroom options at the

[1:30:19] opposite end of Creek Street, such as

[1:30:21] restoring property as number two or

[1:30:23] number three Creek Street to house uh

[1:30:25] restrooms to provide a balance, improve

[1:30:28] visitor [clears throat] flow,

[1:30:29] significantly enhancing the overall

[1:30:30] experience for both residents and

[1:30:32] visitors. This also could maybe help uh

[1:30:35] accelerate the timeline of getting a

[1:30:38] restroom open on Creek Street in the

[1:30:41] near future while also parallel planning

[1:30:44] phase implementation of other projects

[1:30:47] also more projects on a smaller scale uh

[1:30:52] or more bathrooms on a smaller scale. Uh

[1:30:55] looking beyond Creek is clear that

[1:30:56] Katchchan needs a comprehensive master

[1:30:58] plan for public restrooms throughout the

[1:31:00] community with volume volume of guests.

[1:31:02] We welcome each year. Adequate and

[1:31:04] strategically located restroom

[1:31:05] facilities are essential infrastructure,

[1:31:07] not a luxury. Proper planning will

[1:31:09] reduce strain on any one location and

[1:31:11] improve sanitation, accessibility, and

[1:31:13] public perception of our downtown. In

[1:31:16] the short term, I also recommend the

[1:31:18] council move forward considering a

[1:31:20] container restroom solution to place on

[1:31:23] the potential Steman property or other

[1:31:25] identified properties. Installing a

[1:31:27] modern container restroom in this

[1:31:29] location in any location would help meet

[1:31:31] the immediate need of the harbor and

[1:31:33] also relieve pressure on surrounding

[1:31:35] facilities for our visitors and

[1:31:37] residents. Container restrooms are

[1:31:39] durable, efficient, can be implemented

[1:31:41] far more quickly than traditional

[1:31:43] constructions and is movable. I've

[1:31:46] attached several replacement concepts

[1:31:47] for the containers uh from Custom

[1:31:50] Container Living, a US-based company in

[1:31:52] Missouri that works with municipalities

[1:31:54] across the country to deliver restrooms

[1:31:56] and housing solutions. These options

[1:31:58] demonstrate how we can address immediate

[1:32:00] needs while long-term projections move

[1:32:02] forward.

[1:32:04] I also put on a base pricing. I know

[1:32:07] we've heard a lot of 100,000, 150,000.

[1:32:11] As you can see, these are bottles you

[1:32:12] can buy off the floor today. Not like if

[1:32:16] you want them to be fancy, you can

[1:32:18] pretty much pick whatever you want. But

[1:32:20] these are base model. These are the

[1:32:22] prices we're looking at, which is much

[1:32:25] less than what we've been presented.

[1:32:28] These can have tanks built in them. They

[1:32:31] could be directly plumbed. Um, they come

[1:32:34] with everything. They're plugandplay. We

[1:32:36] would just have our staff needing to

[1:32:38] connect to the power, water, and uh

[1:32:43] lines. There's various sizes, different

[1:32:45] footprints. There's 13footers to maybe

[1:32:49] fit in a smaller. There are single

[1:32:50] stalls which also um according to other

[1:32:54] studies and other m municipalities

[1:32:57] help deter the congregation and area in

[1:33:00] weight rooms outside the bathrooms or

[1:33:02] outside the stalls. kind of eliminating

[1:33:05] that potential risk of somebody going in

[1:33:07] there. Um so kind of helps with that

[1:33:09] safety um and and things like that. This

[1:33:12] is a reputable company. Um you can even

[1:33:15] change the facade on the outside if we

[1:33:18] wanted to make it cedar or make it log

[1:33:21] cabin or make it look like one of the

[1:33:23] buildings on Creek Street or in that

[1:33:26] area. Uh it's completely customizable. I

[1:33:29] mean, we completely decked out a

[1:33:31] 40footer down to like the grout inside

[1:33:34] and it was still less than $90,000. And

[1:33:37] I mean, it was the best of the best and

[1:33:40] one of the best. Um, so it's very

[1:33:42] reasonable and that 90,000 gets it here

[1:33:44] to catch can. So, I just want these

[1:33:46] options to really be brought forward on

[1:33:48] other properties because I think this is

[1:33:50] truly the solution to solve now. They

[1:33:52] can move anywhere. If we decide one spot

[1:33:54] doesn't work or if somebody says, "Hey,

[1:33:56] this spot might work," they can be

[1:33:59] picked up and moved to a new location

[1:34:01] and installed.

[1:34:05] » Yes.

[1:34:06] >> Uh thank you for giving us that, Abby. I

[1:34:08] » Uh thank you for giving us that, Abby. I

[1:34:08] hope that it's uh it's really an

[1:34:10] interesting thing to look at and

[1:34:12] something we should pursue. I did have a

[1:34:13] question though. I'm missing something.

[1:34:16] Uh, and I appreciate the explanation on

[1:34:19] the

[1:34:21] what was discussed at the cooperative

[1:34:22] relations in regards to more of a

[1:34:25] temporary on the Steman with the plan

[1:34:27] being I actually like that plan a lot,

[1:34:29] but I'm for some reason I'm not

[1:34:32] understanding why we would be losing and

[1:34:34] I think I'm envisioning the right

[1:34:36] property. Could someone explain to me

[1:34:38] why we're going to be losing the parking

[1:34:39] places? To me, it seems like if we were

[1:34:40] to put uh like a temporary conx or

[1:34:43] something on that the property that I'm

[1:34:46] thinking of, I don't understand why we'd

[1:34:47] have to lose parking there. Could

[1:34:49] someone clarify that for me?

[1:34:51] >> Yes, Lacy.

[1:34:51] » Yes, Lacy.

[1:34:51] >> Um your honor and council member Gas. Um

[1:34:54] » Um your honor and council member Gas. Um

[1:34:54] so, this is a fairly narrow lot with um

[1:34:57] facilities on buildings on either side

[1:34:59] of it. Um and the parking as you come in

[1:35:02] is sort of angled. Um, and to exit you

[1:35:06] have to you have a very small car. You

[1:35:08] might be able to turn around within the

[1:35:10] lot and enter the street headon. Most

[1:35:12] people end up backing out of that lot.

[1:35:14] If you were to put a restroom, even a

[1:35:16] temporary one, in there, I don't believe

[1:35:18] you'd even be able to pull cars in

[1:35:20] there. It would completely eliminate the

[1:35:21] functionality of parking in that

[1:35:23] particular lot. It would not be safe

[1:35:25] either. Even if you could fit, I

[1:35:27] wouldn't want a restroom right in the

[1:35:29] back of a parking lot um where people

[1:35:32] are coming and going. I think that would

[1:35:33] prevent a huge safety issue.

[1:35:36] >> Is that a parking lot we manage or just

[1:35:39] » Is that a parking lot we manage or just

[1:35:39] >> It's a parking lot that we manage and

[1:35:41] » It's a parking lot that we manage and

[1:35:41] it's our lot. So, it's a city-owned

[1:35:43] parcel. Um, and just to clarify for the

[1:35:45] council and um anyone interested in this

[1:35:48] particular topic, when the bureau

[1:35:50] requested to have a meeting on this

[1:35:52] topic, it was specific to installing

[1:35:55] restrooms on Creek Street because there

[1:35:58] wasn't a lot of time or detail. Um, what

[1:36:02] what I directed city staff to do was to

[1:36:04] look at parcels that the city owns in

[1:36:07] that area. There's obviously other

[1:36:08] options out there. There's a lot of

[1:36:11] great ideas, but the lowhanging fruit

[1:36:13] and the lowest cost was to look at

[1:36:15] parcels that the city already owns that

[1:36:17] are unoccupied. So, that's what we were

[1:36:19] looking at in the area. We were also

[1:36:20] trying to find um where the need was

[1:36:23] because yes, we have the Tongas

[1:36:26] Historical Museums in the major public

[1:36:28] restroom. We have lose loot. Where are

[1:36:29] there gaps? So that's where we were

[1:36:31] trying to locate parcels as well. Um so

[1:36:34] I'm very interested to hear um what what

[1:36:36] the Reeves have to say in other

[1:36:38] locations. Happy to have public

[1:36:40] meetings, but I can't stress enough that

[1:36:42] what what staff developed just to have

[1:36:45] something to talk about was very

[1:36:47] preliminary and very conceptual in

[1:36:49] nature. It's not this is what we're

[1:36:51] doing. It was just to get the

[1:36:53] conversation going between the two

[1:36:54] bodies.

[1:36:55] >> So with that, I think we certainly

[1:36:57] » So with that, I think we certainly

[1:36:57] discussed it. We got a motion on the

[1:36:59] floor.

[1:37:01] Please call the RO.

[1:37:02] >> Can I clarify something? Yeah. So, with

[1:37:04] » Can I clarify something? Yeah. So, with

[1:37:04] this motion, um, if it passes,

[1:37:10] this body here in terms of bathrooms in

[1:37:13] general, are we halting and just saying

[1:37:14] just go off on these two or are we going

[1:37:16] to continue the movement on our side to

[1:37:19] find overall solutions or a temporary

[1:37:21] solution to I think forward.

[1:37:24] >> Okay. So, I don't need to amend this to

[1:37:25] » Okay. So, I don't need to amend this to

[1:37:25] say continue. No.

[1:37:29] These are just two that were identified

[1:37:30] through cooperative relation. We still

[1:37:32] have bigger issues.

[1:37:33] >> I just wanted to make sure this wasn't

[1:37:35] » I just wanted to make sure this wasn't

[1:37:35] going to

[1:37:35] >> appreciate that.

[1:37:37] » appreciate that.

[1:37:37] >> You please call the

[1:37:39] » You please call the

[1:37:39] >> Zingi.

[1:37:39] » Zingi.

[1:37:39] >> Yes.

[1:37:41] » Yes.

[1:37:41] >> Matani.

[1:37:43] » Matani.

[1:37:43] >> Bash.

[1:37:45] » Bash.

[1:37:45] >> Gas.

[1:37:46] » Gas.

[1:37:46] >> Yes.

[1:37:47] » Yes.

[1:37:47] >> Finnegan.

[1:37:48] » Finnegan.

[1:37:48] >> Yes.

[1:37:48] » Yes.

[1:37:48] >> Redberry.

[1:37:49] » Redberry.

[1:37:49] >> Yes.

[1:37:50] » Yes.

[1:37:50] >> Gage.

[1:37:51] » Gage.

[1:37:51] >> Yes.

[1:37:52] » Yes.

[1:37:52] >> M.

[1:37:55] » Thanks. That passes your

[1:37:57] >> Thank you. Brings us to item E, agenda

[1:37:59] » Thank you. Brings us to item E, agenda

[1:37:59] item requests ordinance for submitting

[1:38:02] budget documents to the city council,

[1:38:05] Bradbury and Zingi. Do I have a motion?

[1:38:08] >> I move the city council direct acting

[1:38:10] » I move the city council direct acting

[1:38:10] city manager to take such action as

[1:38:12] deemed to approve the guardian

[1:38:13] establishing with the proposed budget

[1:38:15] submitted [clears throat] to the city

[1:38:16] council.

[1:38:17] >> Is there a second?

[1:38:20] » Is there a second?

[1:38:20] >> Second.

[1:38:21] » Second.

[1:38:21] >> It's been moved and seconded. What do we

[1:38:23] » It's been moved and seconded. What do we

[1:38:23] have here, Amy? Uh so just brief um

[1:38:26] brief comments real quick. Uh I also

[1:38:30] want to just preference I'm open to any

[1:38:32] suggestion but the way things I just

[1:38:36] I would like to highlight the value of

[1:38:38] receiving the proposed budget well in

[1:38:39] advance of the first budget session. I

[1:38:42] understand that this year we implemented

[1:38:43] a new program and that the learning

[1:38:44] curve associated with that change

[1:38:46] contributed to some delay. I appreciate

[1:38:48] the effort staff has put into adapting

[1:38:50] to the new system and moving the process

[1:38:52] forward. Having adequate time to review

[1:38:54] review the budget allows council members

[1:38:56] to fully understand the information

[1:38:58] presented. Ask thoughtful questions.

[1:39:00] Engage in meaningful discussion. This

[1:39:02] preparation supports our shared goal of

[1:39:05] developing a balanced and responsible

[1:39:06] budget that reflects the priorities of

[1:39:08] the citizens who elect us. It's also

[1:39:11] important to recognize that many council

[1:39:12] council members balance their council

[1:39:14] responsibilities with full-time jobs,

[1:39:16] family commitments, and other

[1:39:18] obligations. Additional review time

[1:39:20] helps ensure that everyone has a fair

[1:39:22] and reasonable opportunity to carefully

[1:39:24] read the budget and come prepared with

[1:39:26] informed questions and options. I also

[1:39:29] understand that changes may come down

[1:39:30] the line during the budget meetings as

[1:39:32] we just saw as needed and that the

[1:39:34] budget is an involving document. Having

[1:39:36] more time though to review the initial

[1:39:38] proposal gives us a stronger foundation

[1:39:40] to thoughtfully evaluate and respond to

[1:39:42] the changes when they do arise. Early

[1:39:45] access to the budget provides an

[1:39:47] opportunity to work collaboratively with

[1:39:48] staff ahead of time to clarify details,

[1:39:51] meet with them, learn the systems, and

[1:39:53] gather additional information. This

[1:39:56] helps streamlines the budget sessions,

[1:39:57] reducing last minute questions, and for

[1:40:00] me, keeping discussions focused and

[1:40:02] productive. Allowing sufficient review

[1:40:04] time benefits everyone involved and

[1:40:06] improves efficiency, supports staff by

[1:40:07] addressing questions proactively, and

[1:40:09] enables council members to make

[1:40:10] thoughtful and wellinformed decisions.

[1:40:14] It also provides u transparency,

[1:40:17] collaboration, and confidence in the

[1:40:18] budget process, ultimately helping us

[1:40:20] serve our community more effectively.

[1:40:24] >> Thank you.

[1:40:24] » Thank you.

[1:40:24] >> Yeah.

[1:40:25] » Yeah.

[1:40:25] >> Yes, I agree with this motion and I'll

[1:40:28] » Yes, I agree with this motion and I'll

[1:40:28] support this motion. As you know and we

[1:40:32] know this turn turn around when we were

[1:40:36] presented the budget, it was way

[1:40:38] different from years past. It was more

[1:40:40] complicated in referring from one page

[1:40:43] to the other from the front to the back.

[1:40:45] So if we are presented with a budget

[1:40:48] earlier, it'll be easier for us to work

[1:40:51] through the budget.

[1:40:53] Judy,

[1:40:54] >> um, you know, I agree to add my aim to

[1:40:57] » um, you know, I agree to add my aim to

[1:40:57] this because I think that anytime we

[1:40:59] need to discuss something, everybody

[1:41:01] should have the right to do it. I don't

[1:41:03] think there was any, and I'm pretty sure

[1:41:05] you're not suggesting that there was any

[1:41:07] maliciousness in terms of us not getting

[1:41:09] this on time. There was a lot of things

[1:41:12] that came into play and that is why we

[1:41:14] got it late. In years gone by, we've

[1:41:17] received our budget on time. Um, I think

[1:41:21] that, you know, if you want to change

[1:41:23] the policy, okay, but I don't see the

[1:41:27] need to to change and write an ordinance

[1:41:29] right now. I just don't. I think that

[1:41:32] everybody works really hard, especially

[1:41:34] our staff to bring us this. Um, yeah,

[1:41:38] there was a lot. I mean, it's a new

[1:41:39] software program. It it took us all, you

[1:41:42] know, a lot of time to figure it out.

[1:41:44] Um, I'm sure it took the staff equally

[1:41:47] that amount of time. So, I think that,

[1:41:50] you know, if you want to change the

[1:41:51] policy

[1:41:52] um this year, okay, and then see how

[1:41:55] that works for next year and not, you

[1:41:58] know, not go in and and I don't think an

[1:42:01] ordinance is necessary, but that's just

[1:42:04] me.

[1:42:06] >> Lacy,

[1:42:09] » Riley had a question.

[1:42:11] >> Oh, go ahead. Just a comment.

[1:42:13] » Oh, go ahead. Just a comment.

[1:42:13] >> Okay.

[1:42:14] » Okay.

[1:42:14] >> Go ahead. Uh, I guess [laughter]

[1:42:17] » Go ahead. Uh, I guess [laughter]

[1:42:18] I would kind of agree with Judy in

[1:42:20] general, but uh,

[1:42:23] not to get into any specifics, but we've

[1:42:25] kind of been on an ordinance train

[1:42:27] lately, and I think it's only fair that

[1:42:29] if certain members who maybe weren't on

[1:42:32] that train before want to do ordinances,

[1:42:35] we've kind of set the precedent. So,

[1:42:36] I'll support it.

[1:42:39] >> Please, go ahead, Abby. I do agree with

[1:42:43] » Please, go ahead, Abby. I do agree with

[1:42:43] the policy changing the policy in first

[1:42:46] instead of an ordinance. That's why I

[1:42:47] stated at the beginning I'm open to

[1:42:50] changes. I just

[1:42:55] what staff and others may deem adequate

[1:42:58] time to review thousands of pages um

[1:43:03] maybe isn't for everyone at the table.

[1:43:05] And so I just if it's a policy maybe

[1:43:07] just adding a little bit of time knowing

[1:43:10] no matter what it's always it always

[1:43:12] change look at I mean look at it

[1:43:13] throughout the process just being able

[1:43:15] to get the base

[1:43:18] info just of like just starting to look

[1:43:21] through the numbers earlier than later

[1:43:24] and then as changes come that's that's

[1:43:26] all I'm trying to get however the best

[1:43:29] way is but I just I I personally I'm

[1:43:32] hopefully sitting here for another two

[1:43:34] years I need it sooner.

[1:43:36] to start.

[1:43:38] >> Yeah.

[1:43:39] » Yeah.

[1:43:39] >> Thank you, honor. Yeah, I'm I'm eager to

[1:43:41] » Thank you, honor. Yeah, I'm I'm eager to

[1:43:41] get the information as quickly as

[1:43:42] possible so that as much time can be

[1:43:44] spent as possible either asking

[1:43:45] questions or comparing numbers or

[1:43:46] looking at previous budgets. Um I I did

[1:43:49] um I do like the uh suggestion that was

[1:43:52] profered by staff with regard to kind of

[1:43:55] a compromise instead of having a 21-day

[1:43:58] or fix however it was worded. um that

[1:44:02] that deadline uh rather than a 21-day

[1:44:04] date 21 days before the first budget

[1:44:06] hearing uh having it um I can't find it

[1:44:10] now. Uh I think it was by the time of

[1:44:13] the first November meeting. Was that was

[1:44:14] that what was suggested in the

[1:44:15] memorandum? And I what I'm what I'm I'm

[1:44:18] eager to get the information as quickly

[1:44:19] as possible, but I don't want to do is

[1:44:21] put additional staff uh additional

[1:44:23] pressure on the staff to complete this

[1:44:25] enormously complex document when they're

[1:44:27] already up against a pretty significant

[1:44:28] deadline.

[1:44:30] Lacy.

[1:44:31] >> Um, your honor, members of the council.

[1:44:33] » Um, your honor, members of the council.

[1:44:33] So, um, no, I I fully concur that this

[1:44:37] that the city council needs as much time

[1:44:39] as possible to process the budget. I

[1:44:41] recognize that it is a weighty and

[1:44:43] complex document. Um, but as council

[1:44:46] member Zangi said, historically staff

[1:44:48] has met um a totally arbitrary deadline,

[1:44:52] just one that I think we put in

[1:44:53] practice, which is usually to get it to

[1:44:54] the council by that first meeting in

[1:44:56] November. this year for all the reasons

[1:44:58] that we've discussed that wasn't

[1:45:00] possible. Um I do want to add though um

[1:45:03] which I included in my my memo that we

[1:45:06] work this year and every year been

[1:45:08] compliant with the city charter which is

[1:45:10] the one thing that exists currently

[1:45:12] which speaks to the timing that the

[1:45:14] council must receive that budget for its

[1:45:16] deliberative purposes. Um so that

[1:45:18] specifies five weeks prior to the start

[1:45:20] of the next fiscal year. So so we met

[1:45:22] that. I get that that's not enough time

[1:45:23] but we met that. Um so [clears throat]

[1:45:26] as as council member Finnean had just uh

[1:45:28] discussed my recommendation rather than

[1:45:30] to create an ordinance um that specifies

[1:45:33] a number of days which is highly

[1:45:35] variable based on when the council wants

[1:45:36] to start its budget process um just to

[1:45:39] pick again that first regular meeting in

[1:45:42] November which historically is when we

[1:45:44] provided the budget which I think again

[1:45:46] has provided adequate time for council

[1:45:48] review in previous years. Um, but that

[1:45:50] could be advanced. That's why we're

[1:45:52] having the discussion. But it seemed

[1:45:53] that putting in policy rather than

[1:45:55] ordinance might be the best way to

[1:45:57] start.

[1:45:58] >> Michelle, do you have anything to offer?

[1:46:02] » Michelle, do you have anything to offer?

[1:46:02] [laughter]

[1:46:07] » Your honor, thank you for the

[1:46:08] opportunity to comment. Um, I I think

[1:46:12] that

[1:46:14] there there are things that maybe the

[1:46:16] council doesn't realize. There are a lot

[1:46:19] of hours that are put into but every

[1:46:21] department puts into providing a budget

[1:46:24] to the council and then and and yes this

[1:46:28] year and even last year. Last year we

[1:46:30] were dealing with a landslide that

[1:46:32] happened right before the c the each

[1:46:35] department had to submit their budget.

[1:46:37] So there was that and then the

[1:46:40] engineering department which was a

[1:46:42] significant share of every department

[1:46:46] that goes to our engineering department

[1:46:48] to help with those capital projects

[1:46:51] estimates. Um

[1:46:55] they were weeks behind and then each

[1:46:58] department then was weeks behind. So

[1:47:01] it's it was [laughter]

[1:47:04] there are significant

[1:47:07] issues and I will remind the council we

[1:47:11] brought you a capital project budget in

[1:47:14] July. The only thing that was different

[1:47:17] we gave you an agenda item that said

[1:47:20] here's what changed from July to the

[1:47:23] final budget. And

[1:47:27] so then it was just the operating budget

[1:47:29] that was new in November. And yes, it

[1:47:32] was it was later than usual, but it

[1:47:36] shouldn't have been totally foreign

[1:47:39] because we had given you the capital

[1:47:41] project budget. So um that in addition

[1:47:46] to um we for personnel, it wasn't just

[1:47:51] one little thing. it has to be put into

[1:47:54] this from here to here. It was every

[1:47:56] collective bargaining agreement, every

[1:47:58] employee that had to be added. Um, all

[1:48:01] the little nuances trying to make sure

[1:48:03] that we're budgeting appropriately for

[1:48:05] each staff, what those wages should be.

[1:48:08] Are there other there additional factors

[1:48:10] for each person, their overtime, their

[1:48:13] their um what they what kind of pay they

[1:48:15] get, any differentials? Um, so there's

[1:48:20] health insurance, there's employees that

[1:48:22] are 50/50. I mean, and that's just a tip

[1:48:26] of the iceberg just for personnel. Then

[1:48:29] there's every department and making sure

[1:48:32] that all of the budgets from the 2024

[1:48:35] budget got put in there. It was was not

[1:48:38] a small task. And so my point is, yes,

[1:48:42] our goal is to get you that budget as

[1:48:44] soon as possible. It's usually the first

[1:48:45] week, the first meeting in November. And

[1:48:48] that is always our goal. We don't want

[1:48:50] you to not have a document to review. We

[1:48:54] want to give that to you. So it it is

[1:48:57] our full intention to make sure that

[1:48:59] next year it's done quicker and faster.

[1:49:02] And we we fully think that that will

[1:49:04] happen with this budgeting software. We

[1:49:06] think that that can happen. Um, so,

[1:49:10] um, to put something a to me a a policy

[1:49:15] in place

[1:49:17] that doesn't take into consideration the

[1:49:20] time that it takes to

[1:49:24] to perform and and make sure that you

[1:49:27] have a document. You can tell me that I

[1:49:29] need to have this to you earlier. What's

[1:49:32] going to end up happening?

[1:49:34] What I see, what I envision is I'm gonna

[1:49:37] get multiple requests and I'm gonna have

[1:49:39] to bring you I don't know how many how

[1:49:41] many updates do we have this year? How

[1:49:43] many more updates? Because staff still

[1:49:45] has to put that together that to give to

[1:49:47] us to give to you and if anything

[1:49:49] changes from the date we give it to you,

[1:49:51] it's a budget update. So, just keep that

[1:49:53] in mind that um that even though we can

[1:49:57] pro we could provide it to you earlier

[1:49:59] that those estimates aren't going to be

[1:50:01] as good possibly and then we're going to

[1:50:03] have more revisions to the budget

[1:50:05] document. So,

[1:50:08] >> there's a balance, right? You're going

[1:50:10] » there's a balance, right? You're going

[1:50:10] to give and take and and we can give it

[1:50:12] to you earlier. It just might not be as

[1:50:15] good. And if you don't like some of the

[1:50:18] estimates that are provided right now,

[1:50:21] then it's going to be not

[1:50:24] there's going to be more fluidity in

[1:50:27] those numbers and maybe not as accurate.

[1:50:30] So

[1:50:32] I think I have said enough. [laughter]

[1:50:36] >> I'm not here to get in an argument or

[1:50:37] » I'm not here to get in an argument or

[1:50:37] anything. Uh I'm here for the citizens.

[1:50:40] That's who put me here. I'm that's my

[1:50:42] ultimate person that I answer to.

[1:50:45] >> On average, I went back for the last 10

[1:50:47] » On average, I went back for the last 10

[1:50:47] years. We've gotten the budget

[1:50:50] at the shortest time was 17 days before

[1:50:53] the first budget meeting except for this

[1:50:55] year. I'm only asking for three to four

[1:50:59] more days. That's literally I I'm

[1:51:02] literally only asking for a few more

[1:51:04] days that we could get the budget

[1:51:06] earlier. I'm not asking for weeks and

[1:51:08] weeks and weeks. just a few more days,

[1:51:11] maybe we could come to an agreement of,

[1:51:14] you know, policy is by November 1st or

[1:51:17] the first

[1:51:19] business day, first business day of

[1:51:22] November because if it falls on a

[1:51:24] Saturday, that's not fair. Um, but we

[1:51:26] could do something of that nature. I'm

[1:51:28] just on average it's been 17. I'm only

[1:51:31] asking for a few more extra days to

[1:51:33] allow us to make sure we're I'm not

[1:51:36] asking for time. So,

[1:51:41] » you know, I think that if we set a

[1:51:43] deadline of the first meeting in

[1:51:46] November

[1:51:49] as as what we're looking for in policy

[1:51:52] um and then if we get it earlier, more

[1:51:54] better for us, right? And I think that

[1:51:57] staff understands that uh from the

[1:52:00] conversations we're having here right

[1:52:01] now. That's

[1:52:02] >> I just want to take note that would make

[1:52:03] » I just want to take note that would make

[1:52:04] it 12 days.

[1:52:06] So, only 12 days for review. If you look

[1:52:09] at if you always do the first meeting,

[1:52:13] it would time that you get the budget's

[1:52:16] going to fluctuate.

[1:52:17] >> We normally do it. No,

[1:52:20] » We normally do it. No,

[1:52:20] >> it moves. So, it's not the staff doesn't

[1:52:22] » it moves. So, it's not the staff doesn't

[1:52:22] dictate that. The calendar does. So

[1:52:25] that's the only reason I wanted to get a

[1:52:26] more standard date versus the first

[1:52:29] meeting because the first meeting could

[1:52:31] actually be

[1:52:33] November 7th or 8th which if the first

[1:52:36] meeting on average is the week of

[1:52:40] >> Thanksgiving

[1:52:40] » Thanksgiving

[1:52:40] >> actually the 5th but

[1:52:42] » actually the 5th but

[1:52:42] >> well next year I'm saying

[1:52:45] » well next year I'm saying

[1:52:45] >> the policy stays and so it moves

[1:52:48] » the policy stays and so it moves

[1:52:48] >> and I I was looking at the budget

[1:52:49] » and I I was looking at the budget

[1:52:50] meetings for next year and actually

[1:52:53] we could actually do two in November the

[1:52:55] 23rd and the 30th which is the 20 is

[1:52:58] before Thanksgiving. It's just how

[1:53:00] December and all the days move because

[1:53:03] the adoption date is the 17th this year

[1:53:05] instead of the 18th. So everything kind

[1:53:08] of moves forward a little bit.

[1:53:11] I just

[1:53:12] >> I'm just asking for a few more days than

[1:53:13] » I'm just asking for a few more days than

[1:53:13] what's normal. So

[1:53:16] >> any other comments?

[1:53:21] » So I have a question. Yeah.

[1:53:24] >> Are we voting on a policy or are we

[1:53:26] » Are we voting on a policy or are we

[1:53:26] voting on an ordinance?

[1:53:28] >> Just says direction. Direction

[1:53:29] » Just says direction. Direction

[1:53:30] direction.

[1:53:30] >> Yeah.

[1:53:31] » Yeah.

[1:53:31] >> I

[1:53:33] » I

[1:53:33] I think um policy. I mean I I think the

[1:53:37] manager um you know the ex the 10 days I

[1:53:42] think that's reasonable. I I've never I

[1:53:45] new programs are always funky and always

[1:53:48] screw everybody up. And to be honest

[1:53:50] with you, um,

[1:53:52] coming in after an election, and I mean,

[1:53:56] not that I haven't been here before, but

[1:53:58] if I look back to when I first in 2015,

[1:54:02] I was thrown to the wolves. And

[1:54:05] honestly, this compared to how we used

[1:54:08] to do it and how this hole was how it

[1:54:11] got set up in the last few years, I find

[1:54:14] the budget a lot easier to look through.

[1:54:18] I get um wanting a few more extra days.

[1:54:22] I think uh if staff can get that great,

[1:54:25] but I prefer to have the best numbers

[1:54:28] possible at the get, you know, from the

[1:54:30] get-go versus having to have budget

[1:54:33] updates.

[1:54:33] >> You want to amend the motion then to

[1:54:35] » You want to amend the motion then to

[1:54:35] give direction.

[1:54:37] Yeah.

[1:54:39] To have the policy updated to the

[1:54:41] >> just have the policy. Yeah.

[1:54:44] » just have the policy. Yeah.

[1:54:44] >> First

[1:54:45] » First

[1:54:45] >> first

[1:54:46] » first

[1:54:46] business day. the first

[1:54:49] >> first business date.

[1:54:50] » first business date.

[1:54:50] >> Well, yes, because I want to make sure

[1:54:52] » Well, yes, because I want to make sure

[1:54:52] it's not

[1:54:53] >> Yeah.

[1:54:53] » Yeah.

[1:54:53] >> Yeah.

[1:54:55] » Yeah.

[1:54:55] >> Which it would then always change every

[1:54:57] » Which it would then always change every

[1:54:57] year,

[1:54:57] >> right?

[1:54:59] » right?

[1:54:59] >> And next year it'll be the second of

[1:55:01] » And next year it'll be the second of

[1:55:01] November.

[1:55:02] >> Correct. Yeah.

[1:55:09] » And just said it in policy and not in

[1:55:11] ordinance at this time.

[1:55:13] >> Ordinance. Is that a Are you making a

[1:55:17] » Ordinance. Is that a Are you making a

[1:55:17] motion then?

[1:55:18] >> Yeah.

[1:55:18] » Yeah.

[1:55:18] >> And who would like to second?

[1:55:24] » Any other discussion

[1:55:28] » hearing? Seeing none, please call the

[1:55:32] on the

[1:55:33] >> amendment. This is amending for the

[1:55:35] » amendment. This is amending for the

[1:55:35] direction. It'll be the main motion

[1:55:37] because the it was just direction. So

[1:55:40] the director to staff will be updating

[1:55:43] the policy to the first business day of

[1:55:46] November.

[1:55:49] » Matani,

[1:55:50] >> yes.

[1:55:51] » yes.

[1:55:51] >> Cuz absent.

[1:55:54] » Cuz absent.

[1:55:54] >> Zingi,

[1:55:55] » Zingi,

[1:55:55] >> yes.

[1:55:56] » yes.

[1:55:56] >> Gage,

[1:55:57] » Gage,

[1:55:57] >> yes.

[1:55:57] » yes.

[1:55:58] >> Bradberry,

[1:55:58] » Bradberry,

[1:55:58] >> yes.

[1:55:59] » yes.

[1:55:59] >> Finigan,

[1:56:00] » Finigan,

[1:56:00] >> no.

[1:56:01] » no.

[1:56:01] >> Gas,

[1:56:02] » Gas,

[1:56:02] >> yes.

[1:56:03] » yes.

[1:56:03] >> That passes your own.

[1:56:05] » That passes your own.

[1:56:05] >> Thank you very much. brings us to item

[1:56:07] » Thank you very much. brings us to item

[1:56:07] F, ordinance number 26, 2015, increasing

[1:56:10] water rate 8% first reading. Do I have a

[1:56:13] motion?

[1:56:14] >> Your honor, I move the city council

[1:56:15] » Your honor, I move the city council

[1:56:15] approve ordinance number 26-2015

[1:56:18] and first reading amending certain

[1:56:19] provisions of Pitchkan Municipal Code

[1:56:21] Chapter 11.16 entitled water rates to

[1:56:24] increase by 8% and providing for an

[1:56:27] effective date.

[1:56:29] >> We have a second.

[1:56:31] » We have a second.

[1:56:31] >> Second. No, it's been moved and second

[1:56:35] » Second. No, it's been moved and second

[1:56:35] discussion.

[1:56:40] » Hearing seeing none, please call the

[1:56:42] role.

[1:56:45] >> Gas,

[1:56:45] » Gas,

[1:56:45] >> no.

[1:56:47] » no.

[1:56:47] >> Finan,

[1:56:48] » Finan,

[1:56:48] >> yes.

[1:56:49] » yes.

[1:56:49] >> Yes.

[1:56:50] » Yes.

[1:56:50] >> Gage,

[1:56:51] » Gage,

[1:56:51] >> yes.

[1:56:52] » yes.

[1:56:52] >> Zingi,

[1:56:53] » Zingi,

[1:56:53] >> yes.

[1:56:54] » yes.

[1:56:54] >> Matani,

[1:56:54] » Matani,

[1:56:54] >> no.

[1:56:55] » no.

[1:56:55] >> That passes your honor. Fortitude.

[1:56:58] » That passes your honor. Fortitude.

[1:56:58] Thank you. Brings us to item G,

[1:57:00] ordinance number 2616, increasing the

[1:57:02] sewer rate by 8% first reading. Do I

[1:57:06] have a motion?

[1:57:08] Your honor, I move the city council

[1:57:09] approve ordinance number 26-2016

[1:57:12] in first reading amending Kitchkan

[1:57:13] Municipal Code section 12.09.040

[1:57:17] entitled cost per eru by increasing

[1:57:20] sewer rates by 8% and providing for an

[1:57:23] effective date. Second

[1:57:25] >> been moved and second discussion

[1:57:28] » been moved and second discussion

[1:57:28] hearing. Seeing none, please call the

[1:57:30] roll.

[1:57:32] >> Finan,

[1:57:33] » Finan,

[1:57:33] >> yes.

[1:57:34] » yes.

[1:57:34] >> Bradbury,

[1:57:35] » Bradbury,

[1:57:35] >> yes.

[1:57:36] » yes.

[1:57:36] >> Gage,

[1:57:37] » Gage,

[1:57:37] >> yes.

[1:57:38] » yes.

[1:57:38] >> Zingy,

[1:57:39] » Zingy,

[1:57:39] >> yes.

[1:57:40] » yes.

[1:57:40] >> Matani.

[1:57:41] » Matani.

[1:57:41] >> Oh,

[1:57:42] » Oh,

[1:57:42] >> yes.

[1:57:43] » yes.

[1:57:43] >> No.

[1:57:44] » No.

[1:57:44] >> That passenger 42.

[1:57:49] » Yeah. [clears throat]

[1:57:51] >> What's that? Can we take a a break?

[1:57:54] » What's that? Can we take a a break?

[1:57:54] >> Yeah.

[1:57:54] » Yeah.

[1:57:54] >> All right. We're taking a break.

[1:58:00] » Item G H

[1:58:07] ordinance number 26 2017 amending

[1:58:10] section 3.04 04 uh that's consumer sales

[1:58:15] tax of the Ketchan municipal code to

[1:58:18] provide for an additional one and a

[1:58:19] half%

[1:58:20] consumer sales tax during the period of

[1:58:23] April 1st September 30th first reading.

[1:58:25] Do I have a motion?

[1:58:28] Your honor, I move that the city council

[1:58:29] approve ordinance number 26-2017

[1:58:32] in first reading increasing the seasonal

[1:58:34] sales tax by increasing the sales tax

[1:58:36] levy 1.5% from 5 and 12% to 6% for the

[1:58:40] period of April 1st through September

[1:58:42] 30th by amending subsection A of KMC

[1:58:45] section 3.04.020

[1:58:48] entitled levy of tax subsection B of KMC

[1:58:51] section 3.04.040

[1:58:53] 040 entitled tax added to sales price

[1:58:57] and subsection C of KMC section 3.04.130

[1:59:01] entitled use of proceeds of sales tax

[1:59:04] and establishing an effective date.

[1:59:06] >> Second move second. Any discussion? Yes.

[1:59:10] » Second move second. Any discussion? Yes.

[1:59:10] >> Thank you, honor. Uh

[1:59:12] » Thank you, honor. Uh

[1:59:12] I held my comments for this particular

[1:59:15] one because I think it's actually

[1:59:17] probably the most hard-hitting. Uh,

[1:59:21] and I don't mean to ramble on, but uh,

[1:59:23] as we go through our business at the

[1:59:26] council,

[1:59:27] uh, in passing expenditures and

[1:59:31] increases and contracts,

[1:59:33] uh, I think it's important that we

[1:59:35] always remember that there's a price to

[1:59:38] pay for all these things. And, um, I can

[1:59:41] only speak for myself. There have been

[1:59:44] almost all the general government

[1:59:45] contracts or yeah almost all but one I

[1:59:49] think where I found myself in a very

[1:59:51] tough position internally weighing the

[1:59:55] pros and the cons of uh recognizing that

[1:59:59] increases to not just employee benefits

[2:00:02] but you know to that and to other

[2:00:04] expenses

[2:00:06] um is something that is often times

[2:00:08] deserved, warranted, needed.

[2:00:12] But some things that kind of get or

[2:00:14] something that I think gets lost in the

[2:00:16] process sometimes or we lose sight of is

[2:00:18] the price tag. And every time this time

[2:00:21] of year, this is where the price tag

[2:00:22] comes home to roost. And uh I just want

[2:00:26] to take this opportunity as a chance to

[2:00:29] remind everyone

[2:00:31] when we're doing these things, when

[2:00:33] we're passing these increases, this is

[2:00:35] where the rubber meets the road. We are

[2:00:36] a tremendously taxed city when you

[2:00:39] factor in our bureau and city. Uh every

[2:00:42] I don't have a pie chart, but I'm pretty

[2:00:44] sure if you had one, we're one of the

[2:00:47] bigger pieces of pie when it comes to

[2:00:49] the taxing amounts. Uh and as I've said

[2:00:53] before, every time we increase some of

[2:00:55] this stuff, we usually say, well, it's

[2:00:58] only a half percent and it's only a

[2:01:00] little bit and it's only a little bit,

[2:01:01] but it's darn near every year we're

[2:01:04] increasing. So, uh I'm going to be

[2:01:07] voting no against this. I know that this

[2:01:09] is this was implemented into the budget

[2:01:11] going forward. The frustration that I

[2:01:14] have is when attempts are made to reduce

[2:01:18] our spending to reduce our government in

[2:01:21] areas that I think are reasonable in

[2:01:23] areas that private businesses, private

[2:01:26] families do when their budgets get

[2:01:28] tight. We don't seem to have much

[2:01:29] traction. So, in good conscience, I

[2:01:32] can't vote for an increase when I have

[2:01:34] attempted and others have attempted to

[2:01:38] make necessary reductions to at least

[2:01:40] chip away at this. Um, so I just I can't

[2:01:44] in good conscience vote to keep raising

[2:01:46] taxes on people. It goes against

[2:01:47] everything I believe and I think that as

[2:01:50] we go forward, we have we have to stop.

[2:01:52] I mean, I don't know what to do. I just

[2:01:54] feel like I'm banging my head against

[2:01:55] the wall every year, but our people

[2:01:57] can't afford this stuff. And somewhere

[2:02:00] there's got to be a red line. And I see

[2:02:03] the red line as all the people I know

[2:02:04] that grew up in this town that are

[2:02:06] leaving here because of the costs. And I

[2:02:09] know some of it's not our deal, but some

[2:02:11] of it is. And this is an example. So,

[2:02:14] uh, I would just would like to encourage

[2:02:16] yet again people moving forward.

[2:02:19] We have to make tough choices. But, you

[2:02:22] know, just saying, "Oh, well, we'll in

[2:02:24] we'll increase the taxes later on and

[2:02:26] we'll increase the rates and and move

[2:02:28] on." I'm not on board with it. So, I

[2:02:30] can't support it. And I think we're in a

[2:02:33] crisis of our affordability for people

[2:02:36] here who are being forced to move away

[2:02:38] because of it.

[2:02:39] >> Thank you. Anybody else?

[2:02:42] » Thank you. Anybody else?

[2:02:42] >> Yes.

[2:02:43] » Yes.

[2:02:43] >> So, this takes comes into play April 1.

[2:02:48] » So, this takes comes into play April 1.

[2:02:48] >> Yeah.

[2:02:51] And have we looked at I mean to me I'm

[2:02:53] having trouble with this one. I mean

[2:02:54] when especially when you look at it on

[2:02:56] the list it's 8% 8% now it's you know.5.

[2:03:01] Have we are we sure we looked at every

[2:03:04] other avenue? I mean aren't we going to

[2:03:06] be receiving what 1.8 million visitors

[2:03:10] this year? Won't that increase our our

[2:03:12] sales tax? Do we know what that number

[2:03:14] is? Have we estimated any of that? Um I

[2:03:18] I just want to it just to me

[2:03:22] was it didn't we just save $2

[2:03:26] some thousand? We cut something. Abby,

[2:03:29] I'm sorry. Through the mayor.

[2:03:31] >> Yes, we did cut that. We also have

[2:03:34] » Yes, we did cut that. We also have

[2:03:34] increased cruise ship revenue, which

[2:03:36] I'll speak to that's coming in. I mean,

[2:03:38] we have other revenue aspects that I

[2:03:40] just don't think have been included in

[2:03:42] this.

[2:03:44] Michelle,

[2:03:45] >> um, mayor and council, um, port revenues

[2:03:49] » um, mayor and council, um, port revenues

[2:03:49] belong to the port. They don't go to the

[2:03:53] general fund. Um, sales tax

[2:03:57] >> during the six months is utilizing the

[2:04:01] » during the six months is utilizing the

[2:04:02] sales from people outside of the city.

[2:04:06] All those passengers that come visit

[2:04:08] when they purchase something, we're

[2:04:10] capitalizing on fact that they're coming

[2:04:13] from outside of our community. They are

[2:04:15] helping pay for the costs that the city

[2:04:18] provides for fire, police, streets,

[2:04:23] um

[2:04:24] all public works in the general fund

[2:04:27] except for solid waste and waste water.

[2:04:29] Um and and so all of those functions

[2:04:35] in the general fund, that's what this

[2:04:37] helps support.

[2:04:39] Um

[2:04:41] so port revenues

[2:04:44] do not pay the general fund. That is

[2:04:46] port revenue that stays in the port

[2:04:48] fund. The passenger warfage fee, the CPB

[2:04:52] revenues. We went through the the cruise

[2:04:55] ship passenger impact study and we

[2:04:57] talked about all the things that we did

[2:04:59] to adjust and payments in le of taxes

[2:05:02] was one of them.

[2:05:03] >> Um

[2:05:05] » Um

[2:05:06] but when we're looking at there's a

[2:05:08] schedule attached to the agenda item in

[2:05:11] year two

[2:05:13] the draw on the general fund is 1.2

[2:05:16] million.

[2:05:18] So that there's um

[2:05:22] we can utilize more SEM money, but that

[2:05:30] money was set aside to be able to pay

[2:05:32] for fire department equipment and

[2:05:35] training, but and and we also haven't

[2:05:39] received our final payment for any year

[2:05:43] that we've submitted. So until we get

[2:05:45] that final payment, we didn't want to

[2:05:47] overall allocate SEMT money to make sure

[2:05:50] that there's funds available for for

[2:05:52] that equipment. At some point when we

[2:05:55] get that final final audit completed,

[2:05:58] then we'll have a better idea of how

[2:06:00] much SEMT and potentially could put more

[2:06:04] operational money into the general fund.

[2:06:07] But until we have that, we can't in good

[2:06:10] conscience start taking that money and

[2:06:13] not have it available for that that

[2:06:15] equipment for the fire department.

[2:06:18] >> Yes, Jay. Your honor to the mayor.

[2:06:20] » Yes, Jay. Your honor to the mayor.

[2:06:20] Question for the finance director. Have

[2:06:23] we received our last payment or a figure

[2:06:27] of what we're getting uh for uh the

[2:06:30] burough sales tax? And did we are we

[2:06:33] under our expectations or did we go over

[2:06:36] our expectations?

[2:06:37] >> Um we are right at where we were last

[2:06:42] » Um we are right at where we were last

[2:06:42] year. So we did finally get just this

[2:06:46] week or maybe it was late last week.

[2:06:48] I've been out of the office. So um we

[2:06:51] received 1.37

[2:06:53] million which puts us right in line with

[2:06:55] where we what we got last year. So, we

[2:06:59] can't predict what sales revenue will

[2:07:03] come into the city with additional

[2:07:05] passengers. We don't know if those

[2:07:08] passengers going to Ward Cove, if

[2:07:10] they're coming into the city, if they're

[2:07:11] spending money in the city. We don't

[2:07:13] know because we don't have transactional

[2:07:15] data. We would like to say yes, we'll

[2:07:18] get a whole bunch more money based on

[2:07:20] more passengers, but that isn't the case

[2:07:23] the last two years. The last two years,

[2:07:25] we've actually had less in sales.

[2:07:27] than 2023.

[2:07:32] » So

[2:07:33] >> Judy Riley and

[2:07:34] » Judy Riley and

[2:07:34] >> so just so I understand. So we raise the

[2:07:37] » so just so I understand. So we raise the

[2:07:37] tax on our citizens

[2:07:40] because we're not sure how much money

[2:07:42] we're going to be receiving and

[2:07:45] >> No, no, no. I'm sorry.

[2:07:47] » No, no, no. I'm sorry.

[2:07:47] >> Okay,

[2:07:48] » Okay,

[2:07:48] >> Council Member Zingi. Um

[2:07:50] » Council Member Zingi. Um

[2:07:50] the tax is to pay for the increase in

[2:07:54] wages.

[2:07:56] We're when we evaluate the revenue,

[2:07:59] we're looking at sales revenue and

[2:08:01] evaluating our regular sales tax based

[2:08:03] on that based on what's happened the

[2:08:06] last two years in the sales.

[2:08:09] We project a certain amount of revenue.

[2:08:12] It's been a little bit below. It's been

[2:08:13] about 130,000 below. We projected 19

[2:08:17] million the last two years and it's been

[2:08:20] in 2024 it was 18.87 987 and right now

[2:08:24] we're trending towards this the same

[2:08:27] amount. We're within $12,000 of where we

[2:08:29] were last year. So 12,000. So we're

[2:08:31] about the same amount. I haven't

[2:08:33] received the final payment. We still

[2:08:35] haven't actually gotten November's

[2:08:37] payment. Um we've got the data but not

[2:08:40] the payment. So we haven't gotten the

[2:08:43] final data for that one. But we're

[2:08:45] receiving a certain amount of sales

[2:08:47] revenue. The SEMT money I was mentioning

[2:08:51] is we sent in financial information.

[2:08:54] They only gave us half what we said we

[2:08:58] utilize the the cost of the service. So

[2:09:02] they only gave us half of that. They

[2:09:05] give us the other half when they do the

[2:09:07] final audit. They were supposed to

[2:09:08] finish the final audit in the beginning

[2:09:10] of 2025,

[2:09:12] but we haven't gotten the final audit.

[2:09:14] And we're expecting to get 2019,

[2:09:18] 2020,

[2:09:19] 22, 2023, and 2024.

[2:09:24] So eventually,

[2:09:26] but they haven't given us the final on

[2:09:29] those.

[2:09:30] >> Do you have a followup?

[2:09:31] » Do you have a followup?

[2:09:31] >> I do. So if we received

[2:09:35] » I do. So if we received

[2:09:36] the SEMt money, would we be able to use

[2:09:39] that to offset the burden on the

[2:09:42] citizens?

[2:09:43] That is

[2:09:46] I don't know because I don't know how

[2:09:48] much that would be.

[2:09:50] >> They cut they could come back and say

[2:09:53] » They cut they could come back and say

[2:09:53] what you received is all you'll get.

[2:09:55] They could come back and say we overpaid

[2:09:57] you. You need to give us money back. Or

[2:10:00] they could come back and say what you

[2:10:01] submitted is what we'll give you and

[2:10:03] they'll give us everything.

[2:10:04] >> So can I ask how much we submitted? How

[2:10:07] » So can I ask how much we submitted? How

[2:10:07] much that amount was? Um the first year

[2:10:10] I believe we got 700,000.

[2:10:13] The first couple years was about 700,000

[2:10:16] of which we only got we only get half.

[2:10:19] Is that the half?

[2:10:22] About 700,000. Um it also depends on our

[2:10:25] assets. So if we purchase new assets

[2:10:28] then that that cost increases and so we

[2:10:31] can submit for more. We have to keep in

[2:10:34] mind SEMT is based on Medicare funds and

[2:10:39] if that goes away,

[2:10:41] >> the SEMT program can go away. So there's

[2:10:44] » the SEMT program can go away. So there's

[2:10:44] a balance. So one, we haven't received a

[2:10:46] final audit. Two, we want to make sure

[2:10:48] that once we get that final audit, what

[2:10:50] can we plan for making sure that the

[2:10:52] fire department's assets, their their

[2:10:56] emergency medical transport program can

[2:10:59] still function and operate.

[2:11:03] The only reason why I bring that up is

[2:11:04] it is possible we could put more of

[2:11:07] those funds into the general fund, but

[2:11:10] it shouldn't that's not funding that's

[2:11:12] not the cost that it that needs to be

[2:11:15] funded. The cost outside of fire

[2:11:18] department is 1.21.

[2:11:22] That's not included in it that does not

[2:11:24] include any fire department increasing

[2:11:26] wages.

[2:11:28] >> Right. Uh did I understand? Are you

[2:11:31] » Right. Uh did I understand? Are you

[2:11:31] saying that the increased number of

[2:11:33] passengers coming in, we are not

[2:11:36] factoring in or estimating an increase

[2:11:38] in sales tax due to that because they

[2:11:40] might not come into town and spend

[2:11:42] money? Is that what I heard you say?

[2:11:44] >> Um, the reason why we don't factor in an

[2:11:47] » Um, the reason why we don't factor in an

[2:11:47] increase in sales is one, we don't know

[2:11:50] how much they'll spend. We don't know. I

[2:11:53] mean, our economy nationally costs are

[2:11:57] increasing. So how much we've what we

[2:11:59] have seen is sales for the last two

[2:12:01] years were lower than the 2023 sales. So

[2:12:05] what we're looking at is sales numbers.

[2:12:07] So the last two years have been stagnant

[2:12:10] even though the number of passengers

[2:12:12] have significantly increased. So that's

[2:12:15] a concern when I'm looking at sales. I

[2:12:18] can't in good conscience say oh well

[2:12:20] just because we'll receive another

[2:12:21] 100,000 they'll all spend I mean then

[2:12:23] how much does each person spend? I think

[2:12:26] that's going to vary based on the

[2:12:27] economy and and we don't know what that

[2:12:30] number per passenger that they spend in

[2:12:33] the city is.

[2:12:35] >> Well, I mean, they're going to spend

[2:12:36] » Well, I mean, they're going to spend

[2:12:36] something,

[2:12:37] >> but based on the economy, is is Joe

[2:12:41] » but based on the economy, is is Joe

[2:12:41] going to spend $50 and then this family

[2:12:44] over here going to spend less because

[2:12:46] >> they have less because of the economic

[2:12:49] » they have less because of the economic

[2:12:49] conditions everywhere?

[2:12:51] I don't know. I don't think we have a

[2:12:54] crystal ball with that. And so what we

[2:12:56] take is our last year's sales and that's

[2:13:00] what we use to base next year's sales

[2:13:03] on.

[2:13:04] >> Great.

[2:13:06] » Great.

[2:13:06] To the finance director's point, she hit

[2:13:10] it on the nail.

[2:13:13] Last two years, our sales tax income has

[2:13:16] reduced. Do you know why it has reduced?

[2:13:19] I'm one of those retailers that collect

[2:13:20] sale tax. Restaurants collect sales tax.

[2:13:24] Shows collect sales tax. Tourists

[2:13:26] collect sales tax. Our taxes and our

[2:13:29] prices are so high that the tourists

[2:13:33] coming in do not want to spend that kind

[2:13:36] of money

[2:13:39] in our town. That's why the number of

[2:13:42] collections have reduced

[2:13:44] and we continue

[2:13:46] to raise taxes.

[2:13:48] It not only affects the tourism economy,

[2:13:52] it affects our local economy. Somebody

[2:13:55] has a problem with a car. Engine gets

[2:13:57] destroyed.

[2:13:59] You can't tell them to wait till the

[2:14:00] winter.

[2:14:02] They have to pay and get a car

[2:14:05] transportation. A roof gets uh caved in.

[2:14:09] We continue continuously to raise rates

[2:14:14] and taxes.

[2:14:17] My issue is we are doing that to support

[2:14:19] our contracts that we give out.

[2:14:22] I don't know whether we need better

[2:14:24] negotiations.

[2:14:27] I mean

[2:14:29] our sales tax revenue, our tax

[2:14:32] collection is

[2:14:35] every penny. I mean people question me

[2:14:37] even today I get phone call why are we

[2:14:38] raising taxes? Where is this money

[2:14:40] going? This money is going to pay wages.

[2:14:44] Every three years, every six years,

[2:14:46] there is a huge increment. We've got to

[2:14:49] make some cuts. I mean, I tried to make

[2:14:50] a small cut and everybody

[2:14:53] jumped on that during the budget

[2:14:55] session. Couldn't make cuts. Now we I

[2:14:59] mean across every department, we raising

[2:15:01] rates and then we raising taxes as well.

[2:15:03] I mean there are more things coming down

[2:15:05] the pipeline that

[2:15:07] will destroy business activity in this

[2:15:11] city.

[2:15:13] >> Gently.

[2:15:19] » So years ago I was part of the um

[2:15:24] um survey team that went down on the

[2:15:26] dock and surveyed um passengers around

[2:15:29] 2014.

[2:15:31] And the average spent

[2:15:34] tourist um spent off a cruise ship is

[2:15:37] between $75 and $100 depending on which

[2:15:41] way they're traveling. So if we're the

[2:15:43] last stop, they spend even less. If

[2:15:46] we're the first stop, sometimes they

[2:15:47] spend less because they want to save

[2:15:50] their money for what might be upstream.

[2:15:54] Um,

[2:15:56] we chose not to raise the bed tax

[2:15:59] because that affects locals somewhere

[2:16:02] somehow in one way or another. And now

[2:16:05] we want to choose not to raise a 5%. I

[2:16:10] get that we do not want to put the

[2:16:14] pressure on our uh community. I'm part

[2:16:17] of that community.

[2:16:19] I don't really want to see my rates go

[2:16:20] up. I don't want to see my taxes go up.

[2:16:24] I don't even want to see

[2:16:28] the costs of living that I'm seeing

[2:16:30] anywhere go up. However,

[2:16:34] my I mean insurance, all these things

[2:16:36] are going up. We have no control.

[2:16:40] Our finance department has no control.

[2:16:42] Our manager has no control. Our

[2:16:45] community who works for the city that

[2:16:48] lives and works in our city doesn't want

[2:16:51] to see it either. However, we look at

[2:16:54] our programs, we look what we have. When

[2:16:58] we talk about small government, we're

[2:17:01] talking about cutting crew. We're

[2:17:03] talking about having maybe volunteers to

[2:17:07] deliver our uh garbage to the dump.

[2:17:11] We're talking about what's happening in

[2:17:12] Juno right now. We have no street crew.

[2:17:17] We have volunteers out there shoveling

[2:17:19] roofs and streets because we we're

[2:17:23] already bare bones. We have how many

[2:17:26] fire department guys that are running

[2:17:30] summers like crazy, like their head cut

[2:17:32] off. We have police officers. We can't

[2:17:36] even, you know, there are so many people

[2:17:39] that don't even follow the law that they

[2:17:43] I've seen people running the stop signs

[2:17:46] and there's no one around to catch them

[2:17:49] because well, everyone's busy with other

[2:17:51] and I get it. Um,

[2:17:56] at the end of the day, as much as I

[2:17:59] don't want to pass this

[2:18:02] and I've lived in a community where we

[2:18:04] had the seasonal tax,

[2:18:08] I and I bought stuff throughout the

[2:18:11] season all the time. Honestly, there are

[2:18:14] other ways we could do this. We could

[2:18:16] just get rid of the tax cap on jewelry

[2:18:19] for one because we're not buying it.

[2:18:23] None of us, this community, we're not

[2:18:25] spending $50,000 on jewelry. Juno took

[2:18:29] the cap off. It makes me angry because

[2:18:32] at the end of the day, we're talking

[2:18:34] about

[2:18:36] we have to have a budget. We have to pay

[2:18:38] our staff. We cannot afford not to do

[2:18:41] that because we have the bare minimum of

[2:18:45] staff and what we need to support our

[2:18:48] community in the services that we need

[2:18:51] to have. It's not water. It's not sewer.

[2:18:55] Those are things I pay for because I get

[2:18:58] them. We're talking fire, police, we're

[2:19:02] talking safety.

[2:19:04] And if we want those things, we have to

[2:19:06] do this. If we want public works to be

[2:19:10] able to do what they do, we have we

[2:19:13] can't take money out of the port to do

[2:19:16] these things. We've said this forever.

[2:19:19] It's there. That's how it works.

[2:19:22] I don't want to do it any more than

[2:19:24] anybody else. But at the end of the day,

[2:19:26] we also have to have our services.

[2:19:29] Abby in the meeting.

[2:19:35] » At [clears throat] this time, I do not

[2:19:36] support a seasonal sales tax increase

[2:19:38] because I believe there are multiple

[2:19:39] existing, upcoming, and potential

[2:19:41] revenue opportunities as well as

[2:19:43] cost-saving measures that should be

[2:19:45] fully evaluated before asking residents

[2:19:47] to pay more. First, we should review the

[2:19:49] potential carryover of unspent funds

[2:19:51] from prior budget cycles. These funds

[2:19:53] represent dollars already collected or

[2:19:56] will be collected and may help address

[2:19:58] the long-term solution. Second, cruise

[2:20:01] ship related revenues continue to grow

[2:20:03] with an increased number of vessels

[2:20:04] calling in catch can waters. Cruise ship

[2:20:07] sales tax revenue, not talking about the

[2:20:09] portification

[2:20:11] is rising.

[2:20:13] We had $120,630

[2:20:15] come in in 2025

[2:20:18] and we have nine more ships entering our

[2:20:20] catch can watch waters next year. In

[2:20:22] addition, fee increases schedules for

[2:20:24] 2027 are expected to further strengthen

[2:20:26] the port revenue which will help in

[2:20:29] return the percentage of our general

[2:20:31] fund in multiple departments.

[2:20:34] There are also opportunities to reduce

[2:20:35] pressure on the general fund through

[2:20:37] targeted userbased fees and expanded

[2:20:39] earned revenue. The proposed $1 increase

[2:20:43] from the museum and Totem Heritage

[2:20:44] Center does exactly that and helps

[2:20:47] directly support these facilities while

[2:20:49] reducing the level of general funding

[2:20:51] subsidy requirement. [laughter]

[2:20:53] We can further build on this by

[2:20:54] expanding revenue generating

[2:20:56] opportunities within these spaces such

[2:20:58] as adding a small coffee shop, a small

[2:21:01] uh souvenir store, or even allowing

[2:21:04] large-scale groups to tour at Totem

[2:21:06] Heritage Center like we did precoid.

[2:21:09] These enhancements could help create a

[2:21:11] more self-supporting model for the

[2:21:12] museum and heritage center, allowing

[2:21:14] residents to continue enjoying these

[2:21:16] cultural assets while then leveraging

[2:21:18] the visitors dollars to cover a greater

[2:21:20] share of the operating costs, then

[2:21:22] ultimately benefiting the general fund.

[2:21:25] Operational efficiencies also remain an

[2:21:28] important part of the solution. We

[2:21:30] continuously talk about redundancy

[2:21:32] studies, efficiency studies. We I'm not

[2:21:35] going to go much detail there, but

[2:21:37] there's a lot of areas that and systems

[2:21:39] that could be streamlined, duplication

[2:21:42] reduced, and long-term cost savings

[2:21:44] achieved, all of which again benefit the

[2:21:46] general fund without impacting service

[2:21:48] levels.

[2:21:49] Additionally, two major revenue

[2:21:51] opportunities may present themselves

[2:21:52] pending court rulings. One is the

[2:21:55] potential expansion of the transient tax

[2:21:56] to cruise ships similar to model Hawaii

[2:21:59] is currently working on and as of today

[2:22:02] it was upheld in the uh court but clea

[2:22:05] did file an appeal on New Year's Eve. Um

[2:22:09] but it is looking very promising that

[2:22:11] Hawaii will win. The second is the

[2:22:15] collection of sales tax on the prices

[2:22:17] cruise lines charge for tours. I want to

[2:22:20] make note that that can sometimes be

[2:22:22] 200% more than what the operator is

[2:22:25] paying tax on currently. So a

[2:22:27] significant increase

[2:22:30] and services offered within our

[2:22:31] community and approach Skagway is

[2:22:33] working on. They also filed a motion to

[2:22:37] the um courts that clea cannot impact um

[2:22:42] taxation and commerce law in the US. uh

[2:22:46] which is looking very promising and

[2:22:48] coming out.

[2:22:50] If upheld, these options could generate

[2:22:52] significant revenue to specifically the

[2:22:55] general fund and help offset costs that

[2:22:57] would otherwise fall on residents. Taken

[2:23:00] together,

[2:23:02] the unspent funds, carryovers every

[2:23:04] year, increased cruise ships sales tax

[2:23:06] revenue, future fee increases, targeted

[2:23:09] user fees, expanded earn revenue at

[2:23:11] cultural facilities, operational

[2:23:12] efficiencies, and potential other

[2:23:14] revenue tools such as the um sales tax

[2:23:19] cap that council member Gage mentioned,

[2:23:21] which is also on the January 30th

[2:23:23] cooperative relations meeting to discuss

[2:23:28] including that option.

[2:23:29] Um, I think it could collectively offset

[2:23:33] the approximate 1.2 million that we

[2:23:36] think we will bring in with the added

[2:23:38] sales tax increase. Given these

[2:23:40] alternatives, I believe it's prudent to

[2:23:42] fully explore and implement these

[2:23:44] options before moving forward with the

[2:23:46] seasonal sales tax increase. This

[2:23:48] approach allows us to remain physically

[2:23:51] physically physically responsible,

[2:23:53] protect residents and local businesses,

[2:23:55] and ensure that any tax increases

[2:23:57] considered only after other reasonable

[2:23:58] options have been exhausted. For that

[2:24:01] reason, I'm not supporting the sales tax

[2:24:03] increase. I do want to note that I did

[2:24:05] support the rate increases because we

[2:24:08] know the user base, we know what that's

[2:24:10] going to, we have a plan, you know,

[2:24:12] infrastructure, things like that. It was

[2:24:15] heart heartburn to do that because I

[2:24:17] know all of them are going to add but

[2:24:18] that's infrastructure for our residents

[2:24:21] is vital and they are a user and I

[2:24:23] support user targeted rates versus just

[2:24:26] a generic for everything.

[2:24:28] >> Thank you Judy.

[2:24:32] » Thank you Judy.

[2:24:32] >> Well I just think that we could do I

[2:24:35] » Well I just think that we could do I

[2:24:35] mean I agree with Councilwoman Gage.

[2:24:37] Let's look at the bed tax and let's look

[2:24:39] at the cap. I just think that um

[2:24:43] there's better ways. I support with what

[2:24:46] Aby's talking about. Maybe we need to

[2:24:48] take a closer look at this. It seems

[2:24:50] like and maybe it's just me over these

[2:24:53] last few years and because where we are

[2:24:55] financially

[2:24:56] um

[2:24:58] it's our go-to. Let's raise this, let's

[2:25:00] raise that. We do have to raise a rates.

[2:25:02] I agree with that. We haven't done that

[2:25:03] in a long time. But

[2:25:06] I just feel that we could hold off on

[2:25:08] this one until we look at something

[2:25:11] else. I don't know what something else

[2:25:12] is at this point, but I just think that

[2:25:16] we're just going about this the wrong

[2:25:18] way. There has to be a way where it

[2:25:21] doesn't affect all these folks. Um, you

[2:25:26] know, I mean, I know a lot of people

[2:25:27] that are just working in restaurants and

[2:25:29] they they can barely afford to live

[2:25:31] here. Now I have I have a table at the

[2:25:34] mall where people come and get food. Who

[2:25:36] do you think goes and gets that? It's

[2:25:38] the people that are paying this. So we

[2:25:40] need to do a better job. We need to dig

[2:25:43] deeper. Do we have to do this right

[2:25:46] today? Can we not go back and just maybe

[2:25:49] take another look? Uh I I don't know.

[2:25:51] I'm I'm having trouble supporting this

[2:25:54] and it's kind of where I'm at.

[2:25:56] >> Yeah. Uh thank you. This is one of those

[2:25:59] » Yeah. Uh thank you. This is one of those

[2:25:59] areas where I think the convoluted

[2:26:00] nature of the business of government

[2:26:03] gets frustrating for residents and also

[2:26:06] for council members and certainly for

[2:26:08] staff. Um I for me in part the

[2:26:11] frustration is you know we've had this

[2:26:13] concept under discussion since the

[2:26:15] middle of last year elements of this

[2:26:18] proposed increase and granted it wasn't

[2:26:19] passed so we're operating on an

[2:26:22] assumption here but the budget that we

[2:26:23] did just approve was tabulated in part

[2:26:26] on this increase and I'm I'm certainly

[2:26:28] not excited about raising rates or taxes

[2:26:31] on our citizens including ourselves us

[2:26:33] all being citizens paying those taxes as

[2:26:35] well but this did seem to me to be a

[2:26:37] better alternative to something like a

[2:26:39] around tax increase or a property uh

[2:26:41] property tax mill rate increase. Um I we

[2:26:46] have we we have obligations

[2:26:48] to our citizens to provide the services

[2:26:51] that they depend on and those services

[2:26:55] require staff. Those staff require

[2:26:57] wages. We as a council have to find a

[2:27:00] way to pay those wages. I'm all for

[2:27:02] finding creative ideas. I just wish we

[2:27:03] weren't doing it literally at like 11th

[2:27:06] hour and 59th minute when we've been

[2:27:08] talking about this proposal for the

[2:27:10] better part of half a year having just

[2:27:13] passed a budget that was tabulated in

[2:27:15] part on the assumption that this would

[2:27:16] be going into place. If there have to be

[2:27:18] increases, I would prefer it to be

[2:27:20] seasonal. I certainly don't want it to

[2:27:21] be year round. I know that there's an

[2:27:23] impact on our year- round residents,

[2:27:25] myself included. Um, but with respect

[2:27:28] to, you know, where and I know it's it's

[2:27:29] it's little solace to people who are

[2:27:31] already stretched thin, but with respect

[2:27:32] to where we are taxed, like as as a

[2:27:35] municipality, you know, I mean, the

[2:27:36] median American average for municipal

[2:27:38] sales taxes, uh, and this is according

[2:27:40] to the the uh the U tax foundation,

[2:27:44] which is a nonprofit, nonpartisan

[2:27:46] organization, is a little bit over 8%.

[2:27:48] So, we're really right there in the

[2:27:49] median. It's 8.04% is median average

[2:27:52] nationwide. And like I say, I know

[2:27:54] that's little solace to somebody who's

[2:27:55] already stretching every dollar. Uh but

[2:27:57] I I don't agree with the assessment that

[2:27:59] we're a highly taxed municipality when

[2:28:02] we're right there in the middle. Um and

[2:28:04] uh I guess, you know, I also I can't go

[2:28:07] on anecdotal evidence. You know, I don't

[2:28:09] for myself, maybe I'm not pennywise

[2:28:10] enough, but when I when I go on

[2:28:12] vacation, I don't consider a city's tax

[2:28:14] rate before I buy lunch. You know, we

[2:28:16] can't anticipate what people's spending

[2:28:18] habits are going to be. There's a lot

[2:28:20] lot of volatility in the in the uh

[2:28:23] economy right now. And anybody that is

[2:28:25] coming here then, you know, they're

[2:28:27] they're they're on vacation. They're

[2:28:28] taking a trip. This we we can't

[2:28:30] anticipate how comfortable they might be

[2:28:33] getting that extra meal out on the town

[2:28:35] instead of, you know, eating at the

[2:28:36] buffet on their ship. We just can't we

[2:28:38] can't anticipate that. What we can

[2:28:39] anticipate are the costs that we're

[2:28:41] going to have with respect to the staff

[2:28:43] that we have and the services that we

[2:28:45] provide. And so though it's a bitter

[2:28:47] pill to swallow, I think we have a

[2:28:49] responsibility as a council to make sure

[2:28:51] that we are paying the bills that we are

[2:28:52] putting before ourselves. As council

[2:28:55] member Gas mentioned at the start of

[2:28:56] this discussion, yeah, this is where the

[2:28:58] rubber hits the road. This is where we

[2:28:59] actually have to this is where the bill

[2:29:01] comes due. We we know what expenses

[2:29:03] we're going to have this year. certainly

[2:29:05] with respect to personnel and I think we

[2:29:07] have an obligation to find the most

[2:29:08] practically balanced way that we can to

[2:29:11] put as much of that uh that expense out

[2:29:14] of the pockets of the residents of

[2:29:16] Ketchacan. And so I think at least in

[2:29:18] the interim that a.5% seasonal sales tax

[2:29:21] increase is a workable solution. And if

[2:29:24] we find at the end of the year or over

[2:29:25] the next several months that there are

[2:29:26] creative solutions that we hadn't

[2:29:28] considered or the spending is increased

[2:29:30] or we have new streams of revenue or the

[2:29:32] new ships that are coming provide

[2:29:33] additional uh sources of funds then we

[2:29:36] repeal the.5 additional percent sales

[2:29:39] tax increase. We have that option also

[2:29:42] but I think you know at least out of the

[2:29:43] gate we have an obligation to pay for

[2:29:46] the services and staff who provide those

[2:29:48] services that we assure for our

[2:29:50] residents.

[2:29:52] We have Jan Lee, then we have Riley,

[2:29:53] then we have Evie.

[2:29:54] >> Yeah, I agree with Jack and I think I

[2:29:57] » Yeah, I agree with Jack and I think I

[2:29:57] agree with everybody on the um finding

[2:29:59] other ways to do this. Um I think that

[2:30:02] that means in the next year we work on

[2:30:04] those things. I do know that if we do

[2:30:07] some of those things, they will the

[2:30:09] money does won't go to the general fund

[2:30:12] based on how the cruise funding works.

[2:30:15] However,

[2:30:17] um, as Jack put it, if if we were to

[2:30:20] find more money in another way and we do

[2:30:24] take away the tax caps and stuff and

[2:30:27] that provides us with more funding,

[2:30:29] that's going to take time to set up.

[2:30:32] Anything we do usually takes one to two

[2:30:34] years to get set up. In the meantime,

[2:30:38] we still have to pay the bill like Jack

[2:30:40] said. And and I agree like I you know if

[2:30:44] we can come up with a creative way to

[2:30:46] get the funding we can always repeal the

[2:30:49] tax.

[2:30:51] >> Right.

[2:30:52] » Right.

[2:30:52] >> Uh this will be my last go. I was just

[2:30:54] » Uh this will be my last go. I was just

[2:30:54] going to make one point but I have to

[2:30:56] make several now. uh one I'm sure that

[2:31:00] compared if you factor in huge

[2:31:03] metropolitan areas like New York and

[2:31:05] California we may be somewhere near the

[2:31:07] middle of taxation but when I look

[2:31:08] across Alaska towns big and small we are

[2:31:12] very very highly taxed and we seem to be

[2:31:15] raising it more frequently than other

[2:31:17] places. Uh, also with respect,

[2:31:21] [snorts] I would not say this is an 11th

[2:31:23] hour and 59th minute opposition to this.

[2:31:27] I can only speak for myself, but also

[2:31:30] other members of the council have been

[2:31:33] in opposition to a lot of this spending.

[2:31:35] For many many months and/or years,

[2:31:37] attempts have been made to reduce

[2:31:39] spending, to reduce the size of our

[2:31:40] growing government, to uh make savings

[2:31:43] all with the intent not to

[2:31:46] uh not that we want to have less staff

[2:31:49] or less things or less trucks or less

[2:31:51] equipment, but that we know that at the

[2:31:53] end every time we do these things, this

[2:31:55] is the end result. So for me, for me,

[2:31:58] every time I uncomfortably and with

[2:32:01] great uh you know, a great amount of

[2:32:04] thought put into it oppose things that

[2:32:06] would be good to have or good to do. The

[2:32:09] reason I'm opposing them is be to try to

[2:32:11] avoid being where we are today. So with

[2:32:14] all due respect, this is this is nothing

[2:32:16] new for me. Uh, and I would also remind

[2:32:20] that the the budget that was presented

[2:32:22] and that we maybe made some amendments

[2:32:25] to, not a whole lot, passed by one vote.

[2:32:27] So, it's not as if the whole council has

[2:32:29] been in support of the level of spending

[2:32:31] that we've been presented for months on

[2:32:33] end. Uh, also

[2:32:38] I do think this is yet again another

[2:32:40] reminder and this is something I've been

[2:32:41] thinking about talking about. I know

[2:32:43] there's a lot of opposition to it for

[2:32:46] legal possible legal reasons, but with

[2:32:50] like what Abby said with other areas

[2:32:52] challenging and trying to get more out

[2:32:54] of their cruise industries, I really

[2:32:57] think long-term we ought to come up with

[2:33:00] something that says every cruise ship

[2:33:02] passenger that comes to catch a can is

[2:33:04] going to pay it'll be factored in

[2:33:07] separate from the CPV a small fee that's

[2:33:10] going to go for all the things that they

[2:33:12] use they use our garbage. So that's the

[2:33:16] garbage has their own fund, but we raise

[2:33:18] rates in there all the time. So that

[2:33:19] would help with that. They use our

[2:33:21] sewer. As we've heard, there's a great

[2:33:22] need for bathrooms. Obviously, they're

[2:33:24] doing something in the bathroom. They're

[2:33:25] not freshening their hair. They're using

[2:33:27] the sewer. So a little bit for that.

[2:33:30] Same with water. Definitely the streets.

[2:33:33] And I think long term we need to come up

[2:33:36] with a plan that where we can charge a

[2:33:38] little bit to each one of those tickets

[2:33:40] that's going to go dedicated to those

[2:33:42] funds. Some of those such as the streets

[2:33:44] come out of the tax the uh general fund,

[2:33:47] others are not, but they all need

[2:33:49] funding and I think that the tourisms

[2:33:51] needs to be paying more. I don't feel

[2:33:52] they're paying their fair share in my

[2:33:54] personal opinion. Uh, and with that, I

[2:33:56] would like to make an amendment to this

[2:33:58] motion, your honor, to include

[2:34:01] the wording uh to lower the sales tax

[2:34:06] 0.5%

[2:34:08] from October 1st through March 31st.

[2:34:12] second.

[2:34:13] >> In addition to this, that way we're

[2:34:15] » In addition to this, that way we're

[2:34:15] we're, as the finance director said,

[2:34:17] we're going to capitalize on that nice

[2:34:19] extra tourism revenue during the summer,

[2:34:23] which is also going to be the same cost

[2:34:24] to our people, but at least when the

[2:34:26] cruise ships go away, we can do a small

[2:34:28] alleviation. And I know that that's

[2:34:30] obviously not going to bring in as much

[2:34:32] money, but we collect much more during

[2:34:34] the summer due to that. So, at least

[2:34:36] this is some amount of an alleviation

[2:34:39] for the long-term residents

[2:34:41] >> or year round residents.

[2:34:43] » or year round residents.

[2:34:43] >> Abby,

[2:34:46] » are we talking now about the amendment?

[2:34:48] >> Yes.

[2:34:48] » Yes.

[2:34:48] >> Okay.

[2:34:52] » I guess your turn.

[2:34:53] >> I uh the amendment winter. I think it's

[2:34:56] » I uh the amendment winter. I think it's

[2:34:56] a great idea. I didn't think of that. Um

[2:34:58] that would directly positively impact

[2:35:01] our residents. Uh I do just have a few

[2:35:04] comments in general on this is I hear

[2:35:06] time and time again about tourists and

[2:35:08] it's we're we're concerned about the

[2:35:10] tourists paying a sales tax.

[2:35:13] I apologize to Bizard. I could care less

[2:35:15] how much they pay in sales tax. It's

[2:35:17] great that they pay it. I'm concerned

[2:35:19] about the people who are here buying

[2:35:20] groceries. Those are the people I'm

[2:35:22] concerned about because unfortunately

[2:35:24] they're affected too. These decisions

[2:35:26] affect them. We just increased their

[2:35:28] their water rate, their sewer rate. It

[2:35:30] will be electric rate and

[2:35:34] harbor fund and solid waste next. Like

[2:35:37] those are all coming. Those directly

[2:35:39] impact our residents.

[2:35:43] If there was a way to target this just

[2:35:44] to visitors, sign me up. Let's increase

[2:35:46] this 20%. Let's make some revenue. But

[2:35:48] it's not. I'm worried about the

[2:35:50] residents who are going to have to pay

[2:35:51] this. I'm also We have $120,000 that

[2:35:56] went to the general fund from cruise

[2:35:58] ship sales tax. has nothing to do. It's

[2:36:00] not tied to CPB funds. Warfridge that is

[2:36:03] $120,000

[2:36:05] extra into our general fund that we

[2:36:07] hadn't anticipated and that's going to

[2:36:09] increase for next year. So, there's all

[2:36:12] these other revenue sources that I know

[2:36:13] we can't factor in this specific amount,

[2:36:16] but we can factor in there is going to

[2:36:18] be revenue that can be used.

[2:36:21] If there's any way to if this has to go

[2:36:23] through, I mean, if we can lower it for

[2:36:25] the locals in the wintertime,

[2:36:28] I'm hugely in support of of that part of

[2:36:31] this amendment.

[2:36:33] The last thing that I have on here is I

[2:36:38] normally I don't get offended at this

[2:36:40] table by another council member's

[2:36:41] comments. I mean, we've we've had some

[2:36:43] great discussions, some crazy arguments,

[2:36:45] and it typically doesn't bother me. Uh,

[2:36:48] you know, usually we walk away, have a

[2:36:49] good night, and move on.

[2:36:51] But quite frankly, to hear multiple

[2:36:54] times at this table, well, nobody's

[2:36:56] brought forth ideas to cut this budget

[2:36:59] to make sure we didn't have to increase

[2:37:01] this is extremely frustrating because I

[2:37:04] specifically sat here and asked for

[2:37:07] $500,000 cut [snorts] of unfilled

[2:37:11] positions. Nobody was impacted. No

[2:37:14] single independent person would lost

[2:37:16] their job or anything. and everybody

[2:37:19] here said, "Nope, we want to make sure

[2:37:22] we can fill those spots." So, I'm

[2:37:24] extremely annoyed hearing it time after

[2:37:26] time that nobody's coming up with

[2:37:29] suggestions and there are suggestions

[2:37:31] that don't impact our active staff. And

[2:37:34] so, please tread lightly on those

[2:37:37] comments. I mean, I don't sit here and

[2:37:39] bash other council members for their

[2:37:41] comments or their ideas. Maybe don't

[2:37:43] support it. we have great conversations,

[2:37:45] but continuously repeating those words

[2:37:46] and saying we're waiting till the last

[2:37:49] hour um to to bring up suggestions. Uh I

[2:37:54] just I brought up those suggestions back

[2:37:56] in July and 6 months later I'm still

[2:37:58] begging for it, you know. So I just want

[2:38:00] people to really be mindful of their

[2:38:03] their comments and I'm not going after

[2:38:06] the tourists. I'm trying to protect our

[2:38:07] residents.

[2:38:09] >> Great.

[2:38:11] » Great.

[2:38:11] Just a clarification on the amendment.

[2:38:13] So, are we saying with this amendment

[2:38:15] we're going to reduce the se uh winter

[2:38:18] tax to 5%.

[2:38:21] You mean additional 0.5%.

[2:38:23] >> So, the original proposal is a 0.5%

[2:38:26] » So, the original proposal is a 0.5%

[2:38:26] increase in the summer. This would

[2:38:29] >> lower 0.5 in the winter.

[2:38:32] » lower 0.5 in the winter.

[2:38:32] >> So, that was always the case, right?

[2:38:34] » So, that was always the case, right?

[2:38:34] >> No, I mean from where we are now.

[2:38:37] » No, I mean from where we are now.

[2:38:37] >> Yeah. But if you raise 0.5 for the

[2:38:39] » Yeah. But if you raise 0.5 for the

[2:38:39] seasonal, it automatically goes away in

[2:38:41] the winter. I am proposing an additional

[2:38:45] subtraction of%

[2:38:47] >> that makes the tax rate 5% not 5.5% in

[2:38:50] » that makes the tax rate 5% not 5.5% in

[2:38:50] the winter.

[2:38:51] >> Correct.

[2:38:52] » Correct.

[2:38:52] >> Okay,

[2:38:52] » Okay,

[2:38:52] >> that's what my clarification was. Yeah,

[2:38:54] » that's what my clarification was. Yeah,

[2:38:54] >> Michelle.

[2:38:55] » Michelle.

[2:38:55] >> So, your honor, I just want to point out

[2:38:57] » So, your honor, I just want to point out

[2:38:57] that in the from October to March,

[2:39:02] the general fund uses 0.5%.

[2:39:06] And this increase is specifically to

[2:39:09] increase four general fund revenues.

[2:39:12] The other 1% in the off season is

[2:39:16] hospital sales tax and 1.15 to the

[2:39:19] public works sales tax fund to fund

[2:39:21] capital projects. So 1% is for debt

[2:39:25] service in the hospital sales tax fund,

[2:39:28] one and a half% for capital projects. If

[2:39:30] you reduce the general fund by 0.5,

[2:39:34] it will receive zero sales tax revenues

[2:39:38] for the October to December quarter and

[2:39:42] the January through March quarter. I

[2:39:44] just want the council to understand what

[2:39:48] that would mean.

[2:39:51] So

[2:39:53] from my perspective,

[2:39:55] if you reduce the tax, don't pass the

[2:39:58] half percent.

[2:40:00] All we're doing is taking money out of

[2:40:02] reserves. We're not we're going deeper

[2:40:05] into the hole. We're trying to work our

[2:40:06] way out of that hole. We all understood

[2:40:09] that we passed the union contracts or

[2:40:11] the labor contracts that we have that

[2:40:12] there was a cost associated with that

[2:40:14] and the opportunity was given to do this

[2:40:17] half a percent sales tax to to make up

[2:40:20] for that. If you don't next year you're

[2:40:23] going to have to be more. It's going to

[2:40:25] be double that. If you don't make a

[2:40:27] small increment at some point the larger

[2:40:30] aggregate is going to catch up with you

[2:40:31] and that's what's happened. It's

[2:40:33] interesting. This is the same discussion

[2:40:35] we had 16 years ago when I started on

[2:40:37] the council and every year since then.

[2:40:40] Nobody likes to talk about taxes. Nobody

[2:40:42] want to talk about uh rate structures.

[2:40:45] It's it's difficult. I get that. And and

[2:40:48] our economy isn't growing. That's a

[2:40:50] fact. People aren't making more money.

[2:40:51] You know, there in some sectors they

[2:40:52] are, but across the board we have we

[2:40:55] have, you know, certain factors that are

[2:40:57] are struggling.

[2:40:59] Um but we have an obligation to run the

[2:41:02] city. Uh we went through a budget

[2:41:04] process and I agree we put up a lot of

[2:41:06] good ideas. Some made it, some of them

[2:41:08] didn't. Um and and I've made with

[2:41:12] myself, I started working on the budget

[2:41:14] two days after we passed the budget for

[2:41:16] next year because there's some concerns

[2:41:19] I have in regards to

[2:41:22] um operating budget and capital budgets

[2:41:24] as we talked about. But those are

[2:41:26] discussions that we're going to have to

[2:41:27] have throughout the year. More meetings,

[2:41:28] but throughout the year to better

[2:41:30] understand it so that and we got to get

[2:41:33] better buyin, I think from from staff

[2:41:35] because um our department heads are the

[2:41:38] ones that are managing our budgets and

[2:41:40] if we're going to cut them or if we're

[2:41:42] going to ask them to cut them, they're

[2:41:43] the ones that should do that because if

[2:41:45] I cut them, it's going to be in the

[2:41:46] wrong place. We're going to run short.

[2:41:49] But I I support this this tax. I know

[2:41:52] it's tough. It's a difficult time. Um, I

[2:41:55] just

[2:41:57] was reading a trend magazine. One of the

[2:41:58] things that popped up and I read I wrote

[2:42:00] down here was local governments will

[2:42:02] continue to weigh residential

[2:42:04] expectations for services such as snow

[2:42:06] removal, road maintenance, permitting

[2:42:08] and public safety with the reality of

[2:42:11] short staffing, budget constraints and

[2:42:13] aging equipment and infrastructure. And

[2:42:16] this is across the state.

[2:42:18] This so all we do is provide services.

[2:42:21] And if we want to save money, you just

[2:42:22] got to tell us what services we want to

[2:42:24] cut or reduce.

[2:42:27] That's what it comes down to. Want less

[2:42:30] police, we can save money. You want less

[2:42:33] fire, we can save money. You want your

[2:42:35] garbage picked up only two days a week,

[2:42:39] you know, whatever you want to do. If we

[2:42:41] want to close a landfill, I mean, those

[2:42:42] are things that we do because all we do

[2:42:43] is provide services. And the only way

[2:42:46] that we can make end meet because the

[2:42:47] cost we have a 2.7% cost living which is

[2:42:51] great because it's lower than it has

[2:42:52] been.

[2:42:54] But that cost of living affects

[2:42:56] everything that we buy as a city. And

[2:42:59] it's not just tourism. I agree with you.

[2:43:01] There's more people in Ketchacan that

[2:43:03] shop on the internet taxfree.

[2:43:09] So when we talk about tax revenues,

[2:43:11] that's part of what's reducing that.

[2:43:13] they can get it cheaper elsewhere.

[2:43:15] It's just the reality of what the

[2:43:17] internet is. We don't we're not hiring

[2:43:19] employees because they're buying the

[2:43:21] stuff on the internet and we not selling

[2:43:22] it out of the stores. That that's the

[2:43:24] fact. People are buying groceries.

[2:43:26] People are buying dry goods. They're

[2:43:28] buying building supplies. They're not

[2:43:29] buying them catch can. They're buying

[2:43:31] them down south because it's cheaper and

[2:43:33] we don't get the tax revenue on that.

[2:43:36] So, it's not it's not just the fact that

[2:43:40] we have to raise this rate. There's a

[2:43:42] lot of things that are impacting the

[2:43:44] rates that the the sales tax that we

[2:43:46] collect. People are going to do le and

[2:43:48] are doing less are putting off project

[2:43:50] just like we are. So um I think that we

[2:43:54] have an obligation we we but we we pass

[2:43:56] the budget and we have an obligation to

[2:43:58] fund it. If we don't those monies just

[2:44:00] come out of reserve if we reduce it by a

[2:44:02] half percent we're not putting the money

[2:44:04] into our general government. So, we're

[2:44:07] not getting the revenues to support the

[2:44:10] capital projects or the the um public

[2:44:13] works operating budget because we're not

[2:44:15] collecting any tax. We want to reduce

[2:44:16] it. So, by reducing the tax,

[2:44:20] we're compounding the problem we're

[2:44:22] going to have on this table of balance.

[2:44:24] >> I think that we can do better. If I

[2:44:26] » I think that we can do better. If I

[2:44:26] could on that just to clarify so

[2:44:28] everyone's clear,

[2:44:30] >> the amendment is to keep staff's

[2:44:32] » the amendment is to keep staff's

[2:44:32] recommended

[2:44:34] summer increase where they as they have

[2:44:37] presented

[2:44:38] >> we collect more sales tax and then the

[2:44:40] » we collect more sales tax and then the

[2:44:40] decrease is just in the winter. So we're

[2:44:42] still going to be net more than we are

[2:44:44] currently.

[2:44:44] >> But but maybe we don't know that because

[2:44:47] » But but maybe we don't know that because

[2:44:47] 10:00 revenues right now showed that we

[2:44:49] were right where we were before. Is that

[2:44:50] correct?

[2:44:51] >> Correct.

[2:44:51] » Correct.

[2:44:52] >> Yeah. But we're going to still raise it

[2:44:53] » Yeah. But we're going to still raise it

[2:44:53] a half percent in the summer. Mhm.

[2:44:55] >> But if you you reduce it in the winter,

[2:44:57] » But if you you reduce it in the winter,

[2:44:57] all that has gone away. We haven't

[2:44:58] funded anything.

[2:44:59] >> But it's not all done away because we

[2:45:01] » But it's not all done away because we

[2:45:01] spend way more in the summer or people.

[2:45:03] >> Yeah, we probably collect more sales

[2:45:04] » Yeah, we probably collect more sales

[2:45:04] tax. Yeah,

[2:45:06] >> I agree with you.

[2:45:08] » I agree with you.

[2:45:08] >> No doubt.

[2:45:09] » No doubt.

[2:45:09] >> We do collect more in the summer, but

[2:45:10] » We do collect more in the summer, but

[2:45:10] there's an incremental difference and

[2:45:13] I'd have to look at what our sales for

[2:45:15] those quarters look like. But yes, we

[2:45:18] would be reducing sales tax. It wouldn't

[2:45:20] be the 1.2 to that we're projecting with

[2:45:23] the half a percent.

[2:45:24] >> Well, I I I sat at this table where we

[2:45:26] » Well, I I I sat at this table where we

[2:45:26] all work real hard to reduce the budget

[2:45:29] and and more efficient at what we do.

[2:45:31] And we asked our department stuff to do.

[2:45:33] We made small

[2:45:35] um increments of excess, but probably

[2:45:38] not enough. So, um, I think we got to we

[2:45:41] there's going to be a lot of the same

[2:45:42] people sitting here next year that we

[2:45:44] got to do a better job of what we're

[2:45:45] doing to get that information earlier on

[2:45:47] throughout the year in regards to what

[2:45:49] our spending is in regards to capital

[2:45:51] budgets, our operating budgets, but we

[2:45:54] passed the budget and I think we need to

[2:45:55] fund it.

[2:45:57] >> Yeah.

[2:45:57] » Yeah.

[2:45:57] >> Just a clarifying question for me, your

[2:45:58] » Just a clarifying question for me, your

[2:45:58] honor. Uh if we were to pass this

[2:46:00] amendment, because we're in first

[2:46:01] reading on this uh on this motion, would

[2:46:04] that give staff time to present to us

[2:46:06] some information about what the impact

[2:46:08] of that decrease in the offse might be?

[2:46:09] Okay,

[2:46:10] >> thank you.

[2:46:11] » thank you.

[2:46:11] >> So now we have amendment on the floor to

[2:46:14] » So now we have amendment on the floor to

[2:46:14] reduce the winter sales tax by

[2:46:19] half%.

[2:46:20] >> Yes.

[2:46:21] » Yes.

[2:46:21] >> Correct.

[2:46:23] » Correct.

[2:46:23] >> So that way I

[2:46:25] » So that way I

[2:46:25] >> No, no, that would be the amended here.

[2:46:26] » No, no, that would be the amended here.

[2:46:26] Correct. No, I'm just clarify. Remind me

[2:46:29] what the um

[2:46:31] >> and and keep the 5%

[2:46:33] » and and keep the 5%

[2:46:33] >> sales

[2:46:33] » sales

[2:46:33] >> tax

[2:46:36] » tax

[2:46:36] already lower it in the winter

[2:46:39] further.

[2:46:40] >> So it would go down an additional

[2:46:43] » So it would go down an additional

[2:46:43] >> we're going to go up an additional of

[2:46:45] » we're going to go up an additional of

[2:46:45] what we already are and this would bring

[2:46:46] us down an additional.5 in the summer.

[2:46:49] >> So that would take us to what?

[2:46:51] » So that would take us to what?

[2:46:51] >> 2.5

[2:46:52] » 2.5

[2:46:52] >> in the winter. So then that pays 1% goes

[2:46:56] » in the winter. So then that pays 1% goes

[2:46:56] to the hospital fund, right?

[2:46:58] >> Yeah.

[2:46:58] » Yeah.

[2:46:58] >> And then what is the other?

[2:47:00] » And then what is the other?

[2:47:00] >> One and a half% goes to the public work

[2:47:02] » One and a half% goes to the public work

[2:47:02] sales tax fund. So 0% would go to the

[2:47:05] general fund October through

[2:47:07] >> Yeah. We lose money

[2:47:09] » Yeah. We lose money

[2:47:09] >> and then in the summer we gain much

[2:47:11] » and then in the summer we gain much

[2:47:11] more.

[2:47:12] >> Not enough money. But did you have

[2:47:14] » Not enough money. But did you have

[2:47:14] something Lacy?

[2:47:15] >> I I just wanted to clarify. So with the

[2:47:17] » I I just wanted to clarify. So with the

[2:47:17] amendment in the summer you would have a

[2:47:21] 6% sales tax and in the winter you would

[2:47:24] have a 2.5%

[2:47:26] sales tax.

[2:47:30] » That's what that's what he's saying.

[2:47:31] >> Yeah. I'm just I just I wanted to make

[2:47:33] » Yeah. I'm just I just I wanted to make

[2:47:33] that

[2:47:34] >> that's the if the amendment passes but

[2:47:37] » that's the if the amendment passes but

[2:47:37] the other the main me motion as amended

[2:47:40] fails well it goes. No, no. He's already

[2:47:43] put into his motion to do the 5% half

[2:47:47] percent that we talked right increase in

[2:47:50] the summer.

[2:47:50] >> The only amendment I am making currently

[2:47:52] » The only amendment I am making currently

[2:47:52] is

[2:47:53] >> to do the decrease. The rest of the

[2:47:55] » to do the decrease. The rest of the

[2:47:55] motion would remain. So, we would still

[2:47:56] have to vote if the amendment passes, we

[2:47:58] would still vote on the main motion with

[2:48:00] the amendment added.

[2:48:01] >> So, the motion is to reduce the winner

[2:48:04] » So, the motion is to reduce the winner

[2:48:04] tax rate by a half a percent.

[2:48:06] >> Yeah.

[2:48:09] » Yeah.

[2:48:09] >> Please call the role.

[2:48:11] » Please call the role.

[2:48:12] Gage,

[2:48:12] >> no.

[2:48:14] » no.

[2:48:14] >> Bradbury,

[2:48:15] » Bradbury,

[2:48:15] >> yes.

[2:48:16] » yes.

[2:48:16] >> Finnegan,

[2:48:17] » Finnegan,

[2:48:17] >> yes.

[2:48:18] » yes.

[2:48:18] >> Gas,

[2:48:19] » Gas,

[2:48:19] >> yes.

[2:48:20] » yes.

[2:48:20] >> Matani,

[2:48:21] » Matani,

[2:48:21] >> yes.

[2:48:23] » yes.

[2:48:23] >> Zingy,

[2:48:23] » Zingy,

[2:48:23] >> yes.

[2:48:24] » yes.

[2:48:24] >> And that passes, your honor.

[2:48:26] » And that passes, your honor.

[2:48:26] >> So, we're back to the main motion in

[2:48:27] » So, we're back to the main motion in

[2:48:27] regards to the half percent.

[2:48:31] >> Yes. Abby.

[2:48:33] » Yes. Abby.

[2:48:33] >> Um, I would like to make a another

[2:48:35] » Um, I would like to make a another

[2:48:35] motion, your honor. Um,

[2:48:40] I would like to amend this an ordinance

[2:48:43] to add a third public hearing

[2:48:46] meeting onto it. And if I can get a

[2:48:48] second, I'll explain why.

[2:48:50] >> Second.

[2:48:51] » Second.

[2:48:52] >> Um, thank you. Appreciate that. So,

[2:48:56] » Um, thank you. Appreciate that. So,

[2:48:56] I called around to some people um kind

[2:48:59] of all over about numerous topics on the

[2:49:01] meeting tonight and a lot of people

[2:49:05] didn't realize we were meeting tonight

[2:49:07] versus Thursday because we're it's a

[2:49:09] regular meeting. We knew it's a holiday

[2:49:12] stuff like that. Um and so I just feel

[2:49:15] like

[2:49:18] we need an additional time frame for the

[2:49:21] public to weigh in. I mean this only on

[2:49:23] this one the sales tax because

[2:49:25] ultimately we answer them. I know it

[2:49:27] delays this timeline but I really think

[2:49:29] that we should have a third public

[2:49:31] hearing on a regular scheduled meeting

[2:49:34] so that it's at Thursday at 7 to make

[2:49:37] sure that the public knows when we're

[2:49:39] meeting and and whatnot. So that's the

[2:49:41] only reason I wanted to add add that for

[2:49:42] the public.

[2:49:44] >> Can we add an extra hearing for these?

[2:49:45] » Can we add an extra hearing for these?

[2:49:45] >> I don't know.

[2:49:48] » I don't know.

[2:49:48] >> Yeah.

[2:49:49] » Yeah.

[2:49:49] Um, so our remote sales tax seller, we

[2:49:53] have to give them any changes in the

[2:49:56] sales tax rate um, 30 days before it's

[2:50:00] effective. So, I just want the council

[2:50:02] to know that. And the bureau also has to

[2:50:06] program into their paperwork for April

[2:50:09] one information any changes. So, we need

[2:50:13] to be cognizant of the time it will take

[2:50:15] them to modify. And I don't know exactly

[2:50:19] what that is, but we we want to give

[2:50:21] them ample time to change their

[2:50:25] documentation online and in paper form

[2:50:30] if it passes.

[2:50:32] >> When would you need that?

[2:50:34] » When would you need that?

[2:50:34] >> The third public hearing would be

[2:50:35] » The third public hearing would be

[2:50:35] February 5th.

[2:50:40] » Does that give enough time

[2:50:42] >> for the remote seller? I need to check

[2:50:45] » for the remote seller? I need to check

[2:50:45] on with the bureau to see how much time

[2:50:47] they'll need.

[2:50:48] >> It would give them most of February and

[2:50:51] » It would give them most of February and

[2:50:51] all of March.

[2:50:52] >> May not be as much because a lot of

[2:50:54] » May not be as much because a lot of

[2:50:54] things are online. I just don't want to.

[2:50:57] >> Sure. Sure.

[2:50:59] » Sure. Sure.

[2:50:59] >> But present, we have a motion

[2:51:02] » But present, we have a motion

[2:51:02] to raise the seasonal sales tax by a

[2:51:06] half% during the summer

[2:51:07] >> and it's been amended to lower it during

[2:51:10] » and it's been amended to lower it during

[2:51:10] >> that one already except Yeah.

[2:51:11] » that one already except Yeah.

[2:51:11] >> Yeah. I know it's

[2:51:12] » Yeah. I know it's

[2:51:12] >> been added to the motion now. Yes.

[2:51:14] » been added to the motion now. Yes.

[2:51:14] >> So, I want to keep it all the same. I'm

[2:51:15] » So, I want to keep it all the same. I'm

[2:51:16] just wanting to add a third meeting on a

[2:51:18] proper

[2:51:19] >> hearing

[2:51:19] » hearing

[2:51:19] >> meeting time.

[2:51:21] » meeting time.

[2:51:21] >> That's all I wanted.

[2:51:23] » That's all I wanted.

[2:51:23] >> Yes.

[2:51:23] » Yes.

[2:51:23] >> I don't, your honor, um, and council

[2:51:25] » I don't, your honor, um, and council

[2:51:25] Bradberry, I don't think there's

[2:51:26] anything to prevent the council from

[2:51:28] doing that. I think it's more a minimum

[2:51:31] that you have to have those two hearings

[2:51:33] to provide

[2:51:35] >> um, public notice. I I I feel like we've

[2:51:38] » um, public notice. I I I feel like we've

[2:51:38] done this in the past, especially when

[2:51:40] there's been enough changes to the

[2:51:42] original ordinance to warrant additional

[2:51:45] discussion. So, I don't think there's a

[2:51:46] problem in doing that. Again, provided

[2:51:48] the timing

[2:51:49] >> beforehand that we agreed to move to

[2:51:51] » beforehand that we agreed to move to

[2:51:51] have made an amendment.

[2:51:53] >> I made an amendment and it's been

[2:51:55] » I made an amendment and it's been

[2:51:55] second. So, please call roll.

[2:51:58] >> Uh Matani,

[2:51:59] » Uh Matani,

[2:51:59] >> yes.

[2:52:00] » yes.

[2:52:00] >> Zingy,

[2:52:01] » Zingy,

[2:52:01] >> yes.

[2:52:02] » yes.

[2:52:02] >> Gage,

[2:52:03] » Gage,

[2:52:03] >> yes.

[2:52:03] » yes.

[2:52:03] >> Bradberry,

[2:52:05] » Bradberry,

[2:52:05] >> yes. Okay. Finnegan.

[2:52:07] » yes. Okay. Finnegan.

[2:52:07] >> Yes.

[2:52:08] » Yes.

[2:52:08] >> And gas.

[2:52:08] » And gas.

[2:52:08] >> Yes. And that passes, your honor.

[2:52:10] » Yes. And that passes, your honor.

[2:52:10] >> Thank you. Then we're back to the main

[2:52:11] » Thank you. Then we're back to the main

[2:52:12] motion.

[2:52:14] >> Yes. Abby,

[2:52:14] » Yes. Abby,

[2:52:14] >> your honor, I would like to make another

[2:52:16] » your honor, I would like to make another

[2:52:16] amendment. I would like to amend the

[2:52:18] effective date for this to from April

[2:52:21] 1st, 2026 to April 1st, 2027.

[2:52:25] >> Put it off a year.

[2:52:27] » Put it off a year.

[2:52:27] >> Just need a second and I can talk

[2:52:28] » Just need a second and I can talk

[2:52:28] further about

[2:52:29] >> second.

[2:52:30] » second.

[2:52:30] So, the reason I am asking for this to

[2:52:33] be postponed to 2027 on top of my

[2:52:35] numerous other questions or statements

[2:52:39] earlier,

[2:52:40] businesses in our community, local

[2:52:42] businesses have been selling their tours

[2:52:44] and services for this upcoming summer.

[2:52:48] They've been online since probably, if

[2:52:51] they're lucky, as early as October. So,

[2:52:53] they've been selling under the

[2:52:54] assumption of a certain rate. So if we

[2:52:57] increase this for April 1st,

[2:53:00] they will have to

[2:53:02] beat that cost on them. Those businesses

[2:53:05] will because they have not had ample

[2:53:07] amount of time to raise the tax rate on

[2:53:10] their um on their customers. So I I am

[2:53:15] because it's based off of service date.

[2:53:16] It's not based on purchase date. And so

[2:53:19] I'm just concerned that we are now if we

[2:53:21] wait and or if we do this and we say

[2:53:23] this summer we're going to increase it,

[2:53:26] we're now taking more money out of our

[2:53:28] local business pockets if they've

[2:53:31] already sold their services, made

[2:53:32] contracts or things like that under that

[2:53:35] service um time frame of a different

[2:53:37] one. So I am concerned again on the

[2:53:39] impact of local businesses. I don't care

[2:53:41] about anybody else. Um, so that is a

[2:53:43] huge concern for me and the why I'm

[2:53:46] wanting to postpone the effective date.

[2:53:52] » Well, I don't I don't agree with that. I

[2:53:54] think that uh the tourism industry is

[2:53:57] continue to run. We can't adjust our

[2:53:59] taxes based on their seasonal sales. So,

[2:54:03] um, and and you know, it's kind of

[2:54:07] ironic we sit here and talk about the

[2:54:08] cost going up for the city. you don't

[2:54:10] want to pass rates, but it's a given

[2:54:12] that the the industry is going to raise

[2:54:14] rates automatically if their rates go

[2:54:15] up. So, I don't know where we're at with

[2:54:18] stuff. So, I I I couldn't support that.

[2:54:22] >> Yes,

[2:54:22] » Yes,

[2:54:22] >> I would like to counter that because uh

[2:54:24] » I would like to counter that because uh

[2:54:24] we as service business, we increased our

[2:54:27] rates on user bases. So,

[2:54:30] the businesses are we're passing on our

[2:54:32] costs and increased 8% on two so far.

[2:54:36] That's what our local businesses also

[2:54:39] do. Yep.

[2:54:40] >> And so you saying, well, we don't

[2:54:43] » And so you saying, well, we don't

[2:54:43] necessarily

[2:54:45] uh it contradicts itself. Well, I think

[2:54:48] that statement contradicts ourselves

[2:54:50] because we just did that to ordinances

[2:54:53] before this. And so now we're saying

[2:54:57] sorry because you operate a business and

[2:54:58] you're offering a service.

[2:55:01] >> Too bad. I mean, we don't say that to

[2:55:02] » Too bad. I mean, we don't say that to

[2:55:02] ourselves.

[2:55:04] >> Yeah. Well, you raise your tax and they

[2:55:05] » Yeah. Well, you raise your tax and they

[2:55:05] pay your RA. I'm just saying I

[2:55:08] >> but I think we have a need that your

[2:55:11] » but I think we have a need that your

[2:55:11] honor

[2:55:12] >> I I think we have a need a need that's

[2:55:13] » I I think we have a need a need that's

[2:55:14] greater than that of the

[2:55:15] >> the tourism industry and so on

[2:55:18] » the tourism industry and so on

[2:55:18] >> local businesses

[2:55:19] » local businesses

[2:55:19] >> local I guess so

[2:55:24] » motion on the floor any other comments

[2:55:26] please call go

[2:55:28] >> yes

[2:55:32] » yes

[2:55:33] >> matani

[2:55:34] » matani

[2:55:34] >> yes

[2:55:36] » yes

[2:55:36] >> zingy

[2:55:39] Yes.

[2:55:41] >> Gage, no.

[2:55:43] » Gage, no.

[2:55:43] >> Bradbury,

[2:55:44] » Bradbury,

[2:55:44] >> yes.

[2:55:45] » yes.

[2:55:45] >> Finnegan,

[2:55:46] » Finnegan,

[2:55:46] >> no.

[2:55:48] » no.

[2:55:48] >> Who did I miss?

[2:55:51] » Who did I miss?

[2:55:51] >> Goose is not here.

[2:55:52] » Goose is not here.

[2:55:52] >> I know. Easy. So,

[2:55:54] » I know. Easy. So,

[2:55:54] >> all right.

[2:55:55] » all right.

[2:55:55] >> So, that passes.

[2:55:57] » So, that passes.

[2:55:57] >> We move on to uh the executive session.

[2:56:00] » We move on to uh the executive session.

[2:56:00] >> Oh, the main motion is still yet to go.

[2:56:02] » Oh, the main motion is still yet to go.

[2:56:02] Oh, sorry. We haven't got it yet. Big go

[2:56:07] >> Bradbury.

[2:56:09] » Bradbury.

[2:56:09] >> Yes.

[2:56:10] » Yes.

[2:56:10] >> Gage,

[2:56:10] » Gage,

[2:56:10] >> yes.

[2:56:11] » yes.

[2:56:11] >> Zingy,

[2:56:12] » Zingy,

[2:56:12] >> yes.

[2:56:14] » yes.

[2:56:14] >> Matani,

[2:56:15] » Matani,

[2:56:15] >> no.

[2:56:16] » no.

[2:56:16] >> Gas,

[2:56:17] » Gas,

[2:56:17] >> no.

[2:56:18] » no.

[2:56:18] >> Finigan,

[2:56:19] » Finigan,

[2:56:19] >> yes.

[2:56:20] » yes.

[2:56:20] >> That passes on 42.

[2:56:23] » That passes on 42.

[2:56:23] >> That moves us on to executive session.

[2:56:27] » That moves us on to executive session.

[2:56:27] There's a request for an exe executive

[2:56:29] session authorizing to negotiate with

[2:56:31] the newly represented

[2:56:34] employees of the Porton Harbor

[2:56:35] Department.

[2:56:38] » I have a motion, please. $2 million.

[2:56:41] [clears throat]

[2:56:41] >> Your honor, I move the city council

[2:56:42] » Your honor, I move the city council

[2:56:42] declare that consistent with the acting

[2:56:44] assistant city manager's recommendation,

[2:56:45] it is in the best interest of the city

[2:56:47] to discuss strategies relative to

[2:56:48] negotiation of an interim letter of

[2:56:50] agreement between the city and the

[2:56:51] international brother of electrical

[2:56:53] workers local 1547 to be incorporated

[2:56:55] into the general government contract in

[2:56:57] executive session. In accordance with

[2:56:59] that finding, the city council will go

[2:57:00] into executive session in accordance

[2:57:02] with KMC2.04.025A1A

[2:57:04] 25A1A

[2:57:05] to discuss said negotiations and

[2:57:07] subjects the knowledge of which would

[2:57:09] have an adverse impact upon the finances

[2:57:10] of the city and upon the city's ability

[2:57:12] to negotiate favorable labor agreements.

[2:57:16] Do I have a second?

[2:57:19] >> Second moved and seconded. Any

[2:57:21] » Second moved and seconded. Any

[2:57:22] discussion

[2:57:24] hearing? Seeing none, please call the

[2:57:27] >> Zingi.

[2:57:28] » Zingi.

[2:57:28] >> Yes. Madani.

[2:57:31] » Yes. Madani.

[2:57:31] >> Yes. Gas.

[2:57:33] » Yes. Gas.

[2:57:33] >> Yes.

[2:57:34] » Yes.

[2:57:34] >> Finigan.

[2:57:35] » Finigan.

[2:57:35] >> Yes.

[2:57:35] » Yes.

[2:57:35] >> Bradberry.

[2:57:36] » Bradberry.

[2:57:36] >> Yes.

[2:57:37] » Yes.

[2:57:37] >> Gage.

[2:57:38] » Gage.

[2:57:38] >> Yes.

[2:57:41] » Yes.

[2:57:41] >> All right. We do.

[2:57:54] » Directive.

[2:57:56] Motion to

[2:57:56] >> adjourn.

[2:58:00] First. Oh, we got all that stuff.

[2:58:03] >> [laughter]

[2:58:04] » [laughter]

[2:58:04] >> I'm getting out of here early.

[2:58:06] » I'm getting out of here early.

[2:58:06] >> We should have done all that before.

[2:58:08] » We should have done all that before.

[2:58:08] >> Yeah, we should have done that before.

[2:58:09] » Yeah, we should have done that before.

[2:58:09] Manager did

[2:58:12] [laughter]

[2:58:13] >> you got off that anyway?

[2:58:14] » you got off that anyway?

[2:58:14] >> You thought you got off easy.

[2:58:16] » You thought you got off easy.

[2:58:16] >> Um your honor and members of the

[2:58:17] » Um your honor and members of the

[2:58:17] council, I really don't have anything. I

[2:58:19] just want to um express my appreciation

[2:58:22] to all the folks who've been working

[2:58:24] really hard as we've had these snow

[2:58:25] storms. um who have been out plowing,

[2:58:28] consulting, um making sure our essential

[2:58:31] services are still happening. Um so just

[2:58:35] a lot of appreciation and kudos to them.

[2:58:36] That's really it.

[2:58:38] >> Thank you. Uh council committee reports.

[2:58:44] » Thank you. Uh council committee reports.

[2:58:44] Um city clerk spot.

[2:58:45] >> No, nothing.

[2:58:46] » No, nothing.

[2:58:46] >> City attorney not here. Um future agenda

[2:58:50] » City attorney not here. Um future agenda

[2:58:50] items.

[2:58:51] >> Yes. I'd like to bring back a future

[2:58:53] » Yes. I'd like to bring back a future

[2:58:53] agenda item to align the process for

[2:58:58] obtaining cab licenses to align it with

[2:59:02] that that Uber is under

[2:59:06] >> changing the self-regulating to the

[2:59:08] » changing the self-regulating to the

[2:59:08] company rather than the police

[2:59:10] department.

[2:59:10] >> And I'd like to co-sponsor that.

[2:59:12] » And I'd like to co-sponsor that.

[2:59:12] >> Okay.

[2:59:12] » Okay.

[2:59:12] >> Okay.

[2:59:13] » Okay.

[2:59:13] >> You all want to sponsor it.

[2:59:15] » You all want to sponsor it.

[2:59:15] >> I'll send you the

[2:59:16] » I'll send you the

[2:59:16] >> cross the aisle. [laughter]

[2:59:20] » cross the aisle. [laughter]

[2:59:20] Bring the mayor and council comments.

[2:59:22] Abby,

[2:59:23] >> none.

[2:59:23] » none.

[2:59:24] >> Gently,

[2:59:24] » Gently,

[2:59:24] >> I have none.

[2:59:25] » I have none.

[2:59:25] >> Judy,

[2:59:26] » Judy,

[2:59:26] >> I have none.

[2:59:27] » I have none.

[2:59:27] >> Jay, just kudos to the street crew and

[2:59:32] » Jay, just kudos to the street crew and

[2:59:32] the electric department. They kept the

[2:59:34] lights on and the streets crew did a

[2:59:36] great job cleaning up the snow and

[2:59:39] everything that came with the wind.

[2:59:43] >> Riley, your honor.

[2:59:44] » Riley, your honor.

[2:59:44] >> Yeah.

[2:59:45] » Yeah.

[2:59:45] >> Oh, yeah. Thank you, your honor. Just

[2:59:46] » Oh, yeah. Thank you, your honor. Just

[2:59:46] reflecting on this evening's

[2:59:48] conversations, especially with respect

[2:59:50] to the final motion that we had on the

[2:59:52] table. Uh I know that I I characterized

[2:59:55] um the decision tonight regarding that

[2:59:58] motion as being one of the 11th hour.

[3:00:00] And um I think the point was made and I

[3:00:03] think it was a good one. And a lot of

[3:00:04] effort has been made by council members

[3:00:06] who have been very creative, have worked

[3:00:08] really hard to find other ways to save

[3:00:10] uh funds. So, I don't think it was

[3:00:12] really appropriate or fair for me to

[3:00:14] characterize that as an 11th hour

[3:00:15] decision. So, I just wanted to reflect

[3:00:17] on that and make that comment and um

[3:00:21] apologize for dismissing the efforts

[3:00:23] that have been made by council members

[3:00:25] who have made efforts or attempted to

[3:00:27] find other ways of making cuts or

[3:00:28] finding creative ways of generating

[3:00:30] revenue.

[3:00:31] >> Thank you.

[3:00:32] » Thank you.

[3:00:32] I have nothing. Ajourn.

Regular City Council Meeting

Transcript