[0:03] Good evening and welcome to the regular meeting of the Mid and City Planning Commission, taking place on Tuesday, August 23rd. This meeting is called to order. Please rise for the pledge of allegiance.

[0:14] to

[0:20] the flight of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible with liberty and justice for all.

[0:41] Mr. King, please hold on.

[0:44] Do you feel this?

[0:45] Dr. Ron, here.

[0:46] May the bill.

[0:47] Here.

[0:47] Thank you.

[0:48] Here.

[0:49] Here.

[0:51] All right.

[0:53] We have a forum.

[0:54] First,

[0:57] on the agenda is meetings from the last regular meeting in August 9th, 2022.

[1:04] Live in the questions or comments, last meeting agenda.

[1:11] Chair, make a motion to approve the minutes.

[1:15] Second.

[1:16] Chair, may I go?

[1:17] Second.

[1:18] All those in favor say aye.

[1:20] Aye, aye.

[1:21] Opposed, same sign.

[1:22] Meeting minutes are approved.

[1:24] Next item on the agenda is only petition 641.

[1:33] Mr. Chair, I'd like to, I guess I'd like to acknowledge a conflict our company has a

[1:40] potential conflict with this really general contractor working on this project.

[1:46] So I'd like to be excused from this petition.

[1:50] All right.

[1:51] Excuse me.

[1:52] I'm

[1:55] helping her to go get him when it's time to make sure we do that as well.

[2:01] It's been a long time.

[2:05] Yeah, so this is a reminder of the process.

[2:09] We'll begin with the staff presentation and overview of the petition.

[2:12] Then we'll invite the petitioner to present at which time we'll open it up for public comments.

[2:17] and questions, and then we'll provide the position or the ability to have final

[2:23] comments on your bottle, and at that point we'll close the public hearing,

[2:27] and then we'll go under deliberation, and if decided possible decision by the

[2:32] planning commission. So with that, we've got the first one of

[2:37] Sony Partition 641 initiated by Matthew Rapanos to rezone property located

[2:43] We did it 3-715 and 3-719 North Saginaw Road from office service to regional commercial and with that, turn it over to Mr. King for the presentation.

[2:55] Thank you, Vice Chair Deckero. Good evening.

[2:59] The subject property is located at 3-715 and 3-719 North Saginaw just short of one acre in size as the Vice Chair referenced.

[3:11] Once the proposal is to rezone the property from OS office service to RC regional commercial properties located just east of West Main Street on North Saginaw Road.

[3:22] You'll note looking at the outline shown on the aerial image above that this is a portion of two parcels of land so it's the entirety of one parcel of land and a portion of a second parcel of land so the applicant's not proposing to rezone the entirety of this parcel from office service but just the area depicted in the outline.

[3:40] in yellow. The property in question is located just to the east of HH style high school. You'll

[3:48] know on the arrow imagery that there is an office building shown immediately to the east.

[3:52] That office building actually is not currently there. It was damaged in the flood of 2020 and has

[3:57] subsequently been torn down and replaced by a private park.

[4:04] Looking at zoning in the area, as

[4:06] mentioned, the subject property is currently zoned OS office service. That's the same zoning

[4:10] district that is applied to the properties to the north-south east and west of the subject

[4:16] property. There are areas zoned RB, immediately to the north and northwest and the south and

[4:22] southeast.

[4:25] Future land use is a bit more diverse in the area. The subject property is primarily located

[4:30] in an office service future land use designation. There is office service future land use designation

[4:35] to the north as well. To the north and west we have a medium density

[4:39] the residential future land use designation and to the south and east we have a low density

[4:44] residential future land use designation.

[4:48] The regional commercial district is intended to provide commercial development that serves

[4:52] the city and the region.

[4:54] It's the most intensive and vehicle-oriented commercial district and so these are intended

[4:58] to be applied in this district's intended for areas that have service from major or minor

[5:04] are thoroughfares and are buffered from residential uses.

[5:07] And so with that comes a very high standards under the zoning ordinance in terms of site planning and landscape design.

[5:15] Some of the permitted uses in the RC regional commercial district include those shown on the screen.

[5:20] So repair garages, banks and credit unions, convenience stores, hotels, medical clinics, places of worship shopping centers.

[5:26] There are few or to know residential uses permitted in the district.

[5:31] This is primarily a higher intensity commercial and retail district.

[5:38] As you're aware, there are 10 general evaluation criteria that apply to every rezoning case.

[5:43] And I think rather than go through each of those one at a time,

[5:46] I just like to summarize in general, this petitions conformance with those criteria.

[5:52] I will note, or restate as I've already noted that the subject property does have a future land use designation of office service, which is consistent with the current zoning designation.

[6:02] And so I think it's important to first address that.

[6:05] The master plan is meant to be a generalized vision for the future of the community.

[6:10] And it's meant to be adaptable and change over time.

[6:12] And the future land use map is one element of that master plan.

[6:16] The master plan also has a series of other land use schools and objectives that are intended to be met as things change over time.

[6:22] And so although this proposal is not consistent with that future land use map,

[6:27] the proposed rezoning could promote other goals that are included in that plan.

[6:30] and such as broadening restaurant and retail choices

[6:33] and providing nodes of commercial activity

[6:35] for surrounding residential areas

[6:37] that are appropriately buffered.

[6:39] As I pointed out, residential uses

[6:41] are primarily located to the north of Sagaw Road

[6:44] along this corridor.

[6:45] To the south is primarily property located in the flood plain

[6:50] or properties that have an institutional or civic use.

[6:54] And so contextually, this rezoning can make a lot of sense

[6:57] in terms of advancing those other goals on the master plan.

[7:00] The master plan is also meant to be considered in context of changes that have happened in the community since its adoption.

[7:07] And there's a few things that we're all, I think, aware of and would agree have changed since the master plan's adoption.

[7:13] One, we've continued to see strong growth to the northwest, western parts of the city of Midland and outside the city of Midland in the residential category in particular.

[7:23] And two, to the south and east of the subject property, we've continued to see growth at the my Michigan health care complex.

[7:31] And so those two changing conditions could help to provide context to support the inclusion of some additional regional commercial activity at this particular node.

[7:41] We

[7:46] have received one public comment on the project to date and that comment was included in your packet.

[7:52] So with that staff recommends approval of zoning petitions 641 based on the following.

[7:58] First, the proposed zoning supports goals of the city's master plan to the proposed zoning facility development that is compatible with the pattern of use and development in the general vicinity.

[8:08] Three, the subject properties located such that the permitted uses in the proposed zoning district will be buffered from residential uses.

[8:15] four conditions have changed since the adoption of the zoning ordinance including residential growth to the north and the west and institutional growth to the southeast, which support the addition of commercial land uses in this area and five public services in the transportation network are sufficient to support the permitted uses in the proposed zoning district.

[8:32] This is the first step in the process following your normal rules of procedure.

[8:37] The planning commission will hold a public hearing this evening and take consideration of making a recommendation to the City Council at your next regular meeting on September 13th.

[8:45] The applicant is here to answer any questions that the planning commission might have and I would welcome any questions as well.

[8:50] Mr. Chair.

[8:52] Thank you.

[8:54] Any questions?

[8:55] Yeah, great. Sure. Thank you. Would we, if we go forward with this, it kind of puts that in a kind of a hole in there as far as a regional commercial for the master planning that we'd be looking to do coming up.

[9:11] Would we then look at and put on our list of things to do? Maybe that whole corner node of mean street and sagging on as regional commercial?

[9:21] or what do you, a future line of use, ma'am?

[9:26] Sure, I don't want to presume to predict exactly

[9:31] what that might look like.

[9:32] I would just offer some context.

[9:35] The majority, actually the entirety of the subject

[9:37] properties located in the 100-year floodplain

[9:40] and the majority of it's not suited to development due to

[9:44] its terrain and natural features.

[9:46] Okay.

[9:46] And so I think that is one thing that would need to be

[9:50] taken into consideration when looking at the future land use pattern on this particular property.

[9:54] So this property is not in the floodplain or?

[9:57] This property is in the 100 year floodplain, the entirety of the parcel.

[10:01] All of it, okay.

[10:02] And so any development here is going to have to conform with the city's floodplain management standards.

[10:06] Okay.

[10:07] But the portion of the property is proposed for rezoning and development is the high ground within the property and the most suited to development.

[10:15] The properties immediately to the east as I noted are currently a private park are also located in the 100-year floodplain.

[10:22] Properties to the north of North Saginaw, because they are more proximate to residential uses,

[10:28] might be appropriate for a commercial or non-office use, but likely a commercial or

[10:35] non-office use that's of lower intensity than regional commercial, or with some buffering to those areas from that regional commercial designation consistent with the intent of the district.

[10:44] So your recommendation may be to evaluate this when we move forward.

[10:51] I would expect that as part of the overall city monitoring process that that entire map will be reviewed.

[10:57] And I think one thing that would continue to advance existing goals within the current master plan is to think about how we can introduce a mixture of uses in appropriate locations throughout the city.

[11:09] Not just along our major retail and commercial nodes.

[11:12] Okay, and likely the inverse as well. How can we introduce some residential components into those commercial areas to help in life and an advocacy to those areas as well?

[11:28] It looks from that map that that parcel does not

[11:33] Front directly on to Saginaw Road or is that just an artifact of the shading or does it front on Saginaw Road?

[11:42] It does front on Saginaw Road. That's an artifact of the width of the right of way in the area

[11:46] So the right way is just set back a considerable distance from the back of curable and that park I drove through that

[11:55] It looks like it's affiliated with the hospital as a general park or is it a park for people who are in the hospital

[12:02] Do we know what the nature of its use is and compatibility with possibly this

[12:11] Development great question. So it's known as roger's family wellness park

[12:16] It is a privately owned park that is open to the public.

[12:20] So it's intended to promote, as I understand it, general community wellness through outdoor activity.

[12:27] Okay, so it is a publicly accessible park, not for therapy uses from people who are associated with the hospital somehow.

[12:36] Correct, a minor thing is it's designed specifically to be usable by people of all ages and abilities.

[12:43] So there's sections of the playground that are designed for adults, and for children, and for seniors, and for those with disabilities.

[12:52] It's meant to be inclusive in that way, and it is open to the public.

[12:55] But it is not like most parks in the city of Midland owned by the city of Midland or operated by the Midland Parks and Recreation Department.

[13:03] Okay, thank you, that's all I have.

[13:06] Do you have a question?

[13:07] I just have one, I might just be an admin question, but I don't have the public comment.

[13:11] I have the one for the other site plan. I just don't have this one.

[13:16] It is a handwritten note on the city's notice letter.

[13:22] So it won't, it doesn't look like a traditional comment you might expect.

[13:27] It'll be from Tom Cannes.

[13:29] It'll be the very last item before the next staff report.

[13:32] I understand now. Thank you.

[13:33] Usually comments like that on these.

[13:35] Got it.

[13:39] I had another question if I could on the zoning map if you want to go to that.

[13:45] I notice that, you know, it's blue all the way around.

[13:49] We have the hatched area that we're looking at potentially rezoning.

[13:53] Why not the rezoning all the way to Saginaw Road, like the other areas go, you know what I'm

[14:00] talking about?

[14:01] To the north?

[14:03] Yeah, to the north.

[14:03] The rezone will ultimately as mapped it will apply up to the center point of the center line of the rate away, but the privately owned property is the area that's it's hashed so if it's rezone, it will go to the road.

[14:19] The map will reflect that but the public right of way doesn't technically have zoning applied to it in anywhere, okay, yeah, okay, thank you, a function of how it's mapped.

[14:30] Okay.

[14:32] Question.

[14:33] That originally was the NATM there before, I don't think it was.

[14:38] Yeah.

[14:38] A DCCU.

[14:39] Oh, is it?

[14:40] Okay.

[14:40] That's how it's trying to picture if that was the same spot.

[14:42] Okay.

[14:46] Questions?

[14:48] Thank

[14:51] you.

[14:52] Thank you.

[14:57] Now, we invite the petitioner to present.

[15:03] Sure.

[15:08] I just need you to step on the blue map, could we name a draft? Good evening, everybody. John

[15:12] Mori from DNM site, surveying and engineering. And I'm representing Matt Reponis, the owner

[15:17] of the property. His brother, Dave owns the rest of the property. So currently, this was

[15:24] the site of that previous ATM that was there. And so it had a horseshoe drive. People drove

[15:30] in, hit the ATM, drove out an in and out on Saginaw Road. The property is all flood

[15:37] plane. There's a small portion of area that's above that 615 elevation, and that is basically

[15:44] just basically encompassed a small rectangle around where that ATM currently are, you know,

[15:52] futurely sat. And so the reason for the rezoning is for a drive-through. Office service does not allow

[16:04] the drive-throughs and so we're coming for a rezoning for regional commercial so we can I guess

[16:10] continue the drive-through situation. Now I know that you guys don't want to hear what is planned

[16:17] because that's not part of what we're what you guys consider in the rezoning but it's I can just

[16:27] Let's tell you that it's a 480 square foot coffee shop.

[16:31] Using the same horseshoe driveway that would be there, the coffee shop would sit right

[16:36] on the ATM location on that pad and then we would have parking for about a dozen cars.

[16:44] So it would have coffee and ice cream and then they could kind of, we have an area for picnic

[16:49] tables and a walking path down towards the state drain.

[16:54] I mean, the reason I hatched that property out like that, I tried to just include high ground and from those parameters that I had there on the west, it dips right down to the state drain.

[17:05] And so really this whole piece of property is pretty much worthless.

[17:09] I mean, you're never going to develop anything else.

[17:11] Just this little and that's probably why that ATM was sitting on such a little teeny piece of property, right?

[17:18] Because that's about all you can do there.

[17:21] It's obviously Saginaw Road has the utilities next door was, I believe it's Mid-Michigan Medical still owns that next door.

[17:31] And so that's what we're asking the board to consider in this rezoning, it's a pretty minor project.

[17:43] There isn't a whole lot we could really do there and Matt wanted to utilize something.

[17:49] there so if you guys get any questions I can answer anything that you need.

[17:56] Questions?

[18:02] Okay, thanks.

[18:05] I had a question but it'll be for the site plan.

[18:07] Okay, yes, for sure.

[18:08] All right, we'll go ahead and open up the floor for public comments and questions.

[18:20] John Olson, 6106, 30 Creek Parkway, Midland Michigan. I live on 30 Creek Parkway but I live

[18:27] on the whack release side. So I'm not really in problem with floods, but to me, this is

[18:34] a one example, another example of many times that I've been in front of City Council

[18:39] talking about this. Using utilizing flood plain areas because if he's talking about developing

[18:45] this, he's probably talking about fill. If you looked at the other side of the other side

[18:51] of Sturgeon Creek, you see there's a substation. You saw how much they had to build that up

[18:55] to be able to be above the flood plain.

[18:59] So we're talking about building in floodplains again.

[19:02] To your left, you see that's in Mandrain, where you call it the state drain.

[19:05] Most people call it in Mandrain.

[19:07] That does flood all the time.

[19:09] And you've got to know that this floods all the time.

[19:11] And it's natural that we have areas where things flood.

[19:14] What the problem that we've done in Midland for many, many years, and

[19:17] not just this planning commission, and not just the city council has been going back.

[19:22] for many years, developing too much north and south,

[19:26] our north and west of town,

[19:28] where we've taken so much land that was normally

[19:32] for drainage from when we have flood event,

[19:35] and now we're building it up,

[19:37] and we're building on top of it.

[19:39] So people, I've been to the last two city council meetings,

[19:42] have been so much talk about flooding drain disconnect.

[19:45] If you know about that, yeah?

[19:47] You've heard about that?

[19:48] It's a big controversy.

[19:49] So someone's as bad as the road diet, you know what I mean?

[19:52] People are really upset about this thing.

[19:55] And what I have to say is that more than most people,

[19:59] when they talk, they say back when I bought my house in 80,

[20:02] when I bought my house in 75, when I bought my house,

[20:05] whenever we didn't have these floods.

[20:08] Now they have floods.

[20:09] And many people have said back in 86,

[20:12] I had two inches of water in my basement.

[20:15] In 1998, I had so many more inches in my basement.

[20:21] Now they're talking about feet in their basement.

[20:24] Why is that?

[20:25] Because that's a natural way, the land slopes to go down to the Tidawasio River.

[20:33] This is all was floodplain.

[20:35] There's a lot of drains.

[20:36] Inman drain was a man-made drain to drain area for development, farms, whatever the reasons were back in the day.

[20:45] There's another drain that's just north of US 10 would be, which could be, I don't know

[20:52] that can't remember the name of the drain, but it's by parent road, there was just some

[20:56] work controversy on that one, because people have noticed that they're getting more water,

[21:01] and all that water drains where to, it goes to the Inman drain, which Inman drain goes just

[21:07] not too far to the, I don't know what direction, and it is down that that way on the map,

[21:14] I

[21:15] Anyways, that goes right into Sturgeon Creek.

[21:18] When you take two big waterways or big creeks and fulfill them full of water, there's

[21:23] only so much capacity that these things can take.

[21:26] So this is why it's getting worse.

[21:28] I can tell you right there on Sturgeon Creek Park, or Sturgeon Creek Park, right there,

[21:32] Marvo Court.

[21:34] Back in the day, that flooded them too, you know?

[21:37] That's a low lying area, and like the gentleman said earlier, that whole thing you can tell

[21:42] That's a flood plain because it's full of reads and cocktails and it's a distance down there.

[21:48] What I'm trying to say is that this planning commission and the City Council has got to take more responsibility for the existing citizens in Midland who are being tortured by inadequate planning when we're talking about development of properties that would normal be in a wet plain area.

[22:07] So, this is just a tiny example and probably wouldn't affect everything, but, you know, it's like, you let one, it's like eating one potato chip, one potato chip, then it's going to be five potato chips, and then it's going to be the whole area will be something, and I mean, even Dow High, which is on the other side of the street there, that whole, why don't they get rid of that stadium?

[22:28] Because it was flood plain, flood area, that's what floods every time it gets severe.

[22:32] So, you know, you got to think about the whole city.

[22:36] I mean, this is a flat terrain, this is like Houston, this is like Dallas, which you hear

[22:41] about now and what's all the things.

[22:43] And these people in Houston and Dallas have actually got retaining ponds.

[22:47] They've found a head, you know, can you tell me a retaining pond in Midland where we actually

[22:53] We utilized some space to hold water other than parking lots.

[22:58] I mean, I mean, there's a couple of good examples of where we could do that, chestnut

[23:03] hill, whatever that we're going to use that where we have a park now.

[23:06] That could be utilized for holding capacity for times or in events where we have floods.

[23:14] Yeah, that's all people care about.

[23:16] They don't want to go back to their basements and spend thousands of dollars to fix them

[23:20] all the time.

[23:21] So this planning commission has got to stop doing that kind of stuff and I remember last week

[23:27] There was talking about Stark wrote, you know

[23:29] What that is the area? This is the area that drain in the in the in men drain the one gentleman who was one of the big

[23:39] Complainers and there's a lot of engineers working on it's actually a lot of this including myself with engineers

[23:45] You know, he talked about why don't we move in

[23:52] to the Titablasse River. That would take a lot of pressure off of the Sturgeon Creek and that

[23:59] Inman Drain. If you had more access to the river, that would actually help a lot of places to be able to not get so much water.

[24:08] So I just want you all to be thinking about this and you know, you don't know me very well, but I mean I've planned lots of things in my life, a lot of

[24:16] $100 million oil wells, a lot of $40 and $50 oil wells.

[24:21] And I mean, this whole city budget's only $100 and some million.

[24:26] So this is, and I realize working for BP,

[24:29] they got a lot more cash than you've got, you know, and I mean, but,

[24:32] but it's still a process for planning,

[24:35] remain the same no matter where you are.

[24:37] There is a procedure and a way in which you plan.

[24:40] So, I'm just asking you to consider, like I said,

[24:44] that maybe you can have a tiny little whatever there

[24:47] where we're utilizing for something,

[24:49] but to me, it's like one potato chip,

[24:50] and I'm not against this thing so much,

[24:54] I'm not against development,

[24:55] but if you're gonna develop,

[24:57] you need to be responsible in the way you develop.

[25:00] So thanks a lot for listening to me.

[25:02] Thank you, Jen.

[25:04] Any other public comments or questions?

[25:12] All right, I'm not seeing any.

[25:15] Petitioner, I'd like to come up for a rebuttal.

[25:22] Again, we don't want to talk about what is going to happen, but we're going to use the existing infrastructure that's there.

[25:31] The drive, you know, we have two entrances, MDOT on North Saginaw Road, there's an existing pad there already from where that ATM is.

[25:39] We weren't planning on putting any fill, that's going through Eagle and getting all that approved as a logistics nightmare.

[25:46] and so we were just going to utilize the existing infrastructure that's there, the pavements that's there, and just plop a nice little 480 square foot, 15 by 40 coffee shop.

[26:01] That was the game plan.

[26:03] Thanks.

[26:04] Okay, thank you, John.

[26:11] We'll go ahead and close the public hearing.

[26:17] With our normal rules of procedures, we wait two weeks and move on anything.

[26:22] Have we done before we have waved those rules and considered them this evening?

[26:27] If the commission's comfortable doing so, but in order to do that, we would need a motion in the second.

[26:32] I'm a waved and consider.

[26:35] You don't have enough members that can participate in this vote.

[26:37] Oh, right.

[26:38] You need six members.

[26:39] Yes, please.

[26:40] So, unfortunately, because of the attendance tonight, you won't have that option available.

[26:46] So, you don't think I don't, yes, I'm the next item with Mr. Penozik back unless anyone else has a conflict on the next item, you could.

[26:55] Who we should go get after this item, concludes.

[27:00] So, the deliberation and consideration will be at the next meeting.

[27:04] We'll have to be, yes, that's all.

[27:06] So at that point we do move on to the next, this will be two weeks from now, we will have

[27:14] a deliberation and we will then move on to conditional use permit number 77 and we will

[27:24] wait until we have shahm back on them.

[27:41] So while shahm is coming, is that then a misnumbering mistake or this looks like it would this

[27:50] the next meeting or okay I see it I see it sorry it's already pen for the next meeting

[27:55] unless we waved it which we were able to okay thank you all right for the for the conditions

[28:06] number 77 this is for the legacy center for the community success for a nonprofit social service

[28:13] agency located at two four one seven at a road with that I'll turn it over to Mr. Kane for the

[28:22] As you noted, the applicant is requesting a conditional use permit for a nonprofit social service agency in the residential B multiple family district.

[28:32] The subject property was most recently used by Saint Timothy's Lutheran Church, which is subsequently merged with Trinity Lutheran Church at their location at 3701 Jefferson Avenue, which is left this structure vacant.

[28:45] So the applicant is proposing to lease the structure from the church to occupy for their non-profit social service agency.

[28:52] The subject property is located just north of the intersection of East Lawn Drive and Abbott Road and the city's southeast section.

[29:00] As I noted, the site was most recently used as a church.

[29:03] In the immediate vicinity, there are residential uses to the north and to the west.

[29:08] To the south, we do have an office use as well as the Grove T-Lounge.

[29:11] This is just a zoomed in perspective on the subject property.

[29:17] You'll note the northern half of the property is largely undeveloped and

[29:21] characterized by wooded areas as is a portion of the western property line.

[29:27] The existing structure is located on that south half of the property along with a 50 space parking lot.

[29:33] The existing structure is just over 6000 square feet in size.

[29:37] Yes, some of the properties located in the residential B zoning district to the south we have neighborhood commercial zoning where that office building and the T lounge are located to the east we have residential B zoning to the north we have the RE4 district and to the west we have the RV zoning district as well.

[30:00] Future land use in the area is similarly diverse. We've hired that city residential to the east and part to the west. To the north and west, we also have medium-density residential future land use designations. Into the south, we have a commercial future land use designation.

[30:19] On the screen, you'll see the applicants proposed site plan. Very limited in scope. The applicant is proposing to add a four-foot sidewalk that will connect from the existing public sidewalk along Abbott Road to the end

[30:31] entrance to the building.

[30:33] The applicant is also proposing to add a bicycle rack in the parking lot.

[30:38] The site is otherwise conforming with the standards of the zoning district as it currently exists.

[30:45] Conditional uses are subject to several non-discretionary standards which are included in the zoning ordinance,

[30:51] as noted all applicable versions and setback standards have been met.

[30:55] The site plan is compliant with standards of 27.06A,

[31:02] and

[31:02] additional bicycle rack and that four-foot sidewalk to the entrance.

[31:06] Those existing wooded areas, so the north and west provide adequate screening from the residential properties in those areas.

[31:12] The applicants 50 parking spaces include two barrier free parking spaces.

[31:17] The zoning ordinance table for minimal parking requirements does not specify a standard for private and

[31:22] non-profit social services service agencies like this.

[31:26] However, the existing parking exceeds the minimum quantity that would be required for an equivalent office use.

[31:31] whether it was medical dental or a different type of professional office.

[31:37] Conditional land uses are also subject to several discretionary standards and

[31:40] this is for the planning commission to review and determine if the proposed use fits in the context within which it's proposed in the district.

[31:47] Those are listed on the screen.

[31:51] Staff is not recommending any contingencies based on the internal staff review of the proposal.

[31:58] We have received one public comment in support of the application.

[32:02] And where we are in the process tonight, the Planning Commission will hold a public hearing.

[32:07] The Planning Commission will then per your rules of procedure, consider taking action on

[32:12] making a recommendation to City Council at your next regular meeting.

[32:15] This would then go to City Council for public hearing and consideration.

[32:20] But welcome any questions.

[32:21] The applicant is present tonight to answer questions as well.

[32:24] Thank you.

[32:25] Any questions?

[32:26] Jay?

[32:27] When I was there, there's a playground that I was unclear whether that's part of this or

[32:33] or whether that's part of growth T lounge,

[32:35] could we get clarification on that?

[32:38] I'm happy to let the applicant address that.

[32:40] I believe it is on this site.

[32:45] I understand as they've built there,

[32:48] but we'll let that go.

[32:50] Okay, thank you.

[32:56] Questions?

[33:01] Thank you, Jake.

[33:03] Next one by the petitioner to present.

[33:09] I can give your name and address.

[33:11] Certainly.

[33:12] Good evening.

[33:13] My name is Catherine Tate.

[33:14] I'm the CEO of the Legacy Center.

[33:16] We're located at 3200 James Savage Road, Suite 5.

[33:21] And thank you, Jacob, for the detailed presentation.

[33:26] The Legacy Center is excited to utilize this property to provide the services and

[33:30] continue serving our community and the way that we currently do.

[33:34] We believe that this proposal adequately meets both the objective and

[33:39] subjective criteria and we will welcome your support for the proposal tonight.

[33:42] I will confirm that the playground is part of Grove T-Lounge's property, and also that the new sidewalk has already been installed as of last week.

[33:55] I would welcome any questions that you have for me.

[33:58] Yes, ma'am.

[33:59] What are the hours you anticipate being open?

[34:03] Sure, so our standard business hours are 9 a.m. to 6, 7 p.m. Most evenings we run a tutoring center. So we have a lot of after school tutoring. We probably, we may see 20,

[34:18] 20 tutoring pairs per hour at our maximum with growth. So eventually we may get to that point.

[34:25] That runs to five or six, or does it run late?

[34:28] That runs usually in cell six or seven p.m.

[34:31] Because it has to be after school.

[34:33] Okay.

[34:35] And do you use have outdoor events then?

[34:38] No.

[34:40] Okay.

[34:46] Utilize the facility as it is.

[34:50] Yeah, very few changes on the inside.

[34:53] We're updating electrical.

[34:55] We're adding some air conditioning

[34:57] because the building is not currently air conditioned.

[34:59] And then the remainder of the building changes will be modular.

[35:05] But no extended parking lot or anything else?

[35:08] Nope, nothing on the outside.

[35:16] You mentioned the 22 number that you said that's per hour or is that a during that window or?

[35:21] So, at most, right now we see an average on a busy school night.

[35:27] We'll see 10 to 12 pairs an hour.

[35:29] That's what that's in our current location, busing at our seams.

[35:33] This will allow us some additional growth and it will allow us to serve more of our clients

[35:38] in our building instead of having them find other public locations.

[35:42] So at most ICS serving 20 pairs, one adult, one usually a minor during those hours working

[35:50] together as a pair.

[35:52] Okay.

[35:54] Any other questions?

[35:58] All right.

[35:59] Thank you.

[36:01] We'll go ahead and open the floor for public comments and questions and

[36:10] your public questions

[36:11] your comments?

[36:15] All right, anything else? You're all good? All right, now we have Sean

[36:26] back. We do have the option to waive our procedure and to consider this this

[36:34] this this evening. And so to do so, I've need a motion in a second and then we

[36:39] can consider that this evening. I move that we wave and consider.

[36:44] Okay, the second.

[36:46] Nice second.

[36:46] James.

[36:48] All right.

[36:49] We have a motion in a second.

[36:51] All in favor, say aye.

[36:56] Aye.

[36:57] All in favor, say aye.

[36:57] All in the same time.

[36:59] All right.

[37:02] I guess we can open for deliberation.

[37:07] I think it's a good fit.

[37:09] Makes rational sense to me, especially in a church building.

[37:13] Yeah.

[37:13] It's that neighborhood area and what's going on there. I think that to me fits, you know, it's all that area

[37:20] The residential uses are pretty much much more firm

[37:23] From this and the adjacent property owners and support of it

[37:29] I think also even if there are outdoor events it won't change anything. It won't affect anything negatively. There's space and

[37:36] Yeah, I think it utilizes an existing building that won't deteriorate

[37:41] Yeah, further it's a good within the city and it's not a vacant property then

[37:47] So it's a I think a good use to have tutoring there

[37:52] That sort of thing so I'm in I'm a support of this

[37:57] Yeah, I was also say also being in a near-neighborhood

[38:03] Yeah, I was like after school program is a good piece of that

[38:06] So there aren't many resources on that side of town right now either

[38:09] But there are schools, so I think that could be helpful.

[38:13] Mr. Chair, make a motion that we approve conditional use permit number 77.

[38:19] A second.

[38:21] A second?

[38:22] A motion a second?

[38:24] All in the paper say aye.

[38:25] I just had a question.

[38:29] Are we approving or are we recommending approve of the city council?

[38:32] Thank you.

[38:33] Let me read you.

[38:34] I'm sorry.

[38:35] Sorry, it's okay and we'd be looking for roll call vote

[38:40] So we recommend this to approve for city council and with that

[38:46] roll

[38:48] Fields yes, Sakura. Yes, maybe yes. Yes, pain. Yes, not sick. Yes, Craig. Yes

[38:56] Thank

[39:03] you. So with that we move on in the agenda

[39:08] Old business. I believe there is none

[39:14] Next is public comments unrelated to items on the agenda are there any public comments unrelated

[39:20] to the agenda?

[39:25] All right.

[39:26] Seeing none.

[39:27] Any new business?

[39:30] Nothing.

[39:31] Good evening.

[39:31] All right.

[39:33] And I have, we do have the communications on the table here.

[39:37] And I don't have any report of the chairperson.

[39:43] And then report from the planning director.

[39:47] Yeah, I wanted to just briefly circle back on Mr. Alcens' comments, just to note I've

[39:56] been, I've had the fortune or misfortune of being at several of the council meetings where

[40:01] the footing during disconnect program and some of the other capital improvement items that

[40:07] council has been working on in response to prior floating events have been discussed.

[40:11] and it's certainly registered with me having attended those hearings that there's significant concern, similar to that expressed by Mr.

[40:22] Elson about the development pattern and the city's approach to floodplain management, storm water management in general, particularly in that part of the city.

[40:31] And so I just wanted to acknowledge that and note that it is certainly my intention to ensure that in the next phases of our city modern master plan process.

[40:40] us that we engage in additional conversations that go beyond the capital improvements that

[40:46] have been approved by the city this week to additional consideration of the manner

[40:53] in which we approach development in sensitive areas and the manner in which we treat storm

[40:59] water in those areas. There was also similarly a motion made last night by council to ask staff

[41:06] after review current procedures and policies related to storm water.

[41:10] Those for the most part are not within the purview of the planning commission.

[41:14] But I did want to let you know that that is something that we'll be taking place as well as part of that broader conversation.

[41:19] So I just didn't want to let that those comments go on responded to because it is certainly on my on my radar.

[41:26] And I hope it's on all of yours as well.

[41:30] If you don't mind, I'll jump right to items for the next agenda.

[41:33] Yes, it's going to be busy.

[41:35] So, so y'all, y'all earned a gimme if you want to be absent next month.

[41:40] Your colleagues, they need to be here at least five of you.

[41:43] We will here be looking for a recommendation on the zoning petition.

[41:50] The public hearing was held on tonight.

[41:51] We have three additional zoning petitions that will be coming forward.

[41:54] One that is sort of related to the zoning petition you saw in your last regular meeting.

[41:59] on north side on our road, two that are related to recent annexations into the city of relatively small pieces of property along Peron Road.

[42:10] We have a conditional use permit for a single family dwelling in the residential be zoning district, not on the list near agenda, but another item that will be on that next agenda is a petition to vacate a street, an undeveloped street on the city's west side.

[42:26] And we will also be talking about our notice of intent to plan for city modern master plan,

[42:33] the planning commission, bylaws and rules of procedure, under new business, and one other

[42:39] item that escapes me.

[42:40] So, you know, eat a good dinner before you arrive next, next month, and enjoy your Labor Day

[42:48] holiday.

[42:48] If there are any chance we could maybe get, we've been getting the agendas on Thursday

[42:55] late.

[42:55] We're working on moving that up.

[42:57] Yeah.

[42:58] We could get at least by Thursday that wouldn't give us time to do justice to the topics.

[43:04] My intention is that you will, at a point in the future, be receiving those agendas by

[43:11] noon on Wednesday at the latest, but it may take us a couple of months to exercise some

[43:17] of our system. So we are working in an ejection though. Okay, I'd like you to have at least six days

[43:27] with the packet in the worst case scenario. And so we are that is our intention as soon as we can

[43:34] get there moving forward.

[43:38] Yeah, just comment. You guys have the Michigan planner coming up in mid-October.

[43:44] there is a planning Michigan conference and sometimes the city has a budget to

[43:52] send one or two people and I would encourage some of the newer members to go and

[43:56] look at the citizen planner portion of that if it's possible to go. Jacob will

[44:02] let us know if that's something potentially we can do. I've gone to it in the

[44:07] past and it's very worthwhile to learn.

[44:10] And that's the second week of October.

[44:13] So you would not have to miss a planning commission meeting.

[44:17] Necessarily, citizen planner portion does overlap with our meeting that week.

[44:23] But the remainder of the bulk of the conference sessions will begin Wednesday morning.

[44:28] I'll be traveling up after the planning commission meeting that Tuesday night.

[44:31] It's on Macon Island.

[44:32] I don't know if that or as mentioned, but not a bad place to visit, depending on the weather in October.

[44:39] And we would be happy to support anyone who's interested in attending to the extent the budget will permit.

[44:45] So if you are interested, you just need to, I would encourage you to let me know as soon as you can so that we can ensure we can make the appropriate accommodations for your travel.

[45:00] Final motion. I move, we adjourned. All right, motion, aye, you. I'll second.

[45:06] Got a second.

[45:07] On the fifth SI.

[45:08] All right.

[45:09] My pose seems fine.

[45:11] Where you going?

Planning Commission Meeting trimmed

Agenda

Transcript