[0:19] All right, I will recall this meeting to

[0:21] order and

[0:23] we see the 5th of May and those present

[0:27] are same as they were during closed

[0:29] session with the addition of Mr. Adler.

[0:32] And with that, we will stand for the

[0:33] Pledge of Allegiance.

[0:37] » I pledge allegiance to the flag of the

[0:39] United States of America and to the

[0:42] republic for which it stands, one nation

[0:45] under God, indivisible, with liberty and

[0:48] justice for all.

[0:54] » All right, thank you and we will start

[0:57] off with our 4:00 p.m. citizens to be

[0:59] heard. So,

[1:01] folks that want to come up and talk,

[1:03] when you are called up, please introduce

[1:05] yourselves and

[1:07] keep your talks will keep us on

[1:09] schedule.

[1:11] So, yes, ma'am.

[1:20] » So, my name is Gail Beaterman. I'm one

[1:23] of the

[1:24] homeowners on the Spanish Valley Trail

[1:28] um multi-use bike path

[1:30] and I wanted to introduce myself.

[1:35] Gail Beaterman, my husband

[1:38] um Larry Gorella was an avid cyclist

[1:41] that

[1:42] had been coming to Moab for 30-some 30

[1:46] 35 years

[1:48] um when he was in the ski season

[1:51] and bought this house in 2005

[1:54] and um

[1:56] I wanted you all to kind of put a face

[1:59] with when you look at the plat maps and

[2:02] see what's involved. Um, I

[2:06] My husband was a very big cyclist. In

[2:09] fact, he died mountain biking in Park

[2:11] City. He had a cardiac arrest in 2023.

[2:16] Um,

[2:17] but he died doing what he loved and

[2:19] that's why he

[2:21] bought the house in Moab.

[2:23] So, um,

[2:27] when you look at

[2:28] I'm a big proponent of cycling and

[2:31] safety for cyclists and and that is why

[2:35] so it brought so many people like us

[2:38] from different parts of the country to

[2:40] live in Moab and why

[2:43] I chose after Larry died to sell the

[2:46] house in Salt Lake and become a

[2:48] full-time resident here. So, I moved

[2:51] here full-time

[2:53] in June. I sold my house in Salt Lake

[2:56] and moved down here in June of last

[2:58] year.

[2:59] So, this is kind of my

[3:02] Well, it is my forever retirement home

[3:06] and um,

[3:08] I wasn't aware of the bike path until

[3:13] the guy I would

[3:15] going to do some xeriscaping landscaping

[3:17] in my front yard and my fix-it guy went

[3:21] down to look at some of the property

[3:23] lines and said, "Gail, you've got a bike

[3:24] path coming through your front yard."

[3:27] So, it's a pretty

[3:29] um, my house is if you haven't driven

[3:31] by, I would encourage all of you to

[3:34] drive by.

[3:35] Um, I think my house is one of the most

[3:38] substantially impacted because the

[3:41] corner of my house comes within 18 ft of

[3:45] this bike path.

[3:46] Um,

[3:47] so,

[3:49] I just want to let you know that I'm a

[3:51] big proponent, but it is going to

[3:54] greatly

[3:56] change the value of my house

[3:59] um

[4:00] with the with it so close to the house.

[4:03] And I um

[4:05] want to encourage all of you to drive

[4:08] by, to stop in, walk it. It's staked

[4:12] right now where you can see the the

[4:14] multi-use bike path will go. And um

[4:19] I just I wanted you to put

[4:22] a face with the

[4:24] when you're looking at this

[4:26] chunk of change I'm sure you're all you

[4:28] know toying with, but it's going to

[4:33] because of the close proximity of my

[4:35] house, I've just spent a lot of money on

[4:38] windows and and putting a new roof on my

[4:41] house, and the closeness of it is kind

[4:45] of

[4:46] greatly impacting my quality. So, I

[4:49] would encourage any all of you to come

[4:52] by and have a look.

[4:54] So, thank you.

[4:55] >> Well, thank you and we look forward to

[4:57] working with that on you. And

[5:00] our condolences for your loss.

[5:02] >> Thank you.

[5:02] >> And any of your husband, Gail. Larry the

[5:04] legend we called him in the

[5:05] » [clears throat]

[5:05] >> bike community here.

[5:06] >> Thank you.

[5:08] are welcome.

[5:08] >> Do we have anyone else that would like

[5:10] to come up?

[5:11] Yes, please introduce yourself.

[5:17] » I'm Mary O'Brien in Castle Valley.

[5:21] In a few moments, residents of Grand

[5:24] County will hear a summary of the

[5:25] Gardner Institute report

[5:28] regarding whether Arches National Park

[5:30] timed entry was lowering the profits of

[5:33] some businesses in Grand County.

[5:36] Hopefully soon, Grand County residents

[5:39] paid for this will even get to read the

[5:42] report for themselves.

[5:45] The contracting for the report never was

[5:48] based on real curiosity

[5:50] as to whether timed entry affected the

[5:52] profits of the local businesses.

[5:56] Contracting for the report was and is

[5:59] part of a statewide effort to dominate

[6:02] Arches National Park

[6:04] and to show the park supervisor and

[6:06] staff that their public decision-making

[6:09] processes about travel management are

[6:12] subject to county nullification.

[6:16] It's part of the decades-long efforts of

[6:19] a minority in Utah to dominate, control,

[6:23] and privatize national public lands in

[6:25] Utah.

[6:27] Without waiting for the results of the

[6:29] report,

[6:30] Arches National Park was ordered to halt

[6:33] timed entry.

[6:35] Without waiting for results of the

[6:37] report,

[6:38] an Arches access and capacity

[6:40] enhancement plan was presented to the

[6:42] supervisor of Arches in a meeting with

[6:45] state officials and other county

[6:47] commissioners who were also presenting

[6:49] their plans to tell their adjacent

[6:51] national park how they should let people

[6:54] come into their park.

[6:57] Without waiting for results of the

[6:59] report, commissioners Winfield and

[7:01] Martinez have begun to seek funds for a

[7:03] shuttle into Arches National Park to

[7:07] supplement cars and RVs.

[7:10] This is not a critique of the Gardner

[7:13] Institute who simply did a study they

[7:16] were paid

[7:17] to undertake.

[7:22] » Thank you. Do we have anyone else? Yes,

[7:24] sir.

[7:33] » Hi, I'm Andrew Jackson. I'm just doing

[7:35] my annual PSA. Um, May is designated as

[7:39] skin cancer awareness month, a time

[7:42] dedicated to promoting sun safe

[7:45] sun safety, early detection, and

[7:48] education about the most common form of

[7:50] cancer.

[7:52] You may know I've had a 15-year battle

[7:55] with skin cancer, but it really hasn't

[7:57] been a battle. I just surrendered

[7:59] territory.

[8:00] And I enjoyed every day at the beach,

[8:04] and every day at the lake, and every day

[8:05] at the ocean and the pool. And um

[8:09] they were fun times. So, at least I had

[8:11] a fun time getting cancer.

[8:13] Uh key initiatives during this month

[8:15] include melanoma Monday, which was

[8:17] yesterday.

[8:19] And then don't fry Friday on the Friday

[8:22] before Memorial Day. It's important to

[8:25] not get sunburned.

[8:28] Recent studies have said sun tanning is

[8:30] okay, but the burn is the problem. Thank

[8:33] you.

[8:34] >> Thank you.

[8:36] >> [clears throat]

[8:38] » Anyone else?

[8:44] All right.

[8:45] Anybody online? I should check.

[8:50] We're good.

[8:52] All right, we'll move on then. Thank

[8:54] you.

[8:55] And we will

[8:57] go into Who do we have doing employee

[9:00] recognition here?

[9:01] >> Yes. Yes.

[9:02] >> Oh, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I didn't see

[9:04] your face back there.

[9:06] Come on forward.

[9:10] I've also mentioned, and maybe you are

[9:12] already, that Chris Kauffman was given

[9:14] an Affiliate of the Year award

[9:16] >> I did it. I wasn't aware of that.

[9:18] >> Association of Counties just last

[9:20] Thursday.

[9:21] >> Correct.

[9:22] >> Thursday or Wednesday?

[9:22] >> Yeah, incredible. Very happy to observe

[9:24] that when we were doing considerations.

[9:27] >> That's wonderful. Well, cool. Good for

[9:29] Treasurer Kauffman. He does an amazing

[9:30] job for our community.

[9:32] Um so, so I'll first by start off by

[9:34] saying that our wonderful Grand Center

[9:36] employees actually didn't want um

[9:38] individual recognition. They were they

[9:40] were uh very very humble about this. So,

[9:42] I'll read a statement on behalf on

[9:44] behalf of the county to the entire Grand

[9:46] Center team.

[9:47] Um so, the statement recognizes the

[9:49] Grand Center team's incredible work and

[9:51] coordinated response during an emergency

[9:53] incident. Last week, a Grand Center

[9:55] employee arrived at a senior's home to

[9:57] provide scheduled transportation.

[9:59] After receiving no response at the door,

[10:02] the employee jumped into action by

[10:03] immediately contacting the senior's

[10:06] emergency contact and their fellow Grand

[10:08] Center staff.

[10:09] The Grand Center team helped facilitate

[10:11] successful contact with the senior's

[10:13] family. Because of this swift and

[10:15] coordinated response, the senior's

[10:16] family was notified promptly and

[10:18] contacted emergency medical services.

[10:21] The senior was transported to receive

[10:22] necessary medical care.

[10:24] We cannot overstate the value that the

[10:27] Grand Center services and staff offer to

[10:29] our community's senior citizens.

[10:31] Thank you to them for the care,

[10:33] compassion, and responsibility with

[10:35] which they approach their work.

[10:39] » Very nice. Thank you.

[10:46] The entire staff at the Grand Center

[10:48] does an awesome job down there. They um

[10:51] and then they keep things running

[10:53] smoothly.

[10:55] So.

[10:56] All right. With that, we will look for a

[11:00] couple of folks from the Kem Gardner

[11:02] Institute to come online and

[11:05] help with their presentation. This um

[11:07] presentation was

[11:11] um asked for, studied, had a lot of

[11:14] feedback back and forth, and was

[11:17] commissioned by the commission here. And

[11:19] so, we thought it appropriate that they

[11:22] present their findings to the commission

[11:24] here. And then from here, they will then

[11:26] go out into the public and people will

[11:28] have an opportunity to dig into it at

[11:31] their Well, so

[11:34] thank you, Mr. Dean, and feel free to

[11:37] take it away.

[11:40] » Thank you. Appreciate the chance to

[11:42] join. I do have some slides to share.

[11:44] Could I get that enabled?

[11:47] >> Okay, um Quinn will help you get online

[11:49] here.

[12:12] » All right, should be good.

[12:20] » There we go.

[12:21] >> We can see it on this end.

[12:24] >> Great.

[12:26] So, uh Mr. Chair, members of the

[12:28] commission, Phil Dean with the Kem C.

[12:29] Gardner Policy Institute. I'm the

[12:31] research director and chief economist

[12:33] here, and first of all, just want to say

[12:35] how great it is to join with you today

[12:38] and share the findings uh from our

[12:40] recently completed report. Um

[12:44] so, I plan to walk through the main

[12:45] findings here in some slides,

[12:48] and then uh at the end of the chair's

[12:50] discretion,

[12:51] uh happy to respond uh to questions from

[12:54] the commission members.

[12:56] Uh one thing I do want to uh touch on a

[12:58] little bit before I jump in on the

[12:59] slides themselves, uh is something that

[13:02] we value a lot here at the Gardner

[13:04] Institute, that we work very hard

[13:07] uh

[13:08] to be a credible independent voice. And

[13:10] so,

[13:10] as in fact, one of our committable core

[13:13] values

[13:14] uh is research integrity uh and

[13:17] relevance.

[13:18] And uh you know, as as I've been

[13:21] involved in this study and worked with

[13:23] our our team on that, I feel very

[13:25] strongly that our team delivered on

[13:27] that. I know there's a lot of questions

[13:28] and a lot of back and forth about all of

[13:30] this,

[13:31] but but I hope you know that um we've

[13:34] given our level best in in giving you a

[13:37] credible um reasonable estimate. Now,

[13:40] one of the challenges when you're doing

[13:42] econometric estimates is they are

[13:44] estimates, right? And and so uh Michael

[13:47] Hogan and the team members that I'll uh

[13:49] talk about here in a minute,

[13:51] you know, makes this comparison that I

[13:52] think is very apt uh to you're doing an

[13:55] appraisal. Uh maybe even just like your

[13:57] county assessor does an appraisal uh for

[14:00] property tax purposes. Uh at the end of

[14:03] the day, you don't with certainty uh

[14:06] know what every single property will sell for uh

[14:11] given a willing buyer, willing seller

[14:13] situation,

[14:15] but uh the estimates are trying to get

[14:17] at that. And And again, I want to go

[14:19] back to that. We've given you our best

[14:21] thinking and analysis. Uh we hope it's

[14:24] um

[14:25] presents uh a series of data points that

[14:28] you can look at uh as you make decisions

[14:31] uh about what what to do best for your

[14:33] county. Uh and we know there going to be

[14:35] other data points out there that you're

[14:37] also going to look at as you do that,

[14:39] and that that's great. Like we're we're

[14:40] just giving you our best thinking. I

[14:42] hope you understand that context um that that that's what we're doing.

[14:48] So, with that um

[14:50] just want to kind of touch briefly on

[14:51] our uh our team that worked on this

[14:53] report. Uh so, John Downen, our senior

[14:56] research fellow, Michael Hogan, our

[14:59] senior research statistician, Jennifer

[15:02] Leaver, who's our senior tourism

[15:04] analyst, and Nate Lloyd, that's the the

[15:06] director of economic research here,

[15:08] uh

[15:09] put a lot of time and and effort in into

[15:11] kind of looking at

[15:12] uh what happened. I want to give them

[15:14] kudos uh for the for the work that they

[15:17] did.

[15:18] So, now

[15:19] again, just talking a little bit about

[15:20] the basic context of this report,

[15:22] looking at timed entry and what happens.

[15:24] And the report goes through all of this

[15:26] in in much more detail. I'm just hitting

[15:28] on some of the high points here.

[15:31] As we work through some of the pieces,

[15:33] so Arches that began in 2022

[15:37] show some of the other places where

[15:39] timed entry has happened

[15:42] throughout the nation.

[15:44] And I want to like I know you know

[15:47] these areas very well that we're

[15:49] highlighting here. But I but I want to

[15:50] use the visual to kind of highlight

[15:54] two separate but related things we're

[15:56] looking at. So one is Arches National

[15:59] Park itself and looking

[16:02] at visitation there.

[16:04] And and so that's the the one study

[16:06] area. And then the second study area is

[16:09] the broader Grand County

[16:11] and looking at that broader economy.

[16:15] And so we'll kind of talk about some of

[16:17] the basic data. It's

[16:20] So some of this we're working from

[16:22] actual data. So we see what actually

[16:25] happened.

[16:26] Others are estimates of of actual data.

[16:30] And then others are different types of

[16:32] estimates that that we'll talk about

[16:33] where we're trying to estimate a

[16:34] counterfactual

[16:36] that that didn't in fact occur but but

[16:39] it's our best estimate looking at the

[16:42] data of what we would have what we think

[16:45] would have occurred in the absence

[16:48] of a timed entry system. So it's

[16:50] Again, it's

[16:53] just try to keep those clear. I know for

[16:55] me sometimes they melt together thinking

[16:57] about

[16:58] you know, the broader geography versus

[17:00] the more narrow geography and looking at

[17:02] little bit different you know, pieces of

[17:05] data there.

[17:07] So to start with our first key finding,

[17:09] one is that Grand County has had

[17:12] positive

[17:14] economic growth.

[17:16] So we do these comparisons uh when we're

[17:19] looking at dollar amounts, these are are

[17:20] in inflation-adjusted terms. Uh, so it's

[17:23] not just nominal increases, but

[17:25] inflation-adjusted increase.

[17:27] And uh across a broad array of standard

[17:30] economic indicators, we see economic

[17:33] growth uh took place in Grand Grand

[17:36] County

[17:37] um between 22 and 2022 and 2024, which

[17:42] is our um our main period of analysis

[17:45] um for the post timed entry

[17:48] period. So in inflation-adjusted terms

[17:51] uh

[17:52] 20 over 22% uh increase in visitor

[17:56] spending within Grand County, uh jobs at

[18:00] over 16% uh and if you just look at the

[18:03] private sector jobs at almost 20% uh

[18:06] higher than than the pre timed entry uh

[18:10] analysis period. And then related to

[18:12] that economic growth, uh we see higher

[18:15] uh

[18:16] higher tax collections that that's

[18:19] coming from that visitor spending.

[18:22] So just uh in each of these uh findings,

[18:24] I'll kind of just hit on a couple of the

[18:25] high points of the graphs that are in

[18:28] there. Again, it's uh

[18:29] quite a a robust report with a lot of

[18:31] details here. Uh so you can uh

[18:34] you can read through all of uh the fun

[18:37] details uh in the you know, 30-plus page

[18:40] report uh that that really is chock-full

[18:43] uh of a bunch of different data points

[18:45] that again, we hope are of use to you.

[18:48] Uh so this one here looks at total

[18:50] visitor spending.

[18:52] Um and so one of the challenges in doing

[18:55] this analysis is how we deal with the

[18:58] pandemic time period.

[19:00] Uh and it's not only an issue in this

[19:02] study, but other studies, uh other

[19:05] forecasts we do, just because of

[19:08] the anomalies that took place in 2020

[19:11] and 2021. And so that's why those are

[19:14] grayed out there and it is one of the

[19:16] challenges of this that that timed entry

[19:18] then begins in the aftermath um of that.

[19:22] So,

[19:24] the the comparison that we do then is

[19:27] compare the 2017 to 2019 period uh to

[19:31] the 2022 to 2024 time period and see

[19:34] what the differences are. So, um

[19:38] again, I want to reiterate these are in

[19:39] inflation in inflation-adjusted

[19:42] dollars.

[19:44] Uh and and you see that pre-timed entry

[19:47] average time period

[19:49] uh $373 million

[19:51] on average in total visitor spending

[19:53] within the county to uh

[19:55] 456 over 450 million in the post-timed

[19:59] entry period.

[20:00] Um so, we note this uh in the report.

[20:04] You do see a decline uh a relatively

[20:06] small decline, but it is a decline

[20:08] between 22 and 2024 in that um

[20:12] post-timed entry average, but even so,

[20:16] uh that you know, 2024

[20:19] time period uh is still well above the

[20:22] pre-

[20:23] um

[20:24] >> [snorts]

[20:24] >> the pre-timed entry uh average that

[20:27] we're using uh for that comparison.

[20:31] Um I'm not going to go through all of

[20:33] these in detail, but just know that this

[20:34] detail is uh in the report, but again,

[20:38] uh kind of showing private sector jobs,

[20:40] public jobs, uh tourism jobs, visitor

[20:44] spending, and then related uh state and

[20:46] local

[20:47] tax revenue. And then elsewhere in the

[20:49] report, we kind of have breakdowns of of

[20:51] some of that.

[20:53] Um another another way of looking at an

[20:56] economy and how it's doing uh is jobs

[20:59] and uh what what's taking place just in

[21:03] the count of jobs. And so that's what's

[21:06] what this is showing and this is that

[21:07] 16% um growth from the pre-timed entry

[21:12] analysis period to the post-timed entry

[21:15] analysis period.

[21:17] So then transitioning to key finding two

[21:20] is uh the Arches uh did have lower

[21:23] visitation, but uh there was higher park

[21:26] visitation in Grand County

[21:29] uh more broadly. And so um

[21:33] just in terms of of the counties, we see

[21:35] these drops uh

[21:37] in the '22 to '24 time period uh

[21:40] at Arches, about 9% uh lower. Um

[21:45] the '22 to '24 time period was also

[21:47] lower than 2016. Um

[21:51] and then

[21:53] as as you broaden that lens or you

[21:55] broaden the scope and look at that, if

[21:57] you combine not only look at not only

[21:59] Arches, but then also combine in

[22:01] Canyonlands and Dead Horse

[22:03] um

[22:04] Point,

[22:05] the total visitation actually increased

[22:08] in the county at those parks and then

[22:10] kind of later uh you we did have the

[22:13] Utah Raptor uh park come in but come

[22:16] online, but we're excluding that because

[22:18] it wasn't around uh in the pre-pandemic

[22:21] uh or the or the pre-timed entry um

[22:24] time period. So again, lower Arches

[22:26] visitation, but higher overall uh state

[22:29] and national park um

[22:31] visitation.

[22:35] And again, I'm not going to go through

[22:36] the details uh of of all of this, but

[22:39] even with those three, if we had Utah

[22:40] Raptor, it would presumably make these

[22:42] numbers and that growth rate a little

[22:44] bit higher. Um that that we did see

[22:46] increases uh in park visitation, but we

[22:50] also did see decreases uh in Arches

[22:55] um visitation.

[22:57] And so this is just a graph visualizing

[23:01] that data.

[23:03] Uh the red being Arches National Park

[23:06] and then the other four national parks

[23:09] in Utah being shown in the different

[23:11] colors. Uh

[23:12] I think it is important to note that

[23:14] every other national park uh in the

[23:16] state of Utah did see uh increases in

[23:20] the

[23:20] um post-timed entry time period uh where

[23:23] Arches was essentially flat um you know,

[23:26] a little increase and then some

[23:27] decrease, but essentially flat uh where

[23:30] we did see increases in the post-timed

[23:32] entry part uh in the other national

[23:34] parks within the state of Utah.

[23:39] So, the the you know, what we've talked

[23:41] about so far are estimates of data or

[23:44] hard actual data um kind of those

[23:47] combined. So, this is where we get into

[23:49] more statistical modeling

[23:52] where where we try to estimate

[23:55] um

[23:56] more precisely some of the effects uh of

[24:00] timed entry itself. Um

[24:03] and so uh this essentially comes up with

[24:06] uh the methodology is to have a

[24:08] counterfactual

[24:10] um visitation given historical data and

[24:13] kind of pulling in uh data from other

[24:15] parks that did not have

[24:17] uh a timed entry and we looked at it not

[24:20] only one way, but a host of ways uh for

[24:23] visitation as well as for

[24:26] uh some of the uh economic variables and

[24:29] that's all again spelled out in detail

[24:31] in the report itself. So, this shows um

[24:35] that uh counterfactual. So, first of

[24:38] all, the gray is showing the actual um

[24:41] Arches park visitation.

[24:44] Uh and then the red is this

[24:46] counterfactual estimate. And so, what

[24:48] you try to do with these uh econometric

[24:51] models is try to match up those lines as

[24:53] closely as possible. Try to take the

[24:56] data that we have uh and and

[25:00] essentially fit a trend line

[25:03] to what actually happened. And as you'll

[25:05] see with the red this counterfactual

[25:08] using this other data does

[25:12] fairly closely approximate what happened

[25:15] in Arches since 1990 through that time

[25:18] dented period. And so then that carries

[25:21] forward into the post time dented

[25:24] time period.

[25:26] We also include other model variants. So

[25:29] this is the one that we think is our

[25:31] best estimate of what the counterfactual

[25:34] showing there in the red what the

[25:36] counterfactual Arches visitation would

[25:38] have looked like. But we also included a

[25:42] number

[25:43] of different models, right? There are

[25:45] different ways to estimate that this.

[25:47] And this is showing the interquartile

[25:49] range or the middle 50% of these other

[25:52] alternative model variations.

[25:55] And they show you know it's not exactly

[25:57] the same as the red line but it's still

[25:59] fairly similar to what's taking place

[26:02] there. And then we compare that to what

[26:04] actually happens and and that difference

[26:06] is what we're talking about. We we think

[26:08] there's about a 14% difference between

[26:11] what we're estimating would have

[26:13] happened in Arches otherwise versus what

[26:16] actually did happen.

[26:19] There's foregone visitor spending

[26:21] associated with that

[26:23] under what we call a ceteris paribus

[26:25] analysis

[26:26] which means just all else equal. Now I

[26:29] do think this is a really important

[26:32] thing to highlight. This isn't what

[26:33] actually happened. As we talked about

[26:35] before that that we did see increases in

[26:38] visitor spending meaning like other conditions changed, right? But

[26:44] this is just a if nothing else changed

[26:46] analysis this is what we estimate would

[26:50] have happened.

[26:52] So that's my high-level overview

[26:54] Uh uh

[26:55] of of our report. Again, there's much

[26:58] more detail

[27:01] in the report itself. And at the chair's

[27:03] discretion, I'm happy to respond to

[27:05] questions.

[27:07] >> Yeah, thank you for walking us through

[27:09] that, Mr. Dean.

[27:11] A couple of notes before we get into

[27:13] questions. If we have any real

[27:15] high-level questions that we would like

[27:17] to send, we would like them sent in

[27:20] writing to the Kem C. Gardner Institute.

[27:23] Uh there were a lot of different people

[27:24] involved in this study, and

[27:27] hoping that Mr. Dean can answer any of

[27:31] our questions that might involve other

[27:32] people. Well, if they're real deep,

[27:34] please put those in an email to the

[27:36] institute. Also, just for some

[27:39] background, all of the commissioners

[27:42] were given the opportunity to ask

[27:44] questions, and I believe everyone did

[27:46] during after we received the draft

[27:49] report. And so, there were multiple

[27:51] opportunities for the commission to ask

[27:53] questions and receive answers to those

[27:56] questions, and

[27:58] I want to just thank you for the fact

[28:00] that answers that you did give were very

[28:03] in-depth, and it appeared that

[28:06] everybody's questions were taken to

[28:08] heart, and I just appreciate the fact of

[28:11] what you did at the Kem C. Gardner to

[28:13] try and meet

[28:15] seven very different people's opinions

[28:17] on how this report should have came out.

[28:21] So, questions, anyone?

[28:23] Commissioner McCreary?

[28:25] No?

[28:27] >> Thank you for the report. Uh I mean, we

[28:30] can all sit here and say, we think this, but an in-depth study

[28:34] really gave a

[28:36] I mean, stark review of the total uh

[28:38] totality.

[28:42] » I just got one quick question real

[28:43] quick.

[28:43] >> Sure, Commissioner Martinez.

[28:45] >> So, thank you, Phil. Um so, under 3A on

[28:48] the MOU I'm sorry, the MOA, it says

[28:51] provide a detailed estimate of annual

[28:54] visitor spending in Grand County pre-

[28:56] and post-implementation of timed entry

[28:59] with post-implementation comparisons

[29:01] between actual and counterfactual

[29:03] scenarios.

[29:05] Can you give me that value?

[29:08] >> Let me try to find out. I believe we

[29:10] have So, some of some of the

[29:12] counterfactual we have in the body of

[29:14] the report and some of it shows up at

[29:17] the end of the report.

[29:19] And I know on each of these if if I

[29:21] can't find it right now, we will get

[29:23] that to you because I know we have that

[29:25] we had essentially mapped out everything

[29:28] in the MOU to to what was in the report.

[29:32] Um

[29:38] So, in the when we're looking at some of

[29:40] the economic indicators on like page 11

[29:45] through 14

[29:48] include some of that and then then

[29:50] there's also additional detail um

[29:58] And let's see, looks like appendix F

[30:02] starting

[30:04] on page 26.

[30:07] And as I I'm happy to to send again we

[30:10] have this mapped out what was in the MOU

[30:12] which sections of the report. I'm happy

[30:13] to send that.

[30:15] Um

[30:17] But like on so table F

[30:20] uh

[30:22] like the more detailed tables F3, F4

[30:27] >> told that it was going to be in the

[30:28] center of the center's paradise.

[30:37] » Yeah, and I'll have to follow up on

[30:38] that.

[30:41] » Thank you.

[30:42] >> Okay, and we'll we'll make sure he gets

[30:44] that to you in actual email and then

[30:47] it'll be accurate for you, but we

[30:48] appreciate that and Commissioner Hadeen.

[30:51] >> Uh

[30:51] >> Yeah, and again, sorry, if I could just

[30:53] go back to that. Uh there's

[30:55] like I I think much of what what you're

[30:57] talking about is in those like detailed

[30:59] tables in Appendix F.

[31:02] >> Okay.

[31:03] Commissioner Hadeen.

[31:04] >> Oh, sure. This This question is more for

[31:07] um Commissioner McCandless. And thank

[31:09] you, Mr. Dean, for for your

[31:11] presentation. Um

[31:14] when we state that we're going to put

[31:15] this out to the public, are we going to

[31:17] attach it to this agenda so that the

[31:19] public knows where to go to find that?

[31:23] >> Yeah, we are going to attach it to this

[31:25] agenda and also we are going to release

[31:27] it on our website and share it online on

[31:31] our Facebook on our social media pages

[31:33] the links as well.

[31:34] >> And are we uh Mr. Dean, can we share

[31:37] your presentation also? Is that

[31:39] possible?

[31:40] >> Yes. Yeah, I'm happy to send send a copy

[31:42] of it.

[31:43] >> Wonderful. Thank you.

[31:44] >> largely just what's in the

[31:45] but a condensed version of what's in the

[31:47] report.

[31:48] >> Yeah. Yeah, that'd be great though.

[31:50] Thank you.

[31:51] >> Anyone else?

[31:53] >> I was going to ask the same question.

[31:54] >> Okay.

[31:55] >> Sorry.

[31:57] I had a lot of people calling

[31:59] questions, wanted to know when they got

[32:01] to see the report, so

[32:03] >> Yep. As soon as after this presentation,

[32:07] they get to see it.

[32:10] Anybody else?

[32:12] Mr. Dean, we appreciate your time. I

[32:14] heard that Jennifer was signing on also,

[32:17] but I don't see her on there, but if she

[32:19] is in fact listening, we appreciate both

[32:21] of you and your help and participation

[32:25] in this process.

[32:27] >> Thanks. I appreciate that. Appreciate

[32:29] the chance to work with you and it looks

[32:30] like I know Jenny's had a number of

[32:32] things she's juggling today. It looks

[32:33] like she did just hop on, but uh thanks

[32:36] again for the chance to work with you

[32:37] and and we'll get that a copy of my

[32:40] slides and and just kind of the

[32:42] crosswalk

[32:43] over to you.

[32:45] >> Okay, thank you very much. Appreciate it

[32:47] and we will move on to the next item.

[32:52] >> Thank you.

[32:53] >> I don't see

[32:57] future considerations point or our

[33:00] disclosures on this unless I'm missing

[33:02] it.

[33:03] >> Should be doing part part 10 of the

[33:05] presentation.

[33:07] >> Okay.

[33:09] He had a Bart online?

[33:11] >> He is online. He had an inner obligation

[33:13] that we needed to get him to.

[33:15] >> All right, so we will move forward with

[33:18] Bart and an update from him. Thank you,

[33:22] Bart.

[33:24] >> Thank you.

[33:26] >> Phil, just for clarification, is that is

[33:27] that or Steven, is that the discussion

[33:29] item?

[33:30] >> Sure. It it is discussion item number

[33:33] two, discussion of options for

[33:35] >> the proceeding land use change

[33:36] applications during land use code update

[33:39] process.

[33:40] >> Yeah.

[33:40] >> And Bart's going to give you the road

[33:41] map and walk us through it.

[33:44] >> Thank you, Bart. This is getting away.

[33:46] >> Thank you.

[33:48] I was asked to talk a lot about um

[33:51] sort of vested rights and moratorium and

[33:56] how those two interrelate and how they

[33:59] interact with changes to the land use

[34:01] code. So, as many of you know, when the

[34:06] commission is considering updating land

[34:08] use zoning,

[34:10] that as soon as it's formally initiated

[34:13] takes effect. And so,

[34:15] any applications that come in after that

[34:18] begins can be considered under the new

[34:20] code if that new code would prohibit the

[34:22] use that the application is coming in

[34:24] under.

[34:25] This sometimes begs the question as to

[34:27] whether the governmental entity should

[34:29] pass some sort of resolution stating,

[34:31] "Hey, we're we're starting the clock now

[34:34] on the new zone uh just so everyone is

[34:37] aware of it. And so, I'm kind of going

[34:39] to walk through what the vested rights

[34:41] doctrine is, how it's been codified in

[34:44] Utah law,

[34:45] what moratoria are, they're distinct but

[34:47] they're also interrelated with the

[34:49] vested rights doctrine, how that's been

[34:51] codified under Utah law, and then we can

[34:53] kind of get to the timing issue uh that

[34:56] I was presented the question with. And

[34:58] if you have any questions or or comments

[35:00] you want to ask it during this time,

[35:02] feel free. I'm just kind of going by the

[35:05] general guidelines that I was given. So,

[35:08] um first, just by way of background how

[35:11] all this developed, the vested rights

[35:13] doctrine is a common law doctrine. Um

[35:16] so, what happened is under common law,

[35:18] whenever a landowner submitted an

[35:20] application, they were entitled to have

[35:22] the application considered under the law

[35:24] as it was at the time that they applied.

[35:27] So, it prevented surprise, it encouraged

[35:29] predictability, um it prevented the

[35:31] government from changing the rules when

[35:33] they didn't like the applicant or they

[35:34] didn't like the application. Um the

[35:37] state codified this under Utah law, and

[35:40] what that did is it created a sort of a

[35:43] race where the government always lost

[35:46] because um anytime the government

[35:48] started considering a change to law, it

[35:50] would have to go through process. So,

[35:52] you'd have to go to the planning

[35:52] commission, and by the time the law

[35:55] actually was changed, anyone who wanted

[35:57] to develop their land in a way that was

[35:59] going to be prohibited would run to uh

[36:02] the government, submit their

[36:03] applications, and get their get their

[36:05] projects approved. So, you know, there

[36:07] wasn't there was this lag time between

[36:10] when the government decided it needed to

[36:11] prohibit something and when it was able

[36:14] to actually prohibit it. And during that

[36:16] time, that gap, a lot of developers

[36:19] would get approved on the projects that

[36:22] were going to be prohibited. So, in

[36:24] order to adjust for that, a couple of

[36:26] exceptions were imposed by law uh to the

[36:30] common law doctrine of vested rights.

[36:32] And one of those was when there's a

[36:35] compelling countervailing public

[36:38] interest that would be jeopardized by

[36:40] the approval. And the second was when

[36:45] the county had formally initiated the

[36:48] process to amend the regulation in a way

[36:50] that would prohibit the application as

[36:53] it was submitted. So, they have those

[36:54] two exceptions to the vested rights

[36:58] doctrine. Now, the first of those, I'm

[36:59] going to kind of switch over to

[37:01] moratorium now because that that

[37:03] standard compelling countervailing

[37:06] public interest is the same standard for

[37:08] moratoria.

[37:09] So,

[37:11] moratoria now under Utah law are called

[37:13] temporary land use regulations instead

[37:16] of moratoria. So, you know, if you hear

[37:19] that term, that's what it means.

[37:20] Essentially, what we used to call

[37:22] moratoria is now temporary land use

[37:24] regulation. It's under a different

[37:26] section of the land use code. Um, and it

[37:29] allows the governing body of the

[37:31] governmental entity. So, in this case,

[37:33] you, the county commission, can pass

[37:36] a a moratorium

[37:39] without going through the planning

[37:41] commission. Just immediately pass it.

[37:43] Still have to have a public hearing,

[37:45] but you don't have to go through the

[37:46] normal process. And you can do that in

[37:48] three circumstances. One is if it's an

[37:51] unregulated area. I don't know that you

[37:53] have any of those in Grand County. I I

[37:55] doubt it from what I've seen.

[37:57] Two,

[37:58] if it's subject to an environmental

[38:00] impact statement or a major investment

[38:03] study, and it's examining an area for a

[38:06] proposed highway or transportation

[38:08] corridor. So, that's the second one. And

[38:11] then the third one is the one that is

[38:12] most commonly used, and that's where you

[38:14] have this compelling countervailing

[38:16] public interest. And that is a situation

[38:19] where the public's interest is deemed to

[38:21] outweigh an individual's interest. So,

[38:25] uh for example,

[38:27] um

[38:29] a couple There's only been a couple of

[38:30] cases on this in Utah. One of those is

[38:34] the Gardner case up in Wasatch County

[38:36] where UDOT was putting in a road and

[38:40] they discovered that a slope was moving

[38:43] was actively moving and there was a

[38:45] subdivision that the county had approved

[38:47] on that slope. And so, when the county

[38:49] learned that the slope was actually

[38:51] moving, they imposed a moratorium. That

[38:53] was upheld by the Supreme Court. Um in

[38:56] another case, the Maackey case,

[38:59] um

[39:00] they

[39:01] attempted to use uh moratorium to

[39:05] um stop a right to a referendum, uh but

[39:08] the Supreme Court held no, uh a right to

[39:11] referendum is constitutional under our

[39:13] state constitution, and therefore the

[39:16] public's interest outweighs uh the

[39:17] individual's interest in that situation

[39:20] as well. So, that's that's what has been

[39:22] defined under Utah law as a compelling

[39:25] countervailing interest. The mere fact

[39:27] that a new regulation is being

[39:29] considered is not enough uh for it to be

[39:32] a compelling countervailing public

[39:34] interest. Um

[39:37] and as evidence of that is listed

[39:38] separately as an exception to the vested

[39:40] rights doctrine. So,

[39:42] um also for a moratorium, they can't

[39:44] last longer than 180 days, which is

[39:46] around 6 months.

[39:48] Um

[39:49] I have always argued that you can stack

[39:51] them. So, if you make a new finding um

[39:55] of a compelling countervailing public

[39:56] interest, you can pass a new one. That

[39:58] is been hotly contested. Uh there's no

[40:01] case law deciding it. The argument

[40:03] against it is good and and and and a

[40:06] good argument. I just I just think it's

[40:08] different. Um and they do not apply to

[40:11] applications that are covered by

[40:14] um this second exception to the vested

[40:17] rights doctrine. In other words, they

[40:18] don't apply to applications that

[40:21] um

[40:22] cannot move forward because the county

[40:24] has already started the process of

[40:26] changing its code to prohibit the the

[40:29] land use application. So, if we go back

[40:32] to vested rights now, so that's that's

[40:34] moratorium, that's one of the reasons

[40:36] compelling countervailing interest that

[40:38] you can uh not process an application

[40:42] under the old law. The other is uh

[40:46] when the county has formally begun the

[40:48] process to amend the land use regulation

[40:50] in a way that would prohibit

[40:52] the applicant's use.

[40:54] And for example, let's say you have a

[40:57] zone that allows you to build

[40:58] high-density housing, um but before I as

[41:01] a developer submit an application, the

[41:04] county has formally instituted a change

[41:07] in that zone so that um I can't build

[41:10] high-density housing there anymore. So,

[41:12] that would be a situation where it's

[41:13] prohibiting the use that I'm applying

[41:15] for. If you formally begin that process

[41:17] before I submit the application, uh then

[41:20] my application uh does not does does is

[41:23] not uh guaranteed a right to be

[41:25] considered under the old zone.

[41:28] Now, a couple of words here of caution,

[41:32] it has to prohibit the proposed use, not

[41:35] just affect it, not just even adversely

[41:38] affect it. It has to prohibit it. The

[41:39] word prohibit is the your word that is

[41:41] used in the statute. Um there are also

[41:44] time limits associated with this. If the

[41:47] county does not enact the legislation

[41:49] that prohibits the use within 180 days,

[41:51] that is within 6 months, around 6

[41:53] months, um after initiating it, then

[41:57] uh the right of the applicant will vest

[41:59] under the old zoning. Uh so, practically

[42:02] you have about 6 months to get the zone

[42:04] passed from when you begin it. Um

[42:09] there's another exception, a timing

[42:10] exception that says that if the

[42:12] application

[42:14] fell under a moratorium, then also uh

[42:17] it's subject to the 180-day limitation.

[42:20] I think that's a that's a mistake in the

[42:22] code. Um I think they meant to say that

[42:26] it was if it was prohibited under a

[42:28] moratorium that it did not uh it wasn't

[42:31] subject to the exception, but that's not

[42:32] the way it's worded. The way I read it,

[42:34] the way it's worded is that also for

[42:36] falls under the 180-day limitation,

[42:39] which doesn't make a lot of sense, but

[42:41] that's the way it's written. So, I think

[42:43] the intention is it just prevents

[42:45] governments from flipping back and forth

[42:47] to prevent a project from going by

[42:48] saying, "Okay, now you're under a

[42:50] moratorium." And then, "Oh, now you're

[42:52] under

[42:53] uh the vested rights statute." And just

[42:55] going back and forth and just

[42:57] continuously um stopping the project

[43:00] from going forward. So, then the

[43:02] question is, "Well, should we pass a

[43:04] resolution saying, 'Okay, this is when

[43:06] our 180 days begins. We have formally

[43:09] begun to consider a new zone now.'" And

[43:14] then that way everyone knows about it.

[43:16] The The benefit of that is that um it's

[43:20] sunshine, it provides transparency,

[43:22] everyone knows. Um and the the language

[43:25] of the statute itself is it it begs

[43:27] questions. It's kind of squishy. It

[43:29] says, "In the manner provided by the

[43:32] local ordinance

[43:33] uh the county formally initiates

[43:35] proceedings to amend the regulations in

[43:37] a way that would prohibit approval." So,

[43:40] what does it mean to formally initiate?

[43:42] What is the manner provided? These are

[43:44] questions that are kind of up in the

[43:45] air. And so, if I providing a

[43:47] resolution, you provide clarity for

[43:48] that. However, there is a two-sided

[43:51] coin. There is an opposite

[43:53] uh there side to that coin, and there

[43:55] are some concerns that you should be

[43:57] aware of. One is that

[43:59] in my opinion, I think that if the

[44:02] county passes that resolution, it would

[44:04] only be applied against the county. Um

[44:07] it would not be applied against the

[44:09] applicant because the county is the one

[44:11] that is saying, "Okay, we are starting

[44:12] now." Which allows the applicant to make

[44:15] arguments that the process started

[44:17] later. Also, I think it could give rise

[44:20] to potential arguments that it was

[44:24] misleading depending on how it's worded.

[44:26] So, for example,

[44:28] you could say that the exception only

[44:30] applies to a proceeding that prohibits

[44:33] approval. But

[44:36] you know, maybe

[44:38] that

[44:40] prohibition is added later. So, at what

[44:43] point then does that prohibition part of

[44:46] the formal process? Or perhaps the

[44:48] prohibition began but then was later

[44:50] taken out or changed to simply a

[44:52] limitation. All these questions arise

[44:55] during the process of amending the code

[44:58] and so it's always very ad hoc on when

[45:01] this time period begins. And if you set

[45:03] a time period with a resolution I think

[45:07] that that binds your hands somewhat

[45:10] to that date in the resolution when in

[45:13] actuality depending on the the legal the

[45:16] legal concerns at play, the facts of

[45:19] when certain terms were added or

[45:21] deleted,

[45:22] that date can vary

[45:25] through the process.

[45:27] So, that's kind of my overview summary.

[45:29] I'm happy to ask answer any questions

[45:31] you might have about it.

[45:35] » Thanks.

[45:38] Mr. Hadip.

[45:39] >> I have a comment. That really helped a

[45:40] lot, Mark. Just to kind of go through,

[45:43] you know, the positives and negatives.

[45:46] That helps a lot. I appreciate the

[45:47] process. Thank you, Stephen, for for

[45:49] supporting me on that when I when I

[45:52] reached out to you all. So

[45:57] » Have you seen or when you've seen these

[46:00] in being passed, have you seen the

[46:03] resolutions being challenged?

[46:06] >> I have not seen Well,

[46:08] I have not seen the resolutions be

[46:10] challenged. Um although

[46:14] I have seen them

[46:17] to stop an argument from a governmental

[46:20] entity for a different date.

[46:22] >> Okay.

[46:26] Excellent. Well, Bart, thank you so much

[46:28] for dedicating some time to this. If If

[46:30] we have follow-up questions,

[46:31] commissioners, if you'll email any of

[46:32] those follow-up questions that you may

[46:34] have, um then Bart and I can address

[46:36] them and we can provide any other

[46:38] information or requests that you guys

[46:39] have as we move forward with the

[46:41] with any any questions you might have.

[46:43] So, that's everything that I had for

[46:44] Bart. Any other questions?

[46:46] Anybody else?

[46:48] >> Bart, thanks for your time. It's always

[46:50] good to see you. We appreciate your

[46:51] advice and help.

[46:53] >> Good to see you as well. Thank you.

[46:58] » All right. With that, I don't Again, I

[47:01] set up previously, I don't see a future

[47:04] considerations on here. So, we're going

[47:06] to take that opportunity and then we

[47:08] will get to Andrew and also action

[47:11] disclosures.

[47:12] >> Yeah, it's number three.

[47:13] >> Yeah, it's down there.

[47:15] >> Yeah.

[47:16] >> Seth.

[47:16] >> But

[47:17] >> It's after general

[47:18] >> after

[47:19] >> Yeah.

[47:19] >> It's after general business.

[47:23] » All right. Well, let's get it out of the

[47:24] way.

[47:26] >> Perhaps while you guys are doing that,

[47:27] can Andrew and I set up here?

[47:29] >> Yes.

[47:29] >> Please feel free to come up and set up.

[47:32] >> Making disclosures, commissioner.

[47:34] >> As always, my uh my wife works for the

[47:36] sheriff's department.

[47:37] >> Okay.

[47:38] Anyone else?

[47:40] >> Don works for

[47:41] that but

[47:43] >> All right. And we had a future

[47:44] consideration mentioned earlier.

[47:47] >> Yes. Uh uh

[47:49] >> You go. You go.

[47:51] >> We'll need a um

[47:52] a commissioner to be appointed to a

[47:55] group uh to discuss the boat ramp at the

[47:58] pedestrian bridge.

[48:00] So, we'll have going to have that on the

[48:02] next time as well.

[48:03] >> Okay, do

[48:05] we want to make recommendations in the

[48:07] future?

[48:08] >> Just putting that on the next agenda.

[48:10] >> Yes.

[48:10] >> Okay, sounds good.

[48:13] All right.

[48:14] Future considerations?

[48:15] >> Yeah.

[48:16] >> Um if possible during the next meeting I

[48:18] would like to talk about the funding

[48:21] surrounding the Kimsey Gardner study

[48:24] if possible.

[48:31] » Okay, what else?

[48:33] Yes, Commissioner.

[48:34] >> I just like to make another request that

[48:36] we get a financial

[48:38] update from our clerk auditor for that

[48:40] department.

[48:42] I asked the last meeting and

[48:45] it would be great to see that.

[48:48] » All right, if that's it, another one

[48:50] Commissioner McCurdy?

[48:52] >> Yeah, I'd like to know future

[48:53] consideration on

[48:55] our our upcoming topic.

[48:57] Uh

[48:58] Spanish Valley Pathway, I would like to

[48:59] know

[49:01] uh interest off of our holdings,

[49:04] the current money that we've had for the

[49:06] Spanish Valley Pathway, our earned

[49:07] interest off of that and if that

[49:10] interest is

[49:12] uh

[49:13] regulated to to the Spanish Valley

[49:14] Pathway specifically or it has been put

[49:17] in general funds generally.

[49:20] Peace.

[49:22] >> So, we have a couple of questions for

[49:24] our clerk auditor and I know this one

[49:26] that Commissioner McCurdy brought up has

[49:28] been brought up several times in the

[49:29] past, so maybe we need to get Gabe to

[49:32] dive in dive into that.

[49:35] Is there Yes, John.

[49:36] >> Uh just a clarification on the on the

[49:37] boat ramp. Um is that is is that as

[49:39] we're looking at? I remember a few years

[49:41] ago we had a a plan to redesign that

[49:43] whole area. Is that that's what it is is

[49:44] considered? Okay, awesome.

[49:46] Oh, thanks. Got to just

[49:48] Can I jump in here real quick?

[49:49] >> Sure, please.

[49:50] >> Got a meeting set up potentially for May

[49:52] 27th. I had a very small meeting this

[49:53] morning with some of the

[49:55] BLM and SAR to just kind of discuss

[49:58] getting that back on track. And so then

[50:00] the 27th will be the first kind of

[50:02] official meeting of

[50:03] >> Okay.

[50:03] >> getting that project back into the

[50:07] wherever we go with it.

[50:08] >> So this would be this would be like

[50:09] having a commissioner on like a

[50:10] subcommittee then

[50:11] discuss similar to the path they are on

[50:13] now.

[50:13] >> That's a beautiful sight plan.

[50:15] >> Yeah.

[50:16] It's pretty.

[50:17] >> All right. So that's it.

[50:19] >> Oh.

[50:19] >> This One one clarification. When the the

[50:22] commission's requesting assistance to

[50:24] look into I think there was a financial

[50:26] update requested regarding a department

[50:27] and then there was another request to

[50:28] the clerk's office. Who did you folks

[50:30] want to communicate that message to? Is

[50:33] it the department the department you're

[50:35] requesting to look at financial

[50:36] financials? That's the clerk auditor's

[50:38] department. Or is it the uh

[50:41] Which department was that?

[50:42] >> Um

[50:43] >> Are they administering

[50:44] >> the administrator I thought it was the

[50:45] clerk auditor.

[50:46] >> Okay.

[50:46] >> for that report.

[50:47] >> Okay.

[50:48] >> But I would ask that the administrator

[50:49] just communicate that to the clerk

[50:51] auditor that we'd like to see a report

[50:53] especially as we're looking for Um I

[50:55] think we had set a Was it a

[50:58] quarter one or quarter two that we were

[50:59] talking about moratorium or the the

[51:02] hiring freeze that we had. So I think

[51:04] that some decisions were supposed to be

[51:05] made and I'd like to get an update to

[51:07] see where we are and how we're tracking.

[51:09] >> I just want to make it clear for who is

[51:11] carrying the torch so it'd be the

[51:13] commissioner administrator's office

[51:14] doing that.

[51:16] >> That was my thought on that.

[51:17] >> I don't I don't have any any items. I'm

[51:18] just wanting

[51:19] >> Okay.

[51:20] >> And really to the way and I I thought

[51:22] that it was kind of a given that that's

[51:24] why the administrator was here to carry

[51:26] out our wishes. But thank you for the

[51:27] clarification.

[51:31] » The genie.

[51:32] >> And we're looking forward to it.

[51:46] » Okay. Okay. Um I just want to say good

[51:50] afternoon. Thank you for having us here

[51:52] from the CJC. One thing I really just

[51:54] want to come before you today and

[51:56] express my gratitude um for the support

[51:59] from the commission. My report's

[52:01] actually going to be a little bit more

[52:03] of a 6-month report than an annual

[52:05] report because I was here just in

[52:07] September

[52:09] um with the completion of our annual

[52:12] report at that time.

[52:13] Our mission of the CJC is primarily to

[52:16] protect children, support families in

[52:18] crisis, collaborate with our partners,

[52:20] promote healing, advocate for justice,

[52:22] and strengthen our community. One way I

[52:25] really believe we can do that is through

[52:27] supporting our community's youth.

[52:31] For our community engagement, one of the

[52:33] biggest milestones we officially opened

[52:35] the brand new center. We were

[52:37] overwhelmed in the best way possible by

[52:40] the number of community members who

[52:42] showed up to support us. The grand

[52:43] opening wasn't about the building. It It

[52:47] really gave us an opportunity to share

[52:48] the mission of the CJC and what we do.

[52:51] We were able to walk community members

[52:54] through step-by-step of the process when

[52:56] a child comes forth with allegations of

[52:59] abuse.

[53:02] Again, I just want to come forth with

[53:04] gratitude. I am fully aware that this

[53:07] was a significant financial investment

[53:10] by our community and I want you to know

[53:13] how greatly or how deeply grateful I am

[53:15] for that support and also how much I'm

[53:18] really trying to be a good steward of

[53:20] these funds.

[53:21] Um, walking through the new center, I

[53:23] just want to kind of piece by piece

[53:26] outside of the initial purchase of the

[53:28] building, um, showcase what efforts have

[53:32] been made to

[53:34] alleviate the burden from the county.

[53:36] So, the entire center was furnished by

[53:40] our nonprofit and private donor funds. I

[53:43] also applied for a grant through

[53:45] Synergy, which funded the entire AV

[53:49] equipment for our new center.

[53:51] Um, I reapproached the state for

[53:54] additional funds to complete the remodel

[53:57] of our ADA bathroom, our medical

[53:59] facility, and um, turning the garage

[54:03] into a meeting space for our MDT.

[54:05] Um, our landscaping was actually

[54:09] funded by our nonprofit as well, and we

[54:11] utilize volunteers in the community to

[54:14] help install some of that.

[54:17] >> And the nonprofit she's referring to is

[54:19] the Friends of the CJC, and we have a

[54:21] lot of community members that are part

[54:23] of that. So, when we say nonprofit,

[54:24] that's the Friends of the CJC.

[54:26] >> Yeah, thank you so much. Um, we also

[54:29] utilize the state funding to remodel the

[54:31] garage in the new county meeting space.

[54:34] I believe it's you, um, Commissioner

[54:36] McGinn last year that mentioned that you

[54:39] really wanted to see the space be able

[54:40] to be utilized then more than just the

[54:42] CJC. And so, now we've opened this

[54:45] meeting space up to be utilized by the

[54:47] entire county departments, as long as

[54:49] there's not a forensic interview going

[54:52] on at that time. We really want to be

[54:54] mindful of protecting the integrity and

[54:56] privacy of our children. Um, another way

[54:58] that we've really tried to leverage and

[55:00] be mindful of state funds is we used to

[55:03] cater all of our lunches and meals, and

[55:05] I've now actually been um, cooking those

[55:08] myself and providing meals to our

[55:10] meeting, um, our members of our meeting

[55:13] to try to help save the county month

[55:15] funds in those ways. So, we've tried to

[55:18] make small operational changes to save

[55:21] on the budget.

[55:22] >> So, one other awesome way that we're

[55:24] utilizing that space, you can see the

[55:26] letters MDT, that's the

[55:27] multidisciplinary team.

[55:30] Um, they meet out there to discuss

[55:31] cases. It's a cross section of law

[55:34] enforcement, victims advocates,

[55:36] prosecution, as well as the school and

[55:39] therapists, and that gives a wonderful

[55:41] space to be able to meet. Previously, we

[55:43] were meeting at the city hall. That was

[55:46] wonderful to meet there, but this gives

[55:48] another extra level of security,

[55:50] protection, and it is being utilized,

[55:53] and it's it's really, really helpful and valuable.

[55:58] » So, um one big piece of the last 6

[56:01] months has been around legislative

[56:04] advocacy because as you guys are well

[56:07] aware that the CJC by design was is

[56:11] meant to be funded by multiple funding

[56:13] streams, and one of the biggest funding

[56:15] streams is the state. Um they provide a

[56:18] substantial amount of money to make sure

[56:20] that we have the center for our

[56:21] community. And what happened was in the

[56:25] 11th hour, we found out we were left off

[56:27] the governor's budget, which created a

[56:29] real problem for us to look forward for

[56:31] funding. And so, um

[56:34] Representative Ivory was so gracious to

[56:37] run an RFA for us. We approached the

[56:40] legislature to ask for one-time funds to

[56:43] be a stopgap measure in the amount of

[56:45] $470,000

[56:47] to help with this next year being left

[56:49] off the governor's budget. But because

[56:52] of incredible state leadership, and

[56:54] honestly because of our own commission

[56:57] who helped advocate for us at the state

[56:59] level, we were in 40th on that list, and

[57:02] we actually were funded number second.

[57:05] And not only just for the one-time ask

[57:07] for the $470,000,

[57:10] but for ongoing funding. So, this is an

[57:12] incredible win, obviously, for the CJC,

[57:15] but for the county moving forward

[57:16] because

[57:18] the state has now decided to take that

[57:20] ongoing funds and split it between the

[57:23] 26 centers. So, now moving forward,

[57:25] we'll be able to receive more front

[57:27] money from the state, and so the county

[57:28] will actually have to pitch in less

[57:30] moving forward. So, that will be an

[57:32] additional cost saving to um our

[57:34] taxpayers. And then

[57:36] >> And and one other important part and I

[57:40] Andrew might mention her later is Tracy

[57:42] Cabott's been

[57:43] critical and helpful.

[57:45] We really appreciate her and the

[57:47] Attorney General's office for being able

[57:48] to provide the funding. She's been a

[57:50] wonderful partner, advocate, friend,

[57:53] mentor for the CJC statewide. She's

[57:56] making special trips down to this area

[57:59] as well.

[57:59] >> I just wanted to add that.

[58:00] >> Yes. So, and Steven's exactly right.

[58:03] Like we are so grateful for the state

[58:04] leadership and Tracy Cabott and

[58:06] everything she does to advocate for our

[58:08] community's youth.

[58:10] Not only did we really work hard on that

[58:12] funding to help support the centers and

[58:14] the cost to our county, but we also

[58:17] fought for really critical legislation

[58:20] changes. One of those and I'm just only

[58:22] going to touch on a few of them that

[58:23] impact our county and our kids directly,

[58:25] but

[58:27] we met with Senator Brammer. SJR one is

[58:30] going to be really huge for our kids

[58:31] because it allows prior acts of abuse,

[58:35] specifically in like child molestation

[58:37] and sexual assault cases, to come in to

[58:40] be a factor so that it can show a

[58:42] propensity for abuse. And so, when

[58:45] people are looking at these cases,

[58:47] they're not just looking at an isolated

[58:48] incident in front of them. And so,

[58:50] that's going to add additional

[58:51] safeguards to our kiddos. HB 89 was

[58:54] another victory. It protects our victims

[58:57] by limiting the use of polygraphs. So,

[59:00] now polygraphs can't be asked or victims

[59:03] can't be asked to submit to a polygraph

[59:05] test, which is really important. HB 90

[59:08] was

[59:10] another victory for us. It clarifies

[59:12] what qualifies as a sexual offense

[59:13] across Utah. So, it helps ensure

[59:16] consistency.

[59:17] SB 92 was also known as the Desiree

[59:21] Turner bill. If you guys are familiar

[59:22] with that, Desiree Turner was um

[59:26] uh sh- was an incident involving two

[59:29] juveniles that actually shot Desiree and

[59:32] left her for dead. And so, previously,

[59:35] there wasn't any um pieces of

[59:38] legislation that allowed to prosecute

[59:41] those kinds of heinous acts if the

[59:44] victim survived. So, this created a

[59:46] stopgap in that regard because now,

[59:50] regardless of whether the child

[59:51] survives, it allows for prosecution, and

[59:54] then it also allows for prosecution if

[59:57] the victim dies at a later time as a

[59:59] result of those injuries. And then, HB

[1:00:02] 102 was rep- was ran by Representative

[1:00:06] Sahara Hayes, and this is actually a

[1:00:08] victory, I would say, in a rural

[1:00:09] community because it allows victims of

[1:00:12] crime to utilize their initials instead

[1:00:14] of their name on court documents. And as

[1:00:16] you guys know, in small communities,

[1:00:18] nobody asked to be a victim, so they

[1:00:20] don't want to be exploited in front of

[1:00:22] their community and maybe have to see

[1:00:24] them at city market or things like that.

[1:00:26] So, we felt like that was a wonderful

[1:00:27] victory. Um I had the wonderful

[1:00:29] opportunity to meet with Senator Ipson

[1:00:32] and thank him for the child torture law.

[1:00:34] I know when um

[1:00:37] our when we went before legislation

[1:00:40] before to enact the child torture law or

[1:00:42] try to get it passed, um some of the

[1:00:46] medical experts in that area said that

[1:00:48] there was concern that there may be

[1:00:50] about 12 cases over the course of the

[1:00:51] last 4 years. And now that the

[1:00:55] legislation's passed, we are actually up

[1:00:57] to nine

[1:00:58] um filed cases of child torture in this

[1:01:01] very first year. So, it's very critical

[1:01:03] that we have this uh

[1:01:05] piece of legislation. Um I met with um

[1:01:09] multiple different senators who were so

[1:01:10] gracious to be able to speak with us and

[1:01:13] just thank them for the support. Senator

[1:01:15] Owens, he gave the Grand County the DPS

[1:01:17] grant to cover our MDT money and

[1:01:20] financial um support to make sure that

[1:01:23] our first responders have critical

[1:01:26] mental health support. And then,

[1:01:28] honestly, we were only supposed to meet

[1:01:29] for a few minutes with Derek Brown, but

[1:01:31] he stopped and actually had lunch and

[1:01:33] offered his support with the child

[1:01:36] torture case that just recently came

[1:01:37] through our county. And so, he was so

[1:01:40] gracious and kind and willing to listen

[1:01:42] to what's happening within rural Utah.

[1:01:44] So, I was really grateful for that.

[1:01:46] I won't speak too much to this because

[1:01:50] this is an open and active case. But, as

[1:01:52] you know, we were in the news for a

[1:01:54] child torture case. The one thing I do

[1:01:57] want to express my gratitude to is, and

[1:02:00] I know Andrew's actually here,

[1:02:03] but these cases can be really

[1:02:05] exploitative to our victims. And our

[1:02:07] local news media actually really

[1:02:10] leveraged this opportunity to educate

[1:02:12] our community on how we can report

[1:02:14] concerns when we have any any red flags

[1:02:18] with our children. So, rather than being

[1:02:21] exploitative, they were really

[1:02:22] supportive and helped us educate our

[1:02:24] community. So, I just want to express

[1:02:25] gratitude for that.

[1:02:28] Um

[1:02:29] The one thing I will say is the child

[1:02:31] torture case was incredibly difficult

[1:02:33] for my team. We were able to leverage

[1:02:36] the DPS grant and bring in first

[1:02:38] responders first to conduct a critical

[1:02:40] incident debriefing and also provide

[1:02:43] 24/7 access

[1:02:47] for our team members and their families

[1:02:49] in case they were struggling being on

[1:02:51] the front lines with that case. So,

[1:02:55] First Responders First was a critical

[1:02:57] resource for us and so we're grateful to

[1:02:59] them.

[1:03:00] At a glance, just over the course of the

[1:03:02] last 6 months, like I said, this is just

[1:03:04] our 6-month review instead of our annual

[1:03:05] review,

[1:03:07] the total number of new and active cases

[1:03:09] has been 71.

[1:03:11] The total number of people who received

[1:03:12] services is 136.

[1:03:15] And

[1:03:16] um total of open and active is 208. One

[1:03:19] thing that's actually been a little bit

[1:03:21] different in our case trends is right

[1:03:23] now we're seeing um an increase of child

[1:03:25] physical abuse over child sexual abuse,

[1:03:28] and historically we've seen child sexual

[1:03:30] abuse. Um so that's actually been an

[1:03:32] interesting trend that we're really

[1:03:34] trying to keep an eye and understand why

[1:03:35] that's happening for us. Um

[1:03:40] I rather than

[1:03:42] really me saying what kind of job the

[1:03:45] CJC's doing, I wanted to use the words

[1:03:49] of the clients who have come through our

[1:03:51] center so that you guys can see the kind

[1:03:53] of experience they're having. We use a

[1:03:56] survey called an OMS survey, and it is

[1:04:00] completely confidential, but it gives us

[1:04:02] feedback to help us improve our work at

[1:04:04] the CJC. And as you can see, these are

[1:04:06] some of the comments I've just created a

[1:04:08] word cloud of the experience that the

[1:04:10] clients are having at the center.

[1:04:13] Um and some of the things that really

[1:04:14] stand and stand out to me is that they

[1:04:16] feel safe, they made me feel important,

[1:04:19] and they felt heard and supported. And

[1:04:21] if children can walk into a place like

[1:04:23] the CJC during the hardest moments of

[1:04:25] their life, and they feel safe, then I

[1:04:28] feel really incredibly proud of the work

[1:04:30] that's happening at the CJC.

[1:04:34] Sorry.

[1:04:37] Some of the system improvements that

[1:04:38] we've done over the past 6 months is

[1:04:40] we're really trying to enhance statewide

[1:04:42] collaboration. Um

[1:04:45] We were the first in the state to offer

[1:04:46] a tele-forensic interview. It's

[1:04:48] incredibly expensive to bring in the

[1:04:51] Spanish-speaking translator because they

[1:04:53] have to be court certified, and so each

[1:04:56] time we have a case that involves our

[1:04:58] kiddos that speak Spanish and need a

[1:04:59] translator, it costs us approximately

[1:05:01] $1,500 to do a forensic interview. While

[1:05:05] I do not feel like it's fair that our

[1:05:07] rural children do not have access to

[1:05:10] critical services, I don't think cost

[1:05:12] should be a barrier. So, we reached out

[1:05:14] to the Salt Lake Children's Justice

[1:05:16] Center to try to leverage their forensic

[1:05:18] interviewer, and we created a system

[1:05:20] where we could do forensic

[1:05:22] tele-forensic, sorry, tele-forensic

[1:05:24] interviews utilizing their forensic

[1:05:26] interviewer in Salt Lake at no cost to

[1:05:29] us, and we're able to conduct an

[1:05:31] interview here to also try to save on

[1:05:34] that $1,500 per case.

[1:05:36] Did you have something?

[1:05:37] >> I'm just curious.

[1:05:37] >> Yeah.

[1:05:38] >> Does

[1:05:40] when it's a tele- conference,

[1:05:43] does it increase or decrease or does it

[1:05:46] stay the same, the anxiety that the

[1:05:48] child is

[1:05:49] Cuz I I you know, I find

[1:05:50] teleconferencing

[1:05:52] >> You know, um so, there has been research

[1:05:55] and studies around that, and they've

[1:05:57] showed no change. Depending on the

[1:05:59] child, a lot of times they feel more

[1:06:00] comfortable because they're not directly

[1:06:02] in the room making a disclosure to

[1:06:04] another human, but there are people

[1:06:07] still around. So, we did have human

[1:06:08] observers in the secondary room, and

[1:06:11] then they were talking to a

[1:06:12] tele-forensic interviewer on the screen.

[1:06:14] And because it is an actual person

[1:06:17] having the conversation with them,

[1:06:19] studies have shown that our kiddos are

[1:06:20] used to operating on a screen, and they

[1:06:22] are comfortable

[1:06:25] >> Yeah, that makes sense.

[1:06:26] >> Um for our specific cases, we don't have

[1:06:29] enough data to see if we're getting the

[1:06:31] same amount of disclosures yet as this

[1:06:33] is pretty new, um but it is a means that

[1:06:35] we're really trying so that we can kind

[1:06:37] of save on the cost, but also still

[1:06:40] bring critical resources to rural Utah.

[1:06:43] And then, another thing that we did is

[1:06:45] we tried to standardize which types of

[1:06:47] cases warrant a forensic interview just

[1:06:50] to make sure that we have um equal

[1:06:52] access, and that we're staying

[1:06:54] consistent with our care. And then, our

[1:06:56] MDT created a unified mission statement.

[1:06:59] Um

[1:07:01] let's see.

[1:07:03] We provided strangulation training for law enforcement to better respond to

[1:07:06] child abuse cases involving this really

[1:07:09] high risk factor that we are seeing.

[1:07:12] And we provided uh we also increased the

[1:07:15] community awareness. This was our most

[1:07:17] recent event which was chalk the walk.

[1:07:21] I don't know if you guys can see right

[1:07:22] here on this.

[1:07:24] >> They can see it.

[1:07:24] >> You can see it. So,

[1:07:26] I'll just show you a video. Um chalk the

[1:07:28] walk gave us an opportunity to just

[1:07:32] um share supportive messaging to our

[1:07:34] youth to let them know that they matter

[1:07:36] and they're not alone. We also opened

[1:07:38] the new CJC for walk-throughs and any

[1:07:40] questions so that people can could come

[1:07:43] in and see the new facility and and

[1:07:47] better understand what our mission is

[1:07:49] and what we're trying to do at the

[1:07:50] center.

[1:07:53] Um

[1:07:54] I continue to serve as the chair of the

[1:07:56] 7th District Victims' Right Commit

[1:07:58] Rights Committee and I'm still the vice

[1:08:00] chair of the Utah State CJC Standing

[1:08:03] Board. I'll continue to serve in this

[1:08:05] capacity for the next year and a half

[1:08:07] and then my role there will

[1:08:09] automatically

[1:08:10] um

[1:08:11] roll into the chair of the state

[1:08:14] standing board and so I really do

[1:08:16] appreciate this opportunity because I do

[1:08:18] feel like it's so important to have a

[1:08:19] rural voice at the state level when

[1:08:22] they're making such important decisions

[1:08:23] that do affect us here down in Moab.

[1:08:27] >> And just a little bit of information on

[1:08:29] that Rights Committee that Andrea is the

[1:08:31] chair on. It's a committee that receives

[1:08:34] any complaints that victims have

[1:08:35] regarding

[1:08:36] Grand, San Juan, Emery, Carbon County.

[1:08:39] It has representation from across the

[1:08:42] different

[1:08:43] disciplines. I sit as the prosecutor on

[1:08:46] it. The sheriff from Emery County or

[1:08:47] Carbon County?

[1:08:48] >> Emery.

[1:08:49] County sits on it with thematic

[1:08:51] San Juan. So, it's a cross-section. We

[1:08:52] receive the complaints and process those

[1:08:54] complaints and that's been something

[1:08:56] that's been spearheaded by the state and

[1:08:59] Ms. Fox has really been helpful with

[1:09:02] setting that up and getting that.

[1:09:03] >> Yeah, it's a part of the Victim Services

[1:09:05] Committee and one thing that's really

[1:09:07] nice about that is we get real victims'

[1:09:09] voices and impact statements

[1:09:11] understanding how their experience has

[1:09:13] been while interfacing with the justice

[1:09:16] system and it gives us an opportunity to

[1:09:18] improve because we already know that

[1:09:21] they're in crisis and we don't want to

[1:09:23] add to their trauma through the system.

[1:09:25] Um, the nonprofit that I talked about

[1:09:27] earlier is the Friends of the CJC. It's

[1:09:30] our nonprofit leg. It's fully up and

[1:09:33] running and it's it's helping supply

[1:09:36] critical financial resources to our

[1:09:39] kiddos. It pays for therapy, it pays for

[1:09:40] clothes, at times it's paid for food and

[1:09:43] things that we need to help support this

[1:09:46] mission and offset the cost. And so I

[1:09:49] just want to show this quick video

[1:09:51] mostly because our friends board is

[1:09:54] active and our community has showed up

[1:09:57] in such incredible ways to support this

[1:09:59] work. Like I said, it's funded such

[1:10:01] critical services to help our kiddos

[1:10:04] through some of the hardest times in

[1:10:06] their life and so we're really grateful

[1:10:08] just for

[1:10:10] getting all the donations that the

[1:10:12] Friends of the CJC has received.

[1:10:19] And then

[1:10:21] uh the Friends of the CJC will be

[1:10:23] hosting our second annual kickball

[1:10:25] tournament. We're going to um

[1:10:27] we've set the date for September 11th so

[1:10:30] that we can honor the first responders

[1:10:33] that contribute to this critical work

[1:10:35] and it's actually going to be a two-day

[1:10:37] event because we had such a good showing

[1:10:38] last year. I'm really excited about it.

[1:10:40] So we're going to do a Battle of the

[1:10:41] Badges. We're also going to honor our

[1:10:43] first responders and make it into an

[1:10:45] entire community event. So I would love

[1:10:47] to see you guys out there and maybe

[1:10:49] kicking a ball around with you and play.

[1:10:52] Um another thing that I'm really excited

[1:10:54] about this year is

[1:10:56] on October 2nd we're going to be

[1:10:58] bringing in Gaylen Elmore. He's a former

[1:11:01] NFL player and he's going to speak to

[1:11:04] our community, specifically our high

[1:11:06] school kids, about belonging. And we

[1:11:09] wanted to make this event really fun and

[1:11:10] engaging for our youth. So, we decided

[1:11:13] to create a Stars for Students event

[1:11:15] where we're going to play flag football.

[1:11:16] I'm still in the process of reaching out

[1:11:18] to stars, but we've had some commitments

[1:11:20] already from the sheriff and the chief

[1:11:22] of police and

[1:11:24] our prosecuting attorney who's willing

[1:11:26] to play flag football against our high

[1:11:28] school students. And it's going to be just a really fun

[1:11:31] event. We're going to be doing giveaways

[1:11:33] and engaging the community because

[1:11:36] his messaging is so important and

[1:11:38] powerful. It talks to our kids about the

[1:11:41] importance of belonging and just taking

[1:11:43] that extra second to maybe get off your

[1:11:44] phone and show up for other people cuz

[1:11:46] you really don't know what they're going

[1:11:48] through behind the scenes. And he was

[1:11:51] actually abused as a child himself. He

[1:11:54] went through the foster care system and

[1:11:56] be He doesn't talk about his success

[1:11:58] amongst himself, but it was about who

[1:12:00] showed up for him that actually helped

[1:12:02] him become the success he was today. And

[1:12:05] so, I just feel like his messaging's so

[1:12:07] important because it showcases what we

[1:12:09] can do as community members to help

[1:12:11] uplift our kiddos. And so, that will be

[1:12:13] October 2nd at the high school at 6:00.

[1:12:17] We'll do the flag football game first

[1:12:18] and then we'll be having Gaylen speak

[1:12:20] afterwards.

[1:12:22] And like oops. And the only thing

[1:12:26] without the video I won't or the sound I

[1:12:28] won't really play my video. But, the

[1:12:30] only thing I do want to say is just

[1:12:32] thank you again for believing in this

[1:12:33] work and and in me and your support at

[1:12:35] the state level to help ensure critical

[1:12:38] funds are met. I mean,

[1:12:40] I knew that this work was critical, but

[1:12:44] when we had our kiddo come through the

[1:12:46] center that experienced such atrocious

[1:12:49] child torture, I knew that we'd saved a

[1:12:51] life and we continue to do this. The The

[1:12:54] CJC saves children and it's because of

[1:12:57] you guys that we're able to do that. And

[1:12:58] so I'm just thankful to our community.

[1:13:02] » All right. Any any questions, comments

[1:13:05] for Andrea?

[1:13:07] I want to just say thank you, Andrea. I

[1:13:09] think you're doing an awesome job there.

[1:13:11] It's um a privilege to be part of that

[1:13:13] board.

[1:13:15] I uh I can't say enough good for Andrea.

[1:13:18] I uh

[1:13:19] I will also say that Tracy Taver is an

[1:13:21] incredible human being and what she does

[1:13:25] with with what she's in the middle of in

[1:13:27] her own life and continues to watch out

[1:13:29] for kids all over this

[1:13:31] an incredible person. So very thankful

[1:13:33] for her support we get down here from

[1:13:36] somebody at the state level.

[1:13:38] >> We're so grateful for Tracy. She's an

[1:13:39] incredible Thank you, guys.

[1:13:41] >> Physical.

[1:13:43] All right. We will move on to a few full

[1:13:47] uh consent agenda items.

[1:13:51] We'll start with approval of the meeting

[1:13:53] minutes of April 21st, 2026.

[1:13:57] Ratification of payment of bills, the

[1:13:59] total bills being $1,920,132.99.

[1:14:07] Total payroll

[1:14:09] $458,000

[1:14:12] $57.30

[1:14:14] with total bills and payroll at

[1:14:17] $2,378,190.29.

[1:14:24] Moving on, the independent contract

[1:14:26] agreement with Shires Bounce Rentals for

[1:14:29] the 2026 Grand County Fair.

[1:14:32] B, the independent contract agreements

[1:14:35] for the 2026 Grand County Fair for the

[1:14:37] Boom Town Crawlers.

[1:14:41] E, letter of support for Trust Lands

[1:14:43] Administration DWR land transfer

[1:14:47] and sale and F ratification of 2025

[1:14:51] contour agreement in her flights and G

[1:14:54] conflict public defender contract award.

[1:14:59] >> Commissioner Hadler.

[1:15:00] >> Uh motion to approve consent is

[1:15:02] presented.

[1:15:03] >> And motion by Commissioner Hadler,

[1:15:05] second by Commissioner McCurdy. All in

[1:15:07] favor?

[1:15:07] >> [clears throat]

[1:15:09] >> Passes unanimously. Thank you. We move

[1:15:12] on again to number five position

[1:15:15] backfill request test borders.

[1:15:18] >> Has to be a mail.

[1:15:19] >> No. What's that?

[1:15:20] >> Did we get mail on that?

[1:15:22] >> I raised my hand.

[1:15:23] >> I couldn't get the audio.

[1:15:23] >> I [laughter] couldn't see I just wanted

[1:15:25] to know

[1:15:25] >> Yeah, I didn't hear you or see you. My

[1:15:27] apologies. Thank you for

[1:15:29] reminding me. Yes, yes.

[1:15:32] >> Thank you all.

[1:15:33] We have two position backfill requests

[1:15:35] coming before you all today. The first

[1:15:38] is for our OHV trail coordinator

[1:15:41] position, which is housed under the

[1:15:43] Grand County Active Transportation and

[1:15:45] Trails Department. This position is soon

[1:15:48] to become vacant. The request for this

[1:15:51] position is because this is our only OHV

[1:15:54] trail

[1:15:55] focused position. So without an employee

[1:15:58] in this position, none of none of our

[1:16:00] OHV efforts will have an employee

[1:16:02] specifically dedicated to them. This

[1:16:04] position is also primarily grant funded.

[1:16:06] The salary of this position is grant

[1:16:08] funded. The benefits are covered by the

[1:16:09] county.

[1:16:11] Um

[1:16:12] and I'm happy to to pause at that unless

[1:16:13] you all would like to

[1:16:14] >> Same agreement as before?

[1:16:16] >> Yes.

[1:16:16] >> Yeah, I just made sure.

[1:16:17] >> Yes, thank you.

[1:16:19] Verify.

[1:16:20] Um [clears throat] are there any

[1:16:21] questions on the OHV trail coordinator

[1:16:23] position request?

[1:16:30] And and I apologize these were put under

[1:16:32] the same um agenda item and so I'm more

[1:16:34] than happy to go over the next unless

[1:16:36] you all would prefer to to split them

[1:16:38] up. But I think we're good. I'll keep

[1:16:39] rolling.

[1:16:40] >> Yeah.

[1:16:41] >> Um so this next request is for one of

[1:16:43] our patrol deputy positions in the Green

[1:16:45] County Sheriff's Office. A position of

[1:16:48] patrol deputy position recently became

[1:16:50] vacant and the Sheriff is requesting to

[1:16:52] backfill that position. Um,

[1:16:54] it is

[1:16:55] as we all know becoming very busy and so

[1:16:57] their need for patrolers out there is

[1:17:01] as as

[1:17:02] uh necessary as it is any time of year

[1:17:05] really this time of year. So that

[1:17:06] request is also for immediate backfill.

[1:17:10] >> Yeah.

[1:17:11] Um, question and a motion. Um, is the is

[1:17:13] the Sheriff's position is that open

[1:17:15] currently or did someone just give their

[1:17:17] notice so it's we're looking to fill it?

[1:17:19] >> It's open currently. It's open

[1:17:21] currently. Yes.

[1:17:22] >> Thanks. And then I

[1:17:23] move to approve the backfill of the OHV

[1:17:26] trail coordinator and patrol deputy

[1:17:27] positions effective immediately.

[1:17:30] >> Okay, motion by Commissioner Hapler,

[1:17:31] second Commissioner McGann. Um, the only

[1:17:35] I'll start off with a question.

[1:17:37] Um, will those positions how long do

[1:17:39] they get advertised?

[1:17:41] >> So the positions have to be posted for

[1:17:43] at least 10 business days before we can

[1:17:45] begin the recruitment process and so

[1:17:48] approximately 2 weeks um by the time we

[1:17:51] have the 10 business days and um again

[1:17:54] during that time we receive applicants

[1:17:57] and

[1:17:58] we'll start the the you know screening

[1:18:01] and interviewing process as soon as as

[1:18:03] soon as we're able to.

[1:18:06] >> Thank you. Anyone else questions?

[1:18:08] All right, I'll call for vote. All in

[1:18:10] favor?

[1:18:12] No?

[1:18:12] >> I.

[1:18:13] >> Are you out of it? Thank you. Passes

[1:18:14] unanimously.

[1:18:17] No?

[1:18:18] >> I abstain.

[1:18:19] Department.

[1:18:20] Oh, my bad. I didn't see you. I abstain.

[1:18:24] All right. So that passes six with one

[1:18:26] abstaining Commissioner

[1:18:27] >> Sheriff's Department.

[1:18:28] >> Thank you all.

[1:18:29] >> For the record. All right.

[1:18:33] Number six, consider

[1:18:36] >> What's that, man?

[1:18:37] >> I'm just making sure he knew that he can

[1:18:39] if it doesn't involve money. Keep my

[1:18:41] foot out of it.

[1:18:42] All right. Consideration of approval to

[1:18:45] enter negotiations phase for the Spanish

[1:18:48] Valley multi-use pathway.

[1:18:51] Maddie and Shawn Yates and looks like

[1:18:56] on Yates.

[1:18:58] Good luck, Shawn.

[1:18:59] >> [laughter]

[1:19:00] >> It's a pretty easy one, Shawn.

[1:19:06] Is she on Zoom possibly?

[1:19:08] >> She's not on Zoom, but I'm happy to help

[1:19:09] as well.

[1:19:10] >> Okay.

[1:19:15] » So, as as you know in the closed session

[1:19:17] the motion is made to

[1:19:21] proceed

[1:19:22] >> No motion was made.

[1:19:24] And we don't discuss what happens in

[1:19:26] closed session.

[1:19:28] » I don't mean to cut in.

[1:19:31] But, if I may

[1:19:32] >> Sure.

[1:19:35] >> I'd like to make the motion to approve

[1:19:37] consideration

[1:19:38] or approve to enter negotiation phase of

[1:19:41] Spanish Valley multi-use pathway.

[1:19:44] >> Motion by Commissioner McCurdy, second

[1:19:46] by Commissioner Hattler.

[1:19:48] Further discussion, questions?

[1:19:51] Yes, Commissioner Martinez.

[1:19:53] >> Yeah, I'm just happy to see this project

[1:19:55] moving along. I know that there's a lot

[1:19:56] of folks that have been interested in

[1:19:58] seeing this

[1:19:59] get done. So, I just want to thank

[1:20:00] everybody who's been working diligently

[1:20:02] on this.

[1:20:03] And I want to say let's just keep it

[1:20:04] moving along.

[1:20:06] >> Appreciate your motivation and help on

[1:20:08] this too.

[1:20:09] It will help us a lot.

[1:20:12] >> A lot of the community is very eager to

[1:20:14] see this path done. So,

[1:20:17] All right. Any Anyone else? Comments?

[1:20:21] All right. I will call for a vote.

[1:20:23] All in favor?

[1:20:25] >> Aye.

[1:20:26] >> Passes unanimously.

[1:20:29] And we will move on.

[1:20:33] >> object

[1:20:37] » Bid award for the Jackson Street storm

[1:20:40] drain project. Maddie, and we just It

[1:20:42] was short.

[1:20:43] >> I ran into Sean in the parking lot and

[1:20:45] started talking about parking spaces.

[1:20:47] That's the whole thing.

[1:20:48] >> It was so short, you missed literally

[1:20:50] very little. So, it's all good.

[1:20:52] It passed unanimously.

[1:20:54] >> Great. You're free, Maddie.

[1:20:57] >> Yeah.

[1:20:57] >> All right. So, back to the Jackson

[1:20:59] Street

[1:21:00] storm drain project.

[1:21:04] >> So, I I'll open up the meeting. Do you

[1:21:05] want me to?

[1:21:06] >> Yeah.

[1:21:07] >> Um

[1:21:09] We put this out to bid. It went in the

[1:21:11] spring of '24, and we only got one bid,

[1:21:14] and it was very, very high. We reworked

[1:21:15] some of the plans. We put it back out to

[1:21:17] bid. We've got those bids back. They're

[1:21:19] much more acceptable. I think you're

[1:21:20] seeing the low bid in the packet.

[1:21:23] You got any questions? I'm happy to

[1:21:24] answer them.

[1:21:26] >> Anyone?

[1:21:29] All right.

[1:21:30] >> Commissioner Hadler, I'll move to award

[1:21:31] the contract for the Jackson Street

[1:21:32] storm drainage project to Silver Spur.

[1:21:36] >> All right. Motion by Commissioner

[1:21:37] Hadler, second by Commissioner McGann.

[1:21:39] Further discussion?

[1:21:43] All right. I will call for a vote. All

[1:21:45] in favor?

[1:21:46] >> I.

[1:21:48] >> That passes six with one absent,

[1:21:51] Commissioner McCurdy.

[1:21:53] And we will move on.

[1:22:05] And the ordinance

[1:22:09] Rocky Mountain Power was U dot franchise

[1:22:12] agreement 2027.

[1:22:15] >> Yes, sir.

[1:22:16] >> Mr. Tyner.

[1:22:16] >> Yes, sir.

[1:22:18] Um

[1:22:19] It should be Rocky Mountain Power as

[1:22:20] opposed to U dot.

[1:22:22] Um this ordinance grants a non-exclusive

[1:22:24] franchise and general utility easement

[1:22:27] to Rocky Mountain Power for a period of

[1:22:29] 25 years to access county rights of way

[1:22:33] to construct, operate, and maintain

[1:22:35] their electrical system. The previous

[1:22:37] agreement was for a term of 50 years.

[1:22:41] So, we just asked them to

[1:22:43] give us the county a little more

[1:22:44] flexibility and and extend that

[1:22:47] agreement for 25 years as opposed to 50.

[1:22:51] >> Okay. Yes, Commissioner Abbott.

[1:22:52] >> Uh when was that 50-year term due to run

[1:22:54] out then?

[1:22:54] >> It runs out in '27.

[1:22:59] Uh it was from '77 to '27.

[1:23:02] >> Oh, well. Okay.

[1:23:03] >> Yes. So, yeah, so it's timely and we're

[1:23:05] just looking at having the advice.

[1:23:07] >> Yes, that's correct.

[1:23:10] >> A lot can happen in 25 years.

[1:23:12] >> Oh, yeah.

[1:23:14] >> What's happening in 50 years, typically?

[1:23:17] >> Um does this require a vote?

[1:23:19] >> Yes, sir.

[1:23:19] >> Okay. Yes, Commissioner McGann.

[1:23:21] >> I move to approve the franchise

[1:23:23] agreement with Rocky Mountain Power as

[1:23:25] presented.

[1:23:27] >> Motion by Commissioner McGann, second by

[1:23:29] Commissioner Martinez. Further

[1:23:31] discussion?

[1:23:34] Seeing none, I will call for a vote. All

[1:23:36] in favor?

[1:23:38] >> Aye.

[1:23:39] >> Passes six with one absent, Commissioner

[1:23:42] McCurdy. Thank you. Thank you, and we

[1:23:45] will move on then to resolution

[1:23:47] declaring May 15th

[1:23:51] Adventure Safe Day. 16th, I'm sorry. I

[1:23:53] didn't have it written down here. May

[1:23:54] 16th as Adventure Safe Day. Commissioner

[1:23:58] Martinez. Be safe.

[1:24:01] >> Yeah, this just came across me. Yeah,

[1:24:03] this declaration is an integral part of

[1:24:05] the Always Adventure Safe statewide

[1:24:07] campaign. And yeah, Adventure Safe Day

[1:24:09] is May 16th.

[1:24:13] » All right.

[1:24:14] Yes, Commissioner Abbott.

[1:24:16] >> Uh move to approve the resolution

[1:24:17] declaring May 16th Adventure Safe Day.

[1:24:21] >> All right, motion by Commissioner

[1:24:22] Handler.

[1:24:23] Second by Commissioner McGann.

[1:24:26] Further discussion?

[1:24:28] Yes, sir.

[1:24:29] >> uh just a question for Brian. Is this Is

[1:24:30] this the first year they've done that?

[1:24:33] >> First year that we know of. Yeah, I

[1:24:34] think it's his

[1:24:36] It's a state initiative.

[1:24:37] >> Yeah, it's a state initiative but it's

[1:24:38] still already. Yeah, I think it's coming

[1:24:39] from the governor's office that's coming

[1:24:41] through, so.

[1:24:44] >> All right.

[1:24:45] No further discussion?

[1:24:47] All right, I will call for a vote. All

[1:24:49] in favor?

[1:24:51] Passes

[1:24:52] with one absent, Commissioner McCurdy.

[1:24:55] Hopefully he's being safe.

[1:24:59] All right, we will move on to

[1:25:04] I'm permitting.

[1:25:07] Turn on the

[1:25:07] >> Chief Jameson wants to talk.

[1:25:09] >> Jameson does? All right.

[1:25:11] Move on then to our elected officials'

[1:25:15] reports. We'll let Mr. Wiggins

[1:25:18] start us off here.

[1:25:20] >> All right, thanks, guys.

[1:25:22] Real quick, I was just going to talk

[1:25:24] about a couple things. The first thing

[1:25:26] is I just signed a BLM contract for

[1:25:28] another 5 years paying for our deputy

[1:25:30] hours to patrol on BLM land.

[1:25:33] This time it's a little bit different.

[1:25:34] They're going to pay for dispatch

[1:25:35] services and they're also paying to use

[1:25:37] our computer operating system. And that

[1:25:40] money goes to fund our search and rescue

[1:25:41] commander position. The idea behind that

[1:25:43] is because of uh our search and rescue

[1:25:46] most of our search and rescues happen on

[1:25:48] BLM land. So, we have a good working

[1:25:50] relationship with the BLM.

[1:25:52] So, that's a good thing. Um the next

[1:25:54] thing I'd talk about is South Valley

[1:25:56] SWAT. Their tactical team's going to be

[1:25:58] in town this weekend.

[1:25:59] We're going to be doing a joint training

[1:26:01] with my tactical team as well as San

[1:26:03] Juan County. So, in case you guys see

[1:26:04] officers in camo and long guns,

[1:26:07] no need to worry about that.

[1:26:09] Um

[1:26:11] Starlinks uh emergency manager Kate

[1:26:14] wrote a grant to uh purchase a bunch of

[1:26:16] Starlinks for our patrol vehicles.

[1:26:19] That was 100% covered by the State

[1:26:22] Homeland Security Project. And we've

[1:26:24] started to implement that and roll that

[1:26:26] out, and we've had a lot of good

[1:26:28] feedback on that so far.

[1:26:31] Um and then the last thing I would talk

[1:26:33] about is the C10 car show is coming up.

[1:26:35] The money that's raised from the C10 car

[1:26:37] show

[1:26:38] is donated to our search and rescue

[1:26:40] team. Last year, they donated about

[1:26:42] $15,000 towards our SAR team. Don't

[1:26:44] quote me on that. This year, they sold

[1:26:47] the event out within 72 hours.

[1:26:50] Uh he ran out of space at the Smyrna

[1:26:52] City Park.

[1:26:53] And so it's it's a big event. We're

[1:26:55] doing um

[1:26:56] we'll we'll have a big presence there.

[1:26:58] So, I encourage everybody to show up if

[1:26:59] you're able to to uh help support the

[1:27:02] good cause. The person that puts that

[1:27:04] program on, he was actually rescued by

[1:27:06] our search and rescue team several years

[1:27:07] ago. And so, it's his way of giving

[1:27:09] back.

[1:27:11] >> Okay.

[1:27:12] >> And that's all I've got.

[1:27:14] >> All right. Um yeah, I was there last

[1:27:17] year for that. I thought it was a great

[1:27:19] event.

[1:27:20] Yes, Commissioner Martinez.

[1:27:21] >> Yeah, I just wanted to pass along my

[1:27:22] gratitude, Jameson, on the popsicles for

[1:27:25] seatbelts. As a dad of a a new driver, I

[1:27:29] thought it was a a great little thing

[1:27:31] that you did out there at the high

[1:27:32] school. So, thanks.

[1:27:34] >> Well, thank you. Yeah, it was

[1:27:35] surprisingly everybody had their

[1:27:36] seatbelts on, so it was good.

[1:27:38] >> My condolences, Brian.

[1:27:40] >> Yeah, I was going to say I was sorry.

[1:27:42] >> [laughter]

[1:27:44] » And just another quick note on top of

[1:27:47] what Sheriff Wiggins has mentioned here

[1:27:49] in his work with the BLM,

[1:27:51] also Dave Paules at the BLM, the

[1:27:54] local director, has moved

[1:27:57] as well as moved to another entity

[1:27:59] entirely for his work.

[1:28:01] So, that position is being got an

[1:28:04] intern. It's Jill Stephenson, if I might

[1:28:07] pronounce that correctly. So, Dave

[1:28:09] Paules has moved on. So, we will miss

[1:28:11] him, I'm sure.

[1:28:12] >> Yeah, that would be great.

[1:28:15] >> Thanks, sir. Just a

[1:28:16] few updates from UAC.

[1:28:19] Some Some things that more impact the

[1:28:22] kind of criminal prosecution world.

[1:28:24] They're looking at redoing some of the

[1:28:26] sentencing matrix and there's a new

[1:28:28] sentencing committee that they're

[1:28:29] putting together. They've changed a

[1:28:30] little bit the makeup of who's on that

[1:28:33] statewide committee.

[1:28:34] So, they're making some adjustments

[1:28:36] there.

[1:28:37] UAC is providing additional follow-up

[1:28:39] and encouraging folks to join their

[1:28:41] policy steering committees. It's open to

[1:28:43] any elected for them to be able to

[1:28:45] review those. They meet

[1:28:48] less less often on the off season, but

[1:28:50] they're meeting weekly during the

[1:28:51] session.

[1:28:53] A fun

[1:28:54] point of note, they have recodified or

[1:28:56] changed the codes or will change the

[1:28:57] codes to the TRT codes. I think we're

[1:29:00] probably one of the few counties that is

[1:29:02] really

[1:29:03] on the governor's pulse on that one.

[1:29:05] SB 91, there's a potential for an

[1:29:07] increase of revenue coming into the

[1:29:10] county for the DMV,

[1:29:12] for the assessor's offices that are

[1:29:13] managing the DMVs, there's potential for

[1:29:15] them to receive some additional revenue.

[1:29:18] I've alerted our assessor to that

[1:29:20] information. I don't know exactly how

[1:29:21] much they're going to receive. And then

[1:29:23] lastly, there's conversations

[1:29:26] surrounding the centrally assessed

[1:29:28] valuation, how that process gets done,

[1:29:30] and UAC is leading the charge on helping

[1:29:34] the counties not have to suffer the

[1:29:35] brunt of the appeals and and they're

[1:29:38] looking at having some sort of statewide

[1:29:39] system to be able to balance that.

[1:29:42] So, those are some information for you

[1:29:43] folks. Next week is the CJC symposium.

[1:29:47] The county through the funding that the

[1:29:49] CJC provides sends a number of

[1:29:52] individuals up to Snowbird to get

[1:29:54] training on the child justice

[1:29:56] central reforms and best practices.

[1:29:59] We'll send a few members from law

[1:30:01] enforcement, prosecution, Andrea, among

[1:30:04] some others who go up. And then the week

[1:30:06] following, I'll be heading to Texas for

[1:30:08] ICCR which is the at the Institute on

[1:30:11] the coordinated community response to

[1:30:12] domestic violence. In fact, they're in

[1:30:14] town today providing the training.

[1:30:16] That's that year-long program that

[1:30:18] thanks to the city,

[1:30:20] we were selected as one of four

[1:30:21] communities across the US then to fly us

[1:30:24] out to Texas, give us per diem hotel

[1:30:27] room, and then bring

[1:30:29] a training quarterly here throughout the

[1:30:30] last year. And so this is the final

[1:30:32] hurrah of that program. So, that's all

[1:30:34] the updates that I have.

[1:30:37] >> All right. Do we have anything from our

[1:30:39] administrator?

[1:30:40] >> I don't have anything.

[1:30:42] >> Do we have any commissioners that would

[1:30:44] like to

[1:30:45] weigh in and give an update?

[1:30:48] >> I don't I don't want to give an update.

[1:30:49] Can I ask Can I ask Brian Can I ask you

[1:30:52] a question? Is that possible? Cuz I read

[1:30:55] your report and thank you. Well, no.

[1:30:57] >> I do I have a question about

[1:30:59] >> Yeah.

[1:31:00] >> The update on the Colorado.

[1:31:02] >> Oh, that'll be good, too. But yeah, your

[1:31:04] commissioner report. But if you want to

[1:31:05] give it, then maybe you'll

[1:31:07] >> No, no, no. No, not my commissioner

[1:31:08] report. Yeah, go ahead. If you have a

[1:31:09] question about it.

[1:31:10] >> Um I just noticed that you guys had a

[1:31:12] the artist shadow working group. Do you

[1:31:14] want to give me kind of any little

[1:31:16] tidbits on that?

[1:31:17] >> Sure. Yeah, yeah. There's progress.

[1:31:19] Yeah, I think that right now I think

[1:31:20] that things to know is that we have kind

[1:31:22] of unanimous work around the major

[1:31:24] groups.

[1:31:25] Um we are working through a couple of

[1:31:27] things.

[1:31:28] And I think that I was planning on the

[1:31:31] next commission meeting bringing forward

[1:31:33] kind of where we've landed on that.

[1:31:35] >> Okay.

[1:31:35] >> So, right now we're working on the

[1:31:38] um

[1:31:39] on

[1:31:40] a CMA cooperative management agreement

[1:31:42] to see if that would be a possibility,

[1:31:44] and then trying to put the funding

[1:31:46] package together to see how that would

[1:31:47] look as well.

[1:31:48] >> Okay, so so maybe the next meeting.

[1:31:50] >> The next meeting. Yeah, yeah. So, we

[1:31:51] have a we have a

[1:31:53] another meeting scheduled next Monday.

[1:31:55] So, at that meeting right there I think

[1:31:57] that we should have some pretty good

[1:31:58] answers to bring forward to the

[1:31:59] commission.

[1:31:59] >> Great. And I appreciate your reports.

[1:32:01] They're They're They're detailed and it

[1:32:03] helps me see what's going on. Thank

[1:32:05] >> If you have any questions, just let me

[1:32:06] know.

[1:32:06] >> That's awesome. Thank you.

[1:32:09] >> For anyone else?

[1:32:11] Commission reports, Mr. Adler.

[1:32:13] >> I'd like to highlight something and that

[1:32:16] was the I wanted to thank the governor

[1:32:18] for coming down for the groundbreaking

[1:32:20] on the

[1:32:21] work that they're doing out in the river

[1:32:23] pathway to close the gap. That was That

[1:32:25] was an awesome event. A bunch of you

[1:32:26] were there and also wanted to express

[1:32:29] appreciation to the office of the

[1:32:31] governor for asking our local bike team

[1:32:34] to set.

[1:32:35] And they are There was a It was an honor

[1:32:37] for for the kids to get to do that.

[1:32:41] » Well, anyone else? Commissioner McGann.

[1:32:44] >> Oh, just

[1:32:46] let you know that uh

[1:32:48] county stole a great

[1:32:50] employee

[1:32:52] >> [laughter]

[1:32:53] >> from the solid waste special service,

[1:32:55] Mr. Lilly. So, we're going to be really

[1:32:58] I mean, I'm happy for the county and I'm

[1:33:00] sad for the

[1:33:01] solid waste and this we did have a

[1:33:04] workshop last Thursday that was

[1:33:06] incredibly

[1:33:09] It It was great. You know, it's moving

[1:33:11] forward in a very positive way.

[1:33:13] So,

[1:33:14] definitely go into the details, but it

[1:33:16] was

[1:33:18] We will miss Lilly.

[1:33:21] » Anyone else?

[1:33:22] >> I've been going to the update that I

[1:33:24] have with the Colorado River right now.

[1:33:25] >> Um I'll give a brief one.

[1:33:27] >> Okay.

[1:33:28] >> And then we can move on.

[1:33:30] USAC was very eventful as Steven

[1:33:32] Stockton said.

[1:33:33] There was a legislative panel and

[1:33:35] actually I am seat for the commission

[1:33:38] this year as the chair of USAC.

[1:33:42] But there was a legislative panel there

[1:33:43] and we discussed the centrally assessed

[1:33:45] areas well and I just wanted to put out

[1:33:47] a a quote that Carl Albrecht gave us.

[1:33:50] And he said, "Commissioner, that is a

[1:33:52] tough nut to crack." Because I asked him

[1:33:55] I ask always, "When are we going to get

[1:33:57] there, but that was his quote

[1:34:00] >> [laughter]

[1:34:00] >> at that legislative panel and

[1:34:03] >> Don't expect he's wrong.

[1:34:04] >> Yeah, exactly. It's a It's a huge

[1:34:06] battle. There is a lot of more positive

[1:34:09] movement between the assessors and the

[1:34:13] residential and commercial real estate.

[1:34:16] They They are making some progress in

[1:34:18] trying to balance that out.

[1:34:20] Um anyone that brings up centrally

[1:34:23] assessed is um

[1:34:25] Uh we bring it up all the time, but it's

[1:34:27] just

[1:34:28] It's a very large thing and it feels

[1:34:30] like maybe the They have better

[1:34:32] lobbyists than we do on our end.

[1:34:34] >> What do you think?

[1:34:36] >> Something else is something else.

[1:34:37] >> Return to

[1:34:38] >> I would imagine.

[1:34:39] >> I was also at the thing where the

[1:34:40] governor was privileged to speak, you

[1:34:42] know, following along there. Um it was a

[1:34:45] great honor.

[1:34:46] You know, as I mentioned in that speech,

[1:34:48] that's where when I came to Moab, I

[1:34:50] literally lived in that park until we

[1:34:52] could find housing in this town. It was

[1:34:54] a little camp park at the time I moved

[1:34:56] in, but

[1:34:56] >> Very very little.

[1:34:58] >> Very little. And then also I was in a

[1:35:00] meeting yesterday that um was very

[1:35:01] productive and we were asking, when I

[1:35:04] say we, it was Commissioner Maun from

[1:35:06] San Juan County and myself and we were

[1:35:08] asking to utilize the

[1:35:10] phase two funds to help get the road

[1:35:13] system and the

[1:35:15] parking lots ready for the NICA races

[1:35:18] and they approved us and allow and

[1:35:21] allowing us to do that and then we'll be

[1:35:23] able to come back, I think, in the fall

[1:35:25] to

[1:35:26] reapply for phase two money, but this

[1:35:30] will just

[1:35:32] hopefully, I can't guarantee you nothing

[1:35:33] in life's guaranteed, but that we'll be

[1:35:36] open and ready for those NICA races this

[1:35:38] fall that they want to hold them. I

[1:35:39] think they've got two scheduled. So,

[1:35:42] that that's just a brief one I've got

[1:35:44] and then Commissioner Martinez

[1:35:47] Take it away.

[1:35:48] >> Yeah.

[1:35:48] Thanks. So, um

[1:35:51] there's just There's been a lot of talk

[1:35:52] about what's been happening in the

[1:35:54] Colorado River and um, I just kind of

[1:35:56] want to go through a couple of things

[1:35:59] um, that that we've that we've

[1:36:02] that have gone on. So, the 2026 Drought

[1:36:04] Response Operation, which is called

[1:36:06] Drola, that was signed April 21st.

[1:36:10] And then Brandon Gearhart of the Upper

[1:36:12] Colorado River Commission, this was his

[1:36:14] quote,

[1:36:15] "Uh, we expect three of the five Flaming

[1:36:18] Gorge boat ramps in Wyoming will be

[1:36:20] rendered unusable and low reservoir

[1:36:23] levels will have long-lasting negative

[1:36:26] impacts on reservoir fisheries.

[1:36:28] We recognize that we are what we are

[1:36:30] approving today will have significant

[1:36:32] negative impact on our water resources,

[1:36:35] local economies, and recreation."

[1:36:38] And so, Drola is part of the uh, um,

[1:36:42] of the 2019 Colorado River Drought

[1:36:44] Contingency Plan. And so, for the upper

[1:36:47] Colorado River Basin.

[1:36:49] And their aim is to minimize the risk of

[1:36:52] Lake Powell declining below critical

[1:36:55] elevations. So, the

[1:36:58] Drought Response Operation Plan address

[1:37:00] critical water levels at Lake Powell's

[1:37:02] and Reclamation has identified 3,500 ft

[1:37:06] above sea level. That's the level of

[1:37:08] Lake Powell as the operational elevation

[1:37:10] to provide protection for the for the

[1:37:12] system.

[1:37:14] So, developed by the upper basin and the

[1:37:15] Bureau of Drola authorized a drought

[1:37:18] release of 660,000

[1:37:21] to 1 million acre-feet from Flaming

[1:37:23] Gorge Reservoir through April 2027.

[1:37:27] Um, but there's a little catch right

[1:37:28] there. So, due to the uncertainty

[1:37:30] regarding water year 2027 operations, as

[1:37:33] in we don't have an interim guideline

[1:37:35] set yet, um, the upper basin had

[1:37:39] determined that they are not they are

[1:37:40] currently unable to analyze the

[1:37:42] effectiveness of the 2026 plan beyond

[1:37:45] September 30th, 2026,

[1:37:48] right? Given that the drought agreements

[1:37:50] will expire.

[1:37:51] Um, there's additional contingency

[1:37:54] releases that may be drawn from Blue

[1:37:56] Mesa and Navajo Reservoir depending on

[1:37:58] water availability after the 2026

[1:38:01] irrigation season, but once again,

[1:38:03] that's after that um the um agreements

[1:38:07] expire.

[1:38:08] Um, the Department of the Interior also

[1:38:10] announced April 17th that the Secretary

[1:38:13] is planning to reduce Glen Canyon Dam

[1:38:15] releases to 7.8 million acre feet to 6

[1:38:19] million acre feet in water year 2026

[1:38:23] pursuant to section 16 of the 2024

[1:38:25] supplemental environmental impact

[1:38:27] statement of the 2007

[1:38:30] Colorado River interim guidelines. So,

[1:38:33] we're going to raise the flow and then

[1:38:35] we're going to drop the outflow, right?

[1:38:37] So, inflow is going up, outflow is going

[1:38:40] down. Um, starting May 1st, 2026, flows

[1:38:44] from Flaming Gorge Dam will be at full power, which is 4,600

[1:38:49] cfs. And then starting May 4th, 2026,

[1:38:53] following the power plant capacity

[1:38:55] release, uh Reclamation will implement a

[1:38:58] larval trigger study plan uh release for

[1:39:01] the razorback sucker fish. Uh, this will

[1:39:04] include an additional bypass of about

[1:39:06] 4,000 cfs. So, flows totaling 8,600 cfs

[1:39:11] coming out.

[1:39:13] Um, based on the April forecast, Bureau

[1:39:16] expects the inflow and outflow

[1:39:18] modifications will prevent Lake Powell

[1:39:21] from reaching minimum power pool.

[1:39:23] Um, Amy Hass, the executive director of

[1:39:26] the Colorado River Authority of Utah,

[1:39:28] um, this was her quote. She says, "I

[1:39:30] wish I could say I was confident in that

[1:39:32] forecast. I'm not because the changes

[1:39:35] that we've seen over the last couple

[1:39:37] months." End quote.

[1:39:39] Um, if Glen Canyon de- continues to

[1:39:42] decline below 3,490

[1:39:45] ft right there,

[1:39:47] water releases would only be through the

[1:39:50] river outlet works,

[1:39:52] which could cause operational issues,

[1:39:54] downstream impacts, instability in the

[1:39:57] region while regional power and the

[1:40:00] water supplies.

[1:40:02] Additionally, you have reduced release

[1:40:04] reduced releases from Lake Powell will

[1:40:07] accelerate the decline of Lake Mead with

[1:40:10] the potential for an additional 40%

[1:40:12] reduction to Hoover Dam's hydropower

[1:40:14] generating capacity as early as this

[1:40:17] fall.

[1:40:18] Jenny Dumas, the water attorney for the

[1:40:22] Hikarilla Apache Nation, had this quote

[1:40:24] which I thought was really interesting.

[1:40:27] It's going to take time to recover these

[1:40:29] reservoirs before we can do this again.

[1:40:31] So while we can exhaust our reserves to

[1:40:34] avoid system collapse this year, that

[1:40:36] means reserves won't be there next year.

[1:40:39] That was the end of her quote. So with

[1:40:42] Lake Powell's

[1:40:44] minimum probable inflow this year

[1:40:47] forecasted at 2.78

[1:40:50] million acre feet, the system faces a

[1:40:53] deficit of 4.7 million acre feet

[1:40:56] relative to the delivery of the

[1:40:58] obligations set by the Colorado River

[1:41:01] Compact. We have a law for the river

[1:41:04] that no longer exists right now.

[1:41:07] Complete capacity inside of Flaming

[1:41:10] Gorge is 3.1 million acre feet.

[1:41:14] With all that, Arizona's Department of

[1:41:17] Water Resources released a statement

[1:41:19] agreeing with plans to order upstream

[1:41:21] releases to stabilize Lake Powell, but

[1:41:24] also warning that revised downstream

[1:41:26] releases were quote substantially less

[1:41:30] than required under the 1922 Colorado

[1:41:33] River Compact. Failure to comply is

[1:41:36] itself is itself a serious development

[1:41:39] that Arizona will assess and respond to

[1:41:42] accordingly. Unquote. Um Utah leaders

[1:41:45] and that was in the document that I that

[1:41:47] I did provide on there from the Utah

[1:41:49] Colorado River Authority have said that

[1:41:52] Utah leaders have been direct that

[1:41:54] litigation will not produce more water.

[1:41:57] Um

[1:41:58] they will yeah, the the upper basin

[1:42:00] states Utah, Colorado, Wyoming, and New

[1:42:03] Mexico are calling for state leaders to

[1:42:05] return to the table

[1:42:07] um and bring in a a negotiator into the

[1:42:09] room. The Times Independent has covered

[1:42:12] that pretty well, I think, recently. Um

[1:42:14] couple of other things over the next

[1:42:16] week Bullfrog Marina will be brief

[1:42:18] relocating to Halls uh to maintain

[1:42:21] marina operations.

[1:42:23] Um

[1:42:24] Currently, Lake Powell is at 3,526

[1:42:28] ft elevation. And then in the packet, I

[1:42:31] also put a picture of the the new North

[1:42:34] Wash boat ramp um right there and that

[1:42:36] was from 5:30. So,

[1:42:39] yeah, there's there's a lot going on.

[1:42:41] We're good.

[1:42:42] >> And if I could

[1:42:44] Gary.

[1:42:46] Okay.

[1:42:47] >> Yes, Commissioner.

[1:42:48] >> Um that was excellent. Thank you. Thank

[1:42:50] you for the update. And and I guess just

[1:42:52] uh I won't say much, but you know, we

[1:42:55] sit back. It's really easy to sit back

[1:42:57] and and

[1:42:58] it's so hard to watch this system um

[1:43:05] collapsing.

[1:43:06] And so it's it's also overwhelming.

[1:43:09] And you might be you might be saying,

[1:43:11] "What can we do? What can we do? What

[1:43:12] can we do?" The reality is we are the

[1:43:14] local land use authority and there are

[1:43:16] things that we can do. And so that's all

[1:43:18] I'm going to say.

[1:43:19] Um but to continue to put stress on that

[1:43:23] river [clears throat] is something that

[1:43:25] we as a local land use authority really

[1:43:27] need to think seriously about. Um it is

[1:43:31] that river

[1:43:32] is the most Well, it's the most

[1:43:34] endangered river in the United States,

[1:43:37] for sure,

[1:43:39] if not, you know,

[1:43:41] the world. It is under extreme stress.

[1:43:45] The climate is changing. I don't use the

[1:43:48] word climate change. I use the term

[1:43:50] aridification.

[1:43:52] Um and and there's literally, you know,

[1:43:54] hundreds, if not thousands, of research

[1:43:56] papers to to back up that term. And so,

[1:44:00] I I would just say that it's easy to be

[1:44:03] overwhelmed and to be like, what can we

[1:44:05] do? And we do we can do something.

[1:44:07] That's all I'm going to say.

[1:44:09] You might want to

[1:44:10] I'm sorry.

[1:44:11] >> Yes, Commissioner Magaña.

[1:44:13] >> I just said you might want to explain

[1:44:14] that term.

[1:44:15] >> You know, aridification?

[1:44:17] It's just we're becoming, you know, so

[1:44:19] it's getting hotter. We have less

[1:44:21] precipitation. Soil moisture is going

[1:44:24] down, so it's just becoming more arid.

[1:44:27] We're We're becoming a more arid region,

[1:44:30] specifically the Colorado Plateau, where

[1:44:32] we exist. So, yeah.

[1:44:36] » All right. Anyone else?

[1:44:38] We have the Fixed Guideway Subcommittee

[1:44:41] update report.

[1:44:44] Who was going to give that?

[1:44:46] >> Well, I think we were just um we we've

[1:44:48] included uh meeting notes from those

[1:44:51] meetings going forward just to keep the

[1:44:53] Oh, okay. We're done. I don't I don't

[1:44:54] necessarily think we need to

[1:44:56] do a full report. Um but I think that

[1:45:01] was pretty comprehensive.

[1:45:03] >> All right. Sounds good.

[1:45:05] I believe that that brings us to 5:45.

[1:45:10] Do we want to um out of a closed session

[1:45:14] for our 6:00 citizens be heard?

[1:45:16] >> I think it'd be easier if we

[1:45:18] perhaps call recess,

[1:45:20] then have the 6:00 citizens be heard, if

[1:45:22] any, and then go into closed session.

[1:45:24] >> Okay.

[1:45:25] >> All right. With that, I will call a

[1:45:27] recess at 5:46. We will come back at

[1:45:30] 6:00 p.m. for our citizens to be heard.

[1:45:36] Thank you.

[1:45:44] » The Board of Engineers.

[1:45:46] >> Oh, really?

[1:45:46] >> Mechanics, right? Is that what you said?

[1:45:48] >> Engineers.

[1:53:09] » Mhm.

[1:59:29] » Melody, can you hear us again all right?

[1:59:41] Melody,

[1:59:43] are you back online?

[1:59:46] » Hello.

[1:59:49] Oh, she's here.

[1:59:49] >> You're back. All right. It is 6:00 p.m.

[1:59:52] I will call this meeting back to order.

[1:59:55] We had a brief recess as we closed

[1:59:57] business early tonight.

[2:00:00] And with that,

[2:00:01] we will have our 6:00 p.m. citizens to

[2:00:03] be heard. I will take volunteers. Anyone

[2:00:07] want to come up?

[2:00:08] Mr. Day.

[2:00:12] Thank you. Appreciate it.

[2:00:14] >> Um I've had a couple of concerns.

[2:00:17] Um first, my name is Randy Day.

[2:00:19] I live on Drive.

[2:00:23] Here in Moab, Utah and have for a long

[2:00:24] time. In the valley, in the city, in the

[2:00:27] county. Um been involved in the uh

[2:00:30] planning commission of late. I'm a

[2:00:32] planning commission member.

[2:00:34] And I've really enjoyed that. It's a lot

[2:00:36] of fun. It takes us a lot of time, feels

[2:00:38] like to me to get our feet going to get

[2:00:39] things done. And it's been my

[2:00:42] understanding that we have two liaisons

[2:00:45] from the county.

[2:00:46] And and Trish Hedden has been a

[2:00:48] wonderful asset as far as I'm concerned.

[2:00:51] Uh but as I understand it that Brian

[2:00:53] Martinez was our county commission

[2:00:55] liaison. If there is a code or there is

[2:00:58] a rule that you have passed that we have

[2:01:02] to, I would love to see it. Because of

[2:01:05] Robert's Rules of Orders, I look at it

[2:01:06] and I see it as an out-of-order place

[2:01:09] that

[2:01:11] Trish Hedden, and not her personally,

[2:01:13] but that position that she's holding is

[2:01:16] there. It causes conflict for me as a

[2:01:19] member of the board because I got two

[2:01:21] definitely conflicting opinions on the

[2:01:24] board from the different commissioners

[2:01:26] that we have. Whether that's good or

[2:01:27] bad, it's not the purpose of a liaison

[2:01:30] in my opinion. A liaison is to bring

[2:01:32] your wishes from the council to us, not

[2:01:35] with a dividing opinion, but with that

[2:01:37] opinion. Our job is to promote what we

[2:01:39] have to you through that liaison.

[2:01:42] Correct me if I'm wrong. If I've got

[2:01:44] different opinions from the liaisons, we

[2:01:46] have a conflict. Okay, that's my problem

[2:01:50] with that. If you think that we need

[2:01:52] that many, then you can put two more

[2:01:53] council members on there, commission

[2:01:55] members from the county, and we can all

[2:01:57] go home. You'll have a quorum and you'll

[2:01:58] be ready to go.

[2:02:00] If you really want our input and want us

[2:02:01] to go to work, you need to There's a lot

[2:02:03] of discussion that's unnecessary in that

[2:02:05] meeting because of those two opinions.

[2:02:07] And I appreciate them both and I'm not

[2:02:09] having a heart attack over which one

[2:02:10] gets to stay, but I'm going to tell you

[2:02:13] it's not good for that board. It is

[2:02:15] dragging our feet. You've given us a

[2:02:16] mission and we're not going to complete

[2:02:18] it the way things are going right now. I

[2:02:20] promise. It's not going to happen. And

[2:02:22] we're going to get this. Also, that

[2:02:24] leads me into a good segue of talking

[2:02:25] about any kind of moratorium on people

[2:02:28] that wanted use planning and zoning to

[2:02:30] go forward with their projects. It is

[2:02:32] almost nonsensical

[2:02:35] to stop that and put a moratorium on

[2:02:37] that and here's why.

[2:02:39] Our lack as a county government to do

[2:02:42] our jobs should not be an emergency for

[2:02:45] us to call because we don't do it. Those

[2:02:48] people have a right to go forward with

[2:02:49] whatever it is they're doing. There's

[2:02:51] nothing that we should be doing to

[2:02:53] inhibit that. That's our fault. Shame on

[2:02:55] us. Don't put it on the people in the

[2:02:57] public to drag it out another 6 months

[2:03:00] or whatever more time you think you want

[2:03:01] to do. It's wrong and should not happen.

[2:03:04] And it shouldn't be voted to have that

[2:03:06] because of us.

[2:03:08] If it was something they did, that's one

[2:03:10] thing. If there's something we couldn't

[2:03:11] see coming, that's another. But we know

[2:03:14] we're in the middle of our plan.

[2:03:16] And we know that and we've been working

[2:03:17] on this for a long time and we're

[2:03:19] dragging our feet.

[2:03:20] And I don't like that. Let's go through

[2:03:22] this thing line item by line item. I'm

[2:03:24] ready to work two or three days a week,

[2:03:26] whatever it takes to get it done so that

[2:03:28] this county has a really good

[2:03:29] comprehensive plan that you can punch

[2:03:32] the button and find out what you can and

[2:03:34] cannot do. Thank you for your time. I

[2:03:36] appreciate it. My minutes are up.

[2:03:38] Thank you, sir.

[2:03:41] Do we have further? Anyone else?

[2:03:45] Do we have anybody online, Quinn?

[2:03:47] >> No.

[2:03:48] >> All right.

[2:03:53] » I'll be dealing with

[2:03:54] >> Okay.

[2:03:57] All right. With that, um yes,

[2:03:59] Commissioner Hadler.

[2:04:01] >> I make a motion.

[2:04:02] >> Sure.

[2:04:02] >> I would move to go into closed session to discuss the

[2:04:05] character, professional competence,

[2:04:06] physical or mental health of an

[2:04:08] individual.

[2:04:10] >> All right. Motion to go into closed

[2:04:12] session.

[2:04:13] Seconded by Let's see. Motion by

[2:04:15] Commissioner Hadler, seconded by

[2:04:17] Commissioner McGann. Those in favor?

[2:04:20] >> I.

[2:04:23] » Those opposed?

[2:04:27] So, we have four in favor,

[2:04:30] two opposed, one abstaining.

[2:04:33] Closed session.

[2:04:34] >> So, we can talk about I don't know if

[2:04:36] the if the body wants to talk about it

[2:04:39] in open session, I would encourage the

[2:04:41] commission to consider going into closed

[2:04:43] session to have this conversation.

[2:04:45] >> Why are Why I I'm confused.

[2:04:48] >> We have We have I've talked about two

[2:04:51] items to go into closed session and one

[2:04:53] commissioner can't vote on the closed

[2:04:54] session basis. Yes or abstain.

[2:05:00] » How many What were What were the votes

[2:05:01] again?

[2:05:02] >> Four to one to two.

[2:05:03] >> Four to one

[2:05:04] >> Need five to go into closed session.

[2:05:06] >> Four to one abstain.

[2:05:15] » I I I'm I want to know

[2:05:17] I'm I'm surprised. I I had no idea that

[2:05:20] this would happen that we would not go

[2:05:22] into closed session, especially

[2:05:25] You know what You know, I can't say what

[2:05:27] we were we were planning on discussing,

[2:05:29] but I I don't understand. I I

[2:05:32] >> An option would be the chair can We can

[2:05:35] look at discussing with the chair to

[2:05:37] call an emergency meeting. This is

[2:05:39] something that will come up

[2:05:41] if the commission does not want it to be

[2:05:43] discussed in closed session, it will

[2:05:45] have to be discussed in open session.

[2:05:47] >> Who was opposed? [clears throat]

[2:05:48] Sorry, you didn't call that. Who was

[2:05:50] opposed?

[2:05:51] >> Commissioner Winfield and Commissioner

[2:05:52] Martinez.

[2:05:56] » Okay, so did you guys want to talk about

[2:05:57] this in open session?

[2:05:59] >> No, we don't even think it should be

[2:06:01] discussed whatsoever.

[2:06:04] >> Um it has to be.

[2:06:05] >> So, our our

[2:06:06] county attorney believes it needs to be

[2:06:08] discussed.

[2:06:09] >> Right, but the county attorney is here

[2:06:11] to advise us.

[2:06:13] >> Yeah.

[2:06:15] >> Okay.

[2:06:16] Uh well, I will provide a follow-up to

[2:06:18] the to the chair for consideration.

[2:06:22] This will be something I I I have I have

[2:06:24] a statutory obligation to raise this and

[2:06:27] so

[2:06:28] I will raise raise it for the chair for

[2:06:30] consideration and

[2:06:32] um

[2:06:33] that's all I can do.

[2:06:34] >> And I think that was there was another

[2:06:36] item that we wanted to talk about in

[2:06:38] closed session as well

[2:06:40] that relates to Grandma's.

[2:06:43] >> Yeah, I want to can we do the one

[2:06:45] what would that be under?

[2:06:47] >> It's not character and context.

[2:06:49] >> That would be a different motion. We can

[2:06:50] talk about it in open session as well if

[2:06:52] that's what you guys want to do.

[2:06:54] >> It's

[2:06:55] same motion.

[2:06:55] >> No, it isn't.

[2:06:56] >> But I was going to check.

[2:07:00] » Could we We can table

[2:07:02] >> Correct if I am not mistaken.

[2:07:04] >> That that discussion could potentially

[2:07:05] wait till next meeting.

[2:07:06] >> Sure. I mean both of them can. One one's

[2:07:09] going to be more

[2:07:10] >> I agree.

[2:07:12] >> Uh I I will follow up and provide uh

[2:07:16] I guess I'll provide the commissioners

[2:07:17] updated information on what their

[2:07:19] options are proceeding forward.

[2:07:23] » Okay.

[2:07:25] All right. With that

[2:07:27] I will adjourn this meeting at 6:08 p.m.

[2:07:30] Thank you everybody.

[2:07:32] >> All right. Thanks.

[2:07:36] » Thank you Melody.

[2:07:37] >> Bye.

5.5.26 Commission Meeting part 2

Transcript