[0:29] Thank you.

[0:33] but that was my first point.

[0:40] First, I enjoyed seeing you on the radio.

[0:43] I heard a lot about the radio.

[0:45] I was really glad to see you.

[0:47] Yeah, I was.

[0:55] But it's still a pass from.

[0:57] I was really glad to see you.

[0:58] I was really glad to see you.

[1:00] You can set up the code.

[1:02] Yes.

[1:04] You can set up the code.

[1:10] Yes.

[1:11] Yeah, it's in the office.

[1:17] Oh,

[1:22] it's here.

[1:24] Just a minute.

[1:28] Okay.

[1:34] Good tomorrow.

[1:37] I also, you know, you don't want it now.

[1:39] No, also another shouldn't pay for it.

[1:42] If you got it, it's good.

[1:43] Yeah.

[1:44] Thank you.

[1:45] Yeah.

[1:46] Yeah.

[1:54] Are we ready?

[1:55] It's time.

[2:09] All the meetings at order.

[2:11] It is 631.

[2:20] Audio check.

[2:24] Audio check.

[2:26] Audio check.

[2:27] Check.

[2:35] Did we hear Rocco?

[2:38] He tapped on it.

[2:39] Okay.

[2:41] All right, do we have any additions,

[2:43] deletions or corrections to the agenda?

[2:51] I move to approve the agenda.

[2:54] Do I have a second?

[2:55] A second.

[2:57] All in favor, aye.

[2:58] Aye.

[2:59] Anyone opposed?

[3:02] Passes.

[3:03] All right, it's time for public comment.

[3:05] Do we have anyone on Zoom or in person

[3:07] who would like to make a comment?

[3:09] Yes.

[3:11] Can you hear me?

[3:12] Yes, go ahead.

[3:13] Okay, my name is Howard Price.

[3:18] I don't know if the video is working or not. I'm having trouble with my computer, like always.

[3:25] I live at 6565 Grant Avenue and 10675 Honda.

[3:33] My house will be on Honda will be the only one physically.

[3:40] of causing problems or your, I guess you would say your supposed pump station will be causing terrible problems to my house.

[3:56] When I spoke to the city council about three weeks ago, I asked them a bunch of questions and I have yet to hear an answer back from our wonderful town council.

[4:04] So, some of the questions you're going to get for me tonight will be the same ones that I gave to them.

[4:12] First, how can it possibly build this pun station on Hondo, which is zoned residential?

[4:20] Although I do see now that you guys had asked or somebody had asked on October 12th,

[4:27] the doberries had asked to submit a variance application. I lived next door to where this is going

[4:36] to be done. I did not know about it until three weeks ago when I saw an article in the jackpot on

[4:43] the internet. That is totally against Green Mountain Falls restrict laws and by laws. I should have

[4:55] been notified right off the bat.

[4:59] I want to know why I wasn't notified was it because the CSU was

[5:06] afraid that this would get shut down by me. I've had enough trouble with CSU.

[5:14] I want to know why

[5:15] if it was submitted on October 12, 2022, I or my wife, neither one of us knew about this until three

[5:24] weeks ago. That is breaking code. I know that the GMF Board of Trustees is

[5:34] acting like their second-class citizens, that they have to answer to CSU. In

[5:39] fact, it's just the opposite. CSU has to answer to our town government, our

[5:45] town government. Not theirs in Colorado Springs. I'm not afraid to CSU and our

[5:50] trustees better not be either. We are their bosses. Yet we're following their rules.

[5:57] And I don't like it. I don't like it at all. I asked the town manager specific questions and one

[6:04] of them was going to be, what about parking? And this is street going to be open. And she said,

[6:10] absolutely, it's going to be open. Well, I'm a little thing that they mailed to me to mail because I

[6:16] I have water service in Colorado Springs.

[6:18] It says the road's gonna be closed in front of my house.

[6:24] The only way to get to my house is on Hondo,

[6:28] where they're gonna shut it down.

[6:31] That's a bunch of bull.

[6:35] I don't see a start an official start day

[6:38] or stop date on this building.

[6:40] I don't know why we need the building.

[6:43] It can be done underground.

[6:45] If there's that much space for parking on the side that the MDs are going to allow you can do it like you've done all the other pumps underground.

[6:56] They don't need the expense. We don't need to pay taxpayer money to build a beautiful little building to hold these pumps.

[7:05] Yes, it may be more trouble to perform maintenance underground. I don't care. That's their job.

[7:13] This is being pushed through. I don't know who's making money off of it. I don't know who's hands are in whose pocket, but I can tell you there will be some kind of injunction against this.

[7:26] You have not followed the laws. You have not followed what is set up and bring mountain falls for things to happen.

[7:34] You should be ashamed of yourself.

[7:36] You're the planning commission.

[7:41] I want to know why this is happening.

[7:44] I want to know why when they have all the land

[7:47] that they need to build something like this,

[7:50] that they don't do it up on their land.

[7:52] Honda was a horrible street, horrible street.

[7:56] If those of you that have lived there for a while,

[7:59] you know what it's like in the winter.

[8:01] You know what it's like in the spring.

[8:03] We had a five to eight foot hole in the road

[8:05] that took forever to get filled up,

[8:08] that road is not fit for the kind of traffic

[8:11] it's going to be getting.

[8:13] And then to say that you're gonna block off the street,

[8:18] my street on grant was blocked off for three whole weeks.

[8:23] We could not be home for three whole weeks

[8:27] where we supposed to live.

[8:28] Oh, well, get an apartment someplace,

[8:30] we're in a motel.

[8:32] Are you gonna pay for it?

[8:33] Oh no, we don't do that.

[8:35] So, we had to be out of our house for three weeks.

[8:37] It's a good thing I had the house on Hondo.

[8:40] And when they got done, the road looked like crap.

[8:45] Yes, they put red dirt on it,

[8:47] but they don't know what red dirt is.

[8:49] They don't know what road base is.

[8:50] I see that you're gonna put some road base

[8:52] on the parking area.

[8:54] What are you gonna do for Hondo?

[8:57] What are you gonna do for drainage?

[9:02] This is an eight.

[9:03] I appreciate your comments and I can understand your concerns.

[9:09] We will discuss it later in our meeting, but I appreciate.

[9:16] I'd like to know who's talking now. I can't see anything. Sorry, this is Lamar.

[9:20] Okay, Lamar.

[9:22] And we need to see if there's anyone else that has public comment as well. Thank you.

[9:27] Thank you, Lamar.

[9:28] Absolutely.

[9:32] We have someone with a hand up.

[9:40] I think it's if you could press the button so there's a blue light.

[9:46] Thank you.

[9:47] The name is Mack Patron.

[9:50] Oh,

[9:56] well, I'm sorry.

[9:57] My name is Mack Patron. I live at 10840.

[10:02] My middle street.

[10:06] and

[10:11] then complete agreement with Howard. I got a apparently the decisions have already

[10:17] been made because I got a notification from the water department in the mail today. They

[10:25] claim that they're going to build a pump station, that the structure will be similar in size

[10:31] to a two-car garage. Now, at the last meeting that I attended, I was told in front of the

[10:40] crowd and I'm sure it's on record that their building was going to be 1100 square feet.

[10:46] Now, I've been in the building trades for 55 years. I've built dozens of two-car garages.

[10:55] The smallest two-car garage you can build is about 20 by 20. That's 400 square feet.

[11:00] The typical 2-car garage is 24 by 24, which is 576 square feet.

[11:09] If it's going to be close in size to a 2-car garage, 1100 square feet is double the size of a 2-car garage.

[11:20] The other thing is that, and I have to agree with Howard on the zoning,

[11:27] The entire community up there is residential, spot zoning is frowned on by just about every

[11:38] planning department in the state, possibly the country, just popping in commercial property

[11:48] here and there in the midst of residential is not a good idea, never has been.

[11:53] and this one in particular is more than commercial.

[11:59] This is almost industrial and there's no place for it

[12:03] in that particular area.

[12:06] City of Colorado Springs owns property just about everywhere.

[12:11] There's no reason that it has to be there.

[12:13] If it's simpler for them or cheaper for them,

[12:16] I can understand that, but that doesn't make it right.

[12:20] Thank you.

[12:23] Thank you, Mr. Patron. Appreciate your comments. Do we have any other comments?

[12:30] Anyone else on Zoom wish to make public comment?

[12:39] Anyone else in the audience?

[12:46] Okay. It's time for us to approve our minutes. Are there any additions, deletions or corrections

[12:55] to our minutes of December 6th, Raka? I saw one correction in the minutes at the bottom of item six.

[13:03] There's the word key. I think should be changed to the.

[13:08] Oh, it was a typo. Okay.

[13:13] So I move to approve the minutes with that one correction.

[13:18] Does anybody else have other corrections for.

[13:22] Changes.

[13:24] Second.

[13:26] Second. All in favor. I.

[13:28] Aye.

[13:29] Anyone opposed?

[13:36] Okay.

[13:37] Okay, new business.

[13:44] We have none year.

[13:48] The issues and comments this evening. I guess I would put under other business and we can discuss it at that point in time because I have questions and I think it's worth a discussion.

[14:01] So we have the application for the car port and variances as new business.

[14:08] Oh, it says none next to new business, but it needs to be corrected.

[14:14] Oh, my apologies.

[14:16] Yeah, so I just listed the new business under there, but that application should be next.

[14:22] Okay, so we have this application for a car port construction with variances.

[14:27] and which one of, I guess, are you going to lead this?

[14:37] Yes.

[14:52] Yes, so I was notified of a potential structure going up at 10, 7, 7, 5, bell of a deer.

[15:00] went and checked it out. And the owner is here, then applicant, Ms. Jandy Berenstein, and her nephew, I believe, was starting to do work on replacing a carport. There's some pictures included in the packet that show how in disrepair, the old carport was. So this carport had existed since the 40s or 50s.

[15:29] 1938. So a need of some replacement there. But anyway, so the applicants were not aware

[15:37] of just the zoning rules for Green Mountain Falls, you know, because it was such a small

[15:43] structure. So just I went and let them know of the requirements there and they were very

[15:50] responsive and immediately worked with me to get a surveyor on site to find some pins and also submit all the necessary applications.

[16:05] So upon the location of pins, we discovered that the well for one, the old

[16:11] And this is a cardboard actually encroached into the right of way just by the overhang.

[16:18] There was an over about a three foot overhang that was added at some point during the over the years.

[16:27] And so I'm just trying to get a picture here of the flag.

[16:36] So the red stakes there with the red flags on them and to indicate where the survey was able to find the pins and so we can see that typical of, you know, lots of lots of green mountain properties.

[16:51] There are some close neighbor contact here and so the pin actually originally where they had these posts.

[17:01] When I came on site they were moved a little bit further and so after we worked or after they worked with the surveyor to get these the pins flagged.

[17:13] They move those back so this is actually kind of an improvement in the overall situation in a number of ways but one is that we, you know, they're able to find their property pins and then realize that indeed the right of way starts.

[17:29] where this pin flag is. So, like a lot of properties, just by looking at it, the usable right of way is, you know, 20, 30 feet away from this towards the street.

[17:43] So, you know, just by looking at it, it seems like a usable yard or usable space for them.

[17:49] But indeed, the right of way starts there so they immediately adjusted their plans and push back the design so that would not have an overhang into the right of way.

[18:03] It does however require variances of the front and side setbacks.

[18:10] We bring up the site plan here.

[18:15] So basically as design now or as modified there's nine inches of overhang of the total footprint of the structure is nine inches back from the front setback and 12 inches okay.

[18:32] So, but we'll go with nine since that was what was submitted here gives them a little cushion and then two and a half feet to the side setback.

[18:41] setback. So we processed variance applications for those. And this is just showing the same

[18:49] information on the on the survey or on the document that the surveyer put together, he

[18:55] was able to find three of the four property pins minus this one here. And so also included.

[19:05] So the variance, let me get back to my summary sheet here so I can the variance was the

[19:20] notification

[19:26] of variance was published in the pikes be courier on January 18th, posted at town hall, January 20th and posted on property yesterday, January 23rd.

[19:40] off-filling the 15-day posting requirements before a public hearing at the February 7th Board

[19:46] of Trustees meeting.

[19:49] And so, and because this was submitted before the new land use code was in

[19:57] place, then we're going by the old code, exactly like the pump station situation. So, what we,

[20:07] and we also have a letter from the neighbors directly to the east just

[20:18] voicing that they have no concerns or objection to the reconstruction of the

[20:24] carport essentially in the same footprint as it was.

[20:30] So that's a summary of the

[20:32] application and the project. Here's the design of the carport itself and I'd be

[20:42] happy to answer any questions and the owner applicant is here as I stated so by

[20:49] code are we recall are you whoever is required to specifically reach out to

[20:58] specific neighbors and let them know? Or is it just this public publication?

[21:03] No, there's no mailing requirement in the old code and there is a posting on the site,

[21:10] which would in theory notify the neighbors. So even though it was only posted yesterday,

[21:16] that's still. For the public hearing on the board of trustees, then there's that 15 day threshold

[21:24] there for that.

[21:30] Yeah, the trustees have the final decision. This is basically to you for recommendation.

[21:40] Do I have a motion?

[21:44] So from what I read, this will be the same footprint. It will be just

[21:50] I was reconstructing the car port in the same location, same footprint, and I would distinguish this between if an applicant came to us with a new proposal to build something brand new on an area that didn't meet setbacks, I would give that more scrutiny.

[22:09] looking at this and looking at the situation, it's almost like being grandfathered, you know,

[22:15] just putting in a better structure in place in that same location. So that's the distinction

[22:21] I make, so that I have no further questions on it. I just have one. Is there a height requirement?

[22:31] We just didn't talk much about car reports. We talked about sheds with this car.

[22:37] for the old code, there's just a general height requirement of, I'm forgetting now, 35 or 25, it must be 35 feet of all of it.

[22:50] 35.

[22:53] And so, yeah.

[22:54] That's a maximum.

[22:56] I'm sorry, maximum.

[22:58] And that's kind of a blanket.

[23:01] threshold for any structure.

[23:03] Okay, great.

[23:04] And I should have mentioned variances are, you know,

[23:08] the point of variances is not to just hand them out, you know, without reason,

[23:15] but they're meant to solve a hardship.

[23:19] So in this case, they have a hardship because just east of that of this,

[23:25] where the carport is between the carport and the cabin is basically

[23:29] their entire septic field. So they couldn't they can't just like move this spot over even though it,

[23:37] you know, to clear setbacks, you know, it would be ideal obviously per code, but because that septic

[23:46] field and the septic system is all there, then that's what creates the hardship along with not having

[23:53] another option of, you know, where that could go. There's not enough space, you know, in

[23:59] front of the house between the right of way and the house to do anything. And then the

[24:03] rear is just, you know, a steep hillside. So, so that's the that's the hardship that that

[24:10] variances should, you know, address and theory. Okay. Thank you. Any other questions?

[24:19] I'd move approval. Do I have a second? Second. All in favor? Aye. Aye. Aye. Aye.

[24:25] Anyone opposed?

[24:28] Passes. All right. Thanks. Thanks,

[24:32] Janie, for being here. The next step will be a Board of Trustees meeting on February 7th.

[24:38] And they'll be a public hearing as part of that. So anyone can make

[24:43] comment specific to the application. But after that, if approved, you'll be good to go.

[24:51] Thanks.

[24:59] I, in view of the comments and questions this evening, I'd really like to move other business up and

[25:07] wait on number seven and number eight on our agenda. I'd like to make that motion. Do I have a second?

[25:15] All the favor. Hi. Hi. Anyone opposed? All right, so to have this discussion, I believe some

[25:25] that the citizens that have spoken have some points and some concerns, I know that are valid.

[25:34] I know that when we spoke with CSU that evening, we asked the question, would anybody's property

[25:42] be blocked, would the streets be blocked at all? And they assured us that they would not be

[25:48] that evening. That's my memory. Do you have a different memory?

[25:51] I don't think they assured us that the road would never be closed. I think that they'd

[25:56] explain that there's going to be some disruption to the road and they would

[26:00] try to minimize it and to, you know, set up traffic control as necessary. I mean any project that

[26:08] involves water mains is going to disrupt a road. So I really don't think they've stated that

[26:18] there will be no road disruptions as part of the project. But for a citizen not to be able to

[26:25] enter their property or use their property. How long is that going to take place?

[26:30] I don't think that's necessarily the case I think that they would make every effort to not block the driveway for a significant amount of time and I think probably Becky has some more insight on that.

[26:48] The map shows that it's closed in front of that property.

[26:51] When we had talked to CSU, they had talked about doing a traffic control plan, which really means having somebody out there actually doing the traffic control blocking it while they're moving a piece of equipment and then allowing access when it's they talked about needing to divert traffic

[27:09] like through Colorado Avenue, I think at a certain point in time, we did discuss with

[27:16] them that if they were to be out in that roadway and be up above Colorado, it could prevent

[27:23] folks from being able to access their homes and also us being able to get emergency equipment

[27:28] up there. So we did express that. They assured us that they would work with us to make sure

[27:36] that everybody is able to get what they need to be, and that those delays are not, you

[27:41] know, they're not going to be for hours, that it could be for minutes.

[27:44] Okay.

[27:45] Because the detour on Colorado doesn't help that particular location.

[27:51] Exactly.

[27:52] And that's exactly what we discussed and brought to their attention, and they absolutely

[27:56] agreed that if they're working above there and it's blocking access, that they're going

[28:01] I need to be able to set up either one way traffic control, but not close it completely.

[28:06] Okay.

[28:07] All right.

[28:08] Yeah, that's kind of not what's stated on this.

[28:11] So I can see how people would be really concerned because it's this closure.

[28:15] What it says.

[28:18] So and that we are only option is this detour in green.

[28:23] So other questions that I have.

[28:26] So what was required in the way of notification under the old code what what so that was the same as what we did tonight so it's basically the official posting places which are you know a newspaper posting the website which was done town hall and then also a sign on the property that was there for.

[28:51] or probably three weeks at least before planning commission meeting.

[28:56] The planning commission meeting.

[28:58] And so, yeah, there's no mailing requirement that I did.

[29:04] What is our new code required?

[29:07] It does require a mailing.

[29:11] And so I have the variance checklist that you provided.

[29:17] I think in a recent meeting.

[29:19] Thanks for providing that.

[29:21] I think it might be helpful to add a section in there,

[29:25] which would be like the notifications,

[29:27] because you have a kind of a checklist,

[29:28] the application, the development plan, the procedure.

[29:31] I think for the planning commission,

[29:33] it would be helpful if there was another section in there

[29:36] about notifications that those were all made.

[29:39] So then we have kind of a check and balance.

[29:41] And then that reminds us to ask about that.

[29:45] and then make sure that the appropriate property owners adjacent have been

[29:51] notified and have had a chance to comment on it before we make a recommendation to the trustees.

[30:00] Make sense. Yes, absolutely.

[30:32] There's a lot of you that have a lot of money to do on their way to work, on their local

[30:39] work.

[30:40] They're not interested in looking at what a sign is up.

[30:45] So that's a miserable way to know what they're doing.

[30:49] Well, the good news is the new code is different and does require notifications.

[30:54] So that's mail notification.

[31:03] Well, it should be that could be the fee structure needs to be the fee schedule needs to be restructured according to the new code anyway. So that's one thing that could be put in there.

[31:25] So what are the mechanics for us to make sure the fee schedule? Is that something we need to put on our agenda to work on the fee schedule?

[31:33] It's in progress. I actually have a copy. I have a draft out there that I've created that I've

[31:40] got to mention to you, but it's out there and it has the it has the fee or rows that correspond

[31:50] to all the new processes as they're laid out and the new code. So they just values need to be put

[31:57] on there, and then, you know, you can add less postage or whatever that may make.

[32:02] And this is the once we get a draft of the fee schedule, it'll be something that we share to

[32:07] you to evaluate whether or not the fees that we've set up are not only in alignment with, you know,

[32:14] what the community, we don't want to create a hardship for anybody to be able to do anything.

[32:18] It's not intended to be a money maker for the town. It's just to help to defray some of those costs.

[32:23] As you said, and we will be evaluating that, so I'll share that with you and bring you in when we're when we're at that stage. Perfect. Thank you.

[33:18] I've made notes and we'll include that.

[33:24] Go ahead, Mack. Are you saying that this water pump is going to supply water to

[33:29] to Kristola and to this one in particular, or yeah, yep, yep,

[33:40] okay, I took to scope, but I understand

[33:45] when they put the water human planet in the early mid-Age, about that was they were a little more

[33:56] for coming on who got through the water. They were a little less than what I would consider

[34:03] less than honest about how it got done and some of the ways that things were done,

[34:14] put the water in it. The only thing I can say good about the water department is that City

[34:22] The city council, city council, city council, city councilt had, water, and pine心, I don't know

[34:30] that

[34:34] we might have to beade.

[34:37] Now if these were crew members and made a year after the meeting.

[34:41] So Kindern, Aaron's members, when they're done and when the council is open

[34:49] to complete the user pay that that seemed to be a new word at the time and they all joke on the

[34:56] user should pay. The users in you pass had already been paying 50% more than anyone else in

[35:06] don't pass a card at that time and helped to pay for it because of paying for

[35:13] or one and a half times what you see was downtown,

[35:18] helped to pay for a large part of the Mace of Water

[35:21] treatment plan in Colorado Springs.

[35:24] And we got untreated water.

[35:27] So our water was raw.

[35:29] And if you lived here, you would have a story

[35:32] about turning the bet of water on a given water

[35:36] and coming to have it come out like coffee

[35:38] with the grasshopper leaves and things both around the water.

[35:43] And many people complain an awful lot

[35:49] about the idea that when the lakes turn over,

[35:53] which is four times a year,

[35:57] no notification, and the people in the brewing flows.

[36:02] And with the washroom, so that was the experience.

[36:08] a huge beat. And the water here is a place to kill that point in so that the utility department

[36:15] never never mentioned that you're going to lay certain dirt over your company.

[36:20] It's not running the water for. And we've gained one and a half times the going rate for 31.

[36:28] Well, it helps to have a historical perspective, doesn't it? Yeah. Thank you. I have one more question

[36:34] and others may have questions on this topic as well.

[36:38] So Howard spoke this evening and talked about how

[36:43] as this map is drawn and as the information provided on it,

[36:47] states he's gonna be blocked and he can get into his property.

[36:51] I'm told this evening that's not gonna happen,

[36:54] but my question is what is his recourse if it does happen

[36:57] and what is the town's recourse?

[36:59] What, is this included in our contract?

[37:03] So we had involved Howard in some conversations and invited him to reach out directly with CSU and their PR team.

[37:14] Identifying that if he has concerns, he's probably not the only one.

[37:18] Invited him to speak directly to CSU and to my knowledge, he's not reached out to them.

[37:26] However, we will follow up and ensure that if they anticipate that anybody is going to be not having access to their homes or where they need to go that we have some advance notice in a way to get a hold of them.

[37:39] Okay.

[37:39] I also might keep in mind that store and you can mac use the mic please the zoom people can't hear you when keep in mind that the that the the piping that's stored at the bottom up all a there's about 780 feet of pipe there.

[38:00] That doesn't mean that that's all that they're going to need.

[38:03] So I would take whatever the utilities has to say with the grain of salt, they keep everything that they're doing close to their best.

[38:16] They don't feel like it's any of our business and maybe it's not until you drive it gets covered up or you're unable to get an ambulance to somebody who's had a heart attack.

[38:32] So that's something that you need to keep in mind, you need to keep an eye on these people, they are less than others.

[38:41] Well, I can tell you that all that you've just discussed were concerns that this commission had at the time this was brought to us.

[38:52] And we addressed it to the extent that we were able to.

[38:59] Good. I just uh Rocco. So getting into his residential zone for commercial industrial it's not

[39:08] but this is a public utility and if we look at our new code uh minor utilities are allowed

[39:16] in residential areas and that those are defined in the code and it talks about gas regulator stations,

[39:24] telephone service boxes, well water and sewer pumping stations and related underground and above

[39:31] ground pipes and wires. So that's just a point of information that public utilities are well within

[39:37] being approved for a conditional use in a residential zone area.

[39:46] Thanks for looking at that, Rocco.

[39:49] I think what's really important here is we have a new code coming out which we're going to talk about

[39:54] here in a second and give an update on that. It's really important for citizens to look at that

[40:01] code and we had a comment period but there's still the opportunity to bring things to planning

[40:08] commission to bring things to the Board of Trustees and say I have these concerns and the more involved

[40:15] you are and the more you look at the codes and see what's in there and how it may affect you

[40:20] Because we're only human. We can't think of all the ways that it might affect somebody and it's important for the citizens to participate and look at that as well.

[40:32] Are there other comments or questions on this topic? Yes, Ann.

[40:37] Well, I just like to tell you a personal story that happened to me just a year ago.

[40:43] I needed to turn the water off and hide you the cabin that I tried to stay in.

[40:50] It had frozen when the year my husband died.

[40:55] Well, they've changed all the rules.

[40:57] I used to get Brian Johnson, who's my agent, to do that for me.

[41:02] He now had to have somebody come up and be with him to do it, because people were still

[41:07] water they said or something. Well, we had the order in, he had done it. It was getting

[41:14] colders, you know, everything. And I was so worried he had done everything he did. I called

[41:20] and got people that had no power. Well, I looked on the line on Zoom or whatever you call

[41:28] it and found out the city council because they're the directors. And I emailed them and they

[41:36] were meeting at that time and a girl called me right then and she said, I'll make sure

[41:42] they see your email. That afternoon my water was turned off. The directors knew it and

[41:50] they called the bureaucratic tangle to get it done because they make certain calls. They

[41:58] don't have a lot of calls up here. They don't have enough people to cover everything.

[42:04] But I just explained that, you know, if the water froze, I was going to sue them.

[42:09] And I probably wouldn't have, you know, but, but, but sometimes the citizen has to be brave enough just to go to the top and say,

[42:20] I need to stand and sometimes it works.

[42:23] It did for me.

[42:25] Any other questions or comments? Yes.

[42:27] Just for Becky. So what is the recourse as this project, you know, as any other projects occur in town to be sure, because there's been a bunch of flood ups with the selling base and I mean, maybe they couldn't be helped and we've all been OK, whatever.

[42:44] But is there some recourse that, you know, to protect us after we OK these different companies to come in and I mean maybe it is the county commission.

[42:58] For the CSU issues, right?

[43:01] I think the best thing that we can do is always just to be aware of these issues if people are experiencing bring them.

[43:08] We've built a pretty good relationship with CSU and doing this project.

[43:14] We're continuing to foster those relationships and we do have those channels we do I do feel as though we're being heard we've worked through these what if situations they've been really receptive.

[43:24] to our concerns and, you know, part of this public information that they put out the

[43:29] mailer was hoping to get information out so that people weren't caught off guard. That

[43:34] was closely coordinated with the town. We approved a draft of it. I didn't realize

[43:41] that it looked like people were going to be blocked out of their homes and that's what

[43:46] was communicated. That's not how I interpreted it. Of course, that's, you know, always interpretation.

[43:52] So we'll, the best thing come to us and we'll help work through that.

[43:59] The stealing basins was, you know, anytime you open the ground, you find things that you don't expect to be there.

[44:04] It's, it's pretty typical.

[44:07] And, and we just work through things. It's part of it's just, that's the price of getting things done.

[44:14] And while my ARC, can you hear me?

[44:17] I can.

[44:18] This is Howard Price.

[44:20] And I want you to know, yes, I did call Colorado Springs

[44:24] Utilities.

[44:25] I left a message.

[44:27] I don't remember her name, but it is the name

[44:29] that the town manager gave me.

[44:31] I left a message, said that I was leaving town.

[44:34] I gave her a no charge call number

[44:37] that she could get me here in Costa Rica.

[44:40] I needed to talk to her.

[44:42] It was very important.

[44:43] no return call.

[44:48] Becky, is that something you can help

[44:50] powered with to get the communication going? Certainly, and Mr. Price, I did copy you on that email.

[45:00] Maybe email is a great way to reach out to her as well. I can resend it if you'd like. And if you remember what I said, I have nothing against public relations people, but they really don't know anything they just are told what to say. I should have called the head of CSU. That is, that is probably my fault for not doing that.

[45:25] I also, since you brought it up on the other

[45:30] comments that were done, I believe that their wall that they're building is on the property line.

[45:40] It looks to me from the scale that I've got here. It looks like this wall that they're building

[45:50] between them and between the property they're going to be on in my property. They're building a wall

[45:57] and it's going to be right there on my driveway.

[45:59] I mean, within inches of my driveway.

[46:05] How many inches did we say nine inches?

[46:09] Is that correct?

[46:12] Not on, no, this is the CSU.

[46:15] I'm looking at this.

[46:16] Oh, no, for instance.

[46:17] Okay, okay, sorry.

[46:18] And it is on my driveway.

[46:21] For this?

[46:23] It is over the covert.

[46:27] And there's so many things that can be said,

[46:30] that they're going to have, there's going to be disruptions and I'm really the only one who's

[46:39] going to be disrupted, totally disrupted. There was no sign put up before the town meeting.

[46:49] Yes, there was. No, there was today, there was put up the day that I met with the town manager.

[46:56] And when I got out, I went over there and then that's where the sign was, so I had I had voiced it, but I also said I was going to be out of town.

[47:06] I told the town manager I was going to be out of town and I think I gave her the number.

[47:12] So I could have been reached.

[47:16] This is Anne.

[47:18] Yes, I'm one of the commissioners Howard.

[47:21] Yeah, and I remember you when you were on trustee.

[47:26] Yeah, but I was going to say that, you know, maybe what I did.

[47:31] Sometimes our own people can't reach them any better than we could personally.

[47:36] And you just have to go to the top like I did and sometimes that'll do the trick.

[47:41] Yeah, sometimes it does, but the notification I should have been notified in October when this was taking place.

[47:49] It's harder for people who are in and out of town.

[47:52] Well, and it sounds like our old code.

[47:58] I didn't cover notifications as well as our new code is now going to cover them.

[48:04] Doesn't help me any in my property.

[48:06] No, no, it doesn't. No, it doesn't. And it is going to lower the property value of my house.

[48:16] I just don't understand. I've asked the question. Why it has to be built in a house? Why can it be

[48:23] underground like the other pumps? And I'm not getting an answer to that. I did. I even left that message.

[48:32] All right. If you would, if you would like to send me the list of issues that we have,

[48:38] We talked about, together, an actual specific list of the concerns or issues that you're

[48:43] having, that will help me to better get you the answers that you're seeking.

[48:50] And we can handle this offline.

[48:52] The Planning Commission does have some additional things they need to get to tonight.

[48:56] I will be more than happy to.

[48:58] I appreciate it.

[48:59] Yeah.

[49:00] Thank you.

[49:01] Thank you, Board.

[49:02] Absolutely.

[49:03] Thank you.

[49:04] All right.

[49:05] All right, let's move to our old business land use code update because that should go quickly and then that gives us plenty of time for our discussion about the contract planner.

[49:19] Nate, is that you?

[49:22] Just a quick update to say that a reminder that the new code went into effect on the 20th last Friday.

[49:29] And the grant has been closed out and final reimbursement received from DOLA, so there was a, I can kind of give you a final report here on what's been spent.

[49:50] And

[49:57] while I'm doing that, the code updates for the short term rental and the new land use

[50:05] have been sent to Munich code for updating on our online platform.

[50:19] So basically the total spend with Austin was $14,566.50 total project spend was

[50:47] $46,000.

[50:52] So basically to this date, basically the town had spent half of that. So Dola was doing a 50% match. So the town contributed 23,000 three dollars and 57 cents. Dola essentially matched that and that all of that reimbursement has been received.

[51:13] The town has received funds from the Kirkpatrick family foundation as well to cover that portion that the town spent.

[51:26] So obviously the second half of that project was very efficient and appreciated Austin's professionalism and efficiency with that.

[51:37] And that's where I'm leaving it. So any questions on that? Yeah, and I'm asking the question then. So with the Kirk Patrick money, then actually the town didn't have to pay anything.

[51:58] And we really appreciate you coming coming in this evening, Nate, to go over all this. I know your last day was Friday, so we appreciate that very much.

[52:12] Robona.

[52:12] Um, well, we might want to get this last application across and perhaps I'll be at the next board meeting. We'll see how comfortable.

[52:25] Bow is with or Becky to present it.

[52:29] I think at our last thanks for being here Nate at our last planning commission meeting.

[52:34] There was discussion about the new map, the land use map, and I think Austin said he would get with you offline to figure out the process on that.

[52:45] Has that been passed over to go to kind of tie it up?

[52:51] No, I mean, I could do some GIS work perhaps for the town, if Bo's not comfortable doing that or Becky, I don't know if the actual project in GIS, I don't know that we have that for the existing land use map.

[53:15] I don't know who put that together. That was Logan Simpson. Okay. We may be able to get that from them. They've been pretty good about sharing. And in fact, it may be in that download of files that we received from them. I just haven't really looked specifically, but it wouldn't be too hard to recreate and then obviously update just the new zone.

[53:37] So I'll just bring him that up because it still needs to be completed.

[53:42] That needs to be kept on our agenda to make sure that that unfolds with the cracks.

[53:47] Yes.

[53:48] So what's our next step on that?

[53:54] Probably contacting Austin and just following through with that.

[54:00] That's for the rezoning correct.

[54:01] Yes.

[54:02] Yeah, so I would suggest that since Austin helped us through that.

[54:06] The land use code he's familiar with the project, it'll be most efficient that we utilize his services to help get that rezoning adopted.

[54:15] And probably I don't want to put too much of the planner duties on bow while he's I agree.

[54:22] So I think I would like to work with Austin and the contract planner to ensure that that's accomplished.

[54:28] Okay, all right, we'll just keep it.

[54:31] Rockle will remind us or we'll keep it in front of mine that that makes sure that you are to do list. Thank you. Yes.

[54:38] I have one more note I've forgotten.

[54:41] I hate to jump around tonight, but one other question on the pump station.

[54:48] It was brought to my attention that they're using corrugated metal, which I don't think is maybe to code for that area.

[54:57] does anybody know old codes if there were restrictions on materials? It's not the earth colors or the

[55:06] earth kinds of materials that I think was in the old code.

[55:15] That was for sighting or roofing as I

[55:17] remember.

[55:23] I think yeah, I think it's another proposal.

[55:28] Not the building. Yeah.

[55:51] So prohibited. Okay. So is that something that we can address with CSU because that's not going to meet our codes? I will bring it up with them. Okay.

[56:00] I thought that got changed because metal roof became popular. It used to save.

[56:08] Well, whether it got changed or not, this was passed under old codes.

[56:12] That's gone now.

[56:22] Sorry, are you going to dress that with them?

[56:24] I'll bring it up and see how they like. I just let them know that that's something

[56:27] that we notice in it. It doesn't meet our code. Right, it doesn't meet the code.

[56:30] But I think, I think though the section in the code looks like it may be dealing with

[56:37] Fencing? Well, you know, about 16.

[56:41] Yeah.

[56:45] They talk about

[56:46] Fencing.

[56:48] They talked about the periods.

[56:50] Like that.

[56:51] Fencing.

[57:00] Fencing.

[57:08] Fencing.

[57:09] So that specific area to me reads like it's fencing.

[57:21] Well, they could do something that would look nice.

[57:25] I'll bring it up and I'll have Austin review that and make a recommendation as well.

[57:30] Okay. Thank you.

[57:32] All right.

[57:33] So I did want to address Mr. Price's statement about the sign just because it was definitely an accurate.

[57:39] I saved a photo on my phone when I posted that and I was on October 28th and the meeting he was

[57:47] speaking about, I think he came in before, right before, after the board meeting, which was on

[57:56] November 15th. So, anyway, so the sign was up. But no, October 12th was our meeting, correct?

[58:04] No, November 8th was our meeting.

[58:13] Okay, thank you for addressing that.

[58:18] All right, unless there's any other old business that needs to be brought up,

[58:23] we can move to our discussion about the contract plan or scope of services.

[58:31] And Bow was kind enough to provide to us the ad.

[58:40] I don't think it made it into our packet, but I don't think it made it into your packet.

[58:46] He emailed out the posting that we put and I didn't realize that it didn't have the

[58:51] job description.

[58:53] No, it didn't.

[58:53] So, I have emailed you the job description and I have printed copies.

[58:57] It'll have that.

[58:58] Did it come from you, Becky?

[58:59] Yeah, from me.

[59:01] And you have copies for us as well?

[59:03] Yes, indeed.

[59:04] Wonderful.

[59:05] Thank you.

[59:45] I'll give everybody a minute to look it over.

[59:51] Is it possible to put it on the screen where the zooms can see it?

[59:57] Did you copy the clerk?

[59:58] Okay.

[1:00:00] Thank you. Did you say this is the same as the thing on the website? Or has it been changed a little bit? So this is the copy that we revised in May. I want to say I think that's what's at the top of there. And we did post this on the website when we were recruiting recruiting for a planner and then determined that it was probably best that Nate stay in that capacity to see us through the land use code rewrite.

[1:00:29] right? So we ended up taking it down. Nate was gracious with his time and energy.

[1:00:37] And I'll remind the commission that it was our strong recommendation to the BOT that

[1:00:45] we felt like they didn't need to hire a part-time planner that a contract planner would serve

[1:00:53] our needs and as we are looking at part-time plan or contract planers we need to have a scope of services to present to them so that they understand what we are expecting and we need to understand so we have all the same expectations on both sides.

[1:01:16] Is there anything in the budget for this position?

[1:01:19] Excellent question.

[1:01:25] So in talking to a couple of different contract planners

[1:01:28] that are familiar working in this capacity with communities,

[1:01:31] they have some recommended ways in which we are able to build into the fee schedule

[1:01:37] and absorb a majority of the cost of the contract planner through the applications.

[1:01:43] That was there. That's what they suggest. However, it would mean that our fees to our applicants are significantly higher than what towns people have been used to paying.

[1:02:00] And so that was a huge concern to me because I don't want to have something that's so prohibitive that people are not ever going to come and and do things right and make applications as they're supposed to do.

[1:02:18] Well, it ties in with our discussion we just had we you don't want to make things burdensome on the applicant.

[1:02:27] To where nobody wants to do anything or at least do anything on the books right.

[1:02:32] They want to serve event the process if it becomes prohibited.

[1:02:36] So we had just talked about that.

[1:02:39] We did.

[1:02:40] We did just talk about that tonight.

[1:02:42] So that was a huge concern of mine.

[1:02:45] I mean, you're talking about making up for not only the salary,

[1:02:49] but then travel expenses on top of that.

[1:02:51] So it's pretty expensive.

[1:02:53] Becky, are you saying there's nothing in the budget?

[1:02:56] So all the costs has to be recovered from fees.

[1:03:00] Not entirely.

[1:03:01] We did put in a little bit for a part-time person

[1:03:04] in whatever capacity ends up needing to be.

[1:03:09] And you know, I think what we need to do is kind of look at what a typical application we select a planner we look at what a typical application is going to what how much time it's going to require and look at what that fee is going to be and it could we could, you know, use the simple variance as an example in talking to one of the contract planners, she had said that

[1:03:36] But another thing that they suggest communities do, and she sent over an example from the

[1:03:45] town of Morrison, but that they take a deposit from, you know, the town would take a deposit

[1:03:51] from the applicant, and then any unused portion would be refunded.

[1:03:57] Process ends up being really nice, because it encourages applicants to be very efficient

[1:04:03] make sure that they get their documents in and it encourages efficiency. So as we go into this,

[1:04:13] I think it just ends up being a further conversation and if we feel as though the cost that's passed

[1:04:19] on to the applicant is outside of what's typical or burdensome, that's something that the board can

[1:04:29] review. To Mike's question, what was the amount that

[1:04:34] y'all have put aside so far? Please stand by.

[1:04:39] Well, she's looking at that. Nate did have it pulled up.

[1:04:44] So there's a combination of there's $10,000 for part time labor,

[1:04:50] and there's another 15 in the professional services.

[1:04:55] I think that 15 was for our accounting.

[1:04:57] Yeah, but that that 10,000 can help to offset some of that Nate, were you performing this function up to this point?

[1:05:08] Yes. Any reason why bouquet is

[1:05:16] that in his job description?

[1:05:17] It is not in his job description. Nate was actually doing one and a half positions worth of work.

[1:05:25] the benefit and the reason why that that was able to be accomplished was that Nate was familiar. He'd been the town planner before he took on the clerk and treasure role.

[1:05:35] I think that at least initially it is something that is I don't want to cut off one hand to make the other hand bigger.

[1:05:46] I'd like to allow both the opportunity to settle into his his primary position before taking on

[1:05:52] anything additionally.

[1:05:58] And I should say I had experienced with the clerk and treasure job as well

[1:06:02] before so I hit the ground running in all respects so it's not easy to to do to get caught up with

[1:06:10] everything so I learn everything from scratch. So the answer to Mike's question is 10,000 is that correct?

[1:06:17] As

[1:06:23] far as looking at this job description for part-time planner, a lot of tasks are administrative, updating the website.

[1:06:38] The agenda is the minutes, things like that.

[1:06:42] First point of contact would probably be staff here.

[1:06:45] Right. So, I guess the question would be out of these tasks, which are the ones, the administrative ones that don't need to be outsourced.

[1:06:54] and eat at that $10,000 for the planner.

[1:07:07] Are any of these in those job description,

[1:07:10] any of these administrative functions?

[1:07:15] So you'll notice that some of the language in there

[1:07:17] is very boilerplate of all positions.

[1:07:20] And I do agree that first point of contact,

[1:07:24] the updating the website, those are not things

[1:07:26] that we would contract out.

[1:07:28] Those are things that we would continue to do here internally.

[1:07:31] I think that really rather than identify the things that they wouldn't do, I think it would be better to approach this from the standpoint of what are the critical functions that we would need them to do.

[1:07:45] I mean, be the serving is the first point of contact, a part time person is going to be

[1:07:50] able to do that.

[1:07:52] Somebody walks in here and has a problem with that.

[1:07:54] Well, and that's exactly what we looked at it.

[1:07:56] If somebody's bringing in their application, they need to be able to hand them to a staff person,

[1:08:01] the staff person to compile them and put them into a folder for evaluation from the contract

[1:08:06] planner.

[1:08:07] So there is going to be a staff role that is played here, certainly.

[1:08:10] Well, and as I saw the job description for Bo, he's serving as Planning Commission's secretary,

[1:08:18] just as was previously done.

[1:08:21] And he'll be posting our agenda and creating our agenda, you know, within cooperation.

[1:08:29] And so a lot of those administrative things, as Rocco just talked about, are he is going to be handling.

[1:08:36] Exactly. And so as I look through the second page under essential functions, number two

[1:08:44] seems to be something a contract planner would do. I guess the question here, Rocco and for all

[1:08:50] of us is we had talked about that members of the commission could do some of the simpler things.

[1:09:00] And so it's really going to just be and I don't know if we want to list of examples of what's more complicated, but it's just going to probably be the more complicated things that we're going to need the contract planner for can you do you have language for that.

[1:09:17] I don't have language work, but, you know, looking at my marked copy of the new land use code table five one talks about the table of review procedures, right?

[1:09:28] So it talks about the minor site plan and the approval levels.

[1:09:32] I think the major site plan would be something we would potentially want the contract planner assistance with rezoning and variances.

[1:09:46] So that's, you know, that's just to scratch the surface, but probably to frame our discussion looking at that table in the new land use code. I think the minor site plan.

[1:09:58] It may be a combination of staff and maybe a volunteer commissioner, who's identified to assist conditional use.

[1:10:09] I think the procedures are outlined pretty well in the new land use code.

[1:10:13] I think the major site plan, the variants and the rezoning would be three specific instances

[1:10:21] where we would want a contract planner review and oversight.

[1:10:29] I think we ought to have time to look over this list of essential functions and try to figure

[1:10:35] out what maybe we can get bow to do, what we would do.

[1:10:39] and what Bob would do anyway in part of his job description and then come back and try to figure out

[1:10:47] what you, I hope, of these functions you'd have to hire somebody to do. Because I don't think

[1:10:54] we need to add much to the budget. Do we have time to do that? I would like to do it tonight if we

[1:11:02] could. Simply because I know Becky's anxious to get somebody in the role because we need to

[1:11:07] that we don't need to have applications coming in

[1:11:09] with people not ready to manage them.

[1:11:13] And so we need to get a plan as soon as we can.

[1:11:17] And I don't think this is tough.

[1:11:18] I think what you've described, Rocco is good.

[1:11:22] Placed a start.

[1:11:25] Becky, do you have other things

[1:11:26] that you think of that you think are important?

[1:11:28] Yeah, absolutely.

[1:11:29] I'm glad you asked things.

[1:11:31] In addition to this, you guys have a beautiful,

[1:11:34] brand new land use code.

[1:11:36] So I, and working with a professional planner, other areas that you think that implementing

[1:11:46] the plan they could be supportive, how can they support you in implementing that new

[1:11:50] land use code as one thing.

[1:11:54] And then also, I think that the other benefit of having a contract planner is what other

[1:12:00] educational resources. Can they help to coordinate some trainings? Those types of things to help support you and your roles and staff and our roles as well as we implement this. So, please don't limit it to just, you know, review of applications, but are there other areas that we feel like we could benefit from from their expertise.

[1:12:22] Can you give an example of supporting us in the implementation of the new code something specific because I I mean after going through this process probably we know the code so well more than maybe the average commission would so I think as far as rolling it out announcing help and put together some some information for the public maybe just some some quick snippets of

[1:12:51] And that could be, you know, materials that we could have digitally online reviewing the process that we have and I think part of it is maybe we don't know what we don't know there's some things that they have learned in other communities that they think might be beneficial here as well.

[1:13:10] So I don't know that it has to be purely defined as part of a scope of service typical thing in those particular situations we can address individually.

[1:13:21] But I do think certainly ongoing training for even seasoned planning commission members isn't a bad thing.

[1:13:29] And we can get that at no charge with Dola, right?

[1:13:36] And I did look into the the gal that does the planning

[1:13:40] and the cool said that they did help put that together.

[1:13:44] Right.

[1:13:45] The gal from Dola was on maternity leave for a majority

[1:13:50] of December into January.

[1:13:52] I believe that she's back on staff now,

[1:13:57] but I was trying to give her a little bit of space.

[1:14:00] I can reach out and follow through.

[1:14:03] It's just a matter of scheduling.

[1:14:04] I know that they're on a tight schedule.

[1:14:06] They're working with several different communities,

[1:14:08] so it ends up being timeliness as well.

[1:14:11] Well, I kind of like free.

[1:14:12] I do too.

[1:14:13] And we get the benefit of McCool having done it

[1:14:17] rather than having to pay for it with her.

[1:14:19] Absolutely.

[1:14:20] So I think that's, if you would talk to them,

[1:14:26] whatever is convenient that would be helpful. So we maybe don't want to add educational

[1:14:33] trainings because we know places we can get that for free. Our 10,000 to me needs to since we have

[1:14:40] such very little money needs to really be focused on the contract plan or doing the contract planning

[1:14:46] work and we'll have to figure out how to do other things. Now Austin had his wonderful presentations

[1:14:53] for BOT and the public who we just take some of his bullet points and

[1:15:00] Does disseminate those to the public? I think that's a good idea. That's a great point.

[1:15:09] So just looking through, I'm sorry, the essential functions, you know, probably two thirds of these are administrative in scope. That doesn't mean it's going to fall on the clerk treasurer. It may be the planning commissioners volunteer and assist with posting on the website or, you know,

[1:15:31] looking at agendas, things like that, but the fifth bullet, which is interprets and applies applicable codes and regulations, including the town's municipal code provisions and relevant state federal laws.

[1:15:45] So the fifth bullet under essential functions, I think, would be essential.

[1:16:04] So that would be kind of the grunt work and you'd have to have some experience. And then the one after that preparing the staff report staff recommendations, producing reports supplemental material and presentations to planning commission and board.

[1:16:20] trustees. So I think those would be very helpful especially with the scope of major site plans,

[1:16:27] variances and rezoning.

[1:16:33] I have one. Yes. If you read on down it says attend planning commission

[1:16:39] meetings and ensures the minutes are properly recorded so on. And then on down serves as a liaison

[1:16:48] on between the planning commission board of trustees

[1:16:51] and other ministries for 20 hours a week.

[1:16:54] That's a lot of meetings that person's going to have to go to.

[1:16:58] Well, I think that it's in Bose job description

[1:17:02] to do the meeting minutes.

[1:17:05] That's what I read in his job description.

[1:17:09] And also the properly recorded related to the town board,

[1:17:13] signed an archive.

[1:17:14] I think he can handle all of that.

[1:17:16] and serves as a liaison between all of these groups.

[1:17:19] I think is also in both job description, I believe.

[1:17:23] So the contract planner wouldn't be here tonight.

[1:17:27] Maybe by Zoom and especially to make recommendations

[1:17:30] and to present, you know, similar to, you know,

[1:17:35] what Nate's been doing all this time,

[1:17:36] where he goes through and his packet that he's provided us

[1:17:41] and answers our questions and those kinds of things.

[1:17:43] I would see the contract person doing that, potentially by Zoom, I had a lot of heartburn

[1:17:49] over the travel fees that we, when we talked to groups.

[1:17:57] We don't know yet what we're going to be paying.

[1:18:00] We don't know yet what the prices are going to be for $42.

[1:18:05] We are still interviewing and looking at people and getting pricing, and so far we can't afford

[1:18:11] anybody we've talked to.

[1:18:12] So we're still working on it and you mentioned 20 hours a week for $10,000.

[1:18:20] We're not going to get someone consistently here for five to 10 hours a week.

[1:18:25] I think we have to we have to use this person sparingly for the situations that we can't handle with with bows.

[1:18:35] You know.

[1:18:36] We didn't have much time.

[1:18:38] We used to do that more.

[1:18:39] We did.

[1:18:40] I thought we did.

[1:18:42] I mean, things have gotten more complicated.

[1:18:45] However, the land use code has gotten more simplified.

[1:18:48] That's good.

[1:18:49] And you don't have to do.

[1:18:52] Well, I mean, potentially I can rule out volunteering, you know, to help.

[1:18:57] Yeah, I would.

[1:18:58] And Rocco, you got table five one in front of you.

[1:19:01] It says, the staff does minors and then the planning commission approves it and then there's nothing for the board.

[1:19:13] I remember right.

[1:19:18] It's.

[1:19:19] Yeah, so for the minor, the review and decision was with staff and the planning commission was the appeal.

[1:19:28] Okay, so in that case, we would need to make sure that no planning commissioners would be involved in the in the initial because you can't do both can't be on the design and approval and appeal.

[1:19:44] I would also say for flexibility if you identify who that commissioner is for the initial review and decision.

[1:19:54] They recuse them. Yeah, you know, and you also have the ability to create a basically a subcommittee.

[1:20:03] I remember right?

[1:20:05] Subcommittee.

[1:20:06] A subcommittee that would.

[1:20:09] Planning commission.

[1:20:11] So yeah, just keep that in mind.

[1:20:14] Because we have so many volunteers who can't wait to do this.

[1:20:17] So

[1:20:22] I do want to, you know,

[1:20:24] prep us this in the both bow.

[1:20:27] And I have some experience in land use planning

[1:20:31] and in different communities and with different projects,

[1:20:34] probably from different very different angles of projects.

[1:20:38] But, you know, in a typical winter,

[1:20:43] we don't have a ton of applications.

[1:20:45] My biggest concern ends up being in the spring and summer time

[1:20:49] when people are coming forward doing projects,

[1:20:52] that that's when I think that this contract planner function

[1:20:56] is going to become the most critical.

[1:20:59] That great.

[1:21:01] Absolutely.

[1:21:05] So do we feel like we've gotten enough of a skeleton of something

[1:21:13] that we could present to somebody as far as a scope of services?

[1:21:17] And we've sort of outlined roles here.

[1:21:23] Are there any other comments from other commissioners that you want to see included our questions.

[1:21:28] Right now we're talking about the three that Rocco mentioned.

[1:21:31] Well, actually, he mentioned one, two, three, four.

[1:21:35] The second point, the fifth point, the eighth point, and the ninth point.

[1:21:40] Actually, I'm the one who mentioned the second point, but.

[1:21:43] Anyway, those four to me.

[1:21:44] is

[1:21:49] number two. Number two from a planning part-time planning profession coordinating reviewing analyzing

[1:21:59] evaluating. Well is that something that that Bose able to do he would certainly be the first point

[1:22:05] of contact and there probably needs to be somebody that's sort of the traffic manager and Bose sending

[1:22:16] stuff to us. I think this is more minor. Y'all can handle this, and this is more major. We'll

[1:22:22] send it to the contractor, but the part of staff review processing, planning commission

[1:22:30] action. I see that contract person being involved in that piece, and especially, you know,

[1:22:37] with the, with the BOT as well. I don't know, what are your thoughts on that?

[1:22:45] It could probably

[1:22:46] be stated better.

[1:22:53] That's looks like a process.

[1:22:55] I think that's about an administrative process function that I don't think we need to hire

[1:23:00] somebody to do.

[1:23:06] I think we got to call them in when we need them, but not have them manage

[1:23:09] the process and be involved in every little thing that goes on.

[1:23:12] Sure. And I think what Lamar what you just outlined is Bo is kind of the probably traffic

[1:23:17] call. Yeah. This goes here. This goes there. So and that's most of what that second

[1:23:24] bullet is getting at. Okay, so let's leave it to the three then, five, eight, and nine,

[1:23:32] in the minor site, the major site plan, rezoning, and variances. And if some, you know,

[1:23:40] obviously the CSU gigantic project was something that a planner would need to do,

[1:23:45] if anything else came up, that was a big thing like that.

[1:23:51] And, you know, the variance for the carport is probably something we don't need to pay big bucks for if it's cut and dried and between us or staff can do the research and take some photos.

[1:24:07] I think it's totally under control of Grinnell Falls.

[1:24:11] Basically, the cardboard and the variances and all the bill have to worry about.

[1:24:16] Pikes to building.

[1:24:20] She's asking about.

[1:24:23] Be sure to use your microphone.

[1:24:25] She's asking about where Pikes Peak comes in.

[1:24:28] And is this completely the purview of Grinnell Falls?

[1:24:34] So regional building.

[1:24:37] they are involved with their conflict.

[1:24:40] Well, I mean, there's situations where we can,

[1:24:44] do we still stamp things, Nate,

[1:24:46] or is that done all electronically

[1:24:47] if we're approving something?

[1:24:50] Yeah, there's a Pikes Peak Regional has a dashboard

[1:24:53] that we do a electronic stamp on after it's approved,

[1:24:57] after it goes through the necessary approvals on our side.

[1:25:00] And someone has to have access to that,

[1:25:04] to on our network basically. Well, but we would want to have to pay a contract planner to do that administrative function of putting a stamp on it on the dashboard.

[1:25:16] That's something Bo could do, right? Yeah, it's, I mean, as long as, yeah, it's approved and yeah, he's aware of the approvals. It's just a, it's really quick.

[1:25:26] So the queue for regional is that point and they know that we have approved it.

[1:25:30] Right. And we receive an email.

[1:25:33] If anything pops up there, so that's another check on things like say someone

[1:25:40] pulls a permit for a garage, but they didn't know they had to come to the town as well.

[1:25:46] It's possible. Sometimes it's shown up on PySpeak Regional. I get an email. Oh wow.

[1:25:51] I didn't know anything was going on in that address.

[1:25:54] And then that then can prompt the town process to get a hold of them and say, oh, by the way, you need to go through town zoning and sometimes, you know, regional hit or miss about when they notify someone about that it just all depends on how that.

[1:26:12] That interaction goes, but anyway, it goes both ways.

[1:26:20] And Nate, since you've been doing this, do you have any other comments or suggestions?

[1:26:24] suggestions. No, I think that. Does that sound right? Yeah, I think everything's been pretty

[1:26:31] accurate. I think, you know, most of the variances are more simple like the one we had tonight

[1:26:39] that, but I do think that there's a slippery slope of going down the road of handing out variances

[1:26:50] without maybe, you know, proof of hardship, you know, like we talked about. And sometimes,

[1:26:58] you know, that could be, that could get into a situation of relationships in town. And I think

[1:27:06] that in that case, you know, somewhat a neutral party could be very helpful in that regard to kind

[1:27:13] of keep everything standardized. If that's a concern, it may not be a concern, but I felt like

[1:27:19] It wasn't a concern for me, but that was me.

[1:27:22] Someone else could have thought that it was a concern based on their view of me.

[1:27:29] But anyway, so just in that small town environment, it's very easy to have those perceptions and all that.

[1:27:38] So that would be another thing to just overall idea to consider with a plan or contract planner,

[1:27:48] or especially a firm that is established

[1:27:50] that could give the town consistency, you know, move forward.

[1:27:55] That would be nice if we had that kind of money.

[1:27:57] Yeah, well.

[1:27:59] So why don't I put the notes together

[1:28:01] that we've discussed tonight, circulate them tomorrow

[1:28:04] if anybody has changes or comments on it

[1:28:08] and otherwise that'll be our scope of services.

[1:28:11] Thank you.

[1:28:12] Appreciate it.

[1:28:13] Sure.

[1:28:14] Thank you.

[1:28:15] All right.

[1:28:16] Thanks.

[1:28:17] Back to our agenda. I think this was our last our

[1:28:32] agenda.

[1:28:39] So one more thing on hiring the contract planner.

[1:28:43] What procedure should we go through?

[1:28:47] We have to notice meetings if all of us are in them.

[1:28:51] So Becky and Lisa and I have been talking to various ones.

[1:28:56] And then I think maybe if we get a finalist,

[1:28:59] What should we bring them before the whole planning commission and in the essence of

[1:29:05] saving time?

[1:29:06] Yes.

[1:29:07] What I would suggest doing is let's do a joint meeting between the board of trustees

[1:29:10] and the planning commission and what we can do is just have them kind of come in, give

[1:29:15] a presentation, we can walk through, you know, what developing that MOU would look like,

[1:29:23] the pricing, the fee schedule, and we'll schedule a work session.

[1:29:27] Okay, so the fee schedule that y'all are already working on will play into this whole program, but again, we cannot get those real real high.

[1:29:40] Absolutely, I totally agree. I don't want to be a burden on anybody that's trying to make their home or their situation better.

[1:29:48] So will we have a chance to look at that fee schedule before it's presented to BOT?

[1:29:53] Um, but I think we should do it together. Okay.

[1:30:00] But before we all get together to interview the potential contract planner, correct? We're going to sort of finalize those fee schedule. I would like the contract planner to discuss how that works with everybody so that they can explain it better than I'm able to. This is my first experience doing this type of contract workout. Yeah. And so therefore, I would like them to be able to paint the picture of what it would actually look like if we were doing a simple variance.

[1:30:28] and they were having to review it,

[1:30:31] how much would it end up costing the applicant?

[1:30:34] And we'll just look at a typical situation

[1:30:37] and then be able to explain that and we'll go from there.

[1:30:43] So the fees will be worked out in a work session with us

[1:30:47] and with BOT and with the potential contract plan.

[1:30:51] Is that an, am I understanding you?

[1:30:53] I think let's have that conversation.

[1:30:55] the fee schedule will not be adopted during the work session.

[1:31:00] But let's discuss what we think is reasonable.

[1:31:02] The board can take that into consideration and move from there.

[1:31:09] I think the next step is a joint work session.

[1:31:12] Okay.

[1:31:15] Any other comments, questions, suggestions, anybody?

[1:31:20] I do have a comment. I am reminded or told bow about this, but every committee is supposed

[1:31:27] to annually do their officer elections, and I forgot about it for this agenda. So just

[1:31:33] be thinking about that. I reminded bow to add it, put a bookmark in it, or a placeholder

[1:31:39] for next meeting. So something to think about as well as all the other, well, the two other

[1:31:45] committees so okay good thanks thanks for the reminder Todd yeah something to think about

[1:31:53] you know hopefully since you might have some more time now and you're not dealing with

[1:31:58] as many applications you might want to consider reviewing appendix B and seeing of

[1:32:06] of our comprehensive plan and seeing if we got recommendations based upon that.

[1:32:12] Did you say the whole thing or did you mention appendix be appendix B? Yeah

[1:32:20] They kind of list the capital improvement programs that they were initially. Is that online?

[1:32:26] Yes, this is online. I just happen to have a nice bound copy

[1:32:31] I'll send out a link to everybody's at the top of your mailbox. Okay. Thank you. Anything else?

[1:32:39] What did you want us to do? Just look at it.

[1:32:45] See if we have suggestions for planning because he's wanting us to plan.

[1:32:50] Lisa.

[1:32:51] I just want to thank Nate and welcome both.

[1:32:57] So.

[1:32:57] Thank you.

[1:32:59] It's great working with you all.

[1:33:00] Good luck.

[1:33:02] Five of you.

[1:33:03] Appreciate it.

[1:33:04] Thank you all.

[1:33:06] Absolutely.

[1:33:06] Thank you for doing a job in a half-nate.

[1:33:09] Yes.

[1:33:10] You're welcome. Good luck down there in the big city. We'll miss you. All right. Our meeting

[1:33:19] being stands adjourned.

[1:33:24] Yes.

[1:33:26] She was fighting.

[1:33:28] I'm not sure.

[1:33:29] You had a job trying to talk to keep the two.

[1:33:33] Now.

[1:33:35] Yeah, I did.

[1:33:36] I think.

[1:33:37] I still have to.

[1:33:38] I'm going to try to.

[1:33:41] Smartly.

[1:33:42] I was in a few.

[1:33:44] Heather.

[1:33:45] Heather.

[1:33:46] I'm going to try.

[1:33:49] Heather.

[1:33:51] and we had a good night, so it's like two things, because not a lot of people, you know,

[1:33:56] who we should really come to.

Green Mountain Falls, CO meeting

Transcript