[0:00] All those in favor. >> All right, let's get this party started.

[0:08] » I'd rather dig up earthworms and count them than deal with me.

[0:13] » Maybe even eat them. >> I'd eat them at this point. I just

[0:16] They're just It's just >> I mean, I was hoping that our plan to

[0:20] get to the point where we don't have to

[0:36] No, they're all

[0:41] » I don't think

[0:55] » [cough]

[1:02] » John.

[1:09] » Well, he had he had

[1:20] » [clears throat]

[1:52] [clears throat]

[2:17] » It's not

[2:34] too much. How yall doing?

[2:49] » I got one more.

[2:54] Sorry.

[3:00] » Yeah. All right.

[3:19] No screen.

[3:23] » Did you have a flash drive? >> Yeah, we did. We have to be made aware

[3:28] before get our No, that's okay. [snorts]

[3:31] » It is usually in here though, right?

[3:38] All

[4:05] right, here come

[4:09] All right, this is our 11:30 appeal. The appellant Kenneth Jones from GF Coast

[4:14] Development and Design LLC is appealing the planning commission denial of case

[4:18] number 2606 HC 157 requesting a conditional use permit to allow for a

[4:25] 230 lot single family residential subdivision on 150 acre parcel on West

[4:30] Worm Road. Abalore and tax partial number is 0504

[4:35] 34002.0000

[4:39] and 050433 uh- 001.0000

[4:46] hearing before the Harrison County Planning Commission was the time when

[4:50] the applicant andor and object OB objectors were given the opportunity to

[4:56] make a record in support of their respective positions. Since the

[4:59] appellant has exercised his right to appeal the planning commission ruling to

[5:03] the Harris County Board of Supervisors, only the record made before the planning

[5:07] commission and order arguments will be considered by the board of supervisors.

[5:10] Both appellent and opposition [clears throat]

[5:14] are allowed 30 minutes. Uh the appellant uh will be allowed a

[5:20] fiveminute rebuttal. The appellant or opposition will address [snorts] any

[5:25] board questions. then the board will render its decision. I'm recommending

[5:29] that since both appeals are dealing with the same property and appellant

[5:33] recommend hearing both appeals together. And if the first appeal fails, the

[5:38] second appeal would be a move point.

[5:43] » All right. If you'll be the keeper of the clock,

[5:44] » I will call the first who's going first and how long.

[5:50] » All right, Mr. Jones. How long does Mr. Jones have?

[5:53] » 30 minutes. >> Yes, ma'am. Um, Mr. Jones, do you agree

[5:57] to combine both the fields? >> Yes.

[6:02] » And, uh, I'll be speaking for a little while. Um, Andy Felen will be joining me

[6:09] and then we our attorney as well. So, u, thank you all for having me here today.

[6:15] I guess I don't need to say my name and address for the record.

[6:19] But um so we're here today um not to request a

[6:24] reim um but only a conditional use. So as a matter of law and public record,

[6:31] the land use of this property, it's already been settled. Um this property

[6:35] has been zoned R1 since 2007 when it was designated for residential growth

[6:41] alongside the surrounding parcels. that zoning remains in full legal effect,

[6:46] does not expire, does not revert. Under the R1, the right to build single

[6:52] family residential homes on this land has already been established and is

[6:56] allowed by right. We're not here to litigate zoning, debate public need, or

[7:03] evaluate a change in character neighborhood. That's [clears throat]

[7:06] already been done. Property literally a bust of land for West Wam Middle and

[7:11] Elementary School. I've heard many discussions with the planning

[7:14] commission, the board opposition and developers like myself over the last

[7:19] several years to this this room and other rooms like it and I cannot recall

[7:23] a time where anyone has ever suggested that residential housing should not go

[7:29] next to an elementary or middle school. In fact, this is likely the most logical

[7:34] place to have a residential development that y'all have ever heard as far as an

[7:39] appeal case. um for the conditional use which does so the com the conditional

[7:46] use permit does revert back and pro no progress is made in two years and that's

[7:51] the reason why we're here but for this conditional use we must show that our

[7:55] site plan conforms to the concepts in the UDC

[7:59] and you'll see from our our presentation that it not only meets those

[8:04] requirements exceeds [clears throat] them in every instance

[8:08] um on the next page of that presentation that I gave to you guys. Um, on the

[8:14] zoning map, it says this parcel doesn't sit in isolation. So, as I mentioned a

[8:19] second ago, in 2007, this property and the contiguous tracks immediately to the

[8:25] east and west of this parcel were approved as a master plan community of

[8:30] 780 lots or 780 homes. and uh this R red one designation that's right there

[8:37] adjacent to this this that boundary. Um so directly north to the of our site

[8:44] established single family residential neighborhoods with hundreds of homes. So

[8:49] I'm sure all of you have driven out there and know what I'm talking about,

[8:51] but Edgewood has about 165 lots. Magnolia Heights has 180 lots. Shady

[8:58] Hills has 92 lots. And as you travel further east back towards Highway 49,

[9:04] you have development and residential on both sides of the streets. You have Worm

[9:08] Estates, Twin Lakes, Robinwood, Woram Heights. Again, hundreds of single

[9:14] family residential lots. Um, and I've driven out there. I'm sure there are

[9:21] several places that maybe have a horse or something like that on Westworth. I

[9:26] haven't really seen them, but there's very very few places driving on

[9:31] Westworth and from Highway 49 getting to this property that there's any

[9:35] agricultural land whatsoever. Um, also our property borders C2

[9:42] Commercial. There's a Dollar General and the top um the north west side of our

[9:48] property and there's a bunch of R2 zoning that's in the general area as

[9:52] well as you guys know is medium density residential and actually allows for

[9:56] duplexes. Um directly to the east again I'll mention this several times is uh

[10:00] the Westworth and middle and elementary school.

[10:04] Uh on the next page is the site plan for the previously

[10:09] approved 780 um lot development that was done in 2007.

[10:14] After this uh the the person who went through the process and who owned the

[10:18] land got sick um I think with cancer ended up losing the property to the

[10:23] bank. It ended up getting sold several times and then mostly got sold in some

[10:27] larger tracks to various people. Um to date only one other subdivision has been

[10:33] approved out of this track. It's the north uh northwest corner of this track.

[10:38] It was recently approved by this board and by the planning commission for 24

[10:42] 1/2 acre lots fronting west. Um which is actually pretty comparison to the larger

[10:49] lots and part of our property. And you can I want to point out some differences

[10:54] even between this which was approved and our current site plan. So we have uh the

[11:00] 2007 footprint has plotted lots directly into

[11:04] the wetlands. So the lot lines actually go into the wetlands requiring extensive

[11:08] fill and severe environmental disruption. Um our site plan however

[11:13] pulls back this development working with the natural topography rather than

[11:17] fighting it. And by steering clear of these wetlands intrusions and dedicating

[11:22] more open space and natural buffering, we're protect pro protecting the

[11:25] hydraology and delivering a superior drainage and storm water management

[11:29] system for the surrounding community. Um, as you can see from our site plan

[11:34] here, this a little 3D rendering of it. Um, we have curved streets that, uh,

[11:42] eliminate some of the monotony and track housing feel uh, by having these

[11:47] different lot sizes as well. So, we have some lots as we'll go into in a second

[11:51] that are 90 foot wide, some that are 75 foot wide. The 90 foot ones are about a

[11:55] half an acre each. But by having these different uh, lot sizes, it also allows

[12:00] for different housing footprints that also eliminates uh, monotony and avoids

[12:06] architectural monotony. Um, so we have generous undisturbed perimeter buffers

[12:12] on the east and west side through wetlands and we have a uh a 50ft buffer

[12:17] along the south side that'll guarantee zero access points to h Houston Liner

[12:22] Road or Gaylord route. We have dual entrances and interconnectivity in the

[12:28] subdivision to ensure emergency vehicle accessibility and neighborhood flow and

[12:33] walkability. and we have substantial open space. Um the platted community

[12:38] parks provide usable recreational areas for residents and we have dedicated

[12:44] easement access to go into the drainage areas to be make sure that those can be

[12:48] cleaned out man maintained over the life of the development.

[12:53] Um, as far as our site plan on the next page, [clears throat] uh, again pointing

[12:58] out the wetland buffers on the east and west side, you can see on the very

[13:02] bottom of that page, it has a, you see the dark green, which is our 50 foot

[13:07] buffer and the north west side the Dollar General and northeast side is the

[13:13] Westworm Elementary Middle School. Um, total site is about 150 acres. Almost a

[13:19] third of the property we're preserving in common areas and wetlands. Um parks

[13:24] is included in that as well. 230 lots with an average lot size of 17,300

[13:30] square ft. Um this next slide that has it has red

[13:35] and blue on there. Um has lot size details. Probably one of the more

[13:39] important slides. So, um, as we'll discuss a little bit more in detail

[13:44] later, there's a large demand for working middle class homes in Harrison

[13:50] County, especially in the unincorporated county. This current site plan will

[13:53] allow for multiple different price points. We have smaller lots, it'll be

[13:57] obviously a little cheaper, and then the larger lots a little bit more expensive.

[14:01] Um, in the blue area, we have home prices starting at $250,000. Obviously,

[14:06] all these are just estimates um for now, but this is what the our market research

[14:12] and plan is showing us right now all the lot sizes exceed the R1 zoning for

[14:19] Harrison County. So even though we qualify for the uh conservation

[14:24] subdivision according to the UDC we have to only we have to preserve 10% we're

[14:29] preserving 30%. None of our lots are smaller than 10,000 square feet or less

[14:33] than 75 foot wide. So we're not taking advantage of that conservation

[14:37] subdivision. So, we're exceeding it even though we qualify for it. That makes

[14:42] sense. Um, the red outlined area has average lot size of approximately a half

[14:49] an acre and are 90 foot wide. Um, the major thing to point out even with the

[14:53] blue area though is that some of these lots are even though they're just above

[14:57] the minimum 10,000 square feet, that's because none of our lots will have

[15:02] wetlands in them. Okay? So, we could have made those lots larger by just

[15:07] extending that that property line into the wetlands and saying that they're

[15:11] larger. Um, that's completely legal and but we've kept the wetlands out of the

[15:16] lot lines to ensure that they will be owned by the HOA and won't be able to be

[15:21] filled by the residents over time. I know that's something that has always

[15:24] been important to you guys and has had issues in the past, but that way with

[15:29] keeping them in the HOA, allow them not to be filled by residents over time and

[15:34] affect the natural drainage of the area. And just pay attention to the red and

[15:39] blue area. The red area has big bigger lots. The uh blue area has somewhat

[15:43] smaller lots. Um park areas. So we have two main park areas. There's some other

[15:50] areas that can could be utilized for parks, too. The park areas are very

[15:54] important to building a community and making sure that children and adults uh

[15:58] have gathering places and places to play. There are two areas that will be

[16:04] internally connected to the left and right side of the subdivision to allow

[16:08] for walkability. Um, and we've included some conceptual designs of these other

[16:13] park areas you can see around there. Um these can't be finalized until we have

[16:18] full engineering and have a home builder selected, but we've done very similar

[16:22] parks in other subdivisions and they've done very well. Um including that lake

[16:26] one we have a development in Gulport that has been really well received with

[16:31] the walking trail. Um as far as infrastructure, there's water and sewer

[16:36] along Weston Road and we do have a will server letter for that. There's a fire

[16:40] station that's right on the other side of the uh of the school and police and

[16:45] other emergency services are available as well. Education obviously we're right

[16:50] next to Westworth Elementary and Middle School and I'll mention again the

[16:55] environmental impact. We have less than a half an acre of wetland impacts on

[16:59] this whole site. So 150 acres with less than a half an acre of wetland impacts

[17:03] is is pretty huge. Um it's a lot better than the previous plan that was here.

[17:08] And one of the main reasons we even have a half an acre of wetland impacts is

[17:12] because we're making sure that the lots do not have any remaining wetlands on

[17:17] there, so they can't be buil filled at a later date.

[17:22] Um, as far as traffic and accessibility, there's a lot of uh discussion. Next

[17:26] couple slides are going to go on some things that were at the planning

[17:28] commission, but there's a lot of discussion at the planning commission

[17:31] about traffic and accessibility. Um, two things. One, I think the best thing for

[17:37] us to do is to get with engineering. They're the ones who determine as far as

[17:41] traffic and number one, what we could or couldn't do in a rideway and what's

[17:45] needed for the subdivision to ensure track traffic is good. And we commit to

[17:50] doing what they recommend. So, if the traffic studies needed, we could do

[17:55] that. if the uh and if we can just work with Jackie and her group, they do a

[17:59] great job and we can determine what's needed for this subdivision to ensure

[18:03] that traffic flows properly. I will say one thing that came up the meeting and

[18:08] I'm kind of bewildered by this, but the the tra there's no turning lane going

[18:15] into Westworth Elementary and Middle School. So, if we think that there's a

[18:21] one going into here is needed, why isn't there one in front of the middle school

[18:25] and elementary school? Cuz you want to talk about everybody coming to a

[18:29] location at the exact same time every day and leaving at the exact same time,

[18:32] that would be at a school and there is no turning lane there currently. So,

[18:37] either it's not needed or enough people [clears throat] haven't complained about

[18:40] it to get one put in, right? Um, I don't think 230 lots is going to change that

[18:45] compared to a middle school and an elementary school all getting up at the

[18:48] same time in and out at the same time. Um, we preserve 30oot green space along

[18:54] the front in case the county ever needs to widen outside of the current right

[18:58] away. They wouldn't have to imminent domain any homes. Um, connectivity again

[19:03] we have walk to ensure walkability. And for emergency access, we have a loop

[19:09] in this road and we have internet connectivity with walking trails um

[19:14] around parks and the mailbox. Um the next slide was about the G1 and

[19:21] G2 G corridor. So this was a huge discussion

[19:27] at the uh planning commission as well and

[19:31] whether it was in a G1 or G2. And I guess I my first contention is that

[19:37] number one I think it's irrelevant. Um I think this property was already zoned

[19:45] and let's see sorry first contingent that

[19:49] it's irrelevant. So the same year that those neighborhood plans came out from

[19:53] the comprehensive plan so associate comp plan comprehensive plan and all the rest

[20:00] of them. This property was actually reszoned R1 that exact same year. So

[20:07] whether it is or wasn't, I think, this is my personal belief, has no basis in

[20:11] opinion or or in fact of many or whatever, but I believe that they

[20:17] realize they made a mistake cuz why would anybody put a G1 next to a

[20:22] elementary and middle school with G1 across the street of it all the way to

[20:28] uh what is it? um social road and not have it on directly abuing the middle of

[20:35] elementary school. But the exact same year that those plans came out, they

[20:39] reszone this property and all the surrounding property almost two social

[20:44] road are one right um exact same year they res

[20:51] can't talk. We can't no ma'am. No, >> there'll be a turn for you. Not right

[20:55] now. >> Yes, sir.

[20:58] Um, I guess I'll address that. So, the plans

[21:02] came out, the community plans. It says April 2007. This property was reszoned

[21:07] in 2007. So, I don't know what else to provide for evidence as far as that's

[21:12] concerned. Um, however, I do want to defend myself briefly in this

[21:17] presentation. Um, as the opposition said, our presentation was full of lies.

[21:23] Um, number one, the property is split between the G1 and G2 growth cor. So,

[21:28] part of our property is in G1, part of it's in G2. Number two, we didn't find

[21:33] this out until after the presentation. Even members of the planning commission

[21:36] staff believe it was all in G2 at the time of the meeting. Number three, these

[21:40] maps are difficult to zoom in at a granular level to determine exactly

[21:44] where [clears throat] to where the property is. And to be honest, I don't

[21:47] think that's by accident. I don't think it's supposed to be exact. Um, and

[21:53] number four, uh, there was a subdivision, Liberty Ridge, that's I

[21:58] already talked about that's just on the northeast side of where we're talking

[22:00] about right now. It's part of that R1. Um, and it was recently approved for 90

[22:05] foot wide lots facing Westworth and Road that are approximately half an acre,

[22:09] just like some of our developments. Um, I did have a video and my fault

[22:15] completely for not having it to show you guys like kind of a Google Earth moving

[22:20] from Highway 49 all the way to this property and show you all the

[22:24] residential that's um that's surrounding there, but I kind of already said it a

[22:30] little bit earlier. I mean, there's hundreds of single family residential

[22:35] lots located directly across the street and all the way to Old 49.

[22:42] Um there are some recently approved subdivisions. Most of these you can look

[22:46] at it, but most of these are either smaller than ours um or the same size.

[22:51] There's even a commercial part of this property that there's been so much

[22:55] growth and there's so many residential subdivisions and neighborhood residents

[23:00] that there's not there's a Dollar General that got located on the

[23:04] northeast corner of our or northwest corner of our property. And there's

[23:08] actually um a family dollar that's right down the street. There's so much

[23:12] residential here, but you have a Dollar General and a Family Dollar that's in

[23:16] the area. Um as far as market analysis is

[23:21] concerned, I'm not going to spend a lot of time on this um because it really

[23:24] isn't relevant to today's conversation because we don't

[23:28] have to prove a public need for this hearing. Um, but as you can see, there

[23:33] is a clear public need for homes between 200 and $300,000

[23:39] in order to buy 10. Um, so there's a 2.1 month supply of inventory and the

[23:46] average days on market is 45 days and the median days on market is 19 days.

[23:52] And the only reason I bring it up is for importance is because our 75 foot wide

[23:57] lots are designed to be in that price point between 200 and $300,000 where

[24:02] there is the highest demand for these lots. Um I want to say as well because

[24:08] there's some conflicting information that the opposition brought up. These

[24:11] are not real numbers from realtor.com or trulia Brazil. These are from the

[24:16] Mississippi G Coast MLS. Okay. directly pulled from there right before our

[24:21] hearing. They're not from an arbitrary source. And I'm not saying they're not

[24:25] legitimate. I'm just saying this is directly from our Mississippi G Coast

[24:28] MLS. As far as economic welfare and value, um

[24:34] the average price point for homes within a 2-m radius of this site is 214,000.

[24:40] Our base price starts at $250,000. And um [music] therefore, of course,

[24:46] it's definitely not going to be a detriment to the economic welfare of the

[24:50] community. And I'm going to let Andy um discuss our various requests.

[24:57] » Hey, state your name and address for me, please.

[24:59] » Sure. Andy, 515 Hard Road, Ocean Springs, Mississippi. Uh I'll be doing

[25:04] the engineering on this project and talk quickly about the variance.

[25:08] So the variance request is if you are familiar with your type one, type two,

[25:12] type three subdivisions. Uh type two is simply you have water typically you

[25:19] would have a septic. We would not. We would have dedicated sewer uh gravity

[25:22] sewer system in there but uh type one tends to have curbon gutter with pipe

[25:27] drainage and type two tends to allow [music] for open ditches. So that's what

[25:30] we're requesting is the open ditch for 90 foot lots. Um, we're requesting this

[25:37] based on the physical characteristics of the natural drainage associated with

[25:41] this site. If y'all are on this sheet right here, and again, apologies, we

[25:45] don't have the the TV, but that red line kind of following the back of the 90 ft

[25:51] lots, that's a natural ridge line on our property. And you can see that it kind

[25:55] of favors I'm going to call it the one-/ird mark to where everything that

[25:59] falls west is a little bit steeper and everything that follows east of that

[26:03] ridge you can see has more more room to drain and it it tends to be a little bit

[26:07] flatter because of that steeper slope on the west side

[26:13] we feel like or on the east side this the shallower slopes we feel like curb

[26:16] and gutter is going to work a lot well. However, that ridge line is going to

[26:19] make it where the 90 foot side would benefit from open ditches.

[26:24] um having 90 ft wide lots plus having we're going to expand the rightway to 60

[26:30] on that side instead of the typical 50 and that'll give us the uh room we need

[26:35] to have gentle swailes that are easy to mow and walk back up. Um because of that

[26:41] natural ridge line having those steeper slopes on the west side, we feel like

[26:45] forcing the closed underground pipe system here would require a lot of

[26:49] unnatural earth cuts and more disturbing and natural wetlands and uh drainways.

[26:55] We're trying to match we're trying to stay out of the light green area on both

[26:59] of these just because those are your wetlands. That's where the drainage

[27:02] really happens to get everything off site.

[27:05] Um on the wetland protection, if you were to use curb and gutter, you end up

[27:09] concentrating your storm water to single outfall points, which are higher

[27:13] velocities, which tend to cause a lot more uh erosion downstream, whereas

[27:17] allowing the vegetated swailes on that side would be able to slow the water

[27:20] down, let it go where it wants to go naturally and uh promote infiltration as

[27:25] well. um on the wetlands. I think Kenneth

[27:28] pointed it out, but we designed it this way and and are want to use this

[27:32] variance to keep right now we're only impacting less than 2% of the wetlands

[27:36] on site. So 98 plus% of the wetlands on site would maintain as as they are

[27:42] today. And then finally, we uh note that this is consistent with the approved low

[27:48] impact drainage practices of the surrounding area. Um there are some I

[27:52] believe it's in Edgewood I might have my subdivisions wrong that are even less

[27:56] than 90 foot that still have open ditches but then Liberty Ridge that just

[28:00] got approved also is 90 foot with um open ditches. And the last thing I would

[28:05] just kind of add I don't know that this is a a hardship but from a public

[28:09] opinion standpoint one thing we hear all the time is cookie cutting neighborhoods

[28:12] and that's Kenneth pointed out we're trying to have various lot sizes to

[28:16] avoid that. Um, and then the, you know, another thing out in the unincorporated

[28:21] county here is more rural feel, which, uh, that open ditch concept would have a

[28:25] more aesthetic of a, a rural feel. So, we're trying to keep these subdivisions,

[28:30] while it's one subdivision, we want them to kind of to to play out as two, if

[28:34] that makes any sense. And that's all I have. Dave wanted to speak.

[28:42] » All right. >> Seven minutes.

[28:46] » Yeah. Seven minutes. State your name and address for me, please.

[28:48] » My name is David Crane and I live at 2405 Broadmore Place in Gulfport. Okay.

[28:53] » And I represent G Coast Design and Development.

[28:57] So, I'm here helping support their argument with that this decision of the

[29:03] planning zoning commission should be reversed and the variance and the

[29:07] conditional use permanent application should be accepted. Y'all have a

[29:12] Harrison County Uniform Development Code which establishes eight factors for you

[29:17] to consider when making this decision. And I'm going to go over the factors and

[29:21] time permitting. Then I'm going to kind of go over what's in the record that

[29:25] supports each of those factors. And with regarding the record, there was a

[29:29] question asked just a second ago whether something was in the record. Both of

[29:32] these matters are matters just like Mr. Nolan said that are being decided on the

[29:36] record of the planning and zoning commission. So no new evidence whether

[29:40] it's on our side or their side can come in. But with regard to the the timing of

[29:45] the zoning and the timing of the um the adoption of those community plans for

[29:51] the zoning the comprehensive zoning or comp zoning plan. Those are county

[29:56] documents upon which you can rely regardless of whether they're in the

[29:59] record. Either way the factors harmony with zoning with the zoning code and the

[30:05] comprehensive plan. So that's I'm going to go ahead and address that one because

[30:10] there was some discussion about it being G1. It is obviously R1. So it definitely

[30:15] fits within the zoning code. Um it with regard to whether it's G1 or G2 as Mr.

[30:22] Jones said, it's really not relevant at this time because at the same time y'all

[30:27] adopted those neighborhood um plans, you also chose to zone this as R1. So it's

[30:34] already R1. and the the the the subdivision you approve at 780 houses

[30:41] versus 230. So we're pro promoting a subdivision

[30:47] that's a lot smaller than the one that was previously approved. And so and even

[30:53] then G1 still allows for control growth and as Mr. Jones said this is a

[30:58] conservation subdivision. It qualifies as a conservation subdivision and it has

[31:02] 30 foot buffers on either side. So it's control growth that would easily fit

[31:06] within the G1 concept. So with regard the second factor is compliant with

[31:11] district and development standards. The third is neighborhood character and

[31:15] adverse effect. The fourth is adequate public facilities and services. The

[31:21] fifth is economic welfare. Sixth is no compat incompatible

[31:26] nuisance. Seven is vehicular approaches and interference with surrounding

[31:30] traffic. And finally, eight is property values in the immediate vicinity. So

[31:35] with regard to compliance with development standards, the proposed use

[31:39] is a single family subdivision and already existing R1 property, 230 lots

[31:44] on 150 acres. It's about 17,300 ft and 30% common area. Applicated applicants

[31:52] already stated that no lot is under 75 ft wide and it's 10,000 square ft. the

[31:57] smallest about 1,200 square ft and that's in the record. Residential uses

[32:03] with regard to the neighborhood character. Again, I can't stress this

[32:07] enough. This is already an R1 neighborhood. Residential uses are

[32:11] directly across West Warm Road and elsewhere. School property above

[32:16] [snorts] the site. Liberty Ridge was just approved for the 24 lot subdivision

[32:20] and recent plan includes our plan includes parks and common areas

[32:25] including wetland buffers on two sides and a 50ft southern buffer.

[32:30] With regard to adequate public facilities and services, Jones has

[32:34] already testified that water and sewer exist along West Road. They've been

[32:38] given a a well served letter and the police and emergency services are

[32:43] available. Riverbend is the one who provided the well served letter with

[32:47] regard to the applicant to economic welfare.

[32:51] He's giving you price ranges of $200,000 to $300,000 homes that will at the

[32:58] hearing below that was presented data that that was

[33:03] showing 2.1 month absorption of homes within the $200 to $300,000

[33:09] um price range. So these homes are going to fit within that and probably will

[33:13] sell quickly. With regard to no incompatible nuisance,

[33:20] there is no incompatible nuisance and I don't think that there really has been

[33:23] an argument about that except the opposition below argue that residential

[33:27] development would conflict with farms, livestocks, etc. But this is single use

[33:32] family residential on R1 property that again has already been zoned. So it's

[33:37] you got to measure whether it's an incompatible nuisance within its

[33:40] existing zoning and the existing zoning is our one vehicular approaches

[33:45] interference of surrounded traffic. Well Mr. Jones just mentioned there going to

[33:50] be two entrances. There's a 30 foot green space in case it's ever needed.

[33:54] And he's stipulated the low end today that he's going to work with county

[33:59] engineer to work work on any traffic issues. And the property values in the

[34:04] immediate vicinity. Again, these are 250,000 to 300,000

[34:09] $10,000 homes. There's going to be a buffer area and there's not going to be

[34:13] anything. There's no proof that this is going to somehow diminish those property

[34:16] values. And that's all I have unless you have

[34:20] questions. [clears throat] Anyone have any questions?

[34:25] » Okay. How much time we have left here? >> 1 minute 43 seconds.

[34:29] » Okay. >> Y'all y'all done? Okay.

[34:34] » All right.

[34:38] » How many on the opposition side do I have that are that want to speak? Will

[34:44] there be a chance for just neighbors, people just of the community to see?

[34:48] » Raise your hand now. >> Okay. I wasn't sure.

[34:50] » Okay. One, two, three, four, five, six. >> You want to split it?

[34:58] » 30 minutes. However you want to split it up.

[35:00] » However you want to split it up time.

[35:08] » I thought you said we only >> 30 minutes total. side can break it up

[35:13] however you would like.

[35:22] » If you'll state your name and address for me, please.

[35:24] » Yes, it's Lyn Anne Stiller. >> 19120

[35:30] Gaylord Road, Mississippi

[35:34] is my property. >> Okay.

[35:40] Sorry for the objection. Earlier I was my first time.

[35:52] » Yes, ma'am. You can start whenever you're ready.

[35:55] » So, I am requesting that the board of supervisors uphold the zoning commission

[36:00] correct and legal sound decision. The zoning commission looked at the facts

[36:03] and upheld our ordinances. A 230 home subdivision is a massive jump. That is

[36:09] not slow growth. I brought with me today some documentation that was presented at

[36:13] the zoning hearing. At any time, if your packet does not contain one of these

[36:16] documents, I'll be happy to pass it to you. I want to mention that there were

[36:21] over 375 opposition letters and 378 verified online signatures that were

[36:27] printed per request of the zoning commission. So, that should be on file.

[36:32] I have a map from the Harrison County comprehensive plan showing the subject

[36:35] property being listed as G1 growth factor. Um, in reference to the

[36:39] applications, there's a little bit of pattern difference when you look at the

[36:44] tax records, how they wrote G1 and O2 and G2 and O2. The only one that is

[36:49] missing the handwriting is the one that's on the uh main packet that covers

[36:53] the larger section that's act that's asking for the conditional use. So

[36:57] that's why I felt like it might have been a little intentional since out of

[37:00] four papers, one of them was missing the writing. Then the map, I understand it

[37:04] is hard to read, but if you look at here,

[37:09] um, let me get the paper and hand that out to you.

[37:15] » Was this was this paperwork that was at the hearing?

[37:18] » Yes, sir. Do you have access to that now? Um, we do have, if you can show,

[37:23] well, we do have >> There's a lot of attachments here.

[37:28] » What would be named? I'm sorry. We have so many attachments. What are you

[37:31] referring to? >> This is from the uh comprehensive plan.

[37:34] This is the growth sector map from the comprehensive plan.

[37:37] » So, if you look here, this is going to be South Gaylord Road and this is the

[37:41] creek that floods uh Houston Lader Road and you can reference that in some of

[37:46] the printouts that I gave you from the sheriff's department Facebook page. Uh

[37:50] we had like a couple weeks there of a lot of flooding and Houston ladder is

[37:53] one of them that floods often from this particular creek. The subject property

[37:57] is between this main creek right here and um I'm sorry

[38:04] it's one over. I looked at it wrong. It's one over. It's where is it?

[38:16] » It's the creek on this side. Anyway, [clears throat]

[38:20] you can look and see that this is going to be in a G1. And if you pull the

[38:24] application, you can see on the tax record where they wrote G1 and G2

[38:28] applications. Does someone want to bring me the

[38:32] applications up? They're in the in the brown bag. I'll give those to you in

[38:37] just a moment when they get up here. All right. If you look at the map, you

[38:41] can we already saw that. You should have a list of two flooded streets that were

[38:45] printed from articles from the sheriff's department Facebook page. There's more

[38:49] only printed and the community surrounding this property sustained a

[38:52] lot of damage. >> They're in the backup,

[38:56] » sir. >> Yeah, we have

[39:00] to utilize my time. >> No, we already

[39:04] » Okay. If you look on the tax records, some of the pages have G1 and G2 written

[39:09] on them, and uh some of them don't. So, this one is the 157. It's got the

[39:18] smaller parcel that says G2 and O2, but then the larger parcel has no writing.

[39:26] » That's in the tax collector's record. >> Yes. I I probably said the wrong name.

[39:30] » Oh, no, no, you're fine. I was just checking my

[39:32] » and then you look at the condition the uh variance application. Now look, I

[39:36] don't think these are the moment. Don't get me wrong. I'm just saying that in

[39:43] the documentation,

[39:47] » if you look at the variance with just the second application

[39:51] in the tax records, the writing is in both.

[39:54] [snorts] >> You see what I'm saying? See that same

[39:57] handwriting is in both. We highlighted that there

[40:00] » when we discovered that it was labeled G1.

[40:05] You have a minute unless somebody wants to donate you their time.

[40:08] » Would somebody like to donate some time? I'll give you one of my minutes. Okay.

[40:14] » Um

[40:17] anyway, so the if you if you look at the topographical map I provided, you'll see

[40:22] the massive amount of wetlands with two creeks on each side. It's absolutely

[40:25] dangerous to alter the course of this much water with that much elevation

[40:28] change. It's a 30 foot drop. At the same time, these type of creeks are dependent

[40:33] upon the wershed from the higher elevations and the water table. Myself

[40:36] and my neighbors south of me, we depend on this water with our livestock and our

[40:40] aparies and it's a delicate balance system. I don't think they fully

[40:44] understand what's at stake here. The lowerlying areas have been utilized has

[40:48] been utilizing the water historically and any changes would change the

[40:51] conditions of the lives. The property has an elevation change complicate

[40:55] compacted ground that has a recipe for disastrous conditions during rainfall.

[40:59] This development is trying to cluster the houses on the ridge while trying to

[41:03] avoid wetlands and adding many water retention ponds trying to manage the

[41:07] watershed if they have to ask for a variance to manage the water while

[41:11] trying to cut cost and cluster the homes on the ridge and this pro proves this

[41:14] development does not work. The topographical nature of the subject

[41:17] property is not like the 1998 in the 2002 subdivision across the street.

[41:23] So from the Harrison County comprehensive plan under the promote

[41:27] growth as specified in the designated zones and future land map in action

[41:31] seven revoke resing approval if progress is not made on developments within two

[41:35] years. This property should have been reverted back to agricultural

[41:39] postdevelopmental fa failure and historically it has always been

[41:42] agriculture as it was paper company land and should have been returned

[41:46] [clears throat] to that. Currently, there are over 450 acres of the original

[41:50] 7880 that are agricultural and have been

[41:53] zoned agricultural within the last three years.

[41:57] » Actually, >> yes, sir.

[41:59] » I only I only need two minutes. >> Okay.

[42:02] » So, my time a minute. >> Okay. So, you've got another six

[42:07] minutes. >> So, I want to correct that. My 41 acres

[42:10] is agricultural.

[42:14] » It has already been zoned. The Fazios have purchased over 400 acres and it is

[42:19] on the agenda in about I don't know 10 days or so or eight days to be on

[42:24] agricultural for their farm. So you have a 230 acre subdivision that recently the

[42:30] growth has gone into an agricultural way and if you take the standards of the

[42:35] zoning commission where they consider the impact of uh a subdivision the

[42:40] letters that get mailed out that's their impact right that's going to be more of

[42:44] an R1 and agricultural district not an R2 as they claim and I argue to say that

[42:51] G1 is a slow growth not a rapid growth and a 23 30 pound subdivision. It is a

[42:56] very rapid growth, very impactful on a small rural road next to a school zone.

[43:02] I don't I don't care what anybody says. [clears throat] I believe that if you

[43:05] put an influx of 800 or more cars uh less than a mile from a school zone on a

[43:11] small road that has a 15 mph speed limit during working hours that it's already a

[43:18] heavy burden. Now, if you speak to the residents, it's it's going to be

[43:21] catastrophic. And that's not even including natural disasters, evacuation

[43:25] routes, road maintenance, anything like that. Um,

[43:31] a 230 acre home is a monstrous subdivision. Even we do have a lot of

[43:36] growth out there and it's happening fast and the people that live there and have

[43:40] lived there are trying to absorb this change and it is a stress. It is a

[43:43] stress on them. If you think about four years, how long it's going to take for

[43:48] 230 homes to be built, for them to be running bulldozers and have trucks

[43:52] coming in and out day after day for years, that's the noise that we're going

[43:56] to be hearing. Pete, I don't know if you've ever sat in your yard and heard

[43:58] beep beep beep every single day. I mean, just the developments and look, I bought

[44:03] 41 acres in the middle of the 700 and I still hear it. So, can imagine what is

[44:09] going to impact the whole area like [cough] that. [clears throat] I'm not

[44:12] against development. I just think that things need to be done a little bit

[44:16] differently. Okay, I just want to say that. Um, so you want to say, let's see,

[44:24] there is a Ray Dalio, if I said his name correctly. I don't know if anybody's

[44:29] ever heard of him. He's the founder of a very successful Bridgewater hedge fund.

[44:33] He's been in the top of the Forbes list and donates hundreds of millions to

[44:37] charities and stuff every year. He wrote a famous econom he's he's a famous

[44:41] economic author and who has [cough and clears throat]

[44:43] anyway um he has a bra he has a quote called embrace reality and deal with it.

[44:49] Interesting fact about Ry is that he isn't fond of developments and he finds

[44:53] them risky. This is a time for change towards more preservation and

[44:57] restorative measures. We are not against development but development needs to

[45:02] look different. This application is weak and contains a lot of misinformation. If

[45:07] you go to page 18, line one, where they say, but again, we are early and this is

[45:12] just ballpark or line seven, I can definitely go with smaller lots and make

[45:17] them smaller. Page 22, what is your special circumstances? This is what the

[45:21] commission is asking. You've got to satisfy four needs. The response on

[45:26] record is I think the special circumstances is dot dot dot. I mean,

[45:30] obviously anytime dot dot dot and that's the problem with variances. That's the

[45:35] response. I don't I don't have any information to go off that page 23.

[45:39] Yeah, sorry I made that change. I guess I didn't put that in here referring to

[45:44] how many streets, but commissioner he said she saw it somewhere and and John

[45:48] stated he would agree. Now they're talking about three roads going in and

[45:51] out and that's great. I'm glad they're talking about that because the traffic

[45:54] is is going to be a serious concern. Um the commission had concerned about an

[45:59] influx of 800 cars with 400 cars going to work between 7:30 and 8. Um,

[46:07] Mr. Jones made a statement that they would not all be going at the same time.

[46:11] There's real no studies or anything done to see what the impact on the

[46:14] infrastructure for this will be. Um,

[46:20] I mentioned something about [clears throat] the wetlands that people

[46:25] don't typically walk as a park in wetlands and Mr. Andy who um came up and

[46:31] said, "Well, we have some ponds. Um, it's not a marsh, but they're wet ponds,

[46:35] and the people do enjoy those. Um, I would like to dispute Mr. Jones's market

[46:41] analysis. When you pull information from the MLS, that is an exclusive closed

[46:48] listing service. And I don't feel that it creates an accurate measure for the

[46:54] whole market because there is more things available out there than what's

[46:56] just in an exclusive MLS listing. I would beg to see something from a

[47:02] unbiased third party um [clears throat] study or from someone who's not Dr.

[47:07] Horton or a company that's owned by [snorts]

[47:10] an alliance, someone from the alliance group or owners of developments.

[47:15] Um I know you hear the same voice of all of these neighbors are upset. The

[47:20] developers, they accept it. the developers made statements about so we

[47:25] already went over the R1 and R2 and they did a generalized statement that there

[47:29] is a lot of R2 in the area that I've already talked about that

[47:35] so developers like to say change or or be changed and it's profound I find that

[47:40] there is middle ground there has to be a balance I'm telling you right now money

[47:43] does not care about the ecological balance that humans do and our life

[47:47] depends on it unless you live in a cave you know there are more restorative

[47:51] measures is being done globally. This is where the market is going. We're on the

[47:55] brink of change on the Mississippi coast forever. Do you want to be remembered

[48:00] for passing all the new developments with no change towards real restorative

[48:05] preservation measures? [clears throat] Imagine what you can do as leaders of

[48:08] this community. And I'm excited to see it happen. But no, but

[48:13] » your 12 minutes has expired. >> Okay. If anybody has any time left over,

[48:18] I'll finish. You'll have five minutes at the end for ma'am.

[48:26] » Oh no, the others. I apologize.

[48:33] [clears throat]

[48:38] » Dave, if you'll just state your name and address for us.

[48:40] » Jennifer Morin, 21,000 Houston Lader Road. I'm also a PE teacher at Lyman

[48:45] Elementary. Yes. Social. >> Okay. Uh like many families who choose

[48:49] to live in the Westland community, I live here because of its rural

[48:52] character, open farmland, agricultural herit heritage, and peaceful way of

[48:57] life. I was actually born and raised on the property that is on the south side

[49:00] of this property of the development. Um a family has lived here since 1800s. The

[49:05] proposed 230 home subdivision is completely upscale with the surrounding

[49:09] area and would permanently change the character of our community, our

[49:13] community. um the developers and realtors are

[49:17] strictly in it for the money. Whereas all of us land owners [clears throat]

[49:20] surrounding the development has all been built on blood, sweat, and tears. They

[49:24] can't relate because they live on 23 acres or 0.25 acres. They don't

[49:28] understand hundreds of acres that you've farmed for all these years. Uh look at

[49:35] all the flooding we had a month or so ago. It's because they're shoving these

[49:39] developments between creeks, rivers, and wetlands. These developments do nothing

[49:42] to improve our community. All they do is hinder it. They don't care about the

[49:47] farms and the runoffs that will hurt our farmlands, including our livestock and

[49:51] ponds. And honestly, it's no fault on them because they simply don't

[49:54] understand what it's like to maintain hundreds of acres for us that live out

[49:58] there. Just last week, I drove through the development between Mark West Road

[50:02] and Old Highway 49, and those roads were already flooding. They're not even built

[50:07] on yet, and they're flooding already. We've got to stop these developments in

[50:11] the county that's affecting our country way of life and flooding homes. Will

[50:15] Poston matter of fact when the storming hap I mean when that storm happened he

[50:20] was stuck on one side of the prop on the road couldn't even get to his own

[50:24] property. That's what these developments are causing. Also there are thousands of

[50:28] homes being developed between Canal Road, Old Highway 49, Robinwood just to

[50:33] name a few. Although the developer claims there's a housing shortage, there

[50:37] clearly is not. It's just a shortage to him and the developers and all that will

[50:42] be building these homes because they're not the developers are the ones working

[50:46] on these other developments already approved and being built. 24 acre lot I

[50:50] mean 24 lots that he's been referencing. That's 200 206 less than what he's

[50:57] trying to put in there. Uh he said he drove down Westworth but didn't see any

[51:01] kind of you know farm activity of that sort of thing. drive down Houston

[51:04] Lighter Road, you'll see a lot of the people that have grown up there their

[51:08] whole lives that are still farming hay, cow, whatever. Um the concerns are yes,

[51:14] the traffic. Drive out there during school hours, drive out there afternoon

[51:19] when the schools are let out, sit behind a bus on Houston Lighter Road trying to

[51:23] get out onto West Jordan Road for 10 minutes or so because the traffic's so

[51:27] backed up. Um Lennis Quavvis Road, the same thing. the roads, the drainage

[51:32] systems, public service. We're shortage in all of that even before this growth

[51:37] would be developed. Um they deserve residents deserve confidence that

[51:42] flooding, road maintenance, and emergency response will not be

[51:44] negatively impacted. Sewer and water can't handle what they have after the

[51:48] storm. There were so many uh flood I mean boil water notices there on Shaw

[51:53] Road and in that River Bend area all up and down Shaw Road. Uh, this proposal

[51:59] threatens a quiet, safe, familyoriented, country way of life environment. Once

[52:02] this type of development is approved, the rural character of our community

[52:06] cannot be restored. Not to mention the fire department. Yeah, there is a fire

[52:10] station right there. But some friends of mine live within three miles of that

[52:14] fire station. And years ago, their shop caught on fire and that station was

[52:19] already out on another call and so were the ones in Louisiana. They had to call

[52:22] one from uh Keiesler. Needless to say, their shot burned to the ground with

[52:27] hundreds of thousands of vehicles and everything in it. As board of

[52:31] supervisors, you know how many houses have been built in Harrison County

[52:33] [clears throat] lately. But how many new fire departments have we built? Uh the

[52:38] developer will build this urban sprawl and he will leave. He will go back to

[52:41] his home near the beach on Second Street. We will be left to deal with his

[52:45] mess for the rest of our lives. If he wants these developments, build it

[52:49] elsewhere. You know what about revitalizing DO or some of these other

[52:54] subdivisions? I know there's not as much money in it, but it doesn't affect our

[52:58] lives. Uh I respectfully ask the board of supervisors to deny the Woreram Wood

[53:03] subdivision is currently proposed or require significant changes that better

[53:07] protect the resident schools infrastructure. Thank you for your time

[53:10] and your consideration.

[53:16] » My name is Pat Lowry. I live at 13381 Old Highway 49.

[53:21] » Okay. >> I would like to read something from the

[53:23] core of engineers. There's been a lot I've read the application. I've read the

[53:27] transcript and I've read the code law u the code book and there's a lot of

[53:34] discussion in here about wetlands. Everybody has talked about wetlands.

[53:40] This whole site can be a wetland. And let me explain. Registered land

[53:46] surveyors are generally not qualified to determine or identify wetlands on their

[53:51] own. While a licensed surveyor is the legal authority for mapping property

[53:55] boundaries, identifying a wetland requires specific training in

[53:59] environmental science, hydraology, and botany. Determining a wetland requires a

[54:04] specialized process called wetland delineation.

[54:08] Instead of measuring property line angles, a professional must prove the

[54:13] presence of three specific environmental parameters mandated by the core of

[54:17] engineers. Hydro hydrophic vegetation identifying

[54:22] plants that that exclusively or primarily grow in water or saturated

[54:27] soil. hydrate soils. Digging test pits to

[54:31] analyze color and layering which indicate prolonged periods of flooding

[54:36] or saturation. Wetland hydrarology finding evidence of ongoing surface

[54:41] water or groundwater saturation. We're talking wetlands. You're being asked to

[54:47] make a decision, a very important decision without any delineation on

[54:53] these maps or plats or anything presented that delineates what is truly

[54:59] a wet wetland. Let me make a quick point. I have a hill 100 220 yards from

[55:05] my house. The top of that hill is as dry as a powder house. You put a shovel in

[55:10] the ground, you're going to find water. That hill is a wetland.

[55:15] » [clears throat] >> Thank you.

[55:22] » Hi board. I'm Jennifer Taylor. I live at 21171

[55:26] West Rhythm Road. With that being said, this directly impacts me and my family's

[55:30] way of life and our day-to-day movings. We currently have to um mitigate around

[55:38] the constant flow of traffic, uh semis, um dirt trucks, all of those things come

[55:44] up and down in front of our uh home of residency. I have three children. We

[55:49] can't even at this moment we don't ever play out front ever just due to traffic.

[55:54] I can't imagine the impact that having that many more houses on that road is

[55:59] going to affect us. Currently, there's cleared out an area already for I think

[56:05] 37 is what they told us, acre lots. Um, it's right there on the bin. There's a

[56:11] lot of traffic already. When the gentleman talked about the home,

[56:18] uh, like how much it cost unless you're only taking trailers into effect, there

[56:23] is no way that I completely believe that the houses up in that area sell for two

[56:27] to 300. not with the acreage that they're allotted and the size of the

[56:31] homes. So, I'm going to call that one out right there. Secondly,

[56:37] this is our community. I have elderly neighbors. I have single mother

[56:42] neighbors who are having a hard time with their day-to-day life, let alone

[56:47] having the time to come down here and meet y'all face to face to explain their

[56:52] um positions. I've never been in front of Fort. I don't even know what I'm

[56:56] supposed to be doing, but I feel like I need to be the voice for our

[57:01] neighborhood. >> Um, I'm not against I'm with them. I'm

[57:05] not against development as it is. Like I understand

[57:10] there is growth, but the development that is being proposed is something I

[57:17] would see in Gulfport. It's not something I would see in social. Um,

[57:21] again to piggy back off of Jennifer is you go up and down canal land and all

[57:28] of that. That looks like exactly what he's proposing. That's that's all of

[57:32] that area. Drive down west. Go past the school.

[57:36] » Go past socialure. It's over. Okay. >> Just venture further out and you'll see

[57:41] that it's very contradictory to the way that we live.

[57:44] » 9 minutes and 30 seconds. >> 9 minutes 30 seconds. one. I think I had

[57:48] two other two other people speak. >> She's taking his time.

[57:52] » She's taking Okay.

[57:57] [snorts and clears throat]

[58:00] » Did you want to speak? >> I wanted to say

[58:04] » Yes, sir. Please come up. State your name and address for us, please. For the

[58:07] record.

[58:12] » My name is Richard Smith. I live at 19621

[58:18] Line Drive. >> I'm not good at talking.

[58:22] » That's okay. You're doing fine. >> Uh

[58:26] the biggest concern is y'all saying 230 homes

[58:34] time that time too you close to 500 Westworth road cannot hold.

[58:44] You can ask the sheriff. You come out on 49 and that's about the worst

[58:48] intersection there is

[58:53] and it needs to be repaired now. And then we threelane in traffic

[59:01] there. You need to rebuild that. The second

[59:05] concern is evacuation.

[59:11] Social Louisiana road floods, Shaw road floods, and old 49 floods.

[59:20] Same river. So you can't go south to get [clears throat] out of there. What is

[59:26] the proposal to go north?

[59:32] It's old 49

[59:36] floods in two different areas. And this last rain, never seen it. I've been up

[59:43] there since 1995. Westworth on when you come off of 49,

[59:51] you'll go down a big it just rush in water.

[59:57] That's the only way out. I think >> y'all need to consider this.

[1:00:12] Oh, I'm sorry. Go ahead. Sorry. We're listening. I was just showing where you

[1:00:14] were talking about on the map >> where that flood was because I was

[1:00:18] familiar with >> Can I add that that flood really never

[1:00:20] happened before they started building? >> No, ma'am. We're just It's his time. If

[1:00:24] he wants to give it to you, he can. >> We're all

[1:00:28] to keep it the way it should. >> We all live up there. But evacuation,

[1:00:33] y'all not thinking about. Y'all need to come up with a plan. Ask your sheriff.

[1:00:39] He has to put the gates out to stop traffic.

[1:00:43] » I promise you we do think of it. And we work very closely with our sheriff and

[1:00:46] we have a list of roads. So don't think we don't think of that.

[1:00:49] » Well, I understand thinking. >> Does anybody live out there?

[1:00:55] [clears throat] >> Where are you talking about? Where you

[1:00:58] live at? >> Well, it's not questioned answer. Yes, I

[1:01:01] have family, you know, Robin Wood or whatever.

[1:01:06] » Right out there and see how much traffic there is. It's terrible. [clears throat]

[1:01:12] » Terrible. >> Thank you. Done. All right. Thank you,

[1:01:15] sir. >> Thank you, Mr.

[1:01:16] » All right. How much time is left? >> 6 minutes and 50. All right. Six.

[1:01:20] » I'm trying to be fast. I want everybody that took their time out today to come.

[1:01:24] I just want to finish this a little bit. >> Sure. I want to start off to say that

[1:01:28] the subdivision does not meet the eight factors that they stated earlier. And I

[1:01:32] feel like we've already proven that in a lot of what myself and uh the other

[1:01:37] citizens have said and what this young lady said over here. I want to reiterate

[1:01:42] about the flooding happening prior to the building. Um I stand in line with

[1:01:46] that. And I think that's about it. I want to finish so everybody else can

[1:01:52] talk. So, I want to say change is happening and it's not the old

[1:01:55] traditional way of building subdivisions. We're moving into more

[1:01:57] preservation and restoration. And this is globally. This is what you see

[1:02:01] everywhere. Everybody is dealing with this problem and this is the direction

[1:02:04] we're going. We're not regressing back into the traditional way of just mowing

[1:02:08] things down and and building houses. There's got to be some change. Um, and I

[1:02:12] think Andy said it best when he said God is the best engineer. I do have to agree

[1:02:16] with you on that, Andy. I think he's one of the developers. I think that was a

[1:02:19] beautiful saying. And unless you live under a rock lately, you see natural

[1:02:22] disasters are happening. The old method of buying land and clearing it all out

[1:02:26] and building homes and leaving it. Nothing changes if nothing changes. And

[1:02:30] you sit in the precious seat that holds the preservation for all of this Gulf

[1:02:34] Coast. You love this place. I know you do. And I love I know you love all the

[1:02:38] resources. Everybody here probably likes the seafood, the beach, everything. And

[1:02:42] the people that come here, the festivals. So, please consider more than

[1:02:46] just pressure from an alliance of of an exclusive few business owners who are

[1:02:51] only here for monetary purposes. Your decision today is affecting the quality

[1:02:55] of life for a rural community. The zoning commission's decision was not

[1:02:59] arbitrary. It was based on substantial evidence and local guidelines and the

[1:03:03] Mississippi courts have repetitively ruled that zoning decision is fairly

[1:03:08] debatable. It must be legally sustained and the zoning commission did its job

[1:03:12] perfectly. and we ask that the board stand by the county's own rule book and

[1:03:17] protect our infrastructure and deny the developers appeal.

[1:03:23] » Okay, there's more time. Is there more time?

[1:03:26] » 4 minutes and 50 seconds. >> Four minutes.

[1:03:27] » Oh, I'd also like to say that right now today there's 2200 homes on Zillow.

[1:03:34] Again, we have MLS, we have Zillow. No third party unviable study that can

[1:03:40] absorb all of that. But that would be the homes available.

[1:03:44] If any of the citizens that came here today want us to get some of their voice

[1:03:47] in, I'd like for that. I think he's doing them in the back as well.

[1:03:51] » That's fine. I just have to alter. >> Yeah. Yes, ma'am.

[1:03:54] » I understand that. Um, but I also would like to reiterate as well when he

[1:03:58] mentioned the turning lanes for West that would be phenomenal. So, if you

[1:04:02] guys could get some type of road structure for that area. I know we're

[1:04:08] rural. I know we don't bring as much tax revenue as the city does, but if we're

[1:04:13] planning on developing and moving and grooving, like we definitely need some

[1:04:17] relief in that aspect and the schooling as well. I know many of the teachers

[1:04:21] » Yes, ma'am. We we have nothing to do with the schools.

[1:04:23] » I'm just saying like that all takes into effect when you're adding homes with

[1:04:27] people. >> Yes, ma'am.

[1:04:29] » All right. How much time is left? >> Four minutes.

[1:04:31] » Okay. You have four minutes. Please state your name and address. My

[1:04:34] » name is Bill Gilbert. live 18910 West Worker Road, Central Mississippi.

[1:04:39] » Yes, sir. >> And I guess just as a citizen here who

[1:04:42] has already been impacted somewhat by some previous developments, you know,

[1:04:47] I'm I'm someone that had to get rid of some cows and I hear these statements

[1:04:51] made about you up and down West Broken Road and you don't see any cows or

[1:04:56] anything. That's because some of the previous developments have already

[1:05:00] knocked you out. Okay? And if you go look at 049 right now, some of the other

[1:05:05] subdivisions that been going in there, every week they got traffic blocked off

[1:05:09] down there doing the big 18 wheelers that's coming down through there tearing

[1:05:13] the roads up and they just put little patch jobs in there. If I go up and down

[1:05:17] my drive road now in West Wortham, there's all kind of four-wheelers, golf

[1:05:21] carts, people on bikes and they're and they're just constantly going up and

[1:05:26] down through there. They're not stopped. If I got cows out there on Westworth

[1:05:30] Road, I got a bunch of people coming from these previous developments and

[1:05:34] their kids are climbing on the fences and I try to go down there and I say,

[1:05:37] "Look, I understand if you want to see the cows." You can't have your kids

[1:05:41] climbing on the fences. The first thing I hear is, "Well, they're just kids."

[1:05:45] Well, you're just an adult. They can't tear up my stuff wanting to look at

[1:05:50] something else. The other thing is all the trash that comes off these trucks

[1:05:54] and all it blows out in the hay fields. Okay, I got to walk out and pick all

[1:05:58] that stuff up. You know, if I see the uh I hear all these people wanting to put

[1:06:06] this on us, but you know where they live? Much of them live down in Guffford

[1:06:10] engaged subdivisions. Okay, we moved out there and want to live in a rural area

[1:06:14] for a reason. We don't want all the traffic. We don't want all these

[1:06:18] subdivisions out there. The infrastructure can't handle it. If you

[1:06:21] try to get out now on West Worth Road at 7 or so in the morning, want to go

[1:06:26] somewhere and I understand school traffic, you got to have my kids went to

[1:06:29] Westworth school first year it opened. They were there. But it's something now

[1:06:33] that we've reached a boiling point. Something needs to be

[1:06:38] done to the infrastructure. Something needs to be done to the roads.

[1:06:43] And you know, I just see this as

[1:06:48] I know I'm going to offend some people, but money, it all boils down to money.

[1:06:55] And if you want it down in your area, that's good. But I feel like as us

[1:06:58] citizens and social, we really don't care for it.

[1:07:02] » Thank you, sir. How much time's left?

[1:07:07] » Anyone want Steve?

[1:07:15] got a minute and a half. Okay. >> One thing that I would like to reiterate

[1:07:19] is the amount of water that's going to come off of here.

[1:07:22] » A tremendous amount. What was what was presented in the first case was

[1:07:28] topographical map. But what was not mentioned is that there's a up to a 30

[1:07:33] foot elevation change from the construction site to where the streams

[1:07:39] are. That's a tremendous amount of runoff that's going into that those

[1:07:44] areas. In the presentation, Mr. Jones said that those areas would not be

[1:07:50] affected. How can it not affect it? This is my experience with hydraology

[1:07:55] management. These areas are going to flood and those open ditches are not

[1:08:01] going to be able to be maintained and they're going to become eyes. So again,

[1:08:07] you're being asked to to make a decision on wetlands when the wetlands have not

[1:08:13] been delineated by a professional. You don't know by these plats, designs,

[1:08:20] uh all these fancy drawings and stuff. The wetlands have not been delineated.

[1:08:25] And because of that, none of these are correct. That whole site could be a wet.

[1:08:32] Thank you. >> Thank you.

[1:08:36] Okay, we have time for rebuttal. How much? Got five five minutes on a

[1:08:40] rebuttal.

[1:08:53] » Yes, sir. All right. Uh, I want to address Mr. Lowry's comment first. Um,

[1:08:58] we absolutely do have a well insulination done by ecological asset

[1:09:02] management. already been submitted to the core been done by a professional. Um

[1:09:07] the core actually has our delineation and our application from permit of the

[1:09:11] fill of a half an acre. Um we have to do things by law. I mean we have to dial

[1:09:16] the eyes and cross the tees. They'll put me under the jail without impact well

[1:09:21] without a permit. So um a lot of discussion was discussed about

[1:09:27] you know they're not against development build it elsewhere. And honestly guys, I

[1:09:33] mean, if we can't all agree that where or where else should development be

[1:09:40] besides next to an elementary and middle school

[1:09:44] on a property that's already been zoned R1 with hundreds of homes across the

[1:09:50] street on where where the developer has decided that they're going to preserve a

[1:09:55] third of the property, not in fact, but less than a half an acre of they're

[1:10:00] exceeding meeting all of the R1 requirements. What else? What else do

[1:10:05] you What else do we want? Where else can those developments go? I mean, I I can't

[1:10:11] imagine another place that makes more sense to have a residential development

[1:10:17] than next door to an elementary and middle school that's already zoned that

[1:10:21] has all the things that I discussed. Um, as far as traffic, I mean, listen, I

[1:10:28] understand there probably are some issues out there. We will do everything

[1:10:32] with work with engineering. If they need a traffic study, we will provide one. If

[1:10:36] they recommend turn lane, we'll provide one. We will work with them. That's

[1:10:40] engineering's job. That's who y'all pay to work with us on this stuff. And we

[1:10:45] will commit to doing what they require. Okay. Um I can't help highway 49, all

[1:10:51] 49, those kind of things. I can't help with his ingress and eress of our

[1:10:55] subdivision. And um you know most of the things they talked about were very

[1:11:01] speculative. I'm not sure MLS is definitely an independent source. I

[1:11:06] think you have your real estate license. You know understand that MLS is

[1:11:10] definitely or you maybe >> I did it for six months to sell my own

[1:11:13] personal properties to save commission but I do not have my realtor's license

[1:11:17] for the record. >> Okay. I do know that uh Zillow

[1:11:21] I've looked at the same thing that they're talking about. The 2200 homes

[1:11:24] includes everything. It includes lots and land. It includes commercial

[1:11:29] listings. It includes um apartments for lease. It includes residential for

[1:11:36] lease. Everything that's the 2200 homes that are stand for sale. MLS is MLS. It

[1:11:42] is a independent source. It is not from me. It is not from anybody else. as an

[1:11:46] independent source. Um, and the G1 versus G2 debate, again, I say it's

[1:11:55] irrelevant. If you don't think it's irrelevant, property is split between G1

[1:11:59] and G2. Part of it's in G2, part of it's in G1, and it's irrelevant because it's

[1:12:04] already R1. Um, and that's really all I have as far as a rebuttal. Um, flooding

[1:12:12] and drainage. Andy, you want to kind of talk about that real quick? I think the

[1:12:17] biggest thing is we are putting >> I don't have just a whole lot to add. U

[1:12:22] the one thing that they mentioned, you know, engineering hasn't fully started

[1:12:26] yet. Now, I'm a little bit ahead of the game. I've gotten some ideas. We've

[1:12:29] located some ponds, but if we can't fully engineer a site when we don't know

[1:12:34] what's going to be allowed to be built on the site. So, to my comment about

[1:12:38] God's better engineer than me, I absolutely believe it. He put two major

[1:12:42] drainageways on both sides and I don't want to touch the ones that he built.

[1:12:45] So, we're staying out of those. That's why we're only put impacting so many

[1:12:48] wetlands. You know, we are favoring the ridge. They said we were clustering the

[1:12:53] houses to avoid it, but no, you just we're we're putting the houses on the

[1:12:56] ridge because it doesn't make sense to put them in a bottom in a in a in a

[1:13:00] wooded bottom. So, we will design it. We have worked with G Engineering Group on

[1:13:05] several projects. We've had a good track record with them on this. We do like to

[1:13:09] put more ponds than maybe the some other developers just because we feel like you

[1:13:14] want to keep low points low and have a pond there instead. Um that ties into

[1:13:18] why we want the open ditches is that gives us more release points to have

[1:13:21] more uh areas in the back that will slow the water before it gets into those

[1:13:25] natural drainage ways. [clears throat] The main thing I want to highlight the

[1:13:29] east and west sides of are good size wetlands and we're staying out of those.

[1:13:34] We're not crossing them. We don't have any roads crossing them. We're not

[1:13:37] covering any of them. We're We're not We're not putting a a piece of equipment

[1:13:41] down in the holes down on the sides. >> Anything else? Any questions?

[1:13:48] » Is that everything? >> That's it.

[1:13:50] » Okay. All right. We have Is that all the time? Okay. We'll move to the questions

[1:13:54] that we [snorts] have. >> Kenneth, you said about the wetland

[1:13:58] reports. Have you gotten an hydraology report?

[1:14:04] Because the flooded roads are High Point. Lennis Praver Cemetery Road, Pete

[1:14:08] Hicken, Social Lazana, Kildo, West Maple Canal Road. So I could go I could keep

[1:14:12] reading them. That is a huge concern for me is [snorts] the flooding and the

[1:14:19] serious traffic. If you've sat out there in the mornings on a school day, you'll

[1:14:22] understand the road is narrow. Large trucks can't even pass each other. If

[1:14:27] you notice, they'll go on the the edge of the road. So those for me and their

[1:14:32] way of life definitely concerns me. So have you a hydraology report from an

[1:14:39] expert. >> So, we have had a wetlands delineation

[1:14:43] that analyzes the hydraology of those wetlands and the site. Um, we will also

[1:14:48] be getting soil borings on the site prior to development. Um, as far I mean

[1:14:53] obviously we're not analyzing all the drainage for the entire county. I mean,

[1:14:57] you mentioned a lot of roads and flooding and stuff like that. That's all

[1:15:01] » just ones that we're dealing with with subdivisions that weren't there before

[1:15:04] is our issue >> and all we can do I mean Andy's the best

[1:15:07] engineer I've ever met and obviously that's why I'm partners with him. But uh

[1:15:12] you know we do our drainage a little bit different and with these small ponds we

[1:15:17] want the water to go where it naturally goes and be off the site at the same

[1:15:23] rate or less than it currently is. A lot of times, I mean, sometimes that doesn't

[1:15:28] happen with other developments or whatever, but I mean, I can say for

[1:15:31] ours, I mean, we put a lot of ponds for that exact reason to ensure that you're

[1:15:36] not having one major outfall that's going to put water where it's not

[1:15:40] already going and that's going to go at the same rate speed. Um, you know, I

[1:15:45] understand that there's problems along the county. I mean, I know that there

[1:15:48] was that one rain that a lot of people talk about and stuff. I mean, I don't

[1:15:52] remember how many inches of rain we got in 24 hours, but it was more than

[1:15:57] » I think all of us have seen in a long time. So, of course, the roads are going

[1:16:01] to flood during those those major events. I mean, when you're going to

[1:16:04] have 24 inches of rain in 48 hours, there's there's going to be things that

[1:16:10] do um and then you said traffic and what was other

[1:16:17] » Oh, just the size of the road, too. >> Okay. Um

[1:16:21] » the traffic near the school is already bad. So 500 more cars.

[1:16:27] » I mean as far as 500 cars really isn't a large amount of cars. I know it sounds

[1:16:32] like a lot but I want a major that is a fairly major collector road in that

[1:16:37] area. I mean that's where the collector roads go. Um I do understand that roads

[1:16:43] are going to have to be widened over time. I mean that's why you know land

[1:16:47] and road how we've been talking about that for how long. Um but I think that

[1:16:52] there's I think that the school I think that there's a lot of development. You

[1:16:58] talking about the quality of life and the way of life.

[1:17:02] Please I know you've looked out there, you've driven out there, you already

[1:17:05] know the issues that are out there, but there's there's residential

[1:17:08] subdivisions, hundreds of lots that are out there already. We're not changing a

[1:17:13] rural area, an agricultural area of horses and cows into a residential

[1:17:19] subdivision. [clears throat] This is the residential subdivision area that's next

[1:17:23] to an elementary school. >> You understand? Every time it floods, we

[1:17:26] get I get hundreds of calls and then I'm going out there and then it's why do we

[1:17:29] keep putting subdivisions that increases the flooding? And I'm just being the

[1:17:33] devil's advocate here. I'm just telling you what my people tell me.

[1:17:36] » I don't know. They've lived there 60 years. They've never flooded like this

[1:17:39] before. my road department guys. Oh, Miss Rebecca, you can't you won't

[1:17:42] believe what Riverline Drive looks like today. That really concerns me for

[1:17:47] public safety. >> And I think that your engineering

[1:17:50] department does a great job. I mean, but I also think it's the prerogative of

[1:17:54] this board. They want to change the engineering design standards as well.

[1:17:58] » Yeah. >> So, you're right. I mean, you can't stop

[1:18:00] development >> because there's flooding in Harrison

[1:18:04] County. I mean, because there's flooding in major rain events. You can't stop it

[1:18:07] everywhere. there's changes that need to be made. Let's work together to

[1:18:11] determine what those changes need to be. >> And that's the point of the steering

[1:18:14] committee. You know, GMC we've hired and we're you're part of that. We want

[1:18:17] everybody at the table >> to work on this together.

[1:18:20] » Yeah, for sure. >> So, we're going in that direction.

[1:18:23] » And I mean, we just all I can say is we will do a job to make sure that we are

[1:18:26] not adding to that to the issues that exist right now.

[1:18:31] » And it is the large big boxes that are coming in and hurting us the most. And

[1:18:34] we know y'all, we know that you've done great things in the past. So trying to

[1:18:38] be hard on you. You know that >> you have done us right. But we have to

[1:18:42] protect the big picture. >> That's all.

[1:18:48] » Anyone have any other questions? Um any questions?

[1:18:53] The one one question I have Marlin is the opposition and builders go to the

[1:18:59] comprehensive plan and they say it's the Bible. It's what we're going to use.

[1:19:03] This is we go back to it all the time. But in this case, we have a G1 and a G2

[1:19:09] property [cough and clears throat] split.

[1:19:11] Why wasn't that decided before it even came to us? It needs to be one or the

[1:19:15] other. Correct. Am I wrong in saying that? I'm not I'm not saying but but it

[1:19:22] doesn't need >> I can't change.

[1:19:24] » Well, I understand. But when this when this was applied for, we should have

[1:19:27] picked one or the other unless we're splitting the property in

[1:19:31] half. You're going to do all homes two different two different growth sectors.

[1:19:35] But I'm going back to the comprehensive claim. That's what we're going to use.

[1:19:38] If everyone's going to use that, then we're going to use it as it is. We're

[1:19:41] not going to we're not going to pick and choose what we want to use out of.

[1:19:47] » I mean, am I wrong or am I right? I'm not Listen, I think that's the point

[1:19:51] where this committee is going. >> Correct. There's there's been many cases

[1:19:55] where this board and the planning commission has not gone on what that has

[1:19:58] been. In fact, this is the longest debate I've ever heard about what the

[1:20:03] actual comprehensive plan says. I mean, the one that was on John Clark Road is

[1:20:08] in 100% definitely without a doubt in a G2 growth corridor. And that's not

[1:20:15] mentioned. So, if we're going to follow it 110% then that one should have been

[1:20:20] approved, >> right? I mean, this one I'm saying is

[1:20:23] irrelevant. Number one, because it's already been determined as R1.

[1:20:27] » Yeah. And number two, it is split. It's not designed I mean those are not

[1:20:31] designed to be 100%. It is not a legally binding document. Zoning and we

[1:20:37] discussed this before is the binding. >> Right? If you don't have it by right

[1:20:41] then the conference plan is is not a legally binding document. So I mean it's

[1:20:48] split. >> You can't do it. It's like a split

[1:20:50] zoning. You may have a pick or whatever, but it's it's just a god. A lot of it's

[1:20:54] a guy and that's how y'all have addressed in the past, [clears throat]

[1:20:58] but I sometimes I wish you would. >> Can we join in on this conversation?

[1:21:03] » No, sir. >> Do you have a question? Unless Anyone

[1:21:07] has a question?

[1:21:12] [cough]

[1:21:20] want to speak.

[1:21:24] » Yes, ma'am. There's there's no there's no time for rebuttals. We It's

[1:21:28] » It's about your G1 question. >> Okay. I understand. We can we can have

[1:21:32] that discussion afterwards, but not not here. Thank you.

[1:21:38] » Okay. >> I have a question.

[1:21:41] » If you have a question, >> have a question. Would

[1:21:43] » would you talk about the G1 and G2? >> What is the history? How long have you

[1:21:48] been there? What is >> the comprehensive plan was adopted by

[1:21:52] the board into the unified code and it became the Harrison County comp unified

[1:21:57] code and that encompasses the G1 and G2. Those are the directions that they but

[1:22:03] the Ohio State [clears throat] University saw fit for growth because

[1:22:07] that land itself was supposed to be part preservation. It's a rural area. That's

[1:22:12] why they probably labeled it G1 to be slow growth next to the school for the

[1:22:16] balance. At the uh zoning hearing approved that it was G1 and zoning

[1:22:22] challenged that say that they thought it was G2 and wanted to know where

[1:22:26] information was approved the information in the application and um on the map

[1:22:34] » the zoning director but it's my understanding through my uh

[1:22:39] research that the >> [cough]

[1:22:42] » was adopted into the unified code after it was completion somewhere I think

[1:22:49] around 2008 20 late 2007 2008 something like that. So I took that as part of the

[1:22:55] guidelines that I needed to go by [cough and clears throat]

[1:23:00] » Eric I have a question. >> Yes.

[1:23:04] I I talked to my my appointment on the planning commission

[1:23:09] » and can you tell me why they denied it? >> They were focusing on the G1 G2.

[1:23:20] It it seems it it seems uh pretty simple when if it's if it was this G1, it

[1:23:27] should have never been reszone to R1. >> Correct. Once you reszone it to R1,

[1:23:34] » well once zoning is done, unless it's a >> plan like some kind of special plan

[1:23:40] development, zoning never reverts. >> It does not revert even if our

[1:23:46] comprehensive plan says that it does. >> It does not revert unless it is a by law

[1:23:52] zoning cannot revert to anything else. So this piece of property can never

[1:23:57] revert to something else unless someone comes in and tries to get it reszoned to

[1:24:02] agriculture. It is zoned and zoning runs with the land. When when

[1:24:09] it's approved by this board, it runs with the land. Comprehensive plan uh

[1:24:13] conditional uses run with the developer. Now if we find that the developer was

[1:24:22] you know untruthful or uh misrepresented himself in a case there is there is a

[1:24:29] way to pull the condition but not the zoning this zoning once the only zoning

[1:24:36] if the if it's proven that that the developer did not represent represent

[1:24:41] himself in good faith you could make a case to revert that zoning back but it's

[1:24:46] not an automatic and it doesn't get done because if a

[1:24:50] property owner has reszoneed his property from A1 to R1 with the respect

[1:24:54] of doing a subdivision and he still wants to do a subdivision, he's not

[1:24:59] going to revert his property back to A1. That's just one more hurdle he has to go

[1:25:03] back through. So, [clears throat]

[1:25:08] so explain to me just the legally the difference in R1 and R2. I'm

[1:25:17] just looking at this map right here and everything I see that surrounds this

[1:25:20] property. To the east, I guess it's the east and west. I'm not

[1:25:26] great at directions looking at this, but to the east and west is R1. Mhm.

[1:25:31] » There is some A1 to the south of it, I believe.

[1:25:34] » Right. And then everything to the north across the street is either

[1:25:40] most of it's R2, >> right?

[1:25:42] » What what allows for manufactured out manufacturing.

[1:25:47] » Uh we don't have a lot of that in the subdivisions across the street. They're

[1:25:51] their majority R1. Well, the subdivision I I went through there yesterday and

[1:25:56] there there's a there's more homes, but there are more there are there are some

[1:26:01] streets that have have manufactured homes. Yes.

[1:26:09] » I don't know what the rest of the board will say, but for me,

[1:26:13] I know if this goes to the next level what the outcome's going to be. the

[1:26:17] courts are going to rule in favor of the developer simply because this is zoned

[1:26:22] R1 and everything around it zoned R1. So for me, I have no option. I I

[1:26:32] but but to support the appeal. That's that's me.

[1:26:40] » Any more questions? Any more questions?

[1:26:48] I make a motion, Nathan. Is there make anything in the form of a motion?

[1:26:53] » I'll make a motion. >> I'll second it.

[1:26:56] » The motion is to >> to accept to deny

[1:26:59] » to deny the toe

[1:27:04] to uphold. >> I'll make I'll make the motion. I don't

[1:27:06] know what anybody been. I just >> So, we got

[1:27:09] » It's tough. It's our

[1:27:13] » All right. So we have a motion and we have a second. Okay. All those in favor?

[1:27:19] » I. >> No.

[1:27:21] » All those opposed? >> I

[1:27:25] Okay. So then we do another Do we want to do a second motion to clear to clear

[1:27:29] this or leave it as is? >> I understand. But before we had this

[1:27:33] issue, they we we did the the second way as well.

[1:27:38] So we're good. [snorts] >> Well, now

[1:27:42] » wait. I thought you made a motion to [clears throat] motion

[1:27:44] » to grant the correct

[1:27:48] » to grant the

[1:27:56] » I'm sorry you made a motion to hold the appeal allowing it.

[1:28:02] » Kent seconded it. >> Yeah, there was no

[1:28:04] » How did you >> I didn't second

[1:28:07] » No, Kent second. >> No, I didn't vote with

[1:28:09] » He voted against it. >> Oh.

[1:28:12] Oh, >> yeah. All three of them.

[1:28:23] » Yeah.

[1:28:28] » So, the motion fails three to two. >> Okay.

[1:28:33] » All right. So, that's the end of the hearing.

[1:28:41] explain what happened. >> Um, so the board denied the um denied

[1:28:45] the appeal. So there is a process for them to rebuttal which would be a uh

[1:28:50] we'll take it to the court. So it doesn't end here. This is just one more

[1:28:54] step. So

[1:29:18] Whether they win or not to

[1:29:22] I'm vote

[1:29:29] for [cough and clears throat]

[1:29:34] this session. >> No, we haven't recessed yet.

[1:29:39] » I just I work with Haley Barber

[1:29:48] to Washington with contacted this week. If you asked him

[1:29:55] because there was some potential asked him what was the purpose

[1:30:02] billion dollar on the infrastructure sewer water towers north of

[1:30:10] Wisconsin while the program was designed to

[1:30:14] overhaul water wastewater networks across the lower coastal

[1:30:19] county. A primary strategic goal of the initiative was to build out a

[1:30:25] centralized utility infrastructure backbone north of Interstate high-tech.

[1:30:30] The explicit intent behind this northern expansion was to incentivize residential

[1:30:36] and commercial [clears throat] development further inland supporting a

[1:30:39] northward migration to minimize vulnerability to catastrophic storm

[1:30:45] surge. I don't argue with exist but who who

[1:30:49] nowhere in there it says how many miles north do you go

[1:30:52] » in there it doesn't it doesn't tell you how far to go it just says north about

[1:30:56] 10 doesn't say north by 10 10 miles two miles four miles

[1:31:01] » is that talking about stud

[1:31:05] » no just in general

[1:31:14] » yes I know we need to film we need to Okay, I want you all one more thing.

[1:31:18] Write this down. >> Look up. It just passed two weeks ago by

[1:31:22] HUD housing and urban development. It's called the Road to Housing Act.

[1:31:26] » It's punitive action to be taken against municipalities

[1:31:32] that deny development due to

[1:31:38] » here's the exact words. It says uh minimum lot sales, density, minimum lot

[1:31:44] sizes, density, discretionary approvals, likely review timelines, obstacles to

[1:31:50] middle inome housing. It says what they're doing is after enactment,

[1:31:54] communities not in conformance will see CDBG funds reduced by 10% if growth

[1:32:01] rates below medium average medium growth rate would see additional C. In other

[1:32:07] words, if they based on the barometer that was in

[1:32:10] existence, if there was growth, they would see CDBG funding increased. If

[1:32:15] not, it uh it will be decreased. I've been contacted by the National Home

[1:32:20] Builders Association who is aware of things that have been happening in

[1:32:24] Harrison County. I also talked with um u the fellow from uh his name.

[1:32:31] » We welcome any conversation with anyone that we do the best we can do when we're

[1:32:35] up here. We're going to get it right. No, we're gonna get it wrong. Yes. But I

[1:32:38] will have an open conversation with anyone that talks about CPG and anything

[1:32:42] you have written there about whatever it is, that's fine. We meet we meet twice a

[1:32:46] month. Anyone that that you're referring to can come in and speak.

[1:32:50] » Call me. I'll put them on the agenda. >> Okay. That's what I'm saying is that

[1:32:54] NAHB has targeted the county for some of the rulings of the last couple.

[1:32:59] » Okay. We want to get on the agenda. We anticipate we anticipate them to reach

[1:33:05] out. >> Okay.

[1:33:06] » Thank you. >> This, you know, this is the first time I

[1:33:09] I'm >> built more homes in uh South Mississippi

[1:33:15] than any other builder for 16 years. >> Um

[1:33:18] » what's your name? >> Larry Matraa. I owned Heinaman Homes,

[1:33:22] Hinman Companies. And as a matter of fact, um at the time this all took

[1:33:27] place, that's why Hy reached out. I had over a thousand lots in inventory at the

[1:33:32] time and I have 50 some houses done construction and I'm 78 years old now so

[1:33:38] I haven't been here in a long time but um uh the the issue

[1:33:43] » I'm sure we have to get with our meeting we're in a public meeting we're not

[1:33:46] supposed to talk to you separately on the agenda I'm so sorry

[1:33:50] » on the agenda you some time to speak to >> please do but we have to do it legally

[1:33:55] » let's I would actually I was here 8:30 this morning because I wasn't aware that

[1:33:59] it was >> Yes, sir.

[1:34:00] » So, I listed everything else. All right. >> So, if there's there's nothing else, um

[1:34:04] we'll >> I'll make a motion to recess.

[1:34:06] » Okay. But I want to recess in the name of uh Gregory Crochet. He was perhaps uh

[1:34:12] he worked for Harris County Soil Water Board, Natural Conservation Service,

[1:34:15] Mississippi Association of Conservation District and Soil and Water for the

[1:34:19] Commission Board. So, I'd like to close in his honor or recess in his honor.

[1:34:23] » I'll make that much second. >> All right.

[1:34:24] » Yes. >> All right. Uh discussion. All those in

[1:34:27] favor? I >> All right. recessed.

[1:34:32] » Foundation of that CDBG grant to

September 8th, 2026 - Harrison County Board of Supervisors Meeting Part 3

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