[2:42] The disaster recovery international affairs and planning committee meeting, recess meeting from September 2nd, reconvene on September 3rd at 9.03pm, come to order.

[2:59] If everyone can please silence their cell phones or other noise-making devices that would help our cause. In accordance with the members, in accordance with the Sunshine Law, if you're not in the council chambers, please identify by me.

[3:14] who, if anyone is in the room vehicle or workspace with you today,

[3:19] miners do not need to be identified, also please see the last page of the agenda for

[3:24] information on meeting connectivity. My name is Tamara Palton and I'll be your chair for today's

[3:30] drip committee meeting. Committee Vice Chair, Nohailani Uhu Hodgins, has not joined us yet,

[3:37] So she should be joining us and is excuse at this time.

[3:44] Concent member Konoi Batangla, Aloha Kakayaka.

[3:50] Aloha Kakayaka, Aloha Kakayaka.

[3:52] Aloha Kakayaka, Aloha Kakayaka.

[3:54] Aloha Kakayaka, Aloha Kakayaka.

[3:59] Concent member Rikkiyuu, Junci and Aloha Kakayaka.

[4:04] Aloha, good morning, Chair.

[4:08] I'm here alone in my office and I'm in my workspace and I'm ready to work.

[4:13] Thank you.

[4:14] Thank you.

[4:17] Councillor Alice Lee, Aloha Kukayaka, Aloha Kukayaka,

[4:21] Aloha Kukayaka, chair and no one's here in my workspace.

[4:25] And from the Cherokee Nation, Oceo.

[4:29] Oceo.

[4:31] Next up, Councilmember Kiani Ralein Fernandez, Aloha Kukayaka,

[4:35] I'm Ocio.

[4:39] I love Haka Haka Chaharan.

[4:40] I love Haka Haka Haka Haka Cacko.

[4:42] My Malokai Noiya Hina, I'm at my private residence alone.

[4:47] I do have to step away at 10 for a previously scheduled meeting.

[4:54] But hopefully there'll be like 30 minutes and I'll jump back on.

[4:58] Malature. Thank you.

[5:00] Council member Shin Shin Enzi, Aloha Kukayaka, and OCO.

[5:30] Last but not least, Councilmember Yikili, so you might as excuse this is based on the polling.

[5:37] We also wanted to send a special thank you to member Gib Johnson for allowing us to take up his meeting slot for today, so we can continue this important discussion.

[5:48] This meeting of the Disaster Recovery International Affairs and Planning Committee of the Maui County Council is located on the traditional INO of Kanako EV,

[5:56] who never seated their sovereignty to the United States.

[5:59] We recognized that her Majesty, Queen Millio Colony,

[6:03] yielded the Hawaiian Kingdom to the US,

[6:05] in the rest under threat of violence

[6:07] to avoid the bloodshed of her people.

[6:09] We further recognize that Hawaii remains

[6:12] an illegally occupied nation state by the US

[6:14] as documented in a 2021 scholarly article

[6:18] for the National Lawyers Guild Review

[6:20] by Andrew Reed, a junk professor of law

[6:23] the University of Denver, STEM, College of Law.

[6:26] Generations of Kanakamawani and their knowledge systems

[6:29] have sustainably cared for Hawaii and continue to do so.

[6:33] We're grateful to occupy the space and learn the ways

[6:36] in which we can contribute as a community

[6:38] we seek to support the varied strategies

[6:40] that indigenous people of Hawaii are using to protect

[6:44] their land and their communities and commit

[6:46] to dedicating time and resources to work in and solidarity.

[6:50] from the Department of Management, we had the managing director.

[6:57] He is doing storm prep today, so we may have him

[7:02] like at a limited role because of, you know,

[7:05] a good friend's law, Karina, and Marie come into visit.

[7:11] From the Department of the Police, we have Lieutenant Taylor,

[7:16] come up if you will only and Christina Bordner Carci, as well as Officer Erin Mark, from the Department of

[7:22] Prosecuting of Attorney, we have Prosecuting of Attorney Andrew Martin and Deputy Prosecuting of Attorney Chad Kumogai.

[7:30] From Corporation Council, we have Deputy Corporation Council Role. We also have drip committee staff

[7:38] with us this afternoon, senior legislative analyst James Kruger, as well as legislative analyst

[7:45] star at Pasquale, senior committee secretary, Iwet Boutilier, and legislative attorney

[7:53] Carla Nakata as a reminder that public testimony, oral testimony is closed for today.

[8:02] We had concluded yesterday and routine testimony is still being accepted.

[8:09] We have two items on today's agenda, Drift 27, which is Bill 13, establishing 8.38 Maui

[8:19] County Code on the disclosure sale and commercial use of license plate, Reader data, and Drift 27,

[8:27] 26, Bill 112, 2026, establishing Chapter 8.37 Maui County Code on facial recognition.

[8:38] We will continue where we left off from the last meeting. Last meeting, we had one round of

[8:44] three minutes, but not everybody got their opportunity. I think it was just the men.

[8:52] So this, the males, or whatever you guys want to be called.

[9:00] So this today, I wanted to allow

[9:02] five minutes. And for folks that didn't get their opportunity last round, it can be combined

[9:10] to up to eight minutes if you would like. Would and they realized some of the questions,

[9:22] yesterday, from a number of dancing and singing, would be easier answered by Lieutenant

[9:28] So that's why they asked her to come today.

[9:33] So before we start off on questions,

[9:38] I guess member Johnson and members in NCF,

[9:41] if you wanted to repeat your questions,

[9:43] maybe the tenant won a car seat could answer them.

[9:52] Okay, sure.

[9:53] If you're asking me, chair, sure.

[9:58] The idea was,

[9:59] which part.

[10:00] A lot of money did we use to buy the county owned cameras, and how much is left in that pot? Do you guys plan to buy more of it with that money?

[10:12] And that was the basis of my question of words. You get the money, which fund did you use it from?

[10:18] And maybe council members in the city had more to add to that, but that was my part.

[10:22] Thank you.

[10:22] Members in the city, did you want to do you remember your question from yesterday? We cannot stop if not.

[10:27] yet my questions were posed by some of the testifiers yesterday who has any of the existing

[10:36] of lock cameras as the state have any of the lock cameras already up and then I think

[10:41] the department did answer to some of the license plate of shots from the motor roller cameras

[10:52] that are existing on the traffic, the traffic lights?

[10:58] Yes.

[11:00] And then also I did receive a message from Managing Director Nishita.

[11:06] He said he took with the team that LPR cameras

[11:09] being used at Waikuli are under the Department of Foreign

[11:22] originally he had thought they were flock, but they're genetic.

[11:28] Okay, Lieutenant Bono-Corsi, did you, were you able to answer any of those questions from yesterday?

[11:39] Test.

[11:41] Good morning.

[11:42] Good morning.

[11:43] Good morning, council members.

[11:45] Lieutenant Christina Bono-Corsi, just a really quick background.

[11:48] Initially, I began this project back what two years ago.

[11:54] So I initially have a lot of the information that may not have been passed down.

[12:00] So that's my role, and now I've got promoted in HANA now, so just so all of you are aware.

[12:07] Regarding the, I believe, contracts, this there, Council Member Gabe Johnson, referred to,

[12:14] we don't have any pending contracts, we got a contract, basically, with Motorola back in 2025.

[12:23] And that is that contract, it was already funded, funded money that the chief acquired and

[12:30] that came up with our radios, 400 new radios that we need, Motorola radios, our command

[12:37] central wear program which is basically the brains and operation of the R-talk, which is a real

[12:43] time off-center. And it came with 27 licensed plate reader cameras. So that was all bundled together

[12:51] And basically we got a, when you do it like that, it was a lot cheaper, and then on top of that I got a jagged grant for $150,000 that also went towards these cameras, so that kind of like wiped a lot of the funds out on that contract.

[13:11] and regarding councilmen,

[13:14] births, tendencies, regarding the flock cameras.

[13:18] We do not own flock, nor will we ever own flock,

[13:23] just because there's a difference.

[13:25] We actually own our information.

[13:28] We, the information that flock has,

[13:32] and I'm not other than a lot of leaks and stuff with flock.

[13:36] The Motorola system, it actually is in a secured government.

[13:41] server, see just compliant. So there's we own that information. Nobody can gain the information

[13:47] unless we authorize them to gain information and you see that's other police departments.

[13:52] But other than that, I hope that answers your question. We're good enough.

[13:59] Member Johnson, before you answer, I just wanted to recognize, or commit a waste

[14:11] Thank you.

[14:12] Good morning, chair.

[14:13] Good morning, chair.

[14:14] Good morning, everyone.

[14:15] I'm at my private residence.

[14:17] Alone in my workspace.

[14:18] I apologize for being late.

[14:19] My computer wanted to update when I

[14:22] re-opened it this morning.

[14:24] Thank you.

[14:25] Thank you.

[14:26] Follow up on the answers to your questions from yesterday.

[14:35] Yes, I really appreciate that. Thank you, Chair. So the 27 cameras were bundled with the 400

[14:41] rate. Thank you for that cutification. How about the subscription fees? You have to pay a monthly fee

[14:47] for these and how much are they? Where's that money come from? There's a subscription. I believe

[14:54] If I can get that number for you, it's like per camera, I believe it's around.

[15:00] Like 200 or something like that per camera or 150 or something like that for a year, for each camera, but we'll get the exact number for you.

[15:09] And that's already budgeted in our fiscal year, 2027.

[15:15] It's under contract. It's just a licensing fee. Basically, because we're using basically the software is on like a alert platform is where we utilize that.

[15:28] the brains, that's where we get our information if we're searching something and Motorola does not

[15:35] have access to that. It's ours, we own that. I understand that thank you $200 per year per camera

[15:42] and for a total of how many cameras? We have 20. Technically we have 27 cameras on this contract

[15:49] and we had 11 legendary contracts which we call them legendary because we had a

[15:58] last two years prior to getting this contract.

[16:03] And I'll get the exact number for you.

[16:06] Okay.

[16:07] All right, thank you.

[16:08] I appreciate your following up on me.

[16:11] Thank you.

[16:11] Okay.

[16:11] Thank you, Chair.

[16:12] Have the information to follow up with a letter.

[16:17] Yes, sure.

[16:18] Okay.

[16:19] Member Uhagin's,

[16:20] my head mentioned this round would be five minutes

[16:23] and that the

[16:25] our male members already had their first round.

[16:28] So the female members will get eight minutes up to eight minutes if they'd like.

[16:35] So I guess I would love to go first with member Rowland for nine days because she does

[16:41] have to leave for a moment and I didn't want to mention that member Batangon has a hard

[16:45] out at 1145 before lunch.

[16:50] Okay, member Rowland for nine days, are you ready with you like your opportunity?

[16:54] Thank you.

[16:58] Hello, Tara.

[16:59] And, um, hello to our, uh, resource personnel for being with us today.

[17:05] Uh, and yesterday.

[17:06] Okay.

[17:07] Um, I did have this step away yesterday, uh, and leave a little early.

[17:13] Uh, so I did go back and watch the last 15 minutes of the meeting that I missed to hear some of the questions and answers.

[17:20] by the male council members,

[17:26] and you know, so, remember Paul tonight, and remember I think

[17:30] this was explained yesterday that when we participated in the nickel conference in New Orleans,

[17:39] we were able to join the site visit that took us to New Orleans real-time crime center.

[17:48] It's a real-time crime scenario and they took us on a tour and they shared the best practices and so you know

[17:59] I just want to commend Chair Bolton for very quickly introducing legislation

[18:07] You know kind of based on some of what they've done that was successful there and that what would make sense for us here

[18:19] So I know, okay,

[18:24] so what I'm, I guess I want it to understand and then I'll ask my questions.

[18:34] So testifiers, I'm a hollow two of the testifiers that shared their monol with us yesterday.

[18:40] We're often just using flop cameras as any kind of surveillance camera and our cameras are

[18:50] Motorola and flop cameras are known for its, you know, facial recognition and I guess the data

[18:59] is collected by the company and not an expert in flop, so I don't super know, but it's

[19:07] facing it off of what officer Banakoski was explaining that Counties, Motorola cameras do not

[19:14] have facial recognition software installed and the data that is collected by the county is

[19:22] owned and held or stored by the county. That county does not own or operate cameras with facial

[19:29] recognition,

[19:32] but the county does own and operate cameras with license plate readers.

[19:39] Okay, so my question is how many cameras and how long is the data currently stored?

[19:47] Tammy,

[19:56] come out to be boldly.

[19:57] Thank you for your question.

[19:59] Councilmember.

[19:59] So, curve.

[20:00] Currently, we have 27 cameras all. These 27 cameras are out, you know, throughout our main thoroughfares, you know, keeping track of, you know, anything that, as far as the community or vehicles that may be involved in a crime or maybe stolen or whatnot.

[20:18] The information is stored on an SD card that's within the device itself.

[20:27] Alerts and real-time information is sent to Motorola, but that basically comes right back to us in a vehicle alert that we receive in our email.

[20:36] So it officers that have access through vehicle manager, they're not able to input information.

[20:43] There basically received alerts at this vehicle, possibly the stolen vehicle that was reported

[20:49] that was on the hot list, was glass seen on this roadway this time, and depending on

[20:55] the position of the camera, we'll give the direction of travel.

[21:01] As far as, you know, the flock, and like you mentioned about the flock cameras, it's a bunch

[21:07] information that people are gathering offline. And when you look up LPR as the first most popular

[21:14] searches will be flock. So a lot of the Motorola cameras that we have installed are being associated

[21:21] with flock. You know, flock has had their issues of being hacked. That's one of the reasons why

[21:29] when we want one of the reasons why we won't release the mate model and information on the camera

[21:35] because if you have that information,

[21:38] hackers will be able to find the way

[21:39] to get into the camera systems.

[21:41] Daxis, to the information, will be monitored

[21:45] by those who are in charge of the program currently.

[21:51] But as far as our Motorola cameras

[21:53] and everything else that we have,

[21:55] it is for the safety and for embassy tools.

[22:00] The way that we look at the ALPR cameras

[22:01] is that instead of posting officers

[22:04] on the corners of every street looking out

[22:06] these vehicles that are traveling, you know we have tools and other

[22:09] set of eyes and that you know we'll alleviate and we'll save a lot of

[22:13] manpower and as you folks know it's it's already hard to feel a lot of

[22:18] the positions that we have. You know if we were fully staffed you know it would be a

[22:22] lot easier but it's just the current climate across nation right now. Every police

[22:28] station, every police department, every sheriff's department, the law enforcement

[22:32] in general, or having hiring issues at this time?

[22:41] Yeah, Mahalo, um, officer, come and give you a link.

[22:44] Oh, no.

[22:45] Yeah.

[22:46] Lieutenant.

[22:48] Lieutenant.

[22:52] Okay.

[22:53] And then, um, okay.

[22:55] So you said that, um,

[22:59] when the license plate reader, um, potentially reads the, um,

[23:12] is that a photo that is sent to Motorola and then is sent to MPD or what is that information

[23:22] look like?

[23:25] So yesterday in a PowerPoint presentation, the images that we showed is basically what

[23:29] we received, so that will basically show to the officer, but the officers still have to

[23:34] physically go out there and locate the vehicle and make contact with the vehicle before any

[23:39] type of search, any type of, you know, of stop or whatever maybe the vehicle information

[23:45] has to be verified by a human body.

[23:50] Okay, the part that I was trying to clarify was, you said the information goes to Motorola

[23:57] first and then it, like the company and then it comes to MPD.

[24:06] Okay, just to clarify, Motorola doesn't see any information, it's the platform that

[24:12] we're using that they developed.

[24:16] They do not see, so it's like a platform.

[24:18] So like any brains of it, it goes up into the cloud.

[24:22] Say, you take a picture, it goes up into the cloud,

[24:25] which is a secured government,

[24:27] see just compliant entity.

[24:30] Then when we say, okay, we're looking for this license plate

[24:35] that, and it's just a picture of the vehicle

[24:37] with the license plate, it goes into,

[24:40] Then when we ask, okay, where is this license plate?

[24:44] And then all those pictures of that license plate comes down

[24:48] to our desktop or whatever we're using

[24:52] the secured system.

[24:54] So Motorola doesn't know what the information is up in there.

[24:58] They just applied the system that we're utilizing.

[25:00] Kind of like our CAD system. Kind of like our radios. They don't know. They're just applying the information. Like they just have the program, but they do not have access to it. If that helps. It's just like basically standing on a corner, like the LT said, taking a picture of every vehicle that passes, an officer doing that, or an officer with a pad, a no pad, and writing that every single license plate that passes you. That's all. The system is doing. It's just taking us

[25:29] snapshot of a picture of a vehicle.

[25:32] No personal information is stored.

[25:35] We have to investigate that information further.

[25:39] It's just like a lead.

[25:41] Yeah, it's just a lead leading to the investigation.

[25:43] Sharon, real quick, just to clarify.

[25:46] Because like I said, I'm just trying to understand

[25:49] what the current situation is right now.

[25:51] So Bill 113 is attempting to protect and regulate the data

[25:59] and so I'm trying to understand how data is currently stored and when I ask that question,

[26:05] the data is stored on an SD card on the device itself. So that data is not video that data is

[26:12] only photos.

[26:17] The data is only photos pictures, not live images, not videos just a snapshot,

[26:22] like a photo roll, like, you know, if you took a picture.

[26:28] And then that data went, when it matches a plate that we could be looking for,

[26:35] then that photo is sent into the software in the cloud.

[26:41] And then it goes to MPD.

[26:43] Yes, the perfect example was the one that she used of an office

[26:46] just down the corner, you know, looking for a vehicle.

[26:49] When you seize the vehicle, you take a quick snapshot, what is cell phone.

[26:52] and then basically text the message out to the officers.

[26:56] So basically the Motorola program is basically that.

[26:59] You know, we take the pictures, the system,

[27:02] it does this job, recognizes that we have a possible hit,

[27:05] sends the alert out to the officer.

[27:08] So, none of the information that is sent that is collected

[27:11] is stored by Motorola.

[27:12] Everything is held stored and controlled by us.

[27:16] And recurrently, yes.

[27:17] The reason I ask that follow-up is because I want,

[27:21] I'm trying to understand what stays on the SD card and what is then like released and how it's released and to who it's released. Right. And so I understand what you're explaining.

[27:35] But I think like these details need to just kind of be teased out a little more, which is why I'm asking the question. So I appreciate your responses and I appreciate the flexibility and the follow-up questions. I will have more questions.

[27:49] Mahalachary. Thank you and just double-taking where you

[27:53] able to hear the bell.

[27:57] Yes, okay. All right, either

[28:00] concerto, or committee-based or no-he-ohadians that you had,

[28:05] Charlie, did you want to go first? Yeah, sure. My question is for our

[28:12] prosecuting attorney Andrew Martin. Given all the testimony we heard yesterday,

[28:19] given all the concerns that were expressed and knowing what these two draft ordinances are

[28:30] proposing. Do you have any more suggestions to perhaps bring a little bit more comfort

[28:38] to the general public that we are not overreaching that this is a very well-controlled system

[28:47] that we have.

[28:52] But if there's anything else we can include in the ordinance to ensure that there is no misuse or abuse of the camera systems.

[29:07] Yes, and thank you, Chair Lee, for the question.

[29:13] I think the most important pieces of this proposed legislation, right, are number one the limits on utilizing these systems for law enforcement purposes only where there is a criminal nexus.

[29:30] that that is one key, the second key is the imposition of the documentation requirements.

[29:40] Those are the two key pieces of this legislation that set up the safeguards.

[29:46] And one that I think the committee is looking for, but that also provide the public with the reassurance

[29:53] that the use of these systems is well regulated and

[30:00] Limited to the legitimate law enforcement purpose only.

[30:07] We do have some suggestions on just how to tighten up some of the language to make sure that the legislation doesn't cross over into areas that create ambiguity and concern down the line.

[30:25] And, you know, number one, as I mentioned yesterday, with Subsection in Bill 112, Subsection

[30:36] 8.37.020 Subsection E. We'd recommend striking the language after documentation where

[30:49] there we recommend striking the language is an imminent threat of death or serious bodily injury

[30:54] to a person and instead rewriting that section to read facial recognition technology may be used

[31:02] without prior documentation where there is an exigent circumstance requiring its use.

[31:09] The documentation required by subsection B together with a description of the circumstances

[31:13] is constituting, again, adding an exigent circumstances,

[31:18] must be completed within 24 hours after it's used.

[31:22] The reason that becomes as important

[31:24] is that it appropriately tracks the warrant clause

[31:27] and the Constitution, the exception to the warrant clause,

[31:31] as set forth in case law.

[31:33] And make sure we don't miss an opportunity

[31:35] to use the system under all possible exigent circumstances,

[31:40] which we think is key requirement.

[31:42] Thank you. And Chair, could you have the staff email us, but he just said, yep, so we can consider it as a possible amendment.

[31:54] Okay, and then I ask.

[31:58] You wrote it on circumstances.

[32:00] 8.37.

[32:03] Anyway, could you just email it to email it to us?

[32:06] Now, can I have the police?

[32:09] I'm not.

[32:10] I'm not.

[32:10] What the prosecuting attorney just said.

[32:14] And because you're the actual boots on the ground,

[32:18] the implement the system.

[32:21] So, is he suggesting is it reasonable,

[32:25] or do you have any more suggestions?

[32:28] Anybody from the police?

[32:32] So, the question to the police is,

[32:35] are you okay with changing on what was said for

[32:38] certain circumstances, or would you like more language in their besides

[32:44] editing circumstances?

[32:45] No, I agree with prosecutor D. Andy Martin, I do agree with that.

[32:54] That cleans it up a lot for us.

[32:57] Very helpful.

[32:58] So thank you.

[33:00] Any other suggestions you may have?

[33:07] Just to keep it on a little more broad, because

[33:09] Exitancy, I mean, it all depends on the circumstance and the type of investigation that

[33:14] is occurring.

[33:15] You know, nothing is cookie-colored or nothing is in a box, so that's why, I mean, we

[33:20] don't have any more suggestions, but we do agree with Andy Martin on this one.

[33:26] Okay.

[33:27] Thank you.

[33:27] That's all I have, Houcher.

[33:30] Thank you, Terri, a member of U-Houdings.

[33:35] Thank you, Terri.

[33:36] a couple of comments before I start asking my question.

[33:41] So we live in a world now where I feel like everywhere you go,

[33:46] you can be recorded.

[33:47] We all have a camera in our back pocket.

[33:50] Majority of our job includes being filmed.

[33:54] Our words are memorialized.

[33:57] Our video is memorialized.

[33:58] I'm taking this meeting from home.

[34:00] And I choose to face my back where you see my back yard,

[34:04] but not any personal effects in my house.

[34:07] And that is a choice I make, right?

[34:11] Our jobs are so public,

[34:13] and I have to remind my children as they're growing up,

[34:18] they will be making mistakes,

[34:20] but please don't photograph those mistakes

[34:22] and post them on your social media

[34:24] because that will live forever.

[34:26] And so it's interesting to see that discussion

[34:31] discussion I need to have with my kids in a larger discussion as we deal with adults

[34:37] and what that looks like in our everyday life and I know we have to find a balance between

[34:44] technology, privacy and not living in some minority report of the world.

[34:54] But so I just want to see, I get that finding the balance is difficult, right?

[35:00] I get that. We, how many times we've watched the recent fights, I guess there was in Safeway in Kihai, that was filmed, that was online. Right?

[35:11] We had fights in the mall, that was filmed, that's online. All of this stuff is just filmed, whether or not it's by our police officers or by our regular Schmuggler people, half of our life is being filmed.

[35:22] Yeah, regular Schmuggler. So it's, it's, it's just, it's just what's happening. That's, that's our normal.

[35:29] And it's a weird normal, but that's where our normal is going.

[35:34] So I guess a couple of questions I have is, right now we currently have cameras that can

[35:40] read license plates, but we do not have cameras that can read our faces.

[35:47] So are we, if we do install these other facial recognized recognition cameras, are we having two separate

[35:55] cameras or what is this technology look like? Are we placing them in the same places that we have

[36:05] the licensed-flate reader cameras or are we just going to be like littered with cameras everywhere?

[36:11] How does this look in its totality?

[36:17] Yes. Thank you. We honestly appreciate that question.

[36:22] You are absolutely right about things that forever, social media, you know, I mean it's

[36:30] very, it's scary and every kid lives on social media nowadays so I agree with you on that.

[36:36] This county is already littered with cameras, you got the traffic cameras, you got our cameras,

[36:42] you got the DLE cameras, you got, I mean it's crazy as it is already.

[36:49] The facial recognition cameras and LPR cameras are two separate entities.

[36:54] We could.

[36:55] There are ones that are together, but we do not have any of those.

[36:59] Those are a lot more price here, but we do not have.

[37:02] There's also live feed cameras that we could also purchase.

[37:05] Anything that helps our officers.

[37:08] If you've gone to any real-time officers in the mainland, they can follow a subject

[37:13] from like a robbery all the way down the street into officers in real time where this guy is.

[37:20] So, I would love to get to that, but we're also getting permission to access the street cameras.

[37:28] So it's not our cameras.

[37:29] We're kind of a double, like a multiple force multiplier where we're using other entities which goes in a secure system that we can get the feed, you know what I mean?

[37:40] But we wanted in real time, not like, you know what I mean, not weeks later, when the lead is

[37:49] null gone and we can't get any evidence. So that is our goal in the future. But right now,

[37:55] the cameras are too separate entities and we don't have any facial recognition cameras here.

[38:00] All right. Okay. Okay. So you said you toured other facilities. I know some of our other

[38:08] members did. I did not go to New Orleans and it's too hot for me so I didn't go. What are some lessons learned,

[38:17] which is a question one of our testifiers asked that we don't also have to learn the hard way.

[38:23] Do you have any of those you would like to share? Yes, absolutely. Working with you guys.

[38:29] Council members, a lot of you guys, the mayor, other agencies, they said, once you work together

[38:36] and have an open dialogue with the community of what you're doing and why you're doing them,

[38:41] then they understand. Because it's the ones that are doing something wrong, you know what I mean.

[38:48] If I had somebody missing or hit and run, we're going to be able to catch them like like that.

[38:54] And we have using these cameras. But having our policies and stuff,

[39:01] tight where if any of our officers do anything illegal, they will get in trouble.

[39:05] you know, and that's what the other agencies already have done, so we're kind of helping, you know, working towards that.

[39:11] So we do not make the same mistake.

[39:16] About last year or so, I think it was last year.

[39:20] One of my sons, classmates from Keke Olike, went missing for a long time.

[39:28] And I don't know what I would do if that was my son, but it was my son's classmate.

[39:33] we spoke about it at length at home.

[39:35] And we live in a more rural area

[39:38] where we don't have major intersections,

[39:42] other than maybe the one-by-care code we get.

[39:45] So in our rural places,

[39:48] where would you be putting any cameras

[39:51] seeing as like the easiest place

[39:53] would be on our large intersections?

[39:55] How would that look for our rural communities?

[40:02] So, the cameras, they can either work on Wi-Fi or cellular. That's what the SIM cards are. Just like your phone, it's a cellular information that gets the information to us.

[40:12] On the rural areas, I think they're trying to work on technology to get like Kikolike, you already know that that's really spotty cell phones service up there. So, sometimes it hits you miss, but it does, once the information stores on there, once it has services sends it to us.

[40:28] So there was a camera up there by Keiko Like, I think somebody stole it, you know what I mean it's gone so there was one up there. Yeah, we have those two

[40:39] But in real areas like there's one that's supposed to go to Twin Falls. We can jump on their Wi-Fi. It's on a private place where they can allow us authorize us to put what camera out there. One of the, you know, certain areas like that, but if it's really like real area, we have no cell phone, no Wi-Fi

[40:57] that's a bit difficult for us. But at least we know which way they went the last time. It's not

[41:02] no longer a needle in a haystack. Now we know if this person passed one falls,

[41:07] it we know. They're probably going to Hanah or something. So if that helps a little bit.

[41:13] Okay. Okay. One of the questions I found a little interesting, and I don't know how we find

[41:20] balance, but you know somebody wanted to say they would prefer to tour our places. Like we did

[41:29] like a couple of members did. So if you do a lot of tours, which I'm not suggesting you do or you

[41:35] don't, how do you prevent like a breach of information, maybe I watch too much oceans 11, but

[41:44] that is like getting the tour is where the beginning of the end. So how does this work to be transparent,

[41:52] but also to protect people's privacy? Thank you for the question. Let's see, the hard part will be

[42:00] like our water treatment plants, you know, our critical infrastructure location. We don't do tours,

[42:05] we don't give masks because we are afraid of fire warfare. Exactly. And you know, it'll be the same thing

[42:12] If we ever get to the point, or when we finally complete the project, we would basically

[42:19] vet certain officers and only those people will be allowed in that information or into

[42:24] that seeker facility.

[42:26] And the only reason being, it's not so much the, you know, that we don't want to be transparent

[42:30] is the fact that there is a lot of secure information that is up there.

[42:34] I mean, you know, the event that something does happen during a tour, you know, that information,

[42:39] And we can't go and pull our M.I.B. ones out and look into the flash and make you guys forget what you guys saw.

[42:47] So I'm saying that.

[42:50] So as far as tours, when the crime center is operational or whatever may be, we will not probably allow tours into that area.

[43:02] Thank you.

[43:03] Chair, heard the bell.

[43:04] Thank you very much.

[43:06] Thank you.

[43:07] for my opportunity, so many questions.

[43:11] I just wanted to clarify some ground terms,

[43:15] like RTCC would be a real-time crime center,

[43:18] and that's located like at the key a police station,

[43:23] but that's different than the real-time op center.

[43:27] Real-time crime center is all police, real-time op center,

[43:31] is like any first responder, is that correct?

[43:37] They currently have the, I think, is it Mima that runs the emergency operation center?

[43:43] They have a facility.

[43:45] Yeah, that's the MEOC, right?

[43:48] Yeah, and then the emergency operation center.

[43:50] So in the center, in the center, in the real-time crime center, and Molly, in the emergency

[43:54] option.

[43:55] All the acronyms.

[43:57] So eventually, our hope is to have a real-time operation center.

[44:03] So we don't have that, not.

[44:05] Currently, there's nothing operating.

[44:06] there's no physical location for it.

[44:09] We have an office where in the key station that we meet and we continue the process to develop this real-time operation center.

[44:20] But currently we do not have a facility for it or an office specifically for that.

[44:26] Okay, and those are the real-time crimes in our talk to the Mali emergency office center.

[44:32] There's a lot of things that we assist with, so if, like, during the last corner

[44:37] lows, we have our drone teams that are, they fall under, technically, the real-time

[44:42] operations center, leadership, so we were tasked with going out and assisting with different

[44:50] things as far as damage assessment or whatnot with the drones.

[44:55] So when they need help, help with things and we go and we assist.

[45:01] Okay, and then since you've had these since 2025, except for the 11 legendary ones, if we would have had these, like, say during the fire in West Maui, they wouldn't have been operational because we didn't have any Wi-Fi cellular, is that how that works?

[45:23] would they still be taking photos and just not transmitting them

[45:30] until the Wi-Fi cellular is operational?

[45:34] Yeah, so basically, if we had them during the fire,

[45:37] all the images would have been stored on that device.

[45:40] And then once the cellular and Wi-Fi went back up,

[45:43] then all those images would be flowing back into the system

[45:47] where we can actually see them.

[45:50] OK, if the device isn't.

[45:51] If it didn't burn down, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[45:55] And or get damaged from the heat.

[45:58] And so we have currently 38 cameras, the 27 that we got

[46:04] through the radio purchase and the 11 legendary.

[46:08] Yeah, and I believe there's some that stolen.

[46:11] So I think there was like two or three

[46:13] that were taken the empire of course.

[46:17] And then, yeah, in Keehe, and there's a couple that they're trying to change out, but other than that, there is actually, let's see here, about 32.

[46:31] We would have had, and two, National Park Service Bata Camera, we're trying to get there's online.

[46:38] We can see theirs.

[46:40] They wanted us to see their feed.

[46:41] That one is not up yet, and then the Hawaii visitor bureau, that's the one that they want

[46:46] to put at Twin Falls, we are trying to get there's life, but we're having issues with that

[46:51] camera itself.

[46:52] So, technically that's two more, so it would be if we had all of them working, it would

[46:56] be 40.

[46:59] And then I think in some other written testimonials brought up like, we're not, are we, is the

[47:10] public allowed to know where the cameras are,

[47:13] or is it more general terms,

[47:15] and is there specific areas where they cannot be like,

[47:20] I'm thinking obviously you don't want to mean bathrooms,

[47:25] or changing rooms, or those types of places,

[47:29] but is there places where they absolutely cannot be

[47:32] and can the public know the locations

[47:34] or just the generalities of where cameras

[47:39] our could be cannot be.

[47:43] Thank you for the question.

[47:44] It's on any public roadway.

[47:46] So like bathrooms, there's no way we would ever put anything even outside.

[47:52] There's case law against those things.

[47:54] So it's just on any public roadway.

[47:58] You know, if private property, if they have LPR cameras, that's on them.

[48:02] You know, if they want to share their information with us,

[48:05] then we are grateful because then that helps us.

[48:07] But there's no two way sharing we get the information we do not share it back and if the public wants to know where the cameras are

[48:15] Either you can see them on the roadways or there's that I think there's an app that you can

[48:20] I don't know how it detect somebody can detect but it doesn't all it says is where they are

[48:25] you know and so

[48:28] What I'm hearing you see is the county only puts them on public roadways

[48:33] I've heard from folks that there might be some in parks or things like that, would that not be the county?

[48:42] If there are cameras in a park state, it wouldn't be our cameras, it would be either parks department or some kind of security cameras that were put in to those areas.

[48:52] I know the concern of one of the tests the fires yesterday had mentioned was the cameras that face public, you know,

[48:58] Yeah, probably private homes and whatnot.

[49:01] I think that was our first test to fire from yesterday,

[49:03] but all of our cameras face directly on public roadways,

[49:08] where there is no real expectation of privacy,

[49:11] because we are only looking for vehicle license plates.

[49:15] We're not looking for faces.

[49:18] We're not looking for habits or workouts in the backyard,

[49:23] or those types of things.

[49:24] We're only concerned with vehicles.

[49:25] Maybe I should clarify.

[49:26] there could be common cameras in the parks,

[49:29] but they're not police is ones.

[49:32] It could be parks one because they're dealing

[49:34] with a lot of vandalism or things like that.

[49:37] Yes, correct.

[49:37] And I know for sure, Klamo Park has them,

[49:40] but they're mainly for the ocean, as far as safety

[49:43] and whatnot.

[49:45] I know that there's other cameras that

[49:48] were put into certain locations, like the Park Mall,

[49:51] we, just to monitor the parking areas and whatever,

[49:55] maybe but yeah, we do not have access currently, oh my God.

[50:00] And as Lieutenant Bonnecourt said, mentioned, if they want to share the feed, then we'll take it, and we'll use it for whatever public safety purposes that we may have.

[50:11] So, like if parks had a situation where they called the police because of vandalism,

[50:17] then you may put a camera feed to see if you can get any information or if a private citizen,

[50:25] like I guess there is a string of deaths at monobot yard, and they have their own cameras,

[50:32] and then you can put a camera feed because they reported a crime and you're trying to solve it.

[50:38] So in those cases, we would actually contact, they had a security who would look through their

[50:43] feeds and then basically download the information that will have that may help us in our

[50:47] investigation. But as of this time, we do not have access and we cannot currently pull life

[50:55] feeds at this moment. And then, you know, since you said that this mini started in 2025 with the

[51:08] positive measures of success, like how do you

[51:12] or your key performance indicators?

[51:17] So, basically, before I left about a year ago,

[51:22] with the time we started recording,

[51:23] because we had the older cameras,

[51:25] yeah, we were doing a demo for like two years,

[51:28] and only the year we were actually recording data.

[51:32] And because of our new RMS system,

[51:35] which is our report management system,

[51:36] It's a lot easier, it's going to be a lot easier for us to record these solvable crimes basically solvable crimes meaning like if your vehicle was stolen or

[51:46] missing person we found them we found your vehicle or if there was a hidden run and we found the guy and we found the vehicle we found the guy these are all things that we did we have done

[51:56] That was about a year ago and we had at least 40 40 cases solved and that was within a year span and that was a

[52:05] to murder suspect that was hit and run robbery suspect just from these cameras, just from

[52:12] finding them going through one of the cameras and mind you that was 11 cameras. That was only

[52:19] 11 cameras. Now we have you know a lot more. So it leads to a solving of a case. It leads to

[52:28] something that is what we want. We want that information. And with the retention you guys said

[52:34] seven days, 30 days, and I know I'm going off script here, but the longer the better, because

[52:39] a lot of times we can't do anything within the 30-day span if it's a case that our detectives

[52:43] get. So if you guys can, please go longer at least three to five years, because that's other

[52:50] departments. If it's seven days, the information going to be gone. Okay, and I did hear the bell.

[52:59] I just was wanting to follow up on your key performance

[53:04] in the catering or quality of the quantitative majors

[53:06] of success.

[53:08] It would be 11 cameras, one year, 40 cases solve.

[53:13] That's how it would give somebody

[53:15] where to see an executive summary

[53:16] or whatever you call it about majors of success.

[53:21] That's how it would be reported.

[53:24] Yes, and we can also go back through our records

[53:27] over the last period since we've installed the cameras to time now that we can actually go back

[53:34] and try to find out and get those numbers back to you folks.

[53:37] Okay, because I think in New Orleans, their major success was like hours saved, like manpower,

[53:48] or she, like, I

[53:54] don't know, it's probably apple store

[53:56] and it is, but like, the signs of Kahana situation,

[54:00] you were able to go into their cameras,

[54:04] which I think are probably closed caption,

[54:07] but with the different speed, if you had access

[54:11] to their closed caption, I think the gentleman,

[54:14] unfortunately, it was found many hours later.

[54:17] if it was in real time, maybe you could have got to him sooner or something like that.

[54:26] And then that's hours and potentially a life-seed or how can you, how can you measure

[54:35] or can you measure man hours expedited through the use of the cameras or whatever?

[54:46] Yeah, with the RSAV, I mean, it could be described as being either the amount of RSAV

[54:54] because of the technology cutting down and making police work a little more precise or RSAV.

[55:00] That's far as, you know, special operations to look for certain vehicles and whatnot.

[55:05] That's something that we could actually look into.

[55:08] And we could actually, you know, discuss and maybe, you know, I guess they develop a reporting system or a report

[55:14] that would actually verify or give you the up to the information on that.

[55:19] Thank you. I think that would be important so that people can see why are we doing this?

[55:28] or not trying to spy on people,

[55:31] or trying to solve issues that get reported,

[55:35] but it maybe needs to be worked out a little bit more.

[55:39] I think everybody had their first and second

[55:41] around opportunity, so I can go by hands,

[55:44] re-eased, and we'll be five minute rounds from here.

[55:48] Maybe one or two more rounds of just general questions,

[55:53] and then we can maybe work on the bills, okay.

[55:57] So whoever wants, okay, remember running for 90s,

[56:01] follow by a member cook.

[56:03] Well, the chair, and I'll have to leave in a couple minutes.

[56:09] So, okay, so in New Orleans,

[56:14] their real-time crime center was just like a wall

[56:18] of TV screens with like videos of traffic in real time.

[56:29] And so, in my round one questions, I understand that the county's Motorola cameras do not take video, only photos images.

[56:44] With the Twin Falls, in your response to, and I think this is opposite.

[56:51] And you're responsible to member for this.

[56:57] Lieutenant Bucca, you said

[57:04] that it, it's not lies.

[57:08] When you say lies, you just mean lies and taking photos.

[57:14] Thank you for the question.

[57:15] Yeah, my name is a little hard sometimes.

[57:18] It actually isn't opiate.

[57:19] We were having issues with the camera, so meaning lies, it's just not there yet.

[57:23] You know I got your title wrong, but am I also but you're in your name?

[57:32] But that's okay.

[57:34] That's a hard one.

[57:38] Okay.

[57:39] All right.

[57:43] With these cameras,

[57:46] can they take video?

[57:49] And we just are choose and the colony is choosing not to and is only just taking photos right now.

[57:56] These cameras cannot take the life feed, they have newer cameras out that do both that take life feed and that you can access, but these do not.

[58:04] These actually, these cameras are actually equipped to do speed too, but we are not doing that.

[58:10] Like to see if vehicles are speeding in areas, but we're just getting snapshots. We're not doing that.

[58:20] All right, so some of the questions or concerns that we heard in testimony,

[58:26] me like in other places where you know like in Chicago and Indiana, Kentucky, you have

[58:34] like officers like watching women of interest, but this more this camera cannot do that.

[58:50] Women's of interest, they're talking about like stalking, stalking, okay, yeah, like ex-girlfriends

[58:58] So there are, there are departments that even if people interest you mean like potential

[59:05] violators of crime.

[59:07] I mean like attraction.

[59:11] So these cameras don't take any life feed or anything like that.

[59:15] There are departments that have caught officers trying to find out where their exes are.

[59:21] And that's, you know what I mean?

[59:22] But those officers got in trouble and got fired.

[59:24] And those are other departments.

[59:26] That's why we have a policy, in effect,

[59:29] that if anything is ever caught,

[59:30] because everything is logged, whoever goes on,

[59:32] whoever tracks anything,

[59:35] every single thing is logged, dated, and timed.

[59:37] So we will know that administrators on the system

[59:39] will know who does that.

[59:42] Does that add to your question?

[59:47] Oh, hello.

[59:48] Okay, I'm going to go to my meeting

[59:49] and I'll be back.

[59:51] My pleasure.

[59:52] Thank you, member Cook.

[59:54] Thank you, Chair.

[59:54] Um, I'm, I'm, I'm, thank you again for having.

[1:00:00] This has been a really challenging for me personally. This has been one of the most distressed

[1:00:05] full issues and topics. The way I've been approached by people from my individual, representing

[1:00:14] and doing what they're doing. From dear friends who are writing and going like, I cook, I've

[1:00:20] known you forever. You've got to tell me that you're not supportive of this. What's going on? I can't

[1:00:24] support you if you do this kind of stuff.

[1:00:27] So I want to, I'm going to talk for a minute.

[1:00:32] I want to frame how I see this conversation and hopefully,

[1:00:37] how I see it being represented.

[1:00:40] And then where I am, as being a local resident,

[1:00:43] and fortunate to be sitting here as a council member,

[1:00:51] most of the testimony that we've received

[1:00:53] and people who have written to me about concern,

[1:00:57] it's basically like this national surveillance narrative.

[1:01:02] It's this, you know, quoting places all over the country,

[1:01:07] Washington, D.C., which, whatever,

[1:01:09] I'm just really disappointed,

[1:01:11] and it's just disgusted with how the direction is gone.

[1:01:15] But framing the use of the data platform,

[1:01:18] like flock, in particular, or similar tech,

[1:01:21] as a broad coordinated privacy threat connected to federal overreach.

[1:01:27] And now with the testimony here to Maui County MPD overreach.

[1:01:37] And I've strived to kind of like do what I do.

[1:01:41] Talk story and it's like, yeah, but this is this is different.

[1:01:46] I look at it. We have a, and has it resonated with the people I'm talking to.

[1:01:50] We have a small community reality,

[1:01:53] always a tight-knit community,

[1:01:55] use-alizing technology for local safety,

[1:01:58] traffic management, emergency response,

[1:02:01] not for political weaponization.

[1:02:04] And so I just want to foundationally,

[1:02:06] that's how I see it.

[1:02:07] And I want to, I want to be real personal for a minute.

[1:02:10] The nine of us have many different backgrounds,

[1:02:13] and many different political positions.

[1:02:16] And we clash radically.

[1:02:20] we care for each other, doesn't matter how much I disagree, disagree whatever, it isn't like

[1:02:28] wanting harm or bad or undermining.

[1:02:34] And I get emotional because I mean I feel that I think we all

[1:02:37] feel that. And so this stereotyping and I feel this from outside and I'm not negating it because it

[1:02:44] events is happening all over, but I don't think it's happening here and to be, I feel

[1:02:52] like I'm playing defense, need to, I want to represent, I want to, I don't want to defend.

[1:03:01] I've gotten familiar with MPDs since I've been in office,

[1:03:07] Kalama Park, meetings, you know,

[1:03:13] community policing, all of these things I've seen this interaction and this willingness and also I know you guys got one tough job

[1:03:24] the police department

[1:03:27] and I was joking with somebody other day it's like

[1:03:30] people don't come up to you and go like oh I'm guilty arrest me I did it I did it I did it people lie all the time

[1:03:37] people that deceptive all the time. I'm sign waving and everybody's on their camera at

[1:03:42] an intersection and everybody. It's just a habit. People drive 60 miles an hour and 35

[1:03:47] miles an hour and they're saying, but everybody's doing it so it's safe. I'm just sharing

[1:03:51] with you. I'm hoping that people hear this and see this and can pause and open up the

[1:04:03] to understand that this is a very intense issue,

[1:04:07] it's a very serious issue and also thank God,

[1:04:10] this is Maui.

[1:04:11] We're in island.

[1:04:13] People aren't driving in and out of here.

[1:04:16] You know, and I never got it,

[1:04:18] people still in cars here.

[1:04:19] There's nowhere to go.

[1:04:21] So having said that,

[1:04:23] that sort of set the stage for my questions.

[1:04:29] I see like the question of that my colleague made, so it goes into the cloud for Motorola.

[1:04:38] I interpret that sort of just like the hard drive landing point that like the other cloud service was used.

[1:04:45] You can access it when you need it and it's stored.

[1:04:50] I guess the question for that is how secure is that?

[1:04:56] So it's a seed is compliant.

[1:04:59] So that is...

[1:05:00] That is what police departments go off of is the criminal justice information system. That's

[1:05:07] a serious, compliant government entity server. That is where the information is stored. I know

[1:05:15] people get scared when it comes to technology, but technology is here. We are just doing our due diligence

[1:05:21] and making it the safest for anybody's information. And nobody's personal information is ever

[1:05:28] kept on there. No personal information. That's all you have to, just because we have a license plate up there,

[1:05:34] doesn't mean I know who's one that is. Unless I have an investigation then I can grab it.

[1:05:49] If I may enclosing, because I heard the bell,

[1:05:54] the bottom line is developing trust and

[1:05:57] And I just say, again, pausing in the, is this happening here and if the people

[1:06:05] are working with, and so I'm just hoping that the people who are very concerned about

[1:06:10] this.

[1:06:11] And it's, it's, it's, it's, it's the concerns real.

[1:06:15] It's just how applicable is it to hear how what opportunities we collectively have as

[1:06:21] community, government, the agencies, the administration, and the public to work together to

[1:06:29] identify that, okay, we don't want that here, let's have the best transparent communication

[1:06:33] we can have. Thank you for your, you know, your monol and just sharing your heart on this whole

[1:06:41] in this whole topic. Your job is just as hard as our job, you know, you guys have to make decisions

[1:06:46] and taking the best information you can to make those decisions for us, it's a lot of times

[1:06:53] it's damn what we do and damn what we don't.

[1:06:57] The person has their cars, I mean social media for instance, sometimes someone's cars

[1:07:03] stolen.

[1:07:04] If you look on there and say, oh, where is MPD, how come MPD's not looking for my car and everything

[1:07:08] else?

[1:07:10] I mean, it's never needed until they need it, if that makes sense.

[1:07:14] You know, people never think about it until they actually need it.

[1:07:19] You know, if their loved one is injured, if they're not loved one is missing, or whatever

[1:07:22] may be, or if their car is stolen, you know, help me to find my car.

[1:07:26] I know one of the testifiers have mentioned coconut wireless and, you know, we do use some

[1:07:31] coconut wireless as well, but for some reason, you know, the coconut wireless is always anonymous,

[1:07:37] and anonymous information is in useful information.

[1:07:39] You know, unfortunately, and that's just the truth of the game.

[1:07:42] But for this particular topic, I mean, it is our goal, our 100% goal to build trust.

[1:07:51] The whole platform of 21st community policing came from Barack Obama, so if it is a political issue,

[1:07:58] I know a bunch of the testifiers I had mentioned that we are under a MAGA regime,

[1:08:03] but the fact of the matter that this whole policing thing, community policing,

[1:08:07] those six pillars of community policing came from Barack Obama.

[1:08:11] So if it is a political issue, then it actually started off from a different party, not the party where I'm there correct, yes.

[1:08:19] So with that being said, our goal, again, is to ensure community safety, protection of life and property.

[1:08:26] That's always our goal, and tools like this will assist us in doing so.

[1:08:31] I mean, I know, you look at any type of job, you know, McDonald's, Burger King Taco Bell,

[1:08:38] you know, to the top of the platform.

[1:08:41] You know, is there issues in those workplaces?

[1:08:43] There's always going to work issues and always comes down to the intent and the heart of the person who's in control of it.

[1:08:50] You know, so, I mean, our thing is that, you know, we endure, we serve with our hearts, we give our all.

[1:08:56] You know, I mean, do we have family members that, you know, in our lives that make mistakes?

[1:09:00] Yeah, we do.

[1:09:00] We all have them. We don't have perfect families. We don't have perfect, you know,

[1:09:04] Johannes, but the thing is that we continue to move forward and stick to our goal, stick to

[1:09:09] the plan, and our goal is to provide the best service that we can to our community.

[1:09:16] Thank you, Nama Gansen.

[1:09:20] Thank you, Chair. This is just a couple of follow-up questions in regards to the

[1:09:25] the radios that got bundled, or I mean the cameras that got bundled with the radios.

[1:09:31] Was the council ever informed that the cameras were going to be bundled with the radios?

[1:09:36] I don't recall that during that discussion.

[1:09:37] I remember how expensive the radios were and I just didn't know that that included cameras.

[1:09:43] Were we ever informed, did you guys ever tell us that?

[1:09:48] I do not know, I wasn't there during that time about during that time.

[1:09:54] I know that the wear system, the real-time operations center.

[1:10:00] I know that was mentioned that it was going to be in the next contract during the RMS CAD system contract.

[1:10:12] And then so.

[1:10:14] Okay, I just remember the discussion and I don't recall having cameras included in the radios.

[1:10:24] I want to pivot and I really appreciate you guys have an anti-stalking policy because that's a big concern of mine.

[1:10:34] I know we talk about bad apples and everything, but the idea that you guys are getting ahead of it, which is great. I love that. Thank you for that.

[1:10:46] I know that's there, the cameras that we have now are just taking pictures, but the department's

[1:10:55] intention to eventually move to taking video and if so, will you guys let us know if you're

[1:11:02] planning to do that?

[1:11:07] I mean, any purchases that we are, you know, either procure through RFPs or, you know,

[1:11:18] are purchasing the apartment.

[1:11:20] So if we are moving towards purchasing any new equipment

[1:11:24] that may be able to do the things that we are addressing here

[1:11:27] today, yes, you will be notified.

[1:11:30] Is that your intention?

[1:11:32] Yes.

[1:11:35] OK, eventually.

[1:11:36] Again, it was just a matter of tools.

[1:11:38] What tools can we have on their tool

[1:11:40] well, in a little bit of a server community?

[1:11:49] You know, I'll save my discussion for when we do get into the bill, but I looked, I was looking at the bills, and I was looking for ways that we could just outright put a moratorium on county buildings and county roads, but I don't think there's a way for that to make it for me to make an amendment.

[1:12:08] And I also feel like if we're at 40, I would prefer to maybe cap it 40, but I don't really feel that I'm having any kind of traction in that opinion, but that's where I'm at on this, I think my questions were answered for now.

[1:12:22] I appreciate that. Thank you, Chair.

[1:12:25] Thank you, Member Johnson and Member Sinente.

[1:12:30] Hello, Chair and I apologize if there was a previous discussion on data, particular data centers.

[1:12:40] I know some of the testimony referred to data centers, the collection of the amount of data.

[1:12:47] So, who would be storing this data that doesn't require that we get more storage or units

[1:12:58] to store this data if the data will be protected and only access for the warrant.

[1:13:06] or an anus for budget purposes will this also be a request for next year's budget?

[1:13:18] So, you're asking if the data is stored anywhere else than the SD card basically on the camera?

[1:13:26] Yeah.

[1:13:27] Thank you, Councilmember.

[1:13:30] So the SD card is like SD card because I know there's a little confusion but it's just

[1:13:35] the one in your cell phone. So it's like a a link that goes up. So so once that information

[1:13:41] say if it it block with Wi-Fi was out or there was no cellular in that area it would store on

[1:13:48] that and then go up into the secured government CGS compliant entity is where it's stored.

[1:13:56] nowhere else is it stored? You can't grab this SD card off of one of the cameras by breaking it open

[1:14:02] taking that information, you cannot, and the only information is those still pictures of a vehicle

[1:14:12] with a license plate.

[1:14:15] Okay, thank you for that. Perfection. I think, you know, hearing all about

[1:14:20] this heat data centers across the nation, we might, we're not at that level of data collection yet.

[1:14:31] I just add to that real quick. I know, I know there's a scare with the whole flock in the whole

[1:14:37] You know hacking of that information right and that's why a lot of people are scared right and they don't trust government entities and stuff like that totally understandable

[1:14:49] Fluck owns and keeps the data. So they want the more people they have that by their cameras, they keep that data. We keep our data our analytics, you know

[1:15:00] White, white Toyota truck. We want to search our information. We can search it that way. We keep that information. Nobody else gets that information. Not flock, not Motorola. We have that on that as ours and that's owned by us.

[1:15:14] And that's written part of if we are in contract with any of these companies.

[1:15:20] Yes. Yes.

[1:15:22] More or less solutions.

[1:15:24] So it is in there when we get that information that they cannot access these cameras.

[1:15:31] Thanks, O.T.

[1:15:32] Thanks, Chair.

[1:15:34] Shipping, member Batangman.

[1:15:38] Thank you, Chair.

[1:15:39] I'd like to start off by also acknowledging the tension between civil liberties and public safety.

[1:15:46] And I want to commend you for bringing this conversation forward and trying to thread the needle with these two bills.

[1:15:57] And I think we shared the sentiment from the community.

[1:16:02] And I think the conversation we're having now goes a long way in addressing some of the concerns in building public trust.

[1:16:08] I especially like the portions of the bill that limit access, require audit and accountability.

[1:16:22] And so I just want to start there.

[1:16:26] I asked yesterday about questions related to cryptocurrency and prosecuting attorneys requested amendments.

[1:16:34] I think we heard from prosecuting attorney.

[1:16:38] I saw an email with one of them.

[1:16:40] Did we get both of your requests and languages?

[1:16:45] No, no, we have additional suggested language in the time.

[1:16:48] So I guess I'll hold for that.

[1:16:51] Then I do have a question for police and the license plate readers.

[1:16:58] You know, the bill before us limits use to criminal activity, has the technology been used

[1:17:08] for enforcement on civil traffic violations and is there any contemplation of that doing so?

[1:17:15] Are you guys doing so?

[1:17:16] So currently, all we're focused on is criminal activity.

[1:17:20] There has not been any citations issued with the use of cameras.

[1:17:24] You know, as Lutheran, of course, you said that the cameras do have that capabilities, but we haven't used it.

[1:17:33] Did you want? I think there's a state statute that prohibits not.

[1:17:39] You mentioned that previously.

[1:17:41] Thank you, Chair.

[1:17:44] And then, for a corp console, on the definition of criminal intelligence information under Bill 113,

[1:17:54] It might be the same for both, but I have it up on 113.

[1:17:59] Criminal intelligence information means information is relevant to the identification

[1:18:04] of and the criminal activity engaged in by an individual or organization

[1:18:08] reasonably suspected of involvement in criminal activity, et cetera.

[1:18:13] Can you help me understand this?

[1:18:17] Because on one hand, I read this to me that you have to be already reasonably

[1:18:21] suspected of involvement in crimin activity, but on the other hand, that the information can be used for identification.

[1:18:30] Am I just misinterpreting this?

[1:18:37] Thanks. Can you help me understand the definition of criminal

[1:18:41] intelligence information as it's presented in Bill 113? Because I see that

[1:18:49] it's information relevant to identifying crimin activity. But on the other hand, you also need to be reasonably

[1:18:56] suspected of being involved in a criminal activity.

[1:18:59] So I see tension in this definition here.

[1:19:04] And would like either you to clarify that I'm mistaken

[1:19:08] or provide alternative language to help clean that up.

[1:19:15] Oh, remember, Tangan,

[1:19:18] that's the section

[1:19:18] that talks about consistency in sweet title 20,

[1:19:23] quote of federal regulations, part 23.

[1:19:25] I do have a copy of that if it would help, but I'll also yield to our attorneys and I can have staff.

[1:19:34] He looks like he's contemplating. So if you can give him a minute, would you mind?

[1:19:39] Yeah, and I can have staff upload on what we have about 20 CFR 23 as well, because I guess, you know, federal regulations are higher than state regulations,

[1:19:52] and they're higher than county regulations,

[1:19:54] kind of like Mr. Martin had previously said.

[1:19:57] So we've got to abide, stay in our lane.

[1:20:00] If this is language taken from elsewhere that's already been approved, then I'm comfortable. Thank you, Chair.

[1:20:06] Did the lawyers have anything to add to his?

[1:20:10] So I did have a title 28 code of federal regulations part 23 up that definition that is included in here is fairly consistent with it.

[1:20:19] I understand your question about it being consistent, but I mean, it's information relevant.

[1:20:31] So

[1:20:34] it means that there's a person or an individual, an individual or an organization that

[1:20:40] is suspected of involvement in a criminal activity.

[1:20:45] And this just means information that's relevant to that suspected criminal activity.

[1:20:51] Okay, so it's to the suspected activity, not that you have to be previously identified.

[1:20:57] Okay, understood. Thank you, Chair.

[1:20:59] Your NM staff is going to make copies and upload the C28 CFR Part 23 to Bill 13.

[1:21:09] So when she finishes that, you can refresh and get a copy of that as well.

[1:21:14] Thank you, Chair. Thank you, Corporal.

[1:21:17] Member Uhu Hodgins.

[1:21:23] Thank you, Chair.

[1:21:25] I know I was talking about movies. I don't mean to make just super light of this situation, but sometimes I feel like that's my only reference point to really get a grasp on how this works because all of it is a lot for me.

[1:21:39] And this might be kind of simple, but if we ever do have facial recognition technology, how do you get an image of the person to look for?

[1:21:52] Is it when somebody is going to provide it for to you like if there's somebody missing or you do a Google search or how do you get the photo to start doing your facial recognition in those cameras?

[1:22:10] Thank you for the question.

[1:22:12] So, once or if we moved that direction, I'm not in that section anymore. However, the way that would work is if you got it from say it's a missing person.

[1:22:23] say you give me a picture on your phone or print it all picture or whatever it is. It would go

[1:22:29] in a separate program that we would have. We would scan it in and then that scan will look at all

[1:22:36] the images throughout the facial recognition or whatever cameras have. This is how this normally works

[1:22:43] or into that system so it would alert similar features and stuff like that. That would pinpoint

[1:22:50] on this photo. So that way we would actually look at the photo again and run it through different

[1:22:56] additional checks. So it's just not some Joe Small on the on the road, you know what I mean?

[1:23:02] It is actually a fact that person. And that's just a lead leading to who that may be.

[1:23:08] And then in the event where it's more of like a criminal activity like in high cool recently,

[1:23:15] we had a couple teenagers attempt to break into a smoke shop and you know there was video online

[1:23:23] and they're throwing rocks at the window. I think some one of the children had a gun in their

[1:23:29] hand and they were using the butt of the gun to attempt to break the window. In that case where you

[1:23:35] know we have cameras there's clearly footage. It's not like a parent is providing you with a photo

[1:23:41] that I know of. How do you take an image from somebody else's private

[1:23:46] camera and put it on to your camera to potentially find those individuals?

[1:23:51] How does that work? It's the it's the same concept so like if we get a clip of of

[1:23:55] whatever it is and now we have it say it's on a flash drive or something or they sent it to

[1:24:00] us via email or however we got that actual footage that footage or clip of that would be

[1:24:06] place through our software, and again, we do not have the

[1:24:10] server software right now, but that's how it usually works.

[1:24:13] You put that image or video through the software, and then it

[1:24:16] takes frame by frame, still images of that face or whatever you're

[1:24:23] looking at, and then it goes through our software to identify who

[1:24:27] that person would be.

[1:24:28] That's usually how that works.

[1:24:31] And then I have another question, and it seems silly, but

[1:24:34] me, it's not silly. So, it's easy to change your, what your face looks like, like right now,

[1:24:41] and the bartender looks like Jeff Goldblum, you know, what his beard. If he was to shave his beard,

[1:24:47] how would we track his facial features, hypothetically? You know, like, if somebody like Na Hulu

[1:24:53] shaved yesterday, he looked like a whole different person. So, and women can't do all kinds of things

[1:24:58] in their face, we can die.

[1:25:01] How do you track, and I know this sounds silly, but it is legitimate, like, how do you track potentially

[1:25:08] somebody's face when you can shave your beard or you can dye your hair orange or you can

[1:25:13] unite me, do a chokebow talks and look completely different than the week before. How do you keep up with

[1:25:21] like somebody's ever changing face.

[1:25:25] Like if I was able to put my hair down,

[1:25:26] I look like a whole different person.

[1:25:28] So how do you keep track?

[1:25:31] So using Andy as an example.

[1:25:35] You're sorry.

[1:25:36] I'm sorry.

[1:25:36] So if you're the color is hair red,

[1:25:38] you know, give them a green beard.

[1:25:40] It still recognizes the brawl structure,

[1:25:43] cheek structure, and nose.

[1:25:45] So all those are identifying factors.

[1:25:46] And the same way that an artist would draw a picture

[1:25:50] of a sketch, you know, they'll describe, you know, how this is

[1:25:53] personal, is not looking or not, but the technology will do it

[1:25:56] at that for us. And you probably look good right here, by the way.

[1:26:01] You know, I think you can pull up anything. So, um, okay, what happens

[1:26:06] when our technology advances, because we, that it is advancing

[1:26:11] every single day, um, how do we catch up to what's available and how

[1:26:20] create legislation and policy. Like I feel like we apparently are linked to the party and then

[1:26:27] I was pulled around the wrong side of history in testimony. So how do you think as somebody who

[1:26:33] has to work with this technology and us on our end that we have to legislate this technology?

[1:26:39] What do we do when technology advances? How do we communicate with you folks? How do you communicate

[1:26:44] with the public to let us know when there's changes and whatever is being proposed or whatever

[1:26:52] type of camera is upgraded or whatever. And, Chair, I heard my bell, but thank you.

[1:26:59] Yeah, and to address that, we're always going to be approached by companies that are coming

[1:27:02] out with new technology tools that better certain departments and certain organizations around

[1:27:09] the world or the different around the country, we look at it and we determine if it's going

[1:27:15] to help us here.

[1:27:18] And you know, if it's an improvement from what we have right now, we don't

[1:27:22] just get the latest and greatest because it's the coolest thing and we just want technology.

[1:27:28] We want to see if we can develop it to make it work for us and better the community here.

[1:27:36] So, and of course we have, that's why this legislation is important so we can follow the guidelines

[1:27:40] are here or we try to request a change or what not but you know it's not just okay this is

[1:27:46] the latest let's go forward and not tell anybody we follow the process to get this stuff.

[1:27:53] Okay thanks thank you chair. Thank you. Chair Lee did you need an opportunity or should I go?

[1:28:03] Okay before I get into my questions on bill 113 which is where I think was start because you said that

[1:28:11] You don't have any facial recognition technology software.

[1:28:15] So maybe we're ahead of that one, but behind of the ALPR one.

[1:28:21] You mentioned that there's newer technology that does live streams, that combines facial

[1:28:26] technology and that, and that I think, you know, there was money included in the budget,

[1:28:31] and you would like to expand the ALPR.

[1:28:36] Is it the same exact technology that you're looking into for the expansion or were you going

[1:28:45] to use the budgeted funds for live stream type capabilities, facial recognition, integration,

[1:28:55] capabilities or is it the exact same capabilities as what you've described that we have?

[1:29:03] Yeah, right now with the LPR, the license plate readers, any expansion would be similar

[1:29:09] technology, just more of them throughout the island.

[1:29:14] We don't have just the positioning of the cameras.

[1:29:16] I don't see how they could be beneficial for facial recognition anyway, even if they say

[1:29:22] they do this.

[1:29:24] It's one tool that does one thing, and there's much better ways to do facial recognition

[1:29:29] that we'd look at first is trying to combine it into these systems.

[1:29:34] OK, so your intention is to expand on intersection, roadways, still cameras,

[1:29:41] taking shots of license plate.

[1:29:44] Yeah, and we wouldn't do live feeds with these cameras either.

[1:29:48] They are very, they're fixed in place, and they have a very narrow field of view that

[1:29:53] will actually check for optical character recognition, the way the camera's work.

[1:29:58] so.

[1:30:00] I'm sorry. No pan killed soon. No, none of these can do that. They're fixed in place. Okay. Okay. I had some questions. Oh, my love to start with Bill 13. Since we currently have OPRs and we don't currently have facial recognition technology for police or court counsel on Bill 13 could number three, where it is documented. Oh, I'm sorry.

[1:30:26] documented law enforcement nexus definition be shortened to say connect the query to

[1:30:37] disclosure, sorry, connect the query or disclosure to a legitimate law enforcement purpose

[1:30:45] because the requirements in number three are already defined for a legitimate law enforcement purpose.

[1:30:58] That's on page two of Bill 113, 8.38 or one or number three.

[1:31:09] if we say connect the query or disclosure to a legitimate law enforcement purpose because that is described below we could amend a criminal offense to say a specific criminal offense.

[1:31:27] Is there any issue with cutting out part three because legitimate law enforcement purposes defined below?

[1:31:36] Thank

[1:31:40] you, Chair. Yeah, I actually think that that's a good idea because it is a little bit repetitive as written.

[1:31:47] The kind of five standards that you have under the query or disclosure are consistent with the five things listed under legitimate law enforcement purpose.

[1:31:56] Okay, great. And then on the next page three where it says a private entity.

[1:32:03] What agency is being referred to where it says private entity means a person except for an agency or a government or other government to entity is the agency being referred to a law enforcement agency or

[1:32:27] Mr McNight had helped us with some of this legislation.

[1:32:32] but I think he's on vacation.

[1:32:39] Yes, the private entity refers to anyone besides a law enforcement agency.

[1:32:44] So, you know, anyone, I guess, that owns a camera or whatever, maybe.

[1:32:52] I think that's what he's referring to.

[1:32:54] And it's not, you know, like a law enforcement agency.

[1:32:57] So, you could be, you know, long for the DLE.

[1:33:00] You could be, you know, anyone who's, you know, possesses those cameras.

[1:33:04] So would it make sense to say private entity means a person except for law enforcement agency or any other or other governmental entity would that make sense?

[1:33:20] Yes.

[1:33:21] Okay.

[1:33:22] Thank you.

[1:33:23] And then for police or court counsel in Subsection 8.38.0308.0301113,

[1:33:33] could it be simplified to say an authorized LPR user

[1:33:39] may query LPR data only where a documented law enforcement

[1:33:45] nexus exists?

[1:33:48] Because the definition for documented law enforcement

[1:33:52] next is appears to contain the same specifications in subsection A.

[1:34:05] Yeah, that would make that make sense to me.

[1:34:09] Would you, you're sorry, you'd be saying that you would be law enforcement nexus instead?

[1:34:16] Yeah.

[1:34:18] That that would make sense because the definition that we discussed of law enforcement nexus and references law enforcement purpose.

[1:34:24] So they kind of saying the same thing here twice.

[1:34:27] Okay, members, I had two more questions related to the bill.

[1:34:31] You guys, mine if I take care of these time?

[1:34:35] Okay, thanks.

[1:34:37] And then for court counsel on bill 13,

[1:34:42] because an amendment will be needed to say the

[1:34:45] accounting must not execute or renew contract should the section title be revised to

[1:34:51] when their disqualification or when their ineligibility.

[1:35:00] That's on page 5, 8.3, 8.060.

[1:35:07] Yeah, I'm not really sure that necessarily matters, because part of their eligibility is whether or not they're

[1:35:13] ineligible, right? I don't, I think it's either way. It doesn't matter, it's at your

[1:35:20] discretion. Okay. And then the last one is on 8.38.050 on contracts in special conditions will work

[1:35:34] in practice and if there's any suggested revisions to the language. So I did actually have a

[1:35:43] adjusted revision on this one.

[1:35:46] So it says every county contract for an ALPR system

[1:35:49] or for the ALPR service must include

[1:35:52] the following special conditions.

[1:35:54] I would suggest maybe having that instead say something

[1:35:57] along the lines of must include special conditions

[1:36:01] consistent with the following.

[1:36:03] That would kind of allow us to adjust the language a little bit

[1:36:07] as written this specific wording would have to be in there.

[1:36:11] If we have something in there that says consistent with these conditions, we could wordsmith it a little bit to

[1:36:17] more contract appropriate language.

[1:36:20] Okay. All right. Thank you.

[1:36:23] We had considered part C of 18.38.030 could potentially be an administrative rules.

[1:36:32] But then we were informed that police don't generally have administrative rules.

[1:36:36] What they have is general orders which aren't so much a public process, so then in that

[1:36:43] case it made sense to codify it here, but as this works out, if there are changes, then

[1:36:53] we'll just have to come back in and make amendments to this section of the code that

[1:37:01] I think on the next round, if we can start working on Bill 113, that would be great.

[1:37:11] How do folks feel about five to ten minutes recess at this point? Yes. Five minutes, ten minutes. Ten. Okay.

[1:37:22] We will be back at ten forty seven recess for ten minutes and forty seven. Thank you.

[1:37:30] Well,

[1:37:45] the drip committee meeting of September 3rd,

[1:37:48] recess from September 2nd,

[1:37:49] returns order the time is 1101.

[1:37:52] Thank you members for that break.

[1:37:54] We did work on some verbiage.

[1:37:56] If there are no objections at this time,

[1:38:00] I would love to move on with bill number 113CD1,

[1:38:06] a bill for an ordinance establishing Chapter 8.38,

[1:38:10] Maui County Code on the disclosure.

[1:38:12] So, in commercial use of automated license plate reader data,

[1:38:21] any objection to that course of action?

[1:38:25] Number two.

[1:38:26] Sorry, Chair.

[1:38:26] You said CD1, I am working off of just, I don't have a CD1 version.

[1:38:35] Oh, okay.

[1:38:36] I'm sorry.

[1:38:37] I don't know why it says CD1 on mine.

[1:38:41] And my staff and my, am I missing something on granicous?

[1:38:46] Apologies, share.

[1:38:46] So we did send a CD1 version to court counsel just incorporating on substantive revisions

[1:38:52] just for their review in comments.

[1:38:54] So we don't have enough amendments.

[1:38:56] I also want to remove that.

[1:38:57] Okay.

[1:38:59] All right.

[1:39:02] So during the break, we had been working briefly with the prosecuting attorney and court

[1:39:07] on some of the amendments to this bill because it was rushed because we wanted to try and take it up

[1:39:13] before the South Montgomery Community Plan which is going to shut things down for like about a month of other committees.

[1:39:21] So, at this time, I would love to entertain a motion to recommend passing of bill 113 in 26 on first reading.

[1:39:36] move by member Batonga and second by member U-Hajans.

[1:39:42] Okay, excuse me, Chair.

[1:39:43] As a C-1 version is undergradicus number three.

[1:39:47] Okay.

[1:39:47] We'll be working off the C-D-1 version on grandkids number three folks.

[1:39:53] And it would include any non-substantive changes or revisions.

[1:40:00] Okay. So,

[1:40:09] looking at page 2, granted case number 3, the CD-1 version,

[1:40:25] the first potential amendment based on deputy

[1:40:28] Corp Council rules notes to see if an amendment is necessary to the definition of authorized

[1:40:39] AOPR user to see an agency authorized under the structure to operate an AOPR system.

[1:40:52] Deputy Corp Council rule, is that?

[1:40:59] Yeah, that was a suggestion at a first flag, but now that I think about it because there is a code of federal regulations that is also kind of on point on this. I think that you know leaving it as authorized by the law would also encompass that as well as this chapter. So I actually think maybe we should just leave it.

[1:41:17] Okay, great, great.

[1:41:20] All right, so moving on from that still on page two.

[1:41:28] If you guys are following on number three, 8.38.003,

[1:41:37] it's kind of the same as right below.

[1:41:40] So I would entertain an amendment to amend number three

[1:41:47] to say connect the query or disclosure to a legitimate law enforcement purpose, striking ABCD and

[1:42:00] under there, and connecting it, be low to the definition of a legitimate law enforcement

[1:42:10] purpose means 1, 2, 3, and 4, striking number 5 because that's covered under criminal offense.

[1:42:22] And then just we can strike the in the sentence law enforcement agency means a federal state or county agency with statutory authority to investigate criminal offenses or enforce criminal laws striking the word.

[1:42:42] So does everyone understand that first amendment would somebody like to move to make that amendment

[1:42:54] move by member Batangang on second my member U-Hodians?

[1:43:01] So any discussion on that?

[1:43:02] just tightening it up instead of kind of repeating the same thing twice. Number five is being

[1:43:12] tricky and because it falls under number one. Any discussion by the members?

[1:43:22] Nope. All in favor raise your hand and say aye.

[1:43:28] Okay. Chair, you have eight eyes zero. No

[1:43:30] one excuse, members, sigma or emotion passes.

[1:43:34] Thank you.

[1:43:39] Moving on to page three definitions.

[1:43:43] Their

[1:43:47] private entity did we want to add means of person except for a

[1:43:52] line, first one agency or other government entity was that something that

[1:43:56] we did say we wanted the beauty corp cultural rule?

[1:44:01] Yes, thank you.

[1:44:01] I think that that would clarify what's meant by agency.

[1:44:05] OK.

[1:44:05] So, I'll entertain an amendment to insert the word except for a law enforcement agency or other government entity here for this definition at the top of Page 3.

[1:44:24] By a member, Uhong, second by member Cook, all in fee, very raise your hand and say aye.

[1:44:33] All right.

[1:44:34] Chair, once again, eight eyes, sir, and I was one excuse, members of the Gamora motion to amend passes.

[1:44:39] Thank you. Okay, the next one is also based on comments by Deputy Court Council rule.

[1:44:47] 8.38.020.

[1:44:53] Recommendation is to strike number D3 because it's in court.

[1:45:00] We're separated under D4. So we're going to be striking number 3, disclosure to a person

[1:45:06] of a recording concerning that person, if required, are permitted by chapter 92, FOA revised statutes

[1:45:13] are section 139 revised charter of the county of Maui. 1983 is amended because that is

[1:45:22] sufficiently addressed by number four. Any motion to amend 8.38.020 by striking D3 and

[1:45:34] re-numbering number four and five. Move by U-Hodding. Second of my member, Cook. Any

[1:45:42] discussion?

[1:45:46] Seeing none all in favor, raise your hand and say aye.

[1:45:50] I'm going to be seeking more motion to amend passes.

[1:45:55] Thank you.

[1:46:20] 8.38.030 E and F

[1:46:30] to 4.

[1:46:36] Deputy Court Council rule is an amendment needed to 8.308.030 E and F to rephrase the language.

[1:46:46] I

[1:46:49] think it would be a good idea just because the way that it's presently written, it sounds like it's saying that the receiving agency must agree to further disseminate, which I don't think is part of what's intended.

[1:47:04] So the suggestion that I had would be to have the first sentence be before release or receiving agency

[1:47:13] must agree in writing to receive maintain and secure the data consistent with the policies

[1:47:18] of the disclosing agencies. In addition, the receiving agency must agree in writing to limit

[1:47:24] dissemination to the extent that it is permitted under the policies of the disclosing agency.

[1:47:29] Just so it's the word must and further disseminate art together, if that makes sense.

[1:47:38] And then F, you're okay with?

[1:47:47] For similar reasons, instead of and disseminated there,

[1:47:55] I would maybe have, instead of and disseminated, have and dissemination limited in accordance.

[1:48:03] and dissemination limited, and then I think Mr. Martin said that the end is not criminal

[1:48:12] intelligence information and is governed by subsection A when exudence circumstances

[1:48:20] exist is that correct, Mr. Martin?

[1:48:25] That's

[1:48:39] correct, Sharon.

[1:48:44] after do you get the recommendation for E that Mr. Rule had read out?

[1:48:50] Thank you, Chair.

[1:48:50] I believe Deputy Corporation Council ruled the central for his revisions to us.

[1:48:55] So we do have it in writing.

[1:48:56] Oh, great.

[1:48:57] Um, could you read it on for one of the members to make a motion to amend?

[1:49:02] Okay.

[1:49:02] Uh, if you could give me one moment to pull up his notes.

[1:49:13] I'll be into a motion to amend 8.3, 8.03, or E to say.

[1:49:45] Chair in the first, I will end the sentence to delete further disseminate.

[1:49:54] And then to include as a second sentence, the receiving agency must agree in writing to limit

[1:49:58] to dissemination to the extent.

[1:50:00] And that it is permitted under the policies of the disclosing agency.

[1:50:05] Okay, so that's what we're amending, e2, and then if we're going to change dissemination,

[1:50:15] meeting and

[1:50:18] dissemination limited in accordance with Title 20 code of federal regulations

[1:50:37] part 23 and then the last sentence would be amended to say is not criminally intelligence

[1:50:46] information and is governed by subsections A through G or A through E when the exident circumstances

[1:51:03] exist. Members. I think the language is slightly different than what Mr. Martin had said.

[1:51:15] Okay, Mr. Martin.

[1:51:17] Yeah, I'm sorry chair.

[1:51:19] My suggestion wasn't to regarding subsection

[1:51:23] F, but rather subsection G.

[1:51:26] Okay, okay, okay.

[1:51:28] And that first sentence reads,

[1:51:31] this section does not limit disclosure

[1:51:33] when exigent circumstances exist.

[1:51:38] Thanks, I mean that much more confusing than it needed to me.

[1:51:43] No, no.

[1:51:44] So we're making a motion to amend E as stated by our staff, James Kruger, as stated by

[1:52:02] per consul rule, dissemination, limited in accordance with,

[1:52:06] and then G to say, this section does not limit disclosure

[1:52:15] when exudent circumstances exist, a disclosure

[1:52:22] for this purpose must be documented as soon as possible.

[1:52:26] So that's the proposed amendment that I'll be entertaining

[1:52:33] if somebody wants to move by member Batonga and seconded by member U-Hajans. Any discussion?

[1:52:42] Seeing none, all in favor, raise your hand and say aye.

[1:52:46] Okay, thank you. Sure, eight eyes, there are no one to excuse members, so give more emotion to them and passes.

[1:52:53] Okay, the next amendment, 8.38.045O. I'll entertain a motion to amend by seeing every

[1:53:04] county contract for an ALPR system or for ALPR services must include special

[1:53:15] considering special conditions consistent with the following

[1:53:21] calling

[1:53:24] right Mr. Rull.

[1:53:27] That's correct, sir. Thank you.

[1:53:30] Okay. Anyone want to make that motion?

[1:53:34] made by members in U-Hodden, seconded by members in NNC. Any discussion? All those in fever,

[1:53:42] raise your hand and say aye.

[1:53:46] Chair, once again, AIDI zero knows when excuse members to do more

[1:53:49] motion to amend passes. Thank you.

[1:53:54] Okay, and the next amendment for 8.38.060 kind of an important one to

[1:54:02] the word not, the county must not execute or renew a contract for an ALPR system or ALPR services with a vendor who's

[1:54:27] may member U-Hagin, second in my members in NC, any discussion? All those in favor, raise your hand and say aye.

[1:54:38] Chair 800 knows when excuse me for seeking more motion to amend passes.

[1:54:44] Okay. Next on page 68.38.07 or

[1:54:56] entertain a motion to amend to say unless

[1:54:59] Thanks for watching!

[1:55:00] ceuxly stated, in this chapter, como. This chapter does not limit the performance of duets, blah, blah.

[1:55:12] Sorry, can you repeat them? Sure, unless explicitly stated in this chapter, this chapter does not limit the performance is

[1:55:22] Please move

[1:55:25] by member U-Hodians, second of my member Johnson, any discussion?

[1:55:34] All those in fever, raise your hand and say aye.

[1:55:39] Chair, eight eyes here.

[1:55:40] No, it's one excuse.

[1:55:41] Members who can more motion to amend passes.

[1:55:54] You've explained that last one.

[1:55:57] So unless explicitly, what is the language?

[1:56:01] Unless explicitly stated in this chapter,

[1:56:03] This chapter does not limit the performance of duties imposed by state law compliance with a judicial warrant court order or subpoena, participation in mutual aid or the provision of information

[1:56:18] and expressly required by federal or state law?

[1:56:22] Sorry, so we are now saying that this chapter

[1:56:29] would prohibit the county from complying

[1:56:33] with a judicial warrant, any court order?

[1:56:35] Is that am I reading that correct?

[1:56:37] Unless it's explicitly stated in this chapter.

[1:56:41] Can we do that?

[1:56:43] Sure, do you like me?

[1:56:44] That's what I'm saying.

[1:56:45] The PDU rule.

[1:56:47] So, as far as a judicial warrant, there's nothing in this chapter saying that you can't comply.

[1:56:55] So, the reason that I suggested that is really the participation in mutual aid,

[1:57:00] and that's partially due to Section 8.38.040 regarding immigration enforcement.

[1:57:07] So, because we're explicitly stating that a consistent with Act 141 an agent must see must not disclose.

[1:57:12] We're saying that because it's explicitly stated in there, but participation in natural aid agreement would not be.

[1:57:23] Okay, so that part I understand.

[1:57:24] But in general, we can pass a code that says the county will not comply with a judicial warrant or a court order.

[1:57:31] If the state already passed a law to allow for us to not comply, well, I'll leave it to the light.

[1:57:39] We're not doing that in this in this bill.

[1:57:42] Okay, so I'm just misunderstanding what was the the purpose of this bill is really related to the participation in mutual aid section

[1:57:53] So it's it's applied it is applying to all of those, but nothing in this chapter is doing anything

[1:58:00] on a judicial warrant for example

[1:58:05] Again, I'm just trusting the the corporation council on this. Thank you chair

[1:58:10] I know it's difficult to trust corporation council sometimes but

[1:58:15] So I guess if you guys did have something in here that tried to prevent complaints with a judicial ward

[1:58:21] I would have flagged that earlier and that would not be in this chapter

[1:58:31] I'm glad we don't have to do a reconsideration

[1:58:34] Okay, sorry folks let's return to 8.38.030 to taking some more language

[1:58:45] I

[1:58:49] would entertain a motion to strike number one and see queries and disclosures and authorized

[1:59:00] ALPR user may query ALPR data only where a so striking number one and just the number

[1:59:10] to say where a documented law enforcement nexus exists.

[1:59:17] And then it looks like we can strike that section

[1:59:23] because it's addressed in the following part B.

[1:59:32] Strike everything under about the key report into the number

[1:59:37] because it's already included in C and D, B C and D.

[1:59:46] I call it my chair, I didn't follow them out.

[1:59:48] So this is under 8.38.03, all queries and disclosures.

[1:59:53] We're striking number one.

[1:59:54] Number two becomes the new number one, and we're going with your proposed language.

[1:59:58] I think we don't need a-

[2:00:00] Any numbers, because it's just a statement, where undocumented law enforcement nexus exists.

[2:00:09] And then go on to be striking the whole the case report part of it and going straight on to be from there.

[2:00:19] Okay, can you repeat the, how would it read?

[2:00:22] It would just read 8.38.030 queries in these closures, A, and authorized ALPR user may query

[2:00:33] ALPR data only where a documented law enforcement nexus exists.

[2:00:41] And then it would go on to B. Okay, understood? Thank you, Chair.

[2:00:44] And the part that we're striking is pretty much covered by like

[2:00:57] some extent and we had considered making that part of admin rules, but police don't really have admin rules.

[2:01:05] They have general orders and general orders are not public facing or a public process, so that's why it was determined to leave this in code because that's a public process.

[2:01:17] And the public can see what the process is, I guess.

[2:01:24] So, yes, Memorale Internet is.

[2:01:28] Hello, Chair.

[2:01:30] Okay, so we're on Bill 112, the facial recognition technology.

[2:01:35] Bill 112.

[2:01:36] Oh, 13 still, okay.

[2:01:37] Yeah.

[2:01:37] 8.38.030 at the bottom of page 3.

[2:01:45] Okay,

[2:01:48] I don't have a question.

[2:01:49] Um, is anyone, oh, remember, uh,

[2:01:52] students makes that motion and

[2:01:56] members in and she makes the second

[2:01:57] any discussion.

[2:02:00] All those in favor, raise your hands and say,

[2:02:03] I.

[2:02:04] I chair, eight eyes, zero notes.

[2:02:05] One excuse, members, second,

[2:02:06] more motions for the passes.

[2:02:11] Those are all that I had in my notes.

[2:02:17] Are there any further amendments,

[2:02:19] the body wishes to consider?

[2:02:21] No,

[2:02:26] but can I just confirm with the legal representatives here that we captured all of the requested amendments?

[2:02:34] Thank you, Chair.

[2:02:37] Okay, so that was my next question.

[2:02:40] Any additional comments from police prosecuting attorney or court counsel?

[2:02:45] and you guys indicated no to member baton gun, okay?

[2:02:51] At this time, members, any discussion

[2:02:54] on the main motion as amended, Teryley, did you?

[2:03:01] No, I don't think, okay, member dancing.

[2:03:06] Thank you, Chair.

[2:03:09] Well, first off, I support the majority

[2:03:11] of our police efforts,

[2:03:12] and I want to appreciate that once again,

[2:03:15] 14% reduction in crime and in crime in Maui County is an excellent job. So I want to thank you guys for doing that kind of work

[2:03:23] And I also support consumer importance attempts to work together to make this bill

[2:03:28] even better

[2:03:29] But at the end of the day we all vote with our guts and

[2:03:34] I live on Lone and I know a thing or two about heavy handed uses of power and I'm gonna proponent of more of a light touch instead of a heavy hand

[2:03:44] If the police officers, as well as everyone, all of our resources make a very good point

[2:03:49] that we don't want it until we need it.

[2:03:52] But I know this department can be capable of keeping people safe as well as respecting privacy

[2:03:59] rights.

[2:04:00] And there is a balance, and that I would hope we could all reach a team.

[2:04:05] So I voted yes on all the amendments, but I think as the main motion is amendment, I would

[2:04:10] Thank you, Chair.

[2:04:14] Sure thing.

[2:04:16] Members, any other members with discussion?

[2:04:24] Okay, I guess for my discussion,

[2:04:32] it was stated, I believe that there are

[2:04:36] the Maui Police Department has 32

[2:04:40] ALPR cameras in use.

[2:04:44] And this is establishing how that data could be potentially shared.

[2:04:56] And we can't just...

[2:05:00] See how we want it to be because we're under the jurisdiction of the federal and state government.

[2:05:09] And so the federal limits us with that 28 CFR, part 23, and thankfully the state has enacted Act 141.

[2:05:26] Mr. Roe was there another state HRS about using humans to do traffic tickets that we needed to add into this, that you had said that there was state legislation passed.

[2:05:43] The state legislation that was passed that I referenced yesterday was the regarded the facial recognition.

[2:05:50] Oh, okay, okay. Thank you.

[2:05:53] All right, sorry, wrong bill.

[2:05:57] So the state thankfully limits us

[2:06:01] that we cannot share the information

[2:06:03] for immigration purposes,

[2:06:07] the code of federal regulations

[2:06:08] is that we have to share stuff in it.

[2:06:12] That has been the parameters of how that works,

[2:06:15] has been uploaded into Granticus.

[2:06:20] So this bill, as people said, maybe a little bit

[2:06:25] Lee, as ALPR,

[2:06:30] data was used in 2025, and this is 2026.

[2:06:39] I guess, better Lee than never.

[2:06:43] All right, any further questions you have like,

[2:06:45] call for a roll call at this time?

[2:06:47] Any further discussion?

[2:06:48] and I'm sorry.

[2:06:50] Seeing none go ahead.

[2:06:52] Chair proceeding with the roll with the roll call vote.

[2:06:54] Council member Suki Mora.

[2:06:56] Exceed.

[2:06:57] Council member Sinanci.

[2:07:01] Aye.

[2:07:03] Council member Rollins Fernandez.

[2:07:11] Council chair Lee.

[2:07:13] Aye.

[2:07:14] Council member Johnson.

[2:07:19] Council member Cook.

[2:07:21] Council member Patongan.

[2:07:22] Aye.

[2:07:23] Committee Vice Chair, Oof Hodgins.

[2:07:26] Aye.

[2:07:28] Committee Chair Paulton.

[2:07:30] Chair, you have seven eyes, one, no, one excused.

[2:07:34] Member Sikimura.

[2:07:35] Main motion as amended passes.

[2:07:38] Okay.

[2:07:39] Members, I know member Batanga needs to leave in 15 minutes.

[2:07:44] The department has stated that they do not have any facial recognition technology at this time.

[2:07:52] So I leave it in your hands, do you want to continue on with this today, or would you like to defer?

[2:08:02] You do want to continue on with this today.

[2:08:04] Okay. All right.

[2:08:05] So next up we have Bill 112, which is a bill for an ordinance establishing Chapter 8.37,

[2:08:14] in Maui County Code on facial recognition technology.

[2:08:18] So we're not behind the curve on this

[2:08:21] because the police department,

[2:08:25] and I think the county doesn't use this so we're setting up

[2:08:29] the framework on how it could be used

[2:08:32] if it ever becomes a technology.

[2:08:34] Is that correct?

[2:08:35] Lieutenant Bonocarci?

[2:08:43] Um, Charlie, not at her head. Yes, let's continue on. Um, okay. So, I'll entertain a

[2:08:52] motion to recommend passage of Bill 112, 2026 on first reading. So, I'll move by

[2:09:01] member Lee. Is there a second?

[2:09:10] A member Batonga and there's a second. Okay. Um, so the

[2:09:16] potential first amendment, I have based on deputy court counsel rules response.

[2:09:24] We might want to consider an amendment to Section 8.3703OH, which is on page 4.

[2:09:41] Each current ace says facial recognition technology must not be used for the enforcement

[2:09:46] of civil traffic infractions.

[2:09:53] He suggested we may want to include that facial recognition

[2:09:57] technology must not be used in...

[2:10:00] A photo red light imaging detector systems or automated speed enforcement systems in accordance with Act 21225, which is, I guess, what you just said that it was on Bill 113. Is there a desire to go ahead, Mr. Will?

[2:10:19] Sorry, it apparently has been codified as chapter 291, it looks like J and L.

[2:10:29] So we don't have to reference the bill, we can actually reference the sections.

[2:10:34] Okay.

[2:10:35] Is there a desire by the members to include that in letter 8 of 188.3703 or that limitations of use,

[2:10:48] include that facial recognition technology

[2:10:51] must not be used in photo red light imaging detector systems

[2:10:56] or automated speed enforcement systems in accordance

[2:10:59] with chapter 291, J and L is there a desire

[2:11:04] to make Adam and me.

[2:11:10] Move by member U-Hajans, second and by Charlie

[2:11:15] to amend Section H to include limitations on photo red light

[2:11:22] imaging, detector systems, and automated speed enforcement systems.

[2:11:28] Any discussion?

[2:11:30] Member U. Hodges.

[2:11:32] Thank you, Chair.

[2:11:33] I know Chair Lee wants to work on this.

[2:11:36] I'm happy to kind of go through this.

[2:11:39] But I don't know if I'm ready to pass it now.

[2:11:42] I know you have another bill that you're working on.

[2:11:45] I know we're going to have to take a month

[2:11:47] hiatus from all of our other committee meetings.

[2:11:51] I would appreciate a little bit of time to kind of

[2:11:55] sauce out how I feel on some of the length this bill.

[2:11:59] The other one I think was a little bit easier for me,

[2:12:02] but I just wanted to throw that out there.

[2:12:05] And I'm trying to take up any more time in your committee.

[2:12:07] I know you're super busy.

[2:12:09] So if you want to talk about this today,

[2:12:11] cool, happy to do that.

[2:12:13] But I don't, it's all a lot for me right now.

[2:12:18] I'll be honest for this one, especially.

[2:12:19] Thank you. Sure thing. I'll go to member on this for nandis and then you, Charlie, if that's all right.

[2:12:26] Or dunk in a pool? Okay. Member on this for nandis?

[2:12:32] No, she's giving me an octagon, just kidding, Charlie.

[2:12:41] Similar to member Uhajans.

[2:12:47] I want vote to support passage of this bill.

[2:12:53] Since we don't have facial recognition, since our county is not using facial recognition technology, I would support something like not using facial recognition technology and just like disallowing it, that's something I could get behind right now, just so that it's clear what our position is.

[2:13:22] And, you know, I commend you for introducing this bill to try to get ahead of it, I think

[2:13:33] like, you know, just like, with all the concerns, that was shared that we know is going

[2:13:40] on, like, it would be better to just like super pump the brakes on it and just say, like,

[2:13:45] not know to us, that's right, that it hadn't been that we didn't have. Right.

[2:13:52] Where I thought we did. Yes. Yes. Yes. So when I saw the same thing, you know, I, you know,

[2:14:00] I was on board. But now that learning that we don't, then I'm more like, let's not have it at all.

[2:14:07] And then we can have that discussion later if necessary. But that's kind of where I'm at.

[2:14:15] Okay, I'm all here, Charlie.

[2:14:19] I was only thinking of the schedule.

[2:14:22] We have a very tight schedule

[2:14:25] down the homestretch till December 31st.

[2:14:29] This is like a non-issue at this point.

[2:14:32] So I didn't think it would generate that much discussion,

[2:14:36] but in all fairness, this should be taken up next year.

[2:14:42] Okay, I have no problem taking a breath.

[2:14:46] It's been a long, eight years.

[2:14:51] Anyway, go ahead, remember dancing.

[2:14:54] Thank you, Chair.

[2:14:55] You know, I support what's the conversations

[2:14:56] but been heading, but I do want to thank you,

[2:14:59] because we're working.

[2:15:00] On these bills takes a lot of time, a lot of effort, a lot of research. So just because we might, I'm

[2:15:05] what I'm feeling is maybe way or table, I do want to show you know, mutual respect to you for

[2:15:11] doing this kind of work. This is so complex and thank you for that. Thank you, Chair.

[2:15:16] Sure. Yeah, I have no problem differing that second item and a draining the meeting before

[2:15:23] member Batanga and has to leave. I do have that third bill that was directly referred it

[2:15:31] talks about the length of time data can be held onto and all the rest of the stuff and we

[2:15:38] can work on it. I could work on Bill 112 to get the amendments that folks want in but it seems

[2:15:47] like the direction is more so like let's not have facial recognition technology as I am

[2:15:53] prepping and going into the South American community plan I just wanted to put it out there

[2:15:58] that I won't be the one to introduce that type of bill but feel free because you know sharing

[2:16:06] the load and whatnot um even if I have to facilitate the meaning I don't mind whatever but somebody

[2:16:13] can write the bill on that and then we can take it up maybe at the scene time as the other bill and it'll give us time to refine that third bill

[2:16:24] so

[2:16:26] if there's no objections to

[2:16:33] different bill

[2:16:35] one

[2:16:37] one 12

[2:16:40] No projection, chair.

[2:16:42] Go ahead, but I think.

[2:16:44] Members on the floor.

[2:16:44] I do have a question.

[2:16:47] So with our resource folks, since they heard the council members

[2:16:53] position on this, do we need to pass a law to, you know,

[2:17:02] like, put a more regional, more to prohibit the use of facial recognition,

[2:17:06] in technology or is the, you know, what the intention of the council members expressed like sufficient for the county not moving at that direction. I mean, I guess if it comes up in budget, you know, we could vote against it. But I'm just thinking through like how clear of the direction.

[2:17:31] There was a very much sent out by that administration today regarding placing a pause on the real time crime sensor and installation of new surveillance equipment.

[2:17:45] I don't know if that request would be honored because the administration isn't the entity that oversees.

[2:17:54] I don't know if they can stop money from being released or how that all works, but that I've been informed that that occurred today, which is probably because of yesterday, maybe not, I don't know, I don't know, I don't know, speculate.

[2:18:15] But yeah, I'll let the Lieutenant's, if they want to answer your question,

[2:18:31] yeah,

[2:18:31] facial recognition technology, would you based on the concept members' statements, would

[2:18:41] you guys still pursue facial recognition technology for the police department?

[2:18:47] I would say that I know facial recognition is a scary thing.

[2:18:52] I think we all need to kind of maybe get in a room and discuss it, you know, on the side

[2:18:59] and do like demos and see what it's capable of doing.

[2:19:02] Because I think there's a lot of misinformation out there.

[2:19:05] So I think if we are able to do that and just to discuss it and see what it's capable of doing

[2:19:11] and see what other counties and other states are doing,

[2:19:13] Then go that route before making a decision at this point.

[2:19:18] That's my personal opinion.

[2:19:21] And we'll be willing to work alongside those council members and whatnot.

[2:19:25] Again, kind of like how you folks tour the RTCC in New Orleans.

[2:19:29] It gives you a first look and you have a better understanding of what

[2:19:33] the technology dollars and the capabilities of it doing.

[2:19:36] So in the same sense with this technology,

[2:19:38] I mean, it would be good to sit down and see a demo and actually see first-hand.

[2:19:43] I mean, because, you know, we tend to, of course, to mention, there is a lot of, you know, things and items out there on the internet and, you know, different points of views of the goods, the bad, and also, you know, a mean, of course, you know, the mention of 1984 and the Terminator.

[2:20:00] But I mean, those types of things. I mean, it is just, it is the more information we have, it helps us to make a better decision.

[2:20:09] Member, I'll introduce.

[2:20:12] Well, if I look for your responses on that, and I know there were books and movies that were reference,

[2:20:19] but there's also like actual indictments that are happening, like in Kentucky and Chicago and across America.

[2:20:27] So, there's actual abuse happening with like surveillance cameras and so there is like real concern legitimate concern for community members to have and so just to clarify was the answer to my question about

[2:20:49] The Department not pursuing facial recognition technology based on the statements made today

[2:20:58] sufficient or do we have to cast a law for that?

[2:21:09] That might be above their pay agree.

[2:21:10] Yeah, that is.

[2:21:11] I was going to say that.

[2:21:12] That's going to response to you on the letter.

[2:21:15] The other respond by letter.

[2:21:17] Did you get the question?

[2:21:19] Yes, sure.

[2:21:20] But in response to the things we're seeing nationwide as far as the abuse of ALPR, facial recognition,

[2:21:28] the beauty of the way our system was set up by the Santa Pana Corsi and her predecessors.

[2:21:34] We've locked down it's not just anybody can use the system, like they've used in other agencies,

[2:21:41] where they've abused it.

[2:21:42] We require a report number.

[2:21:43] We require that nexus to a criminal complaint or what have you.

[2:21:49] It's not just an open system that anybody can use and that's what people have been taking the advantage of across the country and that's what they're getting in trouble for.

[2:21:57] So we have these systems in place that will prevent 95% of what was going on, what you've seen in the news.

[2:22:04] Our system would not allow what's been going on there.

[2:22:07] And then the 5% another case where it was just a single person that's doing the checks and checks and balances.

[2:22:14] We have multiple people that do these audits, even as far as automated audits that flag things in real time.

[2:22:22] So it's not just waiting for this quarterly audit or whatever timeframe we've set up.

[2:22:29] But we have these checks and balances in place to prevent what you're seeing nationwide.

[2:22:36] I appreciate you sharing those policies with a council and you know I hear best practices being built in.

[2:22:45] But the best practices, like do rely on humans who are such flawed creatures,

[2:22:53] and, you know, with the MPD being in the news, you know, in the past few months.

[2:22:58] I'm sure you can kind of understand where the, you know, community members are coming from right now.

[2:23:05] Even with, like, everyone's best intentions,

[2:23:09] you know, not everyone has, like, the highest level of integrity.

[2:23:13] And addressing that, if that was not technology related, if it was, you would have been caught a hell of a lot sooner, and would not be, you know, it was not tech related, and that stuff, you know, tech catches and has these audits and whatnot. So, unfortunate, but yes.

[2:23:32] Membrou.

[2:23:33] Oh, sorry. Membrou, I didn't.

[2:23:39] Thank you, Chair.

[2:23:40] I appreciate how Membrou is running this field.

[2:23:42] I just wanted to make clear for me.

[2:23:44] I just, I would like more time to kind of sit and learn

[2:23:48] about all of the new technology that we're going to have to discuss.

[2:23:55] And I appreciate you differing

[2:23:56] these bells so we can continue to discuss it.

[2:24:00] Because like I said earlier, there are cameras everywhere.

[2:24:03] where they belong to us or not, everybody has one in their back pocket. I have

[2:24:07] cameras in my house. You kind of come to my house without me knowing that you

[2:24:10] came to my house. So I guess would like a little bit more time to understand how

[2:24:17] this really applies to all of us and I appreciate MPD willing to work with us. So I will

[2:24:24] take them up to see what this does and I appreciate your hard work on this too and

[2:24:30] That's kind of all I have to say. Thank you. Yeah, I did want to mention that the facial recognition technology bill was a little bit more stringent before collaborating with mtd and one of the things that the chief shared with me is

[2:24:48] He went to a conference where people who are not MPD with open source facial recognition, things could determine.

[2:25:00] Questions that were far ahead of what they could do and like how it would be like if on their off-study, they used open search for facial recognition technology to gain the information that other folks would do.

[2:25:15] But I don't really understand what all that means. I agree that time and education is worthwhile for not just us, but the county is a whole, including our residents.

[2:25:29] It's like what the chief head said is he doesn't want people that aren't police to overtake

[2:25:36] what the police capabilities are, and I get that as well.

[2:25:40] So kind of like what you're seeing is where is the balance?

[2:25:44] How do we thread the needle?

[2:25:45] We don't want criminals to have more information than our police have access to, but we also

[2:25:52] want to make sure that police are held accountable.

[2:25:55] and there is legitimate maybe whether it's third party oversight or what. So I mean,

[2:26:05] yeah, I think the most important thing to take away from this whole experience is that we should

[2:26:14] continue to keep the lines of dialogue flowing and ask questions when we don't know the answers

[2:26:24] and work with the public law enforcement and prosecuting attorneys, office managing director and corporation council to get the information that the public would like to know and what is legal, what is not legal I think some people genuinely believe that cameras on highways are an infringement of their privacy

[2:26:50] I'm sorry, the tenant, one of course, he gave me a couple of Supreme Court law cases regarding

[2:27:01] ALPR readers and our technology and reasonable expectation of privacy.

[2:27:11] So what we believe and what the law states are not always one in the scene, which I mean,

[2:27:18] That's why I'm not really that fond of lawyers, sorry guys.

[2:27:24] But there's that.

[2:27:29] So did we get no objections on differing bill 1,

[2:27:36] 12, no objections?

[2:27:38] And then

[2:27:52] this concludes today's disaster recovery international fairs and planning committee

[2:27:57] meeting.

[2:27:58] Thank you very much everyone. We'll see you at 430 for our next listening session the time is now 1152 and this meeting is adjourned

Disaster Recovery, International Affairs, and Planning Committee (2025-2027) on 2026-09-03 9:00 AM - Reconvened from 9/2/2026 at 1:30 p.m.

Agenda

Transcript