[0:00] One of them. >> Yeah, the Yeah.

[0:04] » Oh, no.

[0:08] » Yeah, I saw that. So, I'm just sorting it with my packet that I got.

[0:12] » Oh, okay. >> So, I'm making sure. Hi. How are you?

[0:16] » I'm [snorts] here. How are you? [laughter]

[0:22] » I'm here sort of.

[0:32] » [snorts]

[0:37] » Yeah. Really?

[0:42] » Oh, Sam's Sams.

[0:51] » Good. Can you >> Same? Hey,

[0:55] » we have these names. >> Oh, I know. I know. I woke up this

[1:01] morning thinking it was Monday. >> Occupational.

[1:07] » Do you know anything about therapist?

[1:17] [laughter] >> There you are.

[1:18] » I felt your hand there, but I'm Who is it? massage afterward.

[1:23] » Yeah. >> Did you want me to fall asleep?

[1:27] » Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, seriously.

[1:38] » Because it's just they use acupuncture.

[1:43] » Welcome back. >> Oh, that's all right. I'm trying to No,

[1:46] » they just got some signature.

[1:58] And I panic,

[2:02] » you know,

[2:08] and I panic and I suspect

[2:13] [clears throat]

[2:21] Oh, I'm sure. >> And she loves

[2:30] [laughter]

[2:40] [snorts]

[2:48] you, right? Contingency.

[3:19] There you go.

[3:54] Yeah.

[4:05] All right.

[4:12] I might add.

[4:31] » Yeah, the system's not the best.

[4:47] Exactly right.

[5:14] really

[5:30] help. I can't

[5:38] Yeah. [snorts]

[5:42] A few cell phones. >> All right.

[5:58] » All right. ready to uh begin the planning, zoning, and historical

[6:02] appropriateness commission meeting. This is our regular meeting. It's at um it's

[6:07] Tuesday, September the 8th or yeah, the 8th uh 2026 at 6 p.m. So, if you would

[6:16] join us with the pledge of allegiance, I appreciate that.

[6:22] I aliance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic

[6:28] for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and

[6:34] justice for all. >> Thank you.

[6:38] » Next order of business is roll call for determination of quorum. If you could uh

[6:45] do that for us. >> Yes, Mr. Chair. Uh, good evening,

[6:50] » Vice Chair Gayos. >> Present.

[6:54] » Commissioner Miller, >> present.

[6:56] » Mr. Chair Walking, >> present.

[6:58] » Commissioner Alviar, >> present.

[7:01] » Commissioner Moby Hill, >> present.

[7:04] » Commissioner Bus. Commissioner Lucero

[7:07] » here. >> Mr. Chair, we have a call. Okay, very

[7:10] good. Thank you. Thank you. And now it's time for any changes and approval of the

[7:15] agenda. I need a motion, please. I move to accept the agenda for uh Tuesday,

[7:21] September 3rd, 2026. >> First motion by Commissioner Mobile.

[7:28] » Second accepted September 8th. >> Oh, yes. Sorry. Thank you.

[7:35] » Second by Commissioner Miller. >> Any discussion?

[7:44] » Doesn't sound like it. Go ahead and get a vote, please.

[7:47] » Yes, sir. I'll go ahead and take a vote. >> Vice Chair Gigos.

[7:52] » Yes. >> Secretary Miller.

[7:54] » Yes. >> Commissioner Alier.

[7:59] » Oh, yes. >> Yes, ma'am.

[8:03] » Sorry, I apologize about that. >> Commissioner Mhill.

[8:06] » Yes, >> Mr. Chair. Motion passes for

[8:10] » Very good. Thank you. >> Thank you, sir.

[8:12] Now it is uh time for item number four on your on your agenda is

[8:18] public input for the one, two, three, four cases that are for action and

[8:24] consideration. If anyone wants to get up and please state your name and um your

[8:29] address and any comments you might have on any of those proposals that we're

[8:34] going to look at. Yeah. Thank you.

[8:44] Good afternoon. My name is Annette Granado and I'm here on behalf of my

[8:48] mom, Rebecca Segoia, owner of 2928 Laamesia Circle. I want to make it clear

[8:54] that we are not against Mr. Bernal subdividing his property or building his

[8:58] own private road from Caysur. The new proposal shows that Mr. Bernal will have

[9:02] his own private road coming from Caya Delsur. My only request is that it be

[9:07] made very clear that my mother's road will not be used for regular access or

[9:10] emergency access to this subdivision. I also want to make sure that doesn't

[9:15] change down the road [clears throat] whether Mr. Bernol keeps the property,

[9:20] passes it on to his family, or someone else eventually buys it. My mother's

[9:24] private road should not become an access road for this subdivision. So, I'm

[9:29] asking that this be clearly stated in the approval and the documents that are

[9:32] recorded with the property. We are not trying to stop this subdivision. If Mr.

[9:37] Bernal can provide and maintain his own access from Cay dels, we are okay with

[9:41] it. Before you vote, I would just ask that you confirm that for the record

[9:46] that my mother's road will not be used for either regular or emergency access

[9:50] to this subdivision now or in the future, regardless of who owns the

[9:54] property. Thank you. >> Okay. Thank you.

[9:59] » Any other comments on any of the other proposals or that one?

[10:04] All right, sounds like it's not. So, um, next order of business is approval of

[10:10] the consent agenda, which is the, uh, August 17th, 2026

[10:17] PNZ regular meeting minutes. So, if I could get a proposal or motion for that,

[10:22] please. [snorts] >> Move to approve.

[10:25] » Second. >> First motion by vice chair chair Gos,

[10:31] second by Commissioner Alvier. Oh, I'm sorry. Bubble Hill. I apologize

[10:36] about that, Commissioner. >> Thank you. [snorts]

[10:43] » So, any uh comments on the minutes? >> No, I thought they looked pretty good.

[10:50] No comments. So, we'll go ahead and get a vote on that, please.

[10:53] » Yes, sir. >> Commissioner Gos,

[10:57] » yes. >> Commissioner Amiler,

[10:59] » yes. >> Commissioner Alvier,

[11:01] » yes. Commissioner Mulvill.

[11:05] Yes. >> Yes ma'am. I apologize about that, Mr.

[11:08] Chair. Motion passes 40 to zero. Thank you very much. All right. Now we're down

[11:12] to approval of the Oh, excuse me. We're down to item number six, which is the

[11:19] action and consideration. The first is PZ HAC case 062171

[11:27] at 2231 Karion. if you can go ahead and give us a little

[11:32] background on that project, please. >> Absolutely, Mr. Chair. Oh, excuse me. We

[11:37] need a motion on the move to approve PCHACK062.

[11:43] Thank you. >> Go ahead.

[11:46] » First motion by Vice GO, second motion by Commissioner Albia.

[12:00] Uh Mr. Chair, speaking about case um 062171

[12:04] Sony's historic commercial. The address is 2231 Cay de Paran submitted by Eric

[12:10] and Theresa Sanchez which are here tonight requesting approval to install a

[12:13] three-tonon package AC unit on their property.

[12:17] Eric and Teresa Sanchez are requesting approval to install a three-ton package

[12:20] unit supplying two bedrooms and two bathrooms. The property currently has

[12:24] one AC unit that provides service to other areas of the residence. The new

[12:27] unit is planned to be installed towards the back area of the residence.

[12:38] Some of the department comments that we have uh the carpets are of small size

[12:41] and will not cover the entirety of the unit. Usia town code 183550 exterior

[12:46] appearance. Um, an application for a permit which would authorize

[12:50] construction, modification, moving or destruction, use or function with would

[12:54] affect the exterior appearance of any structure or sign must first be reviewed

[12:58] and approved by the PAC for compliance with chapter 1833 MTC historic

[13:02] preservation and receive final approval by the board of trustees

[13:09] on this first picture. Oh, I apologize. >> Um, I just I just wanted to state that

[13:13] we have proof of ownership on this first picture. Um, it's right here on the left

[13:16] side. Um, we also have a a an image on the right with a star and that is what

[13:21] it's proposed to uh be the installation for that new um AC unit.

[13:37] We have the business license for the general contractor as requested.

[13:45] And I'm gonna proceed to the uh pictures.

[13:49] » Yeah, there's we have the site plan uh the three-tonon

[13:54] unit and the ducting how it's going to be looking on that area uh seen from the

[13:58] top and we have some images I believe on your packages do not or your packets do

[14:04] not um reflect that arrow. Um I just wanted to uh from my end to reflect that

[14:10] this first image is an existing AC unit that the residence has from the Cay

[14:15] Paran. This is the view that you would you would see

[14:20] and this second picture is on that arrow would be the proposed unit installation

[14:25] area would be towards the back of the property.

[14:29] I stand by for any questions. I guess I have one question as far as, you know,

[14:33] you can see the height of the the one that's already installed and the other

[14:38] one will probably be the same height or would you estimate it?

[14:43] » I I have a the property owner is here with me. I'm not sure if they would like

[14:47] to take a stand. >> Yeah. Thank you. [clears throat]

[14:50] » Yes, sir. >> I'm Eric Sanchez, the owner of the

[14:54] property. It'll be a little bit smaller than than that existing unit. That's

[14:58] » is the existing one a five? Probably a five time.

[15:00] » I think that one's a three. Yeah, it's a three. And then it's going to be towards

[15:03] the back. >> Right.

[15:05] » Okay. Of the structure. >> Yeah. Thank you.

[15:08] » My question is so this is we're not we're not replacing it. We're just

[15:12] adding an additional. >> So currently it has mini splits and

[15:16] we've had issues with them since we put them in. So, we're just getting rid of

[15:20] the mini splits and putting what we should have done when we did the

[15:23] renovation to begin with. [laughter]

[15:31] » Any other comments from the commissioners? All right, I think we're

[15:34] ready for a vote.

[15:40] » Ready for a vote? >> Yes.

[15:41] » Yes, Mr. Chair. [snorts] >> Vice [clears throat] Cherryos.

[15:44] » Yes. >> Secretary Miller.

[15:47] » Yes. Commissioner Alvier, >> yes.

[15:50] » Commissioner Malvill, >> yes.

[15:53] » Mr. Chair, motion passes 4 to Z.

[16:00] I well I should have caught this earlier and stated it but u I know some of the

[16:07] approvals from the public works came to came in later and uh I just noticed on

[16:13] the copy I have unless you gave me another copy because it didn't have a

[16:17] signature for Tom but I didn't know whether that came in

[16:23] the if you got [clears throat] my mixed up.

[16:30] » It's on there.

[16:34] » Okay, >> Mr. Chair, Mr. Messa's name is is on

[16:40] both documents. Oh, okay.

[16:44] There it's an electronic signature, but I think that's remains valid.

[16:52] » Okay. I'm sorry I missed that one. Okay. Very good.

[16:57] » Good. We're good. Yes, sir. Thank you for picking up on that.

[17:02] » So, I think we're ready. >> We did the vote.

[17:11] » All right. The next uh project to to consider is PZ HAC case 062169

[17:20] at 2450 Cay Principel. submitted by Felix Armalo Army Miho, excuse me. And

[17:29] if you can give us a little We I need a motion on addressing this project,

[17:33] please. >> Accept case 062169

[17:39] » 2450 K. >> Second.

[17:45] » First motion by um Commissioner Mohill. Second motion by Commissioner Miller

[17:50] Mill. Correct. Thank you. Mr. Chair.

[17:55] » All right. Can you give us a little background on this project, please?

[17:58] » Absolutely, Mr. Chair. This is case number 062169

[18:04] 2450 Kay the principal as submitted by Mr. Felix Armiko requesting approval to

[18:09] amend his building plans relocating previously approved drain pond and

[18:14] installation of a rot iron fence red brick pavers on the property. Uh the

[18:18] property zone is um HC historic commercial.

[18:22] Mr. Ami is requesting approval to install a 52 inch rot iron fence red

[18:27] brick pavers along the front entry side of the property on Kaj the principal

[18:31] following the path on the south side towards the back parking area. The drain

[18:36] pond uh previously planned near the parking area would be relocated towards

[18:40] the middle section between the north neighborh neighboring building and the

[18:45] mansion property. The proposed road item fence would also help prevent entry into

[18:48] the drain pond. On this propos proposal, Mr. Amo requests to cancel the

[18:53] construction of the entry walls uh previously approved.

[18:57] Uh some of the department comments that we have

[19:01] um oh I do apologize. I I missed some of the analysis and background. Uh Messia

[19:05] historic specialist Lyanna Ag expressed concern about the rot iron being

[19:09] proposed on this packet. It does not fit with the design standard of the

[19:14] structure. Other concerns of the structure also includes doors are too

[19:18] modern and have a single pane window. Door needs to be out of natural wood

[19:24] heavy. The door the color on the door is not an approved color. Windows also too

[19:30] modern paints are inside the glass not meeting the design standards to the

[19:35] development zone. Adding wooden frame and and to the exterior would resolve

[19:39] this issue if they're able to give it uh the appearance of a natural pin window.

[19:43] front light fixtures to mo to modern as well that we need to replace. Electric

[19:48] meter needs to be screened from the street.

[19:53] We have some of the department comments as well. Uh Mr. Amiho no longer wishes

[19:57] to build the front porch walls originally approved is requesting um

[20:02] approval for this amendment. MTC code 183550 exterior appearance an

[20:06] application for a permit permit which would authorize construction

[20:10] modification moving or destruction use or function which would affect the

[20:15] exterior appearance of any structure or sign must first be reviewed and approved

[20:19] by the PAC for compliance with chapter 1833 MTC a historic preservation and

[20:25] receive final approval by the board of trustees

[20:28] also ro iron being proposed does not match the design standard of building

[20:34] windows already installed appear to modern.

[20:38] I'm going to scroll down a little bit on the document so we can see uh this this

[20:44] image right here would it's the request for previously approved front entry

[20:47] walls to not be constructed. Um I have highlighted on the red um which would be

[20:52] the area that um Mr. Armik was requesting not to not to build.

[21:02] I have also added a site plan which would include um what he is requesting

[21:07] as far as the um rod iron fence. It is that blue mark. It's a little difficult

[21:12] to see but I have another image that would represent that here later on. Um

[21:16] as far as the red brick pavers, the the proposal would be starting from the

[21:21] street. Um pretty much that entry uh would be that that facing the street

[21:26] side along the neighboring uh edge sort of like a path going towards the back

[21:33] end for >> that's south.

[21:35] » Yes sir. >> Yes sir. And it would be also on the

[21:38] parking area which be would be towards the back of the property. Um, it's a

[21:43] little difficult to read right here, but there is a pond

[21:47] » that it's already on the right of of or I guess the south side of the property.

[21:53] Mr. Mik is requesting to relocate that pond onto that middle between those two

[21:58] two buildings. That is also another um pretty much request for the for

[22:04] approval. Th this image right here uh it is just

[22:09] to illustrate what we're we're trying to pretty much uh mention. It would be the

[22:15] rot iron fence running towards um that area as well as the red brick papers

[22:23] just to have an idea of what it would look like. This was made by the office.

[22:28] I I was the one that did this. It is not going to look exactly like this. It's

[22:32] just a representation of what I could come up with.

[22:41] Lanna, would you like to talk about this? Mr. Chair, would that be okay if I

[22:46] » Oh, yes. request.

[22:55] » Thank you, Mr. Rocha. Good evening, commissioners. Uh, Mr. Sure. He read off

[23:00] number of the details that I went over um as looking at this property and as

[23:06] being a property right off our national landmark, right off our plaza, I think

[23:10] it is very essential that we address these issues. Um as we were just looking

[23:16] at this other the actually I can scroll back if I may. [clears throat]

[23:26] This would be more appropriate. These windows would be more appropriate. This

[23:30] door would be more appropriate. >> Um the final product that we have right

[23:34] now looks nothing like >> Yeah. And I guess I is it okay if I

[23:39] question to you? Um >> and the note on the budget of that this

[23:43] was the original proposal was so definitely it's not correct now.

[23:50] » So that's part of your comments. >> Absolutely. Yes,

[23:54] » Mr. Yes. Uh, so my question is why why does Mr. Amo want to um stray away from

[24:01] our original agreement on the original plan that's that we're looking at right

[24:05] now? >> Would you know?

[24:09] » Yeah, that's >> um I he had but I don't think he's given

[24:14] us a reason. There's just I mean yeah, this is what he's come up with and um

[24:19] unfortunately he's not here and I don't know if we've been able to get in

[24:23] contact with him. No. >> Yes.

[24:28] » Well, you probably don't know the answer to that,

[24:30] » but why would he want to move the ponding area when that was already

[24:33] agreed on? >> My question.

[24:36] » I mean, like we have to be concerned about parking areas too for the ponding

[24:41] area. >> Yeah.

[24:44] » So, my com my comment to that is it made sense as far as where he's putting the

[24:49] pavers. And the parking area is right behind where the pavers end. Is that

[24:54] correct? >> In other words, parking's not on the

[24:56] side where they want to have a new park. >> Correct. I think the parking be um I

[25:02] think what's happening here is um what we're proposing and what we were

[25:06] considering the department here is that perhaps we could have a a revisit this

[25:11] in a workshop. Um if this is something you all agree on um and I I I also

[25:18] agree. So >> um I think there's

[25:23] Yeah. Um >> to address this,

[25:37] » I'll follow your direction, Mr. Chair. >> Yeah, I I had another comment trying to

[25:43] understand this this railing, and it's not the railing that he's going to put

[25:48] in there based on what you just mentioned. You put in a railing there.

[25:52] So, I have two questions about I don't know what kind of railings I'm going to

[25:55] put in there and that's we need to know that. And then I trying to understand

[26:00] why the railing isn't in front. Where's the railing?

[26:04] » Actually, it sounds like it's it's on the north side

[26:08] » and it's just on the north side. >> If you look at this picture, it looks

[26:13] like that's what the how it was now. But he wants it there. There's already an

[26:21] iron gate right there. >> An iron gate

[26:24] » and he wants to go across the paper, right? Does he want This is what's

[26:28] there? >> Yes. Yes, Commissioner. That that is

[26:31] currently there at the at the property. Those pictures are were taken recently.

[26:34] » Right. So, there's already an iron gate there. So, there was one before,

[26:40] » not not in front. I'm talking about >> That's what I'm saying. Now, maybe he

[26:44] wants to put it this way to kind of >> to kind of block the Those

[26:51] are just two.

[26:57] » Me too. >> What's that? I'm sorry.

[27:01] » Um,

[27:08] » Mr. Chair, will that be okay? >> Yes.

[27:10] » Yes. So I just to I as I um pardon as I was um I did look at the gate on the

[27:17] property as well and that gate is very uh it's more of an ornamental raw iron

[27:22] which is fairly different from what which I agree Mr. Chair is what we need

[27:27] are some actual photos of what this would look like. However um the fact

[27:31] that it was a rot iron fence was due to the business. However, now there are

[27:36] homes that need to and these homes need to reflect that historic character as

[27:40] well. And so the the bright iron and the homes, it's it's not um very

[27:46] characteristic of style. >> Is he going to have to replace the

[27:50] windows or just put like

[27:55] » So what we're what I'm going to >> Yes. What I'm Exactly. Yeah. What I'm

[27:59] what I am going to propose is um frames uh wooden frames as as in that prior um

[28:06] plan and um external panes as well. Um which is very interesting that the panes

[28:13] are in interior um but I would I would recommend wooden panes um around the

[28:19] window and the door absolutely needs to be changed as well.

[28:27] frames on not in the because usually the modern

[28:30] ones now it's double it's double pain and the divisions are in the center

[28:37] it's actually in >> yeah it seems like the seems like the

[28:41] window I know you're speaking of like a double pane but the [clears throat]

[28:44] » it seems like this is a single pane um however in with historic you know it

[28:50] doesn't follow the historic guidelines even if it was in between two when you

[28:54] see it Essentially, it's also as that prior case we had, it's a single pane of

[29:00] glass exterior. So, it it's it's not broken.

[29:06] » It's just not >> correct. Yeah. And also frames around

[29:10] the window as well. Um and the window the door. Um I don't I don't think we

[29:16] have a photo of the door. Let me just double check here.

[29:20] » Oh, yeah. Yeah, that's >> that's

[29:25] yeah I don't I don't think that's accepted.

[29:28] So um >> any more comments or consideration for

[29:33] the >> right?

[29:37] » So I I do have a question to the team out there is what would the value be? I

[29:43] mean I can see some value. I mean, it should have happened a long time ago.

[29:46] And and that's why we have it in our code in 1833. We're supposed to have

[29:52] work sessions with the team before they even propose anything. So, it's it's

[29:58] just kind of all ass backwards, pardon me, part of the privilege. But it's just

[30:03] I'm frustrated about that. >> Yeah. It's very frustrating. So, so, so

[30:09] what if we deny it, which I think most of most of us agree on that is okay.

[30:13] What then would he come back? He got to have a work session with us after we

[30:18] deny it. But >> yeah, basically up to

[30:24] » I think that's what needs to happen. >> Yeah.

[30:27] » Is because

[30:31] Mr. Commissioner Eddie Salazar. Um the the the

[30:38] proposed project that originally was approved was obviously not adhered to,

[30:41] you know, and and and we don't have a a checks and balances to where after a a

[30:46] permit is approved to somebody go back there and check and gave them the the

[30:50] final, you know, uh inspection like C does through the buildings, right?

[30:55] » Um so this is a perfect example. I think we need to consider something like that

[31:01] maybe in your future especially for anything maybe in the historic zones to

[31:04] where you need to adhere to the permit. I mean you you were you were given these

[31:10] directions and then on your own and I spoken with Mr. Miko before. No, you

[31:13] can't do that. And and one of the reason why we brought it here and normally we

[31:17] don't bring cases to the commission when you know but we brought I I elected to

[31:21] bring it forth also for discussion purposes is because uh he understands

[31:26] that uh he just cannot not do it. So um but again you know u he wants to make

[31:32] some changes. I think the pavers is not that bad of an idea. There's a couple

[31:36] things the rot iron that he's proposing there. I mean there's a rot iron fence

[31:40] but there's also a chaining fence there too. We're not going to put a chaining

[31:42] fence just because it's sitting there, right? So So, and again, like Miss Lana

[31:46] mentioned, it doesn't fit the the the structure itself, you know, and I agree,

[31:50] the windows and the doors, those doors, those windows specifically looks like

[31:53] the one on Gay Desur with those uh those town houses down there, right? So, um

[31:59] again, all this is is is for discussion reasons, but um I agree I agree with the

[32:05] board that I think it, you know, it does need to come back for a work session and

[32:08] need to be revisited. um we just need to I need to kind of dig a little bit

[32:13] deeper is to where what will happens if somebody doesn't

[32:18] um follow through with the permit and he wants to make some changes you know and

[32:21] and you have no choice in my in my opinions but again I just have to you

[32:26] know in my own investigation what's the next step after that in case worst case

[32:31] scenarios right so uh u again you know there the papers I think you know I

[32:36] think the the the framing around the windows would and and the paints itself

[32:41] and then you know the doors it looks like it's light green or turquoise or

[32:44] some so that wasn't that wasn't the approval I don't even remember talking

[32:49] about the doors to be honest with you but there is we do have a catalog in in

[32:53] in our in our in our office that determines what you know colors of doors

[32:57] you can have so that's just my

[33:03] vote >> assuming we both know what precedent do

[33:07] we that going forward for total disregard of plans and um

[33:16] I would like to see folks huddled and >> I'm sorry

[33:21] » I guess it's not fair of us but it seemed like it's up to you to talk to

[33:26] this and say this is what the alternative is the

[33:32] paint colors the design of the door and windows

[33:35] » and um >> and the discussion was with them uh I

[33:38] told him, "You got to follow your permit. You have to do it."

[33:40] » But but he then he was like, "Well, what if I do this? What if I do that?" Well,

[33:44] » that's up to the commission to make that determination. You know, it's it's not

[33:47] something. So, that's why we're here. You know, I mean, he he he knows that he

[33:51] needs to follow through, but he's proposing other things to see if he can

[33:54] do those instead. And I said, >> we really need to, you know, have work

[33:58] session talk with the commission about that.

[34:00] » Mr. Sal, I have a question. like um Commissioner Miller said, like if

[34:04] they're not following their original plan that we've approved, is there like

[34:09] a fine set for them or is there some kind of

[34:13] » there eventually it's going? Yes. If if the commission, you know, again, you

[34:17] know, this is for training purposes and then for future clarifications, you

[34:22] know, is that there is if you don't follow the the the permit, I mean, you

[34:26] have to I mean, you have to be held accountable,

[34:28] » you know, I mean, you go I got to go through the process. So whatever that

[34:32] entitles I mean do we go over there and build the wall for him in front I mean

[34:36] again it's just just a little bit it does need to go into enforcement just

[34:40] for that you know as far how that's going to look we don't have you know

[34:42] we're still have the you know hearing examiner coming up and those kinds of

[34:45] things so it definitely needs to be held accountable for not following through

[34:49] with the because there is going to be a set of presidents to where nobody's

[34:52] going to you know follow through whenever we

[34:54] » it's in Mr. best interest to work with the

[34:58] commissioners and board of trustees on this process. We want to work together.

[35:02] » Yeah. And that's what again he doesn't want he didn't want to do that. He's

[35:06] proposing other things and the commission says no we're going to stick

[35:08] with the original plan. That's that's my direction to proceed.

[35:14] » All right. >> Any other comments?

[35:17] So I think we're ready for a vote.

[35:38] Commissioner Gos, >> no.

[35:42] » Secretary Miller, >> no.

[35:45] » Commissioner Alier, >> no.

[35:48] » Commissioner Malill, >> no.

[35:51] » Mr. Chair, motion 9 to zero. >> All right. Thank you.

[35:55] Now we are ready to address PZ HAC case 062172

[36:05] which is at uh 26. Oh, I missed one. >> Oh, I'm sorry.

[36:14] Yeah, it's PNZ case uh 062161

[36:20] and that's submitted by uh or that's at excuse me 2355 Avenue DASIA

[36:28] and if you can give us a little background on that appreciate that we do

[36:33] need a a motion please. I move to accept 062161

[36:40] uh 2 2355 Aanita. >> Second.

[36:46] » First motion by Commissioner Malill. Second uh motion by Commissioner Alvier.

[36:56] This is case number 062161 submitted by Evado Carvajal for Las

[37:02] Cruises public schools requesting approval of a new pergola project on

[37:08] 2355 aid messia at the west side of the

[37:12] property at Rio Grand Preparatory Institute. The property zone is HC.

[37:18] A little background on analysis. uh Las Cruz public schools requesting approval

[37:22] of a new pergola project on 2355 at Msia at the west side of the property at Rio

[37:27] Grand Prep Institute. The project involves three steel pergolas. The

[37:31] purpose of the project is to allow students to present and sell products.

[37:38] some of the department comments that we have. Um, just going back to MTC 183550,

[37:44] exterior appearance. An application for a permit which would authorize

[37:47] construction, modification, moving or destruction, use or function which would

[37:52] affect exterior appearance of any structure or sign must be first reviewed

[37:55] and approved by the PAC for compliance with chapter 1833 MTC historic

[38:00] preservation and receive final approval by the board of trustees.

[38:07] Article 22 of historic districts and landmarks for the state of New Mexico

[38:11] 322 purpose. The legislature of the state of New Mexico hereby declares that

[38:16] the historical heritage of this state is among its more most valued and important

[38:21] assets and that it is the intention of the historic district and landmark

[38:24] landmark act to empower the counties and municipalities of this state with as

[38:29] full and complete powers to preserve, protect and enhance the historic areas

[38:33] and landmarks lying within the respective jurisdictions as it is

[38:37] possible for this legislature to permit under the constitution of the United

[38:42] States and the constitution of New Mexico and subject to the specific

[38:45] duties and responsibilities respecting historical matters already granted or to

[38:50] be granted under other statutes of this state.

[38:54] We also have article 22 historic districts and landmarks of the state of

[38:57] New Mexico 3226 applicability of applicability of state

[39:02] capital outlay projects limitation recognizing the fragility of the state's

[39:08] historic heritage. The purpose of this section is to establish a procedure

[39:12] under which the state and its municipalities and counties will commit

[39:15] to collaborate in good faith and work jointly to preserve and protect the

[39:19] historic districts of New Mex Mexico. Uh we have attached more information on

[39:23] your packets.

[39:36] on the presentation. I do have a some pictures that are as well in your

[39:40] packets uh with the Marcado project at Rio Grand Propriatory Institute.

[39:53] We have a site plan uh involving the three per that um I requested approval.

[40:01] We have another picture down here of what it would look like from one

[40:05] perspective. We have I believe we have three perspectives.

[40:25] So, this design uses the same design language and structural steel. Um, it

[40:29] emers as a bus stop to the west. >> I stand by for any questions.

[40:36] » Commissioners have any questions? Yes, sir.

[40:38] » Sir, I do. >> Yes. Uh my question is so the these

[40:42] steel beams uh so they're going to be exposed to the

[40:48] elements to look like the the rust that it looks like on these photos or the

[40:53] depictions of what it might look like. >> Mr. Chair, if if you allow Commissioner

[41:00] Goss, we have um some members of the public that are part of this project. If

[41:05] if you allow me to m it over. >> Yes, please talk a little more.

[41:09] » Yes,

[41:18] » commissioners. Thank you for >> can you give us your name

[41:20] » listening to us? >> So we are proposing to build this

[41:24] Medicaid project. >> Excuse me.

[41:26] » Can you give us your name? So >> Oh, sure. Sorry about that. Everardo

[41:29] Carbajal with Buildex Construction Company.

[41:32] » Yeah. So we are proposing to build the MERAVO

[41:36] project at the Rio Grand Preparatory Institute.

[41:39] Um we will be working together with LCPS Robert Williams and our designer Carlos.

[41:51] » Yeah, with Navitech. Um now let's see

[41:59] any questions you may have. It's is this is going to be a concrete foundation

[42:06] with steel post and a steel um structure above the rafters and the beams are

[42:11] going to be all steel exposed steel and they're going to be naturally exposed to

[42:16] corrosion and make the rust you know produce this rustic look.

[42:21] » Selfing steel, right? >> Yeah, exactly. Thin steel, lightweight

[42:26] but still very durable. And the rafters up above will have a

[42:31] slight angle to produce a little bit of shade down

[42:35] below. We'll produce some lighting within the rafters and we'll have uh

[42:41] outlets uh for the students to use if they have crafts they're working on.

[42:46] They'll be able to use the power there. Um yeah,

[42:53] » yes. >> Look.

[42:58] bus stop. Um, >> that's exactly right.

[43:01] » But right now, the bus stop looks like it's

[43:05] like wood. When you drive by it doesn't look like it's steel, the steel beams.

[43:11] Am I confused or is it just >> um There is an image of the bus stop in

[43:18] in this >> I saw that I know what I saw.

[43:24] So if I I don't know my eyes directly. >> Maybe it um it is steel but maybe

[43:31] because of the aging but it is steel >> and it does kind of resemble like rustic

[43:36] old wood. >> So that's why I'm like is that how the

[43:40] the beans are going to turn into >> Yes.

[43:45] » It'll take some time. >> It hasn't been there that long and it's

[43:49] already looks really good. Now, we could expedite that uh aging process by using

[43:54] chemicals on the steel, but that's up for discussion.

[43:59] » If LCPS Robert would know

[44:05] [laughter]

[44:11] » like we're trying to do, >> like we're trying to do, right?

[44:13] » Exactly. Let nature take its course. >> All right. So,

[44:19] » yeah. Any other questions? >> I do have a question. Um,

[44:24] » it doesn't need to be cleared by C or anybody like that.

[44:34] » All right. Yeah, it'll it'll go through C.

[44:36] » Yeah. >> Thank you.

[44:38] » You're welcome. >> Oh, you have a job right next to you.

[44:40] Does do you have any anything to offer? >> Uh, no, Commissioner. Uh, for the

[44:44] record, my name is Carlos Sagilad. I'm the designer. I work for Navitech and

[44:48] Associates. I've been hired uh through Buildex under the Lus Christ public

[44:53] schools for this design. So, I'm I'm just here for uh for brevity and for to

[44:59] help my So, >> but if you have any other questions, I'm

[45:02] happy to answer. >> Very good.

[45:03] » Thank you. Thank you both. >> Thank you all.

[45:09] » Oh, yeah. >> Oh,

[45:13] » no. Go ahead. >> Um It's just to make sure it'll be just

[45:18] over the concrete slab and no protrusion.

[45:23] » Yes, it's it's all going to be concrete slab. We were thinking about on the

[45:27] images you see some bricks on the edge just to give it

[45:31] » as a trim. >> Okay.

[45:32] » Right. But where the students will be working, it will all be solid concrete.

[45:37] » Okay. So, no digging or anything. >> Oh, before to start. Yeah. So, that that

[45:41] that would be a new foundation. So, we'll have to remove a section of the

[45:45] grass to put in

[45:51] » uh 6 in.

[45:56] » I do have a question to you while you're while you're up here. Um

[46:03] the the school building is not historic at all, is it? Yeah,

[46:07] » I mean I guess I'm wondering why we I mean it's HC and I understand I

[46:12] understand we have to meet the 1833 >> area is fairly historic. Um which is why

[46:19] I was asking how deep under because I um >> yeah something I'm very very much

[46:25] considering in a lot of our future um construction well is the the need for an

[46:30] archaeologist. Yes, >> but

[46:32] » six inches is good. It's better than two feet. Could I make a point of clarity?

[46:37] Um, >> yes.

[46:38] » So, 6 in will be for the concrete slab, right? There also be, if you see in the

[46:43] images, the in the foreground there's a red papers. It'll also be concrete, but

[46:48] it'll be color just to give a little bit more of an earth tone. However, each of

[46:53] those steel columns will have a footing which will be about two feet by two feet

[46:59] by two feet. >> So, six inches for the slab. Yeah.

[47:04] » No, that's

[47:08] » So, would that need a little bit of archaeological work when they're when

[47:12] they're actually digging it? Maybe that's the best time.

[47:15] » It's usually um for two I I would always I do recommend especially for two feet.

[47:20] I mean, what I've heard from here is that um we our public works department

[47:26] usually requires four feet. Oh, >> but I think

[47:30] » um I don't know anything more than one. And then because it says two feet,

[47:35] right? But usually they're >> get to where they need to get. So I

[47:40] always do recommend, especially within this area, um an archaeologist if

[47:46] possible.

[47:49] » Okay. Thank you. >> And then as far as the structure itself,

[47:54] obviously when it's not being in use, you can still see through that. So, do

[48:00] you have any concern about >> about its presentation in front of the

[48:04] building? >> Okay. Okay. I Okay.

[48:11] » The design kind of echoes what's already >> good. Okay. Thank you.

[48:15] » I think it's part of our comprehensive plan as well.

[48:18] » Yeah. Yeah. I think so.

[48:23] » Any other comments from the commissioners? Mr.

[48:26] » Sure. I'd like to Eddie Sal community development. I'd like to uh kind of uh

[48:32] ask the uh the engineering architect uh some of the questions that I was asked

[48:36] uh regarding the the the program and the the parking is was the biggest concern

[48:43] » uh because you know my understanding at the beginning uh this is going to be

[48:47] something that the students are going to put their projects up you know stuff

[48:50] that and it's going to be open to the school their own students the faculty

[48:54] will be able to go to this marcado how is that at what point are they any of

[48:59] this has changed to open to the public. Uh because if it opens to the public,

[49:03] you know, the the concern is, you know, we do have limited parking here at town

[49:07] hall. Uh because it's very adjacent to it is it's going to fill up our parking.

[49:11] And so what parking uh requirements uh if any uh you know are we thinking about

[49:18] along with this project

[49:29] » any parking the um I don't know exactly I the the intent is

[49:36] I don't know the exact programming of the the facility because the schools are

[49:39] still working out a lot of details and stuff on But I mean other than the fact

[49:42] that the students it is intended for students. So so whenever they're using

[49:47] it they'd have the parking our parking lots open. So it's like so they they

[49:52] have full access of the parking lots at the school. [clears throat] So it's like

[49:55] » so in other words these events would probably have after school hours

[49:59] » um or well the intent from from what I understand from when they first start

[50:03] when this first project is as many of you know this was a competition that was

[50:07] done a couple years ago with students and the students were the ones that came

[50:10] up with the initial design um and the intent was that they would work with the

[50:15] farmers markets when the farmers markets are in play are going to be they'd also

[50:20] be setting up so that the students because it's only a block away

[50:23] » right farmers market so people could wander over from the farmers market and

[50:27] they can coincide with that. So it's like so that's kind of um the intent of

[50:31] it. So so that so I don't know they may like I said they probably do events on

[50:36] their own in the evenings after hours kind of stuff. [laughter] I know that we

[50:39] talked about if we get it done before the the holiday season this year um that

[50:44] they would probably do some um craft shows. the students would bring their

[50:48] crafts and stuff and set them up and sell them and those would probably be

[50:50] evening hours and again then it would be the they would open up the parking lot

[50:55] um and have access to the school for bathrooms and things like that.

[50:59] » Thank you. >> Yeah.

[51:01] » Quick question, Mr. Chair, if I may. Uh I know this is outside of what we are

[51:07] charged with, but I'm just kind of thinking like what So do you have

[51:11] students that are raising money and and they're they're building crafts and

[51:16] they're trying to work with the farmers market here in Messia and try to get

[51:20] some of that traffic over that side. It seems like we're okay with parking

[51:23] because you'll have we'll now have access to parking on Los Cusus public

[51:28] school property as well as town of Msia. My question was like what what happens

[51:34] with the proceeds? So does it what is it?

[51:36] » Well, it's what's the plan for that? >> Most of the from my understanding and

[51:40] again I don't know the exact instructions is these are projects that

[51:43] they do in school. So I think it goes back to the to whatever class they're

[51:47] in. It's sort of fundraisers for whatever their activities. So like HOSA

[51:51] or what the um the the the shops classes and stuff

[51:56] like that. Um,

[52:00] uh, Las Cru says High has a a floral they do like

[52:05] floral decorations and things like that. >> All that goes back to the club or the

[52:09] organization, okay, at the [clears throat] organizing. So, I would

[52:13] imagine that the students when they're doing it may get something for it. I

[52:17] don't know exactly though. >> Yeah. I just I'm very excited for our

[52:20] youth because we really want to invest in them and help, you know, get them to

[52:24] participate in what we have here. So, it's very exciting. Well, and I know Los

[52:28] Cruz I know for the farmers market and on they have the kids can. I don't know

[52:32] if you're familiar and I don't know if this would coside with something like

[52:36] that where it gives the kids the opportunity to be able to do their own

[52:40] kind of a thing. Great. >> Yeah, very much. [snorts]

[52:44] » And and uh I noticed that um you have a business plan

[52:50] write up in here. Correct. And so my assumption is

[52:55] and that has to be renewed every year. >> It has to be renewed every year,

[53:00] correct? The business plan. So you say $35. So where's that tie into the

[53:05] business for the kids? I mean, it they're they're in a business. They're

[53:08] selling stuff. So So that's why they have to have a permit, I would assume.

[53:12] » Yes, Mr. Chair, Commission. Yeah, the uh the original plan when I spoke with the

[53:16] with my contact, I forget her name, but she was very excited and we we actually

[53:21] went to to the community center and we voted on what project, you know, they

[53:25] had a presentation and such and her her original the school's uh goal is to

[53:31] introduce young adults into new skills

[53:36] » and then follow the process that you normally will do in the day-to-day life,

[53:40] right? similar to this project here. Whenever the the the students drafted up

[53:44] this this project, they actually are going through this process as was doing

[53:48] now and this is part of their project that they're so when it comes to

[53:52] business, I I was also advised by by this teacher that they will also be

[53:58] seeking out uh business licenses and renewals and following all those process

[54:02] just like it would normally follow. >> Excellent.

[54:05] » That's good. Any other questions for me? for me. Any other questions? All right,

[54:11] I think we're ready for a vote, sir.

[54:19] » Vice Chair Gahos, >> yes.

[54:22] » Secretary Miller, >> yes.

[54:25] » Commissioner Alvier, >> yes.

[54:28] » Commissioner Mulill, >> yes.

[54:31] » Motion passes 4 to zero. >> Thank you. Now we're down. We're down to

[54:36] PZ HAC case 062172

[54:42] in a 2618 K desour submitted by Sam Banell if you could go ahead and

[54:49] » Bernal >> Bernol I'm sorry Bernal if you can go

[54:51] ahead and do a little presentation about it.

[54:55] » Oh we [clears throat] need a vote. Excuse me. Thank you.

[54:57] » I make a motion for approval of case 06. Um yeah 2172 Kelsur submitted by Sam

[55:06] Bernol. >> Second

[55:10] » first motion by Commissioner Alviar. Second motion. Motion by Vice Chair

[55:13] Leos.

[55:33] This is visa case 06217215

[55:38] Cayour submitted by Mr. San Bernal requesting approval of a summary

[55:43] subdivision of his property and zone is historical residential.

[55:48] Mr. Bernal is requesting approval for a summary subdivision. Mr. Bernal lives at

[55:52] 2615 Kay Desour and has another property adjacent to his on the south side.

[55:58] According to Donana County Assessor's office, the property is 47

[56:05] 1.09 acres. Mr. equal parcels each approximate

[56:13] acres each access

[56:18] by his property adjacent to Kay des 20 ft private road easement will provide

[56:26] agress ingress uh this private road will widen to 35 paralleling to the two

[56:32] properties being split for utilities and access uh road eastment

[56:38] A turnaround will be included between both parcels new parcels uh to meet fire

[56:43] code regulations uh cir hydrant will also be installed on messia

[56:48] circle to provide emergency services to the two lots and nearby residences. A

[56:53] var variance is being requested by Mr. Bernal from meeting MTC 183568.

[57:00] Uh each lot or parcel to be developed in the HR zone should ha shall have a

[57:05] minimum of 80 feet of frontage on a public street and a minimum of 8,000 um

[57:11] square feet of area. Mr. Bernal's property is landlocked and not adjacent

[57:16] to any public access. A variance is also being requested from installing paved

[57:22] streets and curb uh and gutter as it is a private road. Drainage will still be

[57:27] provided on August 12, 2025. Mr. Rell was approved by the PAC for a request to

[57:32] subdivide his property. On August 25, 2025, Mr. Bernal was denied by the B for

[57:38] not having illegal access to his property as it was uh proposed. Mr.

[57:43] Bernal has changed his access to these two properties and request consideration

[57:47] for approval. A replat draft has been amended to show changes from the

[57:52] original request. If approved, Mr. Ronald understands a legal replat by a

[57:56] licensed surveyor will need to be submitted.

[58:07] All the department comments that we have all documents have been submitted for

[58:10] consideration.

[58:41] » [clears throat] >> We have an image right here in the uh TV

[58:45] screen. It's stating a proof of ownership for Mr. Bernard.

[59:16] On this image, we have um the summary subdivision requested. Um there's uh

[59:22] between lot B and lot C there's a little area uh that would be the requested uh

[59:29] for a turnaround uh for the emergency services. The fire department would be

[59:34] able to have that turnaround um in case of an emergency but wanted wanted to

[59:39] display and and explain that to the committee.

[59:49] » I stand by for any questions. Mr. Chair.

[59:53] » Yes, sir. Go ahead. >> Um, my question is, so first responders,

[59:58] especially the fire large fire truck that we have, do they have access from

[1:00:04] Ka the Sur to turn into that little hole or whatever you want to call it, a

[1:00:10] little road, >> 20 foot road. Yeah.

[1:00:12] » Is there are because we know we see the road, it literally narrows as it gets to

[1:00:18] guy of the sword. Do we know for sure that we first responders have access to

[1:00:24] the properties? >> To my understanding, um, I apologize.

[1:00:30] Did I interrupt? >> I'm so so sorry.

[1:00:34] » Oh, yeah. Go ahead. >> Oh, I apologize. I thought somebody was

[1:00:37] mentioning something. >> Um, from my understanding from from the

[1:00:40] from the plan um from Cay Desour, there would be a road um giving access to Mr.

[1:00:46] Bernal uh to th to that subdivision to that summary subdivision um allowing um

[1:00:51] entry from from a landlocked uh perspective that that would provide

[1:00:55] entry to those emergency services onto his property. Um given u that in

[1:01:02] consideration that would allow the fire engine to go through uh Cayour into the

[1:01:07] subdivision be able to have that turnaround uh to provide um exit to that

[1:01:12] fire engine [clears throat] if Yes. Yes.

[1:01:18] » I have a I have a concern because when this went to the BO they said that the

[1:01:23] civil um issues needed to be resolved before we could move forward on this.

[1:01:28] And I want to know if the civil maybe Mr. Bernald needs to present because has

[1:01:34] the civil um case been resolved if

[1:01:41] have you have you resolve that Mr. Bernnol

[1:01:45] has resolving that case like it was denied by the P. Okay.

[1:01:51] Mr. Shelton when he was denied to use that road

[1:01:58] he got his attorney and requested it's litter in that packet where he

[1:02:05] requested that

[1:02:09] myself and my wife's names in that contract on that lawsuit. Okay. It was

[1:02:15] not saying it was a lawsuit. It was brought up by Mr. Shelton's attorney

[1:02:21] » to uh to uh Rebecca.

[1:02:25] » Sorry. I'm asking did you resolve your issue, not somebody else? I'm asking

[1:02:29] » Well, that that's what I'm trying to tell you is that it was solved way

[1:02:33] before. >> No. Or else the B would have approved

[1:02:37] it. I'm sorry. >> That's what I'm trying to express that

[1:02:40] there was a letter. >> There was a letter there in that packet

[1:02:44] the first time that I brought it up. Now, they were saying that that I was

[1:02:48] going to use that ex south side >> for emergencies,

[1:02:53] » right? >> But I'm requesting now I'm not going to

[1:02:55] be using that exit. That's why I'm wid turn that t-bone turn around

[1:03:02] » and it will be just to go back in for emergencies for the fire truck to be

[1:03:06] able to go in and out. >> Have you resented your um complaint on

[1:03:13] that? And is that in writing that you're not

[1:03:17] going to move forward with that? That that's what I'm asking because I think

[1:03:21] for myself and I I want you to have the subdivision, Mr. Bernol. I don't have a

[1:03:26] problem with that. I just want us to do it right so that when it goes to the B

[1:03:31] that they know that we did our our share of what we were supposed to do. So

[1:03:39] like I like we before when we requested it was going to be three lots actually

[1:03:45] four okay because where I live now and then three more

[1:03:49] » three more. So that's why we turned around and I talked to my kids. Okay,

[1:03:54] let's at least get two lots >> instead of being just landlocked. I

[1:04:00] can't do nothing with it. >> Right.

[1:04:01] » So it was pertaining [snorts] to the turnaround and pertaining to using that

[1:04:06] access on the back. I'm not going to be using that. Okay. As

[1:04:13] the request, why do we have to go to court? I mean, it's like the fire chief

[1:04:18] like he requested. He says it's that road will be able to maintain the weight

[1:04:25] of the fire truck to be able to go in and go out.

[1:04:29] So, that's why we have to go to court and

[1:04:32] spend money on something that the fire chief and the engineer requested

[1:04:38] because it's it's costing a lot of money. It it really is. When I tried it

[1:04:43] back in 2002, same thing happened. 2011, same thing happened every time. And it

[1:04:50] cost a lot to be able to get these blueprints done.

[1:04:55] » I understand that and I I you know, respect you for that, but I feel like

[1:04:59] we're kind of stuck here because there's not really any resolution. I don't see

[1:05:05] it in writing. >> It excuse me. It is the resolution is

[1:05:08] what he's saying. I know, but he's saying later he might need to use that

[1:05:12] road. >> He never said that.

[1:05:15] » Okay. >> All right.

[1:05:16] » So, it's a public >> a private road. No, he's running a

[1:05:20] private road. >> Aside from not using that private road

[1:05:23] that's to the south, >> Mr. Chair, I think we're okay. Yeah,

[1:05:28] » I don't think we are, but >> No, Mr. Chair. Yes, sir. Uh, Mr. But so

[1:05:33] board of trustees denied your request on August 25th last year for not having

[1:05:38] legal access to your property. >> Do you have legal access access to your

[1:05:44] property now? >> I've had it since I bought it.

[1:05:48] » Okay. >> That road has always been used since

[1:05:51] 197. >> Okay.

[1:05:52] » Two. Since I've been since I purchased that property in the front.

[1:05:56] » Okay. >> Okay. I purchased from Dan Lori

[1:05:59] » and then the property in the back because if you notice it runs in a 45

[1:06:04] that's why that lot line I want to square it off.

[1:06:07] » Yes. >> So but there it's always it's always

[1:06:10] been in and out through there on both sides.

[1:06:13] » Yes. >> But to go to the back that's what we've

[1:06:16] been using. >> Yes.

[1:06:19] » Back in the 80s when it started. >> Yeah. [clears throat]

[1:06:24] » Okay. fixing a neighborhood swap.

[1:06:28] » I'm sorry. >> This your plan here is fixing a

[1:06:32] neighborhood disagreement >> and

[1:06:34] » exactly.

[1:06:40] » Okay. So then my other question is, have the have the residents been notified? Um

[1:06:46] and do you have the um the certified receipts for that? Are they supposed to

[1:06:51] be notified that you're wanting to do this or is it supposed to be posted?

[1:06:56] as in our >> in our codes it's ordinances say that it

[1:07:01] you know it has to be posted he has to send out the letter [clears throat]

[1:07:06] » Mr. Chair uh Eddie Salazar community development this is this is a proposal

[1:07:10] for a summary subdivision summary subdivision uh does not follow u regular

[1:07:16] subdivision ordinances that is why one of the reason Mr. Bernal decided to do

[1:07:20] it to two lots and not three because uh he is requesting a summary subdivision

[1:07:24] not a formal subdivision as before. Uh two as far as this the civil issue

[1:07:30] before um that was brought up was that Mr. Bernal was requesting to use the the

[1:07:37] the property or the private road that was owned by uh Miss San's mother

[1:07:42] Rebecca and that that's why it's a civil issue by proposing it how he's doing it

[1:07:48] now. there's no civil issue because he's providing his own access from Cay on

[1:07:53] this property and uh there and just to confirm there is no request whatsoever

[1:07:59] to use the private road that uh Mr. Rebecca Seiggoia. Uh,

[1:08:06] any questions? >> Well, my last question, I'm sorry. My

[1:08:10] last question is it looks like um so for the little adobe houses, are you

[1:08:17] requesting to move the landline from that and then just use the other two as

[1:08:22] your proposal? Well, the reason I'm pointing out it's that I don't know why,

[1:08:27] Dan Lori, all those properties were actually sold in 45s. I don't know.

[1:08:35] There's even a a blueprint back when Mr. Galena was a mayor that the lot line ran

[1:08:41] right in between the house. Okay. But my lot line where I live now

[1:08:49] is it's like it's right there next to the

[1:08:53] pillar of the carport. What I'm trying to do would just square it off with the

[1:08:58] the neighbors next to make it even. So that way there's a complete whoever

[1:09:05] inherits that house has access to go around itself too. Okay.

[1:09:13] I guess my question is, are you moving that landline a little bit to

[1:09:17] incorporate that into yours or it's already I'm kind of confused for the

[1:09:22] adobe house. Are you moving your landline down below it?

[1:09:26] » No, >> it's just Well, not that I'm moving it.

[1:09:31] I'm just It's giving enough. It's almost 15 20 feet away from the old house.

[1:09:38] So the lot line is just going to be squaring off instead of being on the 45.

[1:09:44] » Lining it up with your other lots. >> Sorry.

[1:09:47] » You're lining it up with the other. >> Yes, that's all I'm doing. That's all

[1:09:51] I'm doing. Just scoring it all.

[1:09:57] » Okay. I have a couple questions with saying that that you're lining up and

[1:10:03] lighting up the Adobe House. Is the Adobe house going to continue to be the

[1:10:10] with the plot from the end of your property line to

[1:10:16] the south side of your property? Is that included

[1:10:19] with the subdivision that you're proposing or is it after the adobe house

[1:10:25] that the subdivision is being proposed? that why is

[1:10:30] » because your pl your say A D there's no D in the picture show so I'm kind of

[1:10:36] confused as to where you're going from point A to point B and and how it's

[1:10:42] going to incorporate and where does the adobe building down in this whole

[1:10:47] » the building is not showing there but okay

[1:10:52] » right here >> but if you look on the very top it says

[1:10:55] blocks A B C and That was the

[1:10:58] » It's not in the It's not in the proposed draft,

[1:11:01] » right? >> So, I'm I'm confused because

[1:11:06] uh the numbers on the lot. So, you're saying you have 1.09,

[1:11:11] but if you split that in two, well, how I calculated it into five

[1:11:18] through seven or something to the effect, you're proposing

[1:11:22] 488. And then in your paperwork for the subdivision, you're

[1:11:28] proposing 379. So I'm I'm just like kind of

[1:11:32] confused with the numbers, but again, are you going from the end of your

[1:11:36] property line all the way to the south side or are you going from the other

[1:11:41] side of the Adobe building to your >> And where does the extra lot where is

[1:11:50] where where is that? I don't know where it's not there but

[1:11:53] tell me it's going to be just lots A, B, and C.

[1:11:57] » Mr. Chair, keep in mind uh Commissioner uh Lucettto, keep in mind these were the

[1:12:01] original uh plans that he got and in lie of investing more money into this

[1:12:06] proposed project. He's using the the the other plan. This is where the building

[1:12:10] is at. >> Right.

[1:12:12] » Right. So he wants to move see this line here uh it's very close to the south. He

[1:12:17] wants to square this off. >> Right.

[1:12:19] » Okay. And I get that because that's the end of the property line right there.

[1:12:24] But again, my question is where does this

[1:12:28] building stand with the subdivision? Because your line is showing on that

[1:12:34] other place. It's showing on this side of the

[1:12:38] Adobe building to split these two lots. >> Yeah. There's only going to be two lots

[1:12:42] here. >> So the Adobe building,

[1:12:44] » it's going to be on one. It's going to be on one and then there's going to be

[1:12:47] another empty lot. And there's going to be the the the hammerhead turnaround in

[1:12:52] between both. >> I thought hammerhead was not allowed.

[1:12:56] » I thought it had to be focus.

[1:13:01] » Yeah. >> What's a hammerhead? Go in here. Yeah,

[1:13:05] » I thought that was so

[1:13:13] » I know but he said the last time is what I'm saying.

[1:13:20] » This is what we're looking

[1:13:25] for. I appreciate that. And then the portion.

[1:13:31] Okay, there was kind of two things. One of them is kind of really really petty.

[1:13:34] But on your permit, you signed 2027 and I assume that's a typo.

[1:13:40] » I would say so on your permit

[1:13:45] » it.

[1:13:50] » Yeah. Can be rectified. And then the other

[1:13:55] thing was the portion where you put that it was landlocked. The land is

[1:14:00] landlocked. that is proven in the court of law. So if you can get that removed

[1:14:07] from the document that >> I'm sorry, say that again.

[1:14:11] » The portion on paragraph three where it says Mr. Bernal's property is a landlock

[1:14:18] and not adjacent to any public access. The portion

[1:14:23] has not been proven.

[1:14:28] » It's not a public. That's why he couldn't use this road

[1:14:32] down the road. >> And that's why it's landlocked

[1:14:35] » because there are no other way. >> That's why he has to have a private road

[1:14:41] versus a public road. >> It doesn't have to be approved. I wish.

[1:14:49] » Well, he signed up.

[1:15:02] » This is why [snorts] we're here.

[1:15:17] Are you ready? >> Okay. Any other comments? I do have a

[1:15:20] couple comments of clarification because in the write up on this project,

[1:15:28] we say he's asking for a variance. What I'm wondering about is if you look in

[1:15:33] the code, it doesn't address private road at all.

[1:15:37] It just addresses public road. So, I'm wondering why we even have to have a

[1:15:42] variance. And the variance that we quoted in here was because you wanted to

[1:15:47] put curbon gutter. Well, where is that in our code that even addresses that? I

[1:15:53] mean, that's something that I'd like to see him doing that for water

[1:15:58] control, whatever. And I was just wondering

[1:16:06] because he said pray. It's hard to measure

[1:16:12] doesn't show 80 foot in front, but I think it I think it's there,

[1:16:17] » but it's not a public street. >> Well, that's the whole issue. It's not a

[1:16:20] public road. So, uh so why are we why is it stated that there's a variance? I'd

[1:16:27] like to have that. >> Mr. Chair, uh commissioner, the reason

[1:16:31] why there's a and this was on his original uh um proposed project a year

[1:16:37] ago. The reason why it's being requested is because um 18 of the where see do you

[1:16:44] have the the the town code?

[1:16:49] The reason why it's requested is because um it is not right. It's a private road.

[1:16:53] So you the code regulates that you need to have minimum eight 8,000 square feet

[1:16:58] and 80 feet of adjacent to a public road. And because it's not a public

[1:17:04] road, uh because it is landlocked proven that there's no legal access to it,

[1:17:09] right? So that's that's why again staying in our purview, right? Whatever

[1:17:14] we're we're we're capable of understanding. Um we do need to request

[1:17:18] a variant and this is something that's happened and other uh summary

[1:17:22] subdivision as well uh to include one uh right next door that they went through a

[1:17:27] variance process as well because the the property is not adjacent to the public

[1:17:33] road

[1:17:37] » and and in in order for that 1740 on on the on your title 1740 with the

[1:17:43] subdivision there is a section on there if you look at that it proposes that it

[1:17:48] not proposes it states that the applicant uh variance request is to the

[1:17:54] commission. It's not to the board of adjustments and that is why um he's not

[1:17:59] going to uh the board of adjustments for a variance and then come to the

[1:18:02] commission for approval. This is something that as it states in our in

[1:18:07] our code that uh it uh it needs is decided through them.

[1:18:13] » Any other questions? Um I didn't I didn't see any people. Is

[1:18:18] there a varian form?

[1:18:22] » No that's that is why that is the the format itself. It states on the bottom

[1:18:26] is there any variances being requested that is part of the subdivision of 1740

[1:18:32] » and it states here 1749 read 1740 1110 uh 010 sorry uh where in the case of

[1:18:39] particular proposed subdivision it can be shown that the strict compliance with

[1:18:42] the requirements of this regulation would result in inhibiting uh the

[1:18:46] achievement of the objectives of these regulations the planning commission may

[1:18:49] vary modify all wave requirements no variances shall be allowed when such

[1:18:54] variances is requested Is it because of inadequate branch?

[1:18:56] » That's >> pretty clear, you know, so the the

[1:19:00] process goes through that. So if it doesn't need a variance, then

[1:19:03] » yeah, >> you don't need a beverage, but it's

[1:19:05] better to ask for one and not need it then vice versa.

[1:19:12] » Any other comments? Yeah, I know it was brought up during the um

[1:19:19] the public um statement about this project and I guess my question is can

[1:19:25] we even put I mean it sounds like it's more of a a a legal issue as far as how

[1:19:32] can we in other words if someone you know you sell your land your family

[1:19:36] sells the land in the future and so we have a new buyer can we really hold that

[1:19:41] to to the requirements that that that southern road would never be accessed

[1:19:48] by. It just >> it just seems like

[1:19:51] » you know I

[1:19:55] I'm not I'm not familiar with with with property laws and legalities and I think

[1:19:58] I don't think that's something that we should even consider.

[1:20:02] Um I I think as I mentioned is is this this application is only proposing to

[1:20:07] use the word he's giving himself access to and not the uh the private road being

[1:20:13] owned by Mr. Go. That's the best that I think I would advise go as far as but we

[1:20:17] you know to include an addition that that role would never be I think that's

[1:20:21] stepping outside of our >> Okay. Thank you. All right. Any other

[1:20:27] comments, questions? I think Thank you. >> Thank you.

[1:20:32] » So, I think we're ready for a vote.

[1:20:40] » If I if I may add something. >> Yes, sir. Yeah.

[1:20:43] » Going back to Commissioner Ggo's question. Um I apologize. I I didn't

[1:20:47] completely answer your question. Uh just going um based off of this image right

[1:20:52] here um engineers have measured and approved fire engine would be able to

[1:20:58] use that term towards the property. So I I want to clarify that for the record.

[1:21:04] » Thank you.

[1:21:18] I >> think we're ready for vote.

[1:21:21] » Yeah. >> Vice Chair Gigos.

[1:21:24] » Yes. >> Secretary Miller.

[1:21:26] » Yes. >> Commissioner Alvier.

[1:21:30] » Yes. >> Commissioner Mulvill.

[1:21:33] » No. And my reason is because I feel like we needed to address what B wanted us to

[1:21:38] address.

[1:21:49] Motion passes 31. All right. Thank you. Now we ready for any commissioner

[1:21:54] comments and um also staff comments.

[1:22:07] Evening again commissioners. Uh I just wanted to briefly touch upon um

[1:22:12] nominations and what defines a nomination, what in fact is historic and

[1:22:16] what is integrity. There seems to be a question um and it can be

[1:22:23] one item can make it historic. It doesn't have to be more than one. Um,

[1:22:30] and I consulted with uh the state historic preservation officer regarding

[1:22:34] uh possible changes if changes ever needed to be made to historic

[1:22:38] properties, what that looks like. Um, and it is very common and I believe um,

[1:22:44] Mr. Chair, last time you mentioned updating the National Register and when

[1:22:48] you do that updating, you are changing information to a property. Um, and so a

[1:22:54] part of responsibility and that's up for the National Register. This is our um

[1:22:58] cultural historic register that I'm speaking um of in particular and it is

[1:23:03] always open to updating um and so I just wanted to share with you some

[1:23:09] information regarding that there's um technical amendments that are called and

[1:23:14] those are really um when you're changing uh correcting mistakes or providing new

[1:23:19] information about property's physical nature or um a revised property

[1:23:24] description or resource inventory new photograph graphs or updated maps. Um,

[1:23:29] this is when you're amending the national register documentation. Um, and

[1:23:33] it will also um it also aligns with our national with our local and cultural

[1:23:38] register. There's also um known as subst substantiative um amendments and these

[1:23:44] are those that require opinions adding new criteria or new areas of

[1:23:48] significance changing the periods. Um so changes are frequent um and or they they

[1:23:54] actually should be frequented. However, when you're making the nomination, it is

[1:23:58] with the n the information that is already at hand.

[1:24:01] » So when you say period, that's period significance. Correct.

[1:24:04] » Yes. So the yeah, these are just some examples. Correct. Yes. So they'll

[1:24:08] change um and I can um share with you with a further detail on that. But just

[1:24:14] a reminder also the um the national register criteria for evaluation which

[1:24:19] is also the one the same criteria that we abide by are the quality of

[1:24:25] significance in American history, architecture or archaeology,

[1:24:30] engineering, culture present within the districts sites, buildings, structures

[1:24:35] and objects that possess integrity or location design setting materials

[1:24:40] workmanship feeling association and Um, it can be that they are associated with

[1:24:45] events that have made a significant contribution or that are associated with

[1:24:50] the lives of persons significant in our past or that embody the distinctive

[1:24:55] characteristics of a type period or method of construction that represent

[1:24:59] the work of a master or that possess high artistic values or unique um

[1:25:04] architecture or that have yielded or may be likely to yield information important

[1:25:10] in prehistory or history. So that was just a refresher because I just want to

[1:25:15] really accentuate that it is just our buildings almost all of our buildings

[1:25:20] are historic on their own without adding any narrative to that. Um, however,

[1:25:24] there will be an open process and I I will begin to create a form where where

[1:25:30] if we do decide that we need to add further information as it comes along

[1:25:34] that that becomes a separate document that we can kind of add on to our

[1:25:38] historic local >> a little bit about who owned what at

[1:25:42] certain times. >> Yes, exactly. [laughter]

[1:25:46] Um, yeah. So, I just wonder any questions on that for anybody. Okay. Um

[1:25:51] yeah, I just wanted to say that and I'm put it's um I'm also I just the other

[1:25:57] day I had a meeting with Rio Grand Prep um on getting perhaps historic trades

[1:26:03] involved with them and I have a meeting with their um construction uh instructor

[1:26:09] which hopefully little by little something come out of that. I'm also

[1:26:12] looking forward to having kind of a missia um history day uh with them and

[1:26:19] I'm I'll be trying the once again if you don't believe me they give me literally

[1:26:23] two weeks to apply for a grant. I received an applica an advis a notice

[1:26:28] about two days ago and now they're saying it's due on the 18th. So, I'm

[1:26:32] trying I'm scrambling to get an educational grant so that way we are

[1:26:37] able to um do kind of a either I spoke with a she actually runs the programs

[1:26:43] for all of Las Cru's public schools which was fantastic. I would love to

[1:26:48] involve all the schools. That's a lot of work for me. Um so I was hoping you know

[1:26:53] maybe we start with just the schools [laughter] within Missia and then

[1:26:56] hopefully we'll work out of that. But um a competition amongst you know different

[1:27:00] grades just some friendly fun competition on making perhaps some plays

[1:27:05] some poster boards some a little video snippets and um they're also Rio Grand

[1:27:10] Prep is also really um they possibly be interested in creating kind of a digital

[1:27:16] audio tours that was something that was um so maybe having um students uh focus

[1:27:22] on specific areas in the town and kind of uh giving some history on that in

[1:27:27] their own perspective. I think that'd be great. Um, and also maybe it was even

[1:27:31] thank you some plays and stuff. So, this is in the works if anybody's interested

[1:27:35] in giving a helping hand. Um, there also um there's a teacher that is an old

[1:27:41] seventh grade teacher uh that has been very involved and um he's hoping to I'm

[1:27:47] hoping to connect with him. He's no longer a teacher, but he's still very

[1:27:51] enthusiastic about projects such as these. So, um, but yeah, just wanted to

[1:27:55] share that with you and, um, I'm trying to get our newsletter out before the the

[1:28:00] celebration. Um, getting there. So, >> time

[1:28:04] » getting there. Getting there. Thank you so much. Yes.

[1:28:08] » You want to talk about what that mean? >> Yes. Plaza.

[1:28:12] » Yes. Yes. Um, well, I will have a table. Um, there's also the the days um

[1:28:16] celebration happening, I believe, both um Saturday and Sunday. Uh, Saturday

[1:28:22] runs a little bit later. A lot of fun things. Um, you know, Dorothy and the

[1:28:26] community development team work really hard to kind of get this together. Um,

[1:28:31] so expect to have fun, but please show up. Um, if you can if you can. Um, and

[1:28:37] yeah, there's ongoing and I'll actually be not this weekend but two weekends uh,

[1:28:42] two weeks from now I'll be headed to Washington DC on this um, scholarship to

[1:28:47] speak on preservation of Capitol Hill, which is very exciting. Um there's a lot

[1:28:51] as I shared with some of you, there's a lot of things happening regarding

[1:28:55] historic preservation and thank you for those who were able to attend. Um but if

[1:28:59] you're still curious, please come speak with me. I'm adding that into

[1:29:03] newsletter, but it's on um protecting our private lands um and kind of

[1:29:09] mitigating federal undertakings and federal undertakings can be anything

[1:29:13] from federal dollars to um putting up a road. So, um, just keep an eye out or

[1:29:19] keep an ear out as to what those but there's always an opportunity for, uh,

[1:29:22] public input and, um, I'm really looking to engage more with, uh, the mayor.

[1:29:28] Hopefully, we can work towards some other projects to say that we, um, we do

[1:29:33] not agree with these proposed changes that they're making. So,

[1:29:39] » all right. Thank you. >> Thank you so much.

[1:29:41] » Thank you. Thank you. >> We appreciate you very much.

[1:29:43] » Thank you. So, I just have one last comment. Oh.

[1:29:49] » Oh, go ahead. >> No, not for you.

[1:29:52] » Before the meeting's over, I just want to congratulate you, Mr. Rocha.

[1:29:56] » Yeah. >> On a job well done.

[1:30:01] » Thank you. >> Thank you, Commissioner. Thank you, Mr.

[1:30:03] Chair. >> Learn from the the best.

[1:30:06] » Appreciate it. Thank you. I want to say thank you, commissioners, chair,

[1:30:09] residents. I appreciate the opportunity. For me, this is an honor.

[1:30:13] I look forward to more meetings. >> Thank you.

[1:30:17] » All right, >> Mr. Bernal wanted to

[1:30:20] » Oh, just >> I don't know if you can.

[1:30:24] » Yeah, go ahead. I'm sorry. >> To my case. Uh, I just had a

[1:30:29] conversation with Mr. Rea's daughter. >> Yes.

[1:30:32] » And, uh, I just want to put it for the record. For the record on behalf, as

[1:30:36] long as I'm alive, okay? longest time of life. My kids will not use

[1:30:43] that easement in the back. That's why we're

[1:30:46] » Yeah. I was just more concerned about in the future

[1:30:49] » for the future plans. We don't know what the future

[1:30:51] » exactly like what they're saying. My kids might I may tell them back and

[1:30:55] forth. You are not going to sell that. >> Money talks.

[1:31:01] » Okay. >> All right. Thank you.

[1:31:03] » Very good. Thank you.

[1:31:09] My turn. >> Five more minutes. Give me five minutes.

[1:31:13] Just real quick. Um, obviously uh most of us are going to Albuquerque tomorrow.

[1:31:18] I do have the agenda there. If you haven't downloaded it yet, you should

[1:31:22] already gotten a registration on your email uh for uh for the league.

[1:31:28] If you don't, you're you're you're registered, but if if you have any

[1:31:33] issues, just let me know. Uh, I'm planning on leaving around 8 o'clock

[1:31:36] tomorrow. I'll be there before noon. Um, 12:30 is the beginning uh of the first

[1:31:42] class. 12 o'clock is registration. >> Um, u 5 o'clock and then uh by then and

[1:31:48] I'll already be at the hotel having everybody's room squared away. I put

[1:31:52] everything under my name. So, it'll be easier I think this way. That way I'll

[1:31:55] just go pick up all the cards, get the card numbers, and then I just, you know,

[1:31:58] just hand them out individually. I'll do that during the uh before 5:00 during

[1:32:04] when they're at the league. >> Sounds do we get reimbured for mileage?

[1:32:08] » Reimbursement? >> Yeah. Per deal.

[1:32:10] » Yes. Correct. Okay. >> Correct. Then let me just explain this

[1:32:13] real quick how that works. Okay. There's actual and there's perde deal.

[1:32:16] » All right. I myself didn't quite understand it and I'm I think I I

[1:32:22] finally got it. >> Um if you're going actual, um you're

[1:32:26] you're you're you're requesting the money in advance, right? And whenever

[1:32:29] you requested your money in advance um minus gas, you know, for your food and

[1:32:35] and your hotels, you get 80%. Uh we get money, but you don't you have to reserve

[1:32:40] your own hotel and you have to do all your your plans, right? When you do that

[1:32:44] and when you go PDM, you you save the receipts, right? And it's $65 a day,

[1:32:49] right? The the receipt you save has to be itemized. So a lot of times you know

[1:32:52] how the credit card uh companies or the the restaurants give you two receipts

[1:32:56] once for the sign you know that's not anomi don't want to turn that in because

[1:33:00] that's show anything and it needs to say and then obviously you know try not to

[1:33:04] put any alcohol on it you know it's not a very good thing to put on there and if

[1:33:09] there's multiple people always try to have yours on its own so there's no you

[1:33:13] know argument that you know who paid what who ate what and I eat the biggest

[1:33:17] most expensive stuff and it just gets crazy so just get your own obvious

[1:33:21] receipt Um, and then uh the gas is they pay.7

[1:33:24] cents to a gallon and that's for round trip. It's I haven't done the math.

[1:33:29] » Yeah. Well, yeah. So, and if it's based off of of Google, so it's not something

[1:33:34] that, >> you know, you make on your own. I took

[1:33:37] the long ray out or whatever. >> Um, yeah, we're excited for the the for

[1:33:41] the uh for the for the September. Uh, we do have a do have a parade starts at 10

[1:33:47] o'clock. I'm excited for I keep hearing about the the

[1:33:51] in Spanish you call them matachinas but the Aztec people that perform uh I've

[1:33:56] never seen that and I always heard that that is so cool and it's 12 as it starts

[1:34:01] at 12:30 and I I will not miss it so I'm looking forward to that and again

[1:34:06] hopefully I'll see you all out there and then uh thank you and Mr. Uh, all I hear

[1:34:11] was nervous, but I think he he >> for the very first time, I think he he

[1:34:16] did pretty decent, a lot better than I did.

[1:34:21] » And and I'll I'll try to sit out away and get any discuss because I want him

[1:34:26] to go through the whole if you need me for any questions, please ask. I'm not

[1:34:30] trying to like, you know, stay out of it, but I'm trying to, you know, let him

[1:34:34] do everything and if any questions for me.

[1:34:38] Thank you. >> Thank you.

[1:34:49] You got to hit

[1:34:57] your hair.

9/8/26 PZHAC REGULAR MEETING

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