[0:03] You are watching Access LaPorte County

[0:05] Channel 97. The next meeting is the Michigan City

[0:07] Board of Aviation Commissioners meeting on October 8

[0:10] . You can find more

[0:13] information about this meeting

[0:15] by visiting www.accesslaportecounty.org.

[0:32] Meeting of the Board of

[0:34] Aviation Commissioners to begin the session.

[0:38] Today is October 8, 2026, and we

[0:43] will meet here at the

[0:48] Michigan City Airport terminal. The

[0:51] members attending today are Jeff

[0:54] Ohling, Dwight Holman, Chuck Foreman,

[1:01] Steve Ryan, and Tom. We have a quorum.

[1:07] Other members present include Jess Neil.

[1:12] And Paul Scherer, yes, and us here.

[1:18] I think that's all, and our

[1:20] cameraman isn't here. Hello. Very

[1:24] good. So, did everyone have the

[1:27] opportunity to see the

[1:29] meeting minutes? I think it's from August 21st.

[1:35] August 21.

[1:36] Yes.

[1:37] Okay.

[1:38] I propose that they be accepted as

[1:41] written.

[1:42] OK. I

[1:42] second.

[1:43] OK. Is everyone in favor?

[1:45] Me, me, me.

[1:46] Here. Thank you. Very good. Let's see.

[1:52] We need to review the reports.

[1:57] We have the financial report and the

[2:00] manager's report, and everything else.

[2:02] Jessica,

[2:03] very good. Account balances. Oh, we

[2:07] 've already spent 67% of the

[2:10] total operating budget and 82% of the

[2:12] aviation fuel budget. We only have

[2:16] 50,630 left in our

[2:18] fuel budget. So, if we needed to

[2:20] get a full load of Jet A

[2:21] and Avgas, we couldn't. So,

[2:23] hopefully, we won't need either of them

[2:24] by the end of the year. We have two

[2:26] more months. Hopefully, we'll only need

[2:28] one or the other. I'm going to have to transfer

[2:32] funds to some

[2:33] budget lines, as I do every year

[2:35] , including overtime,

[2:38] building maintenance supplies, legal, and possibly

[2:40] electric gas. Right now we're $

[2:44] 415.14 overpaid on electricity and gas,

[2:47] but you never know. This month has been

[2:50] quite nice, so our

[2:52] next bill might be a bit

[2:53] lower than I expected and we'll get by

[2:55] . Everything else is more or

[2:58] less normal. Not legal. The reason

[3:02] the legal process has ended is

[3:03] simply because all these

[3:05] lease transfers that are

[3:06] right here are on this agenda. Bill has

[3:10] been working very hard to

[3:12] document them properly and

[3:13] deliver them to me because we had the death

[3:16] of a hangar owner. And it had

[3:20] quite a few hangars. That's why

[3:22] the legal process has ended.

[3:23] And does each hangar require

[3:24] separate authorization?

[3:25] Yes. Each hangar requires a

[3:27] separate lease. Correct.

[3:29] Well, those are our

[3:32] account balances. Regarding

[3:35] fuel sales, we sold a total of 2,046

[3:38] gallons of 100 low lead, 3,456

[3:41] gallons of Jet A, and 149.8 gallons of UL

[3:45] 94 in September. So far this year,

[3:48] fuel sales have risen by

[3:50] 22%. Well, at the beginning of summer

[3:52] we were at 68%, we're at 22% now,

[3:54] that's still incredible, guys.

[3:56] We normally aim for 5%; A good

[3:58] year is when we achieve 5% more than the

[4:00] previous year. So 22 is very good.

[4:03] Our fuel prices are $6

[4:06] for AVGAS self-service, $615 for

[4:08] AVGAS Jet A full service, we're

[4:11] at $564 for both self-service and

[4:13] full service, and

[4:15] UL 94 self-service is $645. I just found out

[4:18] , I haven't checked, but they did

[4:20] say they no longer manufacture

[4:22] UL 94 and that 100LL has been approved

[4:25] for Swift. So I think

[4:27] next time we buy fuel it

[4:29] will be 100LL, but I haven't

[4:30] tested it with Swift yet. I just found out

[4:32] from someone who uses Swift

[4:34] that it's been approved and

[4:36] that we should move there soon.

[4:38] Brilliant. Well, we'll

[4:40] keep the 100LL in the

[4:42] big tank, but we'll have the 100R in the

[4:44] small 1000-gallon tank. That's

[4:48] all about fuel sales.

[4:51] Airport project presentations. These last two weeks

[4:53] I've been invited to give some

[4:54] presentations. Brilliant. Current state

[4:57] of the airport, ongoing and

[4:58] upcoming projects. I completed the

[5:00] Neighborhood Leadership Academy at the

[5:02] Economic Development Corporation and also gave a

[5:03] presentation for the

[5:05] Michigan City Exchange Club. It

[5:07] 's always fun, and then they always

[5:08] trick me into buying a

[5:10] fundraising ticket and going to their dinners and

[5:12] everything else. So. The

[5:14] Fall Waste Department is

[5:15] a full amnesty program for

[5:17] trash containers at the

[5:18] airport. As part of an

[5:20] ongoing campaign to help Michigan City

[5:22] have a clean community and reduce

[5:24] unwanted household clutter.

[5:25] Michigan City continues its fall

[5:27] trash container cleanup program

[5:28] here at the airport. This

[5:30] month, six opportunities

[5:32] to quit began yesterday. It ends on Saturday,

[5:36] October 24. They are on Wednesdays and Saturdays

[5:38] from 8:00 a.m. m. at 12:00 p.m. m. Refuse

[5:41] also has a

[5:42] tire amnesty during which they will accept

[5:44] four tires per household. Programs

[5:47] for Michigan City residents with

[5:48] a valid ID.

[5:51] Participants need to arrange their

[5:54] own transportation, and if

[5:56] anyone has any questions, they can

[5:58] call the waste department at

[6:00] 219-873-1530. No to the airport. Because all I'm saying is,

[6:05] call Refuse. I know

[6:07] nothing about garbage. I only know about

[6:09] airplanes. Police

[6:12] department short course training program

[6:13] . We love it when you come

[6:15] here, don't we? For many years,

[6:18] the police department has

[6:19] used our track for an

[6:20] annual

[6:22] short-course driver training program. They place

[6:25] cones. Each police officer goes out

[6:26] with a training officer. They

[6:28] lead the course. They use the

[6:30] northeast part of the runway. There is still plenty of

[6:33] space to park aircraft and

[6:34] access to self-service

[6:35] refueling while they

[6:37] are here. The short course is

[6:38] delimited by cones. I issued a NOTAM

[6:40] closing the northeast portion of the runway.

[6:43] The dates have not been set yet, but it

[6:45] should be at the end of October or the

[6:47] beginning of November because that's

[6:48] when they have to finish it. They know that

[6:51] summer is off-limits because

[6:52] we're too busy and I don't have

[6:53] time for that. So October,

[6:55] November, I don't care. So that's it

[6:59] . That's all, Paul.

[7:01] Okay. Okay. The airport development hole

[7:04] .

[7:07] Yes, the runway project is not

[7:10] very far along yet. Basically,

[7:15] we've spent the last year

[7:17] talking about why they paused it and

[7:19] asking for the cost-

[7:21] benefit analysis if you need it, if you

[7:23] remember. At the last meeting, they laid

[7:28] everything out. We have requested another

[7:31] meeting. But I think the plan now

[7:34] is that we have an agreement to announce

[7:38] the temporary road and

[7:40] storm drains. We put it on

[7:44] hold because there was no point in doing it

[7:46] if they weren't going to give us the money. We've been

[7:49] charging the

[7:51] grant administration number for

[7:53] all these meetings with the FAA.

[7:57] Therefore, we will not take any

[7:59] action on this matter today, but we propose that

[8:02] we modify some of these services

[8:04] and include cost

[8:07] -benefit analysis because I do not believe we will be able

[8:10] to avoid it. We've been playing around with

[8:14] that, just experimenting. They are quite

[8:17] uncommon for any project,

[8:21] particularly for

[8:24] general aviation projects. We have three miles

[8:27] of costs and benefits that we

[8:29] have played with. We believe we can

[8:32] make this work. Therefore,

[8:35] if we believe we can win,

[8:37] we might as well say yes and review it

[8:39] to see if we can make this

[8:42] work again. That's the plan.

[8:47] They did not request a CIP meeting with

[8:49] us. We applied to the FAA for one,

[8:52] so let's wait and see, but the most

[8:54] important thing is that INDOT continues to

[8:56] invest money in the 5-

[8:59] year program for the track, a sum of

[9:01] about $15 million at the

[9:04] moment, which they have there for a

[9:06] period of 5 years. And the FAA says we can't

[9:10] do anything about it until

[9:12] we get approval from the BCA.

[9:15] Therefore, we need the FAA to

[9:19] align with INDOT and basically tell us,

[9:22] "Are you really going to make us

[9:25] redo all of this if

[9:28] the BCA is approved?" Because, you know, there's a

[9:31] 3-year timeframe for much of that

[9:33] planning that was approved in

[9:35] 2018-19. So that's where we are

[9:39] with that. We're not going to give up, but

[9:43] last year was certainly

[9:45] frustrating. Last year. Any

[9:49] questions about that?

[9:51] Okay.

[9:52] I anticipate that meeting will

[9:55] probably be in the first or second

[9:57] week of November because they already have

[10:00] CIP meetings scheduled until the

[10:02] end of October. So that's

[10:05] where we are.

[10:06] Oh. Oh, yes. What are

[10:14] they demanding? What are they saying they're demanding? Another BCA

[10:18] ?

[10:19] Well, we never did a BCA because the

[10:22] first time we reviewed the

[10:25] AIP manual at that time, if you didn't spend more

[10:28] than $10 million in

[10:31] discretionary money on capacity, you didn't have to

[10:34] do a

[10:36] cost-benefit analysis. So, in the

[10:40] study of the runway protection zone

[10:42] , we analyzed how much of the

[10:48] project funds were for capacity and

[10:51] how much for safety. Therefore,

[10:55] there is a runway extension element

[10:57] in the project, but in reality, the

[10:58] majority of the project cost is

[11:00] for the runway protection zone

[11:02] and the improvement of the runway safety area

[11:04] . The protection zone and the

[11:07] safety area of the runway are

[11:08] key elements. Well, that's how

[11:12] the AIP manual was written at the

[11:14] time, and it said, "Well, if it's a

[11:16] security project, there's no limit. You

[11:20] never have to do a

[11:21] cost-benefit analysis if it's related

[11:22] to security. You only have to

[11:24] do it if it's related to

[11:25] capacity." Well, the extension of the

[11:28] track section was very small,

[11:30] like $2 million. Well below the

[11:34] $10 million threshold, it remains

[11:36] below the $10 million threshold

[11:38] even with the project at current cost

[11:41] . The problem is that it was Deb Martell

[11:44] who basically wrote the

[11:48] compliance with the RPZ study and

[11:51] accepted that. She was also the one who

[11:53] said, "We will finance this great project

[11:54] . Wait in line."

[11:57] She is assigned to a different area,

[11:59] so she has not been involved. There are

[12:01] new people. The AIP manual, which contains

[12:04] the rules on how they spend their money

[12:07] , has changed. There was an update on that

[12:08] . And they added another paragraph in

[12:11] the cost-benefit analysis that

[12:13] basically says everything they said before

[12:16] about the $10 million in security and

[12:18] capacity and all that kind of stuff,

[12:21] but there's another general paragraph that says

[12:24] , or if the AFA requests one. Yes, in

[12:27] other words, if they don't like the

[12:29] project, they can say, "Show me a

[12:32] BCA." Correct? They can request one

[12:34] at will. They don't have to have a

[12:37] reason. It doesn't have to follow

[12:39] safety versus capacity or anything like that

[12:42] . So, in that last

[12:45] paragraph they're saying: "Hey, the

[12:48] project is a good project.

[12:51] We just need to know if it's a good

[12:53] project at the current price."

[12:54] Basically, that's where they are.

[12:56] So, do a

[12:57] cost-benefit analysis. And we really can't

[12:59] . We went back and told the

[13:01] story several times: "Hey, we were

[13:02] told we wouldn't have to do

[13:04] this. It's not a

[13:06] $10 million capacity." Nobody believes it

[13:09] .

[13:10] So, what is the

[13:11] investment cost of the BCA? How much is it?

[13:13] Well, we're trying to figure it out.

[13:16] The answer is,

[13:17] pages? What are you talking about?

[13:19] How big? I don't know how big

[13:21] a BCA is.

[13:22] Yes, very

[13:23] big. There isn't

[13:23] ...Yes, they're going to be honest about

[13:26] this. They don't. Nobody does them. And the

[13:30] guide is very vague. And well, we

[13:33] made them for Indianapolis International Airport

[13:34] , and they cost around

[13:36] $200,000. We don't think that's it

[13:38] . We think it's something, you know, maybe

[13:42] a tenth or a quarter of

[13:45] that. Yes.

[13:47] And it's basically not like an ROI, like

[13:51] where you would pay off the

[13:54] project investment. It has to do with the type of

[13:58] value they assign to human life, and

[14:00] what the potential for loss of

[14:02] life is, and all that kind of stuff. And that's

[14:05] basically what drives the

[14:07] profit side of the project.

[14:09] That's the cost aspect.

[14:10] The cost is, obviously,

[14:12] the cost of the

[14:13] asset

[14:14] over time, but

[14:16] all maintenance is taken into account, and it is

[14:18] brought back to its present value, and then

[14:20] compared with the benefits. So,

[14:23] the benefits are, you know,

[14:25] obviously, first, the preservation

[14:27] of life and property, which is the

[14:29] most important figure. And then you

[14:33] wonder, if I weren't here,

[14:35] how long it would take to drive

[14:37] from Gary or LaPorte or South Bend, and

[14:39] get here. So, you add up

[14:42] all that ground transportation time

[14:44] , the additional fuel burned, and

[14:46] all that ground transportation stuff; all of that

[14:48] goes into the figures. But

[14:51] what about the benefit to the

[14:53] community here? I mean,

[14:54] that's not really...

[14:55] We have a pretty big impact

[14:57] on the community. It's

[14:58] not really an economic impact.

[15:00] That's it, that's all.

[15:02] Yes, that's the

[15:02] impact statement we made.

[15:04] EIS.

[15:05] Yes, economic impact study.

[15:07] Analysis. They just want to know.

[15:10] Yes, it mainly concerns

[15:13] direct costs or potential

[15:15] liability if the project is not carried out

[15:18] . That's what goes in the

[15:20] profit column. And the cost is...

[15:24] But I thought it was the

[15:25] security part. I

[15:26] know. And I

[15:30] thought it was the infrastructure. I mean

[15:32] , I

[15:33] know.

[15:34] Yes.

[15:35] And it's not very clear, you know. I understand you

[15:40] .

[15:41] But then you get into very

[15:44] abstract things. So, to be

[15:46] totally honest, I don't know what

[15:48] the rules are. I'm telling you. I don't know what

[15:50] the rules are for

[15:52] cost-benefit analysis at an airport

[15:54] like this, of this size. It's very

[15:56] clear for Indianapolis. It's not very

[15:57] clear here. Because nobody

[15:58] had done it. There isn't a book that says, you

[16:04] know, that an accident, you know,

[16:07] has this value or that this human life

[16:10] has this value. We've already

[16:13] covered that.

[16:14] Correct. Did

[16:16] n't we manage...? Yes.

[16:18] So we're going to charge as little as

[16:21] possible because, as you know, we've

[16:24] invested a lot. They have invested a lot in

[16:28] this project that goes south. We don't

[16:31] want to spend money or time on anything other

[16:34] than building runways

[16:37] .

[16:39] Make sure to count the number of

[16:41] school buses that pass through here

[16:43] . Yes. I

[16:44] mean, there are 20,000

[16:46] cars a day, which, when

[16:47] we did the initial study, the

[16:49] initial RPC.

[16:50] These are the shirts that have that

[16:51] logo.

[16:52] Correct.

[16:52] Yes, that's correct.

[16:55] Yes. To answer your question, we

[16:58] 've never done a

[16:59] cost-benefit analysis because we thought we

[17:01] had already achieved that. Or no, we hadn't

[17:03] succeeded.

[17:04] We thought not, I

[17:06] thought we had made it.

[17:07] We made one years ago. We

[17:09] only had to justify the use of the

[17:11] track.

[17:11] We made a justification.

[17:12] Yes.

[17:13] Justification for the

[17:14] runway. Yes. Yes.

[17:15] And that...

[17:16] Yes, something like that. Yes. Okay. The project

[17:21] to seal cracks and surfaces of

[17:23] the track, a warranty inspection was carried out

[17:25] . It's not working very

[17:28] well. Therefore, it was supposed to

[17:32] last 5 years. That's debatable, I

[17:34] think. So, we're going to call a

[17:38] meeting with the N-Dot and the manufacturer

[17:40] here. There is still more

[17:42] warranty work to be done. Therefore,

[17:45] I guess N-Dot will pressure these

[17:46] people to come and fix it every

[17:48] spring for the 5 years it was

[17:50] supposed to last. And then

[17:53] we will have to, unfortunately, I think

[17:55] the situation is reaching the point where we

[17:58] will have to do something about it.

[18:03] We were trying not to do anything about it

[18:04] while we were working on the

[18:06] runway project. But you know,

[18:09] aviation is the safest means of transport

[18:11] for a reason. We cannot

[18:14] allow the track to reach the point where it

[18:15] becomes a hazard. Therefore,

[18:17] we will have to do a milling and

[18:18] filling.

[18:19] Would it be possible to raise it to where it

[18:22] needs to be for the next level

[18:24] ? The next one.

[18:25] Not so high. There's a lot of fitting.

[18:30] And simply fill it with soil.

[18:31] Yes. Okay. Well, that's all. Any

[18:38] questions about that project? No. Yes.

[18:43] Regarding the fuel supply, no

[18:45] changes. The same schedule as

[18:49] before. I'm supposed to be

[18:51] here. Well, it's actually in

[18:52] November, right?

[18:53] Yes, it's almost here.

[18:54] So they'll leave everything, wire it up

[18:57] before, you know, they shut down the

[19:00] old system, that's the plan. So

[19:05] , if they remove the old system from the

[19:07] ground and close it up this season, it will be

[19:12] interesting because winter is coming

[19:13] .

[19:14] But they planned to try. So we'll

[19:16] see.

[19:16] Clear. Clear. And that

[19:20] state and local maintenance program. So

[19:23] we signed the grant agreement yesterday.

[19:25] Oh. That's great. So now

[19:27] we have a signed grant agreement. Now we just

[19:29] need to buy the radar. They have

[19:30] n't sent you the

[19:31] purchase order number yet. Not yet

[19:32] .

[19:33] As soon as we have the

[19:35] purchase order number, we will issue the

[19:36] contracts and you can proceed. With the

[19:39] weather as it is, it's likely that if

[19:41] they had an open schedule,

[19:43] they could come and do it, but

[19:45] they're probably busy for a

[19:47] while. That could happen in the

[19:49] spring. The IIJA funds, we have

[19:56] this point number five and point

[19:59] number six which go hand in hand.

[20:02] Consideration of the draft

[20:04] AWOS professional services agreement. That

[20:07] is the first project we are going to

[20:10] focus on at the CIP. The CIP has

[20:15] very small fonts on the

[20:17] following page. The fonts

[20:19] on the page are a bit small. There's a

[20:22] slightly larger game in the text here,

[20:26] but basically we're saying we have

[20:30] $397,000 of IIJA funds left.

[20:36] Mhm.

[20:36] After we made the track, the

[20:40] snow removal. And now we have to

[20:45] spend that money. $20,000 of

[20:48] that money will expire in October

[20:50] 2027 if we don't spend it. We have plenty of

[20:53] time to spend them. We have some

[20:56] projects listed here for which

[20:58] we had ideas. The AWOS replacement,

[21:01] PAPI replacements at both ends,

[21:05] the FA obstruction tower project

[21:08] . We tested the PAPI and the

[21:16] obstruction tower together because we believe it

[21:23] 's a good case. I'm still not

[21:26] sure if they feel the same, but

[21:28] basically if you fly with the

[21:30] PAPI angle, pilots feel that the

[21:32] obstructions are too close.

[21:38] If we were to replace the PAPIs

[21:40] today, they would probably be further down

[21:42] the runway and at a 4° angle

[21:43] to try to provide more

[21:45] separation from obstructions.

[21:48] Those are the two zoom lenses, right?

[21:49] Yes, at both ends actually. The

[21:52] far south is actually no better and

[21:54] I think that's because, in my

[21:56] research on this, I believe the

[21:59] PAPIs were installed before the

[22:04] current displaced threshold locations. And that illusion...Yes, yes,

[22:08] so instead of being basically

[22:10] 270 feet closer to the end of the

[22:12] pavement than they should be,

[22:14] basically at each end. One is

[22:17] at 250, the other at 270. But that reduces

[22:20] the height at the threshold crossing,

[22:22] right? So if we did that,

[22:26] you would move the PAPIs and lose more

[22:28] effective runway length. I

[22:30] mean, the published length remains

[22:32] the same, but if you fly the PAPI

[22:35] to the touchdown point, you have no endpoints, but if

[22:37] you fly the PAPI to the touchdown point

[22:39] , it's dropping you about 800

[22:41] feet from the end of the pavement. And

[22:45] then, when you're

[22:48] basically working with 4,000 feet of pavement

[22:50] , you only have 3,200 feet left. We want to

[22:54] try to preserve as much of the pavement as

[22:56] possible from the point of contact.

[22:59] So, at this far north,

[23:01] we have also determined that they

[23:03] installed the pappies or installed the

[23:06] obstruction towers at the height of the

[23:08] vent tree before

[23:11] we had the environmental resources plan

[23:13] . The environmental resources plan

[23:15] was approved after

[23:17] the towers were installed. The

[23:20] environmental resources plan gives us permission

[23:23] to prune the trees as long as

[23:25] , you know, we let the

[23:28] debris fall and don't disturb the

[23:30] flora and fauna of the forest area's soil

[23:32] . And with that, we have the

[23:37] ability to manage those trees

[23:39] up to a threshold sighting surface

[23:42] that is more traditional. Instead

[23:44] of raising the pappies on the ground,

[23:46] we can keep them at three, which is a

[23:49] standard approach angle. And

[23:53] we could lower those towers to that

[23:55] surface and prune the trees around them

[23:57] in theory. The justification

[24:01] for this is that, firstly, we did not have

[24:02] the environmental resources document

[24:04] when the towers were installed.

[24:06] Second, the advisory circular

[24:08] actually changed. They cited

[24:12] different thresholds in

[24:14] advisory circular 5313A, which is what they

[24:16] are installing. Now we're under

[24:19] 13B and they've changed, they don't even have

[24:21] appendix two anymore. It is now more

[24:23] aligned with a TERPS procedure,

[24:25] which is how instrument approaches are written

[24:28] . So, we used that

[24:32] argument. We had a meeting with

[24:35] Riley and another FA member, Melanie

[24:38] Myers, who oversees the

[24:40] Indiana Central team because Riley is

[24:42] relatively new in this position. And

[24:45] there were many questions about that. They did not

[24:48] agree with this. I think

[24:51] we can solve it. One question was,

[24:53] well, they already had PAPI, what was the

[24:55] funding? Well, they were installed

[24:57] locally. Oh well, the FAA won't

[24:58] pay to reinstall or replace

[25:00] locally funded PAPIs. That

[25:03] 's not true. The AIP manual makes it very

[25:07] clear that they should have been paid in the

[25:08] beginning. So, in reality, they only

[25:11] got 20 years of free PAPI.

[25:12] So that's how you

[25:14] should look at it. I think we'll definitely win that

[25:16] argument. The

[25:18] instruction tower is something like...

[25:20] Melanie says, "Well, you know, we have

[25:23] the capability to say that they were installed

[25:26] according to 13A, they're protected.

[25:29] They're fine as they are." That's what

[25:32] we heard the last time we wanted to

[25:33] download them. We'll

[25:35] go down one or two, right?

[25:36] Yes. Yes. We went down the one that's right on

[25:39] the Sierra Nevada fence, yes. Well,

[25:45] she didn't believe it, although she opened the

[25:49] door with, "They're 16 years old. If

[25:53] they need rehabilitation or, you know,

[25:56] some work, they're eligible for

[25:59] rehabilitation." So, we've

[26:02] moved on to rehabilitating the towers, in

[26:04] which case, when we rehabilitate them,

[26:06] we should make them comply with

[26:08] current standards, and that would have given us

[26:11] the opportunity to make some adjustments

[26:13] . Well, Jessica says that most

[26:16] of the batteries in the lights haven't been

[26:17] touched. There are a couple of them that we

[26:19] changed the batteries in, I suppose.

[26:21] Yes.

[26:21] But most don't. So I think

[26:24] we have a good case there. So let's go back

[26:26] to that. And then, in addition,

[26:29] the trees that have grown have clearly

[26:32] not been pruned. The trees that

[26:35] we pruned earlier.

[26:36] Correct.

[26:37] Because of the pruning, you know, Jessica

[26:39] astutely pointed out that the trees we

[26:40] 've pruned before are still

[26:42] clearly visible because their canopies

[26:43] are flat. And everyone else, you

[26:46] know, and their cups are on the floor

[26:47] right next to them. The others do not

[26:49] have flat tops and

[26:51] are not lying on the

[26:52] ground either. So it's quite easy to

[26:54] identify. And that's one of the

[26:56] criteria: the FAA pays for pruning a

[26:58] tree once. After paying for it

[27:00] once, it becomes a maintenance item. It is

[27:02] no longer a capital expenditure. So we

[27:05] have to convince them that the

[27:07] trees we are going to prune haven't

[27:09] paid before.

[27:10] Yes.

[27:11] Well, we're still working on it. All

[27:15] this to say that what we had

[27:18] planned for 2027 was to try to

[27:20] resolve those things. So we're going to

[27:24] spend IJ money on the

[27:25] fuel farm, IJ money on AWOS, for

[27:27] sure. Now, let's talk quickly about

[27:30] the AWOS. The AWOS is a Vaisala AWOS.

[27:35] Vaisala was bought by a company

[27:36] called DBT. DBT also bought a

[27:40] company called All Weather. Mhm. All

[27:44] Weather and Vaisala are two approved AWOS systems

[27:46] . There are only four

[27:49] AWOS systems approved by the FAA. So

[27:52] now one company has two of them.

[27:54] Vaisala was mainly manufactured in

[27:56] Canada. They are ceasing to manufacture them

[27:59] in Canada. All Weather was manufactured in

[28:02] Colorado. They are adapting everything to that.

[28:05] So the Vaisalas are

[28:06] rapidly running out of support. Almost

[28:09] all of our customers who have

[28:10] Vaisalas are doing

[28:12] replacement programs. If you have a Vaisala, it's a

[28:15] good project. It fits perfectly into

[28:19] the funds you have left from the IJ. You have

[28:23] 20,000 that are about to expire. It's quite

[28:26] clear. I think it's a piece of cake to be able to

[28:29] use those funds and not let

[28:31] those 20,000 expire. Well, that's what we

[28:35] recommend, that we move forward

[28:37] and start working hard to make it

[28:39] work. Right now there are no

[28:43] technical problems with your AWOS, except

[28:46] that if you run out of salami, you might

[28:49] not be able to find another one because they are no longer

[28:52] manufactured. It's a hard piece

[28:55] to find. People sell used ones

[28:58] when the old systems stop

[29:01] working. But right now it's the

[29:04] only way to find them.

[29:05] And you don't know how long they'll last. So you

[29:07] buy it and you don't even know how much

[29:09] time you have left.

[29:09] How old is yours?

[29:11] 16 years old.

[29:12] Oh. 2010.

[29:14] Yes, and they say they are usually

[29:16] replaced after 15 or 20 years.

[29:22] Yes, the other old ones are

[29:24] good too. They have a much more

[29:30] internet-based interface, so Jessica

[29:35] will be able to make additions.

[29:38] Yes. So, when you listen to the

[29:40] A-wash, you can notice that at the end of it there is

[29:42] a small recording. I mean

[29:44] , she can send it and

[29:45] record it. Yes, every time you issue a

[29:48] note, you can post it on the

[29:50] back of the A-wash too if

[29:51] you want. And that's what

[29:54] most of the places you know do; when you

[29:57] walk in and listen to the A-sauce, like

[29:59] South Bend, they have a recording at the

[30:01] end. It's the same system.

[30:05] They're simply

[30:06] playing.

[30:07] Well, you said that this 20,000

[30:09] would cover the A-wash and the AS...

[30:14] Oh, no, no, no. That's it, that's all...

[30:16] We have 20,000 that are expiring because it's going to be

[30:18] 3 years old.

[30:20] Total?

[30:21] 20. Yes, the A-wash is 212,000 with

[30:24] professional services and facilities

[30:27] . And this one is for a 3PT, which

[30:31] means it's third generation

[30:34] . It has a rainfall

[30:36] and thunderstorm detector.

[30:38] Okay.

[30:39] 21,000.

[30:40] 3 years.

[30:41] Okay, so we're simply

[30:43] adding those 20 to whatever value it is.

[30:46] Monthly costs. Understood.

[30:51] Yes. Yes. Yes. And we're estimating the

[30:59] PAPI replacement,

[31:02] tower rehabilitation, and

[31:05] additional tree trimming that the FAA hasn't

[31:09] paid for at basically 500 of 69,000.

[31:14] Yes.

[31:16] So the fuel park,

[31:19] you can see that the fuel park portion

[31:22] is 1.17, but we're only

[31:26] using 166,500 of IJ funds because

[31:29] that's all that was determined to be

[31:33] eligible from IJ. So, among

[31:38] all these projects, the reason that

[31:40] number is in the red is that that's

[31:42] the IJ balance

[31:44] we would allocate to the

[31:46] PAPI tree obstruction tower project, and that would

[31:49] deplete all the IJ. And then you would pay for

[31:52] the rest of that project with the

[31:54] rights. Technically you have $

[31:57] 300,000 in rights because

[31:59] we transferred them last year, you get

[32:01] another $150 this year, but we would only

[32:03] use $206 of that. So you would have some money left over

[32:05] . That would go towards the

[32:08] program's balance, which is expected to get

[32:13] this

[32:17] track project back on track.

[32:18] The BCA.

[32:19] So, the BCA, we're not actually

[32:21] showing it here because we already had that

[32:23] other agreement and another grant, and

[32:25] we're going to repurpose some of those

[32:27] funds for the BCA.

[32:28] Oh, okay.

[32:30] Yes, in that one we have 157. We've used

[32:33] the whole percentage, so 140,000.

[32:37] Left.

[32:38] Yes.

[32:40] And we won't use all of that for the BCA.

[32:42] I'm thinking of something between 10 and 50.

[32:45] It's a high number, but I don't know.

[32:53] It'll be at least $10,000 because

[32:56] my people don't come to work for less

[32:58] than $10,000, so...well,

[33:01] that's it. So, if it's alright with you

[33:05] , item five on your

[33:07] agenda is this consideration of

[33:09] professional loss services A.

[33:12] There's a draft of that. Of course, they don't

[33:14] need to act on that this

[33:16] month. I didn't expect them to do it, but

[33:20] I wanted to show it to them because, if

[33:22] we decide that's the way

[33:24] we want to do it, I want to get it going

[33:27] so we can get through the

[33:29] FA process. They will begin accepting

[33:33] applications again in November for

[33:35] the next round, with

[33:38] half grants expected sometime

[33:40] between March and April. But they will accept

[33:44] applications from November to December

[33:47] for that April program. Well,

[33:52] they can file the motion tonight.

[33:53] If they want some time to think about it

[33:55] and send it last month.

[34:06] I like the motion that we approve the

[34:10] order of project number 11 of annex

[34:14] one to...Yes, I

[34:17] second it. Is

[34:18] everyone in favor?

[34:19] Yes. Yes.

[34:22] Okay. They certainly don't need to pass the

[34:26] Pappy or the CIP tonight

[34:28] . I recommend that you do not

[34:31] do so until we attempt to hold

[34:33] our CIP meeting. I think it's

[34:34] next week.

[34:36] Well, we haven't

[34:37] scheduled it yet. I don't think it will be until the

[34:40] first or second week of November.

[34:43] I hope it will be before their

[34:45] November meeting.

[34:45] I thought it was always during the AAI.

[34:47] He is, but they didn't fire him. They didn't

[34:50] schedule it.

[34:51] Yes.

[34:53] But now we have to choose for that.

[34:56] So we asked.

[34:57] Well, there are 68 airports and they

[35:00] only carry out 12 each year. Well, you were

[35:04] n't scheduled for the

[35:05] original meeting of 12. That doesn't mean you can't

[35:06] request one.

[35:07] Clear.

[35:08] But they usually do them

[35:10] virtually, like a week or two

[35:11] later.

[35:12] Yes.

[35:12] So it will probably be a

[35:13] virtual meeting. Well,

[35:16] we can probably tell you we'll come by car if

[35:18] you want to come in person. We've always

[35:20] gone in person in the past.

[35:22] Yes. I do

[35:23] n't really know if that makes much of a difference

[35:26] with this particular group,

[35:28] but I'd be happy to drive

[35:31] there with you.

[35:32] Zoom.

[35:34] Yes. Well, I would say let's

[35:36] postpone it until the

[35:38] November meeting. We could get more

[35:41] information. And if we don't have the

[35:42] CIP meeting before the

[35:44] November meeting, we'll have to approve

[35:46] something. It's December 1st. So...

[35:50] There will be action at the

[35:51] November meeting.

[35:52] Like what kind of things? Very good. Alright

[35:55] .

[35:56] Very good. Thank you for your time. Do

[35:58] n't worry. Any other business?

[36:02] None.

[36:04] Very good. Any new issues?

[36:05] New business, we have many

[36:07] new businesses. We have an assignment of

[36:11] leases for

[36:14] aircraft storage land for A 4-3,

[36:17] A 4-5, A 4-7 and hangars T A2 to A3.

[36:22] A tenant passed away, so this

[36:24] is just a transfer of

[36:27] land leases to his children, who were already

[36:29] on the land leases before

[36:32] . It's very easy. It's just a

[36:35] one-page, double-sided document. All

[36:38] leases do not change. It's

[36:40] just a matter of changing, removing one name and

[36:42] leaving only the other two on the

[36:44] list. That's all they do.

[36:46] Land leases continue to

[36:47] say the same thing. If they could

[36:49] approve it, that would be great. And then

[36:56] I'll talk about the last one, unless you

[36:57] want me to.

[36:58] Yes, I will make a motion for us to

[37:00] approve Philip's transfer of

[37:05] aircraft storage land leases for A4-3,

[37:07] A4-5, A4-7, A2-A3, and

[37:09] Perfecto.

[37:10] A 4-9. Not yet

[37:11] . Not yet.

[37:12] Oh I'm sorry.

[37:14] Postponing the last one. The last one is an

[37:24] actual land lease that has

[37:27] changed. It's a new

[37:29] land lease. This particular hangar

[37:31] was also owned by Dale, that is

[37:33] , the same person, the same group

[37:35] . He was there, the two children

[37:38] too, but he had a

[37:40] 20-year lease that had ended and

[37:42] then he had a 10-year extension

[37:44] that had also ended. The

[37:47] old contract only included a

[37:48] 10-year extension, so we had to

[37:50] draw up a new one for him. This

[37:53] lease is for 5 years. And that's

[37:56] to make sure the

[37:58] new owners don't live in the area

[38:00] , so they'll make sure they

[38:02] keep all the insurance up to date and

[38:04] that they have planes in all the

[38:06] hangars. Currently, they are

[38:10] managed by a manager who

[38:12] is neither on the ground nor in the area. He

[38:14] has no experience in aviation or anything like that

[38:16] . So it's a

[38:17] 5-year lease with no

[38:19] renewal. To make sure

[38:22] everything is going well, and if it is, in 5 years

[38:24] we can do whatever the board decides at

[38:26] that time. Well.

[38:29] this is the hangar we

[38:30] agreed to give 5 years to.

[38:32] Correct. And that's the A4-9.

[38:35] Okay.

[38:37] And they have aircraft. I made sure they had

[38:39] aircraft in all their

[38:40] hangars because those were kind of

[38:41] stipulations we talked about.

[38:43] Well, there are aircraft on them. They are

[38:46] doing a good job. They are up to

[38:47] date with all their insurance. Everything is

[38:49] fine. All of their leases are

[38:51] paid. So there's no reason not to

[38:53] give them another lease. Well. Okay.

[38:56] I will make a motion for us to approve the

[38:58] 5-year lease of hangar A

[39:00] 4-9. I

[39:00] second that.

[39:01] Okay. Is everyone in favor?

[39:02] Yes.

[39:03] Motion approved. Do

[39:06] we have to sign all of that today?

[39:07] No. It's just that the only one that needed

[39:09] everyone's signature was the

[39:10] land lease. All assignments are

[39:12] for one person only.

[39:14] Understood.

[39:15] Anyone who wants to sign it can do so.

[39:17] Okay, is this the

[39:18] claims file?

[39:18] Yes, that

[39:20] was circulating around here. 52,189.34.

[39:27] Oh, did you have a question? Are there two

[39:30] payments to NIPsco there?

[39:32] Yes. Because we didn't have

[39:34] a meeting in September, so it's all the

[39:35] claims from September and all the

[39:36] claims from October. And besides,

[39:39] we have two payments to NIPsco every month anyway

[39:41] because they couldn't

[39:42] consolidate our new SRE building

[39:44] with everything else. So I have to

[39:47] pay for everything, and then I have a

[39:49] separate bill for the SRE building. Okay,

[39:52] we paid. But, I mean, the city

[39:54] only writes one check, but we

[39:55] actually now have two

[39:56] separate bills for the airport because of

[39:58] that building. Good questions, Kirk. I

[40:01] like it. Good questions.

[40:03] Okay, the details.

[40:04] Yes they are. Let us

[40:06] make a motion to accept

[40:08] the claim file for the

[40:10] amount of $52,189.34. I

[40:12] second that. Is

[40:13] everyone in favor?

[40:14] Yes.

[40:15] Motion approved. OK.

[40:21] None. Let's

[40:29] make a motion to adjourn the

[40:30] session.

Michigan City Board of Aviation Commissioners October 8, 2026

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