[5:39] be good be good since county has Johnson Grass ordinance if uh the county would

[5:45] set a good example for other people by following their own ordinance. So thank

[5:52] you for your time. >> Thank you.

[6:00] Anyone else?

[6:04] Seeing none, I'll close public comments.

[6:10] Moving down the list, item three, constitutional officers, treasures

[6:15] report only, commissioner's report only. New sheriff's office, uh, Sheriff Mickey

[6:23] Samson.

[6:33] Good afternoon, Mr. Chairman, board members. um been in conversation

[6:39] uh with some of you over the last couple of weeks as it pertains to some things

[6:42] that I had talked about in the past, a couple of months ago um as far as the

[6:46] courthouse. Um and today I would like to request uh

[6:51] another full-time deputy to be at the courthouse and if you'll allow me a

[6:55] little bit. Um in 2019 the general district clerk's office,

[7:01] they changed their schedule. um juvenile domestic relations court. Uh

[7:06] they've added uh dates as well to include uh circuit court. Um

[7:13] we currently staffed the courthouse um with two full-time persons. One of

[7:19] those persons we've taken off the road. We've actually moved somebody off the

[7:22] road and put them in the courthouse. Uh we've done that. I I made that decision

[7:27] as well as actually uh previous sheriff as well had some discussion on that. Um

[7:34] it is a constitutional obligation of ours to do that that and the civil

[7:38] process. Uh so we staff that again with two full-time people again one coming

[7:43] off the road and four now four part-time persons. Two of those part-time persons

[7:49] can only get so many hours in the month uh due to their retirement uh and I

[7:56] believe social security. And one of those four persons is really a full-time

[8:00] civil process server. They are out four, sometimes five days a week, averaging

[8:05] anywhere from 30 to 40 for 32 to 40 hours a week doing nothing but serving

[8:10] civil papers, which does take over does does alleviate some of the

[8:15] responsibilities of of just the deputies on the road where they can focus more on

[8:19] enforcement. Um, but as you go down and start looking at the actual days of

[8:25] court, general district holds somewhere around 48. That's with no additional

[8:28] dates being being added. Um the JDR uh runs somewhere between 36 to

[8:36] 38 scheduled with with again with nothing else added. The schedules for

[8:40] these courts change during the year as the judge sees fit um if he needs to add

[8:45] days or take away days. And then we al also have circuit court date which is

[8:49] the first and third uh Wednesday u and that's to include term day which is

[8:55] today. um it's every other Tuesday of it's it's the first Tuesday of every

[9:01] even month is when they have that. So there's somewhere in the neighborhood of

[9:06] 30 scheduled dates just for circuit court. And again, that's not including

[9:09] any trials or whatever else the judge may

[9:14] uh add add to the schedule. Um, if you just took an a regular day

[9:21] for a general district court day or or any court day for that matter, if you

[9:25] just had if you just had one court going, we have to have somebody in the

[9:29] control room. That control room, they monitor the happenings inside of the

[9:33] court inside of the courtroom itself um to to include uh in the in the lockup.

[9:41] So, if we have a prisoner in the back, that person is monitoring that. if

[9:44] something were to happen, they could get on a radio and let let the other persons

[9:48] know. So, that's one person and that's their responsibility. The second person

[9:53] I'll talk about is the person that sets at the metal detector as well as the

[9:58] X-ray machine, check all the persons coming in. We have we do that with one

[10:01] person. They have to run them through the metal

[10:04] detector. They have to check uh baggage through the X-ray machine, whatever they

[10:08] may have. Um, and recently, uh, I hate to use the term because it seems to be

[10:15] pretty common as of late, but another unfunded mandate by by some legislation

[10:20] that came down. There was a House bill, I believe, that came down where they've

[10:23] allowed uh cell phones in the courtroom. With that, and I'm paraphrasing here,

[10:31] with that, they've allowed the circuit court judges to establish

[10:36] guidelines for that. our judge decided to, okay, we're going to let them in,

[10:41] but they have to keep them in a Faraday bag or a yonder bag. I'm not sure if you

[10:46] guys are familiar with that. I'm I'm kind of just getting spun up on it

[10:49] myself. Um, essentially what happens is if someone

[10:55] comes in, they have their phone with them. We no longer tell them to take it

[10:59] back to the car. We have to supply them with one of these bags. They put it in

[11:03] the bag and we have to lock it. It has to be locked. So, you can't use the

[11:07] phone in the courtroom. Don't ask me. That doesn't make any sense either. If

[11:12] you're not going to allow them to use it, but it could be for evidentiary

[11:15] purposes. Maybe if the person had some pictures or whatever on their phone,

[11:18] they would have it in there. That can only be unlocked by us. So, I'm not

[11:24] exactly sure how many keys that we do have. I think that there was four. There

[11:28] was one where you're going to be coming into the courtroom. the uh baoiff that's

[11:35] in the courtroom will have one and then there'll have to be one when you leave.

[11:40] So anytime that somebody needs to access that phone, whether it's in the

[11:44] courtroom or when they leave, we have to have a deputy now to unlock that because

[11:49] we have the key. There's a special magnetic thing that they do. Of course,

[11:52] it's on YouTube. I think there's a 12-year-old that shows you how to open

[11:55] it up. Um so, but anyway, we have the key for it. So, that's going to take

[12:00] additional manpower. You have to ask, do you have your phone? That's that's

[12:04] manpower. That's going to be seconds. That's going to be time. And on a day

[12:08] like today, uh, where you have a term day, you have multiple people coming

[12:11] through. Not to mention, now we're going to that's only the two people that I've

[12:15] talked about up to this point. Now, we're going to have to have somebody and

[12:18] we're going to have to figure this out. How are we going to gather these bags at

[12:21] $50 a piece so they don't walk out in somebody's purse or in somebody's back

[12:26] pocket? The third person I'll talk about is the Chief Baleiff. He is actually in

[12:30] the courtroom. We put one person in there. One.

[12:36] And the last person would be uh if there was a prisoner, they would we would have

[12:40] to have somebody in the lockup. So that's four people at a bare minimum.

[12:44] Bare minimum just to function. Um I would give you an example.

[12:49] Um there have been times where there's been

[12:52] two courts going. We do not have enough people for that. As of today, we had

[12:58] road deputies that also had to come in. some on their day off and substitute in.

[13:02] We had some people that were off. So, we had road deputies in there today again

[13:06] uh back filling for our our uh our courtroom personnel.

[13:11] Um with that person coming off the road, we

[13:14] put a little bit more stress on our on our road units uh to accommodate their

[13:20] day-to-day things that they have to do uh and and their uh patrols and and

[13:24] whatnot. Um, that being said, that's that's a very small part of what our

[13:31] manpower goes towards. Anything we have two campgrounds. I'm not telling you

[13:35] anything. You guys don't know, ladies don't know. Uh, I've been up here before

[13:39] and and I've kind of told you this or or mentioned it that the, you know, we have

[13:43] to staff the campgrounds. They they request a deputy for the campgrounds.

[13:46] And we, you name the call and we've answered at these campgrounds. The calls

[13:49] are for service are continuing to go up into the campgrounds. I personally don't

[13:55] like just having one person at these campgrounds. You take Beth Page, you

[13:58] could have 5,000 people in there and one deputy. It's not a good number. That's

[14:02] not good numbers for us. But we have to have one at Beth Page, one at Grace

[14:06] Point. Uh we've run everything uh from uh possible attempted murder to drug

[14:11] charges to domestics to alcohol stuff. I mean, you name it, we answer the calls.

[14:16] And that's just ours. That's not EMS calls um as far as that goes as well.

[14:21] And that's just the that's just uh the campgrounds. Any of these other events

[14:26] that we have to do, the Fourth of July, the 5K, any of these other special

[14:29] events that that we are requested, I mean, we have to have people there, the

[14:32] crab feast, and we're we're stretched really really thin. uh the person that

[14:37] actually fills in that or that we've moved over to the courthouse is also

[14:42] coming back out in the evenings and trying to pick up some of this other

[14:45] stuff whether he's covering the road uh or he's doing an ECO emergency custody

[14:50] order where we have a mental patient where it falls on law enforcement as

[14:54] everything goes if you don't know what to do just let law enforcement handle

[14:58] it. Um it seems that that's the that's the that's the standard. Um,

[15:06] so, uh, again, this is not a request that's based on something that's going

[15:10] to happen in the future. This is kind of now. And we're feeling we're feeling the

[15:15] strain. We're spread very very thin. And, you know, we have a a tremendous

[15:20] bunch of people that we have there now. It's uh it's been it's been really nice

[15:24] to watch uh people come around and and the excitement and the morale come up

[15:28] within the department. So, um, again, I I am requesting that one deputy so we

[15:34] could put that back on the road and leave our person over there to actually

[15:38] run the courts. >> Questions?

[15:45] » I just have one. Uh, I know that in uh my former department, we we had a lot of

[15:50] guys that would retire and they would uh they'd come in and they were they were

[15:53] the bailiffs. They'd come in and work in the court. And I was wondering if that's

[15:57] a possibility here. that would be somebody who obviously wouldn't be uh

[16:01] getting the benefits and that sort of thing. Um would that is that a something

[16:05] that could be done as well or have you looked into that?

[16:07] » We're doing it now. We [laughter] we have a couple of former uh we have a

[16:10] former deputy uh who's in there now. Uh again, we had some people from the jail

[16:16] that were filling in as well. They phased out some people have taken some

[16:20] different jobs. Um but we're and we're actively looking for for some more

[16:24] part-time part- timerrs as well. That being said, if you kind of pay attention

[16:29] to that, we're we're pushing that line item as it stands on the part-time for

[16:34] at that courthouse as well because we just we just have to have people. You

[16:38] there's there's no other there's really no other way around it. We're we're

[16:41] trying to backfill with full-time people so we're not getting too much into the

[16:44] part-time money. Um but we do have some people that have applied for this

[16:48] part-time. So, >> okay, good.

[16:52] Those bags you referenced, you might have to have maybe 50 or 75 on hand.

[16:58] » 80. We start We started out with 80. >> So, you're looking at 80 80 people show

[17:05] up. >> Yes, sir. An additional 30 seconds per

[17:09] person that may have a that may have a cell phone. with that deputy having stop

[17:13] the process of people coming through the courtroom. He now has to stop that

[17:17] process, get a bag, have that person put it in there, and then if that person

[17:21] leaves that, we also have to recover that bag. It's just time. Um,

[17:26] » so you're talking about 40 minutes to get them into the courthouse, 40 minutes

[17:30] to get them out just because of this bag.

[17:32] » That's correct. Thereabouts. Yes, sir. >> I mean, yeah, we're talking roughly. And

[17:35] then if they have to come out in the middle of the court or something, make a

[17:38] phone call. >> The same. Yeah. or or if they uh if they

[17:40] are standing up in the court and they have their they have their uh their

[17:44] yonder bag and they need to get into it. We have to stop court proceedings. The

[17:47] baiff, the only baiff in there has to come over there, open the bag for them

[17:51] so they can access and then they have to close that bag. It's just it's just

[17:55] another step. It's just tedious and timeconuming.

[17:58] » So every day in court you've potentially lost two to three man hours.

[18:02] » Yes, sir. Yes, sir. Yes, sir. >> Thank you.

[18:07] So you're saying that everybody that comes in the courtroom have a phone. You

[18:12] got to put it in the bag. So how you It's no nothing provided that say you

[18:18] need to not to bring your phone and is what's the deal?

[18:22] » We're trying not to take those signs down. Please don't. We might put please

[18:26] up there in front of it. I don't >> But regardless uh regardless you saying

[18:30] they can walk in that courtroom now regardless of what?

[18:34] » That's correct. And you got to protect and you say they got you got a law come

[18:37] down from Richmond to say that or the state.

[18:39] » Yes, sir. New state code. Yes, sir. And then we have we have order that was

[18:42] recently added that was put in uh by the circuit court judge and how he plans on

[18:48] implement implementing that starting September 1.

[18:51] » So everybody that comes in the courtroom can have a cell phone and you need to

[18:57] put it in a bag. >> That's correct.

[19:00] » Then you got to get it from >> then you got to get it from them. You

[19:03] know, it's it's a little strange.

[19:10] » Watches, smart watches, those types of things. They're allowed.

[19:14] » Are we permitted provided by law enforcement to say, "Hey, you're not

[19:19] going to bring your laptops in today." I mean, it it got to be it. It sounds

[19:23] strange. It it really sounds strange to me that somebody would make a law saying

[19:28] everybody that comes in the courtroom can bring a laptop or your cell phone

[19:34] into the courtroom. Now, our responsibility is to put them in a bag.

[19:38] I got you there. But the part that is real strange to me is that any lawmaker

[19:43] or any body that we elect that will agree to something like that is very

[19:49] strange. >> Yes, sir.

[19:50] » It's very strange. I >> I agree with you, Mr. Williams.

[19:56] Uh, I assume that probably this would also apply to the district court, but I

[20:00] mean because you don't know where they're going to go once they get

[20:01] through the courthouse as a whole. That's correct. JDR, general district

[20:04] and circuit court >> and yes, commonwealth attorney's office.

[20:09] Anybody that comes in, if you're just going up to the circuit court or you

[20:12] need to go to the clerk's office, >> you're implementing the bags now.

[20:17] » We have the bags now and we Yes. and and per the code, the same code, it was up

[20:21] to the sheriff's office to provide training and and all the other stuff for

[20:25] that. But yes, we plan on implementing it uh with the uh judge's order by

[20:29] September 1. We may try to start a little early to work some bugs out or

[20:32] some I don't know, probably just started a week or two early if we can.

[20:36] » Were any funds provided to you to help with purchase of the bags?

[20:39] » No, sir.

[20:44] » Yeah, I have a question too. Um lock up. I know you know you can lock your phone

[20:48] up. Is there any situation where you could have more lock up and encourage

[20:52] them if you're not going to use it in the court to lock them up? that kind of

[20:56] alleviates the bag because I went in there the other day and you know rushing

[21:00] in I just went up to the for for some records a deed

[21:04] » and I had my phone and what they do as you know I'm I'm just telling people

[21:08] that don't don't know uh they give you a key you lock it up right there and then

[21:13] when you go in you take care of your business you come back out and if you

[21:17] want your phone you better put the key back and and give it back to them that

[21:20] that's a process but what I'm just saying is there any way of helping

[21:24] alleviate so and begging people, you know, putting putting bags in and having

[21:29] more lockup and encourage them, the guy that checks you in. Hey, uh, if you're

[21:33] not using in the court, I appreciate if you lock it up. I mean, it's just a

[21:37] thought, you know, and I I know it's just a thought that ran through my mind.

[21:40] » That was actually one of the options that they had talked about about having

[21:43] that lock just having a lock box, but then the person's in the courtroom

[21:48] and they need to come out and they need to get their phone for something in the

[21:50] courthouse. It's it would be another step. I think the Faraday bags are

[21:54] probably the the the if you just streamline the remedy to the problem, it

[21:59] would be the bags. It would be the bags. I don't even know where we'd put a

[22:02] locker some of those lockers like that to I mean it is it's a little bit tight

[22:06] there in the in the forer coming into the courthouse but

[22:10] and then it's something else we need to be responsible for as well. But but

[22:14] yeah, I mean it would make sense to that to do that as well.

[22:21] Well, September one deadline, not much time there.

[22:26] » No, sir. No, sir. >> So, what is the flavor of the board? Do

[22:31] you want to noodle on it some more or do you want to empower the sheriff to fill

[22:38] one spot?

[22:44] » A motion would be in order. Then

[22:49] » I was just going to you you may want to ask Miss Ricardi about the financial

[22:53] side of that. Like just a thought. Sorry.

[22:56] » In fact, it's interesting you were going to say that based on my estimates the

[22:59] estimated cost for a full year for a deputy is about $78,000 give or take and

[23:05] that doesn't include uniform, weapon, camera or search training. So um that

[23:11] would probably be another $5,000. So, every year, let's estimate that cost to

[23:15] be about $83,000. Sound about right? I didn't include a vehicle because I don't

[23:19] think that position would need a vehicle. Am I correct?

[23:23] » If it's a full-time position, we we try to get our people to do stuff.

[23:30] So, [laughter] they would I mean, not necessarily. Not necessarily.

[23:34] » Yeah. Because we they'll do transports for the

[23:37] » So, I did not even include the price of a vehicle in that. So, would this be

[23:39] something that we would have to um since it's it's an increase in our budget,

[23:44] would we have to have a >> you need an appropriation

[23:46] » to build >> that? That's why I was asking the

[23:49] question. I think I I don't know. I don't know because I don't know where

[23:52] the money's would, Mr. Cardi. Where would the monies come from?

[23:56] » Right. At some point, if again, he might be able to start this because at the

[24:01] first of the year, he's got, you know, everybody's fat with money, but you're

[24:04] going to have to pay for it throughout the year. So, you will run out of money.

[24:06] At some point we would have to appropriate approximately this $80,000

[24:11] um which would be an appropriation fund excuse me from fund balance as as we

[24:17] usual. Yeah, that would be correct. We'd have to appropriate from fund balance to

[24:21] fund this additional position. >> But I don't think it triggers the 1% for

[24:25] a public hearing. Okay. I didn't think so. Yes.

[24:27] » Um the bags, it's interesting you would say that. I gave him about the same

[24:31] advice on that. He's got operating supply money. We all do. for example,

[24:34] the um the facilities and grounds. We've got operating monies. When you have

[24:40] something that pops up, that's what it's it's really not there for. It's there

[24:43] for just their everyday bullets, weapons, ammo, whatever. It's not made

[24:47] for this one time. Was it $10,000 about that for the vict for those bags?

[24:53] » I think it was eight. >> Okay.

[24:55] » So, while it wasn't >> over 8,000 a little over 8,000. So,

[24:57] while their um operating budget wasn't made for that little $8,000 $8,000, they

[25:03] might be able to absorb it because they've got a, you know, a little bit of

[25:06] money for backpacks, um, belts, whatever it is

[25:12] that they got through the year. So, if not, they'll come back and ask for more.

[25:15] I gave them that direction. I said, "Let's get them now and figure out the

[25:18] rest of the budget as year goes on." So, that's a great question. We had did

[25:22] discuss that. You know the only comment that I got

[25:27] it seemed like you know now years ago I said do more with less

[25:32] since that time everybody been doing asking for more. I don't know no

[25:38] organization that revamp or how they do things or anything else. So we

[25:42] [clears throat] keep adding on. We get a mandate and what happens or whatever to

[25:45] come from the state and still we do anything that and and Mickey you said

[25:50] how you was reworking it and all this but everybody comes after this county

[25:54] for taxes no help and I'm just wondering about how our we can't keep asking the

[26:03] taxpayers the elderly and all of them to come you pay more. this is mandated and

[26:08] we're not doing any type of reconstruction at what we got and you

[26:12] know and I'm not going after you know what you're saying

[26:15] » I'm saying every organization they got you know from janitorial service or

[26:20] everything else if we don't start looking at something a little different

[26:24] and we just keep adding salaries which cost money and it runs the budget up and

[26:31] we can pay it we're going to be like everybody else we're going to be like

[26:33] New Jersey you know you paying your house taxes,

[26:37] you going to go crazy. So, uh I understand the mandate and say September

[26:42] the one and there's nothing we can do about it. You got the men, we got to buy

[26:46] the bags, right? >> Yes, sir.

[26:48] » Okay. I I don't see >> we're not talking about needing a car

[26:53] and stuff and everything. We're just talking about a person salary.

[26:56] » We'll be fine with vehicles for now. That's

[26:58] » Thank you.

[27:07] So to clarify, at this time, would we be requesting an appropriation to fund this

[27:13] position? That's what would make it the cleanest. Then I wouldn't have to come

[27:16] back for a secondary appropriation if you chose to.

[27:20] » Well, I think you know, as you know, our job is health,

[27:24] safety, and public welfare. And uh >> when you when you do that, you think

[27:28] about uh you get another person on board, then you you you have to have it

[27:34] alleviates pressure in the whole department. As as I'm saying, you know,

[27:37] you got another man here now. You know, you don't have to be searching for

[27:41] part-time all the time, but then you can use the part-time. You may need a man

[27:44] somewhere else. So, you just think about how the structure of the sheriff's

[27:48] department runs. And and they're they're kind of short. And any weekend with

[27:52] these campgrounds down here, it's busy. And and this this is our job. That's

[27:57] you. Think about it. We you know and and and anything can happen at any time.

[28:01] Just think about that. Anything can happen at any time. And I want the

[28:05] county to be safe enough to to handle their business. Put it that way.

[28:10] » You can make you can make the motion. [laughter]

[28:13] » I said my piece. I'm going let you >> before you do.

[28:17] I believe because this is already three quarters through the or one quarter

[28:21] through the year, we can probably take my the recommended $80,000 and drop that

[28:26] down to 53,000 to because you're not going to pay for it for the full year

[28:30] knowing that it'll go up next year. So, if you only wanted to fully fund or

[28:34] partially fund it this year, that's another option at 54,000.

[28:37] » Okay. Uh Mr. Chairman, I move that we approve of this uh one more position for

[28:44] the sheriff's office to cover these uh incidentals at the uh they have been uh

[28:50] in the past, the sheriff's office has worked with us to uh uh when they were

[28:55] getting the body cams to to get a clerk uh that was already doing other duties

[29:00] to be able to do it. They've they've done everything they can, I think, to

[29:03] cut it to keep the personnel cost down. And I I think in this case it's it's

[29:07] reasonable. So I I move that we uh that we do this

[29:12] » second. >> Any further discussion? Roll call on the

[29:17] motion. >> Mr. Kittinden.

[29:21] » Yes. >> Mr. Jesse?

[29:22] » Yes. >> Mr. Williams?

[29:24] » Yes. >> Mr. Bill Harris?

[29:26] » Yes. >> Mr. Don Harris?

[29:29] » Yes. >> Motion's approved.

[29:31] » Thanks, sir. >> Is there anything else you all would

[29:34] like to know about? >> No. Thank you. told us quite enough.

[29:37] » All right.

[29:45] » Commonwealth Attorney Mike Herd.

[29:56] Good afternoon. So, I think there have been some

[29:58] misunderstandings because I'm in a complicated profession. It appeared that

[30:03] some of the board members were thinking the general assembly was saying that an

[30:06] assistant countless attorney is needed just to look at body warn camera

[30:10] footage. And that's not it. That's not correct. Um, extra work is required more

[30:15] than just looking at footage. It's also the discovery requirements, ethical

[30:19] requirements, and the work the body warn camera footage is on the prosecutor

[30:23] handling the case. and it's recognized that causes extra work in the cow

[30:28] attorney, it's the countless attorney then has to decide how that extra work

[30:32] is to be handled by the countless attorney's office, not a board of

[30:36] supervisors. So when a locality implements the bodywn

[30:40] cameras, the decision on how to staff commonwealth attorney's office is on the

[30:46] comm um to decide how best to operate that

[30:50] office and the needs of individual offices are different.

[30:55] um space available, local workforce, types of cases, work required, whether

[31:00] misdemeanors are prosecuted and determining the impact of the body warn

[31:05] cameras. We have to look at more than just the extra work on the body warn

[31:08] cameras because of that. But what is the office doing before that? What is our

[31:12] workload before that? And I look at the needs of common

[31:16] attorney's office in order to best serve the public and best do the job required.

[31:22] And this board has asked about parallegal. And I think I may have not

[31:27] given you good examples such as a parallegal looks at something and says,

[31:32] "Oh, guy confessed not recognizing the guy was handcuffed

[31:39] and he's being searched after he's been arrest. He's been handcuffed. He's asked

[31:45] about certain questions and things and it's inadmissible. I just watched body

[31:50] worn camera camera footage. I believe it was last within the past two weeks and

[31:56] there was a teeny tiny little report, not actually called a report. It's in

[31:59] the call for service report and it lists a teeny bit of information and

[32:06] completely misses the defense of what the defendant and

[32:11] his witness are saying. Completely missed it.

[32:15] completely missed the whole legal argument that would be presented at

[32:18] court if we go to court because this is a case of the the deputies just said,

[32:22] "Oh, you can go to magister if you want to." So then I'm called by the victim.

[32:27] He wants to know should he do that or not. That means I had to look at the

[32:30] footage and what I saw and what was on the report was vastly different. We

[32:34] can't trust a parillegal with stuff like that. Even the deputy did catch on to a

[32:39] lot of that. And then you've got and the ethical requirements I've talked about

[32:43] before. And when it comes to whether or not to have a part-time person, I put

[32:48] together for you 12 points which I hope you read 12 points is to in detail where

[32:55] I analyze that as to how it could work best or not work for Middle Sex County

[32:59] and I I can summarize it again if needed if someone wants to go through that. But

[33:04] let's look at our current workload. Three years ago, I warned that the

[33:09] situation was untenable and that we desperately needed help. And the office

[33:14] met state state staffing guidelines for another CA, but I was concerned they

[33:18] weren't going to put it in the budget. I asked you for help. You budgeted it, but

[33:21] then you didn't have to spend it because the state came up with the money. So, I

[33:26] advertised for the position at the mandatory minimum. Became obvious we

[33:31] couldn't we couldn't hire anybody for that. and you came forward and

[33:34] recognized the need and came up with a supplement so we could have somebody.

[33:39] And so now here we are about three years later

[33:44] and I had thought honestly with an extra person it could be handled managed you

[33:48] know pretty well but and for a while it was but now we're at a different

[33:52] standpoint than what we were before. Now we're at there's even more discovery

[33:57] rules have been even expanded to general district court now more procedures that

[34:03] are hand that we have to do more CA types of cases sealing statutes etc

[34:09] other stuff is coming on oh you hired someone for to handle ceiling ceiling

[34:14] statutes in circuit court but we don't have anything like that we still just

[34:18] expected just to do it and so with all this extra stuff we have

[34:24] to do now body one camera footage is added and let me tell you about July

[34:29] just for me I had the first two days off for vacation I worked the holiday of

[34:35] July 3rd I was off on July 4th and then I worked 21 days straight

[34:41] because of what we have to do now just body worn cameras but everything else 21

[34:46] days straight

[34:49] nights weekends [clears throat]

[34:53] comes to uh 250 hours a day, 250 hours in July.

[35:00] Now, the business hours were 184, which where I mean I worked 66 hours over for

[35:07] the month, which if you want to do the math, that's uh an extra week and a

[35:12] half. I can't continue to do that. Can't.

[35:18] Thank you.

[35:21] Thanks,

[35:26] Maybe I ought to have skipped the part about what we learned at training

[35:28] recently. Um,

[35:31] I say some of the things I had to cut out

[35:35] included a training session because you can't do everything. And the two-day

[35:38] training I I I skipped out on because I had to meet with a 11year-old girl who

[35:44] attempted suicide because she was so scared of testifying

[35:48] in front of a jury. >> [clears throat]

[35:53] » But we got through that. So, one of the things we learned was um

[36:00] people can't do the job that we do for a lot of different reasons.

[36:05] So, um another thing I learned at the conference

[36:10] was more aware of the inability of offices to find new prosecutors.

[36:16] So, one assistant counels attorney told me he resides in a county that doesn't

[36:20] pay supplements. He drives an hour to get to where he goes for higher pay. I

[36:25] know another assistant councel's attorney in that same locality that

[36:28] doesn't pay supplements. He travels to a nearby city. So, at the VA meeting,

[36:33] Virginia Association Council Attorneys meeting, um I heard something that was

[36:38] surprising to me [clears throat] because for years, VAKA has advocated

[36:42] for more prosecutors positions because we don't have enough. The office is

[36:46] overworked. It's a change now. What they discussed

[36:50] at the meeting was changing strategy because no one's filling these open

[36:54] spots. So the strategy to try to convince the

[36:58] general assembly in the ne next session is for higher pay because there's no use

[37:03] in trying to get you know the more spots when we just can't fill them.

[37:09] Um and plus many lawyers don't want to go through what we go through as a

[37:14] preferred career choice. Um, a panel discussion on Saturday's conference

[37:20] included about the trauma we're exposed to, vicarious trauma, advers constant

[37:25] adversarial experiences, the chronic stress of the job,

[37:29] um, deeply disturbing things we handle, how it disrupts cognition, impairs

[37:34] memory, concentration, causes irritability, which Miss Lewis

[37:37] experienced from me recently, and other problems. and but we can only take so

[37:41] much but we are it was stressed that we help people in a way that no one else

[37:45] can help. So there's a change of strategy that the

[37:50] prosecutors realize we have to go through.

[37:54] So the current minimum salary for a full-time person is 80,725.

[38:01] It's gone up as I told you before. It needs to be higher to attract someone.

[38:06] Now, I previously suggested about 85,000 back when the salary was 77,000, but now

[38:12] that needs to go up. Um, I think it should go around 87 to 90. But I would

[38:18] say this, if you only budget the minimum,

[38:23] if you only, and I'm ending here, but if you only budget the minimum,

[38:28] that is basically equal to not funding the position in the way it can be

[38:32] filled. I mean to be honest we we got to realize that that fact counties can't

[38:37] not f fill the job with only the um so

[38:45] that's not meeting the need the needs to be done right it's a priority of public

[38:49] safety otherwise I can't continue to do the same thing as with head with the

[38:53] extra work and not hiring the extra person we have to cease more trainings

[38:57] than what little I do now do less contacting of victim victims witnesses

[39:02] less le contact with law enforcement. I mean, officers have had me say

[39:06] sometimes, "I can't talk to you right now." That happens. Less interaction

[39:10] with the public, elimination of type of cases we do. I mean, you've heard from

[39:14] the sheriff's office of how more and more cases happen, but no one seems to

[39:20] think about the prosecutor that's got to do the work.

[39:24] And now we have to look at the bodywn camera footage, the hours of that. And

[39:28] frankly, I'll admit I'm doing other things as I'm doing it. If there's if

[39:32] the officer is going to go and get his business card, you know, I'm not

[39:36] watching that time. I'm I'm also doing other stuff on the computer and looking

[39:40] at emails, etc. that I have to do. So,

[39:46] I've strived to not have happen in Middle Sex what happens to a lot of

[39:50] places where mistakes are made, there's a less inadequate job because of

[39:54] underfunding and the inability to get the help.

[39:58] So, I'm asking you to share with me type of effort I'm trying to do for the

[40:03] people of Middle Sex. Thank you.

[40:08] » Oh, questions. >> Sorry. Like I said, I've just been

[40:13] swallowed lately. >> Mr. Chairman, can I ask one

[40:16] clarification point, please? I'm sorry, Mr. Kittin.

[40:19] » Yes. >> Okay. Mr. Herd, what was the I've been

[40:22] trying to find the starting salary. I know the comp board was updating their

[40:25] numbers. Do you have the newest number? >> 80,725.

[40:30] » 8725. Okay. And that's okay. Thank you. Sorry

[40:34] for that. I just I I missed the number. Thank you.

[40:37] » 80,705, right? >> 25.

[40:43] » All right. Um, Mr. Chairman, I I feel that the board's been very fair to our

[40:47] Commonwealth attorney. A year or so ago, Mr. Herd asked for more help handling

[40:51] the increased case load. I supported it. this board supported it and took a

[40:56] chance on whether the state funding that was before we knew it was going to be

[40:59] funded, but we went out on a limb and said, "Okay, we're gonna we we realize

[41:03] you need that and whether the state funding would be there or not, we were

[41:07] going to pay for it." And as it is right now, we're still paying for part of

[41:10] that. Um, we wanted you to get a good assistant,

[41:15] which you did. Now, we're asked to to provide a full

[41:20] funding for another assistant Commonwealth attorney. Now, let me

[41:24] correct that. Mr. Herd has demanded that we fund one.

[41:29] We asked them to explore different options, a parallegal, part-time

[41:33] attorney, whatever. Other area counties have worked uh with

[41:39] their boards to find such solutions. Some have worked. Some lowerc cost

[41:44] alternatives seem to be working. Some have found that they didn't work and

[41:48] they went back to their board. But at least they tried.

[41:52] Not Mr. heard. Now he's taken us to court if we don't comply.

[41:58] He even suggested that our board could be charged criminally with uh

[42:04] malfeasants in office trying to be responsible with our constituents tax

[42:08] money. And according to our county attorney, he has law the law on his

[42:14] side. So be it. Accordingly, I will vote to

[42:20] approve this mandated position. 80,725

[42:26] plus benefits and not one cent more.

[42:34] » Is that a motion, Mr. Kittin? >> No.

[42:37] » Okay.

[42:41] » That's why I was asking for clarification. Sorry.

[42:48] Mr. Herd, the board has demonstrated time and time again that it supports law

[42:53] enforcement and the administr administration of justice. We approved

[42:58] body cameras. Uh we believe in transparency and accountability.

[43:05] We previously funded a second Commonwealth attorney and when you came

[43:10] back seeking additional resources, we didn't dismiss your concerns. We asked

[43:15] you to work with us. We asked whether a parallegal, a par part-time attorney or

[43:21] another solution could accomplish the same objective while respecting the

[43:26] taxpayers who fund this government. Instead of collaboration, we were met

[43:32] with ultimatums. Instead of discussion, we were lectured.

[43:37] instead of compromise, you made it clear that you um that your way was the only

[43:45] acceptable way. And now you've chosen to sh sue the citizens of Middle Sex County

[43:53] through their elected board that you were asked to work with. No one on this

[43:58] board questions the importance of your office.

[44:02] This board does not cheap out on justice. That is why we

[44:08] supplemented your office by $49,000 approximately with the local taxpayers

[44:15] monies. What question is is the refusal to engage in good faith problem solving.

[44:23] Every department head in this county is expected to work collaboratively,

[44:28] consider alternatives, and recognize that every dollar we spend

[44:32] belongs to the taxpayers. We expected the same from our Commonwealth attorney,

[44:38] and it is disappointing that we were not given um did not receive that.

[44:46] Leadership is not measured by how quickly you file a lawsuit. It is

[44:52] measured by your willingness to solve problems before you do. The board was

[44:57] willing to negotiate. You were not.

[45:05] » Anything else? Oh, yeah. You'll have to take a vote.

[45:10] » Not quite yet. >> We won't be voting on anything today. Um

[45:14] uh you know um I would think if history repeats itself in this day day and time

[45:21] if we in the working working sector we don't see

[45:26] with the tools and stuff we have to solve problems it don't get longer. Now

[45:33] Mr. Herb I just going to give one example. You stood right there maybe

[45:36] about three or four months ago and you was on a case and you were saying that I

[45:41] don't know what I would do without cameras. This one

[45:45] particular one had video and you said immediately when I got the video we

[45:50] solved the case right away and that was your your words. Now I understand what

[45:56] the state is saying. It's saying that we uh are as taxpayers of Mils County, as

[46:02] the elderly once again or whatever it is, we don't have a choice. Now, they're

[46:06] making it our fault on the communication factor because I would think that your

[46:12] attorney and your sheriff office should be working together 100%.

[46:18] Now, from my understanding, they write up a case. You know, they take time

[46:22] writing up. Somebody in somebody got to be doing less work for you to be doing

[46:27] more. And that's what I'm saying. Uh because you got better tools. Body

[46:32] cameras better tools. I mean, it it shows more. And I'm not trying I'm

[46:36] saying a picture of video on your camera. Somebody

[46:40] got to be doing less work. every basically everywhere in the sector in

[46:46] the private sector and they spend money. They don't spend money to hire more

[46:50] people. They spend money on equipment to do less. Now we giving body cams and we

[46:57] saying study the body cams and all of a sudden we saying we need more over here,

[47:01] more over there. I can tell you what I think. You know, we don't we don't have

[47:04] a choice. We don't have a choice to tell people like me that are elderly that

[47:07] have been in Middle Sex County all our life or that somebody want to take us to

[47:12] court just because we making things better and we think that it costing us

[47:18] more work when if you in any profession I got to talk to people that's on the

[47:22] job is real. All right. If all I done was open a door every day

[47:28] I would be a whole lot better at open that door up putting that door up. So I

[47:32] don't know if I'm saying it right now. Now you took a lawyer, a lawyer, you've

[47:35] been in service for a long time. He got a case. So what we saying is going to

[47:39] take you forever to be good at what you got because of the little small points.

[47:45] So now I need help so I can lay back and monitor the situation. And if all of us

[47:50] are honest with ourselves, we got to stop keep asking for more and think

[47:54] about the process of the system, how it works before it get to you. Because

[47:59] we've been hearing this, you know, off and on. Now you was a lawyer. I'm just a

[48:04] common Joe. Most of us are. So you come to us in lawyer terms. Well, I'm gonna

[48:08] come to you in simple terms. If you based on your history, based on history,

[48:12] man, you're not going to be perfect. So all we asking is that a chance

[48:21] to make the system work. And I think you can do that. I I really

[48:28] think I really think that if we take the process and make it work, it'll be

[48:32] better for everybody instead of just putting money on the top money on top

[48:38] money. I think somebody say we give them higher wages, you know, bad is good and

[48:42] bad is bad. If you hire somebody, you can pay them all they want sooner or

[48:45] later they're not going to be worth nothing. So the idea if you growing in

[48:49] in the process and I feel you grow in the system, I think it's but a system

[48:53] between you all and the sheriff, you all in the sheriff office. We can talk here

[48:58] uh to night and day. And I'm not going to get on the law enforcement side. I

[49:01] just going to stay on the common sense side. It's a process. It's a system from

[49:06] the person in the house that got the body cams that goes there and look at

[49:10] that video and writes it up, then hand it over to you. And the only thing I'm

[49:15] telling you is that some deputies that I have talked to say they write it up and

[49:19] they look over it. Then you decide, you know, uh, the pros and cons of whatever

[49:24] it is, and you decide what case you want to do and what you don't want to do. So,

[49:29] uh, hey, man, if we ain't got a choice to give you what you what you ask for,

[49:33] we just got to give you what you ask for and let the ship sail. But all I'm

[49:37] saying is that >> Hey, man.

[49:39] » You mean sink? >> No, wait a minute. I'm just saying that

[49:42] everybody should be working together as a system. That's what I'm saying. I I'm

[49:47] not telling you how you do your job. I'm saying from the child that got beat in

[49:51] the house, uh the deputy that went there and you end up in the in in the

[49:56] prosecuting office, you all got to work together and we can get all we want and

[50:00] we can't buy that. We got to have it right here. Okay? So, if you ask me just

[50:05] like just like Randy, I call him Randy. I mean, you know, Randy, he saying,

[50:09] "Man, this is what you want?" I don't have problem because you don't have no

[50:12] choice but you tied my hands. Nobody ties my hand. Tell me how to vote. But

[50:17] but you know >> the law is the law, Mr. Williams.

[50:20] » Look. Oh Lord, man, don't you tell me nothing but the law, right? We gonna

[50:24] leave that one alone. You don't know who you looking at.

[50:26] » All right. Don't you sit there in this courtroom and tell me about the law. We

[50:29] going to leave that alone. I don't even want to talk about it. So we can go on

[50:32] to the next one. I don't want to talk about it.

[50:34] » Um Mike, I would just like to say something before we we got we got we

[50:38] need to make a decision though regardless. I see you you up here

[50:41] getting upset and uh we all got to work together and what's best for Middle Sex

[50:46] County. That's number one. You got to think about what's best for Middle Sex

[50:48] County. This whole scenario shouldn't have happened, how it happened. I'm

[50:52] going to let you know that. And and uh the law is the law. We know, we

[50:58] understand that. But I don't want to delay, you know, the opportunity of us

[51:03] using the body cams and all that stuff cuz it been going on too long anyway.

[51:06] And by getting mad don't help anybody. We we Hey. Hey, let it go. Let's get

[51:13] this thing going on. And uh I well I I would we need to make a motion.

[51:22] » I think a motion would be pertinent after the uh potentially after the close

[51:30] session. >> Okay. Right. Right. I agree with you,

[51:33] but we need to make a motion and and get this out the way. Uh I don't see

[51:37] believing it because the law is the law. Think about it. And uh we can we can

[51:41] drag it on all we want to. >> But the law is the law.

[51:47] Thank you, Mr. Herd.

[51:57] Agency and staff reports. Item number four, VDOT. Lee Mcnite.

[52:02] Um he's not in here. Uh pay. It's a report only of the progress on the road

[52:10] scenario. School matters not presented.

[52:16] EDA marketing report only. Social services report only.

[52:21] Library carry do

[52:45] Yeah, it's right here.

[52:49] » Okay. All right. So, good afternoon. Um, hopefully I can

[52:55] give you something a little bit more light-hearted. Um, first of all, I did

[53:01] want to pass out. So, thi this is um just part of our harvest just from

[53:07] today. Um, at the Urbana Library, we have these straw bale gardens and we

[53:14] have a bumper crop of tomatoes. So, please I'll pass them around. Please

[53:19] help yourselves. We have some extra um plastic bags. So,

[53:32] So, I think we're going to have to report that on our conflict sheet.

[53:35] Carrie, what what do you think the [laughter] value is on those tomatoes

[53:37] there? >> Thank you.

[53:40] » But yes, we have we have plenty more. We'll have more tomorrow, more the day

[53:45] after that, everything. So, but I did want to say that those um that garden

[53:50] has been a real draw for the kids. Um, we have a few different varieties of

[53:56] tomatoes. We have, um, a few different varieties of peppers, bell peppers and

[54:03] jalapenos. We have at least three watermelons growing there and at least

[54:09] three pumpkins, like big carvingsiz pumpkins. So, anyway, it's going to be

[54:13] interesting um, come this fall. So, really today, I just wanted to give you

[54:19] kind of a a snapshot of what the library is. I'm not asking for money. Um I'm not

[54:25] complaining. I just wanted to give you um a taste of what we do every day. Um

[54:33] since I don't see too many of you come by the libraries too often.

[54:38] But anyway, so as you already know, um we are

[54:46] comprised of two branches. One in Deltavville, one in Urbana. Uh the one

[54:50] in Deltavville is actually a uh far was a pharmacy and it was repurposed back in

[54:57] the 90s early 90s as a library. Um the one in Urbana was actually built in the

[55:03] early 90s as a library and we're still going strong.

[55:08] Um, [clears throat]

[55:11] in 2024, we acquired the mobile library and thanks in part for you guys. Um,

[55:20] especially with the the COVID money that we received. Um, so right now the mobile

[55:26] library is very busy. Um, we go to the Urbana and the Deltavville farmers

[55:31] markets every month. Um, twice a month we go to Porttown Village right outside

[55:37] of Urbana. Twice a month we go to Dockside in Locust Hill and then twice a

[55:44] month we go to the Riverside Rehab here in Saluda. Um, during the summer reading

[55:50] programs, we went to the YMCA every week and we went to the Horizon's Daycare

[55:55] every week. So, as you can see, we have been very busy with with our van. Um we

[56:03] you'll also see it like at the Christmas parade in Urbana. You'll see it um let's

[56:09] see at the Junth celebration. So we do a lot of different events with

[56:14] it and the the reception's been really really good. Um especially

[56:21] even you know visitors coming like from the campgrounds you know it's a really

[56:27] good place to see oh they do have a great library so they come and visit us

[56:32] through this mobile library. So I know you like some uh numbers so I

[56:40] just wanted to give you some numbers. So between the two branches and the mobile

[56:45] library we have almost 53,000 physical items. So that's books, print books,

[56:51] audio books, DVDs, and then also we have STEM kits for kids and nature backpacks

[56:58] for kids. Um, in fiscal year 25, we had over 15,000 visits. Fiscal year 26, it's

[57:07] looking like maybe a little bit more than that. So our numbers continue to

[57:11] grow, especially after COVID, just continue to increase our numbers. We had

[57:18] over 7,000 Wi-Fi sessions this past year. And um really that comes from

[57:25] people bringing in their own laptops, bringing in their own phones to connect

[57:29] to our Wi-Fi. Um a lot of Boers in Deltavville do that. They'll come to the

[57:35] library and actually work from the library, work remotely from the library,

[57:40] and that seems to be a very popular thing. Uh, and we just finished our

[57:44] summer reading program on July 23rd. And again, our numbers continue to go up

[57:51] year after year in participation. I mean, 92 reading contest participants.

[57:56] That's the most we've ever had. So, here are some pictures of just

[58:02] programs and people. Um, you can see there's

[58:06] Frank Long down there doing a presentation. Um to the right of him is

[58:13] uh to the right of him is our flower garden at the Urbana Library. Um down

[58:20] below that we have um a our birding presentation that we have annually every

[58:27] February. That's a big crowd draw. Um and then we have a picture from our one

[58:34] of our uh story times from this summer. That's um our children's librarian,

[58:40] Kristen Robertson. And right beside her, her head cut off, but that was our

[58:46] summer intern, um Izzy Kyland, and she did a great job. So,

[58:54] and another couple things you might not know about us. So, we have two special

[58:59] book collections in Urbana. We have Virginia reference collection. that is a

[59:04] reference collection so you can't check them out. But that's prim uh consists of

[59:10] primarily Virginia his history with a emphasis on Middle Sex County and our

[59:15] surrounding counties. Um we have family histories, colonial records, cemetery

[59:20] records, um military records like from the Civil War and then also books about

[59:28] other historical uh topics like colonial architecture, that sort of thing. Down

[59:34] in chess in Deltavville, we have the Chesapeake Bay collection and that can

[59:39] be checked out and that has everything bay related. So, science books, history

[59:45] books about the bay, cookbooks. We have books about sail and power boats, novels

[59:53] centered around Chesapeake Bay, biographies about people around the bay.

[59:58] That one can be checked out and that is very um very popular with our boers

[1:00:04] again down in Deltavville.

[1:00:08] And I would be remiss without talking about our website. So our website is

[1:00:14] when people go to it, I think they're kind of surprised at how much we

[1:00:17] actually have. So our website is your middle sex library.org

[1:00:22] and um we have 19 digital resources available on it. So that means access to

[1:00:32] Libby for ebooks, all free. Access to Canopy, which is free streaming movies,

[1:00:43] um documentaries, TV series like the BBC, TV series, those sort of things. We

[1:00:49] have um digital magazines. We have digital newspapers from around the world

[1:00:56] and the US, you know, so papers like the Richmond Times Dispatch. You can look at

[1:01:02] it, look at a digital copy of it online, so it looks just like what the printed

[1:01:09] one. Um, but we have like a a good oldfashioned database like with

[1:01:16] newspaper articles and journal articles. We have resources for um for job

[1:01:25] seekers. We have resources for vets and um

[1:01:31] even homework help for kids, students. So, we have a wide variety of digital

[1:01:38] resources. I really uh encourage you to go and see those.

[1:01:43] [snorts] And if you have any questions at all

[1:01:46] trying to get through our website, just please contact me. I'm more than happy

[1:01:51] to sit down with you and help you through through all of these things.

[1:01:56] And this you've probably seen before, but this is our current um strategic

[1:02:00] plan. So, right now, we are working on getting physical space for teens,

[1:02:07] especially down in the Deltavville branch right now. Uh we did recently

[1:02:12] receive a grant from the River County's Community Foundation and that will help

[1:02:18] help us to purchase um furniture for teens. When we when I met with some

[1:02:25] teens from our high school um just as a focus group to get what they really

[1:02:31] wanted, I they didn't really talk about electronics or anything. What they

[1:02:36] talked about is having a calming, comfortable space for them so that they

[1:02:43] can collaborate together on group projects and even just something as

[1:02:49] simple as a dry erase board so that they can do their math problems on it, you

[1:02:55] know. So simple things like that and said, I think we can handle that. So

[1:03:00] that's what we're working on right now. Also looking towards the future. Um,

[1:03:05] we're also looking at our meeting areas. So, down in Deltaville, we have a nice

[1:03:11] meeting room that has doors. You can shut it off from the rest of the

[1:03:15] library. But in Urbana, we don't have that luxury. And so, looking forward

[1:03:21] looking at how can we add space to have that meeting space up there. So, that's

[1:03:31] really all it is. So, um, do you have any questions for me?

[1:03:39] » No. Okay. >> I I'd just like to commend the great job

[1:03:42] that you're doing for the county library.

[1:03:44] » Thank you. >> Appreciate it.

[1:03:46] » Appreciate it. All right. Well, thank you so much.

[1:03:53] » Middle Sex, BCE,

[1:03:57] McKenzie, Kirby. >> So, now we had tomatoes. Are you

[1:04:00] bringing zucchini or squash? I mean, Frank, you got you ice cream. Really

[1:04:04] not. >> I know, right? Or some sweet corn, you

[1:04:06] know.

[1:04:12] » So, thank you'all all for having me this afternoon. It has been a true blessing

[1:04:16] and honor to be here. So, I am the summer intern for the Middle Sex County

[1:04:21] Virginia Cooperative Extension. And a little bit to introduce myself, my name

[1:04:24] is Mackenzie Kirby. I am a recent graduate from Virginia Tech where I

[1:04:27] received my bachelor's degree in animal and poultry sciences with a minor in

[1:04:31] political science. I grew up on a farm in Hanover County, Virginia, and I've

[1:04:35] been working in veterary medicine for the last four years. Um, coming into

[1:04:39] this internship, I had a very good background in vegetables, grain, cattle,

[1:04:43] and hog production. But I lacked a lot of knowledge and aronomy, crop and

[1:04:47] soils, oyster production, youth education, as well as just business. So

[1:04:53] to start out my internship, one of the first big events or big two events I was

[1:04:57] able to be a part of was the Virginia Small Grain Spiel Day held at the

[1:05:01] Eastern Virginia A-R in Warsaw as well as the Mid-Atlantic Wheat Tour. And at

[1:05:06] both of these events, I was able to meet with indust industry stakeholders, local

[1:05:12] producers, as well as some that weren't exactly local to this area, as well as

[1:05:17] other interns interning with different organizations and even Secretary

[1:05:21] Frasier, which is the Virginia A and Forestry Secretary. Um, at the small

[1:05:26] greens field day, I was able to meet with the producers as well as

[1:05:29] stakeholders there. We were able to visit farms in Essex, Middle Sex, and

[1:05:33] King William counties. talking with the producers, learning about what they are

[1:05:38] doing, the problems they are facing, as well as how they make their decisions.

[1:05:41] This was also an opportunity to see some of the freeze damage firsthand of how

[1:05:46] that was affected throughout the different areas of the Middle Peninsula

[1:05:51] of this year's wheat crop, which did devastate some areas, unfortunately.

[1:05:56] Um, while doing this, we were able to again just kind of meet and discuss. It

[1:06:02] was a great learning opportunity for me and I'm very appreciative for that. Um,

[1:06:08] but to start out my actual event, I was able to host a couple programs here

[1:06:13] during the summer. My first one is called a JDAM workshop which is all

[1:06:17] about organic practices that come from South Korea. So that program was

[1:06:21] actually held at the Deltaville branch of the Middle Sex County Public

[1:06:25] Libraries and I was able to teach locals about the JDM practices, their

[1:06:29] technologies, their origins, as well as introducing producers throughout the

[1:06:34] state that use these technologies already. And I had the great opportunity

[1:06:39] to actually be able to do demos for everyone that was there and even send

[1:06:42] them home with little starter kits for their solutions.

[1:06:46] My second program was a youth shooting education workshop. Um, for this

[1:06:51] program, it was held at the Middle Sex Shooting Sports Club where youth got and

[1:06:56] their families actually were able to get hands-on safety instruction as well as

[1:07:00] live fire practice in the disciplines of archery, shotgun, and [clears throat]

[1:07:04] rifle. Um, we also have members of the Middle Sex Sheriff's Office there as

[1:07:08] well as the Virginia Department of Wildlife Resources who were able to

[1:07:12] share their experiences, their opportunities with both participants and

[1:07:16] their families. Um, we had education from outside sources as well. We had

[1:07:22] members of the King William Shooting Sports Club there, which is a 4 club for

[1:07:26] King Wham County as our primary instructors. And then the shooting club

[1:07:30] also had some of their NRA certified instructors being there as our secondary

[1:07:34] instructors for the event. And we had support from local organizations such as

[1:07:38] Eminem Building Supply, Tractor Supply, as well as Molden Hill Venue.

[1:07:43] Some other things that I was able to do over the summer was I had opportunities

[1:07:48] to assist in the research plots throughout the county for both corn and

[1:07:52] soybean trials doing variety testing. I was able to help install those plots.

[1:07:56] Unfortunately, I won't be around when they will be harvesting them, but I hope

[1:08:01] to see the data. We were also doing, it's called spore trap collection, which

[1:08:07] in a corn plot here in the county, right up 17, it's collecting fungal diseases

[1:08:11] and basically detecting where they are in the county and how bad they are

[1:08:15] currently. I also had the opportunity to visit oyster seed holdings, which there

[1:08:21] I got a tour of their facilities. I learned about the oyster industry

[1:08:25] because that is something I know absolutely nothing about. Um, learned

[1:08:28] the different sectors of their industry and just kind of how they work as a

[1:08:32] whole. Um, we were also able to visit Crazy Clover Farm which has a butcher

[1:08:37] shop where Mr. Wayne Burch took me around through their butcher shop which

[1:08:41] is currently closed until they reopen later in the month. I was got a tour of

[1:08:45] their facility, seeing their yearly updates, discuss with him some of the

[1:08:49] things that they do, what they're doing with the county, but also just see what

[1:08:54] legislation of the state and locally affects them and discuss that.

[1:09:00] So to the board of supervisors for Middle Sex County and Middle Sex County

[1:09:04] as a whole, thank you for this opportunity and welcoming me as your

[1:09:08] summer intern for VCE. It has been a great teaching experience. Gotten me out

[1:09:12] of my comfort zone in a few areas, but also allowed me to share some of my

[1:09:16] knowledge back with the community. So, thank you.

[1:09:19] » Thank you. Thank you. >> Any questions?

[1:09:21] » I have one question. >> Yes, sir.

[1:09:23] » What is in the organic pesticide? >> So,

[1:09:26] » I saw that. I wanted to know >> that one specifically. JDAM is all about

[1:09:30] kind of curating it to what you want to apply it on. So, your base is going to

[1:09:35] be some sort of starch, water, salt, but if you want to put it on tomato crops,

[1:09:42] it's suggested that you put old tomatoes back in there, whether that's the actual

[1:09:46] plant or the actual fruit and help it ferment. And then you're able to go in

[1:09:51] and spread it specifically on that crop because of the microbes in it are

[1:09:55] they're more likely to attack the fungal diseases that you're seeing or the pest

[1:10:00] that you're seeing on your crops right there.

[1:10:02] » Okay. So, I'm not supposed to use that seven desk. [laughter]

[1:10:08] » Thank you all. >> Thank you very much.

[1:10:13] » Item five, regular agenda items, Sheriff's Training Academy. Amarie,

[1:10:24] » thank you.

[1:10:30] » Um, this agenda item is a bet. excuse me, a budget supplement request

[1:10:35] for $15,200 from fund balance. Specifically, last

[1:10:39] year in the budget, there was no request increase. There was no request for an

[1:10:45] increase in this line item called Sheriff's Training Academy. Um, when we

[1:10:50] got the bill this year, it was for 31,200,

[1:10:56] [laughter] excuse me, and we'd only budgeted 16,000.

[1:11:00] the question. Oh, in case we've got any more questions. I see that the sheriff's

[1:11:04] office did stick around. Thank you. Um, the the price for this academy, they've

[1:11:09] already given me a little brief academy and what the academy is, but it's based

[1:11:13] on $800 per employee that needs certification, which would include all

[1:11:19] their part-time employees as well as their full-time employees. So, they've

[1:11:22] got, I think the number was 39 employees that need this certification. They get

[1:11:27] all their certification through this Hampton Roads Criminal Justice Training

[1:11:31] Academy. So 39* 800 is where we get to 31,200.

[1:11:37] The company itself, the Hampton Roads Training Academy, I actually had to do a

[1:11:41] little bit because one of you had asked me about it. It has been around since

[1:11:45] 1972. Um, and it was originally the Thomas

[1:11:48] Nelson Academy. I think some of you may remember that name. Um anyway, it's

[1:11:53] supported in part there are 30 member agencies including Middle Sex County

[1:12:00] from like the aisle of white sheriff's office um epimeac cape Charles all the

[1:12:06] police departments have to be members because this is how they get their

[1:12:09] certifications for their officers. Um the only other thing I was going to add

[1:12:13] was about their budget because I didn't know this either. The member revenue

[1:12:18] provides about $2.2 million. That's all those 30 members whereas the state only

[1:12:24] provides about 300,000. So this is all funded by these a by participating

[1:12:28] agencies and it's further mandatory training for certification. I can't

[1:12:32] explain to you why there was no budget request increased

[1:12:36] no budget increase requested excuse me but I can explain that we do need the

[1:12:42] money this year for the sheriff's office. So at this point I'm asking for

[1:12:46] a appropriation of 15,200 for academy expense.

[1:12:51] » So what [clears throat] is the real number?

[1:12:55] » The real number the real number is 31,200. That's the total cost.

[1:12:59] » Did we know that going into this? >> If somebody did, I didn't and they did

[1:13:04] not.

[1:13:08] » I mean it's a pretty big increase. >> Yes, sir. It is. Um, and you can see

[1:13:13] what I did. Again, I I'm putting this out there on page 51 that the price in

[1:13:19] the prior year was $650 per person. This year it's 800. Next year it's going up

[1:13:25] to $825 per person. When we were talking about adding the new officer, the new

[1:13:30] deputy, that person is going to be one of those $825. It's going to cost us

[1:13:34] $825 a year just to keep them certified. We're required to do that. So, um I'm

[1:13:40] guessing that part of it is now that we're using part a lot more part-time

[1:13:43] employees because of the increased activity over at the courthouse, all of

[1:13:48] them have to have this certification. >> That includes our dispatchers as well.

[1:13:52] » Oh, thank you. I didn't know that dispatchers, too.

[1:13:55] » Well, that was my next question, which was 31 people or thereabouts.

[1:14:02] Um, what happens if somebody's not

[1:14:07] certified?

[1:14:10] » What's the advantage of the certification?

[1:14:13] » It keeps us

[1:14:22] » Major Chris Easter. Is that what Major Chris Easter?

[1:14:25] » Do you understand the question? >> I do, sir.

[1:14:27] » If someone's not certified, is that that's the question? Correct.

[1:14:31] » Correct. Someone's not certified then that they're no longer allowed to be an

[1:14:35] officer. >> Really?

[1:14:36] » Correct. >> Huh. What's the certifi uh certification

[1:14:40] process time frame? >> It's uh so a lot of us go through for a

[1:14:45] year, right? So every year we get certified to go through the annual

[1:14:49] training requirements. >> Is it like 20 hours or something a year?

[1:14:53] » Okay. the the previous I mean just like

[1:14:57] sheriff Samson had said before the previous sheriff never had upped the

[1:15:01] budget to capture the previous years either. So she was stating that there

[1:15:07] were the previous years there were there were upticks in how much the cost was

[1:15:12] major this is this is um for reertification is that correct? Yes.

[1:15:17] » Okay. Uh initial certifications a different ball game. Yes.

[1:15:22] » Thank you. and the uh handler certification. Is

[1:15:26] that on site or online? >> It's uh so our our we we do have a um we

[1:15:32] do have a training facility that's over at the new building. So unfortunately

[1:15:35] that training facility right now is not certified by DCJS.

[1:15:38] » It's not certified. So we could have the course

[1:15:40] » meaning that in the future there is the ability to have the training that's here

[1:15:44] at our our new sheriff's office. >> So what are we doing about that?

[1:15:48] » Well, right now the uh the jail right now is the one that's uh helping us out.

[1:15:53] So we we send our stuff over to the jail. The jail approves it, goes through

[1:15:56] Hampton Roads Criminal Justice Training Academy. That way some one of their

[1:15:59] instructors has to come over to our building and they sit there through the

[1:16:02] training to ensure that we have the training that's in our building.

[1:16:05] » So So the training uh comes to our building.

[1:16:07] » Yes, sir. It does, but we have to go through the jail to do it because

[1:16:10] there's only one locally here in Middle Sex County. So right now we're looking

[1:16:14] for DCGS uh and then Mr. Coker to come down and uh make sure that our facility

[1:16:20] is good enough to where we can do the training there. Also,

[1:16:24] » some of it is online though, sir. And that that does require uh funds as well,

[1:16:28] but some some of it is online. >> So, what are we doing about, you know,

[1:16:30] so we can cut out some of these calls? >> Yes, sir.

[1:16:33] » Absolutely looking at that, sir. I we need that to happen. Um, Detective Riley

[1:16:38] right now is the one that's dealing with our training. Him and I discussed this

[1:16:41] and we we need to move forward with uh DCS and Hampton Rose coming up here to

[1:16:45] certify our building in order to do that.

[1:16:49] » So, we already got that in progress. >> Well, yes, sir. We've had those

[1:16:52] discussions. Yes, sir. We just haven't had it happen yet. No, sir. Because we

[1:16:56] do have one facility that's able to do that for us here through the jail.

[1:17:00] They're the one they're the only one certified mil sex. So, we have to send

[1:17:04] our our training over there over to them. Then they got to go to Hampton

[1:17:08] Road Criminal Justice Training Academy and then one of their people has to come

[1:17:11] over from the jail to sit in the class to make sure their classes get completed

[1:17:14] here. That's the one that's just the one just locally there. There are some that

[1:17:18] requires our officers to go down to Hampton Roads or to Richmond or to some

[1:17:23] other some other place they need to go to in order for them to stay current

[1:17:27] » without a moving pause. >> Yes, sir.

[1:17:31] » Yeah. Did that answer your question, sir?

[1:17:34] » Yes, sir. >> Thank you.

[1:17:37] » Yes, sir.

[1:17:41] » At this point, I'm simply What am I asking for? Good question. Um, I'm

[1:17:46] asking for an appropriation um to approve the uh

[1:17:51] budget supplement 2027-002, please.

[1:17:56] » I so move. [clears throat] >> Thank you, Mr. Jesse.

[1:17:59] » Second. >> Second by Mr. Krennan.

[1:18:04] » Any further discussion? Seeing none, roll call.

[1:18:09] » Mr. Jesse? >> Yes.

[1:18:11] » Yes. >> Mr. Williams?

[1:18:13] » Yes. >> Mr. Mr. Bill Harris.

[1:18:16] » Yes. >> Mr. Kittinen.

[1:18:18] » Yes. >> Mr. Don Harris.

[1:18:20] » Yes. Motion's approved. >> Thank you.

[1:18:24] » All righty. Um,

[1:18:29] citizens appointments. Amarie.

[1:18:33] » Sir. Today we're asking for just two. Um, the first one is going to be for a

[1:18:40] reappoint of Monica Sanders um to the wetlands board. remember she there was a

[1:18:45] gap in her submission of the forms. She continued to want to be a participant

[1:18:50] but there was a gap in her form submission. So she is now being

[1:18:54] reappoint is asking be reappointed and on the um planning commission we've got

[1:19:00] a Bev Butler again. That's a reappoint. >> You have a what?

[1:19:05] » Bev Butler reappoint. It's my voice. It's not you. There was my friend said

[1:19:10] it was a hay hay fever or something. What's that stuff called? allergies.

[1:19:15] » Okay. So, we have two that we need to approve.

[1:19:17] » Yes, please. >> And Mr. Chairman, I think and and Mr.

[1:19:20] Ricardi, I think um Mr. Longest had something to add

[1:19:24] » about the appointments if you >> evening, afternoon.

[1:19:29] » Uh the the appointment for Monica is a reappointment. So, that'll establish

[1:19:32] that we'll have four members. We do have one alternate that is helping with the

[1:19:36] board. So, we have our five. Uh so Mr. Jesse, what we're waiting on is uh one

[1:19:41] Jamaica representative uh for the wetlands board and also a BCA member.

[1:19:46] » I have somebody that that's going to go online and for the BCA. I'll get

[1:19:51] somebody from wetland. >> Yes. Once we have that, we'll have our

[1:19:54] five members of each of the board with an alternate for the wetlands for

[1:19:58] » all right. Okay. >> But the reappoint will keep our our

[1:20:01] established form we have.

[1:20:08] All right. Uh Wayne, you want to make the uh the motion?

[1:20:16] » Well, go ahead. >> Reappointing one person.

[1:20:21] » Yes. >> And that it.

[1:20:27] » So, there's two people that need to be uh reappointed or appointed. It It's the

[1:20:32] same end result. It's Monica Sanders to the wetlands board and Bev Butler to the

[1:20:37] planning commission. >> Yes, sir. Please.

[1:20:40] » All right. I'll make that motion then. Okay.

[1:20:42] » Okay. >> Thank you, Mr. Jesse.

[1:20:44] » Second. >> Thank you, Bill.

[1:20:48] » Roll call. >> Mr. Williams?

[1:20:52] » Yes. >> Mr. Bill Harris?

[1:20:54] » Yes. >> Mr. Kittin?

[1:20:56] » Yes. >> Mr. Jesse?

[1:20:58] » Yes. >> Mr. Don Harris?

[1:21:00] » Yes. Motion's approved. Item C, noise ordinance committee.

[1:21:06] » That's been withdrawn. >> Pardon me.

[1:21:08] » That has been withdrawn. So, um, that particular individual changed their

[1:21:12] mind. >> So, if we're on to item D at your

[1:21:16] convenience. >> Okay.

[1:21:20] Seaman's contract. >> That's me. Um today I'm bringing forth

[1:21:26] to you the annual contract to provide um HVAC maintenance, preventative

[1:21:32] maintenance over at the new courthouse um located at 73 B um Bowden Street.

[1:21:37] We're using rather than bidding this stuff out, we do use, as you know, we

[1:21:42] often use um cooperative purchasing agreements. In this case, we're using

[1:21:46] Sourcewell. Um, we included a sample contract and this has been reviewed and

[1:21:52] approved except for one minor change by the county attorney which is related to

[1:21:56] the location of >> uh just a venue clause

[1:22:00] » venue location. Thank you. >> Um, we did evaluate three qualified

[1:22:04] service providers and we've um, one of them is our current provider Johnson

[1:22:08] Controls. Um, the other one was called Southern Air and the final one was of

[1:22:12] course Seammens. Um they all were very well under they understood the equipment

[1:22:17] very well but overall seammens demonstrated the greatest understanding.

[1:22:20] They provide us a very competitive quote. Um we gave notice we we were

[1:22:27] dealing with Johnson Controls JCI. We gave them the required day notice 90-day

[1:22:31] notice. They are fully aware they're cycling out. They've also been I will

[1:22:36] give them credit. They're extremely cooperative with us even though they

[1:22:39] know their um contract expires. They're continuing to support us. Um, but at

[1:22:45] this time, the staff recommends awarding a one-year mechanical and automation

[1:22:48] service agreements to Seammens in the amount of $84,000. And that's for the

[1:22:52] period of August 1st. Exc That's not I lied. It's going to be

[1:22:59] because we already passed August 1st. I wrote this earlier. September 1st

[1:23:03] through August 30, 192 1927, 2027.

[1:23:10] So, we're going to start this September 1st and we definitely recommend

[1:23:13] approving this to Seammens

[1:23:18] » questions. >> If it's the board's desire to approve

[1:23:23] this, I would ask that the motion be to um to authorize the county administrator

[1:23:28] to execute the seaman's contracts with any uh revisions or recommendations of

[1:23:33] the county attorney to the contract language, please.

[1:23:40] Yep. Okay. Need a motion.

[1:23:46] » So move. >> Thank you.

[1:23:47] » So moved by Mr. Kittin. Second.

[1:23:52] » I'll second it. >> Second by Mr. Jesse.

[1:23:57] Further discussion.

[1:24:01] Seeing none, roll call. >> Mr. Bill Harris.

[1:24:06] » Yes. >> Mr. Mr. Curtin.

[1:24:08] » Yes. >> Mr. Jesse.

[1:24:10] » Yes. >> Mr. Williams.

[1:24:13] » Yes. >> Mr. Don Harris.

[1:24:15] » Yes. Motion's approved. >> Thank you very much. Oh, and I did I

[1:24:19] think I I wrote this in there, but I want to make sure you know that funding

[1:24:22] in this agreement is included in the current year budget. So, this is a

[1:24:25] typical budgeted item. So, thank you. >> Item six, administrative updates.

[1:24:30] Cigarette tax report only, staff report only.

[1:24:38] Um,

[1:24:48] unfinished and new business. Unfinished business.

[1:24:56] Unfinished business. Constitutional office officers and county 3.5 raise

[1:25:03] discussion.

[1:25:07] Thank you. Um, this item was discussed at the last board meeting with direction

[1:25:11] to bring it back to this meeting. Um, as you recall it when the general assembly

[1:25:18] passed their budget instead of using the 2% annual increase which we all included

[1:25:23] in our budget, they actually amended it and they gave everybody a three and a

[1:25:27] half percent increase. So the comp board raises are going up three and a half

[1:25:31] percent. Um although the the um

[1:25:38] although the comp board gave it to them or is going to give it

[1:25:42] to them, you don't have to. You can't. Last time we all agreed that it would be

[1:25:47] a great idea to do it. We all that would be the

[1:25:52] count board employees, all the the treasurers, the elected officials all

[1:25:55] agreed that this would be great. They gave you all a letter suggesting that it

[1:25:59] was great. Um, and you all said you didn't have enough time to look at that

[1:26:02] those letters. Um, but at this time we would like for you to consider whether

[1:26:06] you want to increase the annual raise. That's this year's raise gets built

[1:26:10] permanently into their budget um into their salaries. Either increase the

[1:26:14] annual raise from two and a half to three and three and a half% for compport

[1:26:18] employees for all employees or do nothing and the raise remains at 2%. Um,

[1:26:24] as a recall, the extra cost would cost about $72,000 more if you chose to do

[1:26:32] this for all employees. The total cost was about $99,000, but that part of

[1:26:36] that's going to be offset by the state's um comp board supplements. So

[1:26:42] the question is if you want to appropriate $72,000 to be funded and

[1:26:46] increase the raise effective August 1st for from 2 and a half to three and a

[1:26:51] half% for all eligible county employees

[1:26:57] » discussion.

[1:27:11] So unless a motion's made it's going to be 3

[1:27:17] » 2.0 >> 2.0

[1:27:18] » right >> and we have already given just

[1:27:20] » a second >> right you have given the 2.0 No.

[1:27:23] Effective July 1st. That's our everybody's already

[1:27:25] » constitutionals.

[1:27:29] » No, theirs will only go up if the county if the comp board when the compport

[1:27:36] increases. Yes, theirs will go up. >> Yeah, that's good.

[1:27:39] » Yes. >> Whether we have a motion here,

[1:27:42] » right? Yeah. The compport has to be adjusted. So,

[1:27:46] » [clears throat] >> um, so let's say right now you're paying

[1:27:48] somebody $40,000. The comp board says no, you're paying them 41,000. you're

[1:27:52] paying them 41,000. Okay. >> So that whether you do anything or not

[1:27:55] that will >> and you had cost it was like a total of

[1:27:58] 90,000 was some cost of middle sex 70 >> right that's right 99,000 more and

[1:28:04] 27,000 is going to be reimbured from the count board requiring about $72,000 to

[1:28:09] be appropriated from the county. >> So they make a mandate for 20,000 and

[1:28:13] then look at us to come up with 70. >> Right. Well they I don't think they see

[1:28:18] it that way but yes you are right.

[1:28:27] I just say I don't like this process at all. I value the employees. We have to

[1:28:32] have them. I think we good at have good employees and we're very fortunate for

[1:28:35] that. And I also believe that we we demonstrate that. I know that the board

[1:28:41] didn't discuss any kind of health insurance increase or anything. It was

[1:28:44] $100,000 I believe roughly more this year. I think the fact that we just went

[1:28:49] home and yes, we value the employees. Like I said, we didn't discuss it. We

[1:28:52] knew we needed to do that for the employees.

[1:28:55] I don't like this thing of dangling carrot out in front of the employees. I

[1:29:00] think it's disgraceful. We're going to get a raise, not going to get a raise.

[1:29:03] The bonus, not get a bonus. We need to do a better job of getting our budget,

[1:29:08] sticking to our budget, and that's where we are. The state brings and moves

[1:29:13] things back and forth and everything. We need to do a better job of how we need

[1:29:17] to look at our employees. We need to compensate them. We need to attract and

[1:29:22] retain. And we have a new county administrator. If we need to go in and

[1:29:26] look at positions, so forth and so on, then that's what we need to do. But this

[1:29:31] thing of the state constantly asking us to change back and forth, they're going

[1:29:34] to throw in 16,000. We need to throw in 70 some. I don't like the process. I

[1:29:39] don't think we're treating the employees fairly by doing it in this manner.

[1:29:46] There's 70ome thousand. What is that?

[1:29:51] Is that just raise or insuranceances and everything that adds up?

[1:29:55] » Right. No, that's um So, the only thing this would cost, excuse me, the only

[1:30:00] thing this would cost would be salaries plus payroll taxes. So, yes, that's the

[1:30:03] increased the total increased cost. >> The state is telling us to give three

[1:30:07] and a half% that actually is going to cost us $70,000.

[1:30:11] » 72,000 if you chose. That's and that's insuranceances and benefits and all of

[1:30:16] that. >> It's well there's no other insurance

[1:30:18] involved in that. The only thing that's involved in the 72,000 is going to be

[1:30:21] the increase in salary plus the payroll taxes. That's all this cost. Payroll

[1:30:24] taxes >> salaries increases and VRS is increasing

[1:30:27] » not for right. Oh, I'm sorry. And VRS. You're right. VRS and I did include all

[1:30:31] that. Sorry, I've got it in the bank. >> Is that in the 70 zone?

[1:30:34] » It is. >> And that's all employees.

[1:30:37] » We're also contemplating, if I'm not mistaken, we have a an ordinance that

[1:30:40] we're going to be talking about later. It's a 2% employee raise as well.

[1:30:45] » It's employee bonus. That's a bonus, >> right? A bonus. One time bonus,

[1:30:49] » right? >> Like I said, I I I personally am I know

[1:30:53] that this is this wasn't pretty. There was nothing

[1:30:57] pretty about presenting this to you all, but we also didn't have a choice. Um if

[1:31:01] the if the if we didn't, we wouldn't that wouldn't have been fair to

[1:31:07] everybody either. So, we we recognize that you don't want if you don't want to

[1:31:11] do this or you don't the timing isn't right, the budget isn't right, that's

[1:31:15] going to move on, but we at least had to discuss it and I think you all are

[1:31:18] discussing it. So, that's exactly what we needed from you. Um whether you want

[1:31:22] to go on with a increasing the annual raise from 2% to three and a half%.

[1:31:26] That's it sounds like that's the only

[1:31:29] discussion for this moment. But to that end, you are right. At the last board

[1:31:33] meeting, we have you you the board approved a the advertising of an

[1:31:37] ordinance to allow for a 2% bonus. And that's going to be discussed after um 7

[1:31:42] p.m. And that's related to last year.

[1:31:48] » So right now we're talking about the three and a half% for everybody.

[1:31:51] » Yep. >> All employees.

[1:31:55] » Well, not the schools. They already got it.

[1:31:56] » No, I ain't talking about school. I ain't talking nothing schools. Well, and

[1:32:00] there's a couple people that are exempt from getting a more raise. Yeah, Matt.

[1:32:06] [laughter] >> Special Matt.

[1:32:10] And and later we're going to be talking about a two bonus

[1:32:14] » and we got to approve that, too. So, one of them is a bonus is flat money. And

[1:32:22] this one here is a 3 and 12% to give all employees or everybody a five I mean a 3

[1:32:28] and 12% raise. And this is not what the state is doing.

[1:32:34] This is what we are doing because all employees is not comp employees. So the

[1:32:40] figure that we talking about is less than $71,000.

[1:32:45] the 71 comes out because we want to give everybody else that are not comp

[1:32:50] employees >> correct

[1:32:52] » the extra money >> right and just to because I know there

[1:32:58] was some confusion about it with at least one one person had asked me about

[1:33:02] this would be one and a half% above and beyond the 2% that the board uh

[1:33:07] allocated in the budget not three and a half% on top of the 2% I just want to

[1:33:12] make that

[1:33:22] Okay, >> on to the next.

[1:33:27] » All right, >> I

[1:33:33] guess you need what you need. >> We're going to just bypass it.

[1:33:39] » There's not a motion to to vote on. >> Yep.

[1:33:43] So, on to the next. Is

[1:33:46] » wait a minute now. You need a motion to give everybody three and a half%.

[1:33:50] » That's what you need. >> Well,

[1:33:52] » change it from two to three. >> Change it to to three and a half%. That

[1:33:56] what you need. >> Well, I mean, as an employee, the answer

[1:33:59] is yes. But as your legal counsel, I'll say it a different way. Um,

[1:34:05] you have options here. Okay. So if the board chooses to do nothing, the

[1:34:11] constitutional officers like some that you've had present tonight, Commonwealth

[1:34:16] attorney, sheriff, treasurer, clerk, commissioner revenue, they will get a 3

[1:34:21] and 12% cost of living increase from the state. Okay.

[1:34:27] if you do nothing. What administration is asking is and and

[1:34:33] I think what they're they're recommending they're saying they have

[1:34:36] the money to give all of your employees, not just the constitutional officers.

[1:34:40] So, think of planning and zoning. Think of administration. Think of myself. Uh

[1:34:46] and we would get the same cost of living increase.

[1:34:49] » Okay. That that requires a motion >> and that's what's causing the extra

[1:34:53] 70,000. >> Yes, sir. Yes, sir. Yeah.

[1:34:56] » So, Amarie wrote a very a very good memo here pointing out to you kind of your

[1:35:01] options, >> but it never can be simple, gentlemen.

[1:35:04] It's always complicated when we get the state involved.

[1:35:06] » Well, for for everybody, I'm going to make a motion everybody get three and a

[1:35:08] half%. >> Has one of those everybody's. Thanks,

[1:35:12] Reggie.

[1:35:16] » You got a motion on the floor? >> I'll second it.

[1:35:20] » Okay. [clears throat]

[1:35:23] Further discussion,

[1:35:30] » Mr. Curtin, >> is wait a minute.

[1:35:33] » Is is is uh what Reggie was asking is that

[1:35:40] because I thought it was one point.

[1:35:45] » So, well, Mr. Williams, if if you're okay, let's add clarification to the

[1:35:49] motion. Mr. Williams motion is to increase the cola from 2% to 3 and a.5%

[1:35:57] for all county employees. >> Mr. Cardier, would that be correct?

[1:36:01] » Correct. And make sure that that's only effective August 1st.

[1:36:04] » Effective August 1st. >> Mr. Williams, are you okay with that

[1:36:08] clarification to your memo or your motion? Excuse me.

[1:36:12] » I know. Uh, so the clarification is that this would be a motion to increase the

[1:36:18] cola for county employees, all county employees, starting August 1st from 2%

[1:36:23] to 3 and a.5%. So it's a 1 and a.5% increase. I just we just want to make

[1:36:29] sure that's very clear. >> More than three and a half.

[1:36:32] » Yes, sir. That is correct. >> I just

[1:36:36] wonder. >> All right. So Mr. Williams has said that

[1:36:38] he is in agreement with that because his mic wasn't on. All right. Roll.

[1:36:43] » Roll call now. >> Mr. Kittinden.

[1:36:48] » No. >> Mr. Jesse?

[1:36:51] » Yes. >> Mr. Williams?

[1:36:53] » Yes. >> Mr. Bill Harris?

[1:36:56] » No. >> Mr. Don Harris?

[1:37:00] » No. Motions failed.

[1:37:06] » All right. New business and matters presented by the board.

[1:37:13] Start with you Wayne.

[1:37:17] » Um I did attend the uh middle pen planning district uh meeting. Um we are

[1:37:23] getting things straight I would say. Um cuz we hired a um

[1:37:29] who did we we hired the um >> Berkeley Group.

[1:37:33] » Berkeley Group. Berkeley Group for part- time to run this to help run it until we

[1:37:38] get a full-time executive director. Right now,

[1:37:41] » they need a CFO as well. >> Yeah. And [laughter] yeah, they need we

[1:37:44] need a CFO. So, uh we're we're heading in the right direction. John McGrder is

[1:37:49] now the chairman uh of the commission at this time. And uh that was it for me on

[1:37:55] my meetings. Um I will meet with the B Festival Thursday

[1:38:00] coming up. So, >> but that's it for me.

[1:38:07] I um on July 22nd uh Mr. Gentry and I had a teleconference with a

[1:38:13] representative from Polymorphic which is an AI company specializing in programs

[1:38:18] for local governments. Uh it was an interesting presentation. Uh AI is here

[1:38:24] to stay and um and it he some of the things he explained were were kind of

[1:38:29] interesting. um help us deliver better, more efficient service to our

[1:38:33] constituents. Uh one of the things that I know they

[1:38:37] mentioned was it could help with foyer requests. Uh because I know that some of

[1:38:41] our employees do a lot of work on foyas. Um and I do believe it deserves some

[1:38:46] further consideration. Um

[1:38:50] on all the same day on the 22nd I went to we we had our joint uh school board

[1:38:56] meeting reference to renovations. On the 24th at Juvenile Detention Commission

[1:39:02] meeting and um finally a couple of weeks ago I

[1:39:06] sent a memo to my fellow board members recommending that we explore the

[1:39:10] possibility of creating a harbor master position for our county. And um so I've

[1:39:16] asked all of you to review that to make sure that you've you've seen it and I'd

[1:39:20] like to put it on the agenda for an upcoming board meeting because I think

[1:39:23] it's something that would be worthwhile and it could be very beneficial not only

[1:39:27] to our business community and our our our uh our marinas and and our maritime

[1:39:34] industry but also uh can help us I think uh tax- wise, revenue wise. So that's

[1:39:40] it. >> Thank you Mr. Krenn. Mr. Harris. No, I

[1:39:44] have nothing at this time. Thank you, >> Mr. Williams.

[1:39:52] [laughter] I got I got to laugh a little bit

[1:39:54] because I'mma think about Wayne cuz we went to the middle peninsula uh meeting

[1:39:58] which you got a whole lot of work to do when it start to we talking about

[1:40:02] handling the money. See, it's a big problem when money get way out of hand

[1:40:06] and we don't handle it. And that's why I always say that we got to do a better

[1:40:09] job of how we moving and how we doing money, you know. Um, and the second

[1:40:14] thing, we was on the renovation committee. Don, you Don left it in my

[1:40:18] hand. Don didn't show up me and give me a call. I said, "Oh, they want me." I

[1:40:23] said, "They don't want me to leave the thing. They don't want me to do it." So,

[1:40:27] uh, I thought it was a real good meeting. And I noticed in our minutes

[1:40:31] that in section B, uh, it seems like, uh, the schools wrote

[1:40:37] the, uh, section B. He was talking about what went on at the uh renovation uh

[1:40:42] committee and an interesting term because you know it's not a mystery that

[1:40:48] uh the schools want to move the uh eighth grade

[1:40:52] to the high school and build a new well a new building and interestingly writing

[1:40:58] they call eighth grade academy. Now we better be very careful when we start

[1:41:04] saying academy because we are saying something that we

[1:41:08] don't know that in our minutes and it said 8th grade academy and at the same

[1:41:13] meeting I also asked for them to do a breakdown for the supervisors how much

[1:41:18] the gymnasium cost how much the auditorium cost and how much the uh uh

[1:41:24] the uh the rendition cost. I'm still waiting for it. Nobody gave me a price,

[1:41:30] but they gave me a lot of excuses. So, what are you saying, Reggie? This is

[1:41:34] what I'm saying. They gave us a price that they confirmed at basically $63

[1:41:38] million. And I told him in the uh meeting, I

[1:41:42] said, "Well, I showed you a price of $57 million at

[1:41:47] the one up at Montles High School, brand new with everything in it." And see, I

[1:41:52] was approached that Mr. Williams, he want to build new and it cost more

[1:41:59] money. Cuz I can tell you right now, according to the numbers, the numbers do

[1:42:04] not say that. And the numbers don't say it because we have seen it. Some that

[1:42:09] was on the uh Zoom meeting or with the contractor and they know about it from

[1:42:15] the head, the chairman didn't know about it. But yet in our minutes, I seen

[1:42:19] somewhere say 62. And I don't appreciate the factor of saying you didn't say

[1:42:23] anything but what I said because if we if we let information get out not that

[1:42:28] we need to change our things because if we know now we are startup kind of like

[1:42:33] getting the system together that's why I always say system together because the

[1:42:37] ones that own this on the board when we started out and I haven't looked at the

[1:42:41] minutes yet and I know the board said that we want you to look at the system

[1:42:48] we only well Somebody only look at a renovation. But this where we at right

[1:42:53] now. All right. Moving the eighth grade to

[1:42:57] the high school. We creating more room for at the elementary school. I've been

[1:43:04] saying that for three or four years. Where your problem? Solve your problem

[1:43:06] at because it's cheaper to build at the elementary level than it is at the high

[1:43:14] school. And I'm not saying not to renovate the high school. All I'm asking

[1:43:17] you is don't wait and run the numbers. But then the craziest thing that none of

[1:43:21] us thought about, you put the fifth grade in the middle school. Now you do

[1:43:25] have a scenario because none of us really thought about that. And like I

[1:43:29] said before, I think about this thing a lot and I've been thinking about it a

[1:43:32] whole lot. And when you start up, so Reggie, he talk all the time. Yes, I do

[1:43:36] cuz I think a lot. People that think a lot talk a lot. [laughter]

[1:43:40] Anyway, this is and this is what I'm saying.

[1:43:44] » I tell I said, "Hey, I'm not going to solve the problem for you. Some say you

[1:43:49] ought to be on the school board or something. No, I was sitting in the

[1:43:52] meeting right at this platform and one of the gentlemen on the school board

[1:43:56] when they say they voted unanimously. So, I ain't see the blue I ain't see the

[1:44:00] blueprints. I don't want to be there. So, if you don't see something that

[1:44:04] actually happened, how can you approve something unanimously?

[1:44:08] You can't do it. But I I I said that I I I really didn't like when I went through

[1:44:12] it. I didn't like the idea. I saw academy and I didn't like because I said

[1:44:17] well I appreciate mama use a different word that if you gave the supervisor hey

[1:44:21] what it cost to uh build a gymnasium because you know uh do we have to do a

[1:44:25] auditorium right now I think about what Don said can we do it in parts can we do

[1:44:29] something and wait we don't need gymnasium now for the uh middle school

[1:44:33] how much money is that then we still can renovate the high school 9 through 12

[1:44:39] and get the wow factor but the only thing about that is they told They going

[1:44:43] to do skin so it don't have to look like the picture that we put on the front

[1:44:47] page of the Sentinel. Okay. So it don't have to look like

[1:44:51] that. So I'm sitting there still thinking about it and man I I I just

[1:44:55] said we going to work this thing out because nobody I don't feel right now

[1:45:01] that that we all think as much about Milics as we think we do. And I've said

[1:45:07] the thing that this board think about the kids of Mils County. Let me give you

[1:45:10] example of that. We talking about the school system. and they'll tell us,

[1:45:13] "Yeah, yes, I'm saying it. We want to move every child in the

[1:45:18] school system. We going to put them in a trailer or whatever we need to move to

[1:45:24] do a renovation and every child is going to be affected in the system because

[1:45:29] you're moving everybody. So, if you sit there and tell me they're not going to

[1:45:33] be affected, you can move. Are you going to move eighth grade? Do you love your

[1:45:37] kids? Oh, we going to put them in a trailer bill." All right. You going to

[1:45:40] move the other ones? Then you going to do the elementary kids when they got

[1:45:42] good uh scenario that they can handle it because back if you're talking to one of

[1:45:48] your teacher said what you want one do for the uh for for the you know for the

[1:45:53] for the little kids they can draw out the teachers and principal teachers in

[1:45:56] principle said this how I want the run would look for three and four years old.

[1:46:00] Now we turn them down and send everywhere else. So our growth is not on

[1:46:04] the top but our growth is in the system and we wonder are we getting money for

[1:46:08] these younger kids. Nobody told us are we getting any money for the younger

[1:46:12] kids three and four years old. How much we get? Oh yeah. They go three years

[1:46:15] old. They ride the bus. They're three years old getting Yeah. So So this is

[1:46:19] what I'm saying. And I'm I'm some of us saying we went too far to change what

[1:46:25] we're doing. Now y'all heard me a number of time. When you get in the fix

[1:46:28] sometime you got to run back the other way cuz it might be quick saying that

[1:46:31] you going other side. All right. So this is what I'm saying. They say we went too

[1:46:37] far. They I mean they went too far to do something different now because they

[1:46:43] made in investment of what they got and I'm just using this as example. Well,

[1:46:48] let me tell you something. All the engineering and all the stuff that we

[1:46:52] talking about that they have to do now, the other guy got it all done because

[1:46:56] remember we was doing a kind of like a horseshoe from the other one like we did

[1:47:00] the elementary school when we got the blueprints and stuff from over there at

[1:47:04] Lancaster and built that school. That's how you save money. But if I I focus on

[1:47:09] any one thing, then I lose my thought of everything. So when you some might hear,

[1:47:15] well, you know, no, we ain't going too far. If we going to spend a plus or

[1:47:20] minus on the $30,000, $30 million I was talking about. And we see it in our

[1:47:25] things that we really said $30 million. Well, they say engineer going get get

[1:47:30] about 8%. And we didn't use the plus or minus because you do the math on the

[1:47:35] plus or minus that's anywhere from 0ero to 8%. So that's 23% right there.

[1:47:40] Where's the cost? All I'm asking for is show me the numbers and and we had a lot

[1:47:46] of things today. we work together as a team then it won't cost as much because

[1:47:50] now in the workplace now we have less people working yet everybody's want more

[1:47:57] because we don't want to change from what we used to do and we got we got AI

[1:48:05] we put I'm going to say this I'm going close down and talk long enough we got

[1:48:08] AI and when we got AI I dare you put AI and tell you how to work your workforce

[1:48:14] I dare you to put it I can tell you

[1:48:18] around here. >> Mr. [clears throat] Chair,

[1:48:22] » Mr. Chair, I have one more thing. Uh, Vanifile Department, we're having the

[1:48:27] crab and shrimp fest. Uh, August the 22nd is all the crabs and and shrimp you

[1:48:32] can eat. Uh, we have two sessions. One starts from 3:00 to 5:00 and then we

[1:48:37] have another session from 6 to 8. So, I just like to pronounce that. Huh?

[1:48:42] » Steamed crabs. >> Huh?

[1:48:43] » Steamed crabs. >> Yeah, steamed crabs. and and steamed

[1:48:46] shrimp. >> Okay.

[1:48:47] » Uh $45. >> Uh no, it's $45, but if you if you don't

[1:48:52] get a ticket from me, it going to be $60 at the door. So, I'm going [laughter] to

[1:48:55] let you know that.

[1:49:02] » Okay. Um I'd like to open the public hearing.

[1:49:07] » Public comment period. Excuse me. >> Comment.

[1:49:09] » Sorry.

[1:49:12] Come on down, Miss Moore. Don't you have um the back to school event? When is

[1:49:16] that? >> Yes, ma'am.

[1:49:17] » Okay. Sorry. >> That'll be at the end of PSA

[1:49:18] announcements. >> Okay.

[1:49:20] » Um I had no intentions on talking today, but

[1:49:25] um yes, our Commonwealth attorney was a little out of line, but you know, I'm

[1:49:30] sitting here listening to you all. You voted down the cola rays for the

[1:49:35] employees. We gave the sheriff's office a position

[1:49:39] last year. We just gave them another position just now.

[1:49:44] If they're increasing, you got to understand the Commonwealth attorney's

[1:49:47] got to increase. And I'm not I'm not in total agreeance with all of it. We're

[1:49:53] we're getting we're as the previous sheriff stated, as soon as we move into

[1:49:59] the building, we'll be accredited. We're not accredited. I have an issue having

[1:50:04] an issue with the body cameras. I feel that we ended the committee too soon. We

[1:50:09] should have pushed harder for the information that we were looking for

[1:50:12] because this has become a flub is the nicest way to say it. Now

[1:50:19] there are internal people getting promotions.

[1:50:24] So the money is changing anyway. There are people taking home cars that don't

[1:50:29] need to be taking home cars. We are expending a lot of money where we

[1:50:35] don't need to. the bags. I had the honor to go over to Lancaster Courthouse to

[1:50:41] assist somebody and they used the bags. They had one gentleman sitting at the

[1:50:46] door. One, you go in, you have your smartwatch, you have your cell phone,

[1:50:51] you have whatever because, you know, the attorneys do not have to put their stuff

[1:50:55] in a bag. So, my girlfriend dropped her smartwatch

[1:50:59] in the bag. We went into the courtroom. When we were done, on the way out the

[1:51:04] door, they have this little thing on the wall. Just like if you go to Target and

[1:51:08] the girl takes your thing and hits it on the counter and it opens.

[1:51:12] Same thing. You tap it on the wall, it opens, you take your phone out, and they

[1:51:17] drop it in the bucket. You don't want to leave with your stuff in the bag cuz you

[1:51:22] can't get it open. No additional

[1:51:26] employees were needed at that point. So, I as Mr. Mr. Williams likes to say they

[1:51:32] went over to Lancaster. Please go to Lancaster courthouse and take a tour

[1:51:38] because it was smooth as can be and there were a lot of people in the

[1:51:42] courtroom and we were sitting there for three hours.

[1:51:46] So, it did not take them no more employees to handle this issue. I wish

[1:51:51] you all would start looking and and not just

[1:51:57] jumping because we just hired another person.

[1:52:02] But if the sheriff office needs another person, so they've gotten two,

[1:52:08] you have to think something's got to happen at the Commonwealth attorney's

[1:52:11] office. And in the past we or the previous and I want to say I think it

[1:52:16] would might have been you Don had talked to the previous Commonwealth attorney I

[1:52:20] mean county administrator and the sheriff the previous sheriff to contact

[1:52:25] the people that own the camp out of state because if we're spending that

[1:52:30] kind of money we're not bringing that kind of money back. I live by the camp.

[1:52:35] I see what comes in and out of there. We're not bringing that kind of money

[1:52:39] back into our economy. So, if we're spending

[1:52:43] the money, the camp needs to do something for us in return because

[1:52:47] they're a nuisance as far as I'm concerned. Thank you.

[1:52:54] » Oh, I was looking at the thing. My PSA announcement. Um, we have the back to

[1:52:59] school bash on Saturday. All the children of the community are involved.

[1:53:04] They're all permitted to come to Camp Pianka Tank from 11 to 3. Um they get to

[1:53:10] use the pool. They get their school supplies. We have whole rooms set up. It

[1:53:14] is a big event um including children and parents. We were at just shy of 300 last

[1:53:22] year. It has increased every year. I really hope that you all would come out

[1:53:27] and see that. And just so you know, if you're not on Facebook, because we don't

[1:53:31] know how to get the information out any other way, August 12th at St. Clair

[1:53:35] Walker Middle School will be a community forum

[1:53:40] from 5:30 to 8:30. Thank you. >> Thank you.

[1:53:46] Anyone else like to speak?

[1:53:51] Seeing none, I'll close the public comment.

[1:53:56] And

[1:54:00] » do you want to take a brief recess before you go into close session

[1:54:04] or you want to go ahead into close session?

[1:54:10] » Let's just go on into close session, I think.

[1:54:12] » Okay. All right. Mr. Chairman, it would be appropriate at this time for the

[1:54:16] board to make a motion to convene in close session. It's a long one, so give

[1:54:20] me a moment. Pursuant to Virginia Code section 2.2-3711

[1:54:25] A7 and A8. This is so the board may consult with legal counsel regarding

[1:54:31] it's no longer probable. It's the actual litigation uh filed by the commonwealth

[1:54:35] attorney against the board of supervisors regarding funding of staff

[1:54:39] and regarding the zoning litigation that has been filed by Katrrol

[1:54:45] versus the board of supervisors in Middle Sex County Circuit Court and so

[1:54:49] that you may discuss the specific legal process and questions with your legal

[1:54:53] counsel and also so pursuant to Virginia code section 2.2-3711 2-3711

[1:55:00] A3 and A8. So the board may discuss and consider the acquisition of real

[1:55:05] property for a public purpose and discuss the disposition of publicly held

[1:55:10] property where a discussion in an open meeting would adversely affect the

[1:55:14] bargaining position of the public body and so that you may consult with legal

[1:55:18] counsel about the specific legal process involving buying the property and

[1:55:22] selling it and related questions. >> So move [clears throat] Second.

[1:55:28] » So moved by Mr. Jesse, second by Mr. Kitten.

[1:55:32] Seeing no further uh discussion, roll call.

[1:55:36] » Mr. Jesse? >> Yes.

[1:55:39] » Mr. Williams? >> Yes.

[1:55:40] » Mr. Bill Harris? >> Yes.

[1:55:42] » Mr. Kittinden? >> Yes.

[1:55:43] » Mr. Don Harris? >> Yes. And we are moving downstairs for

[1:55:47] our close session. So anybody left in here can stay.

[1:55:52] » Yes. And then we have a night meeting. So um if there's any action that's taken

[1:55:58] it will occur before that most likely

[1:56:01] » we are journ

Board of Supervisors | August 4, 2026 | 3:00 PM

Agenda

Transcript