[18:56] Of the Moore County commissioners, thanks everyone for coming out this evening.

[19:01] The invocation will be done by Reverend Theron Willis from Carthage United Methodist Church.

[19:08] He will offer the invocation, and it will be followed by Tammy Golden, who will lead us

[19:12] in the Pledge of Allegiance. Please stand if you're able.

[19:19] Let us pray. Gracious and loving God, we give you thanks and praise for these dedicated

[19:25] public servants who you have answered your call to serve as this County's Board of Commissioners.

[19:32] Please be present in this meeting through the work of your Holy Spirit. Grant these

[19:38] commissioners divine wisdom to be faithful shepherds of the resources and people entrusted

[19:44] into their care. Grant them clarity of mind to weigh complex issues, patience to listen

[19:52] to all voices and unity of purpose to serve all citizens well.

[20:00] May all that is spoken and

[20:01] dedicated here today bring honor and glory to your name. And as in Jesus' holy and precious

[20:07] name we pray, amen.

[20:26] Are

[20:38] there any additional agenda items for consideration this evening?

[20:41] Yes, sir. I'd like to add under new business item a contract amendment number two with United Reynolds for the water pollution control plant

[20:50] That is in the form of a motion

[20:54] Okay, we have a motion by

[20:57] Chairman for Cerno

[20:59] Kurt will be our second

[21:02] All right, just all in favor all in favor

[21:06] The eyes have it 3-0

[21:10] Does any commissioner have a conflict of interest concern in any agenda items on the board will address in this meeting?

[21:18] None noted. All items listed below are considered routine and will be enacted by one motion. No separate discussion will be held except on the request of a member of the board.

[21:30] Motion to approve consent.

[21:34] Okay, I've got a motion by Chairman Pocerno and Commissioner Cook.

[21:45] The vote is 3-0.

[21:48] Excuse me.

[21:49] Well, you need to ask for the vote.

[21:51] Okay.

[21:51] Oh, excuse me.

[21:52] Bear with me, gentlemen and ladies.

[21:54] We're-

[21:55] Training.

[21:56] Trial under fire this evening.

[21:58] Okay.

[21:59] All right.

[22:00] Do I have a vote?

[22:01] All in favor.

[22:02] All in favor.

[22:03] Aye.

[22:04] Aye.

[22:05] Does have it 3-0.

[22:07] So we

[22:12] have nothing under recognitions, presentations.

[22:16] I'll now turn it over to our county manager.

[22:18] Thank you, Vice-Chairman Bunkenon.

[22:20] We do have one item under our public hearings.

[22:23] This is for the board to consider a call to for a public hearing

[22:27] to update our road naming and addressing ordinance.

[22:30] And for this item, we'll recognize our GIS coordinator,

[22:34] Rachel Smith.

[22:36] Good evening.

[22:37] The request is hereby made for the board of commissioners

[22:40] to call a public hearing for Tuesday, August 18th, 2026 at 5.30 p.m. to consider an amendment

[22:48] to the mortar county road name and addressing ordinance to add one road to the ordinance.

[22:54] The background is section three of the ordinance states no new roads outside the municipal

[23:00] limits of the county of Moore, whether part of the state secondary road system or private

[23:05] that shall be named without the approval

[23:08] of the Board of Commissioners.

[23:10] The road listed here is for initial naming

[23:14] and will be privately maintained.

[23:17] Ashton Lane,

[23:20] pause for any comments.

[23:23] Do I have a motion?

[23:25] Yes, Mr. Chairman, I'll make a motion

[23:27] that the Board of Commissioners have a call

[23:29] to public hearing for August 18, 2026 at 5.30

[23:33] to consider amendments to more county road name,

[23:35] addressing ordinance to have one road to the ordinance adding Ashton Lane.

[23:40] I have a motion by Chairman Pizarro and a second by Commissioner Cook. Any discussion?

[23:47] All in favor say aye. No. All opposed say no.

[23:52] We have the ayes have it 3-0.

[23:55] Thank you, Rachel. Thank you, Vice Chairman.

[23:58] There are no items under our quasi-judicial. There are no items under old business.

[24:02] We do have one item that was added as an additional agenda item on the new business and this is

[24:08] for the board to consider a contract amendment to with United Rentals and we'll recognize

[24:12] our public works director Brian Patnode to introduce this item.

[24:17] Good evening commissioners.

[24:18] Thank you for the late addition.

[24:21] If you remember last meeting we were excited about the aeration blowers finally being

[24:26] delivered from Belgium.

[24:28] Unfortunately, they sent the wrong size connection piece.

[24:33] The new blowers are 16-inch, the old are 14.

[24:37] They were supposed to convert it during the manufacturing process, but they did not.

[24:43] So we're still in a holding pattern.

[24:45] We're working with the supplier hoping they can help us out, get it here quickly and

[24:50] help us absorb some of these costs.

[24:53] this amendment is to extend the rental in case we need it in an extended period

[24:59] of time and increase the dollar amount by roughly 103,000 to cover potential

[25:07] cost of that rental. Are there any questions or would you like for me to

[25:12] what was the amount again? 103,000?

[25:21] That takes the new not to

[25:23] to exceed amount to the 451.422.30.

[25:27] All right.

[25:29] Okay, do I have a motion?

[25:31] Yeah, I'll make a motion to approve amendment number two

[25:33] with the United Rentals to extend the contract

[25:35] through September 30, 2026.

[25:37] Increase the, do not exceed amount to 451,422.30 cents.

[25:43] Authorize the chairman to sign.

[25:46] Second.

[25:47] Okay, I have a motion by Chairman Paterno

[25:49] and a second by Commissioner Cook.

[25:51] Any discussion?

[25:52] Yes, Mr. Chair, I would ask that our attorneys prepare and send a letter to the manufacturer

[25:59] requesting a rebate of $103,000 so that we can send this money to United Rentals, not

[26:05] for the ratepayers in Warl County, to fix their mistake.

[26:13] Thank you.

[26:14] Thank you.

[26:16] Thank you, Brian.

[26:18] All in favor say aye.

[26:21] Are we doing that?

[26:23] Okay.

[26:23] All right.

[26:23] Discussion?

[26:24] Yeah.

[26:25] Thank you.

[26:25] All right.

[26:25] Yeah, what do you write a couple you call for the boat? Okay all in favor say aye. They

[26:32] ice have it three to zero. Thank you. Thank you Brian. Thank you Vice-Chairman

[26:38] Von Cannon. That's all the items under new business. There is one item under

[26:43] appointments and we'll turn it over to our Assistant Manager Laura Williams who

[26:48] is filling in for our clerk Jenny Parks who is in a class this week. Thank

[26:54] Thank you.

[26:55] So there are no actions requested on the appointments tonight.

[27:01] This is just review for your next meeting in August for appointments to be made to the

[27:06] airport authority for Eugene Horn's seat, board of health for Nick Ellis's seat and

[27:13] Benjamin Wacker's seat, planning board Tucker McKenzie and the Sandhills Regional

[27:18] Library System, board of trustees Joanne King.

[27:21] So I think Jenny has provided to you the applications and background on those

[27:27] Desiring additional terms of service

[27:29] Nick Alice was he was particular was he a particular position you know some have to be he was at large. He was at large, okay? Yes, and

[27:40] Then Dr. Wacker is optometrist. Yeah,

[27:45] all right. Thank you

[27:47] All right at this time. We're going to open the public comment period

[27:51] This will be three minutes per person, and or when you hear the buzzer, if you're at the end of a thought or the beginning of a thought, go ahead and draw it to a close, and we'll get started.

[28:04] Our first, please stand up to the podium and give your name and where you're from.

[28:09] We're going to start off with Debra.

[28:11] Is this McAllen?

[28:13] McGovern.

[28:14] Alrighty.

[28:22] I'm Debra McGovern.

[28:24] I live in Pinehurst, North Carolina.

[28:26] I'm here to discuss, think about what surveillance is like in our county.

[28:35] We have flock machines going up.

[28:38] We do not think that surveilling our community is a good thing for the community.

[28:47] There are plenty of studies that we can see that show that flock does not make our community

[28:55] safer. And I think we should all be willing to talk about and think about where we go with this

[29:03] because I do not think it's the right thing for us. Thank you.

[29:08] Thank you.

[29:09] Next speaker, John Maziac.

[29:25] Comissors, I'm John Maziac, and I'm from Woodlake. During your July 21 meeting, we heard from two representatives

[29:32] from the nursing and adult care home community advocacy committee. During their presentation

[29:38] they noted how North Carolina has an aging population. More specifically, they mentioned

[29:44] more county is near the top of the list of counties with aging populations and the problems

[29:51] and costs that brings with it. How do we reduce the average age here in more county

[29:57] and the certain increased cost to come.

[30:00] As a result, I suggest we need to find a way to induce younger people to move or locate

[30:06] here permanently. How does that get done? I suggest we need to find a way to bring high

[30:12] paying jobs to more county. During the meeting there was also a discussion about the land

[30:17] use plan. I suggest a portion of our approximately 450,000 acres of land be made available

[30:23] for companies that can provide high paying jobs that will be necessary to attract those

[30:29] was younger workers.

[30:31] That would necessitate extending necessary infrastructure

[30:34] to any potentially newly identified appropriate sites.

[30:39] The clock is ticking.

[30:41] Imagine more.

[30:43] Also during that last meeting, school

[30:45] disrepresentative is reported on future capital requirements.

[30:50] It was reported that being a tier three county essentially

[30:53] makes more county ineligible for state funding.

[30:56] My recommendation is change the state structure.

[31:01] North Carolina has physically the 27th largest state by land area in the U.S.

[31:07] We have 100 counties. Only six states have more counties than does North Carolina.

[31:15] Five of those states are physically larger than North Carolina. Only one is smaller.

[31:20] My suggestion is to reduce the number of counties the state has.

[31:28] I've attached an estimate of the cost savings for the state and local governments if this

[31:34] were to be done, which I've given to your clerk.

[31:37] The number estimated is $20 billion per year.

[31:41] That's savings of nearly $1,850 per year per North Carolina resident.

[31:49] Every man, woman, and child.

[31:51] For comparison, every one cent in property tax reduction here in Moore County saves every man, woman, and child in Moore County approximately $24.

[32:03] Thank you.

[32:04] Thank you, John.

[32:05] Megan Spearing.

[32:15] Hello, my name is Megan Spearing.

[32:17] I live in Southern.

[32:18] Can you hear me now?

[32:21] Okay.

[32:21] I live in Southern Pines.

[32:23] My name is Megan Spearing.

[32:25] I am an Air Force veteran.

[32:26] When I was in the military, I was military intelligence, specifically an imagery analyst.

[32:33] I'm giving you this information because I have a unique insight into why more counties should

[32:38] not have flock cameras, and that reason is being national security.

[32:42] I know that sounds alarmist and dare I say crazy, however, part of my duties were to

[32:49] identify track and neutralize targets.

[32:51] But when I was in, this was done with drones, CTT footage, phones, and any other resource

[33:02] we had available to us.

[33:06] If Flock had been in those countries, specifically OEF, OIF, that would have made my life, my

[33:12] job a million times easier.

[33:14] It literally made the, gave me all of the information that I needed.

[33:24] It would have made our lives so easy.

[33:27] Flock has notoriously weak cybersecurity.

[33:32] The enemy has amazing hackers.

[33:34] They have hacked public works and even the FBI, so Flock would be child's play for them.

[33:40] Now you may be thinking why would the enemy be interested in Moore County? Moore County

[33:46] is home to many special forces members as well as other military personnel. It is also

[33:53] home to many contractors that also do a large portion of the intel work for the special

[33:59] forces. Flock cameras in Moore County are creating a pattern of life intel that can

[34:05] being used against our own warfighters.

[34:08] And it is not even secured properly.

[34:11] It isn't secret that Moore County

[34:13] is home to special operators.

[34:15] I was scrolling on Facebook last night

[34:17] and I saw a meme about special ops

[34:19] and it's specifically named Southern Pines, North Carolina.

[34:23] I took a screenshot so if you guys wanna see it,

[34:26] I can show it to you.

[34:28] I contend that we have a duty

[34:29] not to make the enemy's job easier

[34:33] and not to place our service members at risk.

[34:37] I just want to finish up with two points.

[34:39] The first is our government has banned cars from China

[34:43] due to the slight risk and concern that cameras in the cars may be spying.

[34:50] Sorry.

[34:51] The second is that Flock is a money grab.

[34:54] They get contracts from town, cities, and even private corporations.

[34:57] They collect and own the data that they receive from our roads.

[35:07] They then sell the data that we are paying them because we rent out their equipment.

[35:15] And they sell that data to other companies to include insurance companies,

[35:19] which in fact will raise our premiums.

[35:24] That's neither here nor there.

[35:25] So, sorry. But basically, I'm just going to finish on something that I learned all too

[35:36] well when I was in the military. And that is the intended target is rarely the only thing

[35:42] hit in a strike. You may not be the target, but you could be collateral damage. Thank

[35:48] you.

[35:49] Thank you.

[35:56] All right. If you'll hold for your clapping, we don't allow that in public

[36:00] speaking and we'll try to get through this. Ellis Dominic.

[36:10] Hey, Ellis Dominic from Pine Bluff. Nice to see you again, commissioners. You've heard

[36:13] me talk about Flock and its dangers and problems for the last two months. I'm not going to

[36:18] talk about that this time. I'm just going to say thank you to all my fellow Moore County

[36:22] citizens for coming out. We are a growing group of people. We are bipartisan and

[36:28] we are not going to go away until we ensure that our Fourth Amendment rights are secure

[36:33] from warrantless seizures. Thank you. Thank you Alice. Linda Hoover.

[36:47] I'm Linda

[36:47] Hoover. I live in Sanford and according to your rules because I pay sales tax in

[36:52] Moore County that I'm allowed to speak. I lived in Moore County for 25 years

[36:57] until a few years ago I moved to Tramway and but I 90% of the time I work in

[37:02] this county and probably at least 90% of the time I do all my shopping in

[37:06] this county. So I still consider myself to be very close to more county. I do have concerns

[37:13] about the flock cameras or what are called automatic license plate readers. And my concern

[37:19] is certainly with those is that when we talk about if you're doing nothing wrong, then

[37:24] why is it an issue? But who's going to consider what's wrong, right? That definition can

[37:29] always be expanded. Recently in Texas, a police department checked 83,000 cameras over 6,700

[37:38] networks trying to track a woman who did nothing illegal. So that becomes, you know, a violation

[37:45] of our Fourth Amendment rights. And I realize that you have the weighty responsibility between

[37:50] keeping your people safe, but also maintaining our freedoms. And so there's also the cases

[37:58] of people's stock of officers. Unfortunately, we know that there are many, many, many good

[38:03] law enforcement. But then there's that handful that are now using these to stalk people.

[38:08] So now, as you become concerned about that as well, and like it has been said, that the

[38:13] cameras have been shown not to really increase the safety of our communities. And so they

[38:19] also say, believe the software. But now there have been false arrests. And now it's

[38:24] upon the individual to prove you're innocent,

[38:26] so you're guilty until you prove yourself innocent,

[38:29] rather than you're innocent until proven guilty.

[38:31] So there's those.

[38:33] So it becomes, again, how far is enough

[38:35] with our, I realize there's a lot of surveillance,

[38:37] but how far is enough?

[38:39] Is it, are we finally gonna end it

[38:40] with it being like George Orwell's 1984

[38:42] and we've got cameras in our houses?

[38:44] So thank you for your time.

[38:46] Thank you, Linda.

[38:47] Our last speaker at the scene will be Jim Peterson.

[38:55] Hello everyone, I'll be real fast.

[38:56] I've been researching about these flock cameras and like municipal cops and sheriff deputies

[39:01] I know they all love them and I get it why because it makes their jobs a lot easier and

[39:07] they're having good success using them.

[39:08] But I do have some fourth amendment concerns and one arguments I heard people saying well

[39:12] if you're not doing anything wrong or illegal you have nothing to worry about.

[39:16] Something that popped in my head was sometimes right or wrong can be subjective and I'm

[39:21] thinking about J6 looks what happened to people that just wanted to peacefully listen

[39:26] and to their president speak.

[39:27] What happened to me, J6, I wasn't even there.

[39:30] I get blamed for everything all the time.

[39:34] 2021, DOJ put out a letter,

[39:36] pretty much labeling grandma speaking at school boards

[39:39] as extremists and domestic terrorists.

[39:42] 2023, it was found out that FBI was surveilling Catholics

[39:45] as some kind of domestic extremists.

[39:48] So, yeah, it can be subjective, right and wrong.

[39:52] And then I'm thinking like,

[39:52] look, 10, 15, 20 years down the road from now,

[39:55] God forbid, like the DSA took over, would if they labeled Jews and Catholics, I mean Jews

[40:00] and Christians as extremists and used flock crammers, or how much they improved upon them

[40:05] then to round up Jews and Christians.

[40:08] Thank you.

[40:08] That's all I have to say about that.

[40:14] No, no, let's go ahead and hold it, guys.

[40:17] All right, we'll go to Wayne for our manager's report this evening.

[40:21] Thank you, Vice Chairman Bunkenin.

[40:23] I have nothing additional to provide.

[40:25] Thank you.

[40:26] Okay.

[40:26] Commissioner's comments.

[40:27] We'll start up first. Have you got anything?

[40:30] No, I just understand that we do hear everything we know,

[40:33] and because we don't say anything in our response,

[40:37] because we don't during public speaking.

[40:39] We have our opinions on it.

[40:40] But each one of us is going to do their own due diligence

[40:43] and go through everything.

[40:45] So it's not going to be, we're not just listening to someone

[40:49] with their thoughts.

[40:51] We're going to add those to our research, what we know,

[40:55] And guess what I used to do?

[40:58] Yeah.

[40:59] Well, I was one of those green berets that you talked about.

[41:02] So all my neighborhood is SF and other people.

[41:06] So I understand it's not falling on deaf ears.

[41:09] We're going to have a work session next week, two weeks.

[41:12] And then we'll hammer out a lot of things from there

[41:14] and then we'll come to our conclusion.

[41:17] But understand it's not falling on deaf ears

[41:19] and you're not being ignored.

[41:21] Thank you.

[41:24] Thanks. First of all, thank you for your service to our country. I have utmost respect for all veterans.

[41:33] We did. Ellis, he had sent me a couple of emails. As you can see, summer schedules are weird.

[41:41] We got two commissioners not here tonight. It's hard to get everybody together.

[41:45] But as soon as we got the feeling that this was happening as far as the flock

[41:51] and a lot of concerns, a lot of good information, but also misinformation. There's always all

[41:57] that. And so I, as the chairman, I had a work session scheduled with the law enforcement

[42:04] in the Ryan Center August 17th, 4 p.m. That's on a Monday. August 17th, 4 p.m., the public

[42:13] is invited. At this time, we'll be requesting him to answer a lot of these questions

[42:19] that you have presented so that we can understand the way this works I know you

[42:26] most of you don't come to most of our meetings and I get that when I was not a

[42:30] commissioner I didn't come either I depended on these guys that were sitting

[42:33] up here to do what was right when we had the flock contract main mainly what we

[42:41] do we had discussion with the sheriff he had pretty much said it was a good

[42:45] tool our legal part of it is to make sure our attorney goes through the contract

[42:52] to make sure there's no loopholes or whatever and it fits all legal

[42:57] requirements and then we vote on it. We didn't vote on it as to its effectiveness

[43:02] or that we depended on another elected official to actually implement this.

[43:09] So I think it's very important given the concern of our folks and we do

[43:15] work for you that you have that opportunity on August 17th to come and hear

[43:20] answers to these questions that you have. As a matter of fact I have one too

[43:25] because when I hear somebody like say makes a statement I won't know where the

[43:29] proof is or is it just hearsay. And unfortunately in our world with all the

[43:35] YouTube's and the Facebook's and everything there's more misinformation

[43:39] out there than there's actual fact. So we'll depend on our elected

[43:43] to the sheriff and his crew to give us the answers straight from those that use it.

[43:49] And then we'll see what we actually end up doing once we get that information.

[43:55] And but yeah, yes ma'am.

[43:58] But

[44:01] you know what my questions are?

[44:03] Sure.

[44:04] If you want to send them to the clerk, absolutely send them.

[44:07] I think that would be very helpful.

[44:09] A lot of them already have come to us, but sure, if you can get them to us, we surely

[44:14] get them to them and have them answer those questions you deserve than answer.

[44:19] Yes ma'am. That's all I have. Thanks. That was good. Thank you for doing that.

[44:23] First of all, thank you all for coming out tonight and voice your

[44:27] opinion and everything and there always is two sides to the story and we try

[44:31] to get the groups together and make the best decision we can up here. Not

[44:34] going to make everybody happy. What I would challenge you to do this

[44:38] evening though is to go home and call a family member or a friend that

[44:42] you haven't seen in ages and it's getting older and whatever because you know

[44:47] once they get in the paper it's too late and I'm sure everybody out there has

[44:50] one person they've been meaning to call for the last month or six months or

[44:55] whatever so other than that that's all I've got this

[45:00] I need a motion to adjourn.

[45:04] A motion to adjourn the meeting?

[45:06] Second.

[45:06] Okay.

[45:07] All right.

[45:08] All in favor?

[45:09] Aye.

[45:10] Aye.

[45:11] The ayes have it.

[45:12] The motion carries unanimously.

[45:14] Y'all have a good safe evening.

Board of Commissioners Meeting

Transcript