[3:04] We're posting a set notice on the voter board. I'll give you a small complex and on the township website,

[3:13] a township website, F2N Township.org. Fire exits, which are clearly marked in the direction that we're pointing. In an event of an emergency or fire alarm, please move in a convict order in the manner that we're supposed to proceed here for the conduct of this meeting as this follows. A job can't be explored in and asked to describe their votes.

[3:38] In this year's we'll then have the opportunity to ask the questions on comments or suggestions.

[3:47] As the direction of the care the public portion will be over for questions and comments related to the application before the commission.

[3:55] Members of the public wishing to speak should come forward, state their name and address for the record and reach the point.

[4:01] in. Chair reserves the right to limit public comment to one five-minute session for application.

[4:08] At the conclusion of the public portion, Sara B. It's Patrick S. Wire, Attorney for the Commission,

[4:15] will summarize the conditions, suggestions and or approvals prior to the Commission's vote on

[4:21] the application. The historic Preservation Commission will complete all business, no labor,

[4:27] No new testimony or applications will begin after 10 p.m.

[4:32] Minnes of this proceeding are electronically recorded and a copy of the recording will be available for review at the HPC office.

[4:41] This time we asked it all cell phones be out of your turn off or set to vibrate.

[4:46] Commission appreciates the cooperation of all attendees in limiting any unnecessary noise during the meeting.

[4:55] Okay, Heather, would you please call roll?

[4:58] Yes, there were some time here.

[5:00] Listen to Highland here.

[5:01] Do you have any two percent female?

[5:04] There's no presence.

[5:05] Linda Henderson, here.

[5:06] Ain't going to kill you.

[5:07] Here.

[5:08] Also, presence are eight percent female.

[5:10] That's why.

[5:11] Okay, would everyone please rise and salute the flag?

[5:17] I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America

[5:21] and to the Republic for which it stands.

[5:24] one nation under God, indivisible with liberty and justice for all.

[5:32] Thank you.

[5:35] The first application that you're going to be carrying this evening is for 104 Clark.

[5:42] Would anyone who is going to be test-fired?

[5:45] What?

[5:46] Hold on.

[5:47] Hold on.

[5:48] We want to do this first.

[5:49] You can just do them with me.

[5:51] That's it.

[5:52] All right.

[5:52] before you so we can kind of come on up and get yourself settled. What we're

[5:56] going to do is we have three reports for memorialization, 146 Lawrence, 144

[6:03] Lawrence, 142 Lawrence. These are applications from New, two and a half

[6:10] stories, single family homes. We've heard these applications at the last

[6:15] meeting and now we are going to memorialize their approval or acceptance. I need

[6:21] emotion to truth, ball three, ball three, as written?

[6:27] I'll second it.

[6:28] All right.

[6:29] Heather, you want to call roll?

[6:31] Yes.

[6:31] Thanks.

[6:32] Deborah's up, Jeff?

[6:33] Yes.

[6:33] Linda?

[6:34] Listen to Highland?

[6:35] Yes.

[6:36] Jeffrey Rudolph?

[6:37] Yes.

[6:38] Jennifer Babson?

[6:39] Linda?

[6:40] Yes.

[6:41] Jane Gordon-William?

[6:42] Yes.

[6:43] Okay.

[6:44] Great.

[6:45] And also, if I would have learned to read my agenda, I wouldn't have brought you guys up

[6:49] your system.

[6:53] One item of new business that will only take two minutes. We had a contractor

[7:01] who came into the HPC office with a new product. One was for a new decking material or a

[7:09] portage-tongue group material, and the other was for a railing system. We asked if every

[7:18] Every member of the board could come by and review these products in person.

[7:24] As you know, there's a lot of new products that are coming on the market.

[7:28] Our criteria for these new products is how closely these new products resemble the original

[7:35] materials that were used historically in Oshu Road.

[7:38] So in reviewing the Timbertech tongue and groove, the members who came in to review it said

[7:49] favorably that the appearance of this particular product was acceptable.

[7:56] Is there any member who'd like to add to that or can we vote on accepting this new product

[8:02] does something that we would agree to approve in new applications.

[8:09] This is the 10th or 10th time they need to be exploring material.

[8:13] So what I did is in motion to approve this material.

[8:17] I need a second.

[8:19] All right. And I think we can do it.

[8:22] Linda. And I think we can do it.

[8:25] Are we accepting all the colors?

[8:32] What were the colors that we reviewed you on the list, Heather?

[8:35] There were three, right?

[8:39] Yeah.

[8:39] So was that something that you all agreed on?

[8:42] Yes.

[8:43] Yes.

[8:43] Wal-Hawgene.

[8:46] I know.

[8:47] I can't either.

[8:49] It wasn't.

[8:50] It was written on the city.

[8:52] It was written on the city.

[8:53] It was written on the city.

[8:54] It was written on the city.

[8:55] There was a one that was very mahogany in color.

[8:58] There was one that was had gray tones.

[9:00] And there was one that had more soapy tones to it.

[9:07] We certainly do that because the only ones that this commission looked at were the three

[9:12] that were brought in by the contractor, true, and we thought they were all accepted and

[9:17] we thought they were all three acceptable.

[9:18] So the only thing we need to do is clarify what three that's right.

[9:22] That's the only thing we need to do is clarify what three that's right.

[9:25] And that's all.

[9:26] Those are the only ones that we prove were those three.

[9:29] Okay.

[9:29] Thanks.

[9:31] Then the other thing was the porch rally act that was through the, they did, okay, all right, so I don't even have to go through.

[9:45] So Deborah, yes.

[9:48] Listen to Highland, yes.

[9:50] Jennifer, what up?

[9:53] Linda Henderson?

[9:54] Yes.

[9:54] Jane Gordon, really.

[9:56] Okay, so that would be an item that if it is applied for, we would consider it on the informant.

[10:03] All right, now we can get to the first application, which is, yeah, I've got a work clerk.

[10:16] But now I've got over here, that's $69.00, yeah, I guess,

[10:27] we sent you out to us as one of my

[10:30] I am so sorry

[10:34] That's the one drive and also as I'm looking at the one-drive dance is one of four carcassyls this first

[10:46] Okay

[10:50] All right

[10:51] Good evening

[10:54] Jeff, you mean, I mean both are slowing down a lot,

[11:03] the drawer is slowing down right underneath me,

[11:05] okay, talk.

[11:16] It's May, but I have currently on here.

[11:19] So the Carolyn is the only person who really needs to be sworn in.

[11:23] That's the way they expect to be.

[11:24] Gotcha.

[11:26] Okay.

[11:27] Better like that.

[11:28] I think you're right.

[11:29] Do you swear or affirm that the test money will be giving tonight will be the truth or not.

[11:34] Yes.

[11:35] Thank you.

[11:36] And I've got you.

[11:37] Thank you.

[11:38] All right.

[11:39] So we get started.

[11:41] Heather, can you put up the visuals for this particular?

[11:53] I don't know where I'm going to look at first, the sandboards or do you want to go straight

[11:57] to the areas that are going to be demolished on this building?

[12:02] Let's start with the sandboards.

[12:03] Do you guys just look?

[12:04] I would ask.

[12:05] Good place.

[12:06] Do you have a good mind?

[12:07] Yeah.

[12:08] I think that's easiest.

[12:09] All right.

[12:14] You know, sandboards aren't terribly precise, but you know, they're good.

[12:21] general information. So this is 69 Benson. It's a corner lot at Marie and then

[12:31] Marie jogs and it doesn't go through any longer. But you can see here clearly

[12:38] the 1890s and born is nothing to do with the print of what it's now. So nothing

[12:45] was there then?

[12:48] Caroline, can we speak into your question?

[12:51] Yes, sorry.

[12:52] So

[13:08] this is the 1905 map.

[13:12] The footprint of this is in keeping with much of the footprint that's there today.

[13:20] There you can see a porch on the, I wonder if this is the northwest side where the entrance

[13:27] to the house is, that's consistent with today.

[13:31] The general mass is somewhat consistent, the bump to the back, there is a bump to the back, but we're not sure if it's exactly in the same location, but once again I'm not sure how precisely accurate it is.

[13:45] And

[13:48] then we can go to the,

[13:53] it's nice that they're online now isn't it?

[13:57] So, this is a blow-up.

[14:02] Yeah, I blew this up so you could see it, the resolution is not very good, but you could see it relative in scale to what the 19.

[14:19] So here's the 1930.

[14:23] Now you can see that there is a bump out on the front of the house, facing Benson, that did not exist previously.

[14:32] You can also see the back of the house has a whole different configuration in there.

[14:38] And we're going to talk more about the evolution of the construction of the house.

[14:45] So we can go to the...

[15:09] Okay. Actually, I'll go to the photographs before we go to the calculations. If he scrolled down, yes. Okay. These are the photographs that are included in the submission. I also have them printed at a larger scale. If we need to reference anything more closely. The upper left photograph is showing from an angle, the front facing, and you're also seeing the north side,

[15:38] which is very hard to get a photograph of because the houses are so close together so that's the best I can do.

[15:44] The middle photo on the top is the front elevation, which is what the house looks like today.

[15:52] My photographs are the front steps and the stoop in these photographs are very sad.

[16:01] deteriorated and rather rickety, I will say, but the homeowners have since already renovated that, so it looks much nicer I drove by it earlier.

[16:12] The photograph on the right is the side elevation, which is south, and the bottom two photographs each are looking at the rear of the house,

[16:24] two different angles where I think it's pretty evident that was all messed around with during

[16:33] course of time. So the thing about this house that's always been kind of striking is that there are

[16:39] eight steps to go up to the front porch and you can see it in these photographs that the renovated

[16:46] porch is the same way. I drove the neighborhood before coming over here just to really be clear,

[16:52] There is nothing in this area that is more than three risers onto the porch.

[16:58] There are a few instances where it's four risers, but there is nothing that is eight risers onto a porch.

[17:07] Also, in general, driving around, foundations are typically brick painted or natural.

[17:17] And that's not just in this neighborhood, but typically in Ocean Road, or it's a block

[17:25] that has like a faceted hammered face to it.

[17:32] And this does not have that.

[17:34] I have a photograph. I mean, you probably submitted that, but I did print one of the photos.

[17:51] I don't think I sent you this one, but okay, then one mark that is in an A1 and can you just describe where the one is?

[17:58] It's a blow-up of existing right-side view. Thank you.

[18:04] Okay, one. Yes.

[18:09] So, apparently just to be clear, that actually is part of the focus.

[18:13] Oh, it is.

[18:13] It's just the flow.

[18:15] All right.

[18:15] Okay, close up.

[18:17] So, identify the point that she wants like that.

[18:19] Yeah.

[18:20] So, we still should mark it because it's a blow.

[18:22] Yeah.

[18:23] And if you have the ability to zoom in, you can see it as well.

[18:26] I know that you can see it very well from this distance in your first place.

[18:29] But we'll see that the finish on the foundation is not a typical

[18:35] It's a normal motion row of foundation.

[18:38] And this is the yeast salivation.

[18:40] That is the right size.

[18:42] Right size, so that means it's the yeast.

[18:45] Right, that's on the side.

[18:46] It's the south of the base.

[18:47] That's on the side.

[18:48] That's on the elevation.

[18:49] Okay, good.

[18:50] Thank you.

[18:50] What's the though?

[18:51] It's painted a center block.

[18:52] Is that one too?

[18:53] Yeah.

[18:54] Doesn't it look like a perfect one?

[18:55] No, it's like painted and it's not.

[18:58] It's not.

[18:58] It looks like it.

[19:00] So, and also the window proportion, which you see,

[19:05] there. And again, it's just a blow up of this photograph. The proportions of those basement

[19:10] windows is not very, um, 18 million. They are rather 1940s-ish. So Marilyn is a year

[19:22] believed in it. Yes, house was raised. So it gets my belief that this was raised. It does

[19:27] have a usable basement. The homeowners do use it. You know, it's an asset from their perspective

[19:34] of attributes for house, but it is not original.

[19:38] This house has been worked with and manipulated over the years and does not fall into the

[19:49] category of the original.

[19:52] The other thing that's unusual about this house in the existing front view, the photo in

[20:00] in the middle, you can see the gable facing dense and is extremely steep in angle.

[20:08] Which again, I, in a house like this, that's sort of a bun's alone, but that steep gable

[20:17] is sort of alien, that steep gable goes more with a Victorian.

[20:22] So it feels like at some point, again, when they excavated it, raised it up, they probably

[20:29] we did a change to this gable because they thought it was making it more Victorian.

[20:36] So we have a little bit of a hodgepodge going on and then the other awkward result of

[20:41] this is the photo on the right which is again the south side view photograph actually makes

[20:50] it look better than it really is but you're seeing the gable facing Benson but you're seeing

[20:57] a hip roof facing the rear of the house, and it's particularly awkward in this case.

[21:07] You can sometimes have a hip when you have an L-shaped building, but the roof pitches

[21:12] are typically the same roof pitch, so they come together in a nice neat square.

[21:17] In this case, you have that very steep front pitch that we just talked about, which is merging

[21:23] with a shallower pitch, which again, we only can get this limited view of on the left side view.

[21:32] It's not a shallow pitch house, it's probably an eight on twelve, but that front pitch is like a fourteen.

[21:38] So it makes her an extremely awkward line where the two planes of roof meet each other.

[21:46] So once again, I don't think that was an original creation.

[21:54] So obviously the house does not have original sighting on it.

[22:03] This is a positive

[22:07] vinyl sighting.

[22:10] The shutters are not original.

[22:14] The windows were not really proposing to change anything in this demo application.

[22:20] But I think they are somewhat original, except for the bump out to the front because that didn't exist in the original line and the ones to the back and the shed dormer at the top.

[22:32] So there aren't non-originals, but probably the two on the south side and one on the rear side are original.

[22:43] I didn't mention that on the, so to me earlier on, you mean the demonstration openings

[22:50] are original or the witness themselves are original or we don't know yet.

[22:59] Yeah, they're not ongoing.

[23:02] You don't think so?

[23:03] Yeah.

[23:04] Okay.

[23:05] Yeah.

[23:06] I mean, sorry.

[23:08] Yeah, when you say you don't think the windows are original, are they all wood?

[23:11] Do they have storms?

[23:12] They take storms.

[23:13] They take storms.

[23:14] Are they all wood?

[23:15] I don't think so.

[23:17] I think I know the ones on the back are vinyl, okay, we're not, we're not touching, we're not touching, today's conversation, so I wasn't focused on that and I'm sorry, thank you.

[23:31] basement windows are clearly metal frames, there's nothing special. There is this

[23:39] unusual rounded roof thing on the backside of the house which shows in the

[23:46] lower left photo. Some previous owner was being very creative and thought this

[23:53] would be a really wonderful Victorian addition and way to influence the stair

[23:59] access to basement, so you know it's really special I don't know if we're

[24:06] ultimately going to remove it or not but it's not included in our calculations in

[24:12] first place because it's not a habitable space it's just an access to the

[24:16] basement and your ordinance excludes that from the calculations but just a point

[24:21] out with that brown thing is it looks like it should be a doghouse.

[24:26] But not counting to be clear, if it were to be counted, it would not increase us to above 50 percent or above.

[24:34] Correct.

[24:36] Okay, so that's running you through basically what exists.

[24:42] Then we can go back to the plans.

[24:44] What do you want to start paying for?

[24:56] Okay, so in the interest of trying to make this relatively clear,

[25:04] you did two pages of diagrams

[25:06] on the right side diagram, this drawing is about wall demolition, just walls.

[25:16] So the right side diagram is our calculating of existing wall surfaces

[25:21] and whatever all the various numbers are, they have heights, they have angles, variations,

[25:31] the overall wall area comes out to 1847.2 square feet.

[25:41] So that's the walls that exist.

[25:44] The diagram on the left, we've included dotted lines

[25:47] to represent the existing wall areas that we're going to remove.

[25:56] So on that diagram, the dotted lines that are sort of creating a U

[26:01] You've got to shed dormer on the second floor, the dotted line kind of down by the Benson area is just the gable wall area there.

[26:14] And the dotted lines in the back are taking down some of that mishmash of stuff that was done sort of along the way.

[26:22] Excuse me, is your calculation to keep referring to the wall?

[26:27] You did the roof as well.

[26:28] That's how the next step comes in that sense.

[26:31] It just seemed to try to simplify it over and explain it as clearly as I can,

[26:38] for something that is kind of complicated.

[26:40] Yeah, I understand using.

[26:42] And it's complicated because all of those different iterations,

[26:47] it's not like a simple, let's just chalk these walls off.

[26:52] the R application for 124AB, it was much easier that way, it's like both take it off.

[26:58] Here it didn't work that way.

[27:00] So the diagram on the left again, the dotted lines are representing what we're removing,

[27:07] which is a total of 409.9, which is 410 square feet of wall space.

[27:15] If

[27:18] we go to the next drawing, we'll come back to this one in a minute, but this

[27:32] is representing the same idea but in reference to the root.

[27:37] So, the drawing on the right once again is what exists. You see that funky gable that turns with that steep angle tip.

[27:49] you see the bump out to the front, you see the shed roof heading to the back and the other

[27:54] roofs that are down below the sort of the confidate of a roof life.

[27:59] And the diagram on the left is hatched with the areas of roof that we want to remove.

[28:06] Carolyn, can you just explain to me because I am always curious when something is chopped

[28:12] in the middle, what is holding up the part that stays? I mean, I can understand you

[28:19] removing on that upper left, all the way to the edge. How do you stop in the

[28:26] middle and leave a small sanction that will not be removed? That seems so okay.

[28:32] I was just asking you, if you can just describe it, put it in perspective. Yeah. Just

[28:37] Just identify, maybe you can go up to the screen there.

[28:40] Just identify where that front gable is, so that I work

[28:44] on to understand where the top of that front root,

[28:46] that I root, that has the steep pitch

[28:48] that you were referring to.

[28:58] This is the, this ridge is a continuous line coming through.

[29:02] This is answering your question.

[29:03] Yeah, that's fun.

[29:06] And then this is the very steep roof to the front.

[29:09] This is from here to here is the gable facing

[29:16] north which is a different pinch than this and that creates this awkward angle

[29:20] that we saw in photographs. But your question is how are we leaving this?

[29:25] Yeah what holds it up? Well it's it's a little bit of TLC it has to be held

[29:33] up temporarily with posts and shoring and then whatever it is that we're going

[29:39] to build will happen there and go up and of course that'll be a later application

[29:44] But it comes

[29:52] down to proximity to property lines, technically, so we don't want to do that.

[30:01] We want to fight to keep that because if we take it away, we can't hold it back.

[30:13] Yeah, it's just that I see what you're taking off is beyond the ridge of that small portion at the top. And I just question how that possibly hangs in mid-air. Well, it doesn't. It's going to have some temporary being with posts holding it in place. Yeah.

[30:36] Is that a flat portion? No, it has to look.

[30:39] So in other words, if the slope is like this and I'm taking it off to here,

[30:43] are you continuing the slope again?

[30:46] Or are you going up from the slope? I'm not understanding.

[30:50] Well, I think, obviously, that's going to be the application form,

[30:54] but I think we're going to go up from that slope.

[30:59] Okay. But for now, we're going to hold it up

[31:01] And then when we get, you know, into development of what we want to do, then it'll get tied

[31:11] if tied into the new structure.

[31:32] And that slant is lined at the bottom of that line there.

[31:36] So you're going to hold up that whole thing that way.

[31:39] That

[31:52] calculations on this page, the diagram on the right, which represents the existing room,

[32:00] is 752.2 square feet,

[32:06] once again, that excludes the front porch because you don't include that in your calculations

[32:11] and it also excludes the little round lower house.

[32:16] Can you just tell me where in the ordinance it says that only habitable space should be included?

[32:23] The first time this has ever popped up in the demolition here and that's my big area.

[32:26] I mean, I

[32:34] think it would be good for us to note that for seeing you demo helps.

[32:40] It's the first time I've heard that.

[32:54] This is a while ago, I would have to run time, but I'm a little bit anxious to see you.

[33:02] Yeah, I'm just curious.

[33:03] Yeah, I'd be happy to find it for you.

[33:05] Okay, you know, I'm going to talk to you at a tech review.

[33:07] That would be great.

[33:10] So anyway, the demo diagram on the left, the root that we are proposing to remove is 588.3.

[33:21] So when we go back to the previous page,

[33:27] you can see that the box, the previous page, the box on the lower left, has the total of the wall areas.

[33:40] as the 1847 plus the 1722 so the existing area we're working with is 2599 or 2600 square feet proposed demolition again for the walls is the 409.9 and for the group is the 588.

[34:07] Our total is 988.2, which is a bit less than 38.4 percent.

[34:14] 38.4 percent, yes.

[34:17] A demolition of demolition.

[34:20] I'm going

[34:24] to ask a question.

[34:27] I can tell already that our chairperson has a question about the weirdness of the roof,

[34:33] but because the way this system is set up, we must do demolition first before we see the application

[34:39] Which puts us in a position of saying yes to something and we're not sure what comes next.

[34:45] But correct me if I'm wrong in this question to you.

[34:48] Typically, once you get demo approval, you don't tear the roof off until you come back with an application that you've gotten approval for.

[34:58] So if you come with a roof form that doesn't marry politely or historically before we have here, it's not like we're left with an apology.

[35:06] We just have permission to make this myself, and then you will base your proposed addition on that freedom.

[35:13] Is that correct? That's correct.

[35:15] Okay, because it's an odd way that we are forced to do double-separate from the other group.

[35:21] They are integrated together in the design process.

[35:24] I want to make sure other members of the screen have, especially you remember here.

[35:27] I want to make sure she understands, and we're all in the same page, that the process doesn't kind of work hand-to-hand.

[35:34] I just tear it down and then build it up.

[35:36] Yeah, and you know, I think you're more realistic.

[35:40] I was just going to say, you can ask your attorney,

[35:42] yes, believe your attorney in the resolution,

[35:45] we'll say that then the list is approved subject

[35:48] to approval of a certificate of appropriateness

[35:51] of the modifications that are being proposed.

[35:54] We have a very large audience that isn't here,

[35:57] but they're on the hand right.

[35:58] And sometimes we just barrel ahead

[36:00] without explaining our thinking.

[36:02] So I want to make sure people can follow up.

[36:05] Thank you for putting it like that.

[36:07] Yeah, I'm perfectly aware of that.

[36:09] What I'm not aware of is how you hold up half a roof

[36:13] and then build the off of it.

[36:15] And how close are you to the property life?

[36:20] Certainly, it's included.

[36:28] Back where we're talking about the right point 7 feet.

[36:34] Point 7 point 7.

[36:36] Zero point 7.

[36:43] I mean it's kind of like it's kind of like taking off half a wall and leaving a piece.

[36:51] It's kind of like, and this is a roof.

[36:53] This is a roof that has a slant that here's the ridge and it's cut here and this little

[37:00] piece right here is simply hanging on.

[37:03] It's simply saying this is the roof.

[37:06] Yeah.

[37:06] I'm going to put a couple of cans here and here with a beam and I'm going to hold it

[37:12] and I'm going to cut the rest of this off and then it's going to go up and I'm going to hold it.

[37:17] All right until I come back with the next structure.

[37:21] That's going to, it's also very awkward that that line doesn't go straight.

[37:25] That line then jogs off.

[37:28] So you're going to hold that little angled piece and build up an angled wall from there.

[37:39] I'm just kind of having a hard time understanding, well I guess my question would be does that really fall under our curvy or what's that?

[37:46] It's like the architectural integrity.

[37:49] Well, we're going to make a determination as to whether we will or we won't improve a demo.

[37:55] I think we have to understand what part of the process is coming on.

[37:58] I have a question, Caroline, I'm looking at the drawing on page two, the dog one page,

[38:07] I think, on the left hand side.

[38:11] Right there, the little shaded area on the upper left corner of that

[38:16] property, that illustration on the left, that little angle line,

[38:20] it might correct that that is an angle line that's following the pitch of the roof.

[38:24] So if you build a structure on an angle through, if you get that angle line, because the roof has a pitch.

[38:32] So you could be building a structure onto a pitch, almost like a dormer would pop up the roof.

[38:40] So that angle line isn't just a cut in the, it's not an angle line, it's following the pitch of the roof.

[38:49] because that's a very low-age table to the left. I guess we're just tough to weeks.

[38:57] I don't quite follow that.

[39:04] No, but I like the clarification that this one makes sure I understand what you're saying.

[39:10] This is time with getting approval for that design because I understand that.

[39:17] And I mean the homeowners don't want to talk about the room for a year without having to have a next design.

[39:23] I see it sure.

[39:24] We're all trying to achieve the same thing, but yes, having it connected.

[39:30] So, and I didn't touch on the site plan, but you can see the survey is here.

[39:39] We are very close on the north side at the front of the property.

[39:44] We are one foot from the property line at the rear as we just said at 0.7 feet on the front of the house.

[39:54] There are 5.4 or 5.5 feet to the bump out that exists and there are about a little over 4 feet, 4.3 feet on the south side.

[40:10] It is a corner a lot, but Emory is like a dead end and goes into the back of the apartment.

[40:21] Okay, so that kind of summarizes the

[40:28] condition of the building.

[40:30] And our feeling is that we are not demolishing anything that is of such a sort of importance

[40:40] that it couldn't be reproduced. There's no original Victorian

[40:49] vernacular seaside architecture.

[40:54] And

[40:56] mostly interested in removing walls to the rear of the house, where it is not original

[41:04] in the first place. And mostly we want to remove roof of the house, which again we

[41:18] Jeffrey pulled out the tax records, they were talking about that, and Neptune has the house

[41:28] dated at 1920 as the year that was built, which perhaps, I mean, you see that it did exist

[41:38] in some form on the 1905s and more, but perhaps the 1920 date is the approximate time that it

[41:46] it was elevated and basement put in and that front bump put on.

[41:51] Sometime between 1905 and 1930, it's went all the way.

[41:59] So that's...

[42:00] Did you

[42:05] want to refer to your picture or not?

[42:07] I was just curious.

[42:09] I'm sorry.

[42:10] I'm dying trans.

[42:14] So if you can just describe what page 4 is identifying your plan.

[42:24] So page 4 are elevation drawings of the insisting house.

[42:29] And again, we are articulating vertical wall surfaces

[42:34] that are being removed with hatch.

[42:37] And we are articulating roof surfaces

[42:41] that are supposed to be removed with little dots.

[42:46] So this upper left drawer is front elevation.

[42:52] Again, where we set the front gable,

[42:54] The steep pitch gable is proposed to be demolished, the south side elevation, the walls are

[43:04] staying, there is nothing proposed there for demolition except for the roof.

[43:11] The rear elevation on the upper right, you can see that's where we are removing the walls

[43:22] or things that were arbitrarily added along the way and the section of the proof, showing

[43:31] the various points,

[43:38] nor side elevations, which again, photographs, can't see very well.

[43:44] So, check out how it's shown to be clear about stuff like this, the top, this left side elevation,

[43:48] but that's actually the elevation from Emory, correct?

[43:54] That's the Emory, so it's really the right side elevation as you've been describing it.

[43:58] Oh, I've been calling in the South elevation.

[44:02] I mean, they're too left side to tell me.

[44:07] I just want to make sure we're looking at the right side.

[44:10] I think the top one's the right side.

[44:12] I've been calling in South because it's facing South.

[44:16] Yes.

[44:16] And how's the face east?

[44:19] How's the front?

[44:20] Yes, west, west, west.

[44:22] How's the face is west?

[44:25] Yes, I've had to keep on.

[44:30] So I just wanted to clear something, when we're dealing with the top one that says left-side elevation, which is looking at it from the F from that way.

[44:39] You indicated there's no wall coming off. There's actually some wall that you can see there, but that's set back from the face of the wall closest to the right.

[44:48] Yes.

[44:49] Yeah.

[44:49] You should say right.

[44:51] Okay.

[44:52] The other side.

[44:53] Yeah.

[44:53] Wait.

[44:55] It's right and south.

[44:56] Yes.

[44:57] It's right.

[44:59] It's the yellow.

[45:12] I just want to be clear that those, those diagonal hatches, those are actually set back from, from, from, from the face. Correct, closes to the street. Yes, they, uh, are signed with the plan drawing here to see that they are set back on the street.

[45:30] And, and that's the same thing actually. That's the same thing with the, you know, the, the, the, the, the.

[45:34] north's left side elevation. You're not most of that wall staying. It's those

[45:39] in-set dormers that are being removed as far as wall space goes.

[45:44] Yes.

[45:59] So why don't we run into the findings of that?

[46:17] A is the classification of the

[46:20] structure. What is your opinion as to the classification?

[46:25] It's

[46:33] a key structure but I think it has been modified so much that I don't know the

[46:42] way to

[46:45] I

[46:50] think you've been interpreted, you've been submit on whatever you believe.

[46:53] I think you've strongly suggested, excuse me, that the original structure that we see

[46:58] on the sandwork map, the early sandwork map, isn't there in the long term.

[47:02] Yeah.

[47:02] And that whatever was left over has been pretty substantially modified.

[47:07] Yeah.

[47:07] It's very hard to determine perhaps what is, and guessing at what it was, is speculation

[47:13] at this point.

[47:14] question I guess that you've already answered is do you find any relevant valuable architectural

[47:21] elements that should or deserve to be preserved? I don't. I don't. I think that's enough

[47:29] for now. I would say it's another or a supporting structure. I mean it's trying to support.

[47:39] We hope that it's going to support better with renovations, but I think other, other, other.

[47:49] Wait a minute.

[47:50] No, we cannot justify it as another.

[47:52] So that's where a little difficult here.

[47:54] Because if we're another, we don't have to come together.

[47:56] Yeah, you have to be.

[47:58] So we're proud of you.

[47:59] We want to make sure we're...

[48:01] We have made those determinations of what is born on date is in order to classify it

[48:09] supporting or other or contributing. Now, we've presented

[48:12] stand-over maps at the beginning and you showed what felt as a similar

[48:17] footprint yet. So, I think that's really what we need to go by.

[48:20] So, you cannot classify as other. We can float

[48:23] and talk about two things. We were talking about what

[48:26] style it was, and we were supposed to, like, period it.

[48:30] Exactly. It's a style. There are some three styles of them.

[48:33] Right. No, no, but there is also, it's very hard to classify this

[48:36] as a queen, and I don't know what it is, but it's not a viable style, which is, I think,

[48:43] what Caroline said.

[48:44] Right.

[48:45] We're confusing that.

[48:47] Oh, period.

[48:48] I know.

[48:48] And it's some-

[48:49] Yeah.

[48:50] Was there a nice, just leave it go?

[48:51] And she took the coin and he had to turn it.

[48:53] Right.

[48:54] I do not-

[48:55] I don't know.

[48:56] Right.

[48:56] I don't want to put you in a box to call something to me.

[48:59] Yeah.

[48:59] But I don't want us to confuse the period with the style of the house, but right now it's very

[49:04] that comes from what style it is or what it was, correct. There's not enough evidence left

[49:10] to really say, oh, here's a clean-and, brow ball or something.

[49:14] Right. Right. Right. Right. Right.

[49:16] Sorry, I hope I didn't confuse things more, but I want to make sure we're not talking about

[49:20] two things at the same time. Correct.

[49:24] So, the semantics, just to clarify, the semantics on this particular style,

[49:35] But I think you kind of muddied the waters when you use the word other, yeah, so that would be straight away from that.

[49:43] I would agree.

[49:44] Because I think we have to do before this or jurisdiction one.

[49:47] Yes.

[49:48] Yeah.

[49:49] The Sanborn maps are straight.

[49:51] Right.

[49:52] Exactly.

[49:53] Building did exist.

[49:54] Yes.

[49:55] Yes.

[50:08] You're not aware of there being any state historic indication on this property.

[50:15] You're not aware of it being owned or having any history of any important individuals owning this property in the past.

[50:26] And as

[50:30] far as the items, the economical items, I mean, you did indicate there were some

[50:37] concerns with the steps.

[50:38] So, are there any concerns with any other parts of the structure standpoint of construction

[50:42] and availability?

[50:44] No, I think basic structure, particularly with the renovated porch, is structure on the

[50:52] sound.

[50:52] So we are happy to be working on it to prove it, so I think that's fine.

[51:04] And do you think the style as it sits here today is in keeping with the historic preservation design guidelines?

[51:14] As it sits today.

[51:15] No.

[51:17] And what you're proposing to be demolished, any of that within the historic guidelines that you're in?

[51:24] No.

[51:24] Not at all.

[51:31] Is there any questions that anyone on the board would like clarification on or just basically what tonight is just hearing for demolition?

[51:43] and you'll take vote on it within that then it's 90-60 days for a partial vote.

[51:53] So it's 60. I think the board should determine whether we have 60 or 90.

[51:58] Like I would say 64 degrees to 60 days.

[52:01] That's crazy.

[52:03] Do you go out and sit at the house?

[52:06] Do you?

[52:06] Or we have knowledge.

[52:09] We used to.

[52:10] Not

[52:16] lately since COVID, we have not to be honest.

[52:19] To be honest, the homeowner, or in this case you as their representative, if you feel

[52:25] it's helpful for our understanding, you can request that we come up and as such we are

[52:30] happy to respond to your request from the homeowner to visit the property.

[52:34] If you think it will help your case in any way, then the request will come from you to the

[52:38] administrator.

[52:39] Okay.

[52:40] And then she will say that it will come off for us to come up with it.

[52:42] That's a great thing to happen.

[52:43] We're happy to do it.

[52:44] Absolutely.

[52:45] But it's not required, so I think that's it, I mean, we used to do it in our team, but first day we were behind us.

[52:56] Yeah,

[52:59] so seeing that there are none.

[53:02] We need to pick a fund today, 60 days.

[53:06] So that would be, that would be, let's see that.

[53:13] So I'm looking at the calendar and how I have to do my notices, I'm not going to be able to get it in time for the November meeting.

[53:21] All right, so we have to see to December.

[53:24] All right, so we'll be on the December meeting that will vote on this particular demo application.

[53:30] Is that still December 8th?

[53:37] Second Tuesday.

[53:39] It

[53:44] would be 8 and it would be 8 and it would be 7.

[53:47] It would be 8 and it would be 8 and it would be 7.

[53:57] You will do the publications, you will do the property notice.

[54:03] Signs on the property.

[54:04] You will submit all of them to the other events of the next meeting of the separate.

[54:10] That's still 7 o'clock, right?

[54:12] Yes.

[54:15] Thank you.

[54:16] Thank you.

[54:20] I don't have the orders with me, but could it be a 907 that is even a partial demo of

[54:27] his at least 90 days?

[54:29] No.

[54:30] Okay.

[54:30] Maybe it could be so.

[54:31] It's 808.

[54:33] I think we're very wrong.

[54:34] Yeah.

[54:34] We always look.

[54:35] So it's 60, up to one point.

[54:38] You basically said this in a case of a partial demolition of any structure located within

[54:44] In the district, a minimum of 60 days to a maximum of 120,

[54:48] it just stands in case of a key structure,

[54:54] the commission may extend the waiting period,

[54:56] an additional 120 days.

[54:59] So it's 60 to 90.

[55:01] So it's 60 to 90.

[55:02] And in case of a key structure.

[55:03] In case of a key, the commission can extend

[55:05] an additional 100.

[55:06] One, an additional 100.

[55:08] You're going to have additional work.

[55:10] But we're not doing, but this is how to keep it.

[55:12] I extend the waiting period and additional 120 days.

[55:16] That was written.

[55:17] Okay, yeah.

[55:18] So we're 60 to 90, because the answer, right?

[55:21] Right.

[55:23] So the determination here was 60, which, just because of my notices,

[55:30] unfortunately, I have to wait until the answer, right?

[55:32] Yeah.

[55:32] We want to say 60 below parts of that.

[55:38] Yeah, I don't know that we've had a partial number way.

[55:43] All right.

[55:47] Thank you. Thank you. All

[55:56] right.

[55:57] Looks like you're up.

[56:01] Thank you.

[56:01] Thank you very much. Thank you.

[56:03] Thank you.

[56:08] Thank you.

[56:08] We are hearing point over work, Clark.

[56:10] The

[57:36] elder can't officially be here tonight.

[57:39] She's doing some health issues.

[57:42] She's very well aware of the topic.

[57:51] The property is located at 104.

[57:55] I know the homeowners are here for

[58:10] I mean he's doing it for both. He's the speaker for both. So, I just feel way of making him sit here through something that they always do.

[58:19] This is a very considerate thing to do I think if John wants to present the other case now

[58:33] We'll be fine

[58:35] Shipping here again

[58:42] Okay so

[58:43] It's written in

[58:49] touch with the state and the COA application.

[58:51] The date is 728.

[58:55] I know that's one of four of our.

[58:56] Sorry, we're only 724.

[59:19] Before that must have been.

[59:23] Ability that helps.

[1:03:47] A

[1:03:51] vote went out to the members. Right, I have a hard copy of my crew, which is

[1:04:05] much of a change from the update or. I mean the update was just a response to the. Responsed to the colored top, but the. Correct,

[1:04:16] but the original. I'm looking for the original application. I don't see it. I didn't get it.

[1:04:24] Jeff, you received it. I did not. And Linda, you.

[1:04:28] It's not relevant.

[1:04:30] Do you want to see what they'll are doing?

[1:04:30] All you get is find what they'll get?

[1:04:33] I'm just wondering.

[1:04:34] For some reason I promised.

[1:04:36] For some reason I promised not.

[1:04:44] For this guy that just wants to report

[1:05:43] tonight and explained the board has the information

[1:05:46] they need to make a decision.

[1:05:49] And all I asked our Attorney was are we putting ourselves in a precarious position to members

[1:05:55] of this board have not been able to review this application fully before tonight's meeting?

[1:06:01] I'm just about to pay for them.

[1:06:02] I'd like to.

[1:06:03] I'm just saying, and my answer is, I think that'd be the best thing I've ever been.

[1:06:07] I mean, I've got to kick back from, you know, obviously the cost of millions of dollars.

[1:06:13] But I'll play that violin.

[1:06:15] Wait, can you just have them at your office so we can pick them up?

[1:06:20] Oh, that's not for tonight's final.

[1:06:23] But my feeling is that as long as all the relevant information is presented to the board,

[1:06:28] and the board members are comfortable that they understand the application and feel comfortable

[1:06:33] and knowledgeable enough to vote on it. I think we're fine to hear it tonight. That's all I was

[1:06:38] concerned about. That sounds good to me. And if anybody is a counsel, I think that's fine. Thank you.

[1:06:45] John's going to present all the information we want. He's here to answer questions. Right.

[1:06:49] I hope it's going to be a professional soon.

[1:06:50] Okay, good.

[1:07:01] It's time to keep it exciting.

[1:07:03] I think it's exciting.

[1:07:05] Oh, thanks a lot.

[1:07:06] And you're fine.

[1:07:08] Thanks.

[1:07:56] There's people that I know who are there for that.

[1:07:59] Great.

[1:07:59] So as long as Sarah and I just find my hot ones,

[1:08:03] we're exactly fine.

[1:08:05] I just don't want to put this in the pool.

[1:09:46] Let's do it.

[1:09:47] I love it.

[1:09:48] All right, the property is located at Seminoleun Street in Ocean Grove with an HD OZO

[1:09:54] district.

[1:09:55] Existing dwelling is an example of the Swiss Shalent or Swiss Gothic Shalent style, Chelle

[1:10:00] Sainte.

[1:10:01] The owner is seeking a stripper of appropriateness for proposed addition and rehabilitation

[1:10:05] existing dwelling.

[1:10:07] The owner has received the approval for demolition of the existing cottage structure.

[1:10:12] The proposed product consists of the restoration rehabilitation and sensitive expansion of existing

[1:10:17] This thing's to a shallary style residence.

[1:10:19] The primary objective of the project is to preserve

[1:10:21] and enhance the architectural integrity

[1:10:23] of the original historic dwelling-water-facing

[1:10:25] and interior of college education.

[1:10:27] With a new top-led history structure,

[1:10:29] that better supports the long-term preservation content

[1:10:32] and continue residential use of the problem.

[1:10:37] We can go to the center.

[1:10:50] We've already had the approved demolition,

[1:10:52] but just to kind of show you just an impact that is on.

[1:10:54] The deteriorator starts over demolishing and replacing an addition of the 1939-1930 sand

[1:11:04] work map.

[1:11:06] It's set back from the brought from the main house.

[1:11:11] So the proposed addition is kind of trying to reflect that and keep that character close

[1:11:17] if you are initially there.

[1:11:26] Page 7.

[1:11:26] So this

[1:11:34] should be original, this is the existing home.

[1:11:39] The proposal that includes basically includes, you know,

[1:11:42] trying to maintain as much as possible or belong

[1:11:44] in front of the side with the exception

[1:11:46] of the second floor railing.

[1:11:49] We're proposing to put a code to apply a railing in its place

[1:11:53] and doing so and replacing the four posts

[1:11:56] that are holding up any of this structure.

[1:12:00] The railing has a, what we'll get into is I'm just to give you guys an idea.

[1:12:11] So all the details would be refurbished, you know, sand is refainted.

[1:12:15] That would be perfect.

[1:12:18] Page 9, another item.

[1:12:23] Another item that we're proposing is the siding.

[1:12:28] Siding is like extremely deteriorated.

[1:12:32] Throughout the surround, like as you walk around the house,

[1:12:35] there's areas where it's popped up.

[1:12:38] water has infiltrated. The owners also had squirrels and other rodents infiltrate the house.

[1:12:46] It's my opinion that the site needs to come down. Cheating needs to replace work damage

[1:12:51] and a labor barrier put up at this time. So these are just photographs.

[1:12:58] Just

[1:13:09] the existing survey and now before the next page school.

[1:13:16] And you still have that full room?

[1:13:20] That's the drawing for this.

[1:13:22] The end room?

[1:13:23] Yeah, the actual is only the

[1:13:36] approved set.

[1:13:37] There was a drawing that wasn't placed.

[1:13:38] There's only the clear room.

[1:13:39] So basically, what we're proposing is a 2.35

[1:13:46] being in addition off the rear.

[1:13:48] And then this addition on the, you sign in the house,

[1:13:51] the secondary porch to kind of reflect the initial

[1:13:57] But the home would be set back, and then on this side for this group was removed.

[1:14:03] There'd be a new group that is able to see that on the elevations.

[1:14:10] So, and then just go back to the initial package.

[1:14:16] I'm going to page 15.

[1:14:18] Just look around right here.

[1:14:28] 15.

[1:14:28] So, this is 13.

[1:14:30] These are just some conceptual renderings of the project.

[1:14:33] So, the big thing that's changing is basically this rally here.

[1:14:37] Everything else we're proposing to keep the same.

[1:14:40] These posts are raising up to every scene of 36 of Chinatown.

[1:14:44] What we've done here is basically have a more solid piece of the base

[1:14:49] between the rallies, like they really consist of that with the smaller rally.

[1:14:54] And then on the addition, we're proposing a different material.

[1:15:00] I'd like to kind of break it into the main house of Port and Baden.

[1:15:07] You know, the next page are

[1:15:14] going to be preserved, but we're going to get all the dates from certain next page.

[1:15:26] This would

[1:15:34] be obviously the addition, new window, a few doors, all of these were painted, basically, reconstitute preserved as much as possible. The rear facade, this is an existing window. This would be, we had talked about this a little bit, but they're not, we could include their knob.

[1:15:49] but I have included it and the investment was, you know,

[1:15:52] you felt it was necessary for the project.

[1:15:56] And these are just two smaller windows in each bathroom

[1:15:59] that's in the new addition.

[1:16:06] So this is how the base of this is the new addition.

[1:16:08] This is the lower roof intersecting with the main house.

[1:16:12] And then this is a completely new roof to receive that back table.

[1:16:19] Next week, you don't want the next elevation.

[1:16:23] So if these windows are all existing, this window is existing up to here when we're posing to make these windows bigger.

[1:16:35] And that reflects just that's where the kitchen would be, and we just thought it would be a really nice base to enter to bring light into the house.

[1:16:42] And also keep kind of the same precise and proportion of the adjacent windows next to it.

[1:16:47] Could we go back to see the addition side again in the case of the site?

[1:16:52] Sure, very.

[1:16:57] So the west side has, one looks like two windows at the top, two windows at the bottom, the main body of the house.

[1:17:06] And here you move to three windows, not the bottom, if you explain to thinking there.

[1:17:13] I mean, I think we were trying to introduce, you know, enough ways into the new addition.

[1:17:22] And, I mean, we just kind of set it up that it would be, you know, relatively, you know,

[1:17:27] creating a rhythm on the side of the house that's so visible from the street.

[1:17:31] Are you guys want to, like, the other side has two and two, those, yeah.

[1:17:37] Yeah, I mean, they kind of tried to, they kind of had three windows on the, on its face before

[1:17:41] it was demolished

[1:17:45] on the east side, yeah.

[1:17:49] But I think, I think less than this would kind of, you know, create, you know, too much solid

[1:17:55] surface as a, you know, from a dying person. Okay,

[1:18:02] done. Can you go back to the other

[1:18:04] elevation? Show side elevation that you showed before. Yes, west. Yes, west. I'm sorry,

[1:18:10] I should have been clear. Now that addition is where the roof drops down. That was a

[1:18:19] previous addition. That's not this, this is all existing now up to about here.

[1:18:27] This

[1:18:28] This is all because this window is actually existing.

[1:18:31] We're re-facing the roof to bring it up to receive the other table.

[1:18:35] We're trying to be kept that bridge lower than the main house.

[1:18:47] Looking at the rear elevation,

[1:18:51] is that a faux window on the first floor?

[1:18:54] Yes, I mean.

[1:18:56] And the reason for that is it's supposed to be a robbery line?

[1:19:00] No, the reason for that is just the program on the first floor.

[1:19:04] It's a kitchen, there's an oven there, so you can't even have it.

[1:19:07] know, so you're designing the outside of the house based on what the kitchen is laid

[1:19:11] out of.

[1:19:11] In this gear condition, yeah, I mean, it's one foot, it's two feet away from the property

[1:19:16] line.

[1:19:17] And, you know, the house isn't massive, I mean, there's not many places to put to put the

[1:19:22] kitchen.

[1:19:22] In my opinion, like putting it anywhere else, we consider reconfigurations, it would affect

[1:19:26] other windows in the house, like I thought, to carry it.

[1:19:30] To me, this was a good place to kind of, you know, whether that needs to be a floater or

[1:19:34] just a wall like the adjacent properties next to it.

[1:19:38] You know, the owners would be open to that as well.

[1:19:41] I just thought, you know, from a rear perspective,

[1:19:43] this kind of gives that rhythm of the portion.

[1:19:45] I think it's only how far away from the property line.

[1:19:49] This will be-

[1:19:50] Put a window in there if you could.

[1:19:53] I believe it.

[1:19:54] As long as it's so far.

[1:19:56] I believe it.

[1:19:58] You just said two feet.

[1:20:00] I'm sorry.

[1:20:01] I guess it looks very good.

[1:20:05] I believe it's three feet.

[1:20:08] So you could have a real window there.

[1:20:10] I think technically, from a code we're trying to be good, yes.

[1:20:14] Excuse me.

[1:20:15] I'd like to ask you a question.

[1:20:17] Could you clarify the difference between a low window

[1:20:20] and an actual window that she brought down in this slide?

[1:20:25] Yeah.

[1:20:26] If it's a real window that's been she brought in,

[1:20:29] and John, you can chime in on the second slide.

[1:20:32] The low window means that there's a solid wall

[1:20:34] and you simply frame out what would look like a widow with shoulders, but there is no opening, there is no

[1:20:44] fenestration. What you're referring to is something that is a real

[1:20:48] fenestration and an opening that the owners decided to simply she brought the inside and put

[1:20:54] shoulders on the outside. But if someone came along and said, I want that window

[1:20:59] open. It is framed out and it is true for administration. Is that true? I mean, that would explain what we're doing here. This would not be open. This is just a detail to find. It is just a faux window. Yes. Like a stage set. Like a... I'm just clarifying. It's outside our purview but John might know as an architect. I know that

[1:21:29] The fire department requires fake windows or windows that are closed off on the inside to be on record somewhere so that when they're trying to

[1:21:37] I mean in that case they're like is this work if you work yeah the window is still need to be accessible right so I mean in this case

[1:21:44] There's a there's a range and a hood and that's exactly we want to be able to move. We're just trying to answer the chance question

[1:21:50] What is your friend says? My question is that in this particular one this is in the rear of the house where it's not visible from the street we just let this happen

[1:21:59] in much more visible locations.

[1:22:01] Corner of Mount Carmel, New York, right in front of the house.

[1:22:04] The hotel?

[1:22:05] Yes, the hotel.

[1:22:07] Great.

[1:22:07] The hotel.

[1:22:08] With the auditorium?

[1:22:09] Yes, yes.

[1:22:10] As full windows on the side.

[1:22:14] I don't know if you can see it from the street.

[1:22:15] You can see it from the street is when you can't see it from the street.

[1:22:19] Well, I don't know that it's still pretty slow, but I think we're going down.

[1:22:22] I think the question is, would the commission be more open to a blank wall?

[1:22:27] We've been very out of this when we didn't walk blank walls, but in this case is a blank wall better than a fake window.

[1:22:34] Yes. Okay, so that's just my thing.

[1:22:36] Okay, so that's where I was asking, if members think a blank wall is...

[1:22:41] Because it's at the rear and close enough to the property line.

[1:22:46] My understanding is the homeowner has opted to do this to satisfy us,

[1:22:51] but would prefer a blank wall or would argue with it that's the consideration of the commission.

[1:22:57] I just want to make sure that we're not fighting over something that nobody's putting

[1:23:01] a fight about.

[1:23:01] Great.

[1:23:02] So if the tape windows are issue, you can be re-loved.

[1:23:06] Yeah.

[1:23:07] Like with a pen, but there's not a problem either.

[1:23:09] Right?

[1:23:09] Because they're not losing anything.

[1:23:10] Sorry.

[1:23:11] Yeah.

[1:23:11] Right.

[1:23:11] So it would simply be cited.

[1:23:13] Okay.

[1:23:14] Good.

[1:23:15] So I guess my question is when you vote, are you both going through whether you're voting on a

[1:23:21] blank wall or yes?

[1:23:23] A big one.

[1:23:23] Yes.

[1:23:24] Thank you very much.

[1:23:25] I

[1:23:28] do know, just to follow up, I do know that the Commission has allowed blank first floor walls in the past out of the rear.

[1:23:37] So it's not, we're doing something audio quality.

[1:23:42] But I think the homeowner and the architect have accommodated us trying to give us visual balance.

[1:23:47] But what it's creating is an artificiality, which is not a thing.

[1:23:52] So that's fine, I'm sure we'll be very good with it.

[1:23:56] Okay, thanks.

[1:23:58] Okay, a lot of fun.

[1:24:00] Heather, if you don't mind, the $2,900,

[1:24:03] just go up here soon and close the house.

[1:24:10] This is just not towards rallying detail.

[1:24:14] Basically, the custom-based, you know, kind of this,

[1:24:18] the existing railings first, as far as the owner can know,

[1:24:21] when he's at sprays, is that where, you know, very unsafe.

[1:24:25] We're just trying to kind of impose that same design aesthetic but like in a co-compliant way.

[1:24:32] So, this is kind of what we came up with.

[1:24:36] It's an x-raysing that a forward sphere can't fit through.

[1:24:39] These could be custom-rounded with bell balusters.

[1:24:43] That's the profile shown here.

[1:24:46] But all the existing tree width could be.

[1:25:00] Let's have any other questions or more.

[1:25:04] No, I was going to say, John, do you have a profile of what the current column set holds

[1:25:10] up that second floor look like?

[1:25:13] I mean, I see what you've got as far as your portrayal.

[1:25:16] I know what you have to raise and change.

[1:25:19] I just want to know, what is the profile of the current?

[1:25:23] And if you have it, it's in the Zoning documents.

[1:25:28] If you

[1:25:36] scroll down a second piece, it's

[1:25:42] here.

[1:25:44] So if you zoom in, I mean, I'm basically trying to replicate the profile exactly, except for this base here.

[1:26:02] So it's based on the basic, this detail, that's at the base.

[1:26:05] There's another detail on the top here.

[1:26:07] So we're basically raising this base up with that detail.

[1:26:09] It's impossible keeping this little trim down on the nose, you know, or just in the same location to the misty trim.

[1:26:19] I have a question.

[1:26:21] Isn't that current post two, doesn't it have an X profile in plan?

[1:26:27] Is it flat boards that look like they interested?

[1:26:30] The base is square, but as the base goes on the top of the base there's a one by board.

[1:26:36] On the corner there's two bone by board.

[1:26:38] My question is, is that being replicated or can that be replicated?

[1:26:44] It's not being replicated.

[1:26:46] So basically, what's happening is, I mean, I'm not proposing it to be replicated.

[1:26:50] This is up here, right here.

[1:26:52] There's two to buy being.

[1:26:55] And that two by being is supported by a one by host.

[1:26:59] Which I don't think is added, but I know it's not added for any type of structural building position.

[1:27:04] So what we're proposing is basically to double up the width of that

[1:27:07] to receive where the beam is, you know, in relation to that two-by-b, but keeping

[1:27:13] you know, the elevation perspective of the details consistent with what's

[1:27:18] existing. I know during one of the tech meetings or concept meetings that we

[1:27:23] had, we refer to a building, over by the park, Founders Park, where a various

[1:27:31] similar situation where the corner posts were too very wide, very detailed cut pieces held

[1:27:40] up, a very similar roof on and I know that it's new because I remember when we approved.

[1:27:48] Is there a reason that you would not have considered replicating what was there when obviously it

[1:27:54] had been replicated before and seems to be holding up a very similar structure?

[1:28:00] I'm not sure. I'm not exactly sure. I thought I think I thought the one that you

[1:28:04] presented to you was actually a square. It was replicated with a square, so maybe I'm thinking of a different one.

[1:28:09] Since 75 year olds were hurtful.

[1:28:11] And so we're on the central and, you can't see it out, this is the CPU or, they asked you to see if you were

[1:28:29] What

[1:28:32] is the difference here is that it is supporting a 1 by B. Whereas this is a 2 by B, I mean

[1:28:45] it is just not the load of that beam is just different than the 1 by 1 is a different

[1:28:49] detail.

[1:28:51] So in other words, those two, in other words, you could not replicate what you have currently

[1:28:56] on this house by picking on those two corn pieces.

[1:29:02] I'm just curious.

[1:29:04] What are you going to do to make the columns thicker?

[1:29:07] No, no, no.

[1:29:08] What I'm saying is that this is a key structure.

[1:29:12] It has a very unique corner column.

[1:29:14] I'm wondering why it can't be replicated.

[1:29:17] Basically, we're trying, in my opinion, to replicate as best as possible with supporting

[1:29:24] with what's there.

[1:29:25] I understand that it's been supported there, but I have to seal this, it's my professional

[1:29:30] opinion, I don't think that it's same.

[1:29:33] And we're not making it bigger, we're literally taking the same side profile and just making

[1:29:37] it wider.

[1:29:39] Okay.

[1:29:42] Thank you.

[1:29:49] other

[1:29:53] questions concerning the first floor porch and the underside of

[1:30:00] How you were handling it, because I think basically the, under the porch is simply just a large piece of lattice. It has no, footings, there's no framed lattice. It's just, what are you proposing?

[1:30:17] That was part of the indictment, I said.

[1:30:19] You know what I mean?

[1:30:21] Yeah, right.

[1:30:23] I mean, basically, there's sort of the fears

[1:30:26] that this could end for this house is set back,

[1:30:28] like I think eight or nine inches from the base of the...

[1:30:31] You can go down to the elevation.

[1:30:34] John, do you think that was because the porch was expanded

[1:30:37] at some point in time in the first floor?

[1:30:40] It's kind of unusual for the columns out to sit on pears, isn't it?

[1:30:44] Well, there's peers, there are beings running across in the porch slats or sitting on top.

[1:30:50] I mean, I guess an ocean droid might be a little uncommon, but I mean, traditionally an aid extension over a peer is totally suitable for the church itself.

[1:30:59] So just to clarify what you said, there are supports that are sitting on a peer, but the supports come forward in the peers.

[1:31:07] So from the street, you don't see a peer on the jack.

[1:31:17] So here I mean we're basically proposing to do, you know, an eight inch surfboard with

[1:31:22] these at ground and these at lattice, square lattice.

[1:31:37] There's not a gutter kind of thing, but so basically the thought here was basically we're

[1:31:41] going to place the existing location to be more of a cottage, I think the house itself

[1:31:48] we're not changing any of the downsides and then there's a gutter that runs from here to the

[1:31:53] hollow along the side of the house currently that's no longer needed because of the change in

[1:31:58] the roof condition. So basically there's your gutter here that runs down will be a new gutter by

[1:32:02] this pier, this for this roof and then all the existing other gutters are going to remain or the

[1:32:08] downsides. I mean to not do that would actually affect the grading and the drainage on the side which

[1:32:14] trying to avoid. So the one story moved at the addition door that comes down the

[1:32:21] collar, which turns back to the body of house.

[1:32:25] Directly to the right door.

[1:32:30] We

[1:32:30] either would come down this column later, you were saying to go back to the house

[1:32:34] and we generally asked whenever possible to return to the body of house because

[1:32:38] that's what we typically see historically. In this case, I don't think that would be an

[1:32:42] issue. I mean, it's only like a three foot six. So the pitch would be

[1:32:46] suitable to be less long. Okay, great.

[1:32:58] No, I don't see anyone either on well, you don't really have much public

[1:33:03] However, I would like to comment just the sake of the meeting. I'll

[1:33:08] open it to the public saying that there is no condo.

[1:33:13] I

[1:33:17] think there was an issue as far as the rally to see I said that

[1:33:21] that was an amendment to your application to pay

[1:33:23] into talks in the real estate suppose to leave you.

[1:33:26] Yes, that's correct.

[1:33:27] Any

[1:33:36] other questions, any comments?

[1:33:38] I think it's beautiful.

[1:33:43] I think it's very sensitive.

[1:33:47] I want to sort of applaud you for listening very carefully

[1:33:53] to feedback.

[1:33:55] Tech, of course, doesn't speak for the entire commission,

[1:33:59] but you listen very carefully to what

[1:34:02] That has been said in text, so I appreciate that.

[1:34:05] I would agree with Deb.

[1:34:07] I think that rear window could be illuminated

[1:34:10] and that would scoop the way a little bit for this.

[1:34:13] The house is very small.

[1:34:14] I don't think you have a big giant wing wall back there.

[1:34:17] Your neighbors have wing walls.

[1:34:18] It's not going to be a lost thing, anything.

[1:34:20] And I think it will be more fitting

[1:34:24] with this particular key structure, if it's real.

[1:34:32] Any other thoughts?

[1:34:34] Not really.

[1:34:37] So can I just clarify that most of you will be to approve with two conditions, one to remove the rear,

[1:34:45] fake with the bow and the first floor, and two round the downspap on the gutter on the

[1:34:54] addition to the body of the house.

[1:35:20] I'm going to reluctantly say yes, I really feel that this is a preservation ward and

[1:35:28] I think it's very important to try to replicate something especially that's on a key

[1:35:34] structure. I'm really not happy with the columns on the second floor. I understand what you're saying,

[1:35:40] but I've seen it done on other houses and I don't really quite understand why I can't have it here.

[1:35:46] I think we're losing a very important element, a very important feature of this house.

[1:35:52] I

[1:35:56] know we keep calling it a key structure, but there's really going to be very little left

[1:36:03] in the

[1:36:04] Highland, yes.

[1:36:06] Jeffrey Riddell.

[1:36:08] Yes.

[1:36:10] Can you see it from Babson, Linda Anderson?

[1:36:12] Yes.

[1:36:13] Gangward and Julia.

[1:36:14] Yes.

[1:36:15] We'll be very super rude.

[1:36:18] Okay.

[1:36:19] Congratulations.

[1:36:19] There's the next time.

[1:36:20] I'll get right along.

[1:36:22] Not, not, not.

[1:36:24] I think there's anything other better.

[1:36:26] I know that in the field,

[1:36:28] oftentimes, details can be

[1:36:30] The rescue had created and craftsmen are abounding in this town doing extraordinary work, so I can't wait to see how this turns out.

[1:36:42] I think it looks complex.

[1:36:44] Thank you.

[1:36:45] You know, because other stuff will take full plants and stuff you wanted to save.

[1:36:49] Thank you.

[1:36:50] The second floor.

[1:36:51] Thank you for your patience.

[1:36:52] All right.

[1:36:52] Thank you all very much.

[1:36:53] Thank you.

[1:36:55] I'm counting to see you.

[1:36:57] You want to try that again with a little feeling?

[1:36:59] I'm going to miss you guys.

[1:37:02] I'm going to miss you guys.

[1:37:03] I think you can.

[1:37:04] Please don't call.

[1:37:06] Thank you.

[1:37:08] Thank you.

[1:37:20] You're

[1:37:24] just sworn in already.

[1:37:27] We're just using the exhaust.

[1:37:29] We just want to go in.

[1:37:30] I said earlier,

[1:38:43] you're going to hear

[1:38:44] some health concerns.

[1:38:47] She has been a cover presenter in the air place.

[1:38:51] So the product that one of the floor clerk has, you know, should grow in the HDR-1 zoning

[1:38:57] district.

[1:38:58] A lot is currently being taken.

[1:39:01] The owner is seeking a certificate of appropriate answer to the proposed new construction,

[1:39:05] 1,900 feet, except for the single-band tone, the proposed structure is 2.5 storities, a lot

[1:39:12] covered for both the 62 percent and 85 million.

[1:39:16] The front-board setback is proposed at 7th, the building setback, in the building height of 29.25

[1:39:23] and the initial proposed.

[1:39:26] The residents can see there's an interpretation of the American force vertical drawing from

[1:39:31] early 20th century pressure and precedence.

[1:39:34] The design of the size of the discipline proportion and balance symmetry traditionally associated

[1:39:39] to force for technology, express through a strong,

[1:39:42] with advanced in composition,

[1:39:44] broad-headed reform, centered around,

[1:39:46] spent together established,

[1:39:48] timeless, recognizable, architectural presence.

[1:39:52] The home's composition is intensely grounded

[1:39:54] in horizontal character of the overhangs,

[1:39:58] articulated e- brackets, and accounted for from the porch,

[1:40:01] the reinforcing influence of the classical movement.

[1:40:04] The porch served as both an architectural,

[1:40:06] very social, threshold, threshold,

[1:40:08] creating a layer of transition between the public street statement,

[1:40:11] private interior of the residence, prominent de-ocean growth

[1:40:14] or architectural impact, it's

[1:40:29] just the existing law.

[1:40:31] This picture I wanted to point out will get into a little bit

[1:40:34] but explain that to you a lot of folks on the matter.

[1:40:37] So the site itself has a unique top topography

[1:40:41] for ocean probe, it runs it out from the top here,

[1:40:46] about over here, over 14.

[1:40:49] So the challenge basically, you know, setting the house where we could it would be in relation

[1:40:54] to the stairs and fence surrounding topography because of the retaining holes on the root

[1:40:58] wire.

[1:41:00] So basically we try to lower it to match, you know, the existing, there are seven risers

[1:41:04] here as you can see in the proposed one by seven.

[1:41:07] So we did that by stepping down from the side of the house to the two steps to get to that

[1:41:12] level where you basically be matching what's happening to you.

[1:41:15] on the adjacent property through

[1:41:19] the next page, please.

[1:41:33] This page 6, yeah?

[1:41:35] Yeah, that's the facility.

[1:41:36] I want to call it here.

[1:41:38] This is a similar condition for adjacent property.

[1:41:41] We went through this, basically, if the wall gets a certain height,

[1:41:45] if the setback further from the point where it's connected,

[1:41:47] so the page

[1:41:55] 7 keeps moving.

[1:41:59] So here are just some things to call it.

[1:42:02] We're proposing a 15 foot setback adjacent home

[1:42:06] is about 660.4 feet, and then we're proposing a set, but the board set back to the adjacent

[1:42:14] home is on the 8-point set. So trying to keep it relatively close, I don't think there's

[1:42:19] only either guidelines.

[1:42:36] Basically, the deep front porch, or with the home, we have a little

[1:42:42] bump out here to kind of pick up the east facade, or the east, and get the east facade.

[1:43:04] One of the questions that came up is how we're going to go through a closing e-scene

[1:43:08] is back here.

[1:43:09] I think it's rolling over.

[1:43:11] So the neighbor itself, now, with 48 plants, will be a 48-inch fence here, and

[1:43:17] then home, sort of probably going to be pretty shielded in the back corner.

[1:43:22] We're on more defensive, but we're going to go with the thing.

[1:43:26] Here you can see basically when this step is just kind of how we're achieving that minimum

[1:43:31] that minimum access requirement to the home,

[1:43:34] I'll try to keep this side of the house,

[1:43:36] not showing too much of an endation.

[1:43:38] That level was basically driven by the code requirement

[1:43:42] of new construction for these to six inch exposure

[1:43:46] of the foundation before the sign did it.

[1:43:48] So that's kind of where we set it up, the minimum,

[1:43:50] let me kind of drop down to match the stairs

[1:43:52] and maybe it's a structure to kind of get it to be cohesive

[1:43:55] with a similar scale and property structure.

[1:43:59] for example. But

[1:44:08] this page,

[1:44:19] basically, I mean, the owner really wanted kind of a forest

[1:44:23] where ecology and looking around us, you grow, you know, we've got to, and from the

[1:44:28] yards, we're going to be, you know, an appropriate style for the home and property.

[1:44:38] As far as the, we've tried to keep it, you know, the dormant on the top, we replicated it

[1:44:42] here to keep it symmetrical from that standpoint.

[1:45:00] And then, so we'll be able to send our dorkers, and then this is great, and the facade, and the side to kind of break up. The facade will still keep a rhythm and form of the windows and this central piece that kind of connected all. And then the back, kind of, instead of elongating the home altogether, we're trying to keep it as a cubic form as possible. So this became a piece that kind of attaches to the initial concept, but sets itself apart.

[1:45:30] and kind of in a smaller, less, lesser-productive way

[1:45:34] for the property.

[1:45:49] So,

[1:45:58] I mean, in any of the construction, I notice you're

[1:46:02] constantly battling with, you know, contemporary lifestyle

[1:46:06] within a sort of, you know, exterior type of aesthetic.

[1:46:12] So really, really, we try to just make sure that there was, you know,

[1:46:16] a significant vertical rhythm, you know,

[1:46:19] everything kind of kind of consistent, you know, feeling towards this

[1:46:24] craftsmanship style, but adding it, articulating brackets, the two over one

[1:46:29] windows. In this part of the event, here's that door on the left, we changed the

[1:46:35] half glass, and

[1:46:39] we'll go to the next page that I think will.

[1:46:48] So here, I think

[1:46:51] some of the questions were, I think these were the phone windows again. In this

[1:46:56] condition on the rear of the house. This is a closet and it's not very visible from

[1:47:03] the street, it's so close to the neighboring property. Having this condition originally we did

[1:47:09] have windows here, but we were trying to add, you know, basically a more composed elevation here

[1:47:15] by adding yeast for avatars with the issues, but this is just a very important wall for the

[1:47:21] flying. She has a piano and a piece that she like needs to hang there. The way the house is designed,

[1:47:32] we tried different reasons, figurations, and there's a lot of windows already on the façade.

[1:47:38] So, you know, fitting this one piece of furniture and moving in packed other areas of the home

[1:47:42] negatively, and she really wanted to try to just, you know, again, remove the windows her first choice,

[1:47:49] but if not, to put something that articulated at least the

[1:47:53] penetration pattern and rhythm of that of this wonderful

[1:47:57] date.

[1:48:12] Basically, it made from, as far as the pores just

[1:48:15] nasorypheres, with these kind of craftsmen,

[1:48:19] but craftsmen columns, craftsmen style columns.

[1:48:22] And one other thing that was updated from the adenom that we

[1:48:27] have is just the windows were separated about four inches.

[1:48:31] You

[1:48:46] know, at age 21, there's some of the details.

[1:48:56] The design is kind of a, there's a walk around,

[1:48:58] I don't know if you drove, it's a craftsman style poem,

[1:49:01] based on the detail for a craftsman style.

[1:49:05] A craftsman or alley never hoping to wrap,

[1:49:08] from each staircase around to the alley,

[1:49:11] and one of these is,

[1:49:14] these are the interpretation

[1:49:16] of kind of a craftsman style wrap,

[1:49:18] if that would continue on the

[1:49:21] simple form,

[1:49:23] and

[1:49:29] you would have the 22.

[1:49:29] to just

[1:49:36] details for the, I think that one, the questions that he gets at, or the fences

[1:49:42] and their location. They're basically from the corners of the house out on the front

[1:49:46] yard, there'll be the 30 inch on the left, and then around the back of the house, just

[1:49:53] on that one side, we have 48 inch that means that the neighbor and the property will be

[1:49:56] engaged.

[1:49:57] Of

[1:50:08] course, that's all clear.

[1:50:10] Now, how about we start asking some individual questions before we start getting the

[1:50:15] On your color renderings, it's evident that there is spaces between the double windows

[1:50:28] and yet when I get down into your architectural details, there's no space.

[1:50:38] Yes, I submitted it as they did. I know I read it all the obligations. They're showing that form specific

[1:50:45] So they are individual windows and there is space between them

[1:50:51] Yes, they were always be individual windows

[1:50:55] I just

[1:50:56] Yeah, we just separate them to make sure that we're showing that form separation

[1:51:00] Okay, so there is a form separate

[1:51:02] Yes, typical separation. You'll see on any double condition. There's a whole line of states now

[1:51:07] So then I just should ignore the rest of these details.

[1:51:14] The other thing that I'm curious about, I did a little research on fences and how Neptune interprets fence height.

[1:51:23] They measure from grade, not from the height of a retaining wall.

[1:51:30] So all of your fences are too tall.

[1:51:34] Because you measure fence from grade.

[1:51:37] So the retaining wall becomes part of the overall fence height.

[1:51:42] I'm

[1:51:44] not sure if that's how I saw it clarified, but in general, we're at this point, we're just saying we're walking.

[1:51:50] I'm not showing a 30-inch fence here. I'm just saying we're proposing it.

[1:51:54] And what I'm saying is that when they measure fence heights they include the wall and the fence as the overall height of the fence.

[1:52:05] I don't need to disagree with you. That's not the case.

[1:52:08] That's what I read. I think that that would be a zoning determination.

[1:52:12] So even if it's okay, it is a zoning determination,

[1:52:15] but I certainly don't want to vote for something that's against the zoning.

[1:52:19] No, understandable, but if that's something that we need to bring away,

[1:52:24] like I do.

[1:52:25] I looked into it's measured from where this rate exists.

[1:52:31] So, in this case, like, we're leaning all that grade, it's going to sit on top of that grade.

[1:52:36] It's going to sit on top of your cane wall, which is where the grade is.

[1:52:39] So, you're claiming that that would be grade from where the...

[1:52:41] Yeah, that's going to be where the grade is surfaced.

[1:52:44] So, the idea is that I'm standing and it kind of leaves that way,

[1:52:47] is if you just have a wall with the same grade on both sides of the wall,

[1:52:51] then the fence is measured from grade.

[1:52:53] Right.

[1:52:54] So, when you're ever retaining wall, this is grade on that wall.

[1:52:59] So that the fence was a mom and it was a question that's the confusion because when the

[1:53:07] grade is the same on both sides of the wall the wall is included and when the wall is

[1:53:11] retaining it's graded to the nearest grade inside that retaining wall is leveled with the

[1:53:19] That's what it seemed to suggest in my research too, but again, it has to be amended and has to go back to the rezoning for a good one anyway.

[1:53:29] Right, but I don't know that the fence was included in the zoning app.

[1:53:33] It was actually one of these things that got kicked out in the clarify.

[1:53:37] Okay.

[1:53:38] All right, so do you have more questions?

[1:53:43] Now I'm curious about those faux windows.

[1:53:48] I'm sorry, I'm having a real version to this.

[1:53:54] I understand the faux window when you're very close to the property line and it's going

[1:53:59] to result in a blank wall of siding.

[1:54:03] And the faux window because it's visible is kind of a way of minimizing the impact

[1:54:10] of that stretch of sight, and get that.

[1:54:14] But when we start making decisions about somebody's furniture placement,

[1:54:20] as far as how the exterior of the house is designed,

[1:54:24] and really have an issue with that.

[1:54:26] Because someone can come in to us and say, well, you know,

[1:54:31] I'm putting in a huge library on this side of my house.

[1:54:35] I don't want any windows there.

[1:54:37] So I'm going to just put faux windows on the outside and then I'll be able to do whatever

[1:54:42] I want on the inside.

[1:54:43] I think it's a slippery slope and if they have precedent and I know we've done it before.

[1:54:48] There's a lot of things we've done before and I think we learned from our mistakes.

[1:54:52] I don't have a problem with faux windows when the reason for them is as I stated before,

[1:54:58] to eliminate a light wall that is going to severely impact the exterior presentation of

[1:55:05] the house, but to simply say, I can't put a window there because I'm a closet. I can't

[1:55:13] have a window in my closet, or I can't do. I'm really sorry, I can't abide by that.

[1:55:19] We just heard that they can take the full window out of the last house, and suddenly I can't

[1:55:25] remove them. Because these are on elevations that are on the street facing side.

[1:55:30] No, no, no, that's not true.

[1:55:31] No, no, no, no, no.

[1:55:32] They're in the house.

[1:55:34] And they're inside the house.

[1:55:35] And their side of the house is on a street corner now?

[1:55:38] Yeah, but that's not street facing.

[1:55:39] I mean, right?

[1:55:40] I mean, my question is, by the way, stand on the street,

[1:55:42] I can stay in.

[1:55:43] I guess it's not street facing.

[1:55:45] I'm not, I don't know the disagree with you,

[1:55:47] but from the owner's perspective,

[1:55:48] like, the adjacent house that was just built

[1:55:50] has a window right there too.

[1:55:52] So she's kind of saying like she wants to fight for it

[1:55:55] just because it's been approved right next to work

[1:55:57] on property.

[1:55:58] on that stage. I mean, same exact condition in the rear house. She has a fake window.

[1:56:03] Yeah, if you go to the existing condition. I want you to stay next. I just drove by it today.

[1:56:07] And we approved that. Yeah. If you go to page 5.

[1:56:12] It's in the 5th and this one.

[1:56:15] No, not the other.

[1:56:18] It's the one that was just built. Yeah.

[1:56:20] And the reason for the window was, was there a setback issue?

[1:56:25] and you know it's going to literally be in that

[1:56:28] it's going to look for it, it's going to look for it.

[1:56:39] I personally don't like to hit here.

[1:56:40] No, I agree.

[1:56:41] I don't want to hit here.

[1:56:45] I'm looking at it.

[1:56:46] Everything.

[1:56:47] I'm going to say this.

[1:56:49] So we're solving a problem for which there's all

[1:56:58] There are people of town who have pianos and have valuable instruments, they put the picture up so that's the one I just saw today.

[1:57:11] There's only a shutter. It's going to back right up to this in the same elevation.

[1:57:18] It's near the retaining wall on the side, it's near the side of the property that the back view that shows where that location is on the first floor tunnel.

[1:57:28] It's dangerous, I don't know where. That's okay, but we have a drawing here.

[1:57:34] Yeah, we can scroll that down. Yeah, we can just go down.

[1:57:37] Yeah,

[1:57:40] yeah, there you go, it looks like open, yeah, right there I do though. Yeah, but you can see every here.

[1:57:53] And the property line sits right there, well, but is it so it's not a good deal with your property.

[1:58:00] Can you get rid of it?

[1:58:01] You know, that's what I think.

[1:58:02] Why don't you get rid of it?

[1:58:04] No, the other for first, this was kind of a sensual

[1:58:08] with the power dance.

[1:58:10] Without the blood, isn't that...

[1:58:13] Just to be clear, the first time we actually

[1:58:17] we made other planning changes, significant planning changes.

[1:58:21] But there's a lot of glass in front of the size of the home

[1:58:25] and out of glass of proposing, like she has no wall space.

[1:58:28] I mean, it really is like the only place.

[1:58:31] She's a musician, it's basically like...

[1:58:33] It's very specific to the program requirements.

[1:58:37] I'm just curious.

[1:58:39] So John, that little window there by the door, that's where the piano is going to go.

[1:58:44] What about the two windows that are just around the corner?

[1:58:48] I mean, this is the kitchen.

[1:58:49] No, those two windows right there.

[1:58:51] No, no, no, no.

[1:58:52] The bump box.

[1:58:53] The back room.

[1:58:55] The back porch.

[1:58:56] The side view.

[1:58:57] You're right.

[1:58:58] You're right.

[1:58:59] You're right.

[1:59:04] They're not going to affect this piano in any way.

[1:59:07] No.

[1:59:07] The panel is going to be sitting on this wall.

[1:59:11] Oh, it's an upper right?

[1:59:12] It's an upper.

[1:59:14] So five plus three.

[1:59:16] Okay, please just finish this.

[1:59:17] Yes.

[1:59:18] Yes.

[1:59:19] So these phone windows, which don't feel distorted to me, but why is not white?

[1:59:30] Is there a consideration of putting the registration in the air to leave the sheet?

[1:59:35] How do you remove the tape that he has to want to make?

[1:59:37] After it pulls out, it just acoustically.

[1:59:40] And she can choose me next and say,

[1:59:41] I can trust her.

[1:59:42] Or if she's just worried about the acoustics of the nature.

[1:59:45] Even though the sheet right there?

[1:59:48] I believe so.

[1:59:51] But there are acoustic panels that can be put...

[1:59:56] I'm not making any suggestions to me.

[1:59:58] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[1:59:59] Yeah, I'm just like...

[2:00:00] abstain, if that was a consideration. I will, I'll back up a little bit.

[2:00:09] You started by saying

[2:00:12] that it's a American core square with head craftsman influences, and it certainly looks

[2:00:17] that way from the front. And then, that style evaporates. Can you turn the corner or look

[2:00:25] in the other side of the plate.

[2:00:27] We've lost any low squad horizontal element.

[2:00:32] It's just a front entry that has

[2:00:34] those North Square columns.

[2:00:37] To turn the corner, we have a very tall, very vertical

[2:00:43] building here.

[2:00:44] I think American Force Square is not what I would call it.

[2:00:48] Perhaps it's an only in the front port.

[2:00:50] I know you have a very challenging site,

[2:00:54] The topography is such that they're going to get some height there.

[2:01:01] I don't know, that little projection seems smaller than I would expect.

[2:01:04] The house is big.

[2:01:09] This projection, I guess, goes from window to stack.

[2:01:13] I think this is...

[2:01:16] It does not look like other historic homes we see,

[2:01:20] except from the front.

[2:01:22] And that's...

[2:01:23] That's sort of...

[2:01:27] There's no name.

[2:01:28] Not saying it's going to sink the project,

[2:01:30] But all of this horsepower and symmetry and sort of squat elements that we expect to see in

[2:01:39] force groups, it just evaporates when we need the front of the house and that's problematic to me.

[2:01:45] And not a huge family, but we can improve them in an elevator shaft where the house had to have an

[2:01:52] elevator for someone with 88 requirements and we can improve them at the back of the house

[2:02:05] But this is a little strange, and you have two of them, but this is one we know is one on the west side of the second.

[2:02:18] And the west elevation demonstration is absurd when you think of American horsemen.

[2:02:24] There's a bunch of little tiny windows there.

[2:02:26] It's very strange to see if we can see the other elevation.

[2:02:29] And we scroll to that page.

[2:02:31] Page is that?

[2:02:32] That's one.

[2:02:33] It's forward or back to this.

[2:02:35] It's the other side of the building.

[2:02:36] The west side.

[2:02:41] From this.

[2:02:42] Maybe the other way there.

[2:02:43] Jeff, there's it.

[2:02:48] What are we missing in time?

[2:02:49] Somewhere in there.

[2:02:50] Let me talk about the elevation for the...

[2:02:53] You have to go to the color elevation to see the west.

[2:02:55] I'm sorry.

[2:02:56] Is that in this packet or in a different file?

[2:02:59] No.

[2:03:04] before we leave that elevation those two small windows on the first floor is

[2:03:09] they're going to be a fireplace there is that way there that's correct I'm

[2:03:13] gonna see if that's why I'm curious because that's also because we have the

[2:03:22] vent but she's actually considering what the electric and science we don't know

[2:03:27] and the reason for the two windows above it not matching any of the

[2:03:32] the other windows in that elevation between the two second floor above the squares.

[2:03:42] Why are they so small comparatively?

[2:03:45] I mean, in terms of American four squares is a half an eleven one.

[2:03:52] All the windows are the same size, no matter where they are, which is a problem for the most

[2:03:59] part that they are the same size. I'm just curious to know why on the second floor you made that

[2:04:05] so small. I mean it was, it's a reflection of, you know, how we're planning the space.

[2:04:11] Again, interior, but the bed? Yeah. There we go. Okay.

[2:04:18] I think, you know, and we're all faced with,

[2:04:20] if you live in Ocean Grove, they always design houses from the outside in. So you're left with

[2:04:27] awkward places to put pieces of furniture, but the exterior of the home is what we are

[2:04:32] concerned with. And so the exterior of the home has got to be historically appropriate.

[2:04:38] And those two windows, regardless of what furnishings are going on the inside, don't match up with

[2:04:45] the rest of that elevation.

[2:04:53] I would say, like, I understand you like your house, but I've walked around and looked at every

[2:04:58] force for an ocean growth, and every one that has a lot like 60 feet, when the American

[2:05:03] force for a condition, it was a square house, that was relative to a lot of location.

[2:05:07] Most American forcewares that have this front technology in ocean growth, I mean, they,

[2:05:12] all the windows are chaotic and random and different sizes on the side of the homes and

[2:05:15] others.

[2:05:16] I mean, it's literally throughout ocean growth.

[2:05:20] I mean, the house, the house adjacent to this, and then also on the street over three houses

[2:05:27] down that was just misconstruction, all of the windows are different, so I was on the side of that, so that was cool.

[2:05:32] That's the one that's happened to me.

[2:05:33] Stopped.

[2:05:33] Yes.

[2:05:34] That's it.

[2:05:35] I started home.

[2:05:37] It was the one that we allowed them to build up on.

[2:05:39] It's small.

[2:05:40] It's not.

[2:05:41] It's not.

[2:05:42] It's not a stir come to new home.

[2:05:44] I believe it's a new home.

[2:05:45] I don't know.

[2:05:46] Well, the core of it remained.

[2:05:48] Do you remember the one?

[2:05:49] Just the bottom floor.

[2:05:50] I wouldn't really understand.

[2:05:52] But my question is, yeah.

[2:05:54] on a relatively new construction because she just moved in for the last year.

[2:05:58] Right. The corner of Mount Cornwall and New York Avenue. We have in the House

[2:06:05] Faces New York Avenue at the very front corner on the south side of the house.

[2:06:11] There is a faux window right at the front of the house. I will have to have the same thing

[2:06:18] shutters. I would before I would even comment on that and I'd like to see the

[2:06:22] I don't know about how, so that's a chance in your house because there's a window there because it intrudes on the staircase.

[2:06:28] Oh, so we allowed it, and that...

[2:06:31] We didn't have any choice.

[2:06:32] We had to have choices.

[2:06:33] We did there.

[2:06:34] In COVID, let you put a window right through the staircase, so there's no choice but to put a photograph.

[2:06:39] Right, but it's like kind of a very prominent location.

[2:06:42] But there was an exception.

[2:06:47] Other than...

[2:06:48] But, again, we can't do that.

[2:06:50] So, wait a second.

[2:06:51] Let me finish, because we're talking about interior demands.

[2:06:55] You can't dictate the exterior concerns.

[2:06:59] But now you're saying staircase can dictate concerns.

[2:07:02] No.

[2:07:03] Code dictated that.

[2:07:04] We were super seated.

[2:07:07] We wanted to restore the window because we covered a window that was there historically,

[2:07:11] but there wasn't a staircase historically.

[2:07:13] The staircase has been put in later,

[2:07:15] and he said, I have to close it up.

[2:07:16] So in order to honor that there had been a window there, that was being closed by COVID construction.

[2:07:23] But it's still a gray area because it's still in the interior.

[2:07:26] I agree.

[2:07:26] The interior structure dictated the exterior as that.

[2:07:31] And we're applying a different standard.

[2:07:33] I don't know about that.

[2:07:35] We can't do something.

[2:07:36] The code says you can't do something.

[2:07:39] We can't override the code.

[2:07:41] There's one disadvantage.

[2:07:42] That was your case that would be built because maybe you'd had to put it somewhere right or maybe we could have had to move the stairs and

[2:07:48] there's an important little easy option with the house on New York, which is important because of that house

[2:07:57] historically had a historic fenestration that window was there had been closed up at some earlier time but was uncovered during restoration

[2:08:06] In order to acknowledge that there had been a window there which would have completed the

[2:08:11] fenestration rhythm, they agreed to put in a faux window because they couldn't restore

[2:08:15] the actual glass.

[2:08:17] Main staircase was added in like the 30s.

[2:08:21] So I hear all of that, but I'm still at the point I'm starting with is it's still an interior

[2:08:26] concern has changed the exterior.

[2:08:30] And you're saying in this case that my question to you is is I'd like to hang a picture on

[2:08:36] on this wall, a valid interior concern to modify a historic window.

[2:08:41] My historic window, not a brand-new window here,

[2:08:43] but a historic window.

[2:08:44] If someone said I want to aim a picture here,

[2:08:46] would that be sufficient reason to close up

[2:08:49] a historic administration and a historic house?

[2:08:52] I think the answer is no, obviously.

[2:08:55] And in this case, a picture is superseded

[2:08:59] by a code requirement or construction requirement,

[2:09:02] which is, couldn't have this window

[2:09:03] you know, cutting through a staircase,

[2:09:05] at a stair level, to what this would have done.

[2:09:07] I'm just saying, I think we're really

[2:09:09] at this slippery slope.

[2:09:10] That's what I think is.

[2:09:11] Well, let's back out there and go to the rest side.

[2:09:15] Let's go to the west side, and we'll

[2:09:16] just look at the window.

[2:09:17] The administration is here.

[2:09:23] You showed it somewhere on our way.

[2:09:25] So you basically, yeah.

[2:09:28] Thank you, Heather.

[2:09:30] There it is.

[2:09:33] Now, I understand the two smaller windows,

[2:09:35] fire place. What are these two small windows doing? You're on the first floor close to the front of the building.

[2:09:45] This is in the basement of the fire and then in the staircase. In a faux window above.

[2:09:56] And then two smaller windows.

[2:09:59] What are those two small windows? They're all bathrooms on the second floor. What about the first one? That's a bathroom.

[2:10:07] I

[2:10:13] remember a house with this kind of what we would generally call modern

[2:10:18] fenestration pattern that we have approved. Even in that room we have approved full-size windows

[2:10:25] that have interior shutters on the ground floor or something. If this is what the Commission thinks

[2:10:32] is viable and appropriate, then 100% they should vote for. But I know that this is unusual

[2:10:39] configuration before this commission.

[2:10:44] Other architects have brought similar

[2:10:47] configurations that were deemed odd or unusual or moderate and faced a fair

[2:10:53] amount of pushback from this commission. Again, this house is very close to another

[2:10:58] house. It may not be visible. It's a larger house on this lot that was originally

[2:11:03] there which creates some configurations that again are unique to this property and we

[2:11:09] I do say each property is judged on its own merits.

[2:11:12] Maybe here it is appropriate, but I would ask the commission

[2:11:16] to consider whether or not that's the case

[2:11:18] before the latent determination that, oh, it's fine.

[2:11:26] Guarantee this will come back to not haunt us,

[2:11:30] at least visit us again, because someone's

[2:11:32] going to use this as a model of a very serious house

[2:11:35] to your credit.

[2:11:38] You're very serious architect.

[2:11:39] that you do being serious projects.

[2:11:41] This will be a lot more for other houses.

[2:11:45] Again, there are bathrooms that make sense.

[2:11:47] You can want a smaller window.

[2:11:48] But a lot of houses in Ocean Grove have full-size windows

[2:11:51] that there are bathrooms.

[2:11:54] What do you do?

[2:11:55] I do.

[2:11:56] I mean, it's not uncommon.

[2:11:57] It's not like it's an oddity or something.

[2:11:59] No, it's not.

[2:11:59] Can you see directly in your neighbor's house?

[2:12:02] My bathroom.

[2:12:03] No, I just was not sure.

[2:12:05] I've got to be certain from a temporary standpoint

[2:12:07] for building a new shop.

[2:12:08] So, my last house, my windows looked directly into someone's living, so I put them on it, you know, because

[2:12:19] directly, the shower, directly, toilet, directly into all the private areas, the same as the bed.

[2:12:25] That's unfortunate, but when that project came before this commission and I wasn't sitting on this commission, I received the same feedback, which is

[2:12:34] Those are historic-shaped windows that should be there on the side of the house.

[2:12:39] Can I make them smaller?

[2:12:41] No.

[2:12:41] Yeah.

[2:12:42] You have to make them the size of this door so you don't need them.

[2:12:45] So if you want to take the full window out, this is the bottom right hand corner by that staircase.

[2:12:52] I think that you could probably push that through.

[2:12:55] I do.

[2:12:56] I think you could get away with the blank wall for Group GNO.

[2:12:59] I don't think that important of the side.

[2:13:04] That's a preferred thing, if you take that window off, it's a little odd, you don't have

[2:13:07] a shed roof or anything over that staircase, a shed roof, standing out over that platform

[2:13:13] would help dress down all a little bit, you see less flaky, you can notice it in that space.

[2:13:23] The second plate window on the second floor on the west side is a little more problematic

[2:13:35] I

[2:13:38] don't think that that would be very much.

[2:13:41] I don't.

[2:13:42] Okay.

[2:13:45] You said it was in a closet.

[2:13:47] Yeah.

[2:13:47] So I don't think a faux window is a necessity in a closet.

[2:13:51] I don't think anybody is going to be standing into their closet.

[2:13:56] I mean, again, I do.

[2:13:57] Ideally, we wouldn't have.

[2:13:59] It's towards the front of the building.

[2:14:01] But I still think it wouldn't be very visible for me.

[2:14:04] That's not a great deal.

[2:14:06] A lot of houses in Ocean Grove, they're not visible.

[2:14:09] The rear is not visible at all.

[2:14:11] Does that mean you should just...

[2:14:12] I mean, you heard it instead.

[2:14:13] They do not have a glazed block.

[2:14:14] The order needs to be seen.

[2:14:15] No.

[2:14:16] But the order needs to be seen specifically

[2:14:17] to talk to them about window demonstrations.

[2:14:19] If they're not visible,

[2:14:20] let them work against consideration.

[2:14:22] I mean, it's...

[2:14:23] The guidelines talk about visibility of administrators.

[2:14:26] Yes, we do.

[2:14:28] Okay.

[2:14:31] We are taking an end to consideration, but the consideration, I don't think the house

[2:14:38] makes a very persuasive argument that this is an necessity in case where it's both appropriate.

[2:14:47] I decided to go again, I care less about that.

[2:14:50] It is a secondary entrance, it is at the back.

[2:14:52] Although you are on the corner, that we can help that.

[2:14:54] and another property is blocked, that would be in the rear of the house and we wouldn't, that's not it.

[2:15:33] We signed all those kind of elongated rectangles. That house is still sitting way up on that retaining wall, plus you have some foundation showing. There's a lot of hate there because windows give it some weight.

[2:15:48] It feels like a suburban house designed for a suburban location.

[2:15:54] Let's just get rid of all the windows where we don't want to meet them. And we generally do not occur houses that happen. I feel like it may kind of a hard contrary

[2:16:10] person here.

[2:16:10] but he really made to

[2:16:16] people to not present this to us and when they do, we generally push back.

[2:16:24] So that's enough.

[2:16:27] Our guidelines also talk about the fantasies as being one of the most important features.

[2:16:34] So to simply ignore them, I'm just wondering if we want to decide whether to,

[2:16:40] if there might be one of the draw and we're going to make an application

[2:16:45] or do you want to vote on the proposal as proposed?

[2:16:49] I think that would be a different class.

[2:16:52] In other words, did you follow me just there?

[2:16:55] I mean, not quite funny.

[2:16:56] Regardless of the new voter round, if it was denied,

[2:16:59] we'd have to go to another very important list around.

[2:17:02] You'd have to go to the zoning board.

[2:17:04] Well, no, no, or what if you wanted

[2:17:06] to amend the plans after we denied,

[2:17:08] and they want to submit a amended plan?

[2:17:11] It's got to be a home of the application.

[2:17:12] Yeah, yeah.

[2:17:12] You don't want to do that as administratively because you'd have to start the scratch you could ask to the post but you could so to carry it to the next

[2:17:20] Meaning and to discuss with you

[2:17:23] This is the important thing if you need an opportunity to talk to your client

[2:17:36] Before

[2:17:39] any so

[2:17:41] If it's denied what

[2:17:45] The option is to appeal to the zoning board.

[2:17:47] You'll visit the board.

[2:17:49] Board change, right?

[2:17:50] No, but if you change, you have to start with scratch.

[2:17:54] Use.

[2:17:55] It's a certificate called the law.

[2:17:56] You have a pen on the end of it.

[2:17:58] But if we don't vote, and we carry it,

[2:18:00] he would make a amendment.

[2:18:01] If he's asking that, that wasn't his question.

[2:18:03] I guess, but it kind of is my question.

[2:18:05] What's the difference of changing the plans

[2:18:07] with the denial versus changing the plan?

[2:18:09] You can't change the plans for tonight.

[2:18:11] You have to read some mental home ramification

[2:18:14] and then the clock starts all over you.

[2:18:17] You have to raise a bit, start to come back, you know.

[2:18:20] You have to go to the zone again,

[2:18:22] and you have to go back to the point where you'd be parried.

[2:18:24] The right option, if you think you might be changing the plans,

[2:18:27] would be to parry it.

[2:18:29] That would be the best option for you.

[2:18:30] Unless you think that this denial from this board

[2:18:33] is subject to being overturned by the zoning display.

[2:18:39] That's, and I can't say anything else about that,

[2:18:41] But I think your best course back should be to get to, well, you should reach out to your client.

[2:18:46] But unless you think that all these comments are going to go to a proof, you know, I think you can feel out.

[2:18:55] Let me just ask your share of insight through it.

[2:18:58] Okay.

[2:18:59] So we're going to talk five minutes.

[2:19:01] Yeah.

[2:19:02] Yeah.

[2:19:03] Can we pause the recording?

[2:19:05] No.

[2:19:05] Even if you're on, you're going to talk about it.

[2:20:45] Yeah, I guess the question is, like, if it's denied, I'm not quite sure, I don't understand

[2:20:50] why not.

[2:20:51] Like, can I make a change in every submitter?

[2:20:52] No.

[2:20:53] Oh, yeah, but you have to do new fees.

[2:20:56] New everything.

[2:20:56] is how you must return to zoning and those are fees and then you go to check it's based on your voice.

[2:21:06] So it comes down to you. Do you think there's a way in your mind that with your plan, you know your plan?

[2:21:12] Do you think there's an option that plan to make this more viable to this commission

[2:21:18] than the best force of action is probably to withdraw it or just carry it to an extreme.

[2:21:25] If you think that you and your plan are not going to change this, then you should probably go sort of out and then decide whether you want to appeal to CDA.

[2:21:34] So we'll just finish up.

[2:21:35] Right.

[2:21:37] Or start a new application.

[2:21:39] Heather, go ahead.

[2:21:41] There's a lot of delays.

[2:21:43] So if it's carried, it's automatically agenda.

[2:21:46] Well, it has to Heather has room on the agenda.

[2:21:49] For next one.

[2:21:50] Do you?

[2:21:51] Thank you, and that's what I was going to say.

[2:21:53] So as I was trying to explain, if you go to the CDA with a denial, right now is a 45

[2:21:58] vehicle with the process, there's a 45 game at the end of the time, there are, no,

[2:22:03] we all actually go to the next available meeting.

[2:22:06] Right now, I'm in to your gender.

[2:22:09] What else?

[2:22:10] But if you're in the event that's scary, then you can go up to it.

[2:22:13] You would just go to the next, back here.

[2:22:15] All right, and I just, you know, and I'll give you time to review, revise the drawings,

[2:22:20] resubmits tech without having to restart everything from the beginning or redo the zoning because if you get approved through the board

[2:22:28] You're then I take those plans that are approved by the board and I

[2:22:33] Resubmit them to zoning as per the HBC

[2:22:36] For our own so then you're not repaying the $35 waiting attendees

[2:22:41] she's gonna review them with the

[2:22:45] recommendations of the agency

[2:22:47] So it stops, but it's kind of the final.

[2:22:51] So what you have to do on behalf of your of the applicant is request that the application be carried to the next hearing.

[2:23:00] I honestly don't know if she's wrong, but I mean she's not. I think that's the only thing.

[2:23:06] That's your best option. Yeah. Yeah.

[2:23:08] If you if you make no changes, then the at the next hearing, the commission will vote on the application as is.

[2:23:15] Yeah, I'll be sure to get asked.

[2:23:16] Okay.

[2:23:17] All right, so, um,

[2:23:19] we're across from here?

[2:23:20] Yes.

[2:23:21] No further notice?

[2:23:23] No, yeah.

[2:23:24] Can you make a motion to accept it?

[2:23:26] Can you carry?

[2:23:27] No.

[2:23:27] Yeah, we should.

[2:23:28] It should.

[2:23:29] Yeah.

[2:23:29] Right.

[2:23:32] Okay, first of all.

[2:23:35] Uh, I was going to ask if,

[2:23:37] can I come to a time review prior to that?

[2:23:40] Yeah, absolutely.

[2:23:42] That's the thing you heard.

[2:23:43] and you can get a new plan.

[2:23:48] If you want to be with him, you can get a new plan.

[2:23:50] You're in your client and say,

[2:23:53] don't take this to know out of order, this is a not a good school.

[2:23:55] At least you'll have some updates that might make the application a little bit easier

[2:23:59] to follow the reports.

[2:24:01] So that way you think it's over.

[2:24:05] Thank you.

[2:24:06] Rough night.

[2:24:06] Thank you.

[2:24:07] Sorry.

[2:24:08] One way, one, the life.

[2:24:10] That's all I wanted to say.

[2:24:11] I don't want to appreciate your time on it.

[2:24:15] There's no one for the public, so yeah.

[2:24:17] Motion to.

[2:24:18] Motion to adjourn.

[2:24:19] I wish you do adjourned.

[2:24:20] I mean, second.

[2:24:21] No, we have to approve.

[2:24:23] We have to approve.

[2:24:24] We have to approve.

[2:24:25] We did?

[2:24:27] What did we do?

[2:24:29] We did?

[2:24:29] We did.

[2:24:30] We did that first.

[2:24:32] You're right.

[2:24:32] You did it.

[2:24:32] My own favor.

[2:24:34] Hi.

[2:24:38] OK.

[2:24:39] Can we turn off the episode?

[2:24:41] Hi, everybody.

[2:24:42] but that's fine, thank you so much for all the years.

September HPC

Transcript