[6:25] like to go ahead and welcome

[6:28] Teresa.

[6:32] » Are we okay to go?

[6:47] recording.

[6:49] >> Pete, are you ready?

[6:51] >> We're good.

[6:52] >> Okay.

[6:54] >> Welcome on this very warm, smoky

[6:58] Tuesday.

[7:00] Glad to see you all here. Um just we're

[7:03] going to spend a few minutes just going

[7:05] through the agenda and review and

[7:08] preview about coming agenda items. So

[7:11] you all have a copy of the agenda in

[7:13] here and we were going we'll just follow

[7:17] that. But after after item number three,

[7:22] what I was I was informed and I'm I'm

[7:25] very grateful for this that we can do

[7:27] this is that

[7:31] we have the opportunity to remember

[7:34] former city council member Margaret

[7:35] Black. Um she passed away very

[7:38] unexpectedly last Friday. And so I'll I

[7:42] will say a few words and then we'll have

[7:43] a moment of silence before we go on. um

[7:46] carried to the Pavo scholarship winners.

[7:50] Uh the rest of those uh

[7:54] items will have personal appearances and

[7:57] then we have our meeting minutes that

[7:58] will approve for two meetings in May and

[8:01] then it's time to time to appoint a

[8:04] mayor prom

[8:06] a new mayor. Thank you for prom if

[8:09] that's a verb

[8:11] first half of the year. And so council

[8:14] member Lamson, are you down for that?

[8:19] >> I'm down for that.

[8:20] >> Down for that. Okay. I will do my best

[8:23] not to become ill or get in accidents or

[8:25] anything. the county.

[8:30] » We also after that we have an ordinance

[8:32] amending chapter 10 of the ORM city code

[8:35] pertaining to flood damage prevention

[8:37] and that's the FEMA. Is that the FEMA

[8:39] one?

[8:40] >> Yes.

[8:40] >> And as soon as this as we approve these

[8:42] consent items. I know Teresa talked

[8:45] about having me sign that one

[8:47] immediately because it has to be

[8:48] submitted today or something. Was that

[8:52] the one?

[8:53] >> I had heard that but I don't know. Wait.

[8:55] Okay, Trace. Well, I'm sorry for Trace

[8:57] to get back to you.

[8:58] >> It It was, but uh they sent us a letter.

[9:01] They forgot to give us the notice that

[9:04] >> Oh,

[9:05] >> so we have a little bit of time left.

[9:07] >> Okay, Teresa, you don't have to get do

[9:08] it today, but signing.

[9:11] >> Sure. Aaron just met with me and was

[9:14] like, I need it posted today.

[9:16] >> But there was an extension. I don't

[9:18] know. Anyway, I'll I'll be there and

[9:20] I'll sign it if whatever.

[9:22] >> I have it ready for you. Oh, if it's

[9:24] ready, you might as well sign.

[9:26] >> And then we also have on our consent

[9:28] calendar

[9:30] an ordinance changing the zone of the

[9:32] property at 355 West University Parkway

[9:35] from R8 Single Fan Residential to C2 uh

[9:38] with a development agreement. Remember

[9:39] that came to us

[9:42] re uh just recently and they just needed

[9:44] to have the development agreement in

[9:45] place with some changes and so we'll

[9:47] have that on our consent calendar. Then

[9:50] we'll go ahead and we have a number of

[9:51] scheduled items. We have a resolution

[9:53] about the CDBG annual action plan

[9:57] and looks like uh authors signing a form

[10:01] and other HUD documents. We also have uh

[10:05] public we have several public hearings

[10:07] this evening. First one is amending

[10:11] articles of Mr. D coach requiring uh for

[10:14] the conduct u conducting neighborhood

[10:17] meetings in advance of applications to

[10:18] the planning commission. So there is

[10:20] actually a tenant of that that is

[10:22] missing. Um should we Steve should we

[10:25] table that to add the was it Steve or

[10:28] Gary I talked to about that one

[10:30] >> in you?

[10:31] >> Yeah. So one of the issues that came up

[10:34] with this

[10:37] was at planning commission they had a

[10:39] discussion about

[10:41] uh the requirement to mail out notices

[10:45] and what we do is we mail notices

[10:50] to uh each property and we get the list

[10:55] from the county. So, wherever that uh

[11:00] property notice or or for like their

[11:03] taxes, wherever that would go, that's

[11:06] where our notice goes. Uh we did have a

[11:09] discussion about

[11:12] um

[11:14] in some areas of the city we have lots

[11:16] of renters and so a tax notice may go to

[11:20] an accountant or somebody in Salt Lake

[11:23] or out of state because they're renting

[11:26] it and the actual renter at that address

[11:30] where they live would not get the

[11:32] notice. And we actually talked with

[11:34] Meline at the planning commission while

[11:36] we discussed it.

[11:39] Planning commission didn't actually make

[11:42] a recommendation. And part of that is

[11:44] internally

[11:46] we know that can be an issue. We don't

[11:49] quite know how yet to solve that issue.

[11:54] And the and the reason is is the list we

[11:56] get to send out is from the county. we

[11:59] can get a list of properties

[12:03] uh that are just addresses and send to

[12:06] addresses. But if we just send to the

[12:09] addresses,

[12:11] then often property owners will not get

[12:13] a notice.

[12:15] And if we send to the county records,

[12:18] renters may not get a notice. And if we

[12:21] send to both, a lot of people will get

[12:23] two notices. And so

[12:27] we don't have an easy fix in our

[12:31] department of how to winnow those risks

[12:34] unless we do it by hand right now. And

[12:38] so what the planning commission talked

[12:40] about is like, okay, that's a problem.

[12:42] We need to think about how we're going

[12:43] to fix it. Let's not hold up what we

[12:46] have and we'll send it on to council.

[12:50] >> Okay? And so we can do whatever the

[12:54] council would like, but that is

[12:55] definitely an issue that uh you should

[12:58] think about and talk about

[13:01] is how uh legal noticing under state

[13:06] law. Uh

[13:08] there is kind of a a built-in preference

[13:11] for it to go to the actual property

[13:14] owner so that they know. Renters,

[13:17] frankly, are a little secondary, but a

[13:20] lot of renters live there, and we want

[13:23] them to be included in the process, too.

[13:25] We just don't have a great solution.

[13:27] >> They're voters.

[13:28] >> Yeah. Right.

[13:30] >> Could we Oh, go ahead. I'm sorry.

[13:31] >> I'm just saying more and more people are

[13:33] renting. These are It's happening to

[13:35] them. They may be long-term renters, you

[13:38] know. Um it's not necessarily as

[13:40] transitory as it used to be. So, yeah. I

[13:42] don't know what the situation.

[13:44] >> Yeah. And at planning commission, we

[13:46] didn't come up with a solution and we

[13:48] don't have I don't have a good solution

[13:51] for you today on how to handle that. If

[13:55] you wanted to continue this,

[13:58] >> absolutely.

[13:59] >> We could do that and we could come back

[14:01] in a future work meeting after we've

[14:03] looked at it, see how we might fix it so

[14:07] that property owners get notice and

[14:10] renters get notice without

[14:13] duplicating [clears throat]

[14:14] costs and and staff time and effort.

[14:19] I'm wondering if um

[14:20] >> prove this and promise to come back with

[14:23] solutions on

[14:24] >> Well, I have a question about how to do

[14:25] how to not a possible solution. It would be a perfect solution but a

[14:31] solution or an option. Um because we do

[14:34] have the rent the renters are the

[14:35] voters, property owners are the

[14:37] taxpayers. I think it's important that

[14:39] the notice gets mailed to the property

[14:41] owner, but I also think again that the

[14:43] renters should be able to

[14:45] >> Have we thought about putting a sign on

[14:48] the property, a public notice, a notice

[14:50] saying that this is this property is

[14:52] under development review or something

[14:54] like that so those renters in the area

[14:57] or the people who live in the immediate

[14:58] area can see that something's happening

[15:01] on the property. So, we meet the legal

[15:04] notice requirement plus we can meet the

[15:06] requirement. Well, we can let the

[15:07] neighbors know that something's

[15:09] happening.

[15:10] >> Maybe.

[15:10] >> Yeah. And and that's a great idea, and I

[15:13] know a lot of communities do that, that

[15:15] an actual notice, and you have certain

[15:17] size requirements for the signs.

[15:20] >> And so, what one possible solution?

[15:24] Well, part of this is to increase the

[15:27] boundary to which we send notices. It go

[15:31] in some cases, it goes to 2,000 ft with

[15:34] from the property. We think that's a

[15:36] good idea.

[15:38] Frankly, I would like to see this go

[15:41] forward tonight to do that and then

[15:43] you'd have my commitment that will come

[15:46] back very quickly within the next couple

[15:50] of months and we'll talk about uh some

[15:54] ideas that we have on how to do this and

[15:56] it might be a combination of signs. will

[15:58] investigate

[16:00] whether we can automate the winnowing of

[16:04] lists so we're not you know sometimes we

[16:07] mail out 500

[16:09] mailers and we don't want to do a

[16:12] thousand because we're duplicating

[16:15] things that could eventually be quite a

[16:17] bit of expense so we need to think about

[16:20] in in my department how we do this

[16:23] carefully but in the meantime I'd like

[16:26] to get these in place because I think

[16:28] they're going to be helpful for

[16:31] neighborhoods. Now,

[16:32] >> I I know that Chair Coleman was in favor

[16:35] of moving this forward as well.

[16:38] >> I mean, she was in favor of

[16:40] >> who was uh Meline Chair Coleman.

[16:42] >> Oh, chairman. I was thinking too, I had

[16:44] a conversation with some people earlier

[16:46] today about ways to communicate with

[16:48] residents and there is technology out

[16:50] there that if you can do the like a

[16:53] geoence and then text people who live

[16:56] within a certain area if we have their

[16:58] information or if there's a way to

[16:59] obtain cell phone information. So there variety of different ways that we

[17:03] can attempt.

[17:04] >> Can we have landlord licensing? If

[17:06] they're renters, if it is a rental

[17:08] property,

[17:10] you should have a rental license for it.

[17:13] >> Yeah. And and those are the types of

[17:15] ideas

[17:17] that I'm hesitant. I think some of these

[17:20] ideas we've talked about would be very

[17:23] helpful for us and doable, but I don't

[17:25] want to make any commitments here. I

[17:27] would I need to go back and and think

[17:29] about it and look at it because I don't

[17:31] want an unintended consequence of of uh

[17:36] now I have somebody doing 15 hours of

[17:40] work a week, you know,

[17:43] >> going through the notices and things

[17:44] like that. But we want to use technology

[17:47] like the geo fencing. We can do signs.

[17:50] we can do uh [clears throat] maybe

[17:51] there's a good easy way that I don't

[17:53] know off the top of my head to have two

[17:55] lists of addresses and have uh either AI

[18:01] or something or some program go through

[18:04] and spit out a definitive a list that

[18:07] doesn't duplicate things and and if we

[18:09] can do stuff like that quickly that's

[18:12] what I'd like to come back and and and just because we have something in an

[18:16] ordinance and we're doing it I still

[18:18] think we should explore things like

[18:22] uh email lists, getting people to sign

[18:25] up for my Provo, getting what did I say?

[18:30] [laughter]

[18:32] » Well, well, I want them to do that so

[18:34] they can um have input on the

[18:37] development in the canyon.

[18:38] >> [laughter]

[18:39] >> So

[18:40] >> thanks Dave

[18:43] >> uh myorum you know and and come up with

[18:46] some ideas so that we can just in

[18:49] general how do we engage the public not

[18:52] just meeting our technical legal

[18:55] requirements. We want to meet the base

[18:57] legal requirements, but frankly, we want

[18:59] to go above and beyond those base uh

[19:03] requirements to get the community as

[19:06] notified and involved as possible.

[19:09] >> Okay.

[19:16] » All right.

[19:18] Planning or continues. Well, I was going

[19:21] to say one of my I was a planning intern

[19:24] many many years ago for Provo City and I

[19:27] remember having to go out to a piece of

[19:29] property in a thunderstorm in a dress

[19:33] trying to beat a sign into rock hard

[19:35] ground with a large rock.

[19:37] >> Yeah.

[19:37] >> And because I didn't have the hammer. I

[19:40] know what the hammer was, but I didn't

[19:41] have it. And so I don't want anyone to

[19:44] miss out on that opportunity.

[19:49] Um,

[19:51] next item we'll have at the public

[19:52] hearing an ordinance amending the city

[19:54] code um, including standard SLU 6231

[20:00] beauty and barber shops and SLU 6232

[20:03] tattoo and body piercing as pered uses

[20:06] in a manu M2 manufacturing zone.

[20:10] Then after that, we will have another

[20:13] public hearing amending the ordinance to

[20:17] include SLU code 7424 recreation centers

[20:21] general as a permitted use in the PD5

[20:23] zone. For those who are listening at

[20:26] home, the PD5 zones along University

[20:28] Parkway and then we have a public

[20:32] hearing, another ordinance,

[20:34] and this is about our budget amendments.

[20:37] So we have that. Let's bring us in the

[20:40] city manager information items and then

[20:44] we will adjourn to the meeting of the

[20:45] redevelopment agency.

[20:48] Well, we will approve the minutes. We

[20:50] will have another public hearing with a

[20:53] resolution approving the redevelopment

[20:55] agency budget. And then when we're done

[20:57] with that, we will adjourn from the

[21:00] redevelopment agency to the special

[21:01] service lighting district and approve

[21:04] the minutes and then have another public

[21:05] hearing approving the special service

[21:08] lighting district budget. And then we

[21:11] will adjourn from being a special

[21:12] service lighting district and reconvene

[21:14] as a war municipal building authority

[21:17] and [clears throat]

[21:19] we're only approving the minutes for the

[21:21] building authority. Is that right?

[21:24] I know we're not going to be approving a

[21:25] budget.

[21:27] Then after that

[21:32] question,

[21:36] okay, we'll continue meeting and

[21:40] chatting and

[21:43] we will eventually end up I'll end up in

[21:45] there at 6.

[21:47] >> You going to adjourn this meeting so we

[21:48] can recording and

[21:51] >> Oh yeah. Yeah. Let's let's have a motion

[21:53] to adjurnn.

[21:54] >> I move to adjourn.

[21:55] >> Second.

[21:56] >> All right. Motion in a second.

[21:58] >> Ajourn. I

[22:00] >> All right.

[22:02] >> You don't have to hear us eat.

[23:39] Gary just talking.

[23:40] >> Oh yeah,

[23:42] >> it was like really catching Gary. Oh, I

[23:46] forgot to bring the speaker.

[24:08] No. Are you talking about the signers?

[24:11] >> No. The the video.

[24:13] >> What video?

[24:14] >> The Babel video. The Babel scholarship.

[24:17] >> Yeah.

[24:18] >> No.

[24:23] You never think about it. I just thought

[24:24] she would talk. I didn't even think

[24:26] about it. Maybe

[24:28] >> probably need this.

[24:29] >> Just a moment.

[24:32] » We're up in the game. Share.

[24:38] » Uh oh, my being's dead. That's all

[24:40] right. I'll just put it.

[24:42] >> Oh, no.

[24:46] » I was thinking we didn't have video

[24:51] first. Thought I was done after my

[24:53] associates. I thought I was done after

[24:54] my bachelor was.

[24:57] >> Yeah, it should be first.

[25:04] » Oh, you have the splits.

[25:08] >> Why? I shouldn't.

[25:15] I think someone's ready.

[25:28] I just want to see right.

[25:34] » There we go.

[25:44] So ready.

[25:50] Look at that.

[25:52] Oh, the speaker works.

[25:56] Thought I was done after my associates.

[25:58] I thought I was done after my bachelor

[25:59] was for my masters. And I feel like

[26:07] this chair is really short.

[26:15] Take your chance

[26:35] friend said

[26:57] I knew something was

[27:01] training. I thought it

[27:05] at this point.

[27:09] » But I clearly,

[27:12] you know what threw me off is

[27:15] we're going to take off the ribbons and

[27:17] not die and

[27:20] you know I don't even

[27:22] think

[27:27] clearly

[27:33] outfit.

[27:53] Lots of problems.

[28:04] I see you guys.

[28:20] I can

[28:47] Say if we took our name

[28:52] and Those

[29:02] aren't even

[29:23] sources.

[29:34] He wants to go.

[29:56] Then I went and

[30:22] January

[30:24] >> February

[30:27] was January. It was February.

[30:39] » I know. I could have been listening.

[30:55] I like this. I mean, I don't know about

[31:14] tonight.

[31:17] » I'll be I'll sit next to him.

[31:24] Hello sir.

[31:26] >> How are you doing?

[31:47] » Awesome.

[31:57] Thanks for

[32:16] Okay, I making sure cuz

[32:21] just so you know

[32:24] things

[32:38] be

[36:13] I would like to welcome you to this

[36:15] evening's city council meeting. We're

[36:18] glad you're here and coming to be part

[36:20] of the public process. So, I'll go ahead

[36:23] and I've called the meeting to order and

[36:24] we have an invocation or inspirational

[36:28] thought and it will be presented by uh

[36:30] Mr. Jim Bell and our pledge of

[36:32] allegiance will be led by Diane Waker

[36:39] » here. Yes.

[36:40] >> Okay. Well, this is for everyone but

[36:43] I'll talk to you. Recently I took this

[36:45] is a inspirational thought but also a

[36:49] prayer. So there you go. Recently I took

[36:52] a road trip from my home in Oram to

[36:53] Mace, Arizona. I drove through a

[36:56] breathtaking swath I drove through

[36:58] breathtaking swaths of beauty ranging

[37:00] from arid deserts to high mountain

[37:03] forests. The different views I saw,

[37:05] sometimes within a few miles, were

[37:08] dramatic. I've lived in the remarkable

[37:11] city of Oram for over 40 years in one

[37:14] apartment and four different houses.

[37:17] Each was quite different in its

[37:19] appearance, in the neighborhoods, in the

[37:21] friends we made, in the experiences we

[37:23] shared. Experiences that have ranged

[37:26] from celebrating my oldest daughter's

[37:28] wedding in our beautiful North yard to

[37:31] then burying her six years later in a

[37:33] quiet corner of the Orm Cemetery.

[37:36] Through lots of road trips and lots of

[37:38] years being part of several subsets of

[37:40] our incredible community, I have learned

[37:43] that our differences, dramatic as they

[37:46] sometimes are, can either unite us and

[37:49] make our lives richer, or our

[37:51] differences can destroy us. Though

[37:54] everyone here tonight has much in

[37:56] common, we're each uniquely different.

[37:59] Sometimes in ways that whisper and other

[38:02] times in ways we shout from the

[38:04] rooftops. But my hope is that what is

[38:07] discussed and decided upon tonight will

[38:10] grow out of the good that come can that

[38:13] can come from our differences and that

[38:15] we'll each avoid the damage that so

[38:18] easily flows from emnity and

[38:20] divisiveness.

[38:22] >> Thank you.

[38:28] » Please stand for the pledge.

[38:34] I pledge allegiance to the flag of the

[38:38] United States of America and to the

[38:41] republic for which it stands, one nation

[38:45] under God, indivisible, with liberty and

[38:48] justice for all.

[38:56] Thank you. Right. Next item on the

[38:59] agenda are mayor's items and

[39:03] going to take a moment [sighs and gasps]

[39:06] and

[39:09] remember

[39:10] one of my dear dear friends

[39:14] [gasps]

[39:14] uh former council city council member

[39:16] Margaret Black.

[39:19] I had the opportunity to serve with

[39:20] Margaret Black on the city council for

[39:22] seven years. um she passed away

[39:25] unexpectedly last Friday

[39:28] and causing a lot of shock. I've been

[39:31] alternating between laughing at the

[39:33] memories I have of us serving on the

[39:35] council together and and tears and

[39:39] thinking about how she and one of her

[39:41] friends were the [gasps] first people to

[39:44] really introduce me to the culture of my

[39:46] faith tradition by writing an essay

[39:48] called Patty Perfect back in the late

[39:50] 1970s. And it was hilarious about just

[39:53] kind of poking fun at what what women in

[39:57] my faith traditions tend many tend to

[40:00] think how their life should be. And it

[40:02] was it was pretty funny. But come to

[40:05] find out that it was the same Margaret

[40:06] Black. I remember asking her, "Are you

[40:08] the same Margaret Black who wrote Patty

[40:10] Perfect?" And she said [snorts] starts

[40:12] laughing and said, "Oh yes. We had so

[40:14] much fun sitting at my kitchen table

[40:16] writing that, thinking about all the

[40:18] funny things that, you know, the zipping

[40:20] oneself into the slim self into the

[40:22] sweatuit and keeping the scrapbooks up

[40:24] to date and all of that stuff. But she

[40:30] he loved our community.

[40:33] She served with passion for nine years

[40:36] on the city council from 2007 to 2016.

[40:40] And those who know her know she was a

[40:42] fierce and tireless advocate for our

[40:45] community, public safety, education, the

[40:48] arts, and the beautifification

[40:51] of our community. The discussions we'd

[40:53] have about hanging baskets in our

[40:56] community. Um, beyond the council, she

[40:59] served in a many different capacities.

[41:01] She served as chair and board member of

[41:02] community action services and food bank

[41:05] as the representative of Orm City. She

[41:07] was an active member of the Orm Kuanas

[41:09] Club and multiple terms as a PTA

[41:12] president and various other civic board

[41:14] positions.

[41:16] And one thing that I I got to know her

[41:18] more personally is over her 40-year

[41:21] career as a piano teacher, teaching my

[41:25] children piano and taught piano to

[41:28] hundreds of local students. And she and

[41:31] her husband Dennis served a mission for

[41:34] their church in Soul, Korea.

[41:38] So,

[41:40] I just we would like to take just a

[41:42] moment to have a moment of silence as we

[41:47] remember Margaret

[41:49] and and what she has done for our

[41:52] community. So, if you'll just if you'll

[41:54] join me with that, we'll just take a

[41:56] brief uh moment of silence for her.

[42:30] Thank you.

[42:32] So, our hearts go out

[42:35] to her husband, Dennis, and their six

[42:38] children and their many grandchildren

[42:41] and great-grandchildren. So, thank you.

[42:45] She'll be missed.

[42:48] [snorts]

[42:49] Next item on the agenda, I'll turn the

[42:51] time over to our deputy city manager,

[42:54] Carrie Ruck, for presentation on the

[42:56] building a better ORM scholarship

[42:58] winners.

[43:09] Do a quick video and then listen.

[43:27] I thought I was done after my

[43:29] associates. I thought I was done after

[43:30] my bachelors and now I'm going for my

[43:32] masters. And I feel like the city has

[43:34] let me know not just the importance of

[43:36] education but also that I could believe

[43:38] in myself because they believed in me as

[43:40] well.

[43:43] » I was debating between my MBA and my

[43:45] MPA. After working for ORM, I've decided

[43:49] that there's such a large career path

[43:51] here in local government and within ORM.

[43:53] So, I saw a lot of potential within the

[43:55] MPA program. I started with the city as

[43:57] an intern for the uh engineering

[44:00] division. I decided to take a break from

[44:02] school just to kind of help my finances.

[44:04] And after getting into the GIS field and

[44:06] getting the current job I'm in, I

[44:08] realized it was my passion. Through the

[44:10] Battle Scholarship, I was able to

[44:11] continue doing that. I graduated from

[44:13] Mountain View in 1995. Went to Snow

[44:15] College, never graduated from Snow. In

[44:17] 2018, Snow contacted me, said, "Hey,

[44:20] you're really close to graduating. Do

[44:21] you want to finish up?" So, I got my

[44:23] associates. Then, I decided I need to go

[44:25] back and finish my degree. So, with help

[44:26] from the Babel Scholarship, I went back

[44:28] to UVU and graduated in 2023 with my bachelor's degree in criminal

[44:33] justice. The Babel scholarship gives you

[44:35] the opportunity to see that the city

[44:37] sees your future and sees that you're

[44:39] important enough for them to want to

[44:41] invest a little bit in. So, it gave me

[44:43] the not just the money, but also the

[44:45] courage to go back and change some

[44:46] things, go back to school at my age.

[44:48] >> Because of the Babel Scholarship, when I

[44:50] went back to school, I didn't have to

[44:51] take out any student loans.

[44:53] >> I'm really grateful for the financial

[44:55] burden relief that it kind of gave me

[44:57] when I was going through my degree. I

[45:00] think that everybody should go for

[45:02] something that they want to do, even if

[45:03] it's scary for them. It has genuinely

[45:06] changed my life and the life of my

[45:08] family. As a first generation student,

[45:11] it really means a lot that I could be

[45:13] the first and the city was a part of

[45:16] that.

[45:16] >> Ultimately, I think what the Babel

[45:18] scholarships provided me is an

[45:20] opportunity to continue serving the

[45:23] residents of ORM.

[45:24] >> I love the city. I love working here. I

[45:26] plan to be here forever. I just feel

[45:28] like everybody has always been team

[45:29] Terra and then that's part of why I'm

[45:31] team Oram

[45:41] mayor and council. The Babel Ambassador

[45:44] Scholarship began in 2021. Since that

[45:47] time, with your support, the city has

[45:50] awarded 41 employee scholarships. As a

[45:53] result of these scholarships,

[45:55] 17 of the previous awardees have been

[45:58] promoted within the city. This

[46:00] scholarship program successfully opened

[46:02] doors to growth for those who may not

[46:04] otherwise have the opportunity to pursue

[46:06] a formal education and be competitive

[46:09] for new opportunities within the city.

[46:12] Given how successful this scholarship

[46:14] program has been in previous years, I am

[46:16] excited to share that this year is no

[46:19] exception. This year's awardees

[46:22] exemplify building a better ORM. I am

[46:24] proud to present to you the 2026 2027

[46:28] Babel Scholarship Awardees. As I call

[46:31] your name, if you are here, please come

[46:32] up and accept your scholarship award and

[46:35] then we'll take a photo with the council

[46:36] afterwards.

[46:38] Andrew Bellnap. Andrew is a captain in

[46:41] the fire department and has worked for

[46:43] the city for almost 11 years. He plans

[46:46] to use this scholarship towards his

[46:48] master's degree in public

[46:49] administration.

[46:51] Adam Butts. Adam is a public utilities

[46:54] operator in public works and has been

[46:57] with the city for a year and a half. He

[46:59] plans to use this scholarship towards a

[47:01] bachelor's degree and hopes to become a

[47:04] librarian in the future. Bryce, watch

[47:06] out.

[47:08] Jake Gould. He is the manager of desktop

[47:11] experience in IT. He has worked for the

[47:13] city for 5 years and plans to use this

[47:16] scholarship towards his bachelor's

[47:17] degree in IT management.

[47:20] Chris Hadlock. Chris is a lieutenant in

[47:23] the police department. He has worked for

[47:25] the city for seven years and he plans to

[47:27] use his scholarship towards his

[47:28] bachelor's degree.

[47:31] Jeremy Jameson. Jeremy is lieutenant in

[47:34] the police department. He will use his

[47:36] scholarship to work towards his master's

[47:38] degree.

[47:40] Matthew Cameron.

[47:42] Matt is a librarian at the ORM public

[47:45] library. He will use his scholarship to

[47:47] finish his master's degree in library

[47:49] and information science.

[47:52] Gary Leoo. Gary is the neighborhood

[47:55] improvement team manager and he will use

[47:57] his scholarship towards his MBA.

[48:00] Michael Lockach.

[48:02] Michael is a police sergeant and will

[48:04] use the scholarship towards his

[48:06] associates degree in criminal justice or

[48:09] public administration.

[48:12] Casey Metaf

[48:14] Casey is a lieutenant in the fire

[48:16] department and will use his scholarship

[48:18] to further his formal education and

[48:20] expand his knowledge and leadership

[48:21] abilities.

[48:24] Casey Palmer.

[48:26] Casey is a police service specialist.

[48:28] She will use her scholarship for

[48:30] professional studies at BYU.

[48:39] Mariah Shirley.

[48:41] Mariah is the fitness center manager and

[48:43] will use the scholarship towards her

[48:45] bachelor's degree in business

[48:47] management.

[48:48] Cameron Wilson.

[48:50] Cameron is the police department's

[48:52] behavior health specialist. She will use

[48:54] her scholarship towards an implied human

[48:57] behavior certificate.

[49:00] Okay. All right. So, if uh you guys will

[49:03] just send her we'd like to get a picture

[49:05] of you with our council.

[49:18] Here

[49:27] we go. One, two, three,

[49:31] and next.

[49:50] Thank you and congratulations to all of

[49:52] you. I'm really excited that the city

[49:55] has this program and that so many of you

[49:58] have taken advantage of it and are

[50:01] improving and growing and learning. So,

[50:03] thank you and best wishes and good luck

[50:05] on your studies and and may may I say

[50:10] may the homework come easy [laughter]

[50:13] for you. All right, we have our next

[50:16] item on our agenda, presentation by our

[50:18] school resource officer. So, I will turn

[50:20] the time over to to you two.

[50:23] Good evening, mayor, council members.

[50:25] Thank you for giving me the opportunity

[50:27] to address you today. My name is

[50:29] Sergeant Neil Skoggard, and with me is

[50:31] Sergeant Mike Lockach. I've been with

[50:33] ORM police for 11 years. The last four

[50:35] I've been supervisor of our school

[50:37] resource officer unit. During that time,

[50:39] I worked closely with the Alpine School

[50:41] District toward the joint goal of

[50:43] improving school safety for the children

[50:45] of Oram City. Sergeant Lockach, who has

[50:48] also been with ORM police for 11 years,

[50:50] is our new SRO sergeant.

[50:57] Our SRO unit is composed of four

[50:59] detectives and one sergeant. Each member

[51:01] of the unit spends all of their time in

[51:03] Oram schools working closely with

[51:05] administrators, faculty and staff and

[51:08] most importantly the students. We cover

[51:10] six secondary schools, 12

[51:12] elementaryaries, one charter and one

[51:14] private school. Following best

[51:16] practices, ORM SRO's use the National

[51:19] Association of School Resource Officers

[51:22] Triad model. We are first and foremost

[51:24] law enforcement officers in the school

[51:26] as well as informal mentors and public

[51:28] safety educators. While the mission of

[51:31] keeping everyone safe is always the most

[51:33] important, timebuilding connections and

[51:35] interacting directly with the students

[51:37] is vital to our success. ORM SRO's are

[51:41] asked to wear many hats and above all we

[51:43] take the responsibility of protecting

[51:44] many thousands of ORM's children as a

[51:46] sacred duty.

[51:49] In keeping with the tradition of ORM

[51:51] police being proactive leaders in our

[51:53] profession, the SRO unit has been

[51:55] implementing new ideas for many years,

[51:58] working closely with the Alpine School

[51:59] District and other SRO units across the

[52:02] county. ORM facilitated new ways to

[52:04] share vital communications and improve

[52:06] responses to broader scale concerns such

[52:09] as largecale hoax threats. For years,

[52:12] ORM ORM SRO's working with other ORM

[52:15] police officers outside of the SRO unit

[52:19] have innovated to improve in several

[52:21] aspects of school policing.

[52:24] Many of these ideas have later become

[52:25] the standard for SRO's across the state,

[52:28] including some that have been codified

[52:29] into law.

[52:32] The asalent response method grid system,

[52:34] which was developed by ORM officers, has

[52:36] been implemented in many ORM schools for

[52:38] several years. The grid system uses

[52:41] alpha numeric markers to assist

[52:42] emergency responders to quickly locate

[52:44] an area of a large school building where

[52:46] an incident is happening. This allows

[52:49] for clear communications resulting in

[52:51] much faster response times as most first

[52:53] responders will not know how to navigate

[52:55] to Mrs. Smith's math class or Coach

[52:58] Thompson's PE class when they are not

[53:00] intimately familiar with the school. In

[53:03] November of 2024, ORM Police Lieutenant

[53:05] Travis Anderson presented the ARM grid

[53:08] system to the Utah State Legislature,

[53:11] which was adopted into law and will be

[53:12] required in every school in the state in

[53:14] the near future.

[53:17] ORM SRO's have been conducting building

[53:19] assessments on each individual school

[53:21] for years, long before such assessments

[53:23] were required by law. These assessments

[53:26] look at both the physical and physical

[53:28] security as well as the security

[53:30] protocols and their practical

[53:31] application for each building and its

[53:34] occupants. Safety drills are routinely

[53:37] attended by our SRO and valuable

[53:39] feedback is provided to improve for the

[53:41] future. All ORM SRO are trained in

[53:44] multiddisciplinary threat assessments in

[53:46] order to intervene when threats are

[53:48] reported or observed. This again follows

[53:51] nationwide best practices using the

[53:52] comprehensive school threat assessment

[53:54] guidelines known as the SEAG model.

[53:58] One of the most notable changes in Utah

[54:00] law has been the implementation of the

[54:02] school guardian program. This is where

[54:05] current school employees are equipped

[54:06] with specialized training to not only

[54:08] carry a concealed firearm at the school,

[54:11] but to respond immediately to a threat

[54:13] to school safety for the short time

[54:14] between when the crisis starts and first

[54:17] responders arrive. ORM police along with

[54:19] the SRO unit have worked closely with

[54:21] these individuals to ensure they have

[54:24] the skills and knowledge to fill that

[54:26] critical role in the event of the worst

[54:28] happening. The SRO's continue to work

[54:31] closely with everyone involved in the

[54:33] Guardian program to keep their training

[54:35] relevant.

[54:37] The ORM SRO unit was nationally

[54:39] recognized as the recipient of the 2024

[54:42] NASRO model agency award. This highly

[54:45] competitive honor is reserved for

[54:46] agencies that demonstrate peak

[54:48] professional excellence in policy,

[54:50] specialized training, and commitment to

[54:52] the triad model. No other agency in Utah

[54:55] had previously won this award. The

[54:58] support of ORM city leaders, police

[55:00] department administration, and the

[55:01] Alpine School District, as well as our

[55:03] close working relationship with vital

[55:05] partners, allowed us to excel to this

[55:08] achievement.

[55:09] As we move forward in the everchanging

[55:11] environment of school safety, the ORM

[55:13] Police Department School Resource

[55:14] Officer Unit is dedicated to furthering

[55:17] innovation and always striving for our

[55:20] to fulfill our reason for existing to

[55:23] keep kids safe. Thank you for your time

[55:26] and I'm happy to answer any questions

[55:27] you may have.

[55:29] >> Thank you. Thank you for that overview

[55:31] and I wasn't on the council at the time,

[55:33] but congratulations on the award. That's wonderful.

[55:36] >> Thank you. and in all the great work

[55:38] that you do. Council, do you have any

[55:40] questions or comments

[55:42] for um Council Member Gail? Uh

[55:45] >> I just want to say thank you for the

[55:47] work that you do, especially as a parent

[55:48] with children in the schools. I just

[55:50] really appreciate it. So, thank you.

[55:52] >> Thank you. The support means uh

[55:54] everything to us.

[55:56] >> We're grateful you're there.

[55:58] >> Yeah.

[55:58] >> All right, Council Member Millet. So, I

[56:00] was at the, you know, our new school

[56:02] district was having cluster meetings to

[56:04] talk about things um that they wanted to

[56:07] implement in our new district and I went

[56:09] to a couple of them and the Tempanogus

[56:11] High School one um sat on a table.

[56:14] There's one um pillar that they talked

[56:16] about and that was safety and had some

[56:18] great conversations there, but it was

[56:20] really remarkable. One of the parents,

[56:21] well, couple of parents on that table

[56:24] were very complimentary of the SRO's in

[56:28] our schools, of the relationship that

[56:30] they have with the kids, of the positive

[56:34] um mentorship, the positive um

[56:37] opportunity to see a police officer, get

[56:39] to know a police officer, and become

[56:41] friends with a police officer along with

[56:44] this the training and the skill. All of

[56:47] that was actually um I asked after the

[56:50] meeting about that and spoke very highly

[56:53] of all that you do. So, as I'll echo

[56:55] what Jen said, you know,

[56:58] right there where our kids are, that's

[57:00] where we our hearts are. So, thank you

[57:03] for all your hard work and training to

[57:05] make that help us feel safe when we're

[57:07] at home.

[57:08] >> Thank you.

[57:09] >> Right. Thank you. Anything else,

[57:11] Council? Council member Mikum.

[57:13] >> Uh and I'll just add thanks for being

[57:15] innovative. Thanks. Uh thanks for

[57:17] providing leadership for the state. Um I

[57:20] just I I love it when uh we can uh take

[57:25] a leadership role in solving problems

[57:26] that others might also face and uh I

[57:29] appreciate you letting me know uh how

[57:31] effective uh some of those innovations

[57:33] have been in terms of being adopted

[57:35] statewide. Thank you.

[57:36] >> Thank you.

[57:38] >> Right. Thank you very much. Appreciate

[57:40] you and what you do. Thank you.

[57:42] >> Thanks.

[57:44] [clears throat] Right.

[57:48] The next item on our agenda is time set

[57:50] aside for personal appearances. It's

[57:53] been set aside for the public to express

[57:55] their ideas, concerns, and comments on

[57:57] items not scheduled as public hearings

[57:59] on the agenda. Those wishing to speak

[58:01] are encouraged to show respect for those

[58:03] who serve the city. Comments should

[58:05] focus on issues concerning the city.

[58:08] Those wishing to speak have signed up

[58:11] already signed up. I have a list here

[58:13] before the beginning of the meeting and

[58:16] need to ask you to keep your your

[58:18] remarks to 3 minutes [gasps] or less.

[58:21] And so we'll go ahead and start off with

[58:23] is Alona Shelly.

[58:31] » Welcome.

[58:33] I love the flower. That's very pretty.

[58:36] >> Thank you. Thank you for this

[58:38] opportunity to share my thoughts and

[58:39] opinions. I've written them so they will

[58:41] be concise.

[58:43] Having large homes available through

[58:45] Airbnb has been a huge blessing to my

[58:48] family. We've gathered our children and

[58:50] grandchildren in large homes from Logan

[58:52] to Moab as well as here locally. These

[58:55] homes have provided us with a place to

[58:57] cook, eat, sleep, talk, and play

[59:00] together. We've happily complied with

[59:02] the owner's rules of parking, curfews,

[59:05] play areas, and so on to maintain the

[59:07] order of the neighborhoods we've stayed

[59:09] in. Renting multiple rooms in a hotel

[59:11] could never have given us the same

[59:13] feeling of unity, privacy, and

[59:16] togetherness. For seven years, I've been

[59:18] good friends with a neighbor who lives a

[59:20] few blocks from me and owns a large airb

[59:23] on Palisade Drive. It's a fantastic

[59:26] place for families and friends to

[59:27] gather. Over the years, I've been very

[59:30] aware of my friend's conscientious

[59:31] efforts to be a responsible owner. Her

[59:34] large home is on a spacious lot with

[59:37] plenty of parking and garages, and she

[59:40] always strives to maintain the respect

[59:41] and goodwill of her neighbors. She's

[59:44] worked swiftly and diligently to address

[59:46] every issue that's come to her

[59:47] attention, whether from renters or from

[59:50] neighbors. Unlike some owners who don't

[59:52] carefully monitor their property, her

[59:54] family lives on the property and is

[59:56] available to handle concerns immediately

[59:58] if anything happens to arise. [snorts]

[1:00:00] Of course, there can be problems with

[1:00:02] short-term rentals. Owners must be

[1:00:05] extremely responsible and watchful if

[1:00:07] this kind of business is to work well

[1:00:10] for everyone. Clearly, the location and

[1:00:12] number of short-term rentals need to be

[1:00:14] determined wisely. However, I believe

[1:00:18] our ORM city council, our other city

[1:00:20] officials, and our citizens are up to

[1:00:23] the task. We can preserve the integrity

[1:00:25] of our neighborhoods while also allowing

[1:00:28] responsible property owners to offer the

[1:00:30] wonderful service my family and many

[1:00:32] others have so greatly benefited from.

[1:00:35] And I thank you for your time.

[1:00:37] >> Thank you. Appreciate you coming this

[1:00:39] evening. Right. Next, we have Craig

[1:00:41] Walker.

[1:00:52] Good evening, mayor and city council

[1:00:53] members. My name is Craig and I wanted

[1:00:55] to also share a personal experience that

[1:00:57] highlights the need for flexible housing

[1:00:59] options in Oram. My family is currently

[1:01:02] remodeling our home which has made it

[1:01:05] temporarily unlivable for my wife and

[1:01:08] four young boys. During this time, we

[1:01:10] needed a safe, furnished place to stay

[1:01:14] for a month and a half while

[1:01:15] construction was completed. An Airbnb

[1:01:18] provided what exactly what we needed. It

[1:01:20] allowed us to remain in the community,

[1:01:22] keep our routines, and avoid the stress

[1:01:24] and expense of signing a long-term

[1:01:26] lease, moving multiple times, or stay in

[1:01:29] a hotel that wasn't designated for my

[1:01:31] family life.

[1:01:33] And situations like ours happen all the

[1:01:35] time. home remodels, insurance claims,

[1:01:37] temporary work assignments, caring for

[1:01:40] family members, or families

[1:01:41] transitioning between homes.

[1:01:43] When we hear flexible housing, we often

[1:01:45] think of tourists. But it can also be a

[1:01:48] practical resource that serves residents

[1:01:49] and families during temporary life

[1:01:51] events such as mine. As you consider

[1:01:54] regulations, I encourage you to preserve

[1:01:56] options that allow responsible

[1:01:58] short-term rentals to continue serving

[1:02:01] these community needs. Policies should

[1:02:03] balance BA policies should balance

[1:02:05] neighborhood concerns while still

[1:02:08] allowing families access to safe,

[1:02:10] flexible housing when unexpected

[1:02:12] circumstances arise. Thank you for your

[1:02:14] time and consideration. All right. Thank

[1:02:15] you. Appreciate your comments.

[1:02:18] Next, we have um Brendan BB.

[1:02:22] I don't see him. Okay. I don't see him

[1:02:25] here. So, move on to Barry Flint.

[1:02:31] Okay. Berry is not here. Okay. Kurt, I

[1:02:35] don't know what how Kurt Forax Forax.

[1:02:44] » If they're not on the list, we can't

[1:02:45] have them come in and speak.

[1:02:50] I'm I'm sorry. All right. We'll go ahead

[1:02:54] then. And that's all the public

[1:02:57] appearances. Those are all the public

[1:02:58] appearances we have. council.

[1:03:01] Um, I've just got a note here asking if

[1:03:03] we can take a quick break after personal

[1:03:04] appearances to fix a tech issue. So, all

[1:03:08] right, away we go. Take a little break.

[1:04:33] Is it too late?

[1:04:55] Thanks.

[1:06:45] Jared

[1:06:51] getting fire.

[1:07:47] All right.

[1:07:48] I guess we're we're good to go now. So,

[1:07:51] we'll go ahead and continue our city

[1:07:54] council meeting. Council, we have our uh

[1:07:57] consent items which include approval of

[1:08:00] the meeting minutes of May 12th and May

[1:08:01] 26th. Appointing Mayor Pro Tim Jeff

[1:08:04] Lamson and which I'm going to just say

[1:08:07] appreciate and council member Kilpac

[1:08:10] filling that capacity for the first six

[1:08:12] months of this year. We also have on our

[1:08:15] consent calendar an ordinance amending

[1:08:16] chapter 10 of the ORM city code

[1:08:19] pertaining to flood damage prevention

[1:08:21] and an ordinance uh amending article

[1:08:25] 22-5-3A

[1:08:26] in the zoning map of the city of Or by

[1:08:29] changing the zone of the property

[1:08:30] located generally at 355 West University

[1:08:33] Parkway from R8 to C2 together with a

[1:08:38] development agreement. And just as a

[1:08:40] reminder that this came and had its

[1:08:42] public hearing at a prior meeting and is

[1:08:45] coming back just because the development

[1:08:48] agreement needed to be updated with the

[1:08:51] changes from the from what we

[1:08:53] recommended. So I would entertain a

[1:08:56] motion to accept uh and approve the

[1:08:59] consent calendar.

[1:09:02] >> I motion to approve the consent items.

[1:09:04] >> All right. Thank you, Council Member

[1:09:05] Gail. Is there a second?

[1:09:06] >> I second. Thank you, Council Member

[1:09:08] Kilpac. All right, we're going to go

[1:09:10] ahead and start with um we'll start with

[1:09:13] Council Member Gail.

[1:09:15] >> I'm voting.

[1:09:16] >> I

[1:09:23] >> Why do these turn off? I

[1:09:24] >> I

[1:09:26] >> All right, motion carries. Thank you.

[1:09:29] Did you pass this down to

[1:09:32] Teresa? Thank you. All right,

[1:09:36] we now have our scheduled items.

[1:09:39] And so we'll start with our first one,

[1:09:41] which is a a resolution to adopt the

[1:09:44] CDBG 2026 2027 annual action plan update

[1:09:49] to authorize the mayor to execute the

[1:09:50] standard form 424, the grantee

[1:09:53] certification, and all other HUD

[1:09:55] application documents. And a word I've

[1:09:58] never seen before, the fiscal year. What

[1:10:01] is that word?

[1:10:04] Okay.

[1:10:05] >> Is this supposed to be approve?

[1:10:07] Okay. I thought we went some foreign

[1:10:09] language. App ache.

[1:10:12] [laughter and gasps]

[1:10:13] I'm sorry. I am I am such a literal

[1:10:16] person. I'm I can be a party pooper

[1:10:18] because I'm such a literal person. I

[1:10:19] thought, what is that word? Approve the

[1:10:21] fiscal year 2026 2027 CDBG budget. Thank

[1:10:24] you those of you who are more creative-

[1:10:26] minded than I for helping helping your

[1:10:29] poor mayor out. All right, we'll turn

[1:10:30] the time over to um Bradley Day, our

[1:10:34] community and sustainability officer,

[1:10:35] and Taylor Drainy, Mountainland

[1:10:37] Association of Governments. Welcome.

[1:10:39] Thank you. Good evening, Mayor and City

[1:10:40] Council. We had an adjustment which we

[1:10:44] had made to the CDBG budget, which you

[1:10:46] are aware of that we had when we

[1:10:48] presented on May 26th. With that

[1:10:51] adjustment, we had a period of public

[1:10:53] comments from May 23rd to the 22nd and a

[1:10:56] public hearing held on June 11th. That

[1:10:58] is all now closed.

[1:11:00] And with us, we turn the time to you all

[1:11:02] to have the opportunity to vote on the

[1:11:04] CDBG budget and all those associated uh

[1:11:07] materials and items as well.

[1:11:09] >> All right. Any questions,

[1:11:11] council? Council member Lampson,

[1:11:14] >> were there any comments? I mean, were

[1:11:16] there any things that came from the

[1:11:17] public?

[1:11:17] >> Fantastic question. We did not receive

[1:11:19] any public comments and we have received

[1:11:21] the comments which we've had as we've

[1:11:22] interacted with y'all in meetings and

[1:11:24] taken those into account to the ability

[1:11:26] that we can.

[1:11:28] >> All right. Thank you. If there are no

[1:11:31] other questions,

[1:11:33] we'll go turn it bring back the council

[1:11:35] and

[1:11:36] we um there's an example of a motion

[1:11:39] there that we could do or there's

[1:11:41] something else you'd like to do.

[1:11:44] >> Mayor, I move to adopt the ORM community

[1:11:47] development block grant CDWBG 2026 2027

[1:11:51] annual action plan update to authorize

[1:11:54] the mayor to execute the standard form

[1:11:56] 424.

[1:11:57] the grantee

[1:11:59] uh certification on all other required

[1:12:01] HUD application documents and approve

[1:12:03] the the fiscal year 2026 2027 CDBG

[1:12:07] budget.

[1:12:08] >> Thank you. Um do you have a motion? We

[1:12:10] have a motion. Is there a second?

[1:12:11] >> I'll second.

[1:12:12] >> Right. Thank you, Council Member Lamson.

[1:12:14] Um we'll go ahead and have start voting

[1:12:16] with Council Member Mulestein.

[1:12:18] >> I I I

[1:12:24] » Thank you. The motion carries. Thank

[1:12:26] you.

[1:12:28] Next item on the agenda is a public

[1:12:30] hearing. It's an ordinance amending

[1:12:32] articles 22-14-20I

[1:12:34] and 22-1-5G

[1:12:37] modifying requirements for the conduct

[1:12:40] of neighborhood meetings in advance of

[1:12:41] applications to the planning commission.

[1:12:43] So, we'll turn the time over to planning

[1:12:45] manager Jared Hall.

[1:12:48] >> Thank you. Good afternoon, Mayor and

[1:12:49] Council. How are you doing? Um, I

[1:12:51] appreciate being here tonight to talk

[1:12:53] about this. This is the um the

[1:12:56] culmination of of a of a a lot of

[1:12:58] different uh conversations and work

[1:13:00] that's happened um over the past I

[1:13:02] believe it started actually as a

[1:13:03] conversation before I came on with the

[1:13:04] city as an employee. So, it goes way

[1:13:07] back a little ways. As a [clears throat]

[1:13:10] as a background, uh, under under Arm's

[1:13:13] code, projects that are changes to

[1:13:15] zoning and applications that are site

[1:13:17] plans that are adjacent to or within a

[1:13:20] residential zone are required to hold

[1:13:22] neighborhood meetings prior to coming to

[1:13:24] the planning commission for public

[1:13:25] hearing. Um, in those cases, we have

[1:13:28] certain rules and and these uh changes

[1:13:30] to these two different articles involve

[1:13:32] um changes to those rules to kind of

[1:13:34] enhance our ability to notify

[1:13:37] neighborhoods about what's going on and

[1:13:38] make it easier for people to know uh and

[1:13:40] be involved in that process. Um so on

[1:13:43] April 16th back in 2025, the planning

[1:13:45] commission voted to recommend those

[1:13:46] changes um or some changes that we'll go

[1:13:48] over tonight to the city council for

[1:13:50] adoption. Um just a a quick this is kind

[1:13:54] of a quick version an overview of of

[1:13:56] what those entail. Um there's kind of

[1:13:58] four parts to the noticing for

[1:14:00] neighborhood meetings. Um just before I

[1:14:03] get into those things, I want to make

[1:14:05] sure we make one thing clear just for

[1:14:07] the public. I think you guys are all

[1:14:08] aware of this, but just to make sure the

[1:14:09] public, any public listening is aware of

[1:14:10] this. What the planning division and the

[1:14:13] city's part in these neighborhood

[1:14:14] meetings is is just to provide the list

[1:14:16] of property owners that need to be

[1:14:18] notified. uh we don't we don't process

[1:14:21] their applications for the planning

[1:14:23] commission until they've done this. So

[1:14:25] these aren't we don't conduct these

[1:14:26] meetings. Um but we we part of the part

[1:14:29] of the changes that have been proposed

[1:14:30] are to kind of create a a format a

[1:14:33] little bit of regularity to them so that

[1:14:34] they're the results are more um

[1:14:38] digestible when they're included in the

[1:14:40] packets and reports. Some of the things

[1:14:42] that we um have for rules in the current

[1:14:44] code are the dates that people can have

[1:14:46] those meetings, can hold them. uh

[1:14:48] they're they're required not to do them

[1:14:49] before 6:00 p.m. on a week night and on

[1:14:52] Saturday not before 9:00 a.m. and not on

[1:14:55] holidays and not on the day before or

[1:14:56] after holidays. The proposed changes

[1:14:58] that got forwarded to the council are to

[1:15:01] not hold those also on a council night

[1:15:03] or on a commission meeting night that

[1:15:04] it's hard for council members to attend

[1:15:07] uh if they're on one of those nights. Uh

[1:15:08] and then also to clarify that that not

[1:15:11] before a holiday would include the

[1:15:12] Saturday before a Monday holiday. um

[1:15:15] then for distancing so or distance for

[1:15:17] the notice and what we mean by that is

[1:15:19] again this this sort of circle we'll get

[1:15:20] back to that in a second um right now if

[1:15:23] you are in a you're doing a site plan

[1:15:25] that is within that is adjacent to

[1:15:28] residential your notice requirement is

[1:15:30] 500 ft if that site plan happens to have

[1:15:32] multifamily

[1:15:34] um components then it's 1,000 ft and if

[1:15:37] it's a zone change likewise if it's a

[1:15:38] zone change that enables um you know

[1:15:41] multif family then it's 1,000 uh foot

[1:15:44] radius that we noticed the property

[1:15:45] owners within. The proposed change is to

[1:15:47] say any zone change regardless is a

[1:15:49] 2,000 ft uh radius that we notify

[1:15:52] everyone in. And then site plans

[1:15:54] adjacent to residential 1,000 uh ft. So

[1:15:57] we kind of up those areas that we that

[1:15:59] we notice. And then in timing, it's been

[1:16:01] kind of a challenge to make sure that

[1:16:02] mail is is something that people still

[1:16:05] get, but not as frequently as they used

[1:16:06] to get. So we had a we had an

[1:16:09] unnaturally long series of conversations

[1:16:11] about how often people get their mail. I

[1:16:12] know way more about that than I needed

[1:16:14] to know probably about the habits of

[1:16:16] mail collection. But in the end, the the change that they wanted to

[1:16:20] forward was that instead of one week

[1:16:22] prior to the meeting, they would need to

[1:16:24] postmark them 21 calendar days before

[1:16:26] the meeting. It's a lot of extension,

[1:16:27] but this is again the very beginning of

[1:16:28] people's projects. So, it adds a lot of

[1:16:31] time that way, but it makes sure that

[1:16:32] people have a chance to get that mail

[1:16:34] and see that notice. And then finally,

[1:16:36] in content, um right now the the code

[1:16:39] asks for contact information and the

[1:16:41] existing and proposed zoning

[1:16:42] classifications and to provide a list of

[1:16:44] the notified neighbors and a roster. Um

[1:16:47] we're also asking that that include the

[1:16:48] date and time because that's oddly

[1:16:49] missing from the current people always

[1:16:51] do it, but it seems like an obvious

[1:16:53] thing to have in there. And we've

[1:16:54] proposed some templates for the use of

[1:16:56] noticing and the roster and for the

[1:16:59] minutes so that people kind of get a do a better job of those things so

[1:17:04] that the notice is more informative and

[1:17:06] um we'll show you some some of those

[1:17:07] things if you didn't see them in the

[1:17:08] packet. Um for one unknown reason I have

[1:17:12] a second version of that same slide one

[1:17:14] I must have thought was prettier or more

[1:17:16] informative. It's a powerful slide. I

[1:17:18] thought we should have it twice.

[1:17:19] >> It's because I had a question. Can I ask

[1:17:21] a question?

[1:17:21] >> Sure. Um, back to the duplicate slide on

[1:17:24] the top. Yeah, that right there. Uh,

[1:17:26] also not on a council or commission

[1:17:27] meeting date. Is that all commissions?

[1:17:29] And it says date. So, if you have a like

[1:17:31] four o'clock commission meeting, does

[1:17:32] that mean they can't have a 7:00

[1:17:33] meeting?

[1:17:34] >> Good question. I don't think we

[1:17:35] specified that kind of I don't think the

[1:17:36] language has that kind of specificity in

[1:17:38] it. Uh, it's planning commission, not

[1:17:40] any commission, not the other

[1:17:41] committees.

[1:17:42] >> I thought it said planning commission in

[1:17:44] our packet.

[1:17:45] >> It's the planning commission. probably

[1:17:46] just in the slides said commission, but

[1:17:48] so committees like um the the the

[1:17:52] I'm blanking on all the committees, the

[1:17:53] library committee, any of those

[1:17:55] committee meetings, that's not a a

[1:17:57] meeting that you couldn't hold. Just

[1:17:59] planning commission and city council

[1:18:00] dates. Does that answer your question?

[1:18:01] Okay, that's probably why I did the

[1:18:03] duplicate slide. Let's go with that.

[1:18:07] Um so just again just to go over those

[1:18:09] distances uh we this is a typical um

[1:18:13] kind of a just a depiction of what the

[1:18:15] distances would mean. Um sorry go back

[1:18:17] to this. So we would like those to be 21

[1:18:20] calendar days in advance and we want to

[1:18:22] do the 2,000 ft and 1,000 ft. It does

[1:18:24] increase the number of notices that we

[1:18:25] send out. Uh those are the notices for

[1:18:28] the neighborhood meetings. Now the

[1:18:29] planning commission's notice

[1:18:30] requirements are set in the code in a

[1:18:32] different section. We haven't proposed

[1:18:34] changes to those for public hearings,

[1:18:36] but that was the planning commission's

[1:18:37] assumption was that if these kinds of

[1:18:39] things were um acceptable to the council

[1:18:41] for changes for the neighborhood

[1:18:42] meetings that the that the applicants

[1:18:44] would hold that we would probably turn

[1:18:46] back around and and try to modify those

[1:18:48] mod try and modify those requirements

[1:18:50] for the commission's public hearings as

[1:18:51] well. Um but that's something to think

[1:18:54] about. So it's a larger notice area,

[1:18:56] more notices, but the the goal is to get

[1:18:58] more involvement and make sure people

[1:18:59] know what's going on. Again, 21 calendar

[1:19:01] days prior. These are just some some

[1:19:04] depictions of what we did for templates.

[1:19:07] So you can see this is a a template that

[1:19:09] says shows you the area where the thing

[1:19:11] is going to happen. So if you get this

[1:19:12] in the mail, you kind of have a better

[1:19:13] idea of what it's happening. Um

[1:19:15] proposing to do these different things

[1:19:17] that we might be doing um where it's

[1:19:19] happening and when it's happening. And

[1:19:21] then on the rear of that notice to place

[1:19:23] the site plan, the uh the elevations,

[1:19:26] etc. that you're doing and use. We like

[1:19:28] these vicinity maps. We found those to

[1:19:29] be very helpful in noticing uh on our

[1:19:32] part. And so we want the the applicants

[1:19:34] to do those as well.

[1:19:36] And then uh meeting requirements, again,

[1:19:38] rosters for attendance so we know who

[1:19:39] was there. Uh an explanation to be given

[1:19:42] at the meeting. That was something

[1:19:43] that's missing in the code. We'd like

[1:19:45] for for them to know as the applicants

[1:19:47] that you're expected to say something at

[1:19:48] your meeting. It's not an open house. Um

[1:19:50] people aren't showing up for cookies.

[1:19:52] This is for you to make a presentation

[1:19:53] and say, "This is what we're doing." And

[1:19:55] make sure people understand that. and then the meeting minutes

[1:20:00] to have kind of a format there. And

[1:20:02] that's what I've got for a presentation

[1:20:04] tonight. Is there do you have any

[1:20:05] questions about that? I'm sorry. Yeah,

[1:20:06] let me go back.

[1:20:09] Yep. So, this is just the the minutes

[1:20:11] format. And then I believe in the packet

[1:20:13] we also included the kind of the roster

[1:20:14] sheet that we u that we like.

[1:20:19] >> Jared, thank you. Can I ask you a

[1:20:21] question?

[1:20:21] >> Sure.

[1:20:22] >> Uh this last point, additional meetings

[1:20:24] will be required if the concept has

[1:20:26] changed. I'm I'm wondering if [snorts]

[1:20:27] uh we have clarity around how we would

[1:20:29] know if the concept changed if there's a clear definition of that. Um there's

[1:20:35] not a clear definition contained in the language. It's more of a it's more

[1:20:38] of a putting them on notice that if you go with one concept and you're

[1:20:43] going to change that concept, we are

[1:20:44] going to expect you to go again. Um

[1:20:48] so it's really more putting them on

[1:20:49] notice, they might be expected to go

[1:20:51] back and hold another meeting if their

[1:20:53] concept changes before they go to the

[1:20:54] planning commission. It happens more

[1:20:56] often than you'd think that they changed

[1:20:58] their minds after they've met with the

[1:20:59] folks and they got to do it again.

[1:21:01] >> So, so I just one question about that.

[1:21:03] Um, if I was building uh something new

[1:21:07] or uh redeveloping something,

[1:21:10] I would want to take that neighborhood

[1:21:13] feedback into account.

[1:21:15] Uh, which means that uh I might want to

[1:21:19] change elements of my proposal uh as a

[1:21:22] result of the feedback that I received.

[1:21:24] Um, does that mean then that I have to

[1:21:28] go back and then I get more feedback and

[1:21:29] then I have to go back again? It seems

[1:21:31] like it could be a loop.

[1:21:32] >> Yeah, I guess it I guess it depends.

[1:21:34] It's it's a good point and it kind of

[1:21:36] depends on the nature of the changes.

[1:21:38] So, if you went into, for example, a

[1:21:39] neighborhood meeting and and you went in

[1:21:41] with a

[1:21:44] um I'm I'm thinking of a recent example

[1:21:47] and trying not to be so specific that

[1:21:48] it's obvious what it is, but if you went

[1:21:50] in with a certain height uh for a

[1:21:52] building and the neighborhood rejected

[1:21:54] that and said, "We we really would

[1:21:56] prefer this if this were different," um

[1:21:59] you you're not required to make those

[1:22:02] changes. you can come and propose to the

[1:22:04] planning commission whatever you want.

[1:22:05] But if you wanted to take those into

[1:22:06] account and they wanted and those were

[1:22:08] substantive changes, then you'd want to

[1:22:10] reschedule that meeting and hold it

[1:22:11] again. And in this case that I'm

[1:22:12] thinking of, they did that again uh

[1:22:14] immediately a couple weeks later, held

[1:22:16] another meeting, showed another concept,

[1:22:18] and that's probably the one that'll come

[1:22:19] forward. Um that kind of thing happens.

[1:22:22] uh if it's not a substantive change, if

[1:22:24] it's a change in parking stalls or

[1:22:26] something that we wind up with 28 stalls

[1:22:28] instead of 31 stalls or something, we

[1:22:30] might not require another meeting to be

[1:22:32] held. It would have to be significant.

[1:22:35] >> So, so the

[1:22:37] uh

[1:22:39] this is at the discretion of the city uh

[1:22:42] and to determine how much the concept

[1:22:44] has changed and if we think another

[1:22:46] neighborhood meeting is required

[1:22:48] >> may be required.

[1:22:49] >> Okay. Um, yeah. So, I I might just say

[1:22:52] additional meetings may be required if

[1:22:54] the concept is changed rather than will

[1:22:55] be required. That may clarify our

[1:22:58] discretion there.

[1:22:59] >> Sure.

[1:23:02] >> Oh, you mean here on the example on the

[1:23:03] screen it says where it says will be

[1:23:05] required and then say additional

[1:23:08] meetings may be required. Okay.

[1:23:12] And we do say in the in the text to

[1:23:15] council Mikum's point in the text we do

[1:23:16] say will be required if the first

[1:23:18] meeting is held as an information and I

[1:23:20] wasn't as specific in the slide just but for the sake of of the question cuz

[1:23:24] it's a good one. What it says currently

[1:23:26] in the in the red line is a second

[1:23:29] neighborhood meeting will be required if

[1:23:31] the first meeting is held as an

[1:23:32] information gathering meeting to obtain

[1:23:34] input from surrounding property owners.

[1:23:36] That's one part and that happens. So, we

[1:23:38] just wanted to make it clear, hey, if

[1:23:39] you just held this to kind of get a read

[1:23:40] on the neighborhood, that doesn't count

[1:23:42] as your neighborhood meeting for prior

[1:23:44] to the planning commission. You got to

[1:23:44] come back with your real concept. The

[1:23:46] second part of that is andor a proposed

[1:23:49] concept plan is not provided for review

[1:23:51] or the concept plan changes after the

[1:23:53] meeting is held. So, there may be a

[1:23:55] change that we could make if if that's

[1:23:57] preferable.

[1:23:58] >> Yeah, cuz I saw that happen, right? that

[1:24:00] happened on the north village district

[1:24:01] the 1600 north November [clears throat]

[1:24:04] neighborhood meeting which was a zoom

[1:24:05] meeting and they came back with another

[1:24:07] concept completely different so um yeah

[1:24:12] and does will so will doesn't mean you

[1:24:15] have to shall means you have to right

[1:24:17] legally

[1:24:18] so will is okay or do you want may what

[1:24:20] do you want in there

[1:24:22] >> well the legally the the and I

[1:24:26] appreciate the the thought the idea that

[1:24:28] goes behind this but the the term May is

[1:24:30] a little bit problematic legally because

[1:24:32] it leaves people in doubt as to whether

[1:24:34] they're actually required to or not

[1:24:36] required to. So I think probably have to

[1:24:38] be more definitive or you could say, you

[1:24:41] know, you you will have it if these conditions

[1:24:45] exist or you're not required to have it

[1:24:47] if these other conditions exist. But um

[1:24:50] it probably needs to be definitive one

[1:24:52] way or the other.

[1:24:54] And you prefer

[1:24:56] will. I mean, will gives the flexibility

[1:24:59] versus shall. You're saying those two

[1:25:00] are the choices because you don't want

[1:25:02] may.

[1:25:02] >> Yeah. If you want them to have it, you

[1:25:04] definitively want them to have it, then

[1:25:06] I would use a shall.

[1:25:11] » It does go on to say, this isn't

[1:25:13] language that we changed, but just if if

[1:25:14] it helps, it does go on from that last

[1:25:16] statement to say this requirement shall

[1:25:18] not apply to minor amendments to

[1:25:20] existing sites. So, if we're if it's an

[1:25:23] existing deal and and we're making only

[1:25:25] minor changes, that's where Okay.

[1:25:26] >> where we're using discretion, but

[1:25:30] >> I'm I'm comfortable. I just want to

[1:25:31] avoid the doom loop.

[1:25:33] >> Yeah. So, maybe I could uh ask Jared a

[1:25:35] question if that's all right. So, Jared,

[1:25:37] you're saying this draft says that if

[1:25:39] only minor changes are made to the

[1:25:41] proposed uh zoning change or concept

[1:25:45] plan that they don't have to come back

[1:25:47] again. Okay. Okay. Our read our sorry

[1:25:50] our read of it currently is that minor

[1:25:51] changes don't have to go back.

[1:25:53] >> Yeah. So that maybe allows the

[1:25:54] discretion that uh council member Mikum

[1:25:57] is looking for then

[1:25:58] >> we we are still in the position of

[1:26:00] determining how minor is minor. We don't

[1:26:02] have a lot of rules about that but you

[1:26:05] know we have a lot of experience in

[1:26:07] determining what's minor.

[1:26:09] >> But yeah I do have a comment. May I

[1:26:12] mayor mayor can I make a comment? Um, so

[1:26:16] one thing that I and I don't know if you

[1:26:17] guys even discussed this or not, but one

[1:26:19] thing I wonder why we don't have on

[1:26:21] there and maybe I would like to say is

[1:26:23] like we have the where was it? The name

[1:26:26] of the presenter,

[1:26:27] which is fine, but I would almost like

[1:26:30] to have the people actually connected to

[1:26:32] the property, the land owner. Who's the

[1:26:34] land owner? Everybody always askked me

[1:26:35] that. Or who's who's the developer? Can

[1:26:39] we connect those people to their

[1:26:41] projects and not just have Washburn on

[1:26:43] there?

[1:26:45] Yeah. You know,

[1:26:46] >> our we could we don't right now. You're

[1:26:48] right. We don't. Um right now that's a a

[1:26:52] kind of a

[1:26:53] >> cuz then you Google search it just makes

[1:26:55] it easier the whole way to find, you

[1:26:57] know. Um,

[1:27:00] >> so you're saying that the the land owner

[1:27:02] doesn't necessarily have to be there,

[1:27:04] but to have the land owner's name on the

[1:27:06] this is so and so's property and this is

[1:27:08] the presenter.

[1:27:10] >> Yeah. And this is the developer because

[1:27:12] typically who we have is the person that

[1:27:14] they hire to present the case,

[1:27:17] >> right? And so you if you search, you

[1:27:20] know, these people in our city, you'll

[1:27:21] find Julie Smith's name comes up all the

[1:27:23] time, right? Or Paul Washburn or

[1:27:25] whoever. And I almost I kind of wish we

[1:27:27] go away from that and start actually

[1:27:29] putting the parties that are involved in

[1:27:31] the application process and in the

[1:27:32] neighborhood meeting on our literature.

[1:27:35] >> We could we could include that in the

[1:27:36] notice as well. Yeah, these are again

[1:27:38] these are just templates. So we can have

[1:27:40] the template say if if that's the

[1:27:42] direction.

[1:27:42] >> I don't Is there a downside to doing

[1:27:44] that? I don't know. Is there

[1:27:45] >> I think it's a downside. Not that I can.

[1:27:46] >> It could be something like um Julie

[1:27:49] Smith representing

[1:27:52] >> whoever. And then

[1:27:54] >> but require the land owner and the

[1:27:55] developer.

[1:27:56] >> We do that. Absolutely.

[1:27:59] >> Right. Any other questions or comments,

[1:28:00] council? All right. This is a public

[1:28:03] hearing, so I'm going to go ahead and

[1:28:05] open the public hearing. Is there anyone

[1:28:07] who would like to speak to these

[1:28:08] proposed amendments?

[1:28:13] Oh, I see lots of heads shaking. So, no.

[1:28:15] So, I'm going to go ahead and close the

[1:28:17] public hearing and bring it back to the

[1:28:18] council.

[1:28:20] >> Can I ask one more thing? I'm sorry. I

[1:28:21] was going to ask Jared, will you please

[1:28:23] say what we talked about in our work

[1:28:24] meeting about noticing to now that we're

[1:28:28] our community is becoming we have more

[1:28:31] renters and renters are voters and they

[1:28:33] should have a say in things developments

[1:28:36] that are happening around them. Right

[1:28:37] now, we send the notifications to the

[1:28:39] property owners, right? And so, we're

[1:28:41] trying to work out how to notify our

[1:28:45] residents along with our property owners

[1:28:48] who in the case of a renter often times,

[1:28:50] you know, live out of state or whatever.

[1:28:51] So, would you just address that?

[1:28:53] >> Yeah, that's a that's a great point. I'm

[1:28:54] happy to. So, the the current as as

[1:28:58] council councilwoman Millet said,

[1:29:01] currently we pull the records when we

[1:29:03] provide this list of property owners

[1:29:04] that need to be notified. We pull that

[1:29:06] from county property tax records and

[1:29:08] those uh those ownership records are

[1:29:10] sometimes different from who's living in

[1:29:12] the in the property. Uh same goes for

[1:29:14] commercial properties. Lots of tenants

[1:29:16] and commercial properties as opposed to

[1:29:17] the ownership. Um the the state code

[1:29:20] requirement is that we notify property

[1:29:21] owners. And so that's why the code reads

[1:29:23] this way. Um, it's not a competing goal,

[1:29:26] but it's alternative to our goal of

[1:29:28] involving the community if those owners

[1:29:30] are far away from here and not actually

[1:29:32] participating in things that are going

[1:29:33] on. To to be able to notify them all

[1:29:36] would be to send a notice to the

[1:29:38] property itself as well as to the

[1:29:40] property ownership. There are some

[1:29:42] struggles. There will be some obstacles

[1:29:45] in figuring out how to do that. I think

[1:29:47] we can figure out a way to do it. Um,

[1:29:49] the planning commission talked about

[1:29:50] those kinds of issues. Um it it comes up

[1:29:54] with other questions with apartment

[1:29:55] buildings as well too. Do you do door

[1:29:57] hangers on everybody's door? How do you

[1:29:58] do that? Um there's other ways we can

[1:30:01] involve the community as well, but we

[1:30:04] think we can find a way to make it uh

[1:30:07] manageable to notice not just property

[1:30:09] owners but u property residents as well.

[1:30:12] Probably need a couple of months to

[1:30:14] figure that out to make it manageable.

[1:30:16] coating those lists, those different

[1:30:17] lists will be a little challenging

[1:30:19] unless we just want to double up

[1:30:20] everybody's notices. Um, that gets

[1:30:22] confusing. So, we're trying to find a

[1:30:24] way to do that. But the planning

[1:30:25] commission didn't want to necessarily

[1:30:26] hold up this process back in 2025. They

[1:30:29] weren't they didn't want to hold up

[1:30:31] these changes on behalf of figuring out

[1:30:33] how to do that other part. Does that

[1:30:34] make sense?

[1:30:35] >> Yeah. And I can appreciate that because

[1:30:36] we don't want to add any additional

[1:30:38] expense either to these applicants. We

[1:30:41] want to help them make this process easy

[1:30:43] for them, too. So, thank you for,

[1:30:45] >> you know, I just want to make that point

[1:30:47] cuz that has come up a lot, frankly. You

[1:30:49] know, um, so I think everyone in the

[1:30:52] city, whatever we can do to get more

[1:30:54] information out there, if we can figure

[1:30:56] that out, that'd be great. Thank you.

[1:30:57] >> I appreciate the question. Thank you.

[1:30:59] >> Question.

[1:31:00] >> Right. Thank you. Um, Council Member

[1:31:01] Gail,

[1:31:02] >> can you just estimate what sort of cost

[1:31:04] increases you think this might incur for

[1:31:06] applicants?

[1:31:07] >> It it's hard to do uh to to know exactly

[1:31:10] because every project is different. Um,

[1:31:12] but basically we are

[1:31:15] we're basically proposing to double the

[1:31:19] number of people that get a notice from

[1:31:21] 500 to 1,000, from 1,000 to 2,000. Um,

[1:31:24] what that'll mean in that radius is

[1:31:26] probably double where we were doing uh

[1:31:28] 200 people getting notices, it'll

[1:31:30] probably be four. Um, when we double if

[1:31:32] we if we make the changes that we're

[1:31:34] just talking about to to include not

[1:31:36] just ownership but residents, we might

[1:31:38] add another 30% to that. um that need

[1:31:41] different notices. Uh but we won't we

[1:31:44] won't really know until we get into it.

[1:31:45] We regularly just as a kind of a general

[1:31:47] rule when we stuff notices and we're stuffing them in our office for

[1:31:51] all of these planning commission and and

[1:31:52] city council public hearings. A typical

[1:31:56] I there isn't really a typical

[1:31:57] application, but [snorts] 165 notices is not out of the ordinary. 300's not

[1:32:03] out of the ordinary. A big one is 4 to

[1:32:05] 500. A gigantic one is 800 notices. I've

[1:32:09] stuffed a thousand notices before. Not

[1:32:11] here, uh, but in another life.

[1:32:15] I've never had to make anyone stuff a

[1:32:17] thousand.

[1:32:17] >> So, could you, for those of us that

[1:32:19] aren't familiar with stuffing notices

[1:32:20] and how many would go out in this, you

[1:32:21] know, in this new radius we're talking

[1:32:23] here, what sort of property like numbers

[1:32:25] increases? This like 500 more

[1:32:27] properties, 400 more properties, a

[1:32:28] thousand more properties.

[1:32:29] >> It's it's probably a couple hundred

[1:32:31] more. So the scale of this could be a

[1:32:33] range from do you have any like

[1:32:36] >> I'd say the range is is is it depends a

[1:32:39] lot because a condominium project for

[1:32:41] example adds a whole lot of notices in a

[1:32:43] small area but in a typical sort of in a

[1:32:47] typical single family neighborhood. Um

[1:32:50] it's it's a typical single family

[1:32:52] neighborhood getting a zone change

[1:32:53] request we might see 180 to 210 notices.

[1:32:58] Uh this might make it 320 somewhere on

[1:33:01] that order.

[1:33:04] » Can I can I just ask uh Jared, can you

[1:33:07] go back to the slide with the the

[1:33:08] radiuses on?

[1:33:09] >> Yeah.

[1:33:10] >> Uh there are numbers associated with

[1:33:11] that. Can you explain what those are?

[1:33:13] >> I can if I can remember. This is the

[1:33:17] number of notices for example in this

[1:33:19] particular deal for this this radius. I

[1:33:23] just don't remember what the radius was

[1:33:25] that we had them do in the diagram. I

[1:33:27] think this might have been the 500, but

[1:33:28] this this doesn't really match the 1,00

[1:33:30] to me or the 2,000. I'm not sure.

[1:33:34] >> It's going to be We're up here doing

[1:33:36] math with with our favorite 3.1459.

[1:33:40] >> Yeah.

[1:33:41] >> Number. And so that's going to be it's

[1:33:43] not going to be double. It's going to be

[1:33:45] >> it's going to be much larger.

[1:33:46] >> Much larger.

[1:33:47] >> It's because because that because you're

[1:33:49] picking up the radius that that radius

[1:33:52] around.

[1:33:53] >> Well, it does matter. I mean, assuming

[1:33:55] you have all residential properties, it

[1:33:58] really depends on where

[1:34:00] the project is happening because, you

[1:34:04] know, if you're over by State Street,

[1:34:07] you're not going to have a whole lot of

[1:34:09] houses,

[1:34:10] >> right? The size of the properties

[1:34:12] matter. There come to be big, huge,

[1:34:15] larger tracks, right, that that affect

[1:34:17] that.

[1:34:17] >> Yeah.

[1:34:18] >> Um,

[1:34:18] >> it's pretty hard to to know what that's

[1:34:20] going to be.

[1:34:21] >> It it is. So, I apologize. Uh, Jen, it's

[1:34:24] hard to know for sure. And this does

[1:34:26] change. And I I can't I don't know for

[1:34:28] sure if this was at one point we were

[1:34:29] talking about 3,000 feet as well. And I don't know if this is a depiction of

[1:34:32] the 3,000.

[1:34:33] >> This is like 10 times basically between

[1:34:35] 106 to 1173. More than 10 times.

[1:34:38] >> Yeah.

[1:34:38] >> I mean, that's a lot.

[1:34:39] >> It is significant.

[1:34:40] >> Okay.

[1:34:46] » Yeah. All right. Any other questions,

[1:34:49] council? [gasps]

[1:34:51] All right. to close the public hearing

[1:34:53] and bring it back to you for discussion.

[1:34:59] » Can I make a comment? I love the idea of

[1:35:02] more transparency and I love the idea of

[1:35:04] helping our residents better understand

[1:35:06] what's going on in the community around

[1:35:07] them. I also feel like until I have a

[1:35:10] better understanding of what sort of

[1:35:11] additional cost burden this is going to

[1:35:12] place upon the people trying to help

[1:35:15] grow our city and develop it in positive

[1:35:17] ways, I I don't think I'm quite ready to

[1:35:18] vote on it yet until I have more

[1:35:20] information. It's obviously there's this

[1:35:21] balancing act of how you know how do we

[1:35:23] value transparency versus making

[1:35:25] administrative things so

[1:35:27] administratively difficult that it's

[1:35:28] prohibitive. So I personally am not

[1:35:29] ready to vote on this.

[1:35:31] >> Yeah. So maybe I don't know from the

[1:35:32] perspective would be you're looking at a

[1:35:34] $20 million project and you're adding

[1:35:37] $500

[1:35:39] in mailing costs. So what or even a

[1:35:43] thousand or even 2,000 on a

[1:35:46] multi-million, you know, I mean, even

[1:35:47] the homes at Canyon Park, I don't know.

[1:35:51] I've just been on the other side where I

[1:35:54] haven't gotten notices

[1:35:56] um on a huge thing going on in my

[1:35:58] neighborhood and it's frustrating cuz

[1:36:03] you want to we we want to be engaged in

[1:36:06] our community but if we don't aren't

[1:36:08] notified or told I mean if there's a law

[1:36:11] that really does no good 500 ft that one

[1:36:14] was ridiculous that really didn't notify

[1:36:16] anybody you know and even the thousand

[1:36:19] ft we were finding that that wasn't

[1:36:21] notifying everyone. So maybe I'm I'm

[1:36:24] just saying I'm kind of putting in

[1:36:27] perspective of the cost of the project.

[1:36:31] Yeah. And I don't disagree with the

[1:36:32] theory of what we're trying to do here.

[1:36:34] I just need more information before I

[1:36:35] can make an educated decision about it.

[1:36:38] So what how are you going to get more

[1:36:39] information, I guess, is the question

[1:36:40] because you're you're going to have to

[1:36:42] get it depends on where the project is

[1:36:45] in the city. Everyone is going to change

[1:36:47] every notification circle. Oh, Gary has

[1:36:50] an idea.

[1:36:51] >> Say

[1:36:52] >> one. Sorry, I don't have a microphone.

[1:36:55] I'll speak loud.

[1:36:56] >> Oh, you

[1:36:57] >> There's one coming.

[1:36:59] >> You're going to have to get one to get

[1:37:00] on the

[1:37:02] >> One thing we can do. We've done noticing

[1:37:05] for projects. We know what the cost of

[1:37:09] that project was for the council. We

[1:37:12] could go in and not send out new

[1:37:15] notices, but do the new standard and see

[1:37:20] how many addresses we'd have. And we can

[1:37:23] do that, you know, fairly easily on

[1:37:25] several projects and bring back to you

[1:37:28] and say, "Okay, on this project we spent

[1:37:30] X and now with the new ordinance it

[1:37:32] would be why."

[1:37:34] >> I think that would be really helpful.

[1:37:35] And I and I think to your point, you

[1:37:37] know, the scale, I just have no idea. Is

[1:37:38] this $500? Is this $500? Is this $1,000?

[1:37:40] 2,000 or 10 million. I have no idea. So,

[1:37:42] >> well, and I'm just looking at the

[1:37:43] houses. Just the houses behind me. Six

[1:37:45] new homes. They're over a million

[1:37:47] dollars each. So, you've got a probably

[1:37:50] it's probably going to be close to $9

[1:37:51] million project.

[1:37:54] Then, let's find out what the what the

[1:37:55] increased cost of the post. Maybe use

[1:37:57] that as an example. Those most recent

[1:38:00] ones. I'm fine with that. That might be

[1:38:01] a good way to get the data

[1:38:03] >> because then you say what percentage,

[1:38:05] you know, is that point is it onetenth

[1:38:06] of 1% which is

[1:38:08] >> minuscule. We've been told, but

[1:38:11] >> we can take some projects and then like

[1:38:13] Gary said, we can have that ready for

[1:38:14] the next meeting. No problem.

[1:38:17] >> Never make them.

[1:38:19] >> Oh, I I will also appreciate that. Um I

[1:38:22] am a huge supporter of increasing the

[1:38:25] radius. I'm a supporter of increasing

[1:38:27] the the timeline. I think we do have

[1:38:28] real problems with people not getting

[1:38:30] adequate notice. Um just the geometric

[1:38:33] growth as we can uh in terms of of

[1:38:37] expectations around notices. I I would

[1:38:40] like the same information. I think

[1:38:41] Gary's suggestion is great.

[1:38:42] >> We'll do that. No problem.

[1:38:44] >> Right. Anybody else? Right. I'm going to

[1:38:47] just I'll weigh in here that [gasps] I

[1:38:50] really like expanding that radius. I

[1:38:52] think involving the community and and

[1:38:56] having them be notified of what's

[1:38:58] happening. And I think that's the the

[1:38:59] com that's what everybody think but

[1:39:01] thinks help here as well. But I'm not I

[1:39:05] I'm for me to move forward on this

[1:39:07] ordinance, I don't need to have that

[1:39:08] additional data because I think we need

[1:39:10] to do it. But if the council wants to wait and get that information,

[1:39:17] if it would make other council members

[1:39:19] feel comfortable with that, that's fine

[1:39:21] with me as well. So,

[1:39:24] I'm I'm okay either way.

[1:39:26] >> Yeah. I don't need any more information.

[1:39:29] I don't know if it's going to benefit

[1:39:30] that much, but that's, you know, I'm

[1:39:32] I've been looking at this a lot longer,

[1:39:33] too. So, and had experience.

[1:39:36] So, I know. Do you want a motion so we

[1:39:38] can vote or how would you want to?

[1:39:39] >> Yeah, we'd like to. Yeah, a motion would

[1:39:41] be great. Motion of some sort.

[1:39:44] [laughter]

[1:39:44] >> I move to approve by ordinance. Um,

[1:39:48] amending articles 221420I

[1:39:51] and 2215G

[1:39:53] modifying requirements for the conduct

[1:39:54] of neighborhood meetings in advance of

[1:39:56] applications to the planning commission.

[1:39:59] >> Right. Thank you. We have a motion. Is

[1:40:02] there a second?

[1:40:03] >> I'll second that.

[1:40:04] >> Okay. We have a motion and a second on

[1:40:07] that. So, we'll go ahead and we'll start

[1:40:10] with um you council member Kilpac. I

[1:40:13] >> I

[1:40:17] » uh nay

[1:40:19] >> I

[1:40:22] >> nay

[1:40:23] >> I

[1:40:25] >> right I think motion carries 5 to2

[1:40:28] [snorts] on that. Thank you. Next item

[1:40:31] on the agenda is amending appendix A.

[1:40:34] It's another public hearing, an

[1:40:35] ordinance amending appendix A of the

[1:40:36] Orange City Code, by including standard

[1:40:39] land use code 6231, beauty and barber

[1:40:41] shops and standard land use code 6232,

[1:40:45] tattoo and body piercing as permitted

[1:40:47] uses in the M2 manufacturing zone. So,

[1:40:50] I'll turn the time back over to you, Mr.

[1:40:52] Hall.

[1:40:53] >> Thank you. Uh, thank you. So, this is a

[1:40:56] request, as you said, to amend um

[1:40:58] appendix A, and I'm going to give you

[1:41:00] the um nickel tour of the situation. So

[1:41:03] the the applicant has a tattoo a tattoo

[1:41:08] shop and barber shop and he has a

[1:41:10] warehouse where he keeps equipment and

[1:41:12] stores merchandise uh in the M2 zone and

[1:41:15] he would like to add three stations two

[1:41:18] for uh two for hair and one for tattoo

[1:41:21] and body piercing at his location in the

[1:41:24] M2 zone. those two land use codes 6231

[1:41:27] and 6232 are not uh included in appendix

[1:41:31] A for M2 zoning. Um so his his request

[1:41:34] is simply to include those so that he

[1:41:36] can make that change at his location. Um

[1:41:38] the M2 zone as you can see here in this

[1:41:40] slide is primarily west of I-15. It's

[1:41:44] intended to provide areas for heavy

[1:41:46] industrial uh uses and it allows a

[1:41:49] variety of manufacturing uses. um most

[1:41:52] of them um in that standard land use

[1:41:55] codes that we have. The M2 zone is a a

[1:41:58] zone where he owns these buildings or

[1:42:00] owns a building. He wants to add those

[1:42:02] codes because he wants to function this

[1:42:04] way. But one thing that something that

[1:42:06] we wanted to make clear to the planning

[1:42:07] commission too is that one of the

[1:42:08] concerns at the public hearing was will this open up if we were to make

[1:42:12] this change, would this mean that all of

[1:42:14] our warehousing and all of our

[1:42:15] manufacturing buildings would just be

[1:42:17] would be taken over by cheaper uses like

[1:42:20] uh like tattooing or by uh by barber

[1:42:23] shops, etc. And the answer is probably

[1:42:26] not because there's expensive there are

[1:42:28] expensive considerations to to take into

[1:42:30] account. Even if this has changed, you

[1:42:33] still have to make changes to to meet

[1:42:35] fire and building codes, and those are

[1:42:36] usually significant. There's a long ways

[1:42:38] between the occupancies

[1:42:40] uh for warehousing and having people in uh beauty and barber shop situations

[1:42:45] in retail environments. So, it's a it's

[1:42:47] a fairly specific thing. The applicant

[1:42:50] feels like he can capture a group of

[1:42:51] people that are kind of captive down in

[1:42:53] that area that might want to get their

[1:42:54] haircut or or whatever on their lunch

[1:42:57] breaks or right after work or something

[1:42:58] like that. So, he has an interest in

[1:43:00] doing that and he already has the

[1:43:01] building. That's not going to be the

[1:43:02] case for many people. Uh, the planning

[1:43:04] commission did vote uh unanimously after

[1:43:06] some discussion on May 6th to forward

[1:43:09] this with the recommendation of approval

[1:43:11] uh as an accessory. U just as a note to

[1:43:14] tattooing is only allowed as an

[1:43:16] accessory to beauty and barber shops.

[1:43:18] They have to account for less than 15%

[1:43:20] of the total revenue of the shop. Um,

[1:43:22] that's

[1:43:23] >> how do you know that?

[1:43:24] >> It's in the code. It's in the code. It

[1:43:26] would have Oh, you're not saying that

[1:43:28] right now it accounts, but

[1:43:29] >> we don't know that. We're supposed to I assume collect data on that once in a

[1:43:34] while and know that there's still not

[1:43:35] accounting for that. Oh,

[1:43:36] >> it's an age-old question.

[1:43:37] >> Okay. But that's in our code is what

[1:43:39] you're saying.

[1:43:40] >> It's in our code.

[1:43:40] >> Oh, I thought you said he would. Okay.

[1:43:42] >> Yeah.

[1:43:44] >> Um the uh these are this is the slide

[1:43:46] where I was supposed to be telling you

[1:43:48] about uh the differences between the

[1:43:50] occupancies. Uh but you understand that that change is is quite significant

[1:43:54] on the building side.

[1:43:56] um the sorry I wanted to just give you

[1:43:59] one more um piece of information about

[1:44:02] that. So uh for this change if that

[1:44:05] change were made again it's it could be

[1:44:07] applied to any M2 zone. The M2 zone is

[1:44:09] mostly west of I15 right now but there's

[1:44:12] nothing um that keeps anyone from asking

[1:44:14] for an M2 zoning in any part of the

[1:44:16] city. It's not restricted like uh the PD

[1:44:19] zones that are only in certain

[1:44:20] geographic areas or such. So that's

[1:44:22] something to be aware of. Uh any

[1:44:24] questions? I'm sorry about the the

[1:44:25] ramble on that.

[1:44:27] >> Council, you have any questions? Council

[1:44:28] member Lamson,

[1:44:30] >> did we at one point in time have a limit

[1:44:33] of the number of tattoo parlors that

[1:44:35] could be in ORM?

[1:44:37] >> I don't know the answer to that

[1:44:38] question. I'm sorry. We we might have.

[1:44:40] There are certain uses that we only

[1:44:41] allow certain numbers of per capita. I

[1:44:44] don't think tattoo has had that.

[1:44:46] >> No, I I don't think tattoo parlors are one of those uses.

[1:44:50] >> Okay. I know they're not now. I don't

[1:44:52] know if they ever were. Thank you.

[1:44:54] >> Any other questions? Right. Is the

[1:44:56] applicant here?

[1:45:00] » All right. Oh, you have a question.

[1:45:02] Okay. Council member Millet.

[1:45:03] >> Oh, I don't know. It was going to be for

[1:45:04] the applicant. Do Do they want Are they

[1:45:07] Do they have to have the tattoo

[1:45:09] connection or can we just approve the

[1:45:11] barber shop and they'd be okay with

[1:45:13] that?

[1:45:13] >> Um I I don't know the answer to that

[1:45:15] question. I

[1:45:17] >> They don't have those Did they have

[1:45:18] those conversations in planning

[1:45:19] commission? Now,

[1:45:20] >> not about one or the one versus the

[1:45:21] other. just hesitant to expand. We

[1:45:24] already have tattooing and tattoo and

[1:45:26] free.

[1:45:27] >> So, okay.

[1:45:28] >> His current business is both and so he

[1:45:30] just wanted to be able to duplicate it

[1:45:31] down there.

[1:45:32] >> Right. Councilman, do you have a

[1:45:34] question?

[1:45:35] >> Um, I don't have a question, but I I was

[1:45:37] at that meeting uh when the applicant

[1:45:38] was there. I don't want to speak on

[1:45:40] behalf of the applicant, but as I

[1:45:42] recall,

[1:45:43] um the tattooing was um just very very

[1:45:47] adjacent to the the the barber shop

[1:45:50] activities. it was uh small tattoos and

[1:45:54] kind of cosmetic tattoos and so they

[1:45:56] felt like they were comfortable with

[1:45:57] this language because they felt like

[1:45:59] this was a small part of their business

[1:46:01] model.

[1:46:02] >> Right.

[1:46:03] >> Okay. Any other questions? The

[1:46:06] applicant's not here. I have mixed

[1:46:08] feelings about that

[1:46:10] because I like I like having the

[1:46:12] applicant here, but here we are. And so

[1:46:15] I guess we'll just go forward and open

[1:46:17] the public hearing. Is there anyone who

[1:46:19] would like to speak to this uh this item

[1:46:22] on the agenda this ordinance amendment?

[1:46:26] [sighs and gasps]

[1:46:27] Okay, seeing none, I'll close the public

[1:46:28] hearing and bring it back to the

[1:46:30] council. Okay, council,

[1:46:34] what would you like to do?

[1:46:37] Okay, council.

[1:46:38] >> Well, okay.

[1:46:41] So, I want to give him the barber shop,

[1:46:42] but I don't want to do the the tattoo.

[1:46:44] So, what do we do? What what do I He's

[1:46:46] not here to talk about that then. So

[1:46:48] >> he's not his request is for both. I

[1:46:51] don't know if if I mean you can you

[1:46:53] could you can do that.

[1:46:55] >> I just

[1:46:56] >> can we continue it until the applicant

[1:46:58] is here. Can we continue it to the next

[1:46:59] meeting invite him to attend and he can

[1:47:02] answer the question council. Would that

[1:47:04] be beneficial to have the applicant here

[1:47:05] or do you feel comfortable moving

[1:47:07] forward? Okay. We are we okay? Okay. It

[1:47:11] looks like we comfortable I'm seeing

[1:47:14] comfortable moving forward. Uh just one

[1:47:17] question for Jared. Jared, can you

[1:47:18] remind us what the planning commission

[1:47:20] vote on this was?

[1:47:21] >> Planning commission vote was and I

[1:47:22] appreciate that. Thank you. The planning

[1:47:24] commission vote was 7 to 0 to recommend

[1:47:26] approval.

[1:47:26] >> Thank you. All right.

[1:47:32] I'm comfortable with both personally,

[1:47:35] but I'm I try to make a habit of not

[1:47:37] making a motion as as the one conducting

[1:47:39] the meeting. But just so just so you

[1:47:41] council members as you are as you're

[1:47:43] contemplating that.

[1:47:47] Yeah. Go ahead.

[1:47:48] >> Okay. I make a motion to approve by

[1:47:51] ordinance amending appendix A of the ORM

[1:47:53] city code by including standard land use

[1:47:56] number get my glasses 6231 beauty and

[1:48:00] barber shops and standard land use code

[1:48:02] 6232 tattoo and body piercing as

[1:48:04] permitted uses in the M2 manufacturing

[1:48:06] zone. Right. Thank you. A motion. Is

[1:48:08] there a second?

[1:48:10] >> Can I ask a question before we vote? Can

[1:48:14] you go back to the slide that shows the

[1:48:16] M2 zone

[1:48:18] [gasps]

[1:48:19] and that's basically that gray area,

[1:48:22] >> darker gray?

[1:48:23] >> Okay.

[1:48:26] On the um That's a great question. I

[1:48:28] apologize. This was Becca's project. I

[1:48:30] don't know the location. I think it's

[1:48:31] North End.

[1:48:38] Yeah, that there's there's some in this north area there's some mix of

[1:48:41] public facilities and M2. But

[1:48:43] >> do you know what that is, Bren?

[1:48:45] >> I would guess that that public

[1:48:46] facilities would be Storm Brain. What do

[1:48:49] you think, Chris?

[1:48:51] >> That's

[1:48:53] >> Oh, that's the public works building.

[1:48:54] Yeah, there you go.

[1:48:56] >> Oh, it is.

[1:48:58] >> Is that We need our 12th.

[1:49:00] >> Oh, Mr. Shy's like, "Duh, council, don't

[1:49:03] you know the public works building when

[1:49:05] you see it?"

[1:49:07] >> We always forget about you people down

[1:49:08] there. So,

[1:49:09] >> that's a big building.

[1:49:10] >> Beautiful building.

[1:49:11] >> There's a strong desire in public works

[1:49:13] for tattoos.

[1:49:15] >> Yes.

[1:49:16] >> Sorry. The the public facilities up

[1:49:19] within the PD36 though is a regional

[1:49:22] storm drain detention basis. [gasps]

[1:49:25] >> All right.

[1:49:26] >> Okay. Thank you. And sorry to interrupt.

[1:49:28] >> Okay. We have a motion. And is there a

[1:49:30] sec a motion to approve the the

[1:49:33] amendment as presented this evening? Is

[1:49:36] there a second?

[1:49:38] >> I'll second that.

[1:49:39] >> All right. Thank you, Council Member

[1:49:41] Mikum. Any further discussion?

[1:49:44] Okay. I will vote I.

[1:49:46] >> I.

[1:49:47] >> No, I'm going to vote nay because I'm

[1:49:48] concerned that we're expanding tattoos.

[1:49:50] We already have them in C2 and C3 and I

[1:49:52] don't know why we want to put them in

[1:49:54] R2. So nay.

[1:49:56] >> I

[1:49:59] nay. I share similar concerns.

[1:50:01] >> I

[1:50:02] >> All right. Thank you. Motion carries 52.

[1:50:08] Next item on the agenda is um public

[1:50:11] hearing and ordinance amending section

[1:50:12] 22-11-17B

[1:50:16] of the ORM city code including standard

[1:50:18] land use codes 7424 recreation centers

[1:50:22] general as a permitted use in the PD5

[1:50:25] zone. So we'll turn the time over to you

[1:50:27] again Mr. Hall. Thank you. And and if

[1:50:30] you noticed, um, in addition to having

[1:50:31] that duplicate slide, I also put these

[1:50:33] all in the wrong order tonight, too. So,

[1:50:35] I'm I'm doing great. Um, this is a this

[1:50:38] is a good opportunity to, uh, to explain

[1:50:41] the difference here. This this

[1:50:42] particular text amendment is uh is a

[1:50:46] little bit different, although it's also

[1:50:47] just altering. All it's a request to do

[1:50:49] is to alter the list of approvable uses,

[1:50:52] the list of permitted uses. In normal

[1:50:54] zones, you get to do that by just

[1:50:55] altering appendix A, our our standard

[1:50:58] land use list, the giant monstrosity of

[1:51:00] a list of uses. In the case of this PD

[1:51:03] zone, it's a part of that zoning and so

[1:51:05] it's an article within that that PD

[1:51:07] zones. So that's why the difference

[1:51:08] there in case anybody noticed and was

[1:51:10] concerned about that. That's why the

[1:51:12] difference 7424 is recreation centers

[1:51:14] general. This is the result of fun city

[1:51:17] coming in and wanting to be part of a a

[1:51:19] take over the Joann's building that was

[1:51:20] in this location.

[1:51:22] um they're more of a they they came in

[1:51:25] and said, "Well, we're like a gymnasium

[1:51:27] and we view it with an arcade and party

[1:51:29] rooms and and all those kind of things

[1:51:31] as more general recreation." Uh they

[1:51:33] were willing to ask for the amendment

[1:51:34] and so we've been bringing them forward

[1:51:36] with this. The planning commission did

[1:51:38] vote unanimously at the same meeting on

[1:51:40] May 6th to recommend approval of this uh

[1:51:44] request to add this to it. The the most

[1:51:45] recent change was to add gymnasiums and

[1:51:48] things in that same category, that same

[1:51:50] list of 7,400 amusements and and uh and

[1:51:54] sports types facilities. Um it does, as

[1:51:57] was mentioned by the mayor, PD5, uh runs

[1:52:00] up along University Parkway. There's a

[1:52:02] variety of different uses in there, and

[1:52:04] the planning commission felt like it met

[1:52:06] the purposes of this uh zone. It didn't

[1:52:09] fall outside of the the uh the purposes.

[1:52:11] It didn't change the architecture, the

[1:52:13] landscaping, the parking needs. It just

[1:52:15] added one more use and brought a use in

[1:52:16] that was available. Um, these are all

[1:52:19] examples of how the appendix works. Um,

[1:52:23] this is uh again, this is amending this

[1:52:26] section to add uh uh general recreation.

[1:52:30] The most recent ones for health spas and

[1:52:32] gymnasiums and athletic clubs that just

[1:52:34] didn't quite fit. Um, it doesn't again

[1:52:37] change any of the architecture

[1:52:39] requirements, the parking or

[1:52:40] landscaping. It's just that use request

[1:52:41] and that's all. Uh, planning commission

[1:52:44] did vote to recommend approval and if I

[1:52:46] can answer any questions for you if you

[1:52:47] have any.

[1:52:48] >> Thank you. Council, do you have any

[1:52:49] questions?

[1:52:52] All right. This is um I don't I'm

[1:52:55] assuming I since I know everybody in the

[1:52:57] audience, I don't think either one of

[1:53:00] you are the applicant for fun city. So,

[1:53:04] our applicant is not here this evening

[1:53:06] again. So,

[1:53:08] um, I will go ahead and open up the

[1:53:10] public hearing. If there's anyone who

[1:53:12] would like to speak to the proposed

[1:53:15] amendment to add recreation centers to

[1:53:18] the PD5 zone, you're welcome to come

[1:53:20] forward.

[1:53:23] See nobody wanting to do that, I'll go

[1:53:26] ahead and close the public hearing and

[1:53:28] bring it back to the council for

[1:53:30] discussion. So, council, how do you feel

[1:53:32] about recreation centers as a permitted

[1:53:36] use in the PD5 zone?

[1:53:40] » Go ahead.

[1:53:42] >> Yeah, I'm just uh maybe sharing a couple

[1:53:44] of things that came out of the planning

[1:53:45] commission hearing on this where the

[1:53:46] applicant was here. Uh

[1:53:51] again this is uh this is an experiential

[1:53:53] recreational environment u with games

[1:53:56] and trampolines and ball pits and things

[1:53:59] is was the idea. Uh, one of my questions

[1:54:03] initially on this was how do the

[1:54:05] neighbors, the commercial neighbors feel

[1:54:08] about that? And, uh, we heard in that

[1:54:12] planning commission hearing that, uh,

[1:54:14] there's a lot of enthusiasm in that

[1:54:16] particular, uh, commercial district

[1:54:18] because they feel like it will bring a

[1:54:20] lot of of families in and a lot of

[1:54:22] family traffic and that that would be

[1:54:24] good a good redevelopment opportunity

[1:54:27] uh, in that part of our commercial zone.

[1:54:29] Um, I would also say that, you know, one

[1:54:31] of the the opportunities ORM has going

[1:54:33] forward is uh as as we think about our

[1:54:36] economic strategy to have a lot of of

[1:54:39] experiential uh retail or experiential

[1:54:43] uh businesses that I think this fits in

[1:54:47] and so I'm supportive of this this uh

[1:54:49] amendment.

[1:54:51] >> Right. Thank you, Council Member Mikum.

[1:54:54] Any other comments? Council member

[1:54:56] Millet. So I just have a question. Um,

[1:55:00] and this is kind of a little more

[1:55:02] ideological or whatever moving forward.

[1:55:04] So we have a lot of PE and they're set

[1:55:07] and we're starting to see some

[1:55:10] revitalization and changes in some of

[1:55:12] these at least I have the last few

[1:55:13] years. So is this the best way to move

[1:55:17] forward with this and not necessarily

[1:55:20] this project but I mean changes to PD

[1:55:23] zones? Should we have our planning

[1:55:25] commission look into

[1:55:28] um

[1:55:30] differing zones, different ways to make

[1:55:34] those changes and encourage development

[1:55:36] of specific as council member Mikum

[1:55:39] said, you know,

[1:55:40] >> that's that's a great question.

[1:55:42] >> It's a great question. It is a is a it

[1:55:44] is sort of a philosophical one. if we're

[1:55:46] going forward different ways, ED zones

[1:55:47] might not be the way to to do it because

[1:55:49] they become limiting and then as as

[1:55:51] retail changes, you've got to adjust the

[1:55:54] entire zone. Uh the planning commission

[1:55:55] in in talking about the general plan has

[1:55:57] been talking recently about adjusting

[1:55:59] our commercial zones, looking at um at

[1:56:02] more specialized zones, encouraging

[1:56:04] trying to use the zoning to encourage

[1:56:05] rather than just to uh to differentiate

[1:56:08] between uses. So, it's been on their

[1:56:10] minds. Yeah. And then it's one of the

[1:56:12] topics we've been talking about. Might

[1:56:14] that be a better way forward than

[1:56:15] planned development zones?

[1:56:16] >> Okay, because I'm really seeing like the

[1:56:17] C3 zone, right? It used it it's it was

[1:56:20] to preserve to have a buffer. It was

[1:56:22] supposed to be a buffer from residents

[1:56:24] C3 to C2. It's not that anymore because

[1:56:27] we've added tattoo parlors in there.

[1:56:29] We've added things the last few years.

[1:56:31] So, um anyway, just thank you. I

[1:56:34] appreciate that thought. Maybe we can

[1:56:35] have that conversation.

[1:56:36] >> That's a great thought. Thank you,

[1:56:38] >> Mayor and Council. We're probably due to

[1:56:40] have, you know, kind of a joint meeting

[1:56:41] between the planning commission and

[1:56:43] council at, you know, some future work

[1:56:45] session so we could make note to make

[1:56:47] this, you know, one of the discussion

[1:56:49] points as we do that again here in the

[1:56:53] next months,

[1:56:53] >> right? Yeah, that that'd be good. That'd

[1:56:55] be something I'd look forward to. Any

[1:56:57] other comments, council?

[1:56:59] Okay. I would look for some sort of

[1:57:02] action on this. Mayor, I move to approve

[1:57:08] uh by ordinance amending section

[1:57:09] 22-11-17B

[1:57:12] of the Oram city code by including

[1:57:14] standard land use number 742 24

[1:57:17] recreation centers general as a

[1:57:18] permitted use in the PD5 zone.

[1:57:21] >> I'll second that.

[1:57:22] >> Right. Thank you. We have a motion in a

[1:57:24] second. Is there any further discussion?

[1:57:27] >> All right. I just before we vote, I just

[1:57:29] want to say that I agree with what

[1:57:30] council member Mikum said. I think

[1:57:31] working I think this will help

[1:57:33] revitalize that shopping center and will

[1:57:36] bring fun

[1:57:38] to the area. So, um maybe not for people

[1:57:42] my age get stuck in a ball pit, but here

[1:57:45] we are. Um we'll go ahead and if there's

[1:57:48] no further discussion, start with

[1:57:50] council member Mikum. The vote

[1:57:52] >> I motion carries. Thank you. Thank you

[1:58:01] all so much.

[1:58:03] >> Right, next item on the agenda is

[1:58:04] another public hearing. It's an

[1:58:05] ordinance um fiscal 2025 2026 budget

[1:58:10] amendments. So turn the time over to

[1:58:12] Brandon Nelson, our chief financial

[1:58:14] officer.

[1:58:39] Thank you, mayor.

[1:58:41] All right. So, first up, uh, on our

[1:58:45] budget amendments, uh, this is the last

[1:58:47] one of the fiscal year, of course, uh,

[1:58:50] to try to get those items into our

[1:58:53] budget, uh, so that, uh, we don't have

[1:58:56] any missteps in that regard. Um, just

[1:58:59] going down the list through our our

[1:59:01] notes. So, note uh, the items with a

[1:59:03] note of one um, are again grants and,

[1:59:07] uh, donations primarily. Um and as you

[1:59:10] scroll through, you know, those various

[1:59:13] grants, uh and donations,

[1:59:16] uh most of them, you know, are in

[1:59:18] relation to emergency preparedness, uh

[1:59:21] in park cameras,

[1:59:23] um equipment for the internet crimes

[1:59:26] against children, those kind of grants.

[1:59:28] We also um have uh some unique one.

[1:59:31] You'll see kind of right in the middle

[1:59:33] under the capital improvement project

[1:59:34] fund. Um railroad uh crossing safety

[1:59:38] grant that we just barely received. Uh a

[1:59:40] grant from MAG for the North Union Canal

[1:59:43] Trail Master Plan uh to study that. Uh

[1:59:47] obviously the Gold Star, we strangely

[1:59:49] enough, we still continue to receive

[1:59:51] donations for the Gold Star memorial.

[1:59:53] [laughter]

[1:59:54] Um which is great. And uh and then uh uh

[1:59:59] Orammfest. Uh there's some donations in

[2:00:01] there um related to Oramfest. You'll see

[2:00:04] more actually um come our next one in

[2:00:06] next year as kind of a lag there um as we do those. And then um

[2:00:14] those are those are the the majority of

[2:00:16] the the grant and donation items. Are

[2:00:19] any questions about those in particular

[2:00:21] that you see that maybe you had a

[2:00:22] question about? Council, any questions?

[2:00:25] >> Right.

[2:00:26] >> Okay. Then uh item number two, which

[2:00:29] you'll see right here

[2:00:32] near the top,

[2:00:35] uh fees, ambulance services. So our

[2:00:38] ambulance revenues have um been uh quite

[2:00:42] good. And so as part of that, there's

[2:00:45] actually, you'll find this hard to

[2:00:47] believe, but our collection company

[2:00:49] costs also go up with those uh higher

[2:00:53] revenues as we don't do that ourselves.

[2:00:55] We hire a third party to do that. Um so

[2:00:58] there are also not only are there the

[2:01:00] normal collection costs, but we've had

[2:01:02] additional collection costs related to a

[2:01:04] third party collection agency. when the

[2:01:07] um Gul Ross who is our collection agent

[2:01:10] um doesn't collect then they turn it

[2:01:12] over to that third party collection

[2:01:13] agency and and they try to collect on it

[2:01:15] as well. So so there's some cost there

[2:01:17] and then as uh we actually have to pay

[2:01:20] state the state uh Medicaid fees in

[2:01:24] relation to any Medicaid billings that we have. So all of those fees also

[2:01:30] are part of why we're making this

[2:01:32] amendment so that we can make sure that

[2:01:34] we're covering those costs in relation

[2:01:36] to those additional ambulance revenues.

[2:01:39] Any particular question about that

[2:01:42] particular item?

[2:01:44] Great. Item number three right below

[2:01:46] that uh police services for those fees.

[2:01:50] Um we came to you in our last budget

[2:01:52] amendment um discussing UVU and the fees

[2:01:55] that they have been paying to our uh

[2:01:58] police uh in covering overtime shifts.

[2:02:00] Um and this uh kind of brings that uh to

[2:02:05] current as far as um what billings that

[2:02:07] we have received and uh from them. Um

[2:02:11] and obviously the almost all of that

[2:02:14] covers overtime costs that are being

[2:02:17] spent within our police department. Any

[2:02:21] questions about that particular one?

[2:02:24] Okay.

[2:02:26] Um item number four, which you can see

[2:02:29] just a little bit lower on there in the

[2:02:32] within the general fund that says lease

[2:02:34] purchase financing proceeds. Um that is

[2:02:38] uh recording the uh lease ar financing

[2:02:41] arrangement that we have made with JP

[2:02:43] Morgan Chase in relation to our new fire

[2:02:46] engine. um which I believe uh received

[2:02:49] documents to have that funded and paid

[2:02:52] for. So that should happen here tomorrow

[2:02:54] or Thursday at the latest uh to be able

[2:02:57] to finalize uh getting that paid u I

[2:03:00] believe the engine is up in Salt Lake

[2:03:02] and then could be delivered um at at

[2:03:05] once that payment is made. So this is

[2:03:08] just finalizing that transaction within

[2:03:10] our budget.

[2:03:12] Um item number five you see on there the

[2:03:16] at the bottom of the general fund

[2:03:17] section uh fund 63 safety issues. Um the

[2:03:22] that particular fund 63 is our self-

[2:03:24] insurance fund. Um it is contributing

[2:03:27] dollars uh for the purchase of uh safety

[2:03:30] barricades for events. Um and so this is

[2:03:34] paying for those um which unfortunately

[2:03:38] more and more of a need in relation to

[2:03:40] having barricades as we particularly for

[2:03:43] Warhamfest but and many of our other um

[2:03:46] uh events as well.

[2:03:50] Uh item number six in the uh road BNC

[2:03:55] road special revenue fund. Uh we are

[2:03:58] beginning the final phase of our street

[2:04:00] lighting conversion from Rocky Mountain

[2:04:02] Power to our own street lighting. And

[2:04:04] this is using the appropriated surplus

[2:04:08] funds within um that special uh revenue

[2:04:11] fund to fund that final phase.

[2:04:16] A little further down in number seven

[2:04:19] within our water fund. Um you can see

[2:04:23] the uh which

[2:04:25] uh we're we have been having some money

[2:04:29] that falls to our surplus uh account

[2:04:33] within the water fund and we are now

[2:04:35] appropriating those reserves for uh

[2:04:37] spring waterline improvements uh that

[2:04:40] will be going uh beginning here shortly.

[2:04:43] Uh so it's using those funds to fund

[2:04:45] that project.

[2:04:47] Right below that item number eight, um

[2:04:50] same thing, they have some surplus funds

[2:04:53] in the storm water fund and they're

[2:04:56] intending to do a variety of different

[2:04:59] storm water um improvements in relation

[2:05:02] to some of those may be uh storm the

[2:05:05] canal related. Some of those are just

[2:05:08] other um related uh storm water

[2:05:11] improvements that need to be happen. And

[2:05:13] so it's u appropriating those surplus

[2:05:16] funds for those projects.

[2:05:19] Um item number nine uh related to the

[2:05:23] solid waste fund. Um you'll recall we I

[2:05:26] last budget this last budget year we did

[2:05:29] not raise um our garbage rates. Um so we

[2:05:33] uh did that with um some possibility

[2:05:36] that uh the revenue the amount of

[2:05:40] revenues would not necessarily cover the

[2:05:42] amount of the solid waste contract. Um

[2:05:45] this particular uh budget amendment then

[2:05:49] unfortunately has come to the

[2:05:51] realization that that solid waste

[2:05:53] contract will be a little bit short in

[2:05:55] covering that contract. So with full

[2:05:58] anticipation of using reserves for that

[2:06:00] um we're now uh asking for this

[2:06:04] proposing this budget amendment to cover

[2:06:05] those contract costs.

[2:06:09] Uh item number 10 uh are purchasing a

[2:06:13] warehouse uh down at the public works

[2:06:16] facility. We have been kind of saving

[2:06:18] some money um in that fund to purchase a

[2:06:22] new van for our uh warehouse staff to be

[2:06:25] able to deliver product to the various

[2:06:28] uh places throughout the city. Uh the

[2:06:29] time has come to replace that van. And

[2:06:31] so this uh budget amendment appropriates

[2:06:34] that those savings that have been in our

[2:06:37] uh surplus to purchase that van.

[2:06:43] Item number, excuse me, item number 11

[2:06:46] related to the senior citizens fund. Uh

[2:06:49] there are basically two partic well

[2:06:51] three particular items. The first one

[2:06:53] you see is that miscellaneous revenue

[2:06:55] tours. So we have additional revenue. Um

[2:06:58] within that there's also an additional

[2:07:00] expense. So this raises the revenue to

[2:07:03] cover that additional expense for those

[2:07:05] tours. Um the four items following that,

[2:07:09] the donations, membership dues, meals,

[2:07:11] and appropriating surplus from

[2:07:13] operations. All of those changes are to

[2:07:16] cover the meals program that is there.

[2:07:20] So we, you know, had a very a variety of

[2:07:23] sources to be able to to cover those

[2:07:25] costs for that meals program. And those

[2:07:27] four items were the ones that we were

[2:07:29] able to do that with. And then the last

[2:07:31] item appropriating that surplus that's

[2:07:34] misnamed the carryover of capital

[2:07:36] projects but we are appropriating

[2:07:38] surplus from uh the surplus to uh buy a

[2:07:42] floor scrubber that is specific to the

[2:07:44] senior center. Um and so that that unit

[2:07:48] will once purchased will stay down there

[2:07:50] at the city center and replacing a a I

[2:07:52] don't even think they have one

[2:07:53] currently. So that that will be a a good

[2:07:56] benefit for them down there.

[2:07:59] And then I think 12 is the last one. And

[2:08:04] over at Library Hall, uh they have

[2:08:06] various rentals throughout the year and

[2:08:08] those rentals have exceeded their uh

[2:08:10] current budget. Um as well as when

[2:08:14] various artists come and sell product,

[2:08:17] those sales go through our system. Um

[2:08:21] and so we're recording that revenue that

[2:08:24] we've received. a portion of those

[2:08:27] revenues go back to those artists. And

[2:08:30] so we're increasing or on the

[2:08:32] expenditure side, we're also increasing

[2:08:34] that where those um uh amounts that are

[2:08:39] sent back to the uh artists are spent as

[2:08:43] well as uh increasing employee

[2:08:45] development, some employee development

[2:08:47] um uh expenditure account, budget

[2:08:51] accounts, as well as some equipment that

[2:08:53] to purchase for library hall as well.

[2:08:56] So, that's everything I have. Unless you

[2:09:00] want to talk about the $50 item that I

[2:09:02] didn't put a note on.

[2:09:05] >> Does anyone want to talk about the $50

[2:09:07] item? He did not put a note.

[2:09:08] >> Well, now that he mentioned it,

[2:09:10] >> I know you drew our attention.

[2:09:13] >> Yeah. So, we just had uh um some trustee

[2:09:16] fees that came in $50 higher than what

[2:09:18] we had budgeted. So, we had to cover

[2:09:21] that cost.

[2:09:21] >> Totally. I don't like accounts being in

[2:09:24] overspent. So I threw it in there.

[2:09:26] >> He This is a Is it cleansing? A

[2:09:28] confession just happened. Counsel.

[2:09:30] >> Yes.

[2:09:31] >> So now we now we feel okay. You feel

[2:09:33] better.

[2:09:33] >> I'm good. Thank you.

[2:09:34] >> Good. I'm glad. We want to help you feel good. Okay.

[2:09:37] >> That shows the detail that brand.

[2:09:40] >> Thank you, chef.

[2:09:42] >> Feels eagleized.

[2:09:43] >> Thank you for being a good sport.

[2:09:45] [laughter]

[2:09:46] >> Council, any other questions on this?

[2:09:50] Right. It's a Oh, we do have a question.

[2:09:52] Council member Mikum, I'm sorry. Uh so

[2:09:54] this is the end of our fiscal year and

[2:09:57] uh a lot of these items are just

[2:09:59] reconciling things, cleaning things up

[2:10:01] um to make sure that we've done what we

[2:10:03] need to do by the end of the fiscal

[2:10:04] year.

[2:10:04] >> Correct.

[2:10:05] >> U could you just provide us with a

[2:10:07] little bit of a higher level? How did we

[2:10:09] do on our budget this year? Uh and you

[2:10:12] know are how how well did we do at

[2:10:14] estimating our costs and revenues and where are we coming in at the end of

[2:10:19] the year? I honestly I'm not there

[2:10:22] because to be honest a lot of on the

[2:10:25] expenditure side we're we're we're

[2:10:28] meeting those. The question more becomes

[2:10:31] on the revenue side because I don't have

[2:10:33] all of those a lot of the revenues

[2:10:35] particularly sales tax. We don't have

[2:10:37] those yet there there's a two-month lag

[2:10:40] in sales tax. There's a one-mon lag in

[2:10:42] property tax. There's a one-mon lag a

[2:10:46] one and two month lag in franchise

[2:10:48] taxes. So, from the revenue side of the

[2:10:51] house, I don't have the answers. It all

[2:10:54] is looking relatively positive, like

[2:10:57] we're going to be fine hitting budget

[2:10:58] for that, if not uh slightly exceeding

[2:11:01] it. Um, but from the expenditure side of

[2:11:04] the house, we've been able to keep those

[2:11:06] things inside of what was budgeted.

[2:11:10] I don't know if that totally answers

[2:11:11] your question, Council Member Mikum.

[2:11:13] >> Um, the half answer you gave was great.

[2:11:16] Uh unfortunately lot until we get start

[2:11:19] working on through our audit basically

[2:11:22] in late August and September I really

[2:11:25] that's kind of the answer you're going

[2:11:27] to generally get.

[2:11:29] >> Question can I this and this might be BJ

[2:11:32] I'm not sure if you need to answer this

[2:11:33] one or Brandon if you know. So I'm very

[2:11:35] interested in the item one internet

[2:11:38] crimes against children grant. I

[2:11:41] attended that um event at library hall

[2:11:45] and I guess my question is I want to I

[2:11:49] want to talk about that event but I my

[2:11:50] question is is that a set grant? Are we

[2:11:53] getting that every year? Is that going

[2:11:55] to increase decrease? What

[2:11:57] >> it's not set but we do pretty much have

[2:12:00] gotten it every year I [snorts] don't

[2:12:02] know for at least the last decade.

[2:12:04] >> So this was incredible. It was

[2:12:06] disturbing. Right. So, we uh your

[2:12:09] wonderful police officers Cameron,

[2:12:10] right? She um I think it was her that

[2:12:13] did the presentation and they showed the

[2:12:15] apps that as parents you should never

[2:12:17] allow on your children's phone. And um

[2:12:21] they said at the beginning of the

[2:12:22] meeting, you know, a couple of us uh

[2:12:25] that use that do this online

[2:12:27] solicitation stuff pretend to be

[2:12:29] juveniles online. We're going to do that

[2:12:30] right now when the meeting starts and

[2:12:32] then we're going to tell you what we

[2:12:33] find. So very disturbing, you know,

[2:12:37] contact with and then they'd come on and

[2:12:39] say, 'Well, we have a man in Murray that

[2:12:41] thinks I'm a 13-year-old boy and he's

[2:12:43] ready to come pick me up down here in

[2:12:45] Orum.

[2:12:46] >> So, I guess I appreciate what

[2:12:51] they do. It's got to be so hard and

[2:12:53] disturbing to be in that world. Um, and

[2:12:56] I guess my point is what do we need to

[2:12:59] do or what can we do to make sure that

[2:13:01] you get that grant, that you get that

[2:13:03] funding? Who does that come through? How

[2:13:06] do we keep that program running?

[2:13:09] >> The is this on? It's a state grant. Um,

[2:13:13] it has historically gone down

[2:13:16] year-over-year by sometimes a few

[2:13:19] hundred, sometimes a few thousand. Um,

[2:13:22] and so it's supplemented by our existing

[2:13:24] budget. And so, uh, that mainly goes

[2:13:28] for, uh, software, uh, and training, uh,

[2:13:32] for those officers,

[2:13:34] um, and sometimes hearts, uh, computer

[2:13:37] hardware. So, uh, what the grant doesn't

[2:13:40] cover, we make up with our own budget.

[2:13:43] >> Okay. So, if we're ever asked,

[2:13:45] >> I think when we first started it was

[2:13:47] around $25,000 and as you can and then

[2:13:50] gradually being whittleled away down to

[2:13:52] where $16,000. And do we ever do we know

[2:13:55] why is there

[2:13:56] >> I think there's just more people asking

[2:13:59] for it, more agencies across the state

[2:14:01] that are uh receiving funds for that. So

[2:14:04] I don't it's not a neglect on our part

[2:14:06] or we're not doing our part to um meet

[2:14:10] any sort of metric. I just think there's

[2:14:13] more people uh utilizing the pot of

[2:14:15] money across the state.

[2:14:17] >> And so maybe we need to put that out

[2:14:18] there to our legislators, fund this

[2:14:20] grant at a higher level.

[2:14:21] >> That would not be a bad idea. So, okay.

[2:14:24] Thank you.

[2:14:25] >> You bet. Thank you.

[2:14:26] >> Great. Thank you, Council Member Millet.

[2:14:27] Council, any other questions?

[2:14:30] Okay. This is a public hearing. I will

[2:14:32] go ahead and open it up. Is there anyone

[2:14:34] who would like to come and speak to the

[2:14:36] budget amendments?

[2:14:40] Seeing none, I'll go ahead and close the

[2:14:41] public hearing and bring it back to the

[2:14:43] city council for discussion and a

[2:14:45] motion.

[2:14:56] You've left us speechless.

[2:14:59] >> Thank you.

[2:15:00] [laughter]

[2:15:01] >> mayor. I move to approve and adopt the

[2:15:03] fiscal year 2026 2027 budget of the

[2:15:07] special service lighting district. No,

[2:15:09] sorry, wrong back up.

[2:15:12] >> Yeah, there that's what happens.

[2:15:14] >> It's on the

[2:15:15] >> It's right here. It's kind of

[2:15:17] >> It's hiding. It's it's this little

[2:15:19] combination there.

[2:15:20] >> That's why that's why it's white.

[2:15:23] >> It doesn't exist.

[2:15:29] » It's right here.

[2:15:31] >> I move to approve uh amending the fiscal

[2:15:33] year 2025 2026 budget as presented in

[2:15:37] exhibit A.

[2:15:38] >> I have a motion. Thank you. And is there

[2:15:41] a second?

[2:15:42] >> I'll second.

[2:15:42] >> Thank you, Council Member Mikum. Okay,

[2:15:45] we have a um go ahead and vote. Any

[2:15:47] further discussion? Okay. Council member

[2:15:50] Millet, how do you vote?

[2:15:51] >> I.

[2:15:57] >> All right. Motion carries. Thank you.

[2:16:00] All right. We have city manager items.

[2:16:02] Item number eight.

[2:16:06] >> Just real quick, uh we'll come back at a

[2:16:08] future council meeting with more details

[2:16:10] about uh the success we achieved with

[2:16:13] the ORMFest uh event. Um, but just to

[2:16:17] give you um just to wet your appetite a

[2:16:19] little bit, we did have 82,000 people

[2:16:23] just come into our city center park on

[2:16:26] the final 3 days. Um, that's actually

[2:16:28] our second most that we've had uh since

[2:16:31] we started counting, but in part that's

[2:16:34] by design because we spread out events

[2:16:36] more across the week and across multiple

[2:16:39] parks and locations. So, so um we are um

[2:16:43] being continuing to be highly successful

[2:16:45] in that regard. Thank you so much for

[2:16:48] your support. Love seeing you on the uh

[2:16:50] tiller truck and um uh events coming up.

[2:16:54] Then uh of course we've got uh the the

[2:16:58] first of what will be a variety of um

[2:17:01] police picnics in the park and those are

[2:17:04] all on your calendar. we are kind of uh

[2:17:07] making those more robust with more uh

[2:17:09] interactions and and things to do at

[2:17:12] those events. Um and then uh of course

[2:17:15] we have uh the Freedom Festival events

[2:17:17] coming up and in particular in ORM will

[2:17:20] be the Colonial Heritage Festival at

[2:17:22] Sierra Park starting this coming

[2:17:24] weekend. So um uh of course all of these

[2:17:28] wonderful events are are just amazing

[2:17:30] and we're getting more and more interest

[2:17:32] in it. And uh I also just need a shout

[2:17:34] out to staff and and our public safety

[2:17:38] and parks in particular who really put a

[2:17:40] ton of effort into making sure that

[2:17:44] these are not only fun and exciting and

[2:17:47] attractive but also ultimately safe and

[2:17:50] that everyone feels safe attending them.

[2:17:52] So thank you.

[2:17:54] >> Right. Thank you. And thank you to all

[2:17:56] for the your participation in Ormfest.

[2:17:58] It was really fun. It was fun to ride on

[2:18:00] the fire truck and together and it was

[2:18:05] fun. We did a all things or booth at at

[2:18:10] the uh park where people could come and

[2:18:13] visit with with elected officials. And I

[2:18:18] we it was a good first year. I found out

[2:18:20] that a lot of people are drawn by swag

[2:18:24] and [laughter] talked to a lot of people

[2:18:27] who don't live in or anymore but were

[2:18:30] based and and came and spoke about how much they love or they say I don't

[2:18:34] live in ORM now but I grew up here and I

[2:18:37] love it and very positive that way. So I

[2:18:40] hope that's something that we can

[2:18:41] continue um in coming years. [gasps] All

[2:18:44] right. Next item on the agenda is a

[2:18:47] motion to we need a motion to adjourn as

[2:18:50] the city council and reconvene as the

[2:18:53] ORM redevelopment agency.

[2:18:55] >> So moved.

[2:18:56] >> Thank you.

[2:18:57] >> Second.

[2:18:58] >> Motion and a second. Remind me, do we

[2:19:01] have to do roll call on adjournments and

[2:19:03] reconvenings?

[2:19:05] Okay. All those in favor say I.

[2:19:07] >> I.

[2:19:08] >> Any opposed? Thank you.

[2:19:10] >> Okay. Okay, we'll go to the consent

[2:19:12] items and we are now redevelopment

[2:19:14] agency and we have one consent item,

[2:19:17] approval of meeting minutes. Entertain a

[2:19:18] motion for that.

[2:19:19] >> Mayor, I make a motion that we approve

[2:19:21] the meeting minutes for May 12th, 2026

[2:19:24] for the RDA consent items.

[2:19:26] >> Right. Thank you. Is there a second?

[2:19:27] >> I second.

[2:19:28] >> Right. Thank you. Um, how do you vote?

[2:19:31] Um, council member, you're not a council

[2:19:34] member in the RDA, but I can't remember

[2:19:36] what you're called, so I'll call you

[2:19:37] council member like member or anyway.

[2:19:40] >> I think it's board member.

[2:19:42] >> Board. Board member Lamson, how do you

[2:19:44] vote?

[2:19:45] >> I vote I.

[2:19:46] >> All right.

[2:19:47] >> I I

[2:19:49] >> I.

[2:19:51] >> All right. Motion carries. We have a

[2:19:53] scheduled item, item number 11 on our

[2:19:55] agenda, uh, sheet, uh, public hearing.

[2:19:58] It's a resolution approving the

[2:20:00] redevelopment agency of the city of ORM

[2:20:03] fiscal year 2627 budget. We'll turn the

[2:20:06] time over to um Brandon Nelson again.

[2:20:10] Thank you, mayor.

[2:20:14] This is basically a repeat of our

[2:20:16] presentation from back on May 12th. Um

[2:20:20] as we go through it, obviously this time

[2:20:22] we will have a public hearing element

[2:20:24] for that and then final approval. But uh

[2:20:26] just to to revisit the redevelopment

[2:20:29] agency. So uh as mentioned then uh the

[2:20:32] only current active uh redevelopment

[2:20:35] agency area is the University Place CDA

[2:20:39] um which is down all that stuff going on

[2:20:42] down by University Place. uh we do have

[2:20:45] uh uh money in the old RDAs uh that is

[2:20:50] gradually being spent on various

[2:20:51] different infrastructure and different

[2:20:53] projects um that come up and studies and

[2:20:56] whatever else that might uh occur within

[2:20:58] those project areas. Um but as far as uh

[2:21:02] current active um things going on,

[2:21:05] university places is the is the one and

[2:21:08] you know you can see the RDA revenues

[2:21:11] across the top. Uh again those are all

[2:21:13] primarily the university place CDA. Um

[2:21:17] and then as you see the expenditures in

[2:21:19] the bottom section um you could see

[2:21:22] where you know basically we refund 90%

[2:21:25] of the uh growth in tax uh property tax

[2:21:29] revenue back to uh Woodbury who uses

[2:21:33] that to pay off the debt associated with

[2:21:35] putting in the infrastructure in all of

[2:21:38] those areas that they've put

[2:21:39] improvements in. And then uh the city

[2:21:42] keeps 5% as an administrative fee and

[2:21:46] maintains the other 5% within this RDA

[2:21:49] fund for future infrastructure needs

[2:21:51] that may come up um where we can uh use

[2:21:54] those funds to to make whatever

[2:21:56] infrastructure um improvements need to

[2:21:59] be made.

[2:22:02] And I think yeah any any questions about

[2:22:06] uh the RDA? Okay board, do you have any

[2:22:09] questions?

[2:22:11] Okay, seeing none, I'll go ahead and

[2:22:13] open up the public hearing to uh

[2:22:17] regarding the resolution approving the

[2:22:18] RDA redevelopment um agency of the city

[2:22:21] of ORM fiscal year 2627 budget. Is there

[2:22:24] anyone who would like to speak to that

[2:22:26] this evening?

[2:22:28] Right. Seeing none, I'll go ahead and

[2:22:29] close the public hearing and bring it

[2:22:32] back to the board.

[2:22:34] What would you like to do, board? Mayor,

[2:22:36] I move to approve and adopt the fiscal

[2:22:38] year 2026 2027 budget of the

[2:22:40] redevelopment agency of the city of ORM

[2:22:42] as presented in exhibit A. Right. Thank

[2:22:44] you. We have a motion. Is there a

[2:22:46] second?

[2:22:46] >> Second.

[2:22:47] >> Thank you. Um board member Kilpac. All

[2:22:50] right. We'll go ahead and vote. Any

[2:22:52] further discussion? Okay. Board member

[2:22:55] um Gail

[2:22:56] >> I

[2:23:01] >> Right. Motion carries. I'd entertain a

[2:23:03] motion to adjurnn from the redevelopment

[2:23:06] agency and reconvene as the ORM special

[2:23:08] service lighting district.

[2:23:10] >> So moved.

[2:23:11] >> I have a motion.

[2:23:12] >> Second.

[2:23:13] All those in favor, please say

[2:23:15] I.

[2:23:16] >> I.

[2:23:17] >> Any opposed? All right. We have

[2:23:19] adjourned as the redevelopment agency

[2:23:21] and we have reconvened as the ORM

[2:23:23] Special Service Lighting District. Okay.

[2:23:27] We have a consent item, approval of the

[2:23:29] meeting minutes.

[2:23:31] I'll make a motion that we approve the

[2:23:33] meeting minutes for May 12th, 2026 of

[2:23:36] the SSLD on consent items agenda.

[2:23:39] >> Thank you.

[2:23:40] >> Okay. Thank you. A second. Um any

[2:23:43] further discussion? Okay, we'll go ahead

[2:23:44] and

[2:23:45] >> I Right. Motion carries. We have a

[2:23:52] scheduled item. public hearing or

[2:23:55] resolution approving the special service

[2:23:56] lighting district of the city of ORM

[2:23:58] fiscal year 2627 budget. We'll turn it

[2:24:01] back over to Brandon Nelson.

[2:24:04] [snorts] Thank you again mayor.

[2:24:08] Uh so the special service lighting

[2:24:10] district of Waram is a separate

[2:24:12] technically a separate entity has its

[2:24:13] own tax ID so that's why it has its own

[2:24:16] budget. um as part of the uh street

[2:24:19] lighting uh each utility bill has a

[2:24:23] street lighting fee associated with it.

[2:24:24] Those fees are accumulated within the

[2:24:27] street lighting fund. Um and you can see

[2:24:30] the at that top line on the revenues

[2:24:32] shows you the the revenue associated

[2:24:34] with the collection of that street

[2:24:35] lighting fee from year to year. Um and

[2:24:38] then the various other smaller revenues

[2:24:40] um that occur. Um you'll notice uh an

[2:24:43] appropriation of surplus in the current

[2:24:45] proposal. Um and that is the kind of the

[2:24:48] last thing to to finish off the fa uh

[2:24:52] final phases of the street lighting

[2:24:55] changes that we had mentioned was Rocky

[2:24:56] Mountain.

[2:24:59] Um and then

[2:25:01] associated with that

[2:25:04] um you can uh the regular operational

[2:25:06] budget at the top. You can see the

[2:25:08] specific um costs related to the holiday

[2:25:11] lighting during uh Christmas season

[2:25:14] as well as uh just give you an idea how

[2:25:17] much the power costs related to um

[2:25:21] running all the street lights. And there

[2:25:24] was a energy savings lease that we

[2:25:26] entered into a number of years ago where

[2:25:29] we replaced all of the light uh

[2:25:31] incandescent lights with uh LED

[2:25:33] lighting. And uh so we're continuing to

[2:25:37] this fund continues to contribute to our

[2:25:40] debt service fund that pay actually pays

[2:25:43] that lease uh payment. And so we have a

[2:25:46] fee for that. And I think there's

[2:25:48] >> So what's power? What what is that power

[2:25:50] line? That's the actual cost of the

[2:25:52] power.

[2:25:52] >> Okay.

[2:25:53] >> From Rocky Mountain.

[2:25:54] Okay. Thank you.

[2:25:56] >> So, how much longer do we have on that

[2:25:57] energy savings lease?

[2:25:59] >> Chris asks me every year. Is that done

[2:26:01] yet? And I I want to say it's 8 years

[2:26:06] five.

[2:26:08] >> Quite close, but

[2:26:09] >> Okay. Thank you.

[2:26:14] » And let's see. I think I am the last

[2:26:16] item is this year's proposing on the

[2:26:19] rates. Um the rate from uh for all

[2:26:24] neighborhood all residences goes from

[2:26:26] 328 to 336 per month and for all

[2:26:29] businesses that same amount. And just as

[2:26:33] a note uh businesses pay their annual

[2:26:35] street lighting all-in-one payment uh

[2:26:37] upon their business license renewal.

[2:26:39] Just to make you aware of that.

[2:26:43] And that's all I have.

[2:26:44] >> All right. Thank you. Are there any

[2:26:46] questions?

[2:26:49] Seeing none, I'll go ahead and open up

[2:26:50] the public hearing um regarding uh the

[2:26:54] budget for the special service lighting

[2:26:56] district. Is there anyone who would like

[2:26:58] to speak to that?

[2:27:00] Seeing none, I'll go ahead and close the

[2:27:02] public hearing and bring it back to the

[2:27:05] board

[2:27:07] and uh for further action.

[2:27:12] Mayor, I move to approve the and adopt

[2:27:14] the fiscal year 2026 2027 budget of the

[2:27:17] special service lighting district of the

[2:27:19] city of ORM as presented in exhibit A.

[2:27:22] >> I second that.

[2:27:23] >> All right. Thank you. We have a motion

[2:27:24] in a second. Appreciate it. Uh any

[2:27:27] further discussion?

[2:27:29] All right. Did we Did we start with you

[2:27:31] last? Okay. So, Chris, it's

[2:27:34] >> I Right. Motion carries. Thank you. Now

[2:27:42] we entertain a motion to adjurnn as a

[2:27:44] special service lighting district and

[2:27:46] reconvene as the OR municipal building

[2:27:48] authority.

[2:27:49] >> So moved. Second.

[2:27:51] >> We have a motion and a second. All those

[2:27:52] in favor please say I.

[2:27:54] >> I.

[2:27:56] almost forgot to vote. Those opposed.

[2:27:59] Okay. Hearing none. We will adjourn as a

[2:28:02] special service lighting district and

[2:28:04] reconvene as the ORM municipal building

[2:28:07] authority. The only item on the agenda

[2:28:09] is the ORM municipal building authority

[2:28:12] is a consent item approving the meeting

[2:28:14] minutes of June 10th, 2025.

[2:28:19] » Go for it.

[2:28:20] >> So moved.

[2:28:22] >> Second.

[2:28:23] >> Okay, we have a motion and a second. Any

[2:28:26] further discussion? So these meeting

[2:28:28] this is meeting minutes from over a year

[2:28:30] ago. Is that right?

[2:28:32] >> We only meet

[2:28:33] >> once a year.

[2:28:34] Okay. I for

[2:28:35] >> that's what I thought but I wanted to

[2:28:36] make just double check. Okay. Any

[2:28:39] further discussion?

[2:28:41] >> I can I ask a question?

[2:28:43] >> Oh yes.

[2:28:44] >> What is the or municipal building

[2:28:46] authority?

[2:28:46] >> Uh so congratulations you're part of it.

[2:28:50] [laughter]

[2:28:50] >> Yeah. So back in 20 I don't remember

[2:28:54] when exactly was created but I know in

[2:28:56] 2000 uh we had lease financing

[2:29:00] arrangements made in relation to funding

[2:29:03] the street lighting program as well as

[2:29:06] um using and what it has to do with is

[2:29:09] basically a you get a lease on your

[2:29:12] buildings and get financing in relation

[2:29:15] to getting a loan on your building and

[2:29:18] you use that money to then go finance

[2:29:21] whatever it is, in this case, street

[2:29:22] lights and various park amenities. Um,

[2:29:26] and and so then those uh leases are paid

[2:29:29] off. Um, you know, technically, I

[2:29:32] suppose they could take if you didn't

[2:29:34] make your payments, they could come take

[2:29:35] your building, I suppose. But that's

[2:29:38] generally how it works is is um getting

[2:29:40] a a lean against your your building and

[2:29:43] using that structure as a way to get

[2:29:47] financing. it generally has higher

[2:29:49] rates.

[2:29:51] I shouldn't say generally, it always has

[2:29:53] higher rates than general obligation

[2:29:55] bonds or revenue bonds um because all

[2:29:59] you have is you know a piece of

[2:30:01] structure that they have to rely on. And

[2:30:04] as you can imagine, most people who are

[2:30:07] doing the giving us the money don't want

[2:30:10] to take your building. They they they

[2:30:11] realize that's not a good thing. So, so, anyway, but that does cost you a

[2:30:16] higher rate when you do those. And since

[2:30:19] those paid off, I want to say it was

[2:30:20] around 20 16 15 16 17 somewhere in

[2:30:24] there. Um, we we just haven't had the

[2:30:27] need to to do that. There's and mostly

[2:30:30] because our debt structure is so low.

[2:30:32] Um, it just hasn't been that need to to

[2:30:34] go that route. And so, because that's

[2:30:36] the only thing you primarily use that

[2:30:38] MBA for, we just haven't had a need to

[2:30:41] use it. So, we just have decided to just

[2:30:44] hang on to it.

[2:30:45] >> Yeah. We didn't want to dissolve it

[2:30:46] because there's always the possibility

[2:30:48] that maybe we wanted to use it.

[2:30:50] >> Okay.

[2:30:51] >> So, I mean, if you'll recall, Alpine

[2:30:53] School District, they they did something

[2:30:55] very similar to this. Um, when the uh

[2:30:57] property tax was uh bond, the GEO bond

[2:31:00] was defeated or didn't get passed. Um,

[2:31:03] they went the route of going to an MB

[2:31:06] using an MBA lease revenue bond uh to

[2:31:09] get some funding for what they wanted to

[2:31:10] do. Um because at the time, it's changed

[2:31:14] since then, but at the time it didn't it

[2:31:16] doesn't require uh a vote by the public

[2:31:19] to to pass that. It's simply uh you as a

[2:31:23] council approving uh going forward with

[2:31:26] uh bonding.

[2:31:27] >> So that's changed.

[2:31:28] >> So So if I infer correctly um from your

[2:31:32] answer, uh we should not anticipate a

[2:31:35] really exciting agenda uh in this coming

[2:31:38] year with the OR Municipal Building

[2:31:40] Authority. Nope. None whatsoever.

[2:31:44] >> You can rest easy with this

[2:31:45] responsibility.

[2:31:46] >> You can know it's hanging out there.

[2:31:49] >> Yes.

[2:31:49] >> Hopefully in my tenure, you'll never see

[2:31:51] it again.

[2:31:53] >> Well, that's a really good question.

[2:31:55] Thank you for asking that and I

[2:31:56] appreciate the appreciate the

[2:31:58] explanation. I thank you. [gasps] All

[2:32:02] right.

[2:32:04] So, we have a motion and a second.

[2:32:07] >> Have a question. Now we vote.

[2:32:09] >> Now we vote. And I vote I

[2:32:12] >> I.

[2:32:16] >> All right. Motion carries. All right.

[2:32:19] With that, uh I would entertain a motion

[2:32:21] to adjurnn.

[2:32:23] >> I motion to adjurnn.

[2:32:25] >> I second.

[2:32:26] >> Right. We have a motion and second. All

[2:32:27] those in favor? I

[2:32:29] >> I

[2:32:30] >> All right. Thank you. And we got done.

[2:32:33] My goal was before 8:00.

[2:32:35] >> Two minute. Three minutes. You have 3

[2:32:38] minutes to hand in

Orem City Council Meeting | 6.23.2026

Transcript