[0:13] personnel policy, code of ethics policy, remote participation policy and contract

[0:18] negotiation policy. This is a workshop by the board of select men. No public

[0:23] input will be taken. Um, these policies will be reviewed at a board of select

[0:29] men's meeting once finalized. Stand and pledge allegiance.

[0:36] [clears throat] >> I pledge allegiance to the flag of the

[0:39] United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation

[0:44] under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

[0:51] Nancy, because you've been waiting so long, you get to choose which one we're

[0:55] doing first. >> Did [laughter] you know that I was gonna

[0:58] say, "Can I pick which one of those first?"

[1:01] » So, >> was that a line reader?

[1:04] » Um, I was going to suggest we do the contract negotiation process of policy

[1:10] because it's really short. >> Okay. [snorts]

[1:12] But I think >> you don't like that one. It's

[1:16] confliction with the new charter because there's something in there for

[1:22] » contract >> contract negotiations.

[1:25] » Have you read this? >> I have.

[1:27] » Do you know what part? >> No.

[1:33] » And we've got two years before the next contracts are up.

[1:36] » I know. But I know two years. >> It doesn't really matter anyways. It

[1:40] wouldn't matter. It wouldn't matter anyways because anything that the

[1:42] charter charter overrides everything. So, [snorts]

[1:45] » okay. >> Just so you're aware, right? Charter

[1:48] overrides. >> Yeah.

[1:51] » Um, >> do you remember what it said in the

[1:52] charter? >> What are they trying to accomplish?

[2:02] » I don't think it's any different than what's here. But do we really want

[2:06] » steal my policy? [laughter] >> Make yourself look smart.

[2:12] I've heard sal [snorts]

[2:20] and maybe some of the wording should be changed because fight for doesn't

[2:23] necessarily sound appropriate. But

[2:31] » so I I think what you're trying to accomplish is to give the people that

[2:34] are negotiating the contract a little bit of direction.

[2:38] » Yeah. So, there's multiple things I want to do here. One is I feel like we're not

[2:43] whoever is going in to negotiate doesn't really have good direction from the

[2:47] board prior to going in to negotiate. So, I think that we should set that

[2:51] stage and make sure everybody's clear about what they're looking for.

[2:55] » But, I also think that board members aren't necessarily

[2:59] equipped or well-versed on how to negotiate. And it would be advantageous

[3:04] for us as a town if we hired a negotiator who actually knows how to

[3:09] negotiate,

[3:13] » which is a lawyer. >> I would not necessarily agree it's a

[3:17] lawyer because the lawyer has been looking at these contracts and has never

[3:20] fought for us from what I can tell. >> Right. You're talking about somebody

[3:24] that's representation to go into negotiations.

[3:27] » Yes.

[3:29] I mean that you can't you can it's just an added expense that's all

[3:34] » I agree but I think in the long run I think there's certain situations where

[3:39] we would have saved money

[3:44] or put ourselves in a better position.

[3:50] Where do you find contract negotiators do you know that aren't part of unions?

[3:54] So, I looked on the MMA website and it looked like they might have some some or

[4:01] ways that we it likely might be a lawyer. I mean,

[4:06] » logically it does fit, but I don't think it should necessarily be our town

[4:12] lawyer, >> right?

[4:14] » A lawyer that's first and contract negotiations. Yeah. [clears throat]

[4:19] » I don't know. I've never been into it. We've always, but again, attorney, our

[4:24] attorney should be able to, I believe, should be able to do that for us.

[4:30] » I would agree they should. So, does that mean opens up a whole different can of

[4:36] worms? >> Yes. But maybe they did have somebody

[4:38] who didn't have the right person. Or I think what the attorney does, this is my

[4:44] vision from what I've seen from the last two contracts because I got slammed with

[4:48] both of them as soon as I got here, >> is the attorney goes over it as far as

[4:52] what changes we're making. Are they legal? But I don't think I don't think

[4:57] » as far as negotiating, >> right? Because they they don't come to

[4:59] the negotiation meetings and say, "Well, we'll do this if you do that or so." I

[5:05] think that's what you're looking for. I don't think you want somebody just so

[5:07] much to cross the tees and dot the eyes. You're looking for somebody to come in

[5:10] and say, "Go over the whole contract and and try to get

[5:13] » what the priorities are." Yes. And really

[5:17] negotiate for those so that we come out with something.

[5:20] » Yeah. >> Yeah.

[5:26] » I've just seen other instances where I've sat on the negotiation team and we

[5:32] just basically Okay. Yep. Sure. And that's not what we

[5:38] should be doing. >> So that was why I was advocating for

[5:42] that. And if you if Rick, if you think that we should wait until the charter

[5:47] comes out, I'm happy to set this aside for a few months because I think we've

[5:52] got more than we can handle in this meeting.

[5:54] » Oh, yeah. The rest of >> I'm okay with that.

[5:57] » I just think that we need to have something

[6:01] » formalized before we go into our next contract negotiation.

[6:04] » Sure. >> Yeah. Yeah, I say wait for the for the

[6:08] charter, see what that reads. And like you said, we've got two years now before

[6:12] either union comes up because we just did them both. So after the charter, we

[6:16] can sit down with that. >> Yeah, cuz this is basically for union

[6:19] negotiating, not other contracts that we like sand and salt.

[6:24] » Correct. >> No, I'm thinking this is union contract

[6:28] negotiation. >> Okay. And I think that was spelled out.

[6:32] It definitely spelled out charter thing that we're working on. So, I wish I

[6:37] would have brought it. >> Has that I can't bring everything.

[6:39] » Has that passed through the attorney? >> It's gone back to the attorney again

[6:42] because we had to change a few things. >> TJ's waiting for that to come back

[6:46] because he's hoping that he gets it back.

[6:48] » Gets it back in time. >> He had to have the ballot in today. So,

[6:51] it it's back. It's going to be a hand count.

[6:53] » Yeah. >> So, Nancy, you taking notes?

[6:57] » I was going to Yes. So what I what I wrote down over here as the goals for

[7:02] this contract negotiation process is one uh get better direction from the board

[7:10] of select men. Two um how to negotiate the contract.

[7:17] Three, find somebody

[7:22] » negotiator.

[7:28] » Yeah, I was trying to establish that as our goals for this

[7:33] going forward. Um, and I was going to I haven't checked

[7:38] contracts yet, but I was going to look at the contracts to see what the

[7:41] language is for renegotiation.

[7:46] There is 180 days there. There are specifics in the contract

[7:53] if you try to reopen it. That's what you >> No, to well to reneg negotiate for the

[7:58] next year for the next year. There's I thought there was lang language that

[8:14] I can find it, George. On Thursday. >> Okay.

[8:17] » I wrote it down.

[8:38] 120 days. It shall automatically be renewed from year to year thereafter

[8:43] unless either party shall notify the other in writing at least 120 days prior

[8:47] to the annivers date and that it desires to modify this agreement. In the event

[8:54] that such notice is given, negotiation shall begin no later than 60 days prior

[9:00] to the anniversary and until notice of termination of this

[9:04] agreement is provided to the other party in the manner set forth this way. So,

[9:17] and I was pleased. I'm assuming fire is I mean sorry public works is the same.

[9:27] What's your second choice? >> Um [laughter]

[9:30] so I I think the second choice would be just to wrap up the remote policy

[9:36] » before we move on. Um >> I'd like to see the whole thing just

[9:42] gone. >> Yep.

[9:45] » Do you have anything in the charter on that one?

[9:50] So again, it says the policy was reviewed on June 1st, 2026.

[9:57] [clears throat]

[9:59] We didn't didn't we we reviewed it and I thought we just set it aside.

[10:06] » Yep. Okay. >> Because we couldn't

[10:09] » agree on exactly what we wanted to to do from there.

[10:20] So I guess is it >> should we put reviewed on the policy

[10:23] even though we talked about it but it hasn't been formally reviewed per se.

[10:28] » So I think the hangup with this one is if you do if I I believe if you allow

[10:34] video participation at one meeting then you have to allow it at all of them. And

[10:39] it's not just the one participant that's asking to it's not just Rick. If he

[10:43] can't make it, then you have to open it up to everybody to be allowed to do

[10:46] that. And I think they're just can of worms. If you can't be here, you can't

[10:50] be here. >> You can't be here.

[10:55] » I just I think that's just a mess. >> There's too many different meetings.

[10:59] So then do we want to say that remote participation

[11:05] is limited to viewing as a

[11:12] audience member. That's really all it is. It will

[11:16] continue to do the YouTube, right? >> Yep.

[11:18] » But we were not going to allow >> participation board members to

[11:22] participate remotely. >> Yep.

[11:24] » Or anybody else. >> That's right. No remote participation.

[11:28] They can watch it just like everybody else. I mean,

[11:31] » that's why we did this. [clears throat] >> If you if you can't be here, you can't

[11:35] be here. I mean, >> even if you're sick, why would you want

[11:38] to do it? >> Well, that's right. I mean, there's

[11:40] other board members sitting here that >> show up.

[11:44] » Well, they can make the decisions for what's going on.

[11:50] » I just think I think that's opening a can of worms because you got to do it

[11:53] every time. But being devil's advocate of that, you know, well, is the fact

[11:59] that I'm away on vacation, so >> have a good time. Enjoy your vacation.

[12:04] » You guys decided to load the on that particular day.

[12:08] » I'm like, [laughter] we do [clears throat] now.

[12:09] » No, you would not. >> But somebody could. [laughter]

[12:15] » Or >> But somebody could. So that's I just

[12:17] want to >> Or you do what I do and you figure out

[12:19] when the selectman's meeting are and you go on vacation in between them. Mhm.

[12:23] [laughter] >> Yeah. The current policy though does

[12:26] allow for um I want to say it was emergency

[12:32] » illness. No. >> Um well, not necessarily illness, but

[12:35] emergency participation if like a COVID situation or something

[12:42] of that nature, right? get you put down. If there's a pandemic,

[12:46] we can go back to remote. >> I don't think you guys see it again.

[12:50] » I just don't think I just think that's a mess.

[12:54] » You know, when the >> you go on vacation, George, you call me

[12:57] and I'll table it. [laughter]

[13:03] » I'm not saying us, but whatever we put forth is going to be a standing policy.

[13:07] And who knows >> until they get to their

[13:09] » I was very uncomfortable in an executive session looking at somebody coming in. I

[13:15] didn't feel good about that at all. That's an executive session. You need to

[13:18] be here for >> no remote.

[13:21] » Yeah. But we're saying no remote for anything. We're not saying

[13:24] » that's why that's what turned me right off to it was that [clears throat]

[13:28] » I don't think too many allow that. >> No.

[13:31] » I think if you're here, you're here. If you're not, you're not. Emergencies come

[13:35] up. the board carries on and we just try to sneak that stuff in past George when

[13:40] he's not around. That's all. [laughter] >> Yeah. And I think that, you know, if

[13:45] there's controversial stuff that's there,

[13:47] » it can be >> on the agenda. I think that it should be

[13:50] t it should be tabled. >> Absolutely.

[13:52] » So that I think that we talked about that before. Not not everybody's here.

[13:56] Let's table this so that >> So

[14:01] there's a thing called a quorum for a reason though.

[14:03] » Yes. And I think we have to be careful about

[14:06] saying, well, not everybody's here, so we're not going to vote on it. I think

[14:09] that if there's a quorum that as a board, we should be moving

[14:14] forward and doing our work unless somebody has specifically said,

[14:20] "Okay, I'm not going to be able to be there. Can we not talk about that

[14:23] because I really want to participate?" You know, I think there's exception

[14:26] cases, but I think just not doing something because it's a controversial

[14:32] issue and somebody isn't here. >> And I agree with that. I mean, George,

[14:37] because the agenda goes out ahead of time and George, whatever happens, you

[14:40] can't be here. And you call up Nancy and say, "Hey, I really want to talk. I want

[14:43] to be part of this conversation. Could you table that?" I think that that's

[14:46] » that's fair. That's fair. >> And I agree that that's my point. I

[14:50] would I would agree with that. That that's

[14:52] » Mhm. >> Yeah. [snorts]

[14:54] Because but I mean there's some things that don't need to be tabled like the

[14:58] exemptions, the abatements. >> Yeah. Yeah.

[15:02] » And I agree, but if it was something again,

[15:04] » a big big one, >> i.e. hiring a town manager know that the

[15:09] three of us are going to sit here and vote for that when the two others don't

[15:13] have an opportunity to >> where the hell am I going? you know

[15:17] [laughter] that's I mean that just I mean that's

[15:20] but again I think that's a big a big one you know that people should

[15:26] » yeah no there are big issues >> there should be a whole town I would

[15:28] look at it that way anyway >> so we need to we need to revamp this

[15:33] policy then if we're saying that we're not going to allow remote participation

[15:37] because the way it's word worded right now is um section two talks about the

[15:43] adoption of remote participation >> [clears throat]

[15:46] » So that needs to be changed. U permissible section three is permissible

[15:50] reasons for remote participation. So we basically remove that because

[15:56] we're saying there's no permissible reasons for remote participation and

[16:02] then so do we need to revamp it or do we just say at this point we're not having

[16:06] it and just resend the whole thing? >> Yeah.

[16:13] And I guess the only question is are we violating

[16:17] any of the state statutes by not allowing ro participation?

[16:22] » I don't think so. I can ask that question but I don't believe so. I think

[16:26] you're violating more by the way we were doing it than

[16:28] » Yeah. Yeah. >> Based on what [snorts] TJ had shared

[16:31] with me. >> We are in violation right now with this

[16:35] policy. >> Yeah.

[16:37] Because if we're going to do remote participation from a board member

[16:42] standpoint, we have to allow >> the public

[16:46] » Yeah. >> to participate remotely, too. And we

[16:48] don't do that. >> Right.

[16:50] » We probably would if somebody asked. >> No.

[16:53] » No, I don't think so. >> No,

[16:54] » because you have to do it through your YouTube session.

[16:58] » You'd have to have two different setups. You'd have to have somebody on here

[17:01] watching it, manning it, saying, "Oh, we have a question from Jane Doe."

[17:07] » And allowing Jane Doe to speak and then >> Yeah.

[17:11] » And I think that's where it started to get really

[17:14] » the clerk. >> Oh, go ahead and tell him that to his

[17:17] face. [laughter]

[17:21] » He's probably watching. >> No, he's he's

[17:23] » watching TJ move the camera. [laughter]

[17:28] » Oh, yeah. Zoom in. [laughter]

[17:33] » Okay. I'm document here. >> Yep.

[17:36] » Go. >> I'm going to document that we are

[17:39] recommending at the next board meeting that we resend the remote policy.

[17:43] » Yeah. >> Yeah.

[17:45] » Is that >> Yep.

[17:52] » I think that's just cleaner. Then you don't have to worry about whether you're

[17:55] covered or not. >> Or,

[17:58] » oh, here we go. [laughter] >> Should it say

[18:02] the remote participation policy and then say no remote allowed? That's our remote

[18:07] participation policy. >> Oh, there we go.

[18:09] » We have a We have a policy. This is the policy. No remote. No remote.

[18:13] » I like that even better. >> Well, I just Yeah.

[18:16] » If anybody asks Yeah, we have a policy. None.

[18:18] » None. Yep. >> Spelled right out. versus not have not

[18:22] having a policy. >> Yep.

[18:25] Good idea, George. Then no gray area. >> Nobody likes great.

[18:33] » Okay, I guess.

[18:36] » Can we move on? >> Enough to type.

[18:38] » All right, so that one was done. We're delaying on the other one.

[18:43] » Yeah. Um, do you want to do code of ethics because

[18:48] it's shorter than the personnel policy? >> Sure.

[18:51] » Yeah. [clears throat]

[18:55] » I didn't do my homework on that one yet. So, let me

[19:14] Is this This isn't newm. No, this one's in place right now. Okay. You

[19:20] » look at the second page. It's dated sign 724.

[19:23] » You might not have >> I don't have the signature.

[19:26] » Yeah, it's right here. >> That's okay.

[19:29] » Okay. 7 of 24.

[20:15] » [snorts]

[20:26] [clears throat] >> So, as I'm reading this policy, it's

[20:31] talking about town officials. It's talking about town employees and then it

[20:35] talks about board of selectmen planning board and other the town's appointed

[20:40] boards. >> Isn't town official

[20:46] and an elected board member no matter what it is? Isn't that shouldn't that be

[20:51] one and the same? >> I'm wondering if that's not how the I

[20:54] get tied into that. They're calling me the town official. But you're right.

[20:59] town officials will usually select them >> because I'm just wondering if we if

[21:04] we're adding that in there, does it distinguish a difference between the

[21:08] three

[21:14] because it talks about public about the statues

[21:20] that it addresses and it talks about public officials, trustees or employees.

[21:27] I just want to make sure that we're really clear that it applies to all

[21:32] board members.

[21:37] Selectman planning board members members of appointed boards. Appointed boards

[21:42] says they're calling budget committee

[21:50] [clears throat] commission. Yeah.

[21:54] » Damn committee. >> No.

[21:56] » No. That's a whole different thing.

[22:01] Well, I'm not saying it couldn't apply cuz what we have three Savannah, right?

[22:05] Me, >> right,

[22:06] » Steve. I don't know. Steve would some uh mel

[22:13] » Martins Point. >> Yeah. Martins Point Commission.

[22:16] » Yeah. [snorts]

[22:19] So, the board may impose sanctions on appointed board and committee members

[22:25] whose conduct does not comply with the town's policies up to and including

[22:29] removal from office following [snorts] appropriate due process procedures.

[22:39] » And what are those? >> I don't know what the due process.

[22:43] [laughter] >> There he goes again. that devil in a red

[22:46] shirt down there. >> Well, there's it should be spelled out.

[22:51] » That's right. It should be laid out. >> So again, it refered officials

[22:55] » to the town. >> Well, that one specifically says

[22:58] appointed officials. >> The next one is elected officials. Y

[23:02] » says elected town officials who repeatedly or intentionally do not

[23:05] follow the code of ethics >> or other applicable rules or policies

[23:09] may be reprimanded or formally censured by the board of selectmen or other

[23:13] elected board to which they belong.

[23:18] Is that going to conflict with anything in the charter?

[23:35] » I don't think there's still anything in the charter that you'd be able to move

[23:39] anybody. >> So I guess

[23:42] » well in this case you can't rem It says censured, but it says nothing

[23:47] about being removed, >> right? Because I think that's a

[23:51] struggle. But if if it is if something is happening that is costing this town

[23:58] money, >> where do what section do we say, right?

[24:04] No matter what your role is, if you're a financial liability to the town,

[24:11] » here's what happens. And I don't know where that would fit in here.

[24:20] » [snorts] >> So

[24:29] let's start with number one in enforcement. It says

[24:34] » that's but the way it's worded I think enforcement for one is for staff for

[24:40] » okay that's staff >> employee

[24:42] » but it says dealings with public >> so you

[24:45] » the public board selectment and boards and committees boards and that's what

[24:50] staff interacting with chairs or appointed boards and committees have

[24:54] » the enforcement would have to be under three

[25:00] » but it's more about [clears throat]

[25:05] is it compliance? Is it part C where you would say

[25:14] because I think we need to call out

[25:19] anyone in those categories >> that is causing a financial liability

[25:27] for the town.

[25:30] I think it would go under C, but you've got to reward some of that.

[25:33] » Yeah. Yeah. [clears throat]

[25:37] every

[25:53] » because I think right off the bat you've got to say town officials, employees,

[25:57] but you also have to include the board of selectmen or or of all boards.

[26:01] » Still town officials were town officials. I know but if you read on it

[26:05] says established by the board of selectmen so I think it should be laid

[26:09] out that the board of selectman is included in that because if you don't

[26:13] that I think that would be an arguing

[26:37] » [snorts]

[26:44] » Look Is this something that you can look at and see what other towns have?

[26:49] » Yeah, I can try. >> And again,

[26:52] » I don't think a lot of town I can I can see I can see what they

[26:56] have.

[26:59] » And I think too that the censure thing language under the

[27:07] elected officials.

[27:12] What what can be c what is the censure

[27:17] » right >> I mean my understanding is that you

[27:20] can't stop them from voting >> correct

[27:23] » so >> censure is just basically a public slap

[27:27] on the a public declaration of disapproval by the other board members

[27:35] » correct >> correct

[27:36] » yes I mean that's how I see it

[27:41] » but with no other ability

[27:46] to do anything else. I'm assuming that if the voters put me back in, then

[27:53] » I'm stuck with you, >> right? [laughter] No matter how much you

[27:56] censure me, I'm still here and I'm still voting

[28:01] and you're not essentially there's no penalty.

[28:05] » Well, you're not speaking though, >> but you are. You can't limit You can't

[28:10] limit that to my knowledge. >> Um I think you can because well if you

[28:15] look at what happened with that woman from Auburn, didn't they censure her and

[28:20] prevent her from speaking? >> Speaking

[28:23] in going Yeah. But it did. But then it got rever to my knowledge it got

[28:26] reversed. >> Oh, did it?

[28:28] » Finally. It took a while. >> Right.

[28:30] » But did it get reversed because they couldn't do it or did it get reversed

[28:34] because enough people didn't agree with it?

[28:36] » Uh don't know. But we should find that out.

[28:40] » I've got that written down >> just to know where we're

[28:44] » I can't remember. >> Libby. Libby.

[28:47] » Laura Libby. >> Yes.

[28:50] » Oh, that's right. The one in Congress. >> Oh, yeah.

[28:54] She couldn't talk. >> Nope.

[29:02] » I guess that would be a question for MMA legal, too, you know. Yeah. To give us

[29:05] the

[29:15] because it's it will vary too because with these different boards

[29:20] um like the budget committee or planning board it's going to be the chairman's

[29:25] responsibility to to know if they are in violation of

[29:29] the code. >> Yes.

[29:32] So the chair and vice chair of boards, committees and commissions have the

[29:35] responsibility for intervening when actions of members appear to be in

[29:39] violation of code of ethics. >> And that is that is in here anyway.

[29:48] » Action may vary from public admonishment and public censure.

[30:00] elected officials would be member of select board.

[30:04] » Okay, [clears throat] so it says it places the board's disapproval and the

[30:08] reasons for it in the official record, may require corrective measures

[30:12] authorized by an adopted code of conduct, such as an apology, training,

[30:16] or removal from a committee assignment. Can damage the member's credibility and

[30:20] serve as a warning that future violations may lead to stronger action.

[30:24] does not normally remove the selectman from office, suspend their voting

[30:28] rights, reduce their statutory authority authority or prevent them from attending

[30:32] meetings.

[30:41] Do we have freedom of access involved in this? because it should be

[30:46] training because every elected official or board

[30:50] member or anybody that's appointed needs to go through that course

[30:54] » but but this is a code of ethics that's not really

[30:58] » right but >> they need to go through that course

[31:01] isn't part of the code of ethics >> I'm looking at other people's code of

[31:06] ethics and it seems to be in all of them >> really yep

[31:09] » freedom of access training needs to be A censure should be adopted through a

[31:15] motion or written resolution at a properly noticed public meeting. The

[31:19] board may be able to discuss allegations in executive sess session under limited

[31:23] circumstances, but the actual vote in final action must occur publicly.

[31:30] The accused official has specific participation in open session rights

[31:33] when charges or complaints are discussed.

[31:52] It says censure publicly reprimands a selectman but it usually does not remove

[31:56] or silence them.

[32:05] So the the notes that I've taken so far just to make sure I'm doing this

[32:11] correctly for code of ethics under part C

[32:16] we need to add that if an employee appointed official or elected official

[32:21] um or an employee appointed official or elected official shall not cause a

[32:27] financial liability for the town. You can add that in there. Yep.

[32:33] » In some way, shape or fashion. I just don't know exactly how to word that.

[32:37] » Um >> I guess that would i.e. have to be

[32:41] defined to >> what what you may call a financial

[32:45] liability doesn't mean >> if it cost me a dollar that's a

[32:48] financial liability. But so >> yeah,

[32:54] » what's the

[32:59] » I don't disagree, but I'm just >> right

[33:01] » some clarification.

[33:05] I mean, >> so what I'm thinking is the behaviors of

[33:09] any of these people cannot position us in a in a way that

[33:15] could potentially open us up for lawsuits or

[33:20] um extensive um lawyer fees or things of that nature. I don't know how to word

[33:27] that yet. I'm going to need AI help. And well, I'm just I'm trying to get away

[33:31] from the subjective look at it, right? >> And be these are this is the criteria

[33:37] the objective end. >> So can't do this, can't do that, can't

[33:42] do this versus what

[33:47] » so we may feel that night versus >> what do we feel a financial liability

[33:52] is? I mean, in my opinion, it's putting us in a position that we could be open

[34:00] for lawsuits,

[34:04] extensive um legal fees, >> investigation.

[34:10] » Okay. What do you I'm going to capture those three. Do you have any other that

[34:15] you want added there? >> I don't at the moment.

[34:17] » Do you agree with those three? >> Yes. Okay.

[34:30] Nothing went in the chat or about any of that.

[34:33] That's a bad

[34:43] » I'm sorry, Rick. What was the one that you said?

[34:47] » I just said um investigations. investigation

[34:53] [snorts]

[35:00] had it in my hand. I should have brought it. [snorts]

[35:03] » Okay.

[35:07] » Am I taking these notes? And is the expectation that I'm going back and

[35:11] doing this work? >> No. No.

[35:13] » No. >> I've got I've written things down here.

[35:15] I just [laughter] >> Well, maybe if you sent your notes out

[35:19] to all of the board that we could all >> I just needed to know. [laughter]

[35:25] » No, not not from my perspective. >> I'll take care of

[35:28] » If you want to, Nancy, feel free. [laughter]

[35:32] » That was nice of you. Thank you. >> I got that one coming. [laughter]

[35:47] Is there anything else on code of ethics that

[35:52] we feel should be added here?

[36:07] Should

[36:13] we add those items as like in a glossery versus

[36:23] trying to stick them in there somewhere? But this this is our definition of

[36:30] or you just want to make a whole separate section.

[36:38] I don't think so. >> Are we gonna Yeah.

[36:42] » Are we going to include volunteers? >> Should be

[36:47] » anybody who's representing the town, right?

[37:04] » [snorts]

[37:07] » And we should try to get these policies too to match up with the personnel

[37:10] policies. >> Personnel policy has so much red tape.

[37:15] » Yes. >> Yellow highlights I should say.

[37:18] I used orange. [laughter]

[37:34] » Are we ready to move on? >> I am. I was just waiting for those two

[37:39] down there [clears throat] to finish their research.

[37:42] » Yeah, just reading Ken. >> That's fine.

[37:48] Burning daylight. It's all over.

[37:53] » I know. So early already. Okay. Have to look at the

[37:58] » Okay. >> All right. So I the consensus on that.

[38:04] We'll rework that and talk about it again.

[38:07] » See what we can do. Yeah.

[38:12] » So is it now off to personnel policies the bottom of the the list? Y so

[38:18] » uh

[38:21] [snorts] >> we're start

[38:23] » What about this conduct of meetings policy?

[38:26] » It wasn't on the agenda. >> Okay.

[38:30] Cuz we have that too. It was signed in 24.

[38:36] » I don't think it was signed by everybody.

[38:38] » I don't think I've seen that. So if somebody can

[38:40] » cuz I haven't produced that >> cuz I haven't. That's the only copy

[38:43] [laughter] >> cuz somebody cleaned us out over here.

[38:45] There's a lot of stuff that's missing. >> This one I have

[38:49] » conduct at meetings. >> Conduct at meetings policy.

[38:53] » Huh.

[38:57] » And it was >> I'll have to see if I can find it.

[38:59] George is under >> 220. Everybody Curran, meat,

[39:04] Noel, and Norman JP will [clears throat] play it.

[39:11] was another one. I just had it when I was going through everything put in

[39:16] here. What about So, oh, what about social

[39:20] media? >> We already approved that one.

[39:22] » I was going to say I thought we settled that one. Yeah.

[39:24] » So, that one's approved. >> Oh, it's done.

[39:26] » And that was after you did your thing. >> It was. Yeah. Most of my thing was like

[39:32] cut and we just added one little claws at the bottom of it.

[39:35] » Okay. I just want to make sure.

[39:40] Yeah, I had a lot of All right.

[39:46] Look at you all the organizers. [laughter]

[39:50] » All right. Personnel policies. I'm just going to start in section one. Anything

[39:58] for section one?

[40:03] All right. Section two, general provisions.

[40:07] » So the first one I had was 2.2. >> Okay.

[40:11] » Did you have something before then? >> Nope.

[40:14] » So um 2.2 section A says unless otherwise covered by a collective

[40:19] bargaining unit. Um I feel like this should always the

[40:27] personnel policy should cover everybody all the time. And I'm questioning what

[40:32] was the purpose of having that unless otherwise covered by a collective

[40:36] bargaining >> because sometimes the contracts veer off

[40:39] from some of these things especially it could be insurance coverage could be

[40:43] different. Um >> that's not a personnel policy though is

[40:47] it? >> It's insurance. There's all kinds of

[40:50] things in here stated. >> I mean holidays might be different. I

[40:54] don't think they are but they could be. >> Okay.

[40:57] because I think your I think your unions and also your regular employees are

[41:02] pretty much on the same field for the most part.

[41:11] But I've seen it before where let's say the police department, it's not here,

[41:16] but the police department gets more of their insurance paid than everybody else

[41:20] does. So you can't lay it out here. That's why you have to have the

[41:24] collective bargaining piece. >> Okay.

[41:27] Um, all right. I'm not going to fight that

[41:31] battle. >> No, I'm not fighting. [laughter]

[41:34] » I'll drop that one. On B though, I had a problem with B2.

[41:39] It says, "All employees shall receive a copy of a personnel policy at the time

[41:42] of initial hiring." >> And my question was, should we change

[41:47] that verbiage to say is provided the location of where the personnel policy

[41:52] is can be found on the website?

[41:57] Well, I think that one personally they should get a copy. They should sign off

[42:02] on it. >> Yes. I was just have that

[42:04] » along with the code of ethics. >> Yes.

[42:06] » Right. So then should it be she'll receive a copy of the personnel policy

[42:12] and sign off at the time of initial hiring?

[42:14] » Yes. >> Yes. I agree with that. If you've got an

[42:16] up-to-date personnel policy, that's that would be ideal so that everybody's on

[42:20] the same page.

[42:24] Well, every everybody should get a copy of this one, whether it's whatever is in

[42:28] effect at the time.

[42:39] » Signature page to be put in their employee file.

[42:43] » Oh, I like that better.

[42:51] This would be posted on our website anyway, wouldn't it?

[42:54] » It should be. I think it is.

[43:02] » I'm not sure the personnel policies are there, but

[43:04] » it isn't right now. >> All right. Okay.

[43:06] » But I think he's right. It should be out there.

[43:08] » Yes. >> Um,

[43:12] » all of these policies should be out there.

[43:14] » Correct. Um the next one was the town manager shall be responsible for the

[43:19] administration of this policy. The town manager shall be the hiring and firing

[43:23] authority for all employees subject to the Sabbatis town charter and applicable

[43:27] to state and federal legal requirements. And I asked does this align with the

[43:34] suggested changes in the charter? >> I would say so because you said that was

[43:39] was supposed to be clear and cleaning up what my responsibilities were.

[43:43] » Yeah. Um,

[43:48] » hey, why am I not covered by this policy?

[43:50] » That was my next [laughter] question. >> Hey,

[43:56] » what you brought up >> and I said, [laughter] shouldn't the

[43:59] personnel policy apply to everyone? I would also like the conversation about

[44:03] whether this should apply to boards as well.

[44:07] » I think >> Yeah. Everybody should be held to the

[44:10] same standards. >> Exactly.

[44:12] » Yes. because there's a lot of things in here

[44:14] that's going to be addressed by the charter too and the nepotism thing.

[44:18] » Yep.

[44:23] » So I would like to suggest changing D to say the personnel policy

[44:30] not only applies to all employees but also to

[44:37] all elected and appointed officials.

[44:48] But then you look at [groaning]

[44:53] eval do those not count. Um,

[44:58] » sure. You going to do my eval for me? >> Yes.

[45:00] » Okay. >> PTO. I mean I So the rest of the stuff

[45:04] in here >> Oh, I see what you're saying. Doesn't

[45:07] apply to elected officials, right? >> I get I get what you're saying. or

[45:10] union. >> I'm cons maybe I'm operating

[45:15] incorrectly on this but I feel like a personnel policy is not about your

[45:22] benefits. A personnel policy in my mind is about the behaviors that you have and

[45:29] what is expected of you [clears throat] >> in the job.

[45:34] So that's what's giving me kind of the hangup about like insurance or PTO or

[45:39] holidays. >> Jerry, do

[45:42] » I don't really feel like those are >> personnel policy items. I feel like

[45:47] those are benefits of your job. It's not like

[45:53] » which is it's included in this though, right? Because you got section four is

[45:57] benefits. >> Yeah. I like you could specify at the

[45:59] top of that. I don't know how it's written, but I think you could specify

[46:02] that that's for employees only and not board members or

[46:05] » Yeah. >> And your union is different, too,

[46:08] » because their benefits could be could be different. Yeah.

[46:12] » But I also don't want to put us in a position where somebody says, "Well, I'm

[46:17] an elected official and it says this policy applies to me, so what do I get

[46:22] for >> insurance or

[46:27] pay?

[46:32] And maybe maybe it's certain sections apply,

[46:37] » right? That's what I'm saying. I think you might need to lay out in front of

[46:40] every section who it applies to. If if that's the route you're trying to go,

[46:45] » or maybe it's like behaviors identified in this personnel policy apply to,

[46:51] » maybe that's what it is. Could you could you do like some of the other stuff here

[46:56] and and just attach that as the extra >> as an appendex?

[47:01] » Yeah, an addendum. >> So in here is the driving policy.

[47:07] Um that says see attached. Um sorry the other ones

[47:14] » I think the drug and alcohol. >> Yes, drug and alcohol. It's a separate

[47:19] policy. uh medicinal vehicle operation policy,

[47:23] American with disabilities policy. Um these are addendums to smoking

[47:30] » harassment and sexual uh yeah harassment and sexual harassment reimbursement,

[47:36] » drug and alcohol >> layoffs.

[47:39] » I mean, >> so what would that what would you

[47:42] consider that addendum to be called? The appendix [snorts and clears throat]

[47:48] [laughter]

[47:51] can't see [laughter] >> your face speaks volumes.

[47:59] » That's what it's called today. >> What do you want me to No, no. I

[48:02] [laughter] mean, what do you want? If I'm to write something, what am I

[48:07] writing? What am I saying about that? Am I saying

[48:11] that there's going to be an appendix about

[48:15] » appendix one, two, three, four, or five? >> Well, no. So, this this has appendixes.

[48:20] » What does it say? Sorry. Let me >> Right. But I how do I

[48:25] » I get what you're saying. So, >> right.

[48:27] » Appendix 17 is >> which part of

[48:33] » Yeah. board behavior. Yes. and maybe have a one page that addresses the board

[48:37] issues instead of having it all the way through.

[48:45] » Okay. >> Definitely has to be changed. We have

[48:47] people's names on. >> So, yeah. So, the language in here for

[48:54] municipal vehicle operation refer to municipal vehicle operation policy

[48:58] approved by the board of select men in September of 17, 2011. for further

[49:01] details listed as an index number five in this package.

[49:06] So I mean

[49:13] i.e. can that code of conduct and stuff all be put into that one lump sum in the

[49:21] personnel policy? >> You need the code of ethics.

[49:24] » Yeah. >> Yeah. and and then added in as an

[49:27] appendix or >> within the policy

[49:32] » within the personnel policy.

[49:37] » That was a question. >> I mean, it can, right?

[49:40] » Well, yeah, but um does it work? Does it not work? Are we

[49:44] accomplishing the >> same goal,

[49:47] » right? >> I would think so.

[49:52] » Yeah.

[50:01] All right. So, I create I just said create an appendex about the sections of

[50:05] this policy that apply to elected and appointed officials and the town

[50:10] manager. >> Sure.

[50:22] » [snorts] >> Um,

[50:26] did you have something before 2.3? >> No.

[50:31] » So,

[50:34] 2.3. Um, hold on. Sorry, [snorts] I

[50:39] lost my place. 2.3A,

[50:45] item three. The town manager shall not post any position that the board of

[50:50] selectmen must confirm appointment of prior to receiving official approval for

[50:54] such posting. >> Oh boy.

[50:56] » Upon rece [laughter]

[51:01] upon receiving >> posting.

[51:04] » Wait, what? >> I must confirm appointment of that's not

[51:08] how it's written though. >> That's how I changed it back in 24.

[51:13] [laughter] Did anybody sign that?

[51:17] » No. >> Um,

[51:18] » we didn't. I It ended on 2921 actually. >> So, we were just starting to go through

[51:24] this. >> And my question was, what are these? Are

[51:27] they in the charter? Can we call these out here? And do we do this?

[51:31] » They are in the charter. >> Which positions?

[51:35] » Yes. >> Okay. So, it's your department head

[51:37] positions basically. >> Yes.

[51:40] Department heads, town clerk, treasurer,

[51:55] animal control, building inspector, code enforcement officer, emergency

[51:58] management director, fire chief, health officer, local for weights and measures,

[52:02] plumbing inspector, police chief, public works foreman, sleeper dam commission,

[52:07] tax assessor, tax collector, town clerk, voter reg, Deputies,

[52:12] treasurer, town attorney, general assistance administrator, transfer

[52:15] station manager.

[52:20] Okay. So, you wanted to read, the town manager

[52:24] shall not post any position that the board of selectman must confirm

[52:27] appointment of upon receiving official. >> No.

[52:33] » Well, I thought that's what you just said because it didn't make sense to me

[52:37] after I don't Well, that's problematic because if you

[52:43] have somebody resign, >> you're not waiting for the select board,

[52:47] » right? >> You're going to do it at your job.

[52:50] » Yeah.

[52:53] » I mean, for instance, with >> I mean, I would still be sitting here

[52:57] waiting and not being able to hire that position.

[53:00] » Yeah. >> Then you and then you got to advertise

[53:02] and you've got to wait. So, you're just pushing that off weeks.

[53:05] » Yeah. I think that's going to be taken out.

[53:10] What was the purpose of that? >> Knowing too much control.

[53:17] [snorts] >> I could see if it was a new position

[53:20] that was being created that wasn't previously

[53:23] » which you would come to us anyways, >> right? But I could see that

[53:28] » if I all of a sudden said, "Hey, I want to add a fifth person in the office that

[53:32] we haven't had." Then I could see that. But

[53:37] yeah, if id waited, we we'd still be >> But again, it doesn't say you have to

[53:42] wait for the meeting. I mean, we could have an emergency meeting to discuss

[53:46] that. >> I just think that's too

[53:49] » It says official approval. >> Right.

[53:52] » Matter anyway. We're not the governing

[53:59] » because I think because didn't it hold on where did it say that?

[54:05] If you go back to 2.2C, it says I'm responsible for all the

[54:09] hiring and the firing. But then it's I think that kind of

[54:13] contradicts that.

[54:26] If it's a position we've already had, it needs to be filled.

[54:31] » I just I don't know. So, I don't disagree with

[54:37] that, but let me throw this out there and just

[54:42] tell me what your thoughts are. So, take like the fire chief position. My

[54:46] understanding is that

[54:50] is his name Dustin? >> Yeah. That he asked about working being

[54:54] a part-time fire chief rather than a full-time fire chief in the interview

[54:57] process. >> Is that true?

[55:00] » You didn't ask about being parttime. you were in the interview process.

[55:03] » I don't recall. >> He didn't ask about parttime.

[55:06] » He didn't ask about parttime. Okay. [clears throat]

[55:08] » Um so let's just pretend he did. >> Okay.

[55:11] » Just for the [laughter] sake of my argument. Okay.

[55:13] » Is that is that something that we would just

[55:17] immediately say no to or is that something we would be open to

[55:20] conversation about? And what would the process look like for that conversation

[55:24] to happen? >> Well, again,

[55:25] » how does that apply to this particular line?

[55:29] that's within the hiring and firing and the and the job descriptions of the town

[55:34] manager. >> Do you think that would be your call to

[55:37] determine if he said, "Okay, I'd like to be part-time," then your thought is you

[55:43] could make that call as to whether he was part-time or not. And because that

[55:48] feels to me maybe not a full that there need to be. Now, I guess if if you're

[55:55] changing the job description itself, then maybe that's different,

[55:58] » right? If you're hiring for a full-time position

[56:01] » and you're only hire and then he wants to be part, that would be different.

[56:04] Yeah, I could see that. >> Y

[56:08] and one, you've advertised differently. You've advertised for a full-time,

[56:11] right? >> Somebody knew it was going to be a

[56:13] part-time job, but maybe they couldn't apply group.

[56:16] » Yeah. Right. >> Yeah.

[56:23] » Yeah. that that I can see.

[56:48] It's all there. So >> in charge of hiring hiring per charter

[56:55] town charter. [clears throat] >> Yeah.

[56:57] » I'm I'm eliminating number three. >> Okay.

[57:01] » Um provided number two happens.

[57:07] She always does. Who is this? She

[57:11] » tell somebody that's leaving. [laughter] >> I'm not

[57:15] I'm not providing this as the current operation. I mean we we need to make

[57:19] this so that >> right for anybody that

[57:22] » the next >> jeez my think in section one

[57:26] » it does still say the towel manager doesn't matter if it's her she or they

[57:31] » them >> them the towel manager

[57:34] » yes >> will notify George Merrill [laughter] of

[57:39] the select board of all job postings prior to the first day of a job posting

[57:44] » yes >> yes [cough]

[57:46] [clears throat] >> I I do believe I'm pretty good about

[57:48] » yes Monday or Thursday I say so and so has

[57:53] quit today >> I [laughter] put a strike through yeah

[58:00] » I agree George thanks I'm just messing with you know that

[58:06] » for a short time >> where do you think you're going

[58:09] » to censure him Oh. [laughter]

[58:18] [laughter] >> Oh, I can see that.

[58:22] » Don't say much now. [laughter] >> No, you're usually quiet. So,

[58:28] » all right. >> So, but above that, are we done with

[58:31] that? >> Yes.

[58:32] » So, I am on A1 in that section. >> A1. Yep. So announcements of vacancies

[58:42] notices for all vacancies shall be posted for a minimum of 14 days prior to

[58:45] the permanent selection to fill the vacancies.

[58:49] Um um such notice at a minimum shall

[58:53] include the name of the position, brief description of expected qualification

[58:58] and closing date adding

[59:03] um postings will be at all town facilities for the defined post period.

[59:10] » Posting of >> yes vacancy.

[59:15] » What do you mean by that? So you send out a memo that public works, fire,

[59:21] police, they all get it posted their board. This is a job. This is a job

[59:25] opening. It gets posted on their bulletin board.

[59:28] » So just internally posting it as well >> and wherever yours is here.

[59:32] » It's a bulletin board. Yeah. Posting internally.

[59:38] [clears throat] And then I don't I I'm I'll put it

[59:44] either add a section or um all hirings

[59:51] must be approved by the town manager in advance and this includes volunteers

[59:58] paid on call.

[1:00:06] should not be having department heads posting and hiring people without the

[1:00:11] town manager approving that. You know, if we say that, i.e.,

[1:00:17] I'll just use fire because it's easier. They have they have a 35 man roster and

[1:00:23] they want to put a 36 person on. There's no openings.

[1:00:28] » Yeah, >> that's where I'm

[1:00:30] » So, is that going to be number three there?

[1:00:33] » Oh, I just made it number two. Oh, okay. >> But I can put it wherever you want it to

[1:00:38] be. >> Oh, that's fine.

[1:00:39] » Number Well, whatever works. >> So, all staff hirings

[1:00:45] » must be approved by the town manager prior to offers being made.

[1:00:50] » No, before job postings.

[1:00:59] » Oh, job posting and hiring. So,

[1:01:06] This will include promotions. >> Yes, it's a separate separate section,

[1:01:10] but yes. >> Okay. [laughter] He has a whole policy

[1:01:13] for that.

[1:01:17] [laughter] >> I didn't get that far.

[1:01:20] » That's right.

[1:01:23] » He's been waiting for us to talk about this.

[1:01:27] » Well, that could go So, in relation to that, would would it be the same for the

[1:01:32] police department, too? Yes. >> Yes.

[1:01:34] » I think he's saying across the board department.

[1:01:38] » So, i.e. currently or I'm thinking anyhow right now we should be

[1:01:41] advertising for a part-time public works driver on call.

[1:01:45] » Mhm. >> That should be Raquel that's doing that

[1:01:48] and not the public works foreman who decides that he's going to advertise for

[1:01:52] that in advance and hire that on his own.

[1:01:56] » I don't think we advertised for one of those last year.

[1:01:58] » Right. I mean, but we didn't hire one either. So just you know it's something

[1:02:03] like that that I we know it's they need somebody on call but again everything

[1:02:09] should go through in my mind everything should go through the town manager in

[1:02:12] order to do hiring >> be surprise hires

[1:02:17] have to spell that out to all of them. Yeah, that's next week. [laughter]

[1:02:23] » We have a department meeting next week.

[1:02:30] » Hey, good. >> I'm good.

[1:02:32] » Y

[1:02:43] siring preference.

[1:02:59] I think I had >> that need to be changed.

[1:03:02] » Okay,

[1:03:06] » go ahead. >> And I was just looking at the grammatics

[1:03:09] of the first line. If all things are considered equal, the town will give a

[1:03:14] hiring preference to applicants that have colon or it spells

[1:03:21] [clears throat] it out in the next four or five lines here, but I didn't know

[1:03:24] just grammatically. >> Yeah, that doesn't end. It's kind of

[1:03:27] just dead right there, right? >> Yeah.

[1:03:30] » So, our strro is removed. If all things are considered equal,

[1:03:36] » I'm saying I will be giving a hiring preference to applicants. Towns will

[1:03:40] give a hiring preference to applicants

[1:03:46] under the following criteria. Yeah. >> For

[1:03:49] » Yeah, they did. It's like they didn't finish the sentence,

[1:03:50] » right? >> Yeah.

[1:03:52] » But it explains it in the next >> right

[1:03:55] » five or six lines there, but it just it was just the grammatic of okay, what is

[1:04:01] it? [clears throat] And if there were i.e. bullet points for

[1:04:05] the next, you know, see and then then one, two,

[1:04:09] three, four, five, six items that are there. If you could do that,

[1:04:15] if we could see what those what those are quickly versus kind of stumbling

[1:04:20] through the paragraph.

[1:04:27] » Is that your phone? >> I keep looking at mine every time the

[1:04:31] noise goes. [laughter]

[1:04:55] Hey,

[1:05:12] » [snorts]

[1:05:18] » Okay. >> All right.

[1:05:19] » I've captured all that. >> Okay. Good. All right. Anybody else? C D

[1:05:25] E. >> Yes.

[1:05:29] » Um, so hiring process for police officers. So, I basically just said,

[1:05:33] "Are we doing this for only full-time employees? Does it include part-time

[1:05:37] employees?"

[1:05:42] Because I don't if we were actually following this, we

[1:05:47] wouldn't have had an employee who couldn't pass their alert.

[1:05:52] » I mean, their their Yes. >> So, I think

[1:05:56] my comment was more about we're not following our policy.

[1:06:04] Is the alert test the same as the >> No, sorry. She

[1:06:08] » alert test is I'm talking about the physical agility test

[1:06:13] » section two

[1:06:19] if applicable. >> It is applicable. It would be for an

[1:06:23] officer >> that says training program. But wouldn't

[1:06:27] that be just for your full-timers because part- timerrs have to do that?

[1:06:32] » Well, they've already been established as an officer.

[1:06:36] » I don't think that I don't know what the the exam is for reserves for a green pin

[1:06:42] because they've already gone through it. >> No,

[1:06:44] » if they're that if they're already an officer,

[1:06:45] » if they're a blue pin, they've already gone through it, right? But

[1:06:48] » some of these >> we hire we hire green pin green pins as

[1:06:52] reserves. >> Yeah, green pin is a reserve. Mhm.

[1:06:56] » A blue pin is a full-time officer >> most of the time.

[1:07:00] » Yeah. [clears throat]

[1:07:04] » And then I was questioning number, do we have an oral board that has been

[1:07:10] established by the town? >> Not that I know of.

[1:07:19] » So number two, >> so four, five, and six. I don't know

[1:07:22] that we do those for part- timerrs. >> I don't think

[1:07:27] » and I >> What do you consider an oral board?

[1:07:29] Because I don't even know if we do that for the full time.

[1:07:31] » That would be the Thomas Sabbatis page.

[1:07:37] [laughter]

[1:07:41] I'm kidding. [snorts]

[1:07:46] » Yeah, there is none. again. >> And would that be laid out in their No,

[1:07:49] because if they're parttime, they wouldn't be covered by the contract,

[1:07:52] » right?

[1:07:59] » Huh. >> Is there anything in their contract?

[1:08:01] » Wouldn't be for part- timerrs? >> No, nothing part time. You sure?

[1:08:05] » Yeah. >> So, wait,

[1:08:06] » we don't Well, we don't have any part- timerrs that are in the union.

[1:08:12] » I just think we should look at this section and have a conversation with

[1:08:15] [clears throat] our new chief. Yeah. >> And figure out what are we doing and

[1:08:19] what are we not doing and what do we need to do here because

[1:08:22] » it might help us >> a little bit if we followed it.

[1:08:28] » Yes. Correct. >> And also number 10.

[1:08:32] » Oh, I was there too. >> Hold on. Did we say five, six, seven,

[1:08:35] eight, nine were okay? Hold on. >> No, they're all I think they're all pro

[1:08:39] problematic. I don't think we're following any of these. Okay.

[1:08:42] » I mean, maybe eight. Yes,

[1:08:46] » I think you have Oh, wait. >> But that adds in some post-secary

[1:08:50] education, which >> I honestly don't agree with that

[1:08:54] » with what a 60 credit hour. >> Yeah. Yeah.

[1:08:56] » I don't I don't think that is a criteria we should have for a part-time officer,

[1:09:02] but that's just >> But again, that's something we can go

[1:09:04] over with the chief, I would think. >> Yes.

[1:09:07] » Um, but number 10, >> let him because he's going to be the

[1:09:10] hiring guy, right? >> And I Yeah.

[1:09:12] » Yep. I like to see what he has.

[1:09:16] » Yeah. >> Number 10 says, "To become a reserve or

[1:09:19] part-time officer, the applicant must already be a certified full-time police

[1:09:23] officer working for another police department.

[1:09:26] » Yeah, >> that's not true. We don't do that."

[1:09:29] » I mean, I guess I just feel like we should not have stuff in here that we

[1:09:33] know we're not going to do, right? >> Okay. So, [laughter]

[1:09:37] » I the same thing I had it crossed out on my list. Just take that out.

[1:09:40] » I'll talk to him about those. He'll be He worked today.

[1:09:44] He's not here full-time yet, >> but he's working two days next week as

[1:09:48] well. >> Here.

[1:09:49] » Yep. >> Okay.

[1:09:51] » Yep. And then he starts full-time the following week.

[1:09:54] » And the other chief, >> Jeff?

[1:09:56] » Yep. Is he still here? >> Yeah.

[1:09:58] » Okay. >> For now, his golf clubs are ready to

[1:10:01] roll. >> Good. [laughter]

[1:10:03] » Four. >> Two. Four.

[1:10:07] » Yes. >> Okay.

[1:10:14] And I'm just >> I'm just back again to the Nancy

[1:10:17] question with that. Are we >> enforcing this, reviewing this? If we

[1:10:22] have part-time people working 35 hours a week, they're considered full-time,

[1:10:28] » right? >> You'll notice I believe that has

[1:10:32] stopped. >> Yeah. I just want to [laughter]

[1:10:34] » Yeah. So I just and and if if you can get

[1:10:39] clarification for us what that number really is and what what constitutes

[1:10:44] [laughter] continuous. >> I think after the conversation you and I

[1:10:48] had that day, I think I googled it and I said, "Oh, George is right. We need to

[1:10:52] stop this cease and desist." [laughter] >> Yes. But I can I'll get a hold of legal

[1:10:58] and ask. >> All right.

[1:11:00] » What that constitutes >> and and the same it's not in here.

[1:11:11] » Okay.

[1:11:15] Anything else under the section 2.4? Anybody?

[1:11:18] 2.5 >> a

[1:11:21] » a [snorts] >> um [clears throat] talks about

[1:11:24] probationary period and probationary employees shall be formally reviewed

[1:11:28] during the first 90 days of employment. My question is how often are we doing

[1:11:32] that? >> 90 days.

[1:11:35] » Yep. >> No, I hit the six months.

[1:11:40] I guess I didn't realize it was 90. It can be.

[1:11:43] » So >> that one that one can stay. I can do

[1:11:46] that. just kind of calling it out, >> right? Me, too. I That was on my That

[1:11:50] was on my list, too. As well as

[1:11:55] » um the annual

[1:11:57] » 30 6090 >> the annual

[1:12:00] » three months >> evaluation that

[1:12:04] » every employee needs.

[1:12:08] » But are they? >> Mhm. They are now. So, firefighter B has

[1:12:14] » Well, I can't tell you what he's they've been since my new people have come on,

[1:12:18] but they know to do them. >> Okay. Well, I'm asking and who's who's

[1:12:22] double-checking that. >> Yes.

[1:12:23] » We need to decide that every employee in the town needs correct needs an

[1:12:27] evaluation every year. >> And

[1:12:30] » yep. Again, I know it's probably a lot of work, but I'm looking at the biggest

[1:12:35] department we have, 35 volunteers or call paid. They all have a eval in their

[1:12:42] personnel file here at the town office. >> Even volunteers,

[1:12:46] » I said there's no volunteers, so they're all pretty that. But I've got three

[1:12:50] volunteer applications on my desk. [laughter]

[1:12:55] » Well, I think that >> Yeah,

[1:12:56] » they live local, >> I believe. So,

[1:12:59] » that's what it's supposed to be. Again, I think that they should know where they

[1:13:03] stand >> if they're g if they're volunteering and

[1:13:06] and and we're talking fire, you know, that

[1:13:11] they should know whether they're in good standing, whether they're meeting their

[1:13:14] their requirements, you know, and I'm sure that they're having those

[1:13:17] discussions, but something formal should be in place.

[1:13:20] » Document it.

[1:13:24] 90 days,

[1:13:28] six months, one year.

[1:13:33] Are you all set with the rest of the probation area period? All right. 2.6

[1:13:39] promotions.

[1:13:45] So, I made a note that all promotions again should be posted

[1:13:53] for the 14-day minimum just like any other job opening.

[1:14:03] And again, all all those postings will be

[1:14:07] approved by the town manager prior to posting

[1:14:15] is what I've added to that section.

[1:14:20] » I'm not sure that I agree with that. >> Sure. Now that I wrote it down,

[1:14:26] [laughter] >> just because George said it doesn't make

[1:14:29] it gospel truth. >> Hey, George speaks.

[1:14:33] » [laughter] >> Well, I guess

[1:14:35] » he's already rewrote this whole thing. >> Yeah,

[1:14:41] [clears throat] >> I do believe that before any promotion,

[1:14:45] no matter what it is, Raquel should be aware of it and have

[1:14:52] some say in whether it should be filled or not and

[1:14:57] kind of some say as to who is getting the role. Now, does it go back to the

[1:15:03] existing employees have first dibs? >> So, I

[1:15:07] » only if >> I guess let's say it's a a title with

[1:15:12] the fire department, police department, something like that. In that scenario,

[1:15:18] I don't necessarily feel like it should have to be posted.

[1:15:23] The reason I don't is that department head should know their people well

[1:15:28] enough that do you go through this whole interview process with 10 different

[1:15:32] people when you already know exactly who you're going to hire or promote. Now

[1:15:38] sometimes you might not. Sometimes you might say there's two or three people

[1:15:41] who are qualified for that position and then you post it and you go through that

[1:15:45] process. But if you're like, it's very clear the deputy chief should be XYZ

[1:15:50] person. I don't see value in wasting people's

[1:15:55] time going through that whole process. That's that's just my two cents worth.

[1:16:00] » Yeah. Why would somebody want to come here and not be be able to advance

[1:16:05] on based on what you're saying, >> right?

[1:16:08] » And not have to go through like you said posting. And but on the other on the

[1:16:13] other side of that, that [clears throat] may be the case, but

[1:16:18] to not post it and to say, "Hey, John, I think you should have this position and

[1:16:23] you're the right person for the job, so we're not going to post it. We're just

[1:16:27] going to promote you into this position." I think is is does a

[1:16:31] disservice for there may be a Sally over there who's the quietest best employee

[1:16:38] you have and hasn't shown you know has has the credentials has the stuff to do

[1:16:44] that with but doesn't get asked to apply for that position and maybe if she gets

[1:16:49] an opportunity to apply and we can see the resume and see that she's interested

[1:16:54] and see that she's done this IE schooling or or or whatever

[1:16:59] that maybe maybe she is a good candidate for that position. But if you don't post

[1:17:03] it, you don't know if others are interested or maybe interested, maybe

[1:17:08] it's a good way to build, you know, but to me by just hand selecting and I you

[1:17:16] know that I know I know that this person is the best person with the job. I'm

[1:17:19] just going to >> I guess I'm not saying that every time

[1:17:23] it has to be done that way. I'm just saying that there might be times when

[1:17:26] it's very clear who the person should be. And I don't think if you put it in

[1:17:31] here, you're tying yourself to a process that I don't think is always beneficial.

[1:17:36] » I do understand what he's saying. >> It's posting within though. See, I'm

[1:17:42] thinking outside. >> No, this would be posting.

[1:17:44] » This would be posting within. Yeah. No, absolutely.

[1:17:48] » I know what this He's right. That's really You really should be posting

[1:17:52] within because that would avoid some issues that we've had.

[1:17:55] » A lot of it. >> Yeah.

[1:17:56] » And a lot of it here. >> Yeah.

[1:17:58] » It just gives everybody if they would apply.

[1:18:00] » Yes. >> And it gives the town manager the

[1:18:03] ability to to say to the department head,

[1:18:06] » why not this person? Look at this resume. Why not this person?

[1:18:10] » Right. >> And the department head then has to

[1:18:12] explain why this and why not that. You know, it

[1:18:15] gives that person the ability >> to have some dialogue and input versus,

[1:18:21] you know, I've select I've selected this person.

[1:18:24] » Exactly. Why didn't Yeah. Why didn't you even ask me?

[1:18:27] » Right. >> Right.

[1:18:28] » Y >> and if you post it, then every person

[1:18:30] sees the posting has an opportunity to apply.

[1:18:36] » And I think that doesn't that does a good service to our employees to

[1:18:40] » right recognize it. Well, and and it gives them um the ability to go through

[1:18:45] that process for the next time >> to be able to climb a ladder,

[1:18:50] » right? >> So, how do you want it? You want it

[1:18:52] position should be posted internally >> for the 14 days. The same as a hiring,

[1:19:07] but again, only after the approval of the town manager.

[1:19:11] She want to create something that's not there, right? Can't,

[1:19:24] you know, I'll and I'll just I'll go to public works this time. You know, we've

[1:19:29] decided that we want a deputy foreman down there. the public works foreman

[1:19:36] decides that who that's going to Oh, I just think that he's good for the job

[1:19:40] and process.

[1:19:44] [laughter] >> Okay.

[1:19:47] » So, I [snorts] you killing me. [laughter]

[1:19:50] » I try to be entertaining for you. You are all right. Very much. So I will say

[1:19:55] the one thing I think I mentioned this to Rick but I feel like we as a board

[1:20:01] need to start giving better direction to Raquel and I want to add this to our

[1:20:06] next agenda for our board meeting is what are we looking for in the some of

[1:20:12] these positions or in I guess in the staffing because

[1:20:18] you know I will tell Raquel what I want maybe she does it maybe she doesn't do

[1:20:23] it. Then I'm like, "Well, Marquel, you didn't do what I told you to do."

[1:20:27] » Oh, that's George, too. Yeah. [laughter] >> I mean, her response should be, "Yeah,

[1:20:33] well, you just told me the board didn't, right?" So, I think we need to do a

[1:20:36] better job of going back and saying, "Okay, we only want," and I'm just

[1:20:41] making up numbers, but we only want 25 people on the roster for the fire

[1:20:45] department. So if we have 35 right now, one person gets done, that doesn't mean

[1:20:49] we're going to backfill that position, you know, because she doesn't she, as

[1:20:52] far as I know, she has not been given that direction by this board,

[1:20:56] » right? [clears throat] >> I've given her a lot of thought.

[1:20:59] [laughter] >> So I think we need to do a better job of

[1:21:02] doing that. >> And during the project process to define

[1:21:06] that, >> I don't think it should be weighted.

[1:21:09] Well, no, but but if you only but if you only budgeted for 25,

[1:21:14] » right? >> Then

[1:21:16] » that's true. Yeah, >> that I guess that's when it gets very

[1:21:19] clear when the budgets are cut and they're not covered.

[1:21:24] » Yeah. All that you got to remember. >> Okay, I've added that in there.

[1:21:30] » All right. Anything else under that? >> Um I had anything there.

[1:21:37] » Okay. 2.7 Disability Accommodations.

[1:21:43] » 2.8 training, education, and conferences.

[1:21:48] » 2.9 Safety Policy.

[1:21:55] 210 Personnel Records.

[1:22:02] Two. Um, yeah. So,

[1:22:08] » which one are you in? >> Personal records.

[1:22:10] » Okay. >> Are there personal records for select

[1:22:15] people or board members? >> No.

[1:22:19] » Should there be? >> Oh, I say no, but there might be. She

[1:22:24] may have folders up there. >> Well, yes, there probably is because we

[1:22:28] had to do >> Right. You had to do your W TWS or

[1:22:31] whatever your I9. >> Yeah.

[1:22:34] And there should be a I don't know if it's called a personnel

[1:22:39] record, but if you're censuring people or something, there should be

[1:22:42] documented. >> Yes.

[1:22:44] » It's got to be something it's got to go into to be

[1:22:46] » there. >> I'll find out. I mean, that's easy

[1:22:50] enough to start if they're not. But she may have something up there

[1:22:54] » because there should be other things in that personel

[1:22:58] » record, the foyer stuff, the things that they're supposed to you were supposed to

[1:23:02] do, >> right? any sign off on any media or any

[1:23:05] workshop or anything you've been to. Yeah.

[1:23:10] » Yeah. Now that you say that, yeah, should be.

[1:23:13] » Because if we're not included in the personnel policy, we are included in the

[1:23:19] ethics policy, >> right? Yeah.

[1:23:21] » Code of ethics. [snorts] I just feel we should

[1:23:27] » there may be

[1:23:35] all right and 211 job description evaluations.

[1:23:41] So, I highlighted this one um because I feel like somewhere in here

[1:23:49] we should be stating that the town manager needs to kind of

[1:23:57] understand what is being said in those reviews.

[1:24:01] So if for example

[1:24:06] somebody was getting a review stating they were failing to do their job,

[1:24:11] » you should be aware of that >> and be able to be have a conversation

[1:24:14] with that department head to say are we putting them on an action plan? Are we

[1:24:18] doing you know how are we addressing this step

[1:24:20] » rather than it just be addressed >> with that review and nothing happened.

[1:24:26] So you you at least know the context of what's happening. Also the vice versa

[1:24:30] where you you're an excellent employee but maybe everybody doesn't feel that

[1:24:34] way. >> Yep.

[1:24:36] » You know those evaluations are kept here anyway, right? Public horse, we keep

[1:24:39] theirs there. >> No, we have everybody's personnel's

[1:24:41] files here. They may keep copies, but that the originals should be upstairs.

[1:24:46] » Yes. All personnel file should be here and not

[1:24:48] » so he should be when he's re-evaluating somebody or a department's reeval like

[1:24:54] any of them Jerry or them >> fire

[1:24:58] » all those records are kept here. [laughter]

[1:25:00] » Mhm.

[1:25:03] [clears throat] >> Okay.

[1:25:05] Sure about that? >> Like I said they may keep copies but the

[1:25:09] original should all be upstairs. should I want the answer to be they are

[1:25:15] » they are George [laughter]

[1:25:20] » I can't speak to what took place before I got here

[1:25:23] » no I know I'm just so who but the department heads are keeping are the

[1:25:27] ones that are keeping track of that or are you

[1:25:29] » no the department heads keep track of their employees within their department

[1:25:33] » to reval evalue yes for their evaluations

[1:25:36] » yes >> but I believe the town manager should be

[1:25:39] asking that these raw it should be able to see them.

[1:25:43] » You should have Yes. Yes. >> They should come across her desk before

[1:25:45] they get in the file. Correct. >> So she knows that every employee in the

[1:25:49] community in the town has been evaluated annually.

[1:25:52] » Yep. But >> so these questions that you ask at your

[1:25:54] » department, >> sorry, your media department meetings,

[1:25:56] have you got any new evaluations? I need them. Okay. But she needs to also be

[1:26:01] aware of that before it's delivered to the employee because if she doesn't

[1:26:05] agree with it, she needs to be able >> You can't give somebody a great

[1:26:10] evaluation and have [laughter] Raquel's like, "Uh-uh.

[1:26:16] It has to happen in advance." >> That doesn't happen. But I agree that

[1:26:20] would be handy. >> I think that's what needs to happen

[1:26:23] though because ultimately we would be going to you saying, "What the heck?"

[1:26:28] Yeah. >> And in order for you to be able to be

[1:26:31] covered. >> Yeah.

[1:26:38] » It also says here that each employee should be afforded at least one meeting

[1:26:43] six months prior to to their formal evaluation to informally discuss with

[1:26:47] their supervisor their performance. So we should ensure that's happening as

[1:26:52] well.

[1:26:56] one meeting as close to six months prior to the formal.

[1:27:00] » Wow. >> Huh.

[1:27:04] » Well, that's not going on. >> But again, that's not for me. That's not

[1:27:07] a formal sit down, >> right?

[1:27:10] » Well, it's a sit down. It's it's maybe it's a if I'm a public works employee,

[1:27:16] maybe I'm in the truck riding with my boss having a conversation about my

[1:27:20] work, right? You know, and that's fine. It does it doesn't have to be written

[1:27:24] with somebody signing a paper. It's just having that conversation to say, "Hey,

[1:27:28] you're doing good." Or, "Hey, I really need you to step it up here."

[1:27:32] » Yeah. >> And are all the job descriptions up to

[1:27:35] date? Every employee has a job description.

[1:27:41] » They're in the S drive, but I can't say that they're all perfect.

[1:27:45] The ones we haven't had to hire, I couldn't tell you. the only it's only

[1:27:49] the positions that I've had to hire that I would be able to say you where they're

[1:27:52] where they need to be. >> But that would be something that we

[1:27:55] would have to do that would have to be updated to know what their roles are.

[1:28:01] » I suppose >> because we're Yeah. For me, specifically

[1:28:05] the front office now that roles are changing.

[1:28:07] » Yep. >> They sure are.

[1:28:08] » Yeah. >> That their job description should

[1:28:11] include that so they know what the expectations are. Mhm.

[1:28:14] » Yeah. >> And other duties as assigned on every

[1:28:17] job description. >> Right. Right.

[1:28:19] » Yeah. Find out three weeks. I'm not doing that.

[1:28:22] » Yeah. >> That's not my job.

[1:28:25] » The other thing it states here is all probationary employees must receive an

[1:28:30] acceptable performance review prior to the end of their probationary period as

[1:28:34] a minimum to off be offered a regular employee status.

[1:28:37] » Yes, that's at six months.

[1:28:51] So, I'm going to I'm going to go back up to the top for a second of that page.

[1:28:55] Uh, so it'll be 2.8 C. It talks about travel and then on the

[1:29:03] second on the top of the next page uh the employee at uh sorry the town will

[1:29:09] reimburse the employee at the acceptable mileage rate. Um further in the document

[1:29:15] it talks about the IRS rate. So, I was just trying to clean that up and make it

[1:29:21] the same.

[1:29:25] I find the hour.

[1:29:43] So, if we could if we could make it the same so that

[1:29:48] » [clears throat] >> Can't find it now.

[1:30:03] Uh yeah. So under 3.20 20 mileage reimbursement. All employees using their

[1:30:08] privately owned vehicles in the conduct of official town business

[1:30:12] shall be reimbured for mileage at the standard rate allowed by the Internal

[1:30:16] Revenue Service. That should be the language that's in

[1:30:20] there. Just take out acceptable mileage rate

[1:30:24] and put in the internal uh the yeah the standard

[1:30:30] rate allowed by the Internal Revenue Service because it's flexible. It

[1:30:35] changes. >> Yeah.

[1:30:37] » 56 men.

[1:30:56] [snorts]

[1:31:00] » Okay. I added it. >> All right. I didn't feel like fighting

[1:31:04] with you about that. >> All right.

[1:31:07] [laughter] >> She's picking her battle.

[1:31:09] » Yes. >> Yeah.

[1:31:14] » All right.

[1:31:24] So, let me just add it's 10 minutes of 8. How long do we want to go?

[1:31:31] I was suggesting was going to suggest two hours at the beginning.

[1:31:38] What do we just >> I don't think you're going to get

[1:31:42] through the whole thing tonight regardless.

[1:31:47] » So 8:00 to quit for everybody. All right. So conditions of employment in

[1:31:54] the ethical standards

[1:32:00] 32 employee conduct and public relations

[1:32:07] 33 confidentiality

[1:32:12] 34 attendance.

[1:32:20] Oh, whoops. Sorry. Hold on. >> Y

[1:32:24] » that's all right.

[1:32:34] » Yes. Okay.

[1:32:39] » So, where were you? Sorry. >> I I'm at 3.8 is where I have my next

[1:32:44] question. >> Okay.

[1:32:47] So the only I guess the only item when I was looking at ethical standards and

[1:32:51] trying to to put that with our code of ethics

[1:32:55] » and maybe that's where we add that >> that in

[1:32:58] » that in for elected officials. >> Yep.

[1:33:05] All right. So 35 [clears throat] violence free

[1:33:11] workplace attendance

[1:33:16] 34 is attendance 35 violence free workplace

[1:33:21] 3.6 conflict of interest [snorts] 3.7

[1:33:27] seniority 3.8 eight outside or non duty

[1:33:33] employment. >> I had a question on that one.

[1:33:38] » I just put is this legal? It

[1:33:43] it felt like we were saying we have to know about

[1:33:49] every part-time position anyone has. I don't think that's really what it

[1:33:55] means to say.

[1:34:04] Great. So, I um I'll use the public works department. Um, one of them is

[1:34:11] working part-time for another town

[1:34:17] and it's a snow day. >> Mhm.

[1:34:20] » And they're supposed to be called in, but now they're working somewhere else

[1:34:25] or they're working for a private plow contractor

[1:34:29] who they can't get here on time.

[1:34:35] is that that's affecting our operation

[1:34:40] because they're working a job that conflicts with their current job.

[1:34:48] So, that one to me is pretty cut and dry. Where I start to get, you know, the

[1:34:54] way I'm reading it is where I start to get kind of questionable is like, okay,

[1:35:01] let's take that person. It says may subject the town to

[1:35:08] public criticism or embarrassment. So

[1:35:13] what if they work at the local strip club?

[1:35:14] » I was just going to say that. [laughter]

[1:35:18] » Is that what that's what is that talking about? [laughter]

[1:35:21] Where is that?

[1:35:26] [laughter]

[1:35:31] [laughter] >> It says employers must inform their

[1:35:34] department superi supervisor of their outside employment. I mean, you know,

[1:35:40] » somebody in the town office who works as waitress on the weekend, right?

[1:35:44] » Why do they need to tell you that? I mean,

[1:35:46] » I I just feel like >> I understand. I think what you're

[1:35:50] talking about is what we're trying to get to here, but we've made it so

[1:35:55] generic. I don't know.

[1:36:02] And who's to say it does or doesn't embarrass the town?

[1:36:06] » Well, again, though, but what if using your example,

[1:36:13] [laughter] one of the front office staff is working in that club we talked about.

[1:36:18] [laughter] Is that an issue?

[1:36:21] » As long as they're not doing it during work hours, [laughter]

[1:36:24] I don't know. >> Well, that's again, I mean, do you have

[1:36:27] the right to tell people what they can and can't do during their time off if

[1:36:30] it's not infringing upon the work hours? >> Right.

[1:36:33] » I don't know. That's a good question whether that's even legal. You're right.

[1:36:36] » I I mean, >> we should get an answer

[1:36:41] on that. I think,

[1:36:46] you know, definitely like for example, if you know, say we had another

[1:36:50] situation like in Lewon with the shooting, you know, we want to know that

[1:36:54] we have officers who would be available to come in and make this their priority.

[1:36:58] I I totally get that >> and maybe that does need to be here

[1:37:03] somehow, but there's other things and maybe it

[1:37:08] references like, I don't know, on call or I don't know. I I just feel like some

[1:37:13] of what's there maybe is overstepping.

[1:37:22] » Yeah. I mean, if Raquel can reach out to >> Yeah, I've got it written down to see

[1:37:26] I'll get a hold of MMA >> and [snorts] see what their thought is,

[1:37:31] » but I was >> And maybe you should clarify. We don't

[1:37:34] have anything. [laughter] >> There are

[1:37:36] » We don't know that yet. >> There are a lot of people that have

[1:37:39] second jobs. >> Absolutely. Exactly. And I don't think

[1:37:42] that they should have to justify, you know, working as a waitress or, you

[1:37:46] know, doing any of those things. >> As long as there's an impede there,

[1:37:49] » right? As long as they can show up here when their hours are supposed to be.

[1:37:53] Yeah.

[1:37:59] » Um, >> go.

[1:38:02] » My next one was going to be in 310. >> Okay.

[1:38:09] Go ahead. So employees of the town of Sabatis may

[1:38:13] seek election to any office in town government. However, such employees

[1:38:17] shall be placed on an unpaid leave of absence from the date of candidacy for

[1:38:22] such a position when nomination papers are taken out for a position until the

[1:38:26] completion of the election process for said employee.

[1:38:33] I don't think we're doing that. That is well when you started reading

[1:38:38] that I was thinking of bigger than just the town but as you went on it's just I

[1:38:42] believe it's just town a town position right

[1:38:45] » it says if the employee is elected to a town position then the employee will be

[1:38:49] terminated once the officially elected >> correct paid employee

[1:38:55] [clears throat] so to me that would be if somebody was

[1:38:59] run >> the select board

[1:39:00] » select board yeah >> so let's say a Austin yeah No, we didn't

[1:39:05] do that. >> Select board budget committee.

[1:39:09] » It's It doesn't >> specified for just one, right?

[1:39:16] » Charter. >> I was going to say, didn't something

[1:39:17] happen in the charter with that? >> Yeah.

[1:39:24] » So, are you telling me that we don't need to do anything with that because

[1:39:26] it's being accountable? >> I think so. Yes.

[1:39:28] » Yes. It is. >> I'll put a question by that one.

[1:39:32] Charter.

[1:39:36] All right. 311 discipline.

[1:39:42] 312 grievances. Um, so I have a problem. Well, I don't

[1:39:48] necessarily have a problem with it, but 312 we're not following. And I'm not

[1:39:52] sure the way that we're handling grievances if it's feasible to expect us

[1:39:58] to be able to hit this. So if you think about the most recent grievance that we

[1:40:02] have within five working days of the event or the employee having knowledge

[1:40:07] of the event, they shall notify us within 10 working days of receiving the

[1:40:11] notice. The supervisor shall respond in writing with a determination.

[1:40:17] » The determination would be the issue. You can you can acknowledge that within

[1:40:21] 10 days. That's not a problem. But you might not have the determination within

[1:40:25] 10 days. I don't see how you could if you think about

[1:40:29] » right it depends on how in-depth it is. >> Yeah.

[1:40:31] » Yeah. >> So I question whether it

[1:40:36] » I understand. I think it's it should be something about in a timely fashion.

[1:40:43] » But if you read on to the to the next unresolved

[1:40:48] » so the the next determination is um we're moving on to the next step.

[1:40:53] It's unresolved. >> Okay. Then you have 10 more days from

[1:40:56] then, >> right? But it's either resolved or

[1:40:58] unresolved. But then it goes, it's somebody else's responsibility. It drops

[1:41:01] into the town managers. >> Yeah.

[1:41:06] » But at the end, you've only got 30, let's see,

[1:41:09] » 30 days. Yes.

[1:41:14] » And then if it still goes, then it comes to you guys.

[1:41:17] » Yep. >> Right.

[1:41:18] So I I just

[1:41:25] » I think they have the 10 days in there to keep things moving so that it doesn't

[1:41:28] become stagnant and just dropped. >> But I feel like in the examples that

[1:41:34] I've been part of, >> if they happen the day after we have a

[1:41:38] board meeting, >> right,

[1:41:40] » you're already 10 days into it before we even have a conversation. Correct. And I

[1:41:45] don't think that's a good practice. No. So my comment is not that this is wrong.

[1:41:51] My comment is more about we as a board maybe need to come up with a different

[1:41:56] way of doing this so that it can be acted on quicker.

[1:42:02] » Our our involvement is in number five only.

[1:42:06] » It should be. It's just the things that she's been involved in involves the

[1:42:09] board. >> Well, I know it's a little different.

[1:42:11] Yeah, >> but you're right. But I'm not sure that

[1:42:14] that's again that could be addressed above, you

[1:42:20] know, >> we got it, we're looking into it. Um,

[1:42:26] we're going to the next step or something versus

[1:42:30] I mean, what I'm thinking of is i.e. I didn't get paid the right amount. You

[1:42:35] know, that's e, you know, okay, well, looks like I had it. Yeah. Okay, you

[1:42:39] didn't. We'll pay you next week. Cut you a check. Um,

[1:42:44] I didn't get my clothing allowance. Um, yeah, you know, just

[1:42:52] the the everyday little things that certainly should be able to get passed

[1:42:57] in in this short amount of time. >> Yes. If it wasn't if it didn't involve a

[1:43:04] board member, then these things would be fine. That's when

[1:43:09] that's where you're getting hung up. >> Yep. Yeah.

[1:43:18] » Anything else in that section? >> No.

[1:43:20] » Right. Transfers.

[1:43:25] 314 is town property. So employees must not directly or

[1:43:32] indirectly use or allow the use of town property of any kind for other than

[1:43:37] official activities. Town telephones, cell phones, computers, etc. may be used

[1:43:42] for personal business only on an emergency basis. Employees must maintain

[1:43:46] all town equipment and immediately report any damage that occurs to town

[1:43:51] property. What I've added to the end of that is

[1:43:57] um emails are included in that

[1:44:02] and should not town email should not be used for personal business.

[1:44:10] And the example I have for you is the bargaining units

[1:44:15] who use their sebatis.org email address. Um, if they're bargaining for their

[1:44:22] union, then they should have a union email address and not be using the town

[1:44:27] email address to do their personal business. It's not town business then.

[1:44:34] » I think it's still town business. But they were they were acting in a

[1:44:38] different capacity and potentially being >> I've given a lot. George, do you really

[1:44:44] want to fight that battle? [laughter] >> Whatever. Use your satis.org email

[1:44:50] address again. [laughter] >> Damn it.

[1:44:56] » I just put it out there. And um >> yeah, I

[1:45:00] I guess I feel like in in that particular example,

[1:45:06] I feel like that is town business.

[1:45:11] [snorts] That's my take on it. I just wanted an opportunity to try to

[1:45:16] get you to All right. Bend [laughter]

[1:45:20] » sometimes. >> Oh, it's after eight.

[1:45:26] » Even count. >> [laughter]

[1:45:29] » We're putting a pin just above that to bring it up on [laughter] the next

[1:45:33] topic. There's more people here.

[1:45:37] [laughter] >> Are we at a good stop there?

[1:45:40] » Yep. All right. >> Do we want to set another date to

[1:45:47] continue the process? >> Probably.

[1:45:52] My >> Are you so busy that you have to look at

[1:45:56] your calendar? >> I do, man.

[1:46:00] » I don't have one of those 9 to five jobs, you know.

[1:46:03] » I don't either, unfortunately. >> Me either.

[1:46:08] » So, do we want to shoot for the 22nd, which is

[1:46:15] » an off the 22nd or the 6th? Right. That would be more.

[1:46:20] » But the 20 The 29th is here. >> Yeah. But the 29th is a regular board

[1:46:24] meeting, right? >> No. Two meetings. We had two meetings

[1:46:27] this month. So that's an extra

[1:46:32] » Yep. >> So our next meeting is the 14th. Yeah.

[1:46:36] Next week the 15th.

[1:46:40] » 15th. Yes. Mhm. Okay. So, do we 22nd, 29th?

[1:46:48] » I don't care. I can do either. >> Okay.

[1:46:50] » Yep. >> 22nd.

[1:46:52] » 22nd. >> All right. 22nd 6:00 again.

[1:46:57] » Mhm. >> All right.

[1:47:01] Thank you very much. It is now.

[1:47:05] » So then we'll be 04. >> We'll be going back. We'll be continuing

[1:47:08] this and then going back over what we find out on these other ones.

[1:47:13] » Yes. >> Policy.

[1:47:16] Okay. Yeah, this is really the only one we did a we can say a complete is the

[1:47:19] remote participation one. Okay.

[1:47:23] » And as we look through the personnel policies, I'm assuming that we're going

[1:47:27] to review the appendix, the index as well.

[1:47:31] » So the drug policy, drug and alcohol, driving,

[1:47:38] harassment,

[1:47:46] » [clears throat]

[1:47:51] » All right. Keep going.

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