[0:40] You know where anything from?

[0:49] I think

[1:01] passed away.

[1:09] » Yes, you do.

[1:18] » Oh, wow. Okay.

[1:43] » So, I was on my way to last week and I

[1:46] saw the

[1:49] Yeah. And I saw the fire and everything

[1:53] at the rehab center and I and Amy said.

[5:07] Look at that. We're fine,

[5:08] >> man. Whole city got

[5:12] invited.

[5:15] >> Should be quick one. Said that before

[5:18] though. But

[5:18] >> did you say

[5:19] >> No, I didn't. I didn't mean I didn't

[5:21] mean to.

[5:24] Good.

[5:25] >> Yeah.

[5:26] >> I didn't mean to say that

[5:34] for doing the pledge of allegiance.

[5:35] >> Yeah.

[5:36] >> All right.

[5:38] >> Oh, yeah.

[5:39] >> So,

[5:41] just tell me when we're live.

[5:46] » Okay.

[5:56] We waiting for someone. What?

[5:57] >> We waiting for someone.

[5:59] >> Oh,

[5:59] >> she's she's going to let us know we're

[6:01] live

[6:04] in five.

[6:15] » Nice Dave.

[6:19] I'd like to thank everybody for coming

[6:22] to u our planning commission meeting

[6:25] here on Thursday, March the 12th, 2026.

[6:30] I'd like to first excuse two of our

[6:33] planning commissioners, uh Chad Skola

[6:36] and uh Julie Losi.

[6:39] And to get things kicked off, we're

[6:41] going to go ahead and start off with a

[6:43] pledge of allegiance led by Chris

[6:46] Roberts. Commissioner Roberts

[6:53] to the flag of the United States of

[6:56] America and to the republic for which it

[6:58] stands. One nation under God,

[7:02] indivisible, with liberty and justice

[7:04] for all.

[7:13] » All right. Thank you. Um,

[7:16] so we're going to go ahead and move into

[7:19] public comment. Um, this is a section

[7:23] for public comment on anything unrelated

[7:25] to any of the action items to the um,

[7:29] agenda today. So, we'll go ahead and

[7:32] open the mic for public comment.

[7:43] Okay. All right, we're going to go ahead

[7:45] and close the public comment and we'll

[7:50] move straight into the um action items.

[7:54] So, consent agenda from February 12th,

[7:58] 2026 minutes. Um are there any comments?

[8:02] >> I do not have any. No.

[8:04] >> Okay. Neither did I. Um okay.

[8:09] So, we need to make a motion. I'll move

[8:11] to approve the consent agenda for

[8:13] February 12th, 2026. Minutes as

[8:16] presented.

[8:18] >> Second.

[8:19] >> A second.

[8:21] >> Okay.

[8:23] >> And

[8:24] >> roll call or no?

[8:25] >> Oh, do we need to do a roll call for

[8:27] that?

[8:29] >> Yeah.

[8:35] » Oh, Peter.

[8:36] >> Yes.

[8:37] >> I guess that's how I meant by roll call,

[8:38] but go ahead.

[8:40] Okay.

[8:41] >> Okay. All right. Let's go ahead and uh

[8:44] open up the public hearing for the PO

[8:47] bands reszone.

[8:50] >> Um absolutely. Lance, take it away.

[8:54] >> This is a request.

[9:02] The public went out for RM which is

[9:04] actually a higher density.

[9:06] >> Yes.

[9:06] >> Uh and so that was my mistake. Uh but

[9:10] it's it is actually a lower density.

[9:13] We feel it's okay to go forward with the

[9:15] public hearing. Uh given that you were

[9:18] concerned with that, we show up and and

[9:20] this is even less of an impact. So we

[9:23] feel good about that, but we decide

[9:25] where we go from there.

[9:28] And then it's it's just it's a parcel

[9:30] that's agricultural, has been for a long

[9:32] time, has the old shops on it. Um the B

[9:37] will if it is reszone it will be

[9:39] subdivided

[9:40] concept plans for two lots the culdeac

[9:43] there will have to be put in off leester

[9:45] that'll be completed for the access with

[9:47] these two lots.

[9:49] >> Okay. And uh from what I understand it

[9:52] uh complies with the general plan

[10:01] » that is 2.8 eight acres per well

[10:05] >> one

[10:06] >> dwelling units per acre.

[10:08] >> Okay.

[10:08] >> This is 1.45.

[10:11] >> Okay.

[10:12] >> It's actually considerably

[10:15] >> Okay.

[10:18] All right.

[10:21] >> Perfect. Thank you. Um and and with

[10:24] that, um I'll go ahead and open up the

[10:27] public hearing for Buban's reason.

[10:33] And

[10:35] okay, we'll go ahead and I guess just

[10:39] making sure that everybody's had a

[10:41] chance to

[10:44] making sure

[10:46] >> to open public hearing.

[10:47] >> Oh, this one we have to make a motion.

[10:49] That's right.

[10:50] >> I'll make a motion to open public

[10:52] hearing for PON resone.

[10:55] >> I'll second that motion.

[10:58] Okay.

[11:00] All in favor?

[11:01] >> Yes.

[11:10] Are there any public comments?

[11:14] All right. Looking good. Um and then

[11:17] need a motion to close. Yeah.

[11:21] >> Motion to close.

[11:23] public hearing for Pman

[11:26] zone.

[11:28] >> I'll second that. motion. Um,

[11:31] >> yeah. Vote.

[11:32] >> Yes.

[11:35] Okay. Um,

[11:38] at this point,

[11:40] we'll have discussion.

[11:41] >> Yeah. Do we need to hear from the

[11:43] developer provance? We have any

[11:45] questions or

[11:46] >> I mean, it's always good to hear from

[11:47] the applicant.

[11:50] >> I stand up there.

[11:51] >> You do.

[11:51] >> Yes.

[11:52] Please. For those good,

[11:55] >> those tuning in

[11:56] >> and say your name and where you're from.

[11:58] >> Yeah. My name is John Pobansz. I I'm

[12:00] actually a resident of Washington

[12:01] Terrace right above the top of the toll

[12:03] road, but I practiced orthodontics in

[12:06] this general community for 28 years. Uh

[12:10] fact, I know him from the office right

[12:12] there.

[12:14] and uh just really enjoyed um serving

[12:17] the families of South Weieber and I I

[12:20] love to drive my VW van in the parade

[12:23] every year and it's a great community

[12:26] that I live adjacent to and when this

[12:28] property came available um I was really

[12:31] excited about the fact that that

[12:33] building could be turned into something

[12:36] uh more aesthetic and more useful. We've

[12:38] already uh repaired the vandalized

[12:41] windows. Uh we have plans to eventually

[12:45] uh improve the exterior appearance of

[12:47] that building and and use it for um

[12:50] internal storage and hobby space for me

[12:53] and probably gardening around it. I

[12:55] really plan to have that second parcel

[12:57] just be my own space. Um we also um you

[13:02] know had some dilapidated um sheds that

[13:05] we just kind of pulled down because they

[13:07] were kind of unsightly and maybe um

[13:09] traps for whatever could grow in there.

[13:13] And so that's been a positive. And then

[13:15] the adjacent property plan is my my

[13:17] daughter um Jane Gurr is married to my

[13:21] son-in-law uh Skyler Gurr right there uh

[13:24] owner of Gur Construction. uh he's a

[13:26] energetic, ambitious young construction

[13:29] company owner and does a lot of

[13:31] commercial and residential pro projects

[13:33] along the Wasatch front. So, our hope is

[13:36] that they can build a a single family

[13:38] home on that second adjacent property

[13:40] where my grandkids will be. And uh we

[13:44] view that as a wonderful thing for our

[13:46] family, not just now, but in the long

[13:48] term future for them to contribute to

[13:50] that community, uh have their kids walk

[13:52] down the the sidewalk to the elementary

[13:55] school, and just think it'll be a great

[13:58] addition to what's already a fantastic

[14:00] um subdivision.

[14:02] >> All right. Fantastic.

[14:04] >> Thank you. Yeah, I know.

[14:06] >> Thank you.

[14:11] » I actually do not have anything

[14:13] questions for the reason. I don't have

[14:14] any questions. So,

[14:15] >> okay.

[14:18] » As well, um I think the information was

[14:20] laid out uh pretty plainly in the

[14:23] packet. Um thank you to the city staff

[14:27] um for getting that put together. Um

[14:30] we have a motion.

[14:33] I'll move to recommend the approval to

[14:35] the city council of the PON reszone

[14:37] request at approximately 1121 East

[14:40] Lester Street, a zone change from

[14:42] agricultural to residential low on 1.5

[14:45] acres.

[14:48] And I'll second that motion. Roll call.

[14:52] >> Yes.

[14:55] >> Um,

[14:58] next up is the annual training. Um,

[15:04] » thank you.

[15:05] John.

[15:16] » Jamie will not be presenting this

[15:18] tonight. We're just going to go over

[15:19] some slides he's previously provided to

[15:22] us. I believe Lance is just going to

[15:24] touch on these top. If you have any

[15:26] questions throughout, let us know.

[15:28] Okay,

[15:29] >> really quickly we start with the last

[15:30] slide. So sweet.

[15:33] >> Yeah, you record she's eager.

[15:44] » I can help myself.

[15:46] >> Yeah. So, and I think um you guys have

[15:50] had the training. This is kind of new

[15:52] for Brad, but just this is going to walk

[15:54] through kind of how the meeting should

[15:56] run a little bit. uh the types of

[15:58] decisions we make um you know how the

[16:01] code generally functions. I'm gonna say

[16:03] just really brief stuff and then any

[16:06] questions you have about it please ask

[16:08] um and we just need to make sure

[16:11] everybody's kind of on the same page and

[16:12] knows what's going on.

[16:14] >> We'll also send you slides out.

[16:17] >> Thank you.

[16:20] >> And I think Brad's actually watched some

[16:21] videos already. So

[16:24] >> good.

[16:25] >> Yeah. I think and we we operate with

[16:27] pretty informal rules but it is

[16:30] parliamentary rules keep it very simple

[16:32] straightforward and and the big part

[16:34] about having uh there's a lot to be said

[16:37] about having very consistent meetings

[16:38] that we do the same patterns so that if

[16:41] it's a simple one like tonight fine but

[16:44] if it's a complex one we need to make

[16:46] sure we're doing the same thing every

[16:47] time so that it's really clear and you

[16:50] know when we get to a complex one it's

[16:52] really easy for people to say well you didn't do that for so and so last

[16:56] meeting. So that's why it's kind of we

[16:58] get a little bit particular about

[17:00] brief introduction by staff, open and

[17:02] close the public hearing, take, you

[17:05] know, and and respond to those comments.

[17:06] So that's part of it. Um I think

[17:11] the the parliamentary rules, I'm sure

[17:12] you guys all know this, but I mean it's

[17:14] just to keep it clear and and really

[17:16] clear about clear and consistent and and

[17:19] then also just what what is being

[17:21] approved. So when we make a motion it,

[17:24] you know, it's to approve. Um, you know,

[17:26] the quick trip is a good example of one

[17:28] that was complex and we kind of worked

[17:30] on conditions during the or you guys

[17:32] worked on conditions during the meeting.

[17:34] >> Thanks for starting me off on that.

[17:36] >> Yeah,

[17:37] >> Ben, here you go.

[17:39] >> And uh so that is uh I mean that's what

[17:43] these are about. And so it's, you know,

[17:45] you make a motion, you state the

[17:47] conditions of approval, it gets a

[17:48] second. Now, any discussion on what we

[17:51] have on the table that we're discussing.

[17:53] >> I think would it be would it be accurate

[17:55] to say that this the parliamentary order

[17:59] really helps not in the heat of the

[18:01] moment as much as

[18:04] for for history, right? Future, right?

[18:08] when you when you refer back to

[18:10] it, you know,

[18:12] it was done right.

[18:14] >> Yeah. And it and it's it should be

[18:16] really clear. U you know, I made this

[18:19] motion to approve with these conditions.

[18:22] You know, Chris or you or Brad says,

[18:24] "Hey, well, I want to add something to

[18:26] that." Okay, they'll take your friendly

[18:28] amendment. Now, we we've modified the

[18:31] motion and it's really clear. And then

[18:32] we vote on that motion. Um the roll call

[18:36] vote is for uh ordinances and

[18:39] resolutions which is the reason and that

[18:41] type of thing but the date the smaller

[18:44] stuff you know meeting ajourn all that

[18:46] kind of stuff can just be a up or down

[18:47] vote um I don't know you have any

[18:50] questions about that I mean obviously

[18:52] there's whole books on parliamentary

[18:54] procedure and all that but we try and

[18:56] keep it simple but we also need to be

[18:57] clear

[18:58] >> what and can you clarify on like the

[19:00] general consent on number four what is

[19:02] uh

[19:06] may raise general consent chart.

[19:08] >> Yeah. No, that's exactly I mean the

[19:09] consent agenda is is where we use that

[19:11] on the minutes things like that where

[19:13] it's just

[19:14] >> you know does anybody have any questions

[19:16] on the minutes?

[19:17] >> No questions. Can I have a motion?

[19:19] >> Move to approve the minutes. All in

[19:21] favor? I. You're done.

[19:23] >> Okay. Perfect.

[19:23] >> So that's that at least that's how I

[19:25] read that is it's just it's

[19:27] >> Yeah, we're really clear on it.

[19:28] >> Okay. um the reasons the the more

[19:31] complex ones obviously get a little

[19:32] trickier but it's a similar pattern of

[19:35] do I have a motion

[19:37] >> and then you need to have the motion

[19:39] clear get a second

[19:41] >> now we're going to discuss

[19:43] >> so and

[19:44] >> oh so even after the second you want to

[19:46] discuss

[19:47] >> you don't have to okay but that would be

[19:49] the place to discuss

[19:50] >> after we have a motion on the table and

[19:53] I'm

[19:55] >> this is I don't want to go too far but

[19:57] that would be the idea deal way is we

[19:59] have a clear motion that we're

[20:00] discussing

[20:02] and and that's on the record. Uh now

[20:05] let's talk about it.

[20:06] >> Okay.

[20:07] >> Do we want to amend it? Do you want to

[20:09] withdraw it and make a different motion?

[20:11] That's what the parliamentary procedures

[20:13] will help us just keep get really clear

[20:15] what we're discussing.

[20:16] >> Um and if it's outside of that

[20:21] just it's it adds confusion to the

[20:23] minutes to the record but also for the

[20:26] that evening. So, I think we get there.

[20:28] It's a good conversation and all that,

[20:30] but it helps to at least to a degree.

[20:34] Um, you know, like in tonight, we have

[20:37] to have three people for a quorum. Um,

[20:40] and

[20:42] you know, but we don't need to have, you

[20:45] know, the majority rules. It doesn't

[20:47] mean there's five people on the planning

[20:49] commission and so three people have to

[20:51] vote in favor of something because

[20:52] there's no, it's the number of people

[20:54] here. the majority here is who votes. Um

[20:58] anyway,

[21:01] >> so so really quick, um and I I just want

[21:04] to make sure I understood that correctly

[21:05] regarding the motion uh comments that

[21:08] you made. Um when we typically uh

[21:12] discuss an agenda item, um we'll uh

[21:18] we'll talk about it and then make a

[21:20] motion.

[21:22] >> That's fine. to approve or to table or

[21:24] to

[21:26] >> do any one of these actions,

[21:28] >> right?

[21:28] >> Um, so

[21:31] did I misunderstand when you're saying

[21:34] that you should make a motion to

[21:36] discuss?

[21:36] >> No, let me let me back up and just say

[21:38] so I mean

[21:40] >> it's public hearing.

[21:42] >> Yep.

[21:42] >> Uh applicant gets a chance to speak.

[21:45] >> Yep.

[21:45] >> Uh questions, clarifications, then you

[21:48] guys discuss,

[21:49] >> right?

[21:50] Then somebody makes a motion one way or

[21:52] the other. The time of that discussion

[21:54] is when you're, you know, you're hashing

[21:56] out what conditions do you feel like

[21:58] you're kind of getting a feel for

[22:00] >> important issues. Yep.

[22:01] >> Then someone takes the the stab at, all

[22:03] right, I'm going to make a motion to do

[22:04] something

[22:06] >> with these elements.

[22:07] >> Okay.

[22:08] >> Once that's on the table, we're only

[22:10] discussing that,

[22:10] >> right?

[22:11] >> So it sets that other stuff kind of

[22:12] aside and it's just a way to make it

[22:14] one, two, three clear.

[22:16] >> Just a very focused name. You got you're

[22:18] discussing the project then you're

[22:19] discussing the motion.

[22:20] >> Gotcha.

[22:22] I understand.

[22:23] >> And that way yeah that motion's made

[22:26] like

[22:28] >> we'll sometimes

[22:31] uh have a quick discussion on exceptions

[22:34] or

[22:36] >> Yeah.

[22:36] >> conditions or whatever.

[22:38] >> Yeah.

[22:38] >> And that's what you're talking about.

[22:39] >> Yeah. I mean you're going to certainly

[22:40] deliberate and go through that.

[22:42] >> Right. Uh the other thing I'd say about

[22:43] motions

[22:46] these are the motion types. Um

[22:49] but uh is that just going to see uh oh

[22:54] make them based on facts you know um

[22:57] move to approve uh you know it meets the

[23:00] staff report the conditions in the staff

[23:02] report these facts uh what we heard

[23:04] tonight at public basis for your your

[23:07] motion is is always good to have should

[23:09] we have problems done

[23:11] >> so right

[23:12] >> I mean we generally don't have problems

[23:14] so we get a little loose but that's why

[23:17] it's there is if if there is a

[23:18] controversial issue, we we know how to

[23:20] handle it and we've got that process.

[23:23] >> Absolutely.

[23:27] » Yeah. Let's see. Well, okay. Every

[23:29] motion has six steps. Move, second,

[23:32] restate the motion. Whoops.

[23:35] Uh

[23:37] discuss, then vote, then announce. So,

[23:42] and again that's like we were just

[23:43] saying it's to keep everything clear and

[23:45] we know what's

[23:45] >> So the first one that says the hands

[23:47] like does a chair person doesn't have to

[23:49] give the motion.

[23:50] >> No.

[23:51] >> Okay.

[23:52] >> Member raises raises hand to say hey I'm

[23:55] ready to open

[23:57] >> and you guys don't necessarily raise

[23:58] hands. You would

[23:59] >> Yeah. You guys just say I'm ready to do

[24:01] it. But that's I mean this we don't want

[24:04] to get terribly formal but it's just

[24:06] good to be clear

[24:08] >> and restating the motion is a good step

[24:10] in there because it's okay this is what

[24:12] you said we often refer to Michelle tell

[24:16] it that all right this is what I heard

[24:17] the conditions were

[24:20] >> the basis the reasonings

[24:22] >> yeah

[24:26] there's the roll call votes

[24:29] like we

[24:32] And this is where it kind of crosses the

[24:33] line. It's like, well, point of order,

[24:36] you know, I don't think we're doing

[24:38] these motions, right? If somebody's

[24:41] made a motion and it's on the table and

[24:43] then we start discussing

[24:45] things outside of that, that's when you

[24:47] would say, a point of order, we have a

[24:49] motion on the table. What are we doing

[24:50] with it? And if we don't want it, let's

[24:52] vote it up or down and then discuss more

[24:54] if we need to discuss more. You know,

[24:56] that again, just to keep it organized.

[24:58] Um, you know, point of information is

[25:00] just to ask a question. Well, no,

[25:02] apparently it's additional information.

[25:05] Point of inquiry is to ask a question

[25:08] and then privilege is, hey, I can't sit

[25:11] here anymore. It's making me sick. I got

[25:12] to leave. So, anyway, um, I mean, we

[25:15] really don't use these very often, but

[25:18] technically that would be the formal way

[25:19] to do it.

[25:22] Um,

[25:23] >> the writing.

[25:25] >> I know. Let me see.

[25:29] Um and I think you know we we do we just

[25:32] did public hearing. I think we followed

[25:34] this right. Let's see if we did. Uh yes

[25:36] the residents all have right to be

[25:38] heard. They had that opportunity. Uh

[25:41] members of the public body are not

[25:42] required to respond to questions or

[25:44] comments. That is an area that can lead

[25:46] a lot of commissions and committees and

[25:48] councils into trouble is you want to

[25:51] answer their questions. you know, the

[25:53] public's here and um it's like, you

[25:56] know, maybe they're just

[25:57] misunderstanding something. I I go crazy

[25:59] over here. It's like, oh, come talk to

[26:00] me at another time because I can help

[26:02] you understand why we're doing what

[26:04] we're doing and, you know, where our

[26:05] hands are tied or what not. But in the

[26:07] meeting to keep it clear, we're just

[26:09] taking that information and then we will

[26:11] respond all at once and it's just to

[26:13] keep an orderly meeting,

[26:14] >> right? Um

[26:16] obviously public

[26:17] >> and usually during the larger groups

[26:20] we'll reiterate that to everybody. Yeah.

[26:23] Just to kind of help maintain

[26:25] everybody's expectations.

[26:26] >> Yes. Yeah.

[26:28] >> Um

[26:30] yeah, as we saw, do we open and close

[26:32] with motion? Um

[26:35] yes, we said that the applicant gets a

[26:37] right to respond after the public

[26:39] hearing. Uh I have had a lot of concerns

[26:41] and this is where you guys deliberate is

[26:44] um over the years public will get up and

[26:47] say a bunch of stuff uh their concerns

[26:50] and expressions and then the the

[26:52] applicant will get up.

[26:55] How can I play this? Some applicants

[26:57] have been known to stretch the truth at

[26:59] that time and you guys are still just

[27:03] because an applicant says something

[27:05] you're there to deliberate is you know

[27:07] and weigh it.

[27:08] >> Yeah. And so, you know, if they're just

[27:10] flat out contradicting and you know, one

[27:13] way or the other, you know, you've got

[27:15] to weigh those what you get. Sometimes

[27:17] this is just very helpful clarification.

[27:19] Sometimes it's it can be abused, but

[27:22] anyway, the applicant gets to respond.

[27:25] Um, of course, if we have a lot of

[27:27] people here, you're going to want to

[27:29] shorten, hey, everybody's got three

[27:30] minutes and and it's kind of to again

[27:32] keep the meeting moving and orderly.

[27:34] You're going to have some people that,

[27:35] you know, just will take up 15, 20

[27:37] minutes talking and they have a lot to

[27:39] say. We appreciate that, but we need to run a meeting. Uh the time for, you

[27:44] know, if they have a lot of concerns,

[27:46] they can come talk to staff. They can u

[27:49] you know, discuss it at other times, but

[27:51] in the meeting, we've got to be

[27:52] respectful of everybody in the room. Uh,

[28:01] no member of the public shall be

[28:02] recognized until by the church, you

[28:04] know, shall be heard until recognized by

[28:06] the chair. I think when you've invited

[28:07] them up and they come up, that's good.

[28:10] >> You don't need to state their address,

[28:12] just their city.

[28:14] >> Can I ask questions? Yes,

[28:16] >> it's probably going to be going probably

[28:18] going to go over it, but um being that

[28:21] we are in a small town seeing a lot of

[28:24] people, what are our rules and stuff as

[28:27] far as people calling us outside of the

[28:29] meeting?

[28:30] >> Okay, we are going to get to ethics

[28:31] later, but just to answer the question,

[28:33] I mean, you can have uh interactions and

[28:37] discussions

[28:38] um one-on-one.

[28:41] >> You're not supposed to talk to the

[28:42] council members, the other commission

[28:44] members.

[28:45] um about topics. You're just taking

[28:48] information. There's nothing wrong with

[28:49] that.

[28:52] Can't take money though. There's

[28:55] >> um I'm trying to think

[28:57] >> we've had I've like where

[29:00] >> there's incidents where like a person

[29:02] gave me a lot of information. Yeah.

[29:04] >> And I told them put in public comment so

[29:06] that we all have the same information. I

[29:08] don't want to be like

[29:09] >> the same.

[29:09] >> Yeah. I would always recommend they go

[29:11] to our city website

[29:13] >> and say please post your

[29:17] >> That's what I would say.

[29:19] >> Yeah. Put it on the public record.

[29:21] >> It's on public.

[29:22] >> Yep.

[29:22] >> Yeah. That first one is

[29:26] >> Yeah. Yeah.

[29:28] >> So you can Yeah.

[29:30] >> All right.

[29:31] >> Yeah. It's good to have good boundaries

[29:33] about that stuff because it can be

[29:35] abused. But

[29:37] >> now, can he bring that information up as

[29:40] long as he's

[29:41] >> That's a question I have.

[29:43] >> While we're in the meeting, can he bring

[29:44] that information?

[29:45] >> Yeah, he say I have a a phone call or I

[29:48] did a site visit

[29:49] >> res reach out to me. I've heard him say

[29:51] that.

[29:52] >> So, as long as it's within the meeting,

[29:54] >> but I don't have to disclose who it was.

[29:57] >> Um,

[29:58] >> I just I don't know the answer to that.

[30:00] Yeah, if you have to like Yeah.

[30:02] >> What would you say risk?

[30:04] >> I would say unless you feel like it's

[30:07] specifically

[30:08] needed,

[30:09] >> right? Yeah. And and I was just going

[30:12] there in my head too is is that when

[30:14] we're making decisions, we need to

[30:17] evaluate kind of like what Lance said

[30:19] earlier in the training. We need to

[30:21] evaluate factual information.

[30:24] that is allowable to be, you

[30:27] know, you know, of record to for

[30:30] consideration because there are

[30:32] sometimes when we do receive information

[30:35] uh that is is not allowable to the

[30:37] record that that may be you know uh

[30:41] erroneous or or or somewhat

[30:45] uh you know controvertible.

[30:48] >> Yeah. Um, you know, we are making

[30:51] decisions on uh on on code and fact, not

[30:54] on public outcry.

[30:56] >> Correct.

[30:59] >> Legal terms. Public clamor.

[31:01] >> Public clamor. Thank you.

[31:03] >> Outcry is actually more accurate. That's

[31:06] what outcry. Oh yeah, I know what that

[31:09] is. But yeah. Um,

[31:11] >> sorry, I got us off topic.

[31:14] Oh no, that's what we're do. That's

[31:15] great. all in formation

[31:20] comments. To matter of fact,

[31:22] you're only going to be able to go so

[31:23] long on that. Um, it will happen that,

[31:26] you know, sometimes there are people

[31:28] that make statements and whatnot. Um,

[31:32] I'm taking back at Cooper's Landing. I

[31:34] think someone asked me and I shouldn't

[31:36] have responded, but like they they asked

[31:39] me and said, "Well, would you want to

[31:40] live here?" You recommend. Would you

[31:41] want to live here? I was like, you know,

[31:45] Yeah. I'm a city planner. I don't care

[31:47] about density. But anyway, you know, uh

[31:50] should have just kept quiet on that and

[31:52] said, but it's it feels awkward. It's

[31:54] like I want to resolve the issue and

[31:56] concern. So,

[31:57] >> yeah, that's a great example of

[31:58] something that should not be, you know,

[31:59] considered on the record.

[32:01] >> And so, and

[32:02] >> yeah, and it's really and and multiple,

[32:05] you know, they want to get up and debate

[32:06] and all that and that's why we do the

[32:08] three minutes one time. You know, if

[32:10] there's information that you're

[32:12] gathering, that's okay. But to just take

[32:14] general more testimony after you've

[32:16] closed the public hearing is really it

[32:19] just makes everything so much harder.

[32:22] Right. So um and you guys are lucky sort

[32:27] of you can say take it to the city

[32:30] council. I love we we are done here

[32:34] but you guys could you know

[32:36] >> well and that's the biggest thing is

[32:38] we're going after facts like you said

[32:39] and what code is I can't decide if I

[32:41] don't like it it doesn't matter you know

[32:43] like

[32:43] >> right that's not our job

[32:44] >> that's not our job that's

[32:47] >> I think that was probably one of the

[32:49] hardest lessons to

[32:51] really incorporate is that my opinion

[32:54] when I was commission like 98% of the

[32:59] time was irrelevant doesn't

[33:01] >> because I'm not legally allowed to sort

[33:04] of the situation,

[33:06] >> right? And I think that's a

[33:07] misunderstanding a lot too.

[33:10] >> And that's why you see a lot of love and

[33:12] get angry that you're making a certain

[33:14] decision. It's like, but your hands are

[33:16] tied.

[33:17] So my recommendation is anytime there's

[33:19] a really hot topic to somehow insert

[33:22] that into your dialogue of why you're

[33:24] building

[33:26] and that might help alleviate some

[33:28] stress on you because you guys are bound

[33:31] by the code is the rules and so long as

[33:34] it meets code then there's not a lot you

[33:36] can do unless something goes down the

[33:38] path of a uh developers agreement or

[33:42] something like that and even then the

[33:44] majority will come to the council for

[33:46] approval.

[33:47] >> Final approval. Yeah.

[33:49] >> So,

[33:49] >> yeah. I want to start each one with we

[33:52] are looking at you know, you know, the

[33:54] code and the stuff that's it, you know.

[33:57] >> Yeah.

[33:58] >> Like if this meeting is like a one

[34:00] sentence that describes what the

[34:01] planning commission is, you know.

[34:04] >> Is that the agenda? something just to

[34:06] like we're only looking at does this

[34:08] meet

[34:11] » say hey as a reminder

[34:14] commission

[34:16] um I don't know how you

[34:19] >> their role is specifically to evaluate

[34:22] this application and its adherence to

[34:24] the code

[34:25] >> right

[34:28] >> help alleviate some of the out

[34:34] » I I would recommend that

[34:38] >> I guess you're right.

[34:40] >> Just make sure

[34:42] >> not misstating.

[34:44] >> Yeah.

[34:45] >> One more thought I have on this is is it

[34:47] al I've seen it been very helpful that

[34:50] you can say I heard this concern and

[34:53] that I mean letting them know that you

[34:55] know it's not falling on deaf ears.

[34:57] We're not ignoring it. We we appreciate

[34:59] the thought and concerns you have. uh

[35:02] here but here's where the code says I

[35:04] can look at you know

[35:08] it's a balance but

[35:09] >> right

[35:10] >> it's sometimes very helpful to say I

[35:12] heard these concerns

[35:13] >> yeah mediate the response a little bit a

[35:16] little bit of empathy

[35:18] >> yeah

[35:20] uh state law is the land use development

[35:23] management act

[35:25] section 10 for in the state code for

[35:27] cities municipalities

[35:29] um yeah our This is I don't know this is

[35:34] planning

[35:35] land use code 101 but it's the authority

[35:38] to operate and do land use issues comes

[35:41] from the state. It's granted by the

[35:43] state. Um uh we have so we have that

[35:47] direction and then we have personal

[35:48] property rights. It's often referred to

[35:50] as a bundle of rights, you know, to to

[35:53] use your land as you want and you're not

[35:54] harming others. Um

[35:57] so that's the state code. Our code

[36:00] complies with state code should it's

[36:02] just a little more refined. Uh some

[36:04] areas the state lets us make the

[36:06] decisions and calls just has to be

[36:08] within certain parameters and we have

[36:09] that. I think um you know I'm I've only

[36:13] been here a couple years but when I got

[36:14] here I was like we have a good code at

[36:16] Southwaver. I've been in commun I'm like

[36:18] this is bad. So we have a good code. You

[36:21] guys have done a lot of good work before

[36:23] I got here. So they stay on top of it

[36:26] really good. So it's a good team that's

[36:28] done that. So, I think we're pretty good

[36:30] on the code and and it's clear and

[36:33] compliant. Um,

[36:36] yeah, this is, you know, it allows us

[36:39] to, you know, create the plan

[36:40] commission, do a general plan. We're

[36:42] required to have a general plan and

[36:44] certain elements in it. Um,

[36:47] let's see what else.

[36:50] Yeah, you know, what property rights are

[36:52] there, what we may regulate. Uh, you

[36:55] know, the regulations are binding. We

[36:57] talked about that. Um,

[37:01] yeah. And and having an ordinance is

[37:03] plain and straightforward. That's we try

[37:05] to make that happen. Uh, if we're not

[37:08] clear in our code,

[37:10] uh, we have the responsibility to clear

[37:12] and if it's if we're too vague, then the then it goes it's a gray area

[37:18] that we didn't address. It tends to go

[37:19] in favor of the applicant,

[37:21] >> right? So that's something to keep in

[37:23] mind is you kind of if it's a tie we're

[37:27] responsible to have the code clear so it

[37:29] goes to the benefit of that.

[37:33] Um yeah so we have well let's we've got

[37:38] kind of the legislative land use

[37:40] authority and appeal authority. These

[37:42] are the executive uh the legislative and

[37:46] the judicial part of this the three

[37:48] parts of the government. Right? So the

[37:50] legislative body is the city council.

[37:52] You guys make recommendations on the

[37:54] city code. They adopt it. That's a

[37:56] legislative action. Reszones are

[37:58] legislative actions. General plans are

[38:00] legislative actions. So that's public

[38:02] hearings. Public can weigh in with

[38:03] opinions. Uh you know just general

[38:06] preferences, that type of thing. And

[38:07] you're going to weigh that based on your

[38:09] decisions. Uh then you're going to adopt

[38:12] the code. And this is where we have our

[38:14] biggest problem.

[38:16] the state in the last few years has made

[38:17] a great effort to

[38:20] control our meanings a little bit and because when some when something's

[38:25] in the code and we've talked about it

[38:27] already that we have to follow the code

[38:30] it's not time to say well that's not

[38:31] wrong we shouldn't you know we should

[38:34] have a different traffic count standard

[38:37] you know no it's in the code now so the time to correct things is at the in

[38:42] the creating the law itself and

[38:44] hopefully once we get those standards

[38:46] were just most of our actions at the

[38:47] planning commission are do we meet these

[38:49] standards and there is some variation of

[38:52] opinion there but not it's pretty clear

[38:55] uh and then we also have an appeal

[38:57] authority we just use that uh last year

[39:00] for the first time my first time here in

[39:01] a couple years doesn't happen very often

[39:04] variances yeah I want to vary from the

[39:07] code because I have unique circumstances

[39:10] and there's five specific criteria in

[39:12] state code the one that kills a lot of

[39:14] variances is it's um it can't be an

[39:16] economic hardship. So, it's like, well,

[39:19] if I can get one more lot, I can make a

[39:20] hundred more thousand dollars. Uh yeah,

[39:23] we're not going to break the rules so

[39:24] you can make more money. So, that's that

[39:27] kills a lot of those requests. Um but,

[39:29] you know, I I actually sit on the Ogden

[39:32] City U board of adjustment and you know,

[39:36] we had one that's like, "Yeah, you're trying to put a development on

[39:39] this really weird sloped lot and it'd be

[39:43] good development." So, you know, be

[39:44] granted the variance. So, it there's

[39:46] criteria there, but um if there's a

[39:48] hardship or they're not getting to use

[39:50] it the way others would that all the

[39:53] legislative the the appeal body stuff

[39:56] goes to an outside attorney for South

[39:58] Weieber. So, we bring in an outside

[39:59] attorney to hear that

[40:02] the application and then staff responds

[40:04] with this is what we think the code says

[40:06] and then they make a final

[40:08] determination.

[40:10] Um, yeah. So, legislative bodies, the

[40:13] city council.

[40:15] >> Yeah, I think that's we kind of cover

[40:17] all those

[40:19] plain language again talking about that.

[40:23] Um,

[40:24] and then the bill. I think we covered

[40:26] those. Pretty good. Any questions on

[40:28] that?

[40:31] Again, this is another slide talking

[40:32] about the legislative administrative.

[40:35] Uh so conditional use permit is

[40:37] administrative, subdivisions

[40:39] administrative.

[40:41] You know what does the code say? Do they

[40:43] meet the code? We've already set up the

[40:45] standards with the leg the legislative

[40:48] act created the standards. Now do they?

[40:50] So the legislative is where people can

[40:54] uh have the public hearing. The

[40:55] administrative is you're reviewing that.

[40:58] Um yeah

[41:02] some hearing requirements.

[41:03] >> Can we go back to that? Yes.

[41:05] >> Slide the Yeah.

[41:10] » Yeah, that's a good slide. So, zoning

[41:12] ordinance, general plan, reszones,

[41:14] annexation, legislative

[41:18] condition, use site plan, development

[41:20] agreements. Development agreements

[41:22] actually there's kind of two types of

[41:24] development agreements. One is uh can be

[41:28] used to change the zoning. So that would

[41:30] be a legislative.

[41:33] South Gateway is, you know, under

[41:37] construction right now. They went

[41:38] through a development agreement. They

[41:40] changed zoning rights for that property

[41:43] and got into they're allowed to with a

[41:46] development agreement go different than

[41:48] just straight out of the city code and

[41:50] it allows for nuances, but that's a

[41:52] legislative act. This is a development

[41:54] agreement which is now we've adopted

[41:56] that development agreement. as that

[41:57] subdivisions well they went in and they

[42:00] came in previously did they meet the

[42:02] subdivision code and the development

[42:06] any more question on that?

[42:07] >> So um the appeal authority in in our

[42:11] little town where we don't have a board

[42:13] of adjustments

[42:14] um who handles that?

[42:16] >> We get an outside attorney.

[42:18] >> So just the attorney that's it.

[42:20] >> Yep.

[42:21] >> Okay. So we're not a part of that at

[42:22] all.

[42:23] >> We're our adopted code.

[42:24] >> Yep.

[42:24] >> Okay. Sweet. It's good enough.

[42:27] >> I didn't know if like that was a tag

[42:29] team sort of thing or not.

[42:32] >> Okay. Um and then um

[42:37] >> just that goes back to you're executive

[42:40] you're does this meet the code? That's

[42:43] judicial which is a little more

[42:47] >> agree for

[42:49] both. Yeah.

[42:52] >> Okay. Cool.

[42:55] Yeah, I'm good. Thanks.

[43:01] » And there's again the we we've got to

[43:03] have public hearings on those

[43:05] legislative items. The other items we we circumvent it by taking all the

[43:11] public comment during the public comment

[43:13] section. Um

[43:16] Utah's a little unique in in the states

[43:18] I've worked in, but in that they really

[43:20] separate those two things. But anyway,

[43:22] it's that's how Utah does it is this is

[43:24] legislative public hearings. This is

[43:27] administrative and so there's

[43:28] technically no specific discussion, but

[43:31] everybody comes to the open meeting and

[43:33] is able to put in their concerns. They

[43:36] could also write and put it in, you

[43:38] know, send it in before the meeting and

[43:39] that almost gets better attention

[43:41] sometimes,

[43:42] >> right? It's a give and take.

[43:54] Oh, here you go. So, chance meeting any

[43:57] social gathering.

[43:59] You guys are off the hook. Do not

[44:01] conduct city business.

[44:05] I don't know why he's got the criminal

[44:06] penalty.

[44:08] >> This is scarce.

[44:10] >> Um, yeah. And this has been from another

[44:12] community I've had where the text

[44:14] messages go around between the planning

[44:16] commission and it's like guys that's the

[44:19] same as talking. You know, you'll have a

[44:21] group text and if it's who's making it

[44:23] to the meeting tonight, fine. You're not

[44:26] discussing business. How are you voting

[44:28] on the reszone tonight is a problem.

[44:30] >> That's worse than writing.

[44:34] >> It's got a time date stamp.

[44:36] >> But oneonone you can

[44:39] technically correct. Yeah.

[44:40] >> Yeah.

[44:41] >> Once there's

[44:42] >> I can text you and then and text, you

[44:43] know.

[44:44] >> Yeah. Exactly. And and really the way

[44:46] communication should happen between the

[44:49] whole group is that it should come from

[44:51] staff,

[44:52] >> you know, hey, the chair says, hey,

[44:53] we're going to cancel meeting tonight.

[44:55] Staff does that. So, it's always coming

[44:57] from staff to the group. It's and and

[44:59] that that that is a lot of the ethics

[45:02] and and stuff like that is just it's a

[45:04] it's not even close to the line. So,

[45:07] we're okay.

[45:09] You know, maybe that group text is okay,

[45:11] but you know,

[45:13] >> it's real easy for it to slide off and

[45:15] not be okay.

[45:16] >> Fine.

[45:17] Yep. Exactly.

[45:19] >> Yeah. I've gotten text messages from

[45:21] people in my community or in my part of

[45:24] the city and and a lot of times if

[45:26] they're, you know, re because in in

[45:29] these in these circumstances, they'll,

[45:32] you know, like mention, hey, I hope

[45:35] that, you know, this happens at the

[45:36] meeting tonight. And like

[45:39] you know unfortunately like well you

[45:41] know and I'll do a quick little you know

[45:43] primer saying

[45:45] the planning commission is a

[45:47] recommending body only

[45:49] >> you know and and it's we are responsible

[45:52] to the code.

[45:54] >> Um

[45:55] >> it's okay to educate and and to take the

[45:58] information. I think that's why

[46:01] >> make promises.

[46:02] >> Exactly.

[46:05] >> Yeah.

[46:05] It can go a long way.

[46:07] >> That is Tom.

[46:09] >> Yeah.

[46:14] >> So, I think this is the ethics training.

[46:18] >> I'm not sure what that has to do with

[46:20] presentation.

[46:21] >> Jamie knows the details of these slides.

[46:23] I have no idea.

[46:28] » So,

[46:30] >> this shows some examples.

[46:33] >> We've talked about that. We did see this

[46:36] by last year,

[46:37] >> but nothing's changed.

[46:44] » Yeah. So,

[46:47] >> so you need to know

[46:49] no, you know, can't use your office for

[46:51] personal benefit. Uh, no, no money for

[46:55] assistance of a transaction.

[46:57] Business regulated by the city. Business

[46:59] doing business with the city.

[47:04] So, I think these are the six elements

[47:08] that he's talking about or where there's

[47:10] a potential conflict

[47:12] >> where you're crossing that line. You

[47:14] guys know this as well as I do. So,

[47:17] >> um yeah, no using it for personal

[47:19] benefit.

[47:23] Really hard not to go political, but

[47:26] it right there.

[47:31] Oh, Jeremy's back. Never mind. Um,

[47:36] let's see. Yeah, obviously personal

[47:42] I think. Yeah, I mean it's like it seems

[47:44] so simple. Uh, like obviously you're

[47:47] crossing a line, but man, when you get

[47:48] in those ethical scenarios, all of a

[47:50] sudden it gets really very fast. And so

[47:52] it's always okay to talk to staff. We al

[47:55] we talk to Jamie if there's something.

[47:58] I like that $50 is is up to $50 is okay.

[48:03] Uh that's been $50 for 20 years. So I

[48:07] don't know that needs to go up to the

[48:08] 500 or something.

[48:11] >> Yeah. I mean a $50 uh you know

[48:13] Burleyburg gift card doesn't go far.

[48:15] >> That'd be all right.

[48:16] >> But anyway,

[48:24] » yeah. And this appearance, right? That's

[48:28] just don't even come close.

[48:39] Yeah, I mean he's got probably whole

[48:41] stories to each one of these slides. I

[48:43] don't know them.

[48:43] >> Sorry. But watch out for those elements.

[48:50] So I think this is talking about if I

[48:53] mean we have the ethics statement at the

[48:55] beginning of the year but if someone I'm

[48:57] not sure if this is even saying it but

[49:00] if someone you know or have a financial

[49:02] relationship with comes in you recuse

[49:04] yourself

[49:06] uh and you step down and you can sit in

[49:09] the audience and listen but you're done

[49:10] talking on that topic.

[49:14] >> So yeah one of

[49:14] >> I have stories about that too. Yeah. One

[49:16] of the things that could be concerned,

[49:17] this is a small community and I we have

[49:19] friends that like I approve something

[49:22] for his father-in-law and then tomorrow

[49:24] I'm at his house hanging out, right? So,

[49:26] it's like could get a little gray.

[49:28] >> Again, I think a social relationship is

[49:30] one thing, it's financial. Okay, that's

[49:32] where you're crossing the line.

[49:35] >> And if and even if you state that in the

[49:38] meeting, I I know this person uh you

[49:40] know, they live down the block. I've

[49:42] known him for 10 years, but we have no

[49:44] financial

[49:45] >> relationship.

[49:48] That's the type of

[49:50] >> blew a Tacoma, you know, brand new car

[49:52] >> week before. Just because you're a good

[49:55] guy.

[49:56] >> Yeah.

[50:05] » Talk to Jamie and

[50:07] >> absolutely thumbs up or thumbs down and

[50:10] give you some good advice.

[50:13] But

[50:13] >> I I would definitely er on the side of

[50:15] transparency for sure.

[50:18] >> I was at a university town and the

[50:20] professor was on the planning commission

[50:22] and she said well I have a conflict

[50:23] because this is a I worked with the

[50:25] university but she stayed up on the disc

[50:28] and participated in the conversation. We

[50:29] were like um wait a minute that default

[50:33] but weighed in on every other aspect of

[50:35] it. It's like yeah that we're playing

[50:38] both sides of the fence there.

[50:39] >> Yeah it's kind of funny.

[50:42] and you know, professor of land use

[50:45] development. So, it's kind of funny.

[50:47] You would think that she knew she was

[50:50] doing anyway.

[50:52] >> Yeah. And we can throw you in jail.

[50:56] I don't know what else.

[50:58] >> I don't know. Somebody will. I do code

[50:59] enforcement. I'm start.

[51:03] » Oh, yeah. Brought that up.

[51:07] any general questions or anything about

[51:09] I mean how the meetings are running or

[51:12] >> I think we're pretty good about

[51:15] >> So is the rule up to us if a citizen

[51:19] wants to come back up and talk. I know

[51:21] that's been some you know heartburn.

[51:25] >> Yeah, let's talk about that for a

[51:26] second.

[51:28] >> And everybody can weigh in. I I my vote

[51:30] is that if they're coming up to say I I

[51:34] need to correct I I said it's a 100

[51:36] acres and it's actually 50 or 10 or so.

[51:38] If there's a factual correction, fine.

[51:41] >> Um I can't it was a few months ago we

[51:44] had a hearing where they came back and

[51:45] they were just doing more testimony.

[51:47] >> The quick stop whatever it was about the

[51:49] lights and stuff and an hour later he

[51:51] brought it up and wanted to get up and

[51:54] go on again.

[51:55] >> Yeah. the content that we were

[51:56] discussing kind of spurred some thoughts

[51:58] of somebody in the audience and they're

[52:01] just like, "Oh, I've got a lot of input

[52:03] on this." Well, because it's tough

[52:05] because they they hear the direction

[52:06] you're going like, "Oh, wait. I didn't

[52:08] communicate clearly. You don't

[52:09] understand. This is going to destroy my

[52:10] world."

[52:12] >> You know, and I appreciate that, but

[52:14] they're done. And it's easier just to

[52:17] say, "Sorry, that's close and we're

[52:18] done."

[52:19] >> Close,

[52:21] >> right?

[52:23] My opinion is it's really up to the

[52:25] chair to allow or not allow but I would

[52:28] error that way because once you do it

[52:31] once

[52:33] >> and you're almost like sliding off

[52:35] >> and then every meeting you're did it two

[52:37] meetings ago why can't I do it now kind

[52:39] of so

[52:41] >> also got where people didn't even go up

[52:44] to the podium and they just started

[52:46] >> speaking then you lose control of the

[52:47] meeting

[52:48] >> yeah yeah and you lose control of the

[52:49] meeting yeah

[52:50] >> and I wasn't here for the general plan,

[52:53] but it some of the stories I've heard

[52:56] I'm a little concerned to have those

[52:57] meetings and they get

[52:58] >> it was a wild west

[52:59] >> and mean and and it's like no, we're not

[53:01] going there.

[53:02] >> Yeah.

[53:03] >> And and you just it's hard to do.

[53:05] >> Yeah.

[53:06] >> But nope, sorry. We're not doing that.

[53:08] >> It's okay.

[53:09] >> The chair really has a lot of control.

[53:11] >> Yeah.

[53:11] >> And the the way a meeting is ran is is

[53:17] you can blame it on the chair really

[53:19] because they have that gavvel. they have

[53:21] every right to stop and get control of

[53:24] the meeting and not let it get out of

[53:25] hand. And that's the hardest part is

[53:28] when everybody starts talking and we're

[53:30] recording this meeting, you can't tell

[53:32] who's saying what.

[53:33] >> Yeah.

[53:34] >> And it just, you know,

[53:36] >> that's why those rules of order are

[53:37] there.

[53:38] >> Yeah.

[53:40] >> And always go back to the rules of

[53:42] order, right? And you know that is you

[53:45] know that law of as you mentioned

[53:47] consistency and clarity and and so yeah

[53:50] and you know it it's a very simple

[53:52] principle that just you know percolates

[53:55] through everything that you've just gone

[53:57] through on the slides.

[54:01] One last question which doesn't pertain

[54:03] to us but what is how do you do a closed

[54:06] door meeting like what constitute a

[54:08] closed

[54:09] >> what would I call that

[54:10] >> close session

[54:13] >> usually it it involves like legal matter

[54:16] like someone's sued the city or someone

[54:21] situation has happened that could lead

[54:23] to something litigation or if we're

[54:26] talking about sale of city property we

[54:29] haven't put it up for sale yet, but

[54:31] we're debating what we want to do with

[54:33] this

[54:35] >> personel

[54:36] personnel changes and issues that go

[54:42] >> just out of curiosity.

[54:43] >> But the the time I've been on city

[54:46] council, it has been almost 100% related

[54:50] except for one year, almost 100% related

[54:53] to sale property. Okay.

[54:56] The other one was a legal discuss

[54:59] >> some some cities I know put it on every

[55:01] agenda full session as needed to discuss

[55:04] real estate

[55:07] that way just they can always jump into

[55:09] a close session

[55:11] >> door is always open. Yeah.

[55:13] >> I think you have to say what it's about

[55:15] though. You have to say it's for real

[55:16] estate discuss real estate or discuss

[55:18] litigation. You do have to

[55:20] >> kind of just a very general

[55:22] >> this is what we're talking about in that

[55:23] close session. But it's not documented

[55:25] any way in the meeting like you guys

[55:27] don't record or you know transcribe

[55:29] anything in the meeting.

[55:30] >> We do.

[55:31] >> Yeah. It has to be for

[55:33] >> Okay. That's what I was making sure.

[55:34] Yeah.

[55:38] » I'm not sure that doesn't get released

[55:40] to

[55:40] >> it does not get released but

[55:44] information

[55:45] >> meetings are not allowed to say outside

[55:48] of

[55:49] >> are those are those subject to foyer.

[55:53] For what?

[55:53] >> FOYA grant

[55:54] >> freedom of information.

[55:57] >> That's a good question. I don't think

[55:58] so.

[55:59] >> I think I think you have that cause in

[56:04] » Yeah,

[56:04] >> that'd be a good question for J.

[56:07] >> There it could be for a lot of C. I'm

[56:08] assuming people go after that like that

[56:10] they think something was not done right.

[56:13] If that's the case, then I think that

[56:14] the and this is Jeremy's been

[56:19] Jeremy is you would probably have to go

[56:21] down the path of you are opening up an

[56:24] actual litigation against the city and

[56:27] that gives you the right to pull in

[56:30] intel.

[56:30] >> Okay. And I think that would be the only

[56:32] case that I

[56:34] one of the only cases that I that you

[56:38] that

[56:40] >> there is very sensitive details

[56:42] sometimes that is discussed there

[56:45] you definitely

[56:47] want everybody to know

[56:49] >> right

[56:49] >> not that we're being secretive that's

[56:51] not

[56:54] >> right I like you know land deals you

[56:56] know need to have some privacy

[56:59] >> the uh But um everyone should know that

[57:03] obviously we can't do anything legal on

[57:05] those. They're being recorded. So any

[57:08] decisions were held liable to those just

[57:10] like we would if we're doing something

[57:13] in the public on the dis. So all the

[57:17] same rules apply. There's just a little

[57:20] bit card out to to allow you to

[57:24] right.

[57:27] It's a great question though.

[57:31] I have a question,

[57:33] right?

[57:34] >> Not yet.

[57:36] >> I'm just so

[57:38] >> Well, and you can always email. We can

[57:39] always talk later. I mean, stuff comes

[57:41] up and or before a meeting, you've been,

[57:44] you know, we're here to talk and we can

[57:46] always get a good answer.

[57:48] >> No, these trainings are phenomenal.

[57:50] >> They're great.

[57:52] >> I always learn little nuggets at a time.

[57:54] >> Sorry. Uh Jamie is at your best.

[57:58] >> So if you have like a concern or

[58:02] curiosity question, please don't hold

[58:05] back. You can email alongside.

[58:08] He's pretty quick to respond. It's he's

[58:12] that we are paying him as our attorney

[58:13] to give us advice to help guide us to

[58:15] help direct us. So take advantage of

[58:18] that.

[58:18] >> Especially if you feel like you have a

[58:20] conflict of interest.

[58:21] >> Absolutely.

[58:21] >> He get he deals with that all the time.

[58:23] No.

[58:24] >> Okay.

[58:27] I'm just going to plug him into my phone

[58:28] here if you don't mind keeping that up

[58:30] for just a second longer.

[58:34] >> You you emailed this to us. So, you said

[58:36] >> I will. Yes.

[58:42] » I'll make sure we've got phone numbers

[58:44] current too. This slide might be a

[58:47] little

[58:48] >> I don't think so.

[58:51] » People change numbers sometimes.

[59:00] » We have to move to close, right? Or

[59:02] motion.

[59:02] >> Oh, yeah. Sorry, I'm typing really slow.

[59:06] >> It's okay. We don't have any rest.

[59:11] » We have the motion to close, right? I

[59:13] motion to close. uh planning commission

[59:16] meeting today.

[59:20] I almost got the date on top of this in

[59:22] January.

[59:23] >> I'll second that motion.

[59:27] >> Yes.

2026.3.12 Planning Commission Meeting

Transcript