[0:19] I would like you would like to move the approval of the agenda.

[0:27] We have a second

[0:31] one amendment and that is that the minutes of the special meeting of

[0:36] February 4th be um forwarded to next week's meeting so that they're recorded

[0:42] in our regular meeting and not in the special meeting. Uh just makes uh filing

[0:48] a little bit easier. Okay. Um

[0:55] all those in favor of the um agenda with the approval sorry um the number five B.

[1:04] Okay. Um Adley should it be business arising or just this new business

[1:12] and I believe the Bon policy thing should go to the regular meeting.

[1:18] Is that here next week? Yes. >> Yeah. To provide updates on what

[1:24] transpired with the committee and I wouldn't say that they need to be

[1:28] because we mentioned policy. So I wouldn't have

[1:38] just that believe that's what we said in the meeting. I don't just work here.

[1:47] on the other.

[1:52] » Yeah.

[1:58] » We just leave it like that. Everybody good with that? We keep the law policy

[2:01] update there. >> Okay. All those in favor of the agenda

[2:07] with the amendment seeing say I can say motion carate.

[2:15] uh any disclosures of conflict of interest.

[2:20] Uh we will move into 5A the 2024 28 CCB the Canada community building funds

[2:28] plan. So what we'll do for this is have a presentation by one

[2:43] that is passage that was sent out tonight

[2:59] wasn't the fire to my bones in there. >> Yes.

[3:03] » Okay. >> Almost 3/4 just over halfway down.

[3:12] » But I seem to remember the two things being separate from our email.

[3:19] » Yeah. One one was the agenda again and one the documents of the meeting. But

[3:25] no, what I'm saying is the um the um what the two fire chiefs had put in

[3:34] Yeah. >> was in the documents on our email. Yeah.

[3:37] They're not hearing. We don't have We don't have people

[3:46] that

[3:58] share it. But we're just going to do it the other way.

[4:12] that works, right? >> So, which one did you want to have?

[4:15] That's why we're speaking for

[4:32] » I just want to thank everybody for having me here tonight. Let me uh two

[4:36] things. One, I just want to give you just a brief recap of how we got here

[4:40] and and why we're, you know, we're thinking of purchase a new truck.

[4:44] um and kind of what we have currently and then of course the specs and

[4:50] same time framing center on the new fire truck. Um so council and mayor will

[4:56] remember that when we back in September of 2024 we had a uh unfortunately a

[5:02] total engine failure in our rescue truck. So we were responding to a

[5:05] medical call uh the motor truck. Um at the time we looked at different options.

[5:11] Uh there's three options if you'll remember. One was not a great option,

[5:15] but it was still an option was to repair the existing truck. Um we looked into

[5:21] it, but unfortunately between putting a motor in that truck and with it already

[5:24] being refurbished once in the past, it just really wasn't a viable option

[5:29] because you were going to have to put way too much into it for what it's

[5:31] worth. So that left two options. one being a complete new rescue truck which

[5:36] again was going to be best part of half a million dollars even worse now with

[5:40] today's news of tariffs. Yay. >> Yeah. And uh and then of course we need

[5:46] a pumper replacement 2030. So what we came up with at the time was the idea of

[5:51] if we can go a little early on the purchase of the pumper truck which is

[5:55] due in 2030 but in turn save from having to buy a totally separate rescue truck.

[6:00] Um, and then that way avoids the taxpayers burden of having to pay for

[6:05] two fire trucks within a three-year period. Um, which if that was the case,

[6:10] you'd be looking at probably best part of 1.6 to 1.7 million if you're going to

[6:15] do true backtoback. Whereas this version here in theory would save the taxpayers

[6:19] of at least probably 5 to $600,000 in the long run. So,

[6:25] um, so with that being said, right now we're down one truck completely. So

[6:29] we're down to four. The way it works now is that we've kind of retrofitted one of

[6:34] our pumper trucks, which is typically used for fighting fire into a makeshift

[6:38] rescue truck. And so it's already happened a few times where we've been

[6:42] out on calls when something else will come in or in one really remote area of

[6:46] our coverage area where it's a little nerve-wracking having, you know, all our

[6:51] water in one place or all our tools in one place, rescue tools, and not having

[6:55] uh anything on the other end of town. So, um, the idea would be to purchase

[7:00] this new pumper tanker truck and then when it arrives, refurbish our current

[7:06] 2018 pumper into a rescue popper. So, it would have the option of being a heavy

[7:11] duty rescue with all the rescue tools, jaws of life, uh, medical equipment,

[7:15] etc., and the ability to fight fire as well.

[7:20] Uh, so we did reach out to three mark suppliers.

[7:26] uh Maxi Metal of Quebec, which we already have one of their trucks now.

[7:30] Currently, we reached out to Metalf Fab in New Brunswick and we reached out to

[7:34] Ford Gary in uh Calgary, Alberta. Um everybody makes nice fire trucks and

[7:41] there's lots of different companies out there, but we already have a pumper with

[7:44] them and they're able to build exactly what we want and what we need. And we

[7:50] know that it's a good truck because it's tried and tested and we've had really

[7:53] good luck with it. So that's why we we decided to spec out the truck to Maxi

[7:58] Metal Standards. And so they're based in St. George,

[8:02] Quebec. This new truck would be a 2020 freight liner, uh M2106 pumper tanker.

[8:08] All M2106 means is it's just the type of chassis that it is. So uh it would be a

[8:12] crew cab chassis, four door seating for five firefighters.

[8:17] It would hold 1700 gallons of water, which the largest truck we have

[8:20] currently is,200 gallons of water. you'd have 500 more gallons of water capacity.

[8:25] Uh the pump rating would be 1500 gallons per minute, which is 450 more than our

[8:30] current truck. Um again, we're looking at this truck to replace a truck now,

[8:35] but we're not just looking at today. We're looking at next year, 10 years, 20

[8:39] years from now. So, I would hope that by river 20 years from now is booming and

[8:44] we have new infrastructure and we have possibly new apartments or housing and

[8:49] stuff. So hopefully >> hopefully that's what everyone wants to

[8:52] see happen. >> And so that being said, that's where the

[8:55] extra water capacity and pump and stuff comes into play and looking towards the

[9:00] future. And then hydraulic ladder quarter tank storage rack. Um the less

[9:05] you have to climb the top of a truck, the better for safety reasons,

[9:09] especially in winter in this weather with ice and and dark at night. If you

[9:13] don't have to get on top of the truck or the small little steps, preferably you

[9:17] don't. And so now a lot of the newer trucks have safety at the forefront

[9:21] which hydraulic ladders and racks all come down with the push of a button. So

[9:24] everything's accessible from from the bottom. Uh SCVA seating which is the air

[9:29] packs that we use the the breathing apparatus for four firefighters in the

[9:34] cab.

[9:37] So this is a sample truck of what we're looking at. So it's quite similar to

[9:40] what we have currently. There's not a huge amount of difference. There are a

[9:43] few though. Um the truck's a few feet longer, has a bigger tank capacity. Um

[9:48] has extended front bumper with a hose in the front bumper for trash fires, car

[9:52] fires, etc. Um the rear of the truck, it has a dump valve that swivels one way or

[9:57] the other. So when we go to a fire, we have to haul loads of water

[10:00] repetitively. What we do is we set up a portable tank on the ground and we'll

[10:05] dump water. So this has the option to dump from either side of the truck or

[10:09] from the rear, which we don't have that option now.

[10:12] Uh the racks, you can see they're all tucked up neatly on the side, but when

[10:15] they push of a button, everything comes down on both sides of the truck for

[10:18] access to the ladders, tank, hose, etc. Um, so all in all, it's like I said,

[10:25] it's quite similar to what we have. It's just newer version.

[10:28] Give us everything now and for the future as well.

[10:34] » Okay, so timeline and pricing. So, we recently had a meeting with Safety

[10:38] Source, who Safety Source is the rep for Atlantic Canada for Maxi Metal. Um, the

[10:46] current truck we're looking to purchase has actually already been started. Uh,

[10:50] and it's approximately at the halfway point of being built right now with a

[10:53] price tag of $850,000. The truck itself is right around

[10:58] $785,000.

[11:02] The $850,000 price tag is the truck comes fully

[11:06] equipped. So meaning hose, nozzles, ladders, bora tank, everything that you

[11:11] would need, it comes fully equipped. We made that I wouldn't say in mistake, but

[11:15] we we did that in the last truck we ordered 2018 where we got it bare ball.

[11:20] We didn't get a single thing on it and we regretted it after the fact. Because

[11:24] if you can include that amount into the overall price tag at the beginning and

[11:29] divide it throughout the payments of the truck versus buying it all up front from

[11:32] your operating budget, it it makes more sense to do it that way. So we ended up

[11:36] having to scramble and just take stuff from three other trucks to make one

[11:40] truck work the last time. So So again, at 850,000, that's their quote. That's

[11:46] their estimate. Um they're hoping to be under that, but that would be at the

[11:49] high end. That would be fully equipped filbert to our building.

[11:54] And this truck is what's considered a stop program truck. So postcoid, this

[11:58] program was developed to help fast drive a truck in a much shorter time frame

[12:01] than a typical custom build. Um if approved by council now, this truck

[12:06] would be completed and delivered to Rexton the last week of October of 2025.

[12:10] So eight months from now, seven months now because I was done a month ago.

[12:16] Um the stop truck program takes a try and test the truck and includes all the

[12:20] most common options are looking for with safety at the forefront. So again what

[12:24] they did after co is they realized that things are hard to get things hard to

[12:27] keep in stock hard to get ahead of and the truck was taking anywhere from what

[12:32] used to take a year was getting into two years three years plus and so what's

[12:37] happening now is that they realized that. So Maxi Metal has actually

[12:40] purchased over a hundred chassis from Freightlininer International and

[12:44] different companies. They all have them brought in in stock in different

[12:47] configurations and they're building these trucks in a stock truck program.

[12:51] So when fire departments are in a need for a truck, they basically have the

[12:55] bare bones are started, but then from that point you customize it to the way

[12:58] you want it with your own options, colors, lettering, etc., etc.

[13:07] And so reasons we believe council should act now on this. So there's more than

[13:11] one reason but uh we fully understand there's many other projects capital

[13:15] assets that five rivers has to take into consideration. However, our current

[13:19] rescue truck is still completely under commission even though we converted our

[13:22] pumper uh which although is working right now is not ideal. We're taking

[13:26] trucks out of town that normally wouldn't go out of town all the time and

[13:29] we're leaving basically nothing in town if something else comes in.

[13:34] with the looming threat of terrace places going up from here on out. It's

[13:38] no longer looming anymore. When uh when I did this point was a few weeks ago,

[13:42] it's not looming anymore. It's here. >> And so we have been told by the

[13:46] manufacturer that so what they've done is that even though we haven't made a

[13:50] decision yet, they have actually this truck, it's not spoken for yet, but it's

[13:55] also not being I I wouldn't say spec or sold in another

[13:59] department. Not that they're holding this, but they're holding pricing for a

[14:04] short period of time until it gives us time to work out the details on our end.

[14:07] Hopefully, uh, and that being said, that would

[14:11] eliminate having to worry about tariffs going into effect on the equipment side

[14:14] of things, which could quickly stop obviously, but as of right now, it's

[14:18] everything's okay. The US EPA or the United States Environmental Protection

[14:23] Agency has recently issued their updated emissions regulations for 2027 to 2020

[14:28] 2032. These new emission standards will increase the price of this truck by a

[14:32] minimum of $100,000 on the lower side, more than likely even more.

[14:41] » So you're saying it's going to be over 100,000 more.

[14:45] » I'm going to get to this in the next slide. I'm going to explain what I mean

[14:48] by that. So the US eviction standards. So, if this currently available stock

[14:53] program pump or tanker is not purchased, a new truck can still be ordered, of

[14:57] course, but with a minimum weight time, they're telling us roughly 28 months.

[15:01] Uh, that's on the low end. It could be up to 36 months. This would put the new

[15:05] truck into the time frame of the new regulations beginning in 2027.

[15:09] New diesel engines under these restrictions will have to operate on a

[15:12] DPF or diesel particulate filter system as soon as the key is turned to the on

[15:16] position, even if the truck is not running.

[15:19] new diesel engines. So, diesel engines in our trucks now are in uh even 3/4

[15:24] tons or one ton trucks. They all have um they use what's called diesel exhaust

[15:28] fluid and it collects tailpipe emissions from the engine. So, what this means

[15:33] that as soon as the key is turned on, death fluid or diesel exhaust fluid will

[15:36] be burnt continuously until the truck is shut off.

[15:40] Currently, when you have a diesel engine, now what happens is when the

[15:43] truck is running, you're not burning this diesel exhaust fluid right away.

[15:47] The temperature has to reach a certain temperature and then it starts to burn

[15:50] this exhaust fluid which contains the emissions that come out of the tailpipe

[15:54] and in theory eliminates emissions that are put in the environment. What's going

[15:59] to happen though with these new systems is that like it explains when you turn

[16:03] the key to the accessory position, not even on, the motor is going to start

[16:07] burning diesel exhaust fluid right away. And so what's going to happen is and

[16:11] people are really starting to panic about this is that they don't even know

[16:16] there's not even so I'm going to get to that next year. There's currently no

[16:19] engine manufacturer in North America that can even produce an engine of this

[16:22] technicality yet. It doesn't exist yet which again means that the cost of this

[16:27] new truck could easily exceed a million dollars.

[16:30] And so that's kind of the goal how I'm getting behind this now versus just

[16:34] waiting because if these intermissions are effect and you're waiting 36 months

[16:37] for a truck, you're going to have no choice but to fall under these

[16:41] standards. And not to mention the problems that could come with these

[16:45] standards because they don't even know yet how it's going to go for maintenance

[16:48] and for uh issues with these motors because everything that's going to be

[16:53] coming out is going to be brand new. So all the parts are going to be going into

[16:56] new builds versus having parts available for breakdowns etc.

[17:05] » I the wrong way then

[17:10] » so Warren >> you said the stock truck they even have

[17:14] the chassis there so we won't get stuck with the tariffs on the chassis. So they

[17:19] have over a hundred chassis in stock right now

[17:22] » cuz the chassis alone is quite expensive.

[17:24] » Extremely expensive. The way it's worked in the past for our last truck, what had

[17:28] to happen is you had to pay for the chassis up front in full.

[17:31] » Yeah. >> Then you pay for the remainder of the

[17:33] truck on your livery. The way it works now, they have it in stock is you don't

[17:36] pay anything until So you don't pay anything up front

[17:39] » for the chassis since they have them in stock. But he sent me a picture the

[17:43] other day of their yard in St. George, Quebec, and it's as far as the eye can

[17:47] see. is just chassis. But that's why they're doing this is to get ahead of

[17:51] this smart mess. >> And so the last thing um I'll read I'll

[17:58] just read it briefly. This is an article uh that was just published. It's

[18:01] published in 2023, but it's been most recently updated here just a few weeks

[18:06] ago. And it's kind of explaining what's going to happen with these new regul

[18:10] regulations. And you see the title and the chaos that may ensue. And so it's it

[18:15] reads, "Oh man, here we go again into the nightmare of emission regulations,

[18:18] which now make earlier US EPA mandates seem mild in comparison. If you think

[18:23] trucks are expensive now, which they certainly are, just wait until 2027 when

[18:27] the raft of very stringent new regulations take effect in the US and in

[18:31] Canada too because we traditionally follow the American mandates. If only

[18:34] because Indian makers engine makers can't afford to satisfy two different

[18:38] mandates.

[18:41] Your diesel intro alone will cost you an extra$25 to $30,000 US and maintenance

[18:46] costs, who knows? If you're an owner operator or small fleet, that may well

[18:50] just be the moment you decide to pack it in. If all small business truckers can't

[18:55] afford new compliant trucks, they're going to stay with older, less efficient

[18:58] trucks or leave the industry entirely. Once again, EPA is largely ignore these

[19:03] warnings and concerns raised by truckers in this latest rule. But even the big

[19:07] boys will suffer. At the very least will there will be a mad scramble to buy

[19:10] trucks before these new rules kick in just as there was 15 years ago prior to

[19:13] 2007 rules and again in 2010. This next pre-by will be even more

[19:19] widespread and disruptive and just about everybody I guess will plan to keep

[19:23] their trucks longer. Used truck prices will skyrock

[19:27] the EPA published what is called the strongest ever national clean air

[19:30] standards to cut smoke and soot forming emissions from heavy duty trucks

[19:34] beginning with the model year 2027. The main target is oxides of nitrogen

[19:40] and medium heavy duty on highway engines as well as particulate matter and carbon

[19:44] dioxide. One not so small point is that anxic sensors aren't presently perfectly

[19:49] reliable and it's agreed by critics that they won't be able to handle the new

[19:52] demands if they're even available in sufficient

[19:56] quantities. All in above is bad enough, but it gets

[19:59] worse because of the California Air Resources Board of Car has even more

[20:03] stringent set of standards on the books. So-called ACT rule to regulate

[20:06] emissions. See a complicated road ahead? You betcha. Because the EPA and CAR

[20:10] approaches are not fully compatible. Californians with absolutely no proof

[20:14] that these reductions can be done an unrealistically short time frame for

[20:18] manufacturers to comply about half of what the EPA has proposed. Truck and

[20:23] Engine Manufacturers Association says several heavy duty on highway truck and

[20:27] engine producers could actually exit California market altogether because of

[20:31] the cost associated with these provisions. Trouble is Washington,

[20:34] Oregon, New Jersey, New York, Massachusetts have all adopted these

[20:37] rules with Boston follow. So I know it's a lot but in theory

[20:42] what's happening is this is coming whether we like it or not. there's

[20:47] nothing you can do about it. But at the same time, you know, if the trucks are

[20:52] available and you know, it's what we want, it's what we need and it's there

[20:55] now, we can avoid terrorists, we can avoid all these regulations, then I

[21:00] guess that's our plus. The biggest thing to remember again is that we are down a

[21:04] truck and something something needs to be replaced.

[21:07] » And you know this company, >> we already have a truck from them

[21:10] already because this >> couldn't be happier. I believe at the

[21:15] September meeting when you guys made your presentation, it was unanimous.

[21:19] Yes. >> That they go with the option purchasing

[21:22] the new truck. >> So, if you can get it now, save the

[21:26] tariffs and all of that garbage. >> Do I need to make a motion?

[21:30] » No, >> I don't think we made motion yet.

[21:33] » I'm going to make a motion. >> I have a question. Uh, yeah, I have a

[21:37] question in regards to this and your specs and a quote. Has anybody sourced

[21:43] with canoe? >> You have to get your chassis from the

[21:46] US. What he's saying is it's already here and we're not going to pay the

[21:51] tariff on it. >> They've got a quote from a company on

[21:53] their own as a recent fire department. Has anybody gone through canoe? Three

[21:58] other communities are getting fire trucks all through canoe.

[22:02] » Oh, sorry. >> Yeah. Why are we not going through

[22:05] canoe? >> That's a company. I was going to say

[22:07] could just >> women

[22:09] of municipal um municipalities of New Brunswick and they it's like an

[22:14] insurance company or whatever they they source um for all of the municipalities

[22:18] and they're called canoe. >> Okay.

[22:19] » And so Kelly saying that um fire engines I didn't realize

[22:25] » all big equipment, heavy duty equipment. and you give them the specs of what it

[22:28] is you want and who your perhaps choice is,

[22:33] » but have them go back to the table and deal for you

[22:36] » because Canoe could possibly get you something from that metal cheaper.

[22:41] » A lot cheaper. >> Exact same thing you're ordering.

[22:44] » They have buying power, but you don't. >> My my only question to that is

[22:50] » what's that going to do for the time >> frame? Time frame.

[22:53] » You'd have to ask them. >> Yeah. an icy wet warranty.

[22:57] » No, it's something they've already gone through.

[23:01] So, >> as far as red tape goes,

[23:03] » we brought this last meeting. I mean, >> I'm constantly burning up.

[23:08] » Yeah, you are. Um, but I know they trust Maxi Metal because they got a truck from

[23:12] there before, but and as I believe we agreed to in that meeting, I asked which

[23:18] is which solution best suits the fire department purchasing the new vehicle? I

[23:24] thought we'd agreed then. >> I thought it was consensus on that

[23:29] particular drum. >> Yeah. But I don't think we took the

[23:31] motion. >> Yeah.

[23:32] » No, >> I asked them about canoe and to go back

[23:36] and get a quote because I wouldn't do anything without hearing about

[23:41] » so I can tell you there was no motion. >> Well, I did that one with them.

[23:46] » Yeah. maximum

[23:49] » I I'm unfamiliar with with the purchasing channel the canoe provides

[23:54] there's two elements one is time sensitive to with we can look in the

[23:58] canoe when I say it's time sensitive and say that quickly I think what Warren is

[24:03] saying is that we're now whatever was done or not done in the past you're now

[24:07] down to a handful of weeks probably before you can lock this in it goes for

[24:11] all other agencies to explain whether canoe is operating presumably as a

[24:15] middleman because canoe sells a full and broad range of services, fire trucks,

[24:20] everything from like chairs and tables, computers and those things.

[24:24] » Whether they ultimately would provide some advantage, I wouldn't. The

[24:26] particulars of the three you cited, I'm unfamiliar with. So, it could be that

[24:31] they would have some play in here. Uh I did do procurement for a telecom company

[24:35] for a long time for years. Um it's to be determined whether they would actually

[24:41] provide some sort of discount those uh or whether they'd facilitate this trade.

[24:45] Ultimately, they don't manufacture trucks, the ones that the one that he's

[24:49] outside the manufacturer. So, um they have buying power, but we're buying a

[24:54] one off and we're small town probably wouldn't would buy one every four or

[24:58] five years. So, that's all to say that they may or may not provide any

[25:02] advantage in here. The challenge is whether getting them involved in this

[25:06] stage would become an obstruction or delay the process in a way in which we

[25:10] lose an opportunity to buy what does seem to be a a good deal. But I mean

[25:14] that said we can >> we can see the other thing is that the

[25:18] town like we' also looked at Canon Heartland but we didn't sign up with not

[25:22] we just didn't get to the point of looking we we're aware that others if

[25:26] you look at ambian or there's a lot of pain or random using for certain things

[25:31] and um the challenge is that's probably the longer term play to establish

[25:36] relationship with community that not just for this room or other things. So

[25:40] yeah, it's something we can take back and look at, but uh I yeah, its

[25:45] applicability here is questionable. >> Rob, could you make a phone call to

[25:50] Canoe on it week or 10 days, see if they can

[25:56] do anything with this and at the end of that tell Warren or you call Maxi Medal

[26:03] and say >> because the other communities in New

[26:06] Brunswick are only getting a truck, too. So they're still going through canoe.

[26:11] » It can't hurt to make a phone call, can it? And if it's going to save us money

[26:15] but get you what you want. >> Yeah.

[26:18] » It's a win-win. >> One thing I will mention as well is that

[26:20] Maximal So we there's three companies we did reach out to.

[26:25] Unfortunately, Maximal is the only company that does a stop program. So the

[26:30] other two were basically I wouldn't say they're out of the picture, but in my

[26:33] opinion, we might as well say they're out of the picture for that reason is

[26:36] that yeah, you could order through another company, but

[26:38] » because the chassis is expensive. >> Chassis is expensive and I know if if

[26:42] you miss out, I know it's going to lump. Not only that, but they don't like these

[26:47] other manufacturers, they don't make a trip to those specs in

[26:52] a stock truck program. The other thing too is Maxi Metal has what's called

[26:57] their their current Sourcewell. I don't know if anyone's ever heard of Source

[27:01] Well. It's a consortium purchasing company. So it's quite similar to Canoe.

[27:06] » So we asked about that at the beginning. Is that is that something that's more

[27:10] beneficial to us to pursue or not? and they said that for somewhere like um

[27:16] city of Toronto for example where you're you know you have a fleet of

[27:21] 140 fire trucks then that's something where someone obviously doesn't have the

[27:24] time to sit down and source out truck after truck after truck because it'd be

[27:28] a full-time job. So what it is is they go through these purchasing companies

[27:31] where they source it. They take care of all the

[27:34] » the the leg work and then they present it to them. Whereas with us, like you

[27:39] said, it's not that, like you said, some couldn't. It's just that it's something

[27:43] to look into. And then if it's something that's going to delay it by months or

[27:47] that it's not going to be a a a financial benefit to us by going through

[27:52] them, then >> but you've done all the ground work. You

[27:56] got to do is give them the code. You already received everything you want,

[28:00] all the specs, and just say, "Hey, can you do better?"

[28:02] » Yeah. because I was until I saw these documents today and saw this

[28:06] presentation before I left home. I can say I was honestly surprised because I

[28:12] thought we had already agreed that you guys go ahead and get a new truck and

[28:16] I'm sitting here thinking that was six months ago. Now there's tariffs. Now the

[28:21] price has gone up. >> Uhoh. Like you guys can't be down the

[28:25] truck. >> No. And that's that's kind of our my

[28:27] hope coming tonight was that we >> like this has been nights and weekends

[28:32] and evenings and stuff and we've been putting a lot into it. So we've been

[28:35] » studying everything going through the specs. This will be our third meeting

[28:38] with the company. We've been on the phone with other suppliers throughout

[28:41] the country and stuff and we did the labor like you said

[28:44] » that part is all done. So, as far as when it comes down to dollars and cents,

[28:49] if for some reason that they're able to have a benefit to us through this, by

[28:54] all means, I'm 100% open for that. If though that it's going to, then that

[28:58] would be my >> spec meet your specs. Exactly.

[29:01] » And time frame has to be a time. And right now, he's saying that they're

[29:07] forgiving the tariffs right now. >> No, because they're not forgiving it.

[29:10] They already have them here. Well, he is not.

[29:14] » No, but you're right in the way. So, they they are forgiving the tariffs on

[29:18] the equipment. >> Yeah.

[29:19] » For he said he's going to give us a few weeks. So, by a few weeks, I would say

[29:23] like probably mid to late March would be the probably the longest they can push

[29:27] that forward. But all the equipment that they receive that they wouldn't have all

[29:31] that sitting on shelves. Obviously, they're going to have to get some. So,

[29:35] the more that they have to bring in if it's tariff, then the more that's going

[29:38] to drive. So, can I make a motion that we ask Rob to call canoe

[29:46] » um and find out if >> that if this is, you know, we'll find

[29:52] beneficial if it can help or if it can't help

[29:56] » and get an answer and if they say no, then we give him the go-ahhead to order

[30:01] what he's got right up there. >> I'll second it.

[30:04] » But I would like to say too little there's a time frame. they can't be uh

[30:09] » and I'm sure in one or two phone calls you're going to get the answer. I think

[30:13] whoever you talk to with canoe is going to be able to say yes, we can help with

[30:17] this or unfortunately no we can't. I don't think it's going to be a

[30:21] wishy-washy with Canoe because they know what they cover and they don't cover it.

[30:26] But can it hurt to make a phone call? >> If it's going to save us50 or $100,000

[30:33] for example, >> why not? But if they can't or they're

[30:37] not answering us, then we have to >> in theory you have a council meeting

[30:42] next Tuesday. >> Yep.

[30:44] » In theory by then. >> Yes.

[30:46] » In a perfect world to hear something representative of canoe that could say

[30:52] » yes we can definitely help you with this or not a whole lot we can do. Please,

[30:57] please tell the members that we're all on board for you getting a new truck and

[31:02] we misunderstood because we thought in September

[31:05] that we agreed to do that apparently. >> You did motion to purchase it, but you

[31:10] said that this you were >> agreed in favor of that.

[31:14] » Okay. >> The CR.

[31:19] So anyway, tell the fire department >> that is what we want for you guys that

[31:25] we're on your side for what that is and just explain. Rob's going to call you

[31:31] » and then we'll have an answer. Like I said, I don't think it'll be a big long

[31:36] conversation. >> No, as a as a minor note, as a caution

[31:39] to council, I warn any counselor speak on behalf of councilman about the

[31:43] support within their big motion predating it.

[31:47] you would be able to confirm just saying the val you'd be able to validate that

[31:52] unanimous by vote not by >> an unspoken assumption that

[31:58] » um that there's support. So you do want to

[32:01] » preface that. >> Yeah. So

[32:04] » So do we >> just make a motion for you to call canoe

[32:09] and then >> I you don't need a motion to do that.

[32:11] Okay. No talk about that. We'll figure out how

[32:15] out when we follow up >> and bring it to next meeting.

[32:18] » Yeah. For next meeting, we'll we'll know whether it's a viable path forward with

[32:22] canoe versus the route that has already been taken with the source of the

[32:27] decision. So it'll be >> that would be my request if possible by

[32:34] then at least if we could >> that way I can give him feedback on

[32:39] their end of what

[32:44] » we're supposed to be. >> Okay. So thank you really appreciate it.

[32:52] Okay. >> Next

[32:56] have a presentation. It's >> 850. You said it from

[33:00] » Perry. Okay. We're going to spend $850,000.

[33:04] Chief Perry, please say no. We're running out of money.

[33:10] Got some sheep dogs down the road.

[33:14] » Oh,

[33:17] just before he starts >> the EPA.

[33:22] » Yeah. >> Is no longer going to be in existence in

[33:24] about six months >> as far as regulations for Yeah.

[33:28] » So I don't know how

[33:32] » we'll see how that goes. >> Yeah. I think the only as a minor point

[33:37] of information I'll I'll at some risk >> if you're meaning that the EPA is being

[33:43] decommissioned by the federal branch of the

[33:47] » it falls back to the states California would still

[33:51] » almost all regulations that are enacted in California become law in the United

[33:55] States with or without BPA because the buying power and the size of California

[34:00] which is why you sort of heard that's true across the board ultimately so that

[34:03] is to say those regulations Even with probably don't go away

[34:18] » or you can just switch

[34:34] » I just format it ever so slightly in that the same no contact sheets.

[34:40] » So for the past several years we've been putting plans together for like a 10

[34:44] year plan and we we've already had this in place. Uh

[34:49] there's some costing I've get in some of the places and some costing I don't have

[34:53] it. And the reason for the cost was I didn't go get cost on windows doors and

[34:58] stuff because I wanted to see if it would fit into the the council's plans

[35:02] for going forward. So some of the stuff was no cost and there's not a big panic.

[35:06] Stuff that should be done. Time frame is not not important. We start off with a

[35:10] cardboard station. We had uh we need windows replaced here.

[35:15] They're wooden windows and they're pretty well done. And there's not many.

[35:19] There's only a few of them in the building.

[35:22] We talked about adding mini splits in the training area and also painting the

[35:27] truck bays and then my option for mini split in in the truck bays which we

[35:32] would have to get somebody to see if it's even feasibly pulling

[35:35] » because right now we run electric and oil.

[35:37] » Yeah, oil is really expensive. >> Yeah,

[35:41] » but the mini splits work pretty well. So that's there's not a lot to be done.

[35:46] That's that's for the hardboard station over the next few years. So, we'll move

[35:50] on to Beersville.

[35:55] This is cost and this this has to be done in 2026. Our roof is getting pretty

[35:59] bad and that is a a cost and I got from a contractor $29,000. That's that's

[36:05] today's prices. So, of course, if tariff goes in next year, it could be $36,000.

[36:10] You don't know. That's today's prices. And uh people have asked me to put steel

[36:16] on, but the way our building is, our building is in

[36:20] Yeah, >> the peak comes down towards doors.

[36:23] » So, if you put steel on, there's a better chance to put put snow on the

[36:26] doors and if you don't hold it right away, it just gets like cement.

[36:30] » You can put stoppers, but then you're going to put a load on your sealant,

[36:33] too, right? So, >> I mean, shingles, we put them on. These

[36:36] lasted for 17 or 18 years. So, put another set of sh on. So, that's that

[36:41] should be in the budget for next year budget. Uh the windows in the in the

[36:45] building, this is more of a cosmetic thing to me than than it is an important

[36:49] thing, but all the seals broken on the windows. They are reling

[36:55] the glasses and they're from Global Windows. I checked the restore. There's

[36:58] no wash. >> So that's something that doesn't have to

[37:01] be done as cosmetic. Uh like I said, there's no pricing on these. Just

[37:05] because I said we could make a pricing and decide to put them in it works in

[37:09] your budget, 28, 29, 30, really doesn't matter. There's no hurry for that. Um,

[37:14] our ceilings are high in the fire station. We find it cool down around the

[37:19] trucks, but up top of the trucks when you load no is very hot. So, we thought

[37:22] we put a couple of industrial fans in there to circulate the air on the

[37:26] heating too, right? Did your uh your thermostat stuff down low there. That's

[37:32] all for the be station.

[37:43] So M1 is our tandem tanker and it's due to be uh replaced in 20 20.

[37:52] » Yeah. Um but it's not a firstline truck and the

[37:57] trucks today are lasting better than the older trucks with the old GMs and all

[38:01] the trucks that left the bed truck in bed. So on this truck here, we would

[38:05] reassess it and and I guess be to replace 2029 and in 2032, we would we

[38:11] would look at it in to be see if it would still pass. And we're thinking

[38:16] it's going to it had the motor rebuild in it once at a cost of $45,000 just to

[38:20] rebuild the motor. So the truck is still in good shape.

[38:25] » How old is it? >> How old is it?

[38:30] » What year? >> Six years. uh 2009, but we got it in

[38:35] 2010. Okay. So, 20 years 20 years of life. Your

[38:41] first responder truck can't be any older than 20 years out of the graves. So,

[38:45] it's no longer a first responding truck. It's a backup tank or what it is, but

[38:50] it's a bumper tank, too. We can fight tires and everything.

[38:54] Also, engine two will need tires in 2034. Now

[38:59] I don't know if it's CSA that does that but in the province in a bunch you can't

[39:03] tires on a truck any longer 10 years so they have to be replaced so we put some

[39:07] cost in there in 2034 engine roughly these are all today's prices still you

[39:12] don't know will happen right >> 10 years from now they're $1,000 for

[39:16] tires today >> engine three and hardware station need

[39:20] to be based in 2829 uh

[39:27] stand out. Yeah, it's got to be replaced. It's it's

[39:30] a first truck out in our city, so it has to be replaced. It's going to be just

[39:34] going to be 20 years old, so it has to be replaced. And the cost of that it

[39:38] would cost roughly today's price is around $600,000.

[39:42] » Parkplace hanger. >> What's that?

[39:44] » Is it a pump? >> Pump tanker. Yeah.

[39:48] So, that's something we have to work on. Uh Rescue 4 is another truck that uh uh

[39:54] is going to be assessed in 2032. It's it's life is on death at 20 years flat.

[39:59] This is another truck that can be put off. It could even run on probably as

[40:02] high as 25 years, 30 years. Okay. Just a just it's not a bumper truck. It's just

[40:07] all it is that we pull balls. So, and tanker nine stars in 2030.

[40:15] Now, just to say in in 20 in 2029,

[40:23] the beers station is paid off. So there's payment gone there. In 2030,

[40:28] Tanker 9 is paid off there. Also in 2018, Rescue 4 is paid off. So that's

[40:34] that's allow that's freeing up $300,000 cash. So to buy a truck in

[40:40] 2829, you're looking at probably then to $130,000 payment. So it's not as if it's

[40:49] going to cost you any more today than it's costing right now.

[40:53] We always replace our trucks as one truck was paid off, they rolled into

[40:56] another truck because if you never let the taxes go down, you would never get

[41:00] them back up again. So the province always go to another truck.

[41:06] And this is our schedule for for uh changing equipment. There's our trucks

[41:13] and stuff. And the other ones are half done such as the 2012 Silverado. It's

[41:17] it's to be determined. Them are small purchases that can be done. uh at the

[41:23] time whether we need to whether it has been done or not. So there's really no

[41:27] schedule on them trucks and four-wheeler and there's a Zodiac motor truck

[41:38] and see this is this is a big thing here 2000

[41:45] 2026 are not certifying anymore 2216. So what that means is right now we run

[41:52] 2216 Scott air packs. Uh they're only going to start reertifying

[41:58] 4500 Scott air packs. So the air packs we have now are stol. We're going to

[42:03] lose three of them in 2033

[42:08] to u and we're going to lose the rest of

[42:13] them. I've got 12 packs. So we have nine packs left. They're good to 208.

[42:17] The problem is we're running out of bottles. All the stuff has shelf life on

[42:21] it. So we can't we can't stock up on stuff. So we have to we have to buy the

[42:26] stuff when you're going to use it because if you buy 15 if you buy today

[42:31] in 15 years is no good. So you would lose 5 years. You're going to change

[42:34] 2030. And the standards on the Scott airact

[42:37] doesn't go by how old you are. It goes on the standard you bought. So NFPA

[42:41] standard which that's what we run out of the province. I don't know if council is

[42:44] going to run into that or not. That's something that policy you want to figure

[42:47] out. But there were three standard back. So if you buy at the first of the

[42:51] standard, you've got 15 years in your pack. If you buy the last of the

[42:55] standard, you've only 11 years on your pack and it's still the same price. It's

[42:59] a stupid system they have, but that's the system they got. So if you're going

[43:03] to run NFPA standards, uh, work safe compun really doesn't have anything on

[43:08] that. They got some talking about breathing air and wearing masks and and

[43:14] shaving beards and that kind of stuff. So there was two options that we put

[43:18] down here. One option was is uh if we buy bottles today, start

[43:24] buying them from now till 2033, uh we would have enough bottles to last

[43:31] us to 2038. So our Scott air packs would be good to 2038.

[43:36] » Okay. If we don't buy bottles today, then our our stuff is going to run in 20

[43:42] in 2033.

[43:46] Yeah. But if you're going to go if you're going to go to this new standard,

[43:49] new standard is going to be 2031 or 2032.

[43:53] That's when the new standard starts. So you're better off to buy starting a new

[43:56] standard than buy. And the problem is with with

[44:03] going from 2260 and 20 4500s, nothing matches.

[44:07] Okay. So, you can't do that. So, if you decided to buy a few packs now and a few

[44:11] balls now, first thing we have to replace for sure

[44:15] and then you're going to have equipment that's not that's not going to match.

[44:18] So, in a volunteer department, I find it you might have stuck as simple as you

[44:22] possibly can. People don't get confused. You grab the bag and grab a ball. Now,

[44:26] this ball go find a ball.

[44:30] » You're kind of busy. >> I was burn.

[44:33] » So, what's your suggestion? What would you

[44:36] » don't think it really matters a whole lot to me. These are today's prices. So,

[44:41] one thing I thought about today was we we could always purchase a compressor

[44:45] earlier. It's roughly around $40,000. Maybe we can buy it for the end of the

[44:49] week and then you can save too. >> But, u

[44:54] we could turn it down 4500 which when our compressor pumps up today and then

[44:58] we'd have a compression for six hours. That's something that you could use

[45:01] today to do that which I just thought about that today.

[45:05] So to me there's really I think the best way is is is your goal when you're

[45:11] putting your capital all together where is this going to fit in to work on it.

[45:15] Your 20 bottles going to cost you $30,000. If you buy the bottles then

[45:19] you're good to 2030. We've got 12 packs now and we feel we

[45:24] back we can go down to nine and we still be good nine packs because we feel if

[45:28] you get eight guys inside air packs then you're not going to have many guys left.

[45:32] do the other and be done. So that's one option. The other option

[45:36] was to buy all in in 2031 2032 where cost of today's prices are actually

[45:41] done. So with the change you have to change all of it like

[45:46] » there's cost balls the big yellow balls we have change them change in our rescue

[45:52] » the whole everything's ever changed >> like the thing that

[45:55] » everything the mask everything >> everything

[45:59] » does it have to be like Scott >> and there's something there too because

[46:04] I told the guy when he told me this I said well if we're changing everything

[46:07] now we can go to look at NSA we can go to Scott we can go to Gregor and you

[46:10] know I can't think of four of them. We just switched to MSA

[46:14] our last order we just got to 4500s and then that's because they're get them a

[46:19] little cheaper and apparently everyone says they're really good quality. So we

[46:24] kept going for it was always upgrade and you would upgrade but now you're going

[46:28] to you go decide to go new with everything then you have the option to

[46:31] switch >> and I think they're all up to the

[46:34] standard doesn't matter standard so they're all safe

[46:39] if you buy if if we decide to go on buying the bottles to last to 2038 we've

[46:45] got to start doing that this year. So what would we do? Would we buy two or

[46:49] three bottles now? Three more bottles to 2033. When we get to 2033, we'll have

[46:53] spent 20 or 30,000 or >> 30,000.

[46:59] You might be up to 35 to 40,000 by the time you're done. But that will get us

[47:03] to 2038. >> We still get our spot max tested. It's

[47:06] just that it's just that Scott aviation is not or NFPA is not doing tested on

[47:12] 2260. They say that we need 4500s in order to

[47:17] come up to the standard. >> So that 30,000 would be spread out over

[47:21] five years or eight years or whatever >> from now till 2832

[47:25] » and then that changes the bottom number again when we have to change everything.

[47:30] » Yeah.

[47:34] » Good. Either or it's gonna cost >> Oh, only thing is about that time Trump

[47:40] should be billing.

[47:46] » Come down when they >> So that's the option there. That's

[47:50] something I think that maybe fit into your plans and go through your numbers.

[47:54] » Yeah, >> because it really doesn't make any

[47:56] difference to us. I mean, our packs are all good. They all work. They test every

[47:59] year. So, we bet no problem. Any

[48:08] questions on that? I know kind of confusing, but

[48:13] turnup gear. We're always we're always buying new turnout gear just to keep up.

[48:16] And >> we've started something the last two

[48:19] years getting all my interior fires two turnout gear because now we have to send

[48:23] our turnout gear away to get tested which is gone for a weekend. It needs

[48:27] repairs gone a little bit longer. Also, every time you have a structure fire

[48:31] now, usually into the building, you have to take and clean your suits and wash

[48:34] them. And so, I take time to dry. So, once we get our our interior

[48:39] firefighters, then we'll be buying suits for them every five years. So, we'll

[48:43] have a suit because they're only for 10 years, right? So, every five years

[48:46] you'll be able to get new suits. So, and then the other suits just as needed. We

[48:50] have a lot of firefighters that don't do interior.

[48:53] » 3500 per per

[48:57] » Yeah. for one >> your helmets and your gloves and even

[49:00] your boots don't they don't last anyway they're always changing over your gloves

[49:04] changing over your your helmet's good for 10 years let's not be this would be

[49:09] purchased this year here >> this today's cost too by the way

[49:13] » that's just the jacket and the pants >> jacket jacket

[49:17] » now there is cheaper there is cheaper but we've been buying the set and we've

[49:21] got the set where we want it now so we'd like to stay with as far as SCBAS we can

[49:27] to tender the prices and stuff and even with fire truck I mean you can look into

[49:30] that too but our turnout here is something that that we like that who we

[49:35] buy from this >> year's

[49:39] all that >> what's that

[49:41] » I'm wondering about canoe for all of that if what you're saying is right with

[49:45] you know everything that's going to be outdated it's not just going to affect

[49:48] us it's going to affect every single fire department so I'm thinking that

[49:52] canoe must be all over this >> so

[49:55] » and they can go to multi the uh emails and get quotes,

[49:58] » but where we're going longer term. >> Only thing is I need an answer my budget

[50:02] time on the Scott bottles. We just started buying Scott B. We're not going

[50:05] to do it. So, I'm not buying anymore. >> 20 33 or stuff behind

[50:10] good air packs, but bottles for them and the stuff you can't even give away. I

[50:15] try to do >> we end up donating to Dominican. So,

[50:22] » it's good for us long term. There's no problem going whatever whatever works

[50:27] for council not as long as we get equipment but I could see more on the

[50:29] point that >> he's

[50:34] so that's all I got that's that's our plan that's a big expenditures

[50:38] » questions for Chief Perry on the windows I know you said you

[50:43] talked to global but I >> didn't talk to global I just think that

[50:47] they are from global >> I know but I know someone that put those

[50:51] windows in and they did replace them not in the

[50:57] Maybe it's a big trouble with that. >> Maybe

[51:01] the seals. >> Yes.

[51:04] » I just went through the paperwork last week and it was only 10 years on that.

[51:10] » 15 years on the on the vinyl. 15 or 18 years on the vinyl.

[51:15] » And the building's only 18 years old. >> But that's not a big expense. If you

[51:20] change all the windows, you're probably $5,000. So they want to change. They

[51:24] just >> to me it's cosmetic. People said, "Why

[51:27] didn't you get it done?" >> Does it condense in between the glass?

[51:33] » Yeah. >> But that was

[51:36] also heat escapes. So

[51:38] » yeah. Does it ever turn the heat? >> 85% of your heat. He lost her windows

[51:42] and doors >> by turning the heat down too.

[51:46] » But that's the plan.

[51:50] » The stuff was the only one. The only thing is the spider decision

[51:56] budget >> and we need a truck.

[52:02] » The roof should be done next. >> Yeah.

[52:09] » And you said there's a truck that needs to be done when

[52:14] » replaced. 289 >> 28 29.

[52:18] » Which one? >> Engine 3 and hardwork.

[52:21] » Oh. Same thing you want. >> Yeah. And I we'll probably build it the

[52:25] same as same as what Beersville is. We just our trucks identical.

[52:31] » We know where the >> we tried to match them up when we bought

[52:33] this one here. We went see their their truck and build so we could do 100%. So

[52:39] » cuz one was a freight line, one was an international

[52:42] » and we're going to get caught with terror. So we're going to get caught. We

[52:45] need so >> maybe

[52:48] like you. >> Thank you very much.

[52:51] Keith >> said you're welcome to skip the next

[52:55] part because we're kind of be talking into the CCF

[53:00] » Canada Community Building Fund

[53:10] just before World

[53:14] Canada building in front used to be called the Amash and

[53:19] it is always is typically a subset for any given municipality a subset of their

[53:25] capital plan is the system plan. So the federal

[53:30] government uh through the province uh administers the program uh our

[53:38] administrator in Canada Laria or sorry in New Brunswick Laria you deal with and

[53:44] uh so there was a plan for 2014 2019 23 and 24 28 and uh

[53:53] it's for capital purchases so it's not for operating expenditures repair and

[53:58] maintenance and so forth. There needs to be capital assets you purchase. So if

[54:02] you just go forward as one now actually yeah um so the 2019 23 in the course of

[54:08] speaking to Luke about our 2428 plan which they do you can see there's not

[54:13] submitted or there's not one on file with the province. Um we did have a 2019

[54:19] 23 plan but two of the three projects have not been started. So, if you look

[54:23] at your council package, you don't need to open this now, but I did include a

[54:27] copy of the actual 2019 23 plan. There's three projects in it. The first one on

[54:33] page four is the California Road upgrades that was completed. Um the

[54:39] second one, Brain Street upgrade for 200,000 was not completed.

[54:43] » And the third project on page six was the it just says various municipal road

[54:49] upgrades. That was not completed. So, what Luke said is that um

[54:56] that money has to be allocated through this five-year program. So, our five

[55:01] year we either we can do the projects that are listed there as two and three

[55:05] or we can remove those because they're not started um and replace them with one

[55:11] project, three project, whatever, however many to spend that roughly

[55:14] 290,000 or so extending it. And um what we can't do is transfer that money

[55:22] to the 2420 had just add it to the 2428 plan. So the 881,000 that has been

[55:28] allocated to fire 2428 must stay in the 202428

[55:33] and you cannot absorb or um or or add in the 286 that's in the 2019 23 plan which

[55:40] is not that big a deal. You just pick projects that add up to that and put

[55:44] them in. Uh but for council's information, we will next week where our

[55:48] plan is to my plan is to um update the 20 23 2019 23 plan. I will check with

[55:55] Luke. I'll send it to him before the council meeting and see that it's more

[55:58] or less okay. We'll add in projects and we'll do the

[56:02] same with the 2428, give him a preview of it, which is pretty normal just to

[56:06] see the council approves it. Then you find out you can't do something in there

[56:10] and then it's creates another loop. You have to go back and update it again. So,

[56:15] and just as a note I've made before, the 2428 plan, 50% of the last year's

[56:20] allocation uh was held and will be continue to be

[56:24] held until they receive the 24 to 28 plan. So, it's going to go to the next

[56:29] slide. What I'm roughly proposing, but is that

[56:37] the 286,9 roughly that's there you could keep the

[56:41] breakthrough project. You will notice it's 200 in there. Um

[56:46] I was talking to the mayor a little bit earlier about this. That could be

[56:50] another street. That is something we can discuss. I think we identified church

[56:53] and school maybe as the highest priorities. Um but the ad there is that

[56:59] um you keep that street, keep project two andor change the street that you

[57:04] were going to do. Although great is a good candidate for work as well. Uh I

[57:09] would propose that you replace project three with new community projects. So

[57:13] what we talked before council is u beersville claville community center. Um

[57:20] there's they would like to have concrete pad for the rinkage gravel. Now that

[57:24] would be about 50k the bass river hall. Uh they want a wheelchair accessible

[57:29] ramp and stairs. Their current ramp and stairs shouldn't be very bad here. Uh

[57:34] that' be 35. And for Greenwood Lodge, there's bathroom rep rates. Make sure

[57:38] again wheelchair accessibility as well as front steps like on preeps 25.

[57:44] Those are not super firm uh estimates in the sense that they're based on quotes

[57:49] and that sort of thing. That's not the case. They are estimates, but they're

[57:52] pretty fair estimates. I don't think they'll go north or south too badly. And

[57:56] to the extent that they will um within that you know spend there could be you

[58:01] know pluses and minuses that have to come out to about that total of 110 and

[58:05] or you cover through operating expenditures. Um then I'm done in there.

[58:11] You could also add in project 4 new project in that if you had um and this

[58:17] is fluid. You could make the 150 180 and not do the fourth in that within the 23

[58:23] plan. But I thought I did for the sake of getting to the figure I had 30 in

[58:30] there against the Beersville roof which >> the community center.

[58:34] » No, no, that's roof. do that. Now, that does sort of

[58:39] start to play with the line of difference between repair and

[58:41] maintenance and asset. I'd have to check with Luke to see whether that was fully

[58:45] eligible. I think it will be, but that does poke towards the line a bit. Um,

[58:53] » so that would take care of the 2019 23 between and you could say for like a

[58:59] street upgrade and then um the community projects

[59:03] » that owns up to the 286. >> Yeah. All those

[59:08] » four projects. Okay. >> Yeah. Now, the other the other note

[59:10] about that is that um uh for the in case you're wondering, when we're doing

[59:16] projects for a third party organization, nonprofit, all of the transactions run

[59:21] through us. So, we would do the quoting, we would do the uh we would get the

[59:26] quotes, we pick the vendor, we do the payments, it would all root through the

[59:30] town. It would not root through those organiz that would be you can drift them

[59:34] through, but it creates more complications. completely advised that

[59:37] each of the town should just do itself. It keeps it simpler and keeps you out of

[59:41] trouble anymore. >> Sounds good.

[59:43] » So, just on the um two things again, the grade street upgrade that street so that

[59:50] we can do that like with 150,000 obviously.

[59:55] » Well, it depends on what you do. So you could if you I mean if you did repaving

[1:00:00] I think the original scope had like a removal of sidewalk and then there was

[1:00:04] repaving and do the full length. You could also do part of the street.

[1:00:07] There's nothing says you have to do the whole street. We I don't any not to keep

[1:00:12] on saying I but we had a long street but we only did about a quarter of them. We

[1:00:16] did it two years consecutively because we couldn't afford to do it all in one

[1:00:19] year. But um in any event uh there are options there but you could also switch

[1:00:23] out the church or school. >> Yeah. You know, there's another thing

[1:00:27] with school. I was going to mention to pay after

[1:00:30] » the problem. There's a problem with school.

[1:00:33] » What is it? >> Well, with the buses and and drop off

[1:00:37] some pickups, there's like it needs to be wide.

[1:00:39] » Terrible. >> It's not not wide enough.

[1:00:42] » No way. >> No way.

[1:00:43] » Does it have a sidewalk? >> Yes.

[1:00:46] » Yeah. >> It has a pull in

[1:00:49] to get into detail, but it's future thing. Yes. Beautiful springs and you

[1:00:54] can't go away. But the other thing too, so uh the Lions

[1:00:59] Club, they requested upgrades to their kitchen.

[1:01:02] » What I did here was because these are all external organizations. The Lions

[1:01:06] Club, while it's still an external organization, it's our building, right?

[1:01:09] » So these are not our building. So I lump these together because a community uh

[1:01:14] upgrade project for things that are not in that we do not own. So buildings we

[1:01:21] don't. And then the other thing I mentioned off

[1:01:24] the top the counselor is that this is not the sum total of all the capital

[1:01:28] work we'll do and there's actually in the last slide I mentioned there's still

[1:01:31] money we we have through reserves and savings we can allocate this is simply

[1:01:36] this is what I thought would be more an approach to resolving or closing off

[1:01:41] 2019 23 and then as well you'll see 20 20 uh uh 24 to 28 becomes relatively

[1:01:47] simple when you factor in the two trucks to be purchased and and that was

[1:01:51] intentional because now trucks with first time are allowed under CCBF and

[1:01:55] the purchase of those two trucks would essentially uh that would that would

[1:02:00] take care of the 881 plus and they'll I'll explain how the

[1:02:03] » next slide. >> Yeah.

[1:02:06] Yeah. Yeah. >> So with 2024 2028 we have 881 to

[1:02:11] allocate. So you buy the rubber trainer for Rex and 825 and look if there's play

[1:02:17] the numbers if it's 25 for but in any event um it was 525 from CCBF and 8 300

[1:02:26] from source so that would be from reserves that we already have and this

[1:02:30] will be by next year that you would have it. So we had for example now I don't

[1:02:35] want to be too definitive here but it looks like we'll be having the surplus

[1:02:38] for 2025 and north of 200. So that's now that was not put into reserve last year

[1:02:44] but it is available to the town. So the idea there is the way to get the 825 525

[1:02:50] CCDF 300 from source the truck for the Beersville hard courts 550

[1:02:56] uh if you do do that in the last year this plan 350 for CCDF 200 from source

[1:03:01] so that's 500 on source total and 825 uh eight sorry 875 which basically takes

[1:03:09] out I mean again I'm using round figures for simplicity, but that takes it grade

[1:03:13] 81 and then you're that so that plan for 218 consists of two fire trucks and then

[1:03:20] everything else. But the nice thing about that is that everything else we

[1:03:23] decide to do, we don't have to litigate, manage, coordinate it with Luke and God

[1:03:30] bless Luke, but we don't have to go to the province for permission or haggle

[1:03:33] over anything or get it validated or tested, etc., etc. Is our choice

[1:03:38] qualified? It's a check in the box. It's done in order. So So it makes for a very

[1:03:43] simple, you know, CCF plan. >> So does that mean we have no cut

[1:03:47] payments? >> No. Well, it it depends like at the time

[1:03:53] when I say 300 source, you take a reserve, you decide to borrow

[1:03:58] » at that time. It'll depend on and we have the second part of this which is

[1:04:01] the harder and more challenging part is and and I might add like warranty

[1:04:06] there's a longer list of things for accent. There's some other things that

[1:04:09] Mark has mentioned for his then that fits into your capital envelope and even

[1:04:13] some of it in operating tanks you might go operating you might go assets but any

[1:04:18] event so in looking at the rest of it whether you have to borrow for not

[1:04:23] depends on what else you intend to spend how many streets we do is there a sewer

[1:04:26] system part two that we have to do the cost we need etc etc so that's that's

[1:04:31] what uh and not to get too nuanced but if you if there were a sewer system part

[1:04:36] two >> it might be easier to do that to your

[1:04:39] own reserves or savings than it is through borrowing or might or the flip

[1:04:43] of that. So that's a larger set of calculations. CCDF in a way is more

[1:04:48] contained and simple and that that knocks off your 881 that takes care of

[1:04:52] it. You can obviously you know purchase a $825,000 and a 550 with 881,000 but uh

[1:05:00] that's why that's where the 500 home source come in. So, so you believe it's

[1:05:04] it would be best practice to use the tax >> whatever

[1:05:10] gas tax money >> um to to pay for the two fire trucks for

[1:05:15] example. >> Um

[1:05:18] whereas could we not use that money for

[1:05:26] other road projects and borrow that money? The reason why Deputy Mary

[1:05:32] wouldn't the way I would say you would do that this is

[1:05:36] » I think part of the challenge if you were committed to buying this one way or

[1:05:39] the other the easiest way to do it is through the CCBF because it simplifies

[1:05:42] the administration of that program and they don't let here's the thing let's

[1:05:46] suppose for a moment you >> decided you were going to do you're

[1:05:49] going to pay roads AB C and D >> and then two years from now you decide

[1:05:54] you know what I'd rather pay D than Da go back and change your plan if you make

[1:05:58] that change because they actually ask you for coordinates like G uh GPS

[1:06:03] coordinates for your roads and the length of the roads and the whole thing

[1:06:06] when you do that application. So to avoid all that, if you p if we know the

[1:06:11] fire truck we're buying, we say we're going to purchase this firet truck for

[1:06:14] this department, done deal, we contribute 300, you take three, there's

[1:06:19] no fuss. But everything you do, like if you do an upgrade to a park and you say

[1:06:23] you change, if your plans change or your priorities change,

[1:06:26] » you got to go back through the process, which isn't like everybody, there's no

[1:06:31] need to go through that. It just keeps it nice and simple forward.

[1:06:35] » Yeah. The simplest. So for the truck payments that I don't believe you guys

[1:06:41] have any >> um

[1:06:43] » truck payments you have you guys have any deurly.

[1:06:46] » Yeah. >> Oh there are Mark you said you have

[1:06:50] trucks being paid off. Where would that those payments that what I would

[1:06:56] » they just disappear? a couple that where were those pig? So let me see if I fall.

[1:07:02] I was leading to another point which is I would not at least the way I think I

[1:07:06] can tell you I do not think about and you talk about the market like we had

[1:07:11] five deer payments after a million dollars for a fire. I do not necessarily

[1:07:14] think we replace them with five payments or two payments for a million. You don't

[1:07:18] go leg for life. You go based on what you actually need. Might be more, it

[1:07:21] might be less. The timing might be different, etc.

[1:07:24] you you you you borrow what you should what you need to borrow

[1:07:29] » and if you didn't have to borrow then that would be the ideal world and you

[1:07:32] had lots of funds that come in but the details of that you kind of hash out all

[1:07:37] like the purchases after this which leaves all the internal work if you will

[1:07:41] for the town or I should forgive me saying town it's a habit

[1:07:44] » I know >> for mis valley you can figure out as you

[1:07:47] go along so the second part of this the capital the large the internal capital

[1:07:51] plan which will include this is more complicated and gets into more decision

[1:07:56] like it gets into that do we borrow is it reserves what makes sense etc and it

[1:08:00] depends on everybody interest rates >> um you know other say what you do

[1:08:06] » don't you also kind of need a rainy day slush fund for it just in case

[1:08:10] » yeah I mean you >> you don't want to deplete your reserves

[1:08:14] right >> that's a larger discussion and strategy

[1:08:17] on like >> that's why they have operating reserves

[1:08:19] and capital reserves and capital funds >> uh to give you

[1:08:24] But like you said, it is these are the two things we're gonna do.

[1:08:28] These are our two plans and a conversation.

[1:08:32] another TA said actually you should they say you

[1:08:37] know for your CCBF or your gas tax just keep it as simple as you can like have

[1:08:41] fewer projects and make them so write them in such a way they've actually they

[1:08:46] write them in such a way you have more flexibility to administer them or to

[1:08:49] decide to do they actually because of the change they've made to the template

[1:08:53] you have less flexibility because now they want you to put kilometers make you

[1:08:57] got to get coordinates they want you to be able to look up and see what you're

[1:09:00] doing so it's really But it's a pretty big oversight to have. So this is like

[1:09:05] super simple. >> And this is the first time they've

[1:09:07] allowed >> first time. Well, 25 you said. Yeah. 25.

[1:09:11] Yeah. >> Started 24. You could

[1:09:13] » we're going to talk about this morning. >> Yes.

[1:09:16] » Yes. This is an overview tonight. >> Um people to think about I guess

[1:09:24] look at >> Yeah. And we can see our

[1:09:28] next

[1:09:31] » okay so

[1:09:36] that was all >> that was

[1:09:38] » so we'll go on to 5D by policy updates. >> Yeah.

[1:09:47] » Oh the okay >> just a short update I guess. Yeah,

[1:09:52] update is just a narrative add to this, but just for the information of council.

[1:09:56] So, the bylaw committee has been working on two two uh two bylaws and four

[1:10:03] policies now four policies and two bylaws priming the proceedings of

[1:10:06] council and the sewer. >> So, we've got that to a pretty big state

[1:10:10] and pretty close and I think ready for second reading.

[1:10:13] » Yeah. >> Uh the four policies administrative

[1:10:16] standards which I talked about with council before which again has been

[1:10:19] tuned and is getting there. uh municipal fees and charges which is the idea of

[1:10:23] which is to concentrate or to consolidate all fees and charges for her

[1:10:27] and town. So there's a one-stop shop for residents as well as council on a yearly

[1:10:32] basis to decide or both to share what their rates and fees are or to update

[1:10:37] them with your council. Um we added a a policy for coding which just creates a

[1:10:44] standard um set of codes for both bylaws and policies. So it's simplified and

[1:10:49] obvious. And so over time it can stay consistent and so people know that like

[1:10:55] you know proceedings of council is A1 for example

[1:11:00] » and uh the final one is we did get a first draft to the bylaw and policy

[1:11:06] committee of the grant program municipal grant program.

[1:11:10] » So that is again pretty good but there's still be some tuning we did for that one

[1:11:15] as well but uh that's in place. So that's all just was

[1:11:18] » that's for Tuesday night. >> Tuesday night. Yeah. We have

[1:11:22] » coming forward, right? >> Yeah.

[1:11:26] » Yeah. But actually >> the current plan is for the bylaws to do

[1:11:31] a second reading council by title >> and then two of the policies this is we

[1:11:37] were discussing this earlier is that at least two of them will be held till

[1:11:41] April and then two may go through. I mean the codes is a very basic one.

[1:11:45] there's not a lot of in there for uh to be fussed over. And the gray one is

[1:11:49] though new is fairly advanced. Maybe that is ready for reading. Maybe we hold

[1:11:54] it till later. So that's the those are basically the issues here.

[1:12:00] » Good work. >> All right.

[1:12:03] So um I guess that takes up our open session. We're going to go into close

[1:12:07] session. together.

[1:12:18] » Thank you. Good night. See you guys. >> Drive safe.

[1:12:26] » We'd like to move that we go into a close session

[1:12:30] and Mike. All those in favor signify by

[1:12:33] saying against.

25.03.04 | Special Meeting | Mar 4 2025

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