[1:06] How are you?

[1:15] As bad as it sounds

[1:35] for a while.

[2:08] There's not

[2:35] Good stuff.

[2:39] All right.

[3:23] Okay.

[3:37] Yes.

[4:13] All right, perfect. Hey, welcome

[4:14] everyone. Thanks for coming to our

[4:16] meeting tonight for our business

[4:17] meeting. If you could please rise and

[4:19] join us for the pledge of allegiance.

[4:22] I pledge allegiance to the flag of the

[4:25] United States of America and to the

[4:27] republic for which it stands. One nation

[4:30] under God, indivisible, with liberty and

[4:33] justice for all.

[4:39] Okay.

[4:42] [clears throat] Well, welcome everyone.

[4:44] Thank you for showing up to our monthly

[4:46] business meeting. And uh Mr. Campbell,

[4:49] let the record reflect that all three

[4:50] trustees are present. Even Mr. Becker

[4:54] who had a little health scare. So glad

[4:56] you could be here with us. I'm glad

[4:57] you're doing all right.

[4:58] >> That's fine.

[4:58] >> The uh before we get into things, I'll I

[5:01] always like to go over this so everyone

[5:03] knows. Uh here in just a moment, we're

[5:05] going to have public comments and public

[5:07] comments uh are you have comment cards

[5:09] back there and that's for you to talk

[5:11] about anything that you want. You get

[5:12] five minutes to talk to the board and

[5:14] things that are on your mind. If you're

[5:16] here for a couple of the zoning cases,

[5:18] which I'm betting some of you probably

[5:20] are, uh I would suggest holding your

[5:23] comments until we get to that zoning

[5:25] case because basically you're going to

[5:26] have to repeat yourself twice. Uh if

[5:27] that makes sense. So,

[5:28] >> [clears throat]

[5:28] >> um for the sake of that, I would say

[5:30] wait till we get to that zoning

[5:32] resolution case. Uh but uh if you have

[5:34] anything else on your mind here in just

[5:35] a moment, you want to grab a public

[5:37] comment card back there, fill that out,

[5:38] and then we'll come by and grab that uh

[5:41] here in just a moment. Uh so, Mr. Mr.

[5:44] Campbell, are there any correspondents

[5:46] for tonight?

[5:47] >> Yes, sir. I have two. The first one is a

[5:49] liquor permit. Uh, this is a new permit

[5:53] for Amy's FNB LLC,

[5:57] uh, doing business as scramblers. 4375

[6:00] Ferguson Drive, Sweet C, Cincinnati,

[6:02] Ohio 45245.

[6:05] Um,

[6:07] police department says I have no

[6:08] objections and Mr. Flowy has sent over

[6:11] the corresponding zoning and it is

[6:14] permitted in that use.

[6:17] Uh second, I've got a um a letter from

[6:21] the Cincinnati Snapdragons

[6:24] uh thank you card. Really says to our

[6:26] friends at Union Township, thank you

[6:28] again for all your support of the

[6:30] Snapdragons.

[6:31] Our athletes had fun playing baseball

[6:34] this season.

[6:36] Please accept our donation as gratitude

[6:39] for all you do. The Cincinnati Stop

[6:42] Dragons.

[6:44] That concludes the correspondence. Good

[6:46] job, Mr. Campbell. Appreciate that very

[6:47] much. And uh Okay, personnel actions

[6:51] tonight. And uh Mr. Taylor, they are

[6:55] both for you. So, I will throw the floor

[6:57] over to you and I'm going to let you

[6:58] introduce the first candidate, sir.

[7:03] » Thank you, Mr. uh Dills. Uh oh. Stand in

[7:07] front of the podium.

[7:08] >> To the podium.

[7:09] Just turn around the

[7:10] other side.

[7:11] >> Yeah.

[7:12] >> Well, we're the ones that got to vote on

[7:14] you. So, [laughter]

[7:16] >> it's all right.

[7:17] >> We're going to we're going to use this

[7:18] video future

[7:19] >> after we hear from the audience.

[7:20] [laughter]

[7:22] >> Thank presenting to the board of

[7:25] trustees Eric Lenslogger for

[7:27] consideration of employment with the

[7:29] Union Township Service Department. Mr.

[7:31] Lens Slogger is a resident of Claremont

[7:33] County.

[7:35] Mr. Lton Slogger has uh an extensive

[7:39] background in construction, concrete,

[7:41] and blacktop, having spent many years in

[7:43] the private sector as well as the public

[7:45] sector. Uh Mr. Louden Slogger has

[7:49] successfully completed all

[7:50] pre-employment phases for the

[7:52] maintenance worker one position. I would

[7:54] like to request that the board appoint

[7:57] Mr. or will Eric Lens Slogger to the

[7:59] position of maintenance worker one in

[8:01] accordance with the collective

[8:02] bargaining agreement at the two-year

[8:05] rate. Mr. Lton Slugger start date would

[8:08] be September 2nd, 2026.

[8:11] >> Got it.

[8:13] >> Yeah. Thank you, Mr. Chiller. Uh Mr.

[8:16] Becker, anything for Eric?

[8:17] >> Uh just want to say uh thank you for

[8:20] considering Union Township for

[8:22] employment. You sound like you are

[8:24] qualified for the position.

[8:25] >> Thank you.

[8:27] Mr. Luke, sir.

[8:28] >> Uh, hey, no, just we're looking forward

[8:30] to welcoming you to the team. We have uh

[8:32] so much trust and respect in uh uh your

[8:34] boss, Mr. Taylor, and so we know anyone

[8:37] that he brings forward is uh uh going to

[8:39] be a great asset to to support him and

[8:42] the team. So, we're looking forward to

[8:43] having you. Thanks.

[8:44] >> The uh Eric, yeah, you you got your

[8:47] family here?

[8:48] >> I did not.

[8:48] >> No, it's okay. No sweat. The uh uh

[8:50] Claremont County resident, fantastic. A

[8:52] lot of asphalt experience. uh you you'll

[8:55] definitely be a good fit for the team.

[8:56] Uh service department is a great group

[8:58] of guys. You're going to love them. So

[8:59] they'll have your back. Everyone's

[9:01] teammanship mentality. Uh so you you'll

[9:04] love it. So um yeah, welcome to the

[9:06] team. So uh give me just one more minute

[9:08] and then by the way, after we get done

[9:09] voting, if you could uh hang out to the

[9:12] side just for a minute and then we got

[9:13] one more in the service department, then

[9:14] we'll grab a picture with you before you

[9:16] go. Okay. Perfect. Yeah, no sweat. So uh

[9:18] gentlemen, I'll entertain a motion for

[9:20] the approval of the hire of Eric

[9:22] Lenslagger. That's not German, is it?

[9:26] >> To the position of maintenance worker

[9:27] one at the step three two-year rate

[9:29] consistent with the collective bargain

[9:30] agreement with effective date of

[9:31] September 2nd, 2026 pending successful

[9:34] completion of physical examination.

[9:36] >> So move second.

[9:37] >> All right. Any discussion? Mr. Campbell.

[9:39] Roll call.

[9:40] >> Mr. Becker.

[9:41] >> Yes.

[9:42] >> Mr. Lo.

[9:42] >> Yes.

[9:43] >> Mr. Dills.

[9:44] >> Yes.

[9:44] >> Motion carries.

[9:45] >> Congratulations, Eric.

[9:52] Eric.

[9:53] >> Eric.

[9:57] » Yeah.

[9:58] >> Congratulations.

[10:00] >> He's new here.

[10:01] >> Congratulations.

[10:02] >> Congrats. Welcome aboard.

[10:03] >> Congratulations.

[10:05] >> Congrats, Eric.

[10:10] » Thank you.

[10:11] >> And there just hang out real quick.

[10:13] >> Either way. Yeah. the uh do whatever you

[10:17] want.

[10:18] >> Mr. Taylor, sir, I will throw the floor

[10:19] right back over to you, sir.

[10:22] >> Thank you, Mr. Dills. Uh tonight, I

[10:25] would like to present an employee for

[10:27] consideration of promotion. I would like

[10:30] to present John Cascaden for the

[10:31] position of maintenance worker 2, Mr.

[10:34] Cascaden. Cascaden has been a service

[10:36] department employee since 2006. During

[10:39] his tenure, Mr. Cascaden has worked in

[10:42] all facets of the service department. He

[10:44] has also became a certified playground

[10:46] safety instructor and has also received

[10:49] a certification in parks and recreation

[10:51] management from the NR NP.

[10:55] Mr. Cascaden also has an associates

[10:57] degree in business administration and

[10:59] has successfully completed all facets of

[11:01] the promotion

[11:02] >> and tested for his weight. [laughter]

[11:05] So, um, no, we're we're thrilled that you continue your service

[11:09] with us. Uh, so thank you for that.

[11:12] John, you got your family here, right?

[11:16] >> Let me please point them out. Point

[11:17] [clears throat] them out, please.

[11:19] [snorts]

[11:22] » Yeah, I saw I saw

[11:25] >> our dispatch. Yeah.

[11:26] >> Yeah. Well, good. Good. The uh uh John,

[11:29] good people, man. 20 years you've been

[11:31] with Union Township. Appreciate you very

[11:32] much. And uh no doubt you're a leader

[11:34] within the team. And uh I know Mr.

[11:37] Becker has. I have. We've seen you

[11:39] downstairs at the gym many many times

[11:40] getting out after 12:00 noon for

[11:42] lunchtime like clockworks. So uh but you always step up and help help uh the

[11:47] whole team whenever needed. So

[11:49] appreciate you very much. Also I've

[11:50] heard Mr. Taylor said you went back and

[11:51] got several certifications education

[11:53] while you've been here for the past 20

[11:55] years. Appreciate you very much. So uh

[11:56] no doubt we want you to stay here and

[11:58] retire with us. So you're doing a great

[11:59] job. So appreciate you very much. Yeah

[12:01] absolutely. So uh gentlemen I'll

[12:02] entertain a motion for the approval for

[12:05] the promotion of John Cascaden Jr. to

[12:06] the position of maintenance two worker

[12:08] maintenance worker two at the step five

[12:10] 5-year rate consistent with collective

[12:12] bargaining agreement effective date

[12:13] August 12th 2026

[12:15] >> move

[12:22] okay

[12:36] » all All right. And by the way, s they're

[12:37] going to clear off for a second. If

[12:38] anyone has a public comment card, Miss

[12:41] is going to be walking around right

[12:42] there. If you could hand that to her.

[12:44] This is not for zoning cases. Just just

[12:46] public comment. She's going to grab

[12:47] those.

[12:49] Anyone? Oh, it looks like looks like

[12:51] Jude's got one. Perfect.

[12:54] All right.

[12:58] Okay.

[13:08] All right.

[13:11] Perfect. Perfect. Thanks, M.

[13:14] Okay. Got a few of them. No sweat. All

[13:16] right. No particular order. Uh, all

[13:19] right. First one. Uh, is it Mark? Is it

[13:22] Blackham? Did I say that correct? Mark.

[13:24] See, sir, come on up. And then, uh, just

[13:26] do me a favor. You got five minutes and

[13:28] whatever's on your mind, just state your

[13:29] name and address for the record. But you

[13:31] are good to go, sir.

[13:32] My name is Mark Blackham. My address is

[13:35] 4257

[13:37] Court Ohio

[13:40] and

[13:42] trustees.

[13:42] >> Thank you.

[13:43] >> Uh come before you to uh just express my

[13:47] concern about the license plate readers

[13:51] that have been placed. Um I work in IT

[13:56] and uh concerned about information that

[14:00] is gathered. Um how it's used

[14:04] and the access to that information.

[14:10] I don't know if there are any um

[14:14] procedures

[14:15] and policies that are in place that

[14:18] would protect the citizens of their

[14:21] people.

[14:23] And the other point that I have is that

[14:27] one of the cameras was was placed in the

[14:30] property.

[14:31] >> Okay.

[14:32] >> And concerned about the privacy.

[14:35] >> Sure.

[14:35] >> So it's kind of pointing in towards my

[14:37] backyard. So

[14:40] >> Okay. Okay. Thank you very much. The uh

[14:42] Anything else, Mr. Black? What's that?

[14:45] >> Is there any

[14:48] policies or procedures that we have

[14:52] citizens?

[14:53] Now, the now there are other agencies

[14:56] that are allowed access to our cameras

[14:58] if we allow them. And the best way I can

[15:01] explain that to you is if another

[15:02] department in another state is looking

[15:03] for a stolen car that they believe might

[15:05] be in Ohio, specifically Union Township,

[15:07] they may ask for permission to access

[15:09] our camera system to see if that

[15:11] particular plates's been through Union

[15:13] Township. And we would typically grant

[15:15] that.

[15:15] >> And how often does that happen?

[15:17] Typically,

[15:17] >> quite quite quite quite frequently. that

[15:20] we have other departments around the

[15:21] country request access to our cameras,

[15:24] but that doesn't mean that they have

[15:26] access to every still shot of every car

[15:28] that's been through Union Township. That

[15:30] just means that they are allowed to see

[15:31] if the plate or the car they are looking

[15:33] for has been through Union Township.

[15:39] Sir.

[15:39] >> So in in short,

[15:41] the positive side of that is criminal

[15:45] activity

[15:47] that could be associated with a plate

[15:50] is what is looked for via like an

[15:53] algorithm,

[15:55] >> right? I mean, I don't know how much you

[15:56] know about the cameras, sir, but they're

[15:57] not they're not surveillance in in the

[16:00] respect of there's an officer sitting at

[16:02] the station watching the cameras and

[16:04] it's a live feed. They strictly take

[16:06] pictures of cars as they go by. So it's

[16:08] a imagine a still shot of a vehicle with

[16:10] a license plate on the back.

[16:12] >> Yeah.

[16:12] >> Does it even maintain visual images or

[16:17] does it essentially

[16:19] strip the license plate so that like

[16:22] >> strictly a picture of a car? If if your

[16:25] officers or another entity is looking to

[16:27] find a license plate number that that's

[16:31] the only license plate number that's

[16:32] going to hit if it hits because it came

[16:34] through that camera.

[16:35] >> If if they give us a license plate

[16:36] number. Yeah.

[16:38] >> So is this camera in a in a neighborhood

[16:40] or is it on a main drag?

[16:42] >> It's on um

[16:46] >> Okay. Because because there are HOA

[16:48] cameras that are not controlled by by

[16:50] the township.

[16:52] >> These are township cameras. Okay.

[16:58] » Yeah, I believe I know the camera you're

[17:00] talking about. Those cameras, they're

[17:01] not positioned. We don't have any in in

[17:03] neighborhoods. They're usually along

[17:05] Thorough affairs. However, I can't

[17:06] guarantee the the camera that's aimed at

[17:08] a thoroughare doesn't catch a house or

[17:10] two in your neighborhood. I think I know

[17:12] the camera you're talking about, though.

[17:14] >> Is that one of ours or is that an HOA?

[17:16] >> That's one of ours.

[17:17] >> Okay.

[17:17] >> Yeah.

[17:17] >> Okay.

[17:19] our our cameras are only that that the

[17:21] township leases are only on thorough

[17:23] affairs. Think old 74 125 uh Mount

[17:27] Carmel Tobasco Road. They're not back in

[17:29] neighborhoods on on on township streets.

[17:33] >> Okay.

[17:34] >> Yeah. Well, and so what is the retention

[17:36] period on that?

[17:37] >> 30 days.

[17:38] >> Yeah. Th So those those still shots that

[17:41] are taken are captured for 30 days. So

[17:44] if you drive by by one today, you're

[17:45] placed captured for 30 days. Then the

[17:47] camera overwrites it. So we have 30 days

[17:49] a 30-day look back period on those.

[17:54] » Correct. Correct.

[17:59] » So is there any reports on

[18:02] the destruction of that information?

[18:05] >> They're strictly wrote over. I I'm sure

[18:08] that if we did a breakdown, we could

[18:10] tell what plates for what period of time

[18:13] were captured in our system if we did an

[18:15] audit on it. But we trust that the

[18:17] system overwrites it every 30 days. And

[18:20] it's a pretty easy check. I mean, we can

[18:22] check if we if we've looked for a

[18:24] certain license plate on a certain date.

[18:27] If it's still in there 30 days after 30

[18:29] days from then, then we'll know the

[18:30] system's not working correct.

[18:35] » I just have concern in general about it.

[18:38] >> Sure. gathering information about our

[18:40] citizens. You know, I I would expect

[18:43] that, you know, if I was in a prison or

[18:46] incarcerated, but in our environment, I

[18:49] don't expect that, you know, to be

[18:51] something that our government would be

[18:54] gathering information about the citizens

[18:56] and those types of things. I

[18:59] frankly,

[19:01] you know, probably looking at this

[19:06] you know investigations and stuff

[19:08] criminal activity uh our area is very

[19:12] low you know crime area that's one of

[19:15] the reasons why I live here and you know

[19:17] having that extra surveillance as a

[19:22] citizen something I don't really expect

[19:26] to have here

[19:30] » I completely understand hear your

[19:32] perspective on it and I'm definitely

[19:35] open continuing to hear, you know, your

[19:37] type of concern, uh, community's

[19:39] perspectives as well. Um, I I agree with

[19:43] you too from your own individual

[19:45] perspective as we live in a safe

[19:48] community. Um, I guess I have somewhat

[19:50] firsthand experience where uh, my wife's

[19:54] car was stolen out of our driveway,

[19:56] middle of the night, and the license

[19:58] plate hit on flock cameras that were

[20:00] along Beachmont Avenue somewhere. I

[20:02] think it's Beachmont Avenue. Don't cite

[20:04] me to that specific fact. It was

[20:06] somewhere east of here through Anderson

[20:08] Township. Um, and between that and

[20:11] having a locator on the car that I

[20:14] thankfully had uh with some other

[20:17] possessions in the car, um, it it made

[20:20] it so that the team was able to recover

[20:22] that car within five hours since it was

[20:25] stolen. Um, which was miraculous. But

[20:29] that do recognize when you're in that

[20:33] you know,

[20:35] criminal activity comes to your

[20:36] doorstep.

[20:41] » Yeah.

[20:50] » Me either. And I'd chat with you as long

[20:52] as I could too on I carry this in my

[20:55] pocket, right?

[20:59] I carry this in my pocket like pretty

[21:01] much everybody else here. And

[21:04] this has a camera, microphone,

[21:07] everything

[21:08] >> you choose to take with you.

[21:09] >> Yeah. With you. It's not

[21:11] >> right.

[21:16] >> I'm just telling you I I I hear you and

[21:17] completely understand. And that that's

[21:19] type of technology that has been

[21:21] [clears throat] accessible to be able to

[21:24] um

[21:26] outside of our jurisdiction. That's all

[21:27] I can say. Yeah.

[21:28] >> Mr. Black, I'll just say this and then

[21:30] uh and then I I I'll be good. But um it

[21:33] solved a lot of crime very fast, very

[21:35] quickly. If we if we do the old school

[21:38] way, that's fine, too. We can absolutely

[21:39] do that and pull them down. I don't have

[21:40] a problem with that at all.

[21:42] >> [snorts]

[21:42] >> Um, if if someone was to break into your

[21:44] car, uh, and you capture a a black

[21:48] Toyota Camry, but that's all the

[21:49] information you have at 11 o'clock at

[21:51] night, we can run that data, type in

[21:55] black Toyota Camry, and from 11:00 to

[21:57] 11:15 or 11:30, if it pass any of those

[21:59] cameras, we can narrow it down and just

[22:00] help the detectives. Oh, there's the

[22:02] license plate. Let's track the address.

[22:04] Let's go knock on a door. Um, it would

[22:06] help solve crime, it does help solve

[22:08] crimes a lot faster. However, uh if if

[22:10] the community of Union Township feels

[22:12] like it's it's they don't like them,

[22:14] they don't want them, um that's that's

[22:16] fine. We can we can take them down. Um I

[22:18] don't think that's a sort of any one of

[22:19] us is going to die or who any of us is

[22:21] going to die on. I'll tell you, um

[22:23] >> I just don't want to make a knee-jerk

[22:24] reaction because I'll tell you, all the

[22:26] surrounding police forces have them for

[22:28] the most part. For the most part. And we would be the only ones that

[22:32] didn't. Then then the question goes,

[22:33] well then do you want us to access if

[22:35] your house or car got broke into or

[22:37] someone hit skip and they left, do you

[22:39] want us to access flocks and Anderson,

[22:41] Miami, Hamilton Township to try to track

[22:43] down the criminal or is that unfair?

[22:45] Should we not do that because we took

[22:46] ours down? So those are questions that

[22:48] we need to ask. So I don't want to make

[22:49] an reaction, but I will say if the

[22:50] community of Union Township solely feels

[22:52] that this is a violation and it

[22:54] violates, you know, our Fourth Amendment

[22:56] rights, then um roger that. We'll pull

[22:58] them down. Um, however, however,

[23:02] um, we cannot complain when it takes

[23:04] three, four, five weeks to solve a

[23:06] simple break into a car when it could

[23:08] have taken two hours. You know, and the

[23:10] biggest example I can give is the Mason

[23:13] shooting that happened. Guy got 22

[23:15] bullets put in him and it was because of

[23:17] a flock camera and tracked down the guy

[23:19] on 275 and he got him real quick. Um,

[23:22] would have happened that fast if they

[23:24] didn't have flock cameras to to when that car passed that plate. Uh, so

[23:28] questions we all have to just think and

[23:30] ask ourselves, but uh, but I I for me,

[23:32] I'll speak for me, it's not a hill I'm

[23:34] willing to die on. If the community

[23:35] doesn't want them, we'll pull them down.

[23:36] However, I will say it does help solve

[23:39] crime pretty quickly. Um, so but but but

[23:42] all good, you know, I hear you loud and

[23:44] clear though. Yeah.

[23:45] >> Yeah. No problem. Thank you, sir.

[23:46] Appreciate you.

[23:47] >> Yeah, good question.

[23:50] >> Okay, now Mr. Chair, looking at this

[23:52] one, this one might be for you, just so

[23:53] you know. So, you might want to take

[23:54] down this name and address. Uh, I got a

[23:55] Scott Shielman and hopefully I'm

[23:57] pronouncing your name right. Shean

[23:58] Shielman.

[24:02] » 2016.

[24:05] » Oh, I see your case number. Yeah. Yeah,

[24:07] you're good. I I don't need this thing.

[24:08] You're fine. Yep. Never mind. You're

[24:09] good. [snorts] Okay, perfect. Sorry. The

[24:11] uh Okay. Uh, let's see here. Uh, John

[24:14] Hunt.

[24:16] >> Mr. Hunt.

[24:18] >> Oh gosh. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay.

[24:20] So, yeah.

[24:22] >> Yeah. You're good. You're good. No

[24:23] sweat. Oh, our good friend, Mr. Dit.

[24:25] Jude, come on up.

[24:37] » Mr. Dit, you you know protocol. You go

[24:40] on ahead. The floor is yours.

[24:44] » Good evening, gentlemen. My name is

[24:46] Jude, 392 Banks Road.

[24:53] Um, I just wanted to congratulate all of

[24:57] you, including the police chief, for a

[25:01] wonderful police night out. It was

[25:04] great.

[25:04] >> It was

[25:06] >> um I was helping with the food and

[25:10] around the back of the concession stand

[25:13] down at the bottom of the hill.

[25:16] It was Now, I know that that was all

[25:19] reworked this year. That land was re

[25:25] It needs some smoothing. It needs some

[25:28] It still needs a little bit of work. We

[25:31] had trouble walking down the hill. Um

[25:35] people with small children were the kids

[25:39] were tripping. Um

[25:42] it it just needs some some rework. So I

[25:46] just wanted to let you know about that

[25:48] and I will be back in the spring to

[25:50] remind you to have done.

[25:53] >> Which part of the park specifically?

[25:55] >> Behind the concession stand.

[25:59] >> No, gotcha. Gotcha. Michelle, are you

[26:00] good on that?

[26:01] >> We got you, Mr. Good call. Yeah. Yeah.

[26:04] [clears throat]

[26:05] >> But that was really the only problem I

[26:09] saw.

[26:13] » But I just let you know. I'll be back in

[26:16] the spring.

[26:17] >> Yes, ma'am.

[26:20] >> [clears throat]

[26:22] >> But we had fun and it was all really

[26:25] well done.

[26:26] >> No,

[26:27] >> thank you so much.

[26:28] >> I appreciate the kind words and

[26:29] encouragement. Thank you. Thank you, Mr.

[26:30] >> Thank you for volunteering.

[26:31] >> Thank you.

[26:33] >> The uh

[26:35] >> Okay, last call. Is there any other

[26:37] public comments at all? Anything on your

[26:39] mind?

[26:40] >> All right, seeing none, we'll close

[26:42] public comments

[26:44] and all right, department reports. Uh

[26:46] let's start with our fire chief. Uh,

[26:48] Chief Clemens, sir, floor is yours.

[26:50] >> Thank you, Mr. Dills. Uh, real quick,

[26:52] just an update on today's storm that

[26:54] came through. Uh, I know a lot of a lot

[26:56] of residents are currently without

[26:57] power. Uh, notification from Duke is

[26:59] that 40,000 residents within Claremont

[27:01] County are currently out. Uh, could take

[27:04] up to 24 hours to get everybody back up

[27:06] and running. So, just an update on that.

[27:08] We handled about 25 to 30 emergency

[27:11] calls with trees and wires down within

[27:13] that hour of the storm. So, it was a

[27:15] pretty busy day for the fire department.

[27:17] Um, so in the month of July, the fire

[27:19] department responded to 231 fire and

[27:21] service calls, 667

[27:24] EMS calls, which totals 8uh 98 total

[27:28] calls, which was average of 29 calls per

[27:31] day. Made patient contact with 604

[27:34] patients and transported 489 of those.

[27:39] uh completed 808 hours of training, took

[27:42] part in 13 public education details,

[27:45] hosted ride time for EMT paramedic

[27:47] students in a total of 78 hours, uh

[27:50] completed 48 life safety inspections and

[27:54] 16 inspections in conjunction with

[27:56] Claremont County Building Department.

[27:58] And that concludes my report.

[28:00] >> Thanks, Chief. Mr. Becker.

[28:03] >> Um I'm good. Okay,

[28:05] >> Mr. Luke, sir.

[28:10] Chief, if anyone's having uh uh

[28:15] pain in their jaw, pain in their left

[28:17] arm, um chest tightness, sweating, uh

[28:22] what should they do and how fast should

[28:24] they do it? Yeah, all of those are some

[28:26] serious uh symptoms uh which our

[28:29] recommendation is to to call 911 as fast

[28:31] as possible and get somebody get a

[28:33] professional on scene to mitigate the

[28:35] situation of transport.

[28:37] >> Well, nobody told me that.

[28:38] >> Okay.

[28:39] >> Um [laughter]

[28:40] should should should uh someone in that

[28:42] condition uh then also drive themsel to

[28:45] the hospital?

[28:47] >> I'll leave that. You don't have to

[28:48] answer that. You don't have to answer

[28:50] that. I'll leave it at that. I'm good.

[28:51] Thanks, Chief. [laughter]

[28:54] I didn't expect. That was pretty funny.

[28:55] >> That was funny.

[28:56] >> Yeah.

[28:58] >> Good opportunity to ask this fire chief

[29:00] some questions.

[29:03] >> You're good. You're good. Thank you,

[29:04] chief. And then, uh, our police

[29:06] department, uh, Chief Reese, sir.

[29:09] >> Thank you, Mr. Dills. In the month of

[29:10] July, the, uh, communications section

[29:13] handled 5,332 calls for service. Our

[29:17] record section processed uh 572

[29:20] court related documents for juvenile and

[29:22] adult court. We processed 148 uh court

[29:26] notices requiring an officer's

[29:27] appearance in court, handled 173 records

[29:31] requests, and redacted 36 body camera

[29:33] videos. In the area public relations,

[29:35] officers conducted uh or took part

[29:38] participated in six events, including

[29:40] two active shooter response trainings

[29:43] for area businesses. We participated in

[29:45] the Fourth of July parade parade in

[29:47] Shaylor Crossing, hosted a bike bicycle

[29:49] safety event in the polar fields, and

[29:52] participated in a quarterly outreach

[29:53] program with Eastgate Walmart, and we

[29:56] conducted one safety talk at a senior

[29:58] living facility. In the area of

[29:59] operations, our officers took 367

[30:02] incident reports, 100 crash reports,

[30:04] made 554 traffic stops, issued 176

[30:08] citations, 354 warnings, made 98

[30:11] criminal arrests, 91 traffic arrests,

[30:14] and served 83 criminal warrants. In the

[30:18] area of training, our officers attended

[30:19] 80 hours of training uh in the month of

[30:22] July. Currently within the police police

[30:25] department, we have three open police

[30:26] officer positions and a open dispatch

[30:30] position. Um, I just want to close by

[30:33] thanking our residents. Uh, as Miss Dit

[30:35] had noted, was another great police

[30:38] night out. Uh, probably the highest

[30:40] attendance we've had. And I also want to

[30:42] thank, uh, my fellow department heads,

[30:45] uh, Mr. Taylor and Chief Clemens. Um

[30:48] just the touch of the the uh tower truck

[30:50] and the flag uh helping with air care

[30:52] landing. It it really it's the police

[30:54] night out but it's really a township

[30:55] event and I just appreciate the help of

[30:57] all the other uh departments and making

[30:59] it a success. And lastly um to echo

[31:03] Chief Clemens comments today was an

[31:05] absolute mess. Um I stopped in our our

[31:07] dispatch center and I'm really proud of

[31:10] our dispatchers. They handled a really

[31:12] tough time incredibly, including one

[31:14] dispatcher who literally got a phone

[31:16] call while I was in there that a tree

[31:18] came down and totaled her garage. Uh we

[31:20] had extra help on today. She didn't

[31:22] leave. Uh she stayed there. Uh and I

[31:24] heard her tell her fellow dispatchers

[31:26] she wasn't going to leave them in that

[31:28] mess. So just so proud of of all our

[31:30] people. They they work really hard for our township residents. That

[31:34] concludes my report. Thank you.

[31:36] >> Thanks, Chief Reese. Uh vice chair.

[31:39] >> Uh yeah, a couple things. So, first off,

[31:40] um, kudos on on police night out. It was

[31:43] a once again a great event. Uh, on the

[31:47] callout reports there, there was one

[31:49] particular case I want to ask you about.

[31:51] It was a child in dangering would occur

[31:53] on July 14th. A little girl,

[31:57] two-year-old, severe burns. So, two

[32:00] questions.

[32:02] How is she? What's her condition? Is she recovered and or or not? And and

[32:08] what happened? Yeah. So, this was a

[32:10] young girl in this this case you're mentioning. Uh she had

[32:14] seconddegree burns. Long story short, no

[32:17] criminal, no neglect involved here. This

[32:19] was an apartment complex. The family

[32:21] just moved in. Um this is a younger

[32:23] child that got into the bathtub, turned

[32:25] the water on, and the maintenance

[32:28] unfortunately had the the water heater

[32:30] settings very high. Um she the the

[32:33] girl's doing fine. We we got her to the

[32:35] hospital, treated her for the burns, and

[32:37] she's okay.

[32:38] >> All right. Good. Yeah.

[32:38] >> Yeah. That that's that's easy to happen.

[32:41] Yeah. Okay. Thank you. That's all I

[32:42] have. Chairman,

[32:45] >> Mr. L.

[32:45] >> Hey, quick question, Chief, with um

[32:48] again an interest to hear from the

[32:50] community and and and and just really

[32:53] keep the pulse with that. Uh like like

[32:55] Trusty Dills said, um

[32:58] cameras, um if the community wants them

[33:02] or if the community doesn't want them,

[33:04] um fine either way. uh would it be

[33:08] impactful or difficult in the reporting

[33:11] if if you know I'm not sure if there is

[33:14] a count of when a flock camera's use in

[33:17] the preceding 30 days like benefited

[33:20] solving

[33:22] a crime or apprehending someone or like

[33:27] >> there's probably nothing ever positive.

[33:28] I know maybe historically too now

[33:31] there's a lot of discussion about flock

[33:32] cameras and people are looking where

[33:35] things are at and I understand there's a

[33:39] police perspective of criminals

[33:43] avoid

[33:45] those cameras as they can. Um, so I I

[33:48] don't know how much of that

[33:51] help is is is positive for the

[33:53] discussion to hear from the community,

[33:54] but yeah, as far as just a count of

[33:57] utilization, is that something that

[34:00] >> Yeah, good question. And we're trying,

[34:02] we're doing a much better job now

[34:04] because this is such a polarizing topic

[34:06] of tracking our success stories. I can

[34:09] tell you these cameras are used every

[34:11] day from minor misdemeanor shopliftings

[34:13] where they get take off in a car to

[34:15] major felonies. You know, we are solving

[34:17] real crime every day with these cameras

[34:19] and I wholeheartedly believe that the

[34:21] township is much safer because we have

[34:22] these cameras, but I do understand uh

[34:25] the the effect and and the impression

[34:28] that they leave on the community. Um

[34:30] we're solving crimes every day with

[34:31] them.

[34:33] >> Is is there is there ability to to Yeah.

[34:36] to have uh utilization.

[34:40] >> Uh you do

[34:41] >> you want like a hard number of how many

[34:42] crimes we're solving monthly with them

[34:44] >> to just just consider if that's if

[34:47] that's a value ad to the discussion or

[34:49] if the residents would want to would

[34:51] want to know it um or or see it at a

[34:54] trustees report. I don't know if Becker

[34:56] or Dells would have something to add to

[34:59] that concept, but it's just a question.

[35:01] So, um I don't have a metric to say go find now, but if you're open to

[35:08] seeing if he comes up with something or

[35:10] hey, here's how it's a pro or a con and

[35:13] or this utilization rate of the flock

[35:15] cameras.

[35:16] >> It's used every It's used Yeah, it's

[35:18] been used 30 times in the last 30 days

[35:20] and solved 30 crimes.

[35:21] >> It would be interesting to see the the

[35:23] crimes that have been solved. Um

[35:25] especially I mean I think of the what

[35:27] with the Venezuelan nationals that were

[35:29] knocking off a sheriffax I think three

[35:30] different times they got busted all

[35:32] three times

[35:32] >> with flockers

[35:33] >> with flocks. I mean that's great stuff

[35:35] and there's more and more stories like

[35:36] that and I think a compilation of those

[35:38] kind of stories is is great for the

[35:40] community that want to hear that.

[35:41] >> Yeah.

[35:42] We can certainly do that.

[35:44] >> Imagine the data pool's got to be be by

[35:46] that auditor that investigative

[35:48] sergeant. Yeah.

[35:51] uh if it does not put too much of a

[35:53] stress or bandwidth on the police

[35:55] because you are three officers short

[35:57] right now. Uh I say absolutely I'd like

[35:59] to have those stats but if you can't you

[36:00] can't I understand as well. So

[36:02] >> that's we can do that for sure.

[36:04] >> Thank you.

[36:05] >> Thanks.

[36:05] >> Great question for you. Uh Chief I'll

[36:08] say uh I'm looking here total calls

[36:11] 5,484

[36:13] total calls to your dispatch center. Uh

[36:15] that is a record for the year. It's the

[36:17] most we've had uh was in July. Um, and the the the the stat I always like

[36:22] to look at is how many traffic stops we

[36:26] had. We had 554 traffic stops.

[36:28] Obviously, those are variable for

[36:30] running a stop sign to to, you know,

[36:32] getting pulled over doing, you know, 85,

[36:34] right? Um, but citations was 176, but

[36:37] warnings was 354, you know. So, that's I

[36:40] just I love that fact that we try to uh

[36:43] not be hardline police officers and

[36:45] understand, you know, things happen and

[36:47] we let people off with a warning. I I

[36:48] like that. So, But I but I will say I

[36:50] agree with uh you and uh both you and

[36:54] Chief Clemens and um Mr. Taylor, which

[36:56] you're coming up next, but uh all three

[36:58] of you, your team did a great job uh

[37:00] preparing the lands, the landscape, and

[37:01] the parks to get ready for police night

[37:03] out. That's our biggest night of the

[37:04] year. Great job to your team. And then

[37:06] both of you both, I mean, I think you

[37:08] all had just about equal amount of staff

[37:10] there. So, uh, um, your firefighters and

[37:13] police officers were greeting everybody

[37:15] nicely and smiling and out and just, uh,

[37:17] giving them tours of their trucks and

[37:18] equipment and everything and, um, yeah,

[37:21] just really awesome night. Great job.

[37:22] You handled yourselves, uh, top-notch.

[37:24] So, good job both of you. Appreciate it.

[37:26] >> Thank you, sir.

[37:26] >> Yeah. Well done.

[37:27] >> The, uh, M. Taylor, your service

[37:29] department, sir, you were up. Floor is

[37:31] yours.

[37:32] >> Thank you, Mr. Dills. In the cemetery

[37:34] division from July 1st through the 31st,

[37:37] 16 burials were performed generating

[37:40] $29,552.

[37:43] 18 resident crays were purchased for

[37:46] $36,000.

[37:48] Two column barium niches were purchased

[37:50] for $6,000.

[37:52] Uh nine foundation orders uh were

[37:54] purchased for $2,934.

[37:57] The total amount generated for the

[37:58] period was 75,986.

[38:02] In the parks division, uh weekly mowing

[38:05] and trimming and landscape continues on

[38:08] uh all township buildings and within our

[38:10] parks. And in the roads division, the

[38:13] road department patched a total of 96

[38:16] potholes over 13 township streets and a

[38:19] total of 23 work orders were completed

[38:22] on multiple township roads. And that

[38:25] concludes my report.

[38:27] >> Great. Good job. Mr. Becker, sir.

[38:29] >> Yeah. How

[38:30] >> Mr. Lo? I'm good. Thank you. Uh Mr.

[38:33] Taylor, your team's doing a good job.

[38:35] And then uh um I think Mr. Cascaden, 20

[38:39] years is well overdue for promotion. So

[38:41] good night for him. I'm glad to hear

[38:42] that.

[38:43] >> The uh Okay, Mr. Flouty. Planning and

[38:46] zoning director, sir. The floor is

[38:48] yours.

[38:49] >> Thank you, Mr. Dills. the inspection and

[38:52] violations. This month, there were a

[38:54] total of 38 inspections, 18 complaints

[38:57] received, three of those complaints

[38:59] being unfounded, eight [clears throat]

[39:01] warning citations issued in the month of

[39:04] July, three 15-day non-compliance

[39:06] letters with one 30-day violation

[39:09] letter. There were a total of 10

[39:12] resolved with and without action

[39:14] complaints, 496 illegal signs removed,

[39:18] 12 miscellaneous issues resolved for a

[39:23] monthly total violation of 19 and one

[39:27] nuisance filed within the month of July.

[39:31] The activity we had one change of use,

[39:34] seven signs issued, one temporary sale.

[39:37] We had seven single family homes issued,

[39:41] five additions, four decks,

[39:44] eight accessories, and 11 pools and

[39:47] fences for a monthly total of 44 permits

[39:50] and a total revenue of $8,225.

[39:55] And that concludes my report.

[39:58] Mr. Vice Chair, I'm good. Mr. Lo,

[40:01] >> good. Thank you, Mr. Flood.

[40:03] >> Mr. FY, great job. You're busy. Nice

[40:05] job. Uh, all right. Lastly is our

[40:07] township administrator, Mr. Wright. Go

[40:10] ahead, sir.

[40:10] >> Thank you, sir. I'll be brief with the

[40:12] zoning hearings. We have uh not much to

[40:14] provide on the old 74

[40:16] >> [clears throat]

[40:17] >> uh schoolhouse to block box and sidewalk

[40:19] systemic safety grant. Stage one plans

[40:22] have been submitted to ODOT and that's

[40:24] in process. Uh we have applied as I

[40:26] mentioned previously for transportation

[40:28] alternative funding for the Icult

[40:31] expansion. is basically from Walmart

[40:33] kind of getting us down to Ivy Point in

[40:36] that I expect we will do well on the

[40:38] scoring but OKI canled their August

[40:41] meeting so we'll have to wait for good

[40:43] news until September hopefully

[40:46] uh when they score those projects. Uh

[40:48] unfortunately, ODOT did not approve our

[40:50] systemic safety grant application for

[40:52] some road, but again we uh I am

[40:56] relatively stubborn. So we are going to

[40:58] reapply as they like the project, but

[41:00] there was a lot of need. Um we did

[41:03] however receive about $150,000 in CDBG

[41:06] funding to advance a portion of

[41:08] sidewalks on uh Somerside Road. So uh

[41:11] we'll be working with the county through

[41:13] that process. 2026 road rate road

[41:16] resurfacing projects are underway. Uh

[41:19] roads you'll start to see milling and

[41:20] filling activities. Uh the bulk of the

[41:23] activities to date have been curb

[41:24] replacements throughout the county. And

[41:26] again we we save a lot of money through

[41:28] this program. Uh so a little bit of

[41:31] delay is worth it because we are able to

[41:33] stretch our paving dollars further every

[41:35] year. Um work continues on the safe

[41:39] routes plan. Uh Mr. Woodruff and Mr.

[41:41] Flouty are all over that. I do have news

[41:43] on the OPWC project on Elmont. All of

[41:46] the easements have been secured. We're

[41:47] waiting on utility relocations and the

[41:50] county will be bidding that out. There

[41:52] will be a separate sidewalk addition

[41:53] that's not included in the OPWC grant

[41:56] because of the way that they score those

[41:58] projects. If you put a sidewalk in, they

[42:00] penalize you. I don't understand why,

[42:02] but anyway, we'll be bringing that to

[42:05] the board for that when uh we get closer

[42:08] to a bid award or a bid a bid award uh

[42:11] number there. Um just a couple other

[42:14] items. Uh we we are um we will be

[42:18] bringing a Jed 9 expansion to you to add

[42:21] an additional uh facility to that. Um

[42:24] and we have a couple of nuisance

[42:25] resolutions for the board and uh the

[42:29] hazard mitigation plan. Just a couple of

[42:31] late ads. We did have a uh then a

[42:33] certificate for uh park uh water usage

[42:37] and uh we also added uh uh we have an

[42:40] OPWC joint application authorization

[42:43] with u Miami Township for slide repairs.

[42:45] The countyy's not doing slide repairs

[42:47] unfortunately this year. So if we ban

[42:49] together with another organization, we

[42:51] tend to score better. Um

[42:54] uh we're looking specifically at

[42:55] Baldwin. Um,

[42:59] last item, there's an item on on the

[43:01] agenda to transfer a fire truck uh

[43:03] disposed property to the CIC for

[43:05] economic development purposes. And, uh,

[43:08] that is something if you recall, we use

[43:11] the CIC to acquire equipment, but we

[43:13] also use it to dispose of equipment. So,

[43:17] uh, that really concludes my report.

[43:19] >> Thank you, sir. Uh, vice chairman.

[43:21] >> No, I'm good. Mr. Loen,

[43:24] >> I have nothing.

[43:25] >> You're good.

[43:25] >> Okay. That's right. Good. Good job.

[43:26] Thank you for the report. Uh, okay.

[43:28] Public hearings.

[43:30] Now, there's four of them. I'm betting

[43:32] you are most here for two of them out of

[43:34] the four. Uh, so we put the two easiest

[43:36] ones first so we can knock them out and

[43:38] those folks can go home and then

[43:39] obviously the latter two uh the end. So,

[43:42] all right. Public hearings. Okay. And uh

[43:46] public hearing case, Union Township

[43:48] overlay case 3-26-

[43:51] Oscar. Uh, Mr. Flouty, would you like to

[43:54] go and explain that one, sir?

[43:55] >> Yeah. Thank you, Mr. Dills. This

[43:57] application is located at 1118 Ferris

[44:00] Road. The applicant is Mike Shabbesta,

[44:04] and he is requesting approval from the

[44:07] Union Township Board of Trustees for an

[44:09] overlay district plan consisting of five

[44:11] new structures. One of them being a 2500

[44:14] twostory structure for a shop and office

[44:17] use, while there'll be four additional

[44:20] lean to/additions to the existing

[44:23] structure. The applicant is additionally

[44:26] seeking relief from the 10-ft and 20

[44:28] foot M1 zoning district minimum setbacks

[44:32] per article 6 to have the minimum rear

[44:35] and sideyard setbacks be at 3'6 in and

[44:39] this project is located in the Bach

[44:42] Buckton Road commercial corridor. Some

[44:45] background information, the primary

[44:47] principal structure site was constructed

[44:50] around 1988. Since that time, the main

[44:52] building has primarily housed DFS

[44:55] business entities and a variety of other

[44:57] light industrial uses. They were

[45:00] recently here in 2025 with another

[45:03] accessory structure that was approved.

[45:06] Some staff review and analysis. This

[45:09] proposal meets the proposed intent of

[45:11] both the adopted comprehensive land use

[45:14] plan and the overall overlay district

[45:17] regulations. The plan proposes the

[45:20] expansion and/or addition of

[45:22] pre-existing structures or uses such as

[45:25] warehouses, stoages, and office [snorts]

[45:28] spaces. No new lighting is proposed at

[45:30] this time. When the time of permitting

[45:33] comes, we'll need it subject to article

[45:35] 14 of the zoning resolution. And any non

[45:39] enclosed structure generally used for

[45:41] storage should be efficiently screened

[45:43] from the main road via landscaping or

[45:46] fencing to maintain maintain a cohesive

[45:49] level of visual cleanliness.

[45:52] The action required tonight is in

[45:54] accordance with section 1310 of the

[45:56] zoning resolution that the board of

[45:58] trustees is to enter a motion to approve

[46:01] as submitted, approve with modifications

[46:03] or deny this focus area overlay district

[46:06] application as pres presented in Union

[46:09] Township zoning case 3-26-.

[46:13] There are five recommended modifications

[46:15] should the board choose to grant

[46:17] favorably upon this application. The

[46:20] first one being that the applicant shall

[46:22] comply with the requirements of all

[46:24] federal, state, and local agencies. All

[46:27] future lighting shall meet the adopted

[46:31] article 14

[46:33] regulations of the zoning resolution.

[46:36] Any monument signage shall be compliant

[46:40] with the 2030 land use plan. The

[46:42] applicant shall provide additional

[46:44] privacy fencing and screening for

[46:46] materials should any fall within out of

[46:50] the completely enclosed building. And

[46:52] lastly, the applicant shall review shall

[46:55] be subject to review of the buildings

[46:57] containing the number of structures,

[46:59] square footage, location, and materials

[47:01] subject to administrative review and

[47:03] approval. And that concludes the report

[47:05] for the overlay case 3-26-

[47:12] » Mr. F. Do do we have any pictures of

[47:14] what these future buildings are going to

[47:15] look like?

[47:16] >> Uh, we do not have any pictures of what

[47:20] the actual architectural renderings, but

[47:24] >> the applicant can speak better on this,

[47:26] but it would match the existing

[47:28] buildings. It would be a metal metal

[47:30] construction. Uh, since this is in the

[47:33] M1 district and the surrounding

[47:35] buildings are in

[47:36] >> Hold on one second, sir. Hold on. I'll

[47:38] sir, I'll call you up in just one

[47:40] second. Yeah. Yeah. Sorry. Um,

[47:42] >> okay. Fair enough. Um, Mr. Becker, any

[47:45] questions?

[47:45] >> No.

[47:46] >> Mr. Logan, any questions?

[47:47] >> Not currently.

[47:48] >> Okay. Um, [snorts]

[47:50] Mr. Poly for future.

[47:52] >> Um,

[47:54] I get it. I I want pictures of what the

[47:56] future buildings are going to look like

[47:57] from now on. So, tell the applicants

[47:59] from now. I'd like to see those. Okay.

[48:00] just some kind of what they're going to

[48:02] look like, not just, you know, not this.

[48:04] >> Okay.

[48:05] >> For for any new building. I would like

[48:08] to see an actual,

[48:09] >> you know, picture what it's going to

[48:10] look like. So, okay, fair enough. No

[48:11] worries. Uh, okay. Uh, gentlemen, uh,

[48:14] I'll entertain a motion to open this

[48:17] public hearing case, Union Township, uh,

[48:19] overlay case 3-26-

[48:22] Oscar.

[48:23] >> So, move. Second.

[48:24] >> Any discussion? Mr. Kimber, roll call.

[48:27] >> Mr. Becker?

[48:27] >> Yes.

[48:28] >> Mr. Lo,

[48:29] >> yes.

[48:29] >> Mr. Mr. Dills.

[48:30] >> Yes.

[48:31] >> Public hearing is opened at 6:48.

[48:33] >> All right.

[48:34] >> Public hearing is open. All right. So

[48:36] now, sorry, forgot to follow protocol.

[48:38] So, sorry. The I'll go and call you up.

[48:40] So, first thing, well, first thing, just

[48:41] so I'm going to I'll call anyone up that

[48:43] is a proponent of this case, and then

[48:44] I'll uh here's how I'm going to do this

[48:46] with all zoning cases tonight. Just so

[48:48] you know, there's four of them. I'm

[48:49] going to call up usually the the person

[48:51] that would like to have this passed. Uh

[48:53] and then I'll call up anyone that's

[48:55] against it. And then I'll then I'll call

[48:57] up again. So, the developer, whoever's

[48:59] purchasing the property, wants to do the

[49:01] project to basically kind of counter any

[49:03] answer any questions for those that are

[49:05] against uh the case. Just, you know,

[49:06] that's how I'm going to do it for the

[49:07] every single case tonight. So, uh but

[49:09] just do me a favor. I got to swear you

[49:10] in and uh go ahead and raise your right

[49:12] hand if you could.

[49:13] >> Do you swear to tell the truth, the

[49:14] whole truth, nothing but the truth. So,

[49:15] hope you be God.

[49:16] >> I do.

[49:17] >> Okay, great. And then just state your

[49:18] name and address for the right.

[49:19] [clears throat]

[49:19] >> Mike Shabbusta. Our business is located

[49:22] at 1118 Ferris Road, Amelia, Ohio 45102,

[49:27] I1 Anderson Township,

[49:30] [clears throat] Fireside Drive.

[49:31] >> Perfect. Yeah.

[49:34] >> Uh the floor is yours. Whatever you like

[49:36] to say. Yeah.

[49:37] >> So, it turns out it's a very expensive

[49:40] process to even start to think about

[49:42] building a building. So, in this case, I

[49:44] failed to put the two side pieces on

[49:46] last year when I put the first building

[49:48] in.

[49:48] >> Yeah. So on this particular drawing, all

[49:53] the way to the corner there next to

[49:54] Dave's driveway, the white strip,

[49:57] without

[49:59] [clears throat] your approval, nothing

[50:01] can happen. After that, you're looking

[50:04] at $6 to $8,000 for a water management

[50:07] study.

[50:08] >> Uh it's, you know, you could spend 10

[50:10] $15,000 before you could even ask the

[50:13] architect to draw something.

[50:15] So uh you're the first step. In this

[50:19] particular case, I had an agreement with

[50:22] Mr. Food's pro uh predecessor that I

[50:26] would show all my future plans. So the

[50:30] yellow things are things that we may do

[50:31] down in the future. Each one of those

[50:34] would require the initial zoning

[50:38] application for that particular

[50:39] structure.

[50:40] >> Sure. So this is strictly to get the

[50:43] dimension on that proposed structure now

[50:46] and with the water management issues. Uh

[50:49] the chances get slimmer every day

[50:51] there'll ever be built.

[50:52] >> Okay.

[50:54] >> Uh the building has to come out far way

[50:56] into the detention pond. And even though

[50:59] there's never I won't say never this

[51:02] week proved it. Uh I've never seen water

[51:06] above the grass in the detention bond. M

[51:09] >> there was two feet in there because

[51:10] Ferris Road backed up and filled the

[51:13] depend our detention pond on that end of

[51:16] the building.

[51:17] [clears throat]

[51:17] >> A little further complication, the dock

[51:22] at the corner of the yellow was the

[51:25] original detention pond, but the

[51:27] contractor builder didn't tell us that.

[51:29] >> So it more complicated. So, I'm simply

[51:33] trying to get this side

[51:37] uh corrected on the east side. I'm doing

[51:40] the west side so I don't have to come

[51:42] back next year and waste your old time.

[51:44] >> Sure. Got it.

[51:46] >> Any questions about the process of the

[51:48] approach or anything?

[51:50] >> Vice Chairman?

[51:51] >> No. Okay,

[51:52] >> Mr. Luke.

[51:53] >> No, this time. Thank you.

[51:54] >> Uh, and you might not know this, Mr.

[51:56] Flouty. um currently cuz I heard you say

[51:58] what was what's the current setback and

[52:00] then what's the setback that they're

[52:02] asking for?

[52:03] >> So there is the side setbacks of 10 ft

[52:06] and then the rear set back of 20 and

[52:09] overall they're asking for three 3T six

[52:13] inches. So it's a reduction of it's like

[52:16] 16. Yeah.

[52:17] >> Okay. Okay.

[52:18] >> The back is already done last year. So

[52:20] we're really talking the two sides

[52:22] >> three not worried about it. Okay.

[52:23] Perfect. And then total of five

[52:25] buildings. Five buildings total.

[52:27] >> Okay. Can you describe uh first what kind of business are you at?

[52:31] >> Uh and then what

[52:32] >> I do commercial real estate and I'm a

[52:35] systems engineer so I do uh IT stuff.

[52:38] >> Do well I guess are do you plan what do

[52:40] you plan on doing with the buildings?

[52:43] >> I rent out the 95% of the building to

[52:47] Keep Electric.

[52:48] >> Okay.

[52:48] >> They're the neighbor to this side.

[52:51] >> Sure.

[52:51] >> They've expanded that. We've kind of

[52:53] joined the two properties. So, we've

[52:55] probably created

[52:57] I don't know 75 jobs there.

[52:59] >> Fair enough.

[53:01] >> Yeah.

[53:01] >> You know, parking is an issue. I I have

[53:05] 60 spaces and it's still not enough. So,

[53:08] >> that's a good bad problem. The uh Well,

[53:09] Mr. Shvevesa, appreciate you investing

[53:11] in Union Township. Uh you're growing. I

[53:13] appreciate that. Thank Thank you for

[53:15] that. And uh um yeah, all good. That's

[53:18] all the questions I have for you. So,

[53:19] appreciate you very much. Thank you,

[53:20] sir.

[53:21] >> Thank you. Uh, is there any other

[53:23] proponents to this case? Anyone that is

[53:25] for this case?

[53:27] Oh, please come on up. Yeah, the floor

[53:29] is yours, please. And by the way, just

[53:31] so everyone knows, every zoning case,

[53:33] when you want to come up and speak, I

[53:34] got to swear you in every time. All

[53:36] right, come on up, sir.

[53:39] And then uh just raise your right hand.

[53:40] And then, sir, do you swear to tell the

[53:42] truth, the whole truth. I think the

[53:43] truth be to God.

[53:44] >> I do.

[53:44] >> Great. Uh, state your name and address

[53:46] for the record.

[53:46] >> My name is Dave Flourish. I own the

[53:48] adjoining building 1120 Ferris Road.

[53:50] >> Perfect. I also live in Anderson. Mike

[53:53] and I discussed this.

[53:54] >> Yeah.

[53:55] >> He got me on board with what they wanted

[53:57] to do. And um it's also in my also my

[53:59] best interest also to have that setback

[54:02] change.

[54:02] >> Yeah.

[54:03] >> Uh my ingress into my place if that

[54:06] building has to be set out 20 ft from

[54:08] that line is going to really limit the

[54:10] size of building that I can build.

[54:12] >> Got it.

[54:13] >> Perfect.

[54:14] >> I'm on board.

[54:16] >> Fantastic. Well, I appreciate the

[54:17] testimony. Yeah. Thank you.

[54:18] >> Thank you.

[54:18] sir. Appreciate you very

[54:19] much. [clears throat] Okay. Is there

[54:21] anyone else that is a proponent of this

[54:22] case? I see none. Is there anyone that's

[54:25] against this case? Opponent.

[54:28] Last call. All right. No sweat. Okay. Um

[54:32] All right. Uh gentlemen, honor a motion

[54:34] to close public hearing case uh 3-26-

[54:38] Oscar.

[54:38] >> So moved.

[54:39] >> Second.

[54:39] >> Uh Mr. Campbell. Roll call.

[54:42] >> Mr. Becker?

[54:43] >> Yes.

[54:44] >> Mr. Lo?

[54:45] >> Yes.

[54:46] >> Mr. Dills?

[54:47] >> Yes. The public uh portion of this

[54:50] hearing is closed at 6:54 p.m.

[54:52] >> Okay. Uh gentleman discussion. Mr.

[54:54] Becker.

[54:55] >> Yes.

[54:56] >> Fair enough. Mr. Log, any issues,

[54:58] concerns?

[55:00] >> I have none.

[55:00] >> No. Okay. Good. Uh likewise. Uh

[55:02] gentlemen, I'll entertain a motion for

[55:04] the approval of Union Township overlay

[55:05] case 3-26-

[55:07] Oscar uh for the approval uh with

[55:10] modifications as recommended.

[55:12] >> So move.

[55:12] >> Second.

[55:13] >> Mr. Any further discussion? Mr.

[55:15] Campbell. Roll call. Mr. Becker,

[55:17] >> yes.

[55:17] >> Mr. Lo,

[55:18] >> yes.

[55:18] >> Mr. Jills,

[55:19] >> yes.

[55:19] >> Motion carries.

[55:20] >> Congratulations, Mike. You're

[55:22] >> good.

[55:25] All right.

[55:28] >> Oh, you got it. No sweat. The uh

[55:31] >> they're working together.

[55:32] >> Oh. Oh, it is. It's the same the same.

[55:34] Got it. Got it. I mean, Huh. Maybe I'll

[55:36] change my mind on this one. The uh just

[55:39] the uh Okay. Uh Mr. Flouty, sir. Overlay

[55:42] case 4-26- an Oscar. I don't anticipate

[55:45] this taking too long. You go ahead, sir.

[55:47] >> Thank you, Mr. Dills. This is property

[55:50] located at 1120 Ferris Road. It's

[55:52] directly behind Mr. Abesta's property.

[55:55] The applicant is special touch

[55:57] landscaping, and they're requesting from

[55:59] the board of trustees

[56:02] an overlay district plan consisting of

[56:04] two enclosed storage structures. The

[56:07] first being a total of 10,000 square ft

[56:10] with the second being 6,000 square ft.

[56:13] The applicant is seeking relief from the

[56:15] 20 foot setback in the M1 district to

[56:18] have a setback of 3'6 in in the M1

[56:22] district located in the Bach Buckston

[56:24] corridor.

[56:26] The subject property sits on 4.77 acres

[56:30] and again is zoned M1. The principal

[56:35] primary structures were

[56:38] constructed around 1991 and 92 and the

[56:41] applicant intends to improve the

[56:43] property by constructing the additional

[56:45] structures for storage as noted for the

[56:47] existing landscaping business. Uh staff

[56:50] review and analysis. It is this proposal

[56:54] meets the intent of both the

[56:56] comprehensive land use plan and the

[56:58] overall district regulations surrounding

[57:01] properties are M1 industrial and it is

[57:05] consistent with supporting the goals and

[57:07] recommendations of the Box Bach Buckton

[57:10] Road commercial corridor. Again, if any

[57:13] new lighting is proposed, it'll need to

[57:14] be in accordance with article 14 of the

[57:17] zoning resolution in any detention

[57:20] proposed for the site containing any

[57:22] water from any additional proposals on

[57:25] the property. The action tonight that is

[57:28] required is in accordance with section

[57:30] 1310 of the zoning resolution that the

[57:33] board of trustees is to enter into a

[57:35] motion to approve as submitted. Approve

[57:37] with modifications or deny this focus

[57:40] area overlay district applications as

[57:42] presented. In case number 4-26-

[57:46] there are five recommended modifications

[57:49] should the board grant favorable

[57:51] consideration to the overlay

[57:52] application. one that the applicant

[57:54] shall comply with the requirements of

[57:56] all federal, state, and local agencies.

[58:00] The future lighting plan shall be with

[58:03] the requirements of article 14. If there

[58:06] are any proposals of signage, it shall

[58:08] be monument style signage. The applicant

[58:11] shall provide additional privacy if

[58:14] there is any visual outdoor storage

[58:17] areas to the main streets. and the

[58:20] applicant shall be subject to review of

[58:21] the buildings containing the number of

[58:23] structures, square footage, location,

[58:25] and material subject to administrative

[58:27] review and approval. With that, that

[58:29] concludes the report for overlay case

[58:31] 4-26-

[58:35] uh vice chairman.

[58:36] >> No questions,

[58:37] >> Mr. Lo.

[58:40] No questions.

[58:40] >> Yep. Okay. Gentlemen, I'll entertain a

[58:42] motion to open public hearings case

[58:45] overlay case 4-26-

[58:47] Oscar. So moved.

[58:49] >> Second,

[58:50] >> Mr. Campbell. Roll call.

[58:52] >> Mr. Becker?

[58:52] >> Yes.

[58:53] >> Mr. Lug?

[58:54] >> Yes.

[58:54] >> Mr. Dills?

[58:55] >> Yes.

[58:56] >> Public hearing is open at 6:58 p.m.

[58:58] >> All right. We start off with the

[58:59] developer landowner. You're more than

[59:01] welcome to speak. I got to tell you, I

[59:02] have a gut feeling you're not going to

[59:03] have any problems, but it's uh uh you're

[59:06] more welcome to come up here and speak.

[59:07] Now, since this is a separate case, I

[59:09] got to swear you in for this one as

[59:10] well.

[59:11] >> All right.

[59:14] You swear to tell the truth, the whole

[59:15] truth. By the truth, self be God.

[59:17] >> I do. Great. Name it and address for the

[59:18] record.

[59:19] >> 1120 Ferris Road. My name's Dave Flour.

[59:23] Um,

[59:24] been there since about 91 92.

[59:28] Mike helped me out a lot when I moved in

[59:30] because I had no water, no electric. So,

[59:32] we've been buddies ever since. Uh, when

[59:35] he did his building and he told me about

[59:37] the change in the setbacks, I got really

[59:39] excited because it greatly changes my

[59:41] ability to make my building bigger. When

[59:43] you start setting your stuff back from

[59:45] the fence, it kind of crowds things in

[59:48] there.

[59:49] >> Okay.

[59:49] >> So, that's why I'm here.

[59:52] >> Yeah, fair enough. What What line of

[59:53] business are you in?

[59:54] >> A lot of landscape.

[59:55] >> Oh, fantastic. Okay. So, no, appreciate

[59:57] you investing in Union Township and uh

[59:59] we're just happy to help. Uh sorry it's

[1:00:01] a little bit of a process, but uh but

[1:00:03] no, appreciate you invest in our

[1:00:04] township. Uh Mr. Becker.

[1:00:05] >> No, I'm good.

[1:00:06] >> Mr. Log, I'm good. Thank you. Yeah,

[1:00:08] appreciate it. Thank you. You're all

[1:00:09] good. Appreciate you, sir. All good. And

[1:00:11] then uh uh is there anyone else that's a

[1:00:13] proponent of this case? Okay, seeing

[1:00:15] none opponent.

[1:00:17] All right, let's go and close it. Uh

[1:00:19] gentlemen, entertain a motion to close

[1:00:20] public hearing overlay case 4-26- Oscar.

[1:00:24] >> So move second.

[1:00:25] >> Mr. Campbell, roll call.

[1:00:26] >> Mr. Becker,

[1:00:27] >> yes.

[1:00:28] >> Mr. Log,

[1:00:28] >> yes.

[1:00:29] >> Mr. Jules,

[1:00:30] >> yes.

[1:00:30] >> Public portion of this closed at 7 p.m.

[1:00:33] >> All right. Uh any discussion, gentlemen.

[1:00:36] See none. Okay. Uh, I will gentlemen I

[1:00:38] will entertain a motion for the approval

[1:00:40] with modifications as recommended for

[1:00:42] Union Township overlay case 4-26-

[1:00:45] Oscar.

[1:00:45] >> So moved.

[1:00:46] >> Second.

[1:00:47] >> Uh, Mr. Campbell. Roll call.

[1:00:48] >> Mr. Becker.

[1:00:49] >> Yes.

[1:00:50] >> Mr. Lou.

[1:00:50] >> Yes.

[1:00:51] >> Mr. D.

[1:00:51] >> Yes.

[1:00:52] >> Motion carries.

[1:00:53] >> Congratulations, Dave. The uh Okay. So,

[1:00:56] what we'll do before we get to uh both

[1:00:59] zoning cases, uh they're both kind of

[1:01:01] similar kind of. uh at 8 o'clock I'm

[1:01:03] going to have a hard cut off so we can

[1:01:04] take a at that point a two-hour break

[1:01:06] which is in one hour uh and then I will

[1:01:08] break for five minutes you know whatever

[1:01:10] five seven minutes uh also I want to say

[1:01:13] this for those that are against the case

[1:01:16] uh in the event hypothetically it is

[1:01:18] approved I would like for when you you

[1:01:20] don't have to but I would like for you

[1:01:22] to speak on maybe something you would

[1:01:25] like this is now your opportunity

[1:01:27] assuming it's approved it might not be

[1:01:28] approved but if it is approved this is

[1:01:30] your chance to negotiate

[1:01:32] For example, in the past, what I've done

[1:01:34] is I've had the developer over here and

[1:01:35] I've had residents say, you know, I want

[1:01:38] a a landscaping buffer. I would like a

[1:01:40] white uh vinyl fence, 6 foot high vinyl

[1:01:42] fence so I don't have to see these

[1:01:43] houses or I don't have to see whatever.

[1:01:45] I would like this or that and I'm going

[1:01:46] to tell a developer, hey, I'm going to

[1:01:47] put this in here if you want me to prove

[1:01:48] it, you know, kind of thing. This is our

[1:01:50] chance to negotiate where both sides

[1:01:52] win, both sides lose a little bit and

[1:01:54] it's compromise. Or you don't have to at

[1:01:56] all. That's up to you. So when you

[1:01:57] speak, that's your opportunity to say,

[1:01:59] "Hey, if it is approved, I would like to

[1:02:00] see this, this, and this." Okay. Uh so

[1:02:03] um with that being said, and by the way,

[1:02:06] um the uh um the floor is yours. You're allowed to talk, you know, as

[1:02:11] long as you want. Just just know even if

[1:02:13] we're in the middle of this case, in one

[1:02:15] hour, I'm going to call a timeout, five

[1:02:16] minute break, and then we'll come back.

[1:02:18] So Okay. Just everyone knows. Um okay.

[1:02:22] Uh gentlemen, oh no, let's not open it

[1:02:23] yet. Uh Mr. Flowy, sir. Uh, zoning case

[1:02:27] 3-26-Zenzula.

[1:02:29] Go ahead and introduce that, sir.

[1:02:31] >> Thank you, Mr. Dells. This is a request.

[1:02:33] The name is the Oaks at Ridge Point

[1:02:36] subdivision. The applicant is Chris

[1:02:39] Hener at 1062 Kluff Pike. The action

[1:02:44] requested is for a total of three

[1:02:47] parcels totaling 23.63 63 acres to be

[1:02:50] reszoned from R1 single family to an R4

[1:02:54] single family variable residential

[1:02:56] district in order to allow for a

[1:02:59] proposed concept plan subdivision

[1:03:01] developing development consisting of 58

[1:03:04] lots for single family dwelling units

[1:03:07] landscaping elements entry monument sign

[1:03:11] and open spaces. Some land use and

[1:03:14] zoning characteristics in the general

[1:03:16] vicinity is residential uses with the

[1:03:19] exception of instit institutional uses

[1:03:22] such as Club Pike Baptist Church in the

[1:03:25] West Claremont High School to the south.

[1:03:28] In relation to the 2030 comprehensive

[1:03:30] land use plan indicates that the

[1:03:33] proposal is not located within any

[1:03:35] designated corridor. However, the use

[1:03:38] itself would be supportive to single

[1:03:40] family residential character in this

[1:03:42] area of the township. A single family

[1:03:45] residential development goals stated

[1:03:47] within the plan calls for a single

[1:03:50] family dwelling densities up to four

[1:03:52] units per acre, which this proposal

[1:03:54] achieves with a gross density of 2.5

[1:03:58] 2.45

[1:04:00] units an acre. Moving on to some of the

[1:04:06] background information. This area has

[1:04:09] been in the R1 single family zoning

[1:04:12] district since the institution of

[1:04:13] zoning. Since then, the properties have

[1:04:15] been used for agricultural and/or

[1:04:17] residential uses

[1:04:20] according to the auditor site. Some

[1:04:23] staff review and analysis. Wanted to

[1:04:25] note that the staff comments have been

[1:04:27] revised since the zoning commission

[1:04:29] recommendation from the June 24th

[1:04:32] meeting with relation due to the road

[1:04:35] layout. The new lot configuration shows

[1:04:39] seven homes being ended in a culde-sac

[1:04:42] off of Ridge Point Drive and an

[1:04:44] additional 51 homes being accessed off

[1:04:47] of Kluff Pike to be ended in a

[1:04:51] culde-sac. This differs from the

[1:04:54] previous plan which included a through

[1:04:57] street through Ridge Point and there was

[1:04:59] talk back and forth with the zoning

[1:05:01] commission on whether or not to

[1:05:04] have it a through street have a lock

[1:05:07] knock box for emergency services. And as

[1:05:11] we went through the process with the

[1:05:14] developer, uh, they came up and we came

[1:05:19] up with this idea of doing the culde-sac

[1:05:22] to complete the street in the

[1:05:23] subdivision back there off of Ridge

[1:05:25] Point with seven homes in a culde-sac

[1:05:27] and then the 51 additional off of Ridge

[1:05:30] Point. Some additional information

[1:05:33] with this application is the proposed

[1:05:36] street and trees are throughout the

[1:05:38] subdivision with additional plantings

[1:05:41] being provided.

[1:05:43] Uh some of the lots have changed with

[1:05:44] the new proposal since the total amount

[1:05:47] of lots have gone from 60 to 58. Some

[1:05:52] street lighting has been proposed. The

[1:05:54] lighting shall be consistent with

[1:05:55] article 14. An entry monument sign is

[1:05:59] proposed. consideration should be taken

[1:06:00] for the site distance clearance onto

[1:06:02] Clark Pike.

[1:06:05] Lastly, going back to the zoning

[1:06:07] commission, they recommended five

[1:06:09] modifications.

[1:06:11] The fifth modification was the sample

[1:06:13] proposed home facades. The applicant, we

[1:06:16] have a proposal from them to pull up

[1:06:18] with the proposed homes. So lastly, the

[1:06:22] action required tonight is in accordance

[1:06:24] with section 650 through 659 of the

[1:06:27] zoning resolution that the board of

[1:06:28] trustees is to enter into a motion to

[1:06:30] approve as recommended by the zoning

[1:06:32] commission. Approve with additional

[1:06:34] modifications or deny this zoning map

[1:06:37] amendment in accompanying concept plan

[1:06:39] as permitted in Union Township zoning

[1:06:41] case 3-26-Z.

[1:06:45] Staff has made additional

[1:06:46] recommendations due to the new road

[1:06:49] layout and lot configuration that per

[1:06:52] the Horizon 2030 plan to add a

[1:06:55] pedestrian connectivity between the

[1:06:58] established and existing Ridge Point

[1:07:00] subdivision drive to the new

[1:07:02] development. And lastly, efforts to

[1:07:05] maintain the same pre previous

[1:07:07] preservation areas which appear to have

[1:07:09] changed slightly to have them labeled as

[1:07:12] pre preserved and to pay attention to

[1:07:15] the screening to the existing

[1:07:16] residential areas from the proposed

[1:07:18] development. With that, that concludes

[1:07:21] the report for case number 3-26-Z.

[1:07:26] » Thank you, Mr. Flouty. Uh, vice

[1:07:28] chairman, any questions?

[1:07:29] >> Yeah, I do have one.

[1:07:32] So, Mr. Flowouty.

[1:07:33] >> Hypothetically,

[1:07:35] >> if we were to approve

[1:07:38] changing the zoning from an R1 to an R4

[1:07:42] >> and the developer, for whatever reason,

[1:07:45] it could be any number of reasons,

[1:07:47] >> may choose not to build anything at this

[1:07:50] time. Mhm.

[1:07:51] >> could several years from now, new board,

[1:07:57] maybe a new developer, maybe not, choose

[1:08:00] to build apartment buildings on this

[1:08:02] property.

[1:08:04] >> Yes. I That would be a hypothetical that

[1:08:07] could potentially

[1:08:08] >> not R4. Not not R4. It's got to be R3.

[1:08:12] >> PD is apartment.

[1:08:13] >> Oh, yeah. So,

[1:08:14] >> what does R4 allow then?

[1:08:16] >> Sorry.

[1:08:17] >> Single

[1:08:18] >> condos. So if you're you're asking if

[1:08:21] you approve this to an R4,

[1:08:24] >> they come back. Yeah, sorry I

[1:08:25] misunderstood the question. So this

[1:08:28] development what the R4 variable

[1:08:30] structure

[1:08:32] >> does is it creates a formal plan. So

[1:08:34] what you are approving is the concept

[1:08:36] plan in front of you. If there are to be

[1:08:39] any changes to that, you have to come

[1:08:41] forward, the applicant will have to come

[1:08:44] forward with a new set of plans and have

[1:08:47] a new set of approvals to do any changes

[1:08:50] from this. That would be adding a lot,

[1:08:52] changing from single family to attached

[1:08:55] single family. That that would trigger

[1:08:57] coming back to this board. If they were

[1:08:59] to approve, if you were to approve the

[1:09:01] R4 tonight, the development has to be

[1:09:04] per this plan in front of you tonight.

[1:09:08] Okay. So if we

[1:09:10] so so if we approve this tonight and

[1:09:13] then you know the for whatever reason

[1:09:16] they can't or choose not not to go

[1:09:18] forward five years from now

[1:09:20] >> they they decide they want to come up

[1:09:22] with a new plan. Does it revert to R1

[1:09:25] between now and then?

[1:09:26] >> It it would it would not but a new R4

[1:09:29] plan would have to go before the board.

[1:09:30] >> Okay. And then so how different could an

[1:09:33] R4 plan be if it's not this one that's

[1:09:36] before us?

[1:09:38] The hypotheticals can can range, you

[1:09:40] know, depending on what what would bring

[1:09:43] in. But if they would go from this plan

[1:09:46] to

[1:09:48] attached, if they would go above the 58

[1:09:51] number, you know, it again it's variable

[1:09:54] structure. So the possibility to change

[1:09:56] is you know,

[1:09:58] >> basically what I'm if they change from

[1:10:00] this plan, it's got to come back to the

[1:10:01] board.

[1:10:02] >> Correct. Yes.

[1:10:03] >> Yes. It could be a future board is my

[1:10:05] several years from now is my point.

[1:10:07] That's all I have.

[1:10:08] >> Yeah.

[1:10:09] Mr. L, any questions?

[1:10:12] >> Uh, just a [clears throat] little bit is

[1:10:14] uh

[1:10:16] Mr. Becker, is the concern about

[1:10:20] action tonight and then developer not

[1:10:23] being able to to move forward or

[1:10:26] >> I guess I'm just confused about the

[1:10:27] concern of the I want to make sure hear

[1:10:29] his concern.

[1:10:30] >> We're not debating this right now. We're

[1:10:31] asking Mr. Fl.

[1:10:32] >> Okay. I just trying to understand his

[1:10:33] question. No, I don't have a question

[1:10:34] for Mr. Flatty.

[1:10:35] >> U Mr. Flatty. So on basically let's look at this property as an

[1:10:40] overhead there

[1:10:41] >> and uh so uh

[1:10:45] I'm going to say up because it's not

[1:10:47] north, it would be south. But so so uh

[1:10:49] up from the property or I should say to

[1:10:52] the left, let's do the left. Left of the

[1:10:54] property of the of the square. What is

[1:10:56] the average

[1:10:58] um lot size? Um right right there on the

[1:11:02] left on the left through here left

[1:11:04] >> outside the property the existing

[1:11:06] properties

[1:11:06] >> these these through here.

[1:11:08] >> Well so they range

[1:11:09] >> in the community to the left. So just

[1:11:10] the ballpark the

[1:11:11] >> ballpark. So they range you know along Kluff here we do have larger lots

[1:11:15] those were cut out previously you know

[1:11:17] as Kluff developed through and then all

[1:11:20] along so the existing community back

[1:11:23] behind the existing subdivision

[1:11:25] especially you see where ridge point

[1:11:27] that is R2. So, the existing lots within

[1:11:30] the R2, there's a minimum of 20,000

[1:11:34] >> 10,000 square feet. So, you're roughly

[1:11:36] >> a little bit below a quarter of an acre,

[1:11:39] but you might as well just say a quarter

[1:11:40] of an acre.

[1:11:41] >> So, those lot sizes uh on the bottom

[1:11:45] roughly are are quarter of an acre

[1:11:47] ballpark.

[1:11:48] >> The ones where my cursor is at here,

[1:11:51] they're around a quarter of an acre.

[1:11:53] >> Okay. Ballpark, give or take a little

[1:11:55] bit.

[1:11:55] >> Yeah.

[1:11:56] >> All right. And then uh what about to the

[1:11:58] left?

[1:11:59] >> These they vary. They're going to be a

[1:12:01] little bit larger as they're cut out.

[1:12:04] >> I would say half an acre to quarter of

[1:12:08] an acre.

[1:12:09] >> Okay.

[1:12:09] >> One acre.

[1:12:10] >> All right.

[1:12:13] Okay.

[1:12:15] Uh that's all the questions I got for

[1:12:16] you. Thank you. Oh, do do you have any

[1:12:18] pictures of what these houses are going

[1:12:20] to look like?

[1:12:20] >> Yeah, let me pull up their presentation

[1:12:22] here.

[1:12:23] >> And by by the way, I might be stealing

[1:12:25] their thunder. if they want to show

[1:12:26] theirs.

[1:12:29] >> We got

[1:12:32] Okay. If this Are they going to be going

[1:12:34] through their PowerPoint? Is that their

[1:12:35] plan?

[1:12:35] >> Yes.

[1:12:35] >> Okay. Never mind. I don't want to steal

[1:12:37] their thumb. I'll let them do that. But

[1:12:38] I I every single time we have a building

[1:12:40] though, I want to see a picture of what it potentially is going to look

[1:12:43] like. Uh I don't care if it's a shed or

[1:12:45] if it's a massive complex. So, okay.

[1:12:48] >> Uh fair enough. Okay. Um any more

[1:12:51] questions for Mr. Flowy? Good. Let's

[1:12:53] open this case. Uh, gentlemen, I'll

[1:12:54] entertain a motion to open Union

[1:12:56] Township zoning case 3-26-Z in Zulu.

[1:12:58] >> So move second.

[1:13:00] >> Any further discussion? Mr. Campbell,

[1:13:01] roll call.

[1:13:02] >> Mr. Becker.

[1:13:03] >> Yes.

[1:13:03] >> Mr. Lug.

[1:13:04] >> Yes.

[1:13:05] >> Mr. Dills.

[1:13:05] >> Yes.

[1:13:06] >> Public hearing is open at 7:12 p.m.

[1:13:08] >> All right. Good. Good. Uh, same thing.

[1:13:10] Like to start off with the developer.

[1:13:11] They're here and uh or so their

[1:13:13] spokesperson. And uh

[1:13:17] and then uh

[1:13:19] >> we'll have you come through. Perfect.

[1:13:20] And then you saw what I had to do. So,

[1:13:22] let me can I swear you in?

[1:13:23] >> Yes.

[1:13:23] >> All right. Raise your hand. Do you swear

[1:13:24] to tell the truth? The whole truth about

[1:13:26] the truth. Help you God.

[1:13:27] >> I do.

[1:13:27] >> Great. Please uh state your name and

[1:13:28] address for the record.

[1:13:30] >> My name is Doug Smith. I'm with Abraine

[1:13:32] Associates, the civil side engineer for

[1:13:34] the project. The address is 811 Chevy

[1:13:38] Road 200 [snorts] Cincinnati, Ohio

[1:13:40] 45247.

[1:13:42] >> And then uh

[1:13:43] >> Good evening, gentlemen. Uh, also here

[1:13:45] with me tonight is uh

[1:13:48] Brian Henny and Paul Mezer with Arbor

[1:13:51] Homes will be the builder uh in this

[1:13:53] proposed development. And then also in

[1:13:55] the back row next throwback is Ed Fuia

[1:14:00] with Beaver Creek Site Management.

[1:14:02] They're the developers for the project.

[1:14:03] So I'll be here to answer any questions

[1:14:06] you might have. But um I'd like to first

[1:14:08] off and state that um we're excited for

[1:14:11] this development and we think it'd be a nice addition to the township, provide

[1:14:16] nice housing. Uh you know, the R4 uh

[1:14:19] provides an advantage to allow us to

[1:14:21] preserve some of the natural features.

[1:14:23] uh the the the existing pond that's on

[1:14:26] the site as well as the uh the stream

[1:14:30] that's to the I want to say

[1:14:31] [clears throat] to the south I guess is

[1:14:33] uh and the woodlands along it will be

[1:14:35] preserved in open space. We have three

[1:14:37] open space areas meeting the 20%

[1:14:39] requirement. Um you know we we we're

[1:14:43] excited about it. It's it's a similar

[1:14:45] lot, similar product as as the adjacent

[1:14:47] residence as well as the Magnolia Trace

[1:14:50] development that uh is just down the

[1:14:52] street off Shaylor. This will provide

[1:14:54] the same type of housing which we think

[1:14:56] is all very successful and it's done

[1:14:58] well in the township. Um I can say that

[1:15:02] during the um zoning commission meeting

[1:15:05] there was concern about access. We had a

[1:15:08] through street uh Craig I don't know if

[1:15:11] you could pull up the old plan. Yeah.

[1:15:13] Let's see.

[1:15:27] So, this is the plan we presented at the

[1:15:30] zoning commission that had a through

[1:15:32] street from Pluff Pike to Ridge Point

[1:15:34] Drive. uh the residents in in the on

[1:15:37] Ridge Point Drive had a lot of concerns

[1:15:39] about the through traffic and and the

[1:15:41] cut through at that time we proposed to

[1:15:43] gay some you know ballards or some

[1:15:47] things of that nature. Um so

[1:15:49] [clears throat] basically uh Mr. Wright

[1:15:51] Mr. cloudy. Our team met with the county

[1:15:54] engineer. We discussed our options and

[1:15:57] based on the public input and and and

[1:16:00] what we felt was going to be best for

[1:16:01] this development, they developer reduced

[1:16:03] the lots by two lots. We went from 60 to

[1:16:06] 58 units. Um and then we uh terminated

[1:16:10] Ridgeoint Drive in a culde-sac to to

[1:16:13] eliminate that through traffic that uh

[1:16:17] was you know acceptable through the

[1:16:19] county engineer and uh you know that's uh how we kind of

[1:16:25] ended up the plan we have today. We do

[1:16:28] have water sewer availability. There's

[1:16:30] water and sewer available to serve the

[1:16:31] development. Um I can have Mr. Penning

[1:16:35] or Mr. Mezers talk about the product if

[1:16:37] you like. if you'd like to know more

[1:16:38] about the housing product.

[1:16:41] >> Oh, one sec. Uh, Mr. Wester, any

[1:16:43] questions?

[1:16:44] >> Uh, no, but I do want to say that my

[1:16:46] prior question, you know, about

[1:16:48] potential apartments and what the

[1:16:50] develop could do. It had nothing to do

[1:16:52] with any of you in this room. It was

[1:16:54] really just a hypothetical in my own

[1:16:55] mind about zoning in general. So, no

[1:16:58] offense was intended. The the only

[1:17:00] comment I might add to that is is

[1:17:01] [clears throat] uh and Craig, correct me

[1:17:03] if I'm wrong, that u the R4 it's a

[1:17:06] variable type housing, but it's it's

[1:17:08] single family type housing. It's it's

[1:17:10] not multif family or you know the R4 is

[1:17:13] a single type single family residential

[1:17:16] type housing. It's just whether it's

[1:17:18] single family or attached is my

[1:17:19] understanding.

[1:17:20] >> The multif family would have to be in

[1:17:21] the PD district.

[1:17:23] >> Yeah.

[1:17:24] So, so no matter what it would be a

[1:17:26] single single family residential

[1:17:28] product.

[1:17:29] >> Yeah.

[1:17:29] >> I don't have any questions.

[1:17:30] >> Yeah. One sec, Mr. Luke.

[1:17:33] >> No,

[1:17:34] >> thank you for presentation on it.

[1:17:35] >> Uh, I'm going to ask a few questions,

[1:17:37] but I don't know if it's going to be

[1:17:38] necessarily for you or or Arbor the

[1:17:40] builders um

[1:17:43] or it might even be for uh the Fuja

[1:17:47] family. But uh question, first question

[1:17:49] is if you can't answer it, that's okay.

[1:17:51] I'll go through and you can answer with

[1:17:52] first question. How long was the

[1:17:54] property on the market until you you all

[1:17:56] bought it? Now, that's a probably a Fuja

[1:17:58] question, but uh Okay, so the um

[1:18:01] >> what's the average ballpark price of

[1:18:03] these homes? Ballpark.

[1:18:05] >> That would be an Arbor home,

[1:18:06] >> right? Roger that. All right. Um are you

[1:18:08] all willing to

[1:18:11] add any to work with the residents again

[1:18:15] we approve this? If we don't, then this

[1:18:17] is null and void. But are you willing to

[1:18:18] work with the residents if they come up

[1:18:20] and say, "Hey, we would like a white

[1:18:22] vinyl 6ft fence to put up there so I

[1:18:25] don't have to see any new homes." Are

[1:18:27] you willing to put up maybe some rolling

[1:18:28] hills that or whatever? Are you willing

[1:18:30] to work with the residents on that to

[1:18:32] create buffers?

[1:18:34] >> I can't speak on behalf of that on

[1:18:36] behalf of Mr. Fuier. I know that uh yes,

[1:18:38] we'd be willing to work with the

[1:18:40] residents. We've already been in

[1:18:41] discussion with some of them.

[1:18:42] >> All right, fair enough. And then uh what

[1:18:44] about traffic count? Did did you all do

[1:18:46] a traffic count study?

[1:18:47] >> We did. We did a traffic count study.

[1:18:49] We've prepared a traffic impact study

[1:18:51] and we presented that to the county

[1:18:53] engineer and it's currently in in review

[1:18:55] and being processed.

[1:18:56] >> Do do you have any more information on

[1:18:58] it?

[1:18:58] >> Yeah, it uh it it basically says that no

[1:19:01] turn lanes are warranted on Club Pike.

[1:19:03] No improvements are required to Club

[1:19:04] Pike and the development is, you know,

[1:19:07] the the surrounding roadways are

[1:19:10] adequate to serve the proposed

[1:19:11] development with no improvements.

[1:19:12] >> Okay. Fair enough. Okay. Uh, Mr. Smith,

[1:19:15] that's all I got. Appreciate it. Thank

[1:19:16] you. Thank you.

[1:19:17] >> And then uh uh and then any other Yeah.

[1:19:20] You part of the development team? Yeah.

[1:19:21] Come on up, please.

[1:19:21] >> I'll swear you in.

[1:19:23] >> All right. Please swear your hand. Do

[1:19:24] you swear to tell the truth, the whole

[1:19:25] truth? I the truth. Help you God.

[1:19:26] >> I do.

[1:19:27] >> State your name and address for the

[1:19:28] record.

[1:19:28] >> Uh Edwin Fujia. Address is 7861 East

[1:19:33] Keer Road, Cincinnati, Ohio 45249.

[1:19:36] Please go ahead. um to address the

[1:19:38] couple questions you had for us. Um as

[1:19:41] far as how long the property's on the

[1:19:43] market, I don't know. We typically get

[1:19:45] things before they hit the market. Um

[1:19:49] >> and then as far as buffering goes, we

[1:19:51] are happy to help. Um whether it's

[1:19:53] landscaping or a you know artificial

[1:19:57] buffer like a fence or something like

[1:19:58] that in place where it's needed, we're

[1:20:01] always open to that. We want to be good

[1:20:03] neighbors.

[1:20:04] >> Fair enough. Uh but uh before we I

[1:20:06] always allow my vice chair to go first.

[1:20:08] Vice Chairman, do you have any

[1:20:08] questions?

[1:20:10] >> Mr. Lo, the uh uh ballpark. Uh now I

[1:20:13] know this is probably an Arbor question

[1:20:14] because y'all are building, but uh uh do

[1:20:16] we know the average price of the homes

[1:20:17] yet? Ballpark?

[1:20:19] >> I'll let Arbor.

[1:20:19] >> Okay, one more. Um

[1:20:22] I'm sure you you probably footed the

[1:20:24] bill for the traffic count. Can can you

[1:20:25] give me any more insight on that? cuz

[1:20:27] I'll tell you I'll tell you what you're

[1:20:28] going to hear tonight and it's probably

[1:20:30] no surprise to you is uh during rush

[1:20:32] hour times I drive Kluff every single

[1:20:35] day so I can personally say uh there's

[1:20:37] times where Kluff's fine. Cluff's fine.

[1:20:38] It's not a problem. Then there's times

[1:20:40] where Club Pike is a disaster and you

[1:20:41] avoid at all cost. However,

[1:20:45] whether you all like it or not, that's

[1:20:46] actually a county road is not. We don't

[1:20:48] own that road. That's a county road

[1:20:49] which they really need to uh expand it

[1:20:51] probably make it four ways. But uh

[1:20:53] anyways, regardless, their concern is

[1:20:55] going to be uh the traffic count and and folks trying to turn left on Kloff

[1:21:00] at 7 8:00 in the morning. Uh I can

[1:21:02] guarantee every single person is

[1:21:04] probably going to come up here and say

[1:21:04] that. So any thoughts or suggestions on

[1:21:07] that?

[1:21:08] >> So I don't know the exact counts off

[1:21:10] hand. Um however, what I do know about

[1:21:13] the study is we used a 10-year time

[1:21:16] period for the study at that with the

[1:21:18] traffic counts they generated. The way

[1:21:20] the traffic study works and you all may

[1:21:23] know this. So they submit our engineer

[1:21:25] who's doing the traffic study submits a

[1:21:27] memorandum of understanding to the

[1:21:29] county.

[1:21:29] >> Yeah.

[1:21:29] >> The county agrees this is what we're

[1:21:32] studying. Uh after that there's a volume

[1:21:34] submitt and we our engineer submits you

[1:21:38] know says these are the volumes that

[1:21:40] we're going to use. The county says okay

[1:21:42] we agree with those volumes. They can

[1:21:44] either increase the volumes decrease the

[1:21:46] volumes. um with Claremont County and

[1:21:49] our experience that they typically like

[1:21:51] to increase the volumes um as a

[1:21:54] conservative matter.

[1:21:55] >> Um so we got approved on the volumes. We

[1:21:58] did the traffic study. There was no

[1:22:00] using the 10-year period. There was no

[1:22:02] um

[1:22:04] >> traffic there was obviously there's

[1:22:06] impact but there was no improvements

[1:22:08] deemed necessary. Uh currently they are

[1:22:11] asking us to stretch that out instead of

[1:22:13] 10 years to 20 years. This was just as

[1:22:15] of I think a couple days ago.

[1:22:18] >> Um so that's what we're working on right

[1:22:20] now. See

[1:22:21] >> all it's all I can ask for is you get

[1:22:22] you got the factual data. If they say

[1:22:23] it's it's good then it's and that's all we got. So um I think that's

[1:22:28] all I got. Appreciate you. Thank you.

[1:22:30] Appreciate it, sir. Thank you. Yeah. And

[1:22:32] I assume the builders. Yeah.

[1:22:34] >> All right. Raise your right hand and do

[1:22:36] you swear to tell truth? The whole

[1:22:37] truth. I want the truth. Hope you got

[1:22:38] it.

[1:22:38] >> I do. Brian. Yeah. Brian Hending. 9050

[1:22:42] Center Point Drive. got paper copies if

[1:22:44] you guys want any.

[1:22:45] >> Um but yeah, uh so average price is

[1:22:49] going to be 360,000

[1:22:51] to 550,000.

[1:22:53] Um these homes are very customizable by

[1:22:56] the kind of home buyer. So it really

[1:22:58] depends on what they select ultimately.

[1:23:01] One thing on traffic is this will be a

[1:23:04] kind of 55 plus targeted community. All homes are ranch homes. So there

[1:23:10] might just be a little less traffic

[1:23:12] coming out of this neighborhood than

[1:23:13] versus a you know a typical suburb

[1:23:16] suburban neighborhood with families you

[1:23:18] know taking kids to soccer practice and

[1:23:20] all that. Um we've got five floor plans.

[1:23:23] Each floor plan has different uh five

[1:23:25] different elevations. Um they can pick a

[1:23:28] variety of colors. We have a anti-

[1:23:31] monotony policy where essentially no uh

[1:23:34] house next door or across the street is

[1:23:37] allowed to have the same elevation or

[1:23:39] floor or color scheme. Um so essentially

[1:23:42] that just kind of keeps kind of a a

[1:23:44] design rhythm that um you know takes

[1:23:47] away the monotony essentially. So yeah

[1:23:50] that's about it. I don't know if you

[1:23:51] guys have any questions for us. Happy to

[1:23:53] go through kind of our company history

[1:23:55] or anything else you guys

[1:23:57] >> want to say Mr. Mr. back or anything?

[1:23:59] >> No.

[1:24:00] >> Mr. Luke,

[1:24:02] >> I like that destination line. It's

[1:24:04] interesting.

[1:24:05] >> Yeah. Yeah. No, it's nice. A lot of lot

[1:24:07] of communities are looking for that 55

[1:24:09] plus housing type thing.

[1:24:11] >> Okay. So, so just recap the uh so your target market to sell these homes

[1:24:18] is 55 plus age range.

[1:24:19] >> Yep.

[1:24:20] >> Uh price range is ballpark 360 to

[1:24:23] 550,000.

[1:24:24] >> Y

[1:24:26] >> and they're all ranch. So, uh,

[1:24:28] basements, no basements.

[1:24:29] >> Uh, so the customer can select a

[1:24:32] basement, but

[1:24:32] >> Okay. Well, basically, they're not going

[1:24:34] to be two stories. It sounds like

[1:24:35] they're all right.

[1:24:35] >> No, they could be. So, essentially, uh,

[1:24:38] a customer can either select, uh, to

[1:24:41] have a basement or a second story. It

[1:24:44] won't like these are the elevations of

[1:24:46] the home. The second story is

[1:24:48] essentially almost like half story.

[1:24:50] >> Got it.

[1:24:50] >> Um, so yeah.

[1:24:51] >> Okay. Okay. And then uh assuming

[1:24:54] hypothetically if it is approved, when

[1:24:56] are you all planning on breaking ground?

[1:24:58] >> Uh that would be the developer, but uh

[1:25:00] we would say as soon as possible. I

[1:25:02] would I would guess spring.

[1:25:06] » Okay.

[1:25:07] >> We we are constantly pushing these guys

[1:25:09] to

[1:25:09] >> That's okay. That's okay. All right. All

[1:25:10] right. That's uh I think that's all I

[1:25:12] got. Okay. And then uh and then hey I

[1:25:14] would uh

[1:25:16] >> once the folks come up and speak I would

[1:25:18] uh be prepared to just answer any

[1:25:20] questions they or concerns they might

[1:25:21] have for whoever is best suited for that

[1:25:22] one. So okay thank you. Thank you sir.

[1:25:25] >> Um okay. And is there anyone else that

[1:25:28] is a proponent of this case that is for

[1:25:30] this case that would like to talk?

[1:25:33] >> Okay. Anyone that's an opponent? Yeah.

[1:25:35] Come on up. So and by the way I I don't need cards for this one. Uh so

[1:25:38] you're okay. That's just for public

[1:25:39] comment. So uh but go on. Come on up.

[1:25:41] Dave, I'll swear you in.

[1:25:43] >> Okay.

[1:25:43] >> All right, sir. Do you swear to tell the

[1:25:45] truth, the whole truth? But the truth,

[1:25:46] shall be God.

[1:25:47] >> So, help me to God. I do.

[1:25:48] >> Name name and address for the record,

[1:25:49] sir.

[1:25:50] >> David E. Muse. Uh, 1071 Cluff Pike.

[1:25:55] Sounds like I need to get in the golf

[1:25:56] cart business because if it's 55 and

[1:25:59] older, that's what's going to be driving

[1:26:01] in that community over there. You know

[1:26:03] what I mean? I got to start selling golf

[1:26:06] carts.

[1:26:06] >> I think so.

[1:26:07] >> Okay. Thank you to the board of trustees

[1:26:10] for having this opportunity for the

[1:26:12] community to speak before you. Cast your

[1:26:14] votes on the zoning change from R1 to R4

[1:26:20] for the subdivision to be known as the

[1:26:22] Oaks at Ridge Point. My name is David E.

[1:26:25] Muse and I am with the Union

[1:26:28] [clears throat] Township Republican

[1:26:29] Central Committee. I represent voting

[1:26:33] precinct T. Yes, it's true. Only

[1:26:36] Republicans voted me in this position in

[1:26:40] our last primary. I told John Becker,

[1:26:44] who asked me to join and run for

[1:26:46] election, that I would listen and try

[1:26:49] and help with concerns that all voters

[1:26:52] in precinct had, no matter what

[1:26:55] political party they did or not belong

[1:26:59] to. And now here is my first

[1:27:02] representation for Union Township Voting

[1:27:05] Precinct T. I or no one wants to stand

[1:27:10] in a land owner's way of selling their

[1:27:13] land and providing for their family. But

[1:27:17] what we do ask is for them to think

[1:27:21] about the neighbors

[1:27:24] they had while growing up and the person

[1:27:28] that gave you the land and how they

[1:27:33] loved Kluff Pike. They called home for

[1:27:37] many years.

[1:27:39] I first off want to speak about Kluff

[1:27:42] Pike between Shaylor Road and McMahon

[1:27:45] Road. It is one of the busiest and

[1:27:48] dangerous stretches of road in Union

[1:27:51] Township. This section is at its peak

[1:27:55] congestion during school bus pickup in

[1:27:59] the morning and workers going to work at

[1:28:02] it starts all over again when all

[1:28:06] schools let out and workers are going

[1:28:09] home. This will make it impossible

[1:28:15] for those wanting to leave from Oaks at

[1:28:19] Ridge Point subdivision.

[1:28:22] That traffic will not let them out. We

[1:28:27] on Pike know because we cannot get out

[1:28:31] of our own driveways.

[1:28:34] I ask our police chief

[1:28:37] here today. You remember trying to get

[1:28:40] in and out of the old Glenn Estie High

[1:28:43] School in the morning and when school

[1:28:47] let out. A police officer was needed to

[1:28:50] direct traffic and that is what will be

[1:28:53] needed to help those at the Oaks at

[1:28:57] Ridge Point get out of their

[1:29:00] subdivision. A police officer five days

[1:29:04] a week, two times a day. That may be

[1:29:08] what that part of club might need. Might

[1:29:12] be good.

[1:29:14] But with how the police and Union

[1:29:17] Townships budget is stretched as it is,

[1:29:21] we must come up with another answer.

[1:29:25] The only solution for the entrance to

[1:29:28] the oaks at Ridge Point subdivision on

[1:29:31] cloth pipe could only be used as an

[1:29:36] enter only heading to Shaylor Road and

[1:29:41] when leaving the subdivision only

[1:29:43] turning right on Clough Pike heading

[1:29:47] toward Shaylor Road. The real answer is

[1:29:52] to put an entrance

[1:29:58] to the subdivision on Shaylor Road.

[1:30:02] The developer had concerns about the

[1:30:05] creek at the zoning meeting. Upon

[1:30:10] observation

[1:30:12] and Apple Maps, there is enough land to

[1:30:17] make the needed entrance for the

[1:30:20] subdivision. An estimated 500 ft before

[1:30:25] the creek. More than enough needed. This

[1:30:29] is the best time to tell the developer

[1:30:33] that they must put the main entrance to

[1:30:36] the Oaks at Ridge Point subdivision

[1:30:41] there because they will have to pay for

[1:30:44] it now and Union Township will not have

[1:30:48] to pay for the mistake later.

[1:30:52] Just think

[1:30:55] 58 homes, mom and dad have cars.

[1:31:00] One car for the children. That's

[1:31:04] 180 cars trying to get out on pipe in

[1:31:08] the morning going to work and school.

[1:31:11] The traffic will not let them out

[1:31:15] because they've got to be someplace as

[1:31:18] well.

[1:31:19] So that's

[1:31:21] 180 cars backed up in the new

[1:31:24] subdivision that was not planned well.

[1:31:29] The developer wants to change R1 to R4.

[1:31:33] The Woodmont subdivision that will be

[1:31:36] behind it, including Ridge Point Drive,

[1:31:39] is R2.

[1:31:42] Why not change R1 to R2 and not R4?

[1:31:49] Mr. Trustees, before we leave here

[1:31:52] today,

[1:31:54] I would like to uh

[1:31:57] end just a few concerns of those about

[1:32:01] Bluff Pike. They would like to see, this

[1:32:04] is my constituents that have gotten with

[1:32:06] me, and they would like to see a right

[1:32:10] turn on the red light as a three-way

[1:32:14] light

[1:32:16] uh at McMahon and CL. They would like to

[1:32:19] see no turn on red. That would give the

[1:32:23] subdivision a chance to get out

[1:32:27] and uh that would cut down on the road

[1:32:30] rage.

[1:32:32] There's quite a bit of road rage there.

[1:32:34] Uh the cars when they try to get out of

[1:32:37] their subdivision there, cars are upset

[1:32:40] and they ride their bumper and they toot

[1:32:45] all the way down.

[1:32:47] Another thing would be great is to

[1:32:50] change the speed limit from 40 miles

[1:32:53] hour to 25 or 30 miles per hour in that

[1:32:58] stretch from light to light. I hope I've

[1:33:02] presented all of my constituents

[1:33:04] concerns of voting prect well. We want

[1:33:08] to work with the trustees and the

[1:33:10] developer on this project. We feel that

[1:33:14] the matters that we have put before you

[1:33:18] are not out of this world and can be

[1:33:21] done where all can be happy. President

[1:33:25] Ronald Reagan was once asked about his

[1:33:29] deal making

[1:33:31] and how he went about it. He stated,

[1:33:34] "Both sides must come away feeling they

[1:33:38] came away with something.

[1:33:41] If only one gets everything, then the

[1:33:44] next time you sit down across the table

[1:33:48] with that person, they will remember."

[1:33:54] And uh, Mr. Trustees, before you cast

[1:33:57] your vote on changing the zoning from R1

[1:34:00] to R4, I'd like to speak for 30 seconds

[1:34:04] before you cast that vote.

[1:34:08] >> Uh, that's not really how it works

[1:34:10] though, Mr. So this mean meaning this is

[1:34:13] your time to talk right now. I call up

[1:34:15] other people. Uh so it all comes down to

[1:34:19] safety for our community and for our new

[1:34:22] neighbors that will arrive when the oaks

[1:34:25] at Ridge Point subdivision is completed.

[1:34:28] That's all we want from our trustees and

[1:34:31] the developer. If both parties will not

[1:34:34] work with us to achieve these goals,

[1:34:38] which I know our trustees are wanting to

[1:34:41] work with us, and the trustees okay to

[1:34:44] the zoning change from R1 to R4,

[1:34:48] then we

[1:34:52] do

[1:34:53] have uh uh then we must do as the law

[1:34:58] permits. that we have been working on

[1:35:02] as a group in precinct T is called a

[1:35:06] zoning referendum.

[1:35:09] Once we have our needed signatures on a

[1:35:12] petition, the matter of keeping the

[1:35:15] properties at R1 or R4 will be voted on

[1:35:20] the 20 26 November election and be voted

[1:35:25] on by the people.

[1:35:28] So

[1:35:30] that

[1:35:32] will hold up your ground baking

[1:35:37] development

[1:35:39] not happen.

[1:35:42] >> Thank you. Mr. Muse,

[1:35:44] Mr. Flouty, can you throw up a a good

[1:35:46] overview picture so I can see the uh

[1:35:50] houses, you know, on on either side and

[1:35:52] then also the roads it's on.

[1:35:53] >> Yeah. You want a little wider one? I I

[1:35:55] just have a feeling we're going to be

[1:35:56] referencing uh the map quite a bit.

[1:36:01] >> You you had one in your presentation

[1:36:02] that was good.

[1:36:11] » Um

[1:36:14] » yeah. Yeah. Yeah, that one's fine. Can you maybe just Yeah, that's fine.

[1:36:18] That's fine. Okay, perfect.

[1:36:20] Okay. Uh All right.

[1:36:22] Uh, is there anyone else that'd like to

[1:36:24] talk on this project? Yes, sir. I see

[1:36:25] you in the back. Come on up, sir.

[1:36:34] All right.

[1:36:35] >> No problem. Yeah, you're okay. And then

[1:36:38] just raise your right hand. And sir, do

[1:36:40] you swear to tell the truth, the whole

[1:36:41] truth, and they both the truth? So hopey

[1:36:42] God.

[1:36:42] >> I do.

[1:36:43] >> Great. And then just state your name and

[1:36:44] address for the record.

[1:36:45] >> My name is Scott Shean. My address is

[1:36:48] 1069 Ridge Point Drive in Betavia.

[1:36:53] >> Go ahead.

[1:36:53] >> Yeah.

[1:36:54] >> Good evening, gentlemen. Lisa,

[1:36:57] >> um,

[1:36:59] starting off, I hate I hate to just be

[1:37:01] an opponent for everything. I I was

[1:37:04] against the uh the new subdivision going

[1:37:08] through to Ridge Point. So, accolades

[1:37:11] for the the solution of of having a

[1:37:14] culde-sac. I think that solves uh at

[1:37:17] least one of my concerns. So that that's

[1:37:20] on a positive note. Thank you. Um

[1:37:23] concerns that I have uh are several. Um

[1:37:27] if we can we is there another

[1:37:32] >> Let me shoot this up to you guys and you

[1:37:34] can pass. Can I bring approach

[1:37:36] >> this one? This one

[1:37:37] >> the table.

[1:37:38] >> Yeah. Cool.

[1:37:46] That's okay. Craig, give me a give me a

[1:37:48] better picture than that.

[1:37:50] >> The the one Yeah, was fine.

[1:37:52] >> I just want to be able to reference it.

[1:37:55] >> That's perfect. Yeah. Okay.

[1:37:57] >> All right. The first the first thing I I

[1:37:59] would want to talk about is the

[1:38:02] um

[1:38:05] in the culde-sac having the seven seven

[1:38:07] times. Um, couple things come to mind

[1:38:11] here. Uh, the first one is and and my my

[1:38:15] house is uh next to lot 52. I don't know

[1:38:20] whether it's that's my house right

[1:38:23] there. And lot 52 is right here. Lot 52

[1:38:27] is uh one of the smaller lots. It's got

[1:38:30] a 58 foot frontage. uh according to the

[1:38:34] uh design requirements, you have to have

[1:38:37] five feet on each side of the of the

[1:38:39] home, which means it's a 48

[1:38:42] uh it's 48 ft wide maximum. Um and and

[1:38:48] uh if you look at the uh geology and the

[1:38:52] topography of the of the land, the the

[1:38:56] water from this area here flows down

[1:38:59] this way toward where you have a a

[1:39:02] retention pond slammed and um it the

[1:39:06] creek starts probably just to the back

[1:39:10] of my house uh on on the on the edge of

[1:39:13] the property. Uh, in fact, I would say a

[1:39:17] little bit on on my property and and

[1:39:20] maybe 10 or 15 feet into lot 52. And it

[1:39:24] comes down as kind of a wedge that uh

[1:39:27] culminates uh maybe 40 feet behind uh my

[1:39:32] house in a in the beginning of a creek.

[1:39:35] And my concern is is if you look at the

[1:39:38] topography of the land, it it all slopes

[1:39:41] on 52 from the CF site

[1:39:44] uh down toward my property. And I don't

[1:39:47] know how you would ever build uh a

[1:39:49] foundation to a house uh without pushing

[1:39:53] the dirt around in in a manner that

[1:39:55] would move the water towards my house

[1:39:59] and my property. So that is that is a a

[1:40:02] major concern

[1:40:04] uh of a of water issue. You can't walk

[1:40:07] through that area without waiters. Even when it's uh even when it's dry out

[1:40:13] uh as you get down it uh further down

[1:40:17] from my house, you do need

[1:40:20] >> heavy galashes to walk through that

[1:40:22] area. Um, the other concern I have is

[1:40:26] you do have seven homes in that area in that uh culde-sac. We have covenants

[1:40:32] that we had to sign uh uh in order to

[1:40:35] get title to the to our property.

[1:40:37] Everyone on Ridge Point, whether they

[1:40:40] live up to them or not, had to had to

[1:40:43] sign uh that uh the covenants as as part

[1:40:47] of the neighborhood

[1:40:48] >> for the HOA,

[1:40:49] >> please.

[1:40:49] >> For for the HOA, is there an HOA in your

[1:40:51] neighborhood?

[1:40:52] >> There there there is no formal HOA.

[1:40:56] >> So that and that whole thing needs to be

[1:40:59] rationalized and and normalized because

[1:41:01] you're going to be adding seven houses

[1:41:03] into an area that has defined covenants

[1:41:06] that that uh someone could legally take

[1:41:09] uh a neighbor to task on it because they

[1:41:12] signed off on it. And and then and then

[1:41:15] the the uh

[1:41:17] >> my neighborhood's like that. There there

[1:41:19] are things such as what even what fences

[1:41:23] can be used in that HOA in I'm sorry in

[1:41:26] the covenants and and normalizing those

[1:41:29] is is really important otherwise it's

[1:41:31] going to be real messy going down the

[1:41:33] road. Um,

[1:41:37] the

[1:41:40] last item is and and you can see it

[1:41:43] better on the thing that I passed out

[1:41:45] there is my driveway is is on the side

[1:41:48] right toward uh lot 52.

[1:41:51] I for the life of me I don't know how

[1:41:53] you would build that culde-sac or or

[1:41:56] anything without blocking my blocking me

[1:41:58] and and I'd like to understand how you

[1:42:01] would manage that because uh um you know

[1:42:06] I I can move my car down a little bit uh

[1:42:09] but I'm I'm not 40 years old. It could

[1:42:12] be that I need a life squad. the people

[1:42:14] next to us uh uh have had the life squad

[1:42:18] at their house several times and and uh

[1:42:22] we we just can't block off that end of

[1:42:24] the street while things are being built.

[1:42:26] There could be and let me let me propose

[1:42:28] a suggestion, you know, instead of

[1:42:30] everything just being uh what you can't

[1:42:34] do. Um the culde-sac could be designed

[1:42:37] and pro the preliminary design and built

[1:42:40] coming in off of Kluff. Um lay it all

[1:42:43] out and then when you finally get it all

[1:42:46] laid out uh then you know before you put

[1:42:49] the the the curb and the the final

[1:42:52] street in that's when you switch it back

[1:42:55] to Ridge Point and and and manage it uh

[1:42:59] manage it properly. I think I think

[1:43:01] that's a a way to do that with

[1:43:03] minimizing the the the pain and agony to the three or four houses down at the

[1:43:10] end of the street. So, that's that's

[1:43:12] kind of uh where I'm at. My concern is the water

[1:43:18] uh how you would manage that water with

[1:43:19] a 48 foot frontage on on a house with

[1:43:22] five feet on either side in the in the

[1:43:25] midst of of uh the beginning of a a

[1:43:28] creek.

[1:43:29] um the covenants and uh my driveway.

[1:43:33] That's that's it. Anyone have any

[1:43:35] questions?

[1:43:36] >> Mr. Sheman. She right.

[1:43:37] >> She

[1:43:39] sir vice chairman. Any questions?

[1:43:41] >> No.

[1:43:42] >> Mr. Lug?

[1:43:43] >> Uh not currently.

[1:43:45] >> She miss Sheman. By the way, by the way,

[1:43:47] >> please. [clears throat]

[1:43:48] >> I I [snorts] want to commend you because

[1:43:52] not I don't want to say all the time.

[1:43:53] That's a blanket statement. But [snorts]

[1:43:57] more often than not, typically residents

[1:44:00] will come up no no no no. Right. And and

[1:44:05] you have come up here with a positive

[1:44:07] attitude with uh other concessions and also um you know solutions. And so I

[1:44:14] wrote everything you just said down. And

[1:44:16] so I just wanted to say appreciate that.

[1:44:18] Um because I am I'm I'm a pro liberty

[1:44:23] kind of guy. I mean, if it's your land,

[1:44:24] do whatever you want. You want to sell

[1:44:25] it, sell it. You want to develop it, As long as it meets, you

[1:44:28] know, the the township rules. And so, uh

[1:44:30] I just appreciate you you doing that. By

[1:44:32] the way, um can can I can I keep this

[1:44:34] for the time being, please?

[1:44:35] >> Sure. I've got it on my computer.

[1:44:37] >> And then developers, whoever's going to

[1:44:38] talk, y'all need to plan because he's

[1:44:40] 100% right. I'm looking at this and I'm

[1:44:42] looking also at lot number 58 across the

[1:44:44] street from you, which would be category

[1:44:46] to your left. Um, I I need to hear a

[1:44:49] plan and what you plan on doing because

[1:44:51] I will not have this man be

[1:44:52] inconvenienced whatsoever. Um, I need to

[1:44:54] make sure that's crystal clear and

[1:44:55] addressed and for the the lot across the

[1:44:57] street from him. Um, and and and uh the

[1:45:00] reason why you do R4 is so you can not

[1:45:03] have every lot size the same size

[1:45:05] because that makes things difficult. So

[1:45:06] R4 is actually a good thing when it's

[1:45:08] used properly. And I think these

[1:45:10] builders are trying to do it properly.

[1:45:11] However,

[1:45:13] that is a small lot size and I do not

[1:45:16] want dirt or water or you to be or your

[1:45:18] driveway to be blocked at all. Period.

[1:45:20] So, I have your back on that 100%. I

[1:45:22] know these two guys will as well. So,

[1:45:23] I'm just speaking on their behalf right

[1:45:24] now. For what it's worth, thank you for

[1:45:26] pointing that out. So, I appreciate that

[1:45:27] and um and that'll give these guys some

[1:45:30] times to prep for a response to that

[1:45:31] because we're not going to allow that.

[1:45:33] I'm not gonna allow that. So, for what

[1:45:34] it's worth, thank you for your time. So,

[1:45:35] thank you, Mr. Appreciate it very much.

[1:45:36] Thank you.

[1:45:37] >> The uh Okay. Uh, anyone else that is a

[1:45:41] uh uh what's the word? Not proponent.

[1:45:44] Uh, against this against this opponent.

[1:45:46] Geez, what is wrong with me? The

[1:45:48] opponent of this case, please.

[1:45:50] >> All right. All right. Will you please

[1:45:52] raise your right hand? Do you swear to

[1:45:53] tell truth, the whole truth, nothing but

[1:45:55] the truth. So, bey God.

[1:45:56] >> Great. Uh, name and address for the

[1:45:57] record, miss.

[1:45:58] >> My name is Susan Dudak, and I live at

[1:45:59] 1087 Gwood Drive. C,

[1:46:01] >> can you say your name one more time?

[1:46:03] >> Susan Dudak.

[1:46:04] >> Dudak. Okay. Susan. Okay. So, a lot of

[1:46:07] us here were at the uh previous zoning

[1:46:10] um meeting where this was all discussed

[1:46:13] and oftent times the question came up,

[1:46:16] what is the difference between R1 and

[1:46:18] R4? It's it's it's hard for most

[1:46:20] homeowners to understand that and most

[1:46:21] don't. Um and we come to those meetings

[1:46:25] so we can get facts. That's what we

[1:46:26] count on you guys for. So, I can tell

[1:46:29] you that the um description of R1 versus

[1:46:32] R4 that was given by the zoning

[1:46:34] commission was extremely misleading and

[1:46:38] highly biased. Okay? And let me give you

[1:46:41] an example of what they said. In R1,

[1:46:44] typically the houses would be on cookie

[1:46:46] cutter halfacre lots. Now, every time

[1:46:49] they spoke about R1, they use the word

[1:46:51] cookie cutter. But with R4, we are

[1:46:54] allowed to vary the size and shape of

[1:46:56] these lots. Some can be smaller, some

[1:46:57] can be larger, there can be fluctuation,

[1:47:00] there can be diversification rather than

[1:47:02] just this cutout subdivision that we

[1:47:04] used to see all the time. Um, in an R1

[1:47:08] traditional neighborhood, the lots are

[1:47:10] cookie cutter and variable means the

[1:47:12] lots can fluctuate in size. Now, our one

[1:47:16] neighborhood, example, Shante Clear

[1:47:18] Woods, Crystal Creek, drive into one of

[1:47:21] those neighborhoods, do you see cookie

[1:47:22] cutter? Do you see unvaried lot sizes?

[1:47:25] It has nothing to do with that. Um, you

[1:47:29] want to see cookie cutter, drive into an

[1:47:31] R4 neighborhood, drive into Weatherbe

[1:47:33] Farms, drive into um Magnolia Trace,

[1:47:38] nice houses, but boom boom boom lots.

[1:47:41] So, the um zoning commission said they said specifically, we are trying to

[1:47:48] encourage our force.

[1:47:51] They kept referring to the Horizon 2 TW

[1:47:53] uh 2030 as backing up this um ability to

[1:47:57] build our force. And let me read you

[1:48:00] from that report because I'm sure that

[1:48:02] most people don't even know it exists,

[1:48:04] let alone have read it. So there is a

[1:48:06] section in there called land use

[1:48:08] recommendations residential development.

[1:48:10] And the report specifically says, "This

[1:48:13] comprehensive land use planning document

[1:48:16] shall continue to recommend single

[1:48:19] family large lot residential development

[1:48:22] as the guiding principle for new family

[1:48:24] development throughout the majority of

[1:48:26] Union Township. Now, it goes on to talk

[1:48:29] about little pockets where there might

[1:48:31] be the possibility that higher densers

[1:48:33] might be appropriate, but this is not

[1:48:36] one of those pockets. And even in the

[1:48:39] documentation that I received here today

[1:48:43] um where the zoning commission is saying

[1:48:44] further adjacent land uses use use

[1:48:48] characteristics nearly mirror the

[1:48:50] proposed development plan. Well

[1:48:55] take a look at the township zoning map.

[1:48:58] What do you see? You see yellow and

[1:49:00] yellow outside of the development for

[1:49:03] businesses R1 and R2. There are very few R4s here. I mean it's so that's

[1:49:10] not true. Uh their description of our

[1:49:13] winner, they're clearly biased. So who

[1:49:16] here is to stand up for us? Because

[1:49:19] that's not what the community wants. Um

[1:49:23] so that's my first comment. Okay. My

[1:49:26] second thing, I'm a real estate agent.

[1:49:28] So when I heard when I hear about a new

[1:49:30] builder that I've never heard of before,

[1:49:32] I'm I'm going to do my homework. So, at

[1:49:35] the last zoning meeting, they said that

[1:49:37] the price range for this neighborhood

[1:49:39] was going to be in the $600,000 plus

[1:49:41] price range. I see they've ded that

[1:49:44] down. So, did anybody ask, does Arbor

[1:49:47] Homes build $600,000 houses, let alone

[1:49:51] $600,000 neighborhoods? So, I started

[1:49:54] with AI, Google, you know, because

[1:49:56] that's where you start, right? I said,

[1:49:58] "What kind of homes does Arbor Homes

[1:50:00] build?" And it came back. Arbor Homes

[1:50:03] builds affordable stickuilt single

[1:50:05] family ranch and two-story houses

[1:50:08] featuring open concept layouts tailored

[1:50:11] for firsttime buyers and growing

[1:50:13] families. Their properties range from

[1:50:15] budget friendly starter options to

[1:50:18] larger plans with semicustom structural

[1:50:20] choices. I'm like, okay, that doesn't

[1:50:23] sound real. So, I I got more specific. I

[1:50:26] said, does Arbor Homes build $600,000

[1:50:29] plus houses? And the answer came back,

[1:50:32] no. Arbor Homes does not build houses

[1:50:35] priced above 600,000. Their business

[1:50:37] model focuses exclusively on affordable

[1:50:40] entrylevel and mid-range production

[1:50:43] houses, maxing out well below that

[1:50:46] threshold.

[1:50:47] Talks about their target demographics.

[1:50:49] Arbor Homes intentionally develops an

[1:50:52] outer suburban rings where land costs

[1:50:54] are lower, utilizing tax incentives to

[1:50:57] specifically keep homes attainable for

[1:51:00] firsttime or moving up buyers.

[1:51:04] So now I'm getting a little concerned.

[1:51:06] So like let's go to their website,

[1:51:07] right? What what does their website say?

[1:51:09] So, if you go to their website and you

[1:51:11] look at their mission statement on their

[1:51:13] website, this is their mission statement

[1:51:16] to increase home ownership for those

[1:51:18] that didn't think they could afford it.

[1:51:21] Now, I'm getting kind of worried about

[1:51:23] this subdivision. So, I thought, okay,

[1:51:25] let's let's let's take a look at where

[1:51:28] they are in Ohio and what have they what

[1:51:30] have they done or they built? So, they

[1:51:32] are building in about 20 neighborhoods

[1:51:36] uh in Ohio so far. And it really is

[1:51:38] true. They're in very outer suburban

[1:51:40] rings. They're in places like Washington

[1:51:42] Courthouse,

[1:51:43] uh, Plain City, Lethopoulos, Belf

[1:51:47] Fontaine, Vandelia, Tip City, Peekqua,

[1:51:51] New Carile. Okay. Um, and then I looked

[1:51:54] at, and this is all information from

[1:51:56] their website. I looked at what are the

[1:51:58] starting prices in these neighborhoods.

[1:52:01] Here they are. 250, 370, 240, 230, 260,

[1:52:06] 320, 240, 230, 240, 280, 270, 350, 270,

[1:52:12] 330, 280, 300, 270.

[1:52:16] Now, in none of these neighborhoods are

[1:52:19] you going to be able to build a $600,000

[1:52:21] house because you're not going to you're

[1:52:23] not going to start at 300 and put

[1:52:24] $300,000 into upgrades. I mean, that just doesn't happen. So I said,

[1:52:29] "Okay, well, you know, they're

[1:52:30] headquartered in Indianapolis. So let me

[1:52:32] look at what they're building in

[1:52:33] Indianapolis." So they have 31 home

[1:52:36] sites in Indianapolis and only two of

[1:52:39] them start above 300,000. One at 300,000

[1:52:43] and one at 350. They have nine home

[1:52:46] sites in Louisville. None of those home

[1:52:48] sites start above 300,000.

[1:52:52] So

[1:52:53] >> Okay. Can I ask you a question without

[1:52:54] interrupting you?

[1:52:55] >> Yeah.

[1:52:56] I don't if you ever shop for a new home

[1:52:58] like a to build from scratch. So if you

[1:53:01] ever This goes back to a uh Mr. Flouty

[1:53:04] issue because you know all those garbage

[1:53:06] signs that those home builders put up at

[1:53:07] all the corners of busy intersections

[1:53:10] and you see the illegal signs that are

[1:53:12] removed in his report. A lot of those

[1:53:13] are like those home builders, right?

[1:53:15] Which we hate. We all hate. Uh but it'll

[1:53:17] say homes starting at 300,000. Well,

[1:53:19] that's literally like a a bare bones

[1:53:21] home. But once you add the countertops,

[1:53:24] the special floors, the special, you

[1:53:26] know, finished basement or whatever,

[1:53:27] then the price ticks up to four, five,

[1:53:29] 600,000. So Mike, I'm not I'm just

[1:53:31] asking you that question. Is is is it

[1:53:33] say starting at bu building or are these

[1:53:35] homes currently built and they've been

[1:53:36] on the market and I'm just curious for

[1:53:38] that because you know, is it the starter

[1:53:40] package?

[1:53:41] >> Well, I looked into these neighborhoods

[1:53:42] and the homes were priced around that.

[1:53:44] Now, even if you get into a $300,000

[1:53:47] neighborhood, there's no way you're

[1:53:49] going to put $300,000 in upgrades into

[1:53:51] that house. True. It just doesn't

[1:53:54] happen. And one of the ways that

[1:53:55] builders keep their prices low is they

[1:53:58] use standardized flow plans. They have

[1:54:02] volume discounts that they get from

[1:54:03] their contractors and their providers so

[1:54:05] that their quality is pretty much all

[1:54:07] the same. That's how they make their

[1:54:09] dollar here. So, it's extremely

[1:54:14] far-fetched for me to think that this is

[1:54:15] going to be a $500,000 neighborhood. And

[1:54:18] then on top of that, they want tiny

[1:54:20] little lots that are not um like

[1:54:24] anything else that's around it. I've got

[1:54:26] a real concern now. Is this the kind of

[1:54:28] neighborhood that's going to add value

[1:54:30] to this area? And and and how do you

[1:54:33] guarantee that?

[1:54:36] Is is is that really your question to

[1:54:39] us?

[1:54:40] >> Yeah.

[1:54:40] >> To to require the board to

[1:54:43] require a higher value

[1:54:46] >> well higher dollar builder to build

[1:54:48] here. I just want to make sure I get the

[1:54:50] question.

[1:54:51] >> We all want a neighborhood that adds to

[1:54:53] the value of the community and not

[1:54:55] detracts from it. And so from what I'm

[1:54:58] hearing so far, I'm not seeing this

[1:55:02] >> proposal as the type that is going to

[1:55:04] add to this community. So I'm very

[1:55:07] concerned and I think you should be very

[1:55:09] concerned as well. And I know that's why

[1:55:11] we're all here.

[1:55:12] >> Right. Got it. Right.

[1:55:13] >> So we're not opposed to building a

[1:55:14] subdivision there. Right.

[1:55:16] >> But let's make it the right one. And I

[1:55:18] mean it starts with you and you

[1:55:19] approving R1 to R4. That's a big step

[1:55:22] here that that just isn't reflective of

[1:55:24] the community.

[1:55:27] So, I would like you to ask you to take

[1:55:29] that into consideration

[1:55:31] and then

[1:55:31] >> and I would speak on the uh Kluff Pike

[1:55:33] thing, but I think you have enough

[1:55:35] information on that.

[1:55:36] >> The uh and I don't want to interrupt you

[1:55:38] again. I'm sorry. Sorry. Are you

[1:55:40] finished? Okay. Are are you finished or

[1:55:41] No. Um, I just want to say that with the with the cluff um, entrance

[1:55:46] kind of thing,

[1:55:49] >> I think Union Township is getting a

[1:55:50] reputation for letting builders come in,

[1:55:53] build whatever they want, forget about

[1:55:55] what impact it has on the surrounding

[1:55:57] areas. And of course, when you bring

[1:55:59] that up with the zoning commission, you

[1:56:00] know what they say? Oh, not our problem.

[1:56:01] That's a Clare that's a Claremont County

[1:56:03] thing. But it is their problem and it is

[1:56:06] your problem because you are approving

[1:56:07] these subdivisions. So, you have a great

[1:56:10] opportunity in this this instance to ask

[1:56:14] the builder to step up. It's going to

[1:56:15] cost him a little bit more money. That's

[1:56:17] why he doesn't want to move the the

[1:56:19] entrance to Shaylor, but it's going to

[1:56:20] cost us a lot less money in the long

[1:56:23] run. So, you can do that. You can say,

[1:56:25] "Hey, Mr. Builder, go back and change

[1:56:27] that entrance, you know, and make the

[1:56:30] builder, when possible, step up and take

[1:56:32] a little bit of responsibility for the

[1:56:34] impact, the negative impact that he is

[1:56:36] having on the community. Let's have builders that do that.

[1:56:42] >> The um

[1:56:44] Are you finished?

[1:56:45] >> I'm finished.

[1:56:45] >> Okay, interrupt you. I'm sorry. So, um

[1:56:48] >> by the way, uh you don't think about

[1:56:50] things until they're brought up, right?

[1:56:52] So, this board had no idea. We just

[1:56:54] didn't think about it. For example, uh

[1:56:55] do you remember when we voted on the

[1:56:57] truck weight and you couldn't have a

[1:56:59] commercial vehicle

[1:57:00] >> in your parking driveway?

[1:57:02] >> Silliest.

[1:57:04] And I'm using I'm and I'm using uh imag

[1:57:08] like to use a different word, but I'm

[1:57:09] saying silliest rule that we had in the

[1:57:12] township.

[1:57:13] >> You have a minivan legal. You slap a

[1:57:16] company sticker on the side of it.

[1:57:18] Illegal. You couldn't park in your

[1:57:19] driveway. And I'm like, what? Are you

[1:57:22] kidding me? And so we we changed that

[1:57:24] rule to where, hey, if you want to start

[1:57:26] your own company and have a pickup truck

[1:57:27] and now you want to start your own

[1:57:28] plumbing company, slap your logo on it,

[1:57:29] you should be allowed to do that. Now,

[1:57:31] can you have dump trucks and

[1:57:32] semi-truckss parked in your drive? No.

[1:57:34] Uh, but we didn't know that till it was

[1:57:36] brought to our attention and we

[1:57:37] immediately as this board rectify it

[1:57:38] changed it so there we allow folks to

[1:57:40] have more liberty and freedom to start

[1:57:41] their own company or whatever, right?

[1:57:42] Um, but we didn't know that till brought

[1:57:44] to our attention. Um, so I did not know

[1:57:46] that folks thought the the the wording

[1:57:49] and the explanation of R1 to R2 to R3 to

[1:57:51] R4 um was trickery or plain favorites at

[1:57:54] all. I don't I don't want that. So, uh,

[1:57:57] this Mr. Flowy's lane. So, Mr. Flouty,

[1:57:59] can you can you make a note? Let's let's

[1:58:01] try to bring it up to to look at that of

[1:58:04] the wording of the differences between

[1:58:06] R1 to R4 and and make sure it's

[1:58:08] clear-cut and I don't want it to seem

[1:58:10] biased whatsoever. Let's just let's just

[1:58:11] check check it out and look at it if

[1:58:13] that's okay. And then I'll tell you this

[1:58:15] uh M Dubac Mr. Becker voted no on it.

[1:58:19] Mr. Flo voted yes on a uh a housing

[1:58:22] development project. And uh it's uh it

[1:58:26] was funny because those houses were 5 to

[1:58:28] 600,000 and it was from a different

[1:58:30] builder and they they they are they have

[1:58:32] um continuity. They have history of

[1:58:34] building 5 to600,000 homes. Him and I

[1:58:38] got chastised because wait hold on we

[1:58:40] can't. They're like this community

[1:58:41] doesn't want 500 to $600,000 homes. We

[1:58:43] want more affordable homes like two to

[1:58:45] 400,000. We we got ri ripped for this

[1:58:48] and we're like okay. And then [laughter]

[1:58:50] now and so and so and so uh and so you

[1:58:54] know if it is 350 so the the argument we

[1:58:57] heard the la the last this couple months

[1:58:58] ago was guys this is Union Township.

[1:59:01] This isn't Indian Hill or Terrace Park.

[1:59:02] We don't want $600,000 homes. We're like

[1:59:05] okay and then now and now you're you're

[1:59:07] saying see so you know you know it's you

[1:59:08] know what's tough and I I get it. This

[1:59:09] is what we signed up for. It's tough

[1:59:11] because we made that decision. And you

[1:59:13] might have liked that decision because

[1:59:15] those homes are going to be half a

[1:59:16] million dollar plus and and

[1:59:18] hypothetically if these homes are not

[1:59:21] 600,000 they are more 350 to 550 that's

[1:59:24] going to make you unhappy and so it's

[1:59:26] like geez no matter what we do I mean I

[1:59:29] don't know that they're going to be 550.

[1:59:31] So they referenced Magnolia Trace which

[1:59:33] is right down the street right

[1:59:35] >> now Magnolia Trace has not been able to

[1:59:37] sell new construction over 600. Okay.

[1:59:40] There's one house, I think, out of 60

[1:59:42] that sold over 600. Now, this is Dre and

[1:59:46] Brookstone Homes. Brookstone,

[1:59:48] >> they build half a million dollar houses.

[1:59:50] They build million-doll houses in

[1:59:52] million-doll neighborhoods. They have a

[1:59:54] background and they have an

[1:59:56] infrastructure to support that. They

[1:59:59] can't even build that high a level of

[2:00:01] house. How is somebody like Arbor

[2:00:03] Holmes, who doesn't have any

[2:00:04] infrastructure to support that, who's

[2:00:06] never done it before, how are they going

[2:00:08] to do it? So, I question I know there's

[2:00:10] not much you can do about the quality,

[2:00:12] but you can do something about the

[2:00:14] zoning. Make the lots larger, you know?

[2:00:17] I mean, what's wrong with minimum

[2:00:19] setbacks? You can't The only thing wrong

[2:00:21] with it is you can't stuff as many

[2:00:23] houses in there.

[2:00:24] >> Yeah,

[2:00:25] >> that's it.

[2:00:26] >> The uh I understand the uh you you you

[2:00:28] made one comment about I wrote it down

[2:00:31] about some of the tax incentives. Um I I

[2:00:33] don't know why I don't get on Next Door

[2:00:35] at all. Uh but but uh folks tell me

[2:00:38] about it and people will say, "Oh,

[2:00:40] another tax incentive. Another tax

[2:00:41] incentive." We have never given out a

[2:00:44] tax incentive um uh to home builders or

[2:00:48] businesses. Uh that's just not something

[2:00:49] that we do. But for some people have in their brain that that's

[2:00:52] happened. These folks are not getting

[2:00:54] any incentive from us. I know that. So

[2:00:55] just so you know. So

[2:00:56] >> yeah, I understand that. But you do give

[2:00:58] out tiffs. You give out tiffs to

[2:00:59] apartment buildings and all sorts of

[2:01:01] stuff like that,

[2:01:02] >> which which uh conversation for a

[2:01:04] different day. And and I'll tell you

[2:01:06] that that it keeps the money in house so

[2:01:08] it doesn't have to go outside the

[2:01:10] township

[2:01:10] >> but it keeps that away from people like

[2:01:12] that.

[2:01:14] >> You wouldn't believe it or not. That's

[2:01:15] exactly how they've survived subsidizes

[2:01:17] the

[2:01:18] >> have kept those alive have kept them

[2:01:20] alive.

[2:01:20] >> The tiff cannot cannot can go to the

[2:01:23] physical building but it can't be used

[2:01:25] for salary.

[2:01:28] So let's let Mr. Wright but that's

[2:01:30] another

[2:01:32] [laughter] fair. Fair time and and the

[2:01:35] record of multif family

[2:01:36] >> time out. So So a tiff just

[2:01:38] [clears throat] 30 second elevator.

[2:01:39] >> 30 second ele Okay. The tiff freezes the

[2:01:41] property value at the base prior to the

[2:01:43] improvement. All the improvement goes

[2:01:45] into it's basically a separate pile

[2:01:47] instead of the pie being split up 50

[2:01:49] different ways. It gets it all comes to

[2:01:51] the township. We have obligations to

[2:01:53] either make the schools whole or provide

[2:01:55] alternative compensation depending on

[2:01:57] what they want. We do both. Aside from

[2:02:00] that, we have the ability to deploy the

[2:02:03] TIFF revenues specifically in support of

[2:02:06] safety services. And my May 26 work

[2:02:09] session presentation demonstrated that

[2:02:12] we provide more than three million, was

[2:02:15] it three million? 3 million annually in

[2:02:19] safety services funding from our tiffs

[2:02:21] throughout the township. And we're

[2:02:23] permitted to do that.

[2:02:24] >> It's our largest expenditure from the

[2:02:26] tiff aside from debt obligations. that

[2:02:29] support things like this building and

[2:02:31] other public projects and our compensate

[2:02:33] compensation to the schools.

[2:02:35] >> Can TIF money be used for policemen or

[2:02:38] firemen salaries?

[2:02:39] >> It they can it's technically they can

[2:02:41] >> Yeah, you can use it for you can you can

[2:02:44] use it for salaries and capital

[2:02:46] indefinitely for police capital

[2:02:47] expenditures. We typically use it for

[2:02:49] capital expenditures to offset the hit

[2:02:52] on their levied funds which are police

[2:02:56] 9, 10, and 20 because with the salaries

[2:03:00] you have to keep track of that and then

[2:03:02] eventually you basically there's some

[2:03:05] you have to basically refund it and then

[2:03:08] it's

[2:03:09] >> because I read that the tiff funds

[2:03:11] cannot be used for those.

[2:03:12] >> You're looking at post 2005 post 2005

[2:03:17] tiffs. So,

[2:03:18] >> those are typically tiffs that are

[2:03:20] adopted. Uh, 57097

[2:03:23] I actually just sent this to somebody.

[2:03:25] 570973

[2:03:28] C tiffs, which are I call them area

[2:03:30] tiffs, not district or parcel tiffs.

[2:03:32] That's what I call them. Partial tiffs

[2:03:34] are specific projects. Area tiffs are

[2:03:37] larger residential uh they're actually

[2:03:39] called residential incentive districts.

[2:03:41] We don't have any post 2006 residential

[2:03:45] incentive district

[2:03:45] >> tiffs. We only have we have 2003s and

[2:03:49] 2005s

[2:03:51] >> and all of those are eligible to fund

[2:03:53] police and fire expenses out of that.

[2:03:55] >> Okay, good.

[2:03:56] >> And then the 570973b

[2:03:59] tiffs which are the commercial tiffs

[2:04:01] which apartments are taxed commercially.

[2:04:04] >> So they pay a higher effective millage

[2:04:06] rate than a residential property does. I

[2:04:08] believe in West Claremont the

[2:04:09] residential effective rate is about 56

[2:04:12] mills and the the commercial rate is 67

[2:04:15] or 68 mills. So commercial properties

[2:04:18] pay a higher effective millage rate. Uh

[2:04:21] for example, I've seen multif family

[2:04:23] values as high as 155 to $156,000

[2:04:29] per door. So a 200 unit apartment

[2:04:32] complex could be appraised as high as

[2:04:34] $30 to $35 million. I think the union

[2:04:37] was generating more than was it more

[2:04:39] than half a million almost 600 700 th000

[2:04:42] don't quote me I got to look it up but

[2:04:44] it's a lot of money and from that 55%

[2:04:47] goes to the schools the township retains

[2:04:50] the other 45% of that

[2:04:51] >> under a typical makehole agreement and

[2:04:55] those are used specifically to backs

[2:04:57] stop safety services and to keep the

[2:05:00] amount and the levy requests lower

[2:05:02] through that economic development

[2:05:04] funding. Well, that's great and thank

[2:05:06] you for that information. And that's the

[2:05:08] kind of information that we look for

[2:05:11] when we come to zoning meetings, when we

[2:05:13] come to this to get the correct

[2:05:15] information. So, thank you for that.

[2:05:17] >> Oh, thank you. Thank you.

[2:05:18] >> And I'm done.

[2:05:18] >> Good. Good job. By the way, the uh um

[2:05:21] Oh, you're good. You're good. The uh

[2:05:22] Okay, it's 8:07. All right. Let me call

[2:05:25] for a quick recess. Uh gentlemen, I'll

[2:05:26] entertain a motion to recess at uh 8:05.

[2:05:30] >> So, second.

[2:05:31] >> Uh any discussion, Mr. Campbell, roll

[2:05:33] call. Mr. Becker.

[2:05:35] >> Yes.

[2:05:35] >> Mr. Lo.

[2:05:36] >> Yes.

[2:05:36] >> Mr. Dills.

[2:05:37] >> Yes.

[2:05:37] >> For recess at 8:05 p.m.

[2:18:37] All right. Uh, Mr. Campbell, I will

[2:18:39] entertain a motion or gentleman

[2:18:40] entertain a motion to exit recess. So

[2:18:44] move

[2:18:46] >> second.

[2:18:46] >> Mr. Camp roll call.

[2:18:50] >> Mr. Becker.

[2:18:52] >> Yes.

[2:18:53] >> Mr. Lo.

[2:18:53] >> Yes.

[2:18:54] >> Mr. Dills.

[2:18:55] >> Yes. We're back in session

[2:18:58] at 8:18 p.m.

[2:19:00] >> Got it. Perfect. Okay. Uh, thank you,

[2:19:03] Miss Dubac. We'll move on. Is there

[2:19:04] anyone else that would like to speak

[2:19:06] that is against uh this this uh

[2:19:08] development? Sir, come on.

[2:19:09] >> And will you please bring your cards up?

[2:19:11] I know I know Mr. Dill said didn't need

[2:19:13] them, but I that helps me because I'm

[2:19:15] trying to keep notes and keep

[2:19:16] >> I apologize. Mr. Campbell needs to write

[2:19:18] down your name and address for the

[2:19:19] record. The cards help him. So, I

[2:19:21] [snorts] I apologize for that. That was

[2:19:23] my mistake. And the reason we do that is

[2:19:24] if there's followup or something, we

[2:19:26] need to get back with you. We got your

[2:19:28] name and number. Thank you.

[2:19:29] >> Please accept my apology wrong.

[2:19:31] >> No, thank you. No, thank you.

[2:19:33] >> All right. Do you swear to tell the

[2:19:34] truth, the whole truth, and the truth?

[2:19:36] Hope you got it.

[2:19:36] >> I do.

[2:19:37] >> Say your name and address.

[2:19:39] >> My name is Alex Lambro. I live at 1069

[2:19:42] Club Pipe.

[2:19:44] I'm the only resident on Club Pipe that

[2:19:47] didn't get a notice

[2:19:50] on this development. It doesn't

[2:19:51] [clears throat] matter because I got

[2:19:53] enough information.

[2:19:56] I [snorts] recognize the reality

[2:19:58] that people have the rights to develop

[2:20:01] the properties. However, when they

[2:20:04] purchase the property, regardless of how

[2:20:07] they obtained it,

[2:20:11] they they knew it was an R1 property.

[2:20:15] They're asking for an R4, which is

[2:20:18] legally their rights.

[2:20:21] But how it was done is what concerns me.

[2:20:26] [snorts]

[2:20:26] Notifications were sent out. Some people

[2:20:29] got it, some people didn't.

[2:20:32] The association didn't get it

[2:20:36] on the development.

[2:20:40] And when they made the presentation last

[2:20:42] month,

[2:20:44] they had none of this information.

[2:20:48] Different designs, different completely.

[2:20:52] They put the notices out.

[2:20:55] Did everybody get them? I didn't.

[2:20:59] Did they put signs out? They put one

[2:21:02] sign out in the woods

[2:21:06] in the subdivision. Nothing on Club.

[2:21:12] Nothing on Saber.

[2:21:15] How will people know what's going on

[2:21:20] if they didn't notify the people?

[2:21:23] And when we attended the meeting, the

[2:21:26] zoning meeting, the people were pretty

[2:21:29] nice. The whole board sympathetic,

[2:21:33] but whatever the citizens brought up,

[2:21:38] you don't get to see it. No record

[2:21:41] whatsoever.

[2:21:45] Now today we're coming over brand new

[2:21:49] designs

[2:21:53] brand new everything. We don't know

[2:21:55] nothing.

[2:21:58] How can we come up here

[2:22:01] and ask for something when we don't

[2:22:03] know? It was never presented to the

[2:22:06] people.

[2:22:09] And if you look at your own forms, we

[2:22:12] all took an oath at one time and another

[2:22:15] to serve and protect.

[2:22:18] We're serving the public. The public

[2:22:21] don't know what R1 is, M1,

[2:22:26] whatever.

[2:22:28] They don't know what it is, what the

[2:22:30] rules are.

[2:22:32] My main concern between R1 and R4 is the

[2:22:36] spacing between

[2:22:39] the houses,

[2:22:41] particularly in the backyard. R4 allows

[2:22:44] you to only have five feet for backyard.

[2:22:50] What are you going to do? Shake hands

[2:22:52] with your neighbor every morning.

[2:22:55] You know, those things need to be in

[2:22:58] writing.

[2:23:01] It was a complaint about the

[2:23:02] subdivision.

[2:23:04] That subdivision road is only 24 ft.

[2:23:08] It's not wide enough, [snorts]

[2:23:13] you know. Now you change the rules. I

[2:23:16] can't identify the problems now

[2:23:21] on it. R4 changes. Once you take a vote

[2:23:24] here,

[2:23:26] if any changes is done, it doesn't come

[2:23:29] back to you.

[2:23:32] One person makes a decision.

[2:23:37] It's not that comes back to the board

[2:23:39] and the board votes on it for the

[2:23:42] changes.

[2:23:44] Your own bylaws says one individual does

[2:23:48] it and they will notify the board. It

[2:23:52] doesn't come back and start all over

[2:23:54] again for a new. And if you look at your

[2:23:57] paperwork,

[2:24:03] I'm sorry.

[2:24:11] [snorts]

[2:24:31] Okay. If you look at your paperwork on

[2:24:34] 326Z

[2:24:37] part 4, the township zoning commission

[2:24:40] and the township trustee may request

[2:24:42] other county, state, and federal

[2:24:44] agencies such as the Claremont County

[2:24:47] Planning Commission, county engineer,

[2:24:49] water and soil conser conservation,

[2:24:53] Claremont County Water and Sewer

[2:24:54] District, and Ohio PA to review and

[2:24:57] comment on submitted [snorts]

[2:24:59] plans.

[2:25:01] Okay. At the meeting, we asked

[2:25:06] for storm sewer because on Clap Pike, it

[2:25:11] does not work. And I guarantee you that

[2:25:15] you can drop a gallon of dye in front of

[2:25:18] our houses

[2:25:20] and you can dump water

[2:25:24] and let a storm and it ain't going

[2:25:26] nowhere. The storm sewers do not work at

[2:25:30] [snorts] all.

[2:25:35] Sewer system. You got an eight 8 in

[2:25:37] sewer system

[2:25:41] on clock pipe.

[2:25:44] 60 years old.

[2:25:49] You got the creek back there with two

[2:25:53] natural ponds. Do you have an EPA

[2:25:56] report? We hear a lot of reports coming

[2:25:59] in. I came to your office to look at

[2:26:02] them. I can't find them.

[2:26:08] It's all here. I have to see everything

[2:26:11] in writing. What I recommend is because

[2:26:14] the way the process was done, send it

[2:26:18] back and give opportunity to people to

[2:26:22] look at the new designs.

[2:26:25] I can't even talk about it because I

[2:26:27] don't know. This is totally different

[2:26:31] of what we saw two weeks ago.

[2:26:35] How can we make recommendations? How can

[2:26:38] we ask for stuff when we don't know?

[2:26:40] They didn't have no pictures of houses.

[2:26:44] They told us they're going to build us

[2:26:45] to 6,000 square foot homes on a 9,000

[2:26:50] square foot lot.

[2:26:55] Look at the

[2:26:56] >> watch it on TV, on YouTube. It's too

[2:26:59] many unanswered questions, stuff that

[2:27:02] people ask for.

[2:27:05] You, the board, don't get to see them

[2:27:06] because nobody wrote it down. They

[2:27:10] thought it was a big joke about the

[2:27:12] gate, which is the dumbest thing I ever

[2:27:14] heard. You're going to put a gate there?

[2:27:20] Ain't no fence. What's the sense of

[2:27:22] having a gate

[2:27:24] just to block the street? They drive

[2:27:26] around it.

[2:27:32] It's too many unanswered questions to

[2:27:35] the public. They're so fed up and they

[2:27:37] just don't trust you. That's the

[2:27:40] reality.

[2:27:42] I recommend

[2:27:44] send it back. Give the people an

[2:27:46] opportunity

[2:27:48] to digest it. see what they need and

[2:27:52] then come back. We got plenty of time.

[2:27:54] They already admitted that they won't do

[2:27:57] nothing till next year.

[2:28:01] >> Mr. Do you want me to address a few

[2:28:03] things you talked about?

[2:28:03] >> Yes, please.

[2:28:04] >> Just, you know, they're not 6,000 foot

[2:28:06] homes. That would be like an Indian Hill

[2:28:07] style home. That'd be a monster home.

[2:28:09] Just just not 6,000.

[2:28:12] Um this is the first well zoning was

[2:28:15] first and then then it comes here and

[2:28:17] the county won't take a look at it

[2:28:19] unless the township says yes they they

[2:28:22] approving this in their that goes for

[2:28:23] all of Claremont County. So no matter

[2:28:25] where you're going to build in the

[2:28:26] county

[2:28:27] >> if the township's not going to approve

[2:28:28] it and vote it down the countyy's going

[2:28:29] to look at it to begin with. So the

[2:28:31] first step is here that's the first step

[2:28:32] and then and then uh the engineer and

[2:28:35] the county [snorts] those folks look at

[2:28:36] it after that. Um just you know the uh

[2:28:39] so when when they approached the zoning

[2:28:42] >> um they they came with their plans and

[2:28:44] then they heard you know the residents

[2:28:46] talk and they had the zoning board's

[2:28:47] recommendations. That's why they changed

[2:28:49] it to accommodate what everyone with the

[2:28:52] feedback they got to give us these plans

[2:28:54] that that's why they did that. So the

[2:28:55] gate you're talking about they did that

[2:28:57] for those two guys over there for safety

[2:28:59] services but then but then they got got

[2:29:02] approval but they didn't need the gate.

[2:29:04] So the gate was actually to help for

[2:29:05] safety services, you know, for for that.

[2:29:07] And then then they did away with the

[2:29:09] gate because they realized they didn't

[2:29:10] need it. Uh so they actually thought the

[2:29:13] uh the adjacent neighborhood didn't want

[2:29:16] the gate at all. So that's why they put

[2:29:17] an end culde-sac there instead of having

[2:29:18] a gate drive through. So therefore

[2:29:20] >> therefore the road doesn't go through

[2:29:22] the neighborhood to the right. Uh so

[2:29:24] they just put an end culde-sac there.

[2:29:26] was a gate, but from my

[2:29:27] understanding the feedback they got was

[2:29:29] from the residents that live in that

[2:29:30] current neighborhood. They didn't want

[2:29:31] the gate and so they they basically cut

[2:29:33] it off. That's why that's why the plans

[2:29:35] are different tonight than they were. So I mean

[2:29:38] >> you could say you don't trust any of us

[2:29:40] up here on this board. But no no you say

[2:29:42] you don't trust any of us. What I'm

[2:29:43] saying is they send the plans first to

[2:29:45] zonings. Zoning makes recommendations

[2:29:47] then they modify them to bring them here

[2:29:49] and that's what they're doing now. So I

[2:29:51] mean that so far everything they've done

[2:29:53] whether you like them or not is

[2:29:54] irrelevant. They've done everything

[2:29:56] correctly up to this point. That makes

[2:29:57] sense.

[2:29:59] It's as I stated before, it's not a

[2:30:01] matter if they did, you know, the

[2:30:04] corrected problems or the issues. You

[2:30:07] had over 30 concerns

[2:30:10] at that meeting. Not a one of them made

[2:30:14] it to your report that you got in front

[2:30:17] of you. Who are we serving?

[2:30:22] When you met with the contractor, you

[2:30:24] met several times. Your guideline itself

[2:30:27] says that you met with a contractor

[2:30:30] several times. Okay? You send a notice

[2:30:34] out to the people that you're going to

[2:30:37] do it, but you don't give them any

[2:30:39] information, any kind of information of

[2:30:42] what their rights are.

[2:30:49] Nothing,

[2:30:51] you know. And what happens is they say

[2:30:54] they attend the meeting and the I tell

[2:30:57] you very simple

[2:31:00] the only thing everybody got very clear

[2:31:03] if you don't follow our recommendation

[2:31:07] what we're going to do we're going to

[2:31:08] strip the land

[2:31:11] and put houses on it.

[2:31:14] Well

[2:31:16] you don't blackmail people. He's from

[2:31:19] out of town. He's coming in here to make

[2:31:21] a profit.

[2:31:23] There's nothing wrong with it. He has

[2:31:25] the rights to. It's his land.

[2:31:29] But if he wants something changed, he

[2:31:31] has to cooperate.

[2:31:33] You know, we ask how the houses look. We

[2:31:36] didn't have no pictures

[2:31:39] of see what kind of house you do.

[2:31:42] How can we have input on it if we didn't

[2:31:45] know? How can we prepare for it? It's an

[2:31:48] unfair. Now, the bottom line is the

[2:31:53] reality is you can make a choice and you

[2:31:56] got a hard choice to make today. Either

[2:32:00] send it back, vote for it, or turn it

[2:32:02] down.

[2:32:06] You know, that's your choice. And I

[2:32:08] wouldn't want to be in your shoes right

[2:32:10] now. But the difference is these people

[2:32:14] don't know what to do next because

[2:32:16] you're not providing that information.

[2:32:19] Don't you think you should have a piece

[2:32:23] of paper guideline

[2:32:25] for every citizen to look at it says

[2:32:28] okay they're going to do this but I have

[2:32:31] the option of doing that

[2:32:33] you know to protest it or support it.

[2:32:38] You're leaving them out in the cold.

[2:32:42] It's very simple.

[2:32:45] Union tells you precinct t the last

[2:32:49] election for governor, you had 61 people

[2:32:55] voted for the governor. Either way,

[2:32:58] whichever party it was, there was 601

[2:33:01] people voted.

[2:33:03] According to your own township rules, to

[2:33:07] put a referendum in requires 8%

[2:33:12] of that vote. That's 47 people.

[2:33:16] Okay? People should know that that

[2:33:19] that's all they have to do is get 47

[2:33:23] registered voters to participate to put

[2:33:26] it on the ballot.

[2:33:28] Now, this is where you come in. Would

[2:33:31] you assist the people to put it on the

[2:33:35] ballot if you vote yes on it so they can

[2:33:39] meet the the language? They got 30 days

[2:33:42] to do it. Would you provide that service

[2:33:44] to the public to put a referendum in

[2:33:50] >> that I think that I think that I

[2:33:52] completely understand your p completely

[2:33:55] understand your your your perspective in

[2:33:57] question there and yeah you're

[2:33:58] absolutely right that there's a legal uh

[2:34:00] path for referendum

[2:34:02] >> u but I also believe that that probably

[2:34:06] stretches beyond the limit of

[2:34:11] the government here I'm going to ask

[2:34:12] that Because hold on.

[2:34:14] >> Yeah, I understand.

[2:34:15] >> Is it? No, here's a question. Like

[2:34:16] here's the very black and white question

[2:34:18] with that. You be asking if township

[2:34:21] resources can support or oppose a ballot

[2:34:25] item. And that's a very dangerous

[2:34:28] slippery hill. That is an issue.

[2:34:31] >> No, I'm not asking for that.

[2:34:33] [clears throat]

[2:34:33] >> I'm not asking whatsoever of that.

[2:34:36] >> What I'm asking for the res legal

[2:34:40] language that you need specifically

[2:34:44] for Union Township precinct T

[2:34:47] exclusively to vote on this one to

[2:34:51] remain R1

[2:34:54] or to change to R4.

[2:34:56] That's all I'm asking is to provide the

[2:35:00] proper language. clean referendum clean

[2:35:03] referendum language for so yeah and also

[2:35:07] probably another item there is I don't

[2:35:09] believe it's just uh to to precinct t

[2:35:12] >> I think it's a you'd have to collect

[2:35:15] signatures

[2:35:17] uh for the total was it 35% in the last

[2:35:21] gubernatorial for the township

[2:35:23] >> no no no it's not the township

[2:35:25] >> I'm not I'm not here to legisl I'm not

[2:35:27] here I'm not here to litigate that I

[2:35:29] just

[2:35:29] >> what I'm trying to say yes.

[2:35:31] >> I've I've looked at that previously as a

[2:35:34] as an issue for for residents.

[2:35:36] Absolutely understand

[2:35:38] >> and absolutely have shared that in the

[2:35:40] past that referendum is a right that

[2:35:43] residents have. Absolutely. And to make

[2:35:46] it clear,

[2:35:47] >> basically what you're trying to tell me

[2:35:50] if I come in as a businessman,

[2:35:54] okay? And I want something from you.

[2:35:57] You're going to bend over backwards like

[2:35:59] you did with them. You sat down. You had

[2:36:01] meetings with them. You didn't charge

[2:36:04] them for it.

[2:36:06] Okay? You turn around and wrote wrote up

[2:36:09] all the designs and the paperwork.

[2:36:12] Okay? and you didn't charge him

[2:36:15] anything.

[2:36:17] And now the citizens that be paying your

[2:36:20] taxes, and most of them are retirees on

[2:36:23] a fixed income,

[2:36:26] [clears throat] asking you to represent

[2:36:29] them and provide them with the necessary

[2:36:32] tools

[2:36:34] to defend what they will guarantee when

[2:36:38] they purchase their properties.

[2:36:41] And now you want to change the rules

[2:36:45] and you know it and I know it. Senior

[2:36:49] citizens can't afford to fight you. The

[2:36:51] only thing they can ask is put it on a

[2:36:54] referendum.

[2:36:55] >> I'm not I'm not looking for a fight from

[2:36:56] anybody and I'm not trying to change any

[2:36:57] rules with anybody.

[2:36:59] >> I'm not asking to change the rules. I'm

[2:37:01] asking you to use equal rules

[2:37:05] >> to both sides.

[2:37:08] You leaving one side the taxpayers

[2:37:12] on the coal and you open the roll the

[2:37:15] carpets out on the other side. Make it

[2:37:18] even.

[2:37:20] That's all. And I hope you consider my

[2:37:23] position and

[2:37:25] >> you go from there.

[2:37:27] >> Thank you, Mr.

[2:37:28] >> Do you have any questions for me?

[2:37:31] >> No. No. No. Thank you. Thank you for

[2:37:33] your time. Appreciate you. Uh Miss Come

[2:37:36] on up.

[2:37:39] All right, just raise your right hand

[2:37:42] and then do you swear to tell the truth,

[2:37:43] the whole truth. Nothing but the truth.

[2:37:44] So hope you got God.

[2:37:45] >> I do.

[2:37:46] >> And then just do me a favor. Say your

[2:37:47] name and address slowly so Mr. Campbell

[2:37:49] can grab.

[2:37:50] >> There's a card that I turned in.

[2:37:53] >> Someone has

[2:37:54] >> What was your first name?

[2:37:55] >> Margaret.

[2:37:56] >> Got it right here. You're good. We still

[2:37:57] need it for the record. Go ahead and say

[2:37:59] it. I think I just put Margaret Zidan,

[2:38:01] but legally it's Margaret Richardson

[2:38:03] Zan, 1088 Ridge Point Drive, Davia 451.

[2:38:07] >> Yes, ma'am.

[2:38:08] >> Um, this isn't really opposed or for

[2:38:12] more comments and questions.

[2:38:13] >> Yes, ma'am.

[2:38:14] >> Um,

[2:38:16] first I'm grateful for the culdeac

[2:38:19] because my big my big concern living on

[2:38:21] Ridge Point was a road coming through

[2:38:24] with maybe a hundred and whatever number

[2:38:25] more cars trying to get through that.

[2:38:28] >> Yeah. Um, I do want to I do want to make

[2:38:31] one comment because some of you up there

[2:38:33] probably agree with me. Um, I'm still

[2:38:36] very active and I drive a lot. Just

[2:38:38] because I'm a senior doesn't mean I

[2:38:40] drive any less. I just want you to know

[2:38:44] [laughter]

[2:38:45] and my neighbors are in and out of their

[2:38:47] houses all the time just as often as the

[2:38:49] young folks with little kids. I'm sorry.

[2:38:52] >> Sorry. I don't need my I don't need a

[2:38:54] golf cup.

[2:38:54] >> I appreciate that.

[2:38:56] >> I just want you to know. Thank you.

[2:38:57] Okay. So the um the water issue was

[2:39:00] already brought up. It's on both sides

[2:39:02] of that culde-sac. So I think seven

[2:39:04] houses is going to be a big issue um to

[2:39:07] take care of that so that that doesn't

[2:39:09] impact. I'm concerned that if because

[2:39:13] I've seen this even on cloth just across

[2:39:17] a little later, you know, just just

[2:39:19] across shaller

[2:39:21] um when they put in uh into a new

[2:39:23] subdivision there, they really raised

[2:39:25] the ground. I certainly don't want the

[2:39:27] ground raised in a way that's going to

[2:39:31] shed water into either other people's

[2:39:34] yards or homes or the like the Cluff

[2:39:36] Pike residents right now who the water

[2:39:39] doesn't drain.

[2:39:41] I'm extremely concerned

[2:39:45] about another road coming off Cloth Pike

[2:39:48] and the short distance of a light the

[2:39:51] distance of maybe a house and a half and

[2:39:53] the exit we now can take to get out onto

[2:39:56] cloth. Maybe there's only about 10

[2:39:59] houses between us and the next light

[2:40:03] just just to kind of give you an idea.

[2:40:05] And somewhere in there, another

[2:40:08] entrance on the cluff. I I just think I

[2:40:12] I'm concerned. I think that's dangerous.

[2:40:15] I just think it's dangerous. If there's

[2:40:17] a way of doing shallor or shayaylor,

[2:40:20] however it's pronounced, that would make

[2:40:22] a little more sense to me. It doesn't It

[2:40:24] seems to have a little more room without

[2:40:27] some of the difficulty that we're

[2:40:28] already having. And wherever that new

[2:40:31] one goes in, there's not a left turn

[2:40:33] lane.

[2:40:34] Um, so if they want to turn into their

[2:40:38] subdivision from there, it's going to be

[2:40:40] extremely difficult

[2:40:42] um to do that, especially if that's the

[2:40:44] only way in or out for them. Um,

[2:40:48] so I'm not too I'm not certain. There

[2:40:51] are times getting in and out is is

[2:40:54] really difficult and it and we really

[2:40:57] depend on those lights. I think someone

[2:40:59] mentioned about not having a right turn

[2:41:01] on the red

[2:41:04] there. Um because we really depend on

[2:41:07] those two red lights so that we can get

[2:41:09] out even to make a right turn without

[2:41:11] having and times you're still kind of

[2:41:13] gunning it a little bit currently just

[2:41:16] to get out safely and I know there have

[2:41:19] been a few accidents right there but um

[2:41:24] I think that's it. I didn't have major I

[2:41:26] somebody answered the question about the

[2:41:28] housing. Um, I certainly wouldn't want

[2:41:30] houses lower than, you know, 350

[2:41:34] just because of what we just got the new

[2:41:37] evaluations on what ours are.

[2:41:39] >> I know. I know.

[2:41:40] >> And so that's a pro. And then and then I

[2:41:43] also have concerns about they only have

[2:41:45] to put five feet between houses for me.

[2:41:48] That's a big concern as well.

[2:41:50] >> Um, that's that's not a space enough

[2:41:52] space between houses. It really isn't. and I

[2:41:56] grew up and was born and raised in

[2:41:58] Detroit. Um, I know what close houses

[2:42:01] look like and I know also what a hazard

[2:42:04] it is if one of them catches fire, how

[2:42:07] quickly that spreads if you've only got

[2:42:09] five feet or less between buildings. So,

[2:42:13] my biggest concerns are the cluff pike

[2:42:15] and that that glad he mentioned the

[2:42:18] water and the other and that's it.

[2:42:21] >> Yeah, I I didn't get your last name so I

[2:42:22] can't but thank you, Miss Margaret.

[2:42:24] Appreciate you very much.

[2:42:25] >> Thank you. Oh, I'm sorry. Mer, any

[2:42:26] questions?

[2:42:27] >> No.

[2:42:27] >> Any questions,

[2:42:28] >> Mr. Lo?

[2:42:28] >> No. Thank you.

[2:42:30] >> Thank you, miss. Appreciate you.

[2:42:32] >> Okay. Is there anyone else that like to

[2:42:33] speak here? Please come on up, sir.

[2:42:41] » Perfect. Perfect.

[2:42:41] >> You got it. Thank you, sir. Appreciate

[2:42:43] you.

[2:42:43] >> Then I'll swear you in.

[2:42:45] >> All right. Do you swear to the truth,

[2:42:47] the whole truth? Are they both the

[2:42:48] truth? So help God?

[2:42:49] >> I do. Great.

[2:42:50] >> Yours name and address for the record.

[2:42:53] >> My name is Doug Schaer. I live on 1060

[2:42:56] Kluff Pike and um

[2:42:59] I have the house right there that's

[2:43:01] affected by all of this. The house right

[2:43:05] there where the entrance is at.

[2:43:08] >> So I've got

[2:43:08] >> Oh, right. right right there.

[2:43:10] >> Yeah.

[2:43:10] >> Okay. Right there. All right.

[2:43:11] >> Yep. I've got the uh the house that is

[2:43:13] physically affected by all of this.

[2:43:15] Yeah. Which is fine. I just want to say

[2:43:17] I truly support all this. I think this

[2:43:19] is a great

[2:43:20] >> great thing. And the last the May 24th

[2:43:23] meeting, uh, we were talking about

[2:43:25] plenty of green space. The the this is

[2:43:27] new. The prior plans had much more green

[2:43:31] space, which would have been really

[2:43:33] nice. Um, there's a ton of green space

[2:43:35] back there, but there's a ton of

[2:43:37] wildlife back there. Um, I'm not too

[2:43:41] thrilled about having a road right

[2:43:42] beside me, but I know what it is. It is

[2:43:44] what it is. But we also have to consider

[2:43:46] what what's the safety of the people

[2:43:48] that are back there. Uh, we're all

[2:43:50] concerned, all of us people at the

[2:43:52] Bridge Point, one word, Ridge Point is

[2:43:56] concerned about drainage. You I'm sure

[2:43:58] you guys hear this all the time. I'm not

[2:43:59] even going to bring that up anymore.

[2:44:01] Drainage is an issue. But to me, the

[2:44:03] real issue is is the the traffic on

[2:44:06] Kluff opposed to the traffic on Bach

[2:44:09] Bucks. It we've all driven both down

[2:44:13] both of them. Um during school hours,

[2:44:16] traffic on Kluff is insane. you can't

[2:44:18] get out. If it's

[2:44:20] if you're if it's 7:45, good luck.

[2:44:23] Somebody might be nice enough to stop

[2:44:25] short of you. You've got about a

[2:44:27] football field before Shaylor at my

[2:44:30] house and then the new street's going to

[2:44:32] be right there. Um so you've got to gun

[2:44:35] it and hopefully nobody's coming. I've

[2:44:38] almost been t-boned there plenty of

[2:44:39] times. I mean, dozens of times. My kids

[2:44:42] have also too. Um, every time, this is

[2:44:46] just during school hours. U when we

[2:44:48] first moved there 27 years ago, it was

[2:44:50] just a a stop sign. They raised up the

[2:44:53] land. They they took all of our shrubs

[2:44:57] and trees that were blocking the view. I

[2:44:59] replanted another 40 plus shrubs and

[2:45:01] trees out there. Now, with this new

[2:45:04] layout, they're going to have to widen

[2:45:06] the road because people are not going to

[2:45:08] be able to turn in and out safely. It's

[2:45:10] a hazard the way it is now. with this

[2:45:12] plan. The only solution that I see is

[2:45:15] going back to the old plan. Is it

[2:45:17] possible we could pull up the old plan?

[2:45:22] So,

[2:45:23] the old plan it has you have two exits.

[2:45:28] If you want to go south towards 125, you

[2:45:30] have to turn left out of my house or the

[2:45:32] new subdivision.

[2:45:35] Good luck with the school. Like I said,

[2:45:38] TW 27 years ago, Glenn and Ameilia,

[2:45:41] they're miles away. Now that school's so

[2:45:44] close that we can hear the the metronome

[2:45:46] clinking every time the band's playing,

[2:45:48] which is great. Fully support it. But

[2:45:50] the reality of it is Bach Bucks has less

[2:45:52] traffic than than Cliff Pipe.

[2:45:54] >> My solution is either gun it or you turn

[2:45:56] right on the Shaylor. You turn right on

[2:45:58] the Buck Bucks and you're going past

[2:46:00] that subdivision anyways. So the only

[2:46:04] solution is to go through the

[2:46:06] subdivision and then you can turn right

[2:46:08] onto Bach Bucksen and go towards 125.

[2:46:12] And that way the the people in the new

[2:46:14] subdivision, the 60 homes there will

[2:46:16] have an alternative route besides

[2:46:18] turning left and towards 125. They can

[2:46:20] turn right out of out on a Bach Bucksen

[2:46:23] which has less traffic. If you're

[2:46:24] turning right out of that subdivision,

[2:46:26] you have a quarter mile towards Shaylor.

[2:46:28] You got another quarter mile before the

[2:46:30] next traffic light. You don't have

[2:46:32] [snorts] 300 feet before the before the

[2:46:34] traffic lighted trailer like it is at my

[2:46:36] house. I know no matter what happens,

[2:46:38] I'm still have to turn right and turn right. But I'm advocating

[2:46:43] for the new people and all the realators

[2:46:45] that come in, all the contractors that

[2:46:47] come in, all the minivan bombs that come

[2:46:48] in, they're going to need to safely pull

[2:46:51] out of their own subdivision. I don't

[2:46:53] mind it. I'm a wild man. I'll gun it and

[2:46:55] get it. You can ask the people that live

[2:46:57] there, but it's a reality of it all.

[2:47:01] Um, I just don't get the understanding

[2:47:04] of it's going to be a slight

[2:47:05] inconvenience. Uh, and I understand the

[2:47:08] inconvenience. All of the traffic is

[2:47:10] going past my house. All of it. And I've

[2:47:13] had our land got reduced once already.

[2:47:16] It's going to end up getting reduced

[2:47:17] again. So, that's another inconvenience.

[2:47:19] [clears throat] Whatever. Which is fine.

[2:47:21] Whatever. We still support it. But the

[2:47:24] only solution that I see for the

[2:47:25] residents, the new residents for this

[2:47:26] new subdivision is to be able to exit on

[2:47:28] the back side of Bucks and to turn right

[2:47:30] up to 1.5. That's all that I got.

[2:47:33] >> Mr. Becker, any questions?

[2:47:36] >> Mr. Lo,

[2:47:37] >> questions for you guys. What are your

[2:47:40] thoughts between the traffic from Bach

[2:47:41] Boxing and Club Pike? Which one's worse?

[2:47:46] You don't have to even talk about it

[2:47:47] because I know that there's reports and

[2:47:49] this that and the other, but you don't

[2:47:52] have to talk about it. I just want to

[2:47:53] give you something to think about,

[2:47:54] right?

[2:47:54] >> Yeah,

[2:47:55] >> I see it every day.

[2:47:58] >> It's a loaded question. I know.

[2:48:00] >> Uh, no. Well spoken, you know, and thank

[2:48:02] you.

[2:48:03] >> And then, hey, hey, uh, Mr. Flatty, keep

[2:48:06] the old plan handy because I'll probably

[2:48:08] reference it later on tonight.

[2:48:09] >> Y,

[2:48:10] >> uh, M. Schaefer, first off,

[2:48:14] >> fantastic attitude given the fact that,

[2:48:16] yeah, I think out of

[2:48:19] almost everyone, you're probably the

[2:48:21] most affected. Uh especially since the

[2:48:23] main entrance is going right by your

[2:48:25] house.

[2:48:25] >> Yeah. And we still support the

[2:48:27] subdivision. We love it.

[2:48:28] >> I think the homes that you guys have

[2:48:30] presented, I think they're wonderful

[2:48:31] homes and they're somewhat affordable

[2:48:33] for this economy.

[2:48:35] >> Um sorry to interrupt.

[2:48:36] >> No, no, no. You're okay. I I just

[2:48:38] appreciate your attitude. And uh do you

[2:48:42] hypothetically, maybe it's shot down,

[2:48:44] but if it is upheld to be voted for, is

[2:48:48] there anything you want specifically for

[2:48:49] them to do on your property?

[2:48:51] >> Well, I've I'm already building a fence.

[2:48:53] I got a permit to build a fence a couple

[2:48:55] months ago. I'm building shadow box

[2:48:56] fence, the the good neighbor fence. Um

[2:49:00] >> I'm taking I'm being proactive on this.

[2:49:02] Um, but if they do this other they do

[2:49:05] this other subdivision where they're

[2:49:06] because we're bending the knee to the

[2:49:08] fine people at Ridge Point. I might, you

[2:49:10] know, I don't know. I might just buy a

[2:49:12] bunch of junkers out there and put put

[2:49:14] it behind my house. Why not?

[2:49:17] [laughter]

[2:49:17] >> Yeah,

[2:49:18] >> I'm joking.

[2:49:19] >> No, no, I'm laughing. I'm laughing. It's We We have to try to make

[2:49:22] [laughter] light of life sometimes. No,

[2:49:23] it's good. Okay. Um

[2:49:25] >> Um, they said they're already going to

[2:49:26] put shrubs and trees out there. That's

[2:49:28] about all they can do. Um,

[2:49:30] >> do do you want me to ask them for

[2:49:31] anything else? I'll put it

[2:49:33] >> if they want to pony up for some of the

[2:49:34] fence. I'd be fine with that, too. But

[2:49:36] and I'm installing all this. It's It's a

[2:49:38] beautiful fence.

[2:49:40] >> More than welcome to look at it,

[2:49:41] whatever. But

[2:49:43] >> Okay, fair enough. The uh

[2:49:45] >> Yep. I don't have a problem with it at

[2:49:46] all again, but I think it's a safety

[2:49:48] issue.

[2:49:49] >> Yeah, I understand. Thank you. Thank

[2:49:50] you, sir. Appreciate you very much. Um

[2:49:52] Okay. Is there anyone else that is

[2:49:54] Please come on. I saw you first, sir.

[2:49:55] Then then I'll get you you next. Come on

[2:49:58] up, sir.

[2:50:00] >> Yeah. No. No. Yeah. Please bring that

[2:50:01] up. Yeah, appreciate that. Helps out Mr.

[2:50:02] Campbell a lot.

[2:50:03] >> Okay,

[2:50:03] >> then I got to write it.

[2:50:04] >> Oh, it's it's okay. Just just talk slow

[2:50:06] so Mr. Campbell can get you. Okay.

[2:50:07] >> Oh, talk slow. Okay. So, I tell you

[2:50:09] verbally. Great.

[2:50:10] >> You verbally this this nice gentleman

[2:50:12] right here.

[2:50:13] >> You look quite nice.

[2:50:14] >> Yeah. So, you look like a nice Let me go

[2:50:15] swear you.

[2:50:16] >> Absolutely.

[2:50:17] >> Do you swear to tell the truth, the

[2:50:18] whole truth? Are they both the truth?

[2:50:19] So, be God.

[2:50:20] >> Yeah.

[2:50:20] >> Great. And then just state your state

[2:50:22] your name and address for the record,

[2:50:23] but

[2:50:24] >> I know it's a long night. Everyone's got

[2:50:25] the giggles.

[2:50:26] >> Mr. Campbell can write it [laughter]

[2:50:28] down.

[2:50:28] >> Mr. Campbell, it's Ivon Delgado. I V A N

[2:50:32] D E L G A D like dog O.

[2:50:36] >> Got it. And then your address, sir.

[2:50:38] >> 1122 Forest Run Drive. Feel free to

[2:50:41] visit.

[2:50:43] >> That's a joke.

[2:50:44] >> Yeah,

[2:50:47] >> I think there have been tremendous

[2:50:50] solutions [clears throat] raised to the

[2:50:51] issues proposed. I don't want to

[2:50:52] reiterate those. The traffic, the

[2:50:54] drainage, the people whose homes are

[2:50:55] directly affected. I came here to be

[2:50:57] mainly informed and I certainly was and

[2:50:59] I think everyone's spoken very

[2:51:00] eloquently on those issues. I'm in full

[2:51:02] support of the solution proposed the

[2:51:04] entrance to Shayaylor etc. very

[2:51:06] intelligent solutions. There's just one

[2:51:08] perspective I want to add from the point

[2:51:10] of someone who owns no property. Now

[2:51:14] don't be uh misguided by the spring

[2:51:18] chickens behind me. All right? But I

[2:51:22] unlike them who are concerned of their

[2:51:24] property and of their existing value as

[2:51:26] they should be. It is their property.

[2:51:27] >> Sure.

[2:51:28] >> I myself will one day hope to be in a

[2:51:31] position like them where I concerned of

[2:51:32] my own property. Right now I rent a home

[2:51:35] at the address I mentioned with four

[2:51:38] other people. There's five of us. And

[2:51:40] yes, it's legal. Five of us in one

[2:51:42] place.

[2:51:44] We've tried many, many times to buy a

[2:51:46] home, but because of the prices of the

[2:51:48] economy, which I know the trustes can't

[2:51:49] control. We're outbid every time. We

[2:51:51] pulled together our money. We have a

[2:51:52] handsome down payment. I get a nice

[2:51:54] corporate job. That's why I'm wearing

[2:51:55] the shirt. It's not for you guys,

[2:51:56] unfortunately.

[2:51:58] But outbid cash every time. Now, this is

[2:52:01] not necessarily a request of a developer

[2:52:03] or anything like that. I understand the

[2:52:04] prices were lowered. This is just a

[2:52:06] general sentiment that out of all the

[2:52:07] solutions you've heard today, I think

[2:52:08] all of them are valid. I just want to

[2:52:10] throw in my two cents that I think one

[2:52:11] solution that won't solve anything is

[2:52:13] raising the prices. I know some people

[2:52:15] think ah they were 600,000 before

[2:52:18] and some as you mentioned not to make

[2:52:20] your head spin some people want higher

[2:52:21] prices some people want lower prices.

[2:52:24] If I had property in this existing area

[2:52:26] perhaps I'd want higher prices but I

[2:52:28] want to bring the perspective of

[2:52:29] somebody who one day dreams to have

[2:52:30] property in this area to build a life

[2:52:32] here with my friends in Union Township

[2:52:34] where I intend to stay.

[2:52:37] As you enter hypothetically the

[2:52:40] negotiation phase after this, the one

[2:52:42] thing I request for you to weigh is of

[2:52:46] course the traffic, of course the

[2:52:47] drainage, but raising the prices back to

[2:52:50] 600,000

[2:52:52] is not something I think would solve any

[2:52:54] of the problems brought here today and

[2:52:56] not something that would benefit people

[2:52:57] like me and my friends who want to

[2:52:59] establish a future life here.

[2:53:02] >> That's all.

[2:53:03] >> Thank you, Mr. Dion. Appreciate it very

[2:53:05] much.

[2:53:05] >> Thank you very much. eloquently spoken.

[2:53:08] Thank you, Mr. Belgado.

[2:53:09] >> Okay, Mel, did you you want to come up?

[2:53:12] Okay, Mel, come on up, sir.

[2:53:14] Mr. Camp, do you have Mel Mr. Dean's uh address memorized?

[2:53:24] » All right, Dit. Mr. Dit, sorry. Do you

[2:53:27] swear to tell truth? The whole truth. I

[2:53:28] think the truth.

[2:53:29] >> I do.

[2:53:31] >> Melvin Dit 3902 Banks Road. Yes,

[2:53:34] >> sir. I've heard uh many uh things here

[2:53:37] tonight and I want to just restate that

[2:53:41] your first purpose here is to protect

[2:53:45] the residents

[2:53:47] and that means in all their general

[2:53:50] safety, their property

[2:53:52] and that is your duty.

[2:53:56] I disagree with uh one of the statements

[2:53:59] that somebody made. It's not you,

[2:54:04] this board here, that are trying to

[2:54:07] change the rules.

[2:54:10] It's the gentlemen back here that are

[2:54:12] trying to change it from R1 to R4.

[2:54:17] Now, sometime in the past, there's been

[2:54:21] many many people that have looked over

[2:54:24] and figured out how to zone these

[2:54:27] various areas. Why they did that, I

[2:54:30] don't know, but they thought that they

[2:54:33] were good. And for you to change, excuse

[2:54:36] me, I stated that wrong. For somebody to

[2:54:40] try to change those in the middle of the

[2:54:42] road is wrong. If they need to be

[2:54:46] changed, they need to be changed. But

[2:54:49] before something like this comes up, not

[2:54:52] in the middle of the game.

[2:54:55] That's about what I have to say.

[2:54:58] Thank you, Mr. Dwood. Appreciate you

[2:54:59] very much. Thank you.

[2:55:06] I was taking notes. Okay. Uh, is there

[2:55:07] anyone else that like to speak tonight?

[2:55:09] Come on up, sir.

[2:55:12] Oh my gosh.

[2:55:17] » Howdy.

[2:55:17] >> All right. Perfect. And then uh All

[2:55:19] right. Raise your right hand. You swear

[2:55:20] to tell the truth, the whole truth, and

[2:55:22] they both the truth. So hopey God.

[2:55:23] >> I do.

[2:55:23] >> Great. And then just say uh your name

[2:55:24] and address for the record, but slowly

[2:55:26] so Mr. came and grabbed it.

[2:55:27] >> My name is Jacob Dom. J A C O B.

[2:55:32] Last name Dom. D as in dog. A as in

[2:55:35] apple. U is in unicorn. M as in mother.

[2:55:40] [snorts]

[2:55:40] >> Got it. Please. Yeah.

[2:55:43] >> I am the second owner of a 72year-old

[2:55:46] house. I'm proud that I was able to buy

[2:55:49] that house. I'm 25 years old. I bought

[2:55:52] that house three years ago. Most people

[2:55:55] my age, most my contemporaries are not

[2:55:57] capable of being able to buy a house.

[2:56:00] And if I say I didn't compromise, that

[2:56:03] would be a lie. It is a project house as

[2:56:07] an understatement. Certainly, a lot of

[2:56:09] work has to be done to it. That house

[2:56:11] was built after the Second World War.

[2:56:15] It was built for a family who bought it,

[2:56:18] who raised their three daughters in it,

[2:56:20] who lived in it, died in it, had a whole

[2:56:23] life in it. It's like a an 1100 square

[2:56:26] foot house. The profound amount of what

[2:56:30] is being built today, not just here, but

[2:56:32] all across the country, is homes that

[2:56:34] are way larger than that, don't fit the

[2:56:36] scale of that, are much bigger, often

[2:56:39] double the size, and because of that,

[2:56:42] are also way more expensive relative to

[2:56:45] people's incomes. It is not generally

[2:56:48] possible to be able to be a a father

[2:56:52] with a stay-at-home wife and a child

[2:56:54] anymore and own a house. It's just not

[2:56:56] functionally possible. You have to at

[2:56:57] least have a two parent income and then

[2:57:00] all of the uh extra problems that come

[2:57:03] with that like having to afford child

[2:57:05] care and plan around that and all the

[2:57:07] other stuff around that just to be able

[2:57:09] to raise a family.

[2:57:12] And so my problem with this proposal

[2:57:16] wouldn't be that they're

[2:57:20] not expensive enough, but they're too expensive really. Uh, I'm very much in favor of the diversity

[2:57:27] of the free hand of the market. Let

[2:57:29] developers build. If developers

[2:57:30] somewhere want to build expensive homes,

[2:57:32] let them build expensive homes. They

[2:57:33] want to build cheap homes. Let them

[2:57:34] build cheap homes. But certainly as as a

[2:57:37] community, if if the goal of the

[2:57:39] township is to bring in and retain the

[2:57:42] youth to have a literal future because

[2:57:45] eventually all the older people in the

[2:57:47] back are going to die off and you won't

[2:57:49] have a tax base if they're all dead,

[2:57:52] >> right? You better be careful.

[2:57:54] >> You're going to need people like me who

[2:57:56] are willing to set up a set up a life

[2:57:58] here and live here and pay taxes here

[2:58:01] and grow the community. And it's very

[2:58:04] much so impossible to do that when

[2:58:06] there's nothing that you can afford. And

[2:58:09] when the houses like mine that are fixer

[2:58:12] uppers that someone who was 96y old died

[2:58:15] in are very rare to find.

[2:58:18] when when it's impossible to start that

[2:58:20] future, it makes why would you live in

[2:58:23] Union Township? Why not go live

[2:58:25] somewhere else? Why not rent an

[2:58:27] apartment in downtown Cincinnati? I if

[2:58:29] you're going to not be able to own a

[2:58:30] house anyway, like why bother trying?

[2:58:33] So, I think I would encourage the

[2:58:36] trustees here to consider and favor

[2:58:39] development plans that include smaller

[2:58:42] lot sizes, that include lower price

[2:58:44] housing, that include smaller houses.

[2:58:47] And also, you have to consider when the

[2:58:50] only stuff being built and developed is

[2:58:52] big houses on big lots, you're telling

[2:58:54] people essentially, if you want to own a

[2:58:56] house, you have to mow this much yard.

[2:58:58] If you want to own a house, you have to

[2:59:00] vacuum this much floor. Some people

[2:59:02] would rather like to have a smaller

[2:59:04] house and not have to pay the extra

[2:59:06] heating and cooling costs, pay the extra

[2:59:07] energy bills and do the extra

[2:59:10] maintenance, but that that lower end

[2:59:14] diversity in the freehand of the market

[2:59:16] is quite lacking. And that's not just

[2:59:19] because of zoning restrictions, which in

[2:59:22] of themselves are already quite crazy

[2:59:26] restrictive to be able to build smaller

[2:59:28] stuff, but also because of other people

[2:59:30] who already own stuff who are worried

[2:59:33] about their own

[2:59:35] housing values going not up enough and

[2:59:38] then usually often later complaining

[2:59:40] when the precipitous increase of

[2:59:42] property taxes also occurs.

[2:59:45] So, I would I would encourage you all to

[2:59:49] consider and encourage developers to

[2:59:52] build more affordable homes for young

[2:59:55] families that can build and start a

[2:59:57] future here. And maybe we can actually

[3:00:00] revitalize America, one small township

[3:00:03] at a time. Thank you for your time.

[3:00:05] >> Thank you, Mr. Jones. Appreciate

[3:00:06] >> you, Jacob.

[3:00:08] >> Jacob, have you have you spoke have you

[3:00:09] come up to this podium before for

[3:00:11] something recently?

[3:00:13] >> I have not. This is the first time I've

[3:00:15] attended a township trustee meeting, but

[3:00:17] I've lived in the township for six years

[3:00:19] now.

[3:00:19] >> Okay. I thought I was recalling that

[3:00:21] you've uh uh spoken spoken before.

[3:00:24] Anyway,

[3:00:24] >> we might have met before.

[3:00:26] >> Eloquently said, "Thank you, Jacob.

[3:00:27] Thank you. Appreciate it."

[3:00:30] >> Okay. Is there anyone else that's in

[3:00:33] opposition?

[3:00:35] [clears throat]

[3:00:35] >> Okay, Mr.

[3:00:38] builders, developers, I'll bring you

[3:00:40] back up and uh

[3:00:46] please and uh I have sworn you both

[3:00:49] already in. So, you guys are both good

[3:00:50] to go and then uh you guys can tag team

[3:00:53] or whatever you like to do. No problem.

[3:00:55] >> Wow. Well, hopefully we got it uh some

[3:00:57] of it down and some of we can answer

[3:00:59] some of these questions. Um I'll start

[3:01:02] off with um the connection to Shaylor

[3:01:04] Road. Um the terrain is very steep. Uh it's the property really drops down.

[3:01:11] It's about 12 to 15 feet from the uh

[3:01:16] property down to Shaylor Road. It's a

[3:01:17] very steep uh grade to Trevors and it

[3:01:21] wouldn't be practical to put a road to

[3:01:22] Shaylor Road. Um secondly, if we did do

[3:01:26] put a [snorts] road to sh if it was

[3:01:28] possible to put a road to Shaylor, u the

[3:01:31] creek does come I think it's on the

[3:01:33] north side of Sher and it does cross

[3:01:34] over that that uh that proposed street

[3:01:39] would be approximately the same distance

[3:01:41] we have it from the intersection now on

[3:01:43] club. It would be about the same

[3:01:46] distance from the intersection from the

[3:01:47] light. But the main reason is not to go

[3:01:49] to shers is due to the steep terrain is

[3:01:52] the main reason. So that's why we uh we

[3:01:54] propose not to go to uh to Shaylor Road.

[3:01:57] Okay. Um I guess with Mr. Sheman uh with

[3:02:02] his concerns

[3:02:03] um I'd like to say that um construction

[3:02:07] entrance would come off of cloth and

[3:02:09] just as he stated we would build the

[3:02:11] subdivision u you know everything would

[3:02:14] come in off of cloth. The only things

[3:02:16] that we would do uh would be the sewer

[3:02:19] and water tie in onto Ridge Point and

[3:02:21] then the paving and curb construction

[3:02:24] would be uh coming off the ridge point.

[3:02:28] Um but like he said, the main heavy

[3:02:30] lifting of the earthwork and things of

[3:02:32] that nature, we would bring a

[3:02:34] construction entrance in off club Pike.

[3:02:36] Uh his water issues. Um,

[3:02:41] I'd like to, um, I guess the best thing

[3:02:44] to do is if I can, can I approach the

[3:02:46] board and just show them our thoughts

[3:02:47] real quick on this on the plan? Be

[3:02:49] easier to discuss.

[3:02:53] So,

[3:02:59] » so

[3:03:00] this is lot 52. Here's the call to say.

[3:03:04] There's a ridge high point that comes

[3:03:05] this way. Water drains. You can see the

[3:03:08] finger. It drains down into here into

[3:03:10] this pond. This point drains this way.

[3:03:12] There's this finger he's talking about

[3:03:14] that runs across his property. This is

[3:03:16] it's a natural natural drain. All the

[3:03:19] impervious area would be collected by

[3:03:22] the storm sewer run down this way. The

[3:03:24] only thing we we can do a side ditch

[3:03:26] down here and we can put a catch basin

[3:03:28] in here, pick this up, take it to here

[3:03:30] and then we would eliminate that that

[3:03:32] flow from going across this property. So

[3:03:34] that would answer that question.

[3:03:36] >> Got it. Perfect. Okay.

[3:03:56] Let's see. Um,

[3:04:00] I'll let you talk about covenants and

[3:04:01] restrictions on the HOA.

[3:04:05] Um, I guess the only other point I'd

[3:04:07] like to make is is you know, property is

[3:04:09] currently zoned R1 and um, you know, the

[3:04:13] property could be developed as R1.

[3:04:15] Access would come could be uh, come

[3:04:17] right off CL. It would tie it could tie

[3:04:19] into Ridge uh, Ridge Point Drive and no

[3:04:24] approvals are required. There's no

[3:04:26] approvals required. Only approval

[3:04:27] through this board. I'm sorry. an

[3:04:29] approval through this board or these

[3:04:31] residents would now have an input on

[3:04:33] what kind of road would be built from

[3:04:35] Cluff Pike to Ridge Point because it's

[3:04:37] zoned R1. It's approved. They could a

[3:04:39] developer come in tomorrow and build a

[3:04:41] road from Kluff Pike to Ridge Point and

[3:04:44] develop R1 lots on it and and the

[3:04:46] access. So, what I'm trying to say is is

[3:04:48] the access is really independent of the

[3:04:51] zoning. We're asking for R4 zoning

[3:04:54] to build again, as the two young

[3:04:57] gentlemen say, a more affordable

[3:04:59] housing. We're trying to take the

[3:05:02] natural character of the land and uh and

[3:05:04] preserve the ponds, create create a

[3:05:08] community, create an environment that

[3:05:09] would people want to live in, you know,

[3:05:11] and so um you know, in my opinion, the

[3:05:16] uh the access could be that road

[3:05:19] connection could be built tomorrow. you

[3:05:22] know, so I just I just wanted to bring

[3:05:24] that up to your your attention.

[3:05:28] Um,

[3:05:32] oh, with regards to the traffic impact

[3:05:34] study, there was a mention of 180

[3:05:36] vehicles per day or we did the traffic

[3:05:39] counts are as such. The [clears throat]

[3:05:41] AM peak trips are 47 and the PM peak

[3:05:44] trips are 60. Those are minimal. They're

[3:05:46] small amounts of traffic with relation

[3:05:48] to the the overall roadway system. So, I

[3:05:52] just wanted to make you aware that it's

[3:05:53] not 188 or or whatever was referenced in earlier.

[3:06:00] Um,

[3:06:04] the rear yards are 30 feet. They're not

[3:06:07] five feet.

[3:06:09] And, uh, the other op comment I think I

[3:06:11] had was is there will be side

[3:06:13] >> yards, but ballpark. Yeah. Sideyards.

[3:06:15] Ball. Ballpark. say what's I know

[3:06:17] they're different because it is R4 but

[3:06:18] what's what's the

[3:06:19] >> we're proposing 5 foot of sideyard 10 ft

[3:06:21] between houses and that's consistent

[3:06:23] with what was done at Magnolia Trace

[3:06:28] » I think unless you guys got any

[3:06:30] questions for me I'll let Ed take care

[3:06:32] of uh some of the comments that he's

[3:06:34] going to address.

[3:06:39] Um, so I don't want to repeat everything

[3:06:42] that Doug said, but um, when it comes to

[3:06:46] the gentleman who lives at the end of

[3:06:48] Ridge Point Avenue, right, Ridge Point

[3:06:50] Drive right now, we're not going to

[3:06:53] block his driveway as mentioned. We're

[3:06:55] going to be um, coming in off of Cloff

[3:06:57] Pike with our construction entrance. If

[3:06:59] when we go to tie in that sewer, um, I

[3:07:02] believe that sewer is on the side of his

[3:07:06] driveway. Um there are ways for us to

[3:07:10] tie in without blocking his driveway. Um

[3:07:13] we can have no parking for our

[3:07:15] contractors on Ridge Point Drive. I I

[3:07:17] know it's a public street. Um but we can

[3:07:20] require that of our contractors. Um and

[3:07:22] then when it comes to the covenants and

[3:07:25] restrictions, I guess that were filed

[3:07:26] for his their neighborhood. There's no

[3:07:29] HOA, but I guess they had to sign off on

[3:07:31] some things. um for those seven lots.

[3:07:35] We would be happy to review those

[3:07:37] covenants and have our homeowners sign

[3:07:40] off to adhere to those covenants. um if

[3:07:44] they're, you know, if if as long as it's

[3:07:47] not related to um you know, some sort of

[3:07:50] square footage requirement that they're

[3:07:52] trying to meet or a building material

[3:07:54] that uh Arbor Homes isn't pro proposing

[3:07:58] um as far as maintenance of their

[3:07:59] property and things like that, we'd have

[3:08:00] no problem uh having our homeowners sign

[3:08:03] off on that. Um, but other than that, I

[3:08:06] will let uh I'll let Ar unless you guys

[3:08:08] have questions. I'll let Arbor Homes

[3:08:10] kind of take it over with the pricing

[3:08:14] and things like that.

[3:08:15] >> We'll definitely have questions for

[3:08:16] because you all are I'm going to say you

[3:08:18] all kind of one. So, I might have you

[3:08:19] all three come up, but yeah, please come

[3:08:21] on up.

[3:08:23] [clears throat]

[3:08:26] » Oh, I'm sorry, gentlemen. I just did

[3:08:27] you, the one of you have questions for

[3:08:28] those guys?

[3:08:29] >> Sorry. Okay, please go ahead.

[3:08:31] >> Yeah. Uh so we do have a a mission

[3:08:34] around affordable home ownership. Um so

[3:08:38] this this home series, the destination

[3:08:40] series is our higherend home. We have an

[3:08:42] arrival series that we came out with in

[3:08:45] the last few years. Starts in the low

[3:08:47] 200s. Um it's pretty sweet, frankly, in

[3:08:51] my view. I think the the two gentlemen

[3:08:52] in the back might might be a fan of

[3:08:55] those kind of projects. Uh that's not

[3:08:57] what we're building here. Um, once

[3:08:59] again, we so we're we're owned by

[3:09:02] Clayton Homes, which is owned by

[3:09:04] Berkshire Hathway. So, we, you know, can

[3:09:06] borrow money at a lower rate than most

[3:09:08] home builders. Berkshire Hathway owns a

[3:09:11] bunch of different like building

[3:09:12] material companies. So, we can buy in

[3:09:15] bulk from them. There's many different

[3:09:16] ways that essentially we can bring

[3:09:19] efficiency to the process and cost

[3:09:22] effectiveness because of our scale that

[3:09:24] allows us to build a quality home for a

[3:09:27] decent price for American families and

[3:09:30] that's what we're here to do. Is there

[3:09:33] anything any questions you guys have

[3:09:35] specifically about the homes?

[3:09:37] >> No.

[3:09:38] >> Mr. Becker, anything?

[3:09:39] >> All right, Mr. Look,

[3:09:41] >> sounds very

[3:09:43] >> uh I do I want I want to ask you so so

[3:09:47] the number 600 was tossed out at the

[3:09:49] zoning case.

[3:09:50] >> Yeah.

[3:09:50] >> And tonight that number was not tossed

[3:09:51] out. So what what are the prices

[3:09:53] ballpark of these homes?

[3:09:55] >> Yeah. 350 to six uh 550, excuse me. Uh

[3:09:59] we have two um so Arbor's at Grandon

[3:10:02] Pond is a subdivision up in uh South

[3:10:05] Lebanon. It's our um Arbor series which

[3:10:09] is different than the destination but

[3:10:10] similar more similar than the arrival

[3:10:13] and that's an average of 450 460 right

[3:10:16] now.

[3:10:17] >> The John Charles Estates in Forest Park

[3:10:19] is averaging around 450 460. We're about

[3:10:23] to open a um a first destination series

[3:10:28] uh community in um Lebanon proper um

[3:10:32] basically next year.

[3:10:33] >> Yeah. And so we don't have, you know,

[3:10:36] sales figures for that product here.

[3:10:38] >> Okay. The uh I'm going to have questions

[3:10:42] for all three of you. So if you want all

[3:10:44] three want to come up, that's fine. So

[3:10:45] no, no, no. Go go go and stay put. But

[3:10:47] uh Okay. So question is is uh

[3:10:50] um

[3:10:53] Okay. If we if we leave it R1, which

[3:10:56] would put you at a half acre, h how many

[3:10:58] houses could you fit there? And then can

[3:11:00] you just jack the price up? Honestly, I

[3:11:04] couldn't tell you that right now. I'd

[3:11:05] have to go back, talk to our marketing

[3:11:07] team, see what the market could support.

[3:11:10] I'd have to talk to the engine.

[3:11:11] >> Well, I'm gonna ask you to give me an

[3:11:12] educated guess. I'm not trying to come

[3:11:13] across too strong, but it's kind of now

[3:11:15] or never tonight. So, so if we kept it

[3:11:17] the same at R1,

[3:11:18] >> yeah,

[3:11:19] >> u ballpark. Um, just we could do some

[3:11:21] math real quick. Ballpark, how many

[3:11:23] homes could you

[3:11:24] >> cram in there? Yeah, that would be R1.

[3:11:27] Uh, give you halfacre lots. And then can

[3:11:29] you just can you just rub the price up a

[3:11:31] little bit to make up the difference?

[3:11:33] >> I could not tell you that because I

[3:11:35] don't know what the R1 standards are.

[3:11:36] >> Uh Mr. Dales, I do have that.

[3:11:38] >> Thank you.

[3:11:39] >> So R1's halfacre standard. So go ahead.

[3:11:41] [clears throat]

[3:11:41] >> So it's a calculation if you take

[3:11:44] >> 51 homes.

[3:11:45] >> 51.

[3:11:46] >> Yeah.

[3:11:47] >> That's flat

[3:11:49] >> just taking the acreage of

[3:11:52] >> 23.63 63 divided by the minimum square

[3:11:55] footage of an R1 lot, which is 20,000.

[3:11:58] That yields 51 homes.

[3:12:00] >> But they couldn't do that much because

[3:12:01] you have to make way for roads for

[3:12:02] roads. So you're looking at 40

[3:12:05] >> 45 44 45 homes after.

[3:12:08] >> Is there a lot width minimum that you

[3:12:11] guys?

[3:12:12] >> Yes. Yep. 100

[3:12:13] >> 100.

[3:12:14] >> Okay.

[3:12:15] >> Yeah. We I mean I Yeah, we don't build

[3:12:19] on 100 foot wide lots. The development

[3:12:21] cost is too much.

[3:12:22] >> Okay. Fair enough. Okay. Okay. The uh um

[3:12:26] I know the terrain is not the best uh

[3:12:28] but the these folks you you hear them

[3:12:31] loud and clear.

[3:12:32] >> Uh and actually it's really not

[3:12:35] >> it's really not their concern or my

[3:12:37] concern. The concern is the the

[3:12:38] residents that are going to be moving

[3:12:40] into there.

[3:12:41] >> Uh it's going to be difficult for them

[3:12:42] to get on a cloth.

[3:12:43] >> Yeah.

[3:12:44] >> Um

[3:12:45] >> I think you can hear everyone avoids

[3:12:47] cloth if we can avoid worst part is it's

[3:12:50] a county road. we can't do anything to

[3:12:53] that road even if we wanted to. Um, and

[3:12:55] really they need to put a center lane

[3:12:56] there. At least put a center lane there

[3:12:57] so people can turn left, get in the

[3:12:59] center lane, then merge over to the

[3:13:00] right. At least do that. Uh, but but

[3:13:02] regardless, that's that's a that's a

[3:13:04] conversation for our county, not for

[3:13:06] Union Township.

[3:13:07] >> So my question is is uh

[3:13:11] what can you do to make Shaylor happen

[3:13:14] to put put the entrance and exit there

[3:13:16] and reroute this plan?

[3:13:17] >> Yeah.

[3:13:18] >> To make it happen.

[3:13:18] >> I'm going to turn that over. That's why

[3:13:20] I said maybe all three of you can all

[3:13:21] come up

[3:13:22] >> because I

[3:13:24] is there is there is there

[3:13:27] >> emergency response.

[3:13:30] >> All right. So appreciate it if nobody uh

[3:13:32] caused any problems because obviously

[3:13:33] our chief of police isn't here so you

[3:13:34] know don't don't beat us up. Um but okay

[3:13:37] so hey uh I can you can you um

[3:13:40] >> is there any chance you can still make

[3:13:42] your money do what you want to do? I

[3:13:44] know the train's a little rough but make

[3:13:46] it happen to exit out of Shaylor. Is

[3:13:48] that possible? And can the can the

[3:13:50] township work with you folks to make

[3:13:51] that happen?

[3:13:56] [cough]

[3:13:56] >> It's not cost effective to go that way.

[3:13:59] Just

[3:14:00] >> okay.

[3:14:00] >> The terrain's just too steep. And

[3:14:02] secondly, there's a 12 in public water

[3:14:04] man that runs along the up on the

[3:14:08] ridgetop there. That would and require

[3:14:11] more cost uh to relocate that water

[3:14:13] line.

[3:14:14] >> Got it. Got it. Um

[3:14:17] All right. So to go back to

[3:14:21] in the reason why you adjusted your old

[3:14:23] plans to your new plans now, is that

[3:14:25] because uh the folks in the neighborhood

[3:14:28] basically didn't want drive-through

[3:14:30] traffic? Is that is that correct?

[3:14:31] >> That's correct. Okay.

[3:14:32] >> But we lost two lots.

[3:14:34] >> Yeah. Is there is there a way?

[3:14:38] All right. No, fair enough. Okay. All

[3:14:39] right. Got it. Um Okay. What what I went

[3:14:43] done and y'all may want to talk about

[3:14:45] this before we vote and give us give us

[3:14:46] your opinion is for the front house. So

[3:14:49] Mr. Schaefer, he's the one that owns the

[3:14:51] nice beautiful house in the front of

[3:14:52] your house there on Kluff. Um

[3:14:56] the I would like for you all to take

[3:14:58] care of his fence. Okay. Can you all do

[3:14:59] that?

[3:15:02] >> Yes. I was actually I meant to talk

[3:15:04] about Mr. Schaefer when I was up here,

[3:15:06] but yeah, happy to work

[3:15:07] >> out of everyone. Now, the gentleman next

[3:15:09] to lot number 52 is affected big time,

[3:15:11] but out of everyone, everyone is

[3:15:14] entering and exiting by his house. He's

[3:15:16] the one that's affected the most. And

[3:15:17] honestly, I can't believe how positive

[3:15:18] he was because if it was me, I would be

[3:15:20] 100% against him if I was him. So, um I want you to take care of his fence.

[3:15:24] Can you can you do that? The second part

[3:15:26] is is uh

[3:15:29] um

[3:15:36] all right here's the part where you may

[3:15:38] not like it and I need you all to

[3:15:39] discuss this part. So how how wide is

[3:15:42] lot 52 which is the one closest to uh

[3:15:45] Mr. Sheman right there at the end

[3:15:48] ballpark do you have a

[3:15:49] >> it's 60 feet wide.

[3:15:51] >> Okay.

[3:15:54] Yeah. And then how how how wide is lot

[3:15:56] 53, the one right next to it?

[3:15:58] >> I know. I know.

[3:16:00] >> If you're asking me if I can get the lot

[3:16:02] next to Mr. Sheman a little wider, I I I

[3:16:05] can we can do that. We can accommodate

[3:16:07] that.

[3:16:08] >> I mean, do you want me to go to 65 ft? I

[3:16:10] can make it 65.

[3:16:12] What I would do I would increase the

[3:16:14] setback on the culdeac a little bit

[3:16:17] >> and and and was able to shift those lots

[3:16:20] around and and and pull some distance

[3:16:24] out of the lots in the back of the

[3:16:25] culdeac and make Mr. that lot next to

[3:16:28] Mr. Sheen wider.

[3:16:29] >> Well, and and uh I'm surprised that the homeowner by lot number 58's not

[3:16:34] here. So, I don't want those two

[3:16:36] residents affected at all.

[3:16:39] Yeah, he he I mean his lot's a little

[3:16:41] wider now. Anyway, I can tell you how

[3:16:42] wide his lot is.

[3:16:44] >> But I I do not want these two residents

[3:16:46] affected at all. At all. Zero. None.

[3:16:48] Non-negotiable. So, uh I I don't want

[3:16:51] any dirt in their land. Don't affect

[3:16:53] their property. Any drainage at all. No

[3:16:55] dirt. I don't want it. So, and I'll tell

[3:16:57] you, our our zoning inspector, people

[3:16:59] either love him or hate him. Uh but he he he will be on this. And so, uh,

[3:17:04] um,

[3:17:05] can you eliminate lot number 52 and

[3:17:08] still make do and only put seven homes

[3:17:10] or six homes around the culde-sac?

[3:17:14] » I don't want to.

[3:17:16] >> Yeah,

[3:17:16] >> obviously. We've we've sacrificed two

[3:17:19] lots.

[3:17:20] >> Yeah.

[3:17:21] >> From our initial plan,

[3:17:24] I mean, I I would prefer to keep the lot

[3:17:27] obviously and work with the homeowners.

[3:17:35] Okay.

[3:17:38] » You can make it 65 ft.

[3:17:42] >> Okay. The uh

[3:17:48] foot. Okay. The uh

[3:17:53] I think that's all the questions I got.

[3:17:54] Uh

[3:17:56] Mr. Becker, you have anything for these

[3:17:57] guys? Mr. Loie, anything else?

[3:18:05] So, um I I like the questions you're

[3:18:09] asking, Mr. Dills, as far as uh you

[3:18:11] know, the sacrificing of additional

[3:18:13] lots. I was just pondering the previous plan and the road all the

[3:18:18] way through and the sacrifice of those

[3:18:20] two lots that you're talking about, but

[3:18:21] I think that on total more homeowners in

[3:18:26] Ridge Point would not be happy with a road going all the way through,

[3:18:32] but it sounds like it alleviates more

[3:18:33] traffic concerns that uh Mr. Schaefer

[3:18:37] shared. So, I thought that was a pretty

[3:18:39] valid point um for the traffic concerns

[3:18:43] that everyone has and the concern that

[3:18:46] you have about eliminating two lots or

[3:18:49] so and them not wanting to eliminate

[3:18:50] four lots in total. So, I'm saying on

[3:18:54] balance

[3:18:55] a road going through and instead of

[3:18:58] eliminating four that he's asking for,

[3:19:00] just eliminate those two that are

[3:19:01] closest to

[3:19:03] uh Mr. Sheetman and and the other

[3:19:06] gentlemen.

[3:19:08] Um, so that was just a a thought. Happy

[3:19:12] to hear any anyone's comments on that. I

[3:19:15] don't know if you even you crack

[3:19:17] tracking that you like that concept.

[3:19:20] >> Uh, lot 58. How how wide is that one?

[3:19:30] [clears throat]

[3:19:31] >> As they're looking at that,

[3:19:36] it's got a radius so it's impossible.

[3:19:38] It's 35 ft wide in the back and it's

[3:19:42] probably if you measure it across the

[3:19:44] front about 62

[3:19:49] » at at the setback

[3:19:51] >> it's it's 70 ft but what we do is is

[3:19:55] >> the house is approximately 60 ft deep.

[3:19:57] So at the rear of the house we maintain

[3:19:59] the minimum 60 foot. Good.

[3:20:01] >> So if you go 60 ft back we're we're at

[3:20:04] 60 ft.

[3:20:05] >> Okay. So, uh, again, we could work with

[3:20:08] the setbacks on lots 54, 55, 56, and 57.

[3:20:12] Make those a little larger. Make those

[3:20:13] lots a little pull them in a little bit

[3:20:16] and and get some additional uh space for

[3:20:19] lots 52 and 58 and make them 65 ft each.

[3:20:22] We could do that.

[3:20:23] >> Okay.

[3:20:24] Fair enough. Yeah. Go ahead,

[3:20:26] >> M. I mean, that's that's another that's

[3:20:28] another answer to the same question. So,

[3:20:30] >> all right.

[3:20:30] >> Um,

[3:20:34] » I don't have any other questions.

[3:20:36] >> Just just there's a couple things from

[3:20:38] the community that was was brought up.

[3:20:39] Um, and that was following following the

[3:20:42] rules or changing the rules mid middle

[3:20:44] of the game. Um,

[3:20:47] [snorts]

[3:20:48] Ohio Revised Code 519.12.

[3:20:51] I essentially gives you guys the the

[3:20:53] ability, any land owner, to amend or

[3:20:56] bring forward plans like you're bringing

[3:20:57] forward today. Um, so that is kind of

[3:21:00] the rule book that that as land owners

[3:21:04] and everybody has that right. Um,

[3:21:09] >> um, has the township covered any of your

[3:21:11] expenses given you have we given any tax

[3:21:15] abatements?

[3:21:16] >> No.

[3:21:16] tax baitments. We do we have we ever

[3:21:18] given any tax abatements?

[3:21:20] >> No, I've not.

[3:21:20] >> No. Okay. I just just to clear up things

[3:21:22] in the community because a lot of res a

[3:21:24] lot of residents rightfully so place a

[3:21:27] lot of frustration and anger with with taxes and and their costs and

[3:21:32] associate it to poor judgment decision-m

[3:21:35] that maybe goes on um that they perceive

[3:21:39] anyway and other communities and and and

[3:21:42] so we have to try to be clear about what

[3:21:45] it is that we're actually doing. So no,

[3:21:46] we've not covered any of your costs, not

[3:21:49] giving you any tax incentives. We're not

[3:21:51] giving you any tax abatements.

[3:21:53] >> Um,

[3:21:54] >> and you're following state code and we are following state code by hearing

[3:22:00] from you.

[3:22:01] >> Okay, I'm good. Thank you.

[3:22:02] >> Was was so the traffic count was done.

[3:22:04] Was any of it done during the school

[3:22:05] year? Because I'll tell you this West

[3:22:07] Claremont's not too far from your

[3:22:08] location.

[3:22:10] This is why everyone's right now it's

[3:22:11] not awful on cloth. It's not great, but

[3:22:14] it's not awful. But when school opens

[3:22:15] up, gosh, is it next week or this week?

[3:22:18] Next week. Next week.

[3:22:21] We hate Kluff Pike. We hate it. We hate

[3:22:23] No one wants to drive on it. So, so when

[3:22:25] was the traffic study done and and was

[3:22:27] the school taken into account?

[3:22:29] >> The school was taken into account, but I

[3:22:30] cannot tell you when the traffic I was

[3:22:32] not the traffic engineer for the

[3:22:33] project. So, I cannot tell you when it

[3:22:35] was done. I I if I had to say, I'd say

[3:22:38] it was not done during during schools in

[3:22:40] session.

[3:22:43] >> Okay. And West Clara doesn't have busing

[3:22:45] at the high school. No.

[3:22:47] >> So more cars if they use like a average.

[3:22:52] >> Okay. Okay. Perfect. I think that's all

[3:22:53] the questions that we have. Anything

[3:22:54] else?

[3:22:55] >> Okay. Okay. Fair enough. Okay. Thank

[3:22:57] you, gentlemen, very much.

[3:22:58] >> Thank you. Thanks, guys.

[3:23:02] » Okay. All right. Last call. Is there

[3:23:04] anyone else that like to speak on this

[3:23:05] before we we discuss and vote? Okay.

[3:23:07] Come on up, sir. Please. Go ahead.

[3:23:14] All right. Do you resto tell the truth,

[3:23:16] the whole truth and about the truth? So

[3:23:17] hope you got it.

[3:23:18] >> Yes, I do.

[3:23:18] >> And then just uh clearly state your name

[3:23:20] and address for the record.

[3:23:21] >> Uh Chris Miller, 1072 Rid Point.

[3:23:25] >> Um one thing I wanted to bring up just

[3:23:26] real quickly is um we're talking about

[3:23:29] how the traffic is bad on club. Um I

[3:23:32] exit out of Buck Buckton, out of our

[3:23:34] neighborhood all the time. And it's just

[3:23:36] as bad during school when people it's

[3:23:39] lined up all the way past Shaylor. Uh

[3:23:42] people going in and out of the the

[3:23:43] neighborhood. you can't make a left turn

[3:23:45] out of there. Same thing with rush hour

[3:23:47] in the morning. So, um, as far as the

[3:23:50] traffic being, um, you know, heavier on

[3:23:52] Cl or heavier on Buck Buckton, I think

[3:23:55] it's equal because I drive that road

[3:23:56] every single day during rush hour and

[3:24:00] it's extremely busy and backed up. I

[3:24:03] mean, you can be backed up all the way

[3:24:05] to Cleer on rush hour. Okay? So, um, I

[3:24:10] just want to let you know that, you

[3:24:11] know, having this plan there. I like

[3:24:14] this plan with the court. You're having

[3:24:17] at least seven homes there that are

[3:24:18] exiting out our Buck Buckton way and the

[3:24:22] rest of the people will be exiting out

[3:24:23] of club. Now, it is tough both ways

[3:24:26] during the course of the day.

[3:24:27] >> Just want to make that point, make that

[3:24:29] point clear because I I know we're not

[3:24:31] talking about Buck Buckton much, but

[3:24:32] it's just as bad on Buck Buckton during

[3:24:35] the school day.

[3:24:35] >> Fair enough. Yeah. Appreciate you. Thank

[3:24:37] you, sir. Thank you.

[3:24:41] Okay. Is there anyone else?

[3:24:43] >> You you you want to talk or no?

[3:24:45] >> Oh, okay.

[3:24:48] >> No sweat. Okay.

[3:24:51] >> The uh it's okay. Is there anyone else

[3:24:53] before I close public hearing?

[3:24:56] >> Yeah. Yes, ma'am. Yeah. No, you got to

[3:24:58] come to the podium, please. Come on.

[3:25:03] » How can we do a traffic study and nobody

[3:25:05] knows what it said?

[3:25:06] >> Well, we know what it says. We just

[3:25:08] don't know what time of the year they

[3:25:08] took it.

[3:25:09] >> July.

[3:25:10] >> I mean,

[3:25:10] >> July this month. Okay. July. Okay.

[3:25:14] >> And And I mean, really, we're asking

[3:25:17] questions about the traffic study and

[3:25:18] they're like, "Well, we don't know. We

[3:25:19] don't know. I just think we should have

[3:25:21] more information on that."

[3:25:24] >> No. Yeah. I I I get it. I get it. They

[3:25:26] Yeah, I I understand. So, Mr. Phil, so

[3:25:29] >> there's not a lot of information there.

[3:25:30] >> So, with the traffic study, no one in

[3:25:33] this room is a traffic engineer,

[3:25:35] >> right? The county engineer is the

[3:25:37] traffic engineer. The county engineer

[3:25:39] has looked at the traffic study. So they

[3:25:42] have a certified traffic engineer that

[3:25:44] provides the county with a study. This

[3:25:46] is how it typically goes. The county

[3:25:48] looks at it. They look at the

[3:25:49] assumptions. They look at the volumes.

[3:25:52] Sometimes when they do a traffic study,

[3:25:53] they will take actual numbers and then

[3:25:55] they will take background traffic

[3:25:57] volumes and they have those counts. They

[3:26:00] pull from OKI, they pull from ODOT, they

[3:26:02] pull from local county counts. And then

[3:26:05] they make assumptions based on the

[3:26:07] behavior of the existing traffic and

[3:26:10] then based on the proposed traffic and

[3:26:12] then they forward that to the county

[3:26:14] engineers office. County engineers

[3:26:16] office looks at that and makes a

[3:26:18] determination as to whether additional

[3:26:20] improvements are needed or not needed.

[3:26:22] And that usually there's a threshold

[3:26:25] depending on existing traffic, existing

[3:26:28] subdivision u whether it makes a

[3:26:31] connection or not. the traffic

[3:26:32] assumptions that are that are coming

[3:26:34] from the new development and that's

[3:26:36] where they make a determination as to

[3:26:37] whether additional improvements are

[3:26:39] required specific to that project.

[3:26:42] >> And so they said no addition

[3:26:44] >> the county said this configuration

[3:26:46] results in no additional improvements.

[3:26:55] » Hold up. Mr. M, you got to come up here

[3:26:57] and talk if you want to talk.

[3:26:58] >> It's okay. How come there was never a

[3:27:00] counter on the road?

[3:27:01] >> Well, so a couple of reasons. So the

[3:27:03] county already has counts related to

[3:27:07] Bach Buckton and Shaylor because they've

[3:27:09] had to study all this area for the Bach

[3:27:12] Bucks and Shaylor roundabout projects

[3:27:14] which are supposed to hopefully let

[3:27:17] in 27. And I think there's been public

[3:27:20] comment period. They've had that open

[3:27:22] for public comment. I know the county

[3:27:24] asked us about some fire and AMS

[3:27:26] concerns about that project, about

[3:27:28] access and whatever. So, they're working

[3:27:30] through that federally prescribed

[3:27:32] process. So, the county has counts. They

[3:27:35] have existing traffic counts. They take

[3:27:37] traffic counts throughout the year. When

[3:27:38] I work for the city of Leland, they had

[3:27:40] traffic counts,

[3:27:41] >> but not on that stretch.

[3:27:42] >> No, no, no. They have traffic counts on

[3:27:44] all parts of the road. They have a very

[3:27:47] sophisticated data set. The county looks

[3:27:51] at traffic all the time. They count it.

[3:27:54] OKI counts it. ODOT counts it. County

[3:27:57] engineer counts it. The And the other

[3:28:00] thing is the counters. Are you thinking

[3:28:02] about the little strips?

[3:28:03] >> Yeah.

[3:28:03] >> They don't use those anymore. They use

[3:28:05] camera counters. They're like laser

[3:28:07] [clears throat] beam

[3:28:07] >> counters cameras.

[3:28:08] >> You wouldn't see them. They're very

[3:28:10] small.

[3:28:11] >> Very small.

[3:28:12] >> They don't use Those are old school. I

[3:28:15] I'm with you. When I see those, those

[3:28:16] are old traffic counters. I tell you

[3:28:18] what,

[3:28:18] >> the strips,

[3:28:20] >> my grandparents have owned that house

[3:28:22] that I live in since I was 14 years old.

[3:28:26] I sit on that porch.

[3:28:28] Well, pardon me, since I was 12.

[3:28:31] I'm 64 years old. I can do any traffic

[3:28:35] study better than any of you.

[3:28:39] [clears throat]

[3:28:42] And that is the most dangerous

[3:28:45] stretch of road I've ever seen.

[3:28:50] And

[3:28:54] uh I've never seen a camera. I have

[3:28:57] never seen a leprechaun out there

[3:28:59] counting.

[3:29:01] Okay.

[3:29:02] And looking up at this, you only got one

[3:29:07] way in off cluff,

[3:29:09] no way out. you let a uh a gas leak or

[3:29:16] something and that subdivision needs to

[3:29:18] get out of there quickly. Best of luck.

[3:29:22] There's no way to evacuate.

[3:29:26] And he says, "Oh, I've got to cut 12

[3:29:29] feet.

[3:29:31] Uh shave it down." I thought he was an

[3:29:34] engineer.

[3:29:37] >> I'm not being sarcastic.

[3:29:38] >> It's okay. That's okay. He's got 12 feet

[3:29:41] to cut down

[3:29:43] >> to go on Shaylor. I mean, I'm getting a

[3:29:46] little upset here.

[3:29:48] >> I got 11 grandb babies.

[3:29:51] We got people on that street.

[3:29:54] That's dangerous.

[3:29:57] Chief,

[3:29:58] I hope you get two two officers out

[3:30:01] there like you did at Glenn Esby High

[3:30:03] School because we need [clears throat]

[3:30:07] » Okay. Is there any other discuss

[3:30:12] right

[3:30:16] now people with this being 350 ft from

[3:30:20] the traffic light they're blasting

[3:30:21] through there they're trying to make the

[3:30:23] traffic light

[3:30:24] >> in both directions 50 55 it's like

[3:30:27] pulling out on a 32

[3:30:28] >> when

[3:30:29] >> so you're exactly right if the speed

[3:30:32] lower a little bit

[3:30:35] as dangerous

[3:30:46] Okay. All right. Is there anyone else?

[3:30:49] Okay. Fair enough. Fair enough. All

[3:30:50] right. The uh Hold on. I lost my agenda. All right. There we go. Okay.

[3:30:58] Uh, gentlemen, entertain a motion to

[3:31:01] close the public hearing for zoning case

[3:31:03] 3-26-Z

[3:31:04] and Zulu.

[3:31:05] >> So moved.

[3:31:06] >> Second.

[3:31:07] >> Mr. Campbell, roll call.

[3:31:09] >> Mr. Becker,

[3:31:09] >> yes. Mr. Lo,

[3:31:11] >> yes.

[3:31:11] >> Mr. Dills,

[3:31:12] >> yes.

[3:31:13] >> Public hearing session is closed at 9:31

[3:31:16] p.m.

[3:31:16] >> All right. Uh, gentlemen, is now time

[3:31:19] for trustee discussion. Uh, vice

[3:31:21] chairman, sir.

[3:31:28] Mr. Chairman, I

[3:31:28] >> already know.

[3:31:34] » He knows what I'm going to say.

[3:31:37] >> I guess I'm a broken record. I've been

[3:31:38] saying it for five years.

[3:31:42] I have

[3:31:44] never voted for a housing development.

[3:31:49] And there's a couple of reasons for

[3:31:51] that. One of which a lot of what we

[3:31:54] heard tonight, a lot of the grievances,

[3:31:57] it's all part of it. Part of it also

[3:32:02] is I value our zoning that is er that's

[3:32:07] um estate residential.

[3:32:09] Was that minimum two acres? I think

[3:32:12] estate residential and R1

[3:32:16] and I don't want to see that diminished.

[3:32:21] So unless there's a compelling reason,

[3:32:24] I've never said no never to a zoning

[3:32:26] change, I've never said no never to a

[3:32:28] housing development.

[3:32:31] But in my mind, there's got to be a

[3:32:33] compelling reason for me, I guess, to go

[3:32:36] against those values that I hold, the

[3:32:39] values many of you all hold, and the

[3:32:43] platform I ran on when I ran for this

[3:32:44] job five years ago.

[3:32:48] >> Beautiful. Um

[3:32:50] what's that?

[3:32:51] >> Nothing. Go ahead.

[3:32:52] >> So um you know with that, Mr. Chairman,

[3:32:55] I I intend to vote no on this.

[3:32:58] >> Mr. Lucer,

[3:33:00] um heard a lot of uh

[3:33:05] eloquent speakers. Uh tonight I've got

[3:33:08] four pages of notes.

[3:33:10] um try to balance

[3:33:13] uh the state code

[3:33:17] of what land owners are able to do with

[3:33:20] their land

[3:33:22] and bring that forward. Um

[3:33:26] you know, I know we've been asked to

[3:33:30] basically deny based off of um the

[3:33:33] pricing. It's nothing we can set. We

[3:33:35] can't determine the pricing. Uh we can't

[3:33:37] pick and choose.

[3:33:39] uh winners and losers. Um I believe in

[3:33:44] American values and uh free market and

[3:33:48] uh you know what I what I see what's

[3:33:49] presented before us is

[3:33:52] um a land owner choosing to do with

[3:33:55] their land uh and trying to work with

[3:33:57] the community uh where they can um where community members live on their

[3:34:04] land. And uh we've seen great um I think

[3:34:09] interaction commentary by like Mr.

[3:34:11] Schaefer uh very very impacted uh by

[3:34:16] this right there on Cliff Pike. Um

[3:34:22] and the developer

[3:34:24] wanting to work with with Mr. Schaefer

[3:34:27] uh for that screenage and and and and

[3:34:30] the fencing. Um and uh you know as Mr.

[3:34:34] right eloquently spoke,

[3:34:37] uh, we are not the traffic engineers. We

[3:34:39] don't have the engineering authority.

[3:34:40] That is not something that is in our

[3:34:44] jurisdiction and power to to be able to

[3:34:46] do. Um, other residents here uh may agree or disagree with perspectives,

[3:34:56] you know, shared tonight and absolutely

[3:34:59] right. there is a statutory

[3:35:02] uh pathway to to to follow to referendum

[3:35:06] any type of vote and and hear from the

[3:35:08] community and I'm all for that. Uh it's

[3:35:10] exactly why I was elected and am in in

[3:35:14] the position to try to balance the fine

[3:35:17] art of governing which is not just black

[3:35:19] and white and you don't get to just be

[3:35:21] black and white when you're trying to

[3:35:23] govern. Um it is um complex at times. Uh

[3:35:29] I wish it could just be very simple. Um

[3:35:33] same rate I wouldn't want to just give

[3:35:35] the land owner a very easy way to come

[3:35:39] sue the township and earn costs. That is

[3:35:44] also right also taking care of being

[3:35:48] conservative values for you the

[3:35:51] residents and where time and resources

[3:35:54] go. Um so with that it's pretty clear uh

[3:36:00] that there's a plan that is

[3:36:03] ready to move forward uh tonight um that

[3:36:07] has been presented. So I think that's

[3:36:09] last of my my my comment uh to it.

[3:36:13] >> Mr. Dills. All right. So

[3:36:16] Mr. Mr. Mayor, one one question is uh so

[3:36:19] Bridge Ridge Point Drive that that

[3:36:20] neighborhood right there and then all

[3:36:21] the houses to the south of that picture

[3:36:25] based off what you said you would you

[3:36:27] would vote that down as well. So half

[3:36:30] these folks in this room wouldn't have a

[3:36:31] home if you were their trustee because

[3:36:33] those those uh lot sizes are the same

[3:36:36] size and actually they're a little bit

[3:36:38] smaller than the culde-sac. Now, the

[3:36:40] rest of the homes are a little bit

[3:36:41] equal, maybe a little bit more, but the

[3:36:43] culde-sac ones are actually a little bit

[3:36:44] more than the rest on Rich Point as far

[3:36:46] as uh land area. So, you would have

[3:36:49] voted all those down to the right to the

[3:36:51] south based off your logic.

[3:36:53] >> Yeah, they would have vote they would

[3:36:54] have built it on R1 instead.

[3:36:55] >> True. Yeah. Which would they have been

[3:36:57] able to afford it at the time based off

[3:36:59] that because obviously more land, more cost. So, um

[3:37:03] >> more parking on the street.

[3:37:05] >> That's true. Yeah, that's true. the uh so I'll say uh I've said this uh

[3:37:11] almost every time we have a housing

[3:37:12] development come in whether it be multif

[3:37:14] family or in this case single family

[3:37:15] residential um uh one thing that when it

[3:37:18] comes to housing uh Mr. Becker and I and

[3:37:21] of course Mr. We we all agree that we we

[3:37:23] do not like multif family. We don't we don't unless it's a a mixeduse

[3:37:27] and there's only one apartment that I've

[3:37:29] voted yes on. It was because it was

[3:37:30] mixed use meaning first floor retail and

[3:37:32] second floor apartment buildings. Um

[3:37:35] that's the only way I would ever be

[3:37:36] considerate uh right now at this point.

[3:37:38] And so um you know when we got elected

[3:37:42] residents said we need more middle class

[3:37:44] single family residential homes. That

[3:37:45] that's been clear. Um and it sounds like

[3:37:47] there isn't really that many people

[3:37:49] against this development. It's just the

[3:37:50] fact that it exits out on Kluff Pike,

[3:37:52] which I happen to agree with everyone

[3:37:53] because I drive Kluff Pike twice every

[3:37:55] day myself. Uh so, um

[3:38:01] yeah, and it's unfortunate because with

[3:38:04] pre precoid, uh 200 to 250,000 was your

[3:38:07] average middle class nice house and that

[3:38:09] 250,000 has now become gosh 450 500,000.

[3:38:12] So, um but this isn't going to attract

[3:38:15] riffraff. the I mean, you're not going

[3:38:17] to buy a $500,000 house and cause

[3:38:20] problems in the township. You're just

[3:38:22] not. This isn't affordable housing, uh,

[3:38:25] meaning section 8. Uh, it's it's it's,

[3:38:28] uh, it's a good development. I I do hate

[3:38:31] the fact that it's on cluff. I hate

[3:38:32] that. Hate it. Capital H. Hate it. I

[3:38:34] don't like it at all. Um, but it is a

[3:38:37] good development. Uh, so, uh, gentlemen,

[3:38:40] I both want you to hear this. As far as

[3:38:41] this, uh, I'm going to need, uh, I'm

[3:38:43] going to put in here my contingencies

[3:38:44] that Lot 52 and lot 58 need to be 65 ft

[3:38:47] wide. I'm also going to include that,

[3:38:49] uh, they need to pay for Mr. Schaer's

[3:38:50] fence, uh, incomplete, uh, completely.

[3:38:53] So, just so you know, doesn't affect

[3:38:55] you, Mr. Becker, but just, so, you know,

[3:38:56] um, [clears throat]

[3:38:57] >> well, the motion would

[3:38:59] >> Yeah. Yeah. Say it again.

[3:39:01] >> When you wrap up one comment question,

[3:39:08] » Yeah. That's all I got.

[3:39:11] Mr. Wright, is there a pathway for the

[3:39:14] developer to pursue a special assessment

[3:39:15] on these homes? I don't know if it would

[3:39:18] generate enough for traffic improvements

[3:39:20] on Cliff Pike, but

[3:39:22] so the answer is maybe. Um, you know, it

[3:39:25] all has to do with the amount of the

[3:39:28] construction cost and I know there have

[3:39:31] been other neighborhoods where a special

[3:39:32] assessment district has been formed.

[3:39:34] Again, for the benefit of the audience,

[3:39:36] a special assessment district means the

[3:39:38] people in the development are paying

[3:39:39] extra. They're paying more into a

[3:39:42] special assessment district over a

[3:39:44] period of time to either backs stop

[3:39:47] bonds or reimburse expenditures or to

[3:39:50] provide funding for future improvements.

[3:39:52] And so there is that mechanism. Um,

[3:39:57] >> do we do that before and after? It's an

[3:39:59] after the fact.

[3:39:59] >> It's after the fact. It's it would not

[3:40:03] be really germanine issue, but there are

[3:40:06] >> there are avenues if if the developer

[3:40:08] wanted to do that.

[3:40:10] >> Um, okay.

[3:40:11] >> Road improvements are very expensive. I

[3:40:13] will just tell you they're

[3:40:15] >> I I

[3:40:17] don't remember the number for the lock

[3:40:19] bucks and roundabouts, but they're

[3:40:20] creeping up on $12 million.

[3:40:21] >> So, that gives you an idea. So,

[3:40:25] um, what I will say before we wrap up

[3:40:27] is, uh, I I don't want one single

[3:40:30] complaint from the two neighbors living

[3:40:31] next to lot number 58, lot number 52,

[3:40:34] uh, at all. Uh, I appreciate you putting

[3:40:37] the culde-sac in. I think that appease

[3:40:39] the folks at Ridge Point. Um,

[3:40:42] yeah. Okay, we good. Okay. All right,

[3:40:46] gentlemen. I'll entertain a motion for

[3:40:47] the approval of Union Township zoning

[3:40:48] case 3-26-Z is in Zulu uh with

[3:40:52] modifications as recommended including

[3:40:54] uh lot 52 lot 58 uh 65 ft wide and a

[3:40:58] fence fully paid for for Mr. Schaefer.

[3:41:00] >> So moved.

[3:41:01] >> Second.

[3:41:02] >> Uh any further discussion? Mr. Campbell.

[3:41:04] Roll call.

[3:41:04] >> Mr. Becker.

[3:41:05] >> No.

[3:41:06] >> Mr. Log.

[3:41:07] >> Yes.

[3:41:08] >> Mr. Dills.

[3:41:09] >> Yes.

[3:41:09] >> Motion carries.

[3:41:11] >> Okay. Uh moving on to our second zoning

[3:41:13] case of the night. Uh, it'll be Union

[3:41:16] Township zoning case 4-26-ZOU

[3:41:19] and uh, Mr. Flowy, you're up. Go ahead.

[3:41:21] Oh, we'll wait to wait till they folks

[3:41:23] exit.

[3:41:25] [clears throat]

[3:41:30] » Okay,

[3:41:33] get ready for round two.

[3:41:34] >> Okay, I think that's good. Okay, go

[3:41:35] ahead. Go ahead, Mr.

[3:41:36] >> Thank you, Mr. Dills. This is for a

[3:41:39] zoning map amendment for 4-26-Z.

[3:41:43] It's called Bishop's Grove subdivision.

[3:41:45] The applicant has submitted an

[3:41:47] application requesting that two parcels

[3:41:49] totaling 4.77 acres be reszoned from R2

[3:41:52] single family detach residential

[3:41:55] district to the R4

[3:41:57] family variable residential district in

[3:42:00] order to allow for the proposed concept

[3:42:02] plan subdivision development consisting

[3:42:04] of 18 lots for single family dwelling

[3:42:07] units, landscaping elements, greening,

[3:42:09] entry monument signage, and open spaces.

[3:42:13] Some land use and zoning

[3:42:14] characteristics. The current land uses

[3:42:16] in the vicinity are are mostly

[3:42:19] consistent of residential uses with the

[3:42:22] exception of some institutional uses

[3:42:25] such as the church across the street and

[3:42:27] Crocker auto parts the west. All

[3:42:29] adjacent parcels consisting of the R2

[3:42:31] family detached residential in the area.

[3:42:35] The adjacent Willowbrook and Shepardwood

[3:42:37] subdivisions consist of lots with an

[3:42:39] average width of 70 ft and a depth of

[3:42:44] 130 ft. With the horizon 2030 land use

[3:42:48] plan indicates the proposed development

[3:42:50] is not located in a designated corridor.

[3:42:54] However, the R4 district allows for

[3:42:56] creative design yielding the greatest

[3:42:58] green space in retaining vegetation

[3:43:00] compared to the traditional zoning. The

[3:43:05] square the single family dwelling

[3:43:07] densities are up to four units per acre

[3:43:11] and the proposal readily achieves that

[3:43:13] through a density of 3.77

[3:43:16] units an acre.

[3:43:18] Moving with some background information.

[3:43:20] The subject properties have been located

[3:43:24] in the R2 districts since the

[3:43:26] institution of zoning in 1959. The

[3:43:29] principal structure was built in 1937

[3:43:31] according to the auditor's site and has

[3:43:33] several nonconformities. In addition,

[3:43:35] these properties have been in violation

[3:43:38] of the zoning resolution multiple times

[3:43:40] in the recent past and has been resolved

[3:43:43] by the zoning inspector. Some staff

[3:43:46] review and analysis of the application

[3:43:48] shows that the proposal yields the

[3:43:51] zoning map and conceptual plans are

[3:43:54] consistent with the R4 district

[3:43:56] regulations and adopted single family

[3:43:58] use recommendations. The there are 18

[3:44:02] single family housing lots located on

[3:44:08] located within this subdivision with a

[3:44:10] width of an average lot of 50 ft at the

[3:44:13] building lot setback line and 100 ft in

[3:44:16] depths. Some of the open space there are

[3:44:19] four additional lots to be dedicated

[3:44:21] totaling approximately 1.39 acres or

[3:44:24] 29.2% 2% of the total site to be

[3:44:28] maintained by the HOA.

[3:44:31] Uh landscaping, buffering, screening,

[3:44:32] and pedestrian access is included with a

[3:44:35] 36 inch high mound consisting of white

[3:44:38] and white and pine trees and has been

[3:44:42] proposed along the adjacent properties

[3:44:44] to the north and south.

[3:44:46] The areas that have been in indicated

[3:44:51] here as uh with vegetation should be

[3:44:54] labeled as preserved. The installation

[3:44:56] of a sidewalk should be along both sides

[3:44:58] of Bishop's Way and along the Shephard

[3:45:02] Road as consistent with the 2030 plan

[3:45:05] goals. Some lot configuration and

[3:45:07] orientation. A minimum setback should be

[3:45:10] set for the proposed lot to ensure

[3:45:13] enforcement with the zoning is

[3:45:15] consistent throughout and a signage

[3:45:17] package should be submitted so the

[3:45:18] proposed monument signage can be in

[3:45:21] accordance with article 9 of the zoning

[3:45:23] resolution.

[3:45:25] The zoning commission recommended

[3:45:27] approval for the site with seven

[3:45:30] modifications. This was unanimous in

[3:45:33] case number 4-26-Z

[3:45:37] and the action required tonight is in

[3:45:39] accordance with section 650 through 659

[3:45:42] of the zoning resolution that the board

[3:45:44] of trustees is to enter a motion to

[3:45:46] approve as recommended by the zoning

[3:45:48] commission approve with additional

[3:45:50] modifications or deny the zoning map

[3:45:53] amendment in accompanying concept plan

[3:45:55] as presented in Union Township zoning

[3:45:58] case 4-26-Z

[3:46:01] And that concludes my report.

[3:46:03] >> John, Mr. Floody. Um, by the way, for

[3:46:07] all all you folks that have been waiting

[3:46:08] for this zoning case, just apologies um

[3:46:10] for the delay as far as how long it

[3:46:12] took. But no matter what, I like to get

[3:46:14] every single person a chance to voice

[3:46:17] their thoughts. Uh, so for what it's

[3:46:19] worth. Uh, okay. Uh, uh, vice chairman,

[3:46:23] any questions for Mr. Flouty?

[3:46:24] >> No. [clears throat]

[3:46:25] >> No, I'm good.

[3:46:26] >> Mr. Lo,

[3:46:27] >> no, I'm good. Thank you.

[3:46:28] >> Uh, Mr. Flouty, you mentioned HOA. Is

[3:46:30] that a new HOA or is it going to be a

[3:46:31] part of the existing neighborhood there?

[3:46:33] >> It would be a separate HOA for this

[3:46:35] subdivision alone. It would be created

[3:46:37] in the deeds and covetants for for these

[3:46:40] two properties in in whole.

[3:46:43] >> Perfect. And then uh the the houses to

[3:46:46] the left and houses underneath ballpark.

[3:46:48] What are those average uh on on those

[3:46:51] lots?

[3:46:53] >> The the existing homes, those are in the

[3:46:56] R2. So they would be around the quarter of an acre lot. Yes. Correct.

[3:47:02] >> All right. Got Okay. That's all I got.

[3:47:05] Okay. Uh gentlemen entertain a motion to

[3:47:08] open up public hearings zoning case uh

[3:47:11] 4-26-Z is in Zulu.

[3:47:14] >> So moved. Second.

[3:47:15] >> All right. Any discussion? Mr. Campbell.

[3:47:17] Roll call.

[3:47:18] >> Mr. Becker.

[3:47:19] >> Yes. Mr. Lo.

[3:47:20] >> Yes.

[3:47:21] >> Mr. Dills.

[3:47:22] >> Yes.

[3:47:22] >> Public hearing is open at 9:47 p.m.

[3:47:25] >> All right. And first thing is we usually

[3:47:27] have the proponent up. So to be the

[3:47:28] developer, uh, if you'd like to come on

[3:47:30] up

[3:47:32] and then I will swear you in. All right.

[3:47:35] You swear to tell the truth, the whole

[3:47:36] truth, nothing but the truth. So help

[3:47:38] God.

[3:47:38] >> I do.

[3:47:38] >> Great. Uh, name and address for record,

[3:47:40] sir.

[3:47:40] >> Tyler Gibbs, Maddox Development. Address

[3:47:43] is 4026

[3:47:45] Bach Buckston Road, Matav, Ohio 45103.

[3:47:49] >> Michigan. Would you get all that?

[3:47:50] >> I got it.

[3:47:50] >> Perfect. Okay, go ahead.

[3:47:51] >> Oh, I do have a card. If you

[3:47:53] >> I'll take that, too. Um, I'll give it to

[3:47:56] you after.

[3:47:56] >> Okay.

[3:47:58] >> So, Maddox, a little bit history of

[3:48:00] Maddox Development. Maddox Development

[3:48:01] is local to Union Township. Uh, we're

[3:48:03] located on Bach Buckton Road. Um, own

[3:48:07] several commercial properties uh in this

[3:48:09] township, including the building that we

[3:48:11] worked out of in the Kennedy Land, the

[3:48:13] shops at Kennedy's Landing. Um, Maddox

[3:48:16] Development is also responsible for

[3:48:18] building several truly affordable houses

[3:48:21] in this township in the last since 2018.

[3:48:25] Um, some of those houses are on their

[3:48:28] second owner. Um, and they sold for 335.

[3:48:31] We sold them for 315. Um, Maddox

[3:48:34] Development is not the the builder in

[3:48:36] this case. Uh, we are developing it for

[3:48:39] other builders.

[3:48:40] Um, so what Maddox Development looks for

[3:48:42] is they look for we look for infill

[3:48:44] lots. Um, you know,

[3:48:48] for example, we did on traction lane

[3:48:50] over by Speedway on Traction Lane,

[3:48:51] there's an infill lot there. We split it

[3:48:53] into two and put two houses on it. We

[3:48:55] also look for um

[3:48:59] uh troubled properties, I guess you

[3:49:01] could say, houses that may have burnt

[3:49:02] down that we can tear down, rebuild, and

[3:49:04] redevelop. So, that's kind of our

[3:49:06] specialty. Um, and so this particular

[3:49:09] lot came up. We I let it be for sale. It

[3:49:12] was for sale for two weeks before I looked at it. Um,

[3:49:18] it was still available. So, we looked at

[3:49:19] it and this particular lot fits all of

[3:49:21] our requirements that we looked for in a development. It is the house is is

[3:49:26] abandoned. There's nobody living in it.

[3:49:28] As Craig said, there's been several

[3:49:31] zoning uh issues with this lot in the in

[3:49:33] the past few years that have been

[3:49:34] resolved. Um but

[3:49:37] uh you know that this is what we look

[3:49:40] for. We we look for these kind of lots

[3:49:41] and clean it up a little bit. So um we

[3:49:45] came up with a pretty decent site plan.

[3:49:46] I you know if you ask me I might be

[3:49:48] biased. Um 18 lots. It is currently

[3:49:52] zoned R2. So the density is a quarter

[3:49:55] acre per lot which in this case would be

[3:49:58] 20 houses or so. Um and so we hit 18.

[3:50:02] And we also um were able to design this

[3:50:06] to have green space all the way around

[3:50:08] the entire perimeter there, the backside

[3:50:11] and the uh I believe that's the west

[3:50:14] with a mound.

[3:50:16] We have a green space in the middle with

[3:50:17] a gazebo um obviously a monument sign.

[3:50:20] We have two retention ponds and one

[3:50:22] detention pond um to help with drainage

[3:50:24] in the area. It's a relatively flat lot

[3:50:27] and um and so Carl Hartman, he could not

[3:50:29] be here tonight. he fell ill earlier

[3:50:32] today and uh but he he has drawn up a a

[3:50:36] very good site plan for this uh for this

[3:50:38] lot. So um that's all I have for right

[3:50:41] now. Want to answer some questions?

[3:50:44] >> Mr. Fresher.

[3:50:44] >> No, Mr. Lugs.

[3:50:50] » Mr. Gibbs. Uh

[3:50:51] >> Maddox is my middle name. the uh

[3:50:53] regardless how the vote turns out uh you

[3:50:56] know appreciate you investing in the

[3:50:57] township as because you own Kenny's

[3:50:59] Landing and also your other business is

[3:51:00] located here as well, right?

[3:51:01] >> Yeah, we uh we're located on Bach Bucks

[3:51:03] and we also own the building that we're

[3:51:05] in on Bucks, the old KUP electric

[3:51:06] building.

[3:51:07] >> Fair enough. Yeah. Yeah. Appreciate your

[3:51:08] investment here in the township. Yeah.

[3:51:10] Thank you very much. But uh no questions

[3:51:11] for me at the time. Appreciate. Yeah.

[3:51:12] Thank you, sir.

[3:51:13] >> Okay. Is there anyone else that's a

[3:51:15] proponent of this case? Uh for this

[3:51:17] case?

[3:51:18] >> Yes.

[3:51:18] >> Oh, please. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

[3:51:19] Please come on up. Yes.

[3:51:24] All right. Got it.

[3:51:29] » All right. Appreciate it.

[3:51:31] >> Thank you.

[3:51:31] >> Appreciate you. All right. Let me let me

[3:51:33] go swear you in.

[3:51:35] >> All right. You swear to tell the truth,

[3:51:37] the whole truth. Anything about the

[3:51:37] truth. So have you got I do. Great.

[3:51:39] Lor's yours, sir.

[3:51:42] >> My name is David Lamb. Uh my address is

[3:51:46] 1192

[3:51:47] Emery Ridge Drive. That is a Bavia

[3:51:50] address. Uh I am speaking tonight um

[3:51:54] from the perspective of the family

[3:51:56] trying to sell the property.

[3:51:58] So I am the son of one of six siblings

[3:52:03] who inherited the property when my

[3:52:05] grandmother died in 1995.

[3:52:08] >> We have been through about 10 years of

[3:52:11] probate complications.

[3:52:14] We just reached the point this winter

[3:52:17] where we could list the property. the

[3:52:20] family is not in a position to maintain

[3:52:22] the property. We are aware that the

[3:52:24] house on that property is an eyesore,

[3:52:26] that some of the other debris on the

[3:52:28] property is is not only an eyesore, but

[3:52:31] it's a safety hazard if anybody

[3:52:32] trespasses. We know that for the good of

[3:52:35] the community, this property needs to

[3:52:37] move on. The family's not capable. Um,

[3:52:40] so from a sellers's perspective,

[3:52:43] we're looking for support in moving this

[3:52:47] property and letting everybody in that

[3:52:49] community move on. Um,

[3:52:55] two weeks ago was the zoning committee

[3:52:57] hearing. We heard a number of different

[3:52:59] concerns from the local the neighbors of

[3:53:02] the area. One of them was traffic. I

[3:53:05] think this this uh the trustees have

[3:53:07] established the traffic concerns are

[3:53:10] more in the county's area. So I would

[3:53:13] say, you know, any concerns with traffic

[3:53:15] kind of be deferred. I would, you know,

[3:53:17] I'd hope they would go. The other

[3:53:19] concern was related to the use of the

[3:53:23] property. One of the things I learned in

[3:53:25] the zoning and and it's funny, we've had

[3:53:27] a lot of conversation about R1, R2, R4.

[3:53:30] These are things that are foreign to any

[3:53:33] of us, you know, that don't deal with

[3:53:34] properties.

[3:53:36] >> One of the things I learned in the

[3:53:37] zoning committee meeting was

[3:53:39] that the plan that the developer has

[3:53:42] come up with actually meets the density

[3:53:44] requirements for I think it's the R2

[3:53:47] rating, the current rating. So, even

[3:53:49] though they're applying for R4, the the

[3:53:53] density rating when you factor in the

[3:53:54] green space actually still meets the

[3:53:57] current uh zoning for that property. And

[3:54:00] I I can defer to the zoning committee

[3:54:02] for clarification on that. I'm by no

[3:54:04] means an expert on that. So what I'm is from the seller's

[3:54:10] perspective is, you know, we have a need

[3:54:13] to move the property. We're looking for

[3:54:15] improvements for everybody on Shepard

[3:54:18] Road and that as long as the density

[3:54:21] requirements, the zoning requirements

[3:54:23] are are met, we're hoping there's no

[3:54:25] obstruction to selling this property.

[3:54:28] One last point I want to make just just

[3:54:31] noting it. I believe I assume that a

[3:54:35] petition that was turned into the zoning

[3:54:36] committee with about 125 signatures

[3:54:40] um was pulled together by one of the

[3:54:44] competing biders. We also learned in the

[3:54:46] zoning committee meeting that the

[3:54:49] information that was given to a lot of

[3:54:50] the signees at the time, not

[3:54:52] intentionally, but because of a

[3:54:54] misunderstanding of zoning, a lot of the

[3:54:57] people that signed that petition may not

[3:54:59] have gotten accurate accurate

[3:55:00] information on the zoning rules.

[3:55:03] But my concern is is that the person

[3:55:06] driving that petition

[3:55:08] could be using that to keep the sale

[3:55:11] open and prevent the sale to the current

[3:55:13] developer. With that, I'll close.

[3:55:16] >> Fair enough. Yeah. And then did you have

[3:55:18] any questions for Mr. Lamb?

[3:55:19] >> No.

[3:55:20] >> Any questions for Mr. Lamb?

[3:55:21] >> Uh, not apparently.

[3:55:23] >> Appreciate you speak. And by by the way,

[3:55:24] uh, sorry for your grandmother in her

[3:55:27] passing, by the way, Mr. Lamb. The, uh,

[3:55:29] Okay. Is there anyone else that is for

[3:55:31] this case that is a proponent. All

[3:55:33] right. Seeing none, I can kind of tell

[3:55:35] where the room's at. So, [laughter]

[3:55:38] the Okay. Yeah. Uh is there is

[3:55:41] >> wedding

[3:55:42] >> the uh if anyone that that is an

[3:55:44] opponent of this case that is against

[3:55:46] this case uh you please come on up sir.

[3:55:48] Yeah.

[3:55:52] And uh

[3:55:55] this is right.

[3:55:57] >> Yeah.

[3:55:58] >> Thank you.

[3:56:00] >> Oh yeah.

[3:56:01] >> Okay. Do you swear to tell the truth,

[3:56:03] the whole truth, and both the truth

[3:56:04] shall be God?

[3:56:05] >> I do.

[3:56:05] >> Great. And then go and state your name

[3:56:07] for that. Uh, excuse me, Justin Burch,

[3:56:09] 997 Shepardwoods Court. Um, first things

[3:56:13] first, uh, I just want to say, uh, thank

[3:56:15] you, Mr. Dills, for allowing everybody

[3:56:17] to come up and speak. I know it's late,

[3:56:19] pushing 10:00. Um, I have been getting

[3:56:22] texts, uh, Mr. Wright, saying they were

[3:56:24] hearing you uh, ask Mr. Dills to wrap

[3:56:28] this up, which you responded. It's their

[3:56:31] right. So, thank you for that.

[3:56:32] >> Absolutely. Thank you, sir.

[3:56:36] >> Uh, good evening. I'm here tonight to

[3:56:37] voice the collective concerns of many

[3:56:40] residents regarding the proposed zoning

[3:56:43] uh reszoning from R2 to R4 on Shepard

[3:56:45] Road.

[3:56:47] While we understand the need for the

[3:56:49] growth, development development must be

[3:56:52] harmonious with the established

[3:56:53] character of our community. One concern

[3:56:57] is the unprecedented increase in

[3:56:59] density. Currently the small private

[3:57:02] areas along Shepard Road average just

[3:57:05] four homes each. So when you off

[3:57:08] Tealtown all the way down it's about

[3:57:10] four homes on each one of the offshoots

[3:57:14] of that if that makes sense. It does.

[3:57:17] >> Uh this proposal calls for new 18 home

[3:57:20] development. This isn't just a minor

[3:57:22] increase. um myself and those back on

[3:57:25] Willowville um and many residents down

[3:57:29] Sheperwood's Court uh it will feel like

[3:57:32] a mini Brooklyn dropped right in our

[3:57:34] backyard

[3:57:36] uh which is completely out of step with

[3:57:38] the existing neighborhoods down Shepard

[3:57:40] Road. Another major concern is the loss

[3:57:43] of privacy right now. lot of mature

[3:57:45] trees, natural brush, provide a buffer

[3:57:48] between our homes, this property,

[3:57:52] um, and the Willowbrook community behind

[3:57:54] us. This development would remove most

[3:57:57] trees and a three-foot tall burm around

[3:58:00] the perimeter. This burm simply will not

[3:58:02] replace decades of mature trees that

[3:58:04] currently provide any sort of privacy

[3:58:07] for residents all around.

[3:58:10] Uh approximately 21 existing homes

[3:58:13] including 12 on Locust uh Grove Court,

[3:58:16] seven on Sheperwoods Court and two on

[3:58:19] Sheper Road, we'll see our privacy

[3:58:21] significantly decreased

[3:58:24] with this potential to reszone to R4

[3:58:26] allowing more flexibility of homes on

[3:58:28] their respective lot. these new new

[3:58:30] homes um won't have to adhere to the

[3:58:33] setbacks of the 30 feet uh 30 feet and

[3:58:36] 10 feet respectively uh per the zoning

[3:58:39] documents that are online potentially

[3:58:42] putting new homes even closer to our

[3:58:43] existing properties diminishing the

[3:58:45] privacy that is already in danger.

[3:58:48] Um we're also worried about traffic and

[3:58:50] safety. The road leading to this

[3:58:52] development is narrow, has no sidewalks,

[3:58:55] and there is only one entrance and exit.

[3:58:58] Um, one note that I do have, I've

[3:59:00] already had to spend over $200 uh

[3:59:02] because my wife was forced off the edge

[3:59:05] of the road um years ago hitting a trash

[3:59:09] can that was out there because it was so

[3:59:11] narrow.

[3:59:11] >> Is it is that on Shepard?

[3:59:12] >> That's on Shepard Road. Yes.

[3:59:16] Um, and a side note with that, many

[3:59:19] times we're constantly pulling over to

[3:59:22] allow cars to pass.

[3:59:26] Um

[3:59:29] so family, children, walkers, cyclists,

[3:59:32] we all use this road. Uh increased

[3:59:34] traffic creates additional safety

[3:59:35] concerns. Uh we also need to consider

[3:59:38] the impact of the consider uh excuse me,

[3:59:42] consider continued residential

[3:59:44] development on the West Claremont School

[3:59:47] District. It seems there has been a

[3:59:49] recent shift in Union Township toward

[3:59:51] fitting as many residential communities

[3:59:53] as possible into smaller pieces of

[3:59:55] property. But if we stop to consider the

[3:59:58] cumulative impact impact of that growth

[4:00:01] on our schools, 18 additional homes may

[4:00:04] seem like a small number when considered

[4:00:06] on their own, but when combined with

[4:00:08] other new developments, these homes mean

[4:00:10] additional students to the West

[4:00:12] Claremont School District. This affects

[4:00:14] class sizes, classroom space, staffing,

[4:00:16] transportation, and other school

[4:00:18] resources. We urge the the trustees to

[4:00:22] deny the reasonzoning request. We're not

[4:00:24] against the development, bar none.

[4:00:26] Period. Full stop. We're not against it.

[4:00:28] What we're against is shoving 18 homes

[4:00:32] into a 3.7 acre lot

[4:00:36] on a already narrow road to bring if

[4:00:40] there's 18 at least two cars for

[4:00:43] husband, wife, partner, spouse. Now

[4:00:46] you're up to 36. They started having

[4:00:48] children. You're you're climbing way up

[4:00:51] very quickly. Again, on a very narrow

[4:00:53] road already. Um, and I would like to

[4:00:56] just say during snowstorms, plows don't

[4:00:59] really come down Shepherd Road very

[4:01:01] often. Um, there are some low spots,

[4:01:04] there's a lot of ice,

[4:01:06] it it it gets uh pretty dangerous at

[4:01:09] times, and I'm not just trying to

[4:01:11] exaggerate that either. Um, we we do

[4:01:14] agree that the the current property is

[4:01:16] an eyesore. Full stop. We we we agree

[4:01:19] with that. Um, but again, it feels like

[4:01:24] the goal is just to cram as many uh

[4:01:26] homes as possible. Um, I'm sorry, I

[4:01:29] misspoke. I said 3.7 earlier. Um, as

[4:01:31] many homes as possible into a 4.7 acre

[4:01:34] property to maximize the profits of the

[4:01:37] developer that doesn't live in the

[4:01:38] community.

[4:01:40] Um, current currently there is a privacy

[4:01:42] fence, a sixoot wooden privacy fence.

[4:01:45] Um, that is

[4:01:47] C.

[4:01:48] >> Craig, can you pull up a better picture

[4:01:49] of that? Yeah. On the aerial. Thank you.

[4:01:51] >> Um once you turn into well to the if

[4:01:55] you're staring at Bishop's house, which

[4:01:58] is the top right corner, um little white

[4:02:01] building to the right of that, there is

[4:02:02] a 6-ft wooden privacy fence that is

[4:02:05] constantly falling down, uh currently.

[4:02:08] So, uh, one thing that we

[4:02:12] are worried about is what's going to

[4:02:13] happen with that fence all the way down,

[4:02:17] uh, that privacy fence. It then turns

[4:02:19] into barbwire fence that comes down my

[4:02:22] property,

[4:02:23] neighbors property, another piece of

[4:02:25] property, and then around to the private

[4:02:28] drive.

[4:02:30] Who's going to take care of that? Is

[4:02:32] there going to be another fence? What is

[4:02:33] that going to uh what's that going to

[4:02:35] look like?

[4:02:36] >> And all this, Mr. patrol this fence

[4:02:37] you're talking about is that on the

[4:02:38] existing property right now

[4:02:39] >> that is on the existing property that's

[4:02:40] correct

[4:02:41] >> all right

[4:02:43] um

[4:02:45] in the

[4:02:47] last couple things I do want to say um

[4:02:52] we have spoken with people that know the

[4:02:55] developer they're even against it um and

[4:03:00] uh we also know people personally that

[4:03:02] have put bids in on the property um that

[4:03:06] were denied

[4:03:07] whatever it doesn't matter. Um, I just

[4:03:10] want to say or have that on the record

[4:03:12] that other people are bidding on this

[4:03:14] that they were just going to have it as

[4:03:16] a single family lot. They were going to

[4:03:18] use it for green space. They were going

[4:03:20] to build a home on it. Um, not turn this

[4:03:23] into again a mini Brooklyn.

[4:03:27] Um, and then

[4:03:29] the really the only question that

[4:03:31] [clears throat] I have

[4:03:33] is, uh, what are the setbacks on the

[4:03:36] home if this hypothetically did get

[4:03:39] reszoned to an R4?

[4:03:43] » Mr. F, you want to answer that one?

[4:03:45] >> Yeah. So, looking at the plan, let me

[4:03:48] pull out the report here.

[4:03:51] The setbacks for the holes would be the

[4:03:55] minimum fret yard setbacks of all

[4:03:57] proposed lots should be 25 foot. The

[4:04:00] minimum rear yard setbacks of the

[4:04:02] proposed lot should be 15 ft. This

[4:04:05] combined with a landscape buffer. So the

[4:04:08] landscape buffer to the rear of this. So

[4:04:11] you can see that along through there

[4:04:13] makes a combination for roughly 30 feet

[4:04:17] in combined setbacks.

[4:04:22] So from the very the the property line

[4:04:24] to the house would be 30 ft.

[4:04:27] >> So if you're looking at it here, this

[4:04:30] would roughly be

[4:04:32] keep it contingent with 15. So you have

[4:04:35] 15 roughly and another 15 to get 30 in

[4:04:39] there. And then the front would be

[4:04:41] combined to have a standard of 25 ft.

[4:04:45] >> What about Oh, I'm sorry. I didn't mean

[4:04:46] to cut you off. So you can kind of see

[4:04:48] within this plan how all the setbacks

[4:04:51] vary those dash lines. We just keep a

[4:04:55] standard setback there of 25 ft from the

[4:04:58] front, 15 from the rear with the

[4:05:00] additional 15 ft in the back to make a

[4:05:03] total of 30 in. Sorry, what was your

[4:05:06] question? Uh what about the lots that

[4:05:08] are smaller on the right hand or excuse

[4:05:11] me on the lefthand side around the

[4:05:12] culde-sac and then also on the far right

[4:05:14] hand side heading back towards that

[4:05:18] >> I can't see

[4:05:35] they've got So, this one here,

[4:05:38] the mouse, we've got 30 feet. Here we've

[4:05:43] got 25 ft, 20 ft, 25 ft, 20 ft. So, roughly, and then you

[4:05:54] have the buffering of

[4:05:58] the mound throughout here. What about on

[4:06:01] the side where the the burm is on the

[4:06:04] far right side? See a little strip and

[4:06:06] then

[4:06:08] >> Yeah. So, this one's

[4:06:10] 10 15 and then the mound in between

[4:06:15] there.

[4:06:16] >> And how how wide is that mound?

[4:06:19] the mound would be so we know it's 36 in

[4:06:23] high and then it would roughly be um

[4:06:29] it would roughly be let's see here I

[4:06:32] would say what four four feet in width

[4:06:34] to offset you know you can't have it too

[4:06:37] steep otherwise yeah it just erode

[4:06:39] through there so

[4:06:41] >> so about either 14 to 19 feet from the

[4:06:45] burm or from the the property line where

[4:06:48] the burm would

[4:06:50] end for that development to the back of

[4:06:54] the house of a of one of the developed

[4:06:57] homes.

[4:06:58] >> Am I understand that correctly? It' be

[4:07:00] between 14 and 15 ft on that side.

[4:07:06] » Yes, it looks like it's 10 feet and then

[4:07:09] the width which is Yeah, I would say

[4:07:11] roughly around 10. So, we'd be at 20 at

[4:07:14] 20 feet 20T around there. Yeah.

[4:07:18] Thank you. That's one second. Mr. B, Mr.

[4:07:21] Becker, any questions?

[4:07:22] >> I do. Uh, and Mr. Flouty might want to

[4:07:25] chime in on on this as well. So, I'm

[4:07:28] very familiar with Shepherd Road. I've

[4:07:30] even picked up garbage along it the

[4:07:32] whole stretch all the way down. Now, as

[4:07:35] the chairman pointed out, the area is

[4:07:36] zoned R2, but is it my imagination

[4:07:41] or are even though it's zoned R2,

[4:07:44] most of lots are much larger than a

[4:07:47] minimum for R2?

[4:07:50] Do they know the answer to that?

[4:07:54] >> Yeah.

[4:07:54] >> Yes. These these lots are smaller than a

[4:07:57] typical R2. What's made up with this?

[4:08:00] >> I'm talking about the current Sheepard

[4:08:02] Road

[4:08:03] >> hubs. Yeah, Shepard Road. If you look at

[4:08:05] the zoning map, the properties around

[4:08:07] are R2.

[4:08:08] >> Yeah, but that wasn't my question.

[4:08:11] [laughter]

[4:08:13] >> Are you saying the lots around it are

[4:08:14] smaller, bigger? Is that your question?

[4:08:16] >> I'm saying although they're zoned. So, you know, prior to this, I was

[4:08:20] spending some time looking real hard at

[4:08:22] the at the schematics of of, you know,

[4:08:24] the the the property sizes. It appeared

[4:08:27] to me, although it's R2, a lot of these

[4:08:30] properties are much larger than the

[4:08:32] minimum for an R2.

[4:08:34] >> Mr. Becker, if I could, I' I've been

[4:08:35] here a while.

[4:08:37] >> Uh, I've looked at probably

[4:08:42] 300 subdivision plats in my career,

[4:08:44] minimum.

[4:08:45] So, those lots, that's Shephard Road. If

[4:08:48] you look at the yellow there, and then

[4:08:50] uh you kind of see the curve where the

[4:08:52] lots sort of uh they sort of line up,

[4:08:55] they don't line up there. You can kind

[4:08:56] of see Shephard there. And you see the

[4:08:58] frontage there. Those lots to the south

[4:09:01] there. Those are approximately with the

[4:09:03] exception of that one weird shaped lot.

[4:09:05] You guys see it? There's two larger lots

[4:09:08] and then kind of a

[4:09:10] >> I don't even know.

[4:09:10] >> So, put put your put your mouse on the

[4:09:12] curve there.

[4:09:12] >> Yeah. So, those are probably those two

[4:09:15] lots there next to it are probably

[4:09:17] somewhere between a third of an acre and

[4:09:18] a half an acre. And then that weird

[4:09:20] little you see that one that looks sort

[4:09:22] of squareish with the corner cut off of

[4:09:25] it. That might be a little over between

[4:09:28] a quarter and a third. And then those

[4:09:30] lots along the frontage to the south,

[4:09:31] those are quarteracre lots. Those are R1

[4:09:33] lots. The lots in Blackberry and all

[4:09:35] that, those are are R2 lots. I'm sorry.

[4:09:37] We got We've talked R1, R2, R4. I'm are

[4:09:41] I'm

[4:09:41] >> all the ones there on the curve are are

[4:09:43] R2 which are quarteracre lots.

[4:09:45] >> Yeah, those small lots on the bottom of

[4:09:46] the picture there on the bottom right.

[4:09:48] Those are quarteracre lots.

[4:09:51] >> You don't see it very clearly.

[4:09:53] >> I I feel like the maybe I'm wrong. I

[4:09:54] feel like the question was about how

[4:09:56] many houses per acre.

[4:09:58] >> Yeah, it's four R2 is four units an

[4:10:00] acre. And he asked what size are the

[4:10:02] lots on Shepard? And I think the answer

[4:10:04] is it's all over the map. You have large

[4:10:06] lots, you have small lots. Yeah. In this

[4:10:09] particular area, you have some you have

[4:10:10] some quarter acre lots, and then

[4:10:12] literally across the street got two and

[4:10:14] three acre parcels.

[4:10:15] >> And I think that's what I was looking

[4:10:16] for. It's all over the map.

[4:10:17] >> Yeah.

[4:10:18] >> All right.

[4:10:19] >> Above the minimum.

[4:10:21] >> Yeah. Mr.

[4:10:22] >> Because they're building above the

[4:10:23] minimum.

[4:10:23] >> Yeah.

[4:10:23] >> Uh Mr. Look, any questions for Mr. M?

[4:10:26] >> No.

[4:10:26] >> I I'll tell I'll say this to you and I I should have probably said this the

[4:10:29] previous one, but it didn't come up. You brought up uh West Claremont

[4:10:32] schools. Y'all can bring up West

[4:10:33] Claremont schools. We however are not

[4:10:36] allowed to. Now in our brain we can

[4:10:37] think whatever we want but we cannot

[4:10:41] speak about making a decision based off

[4:10:44] anything and take the schools into

[4:10:46] account that's out of our purview. We're

[4:10:47] not allowed to. So we might think it.

[4:10:50] Yeah.

[4:10:50] >> And but but regardless we cannot talk

[4:10:52] about oh overcrowding the schools

[4:10:53] therefore I'm going to vote no. I just

[4:10:54] broke the rules and I can't do that.

[4:10:56] Just just so you know. So you all can

[4:10:58] but we cannot. So for what it's worth.

[4:11:00] So Mr. Burch good job. Appreciate you

[4:11:03] very much. Yeah. Thank you. And then uh

[4:11:04] hey uh Mr. Taylor, will you take note

[4:11:06] that Shephard uh he's saying it's too

[4:11:08] narrow. Uh if we could somehow put that

[4:11:10] in the budget in the future. I don't

[4:11:12] know what when, but in the future. Also

[4:11:14] snow plows as well. Have you heard that?

[4:11:15] Just saying, "Hey, the street doesn't

[4:11:17] get as plowed as much as it should." I

[4:11:18] don't know. I don't live on Shepard, but

[4:11:20] still just uh just just check it out.

[4:11:22] >> All good. Thank you, Mr. B. Appreciate

[4:11:23] you.

[4:11:24] >> Okay. Is there anyone else that is an

[4:11:26] opponent of this case that's against

[4:11:27] this case that like to talk? Yes, miss.

[4:11:28] I saw you first and then sir, I saw you

[4:11:30] getting ready to get up. I'll call you

[4:11:31] on next. But no, Miss Come on up. You're

[4:11:33] first.

[4:11:38] All right. Oh, very nice of you, Mr.

[4:11:40] Campbell. Appreciate that. All right.

[4:11:42] Let me swear you in.

[4:11:46] Okay. Do you swear to tell the truth,

[4:11:47] the whole truth, and but the truth of be

[4:11:49] God?

[4:11:49] >> I do.

[4:11:49] >> Great. Floor is yours, Mr. Name and

[4:11:51] address for the record.

[4:11:52] >> Um, my name is Tanya uh Buts Hamilton. I

[4:11:55] live at 4733 Shepard Road. And um I a

[4:12:01] lot of my questions were already

[4:12:02] answered just listening to what other

[4:12:04] people said and what your response was

[4:12:06] to it. Um but first let me say I'm not

[4:12:10] opposed to development there. I'm just

[4:12:12] opposed to the R for development there.

[4:12:17] Um one of the problems I found when I

[4:12:19] went to the zoning meeting is they tried

[4:12:21] to tell us that their rationale be

[4:12:25] behind it being

[4:12:28] acceptable to go to R4 was that the the

[4:12:32] population density would be the same as

[4:12:34] if it was developed as R2. They tried to

[4:12:38] say that 20 houses would go in on R2 or

[4:12:41] could. And I said, you know, I I I

[4:12:44] actually wrote a letter to each of the uh trustees. I don't know if you got

[4:12:49] them, but I said, you know, just suppose

[4:12:51] I'm a developer.

[4:12:53] I would also have to allow access road

[4:12:56] and a drainage right I said so I try to

[4:12:59] say that at most they're probably going

[4:13:01] to get 12 houses in maybe depending on

[4:13:04] upon the configuration of that lot maybe

[4:13:06] even as low as 10 so the argument that

[4:13:08] they gave us that that 18 was better

[4:13:11] than 20 actually is more in our favor

[4:13:15] that 18 isn't as good as 10 you know so

[4:13:19] and I do my lot is two acres the uh the

[4:13:22] lady who lives behind me, uh, hers is

[4:13:25] 12.43

[4:13:27] acres and that butts up against the

[4:13:31] Cincinnati Nature Center. One of my

[4:13:34] greatest concerns was the decision

[4:13:37] decisions that you make on this lot, how

[4:13:39] is that going to affect all the other

[4:13:41] green spaces and developments back

[4:13:43] sheepard in the future? Now I know that

[4:13:46] doesn't set a precedence because you

[4:13:48] have to take each lot into consideration

[4:13:50] on its own merits or its own what topog

[4:13:53] you know um but if you allow this R4 to

[4:13:59] go into place it's got to make

[4:14:01] somebody's argument easier in the future

[4:14:04] for saying well you've done it before

[4:14:05] you did it up here look at the number

[4:14:07] just like you were asking how big are

[4:14:09] the existing lots well somebody's going

[4:14:11] to say how big are the existing lots I'm

[4:14:13] one of the people that actually brought this to the attention of the

[4:14:16] Cincinnati Nature Center and they seemed

[4:14:18] to be quite interested in it and um I

[4:14:21] used to know Bob TR and he had told me a

[4:14:23] story about one acre of land that his

[4:14:26] client had that was undevelopable he

[4:14:29] said and they wanted him to approach the

[4:14:31] nature center and see if they were

[4:14:33] interested purchasing it and he said oh

[4:14:35] I didn't think they would be interested

[4:14:37] but they were he says anything that that

[4:14:39] prevents future development helps to

[4:14:42] prevent future groundwater contamination

[4:14:44] and maintain their ecosystem. Now, are

[4:14:47] where we're at there, we are right on

[4:14:49] the nature center. So, the things that

[4:14:51] you do here, might they influence things

[4:14:54] in the future? And you know, my dad

[4:14:56] played at the nature center when he was

[4:14:57] a kid. We're talking 70ome years ago.

[4:14:59] So, 50 years from now is not

[4:15:01] inconceivable. And you would hate to say

[4:15:03] 50 years from now, boy, I wish we

[4:15:05] wouldn't have allowed this much

[4:15:06] development to go in around the nature

[4:15:08] center, you know, but it's not too late

[4:15:10] to make that decision now. Now, some of

[4:15:13] those lots are actually almost a tenth

[4:15:15] of an acre. You know, you also have the

[4:15:18] uh uh Shephard Wood, I believe is the

[4:15:21] name of the subdivision that is just

[4:15:23] beyond it. And those are some pretty

[4:15:26] nice houses that went in back there. Um

[4:15:28] uh that letter I also made sure we

[4:15:30] distributed it to all those people

[4:15:32] because I thought they wouldn't be too

[4:15:34] appreciative to know that a a lower

[4:15:36] income housing may be going in, you

[4:15:38] know, up the street. Now, when I

[4:15:40] initially they told us I had heard that

[4:15:43] it was going to be like 260,000

[4:15:45] was going to be the approximate value of

[4:15:47] those houses that were going in. And um

[4:15:50] luckily I got to speak with Tyler Gibbs

[4:15:52] at the break we had which he real nice

[4:15:55] guy. Um and I'm not again I'm not

[4:15:58] opposed to development and I'm not

[4:15:59] opposed to him being successful. From

[4:16:01] what I understand, his purchase of that

[4:16:04] property, and I can't swear to this

[4:16:06] because I haven't seen the contract, is

[4:16:08] contingent upon the changing of the

[4:16:10] zoning. There's also other offers on

[4:16:13] this property to the owner, seller of

[4:16:16] that property, which would then clean up

[4:16:18] that house that's there. So, that isn't

[4:16:20] Yeah. shouldn't sway one way or another.

[4:16:23] Um, so if he were not to if you were not

[4:16:27] to change the zoning, he isn't out

[4:16:29] anything. he's just got to look for

[4:16:30] another property that's going to meet

[4:16:32] the criteria and the zoning of whatever

[4:16:34] he wishes to make the profit margin that

[4:16:37] they'd like to on. Um now then I heard

[4:16:40] earlier they were saying for $300 to

[4:16:42] $500,000 homes. Who's going to buy a

[4:16:45] $500,000

[4:16:47] home on a 10th acre lot on Shephard

[4:16:49] Road? I think that was uh yeah, somebody

[4:16:52] that doesn't sound accurate to me. Um

[4:16:55] and so

[4:16:59] you know I also question the

[4:17:00] infrastructure on that road you know not

[4:17:03] just the how wide it is because it is

[4:17:05] narrow um is we have had so much repair

[4:17:09] of the water sewer lines constantly

[4:17:12] redigging up there because it's all old

[4:17:14] you know and so you're adding more

[4:17:17] development into it and and because

[4:17:20] we've already called them like five

[4:17:21] times to come out with a sewage leakage

[4:17:23] that they've redone dug up right in

[4:17:25] front of my house. You I'm all the way

[4:17:27] back around the corner. If you go there

[4:17:28] on the the pretty blue house on the the

[4:17:30] left hand side and that was my

[4:17:33] grandfather's house. I've lived there,

[4:17:34] caught the bus there my entire life. And one older gentleman here had said

[4:17:41] something about they put, you know, they

[4:17:44] zoned it for a reason. Who decides that

[4:17:47] now we don't want to maintain the

[4:17:49] zoning? Um, and I understand developing

[4:17:53] [clears throat] and but it's it's zoned,

[4:17:58] you know, I don't see the benefit of of

[4:18:00] going to R4, you know, other than it

[4:18:03] benefiting the developer that he's going

[4:18:04] to make the profit margin that he's

[4:18:06] looking for. It's certainly not develop,

[4:18:08] you know, helping me, my family. Uh, you

[4:18:11] know, if it I just put an $80,000 room

[4:18:13] addition on my house back there and

[4:18:16] it's, you know, my kids are going to

[4:18:17] inherit this, my grandkids, and yeah,

[4:18:20] this affects the future. So, um I I know

[4:18:24] that and I can't say that, but that that

[4:18:29] particular company in question that was

[4:18:31] buying this also worked with the Chamber

[4:18:34] of Commerce on a lot of different

[4:18:35] projects. He even helped on developing

[4:18:37] their offices. There's on his website

[4:18:39] the Chamber of Commerce is saying,

[4:18:41] "Thank you for helping us, you know,

[4:18:42] with the developing of." So, it just

[4:18:44] makes you wonder, you know, does he know

[4:18:48] somebody so he's got a better chance to

[4:18:49] get this to persuade you that way. I

[4:18:53] certainly hope not, you know. Um, and

[4:18:56] then also, um, oh, there was one other

[4:19:00] thing I was going to the the property

[4:19:02] values, you know, if they go in, it's

[4:19:05] going to affect all of us, uh, over the

[4:19:07] next 10 years, 20 years, 30 years. Um

[4:19:14] and um oh and and just one other little

[4:19:17] comment that I wanted to make about how

[4:19:19] we all got notified about this and uh if

[4:19:23] it wouldn't have been somebody coming

[4:19:24] around and trying to sign a petition

[4:19:27] because there was 125 names on it and um

[4:19:32] I wouldn't have known about it and and

[4:19:35] they did stay within their guidelines

[4:19:38] that they had to notify the people that

[4:19:40] were adjacent and across the street and

[4:19:42] whatever. But I also found out that

[4:19:44] Kevin Syler got a letter and he lives

[4:19:46] down even further down the road than I

[4:19:48] did. So, how is it that he got a letter

[4:19:50] of notification, but I didn't? Are you

[4:19:52] picking and choosing who you're giving

[4:19:53] them to? I mean, that kind of lends

[4:19:56] itself to think that there's impropriy

[4:19:58] to that. I mean, was it overlooked? Was

[4:20:01] it uh, you know, neglect? Was it got

[4:20:04] lost in the mail? Uh, or is somebody

[4:20:07] doing something that they didn't want

[4:20:09] everybody to get jump on board with

[4:20:10] this? because I think or what I'm saying

[4:20:13] is in the future I think that if it's

[4:20:15] going to affect everyone on that street, should have

[4:20:18] received notification and they did not.

[4:20:21] So, and so that means I think that not

[4:20:25] just this one, any other one. Is there a

[4:20:27] way to change that so that if it, you

[4:20:29] know, everybody that lives on that

[4:20:30] residential street if there's zoning on

[4:20:32] it being changed, I think everybody on

[4:20:34] that residential [clears throat] street

[4:20:35] should receive.

[4:20:35] >> We hear you on that.

[4:20:36] >> That's my recommendation for future.

[4:20:38] That was that was one thing this board

[4:20:40] was able to take initial action on um

[4:20:43] was exactly that concept because it it

[4:20:46] did used to just be the adjacent

[4:20:47] property and we

[4:20:48] >> we pushed for it to be widely expanded.

[4:20:52] >> Yes.

[4:20:52] >> Uh so that people do receive letters and

[4:20:55] that signage goes out. There should be

[4:20:57] the postings that are out.

[4:20:59] >> Um and so that I mean that's that's

[4:21:02] tough when you start to say how far do

[4:21:04] you go? Is it two miles radius? Is it

[4:21:06] you know quarter mile? We had that

[4:21:08] discussion literally dead in road in

[4:21:11] Claremont County or Union Township. One

[4:21:13] of our friends is a postman. He was

[4:21:15] telling me that

[4:21:16] >> we end up doing that. We end, you know,

[4:21:18] we end up saying here it is, you know,

[4:21:19] shepherd and and then we turn around at

[4:21:22] Kluff Pike and and everyone at Clike

[4:21:24] says I didn't get a letter like well

[4:21:27] Pike's this long.

[4:21:28] >> I hadn't considered that. But

[4:21:29] >> so I I appreciate I just it just upset

[4:21:32] me. No, thank you so much. you know, and again, the the lady behind me is

[4:21:36] getting ready to sell her property. It's

[4:21:38] 12.4 acres within this next six to nine

[4:21:41] months,

[4:21:42] >> and whatever happens back here, could

[4:21:44] that influence how much could happen

[4:21:46] behind me coming up in the not too

[4:21:48] distant future. Yeah.

[4:21:49] >> So, I've already contacted the nature

[4:21:51] center. I think they're interested in

[4:21:52] purchasing that, though. So, um and it

[4:21:55] was because of all of this that it

[4:21:56] brought it to my attention that I

[4:21:58] started to get concern. Yeah. So, um,

[4:22:00] beyond that, I don't think I have

[4:22:01] anything else.

[4:22:03] >> Thank you, Mr. Beer.

[4:22:05] >> Oh, yeah. So, Mr. Flouty,

[4:22:07] >> can you comment on the letters that went

[4:22:09] out like how many residents or how far a

[4:22:12] radius from the from the property?

[4:22:15] >> So, we have a list and in the

[4:22:17] >> if it's based on radius, somebody behind

[4:22:19] me got one, even further down got one.

[4:22:21] >> We can see the radius of 200 feet around

[4:22:25] the property and that's who the letters

[4:22:27] were sent to. 200 feet around the

[4:22:29] property.

[4:22:30] >> Yes.

[4:22:31] >> Why would Mr. Syler not

[4:22:32] >> That's what we decided on.

[4:22:34] >> Yeah. That's Mr. Becker. That's that was per our decision to expand it

[4:22:39] because it previously was just the next

[4:22:41] door neighbor.

[4:22:42] >> I remember that

[4:22:42] >> and we wanted to be like the P person

[4:22:44] across the street and we're like we had

[4:22:46] that discussion this exact discussion

[4:22:48] like it's going to be difficult because

[4:22:50] >> we expanded from the original.

[4:22:52] >> Yeah.

[4:22:52] >> But Jason only remember

[4:22:54] >> someone's always going to feel like they

[4:22:55] missed a letter.

[4:22:57] >> Okay. Thank you, Mr. Fl.

[4:22:59] >> That's all I have. Chairman,

[4:23:00] >> did you have anything for

[4:23:02] >> No, I I do appreciate that. Thank you.

[4:23:04] >> Thank you, miss. Appreciate you very

[4:23:06] much.

[4:23:07] >> Yeah. Okay. Is there anyone else that's

[4:23:08] I said I was going to call you next,

[4:23:09] sir? So, please. Yeah. No, I'm right

[4:23:11] here in the front. Red shirt. Yes, sir.

[4:23:13] Okay. Come on up.

[4:23:15] >> Um, perfect.

[4:23:18] >> Okay. And then, uh, Oh, you got your

[4:23:19] card. Perfect. Yeah, Mr. M's fine.

[4:23:23] Perfect. Thank you, sir. Thank you. Yes.

[4:23:25] Okay. All

[4:23:28] right, let me go and swear you in. Uh,

[4:23:30] you want to raise your right hand and do

[4:23:31] you swear to tell the truth, the whole

[4:23:32] truth, but they both know the truth. So

[4:23:34] you got

[4:23:34] >> I do. Then name and address for the

[4:23:36] record, sir.

[4:23:36] >> My name is Jeffrey Bond. I live at 4634

[4:23:40] Sheepard Roadia,

[4:23:42] obviously.

[4:23:47] Good.

[4:23:48] >> Now,

[4:23:50] I raised zoning

[4:23:53] at the zoning meeting. I raised several

[4:23:55] concerns of mine and some of those have

[4:24:00] even changed more.

[4:24:03] The traffic,

[4:24:05] that's one. And we're not talking about

[4:24:10] 36 cars.

[4:24:13] If I had four sons and each one had a

[4:24:16] car and my wife had a car and I had a

[4:24:19] car. Okay, that's six times 18,

[4:24:26] not two.

[4:24:28] That's one. I drive down Shepard Road

[4:24:31] every day. And it is narrow. And yes,

[4:24:35] you do have to slow down. You do have to

[4:24:37] move over. You're going to add another

[4:24:39] 60 cars to this.

[4:24:43] That's one concern.

[4:24:48] Someone raised the point that the

[4:24:51] signatures that were gathered

[4:24:54] was a ploy by a possible purchaser. I

[4:24:59] disagree with that.

[4:25:01] Mr. Crocker's daughter and his son live

[4:25:05] adjacent to me.

[4:25:08] Why wouldn't he be concerned

[4:25:11] about this development?

[4:25:15] I would be if they were my children. and

[4:25:18] grandchildren. We have all kinds of

[4:25:23] pedestrian traffic.

[4:25:26] So now we have another concern.

[4:25:29] And it's 35 miles an hour on a deadend

[4:25:32] street.

[4:25:35] They seldom drive 35. I guarantee you

[4:25:38] that. I back into my driveway to make

[4:25:41] sure I don't get hit.

[4:25:46] Now, we'll talk about my newest concern.

[4:25:48] I came up to the zoning and they were

[4:25:53] gracious enough to print out

[4:25:57] something that I hadn't been made aware

[4:26:00] of at the zoning meeting. If I can

[4:26:05] approach you for just a moment.

[4:26:06] >> Sure. Yeah.

[4:26:09] >> They printed this out for me

[4:26:12] and it has

[4:26:14] all the addresses on it. And

[4:26:15] unfortunately, I only have one copy, but

[4:26:19] my address is 4634.

[4:26:22] And you will see that

[4:26:26] this is my property.

[4:26:28] Along my property line is a drainage

[4:26:32] ditch creek.

[4:26:35] It starts here. This is

[4:26:38] Cindy's property, Mr. Crawford's

[4:26:42] daughter.

[4:26:45] That drainage creek

[4:26:48] drains

[4:26:50] everything

[4:26:53] » all of this.

[4:26:54] >> All of the development over here. All

[4:26:56] the development over there

[4:26:58] >> flows into this creek.

[4:27:00] >> Go north.

[4:27:03] >> That was a question. Does it go north?

[4:27:04] >> Where does it go from there?

[4:27:05] >> It goes back into the junkyard.

[4:27:09] >> Is that north? Okay. Yes, it flows

[4:27:11] north.

[4:27:12] Now

[4:27:15] >> on Friday, oh at my own expense,

[4:27:20] >> because it was narrow,

[4:27:23] I had it expanded

[4:27:25] >> to slow the flow down.

[4:27:31] » And again, I'm sorry I only have

[4:27:34] >> these few pictures.

[4:27:35] >> Yeah, I can imagine.

[4:27:37] >> Friday last we had an unusual amount of

[4:27:40] rain. I know you guys will all agree

[4:27:42] with that.

[4:27:44] So now

[4:27:47] you don't see the creek

[4:27:49] >> because it is flooded. It has flooded my

[4:27:52] neighbor's yard. It flooded part of my

[4:27:55] yard. Even though I expanded this just

[4:27:58] so we could slow the flow down. What was

[4:28:00] this picture taken?

[4:28:02] >> Friday last.

[4:28:03] >> Friday.

[4:28:04] >> Remember we had like three inches of

[4:28:05] rain in an hour and a half or whatever.

[4:28:08] >> I've got this I've got this storm drain.

[4:28:11] And I will not argue that we have no

[4:28:14] storm drains on Shepherd Road.

[4:28:16] >> It's every everything in my neighborhood

[4:28:17] comes into mine and it shoots up into

[4:28:20] the air.

[4:28:20] >> Yeah. Well, it comes up in my basement a

[4:28:22] little bit sometimes, too, because

[4:28:25] >> everything drains in it. There's

[4:28:26] >> exciting.

[4:28:27] >> Oh, it's insane. So now it's you're

[4:28:29] going to add 18 more houses that are

[4:28:32] going to drain into my creek

[4:28:34] according to

[4:28:38] your zoning drawing.

[4:28:41] >> Your house is where?

[4:28:43] >> My house

[4:28:45] is right here.

[4:28:47] >> 4634.

[4:28:49] >> So it runs right there.

[4:28:53] » That's my newest concern. And that's

[4:28:55] because of this.

[4:28:58] the flooding.

[4:28:59] >> Yeah.

[4:29:00] >> That we had and it was an unusual rain.

[4:29:02] But now you're going to add 18 more

[4:29:04] houses, which is 18 more gutters, which

[4:29:06] is 18 more basement drains, etc.

[4:29:10] >> There's no storm storm sewers on

[4:29:12] >> No, there are not.

[4:29:13] >> Shepherd sir,

[4:29:14] >> I did not know that. That's interesting.

[4:29:16] >> No, sir. They're all um either front

[4:29:18] yard drain and in fact when I had my Let

[4:29:22] me go back.

[4:29:24] When I had my driveway laptop,

[4:29:27] the county engineer told me I had to

[4:29:30] slope it so it would drain from the

[4:29:32] street into the creek that runs on the

[4:29:35] property line of my property management.

[4:29:40] >> My other concern is the actual community

[4:29:43] that we live in.

[4:29:48] The vast majority of the houses on

[4:29:51] Shephard Road have halfacre lots.

[4:29:56] Not necessarily all. Some are larger,

[4:29:59] very few are smaller.

[4:30:02] So now we're going to put in housing on

[4:30:05] 8th acre lots.

[4:30:09] So this is not going to fit in this

[4:30:12] community. It won't look right.

[4:30:17] It removes a lot of the privacy of

[4:30:20] several of my neighbors.

[4:30:23] They talk about expanding green space by

[4:30:25] making it R4.

[4:30:27] That's a wonderful concept

[4:30:30] except that that's already

[4:30:33] green space. And yes, I'd want it to be

[4:30:35] developed, but not 18 houses.

[4:30:39] Nine or 10 houses

[4:30:42] would fit really nice. they would be

[4:30:46] able to save a fair amount of the

[4:30:48] existing old forest that's there

[4:30:54] and still have development.

[4:30:56] I'm not against the development at all.

[4:30:59] I'm against the scale of the

[4:31:01] development. And like I said, my newest

[4:31:03] concern is the drainage on my property.

[4:31:09] That's about all. Oh, one more thing.

[4:31:12] These poor gentlemen here, they put the

[4:31:16] development that they want. How are they

[4:31:18] going to get in there to put out a fire

[4:31:20] that has a house that's five feet next

[4:31:22] to it? You're going to put three

[4:31:25] firefighters and a ladder in between

[4:31:28] there and drag the hose in? I don't

[4:31:31] think so.

[4:31:33] I don't think that would work at all.

[4:31:35] And I don't believe the fire chief would

[4:31:38] force those poor guys in there unless he

[4:31:40] had no choice.

[4:31:42] with the resoning that's being proposed,

[4:31:44] he would have no choice.

[4:31:46] >> Yeah.

[4:31:47] >> Thank you, gentlemen.

[4:31:49] >> Thank you, Mr.

[4:31:52] M. Appreciate it. Thank you.

[4:31:54] >> Is there anyone else that's an opponent

[4:31:56] to this case? Sir, sir, come on up.

[4:31:57] Yeah,

[4:32:00] >> let me go swear you in. Yeah, you got

[4:32:02] it.

[4:32:04] >> I got you. Perfect. You're good.

[4:32:08] All right, sir. And then uh let me go

[4:32:10] and swear you in. Do you swear to tell

[4:32:12] the truth, the whole truth, nothing but

[4:32:13] the truth? So hopey God.

[4:32:14] >> I do.

[4:32:14] >> Great. Where's yours, sir?

[4:32:16] >> My name is Richard Crocker. Live at 4630

[4:32:18] Shepherd Road.

[4:32:19] >> Yeah.

[4:32:20] >> My daughter lives at 4631. My son lives

[4:32:23] at 4632

[4:32:25] and also on 4642.

[4:32:27] That is the salvage yard.

[4:32:30] Uh

[4:32:32] it's just too many houses for a small

[4:32:34] space. I guess my first question is in

[4:32:37] the R2

[4:32:39] quarter acre lots.

[4:32:41] They argued that you could put 20 houses

[4:32:44] on that land.

[4:32:46] We still got to deduct for the black

[4:32:47] top, pension ponds, SIBO area. So now,

[4:32:52] how many houses can they put? They're

[4:32:54] not required to show that because that's

[4:32:56] not his plan.

[4:32:57] >> But I think there's a there's a method.

[4:33:00] It's probably, like they said, nine or

[4:33:02] 10. So if it was quarter acre lot

[4:33:05] houses, you just raise the price a

[4:33:07] little bit.

[4:33:08] he would still get his profit margin.

[4:33:11] Uh at the 18 houses proposed, he's

[4:33:14] probably at a $10 million project. I

[4:33:17] don't know if um got it down to quarter

[4:33:20] acre lots, say 10 houses,

[4:33:24] probably wouldn't be that far off. The

[4:33:26] price got raised a little bit. They

[4:33:27] would still sell. That's what I want. I

[4:33:30] want less houses, more land. The green

[4:33:34] space would be the yards that would

[4:33:36] absorb the water.

[4:33:38] instead of so many gutters, so many

[4:33:39] shank, so many roofs. Uh, yeah, there's

[4:33:43] going to be a storm sewer on that

[4:33:44] property. There's going to be a storm

[4:33:46] sewer and it's going to have pipes going

[4:33:47] to the detention ponds, the water

[4:33:49] holding areas. It's got to go out

[4:33:51] eventually. So, there is going to be a

[4:33:53] water problem. It's just too many houses

[4:33:55] on a small lot. Just too many. It's just

[4:34:00] How would you like to have 18 houses pop

[4:34:02] up in your backyard? And, you know, I

[4:34:04] own the land right next to it. My

[4:34:06] daughter lives there. Yes, she's going

[4:34:08] to request she request him to put up a

[4:34:11] fence if that's if that goes through

[4:34:13] tonight. She's sitting right there. She

[4:34:16] would like to have a fence

[4:34:20] instead of trees.

[4:34:23] She don't want people looking at her.

[4:34:24] She don't want to look at nobody, I

[4:34:25] guess. So, she would like a fence. Um,

[4:34:31] I did go around and get all the

[4:34:32] signatures

[4:34:34] because

[4:34:36] My first thought was when Kevin Sal

[4:34:38] shared the the letter with me, it's too

[4:34:41] many houses. Yeah. And the fire marshall

[4:34:43] should speak, but he won't because he'd

[4:34:45] lose his job. Too close together. One

[4:34:49] cow's catching on fire and they're 12

[4:34:51] feet apart. And I realized it's five

[4:34:54] feet and five. That's 10. But it's

[4:34:56] probably more like six and six. It' be

[4:34:57] 12.

[4:34:59] Burn them all down. How would you get

[4:35:01] there in time? That's one. That's

[4:35:04] another thing. I'm not very good at

[4:35:06] talking places like this, but

[4:35:07] >> that's okay. You're good.

[4:35:09] >> This is just wrong. It's just too many.

[4:35:12] I'm not I'm not against developing. I'm

[4:35:15] against overdeveloping. And this is a

[4:35:17] prime case of overdeveloping. It's just

[4:35:20] too many.

[4:35:23] Yeah, I'm happy that they've got it

[4:35:24] sold.

[4:35:26] No big deal. Did I make an offer on it?

[4:35:29] I did. Didn't get it. I'm good. I'm not

[4:35:32] mad about that.

[4:35:35] It's too many houses. It's too many.

[4:35:38] >> There should be an amendment, an

[4:35:40] adjustment. And how can I force them to

[4:35:43] show the the drawing? You know, you

[4:35:45] can't put 20 houses there. It ain't like

[4:35:47] if you had 20 quarter acre lots parallel

[4:35:50] with the street.

[4:35:52] That'd be five acres. And everybody

[4:35:55] entered Shepherd from sheep from

[4:35:57] Shepherd Road to their house. That would

[4:35:59] be what you're trying to say. 20 houses

[4:36:02] on five acres quarter acre at a time.

[4:36:05] If you deduct for the streets, deduct

[4:36:07] for all the other things, you're going

[4:36:09] to get 20 houses in there on R2. It's

[4:36:11] going to be more like 10.

[4:36:14] So that's this is an upgrade. This is

[4:36:17] not a downgrade from 20 to 18. This is

[4:36:21] not a downgrade. We are not getting uh a

[4:36:24] bone thrown to us here. We're not

[4:36:26] getting something special. It's an

[4:36:28] upgrade.

[4:36:30] I realize they got to make a profit. I

[4:36:32] realize they got to make money. If you

[4:36:34] spend money, you deserve to make money.

[4:36:35] Not not not mad about that. That's all

[4:36:38] good.

[4:36:39] But it's just too many houses for for

[4:36:42] where it's going. And it's a dead end

[4:36:44] street. It's one way in, one way out. Uh

[4:36:47] I drive a big truck up down that road

[4:36:48] every day. Every day. A Mac truck. I get

[4:36:52] over and stop for people. I wave. I

[4:36:55] thank them. You know what I mean? For

[4:36:56] giving me space. Shepherd Road is a real

[4:37:00] weird entrance and exit. There's trees.

[4:37:04] There's telephone poles at the bright at

[4:37:05] the corner. I've touched them many times

[4:37:07] with semi trailers. Okay. It's just

[4:37:10] tight. It's It's just wrong to keep

[4:37:13] adding more housing and that many.

[4:37:17] And eventually there's like Elmer

[4:37:19] Griggsby owns 35 acres.

[4:37:22] He's 93 years old. I mean, my place

[4:37:25] ain't never going to get developed.

[4:37:26] Who'd want that?

[4:37:28] >> You know, who'd want that? It ain't

[4:37:30] never going to get developed. It's only

[4:37:32] got a 20 foot entry by about 150, 200

[4:37:34] feet and it's 8 and a half acres back

[4:37:36] there. But who'd want to develop that?

[4:37:38] Nobody. So, I know that my son's taking

[4:37:40] it when I'm gone. I'm good with that.

[4:37:44] It's just It's just too many for the

[4:37:46] spot. So, keep it. Please keep it R2. It

[4:37:50] will adjust. He'll still make money. It

[4:37:53] will adjust. what is the exact number of

[4:37:55] houses when he redraws it and and you

[4:37:58] know he's drawn it three or four

[4:38:00] different ways when he looked at it to

[4:38:03] buy it for R2 he draw it wasn't enough

[4:38:07] housing and money profit margin if you

[4:38:10] keep it R2 he'll redraw it price might

[4:38:13] be a little more because it's a little

[4:38:14] bit more lands

[4:38:17] houses more land the grass will soak it

[4:38:19] up and it'll be more green the the

[4:38:23] perimeter will be the They'll put the

[4:38:24] pine trees up and the three-foot little

[4:38:27] grassy areas. It'll be less houses

[4:38:32] make it

[4:38:35] maker. Any questions?

[4:38:36] >> I I do actually for Mr. Flouty. So, but

[4:38:40] first off, I want to correct myself that

[4:38:42] water is flowing east. I said north. So,

[4:38:45] my apologies on that. Mr. FL those

[4:38:48] detention ponds.

[4:38:50] >> Mhm.

[4:38:50] >> Where does the water go? If there's no

[4:38:52] storm sores along Shepard, where does

[4:38:55] water where does the storm water drain

[4:38:56] to?

[4:38:57] >> Yeah. So there's design calculations put

[4:39:00] into place. And one of the reasons why

[4:39:02] you see three well so there's two

[4:39:05] detention, one retention. It's because

[4:39:08] the site is very flat. So they're having

[4:39:10] to capture the water and bring it and

[4:39:12] hold it. And then it slowly gets

[4:39:14] released to the level to where it

[4:39:18] doesn't affect the surrounding

[4:39:20] properties. There's storm water

[4:39:22] calculations done

[4:39:24] >> that

[4:39:26] they capture the flow on this site and

[4:39:30] >> one of them is like a spillway. One of

[4:39:32] them would be like a spillway

[4:39:34] >> that gets filled up. the pipe of juice.

[4:39:37] >> Uh the the two are grass

[4:39:39] >> so they you know fill up they'll slowly

[4:39:42] release and then the other ones

[4:39:43] >> understand

[4:39:44] >> I understand that we all understand

[4:39:46] that.

[4:39:48] >> Okay. Thank you. That's all I have

[4:39:50] chairman. And the the thing that Jeff

[4:39:52] brought up about the the water now

[4:39:54] running from the flatter area of the

[4:39:56] land

[4:39:57] >> towards the ditch next to my daughter

[4:40:01] >> and then uh if you're standing in front

[4:40:03] of my daughter's house it' be left. I

[4:40:05] guess that would be north. I'm confused

[4:40:07] on that. This guy is

[4:40:09] >> that pipe that goes underneath Sheepard

[4:40:12] Road.

[4:40:13] >> The Leon and Glenn Bishop had worked on

[4:40:15] that catch face because that was

[4:40:17] originally Bishop property back in the

[4:40:20] 60s.

[4:40:22] >> They had worked on that catch phase. I

[4:40:24] remember talking to them when they did

[4:40:26] that and Glenn that was their

[4:40:28] [clears throat] brother. Okay. It does

[4:40:31] leave there, crosses Shepard Road, goes

[4:40:33] between Jeff's house and I used to call

[4:40:35] it the house and goes down between

[4:40:38] those two houses. Then it goes

[4:40:40] underneath the junkyard driveway and

[4:40:42] runs down on the left side of the

[4:40:44] junkyard towards an acres center. It's

[4:40:47] been that way. My family's been on this

[4:40:49] street for 95 years. Been that way

[4:40:51] forever and it works. Does it get a

[4:40:54] little backed up once in a while? That's

[4:40:56] what you scream, but it does. So that's

[4:40:58] been there forever.

[4:41:01] Is it going to overflow that? Yeah, it's

[4:41:03] possible.

[4:41:05] It's very possible because we all

[4:41:07] understand what gutter water, shingle

[4:41:10] water, house water, concrete water,

[4:41:12] black top water moves fast. It moves

[4:41:15] quick. It don't saturate into the

[4:41:16] ground. Everybody understands that. So,

[4:41:20] I ask you please keep it R2.

[4:41:23] if he if he still wants to pursue a a

[4:41:26] building project, a um you know, a

[4:41:29] subdivision project, he will he'll

[4:41:32] adjust it. He'll raise the price a

[4:41:35] little bit. It'll still work. Now, is he

[4:41:37] allowed to call it a subdivision then? I

[4:41:39] don't know that answer. That'd be on

[4:41:40] you. Is he allowed to have an HOA an HOA

[4:41:43] then?

[4:41:44] >> I don't know that answer. That's on

[4:41:46] >> and I realize that's what he's after.

[4:41:48] >> Okay.

[4:41:50] >> Mr. Crocker, I'm curious.

[4:41:52] I'm sorry, Mr. Lug. Do you have any

[4:41:54] questions for Mr. Crux?

[4:41:56] >> No, I'm good. Thank you, Mr. Cer. You

[4:41:57] put an offer in. Um, have you thought

[4:42:00] about matching or beating whatever Mr.

[4:42:04] >> When I did put the offer in the the

[4:42:06] second offer I did put in with my

[4:42:08] realtor,

[4:42:10] um,

[4:42:12] they said it was rejected and they had a

[4:42:14] they were under contract at that time.

[4:42:17] So, and we waited, never heard nothing

[4:42:19] back and it was fine. I'm not mad about

[4:42:22] that. I'm really not.

[4:42:24] >> Um

[4:42:25] >> I'm just cur curious if you ever want to

[4:42:27] go higher than what Mr. Gibbs is

[4:42:28] offering and buy the land yourself.

[4:42:30] >> Wow,

[4:42:33] that's a good question.

[4:42:37] » I'm sure he's he's got some expenses

[4:42:38] now.

[4:42:39] >> I I don't think the owners really care.

[4:42:41] They just want to sell it and make as

[4:42:42] much money as they can. So,

[4:42:43] >> well, I feel some animosity from from

[4:42:46] David here. I feel some animosity from

[4:42:48] him throwing me under the bus every time

[4:42:51] to come to a meeting like this. I am not

[4:42:53] mad no more that I

[4:42:54] >> No, it's interesting. My my question

[4:42:56] though is is is I that I'll let you two

[4:42:58] work out your all

[4:42:59] >> Yeah. Would I still be interested? Well,

[4:43:00] yes, I would. And what would I do with

[4:43:02] the place? I'll tell you. I would

[4:43:04] renovate the old house.

[4:43:06] >> Put 30, 40,000 in it. I'd fix it up.

[4:43:10] It's fixable. Anything's fixable.

[4:43:12] >> Sure.

[4:43:12] >> I'd put somebody in within the family.

[4:43:14] >> I would make a large green space toward

[4:43:16] my daughter's house. I would mow that

[4:43:18] every week. I would leave the back trees

[4:43:21] border to Willoughbrook. Um, and I'd pay

[4:43:24] taxes on a on almost a 5 acre place the

[4:43:28] rest of my life.

[4:43:29] >> Yeah,

[4:43:29] >> that's what I'd do with it.

[4:43:30] >> Fair enough.

[4:43:31] >> I mean, there was a there was a thought

[4:43:32] years ago when I first talked to Irma

[4:43:34] about buying it. I wanted to build a

[4:43:36] house next to my daughter's house in

[4:43:39] between the two and and have just one

[4:43:42] house there and maybe somebody else in

[4:43:44] my family would get my house. I I that

[4:43:47] was just a thought,

[4:43:48] >> but that thought's changed. You know

[4:43:50] what I mean? I've had a lot of different

[4:43:52] things happen in my life since then.

[4:43:53] >> Yeah. Understand?

[4:43:54] >> Could I afford to buy it? Absolutely.

[4:43:57] That ain't the problem.

[4:43:59] >> Yeah.

[4:43:59] >> That ain't the problem. And they know

[4:44:00] that.

[4:44:01] >> Okay.

[4:44:02] >> And I'm happy that the man's bought it

[4:44:03] and he's going to develop it. I'm good

[4:44:05] with that. It's just too many houses for

[4:44:08] that little spot. It's 4.7. I mean, I

[4:44:10] can't even understand how you can have a

[4:44:12] subdivision on that tiny of a spot.

[4:44:15] other there should be a guidelines for

[4:44:18] against that. You should have 30 acres

[4:44:21] with 50 houses to call it a subdivision.

[4:44:24] That's just me thinking out of the box.

[4:44:26] >> Appreciate you, Mr. Crocker. Thank you

[4:44:28] very much. Yeah. Thank you, sir.

[4:44:30] >> Think we're okay. Yeah. Thank you, sir.

[4:44:31] Thank you.

[4:44:32] >> Is there anyone else that's an opponent

[4:44:33] of this case?

[4:44:35] >> Okay. See, one more. Please go ahead.

[4:44:37] Yeah.

[4:44:45] Democracy is not clean.

[4:44:53] » I had no idea that this meeting Oh, I'm

[4:44:55] sorry. Swear me.

[4:44:56] >> I'm tired.

[4:44:56] >> I swear to tell the truth, the whole

[4:44:58] truth. Nothing about the truth. Help

[4:44:58] you.

[4:44:59] >> You bet. I will.

[4:45:00] >> Go ahead. State your name.

[4:45:01] >> So, uh, I had no idea this meeting was

[4:45:04] going to go this long and I didn't bring

[4:45:06] my back medicine, so I am in pain, but

[4:45:08] that's okay. It's important.

[4:45:10] >> Yes, ma'am. Um, my name is Deb Bond or

[4:45:13] Debbie Bond. Uh, I'm the wife of Mr.

[4:45:15] Jeff. Uh, I live at 4634 Shepard Road in

[4:45:20] Betavia. And we are the house that's

[4:45:23] across the street from Cindy's and and

[4:45:26] uh and Dan's. Dan has the one and then

[4:45:29] Cindy's next to that. And we're across

[4:45:30] the street and we're the one that has

[4:45:32] the creek as well.

[4:45:34] >> It's not really a creek. It's a drainage

[4:45:35] ditch, but I'm going to talk about that

[4:45:37] here in a minute.

[4:45:39] Um,

[4:45:41] one thing we've been there about 10

[4:45:43] years and a couple things that I really

[4:45:45] liked about living on Shepard Road is

[4:45:48] that it's it feels very rural. You know,

[4:45:51] there's there's houses we have a half an

[4:45:53] acre. Uh, our house was built in 1949,

[4:45:56] so apparently it's not zoned at all.

[4:45:58] That's what they told us in the zoning

[4:46:00] meeting. Uh, that it's not an R1. It's

[4:46:02] just because it was built before 1959, I

[4:46:05] think. So, there's no zoning to it.

[4:46:07] Yeah. Sure.

[4:46:08] >> Which is fine. We wanted a little land.

[4:46:09] We wanted um you know, peace and quiet.

[4:46:12] There's no um Sorry, I'm so tired.

[4:46:15] There's no um street lights. Uh so it's

[4:46:20] nice and quiet. You hear the crickets

[4:46:22] speaking and the frogs are, you know,

[4:46:24] there's there's um wildlife in the in

[4:46:28] the uh creek itself. Um, and it's just

[4:46:32] nice to be able to sit out on the porch,

[4:46:34] front porch, and listen to that and to

[4:46:36] see the trees and all those beautiful w

[4:46:38] woods that you can see there and it's

[4:46:42] going to all be gone. And I just don't

[4:46:43] understand it. The wildlife that comes

[4:46:45] out of there, we get deer, we get fox,

[4:46:47] we get raccoons, uh, possum, all kinds

[4:46:50] of stuff like that. So, that bothers me.

[4:46:54] The second thing, and people have

[4:46:55] brought this up, is if you have 18

[4:46:57] houses on there, uh, and everybody has

[4:47:00] two cars. We actually have three. Not

[4:47:02] that we drive them all at the same time,

[4:47:04] but we do. But so you're talking at

[4:47:06] least a minimum of 40 cars. And it's

[4:47:10] kind of misleading the the way that that

[4:47:12] road goes. It goes down. It dips down

[4:47:15] and curves around. And we're right on

[4:47:17] the dip in the curve. Okay. So,

[4:47:21] when I used to drive my Miata, uh, it

[4:47:24] would be really scary, you know, to try

[4:47:26] to look, and I'm short, look out this

[4:47:28] way, look out this way, look out this way again, go, you

[4:47:32] know, so you wouldn't get hit. I have a

[4:47:34] bigger, taller car now, but it's still a

[4:47:36] problem getting out of there. And with

[4:47:38] more traffic, just three doors down, I

[4:47:41] just, it's just not right. There's a lot

[4:47:43] of people that walk their dogs, run,

[4:47:46] kids on bicycles, people, you know, and

[4:47:49] I I fear for them. I do if there's more

[4:47:51] cars. So, another 40 cars. I don't see

[4:47:54] it. Um, people mention the speed limit

[4:47:56] of 35.

[4:47:57] That's just it should be 30 or less. It

[4:48:00] really should because it is very narrow.

[4:48:02] You do have to be very careful uh not to

[4:48:06] fall in the ditch because the ditches

[4:48:07] along the road is where the water goes

[4:48:10] and to not hit them as you're going. So,

[4:48:12] it it's a little scary. Um, but the

[4:48:15] biggest thing that concerns me with that

[4:48:17] many homes and with the

[4:48:21] retention, well, first of all, the

[4:48:22] retention uh pond, um, I'm assuming that

[4:48:26] they're going to have something in there

[4:48:28] to make it move around so that the

[4:48:30] mosquitoes don't grow in there. I mean,

[4:48:32] I'm not sure how that works. So,

[4:48:35] concerned about that. Then we had the

[4:48:37] two detention ponds, right? one on the

[4:48:40] one side and one on side right next

[4:48:42] really to where um

[4:48:46] where uh I'm sorry I'm so tired where um

[4:48:50] uh Dan uh Dan's house there's going to

[4:48:53] be one back in that wood that has a gap

[4:48:56] right and it is all going to go down

[4:48:58] into our creek. Now, here's the thing

[4:48:59] about our creek.

[4:49:03] After it goes underneath the shepherd

[4:49:06] road and it goes into the culvert or

[4:49:07] whatever it is and it comes down, right,

[4:49:09] [clears throat] it drops about 20 feet

[4:49:12] deep. It's that steep. It's not just a

[4:49:14] creek. It's steep. Okay? And the

[4:49:18] pictures that my husband showed you is

[4:49:20] showing you the low part of our our So,

[4:49:23] it goes like that. And that's the part

[4:49:26] that flooded.

[4:49:27] >> Yeah. But it also flooded all the way to

[4:49:31] our fence line which is also another 18

[4:49:35] ft deep. So that was a lot of water.

[4:49:39] Okay. I'm concerned, you know, if

[4:49:41] somebody was some child was playing in

[4:49:43] that water and thought it was just a

[4:49:45] pond, you know, boom, dead. It's gone.

[4:49:48] You know what I'm saying? It's a big

[4:49:49] drop off.

[4:49:50] >> Doesn't really show it there, but it is.

[4:49:54] Um, I just wondered whether anyone has

[4:49:58] um checked with Claremont County soil

[4:50:00] and water to make sure that the water

[4:50:02] flow is going to be right for this creek

[4:50:06] area. It's not going to be flooded even

[4:50:08] more when it rains when they release

[4:50:11] these detention ponds because it is all

[4:50:14] going into that creek.

[4:50:16] Um,

[4:50:18] so that's it. I'm sorry. I had no idea

[4:50:20] this was going to be this long, this

[4:50:22] late.

[4:50:24] And I got to get up and go to work

[4:50:25] tomorrow. So, there you go.

[4:50:27] >> Likewise,

[4:50:27] >> and him Yeah. My husband's got to get up

[4:50:29] at 4 a.m., so we're tired.

[4:50:32] So, I just want to I just I think I'm

[4:50:35] like Mr. Proctor. We just don't want as

[4:50:37] many homes there.

[4:50:38] >> Less homes, less water. We're not

[4:50:41] looking to widen the street. We like the

[4:50:43] street. It's It's rural. It's a one-way

[4:50:46] street that goes back several miles, but

[4:50:49] we like that. We like that there's no

[4:50:51] street lights. We like that there's no

[4:50:53] sidewalks. I think the reason a lot of

[4:50:55] people live on Shepard and stay on

[4:50:57] Shepard is because it feels like

[4:51:01] country living and yet you're just

[4:51:03] around the corner from the escape. So,

[4:51:06] I think I said enough as I'm really

[4:51:08] tired. I need to go to bed.

[4:51:10] >> Mr. Re, do you have any questions?

[4:51:11] >> Yeah. Do you have any questions about

[4:51:12] the ditch in the creek and how

[4:51:14] >> You did good. You did a good job

[4:51:15] explaining. Appreciate you very much.

[4:51:16] Yeah. Thank you. Thank you, miss.

[4:51:18] Appreciate you.

[4:51:19] >> Thank you. Sorry.

[4:51:19] >> Is there anyone else that's an opponent

[4:51:21] of this case? Please come on up, sir.

[4:51:22] Yeah.

[4:51:24] >> Oh,

[4:51:27] wait. I just want to go to

[4:51:30] whatever you want to do.

[4:51:31] >> Thank you.

[4:51:34] » You sure?

[4:51:35] >> Yeah.

[4:51:36] >> I'll let you know once.

[4:51:38] >> All right. Okay. All right. Let me know.

[4:51:39] All right. Let me go swear you in. You

[4:51:40] swear to tell the truth, the whole truth

[4:51:42] about the truth. So hope you got God.

[4:51:43] >> I do.

[4:51:43] >> Okay, great. Floor is yours, sir.

[4:51:45] >> Uh my name is Jeff Beal. Um I live at

[4:51:47] 989 Shepard Woods Court. It's actually

[4:51:50] behind site 13, I think it is.

[4:51:53] >> Okay. Yeah.

[4:51:54] >> Um I do have a couple concerns. Um

[4:51:57] it's the first trustee meeting ever been

[4:51:59] to, so it's kind of new new to me. I

[4:52:01] wasn't expecting to be here till as late

[4:52:03] as it is. So I'll be try to be quick.

[4:52:06] Looking at the previous case that was up

[4:52:08] here, I He had everybody lined up, you

[4:52:11] know, and every resident that lived in

[4:52:13] there knew what was going to happen.

[4:52:14] They knew what who was building the

[4:52:16] homes. They knew everything. Who's

[4:52:18] building the homes? I mean, what's going

[4:52:21] in there? That's great. He's got the

[4:52:22] property. He's got a plan. What kind of

[4:52:24] homes are going in there? You know, they

[4:52:26] the previous case they built they built

[4:52:29] the case for us homeowners around them

[4:52:31] to know what was going to happen here.

[4:52:33] What's going on? Is it his parent

[4:52:35] company buying building the homes? I

[4:52:37] don't know.

[4:52:39] So

[4:52:41] that's where I have a concern. You know,

[4:52:44] my house was just re-evaluated. My wife

[4:52:46] and I are putting a pool in. So I know

[4:52:48] what my house is worth. You know, what

[4:52:51] kind of home is going to go in right

[4:52:52] behind us. You know, is it going to

[4:52:55] lower my value? You know, all this money

[4:52:57] that I've invested. Talking about

[4:52:59] drainage. I got water that comes right

[4:53:01] through my the side of my house because

[4:53:03] of that property. My wife and I had to

[4:53:05] put a French train in back in 2020. It

[4:53:07] helped, but it doesn't it's not perfect.

[4:53:11] So, and I'm trying to be quick here

[4:53:14] because I know it's late, but those are

[4:53:15] my concerns.

[4:53:17] If you pull up that map for site 13, you

[4:53:20] can see how close my house is and that

[4:53:22] property line has barely anything there

[4:53:24] that separates me from that community.

[4:53:27] You know, yeah, you got a retention pond

[4:53:28] or whatever it is, but am I going to get

[4:53:30] more runoff because now they don't have

[4:53:31] a storm sewer?

[4:53:34] You know, I'm not opposed to community.

[4:53:37] In fact, if you look at that drawing,

[4:53:38] there's a there's a barn right there. I

[4:53:41] literally in the back of my house look a

[4:53:42] barn, an old barn that's been there 40

[4:53:44] years. It's a pretty decent fall. So, I

[4:53:46] don't mind having somebody live behind

[4:53:48] me, you know, that might actually invest

[4:53:50] in the back of their property, have

[4:53:52] something nice to look at.

[4:53:54] >> It's just what's going to go in there,

[4:53:56] >> you know.

[4:53:57] So, if this gets approved,

[4:54:01] which you know, I I've shared my

[4:54:04] concerns up to this point. Can we get

[4:54:07] can I get some kind of buffer between my

[4:54:08] house and and my fellow neighbors on

[4:54:11] Shepherd Woods? You know, I know each

[4:54:13] and every one of them and has invested a

[4:54:14] lot of money in into clearing their own

[4:54:17] land. When I bought my property, it was

[4:54:19] full of pine suck and everything. spent

[4:54:21] a lot of money dropping trees, building

[4:54:23] a deck, you know, putting up a fence,

[4:54:26] just like probably all of you. I wanted

[4:54:28] your homes to look nice. You know, I

[4:54:30] have five kids. I'm getting ready to

[4:54:32] have a six guardianship of a six.

[4:54:34] >> You know, I got a pool going in and what

[4:54:37] kind of what kind of homeowner is going

[4:54:38] to be living 40 feet from that pool

[4:54:40] where my kids are going to be in bathing

[4:54:41] suits?

[4:54:43] So, you know,

[4:54:46] what kind of uh privacy can this

[4:54:50] developer or whoever is going to be

[4:54:52] building this property offer me to get

[4:54:55] my blessing? I'm not going to be

[4:54:57] building it because it's his property,

[4:54:58] but you know,

[4:55:04] » no, appreciate it, Mr. Beto. The uh Mr.

[4:55:06] Becker, any questions, sir?

[4:55:09] >> Um, again, Mr. Flouty, I got a question

[4:55:11] for Mr. Flouty.

[4:55:13] So, if we don't know who the builder is

[4:55:15] for this development, how is it we have

[4:55:17] the elevations for the for the for the

[4:55:19] houses for the

[4:55:21] >> in our packet?

[4:55:22] >> Yeah. They would have to follow the

[4:55:24] specification. So, you would still be

[4:55:26] looking at single family one to twotory

[4:55:29] homes.

[4:55:30] >> They're not necessarily what we have in

[4:55:32] the packet.

[4:55:32] >> We ask the developer when he comes up.

[4:55:34] Yeah.

[4:55:34] >> Can we ask the developer when he comes

[4:55:35] up?

[4:55:37] >> We just ask the developer when he comes

[4:55:38] up. Okay, that's fine. I was just trying

[4:55:40] to

[4:55:40] >> just curious

[4:55:42] to the points. No, I got a note about

[4:55:45] the buffer and I plan to ask the

[4:55:47] developer about that when that comes up

[4:55:48] and I appreciate you, Mr. Beck.

[4:55:50] >> That's all I appreciate you. Thank you.

[4:55:51] sir.

[4:55:52] >> Thank you. Okay. Is there anyone else

[4:55:53] that's opposed to this development?

[4:55:56] Okay. See, see.

[4:55:59] Okay.

[4:56:02] [snorts]

[4:56:07] All right. Come on up. Yeah. Yeah. Hand

[4:56:10] to Mr. Campbell.

[4:56:11] >> Thank you.

[4:56:14] >> And then uh let me go and swear you in

[4:56:15] and name that address for the record.

[4:56:17] You swear to tell the truth, the whole

[4:56:18] truth. Are they both the truth? Help you

[4:56:19] God. So help me God.

[4:56:20] >> All right. And then name address for the

[4:56:22] record, sir.

[4:56:23] >> Mark Watkins, 4626 Shepard Road. I'm

[4:56:27] Richard's neighbor.

[4:56:28] >> Yep.

[4:56:29] >> And also

[4:56:32] was partial family with Irma. Her

[4:56:36] brothers helped

[4:56:37] make

[4:56:39] developments on my land to fix a wide

[4:56:41] open ditch that was left there from the

[4:56:43] 60s.

[4:56:44] >> Yeah.

[4:56:44] >> I mean,

[4:56:46] >> that's my my brother-in-law p former

[4:56:49] brother-in-law. He's dead. That's part

[4:56:52] of their family.

[4:56:53] >> Oh, I see. Yeah. [clears throat] Yeah.

[4:56:56] >> It's not that we oppose the development.

[4:56:59] It's just too many.

[4:57:03] There is water problems. We all know

[4:57:05] there's water problems from beginning to

[4:57:08] teal town just before Shepard all the

[4:57:11] way down Shepard.

[4:57:15] There's no storm sewers. It's a skinny

[4:57:17] road. It's got ditches.

[4:57:21] [clears throat and cough]

[4:57:22] As you go down Shephard before you get

[4:57:25] to the first hump that goes up by

[4:57:28] Blackberry,

[4:57:29] >> all the water from the top of Shephard

[4:57:31] goes down there and goes into a creek.

[4:57:34] That creek follows along in the back of

[4:57:37] all the houses before me

[4:57:41] and Richards. I've got one in my

[4:57:44] sideyard.

[4:57:46] The crook that they uh the ditch that

[4:57:49] they covered up, we put pipe in. We put

[4:57:52] in a storm sewer. and Friday storms.

[4:57:56] Water was boiling over from across the

[4:57:59] street and boiling out of my storm sewer

[4:58:02] a good foot and a half, two foot tall.

[4:58:04] Sure.

[4:58:05] >> There was a river that run through my

[4:58:07] property 6 to 8 foot wide that went down

[4:58:10] to the creek next to my barn on the

[4:58:12] lower part of my property.

[4:58:17] The water problems on Shepherd, it's not

[4:58:19] uncommon.

[4:58:22] And if you look at the topographical lay

[4:58:24] of the land, all of Willoughbrook in

[4:58:27] that area between Cindy's house and our

[4:58:31] house, it's not it's flat, but it's not

[4:58:34] really flat. It all goes down into that

[4:58:37] little valley where their house is.

[4:58:40] So, how are you going to route all this

[4:58:42] rain water to these retention ponds?

[4:58:46] They have nowhere for it to go anyway,

[4:58:48] but pasting through their lots. We've

[4:58:51] all got water problems.

[4:58:53] Adding all that much roof space, con,

[4:58:57] you know, driveways,

[4:58:59] you're making the water problems worse.

[4:59:03] Like they were saying at R2,

[4:59:07] 8 to 10 houses is more than enough on

[4:59:09] Shepard Road, not 18.

[4:59:14] I mean, I don't know what the rules are.

[4:59:17] Like the HOA,

[4:59:19] but Shephard,

[4:59:22] the development, Shephard Woods just

[4:59:24] passed that.

[4:59:26] They stuck with the AR, too. They had no

[4:59:30] problems with it.

[4:59:32] So, why would you take that much land as

[4:59:34] opposed to a smaller plot of land and

[4:59:38] try to put more houses on it?

[4:59:42] There's just

[4:59:44] It's not good for the neighborhood.

[4:59:47] >> Thank you.

[4:59:48] Mr. Watkins. Thank you, Mr.

[4:59:50] Becker. Mr. Logan, anything?

[4:59:52] >> Thank you, sir. Appreciate you.

[4:59:54] >> Yeah, come on up, sir, please. Yeah,

[4:59:55] love to have you. All right.

[5:00:01] » Appreciate your service, by the way.

[5:00:02] >> Thank you. Yes, sir.

[5:00:04] >> Appreciate.

[5:00:05] >> Thank you for your service.

[5:00:07] >> Okay, let me go and swear you in. Do you

[5:00:08] swear to tell truth, the whole truth,

[5:00:10] nothing but the truth, so shall be God?

[5:00:11] >> I do.

[5:00:11] >> Great. Great. Great. uh for your s the

[5:00:13] name and address for the record.

[5:00:14] >> Uh yes, my name is Doyle Castile. Live

[5:00:18] at 4638

[5:00:20] Locust Grove Court and

[5:00:24] uh our property

[5:00:26] is right

[5:00:29] um

[5:00:31] right there. The kind of high shot.

[5:00:35] We we have the longest property line

[5:00:38] against

[5:00:40] um that property and I have been around

[5:00:46] [clears throat] the building

[5:00:48] uh industry for since 1970

[5:00:53] >> and um I have seen

[5:00:56] a lot of houses go up. I've worked in

[5:00:59] the houses and around the construction

[5:01:02] areas and I have never seen a house

[5:01:07] built on that small of a lot. And um and

[5:01:12] I because we back right up to that

[5:01:16] property

[5:01:18] u and I look at what is what they're

[5:01:22] trying to put in. It's just not

[5:01:27] um too many houses for the amount of the

[5:01:31] property.

[5:01:32] And I like I said, I've never seen a

[5:01:35] house built on that small of a lot.

[5:01:39] And the houses that I worked on back in

[5:01:44] the 70s and 80s and 90s and on up

[5:01:49] >> uh have all been in $300,000

[5:01:53] houses at that time.

[5:01:58] » So I I don't feel that

[5:02:02] um that we should have that many houses

[5:02:06] back there. Plus the strain. Uh we have

[5:02:11] enough strain right now on the

[5:02:13] electrical

[5:02:15] uh grid back there. We're constantly

[5:02:18] losing electric. Uh that's going to put

[5:02:21] more burden on the uh electrical system.

[5:02:26] Um it's all overhead wiring.

[5:02:30] So that's going to put a extra strain on

[5:02:33] the electrical system.

[5:02:35] and um

[5:02:38] and of course the water problems and

[5:02:40] everything that you run into. So

[5:02:44] um that that's my feelings and

[5:02:49] um I don't want to see it to be that

[5:02:53] much and have to worry about what uh

[5:02:58] people move in back there.

[5:03:01] >> Thank you, Mr. Casio. Appreciate it, Mr.

[5:03:03] Becker. Mr. Lope. I have no, you know, I

[5:03:07] have no problems with them building

[5:03:09] houses there, but it's just too many

[5:03:13] houses for that

[5:03:15] property.

[5:03:16] >> Understand?

[5:03:16] >> All right. Thank you.

[5:03:17] >> Thank you, sir. Appreciate you very

[5:03:18] much. Thank you.

[5:03:19] >> Okay. Is there anyone else that like to

[5:03:21] speak?

[5:03:22] >> Of course. Yeah. Come on up. Perfect.

[5:03:27] » That's okay. Then just speak slowly so

[5:03:29] Mr. Campbell can understand. Okay. Are

[5:03:31] you ready? Uh, you swear to tell the

[5:03:32] truth, the whole truth of the truth will

[5:03:34] be God.

[5:03:34] >> Yes.

[5:03:35] >> Great. Name and address for the record.

[5:03:37] >> Cindy Crocker Clark.

[5:03:39] >> My address is 4631 Shephard Road,

[5:03:43] Betavia.

[5:03:44] >> Perfect.

[5:03:45] >> Um, I live directly next to the property

[5:03:48] where they're wanting to build

[5:03:51] uh the 18 houses. I think it's um

[5:03:57] a crazy idea to put 18 houses in this

[5:04:01] tiny little spot. It doesn't fit the

[5:04:04] neighborhood. If you drive down Shepard,

[5:04:07] there's

[5:04:09] just house after house after house. And

[5:04:12] if you throw in just this little tiny

[5:04:15] road and you look and there's just I

[5:04:18] don't know.

[5:04:20] I don't It just doesn't fit. It it

[5:04:22] wouldn't fit to just look back and see

[5:04:25] just a a mega bunch of houses back

[5:04:28] there. I I I don't know. I grew up on

[5:04:31] this road. It it just wouldn't fit the

[5:04:33] neighborhood.

[5:04:35] Uh I already deal with water issues

[5:04:39] and I have a feeling that putting uh I

[5:04:44] think it's the detention pond is going

[5:04:46] to be like right next door to my house.

[5:04:50] Um, I have a feeling that's going to

[5:04:52] cause issues. Bugs, animals,

[5:04:56] um, more water issues.

[5:05:00] Um, noise.

[5:05:02] I'm going to have to deal with people in

[5:05:04] their houses and their cars and more

[5:05:06] noise than I already deal with on the

[5:05:08] road.

[5:05:10] Um, I mean, I could probably sit here

[5:05:13] and complain all night, but I don't want

[5:05:15] to keep you guys here all night.

[5:05:18] So, I just just come up. I wasn't gonna

[5:05:21] get up here, but I thought I'd get up

[5:05:23] here and just

[5:05:29] [clears throat]

[5:05:30] >> um if it were to go through. [snorts]

[5:05:32] Yeah. I mean, I like watching nature and

[5:05:35] stuff like that. There's a deer den back

[5:05:37] in my backyard right now.

[5:05:39] >> Yeah.

[5:05:39] >> Um but if it were to go through, I' i'd

[5:05:43] like to see a fence put up all the way

[5:05:44] around my yard.

[5:05:47] Did you say a deer den or deer pen?

[5:05:49] >> Den.

[5:05:50] What's a deer? Den.

[5:05:52] >> Like there's there's a mother and two

[5:05:54] fawns in my backyard.

[5:05:56] >> Oh, they just live out in the wild.

[5:05:57] That's okay.

[5:05:58] >> Yeah, I still have the woods back there.

[5:05:59] >> That's fine. Thank you.

[5:06:01] >> Okay, I got it. Loud and clear. Yeah.

[5:06:03] Thank you, Miss Crocker, very much. Yes,

[5:06:05] ma'am. You got Oh, I'm sorry. Did you

[5:06:06] want

[5:06:08] >> Okay. Thank you. Appreciate you very

[5:06:09] much.

[5:06:10] >> Okay. Is there anyone else that like to

[5:06:11] talk on this?

[5:06:14] >> Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Please, please, please.

[5:06:20] >> I'd be remiss to say, my wife is texting

[5:06:22] me saying, "Hey, uh, remind them the

[5:06:25] $3,000 we spent um to regrade our

[5:06:28] backyard. We too have uh water issues."

[5:06:31] So, everybody mentioning the water

[5:06:33] issues, uh, reminded us of that. And

[5:06:36] then also, if this were to go through,

[5:06:39] uh, concessions are to be made. Uh, Mr.

[5:06:41] Beal and I, we are very close together.

[5:06:44] uh we share that buffer zone uh

[5:06:49] at the top of this picture, the north of

[5:06:50] this picture uh if you will, um where it

[5:06:53] will be and why I was asking earlier

[5:06:55] what the uh setback would be and so what

[5:06:59] was it uh 10 feet 14 to 19t or so? Could

[5:07:03] we potentially get an even deeper

[5:07:06] setback like the residents on Locust

[5:07:10] Grove get? Uh they get up to 30 feet in

[5:07:12] that buffer zone. So, I just wanted to

[5:07:14] throw that out there uh as well. Um so,

[5:07:18] >> okay, you got it. You got it. I

[5:07:20] appreciate it.

[5:07:23] » Perfect. Okay. Is there anyone else like

[5:07:25] to talk?

[5:07:27] >> Okay. Seeing none, uh Mr. Gibbs, come on

[5:07:30] up and then I will I will go ahead and

[5:07:31] close public session, sir. Public

[5:07:34] hearing. Uh I'll let you talk first, Mr.

[5:07:36] Gibbs. Anything you want to address and

[5:07:38] then I'm sure the board will have a

[5:07:39] couple questions for you.

[5:07:41] >> Let me get back to my notes here.

[5:07:44] Okay.

[5:07:47] Um, when we

[5:07:50] first went under contract for this land,

[5:07:52] it was my intention to bring a multif

[5:07:54] family development to you guys with 25

[5:07:57] units on it. Um, I came to a few trustee

[5:08:00] meetings to kind of feel the temperature

[5:08:01] of the township with multif family.

[5:08:04] >> Yeah. [snorts]

[5:08:04] >> And, uh, here we are. So, uh, you know,

[5:08:07] that's why we end up with a single

[5:08:08] family product.

[5:08:10] I do want to point out um

[5:08:12] [clears throat]

[5:08:14] the subdivision Shepard Woods Court

[5:08:16] that's to the uh west

[5:08:19] directly um off the corner the top right

[5:08:23] corner of that map

[5:08:25] the density there they have I just when

[5:08:27] I was sitting down took a map they have

[5:08:29] 17 houses in the same amount of density

[5:08:32] uh same amount of acreage on private

[5:08:34] driveways not not uh you know township

[5:08:37] streets and uh Willowbrook directly to

[5:08:40] the south has the same density, same 17

[5:08:43] houses on 4 point I think it was like

[5:08:46] six acres is what I came up with. Um and

[5:08:49] so

[5:08:52] our densities match or slightly slightly

[5:08:55] larger than what's currently there.

[5:08:59] >> We we put up a back that image up to

[5:09:01] where it was. Uh

[5:09:02] >> yeah, that one right there shows it the

[5:09:04] best with the yellow. Well, you see this

[5:09:05] one too.

[5:09:06] So, what I'm referring to is that area

[5:09:09] to the north of that photo. That's

[5:09:11] >> Yeah,

[5:09:11] >> I guess I would photo.

[5:09:14] >> If you if you measured the acreage,

[5:09:16] there's 17 houses in the same amount of

[5:09:18] acreage to the south to the on that map

[5:09:20] to the left of it where Willoughbrook

[5:09:22] is, same thing. There's 17 houses in the

[5:09:24] same amount of acreage there, too, with

[5:09:25] a street.

[5:09:27] >> So, um you know, so I do think we're we

[5:09:29] actually are matching the density in

[5:09:31] this subdivision. Um, as far as the we

[5:09:35] were talking about buffer zones on the

[5:09:37] back of the property and there was

[5:09:39] discussed that they were 15t I believe

[5:09:41] they're 30 feet on the back of the

[5:09:43] property. The tighter buffer is the one

[5:09:45] to the u uh sheep sheepard woods court

[5:09:49] side um where we combed that with a

[5:09:53] three-foot mound and some

[5:09:54] >> some landscape. So on I'm going to say

[5:09:57] to the left of that picture. So the

[5:09:58] houses that are butt up to the left of

[5:10:00] the of of the picture you're putting

[5:10:02] rolling hill mounds on there. Is that

[5:10:03] correct?

[5:10:04] >> To the left the long property line to

[5:10:06] the left.

[5:10:07] >> Yes.

[5:10:07] >> There's a 30 foot. We're keeping the

[5:10:09] trees. We're not cut.

[5:10:10] >> So like a no mo zone basically like

[5:10:12] Okay. Got it. Okay.

[5:10:13] >> And that's part of the green space for

[5:10:14] the subdivision.

[5:10:15] >> Craig, can you stay on the picture you

[5:10:16] had it at?

[5:10:20] » Yeah. Perfect. There you go. And then uh

[5:10:22] Okay. Okay. And then well, I'm going to

[5:10:23] say the top part of the picture where

[5:10:25] it's like a like a Z. There you go. What

[5:10:27] are we doing there?

[5:10:28] >> I can't tell from my map if it's 10 or

[5:10:30] 15 which Carl Carl can answer that was

[5:10:33] here, but it it's a different type of

[5:10:35] buffer. It's got the mound with the

[5:10:36] landscaping on it.

[5:10:37] >> Okay.

[5:10:38] >> Um same thing with the with Miss

[5:10:39] Crocker's along Miss Crocker. If you

[5:10:41] look at our site plan, there's a mound

[5:10:43] all the way around that property line,

[5:10:44] too.

[5:10:45] >> Um hypothetically, Miss Crocker, if this

[5:10:48] goes true, do you want do you want a

[5:10:49] mound with landscaping or do you want a

[5:10:51] fence?

[5:10:53] Roger that. Okay. All right. And then uh

[5:10:56] Okay. And then uh so basically is it

[5:10:58] mounds all the way all the way around

[5:11:00] the entire property basically

[5:11:01] >> and and 30 ft of trees? Yeah.

[5:11:03] >> Got it. Okay.

[5:11:04] >> Yes. Okay.

[5:11:04] >> Other than the road and there is some

[5:11:06] along the road too.

[5:11:08] >> Question. Please go ahead. Yeah.

[5:11:10] >> I heard [clears throat] Miss Crocker

[5:11:12] make the comment about a fence all the

[5:11:14] way around her property. I just want to

[5:11:16] clarify. Did you guys just discuss that

[5:11:19] or just about a fence along the border

[5:11:22] to his property?

[5:11:23] >> Yeah. So, so Mr. Gibbs, if so, so her

[5:11:26] pro do you know her property is that?

[5:11:28] >> Yes.

[5:11:29] >> Okay. Is that is that an issue to put up

[5:11:32] a fence basically like like an L right

[5:11:34] there? Would that be an issue? The

[5:11:35] thoughts, what do you think?

[5:11:37] >> No, it's not an issue.

[5:11:39] >> Okay.

[5:11:40] >> Now, the the house that's the second

[5:11:42] house or the house down from her,

[5:11:44] there's nothing behind them. It's just a

[5:11:46] retention pond. Would you be expecting a

[5:11:48] fence there?

[5:11:48] >> I don't think so.

[5:11:50] >> Um, [clears throat]

[5:11:57] » okay. Is that an issue? What are your

[5:11:58] thoughts?

[5:11:59] >> No. But

[5:12:00] >> Okay, fair enough. Okay. All right. All

[5:12:02] right. The things to consider. Okay. Um,

[5:12:04] >> but just so we're clear, we would be

[5:12:05] deleting the mount that goes around

[5:12:08] that.

[5:12:09] >> You can't You can't have both. You can't have both. So, yeah, that's

[5:12:12] what she shows. So, in the event it goes

[5:12:14] through. So,

[5:12:15] >> okay. Uh anything else on on your end

[5:12:17] that you want to go over?

[5:12:18] >> Uh it would discuss about the plans. Um

[5:12:20] none of our other So as you guys

[5:12:23] probably know by now, Maddox Development

[5:12:25] is part of a larger group, actual

[5:12:27] building group and the act Maddox group

[5:12:29] and we do build houses. I do want to

[5:12:31] reiterate we're not building these

[5:12:32] houses. Um I don't have a written

[5:12:35] agreement, but I have intentions from

[5:12:37] Fiser Homes to build these houses.

[5:12:39] >> Okay. Okay. Fisher homes. Okay. And that

[5:12:42] and the plans that we show came from

[5:12:44] Fisher Homes, the uh the the designs

[5:12:47] that you saw in this packet, see,

[5:12:50] >> but and that is obviously um there's

[5:12:53] some contingencies there and it's not a

[5:12:54] final deal, but that is our intention.

[5:12:56] >> Did you talk with the Arbor people

[5:12:58] today?

[5:12:59] >> Who?

[5:12:59] >> The Arbor people tonight. We should have

[5:13:02] >> compet competition might get you a

[5:13:03] better deal.

[5:13:05] >> Okay. Anything [clears throat] else on

[5:13:06] your end at all?

[5:13:09] uh the water drainage. I I think that

[5:13:11] our plan aims to improve the water

[5:13:13] drainage in the area. Like I said, we

[5:13:15] got two retention ponds and one

[5:13:17] detention pond. The retention ponds will

[5:13:18] hold the water and then again, that's

[5:13:21] all kind of regulated by the county and

[5:13:22] so they they have to approve the water

[5:13:24] management plan uh before we they would

[5:13:28] issue us any type of permit.

[5:13:32] » U Mr. Becker, any questions?

[5:13:34] >> No.

[5:13:35] Okay. Mr. Logan, any questions?

[5:13:37] >> No. Um, what what was I didn't ask this

[5:13:39] question. Uh, what ballpark what what

[5:13:42] are you going to be selling these homes

[5:13:43] for? Ballpark each.

[5:13:44] >> I'm not going to be selling the homes,

[5:13:46] but I is there anything? So, the product

[5:13:48] the most comparable product in the new

[5:13:51] the most comparable recent project in

[5:13:54] Union Township would be Bucks and Oaks

[5:13:55] behind Arch Rental.

[5:13:57] >> Okay.

[5:13:58] >> Um, which 400s 400. Okay.

[5:14:01] >> 350 to 450.

[5:14:03] >> Okay. Okay. So, 400K. Okay. Uh why since

[5:14:07] you could fit I assume it's probably was

[5:14:10] it for the green space but I assume you

[5:14:12] could fit what you want in R2. Wh why

[5:14:16] because you don't need to come to us for

[5:14:16] an R2. Why why come to us for an R4?

[5:14:19] >> Because R4 allows for us to have a

[5:14:21] variable design HOA a planned

[5:14:24] development uh the green space uh where

[5:14:29] uh we just look at uh just look at

[5:14:32] Shephard Woods. There's no required

[5:14:34] green space around that perimeter of

[5:14:37] that property or anything like that.

[5:14:38] >> Yeah.

[5:14:39] >> And so we we

[5:14:42] Fisher wants that. They want the HOA.

[5:14:43] They want that controlled area for the

[5:14:45] product they're selling.

[5:14:46] >> Makes sense. Okay. Um any other

[5:14:48] questions at all gentlemen.

[5:14:50] >> Okay. See, hey, Mr. G. Appreciate you

[5:14:51] very much. Thank you. Thank you, sir.

[5:14:53] Okay. And then uh All right.

[5:14:57] >> Okay.

[5:15:00] >> Come on to the mic, please. this

[5:15:03] >> when he's talking about or they're

[5:15:05] talking about fence versus the

[5:15:08] >> you you can't have both.

[5:15:09] >> You can't have both.

[5:15:10] >> But he was having since they're going to

[5:15:13] cut all the trees down in that area

[5:15:14] right in that side where

[5:15:18] >> No, it's going to be a 30 foot mozzone.

[5:15:20] No. Gosh.

[5:15:21] >> In the back.

[5:15:22] >> Correct. Yeah.

[5:15:23] >> But what I'm asking is so they had the

[5:15:26] BM thing or what it's called and they

[5:15:28] had the pine trees. They're going to put

[5:15:30] pine trees there. So if they're defense,

[5:15:31] there's no trees. Is that right?

[5:15:34] >> You still have trees. Uh because he said

[5:15:35] it was going to be a no mo zone. Just

[5:15:37] the the hill mounds are going to go

[5:15:39] away. That's all.

[5:15:41] >> So the pine trees will stay.

[5:15:42] >> Mr. Gibbs, yes or no? Pine trees stay or

[5:15:44] no?

[5:15:45] >> What the design was put on top?

[5:15:48] >> Okay. Okay. So

[5:15:49] >> that's being removed for

[5:15:52] >> Okay. So So hey, I I I I don't I don't

[5:15:55] want to keep going all night. We were

[5:15:56] pushing almost midnight here, guys. So,

[5:15:59] do do we want Hey, Miss Crocker. Miss Crocker, let me look at

[5:16:03] you real quick. You you and I. Do you

[5:16:04] want hill mounds with pine trees or do

[5:16:06] you want a do you want a fence? What

[5:16:07] would you like, miss?

[5:16:08] >> I would like a fence.

[5:16:09] >> Roger that. But I need both. I need

[5:16:11] since the neighbor's not here, Miss

[5:16:12] Crocker's got got president. So, the

[5:16:14] fence is what's going to go in. Um, and

[5:16:15] if he was here, he could have a say and

[5:16:17] then you two could battle it out, but

[5:16:18] I'm sorry. So, you're you're going to

[5:16:19] make the decision for him. Okay. U Miss

[5:16:21] M. Crocker, I'm looking at you. So, so

[5:16:23] your neighbor to your south, assuming

[5:16:25] we'll find out. We're going to discuss

[5:16:26] it first, but uh the the fence it is and that's that's what we'll do. So, the

[5:16:30] hill mounds are going to go away if

[5:16:31] that's what you choose. Okay. Roger

[5:16:32] that. Okay.

[5:16:33] >> And the pine trees.

[5:16:34] Okay. So, uh all

[5:16:36] right, gentlemen. I'll entertain a

[5:16:37] motion to close uh public hearings. Uh

[5:16:40] zoning case number 426-Z

[5:16:43] and Zulu.

[5:16:44] >> So, moved. Second.

[5:16:45] >> Discussion. Mr. Campbell. Roll call.

[5:16:47] >> Mr. Becker.

[5:16:48] >> Yes.

[5:16:49] >> Mr. Logan.

[5:16:50] >> Yes.

[5:16:51] >> Mr. Dills.

[5:16:52] >> Yes. The public hearing is closed at

[5:16:54] 11:16 p.m.

[5:16:55] >> All right. Uh, vice chairman, like

[5:16:58] normal, go to you first, sir.

[5:17:01] >> Spin up that broken record.

[5:17:04] >> I'm uh surprised here. [clears throat]

[5:17:06] I'm going to side with the residents.

[5:17:09] >> No way.

[5:17:10] >> Um,

[5:17:11] >> which resident? I think they're all

[5:17:12] residents of Union Township.

[5:17:16] » That's why he smells like roses

[5:17:18] >> always.

[5:17:20] Go ahead, [snorts] sir. Couple of things

[5:17:22] that that jumped out at me. There's

[5:17:24] legitimate concerns about the the the

[5:17:26] water runoff. Understand detention

[5:17:28] retention basins and such which would

[5:17:30] certainly mitigate it if not entirely

[5:17:32] eliminated.

[5:17:34] There's um you know character of the

[5:17:35] community issue. I think that's most

[5:17:37] compelling. Well, maybe not most

[5:17:40] compelling uh but the issues about how

[5:17:42] narrow Sheepard Road is. And yeah, I've

[5:17:44] been up and down it. I get that. So, you

[5:17:46] have a public safety what I believe is a

[5:17:48] legitimate public safety concern as well

[5:17:51] with the addition additional traffic uh

[5:17:54] going going up and down the road. So, uh

[5:17:57] for those reasons, I will be in no vote.

[5:17:59] >> Okay. Uh Mr. Lug. Sure.

[5:18:02] >> Yeah. Uh look, I feel that I heard I've

[5:18:05] got two three pages of notes here. Um I

[5:18:11] keep keep the decision based off of the

[5:18:14] case that's presented in front of us.

[5:18:15] Obviously, I'd heard some sentiment of

[5:18:20] history and family and purchasers and

[5:18:24] offers made and this is solely based off

[5:18:27] of um the real concerns that I heard

[5:18:29] that were based on the water uh and the

[5:18:32] dynamics there. um and looking at it,

[5:18:35] the water looks that uh working through

[5:18:38] the county uh and the water um

[5:18:41] management

[5:18:42] >> uh but it's also the detention ponds

[5:18:45] that will

[5:18:47] >> basically

[5:18:48] >> grab all the water flow that's coming in

[5:18:50] on the property and control the release

[5:18:52] of it. So I I you know would venture to

[5:18:55] say that that the the overflow and the

[5:18:57] mad rush of the water and storm water

[5:18:59] that that is currently seen uh I believe

[5:19:02] that it will improve and get better uh

[5:19:05] because it's going to have a controlled

[5:19:06] release. Um, and

[5:19:10] I believe between that and the fencing

[5:19:14] were the biggest concerns that that that

[5:19:16] we've heard um of what is aside from an

[5:19:22] R2

[5:19:24] to an R4 and essentially meeting the

[5:19:28] density of that. So

[5:19:32] I I can support the the project as

[5:19:34] brought forward. Okay. Craig, Craig, can

[5:19:36] you go back to that last slide?

[5:19:39] [cough and clears throat] Gosh. Well,

[5:19:41] not not that one. Yeah, there there you

[5:19:43] go. Okay. So, uh concerns I heard

[5:19:46] overall was basically the same

[5:19:47] consensus. Uh too many houses compacted

[5:19:49] into 4.77 acres. Um the green space,

[5:19:53] which I understand that um

[5:19:58] I I don't think 18 homes will kill the

[5:20:02] traffic. I'm not sold on that. I'm sold

[5:20:04] on the other project we voted on 18

[5:20:06] homes. I'm I'm sorry. I'm not sold on

[5:20:08] that part. I think uh it's a good

[5:20:10] argument, but I I don't think it's going

[5:20:12] to affect it that much. The nature

[5:20:13] center, the drainage was the consensus

[5:20:15] was the drainage as well as well as too

[5:20:17] many houses packed onto the one green

[5:20:18] space. Um what I will say is

[5:20:23] uh

[5:20:25] by going to an R4

[5:20:28] that will open up a little bit more

[5:20:30] green space. And I think, you know, when

[5:20:31] the water falls, the water falls in the

[5:20:33] land. Whether there's a roof there, a

[5:20:34] gutter there or not, the water falls in

[5:20:36] the land. I think the two retention

[5:20:37] ponds or I'm sorry, yeah, two retention

[5:20:39] [clears throat] and the one detention

[5:20:40] pond will will will help that. The water

[5:20:42] is the water. Uh whether it hits a roof

[5:20:44] or a gutter or if it hits directly the

[5:20:45] land, it'll it'll help the issues with

[5:20:47] the water drainage. Um

[5:20:52] and uh

[5:20:55] and and

[5:20:57] I mean, we're looking at this. I don't

[5:20:58] think many can argue against the fact

[5:21:00] that it's it's similar very similar to

[5:21:03] Shepherd Woods in in Willowbrook. It's

[5:21:05] very similar. Um

[5:21:08] and I drove by the land uh and it's it's

[5:21:12] the house it needs to come down. So, um

[5:21:16] I agree with it. So,

[5:21:19] um Okay. All right. So gentlemen, I'm

[5:21:22] going to entertain a motion for the

[5:21:23] approval of unit Township zoning case

[5:21:24] 4-26-Z as in Zulu uh with modifications

[5:21:28] as recommended, including the white

[5:21:32] vinyl 6-foot fence to surround the two

[5:21:34] properties as discussed. Um I don't know

[5:21:37] the addresses, but we know what they're

[5:21:39] discuss.

[5:21:40] >> So moved.

[5:21:42] >> Second. Uh any further discussion? Mr.

[5:21:45] Campbell, roll call.

[5:21:46] >> Mr. Becker,

[5:21:47] >> no.

[5:21:48] >> Mr. Log,

[5:21:49] >> yes.

[5:21:50] >> Mr. Mr. Dills.

[5:21:51] >> Yes.

[5:21:51] >> Motion carries.

[5:21:52] >> All right. So, a man motion to recess.

[5:21:55] >> So moved.

[5:21:57] >> I'll second. Mr. Campbell. Roll call.

[5:21:59] >> Mr. Becker.

[5:22:00] >> Yes.

[5:22:00] >> Mr. Log.

[5:22:01] >> Yes.

[5:22:02] >> Mr. Dills.

[5:22:02] >> Yes. We're recess at 11:22 p.m.

[5:29:44] ever.

[5:29:47] >> This is a Christmas party, right?

[5:29:54] » All right.

[5:29:56] >> Oh,

[5:29:57] >> that's right. That's where I met you.

[5:30:00] >> I told you then you speak like a

[5:30:02] Republican.

[5:30:04] >> [laughter]

[5:30:05] >> He was here and I was like, "You're on

[5:30:07] the wrong party, guy."

[5:30:09] >> All right.

[5:30:09] >> I thought good value right there.

[5:30:12] >> All right. Uh,

[5:30:13] >> he sounded very conservative. [laughter]

[5:30:16] >> All right, gentlemen. Entertain a motion

[5:30:18] to exit recess.

[5:30:19] >> So move.

[5:30:21] >> I'll second.

[5:30:22] >> Mr. Campbell. Roll call.

[5:30:24] >> Mr. Becker.

[5:30:25] >> Yes.

[5:30:25] >> Mr. Lo.

[5:30:26] >> Yes.

[5:30:26] >> Mr. Jills.

[5:30:27] >> Yep.

[5:30:28] >> We're back in session at 11:30

[5:30:31] p.m.

[5:30:32] >> Any old business? Seeing none. I don't

[5:30:34] care if there is. We're gonna move on.

[5:30:35] Just kidding. That was a joke. Uh, all

[5:30:37] right. New business. Our consent agenda.

[5:30:39] Uh, gentlemen, entertain a motion for

[5:30:40] our consent agenda. Approval of the

[5:30:42] minutes 2020, sorry, July 20. Wow. July

[5:30:46] 14, 2026 regular meeting minutes. The

[5:30:48] approval of payments prepared by our

[5:30:49] fiscal officer, Ron Campbell, and

[5:30:51] approval of our monthly financial report

[5:30:52] as prepared by our fiscal officer.

[5:30:54] >> So move.

[5:30:55] >> Second.

[5:30:55] >> Mr. Camp. Roll call.

[5:30:57] >> Mr. Becker.

[5:30:58] >> Yes.

[5:30:58] >> Mr. Lo.

[5:30:59] >> Yes.

[5:30:59] >> Mr. Dills.

[5:31:00] >> Yes.

[5:31:00] >> Motion carries.

[5:31:02] >> All right. Uh, Mr. Ray, I'll throw it

[5:31:04] over to you. Approval of our purchase

[5:31:05] orders exceeding 15,000.

[5:31:06] >> First purchase order is blanket purchase

[5:31:08] order for miscellaneous legal fees to

[5:31:10] breaker for 225,000.

[5:31:12] The next purchase order is to Matthew

[5:31:15] Brun Enterprises. That is Champions.

[5:31:18] >> Is that DBA Champions Landscape Supply?

[5:31:21] Matt, is that correct?

[5:31:24] >> That's Matthew Brun Enterprises is DBA

[5:31:26] Champions Landscape Supply.

[5:31:28] >> Yes.

[5:31:28] >> For salt. So that's for our road salt

[5:31:31] contract. You technically can't award a

[5:31:33] bid until you uh have a PO. So that's

[5:31:37] $285,600.

[5:31:40] Next one is Claremont County Water

[5:31:41] Resources for the parks, $50,000 blanket

[5:31:44] PO. Um next one is um Schneller Heating

[5:31:49] and Air Conditioning. We had three units

[5:31:51] at the police department uh grenade at

[5:31:55] the same time. So that's for $39,871

[5:32:00] to replace those three units. Uh the

[5:32:03] next item of business is uh for Flock

[5:32:06] Group for traffic cameras for the ALPRS

[5:32:08] in the amount of $46,900.

[5:32:11] That is our annual contract fee due in

[5:32:13] October. And the last one is Kevin

[5:32:15] Carpenter. That's Dave Carpenter for

[5:32:17] nuisance abatement at 4692 Blue Jacket

[5:32:20] Road in the amount of $26,575.

[5:32:24] And I recommend you know that that would

[5:32:27] be a significant improvement if you guys

[5:32:28] are interested.

[5:32:29] >> That concludes purchase order.

[5:32:31] >> Gentlemen, any question Mr. Right?

[5:32:33] >> Mr. uh I will entertain a motion for the

[5:32:36] approval of purchasers exceeding 15,000

[5:32:38] as recommended by our administrator.

[5:32:40] >> Uh so move

[5:32:41] >> second.

[5:32:42] >> Mr. Kimber roll call.

[5:32:43] >> Mr. Becker.

[5:32:44] >> Yes.

[5:32:44] >> Mr. Logan.

[5:32:45] >> Yes.

[5:32:45] >> Mr. Dills.

[5:32:46] >> Yes.

[5:32:46] >> Motion cares.

[5:32:47] >> All right. Uh

[5:32:50] see uh gentlemen entertain a motion for

[5:32:52] the SWOP 4G 20226207

[5:32:56] road salt contract continuation.

[5:32:58] >> So move

[5:32:59] >> second.

[5:33:00] >> Any discussion?

[5:33:01] >> Mr. Campbell. Roll call.

[5:33:02] >> Mr. Becker.

[5:33:03] >> Yes.

[5:33:03] >> Mr. Lo.

[5:33:04] >> Yes.

[5:33:05] >> Mr. Dills.

[5:33:05] >> Yes.

[5:33:06] >> Motion carries.

[5:33:06] >> I can tell you retired.

[5:33:09] The uh All right. I entertain a motion

[5:33:11] for the approval of 2026 Halloween

[5:33:14] trick-or- treat hours establishing to

[5:33:16] October 31st. 26 between hours of 6:00

[5:33:19] and 8:00 p.m.

[5:33:20] >> So move.

[5:33:21] >> Second.

[5:33:21] >> Uh discussion. Mr. Campbell. Roll call.

[5:33:24] >> Mr. Becker.

[5:33:25] >> Yes. Mr. Lo.

[5:33:26] >> Yes.

[5:33:26] >> Mr. Dills.

[5:33:27] >> Yes.

[5:33:27] >> Motion carries.

[5:33:28] >> Uh item four. Uh Mr. Wright, why don't

[5:33:31] you just briefly describe?

[5:33:31] >> Sure. So uh this is for the Tabasco

[5:33:34] Mount Carbasco and Club Pike uh

[5:33:36] intersection. Uh that uh county has gone

[5:33:39] through some initial review. They've

[5:33:40] selected a preliminary alternative and

[5:33:43] uh we originally pledged $50,000

[5:33:46] uh in concert with the transportation

[5:33:48] improvement district for $50,000 and

[5:33:51] they have secured $385,000 from OKI and

[5:33:54] uh J um I don't I'm not I don't remember

[5:33:57] who JNC is, but it's some state agency.

[5:34:01] Anyway, they've got $385,000 in grants.

[5:34:04] We have a $50,000 pledge. T has $50,000

[5:34:07] pledge. preliminary design and detailed

[5:34:10] design came back a little higher.

[5:34:12] There's a funding gap of around

[5:34:14] $144,000.

[5:34:16] Um, in the spirit of continued

[5:34:18] cooperation,

[5:34:20] uh, they are requesting to see if we

[5:34:22] would be willing to split the funding

[5:34:23] gap. Look, it's probably one of our

[5:34:25] worst intersections in in the township,

[5:34:29] particularly at rush hour, and I think

[5:34:32] this would be consistent with our

[5:34:34] approach to continue to fund this,

[5:34:36] consistent with like what we've done

[5:34:37] with the Bach Bucks and Shield

[5:34:39] roundabouts. We're looking at about 100.

[5:34:41] So, uh I think it's like um this would

[5:34:45] push our total funding commitment to

[5:34:47] about 122,000, just under that. And uh

[5:34:51] the county's funding commitment would be

[5:34:53] the same. And this would get us all the

[5:34:54] way through detailed design. Okay. Any

[5:34:56] questions, Mr. Ray? All right.

[5:34:58] Gentlemen, entertain a motion for the

[5:34:59] mount for the approval of Mount Carmel

[5:35:01] Tabasco Club Pike intersection

[5:35:02] improvements, engineering, and design

[5:35:04] funding.

[5:35:04] >> Submit.

[5:35:05] >> Second.

[5:35:06] >> Any discussion? Mr. Campbell. Roll call.

[5:35:08] >> Mr. Becker.

[5:35:08] >> Yes.

[5:35:09] >> Mr. Logan.

[5:35:10] >> Yes.

[5:35:10] >> Mr. Dills.

[5:35:11] >> Yes.

[5:35:11] >> Motion carries.

[5:35:12] >> All right. Easement approval. Uh, real

[5:35:14] quick, Mr. Right. Go ahead.

[5:35:15] >> Uh, yes. And and just as as far as that

[5:35:17] next item, that last item goes, we'll

[5:35:19] put purchase orders in and everything

[5:35:20] else. We haven't signed anything. thing

[5:35:22] I just told the county I would get the

[5:35:23] board to give me an affirmative on that

[5:35:25] easement approval. So along Icults Road,

[5:35:28] we don't have any easements for the turn

[5:35:29] lanes that were installed 22 years ago

[5:35:32] and we also need to have grant an

[5:35:35] easement for the uh uh the box culvert

[5:35:38] repair that's going to take place. So uh

[5:35:41] just need permission uh authorization to

[5:35:43] grant and sign perpetual and temporary

[5:35:46] easements dedicate the rightway along

[5:35:48] Icults and then also for the uh uh box

[5:35:51] culvert repair.

[5:35:52] >> Great. Any questions? Mr. Right. All

[5:35:54] right. Gentlemen entertain a motion for

[5:35:56] the approval of the easement approval

[5:35:57] for Icults road

[5:35:59] and storm easements clar county

[5:36:01] engineer.

[5:36:02] >> So move second.

[5:36:03] >> Any discussion? Mr. Campbell. Roll call.

[5:36:05] >> Mr. Becker.

[5:36:06] >> Yes.

[5:36:06] >> Mr. Lo.

[5:36:07] >> Yes.

[5:36:07] >> Mr. Dills.

[5:36:08] >> Yes. Motion carries.

[5:36:09] >> All right. Legislative agenda. Uh, I'll

[5:36:11] entertain a motion for the approval of

[5:36:13] resolution 2026-46,

[5:36:15] nuisance vehicle abatement resolution.

[5:36:17] >> So move.

[5:36:18] >> Second.

[5:36:19] >> Any discussion? Mr. Kim, roll call.

[5:36:21] >> Mr. Becker?

[5:36:22] >> Yes. Mr. Luth?

[5:36:23] >> Yes.

[5:36:23] >> Mr. Dills?

[5:36:24] >> Yes.

[5:36:24] >> Motion carries.

[5:36:26] >> Uh, I entertain a motion for the

[5:36:27] approval of resolution 2026-47,

[5:36:31] nuis nuisance abasement baitment

[5:36:32] resolution. two addresses

[5:36:34] [clears throat] 536 Old State Route 74

[5:36:37] and 821 Whiz New Drive U first pin is

[5:36:42] 413 213 A's and alpha 019 second pin is

[5:36:45] 414236

[5:36:47] B is in Bravo 014 move

[5:36:50] >> second

[5:36:50] >> any discussion Mr. Camp roll call

[5:36:52] >> Mr. Becker

[5:36:52] >> yes Mr. Lo

[5:36:54] >> yes

[5:36:54] >> Mr. S.

[5:36:55] >> Yes.

[5:36:55] >> Motion carries.

[5:36:56] >> All right. Next one is resolution onto a

[5:36:58] motion for the approval of resolution

[5:36:59] 2026-48, the Claremont County Hazard

[5:37:02] Mitigation Plan Adoption.

[5:37:03] >> So move.

[5:37:05] >> Second.

[5:37:06] >> Any discussion?

[5:37:07] >> Mr. Kim, roll call.

[5:37:09] >> Mr. Becker?

[5:37:10] >> Yes.

[5:37:10] >> Mr. Log?

[5:37:11] >> Yes.

[5:37:11] >> Mr. Dills?

[5:37:12] >> Yes.

[5:37:12] >> Motion carries.

[5:37:15] >> Application. Uh, do you want to explain

[5:37:16] the next one? Sure.

[5:37:17] >> Township.

[5:37:18] >> Uh, 202649.

[5:37:20] So the Claremont County Engineers Office

[5:37:22] advised us late, I believe in July,

[5:37:24] Matt, was it that they were not going to

[5:37:26] pursue landslide repair joint

[5:37:28] applications. We typically do our

[5:37:30] landslide repair applications through O

[5:37:32] OPWC and piggyback on the county's

[5:37:34] program. They're not doing that this

[5:37:36] year. So we we uh contacted uh Miami

[5:37:40] Township to see because they also

[5:37:42] participate and they are not they were

[5:37:44] in the same boat we are. And with OPWC

[5:37:47] scoring, if we combine our projects, we

[5:37:50] get better if we are funding partners on

[5:37:53] a family of projects, we get better

[5:37:55] scoring.

[5:37:55] >> Yep.

[5:37:56] >> So, we're looking at for Baldwin Road,

[5:37:58] uh, I just got geotech consult again,

[5:38:00] real preliminary, looking at about a

[5:38:03] total cost of around $700,000. We would

[5:38:05] only apply for a 10% match. There is a

[5:38:08] $10 million uh township set aside this

[5:38:11] year that we're going to try to shoot to

[5:38:12] go after. And I think $700,000 would get

[5:38:15] us a significant portion further up the

[5:38:17] hill, which there's already what two

[5:38:19] segments that are in process now at the

[5:38:22] bottom of the hill

[5:38:23] >> next next week.

[5:38:24] >> Next. Yeah. So So that's imminent. So

[5:38:26] this would give us permission to kind of

[5:38:28] execute agreements, bring uh get

[5:38:30] consulting contracts, do other things

[5:38:32] just to get this thing moving forward.

[5:38:34] Okay.

[5:38:35] >> Okay. Uh gentlemen, I entertain a a

[5:38:37] motion for the approval of resolution

[5:38:39] 2026-49, the resolution authorizing

[5:38:41] OPWC, round 41 application union and

[5:38:45] Miami Township slide repairs project. So

[5:38:47] move

[5:38:48] >> second.

[5:38:49] >> Any discussion? Mr. Campbell, roll call.

[5:38:51] >> Mr. Becker,

[5:38:52] >> yes. Mr. Lo,

[5:38:53] >> yes.

[5:38:53] >> Mr. Dills,

[5:38:54] >> yes.

[5:38:54] >> Motion carries.

[5:38:55] >> All right, next one's easy. Looks like

[5:38:57] the disposal of the 2001 Pierce Aerial

[5:38:59] Platform to the UTCIC.

[5:39:02] Uh, gentlemen, I entertain a motion and

[5:39:04] for approval of resolution 2026-50,

[5:39:07] resolution authorizing disposal of

[5:39:09] property to the UTCIC.

[5:39:11] >> Second.

[5:39:12] >> You want any discussion? Mr. Campbell,

[5:39:14] roll call.

[5:39:14] >> Mr. Becker.

[5:39:15] >> Yes.

[5:39:16] >> Mr. Lo.

[5:39:16] >> Yes.

[5:39:17] >> Mr. Dills.

[5:39:18] >> Yes.

[5:39:18] >> Motion carries.

[5:39:19] >> All right. Next one's then for the water

[5:39:21] resources. Uh, gentlemen, obtain a

[5:39:22] motion for the approval of resolution

[5:39:24] 2026-51.

[5:39:26] Then now certificate for the Clement

[5:39:27] County Water Resources.

[5:39:28] >> So moved.

[5:39:30] >> Second.

[5:39:30] >> Any discussion? Mr. Just came. Roll

[5:39:32] call.

[5:39:32] >> Mr. Becker.

[5:39:33] >> Yes.

[5:39:34] >> Mr. Lo.

[5:39:34] >> Yes.

[5:39:34] >> Mr. Jill.

[5:39:35] >> Yes.

[5:39:35] >> Motion carries.

[5:39:36] >> All right. Uh. Oh. Comments from the

[5:39:39] board. Mr. Becker.

[5:39:41] >> Uh, I did have something different in

[5:39:43] mind to talk about for board comments.

[5:39:45] I'm going to it can wait till a future

[5:39:47] meeting, but what I don't want to push

[5:39:49] off to a future meeting is is commenting

[5:39:52] about the flock camera concerns. And we

[5:39:54] did hear that uh tonight where a

[5:39:56] gentleman voiced

[5:39:59] uh his you know very legitimate

[5:40:01] concerns.

[5:40:03] When we first got these, the libertarian

[5:40:06] side of me was queasy.

[5:40:08] Um

[5:40:10] and I was surprised there was actually

[5:40:12] no opposition at the time.

[5:40:16] the um of course as time went on there's

[5:40:20] been no abuse or reason to suspect any

[5:40:22] abuse at least not here locally in Union

[5:40:24] Township and they've been

[5:40:26] extraordinarily effective in fighting

[5:40:28] crime of course you know the other side

[5:40:31] of that nobody wants Union Township or

[5:40:33] the rest of the country to be a

[5:40:34] surveillance state so I do get those

[5:40:35] concerns

[5:40:38] um you know is is I think the the whole

[5:40:41] board here agrees I know I've heard you

[5:40:42] say that and I think as well as Mr.

[5:40:44] still is that this isn't a hill any of

[5:40:46] us are willing to die on. If the

[5:40:47] community wants it out, then then

[5:40:49] they're then then we'll take them out.

[5:40:52] I've only heard from a very few handful

[5:40:55] of people. I'm not even sure the people

[5:40:56] I've heard from even live in township.

[5:40:58] Some clearly do. Some I'm not too too

[5:41:01] sure about. Regardless, it seems to be a

[5:41:02] vocal minority rather than a prevailing

[5:41:05] opinion across, you know, 50,000

[5:41:07] residents or whatever the number is. I

[5:41:10] did um yesterday had a meeting with the

[5:41:13] uh with a representative from Flock. Uh

[5:41:16] this was over at the uh police

[5:41:18] department. Uh we had a good discussion,

[5:41:20] answered uh my my concerns and um um you

[5:41:25] know, I'm I'm I'm comfortable with uh

[5:41:27] continuing to have those in Union

[5:41:29] Township. And that concludes my remarks.

[5:41:31] >> Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Luke,

[5:41:33] >> do they give you the unlimited password

[5:41:35] and secret code so you can see

[5:41:37] everybody's images? I forgot to ask for

[5:41:39] that.

[5:41:40] >> Okay, Mr. Becker's. So, everyone, uh,

[5:41:42] John Becker and his phone number. No,

[5:41:45] thank you, John, for for those update.

[5:41:47] That's good. Um, no, I'll keep it short

[5:41:50] for tonight. Just happy to to to hear

[5:41:52] from the residents. Hear from the

[5:41:54] residents. Obviously, things are never

[5:41:56] black and white and super uh uh simple.

[5:42:00] Uh, and so it's good to be able to hear

[5:42:02] from the residents through and through

[5:42:03] from flock to water and fencing and

[5:42:06] bushes.

[5:42:08] floor to you, Mr. Dills. Mr. Becker, I

[5:42:11] agree with your sentiments on flot

[5:42:13] cameras, so we're on the same page. Uh,

[5:42:15] upcoming events, the next park

[5:42:17] recreations committee meeting is

[5:42:19] Thursday, August 13th at 5:00 pm right

[5:42:21] here. Next township zoning meeting will

[5:42:23] be Wednesday, August 26th, right here at

[5:42:25] 7 p.m. Uh, next board of uh, zoning

[5:42:29] appeals will be Thursday, September 3rd

[5:42:31] at 7 PM. Our next regular business

[5:42:34] meeting will be the second Tuesday of

[5:42:36] the month, September 8th at 6 PM.

[5:42:38] Township offices will be closed

[5:42:40] September 7th in observance of Labor

[5:42:42] Day. Farmers Market is being held on

[5:42:43] Fridays from 4:00 to 7:00 p.m. right

[5:42:45] here on the Civic Center campus. Pickle

[5:42:47] Ball Slam is Saturday 8 uh August 15th

[5:42:50] at 8 a.m. at Cleper Park.

[5:42:54] And uh the Marty Connor Band uh concert is

[5:43:00] canled in inclement matter. Oh, it's

[5:43:01] rescheduled for August 28th, uh 7:00

[5:43:04] p.m. right here at Civic Center behind

[5:43:06] us. Uh, Mount Mariah Cemetery lantern

[5:43:08] lighting is Saturday, September 19th,

[5:43:10] uh, from 5 to 7:30 pm. and the UT

[5:43:13] fireworks celebration that we always

[5:43:15] have September 26 live music at RJ's uh

[5:43:19] which will all begin at 4 pm

[5:43:22] and concert or the fireworks at 8:45

[5:43:24] p.m. Uh the our fire department has our

[5:43:27] open house kickoff, annual open house

[5:43:29] kickoff, national fire prevention week,

[5:43:30] October 4th uh from 11 to 1 pm and

[5:43:35] located at the water tower. And uh

[5:43:38] police department invites residents to

[5:43:39] local businesses to an open house

[5:43:40] Saturday, October 10th from noon uh from

[5:43:44] noon to 4 p.m. at the police department

[5:43:46] building. and uh UT's uh sip and shop

[5:43:49] will be held Saturday, October 17th from

[5:43:52] noon to 4:00 right here at the Civic

[5:43:55] Center campus. And trick-or-treating

[5:43:58] October 31st from 6:00 to 8:00 p.m. Next

[5:44:00] CPR training will be held with our fire

[5:44:03] department uh September 12th from 9:00

[5:44:05] a.m. to 1:00 p.m. And uh All right,

[5:44:09] gentlemen. I will entertain a motion for

[5:44:11] the approval to enter executive session.

[5:44:14] Motion during executive session present

[5:44:15] to Ohio revised code 121.22G is engulf

[5:44:19] as follows. To consider the purchase of

[5:44:22] property for public purposes, the sale

[5:44:24] of property at competitive bidding or

[5:44:26] the sale of other uh disposition of

[5:44:28] unneeded, obsolete or unfit for use

[5:44:31] property in accordance with section

[5:44:33] 505.10 of the Ohio of of revised code. A

[5:44:37] premature disclosure of information

[5:44:39] would give unfair, competitive, or

[5:44:40] bargaining advantage to a person whose

[5:44:41] personal private interest is adverse to

[5:44:44] the general public interest. Uh, number

[5:44:46] two is to confer with an attorney for

[5:44:49] the public body concerning disputes

[5:44:50] involving the public body that are the

[5:44:52] subject of pending or imminent court

[5:44:54] action pursuant to pursuant to Ohio

[5:44:57] Revised Code section 121.22G is engulf

[5:45:00] three. Item three is preparing for

[5:45:02] conducting or reviewing negotiations or

[5:45:04] bargaining sessions with public

[5:45:06] employees concerning their compensation

[5:45:08] and other terms and conditions of their

[5:45:10] employment pursuant to Ohio revised code

[5:45:12] section 121.22 Golf 4. Last item is item

[5:45:15] four to consider confidential

[5:45:17] information related to the marketing

[5:45:18] plan, specific business strategy,

[5:45:20] production techniques, trade secrets, or

[5:45:22] personal financial statements of an

[5:45:23] applicant for economic development

[5:45:25] assistance or to negotiations with other

[5:45:28] political subdivisions respecting

[5:45:30] request for economic development

[5:45:31] assistance provided that both of the

[5:45:33] following conditions apply. The

[5:45:35] information is directly related to a

[5:45:36] request for economic development

[5:45:38] assistance that is to be provided or

[5:45:41] administered under any provision of

[5:45:43] chapter 715, 725, 1724 or 1728 or

[5:45:48] sections 701.073735.67

[5:45:54] to3735.70

[5:45:57] 5709.402

[5:46:00] 579.43

[5:46:02] 579.612 61 to 579.69

[5:46:07] 5709.73

[5:46:08] to 579.75

[5:46:10] or 579.77

[5:46:13] to 579.81 of the Ohio Revised Code that

[5:46:15] involves public infrastructure

[5:46:16] improvements or the extension of utility

[5:46:19] services that are directly related to an

[5:46:20] economic development project. and B, a

[5:46:23] unanimous quorum of a public body

[5:46:25] determines by a roll call vote that the

[5:46:27] executive session is necessary to

[5:46:28] protect the interest of the applicant or

[5:46:31] the possible investment or expenditure

[5:46:33] of public funds to be made in connection

[5:46:35] with the economic development project

[5:46:36] pursued to high revised code section

[5:46:38] 121.22 G is engulf 8. My gosh, what what

[5:46:42] >> sound move?

[5:46:45] >> Second,

[5:46:46] >> Mr. Campbell, roll call.

[5:46:49] >> Mr. Becker,

[5:46:49] >> yes.

[5:46:50] >> Mr. Lo,

[5:46:51] >> yes. Mr. Dills.

[5:46:52] >> Yes.

[5:46:53] >> Okay. We're into executive session at

[5:46:56] 11:46

[5:46:57] p.m.

[5:46:58] >> I was reading and I'm like,

[5:47:00] >> you guys

[5:47:03] see you.

[5:47:05] >> Thanks, gentlemen.

[6:08:08] You You can do whatever you'd like.

[6:08:14] » I want to go home.

[6:08:16] >> It is midnight. You know, we're going to

[6:08:18] hear about this tomorrow

[6:08:21] >> today. Back there.

[6:08:23] >> Good to go.

[6:08:25] >> She was just there.

[6:08:26] >> There she is.

[6:08:26] >> She's got thumbs up.

[6:08:27] >> All right. All right. Uh, gentlemen,

[6:08:29] I'll entertain a motion to exit

[6:08:31] executive session with no action taken.

[6:08:33] >> So move.

[6:08:34] >> Second.

[6:08:34] >> Mr. Campbell. Roll call.

[6:08:36] >> Mr. Becker.

[6:08:37] >> Yes.

[6:08:37] >> Mr. Log.

[6:08:38] >> Yes.

[6:08:39] >> Mr. Dills.

[6:08:40] >> Yes.

[6:08:41] >> We're out of executive session with no

[6:08:43] action taken at 12:08 p.m.

[6:08:45] >> Well, gentlemen, it's my

[6:08:47] >> pleasure. AM. I'm sorry. [laughter]

[6:08:49] >> On uh Wednesday morning, it's my

[6:08:52] pleasure to chair the arguably the

[6:08:54] longest trustee meeting in the history

[6:08:55] of town.

[6:08:56] >> You're proud of yourself.

[6:08:57] >> Yeah, very proud. It's all your fault.

[6:08:58] >> Well, hey, public public session, public

[6:09:01] input. That's

[6:09:01] >> can't wait to hear about this on the

[6:09:02] news tomorrow. We just want news.

[6:09:04] Anyways, uh I entertain a motion to

[6:09:06] adjourn.

[6:09:07] >> So vote.

[6:09:08] >> Second.

[6:09:08] >> Mr. Campbell. Roll call.

[6:09:10] >> Mr. Becker.

[6:09:11] >> Yes.

[6:09:11] >> Mr. Log.

[6:09:12] >> Yes.

[6:09:12] >> Mr. Dills.

[6:09:13] >> Yes.

[6:09:13] >> We're adjourned at 12:09 a.m.

[6:09:17] >> Did you hear about the the death march?

[6:09:20] [laughter]

[6:09:22] » It's common.

[6:09:25] Out of all the zooming cases that were

[6:09:27] those

Union Township Board Of Trustees Meeting: August 11, 2026 at 6:00 PM

Agenda

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