[0:00] Okay, let's call to order. City Council

[0:03] meeting March 24th, 2026

[0:06] um for Alpine City Council. We'll start

[0:08] with a roll call. Um

[0:12] starting from Councilwoman Hanaman.

[0:14] >> Chrissy Hanaman here.

[0:17] >> Andrew Young here. Rmler present.

[0:20] >> Jessica present.

[0:21] >> Sarah Blackwell present. Okay, we'll

[0:24] have a prayer um le given by

[0:27] Councilwoman Haniman and a pledge led by

[0:29] Councilman Rumler.

[0:33] Our dear heavenly father, grateful for

[0:34] this opportunity to gather together and

[0:37] meet and discuss the business of the

[0:39] city and um hear from many good people

[0:42] who contribute to the uh well-being of

[0:46] our residents and things that we need to

[0:49] have accomplished. We're grateful for

[0:51] those that serve in every capacity and

[0:53] those uh staff that work hard to

[0:56] maintain so many of our programs and um

[1:00] facilities and um look out for us. And

[1:04] we're grateful for um the

[1:08] opportunity we have to exercise faith

[1:11] that we may get more water, more snow,

[1:13] whatever moisture we can muster. We're

[1:16] as a community because everybody needs

[1:18] it. And we see these things through

[1:19] Christ. Amen.

[1:20] >> Amen.

[1:21] >> Please rise for the pledge of

[1:22] >> allegiance

[1:27] to the flag of the United States of

[1:30] America and to the republic for which it

[1:33] stands. One nation under God,

[1:36] indivisible, with liberty and justice

[1:39] for all.

[1:42] » Okay, we'll move on to item two on our

[1:44] consent calendar or the consent

[1:47] calendar. Does anybody have questions

[1:48] regarding the items?

[1:50] >> Uh, I just I just had a quick couple if

[1:54] uh I'm pulling it up right now. Sorry.

[1:56] Uh

[1:58] everything was so fun before this

[2:00] happened that I didn't have time to uh

[2:02] pull it up. But basically, do you mind

[2:03] just explaining the surplus? It's the

[2:06] surplus, right?

[2:07] >> Yeah.

[2:07] >> The surplus, how that works because it's

[2:09] new for the the new two city councilors.

[2:13] >> Um just explain briefly. And then is

[2:15] this basically in regards to uh um

[2:20] mostly the park grass and things like

[2:21] that dealing with that? That's what I

[2:23] could glean from the different um uh I I

[2:27] I'm pulling up my notes, but that's what

[2:28] I could glean from the uh different uh

[2:31] machinery, what it's for, and then what

[2:33] we do we need to get new stuff. Is that

[2:35] what's going on?

[2:35] >> It's it's parks equipment. Um some of

[2:38] it, you know, our our previous parks uh

[2:42] head of our parks was

[2:44] very much mechanic and he would hold on

[2:47] to things a little longer because he

[2:49] could

[2:49] >> fix them up,

[2:50] >> parts off one or whatever.

[2:51] >> Sounds like my house.

[2:53] >> Yeah. And he he had a unique set of

[2:56] capabilities. And Troy's awesome with

[2:59] parts. He's just not as much of a

[3:00] mechanic as Cal. Um, but this is stuff

[3:03] like he didn't even use these mowers

[3:06] last year and this equipment and it's

[3:09] just taking up space and um he's our guy now and they have other

[3:16] mowers that they do use and have uh

[3:19] enough. So rather than just let them sit

[3:22] there and depreciate,

[3:24] we talked about it and and decided we

[3:26] should just sell these and um you know

[3:31] we might need something like a new piece

[3:33] of equipment like a different airator or

[3:36] something that's more efficient or

[3:38] something like that that we'd bring in

[3:39] the future maybe next year's budget.

[3:42] >> So it would just go back to new

[3:43] equipment the money that we get for it.

[3:46] >> Yeah, we just put it in a kind of an

[3:48] equipment replacement fund. Cool.

[3:50] >> Yeah.

[3:51] >> Last thing is just for for anyone, this

[3:53] is the time to air rate your lawn

[3:56] deatchch for for the for the summer

[3:58] coming up. We just did ours. It'll it's

[4:00] really important for this summer. That's

[4:02] all.

[4:02] >> Yeah. And if I mean, just so you know

[4:04] how this will be sold, we uh we post

[4:07] this equipment on public surplus. And I

[4:10] mean, we've we've sold equipment to

[4:13] Quebec, Canada before,

[4:16] uh a dump truck a few years ago. And I

[4:18] was shocked it went that far, but a lot

[4:20] of it goes around here. Some does go out

[4:22] of state and and different places.

[4:24] >> Maybe in the future we could make it so

[4:25] some of the residents could buy our off

[4:27] equipment. I've been buying equipment.

[4:29] >> They can get on there and buy anyone's

[4:31] welcome to bid. You don't have to have

[4:32] any kind of membership or anything like

[4:34] that.

[4:34] >> Well, maybe we give them a an early

[4:37] access or something.

[4:39] >> No, it has to be a fair and open bid.

[4:41] >> Competitive.

[4:41] >> Well, but not fair for them. They they

[4:43] get

[4:43] >> has to be fair and open.

[4:44] >> Fair and open.

[4:46] >> Oh, it does.

[4:47] >> Yes. Well, we got to change that. We got

[4:48] to give them a little benefit.

[4:49] >> No, I think that's

[4:50] >> I mean, they're the ones that paying for

[4:51] the equipment.

[4:51] >> Let's move on, guys. Okay. If there's no

[4:53] other questions regarding

[4:55] >> the consent calendar, I'll entertain a

[4:57] motion.

[5:01] » Let me see. I'll move to approve the

[5:03] consent calendar.

[5:05] >> Second.

[5:06] >> Okay. It's been moved by Councilman

[5:09] Rumler, seconded by Councilwoman Smeuan.

[5:12] Any further discussions or questions

[5:14] regarding the motion? If not, let's

[5:16] proceed with the roll call vote.

[5:17] Chrissy.

[5:19] >> Chrissy Henman. Yes.

[5:20] >> Andrew Young, yes. Brad Rama, yes.

[5:22] >> Jessica Smeuan, yes.

[5:24] >> Sarah Blackwell, yes.

[5:26] >> Okay. Consent calendar passes. We'll

[5:28] move on to

[5:31] um can I get a vote to switch around

[5:35] public comment to after the reports and

[5:37] presentations just because I know that

[5:39] we need to get the mayor to his city

[5:40] council meeting tonight.

[5:45] I move that we put item number three,

[5:48] public comment, after item number four,

[5:51] reports and presentations.

[5:53] >> Is there a second?

[5:54] >> I'll second.

[5:55] >> Okay, it's been moved by Councilwoman

[5:58] Blackwell, seconded by Councilman

[6:00] Rumler. Um, any questions regarding

[6:03] >> The only discussion is just if there are

[6:05] residents who are came in, if they want

[6:06] to make a public comment, you they a lot

[6:08] of them don't know the process. You get

[6:10] a card, you give it to uh Deianne, gives it to the mayor and that

[6:14] gives you approval to make a comment. So

[6:16] it'll be in like 20 30 minutes probably.

[6:18] >> Okay. Any um Okay. No further

[6:21] discussions. Let's proceed with roll

[6:22] call vote.

[6:24] >> Gracie Hanaman, yes.

[6:26] >> Andrew Young, yes.

[6:27] >> Brent Rler, yes.

[6:27] >> Jessica Young, yes.

[6:29] >> Senator Blackwell, yes. Motion passes.

[6:31] So we'll move on to reports and

[6:34] presentations item four and put public

[6:36] comment directly after. Um, let we'll

[6:39] start with the Highland Alpine Chamber

[6:40] of Commerce.

[7:04] The buttons just on the on the bottom

[7:06] part of the microphone. I got you.

[7:10] >> There we go.

[7:11] >> Is that working?

[7:12] >> Okay.

[7:13] >> All right. Thank you, mayor and city

[7:14] council for having me over today. Um, so

[7:17] my name is Rob Cwley. president of the

[7:19] Highland Alpine Chamber of Commerce. Um,

[7:23] just a quick intro about my background.

[7:25] So, I grew up in American Fork. We moved

[7:27] to Highland when I was uh still young

[7:30] and uh I went to BYU, got a masters in

[7:33] accounting there, worked for one of the

[7:34] big five CPA firms here in Salt Lake

[7:36] City for several years, became a senior

[7:38] auditor there. um left that and became

[7:42] more of a CFO controller type for many

[7:45] years and then became an entrepreneur

[7:47] and now I have ownership in about seven

[7:49] businesses and

[7:51] um a lot of fun. So that's a little bit

[7:54] about me. The uh I also was on the city

[7:57] council in Cedar Hills for a few years

[7:59] and uh

[8:03] with that I've I've always had an

[8:04] interest in politics. So, how this uh

[8:06] chamber of commerce came about, I'll

[8:08] just tell you the background on that. Um

[8:10] I was interviewing many of the

[8:12] candidates for uh Highland City Council

[8:15] and Ron Campbell uh current city council

[8:18] member there mentioned that he really

[8:19] thought we needed a Highland um chamber

[8:23] of commerce

[8:24] and uh I hadn't really thought about

[8:27] that until then, but it just kept

[8:29] popping up in my mind and about November

[8:30] of last year, I thought that would

[8:32] really help my businesses. I have seven

[8:34] of them and a lot of residents have no

[8:36] idea that I even have a business. So, um

[8:39] that city council idea kept rumbling

[8:41] around in my mind and we uh got a hold

[8:43] of Ron, got a hold of other businesses

[8:44] in the area and started formulating a

[8:47] plan to start the Highland City Council

[8:49] or Highland Chamber of Commerce and uh I

[8:53] have never seen an idea catch on so

[8:55] quickly. I went throughout the city

[8:57] asking people that were business owners

[9:00] and I think I talked to 70 business

[9:02] owners in the Highland area and I think

[9:05] I had two that seemed kind of eh I'm not

[9:09] interested and 68 were like yeah we

[9:11] really need that and so it became kind

[9:13] of a passion for a while to get that

[9:15] started. We actually incorporated

[9:17] beginning of February. Uh filed our

[9:19] 501c6 uh right around the same time.

[9:22] We've now got the approval back from the

[9:24] IRS that we're officially a nonprofit

[9:27] 501c6 and uh everything's in order and filed and everything. And uh we

[9:34] during our first organizing meetings

[9:36] back in January, uh Chris Lendell, who

[9:39] is the owner of um what is it? it's uh

[9:43] Anytime Fitness. He was he was on our

[9:45] kind of uh organizing board and he said,

[9:48] you know, Alpine really should be part

[9:50] of this and uh so that came up and we

[9:54] ended up having a vote in that meeting

[9:55] and it was about nine to zero to include

[9:57] Alpine and so from that we just decided

[10:01] to name it Highland Alpine Chamber of

[10:02] Commerce and uh the discussion was

[10:04] there's a lot of shopping patterns that

[10:06] are similar for the Alpine and Highland

[10:08] area. a lot of businesses are similar,

[10:09] the demographics are similar between the

[10:11] two cities

[10:13] >> and uh it just made sense. So we

[10:15] included Alpine in it from the beginning

[10:18] from that point I should say that was

[10:21] about uh January February time frame and

[10:24] I will say I'd been gathering interest

[10:27] between the businesses for several

[10:28] months by that point in Highland. So

[10:31] we're a little bit behind in in Alpine.

[10:33] But uh once we organized the beginning

[10:35] of February, it's been a little over a

[10:36] month, we've already got I think 29

[10:39] members of our Chamber of Commerce and

[10:41] for a month and a half, that's pretty

[10:44] remarkable. That shows how much interest

[10:46] there was. And uh it's growing every

[10:48] day. We we get new companies signing up

[10:51] daily. And uh we started contacting the

[10:54] Alpine area shortly thereafter, about

[10:57] February time frame. And it takes it

[10:59] takes a couple months to get the

[11:00] interest up uh to get the contacts and

[11:02] everything, but we're starting to get

[11:03] signups from Alpine Area 2. Hugh and him

[11:06] signed up recently. Anna Robinson, uh

[11:08] Hidden Gymn Spa, Ben Nilson, they became

[11:11] a sponsor company. Ala Bank is a sponsor

[11:13] company. Um Courage Reigns from Highland

[11:16] is a sponsor sponsored company. Golds

[11:18] crypto al um Pizza Pie Cafe. And now we

[11:22] have our first organizing, our first uh

[11:25] meeting or lunchon is planned for

[11:27] tomorrow at 11 over at Pizza Pie Cafe.

[11:30] So, a lot of momentum, a lot of

[11:32] excitement about it. And I feel like

[11:33] with um our push is going to be to

[11:36] introduce the residents to businesses, to the residents, and get

[11:41] people to shop local in by increasing

[11:43] the uh uh increasing the uh tax revenue

[11:48] for the cities. um because we are

[11:51] locally central to Alpine Highland area,

[11:54] then we feel like um that will be a big

[11:56] push of ours to get the people in this

[11:58] area to shop locally and increase the

[11:59] tax revenue. So, member benefits, if I

[12:02] still have time, I I think I'm right. Uh

[12:04] free admission to monthly lunchons,

[12:06] unlimited seats, one city appointed

[12:08] board seat. Um we have nine members of

[12:10] our board. Uh there's two empty spots.

[12:13] One is reserved for a um an Alpine city

[12:17] council member and one's reserved for an

[12:18] Alpine business because we're trying to

[12:20] even up the Alpine and Highland um board

[12:24] members. Um inclus inclusion as a

[12:26] trustee member in the chamber of

[12:28] publications marketing. Um so we'll

[12:30] always be mentioning Alpine City if

[12:32] you're part of our chamber. Um we will

[12:35] be the business development arm of the

[12:36] city. We'll help build build goodwill

[12:38] with business community and city. Um

[12:41] kind of act as a liaison between

[12:43] businesses and city um support Alpine

[12:46] City and the Alpine days. Uh we'd like

[12:48] to, you know, jump in and support as

[12:50] much as we can this year and increase

[12:51] that support each year. Um strengthen

[12:55] communication between city and business

[12:56] community and help businesses succeed um

[13:00] increasing the taxes of the city. So

[13:03] those are the goals. Uh I want to leave

[13:05] some time for people to ask questions of

[13:06] me or about the chamber, about myself,

[13:08] about uh our goals as a chamber. You

[13:12] guys have any questions?

[13:13] >> Rob, thanks for coming. Yeah, just real

[13:15] quick ones. Now, and this is as much for

[13:18] us as well. Can we only be part of one

[13:20] chamber?

[13:21] >> No, I think you can be part of

[13:23] >> as many as you want.

[13:24] >> So, this is not like a andor thing or it

[13:26] could be both or could be one of the

[13:27] other. Okay.

[13:28] >> Absolutely. Y

[13:29] >> um Yeah. And then I had one other that

[13:31] I'll remember as soon as someone else

[13:33] starts. So, go ahead.

[13:36] I was curious about um because I I do on

[13:40] some somebody said that we only have

[13:42] like 12 retail. Do you know what is our

[13:44] what can you spec can you tell me about

[13:47] your research on Alpine businesses and

[13:49] what are their retail establishments and

[13:51] what's your goal specifically?

[13:53] >> This this explains why it's so needed.

[13:56] Um, I've already found about a hundred

[13:58] Alpine businesses and I think we'll end

[14:00] up with 200 at least once we dive into

[14:02] the in-home businesses and people have

[14:04] no idea these businesses are here. Um,

[14:07] and so we plan on publishing uh a list

[14:10] of businesses in Alpine and Highland

[14:12] eventually here uh probably late summer

[14:15] and trying to get that out to all the

[14:17] residents so everyone knows, hey, if I

[14:19] need someone to trim my trees, there's

[14:21] one or two options right here. I don't

[14:23] have to call someone from Provo down to

[14:25] trim my trees or if I need someone to

[14:27] fix my sprinklers. We have uh all the

[14:29] resources we need for 90% of our

[14:31] business needs within Highland and

[14:33] Alpine. And so that's that's a beautiful

[14:35] thing about it. So far I found 130

[14:38] Highland businesses and about 100 Alpine

[14:40] businesses.

[14:42] Um, okay. I work in Alpine

[14:45] >> and um, under this Alpine address, I

[14:48] think I had counted today because I'm

[14:50] working on registration with the state,

[14:52] 11 entities, but all of our operations

[14:54] are out of state.

[14:56] >> So, when you say that there's a hundred

[14:58] like I'm or 200 and I worked in I've

[15:01] worked this is my third job with Alpine

[15:04] address business license

[15:06] >> and most of the operations are not

[15:08] conducted inside of the city. Um, and so

[15:12] I'm I'm still trying to figure out what

[15:14] our needs are as a city for the the

[15:17] Chamber of Commerce. Um, we do have a

[15:19] few retail things like uh Alpine

[15:21] Fitness, which like you said is Anytime

[15:24] Fitness or

[15:25] >> um what are some other guys? Oh, Hugh

[15:28] and Ham, you did say that. You know, so

[15:31] I'm trying to understand how you

[15:32] perceive our needs to be because

[15:34] although I have 11 entities registered

[15:36] in the state of Utah with an alpine

[15:38] address, zero zero business activity

[15:41] happens in the state. So how does that

[15:44] work?

[15:45] >> Zero business activity happens in the

[15:47] state. I don't get that.

[15:48] >> We have all our operations are out of

[15:50] state.

[15:51] >> Oh, for your business? Okay.

[15:52] >> Yeah, that's what I'm saying. Like I if

[15:54] you went to the secretary of state and

[15:56] looked at all the businesses registered

[15:57] in Alpine, like we have zero like

[15:59] business operations here, but they're

[16:01] registered here because our headquarters

[16:03] are here. Oh,

[16:04] >> okay. That makes sense. Um I I think the

[16:07] one of the biggest goals I have is to

[16:09] help the residents know what businesses

[16:11] are here, the inhome businesses, the

[16:14] storefront businesses, and help dispel

[16:16] the the idea that they have to go

[16:18] outside of Alpine and Highland area to

[16:20] shop. So of the like one or 200 hundred,

[16:22] there may be more that would be like

[16:24] more retail in nature where like mine

[16:27] are not obviously.

[16:28] >> Well, for instance, one of my neighbors

[16:30] um they have a caramel apple company.

[16:33] They sell caramel apples. No one would

[16:34] have known that they do that if they

[16:36] don't get their word out. And so we're

[16:37] going to have them on our list. If you

[16:39] want to buy caramel apples, you can buy

[16:40] it from them. Um another one of my

[16:43] neighbors is is a plumber. You know, he

[16:45] works on the side. Um well he he does

[16:48] plumbing and he does landscaping and all

[16:49] kinds of different things. But um yeah,

[16:51] I think we'll a lot our eyes will be

[16:53] opened as to how much business there

[16:55] really is here because there's so many

[16:56] people that are trying to make ends

[16:57] meet. They have a full-time job. They

[16:59] want to progress in life so they have a

[17:01] business in the side. So I think I think

[17:03] you'll be surprised once we get our

[17:05] lists out of how many there are here.

[17:07] >> Okay. Thank you.

[17:09] >> Other questions?

[17:10] >> Yeah. Just along those same lines of I

[17:13] how have you gone about identifying

[17:14] those inhome businesses? My daughter

[17:16] Renza, she handmakes um and embroideries

[17:20] things for people and and I see this as

[17:22] like a great way for her to be able to

[17:24] get, you know, the word out like you

[17:26] said. And I've seen shop local campaigns

[17:29] be very successful, especially in

[17:31] communities our size where we maybe

[17:33] don't have a lot of storefronts, but we

[17:35] do have a lot of people that work very

[17:38] hard and have a lot of side jobs. So,

[17:40] what would your shop local initiative

[17:42] look like?

[17:44] Well, that's going to be a big part of

[17:46] every one of our meetings, helping

[17:48] identify additional businesses that we

[17:49] are unaware of. And once you start

[17:51] publishing and getting word out there's

[17:53] these businesses, then people will start

[17:54] contacting. I just keep my eyes open.

[17:56] The other day I was driving down the

[17:57] street and saw a sign for a small engine

[18:00] repair. And I called the number, ended

[18:02] up being a 15year-old. And I thought, I

[18:05] need small engine repair all the time.

[18:07] I'm always driving to American Fork to get that done. So just keeping your

[18:11] eyes open and asking around and once we start publishing here's a list

[18:15] of all businesses and if your business

[18:17] isn't listed call this number they'll

[18:19] come out of the woodwork more but

[18:21] already they're coming out of the

[18:22] woodwork really fast for me.

[18:24] >> So what would that publication look

[18:25] like? That's what I'm

[18:27] >> Does that go to each home? What how do I

[18:29] know? So, we're we're putting a lot of

[18:32] our already we've got $8,000 in sales

[18:35] and most of that budget is scheduled or

[18:38] at least half of it is scheduled for

[18:40] events and publication. We're putting

[18:41] more towards a publication than anything

[18:43] else, but there's a lot of advertising

[18:45] that goes into the publication. So, I'm

[18:47] expecting a loss the first year and our

[18:48] revenue, we've already got enough

[18:50] revenue to cover a loss, but just

[18:52] depends on how much money we have and

[18:54] how much advertising we get. I'd love it

[18:56] to go to every resident. Um, that's the

[18:59] goal.

[19:00] >> Okay. Thank you.

[19:02] >> Anybody else?

[19:06] » Yeah, just two questions. How much does

[19:08] it cost for a municipal municipality to

[19:10] join? Just

[19:11] >> So, we're charging $2,500 this year.

[19:14] It's uh

[19:16] pretty low, but we're new. You know, we

[19:18] don't want to oversell ourselves, so I

[19:19] think that's fair fair first year price.

[19:22] >> And what do you see as a value ad for a

[19:24] city to be part of the chamber? The list

[19:26] I went through um covers it covers most

[19:29] of what I could think of. But I wanted

[19:31] to ask you all too what what besides the

[19:35] list that I gave. Maybe you could put

[19:36] that

[19:38] >> presentation.

[19:39] >> Oh, they don't. Oh, okay.

[19:41] >> Oh, okay. Yeah, I could go over those

[19:44] again. Um,

[19:45] I I think I think the biggest uh

[19:48] advantage is just connecting businesses

[19:51] and helping businesses grow in the area,

[19:54] but that helps the city because the city

[19:56] gets revenue from the local businesses.

[19:59] Um, and just being a place where you can

[20:02] say, "Hey, come to Alpine with your

[20:05] business." Or I don't know if that's a

[20:07] goal of Alpine, but but if you come to

[20:09] Alpine with your business, there is a

[20:10] chamber of commerce that will help you

[20:11] succeed. So, it really helps the whole

[20:13] community

[20:14] >> and I think some budget goes to

[20:16] community development for every city.

[20:21] » Thank you, Heidi. That's helpful.

[20:22] >> Oh, that's helpful. Thanks. Um, but I'm

[20:24] also very open. I I'd love to hear if

[20:27] there's not something on our list, what

[20:29] is is there that I could do to help? I

[20:31] mean,

[20:31] >> well, it's the Well, you chatted earlier

[20:33] and it's the thing I brought up where uh

[20:36] we have a lot of business pro people,

[20:39] but we live in a town that is very

[20:42] sensitive to business overkill,

[20:44] overgrowth, overwhelm.

[20:46] >> Yes.

[20:47] >> And not the business. It's almost not

[20:49] the business. It's more of the side

[20:51] effects

[20:52] >> of even a successful business. So, maybe

[20:54] just something there where you we can

[20:55] balance the uh the identity of Alpine

[21:00] which is quiet, safe, low traffic, low

[21:03] tax.

[21:04] >> Um,

[21:05] >> and even though you won't have

[21:06] businesses like building huge buildings

[21:08] here, I think that uh the homebased

[21:12] business is getting a little more

[21:14] traction, probably is in line with

[21:16] Alpine Cities.

[21:17] >> That's the only thing I could see added.

[21:19] >> If the city decides not to join as a

[21:23] community member, are Alpine businesses

[21:25] still are you going to still allow them

[21:27] to join your chamber?

[21:28] >> Absolutely. Yeah, it would be nice to

[21:30] have the partnership with ship with the

[21:32] city and for instance, Highland City has

[21:34] already asked that we we have a bigger

[21:37] list of businesses than they have. And

[21:38] so they've asked us to help them find

[21:41] advertisers for the um their events

[21:44] coming up in the summertime for their

[21:46] advertisements. And just like that with

[21:48] Alpine Days, we do the same thing. We'd

[21:50] send out an email notification. Hey,

[21:51] they're looking for advertisers. If if

[21:54] you'd like your business to advertise,

[21:55] here's who you contact. So, kind of in

[21:57] partnership with all of your events and

[21:59] things like that, we we'd love to be an

[22:02] assistance there. An assistant there.

[22:05] So,

[22:05] >> thank you very much. Appreciate your

[22:07] time.

[22:07] >> Yeah.

[22:08] >> Oh, I did have one question since we

[22:09] don't didn't get a copy of your

[22:11] presentation. Is that going to be

[22:12] available?

[22:13] >> Yeah, Heidi can send that out.

[22:15] >> Okay.

[22:16] >> One last comment, too. The city of uh of

[22:20] Highland voted five to zero to ex accept

[22:23] become a member of the chamber. We

[22:25] haven't got that ironed out. It's it's

[22:26] pending the memorandum of of of

[22:28] understanding, but Candace from from

[22:30] Highland City already called me up and

[22:32] said, "Hey, there's a business that

[22:33] called the city, wanted to know about

[22:35] the resources." She hooked me up with

[22:36] her. I gave her some advice. I I've been

[22:39] a business consultant for over 25 years.

[22:42] And and as a chamber president, I feel

[22:43] like a little bit of free advice to

[22:45] every business is in order. So, just

[22:47] talked to her for 20 minutes. But just a

[22:49] I think it's just a good re resource to

[22:51] have the um uh chamber of commerce

[22:54] available to the city. So

[22:55] >> I do like the idea of having like a

[22:57] locals list because sometimes

[23:00] we we call it the alpine tax. We So if I

[23:04] have a repair to be done in one part of

[23:06] town and I say one address versus this

[23:09] address,

[23:10] >> we get a different price. So it'd be

[23:12] nice to know who's local. Thank you.

[23:15] >> Okay. Um, America Fork Chamber of

[23:18] Commerce is next.

[23:23] » Thank you for allowing us to take some

[23:25] time. Uh, by introduction, my name is

[23:28] Brad Frost. Um, I'm the president of the

[23:30] American Fork Chamber. And I will say

[23:33] that we have a a PowerPoint. I'm

[23:36] understanding that you'll get that. So,

[23:38] I'm just going to kind of go off the

[23:39] cuff because I think that PowerPoint

[23:41] will tell a lot of things. Actually,

[23:43] anything that they had had to be here by

[23:45] Friday. So, this is new. So, if you want

[23:49] to show a slide, let me know at all.

[23:51] >> It would be what you received today.

[23:53] Send.

[23:53] >> Yeah. No, and it's in front of them. So,

[23:55] you just tell me what you want.

[23:56] >> You got that today. Okay. You know what?

[23:58] I was under the impression maybe it was

[24:00] there. Thank you very much. So, um,

[24:05] uh, I am a mayor of American Fork and I

[24:07] appreciate the accommodation because I

[24:09] will be on that side of the the rostroom

[24:11] here shortly. But, uh, I don't want you

[24:13] to feel rushed at all. We can take our

[24:15] time and they can start without me if

[24:17] they need to. But, uh, my background is

[24:21] people. It's what I've always loved to

[24:24] do is be a part of people. uh to form

[24:27] relationships,

[24:29] um get close to people, to understand

[24:31] who they are, what they do, and I think

[24:33] it just makes the world a better place

[24:35] when you find that out about each other.

[24:37] And I think that's one of the chamber's

[24:38] real um fun foundational goals is to

[24:42] learn and to connect. And so I want to

[24:45] tell you just a little bit about the

[24:46] American for Chamber. Just uh the

[24:48] structure of the chamber as you see in

[24:51] this slide, we've been around for 80

[24:54] years. We we've been around a long time.

[24:57] We will celebrate that 80y year mark in

[24:59] on May 2nd of this year. I started um up

[25:02] in the chambers of city hall in American

[25:04] Fork and it's going strong. It's a very

[25:07] vibrant um organization.

[25:11] We have an executive board that

[25:13] comprised of four members of the of the

[25:16] governing board. The governing board is

[25:18] uh made up of 13 individuals that

[25:21] they're from different cities within the

[25:24] chamber that have the heart to volunteer

[25:26] and be a part of this organization.

[25:30] We have added three ex official members

[25:34] as well. We have a member of Senator

[25:37] Mike Lee's staff that is there to not

[25:40] vote, but just to advise and to give

[25:43] consent and things like that as we meet

[25:46] as a chamber board along with Kate

[25:48] Christopherson, a representative from

[25:50] the state of Utah. And uh we'll have one

[25:53] more in about a month. But we just felt

[25:55] like it was kind of helpful to have

[25:57] people around us as well to maybe point

[26:00] out things that we're not seeing. Now, I

[26:03] do not want to make this sound or feel

[26:05] in any way that we are big and they are

[26:07] small. Um, because uh that is not my

[26:11] intent, but I can't help but just talk

[26:13] about the structure and what I see and I

[26:17] view on almost every day. And when we

[26:20] get together, it's a big event. It's a

[26:23] big tent.

[26:25] And in that tent, there is plenty of

[26:27] room for the big corporations that we

[26:31] all know. If you can change to another

[26:33] slide, maybe the the second or the third

[26:36] slide.

[26:39] » Yes, thank you.

[26:42] But the great thing about this big tent

[26:45] is that the bigger corporations are the

[26:48] people inside them. They look after and

[26:51] they will nurture the small ones.

[26:54] They're there to be a resource to them.

[26:57] They will even um offer up their their

[27:00] physical space,

[27:02] >> but maybe more importantly their time to

[27:05] be a part of this synergy of a chamber.

[27:10] Um

[27:12] a couple things that we do I think that

[27:13] are very unique. Okay. Because we know

[27:16] that it's a it's a changing landscape in

[27:20] business. And so we offer training.

[27:23] Last month we did cyber no this coming

[27:26] week we're doing cyber security and

[27:28] website optimization that can fit the

[27:32] home business it can fit a larger

[27:34] corporation and we'll have all

[27:35] represented there um AI integration into

[27:40] the into your marketing again one of

[27:42] those things that can be a very basic

[27:44] fund fundamental principle in any

[27:46] business big or small

[27:49] um

[27:51] we um feel very

[27:56] um we feel good about how we are

[27:59] interacting with our communities

[28:01] understanding that Alpine is not in the

[28:04] name of the American Fork Chamber. We

[28:07] have the Lump Business Alliance

[28:10] that was uh formed about five years ago

[28:14] and inside that we have Cedar Hills.

[28:18] Formerly we had Highland and we're

[28:20] hoping to keep um Alpine into into that

[28:23] alliance and it's a way of I think maybe

[28:27] for what I would explain is to kind of

[28:29] pull the American Fork name away and

[28:31] give you some identity but there's

[28:33] nothing greater than having the synergy

[28:36] of multiple communities and we will use

[28:39] that I connected today with the PG Lynen

[28:42] Chamber and the Point of the Mount

[28:44] Chamber. We're planning an event and all

[28:47] our chamber members will be welcome to

[28:49] attend that event. It'll be at UVU. We

[28:52] are hosting a women in business um panel

[28:56] and we've got some really fun people

[28:58] that are coming to that. And so that's

[29:01] when the synergy of all the chambers

[29:03] come together to provide resources and a

[29:07] place for people to connect to talk

[29:09] business and to talk pleasure to make

[29:12] life a little bit better. One of the

[29:15] things and I just want to mention it

[29:16] very briefly but it's something that I'm

[29:19] very excited about and it's a it's found

[29:21] in just a small story and I was watching

[29:23] a video probably one of them mindless

[29:26] times where you just kind of scroll. I

[29:28] kind of have fun seeing how creative

[29:30] people can be on Instagram and how they

[29:33] could just do silly things. Gentleman's

[29:36] at Starbucks

[29:38] and he has his coffee and he he has an

[29:43] exchange with the person behind it and

[29:45] he says, "Wait, it's not done." And the

[29:48] gentleman hands it back and he says, "I

[29:52] need a little love in it." And so she

[29:54] just sprinkled a little love. And it was

[29:58] how she replied back to him. He says,

[30:00] 'How much is that going to cost? And he

[30:02] said, she said, love is free. So we're

[30:06] going to take that love is free. We've

[30:08] kind of encircled what it is, what we

[30:10] can do with it, and we're going to make

[30:12] that a drip campaign and we're going to

[30:14] pull that along with us in the coming

[30:16] years to think that we can talk

[30:18] business. there's a point of there's an

[30:21] exchange there's a return

[30:23] but along the way the love is free and

[30:26] we can kind of bring up society. We

[30:29] think that that that's not a bad thing

[30:31] to do along the way. So that is very

[30:34] briefly some of our that's just a a

[30:37] brief introduction to what it is and I'm available for questions now and I

[30:43] can I'll be leaving another piece of

[30:45] information and I would welcome a phone

[30:47] call at any time in the coming weeks to

[30:50] help satisfy any of your questions.

[30:52] >> How long has Alpine been a participant

[30:54] in your organization?

[30:56] >> Officially in the Lone Peak Alliance

[30:57] about almost five five and a half six

[31:00] years. And what level of participation

[31:02] have you seen from Alpine businesses and

[31:04] what kind of benefits have you seen them

[31:07] get over those five years? Um,

[31:10] sparse. We we've had uh we've had some

[31:15] notables like the the Arts Center and in

[31:18] fact for every business big or small, we

[31:20] have a landing page where you can

[31:22] actually host your website. It's in our

[31:24] directory and I can think of probably at

[31:28] least three. Now, I will say this, I've

[31:31] been on the job for three weeks and I'll

[31:33] know more in three more weeks. Uh, but

[31:37] there's room to be had done in Alpine.

[31:41] What I have learned about a chamber is

[31:43] that you you get you get back what you

[31:46] put into it. So, we'll ever be in front

[31:48] of people trying to show them the just

[31:52] the the things that can help them in

[31:54] their business. Some see it and some

[31:56] don't, and that's okay. some of your big

[31:59] corporate tenants. I'm thinking what's

[32:00] their ROI on a big corporate tenant? And

[32:03] then I've learned that Alphab Bank loves

[32:05] to feel that make people feel like they

[32:07] are part of the community. They want to be literally be in the

[32:12] fabric and so they choose the chamber as

[32:15] one of those avenues so that they can be

[32:17] part of something grand. And they do it

[32:20] not here but they do it Provo, they do

[32:21] it in Spanish Fork. They're everywhere.

[32:24] And so we offer that to them as a and

[32:27] they're a great partner. Same with IHC

[32:29] Inter Mountain Health like that. So

[32:33] Councilman Rumbler, I can I can research

[32:35] that and I can absolutely give you, you

[32:38] know, exact data if you're okay with

[32:41] that.

[32:41] >> Sure.

[32:44] >> Anybody else have questions?

[32:45] >> What What's the cost on that we're

[32:47] paying currently on the American Fork

[32:49] one?

[32:49] >> So community partner is $3,500.

[32:52] >> That's yearly. These are both yearly,

[32:54] >> correct?

[32:54] >> Okay.

[32:54] >> Y

[32:58] » um is this question just for Brad? I had

[33:00] a question for you.

[33:03] >> I I was actually assigned to this and I

[33:05] went to many of your meetings and it was

[33:08] good to connect and see like how all the

[33:10] cities are well really how all the

[33:12] businesses are, you know, operating and

[33:15] we talked about transportation once. Um,

[33:18] we had a report from every mayor, state

[33:20] of the city reports and u

[33:23] >> there was one of them that was kind of

[33:24] lacking. I know it was kind of boring

[33:26] and

[33:27] >> No, it wasn't. It was awesome. So, I do

[33:30] and I did uh like meet a lot of people

[33:33] in the general area um just to share my

[33:37] experience with those. And then I I did

[33:40] have I'll just be honest like I thought you were very accurate that I

[33:45] would try and ask people, oh, where are

[33:46] you from? you know, where's your

[33:47] business? Where's your And there was so

[33:48] very little participation from Alpine.

[33:51] There was and then we had to highlight

[33:54] um a business and we were struggling to

[33:57] find some some that like were actually

[33:59] participating in the chamber. So, you

[34:02] know, between um that limited experience

[34:06] I've had, Carla is the expert. She goes

[34:08] to far more things than I've ever gone

[34:09] to and has been in that role longer. But

[34:12] I was as I don't I haven't quite

[34:14] understood as like a city person and

[34:18] you're you you're wearing two hats here,

[34:20] right? Because you you you're elected.

[34:22] How we can um generate the commercial

[34:27] part of our city without our residents

[34:31] becoming um alarmed.

[34:33] >> Yeah. So I I think that like you guys

[34:36] have a very much like American Fork and

[34:38] other even Highland and Cedar Hills have

[34:40] a very robust retail area which we lack

[34:44] and so I think that that's why we have

[34:46] sparse participation but I would like

[34:48] your insight into both you know our role

[34:51] is um developing more commercial

[34:54] business in the city and then our the

[34:57] role of the c the com um chamber of

[35:00] commerce like increasing that because I

[35:03] haven't I I don't really have a good

[35:06] feeling for what needs to happen or if

[35:08] it's a good fit.

[35:09] >> Yeah. Well, you won't like my answer.

[35:11] And you know, I think I think that

[35:14] Alpine, as I have observed over the

[35:17] years, you like the quaint almost the

[35:20] bedroom community.

[35:21] >> They do.

[35:21] >> The only way to generate it would be

[35:24] when I turn that little corner, just put

[35:25] about 300 units. Go seven stories. Maybe

[35:29] Walmart will follow you.

[35:31] >> Wait, what?

[35:32] >> Okay. But but

[35:33] >> you're absolutely right. Not only

[35:36] >> not only will I not like it, but none of

[35:38] the people that elected me would be

[35:40] happy.

[35:40] >> But there there is an interesting there

[35:42] is a an interesting shift in business.

[35:45] >> There's a interesting shift in business

[35:48] >> shift. Okay.

[35:48] >> And I and I have seen it on our sales

[35:51] tax reports and that is the point of

[35:54] sale for us is the home. I mean I mean

[35:58] you would think that u American Fork we

[36:00] have a very robust um commerce. We are

[36:04] we're on a hub of a lot of different

[36:06] things there. The the the lake just kind

[36:08] of turns everybody right there. And for

[36:11] the first time I'm seeing Amazon surpass

[36:14] our car dealers.

[36:16] >> Wow.

[36:17] >> In in total J revenue month by month.

[36:21] And so they it's even last year they

[36:23] Amazon combined. So the point of sale is

[36:27] at the door. That's a very strong has to

[36:29] be an increased revenue source for

[36:31] Alpine. And as a chamber, we can help

[36:34] support those small small homegrown

[36:38] business, but they've got to be able to

[36:39] turn it and put it on your zip code. So

[36:43] the point of sale stays within your

[36:45] city.

[36:47] >> So yeah, we were a little bit afraid of

[36:49] that. We thought the brick and mortar is

[36:50] going away, but we've noticed that the

[36:52] trend is going that direction. And we've

[36:55] discussed that as a board and how we can

[36:57] help support that. Um um not just for

[37:00] the good of the city, for the good of

[37:02] people. If that's way like to conduct

[37:04] business, and it is a trend, we're

[37:06] becoming a a society that likes things

[37:08] quick and easy and to our doorstep.

[37:11] Pretty soon it'll be drones. You might

[37:13] not like that one. I don't know. I We'll

[37:16] see. But it uh so that's and then as a

[37:18] community partner too I think that there

[37:20] is one this is the lens that I have um

[37:25] there's by supporting some of our

[37:29] being in our chamber in a very real way

[37:31] you are supporting a lot of the

[37:33] employers

[37:35] that will that that commute back into

[37:37] your city um the domos the lbts and

[37:42] things like that so we try to be of any

[37:45] resource we can be to make them

[37:47] successful knowing that in return

[37:50] success will follow them and it'll

[37:52] follow the people that work with them

[37:54] and uh their suppliers as well.

[37:58] I don't know if that's an angle you've

[38:00] considered, but I didn't just make that

[38:02] up. I actually have thought that through

[38:05] a little bit to think that however we

[38:06] can make a business succeed, the success

[38:09] will grow with it and go with it. It'll

[38:12] go back to a home.

[38:14] >> For sure. Um I I'm an accounting

[38:17] background too and I went to this

[38:18] accounting uh lecture and it changed my

[38:21] whole view of business and they said the

[38:23] most charitable thing you could do is

[38:25] employ someone full-time. And so it's not necessarily like you're saying

[38:31] that there's a brickandmortar store, but

[38:33] there's a family behind every employee

[38:35] and that's that's the most important

[38:37] part of business. Thank you.

[38:40] >> Does anybody else have any other

[38:42] questions?

[38:44] Thank you. Appreciate your time.

[38:45] >> Very much. Appreciate your time.

[38:47] >> Thank you both. Um we will probably um

[38:51] be bringing this back on the agenda for

[38:53] a vote at a future meeting and um we'll

[38:58] let you guys know where we land. Um

[39:00] let's move on to public comment. We'll

[39:03] go back to item three

[39:08] proposals.

[39:10] Okay. We have Michelle Shamway followed

[39:14] by Kyle Shamway.

[39:17] >> Oh, okay. If you guys can come up and um

[39:19] state your names and you could just say

[39:22] your street that you're on

[39:24] >> and um you have three minutes to make a

[39:27] presentation and after you will be Mario

[39:30] Jes.

[39:34] » Can you hear me? Okay.

[39:36] Uh we are Kyle and Michelle Shamway. And

[39:38] first of all, I just want to thank you

[39:40] guys so much for all the time, energy,

[39:41] and love that you put into Alpine. Um a

[39:44] little bit of background. I grew up in

[39:46] Alpine. My family moved here when I was

[39:48] 12. And um I was actually in Andrew

[39:51] Young's ward. His mom was my young

[39:52] women's leader. Love her dearly. And I

[39:55] love Alpine. I love Alpine so much that

[39:57] we stayed here. We just love it. Um,

[40:01] what we'd like to do today is I'm hoping

[40:03] to um that maybe you might be willing to

[40:06] take another look at letting golf carts

[40:08] be legal in Alpine. Um, I'm talking a

[40:11] lot, but

[40:12] >> you're good. No, you take it away. I I

[40:14] agree with everything she says.

[40:16] >> So, one of the things I loved so much um

[40:18] growing up in Alpine was the small town

[40:20] feel that Alpine had and the community

[40:22] feel. I remember um I was amazed as a

[40:26] 12-year-old coming from Salt Lake City

[40:28] seeing people waving to each other,

[40:30] everyone that drove by and even horses

[40:32] riding by and just the magical feel it

[40:35] was to be part of such a small

[40:36] community. And I really feel strongly

[40:39] that golf carts um bring that community

[40:42] feel. And as far as danger goes, I I

[40:44] personally don't see um them as any more

[40:47] dangerous than um an ebike or a siron or

[40:50] even a bike. And so with that in mind,

[40:53] weighing the pros and the cons and and

[40:55] with a goal of like just thinking that

[40:59] it will make Alpine a happier, pleasant

[41:01] community, um I feel like maybe it's

[41:04] worth taking another look at. So

[41:06] >> I like the idea that Highland recent Oh

[41:09] yeah, sure.

[41:10] >> Highland City also recently, as far as

[41:12] my understanding goes, has legalized uh

[41:15] golf carts. And it's not like cart

[41:17] launch anything goes. They have certain

[41:19] guidelines and it's in their ordinance.

[41:20] And so that's what we'd like to do is

[41:22] have you guys take a look at putting it

[41:24] into the city ordinance, make sure

[41:25] everyone knows what the laws are, giving

[41:27] the Lone Peak Police Department clear

[41:29] guidelines that are exactly the same

[41:31] among Highland and Alpine so that

[41:33] everyone knows the the rules and the

[41:35] laws and so everything stays safe and

[41:37] that people will be allowed to use their

[41:39] golf carts. Ours has been in the garage

[41:41] for the last like over a year and a

[41:43] half. So

[41:44] >> yeah,

[41:44] >> we'd like to start using again. Yeah.

[41:46] Anyway, yeah. So, I just want to thank

[41:48] you so much for your time and your

[41:49] consideration and hope you'll take a

[41:51] second look at that. Thank you. Thanks a

[41:52] lot.

[41:53] >> Thank you.

[41:54] >> Okay, if we could have Mario followed by

[41:57] Julie Daly.

[42:13] » Good afternoon.

[42:15] My name is Mario Jimenez. I live on

[42:17] Whitby Woodlands Drive. Um, I had the

[42:19] pleasure of addressing the city council

[42:21] here two weeks ago. I'm back uh for the

[42:24] same reason. I'd like to try to first of

[42:25] all, I wanted to thank the

[42:31] members of the city council that were

[42:33] kind enough to answer my emails.

[42:36] Um, I'd also like to basically visit

[42:39] with you for just a second as a

[42:42] professional safety. Um,

[42:47] I' I've been in the safety business over

[42:49] 50 years. And um, one of the things that

[42:51] I kind of wanted to talk to the council

[42:53] about is I'm certainly open to any

[42:55] feedback, to any questions, to anything

[42:57] that anybody would like to ask me. I

[42:59] think I can present a view that provides

[43:02] metrics, that provides data, that

[43:03] provides a scientific look at

[43:07] encapsulating or incorporating that

[43:09] municipal code that the city of Highland

[43:12] has chosen to do. Um, statistically a an organization that does not codify

[43:20] does not identify a particular ordinance

[43:22] or procedure or policy has a greater

[43:25] chance of risk that one that has it

[43:28] clearly identified. And so that's

[43:30] something to keep in mind. In my humble

[43:33] opinion, the easiest way, the best

[43:37] return on investment, the most efficient

[43:39] way for the city of Alpine is to

[43:41] basically use the city of Highlands code

[43:44] to create a skeleton. It's already

[43:46] there. It it it agrees with all of the

[43:50] DOT, a Department of Public Safety, uh,

[43:52] highway patrol, all that stuff agrees.

[43:54] So, they've done a fantastic job. Once

[43:56] again, I'm open to any feedback. I I

[43:59] would love to meet with each of you

[44:00] individually. I can spend five minutes

[44:03] or two hours talking about safety and

[44:04] how I honestly sincerely think that this

[44:07] will make the city of Alpine a safer

[44:12] uh city to live in by codifying and

[44:14] identifying these. Um,

[44:17] once again, my primary goal here, and I

[44:19] think the goal of the other people that

[44:21] are going to profer the idea of the golf

[44:23] carts is to solicit one more city

[44:27] council member to back Andrew up and

[44:30] allow us to move this forward to then

[44:32] intelligently spend some time

[44:34] researching, looking at it, studying it.

[44:37] because if we don't get to that point

[44:38] where we study, we're we're we're not

[44:42] being good stewards of our uh of our

[44:45] responsibilities. Once again, I thank

[44:47] you for your time and anything that I

[44:49] can do to answer anybody's question,

[44:50] I'll be more than happy to do that.

[44:52] >> Thank you. Um if we can have Julie Daly

[44:56] come up, if you can just state your

[44:57] name, the road that you live on, and

[44:59] then followed following Julie will be

[45:02] Sid McGee. Hi, I'm I'm sorry I lost my

[45:05] voice yesterday, but hi, I'm Julie Daly.

[45:07] I live off River Circle just around the

[45:09] corner and I'm to just here to ask you

[45:12] to look at the golf cart situation

[45:14] again. And for the past 30 years, we've

[45:16] been here almost 11 years, but in 30

[45:19] years of marriage, we lived in several

[45:20] big cities in the country. And we were

[45:22] drawn to this community as I'm sure all

[45:24] of you were for the small town feel and

[45:27] for being able to get lots of great

[45:29] parks and schools and all the things are

[45:31] so close and to have a golf cart to be

[45:34] able to go to some of those a low-speed

[45:36] vehicle not going more than 25 miles an

[45:38] hour with blinkers and windshield wipers

[45:40] and all the mirrors all the with seat

[45:43] belts all the things you need is so much

[45:45] cleaner for the environment. Um they're

[45:47] electric. you just plug them in and

[45:49] they're so much better for the

[45:50] environment. But we would also be one of

[45:53] five other cities that have already

[45:55] approved this besides Highland. You've

[45:57] got St. George. And I'm not I know that

[45:59] there are three more, but um we love it

[46:02] here. And we feel like especially when

[46:05] we have the beautiful weather that we do

[46:06] in the in the summer and this year in

[46:09] the spring and the fall, it is such a

[46:11] great way to be able to see your

[46:13] neighbors, to see anyone in the

[46:15] community, to be able to stop quickly,

[46:17] wave at anyone in the soccer fields, at the parks, um because you're outside

[46:21] on your golf cart. And um we've just

[46:24] noticed the same thing. It just does

[46:25] bring a sense of community getting to

[46:27] see other people. So, I hope you'll

[46:29] consider it. Thanks.

[46:31] >> Thank you. Um

[46:33] Sid McGee, if you could state the street

[46:35] that you live on and

[46:40] » Nice. Hi. Um thanks for hearing us out.

[46:43] Um I'm Siv McGee. I live on Campfire

[46:46] Circle. Um and I'm

[46:48] >> Is that Sid or Sim?

[46:50] >> Sid Syd.

[46:52] >> Yeah. Um, and uh, yeah, I just want to

[46:55] echo what's already been said. I mean,

[46:56] we we we love to use it mostly just to

[46:59] communicate, uh, commute to, uh, the

[47:02] local parks, everything within like a

[47:04] mile or two of our house, and it's a

[47:05] really, uh, you know, one of the

[47:07] highlights of of of the summer. Um, and all the seasons that permit it. And,

[47:12] um, yeah, I mean, we would just same

[47:14] thing. I think that if the we can adopt

[47:16] the guidelines of of Highland and do it

[47:18] in a way that the the vehicles are

[47:20] registered, that they have their safety

[47:22] requirements met. We have seat belts, we

[47:24] have blinkers, we have license plate,

[47:25] it's been insured. Um just be able to

[47:28] have that ability to move freely through

[47:30] the community in uh in the golf cart

[47:32] would be great. And then um we also loan

[47:35] it out in the summertime for them to uh

[47:37] transport um the seniors to like the

[47:40] park for like the car show and other

[47:42] things like that. So, um, everyone loves

[47:44] it. It's really fun. So, I understand

[47:46] that, um, you know, where it may have

[47:48] originated from to try to keep a handle

[47:50] on it. Um, I think from the point of

[47:52] view of, uh, you know, you know, kids

[47:55] using them or getting out of control,

[47:57] but I think it's very similar to, uh,

[47:59] cars, like we, you know, we can't have

[48:01] kids under 16 just driving cars around

[48:03] and having a good time. And the surons

[48:05] are crazy. I know that. We're trying to

[48:07] get a handle on that as well. But I

[48:08] think uh you know if we can distinguish

[48:11] those things that would satisfy uh you

[48:13] know the the council feeling safety with

[48:15] uh safe with with permitting the golf

[48:17] carts that would be really great. So

[48:20] that's uh that's it.

[48:22] >> Thank you.

[48:23] >> So we do have three additional public

[48:25] comments. Normally we don't take public

[48:28] comment for items that are in on the

[48:30] agenda but if Andrew will guarantee me

[48:32] that we get out before midnight today I

[48:35] will.

[48:35] >> Yes I can guarantee midnight. We haven't

[48:38] gone that far yet.

[48:40] >> But just so you know, I did not ask all

[48:42] these golf clubs to come.

[48:44] >> So, let's

[48:44] >> I I don't even know some of them.

[48:46] >> Let's start with Martha Beck followed by

[48:49] Andy Spencer and we'll end with Steve

[48:51] Jolly if we can go in that order. Again,

[48:54] if you could state your name and the

[48:55] street that you live on. You don't have

[48:57] to give your house address.

[49:00] >> Thank you. I'm Martha Beck. I live on

[49:02] 100 South. Thank you for all your hard

[49:04] work. I know it can sometimes be

[49:06] thankless and people can be honory. Um

[49:13] I feel like I should be better educated

[49:16] on the whole fire station senior center.

[49:21] Um

[49:23] my concern is

[49:25] could things be done in a different way

[49:28] that would

[49:30] make it not as expensive tax-wise?

[49:34] I could say that I'm very blessed that

[49:37] we got our home

[49:40] in 91. So that's a great thing. It was a

[49:44] great deal.

[49:46] That being said, we will pay more

[49:49] in property taxes

[49:52] in the life of us living in that home

[49:55] than we paid for

[49:57] the whole mortgage.

[50:00] So you know I maybe you'll give more

[50:04] information that will help me understand

[50:06] the wise it has to be done how it's

[50:10] projected at this point but I'm just

[50:12] wondering

[50:14] seems like there's other places that we

[50:16] could gather for a senior center. Thank

[50:20] you.

[50:20] >> Thank you

[50:23] Andy Spencer followed by Steve Jolly.

[50:28] Thank you, mayor and council. Appreciate

[50:30] the the moment to speak. Just want to

[50:32] speak uh for a minute. Oh, I live on 200

[50:34] East. Sorry, forgot that. Uh I just want

[50:37] to speak for a minute on a a discussion

[50:39] item on the agenda tonight um relative

[50:41] to the storage unit considerations. Um I uh certainly understand that there is

[50:47] a pragmatic element to these that uh

[50:49] something positive needs to happen with

[50:51] the purple site and you know, if it's

[50:53] not the storage units, then what? I

[50:55] think that that's often been discussed

[50:56] as this has been leading up to potential

[50:58] council votes on this issue. I I think

[51:01] that I would ask that you back up and look at this from more of a

[51:05] long-term land land use perspective and

[51:09] look at the current planning efforts of

[51:10] the city in regard to what has been

[51:12] contemplated for the area from the city

[51:16] hall blocks north as far as its

[51:17] transitional nature to the residential

[51:19] uses. And uh um while it is tempting to

[51:25] um

[51:27] have something positive happen, uh look

[51:30] at what's the right decision uh for uh

[51:33] the city in a longer term sense as far

[51:36] as you know what's the right land use

[51:38] there. Um because uh as I've indicated

[51:41] in some communication with you uh the

[51:43] decisions that you make relative to land

[51:45] use will far outlive you. they will

[51:47] outlive me. And uh you know the uh

[51:50] evidence of that is the fact that we're

[51:52] now battling uh with the land use that's

[51:55] uh in congruent with where the community

[51:58] is today. And so those are very

[52:00] difficult decisions and I understand why

[52:02] they're difficult decisions. I

[52:03] understand that you know having

[52:05] something positive in front of you that could happen is is certainly

[52:09] alluring. Um, but I would encourage you

[52:11] to look at uh the long-term vision of

[52:14] the community and where uh you see the

[52:17] community 10 years from now, 20 years

[52:19] from now, and what the right land use

[52:22] decision is and incorporate that in your

[52:25] decision-m um and as a a last side note,

[52:29] um while I don't advocate for it, uh if

[52:32] you are inclined to move forward with a

[52:34] storage unit there, I I understand and

[52:37] I've read some of the provisions that

[52:38] are in the code trying to limit uh uses

[52:40] of storage units other areas in the

[52:41] city. I would suggest that some type of

[52:43] overlay zone would be a better approach

[52:46] um than actually including the

[52:48] regulations in the general business

[52:50] commercial zoning. Um but again for me

[52:53] that would be certainly secondary and a

[52:55] fallback. Uh uh I I would advocate for

[52:57] something that is more transitional in

[52:59] nature in its character. Uh because

[53:02] while it may mean holding out for a

[53:03] little while longer, I think that it

[53:05] provides a better future for the

[53:07] community. And I know I'm out of time.

[53:08] Thanks.

[53:09] >> Thank you. Okay, Mr. Jolly.

[53:18] » Thank you very much for uh the

[53:20] opportunity to stand up and speak to

[53:21] you. Um u just like was advocated

[53:25] >> name.

[53:25] >> Oh yeah, let's start with that. My name

[53:27] is Steve Jolly. I live on 300 East. Um

[53:30] I'm a downtowner. I've been here for 33

[53:34] years. Um anyway, I really appreciate

[53:36] city council and you mayor Merrill and

[53:40] the the comments that were just the two

[53:43] before me. Um those are really the

[53:47] exactly what I would say. So I don't

[53:48] want to take up my time on those. But um

[53:52] and I apologize that um I I sent out an

[53:55] email I hope that all the council

[53:56] members got whenever you open them. Um,

[53:59] I said I'm late, but uh I needed to be I

[54:03] needed to be more informed, I guess. And

[54:05] it's my fault that I I didn't know about

[54:07] some of these issues

[54:09] until uh a recent meeting with some um

[54:14] Alpiners that are concerned about some

[54:16] of the things coming up. So, I just my

[54:19] thing is is

[54:21] I appreciate the jobs you all do and I

[54:25] know that you are our voice. I mean, we

[54:27] hire you, correct? And and so

[54:31] I just feel that some of these decisions

[54:35] that get made might be moving too fast.

[54:37] And there's a lot of smart people in

[54:40] town. And I'm not saying I'm the smart

[54:41] guy. I'm I'm saying that there's a lot

[54:43] of ideas with the three proposals

[54:46] tonight that I think we could if you all

[54:48] say no tonight, let's move it forward

[54:51] and get better ideas because I don't

[54:53] want my taxes going up like Mrs. Beck. I

[54:56] can't afford to live here anymore. I got

[54:57] here in 93 and you can guess what I paid

[55:00] for my house. Um, but I love the

[55:04] community. I love Alpine.

[55:06] I don't ever want to see a storage unit

[55:08] in Alpine. And I don't think any of you

[55:11] would want a storage unit near your

[55:12] neighborhood.

[55:14] Having said that, I'm grateful for the

[55:17] me uh the people that are doing the

[55:19] library, but I don't think that we

[55:21] should put the money from

[55:24] the bookmobile. That's I'm I'm enjoying

[55:28] that service to go to them. So, and I

[55:32] think the bookmobile can go to the

[55:33] library and and be facilitated there.

[55:36] And and if and if all the things that

[55:37] the bookmobile does that I can log in

[55:40] and and get all the books I want to read

[55:42] or listen to online that that does there

[55:45] and it doesn't cost any more money.

[55:47] Great. Um show that to me. I would

[55:49] appreciate that. and then on the fire

[55:53] department. Um I just don't understand

[55:57] um the reasoning behind it and a

[56:01] community center and maybe down the road

[56:04] we have maybe we have maybe I'm getting

[56:06] older. I mean I have but I feel like

[56:08] you're my community community. So

[56:11] anyway, I appreciate your time and all

[56:13] that you do for us and um I'd be willing

[56:16] to talk to you all.

[56:19] Thank you, Steve.

[56:21] >> So, we have your information. This will

[56:23] be with Dian. If any of council want to

[56:25] follow up, you can get the contact

[56:26] information from her.

[56:27] >> Thank you.

[56:28] >> Um, great comments.

[56:30] >> Move on to discussion items,

[56:35] >> which is, um, let's go on to a um, the

[56:39] proposal to relocate funds from the

[56:40] bookmobile to the Alpine Library.

[56:47] Oh yes, sorry. Thank you.

[56:49] >> Hey, before we start, this is I just

[56:51] found out about this. This is something

[56:53] new for our a new protocol for us. We're

[56:55] having discussion items to discuss the

[56:58] items before we vote at a future date. I

[57:00] know we have done that in some instances

[57:02] before, but it sounds like it's a it's a new procedure. Can you just explain

[57:08] what what the plan is so the public

[57:10] knows? And I is that okay? Do

[57:12] >> you want me to take that m? Yeah. So on some items, sometimes u the council

[57:19] needs a little bit more time to consider

[57:22] an item. So, uh, for some items you'll

[57:25] see on our agenda them being on there

[57:27] for discussion only, and then at a

[57:30] minimum, they would have two weeks until

[57:32] the next council meeting um, if if that

[57:35] item ended up landing on the next

[57:37] meeting uh, to, you know, do further

[57:41] research or consideration or whatever

[57:43] they need to do. And so, we have two

[57:45] items on the agenda tonight that are in

[57:47] that c that discussion category. Uh the

[57:51] ones below that would be action items

[57:53] that we're requesting action from the

[57:55] city council tonight. So this no action

[57:58] will be on this item. It will just be

[57:59] for discussion.

[58:01] >> And um Shane, how does that affect when

[58:04] council members add something to the

[58:06] action item agenda? Will we still take

[58:08] two council members and it just moves

[58:10] right to action?

[58:13] >> I I guess it it probably depends a

[58:16] little bit on the item. If it's like a bigger item, more impactful, like

[58:22] we go over the agenda with the mayor

[58:23] each week, you know, two council members

[58:26] can bring an item on the agenda. I you

[58:29] know, the golf golf cart thing was

[58:31] discussed a few times tonight. Maybe

[58:33] that would be one that would come for

[58:34] discussion and then uh we get direction

[58:37] from the council and bring it back to a

[58:39] future meeting for action.

[58:41] >> Okay.

[58:42] >> I like that. I like that uh model of

[58:45] bringing them up for discussion. I think

[58:47] do you want people to talk during those

[58:49] discussion items or just us? Do you want

[58:51] it to be like a collaborative thing or

[58:53] >> are you talking about with

[58:54] >> Yeah. See or Yeah. So we've got a

[58:57] presentation right now.

[58:59] >> No, not necessarily the public.

[59:01] >> Just the presenter.

[59:02] >> Yes.

[59:02] >> Okay. Got it. Got it.

[59:03] >> Okay.

[59:04] >> This this item did come on the agenda

[59:06] because two council members requested

[59:09] it.

[59:10] I think um like in talk in the new

[59:13] format that you've been talking about,

[59:14] Shane, I I find it helpful to hear all

[59:16] of your other perspectives and then if I

[59:18] need to follow up or think on things,

[59:20] sometimes when I'm hearing new

[59:21] information, it's hard for me to vote on

[59:23] that new information. So, I appreciate

[59:25] the two-step process.

[59:27] >> Yeah, I do too. I like I said, I just

[59:28] learned about it tonight or pre

[59:30] premeating dinner that we have and I

[59:32] think it's a great idea. I agree with

[59:34] Chrissy.

[59:35] >> There's a check mark on the sheet we can

[59:38] do as discussion. Correct. When when

[59:40] we're doing the two city councils, I

[59:43] believe there's a check mark.

[59:46] >> Right. Right.

[59:48] >> Well, here we go. Start the model.

[59:50] >> Okay. I was glad to be like much closer

[59:52] for that conversation. Okay. My name is

[59:54] Bethany Sorenson and I am here um as the

[59:57] facility and operations director for the

[59:59] Friends of the Alpine Library

[1:00:01] organization. So, um, thank you for

[1:00:04] taking the time to hear this, um,

[1:00:06] discussion and this proposal. And thank

[1:00:08] you to council members Blackwell and

[1:00:10] Hanaman for putting this on the agenda.

[1:00:12] Um, so, um, it's a great time to be

[1:00:16] involved in Alpine City. Honestly, it's

[1:00:18] lots of exciting things going on and

[1:00:19] I'm, um, happy to be participating in

[1:00:22] many different aspects of what's going

[1:00:23] on in Alpine City right now. It's also a

[1:00:25] great day. Today is my birthday, so if

[1:00:27] we could just keep this festive

[1:00:29] atmosphere going that we have, it'll

[1:00:32] feel like a party. Um so, okay. Um on

[1:00:35] the next slide. So, um we are here to

[1:00:38] kind of talk about the bookmobile and

[1:00:40] what it offers Alpine City and how we

[1:00:43] feel as the friends of the library

[1:00:44] organization can add to the service that

[1:00:47] has been here for 51 years. Quite a

[1:00:49] tradition um that we've enjoyed here. We

[1:00:52] feel that we can add to this tradition,

[1:00:54] not take anything away. And today's

[1:00:57] discussion really centers on your

[1:00:59] decision of whether or not you feel that

[1:01:01] you can shift kind of library services

[1:01:05] to us um for the same amount, no change

[1:01:08] in the amount, but with a greatly

[1:01:10] increased access for patrons, residents,

[1:01:13] and improvement to those services. So

[1:01:15] that's kind of the decision we're

[1:01:17] discussing today. Um on the next slide,

[1:01:20] these are kind of some of the benefits

[1:01:22] of making this change. I'm sure that

[1:01:24] people are wondering why change a thing

[1:01:27] that's been going for 51 years. Um, so

[1:01:30] we feel that some of the benefits that

[1:01:32] would come from making a change would be

[1:01:35] improved predictability, consistency.

[1:01:38] There's going to be more regular hours

[1:01:39] instead of guessing is it a bookmobile

[1:01:41] week, is it not? Having to look up what

[1:01:43] the schedule is, where is it located in

[1:01:45] Alpine at a certain moment. Um, kind of

[1:01:49] more predictable with a physical

[1:01:50] location. Um, we will also feature

[1:01:52] increased access to residents um and

[1:01:55] resources including audiobooks,

[1:01:57] something that's highly uh requested by

[1:01:59] the patrons at the Alpine Library. Um,

[1:02:02] we also feel that we have a greater

[1:02:03] ability to cater to resident needs. So,

[1:02:07] we can create programs, we can request

[1:02:10] materials all based on someone walking

[1:02:12] into the library saying I am really

[1:02:14] interested in this subject or this book

[1:02:17] and we can make that happen. whereas the

[1:02:18] bookmobile might not be able to cater

[1:02:20] specifically to individuals. Um we also

[1:02:24] feel that this is a very alpine first um

[1:02:27] proposal, meaning the taxpayer money

[1:02:31] stays here in Alpine. It isn't spreading

[1:02:33] out to the county system. It's going to

[1:02:35] a group that's run by Alpine people for

[1:02:38] Alpine people. And that's unique. I

[1:02:40] think there's not a lot of opportunities

[1:02:42] like that. So, um we're very excited to

[1:02:45] kind of keep our funding local. Um on

[1:02:47] the next slide I have some kind of

[1:02:49] explanation about what this is going to

[1:02:51] look like. So we are incredibly honored

[1:02:54] that the state library division has

[1:02:55] asked us and invited us to become part

[1:02:58] of two consortia beehive consorcia and

[1:03:01] juniper consorcia. Um they've come to

[1:03:03] our facility. They've met with our

[1:03:05] board. They've seen our volunteer base

[1:03:07] and our rapid growth and feel that we

[1:03:09] would be a good candidate to join both

[1:03:10] of these consorcia. Just a brief

[1:03:13] overview of what that is. You have the

[1:03:14] Juniper Consoria which is a small kind

[1:03:17] of group of rural libraries, small

[1:03:20] libraries, think Vineyard, um, Nephi,

[1:03:22] things like that. Um, places like that.

[1:03:25] And this benefit of the consorcia is

[1:03:27] basically to share resources, these

[1:03:29] expensive kind of catalog systems, um,

[1:03:32] if we spread out the cost over a bunch

[1:03:34] of small libraries, then it makes it

[1:03:36] that these small libraries can operate.

[1:03:38] The Beehive Consoria is part of the

[1:03:41] state digital library. So joining that

[1:03:44] will give us the access to the Overdrive

[1:03:45] and the Libby and the audio books that

[1:03:47] so many readers love today. So that's

[1:03:50] kind of a an overview and why we want to

[1:03:53] join these consorcia. It would be too

[1:03:54] expensive for us to do this on our own.

[1:03:56] Um on the next slide we'll talk a little

[1:03:59] bit about what the bookmo currently

[1:04:00] offers. So they are here every two weeks

[1:04:03] and they're here for six hours. They

[1:04:05] make three different stops. You can see

[1:04:07] those on the slide. and um have a

[1:04:10] rotating collection. Um I talked to

[1:04:13] Chris the librarian and he said that he

[1:04:15] usually um decides on what's in the

[1:04:17] bookmobile based on what patrons request

[1:04:20] like hold. Um so right now there are 4%

[1:04:23] of Alpine residents that hold bookmobile

[1:04:25] cards. They are free. Um and about 2% so

[1:04:28] 50% of um so 2% of Alpine residents but

[1:04:32] 50% of that 4% is currently using

[1:04:35] utilizing the bookmobile. that is a um

[1:04:39] that data is coming from the state

[1:04:41] library division. So um on the next

[1:04:43] slide. So the benefits of kind of our

[1:04:46] proposal is that we increase the access

[1:04:49] to the same catalog by eight times. We

[1:04:53] increase the physical space. There's a

[1:04:55] lot more room to spread out in the

[1:04:56] library than there is on the bookmobile.

[1:04:58] Um increase convenience, predictability,

[1:05:01] visibility from the Alpine Highway.

[1:05:02] People know that that where the library

[1:05:04] is, where to find it. We have kids

[1:05:06] walking from Mountainville and other

[1:05:08] schools all the time and stopping in.

[1:05:10] It's wonderful. Um we just last week had

[1:05:13] two little girls just pop in, come in,

[1:05:15] play a little game together, and then

[1:05:16] said, "Thanks. See you." And just left.

[1:05:18] And we thought, "Yes, this is what this

[1:05:20] is what we're here for. We want you guys

[1:05:21] to stop by." Um we can offer more

[1:05:24] programs, like I've said before, that

[1:05:26] are specifically tailored to Alpine

[1:05:27] residents and curate our collection

[1:05:29] based on local demand. On the next

[1:05:31] slide, a little cost comparison. So, the

[1:05:34] Alpine City currently spends 13,596 on

[1:05:37] bookmobile services. We are um

[1:05:39] requesting the reallocation of those

[1:05:41] exact funds to the Friends of the Alpine

[1:05:43] Library. Um if you look at a breakdown

[1:05:46] of what that cost is, um right now

[1:05:47] you're spending $87 an hour to operate

[1:05:50] the bookmobile. With us, that would

[1:05:52] break down to $11 an hour. Um the local

[1:05:56] control is about what I've said. We can

[1:05:58] create programs um and collection. We

[1:06:01] can the sub um bookmobile only offers

[1:06:04] summer reading program. These are a list

[1:06:07] of some of the programs we're currently

[1:06:08] offering and we have many more. Um we

[1:06:11] just didn't need to go into all of it.

[1:06:13] So this is kind of we feel that this uh

[1:06:16] Alpine Library is a more fiscally

[1:06:17] responsible use of these funds. On the

[1:06:20] next slide um some more specifics on how

[1:06:23] exactly that money would be broken out

[1:06:25] and budgeted. Um in the packet there was

[1:06:27] a more specific budget breakdown. Those

[1:06:30] are projections. Of course, um as as you

[1:06:32] all know, you can only project so much

[1:06:34] and then when it gets down to actual

[1:06:35] expenditure, um it looks it may look a

[1:06:38] little bit different, but just know that

[1:06:39] all of that expenditure would be

[1:06:41] reviewed with you guys annually. Um

[1:06:45] also, the costs are the same as what

[1:06:47] you've been paying for the bookmobile.

[1:06:49] So, that breaks down into ILS, the

[1:06:51] integrated library system. So, the

[1:06:53] cataloging, how it stays organized, the

[1:06:55] curation of a collection, the rotation

[1:06:57] of it. Um, also maintenance. You've been

[1:06:59] paying for bookmobile maintenance on the

[1:07:01] bus itself. That's includes gas. And I

[1:07:04] know a couple weeks ago it didn't come

[1:07:06] because it had maintenance issues and

[1:07:07] was broken down. That won't happen to

[1:07:10] the library. So, um, anyway, um, and

[1:07:14] this obviously continues to support, um,

[1:07:16] statewide literacy and, um, goals is

[1:07:20] what I was trying to say. Okay. Okay, on

[1:07:22] the next slide, um just to review again,

[1:07:24] we will as part of um if you decide to

[1:07:26] create this memorandum of under um of

[1:07:28] agreement that we would review it

[1:07:30] annually and also provide a record of

[1:07:32] our expenditures. Um and then on the

[1:07:34] next slide there, I have included some

[1:07:37] um of the details for the state library

[1:07:40] division. This is who we've been working

[1:07:41] with directly and you have all been

[1:07:43] emailed a copy of this slide so you have

[1:07:45] all the information. And so if you have

[1:07:46] tons of details that you're wanting to

[1:07:48] know, lots of questions about, I would

[1:07:51] suggest reaching out to them and asking

[1:07:52] them. They could describe it better than

[1:07:54] I can in this brief time that I've been

[1:07:57] allotted. So, um, and I know Council

[1:07:59] Member Blackwell is going to follow up

[1:08:01] with them and has been trying to reach

[1:08:02] them. So, thank you for doing that. I

[1:08:03] would encourage you guys to reach out to

[1:08:05] her for clarification on anything. Um,

[1:08:09] let's see what else. Um we're our goal

[1:08:11] is to kind of uphold the same standard

[1:08:13] that has been provided by the bookmobile

[1:08:15] and and improve upon that. On the next

[1:08:18] slide, um I'm sure many of you are

[1:08:19] wondering how this might affect our

[1:08:21] wonderful residents at River Meadows.

[1:08:23] They are definitely one of our

[1:08:24] priorities and we've been working

[1:08:25] closely with Paula who's the activities

[1:08:27] director and also Josh who's the

[1:08:29] executive director and then Paula's

[1:08:30] assistant Laura. She coordinates field

[1:08:33] trips for the residents. And um we

[1:08:35] already have an established program at

[1:08:37] River Meadows. It's called Golden Hour.

[1:08:38] We have a bi-weekly story time where we

[1:08:40] come to River Meadows and visit with

[1:08:42] them. And as part of that, we could

[1:08:44] offer a mobile catalog. We can bring

[1:08:46] books. They can request books to put on

[1:08:48] hold. Um, like Mr. Dolly was saying,

[1:08:50] like, can we provide that same ability

[1:08:52] to go onto the catalog and request what

[1:08:54] books you want? Yes, we can. We can work

[1:08:56] on an agreement that will create that

[1:08:58] same opportunity and access. That's

[1:09:01] really important to us. So, um, it is a

[1:09:04] priority for us to make sure we're not

[1:09:05] taking anything away. Um, we'll also be

[1:09:09] adding a curbside option. So, patrons

[1:09:11] would be able to pull up to the Alpine

[1:09:12] Library, call the number on the sign,

[1:09:14] and we would be able to bring books down

[1:09:16] if that's a problem for some people or

[1:09:17] if they don't want to go in or have kids

[1:09:19] in the car. Any age could could utilize

[1:09:21] that option. Um, and then we are

[1:09:24] planning to schedule regular field trips

[1:09:25] for River Meadows uh residents to be

[1:09:28] able to come to the library. They like

[1:09:30] to get out. So, um, on the next slide, I

[1:09:32] have an example of a letter of support.

[1:09:34] Um Paula and Josh sent this over uh this

[1:09:38] afternoon and let um to just let you

[1:09:40] guys know that they are supportive of us

[1:09:42] and excited about these changes and um

[1:09:45] would look forward to working with us.

[1:09:47] So I just wanted you to be able to see

[1:09:49] how they felt about it. Um on the next

[1:09:52] slide, some more kind of questions. Um

[1:09:54] just generally the library would be

[1:09:57] continue to be run by the nonprofit

[1:09:58] organization Friends of the Alpine

[1:10:00] Library and we will abide by ALA

[1:10:03] American Library Association standards.

[1:10:05] And it's important to us to make sure

[1:10:07] that we establish ourselves as a

[1:10:09] legitimate library, not just kind of a

[1:10:11] thrown together uh initiative. So, and

[1:10:13] we do have volunteers that have master's

[1:10:16] degree in library science that are

[1:10:18] actually helping to maintain our

[1:10:20] collection that make sure it keeps that

[1:10:22] statewide standard. Um, on the very last

[1:10:26] slide, just in conclusion,

[1:10:28] so we have been kind of officially

[1:10:30] operating for about one year and in that

[1:10:33] year we have issued about almost 300

[1:10:35] cards, library cards. They are free and

[1:10:37] they will continue to be free. And then

[1:10:39] we've been open in our current physical

[1:10:41] location for three months and we have

[1:10:43] circulated um more than 1,000 titles,

[1:10:46] materials in those three months. So

[1:10:48] there it's getting used, it's getting

[1:10:50] accessed. Just I hope that those numbers

[1:10:53] help you guys understand where we're at.

[1:10:54] We have more than two dozen volunteers

[1:10:56] who uh volunteer at the library and

[1:10:58] we're always looking for more. Um and we

[1:11:01] have felt I mean we've grown so quick.

[1:11:04] we faster than we ever anticipated and

[1:11:06] it's been amazing to see the positive

[1:11:08] response. A lot of people come in and

[1:11:10] say this is a dream come true. We've

[1:11:12] waited so long for this and we are so

[1:11:14] excited about it and we just feed off of

[1:11:16] that enthusiasm and that positivity. It

[1:11:19] just keeps us going and we're very

[1:11:20] motivated by uh by yeah by this um

[1:11:24] project, this initiative. We feel that

[1:11:26] this proposal is a wise investment back

[1:11:28] right back into our community and a

[1:11:31] demonstration of kind of our faith in in

[1:11:33] the residents and that they are willing

[1:11:35] to do what they uh willing to put action

[1:11:38] into what they want. So, um thank you

[1:11:40] for taking the time and I would love to

[1:11:42] answer any questions you guys might

[1:11:43] have.

[1:11:45] >> Chrissy, did you want to start

[1:11:48] >> question with questions?

[1:11:49] >> Yes.

[1:11:50] >> Um I'll can I be the last this time?

[1:11:53] >> Okay, Andrew. Sure. Why?

[1:11:56] >> Thank you.

[1:11:56] >> Yeah, that's okay. Uh, thanks Bethany

[1:11:58] and all of your team that does all this

[1:12:00] work. I can think of few things uh more

[1:12:07] good to do in life than libraries and

[1:12:10] books. Um,

[1:12:12] >> I thank you for the call.

[1:12:14] >> You bet.

[1:12:14] >> Thank you for the call. Um, this is like

[1:12:17] many issues that I don't have like a

[1:12:20] strong stance on. So what I do for every

[1:12:23] issue um is I weigh it on two things.

[1:12:28] The consent of the governed, especially

[1:12:29] those that live by somewhere. Do they

[1:12:32] consent to this? Do they want this? Um

[1:12:34] is there some sort of consensus? And

[1:12:36] then does this fit the identity of

[1:12:38] Alpine?

[1:12:39] >> Like I I pretty much weigh every

[1:12:40] decision on that. If it if it meets both

[1:12:42] of those, it's a yes. And it rarely ever

[1:12:44] is. Mhm.

[1:12:45] >> Um yours yours at its current status I

[1:12:49] think does uphold the um identity of

[1:12:52] Alpine being a community that is

[1:12:55] closenknit. I don't know what books are

[1:12:57] in there. I go to the AF library and I

[1:12:58] question everything in life when I see

[1:13:00] the books that are in the AF library for

[1:13:01] my kids but um that's another story. I

[1:13:04] use the AF library. Um and I I was a

[1:13:07] child at the bookmobile. I remember I as

[1:13:09] you were talking about the bookmobile I

[1:13:11] was smelling the smell of the bookmobile

[1:13:13] as a child. There is a smell.

[1:13:15] >> So anyways, I reached the other one

[1:13:16] though is the residents. So I reached

[1:13:18] out to a bunch of residents because I

[1:13:19] did not know where they stood on this.

[1:13:21] You heard from a couple

[1:13:22] >> and umh

[1:13:25] I love that you guys are trying to do

[1:13:26] this, but there are a lot of issues that

[1:13:28] the residents have brought up that I

[1:13:30] would have had no idea about. And I can

[1:13:33] email these to you and it's not just

[1:13:35] some. It's quite a few. Um I can email

[1:13:38] them to you. I can go through a couple

[1:13:40] of them. I can encapsulate them. But in

[1:13:44] short, there's a couple things that if

[1:13:46] you can somehow

[1:13:48] solve it with these residents, I think

[1:13:49] you'll have hit a home run.

[1:13:52] >> There aren't very many people who can

[1:13:53] hit a home run in Alpine. One who has is

[1:13:55] the uh bridal of hope.

[1:13:57] >> I know you love them.

[1:13:58] >> I Well, it's not that I love them. I

[1:14:00] question how they did it. How did they

[1:14:02] build such a

[1:14:03] >> money?

[1:14:05] >> I question how did Well, no. No, because

[1:14:08] that's not true. There are some people

[1:14:09] >> I'm teasing you. I got two really big

[1:14:12] high rollers on both sides of me and

[1:14:14] it's so I asked him, "How did you build

[1:14:16] such a big facility? How did you have so

[1:14:19] many people coming and going and not

[1:14:21] have one resident or neighbor mad at

[1:14:24] you? How are they all how are they so

[1:14:27] happy with you? What did you do?" And he

[1:14:30] just said, "We tried to be good

[1:14:32] neighbors. We we just took it from the

[1:14:34] beginning and we just made sure to be

[1:14:35] good neighbors." So that's what's

[1:14:37] missing here. Um, and it became apparent

[1:14:39] from the people. There's everything from

[1:14:41] trees that were ripped out to the city

[1:14:44] is being played by there was an intent

[1:14:47] for this to be a certain way and now

[1:14:49] it's very quickly changing. People are

[1:14:52] even texting me during this time giving

[1:14:54] me more feedback and so why don't I just

[1:14:57] email them to you and your team and then

[1:15:00] what what I would suggest or my question

[1:15:02] is if if you can address it if you can

[1:15:05] help out be that good neighbor I think

[1:15:07] you'll have something really special.

[1:15:09] So, I guess it's more of a comment of

[1:15:10] where I came from when we talked

[1:15:12] >> because when we talked, I was like, I

[1:15:14] don't know. I've got to I've got to do

[1:15:15] my research and my due diligence with

[1:15:17] the people,

[1:15:18] >> right?

[1:15:18] >> And uh that's what I found. And some of

[1:15:20] the big issues were why are the taxes

[1:15:22] going to this?

[1:15:24] >> Um um you heard some of the other ones.

[1:15:27] Um how does this change the relationship

[1:15:29] once the city is putting out the money

[1:15:32] uh versus or or to a nonprofit? Like do

[1:15:34] we do this to other nonprofits? Anyways,

[1:15:36] I think I've taken enough time, but why

[1:15:38] don't I email them to you and uh your

[1:15:40] wonderful team

[1:15:41] >> and see what you think? See if you can

[1:15:43] meet them. See if you can help them.

[1:15:45] You'll get their specifics. I write down

[1:15:46] every single one.

[1:15:47] >> Perfect.

[1:15:48] >> And see I I guess the question is what's

[1:15:50] your willingness for that that that kind

[1:15:52] of a thing. Well, I would be happy to

[1:15:54] talk to anyone and we have said that

[1:15:56] from the very start that especially in

[1:15:59] previous meetings, we met with residents

[1:16:01] who came to make public comment about

[1:16:04] the library going into that location um

[1:16:06] at planning commission and we we gave

[1:16:09] our numbers to every single person and

[1:16:10] said if you have an issue please let's

[1:16:12] talk to directly to each other instead

[1:16:14] of going through the rigoral that then

[1:16:16] delays meetings and makes it an

[1:16:19] inefficient use of everyone's time. So

[1:16:22] they can reach out to us, okay,

[1:16:24] >> and talk through those things. We would

[1:16:26] be delighted to talk to them.

[1:16:28] >> Awesome.

[1:16:28] >> The other thing I will say is because

[1:16:30] this is a discussion item and we are

[1:16:32] hoping to take action on it by the next

[1:16:35] city council meeting, I'm concerned that

[1:16:37] if we do take the discussion offline

[1:16:41] that then the other council members

[1:16:44] won't feel that they're able to make an

[1:16:46] educated vote.

[1:16:47] >> Oh, do you want me to say them really

[1:16:49] quick? So, I would say maybe take a

[1:16:51] moment to summarize if you're willing to

[1:16:53] summarize

[1:16:55] >> and I could try to address that here.

[1:16:56] >> Well, okay. I'll say them really quick.

[1:16:58] Um, uh, as quick as I can. Uh,

[1:17:01] >> a condensed version.

[1:17:02] >> Yeah, I'm I'm trying. I I feel the

[1:17:04] pressure. Um, okay. Crossing the line,

[1:17:08] the deed back, uh, of the of the parking

[1:17:11] lot is not what people ever anticipated.

[1:17:15] They thought that was going to be for um

[1:17:17] Burgess Orchards. Uh I'm sorry. They

[1:17:20] thought it was going to be for you guys

[1:17:22] so that you would have parking. Uh now

[1:17:24] it's Burgess Orchards. They don't know

[1:17:26] how. And anyways, there's a problem with

[1:17:27] the deedback giving the city giving

[1:17:29] money. The city needs to clean this up.

[1:17:31] Parking dedicated to them during

[1:17:32] operation hours. Full fire marshall

[1:17:34] inspection. And city needs to be close

[1:17:36] to the city needs to uh be over their

[1:17:39] operating hours because uh some of the

[1:17:42] residents are saying like well like

[1:17:43] they're closed when they're at work and

[1:17:44] when they come home they're not there.

[1:17:45] Um against let's see that I'm against

[1:17:48] the public library uh should be a user

[1:17:50] fee based. I got this a lot. They would

[1:17:53] like it to be user fee. They would like

[1:17:54] your funding to come from users not

[1:17:56] taxes. Um I don't want to pay for the

[1:17:59] scale. They feel like it's scaling and

[1:18:01] they feel like they're now becoming uh

[1:18:04] the people who would pay for it and they

[1:18:06] would rather have you combo with Salt

[1:18:07] Lake or ORM. They don't think al they know Alpine already subsidizes

[1:18:11] library cards. They think that's enough.

[1:18:13] Uh uh the service should be funded by

[1:18:16] those who wish to continue donating and

[1:18:18] expanding the current services provided.

[1:18:21] They would like uh to reserve our

[1:18:23] limited revenue we have only to fund the

[1:18:26] essential services like water um and

[1:18:29] things that are really kind of like you

[1:18:31] know pressing. Um I I want to step in

[1:18:33] and say I'm not trying I'm just

[1:18:35] repeating.

[1:18:36] >> I I'm so happy to hear all of these

[1:18:38] because I have answers for all of them.

[1:18:39] >> Oh good. Okay. So however you want um

[1:18:41] the the signage on the wall would be hit

[1:18:43] the gravel spilling on the driveway. Uh

[1:18:45] they sweep the sidewalk. Uh the benefit

[1:18:47] because at work it's okay I got that

[1:18:49] one. The trees. There's a big issue

[1:18:50] about the trees. I guess they were

[1:18:51] promised when they were taken out they'd

[1:18:52] be put back. Instead, there's lilac

[1:18:54] bushes, so they would like those trees

[1:18:56] put back.

[1:18:56] >> Yeah, that's Tom.

[1:18:57] >> Um, the city is being played enough

[1:19:00] already. Okay. I'm trying to do this.

[1:19:02] Uh, the classes. They're wondering how

[1:19:04] you're going to guarantee um if you have

[1:19:06] classes that you can give the parking

[1:19:08] over when it becomes too much with the

[1:19:10] uh Burgess Orchards. So, they're saying

[1:19:12] that uh um that if the city pays money,

[1:19:15] we're going to have to enforce and

[1:19:17] oversee things. Um, from the beginning,

[1:19:20] my understanding was the purchase of

[1:19:21] Suzanne Tyler's home was intended to be

[1:19:22] provided additional parking for the

[1:19:24] fruit stand. Since then, the plan has

[1:19:25] expanded significantly in in creating

[1:19:28] and operating a library. More recently,

[1:19:29] there have been discussions about

[1:19:30] eliminating the book mobile, relocating

[1:19:32] those funds, and hiring a full-time

[1:19:34] librarian, even though the original

[1:19:35] concept concept was to run a

[1:19:37] volunteer-based um library. There's

[1:19:40] more, but I'll email them to you. And I hope that gives you basically the

[1:19:44] feedback from uh I would say 80%

[1:19:47] surrounding the area, 20% uh within a

[1:19:51] mile to some outliers who were far away.

[1:19:54] That's that's all I gathered. Thank you.

[1:19:56] >> Okay. Are you okay if I try to respond

[1:19:59] to those?

[1:19:59] >> Yeah.

[1:20:00] >> Okay. So, a couple of things. I'll try

[1:20:02] to cover all of them. So, we're unique

[1:20:04] in that we inherited a property that had

[1:20:07] some feelings about it before we were

[1:20:10] ever there. So a lot of these issues

[1:20:12] about how it's the property lines are,

[1:20:15] how the trees, all those things we

[1:20:18] inherited. So we're doing our best to uh

[1:20:23] remediate those some of those concerns,

[1:20:26] but they take time and money and we are

[1:20:28] a nonprofit. So um we're aware of them.

[1:20:32] I've talked to some of the neighbors

[1:20:33] about the trees specifically. We've even

[1:20:36] gotten as specific as what kind of trees

[1:20:38] they would like to have put in. And I

[1:20:40] said, "Great. I'm all for that. Just

[1:20:42] give me time to raise the money." So,

[1:20:44] okay. Um, just know that there is going

[1:20:46] to take some time. The, um, one of the

[1:20:49] requests of the planning commission was

[1:20:51] that we regrade that gravel drive.

[1:20:53] That's some of that gravel that's

[1:20:54] spilling down. Yes, I could take a broom

[1:20:56] out there and sweep it if it's bothering

[1:20:58] someone. It's been winter. The

[1:21:00] driveway's blocked off. So, um, I hasn't

[1:21:03] been a safety issue, but that's

[1:21:04] certainly something easy. I can have it

[1:21:06] done tomorrow. Um

[1:21:08] >> yeah, I just and then our planning

[1:21:10] commission, so our permit actually is

[1:21:14] built around making sure we manage the

[1:21:17] overflow parking with Burgess Orchards.

[1:21:20] So we have limited hours during what

[1:21:22] they call open season for the orchard,

[1:21:24] which is from the beginning of July

[1:21:26] until the end of October. So we are not

[1:21:28] open any later than 5:00. We're never

[1:21:30] open on Saturdays and we close by 3 at

[1:21:34] on um during open season. So the reason

[1:21:38] why we didn't feel it was necessary to

[1:21:40] designate parking for the library is

[1:21:42] because the library isn't open during

[1:21:44] those peak times. So we feel that we

[1:21:48] have figured out a good balance between

[1:21:49] our hours and the orchard demand and we

[1:21:53] are using this summer as our test

[1:21:54] summer. So we're really limiting our

[1:21:57] programs. we're limiting our hours out

[1:21:59] of consideration for this issue and

[1:22:03] wanting to make sure that we are not

[1:22:05] adding to an existing problem. So, it's a priority. We don't want the

[1:22:09] drama. We just want our books. So, um so

[1:22:14] just know that we are aware of these

[1:22:15] concerns and we feel that we have put

[1:22:18] some procedures into place that will

[1:22:20] prevent problems and should problems

[1:22:22] arise then we will address them. So, um

[1:22:25] was there anything else? No, the the

[1:22:27] whole point of all this and I'll end is

[1:22:29] just if these types of folks come to

[1:22:33] folks like me and say they've done it, I

[1:22:35] love what they're doing. It's a great to

[1:22:37] have them.

[1:22:39] >> Oh, sorry.

[1:22:43] » I turn if these types of residents come

[1:22:45] forward and say, "Look, that it's it's

[1:22:47] because what I ask them is this

[1:22:48] improving is this giving positive impact

[1:22:50] to your community or is this giving

[1:22:52] negative impact?" I don't know because I

[1:22:53] don't live by it. and then they tell me

[1:22:55] if they can come back and say

[1:22:58] I love what they're doing and it's it's

[1:23:00] creating positive impact, I'll be your

[1:23:02] number one supporter.

[1:23:04] >> Um but but I needed to come from them

[1:23:06] because they live there and it's 24/7

[1:23:07] from for them just like in our beautiful

[1:23:10] neighborhoods. Yes.

[1:23:11] >> Um we want to have it, you know, very

[1:23:13] special and nice and so yes,

[1:23:15] >> I would do the same thing if it was in

[1:23:16] your neighborhood and

[1:23:17] >> and I appreciate that. Um, one other

[1:23:20] topic that maybe I didn't cover so much

[1:23:22] was kind of

[1:23:24] >> why do we want the city to pay for this

[1:23:26] versus Yeah, there's a lot.

[1:23:27] >> So, the city is already already spending

[1:23:30] this money on library services, right?

[1:23:32] It is going to the bookmobile. Is that

[1:23:35] the best use of your taxpayer funds?

[1:23:39] It's $87 per hour versus $11 an hour.

[1:23:42] You're already spended. It's not going

[1:23:44] to increase taxes or add an additional

[1:23:46] burden to the residents. So, we're

[1:23:49] thinking this is a better use, more

[1:23:52] efficient use of those funds.

[1:23:54] >> I see that.

[1:23:55] >> Now, why don't we just have, you know,

[1:23:58] Joan Oram or those other libraries that

[1:24:00] are bigger and then have it not be a

[1:24:03] problem for the city? There are other

[1:24:06] benchmarks that have to be met in order

[1:24:08] to join those larger consortiums. This

[1:24:11] is not the beehive or the juniper and it

[1:24:14] gets complicated and more expensive. So

[1:24:17] actually to join those bigger libraries

[1:24:20] would end up costing everyone more

[1:24:22] money. This is the smartest way to give

[1:24:25] more to the residents and the most

[1:24:27] fiscally responsible. So I hope that

[1:24:29] kind of resolves that concern.

[1:24:30] >> That helps. Thank you. Yeah. And you're

[1:24:32] welcome. I hope it's a beautiful

[1:24:33] collaboration that they uh come together

[1:24:36] with you. Uh, I hope it works out and uh

[1:24:40] I'll follow up with them. Okay. And if

[1:24:42] you follow up with them,

[1:24:43] >> um, I think it will, uh, be very

[1:24:45] positive for them.

[1:24:46] >> I hope so. I really do. I really do hope

[1:24:48] so.

[1:24:48] >> Okay. Well, give them a call. You know

[1:24:49] them all.

[1:24:50] >> Yes, it's true.

[1:24:51] >> Okay. Anyone else have questions?

[1:24:53] >> Yeah, it's my turn.

[1:24:54] >> Okay. Yes.

[1:24:55] >> Happy birthday, first of all. Thanks for

[1:24:57] the tour last week of your library.

[1:24:58] >> Yes. Thanks for coming.

[1:25:00] >> Amazing job.

[1:25:01] >> Um, I heard from some of the same

[1:25:03] residents, so I do have a couple of

[1:25:04] follow-up questions on some things. Just

[1:25:06] want to make sure they're clear and I'm

[1:25:08] clear. Um, first of all,

[1:25:11] I just it sounds like you you're gonna

[1:25:14] meet every

[1:25:16] um benefit of the bookmobile that's

[1:25:18] already being provided to our residents.

[1:25:20] So, Mr. Jolly expressed concern about he

[1:25:21] likes to use the bookmobile and he was

[1:25:23] worried about maybe losing out on some

[1:25:25] of that, but it sounds like that is

[1:25:27] going to be available for everybody in

[1:25:29] for with extended hours. And I really

[1:25:31] like what you've done with with River

[1:25:32] Meadows. I do having uh in-laws that are

[1:25:36] now in assisted living how much they

[1:25:37] like to get out. I think that's great

[1:25:39] that they can come or you guys can take

[1:25:40] the books to them.

[1:25:42] >> So are you you currently meet all the

[1:25:45] requirements to join the Beehive

[1:25:47] Consortium. Is that

[1:25:49] >> Yes. Um

[1:25:50] >> I I got a a text from Jen today because

[1:25:53] I was asking one of the one resident

[1:25:56] asked be concerned about okay I can get

[1:25:57] my ebooks but am I going to get physical

[1:25:59] books? Am I going to get the physical

[1:26:00] copies? And Jen said, "Yeah, we're

[1:26:03] exploring a new program with a state

[1:26:04] library. It's different from the Juniper

[1:26:06] Consortium."

[1:26:08] So is do we already meet those

[1:26:09] requirements or is there something about

[1:26:10] a full-time librarian requirement that I

[1:26:12] hear rumors about?

[1:26:13] >> Okay, so that so full-time two different

[1:26:16] things here. We have full-time librarian

[1:26:18] that is a whole different animal and

[1:26:20] we're not even proposing that or even

[1:26:22] thinking that that is even going to be a

[1:26:23] possibility. It will continue to be

[1:26:24] volunteer. that would be part of if we

[1:26:27] were become a state certified library

[1:26:30] and that is a whole another set of of

[1:26:32] benchmarks kind of what I was referring

[1:26:33] to joining those larger libraries

[1:26:36] different consortium different

[1:26:37] benchmarks so no full-time librarian we

[1:26:40] this money will not be to pay staff so

[1:26:43] just to be clear and then as far as the

[1:26:46] physical books go it's part of that MOA

[1:26:48] that we would build out with you guys

[1:26:51] and with the state library division that

[1:26:53] would include both physical and digital

[1:26:56] media and like I said, our goal is to

[1:26:59] make sure we're taking nothing away.

[1:27:00] That is so important to us.

[1:27:02] >> So when when will you know if that's

[1:27:04] going to work, that you can not take

[1:27:06] anything away from the bookmobile access

[1:27:08] that will now be transferred to you?

[1:27:10] >> In our meetings with the state library

[1:27:12] division, we feel confident that it will

[1:27:14] work. So we'll know when we get approval

[1:27:17] of this agenda item.

[1:27:20] >> You'll know by in

[1:27:22] >> if you say yes, then we can move

[1:27:23] forward. and we're kind of waiting.

[1:27:25] We've already started the training.

[1:27:27] We've already started making sure that

[1:27:28] we're setting up in order to be

[1:27:30] successful in this. So, really, it's

[1:27:32] just a a green light from you guys.

[1:27:35] >> Okay. And then the other question has to

[1:27:36] do with I I was surprised to learn from

[1:27:39] you last week that the Goo family

[1:27:42] basically gave that property to the

[1:27:45] nonprofit, which is great. The goose,

[1:27:46] that's it is

[1:27:47] >> wonderful for them to provide that.

[1:27:49] >> We're very grateful. Um, but it was a

[1:27:51] surprise to me because uh we work so

[1:27:54] hard to try and make the orchard as safe

[1:27:57] as possible. And I want I just want to

[1:28:00] make sure that these expanded services

[1:28:02] that the library is offering isn't going

[1:28:04] to increase traffic to the point that

[1:28:06] it's no longer we this is going to be

[1:28:09] our first year understanding how well

[1:28:11] that property that that new parking lot

[1:28:12] works.

[1:28:13] >> Yes.

[1:28:13] >> It wasn't really in operation until

[1:28:15] August or I believe so or at the end of

[1:28:17] their season.

[1:28:18] >> Late summer. Yeah. So, we're still have

[1:28:19] it's going to be a test period to see

[1:28:20] how it's working, but just want to make

[1:28:23] sure that this added

[1:28:25] traffic to the library location isn't

[1:28:27] going to create a safety concern when

[1:28:30] it's running at the same time as the as

[1:28:33] the um the orchard. So, right now, your

[1:28:36] website shows hours until 5:00 PM on

[1:28:38] most days and classes on the days you're

[1:28:41] closed as well.

[1:28:42] >> So, I assume your your website will

[1:28:44] change on July 1st showing the new

[1:28:46] hours.

[1:28:47] >> Yes. So currently the hours that we are

[1:28:50] currently operating still fit within our

[1:28:53] permit hours. So the hours outlined in

[1:28:56] our conditional use permit and we can

[1:28:58] send a copy of that to you if you'd like

[1:29:00] to review it.

[1:29:01] >> Yeah, I asked Heidi to have that ready

[1:29:02] for today, but if I can review it later.

[1:29:04] We don't need to bring it up now unless

[1:29:06] >> Yeah, we can I can send it to you. But

[1:29:07] >> but you mentioned earlier that when the orchard is operating then

[1:29:12] you're restricting your hours until Is

[1:29:14] that the conditional use condition? Yes,

[1:29:17] it is part of our permit. And also, so

[1:29:19] for example, right now we offer some

[1:29:21] Saturday classes. During orchard season,

[1:29:23] we would not offer anything on Saturday.

[1:29:25] >> No, no operational hours or any other

[1:29:28] >> nothing like absolutely nothing on

[1:29:30] Saturdays.

[1:29:31] >> And the language classes or the other

[1:29:32] classes in the evening or

[1:29:34] >> I think those are kind of based on

[1:29:36] demand. And so like we have people sign

[1:29:38] up for those things. That's how we

[1:29:40] control how many patrons are coming is

[1:29:42] they're all registration required kind

[1:29:44] of thing. And we haven't found that

[1:29:46] we've exceeded, you know, beyond what

[1:29:49] would be reasonable for the parking lot

[1:29:51] to manage, especially in the offse. But

[1:29:54] during the on uh the orchard season, how

[1:29:57] that would look is if it becomes that

[1:30:00] we're a problem, we close. So that

[1:30:03] wording is in our permit that should the

[1:30:06] parking lot be full and we're taking up

[1:30:09] too many spots, um then we would

[1:30:11] actually close down. And

[1:30:12] >> so that would be before 3:00. At 3:00

[1:30:15] under the permit, you are

[1:30:17] >> on Fridays and on Monday through

[1:30:20] Thursday it is till 5:00 pm.

[1:30:21] >> Until 5.

[1:30:22] >> Yes.

[1:30:22] >> So I I wish I would I was gone for the

[1:30:24] last week out of town and I was trying

[1:30:25] to

[1:30:26] >> prepare. That's why I asked to have a

[1:30:27] copy.

[1:30:28] >> We'll send that over to you ASAP. So you

[1:30:30] can review that.

[1:30:31] >> So who who will be in charge of making

[1:30:33] that decision if if it gets too crowded

[1:30:35] and people are starting to park up on

[1:30:37] further up on Baitman and things like

[1:30:39] that? Who who's monitoring that? Who

[1:30:41] will make that decision? So what happens

[1:30:42] up on Baitman is more of the orchard's

[1:30:45] responsibility. Um and we don't have a

[1:30:48] control over how they run their

[1:30:50] business, right? We have a unique

[1:30:52] easement on our parking. That's how it

[1:30:54] is worded is that the orchard has an

[1:30:56] easement on the parking portion of our

[1:30:59] property to use. So the baitment is kind

[1:31:02] of out of our jurisdiction. However, if

[1:31:04] the parking lot itself is full and we're

[1:31:07] observing, then the librarian in charge

[1:31:10] would then and we have this written into

[1:31:12] our policies that we have all of our

[1:31:14] volunteers trained on. And there's

[1:31:16] usually one of our board members is

[1:31:18] there at the library kind of overseeing

[1:31:20] things. We each have a kind of time that

[1:31:22] we take and so it would kind of be up to

[1:31:26] us and our observation but we have it

[1:31:27] built into our training that we are

[1:31:29] supposed to kind of go out look at the

[1:31:31] parking situation see how it's going and

[1:31:33] make those kind of evaluations and we

[1:31:35] could do it every 20 minutes we could do

[1:31:37] it every 10 minutes our priority is to

[1:31:41] make sure that we're not causing a

[1:31:42] problem so we really don't want to be

[1:31:44] adding to the problem so

[1:31:47] >> that's was one of the concerns of

[1:31:48] residents when they found out that the

[1:31:51] property had been gifted to the library

[1:31:53] from the goose that now who's going to

[1:31:56] monitor this because the whole reason I

[1:31:57] mean not the whole reason a big part of

[1:32:00] the reason why the parking lot was

[1:32:02] approved in the first place was to

[1:32:04] alleviate the parking and safety

[1:32:05] concerns on Baitman and into the

[1:32:08] adjoining neighborhoods

[1:32:09] >> naturally. of the concerns as as Andrew

[1:32:11] brought up and his residents have

[1:32:13] brought up to me is now what now I mean

[1:32:17] yeah they might be full with with

[1:32:19] library patrons customers for the

[1:32:22] orchard and so now people are parking

[1:32:24] back up into the into the residences

[1:32:26] area and they're just concerned about

[1:32:28] that

[1:32:29] >> right and we could start to look at

[1:32:31] things like let's say there's more than

[1:32:32] five people in the library at a given

[1:32:35] time you know we're going to look at is

[1:32:36] this a family of you know four kids that

[1:32:39] had one car and there's one librarian. I

[1:32:41] know we've talked as a board like I'm

[1:32:43] going to ride my bike in the summer so

[1:32:44] there isn't a car space taken up. Like

[1:32:46] we can do things like that. We can we've

[1:32:48] talked about creating programs like walk

[1:32:50] to the library day and all those kinds

[1:32:52] of things. We we're supportive of tra um

[1:32:55] traffic calming measures that Andrew has

[1:32:56] tried to bring up. So, we're going to

[1:32:58] participate in all of these things to

[1:33:00] help alleviate these problems and

[1:33:02] provide solutions, not just, you know,

[1:33:06] we don't like this. We know that, but

[1:33:08] let's get creative about solving these

[1:33:10] issues because we like the orchard, we

[1:33:12] like the library. How can we solve these

[1:33:14] issues to make this a possibility and

[1:33:16] not a problem?

[1:33:17] >> Great. Thanks. Hey,

[1:33:18] >> and I'm sure we'll hear if if it ends up

[1:33:21] being an issue. I am sure we will.

[1:33:23] >> We'll be we'll be flexible and try and

[1:33:25] work work together to figure it out. But

[1:33:27] >> and I want them to like let's talk about

[1:33:30] this. Let's be neighbors, right? Let's

[1:33:31] have conversations

[1:33:33] >> and um and work.

[1:33:34] >> I really like I really do like that

[1:33:35] you're identifying something that will

[1:33:37] improve the situation for Alpine with

[1:33:39] greater access, more time while not

[1:33:43] losing any access for anyone who wants

[1:33:44] the bookmobile.

[1:33:45] >> Yes.

[1:33:46] >> Our my family is a big library user. My

[1:33:48] wife is one of those 4%. Um,

[1:33:50] >> thank you, Allison.

[1:33:53] >> All right, any other questions? Um, just

[1:33:55] a question for Shane. What were we going

[1:33:58] to do if the house that didn't that's

[1:34:00] the library now had a family living in

[1:34:02] it? Were we going to monitor parking for

[1:34:06] residential use?

[1:34:09] >> That's my recollection. And Ryan's

[1:34:11] actually online. He might be able to

[1:34:13] address that better than me because he

[1:34:15] was at the planning commission meetings

[1:34:17] where that was discussed, but that that

[1:34:21] was my I know we brought that issue up.

[1:34:23] >> Okay. So, that was also addressed as a

[1:34:25] private residence.

[1:34:27] >> Yeah.

[1:34:27] >> Okay.

[1:34:27] >> Yes.

[1:34:28] >> Just curious and thinking about parking

[1:34:30] and new bike riding.

[1:34:31] >> Yes.

[1:34:31] >> I like that idea.

[1:34:32] >> Well, my little pedals, you know.

[1:34:34] >> Yeah. So, um you know, as I I really

[1:34:37] appreciate all the work you all are

[1:34:39] doing and creating this community asset.

[1:34:42] I think maybe as many people as Andrew

[1:34:45] talks to that are unhappy. I I talked to

[1:34:48] many that are very very happy and and

[1:34:50] couldn't be more ecstatic like you said

[1:34:51] really um if you read our history this

[1:34:55] building had a a library in it. So the

[1:34:58] fact that we have this library again is

[1:35:00] really phenomenal as we work hard to

[1:35:03] preserve Alpine history. A couple of

[1:35:06] things. So, what I'm understanding is

[1:35:08] we're just talking about taking the

[1:35:09] exact same dollars and putting it

[1:35:12] towards the library. You know, we've heard many times we, you know, we

[1:35:16] don't have a big retail sales tax base

[1:35:18] and we really do stretch our dollar here

[1:35:20] in Alpine when I see we're getting, you

[1:35:23] know, I think is it $84 versus or

[1:35:27] >> 87 versus 11.

[1:35:28] >> Yeah. I mean, I I think we can check

[1:35:30] that box that we are really getting a

[1:35:32] value um for that same 13,596.

[1:35:37] Um I've been spending a lot of time in

[1:35:40] our general plan. For those of you that

[1:35:43] may or may not know, every city has a

[1:35:45] general plan. It's a governing document

[1:35:46] or guiding document um that we can

[1:35:49] really lean to as we look to make these

[1:35:51] really difficult decisions for a

[1:35:53] community that oftentimes isn't aligned.

[1:35:57] In our very first mission statement of

[1:35:59] our general plan, it says it's to

[1:36:01] provide a strong positive civic image

[1:36:04] and quality of life in Alpine. I

[1:36:06] definitely see that this library and and

[1:36:09] reallocating these funds. Check that

[1:36:11] box. Another um this is interesting.

[1:36:14] It's in our land use section of our

[1:36:16] general plan. Um but you would wonder,

[1:36:20] well, how does a library fit within our

[1:36:22] land use? We actually have a policy that

[1:36:24] says encourage, develop, and or maintain

[1:36:28] venues that enhance a sense of community

[1:36:31] and provide residents an opportunity to

[1:36:33] congregate, including public gathering

[1:36:36] spaces. So, you know, thank you for

[1:36:39] expanding that. It's great that you

[1:36:41] remember the bookmobile, but I love that

[1:36:43] we've now are looking at broadening that

[1:36:47] footprint to again align with our

[1:36:49] general plan. And then lastly,

[1:36:52] um

[1:36:54] we have a section in our general plan

[1:36:56] under community engagement. And those

[1:36:58] policies read, "Encourage resident

[1:37:01] committees to create community

[1:37:03] engagement. Plan support and conduct

[1:37:05] public gatherings to strengthen resident

[1:37:07] social connections, promote interactive

[1:37:10] and transparent communication through

[1:37:12] online and printed mediums." So again,

[1:37:16] thank you for for aligning with our

[1:37:19] general plan. And I think you guys will

[1:37:22] work hard to make sure that the drama is

[1:37:26] kind of is moved beyond because really

[1:37:29] all the goodness that you're bringing um

[1:37:32] I believe you'll be able to outweigh

[1:37:34] some of those issues. So thank you.

[1:37:36] >> I hope so. Thank you Jessica.

[1:37:38] >> Thank you Jessica. Do you have any

[1:37:39] >> um thanks for being here on your

[1:37:41] birthday.

[1:37:42] >> You're welcome.

[1:37:43] >> I don't know very many people who would

[1:37:44] choose to come here on their birthday.

[1:37:46] So good job.

[1:37:47] >> Budget decisions are looming. So,

[1:37:50] um, the pros that I see are just

[1:37:52] material access, physical accessibility,

[1:37:56] and that it stays local. And so, I I see

[1:37:59] a lot of pros. Um, although I am one of

[1:38:03] the petitioners, I love just making sure

[1:38:06] that I have all the facts. So,

[1:38:08] currently, do you guys are you in

[1:38:10] compliance with your conditional use

[1:38:12] permit?

[1:38:13] >> Yes. Okay, perfect. because I know that

[1:38:16] there was one question about access

[1:38:20] enter exit should be off alpine highway

[1:38:23] is that so the wording in our

[1:38:26] conditional use permit is that we should

[1:38:28] regrade that secondary egress so when

[1:38:31] possible and so that decision was made

[1:38:34] at the permit meeting which was in

[1:38:36] November and then it was winter and we

[1:38:38] were anticipating that we would have a

[1:38:40] real winter and so we blocked that off

[1:38:43] um to not be able to use that. And now

[1:38:46] that we have learned that there's not

[1:38:48] going to be a winter, we feel that we

[1:38:49] are able to regrade that and we're

[1:38:52] working on a plan right now. We have the

[1:38:54] surveys done on the property itself. We

[1:38:57] have a team of people who have been

[1:38:59] willing to volunteer their time, a

[1:39:01] landscape architect and a landscape

[1:39:03] designer to regrade that. Um, it's just

[1:39:07] going to cost money, which as a

[1:39:09] nonprofit is, you know, very precious.

[1:39:13] And so it's just going to take some

[1:39:15] time, but we feel that we're in

[1:39:17] compliance because we have plans. We're

[1:39:19] working on it and it's currently not in

[1:39:21] use. And our goal is to make sure that is ready for orchard season. So

[1:39:25] that creates a a nice flow for orchard

[1:39:28] traffic.

[1:39:29] >> Great. And is that um the Alpine Highway

[1:39:33] access, is that considered in your

[1:39:35] permit a secondary access? So, is the

[1:39:37] primary access supposed to be off

[1:39:39] Baitman Lane or

[1:39:40] >> So, our permit never specified primary

[1:39:43] versus secondary.

[1:39:44] >> Okay.

[1:39:46] Um, I've just gotten some feedback that

[1:39:49] they would prefer to have the traffic

[1:39:51] entering in from Alpine Highway. You're

[1:39:53] probably already aware of that. Anyway,

[1:39:54] just thought I'd pass that along.

[1:39:55] >> I've heard that that um the neighbors

[1:39:58] preferred it. However, that was not

[1:40:00] addressed in the planning commission

[1:40:02] meeting or in our permit.

[1:40:03] >> Okay. And uh we talked about kind of

[1:40:07] egress and what how that would flow and

[1:40:10] I don't know that it really makes a

[1:40:13] difference in where people go in or out.

[1:40:16] Um and again I want to make it clear

[1:40:19] that while we share a parking lot with

[1:40:22] the orchard, we do not have any say on

[1:40:24] how they run their business.

[1:40:27] >> So we don't want to inherit the

[1:40:30] complaints that come because of that.

[1:40:32] We're super grateful for this property.

[1:40:34] We could have never done what we've done

[1:40:35] without this gift and we are going to

[1:40:38] try to do our part to make sure we're

[1:40:40] not contributing and adding to the

[1:40:42] problem,

[1:40:43] >> but um there's limited control on our

[1:40:45] part on how that goes.

[1:40:47] >> Okay. Thanks. And are you currently ADA

[1:40:50] compliant or working towards I know

[1:40:52] you're a nonprofit and that takes funds

[1:40:54] to be able to pour cement for a ramp.

[1:40:57] That's very expensive. So,

[1:40:58] >> correct. So, we have a temporary um ex

[1:41:02] access ramp um that allows the ADA

[1:41:06] access and the permit specifies that we

[1:41:09] are to be ADA accessible when possible.

[1:41:14] So, we are kind of we were grateful for

[1:41:17] that generosity and that clause that we

[1:41:20] kind of have time to raise the money.

[1:41:22] Um, we're working on kind of compacting

[1:41:25] the gravel portion of our access. So, we

[1:41:28] have a kind of a wood ramp up the front,

[1:41:30] a gravel path, and then it turns to

[1:41:33] cement and then another ramp up through

[1:41:34] the back door. Um, so you can get in and

[1:41:38] wheelchair strollers, walkers. We have

[1:41:40] had patrons come up using those and um,

[1:41:44] so we're it's going well so far and we

[1:41:46] are going to continue to improve it. We

[1:41:47] want that to be an ideal situation.

[1:41:50] >> Thanks. And the reason I was asking, and

[1:41:52] you're already aware of this because we

[1:41:53] talked about this, but um River Meadows

[1:41:56] uses the books Bookmo. Um talking with

[1:41:59] them, currently only about two of their

[1:42:00] patrons use it, but they would love to

[1:42:02] come to and do an outing and they could

[1:42:05] bust them over. However, almost all of

[1:42:07] them use walkers.

[1:42:08] >> Correct. So, um, they felt like it would

[1:42:12] be very challenging for their patrons to

[1:42:14] actually go inside the building and that

[1:42:16] they would have to just utilize like the

[1:42:20] curbside

[1:42:21] >> curbside or the or the mobile catalog,

[1:42:23] right?

[1:42:23] >> Yes. So, I actually talked to Josh and

[1:42:25] Paula about this today and said like,

[1:42:27] "Hey, we're this is still in progress.

[1:42:30] um we use volunteers and so it just

[1:42:32] takes time and so we still need to

[1:42:34] compact and then actually use a

[1:42:36] landscapecape glue to kind of firm up

[1:42:39] that surface and if that doesn't work

[1:42:41] then we go to the next step so we

[1:42:43] definitely want to make it accessible.

[1:42:44] Perfect. And then I guess along those

[1:42:46] same lines, my question probably is for

[1:42:48] Steve Doxy is, you know, if we're using

[1:42:51] city funds for this um library and say

[1:42:55] someone gets injured or hurt, what's our

[1:42:58] liability?

[1:43:02] » That's one of the issues I'd like to see

[1:43:03] addressed.

[1:43:04] >> Okay. So, if you're talking about having

[1:43:07] a memorandum of agreement ready for next

[1:43:11] council meeting to be voted upon, we

[1:43:14] need to see a draft sooner than later.

[1:43:16] >> Okay. Um and then sorry I thank you for

[1:43:20] that.

[1:43:22] Um my only other concern is um you know

[1:43:28] if if we are putting funds to this

[1:43:29] library does it become a city affiliated

[1:43:32] library and if so I've just um in our

[1:43:38] conversations and one that I had with

[1:43:40] Jen Wadsworth was that the end goal is

[1:43:43] to become a state certified library

[1:43:46] which would require the city to be

[1:43:48] paying for a full-time librarian and

[1:43:50] that is do I still understand that your the end goal is to become that?

[1:43:56] >> Yes, it is the end goal because of the

[1:44:01] options that it would open up to us. So,

[1:44:03] if you think about it as a ladder, you

[1:44:05] know, we're nonprofit volunteer down

[1:44:07] here, donor based, our next step is what

[1:44:09] we're proposing tonight. And I would

[1:44:11] probably say five more rungs up is that

[1:44:14] state certification and that it would

[1:44:16] involve a full-time employee or a

[1:44:18] full-time equivalent. So it could be

[1:44:20] someone who lives there or there's lots

[1:44:23] of flexibility in that and also the city

[1:44:25] would pay a portion of the budget but we

[1:44:28] are not um I couldn't tell you

[1:44:32] definitively what the timing on that

[1:44:33] would be

[1:44:34] >> but we feel that we can operate with

[1:44:37] this current proposal for a long time

[1:44:40] happily and be able to provide the

[1:44:42] residents with what they want. So, while

[1:44:45] we are going to work towards meeting

[1:44:46] those certifications because we feel if

[1:44:49] you're doing it, you might as well do it

[1:44:50] right. Um, the timing on what that would

[1:44:53] look like, I couldn't tell you. And it

[1:44:55] would just depend on what the residents

[1:44:57] want. Do they want more services? Can we

[1:44:59] not meet those? It will be driven by

[1:45:03] Alpine. So

[1:45:04] >> yeah, I'm just thinking about um Martha

[1:45:07] Beck who made her comment about property

[1:45:10] taxes and even Steven Jolly, you know,

[1:45:13] is this putting the nose of the camel

[1:45:15] inside the tent that eventually I that's

[1:45:18] just my biggest concern is because in

[1:45:20] Vineyard it started out as a volunteer

[1:45:22] library and now they're expending over

[1:45:24] $121,000 a year for this volunteer

[1:45:27] library. So that is my biggest concern.

[1:45:30] Um

[1:45:31] >> did you say vineyard? vineyard. Sorry,

[1:45:33] what did I say?

[1:45:34] >> No, that's what you said, but I was

[1:45:35] wasn't

[1:45:36] >> Yeah, and I just I was going back

[1:45:38] through November 18th planning

[1:45:39] commission where you talked about the

[1:45:42] conditional use permit. And I will say

[1:45:45] when you guys were talking about in

[1:45:46] reference to fundraising, Jen did say we

[1:45:49] are not asking the city to contribute to

[1:45:51] the library. So, I'm just I just want to

[1:45:54] be clear,

[1:45:55] >> what's the expectation?

[1:45:57] >> Yes. like and I know that this will be

[1:45:59] reviewed on a yearly basis and there's

[1:46:02] always a ability for the city to say you

[1:46:05] know what this isn't working correct.

[1:46:07] >> I just want to be fully transparent and

[1:46:09] make sure that

[1:46:11] >> you know we're not going to be tied to

[1:46:13] something that down the road we're you

[1:46:16] know asking residents to pay more in

[1:46:18] taxes so that we can fund this. I think

[1:46:21] that's a good question and I think it um

[1:46:24] encapsulates probably a lot of worry and

[1:46:26] concern that a lot of residents have.

[1:46:28] So, I'm glad you're asking it and I'm

[1:46:29] glad this is on public record. The

[1:46:32] answer is I don't know because I don't

[1:46:35] have a crystal ball and but I will say

[1:46:39] that um I will reiterate that I feel

[1:46:42] that we can offer the residents what

[1:46:45] they are demanding currently with this

[1:46:48] proposal. And I feel that and our board

[1:46:51] feels this way that with um those if we

[1:46:55] did come asking for money that's a

[1:46:58] different ask it would be separate from

[1:47:00] this memorandum of agreement right this

[1:47:03] memorandum of agreement will stay in

[1:47:05] this sphere and should we get to the

[1:47:07] point down the road um that we are

[1:47:10] looking for an increase in funds like a

[1:47:13] drastic increase that would really have

[1:47:15] a big impact on the residents I think

[1:47:18] that would come with a lot of

[1:47:20] forewarning. And so I just feel like

[1:47:23] it's not going to sneak up on anyone and

[1:47:25] it's not going to be a surprise to

[1:47:28] anyone at that point. It's going to come

[1:47:30] as a obvious next step. And I think

[1:47:33] there are so many um benchmarks that we

[1:47:36] have to meet before we even get to that

[1:47:38] point that in my mind I can't really

[1:47:41] fathom

[1:47:42] that at this point um because it seems

[1:47:46] so I just it seems so far out of reach.

[1:47:48] So, I hope that helps. I don't want to

[1:47:50] say we're never going to come ask you

[1:47:52] for more because if the residents want

[1:47:55] it, then I we will come to you and ask

[1:47:57] for more if we feel that that there's a

[1:47:59] demand for it. Um, so I I'm not sure.

[1:48:03] However, you have a different pool of

[1:48:06] money as you reimburse the Highland

[1:48:08] library cards that then we could

[1:48:10] discuss. And I I feel that it would not

[1:48:14] be responsible of us to create

[1:48:17] additional financial demand on the city

[1:48:20] because as residents, we all feel it as

[1:48:22] well. You know, we're all in the same

[1:48:24] boat here. So, I think there's an

[1:48:26] investment on our part in making sure

[1:48:28] that this doesn't create more

[1:48:30] expenditure and something irresponsible

[1:48:33] that isn't needed. So, that's my goal, I

[1:48:36] think, and our goal. I shouldn't say

[1:48:37] just mine, but I appreciate that and I

[1:48:40] appreciate all the time that you've

[1:48:42] devoted to the city, not just with the

[1:48:43] library. I know you've given countless

[1:48:45] hours, so I really appreciate having

[1:48:48] someone like you involved in our

[1:48:49] community. So, thanks, Bethany.

[1:48:51] >> Thank you. Thank you very much. That's

[1:48:52] very kind of you to say. I thank you for

[1:48:55] covering all my topics so I can not have

[1:48:57] to say much. Um I I I was curious where

[1:49:01] you all stood because um as they said

[1:49:03] they're on a tight timeline. So, if I

[1:49:06] don't know, Carla, at the end, how we're

[1:49:07] going to facilitate whether we put this

[1:49:09] on um before we uh expend any city

[1:49:13] resources to get our city attorney to

[1:49:16] write or review um a memorandum of

[1:49:20] understanding like we sort of need to

[1:49:22] know if we have the votes. You know how

[1:49:24] that goes. So, I'm leaving that question

[1:49:26] to you, but it's been brought up um that

[1:49:28] we're on a timeline because of the

[1:49:31] budgeting timeline that we're all aware

[1:49:33] of. Um, I did really appreciate how the

[1:49:37] accountability of how the money was

[1:49:39] going to be spent. If you guys don't

[1:49:40] know, I am an accountant, so any numbers

[1:49:43] always jump off the page. Um, we've

[1:49:46] talked about so many of the things on

[1:49:47] the list. Um, one of the things at the

[1:49:49] bottom was the facility improvement for

[1:49:51] $2,000.

[1:49:53] And having used the ADU ramp or the ADA

[1:49:56] ramp myself, yeah, we need some work

[1:49:58] there. And so I um appreciate I I think

[1:50:02] that it would be uh money well served

[1:50:04] because we do have I asked a resident

[1:50:06] who uses the um bookmo frequently like

[1:50:09] what would they miss not having the

[1:50:11] bookmobile and they said there's just a

[1:50:12] lot of um people in the older

[1:50:15] demographic even older than me who are

[1:50:17] there and right now the bookmobile is

[1:50:19] actually not ADA compliant. You can't

[1:50:21] get in it at all. So, um to make the

[1:50:25] library ADA compliant again expands the

[1:50:28] scope of services um because the step is

[1:50:32] just too high into the li into the

[1:50:33] bookmobile. Been to the bookmobile many many many times. Um I love that the

[1:50:39] library um sometimes people outside of

[1:50:41] Alpine, they have a different perception

[1:50:43] of who we are, but as Jessica shared,

[1:50:46] like those are our values and we like to

[1:50:48] gather. Um, we had another long-term

[1:50:50] resident um, talk about um, Alpine

[1:50:53] values and he brought up how we're very

[1:50:55] self-reliant and we help each other. And

[1:50:58] that's the story of the Alpine Library

[1:51:01] that we like we just roll up our sleeves

[1:51:03] and we dig dirt and we like bind books

[1:51:06] and we take the old librarian that's not

[1:51:08] working at the Alpine Elementary and we

[1:51:10] use her volunteer and her knowledge and

[1:51:13] she has, you know, great knowledge and

[1:51:16] skills and she's willing to give them to

[1:51:18] the public. And that is who we Alpine

[1:51:20] really is. It's not the if you're not

[1:51:23] from Alpine, that's who we really are.

[1:51:25] We we we lean in on each other. We help

[1:51:28] each other with good things. And um when

[1:51:31] I first moved to this area, I heard this

[1:51:34] um adage and if you go visit the Alpine

[1:51:37] Library, thank you for going, Brent,

[1:51:38] they they they embody this entirely. Fix

[1:51:42] it up, make it do or do without. There's a fourth thing, but I can't

[1:51:46] remember what it was, but it's like you

[1:51:47] don't just go out and do do fancy things

[1:51:50] because they didn't have the resources.

[1:51:53] So that's what you've done to that

[1:51:54] little old house was you fixed it up.

[1:51:56] you made it do and you do without in

[1:51:58] many ways. And so I just um am very

[1:52:01] inspired by this group of people. I am a

[1:52:04] heavy user. Allison outdoes me for sure

[1:52:07] as far as book usage, but um so I was

[1:52:10] always a pro of the library. I just

[1:52:12] didn't know where we could find the

[1:52:13] home. So again, due to the generosity of

[1:52:16] neighbors like that is who Alpine is.

[1:52:19] They see a need and they help meet it. I

[1:52:22] think we've addressed the concerns, the

[1:52:24] same concerns you brought up. I've also

[1:52:26] heard about the parking and it doesn't

[1:52:28] make any sense that you would want to

[1:52:30] jeopardize your your neighbors business

[1:52:33] because it's because of their generosity

[1:52:35] that you have a library. So to me you're

[1:52:37] going to tread very lightly and be

[1:52:39] respectful of that agreement

[1:52:41] >> very much. Um, so to me that was a

[1:52:43] no-brainer, but I I it's good to hear it

[1:52:45] in a public meeting that um the priority

[1:52:48] is definitely for the parking cuz like

[1:52:50] we would not have that house, the

[1:52:53] history of that house is it became what

[1:52:56] it is because of the need at the

[1:52:58] orchard. So we don't want to compromise

[1:53:00] meeting that need. And so I really

[1:53:02] appreciate you expressing that very well

[1:53:05] tonight.

[1:53:05] >> Thank you.

[1:53:06] >> I uh celebrated my birthday one month

[1:53:08] ago here at this meeting. So

[1:53:10] >> great minds. Yes. Well, I don't know

[1:53:12] about great minds. Crazy ladies. Yeah,

[1:53:14] crazy ladies. We just show up for

[1:53:16] meetings on our birthday instead of

[1:53:17] going to dinner. So, anyways, thank you

[1:53:20] for your work. Thank you, council, for

[1:53:22] entertaining all of this. We've devoted

[1:53:23] a ton of time to it. And so, I I give

[1:53:27] the floor back to the mayor so we can

[1:53:29] get some direction.

[1:53:30] >> Thank you. I think what you do um you

[1:53:33] know if the two are still you know

[1:53:35] wanting to move forward then you know I

[1:53:38] think you just give staff direction to

[1:53:40] move forward. If you guys can come up

[1:53:42] with a memorandum of understanding so

[1:53:45] that if you can get it in so that Steve

[1:53:47] can take a look at it. He usually comes

[1:53:49] in on um the odd Tuesdays of every

[1:53:52] month.

[1:53:53] >> Okay.

[1:53:53] >> So um if you can get in by next Tuesday.

[1:53:56] >> Okay. We'll do our best. I know that the

[1:53:57] state library division already has some

[1:53:59] kind of basic things worked out. So I

[1:54:02] think we could try to do that. So

[1:54:04] >> thank you for your time. Appreciate it.

[1:54:05] >> Thank you guys very much. Appreciate it.

[1:54:07] >> Okay, let's move on to item B. Proposed

[1:54:10] code amendment to allow indoor self

[1:54:12] storage units and condo luxury garages.

[1:54:18] See, I've been calling it luxury condo

[1:54:19] garages.

[1:54:21] >> That that could easily be changed.

[1:54:25] So, mayor, I think Ryan's having some

[1:54:27] difficulties on his end with Zoom, so I

[1:54:31] have not been involved at all with this,

[1:54:32] but I'll try to get through the staff

[1:54:34] report that he prepared and um try to

[1:54:38] cover this and then I know the

[1:54:39] applicants here and and has some

[1:54:41] information to present.

[1:54:44] So, an application has been submitted to

[1:54:46] amend the city's development code in the

[1:54:49] business commercial zone to allow indoor

[1:54:52] self-s storage units and condo luxury

[1:54:54] garages. Um, they do have a specific

[1:54:57] location in mind. Um, it's on 200 North,

[1:55:01] the former Purple Mattress property uh

[1:55:04] building there uh for this use. However,

[1:55:08] if approved this uh by the city council

[1:55:12] u based on the way this ordinance

[1:55:15] proposed ordinance is written, um it

[1:55:17] could allow other locations as well with

[1:55:19] some limitations.

[1:55:22] Um the applicant has worked with staff

[1:55:24] to propose uh language

[1:55:27] um as a conditional use within the zone.

[1:55:32] Uh that draft language is included in

[1:55:35] this packet.

[1:55:37] Um this would you know if if this were

[1:55:40] approved any project would still go

[1:55:43] through the normal process where

[1:55:45] setbacks heights uh all the different

[1:55:48] things um would be would be looked at as

[1:55:51] well.

[1:55:53] Um the early draft of the main street

[1:55:56] master plan identifies the subject area

[1:55:59] as a main street civic and mixeduse

[1:56:02] area. Um this is meant as a transition

[1:56:04] zone from commercial to residential.

[1:56:09] The com the planning commission this

[1:56:10] item did go to planning commission um

[1:56:12] back on November 18th. Um they did hold

[1:56:15] a public hearing there as required for

[1:56:17] an ordinance change.

[1:56:19] Um

[1:56:21] the discussion focused on consistency

[1:56:23] with the areas envisioned mixeduse

[1:56:26] character uh potential impacts related

[1:56:29] to traffic parking and site design. Um

[1:56:32] there were some public concerns raised

[1:56:34] during that meeting

[1:56:36] um including the press for code changes

[1:56:39] kind of driven by an individual project

[1:56:42] um and then compatibility with the

[1:56:45] community's identity.

[1:56:48] Um the applicant did uh emphasize that

[1:56:52] this would be a low uh traffic nature

[1:56:54] use um compatible with other surrounding

[1:56:57] commercial properties

[1:56:59] and uh potential demand for enclosed

[1:57:03] storage. Um the commission discussed

[1:57:06] operational considerations like parking,

[1:57:09] landscaping, screening and restrictions

[1:57:12] on business activity within units as

[1:57:14] well as the need for compliance with

[1:57:16] design guidelines and standards. Um

[1:57:21] while there was still some concern um

[1:57:24] regarding creating code changes for

[1:57:26] single site, others noted the potential

[1:57:29] community benefit

[1:57:31] and reuse of a vacant building. Um, a

[1:57:34] motion was made by uh was made to

[1:57:38] recommend approval of the proposed code

[1:57:40] amendment uh finding it consistent with

[1:57:42] the general plan and development code

[1:57:44] standards. Uh, that motion was seconded

[1:57:47] and passed unanimously.

[1:57:50] Um, the proposed code is included in the

[1:57:54] packet.

[1:57:55] Um, it's just a a new section. Uh, it's

[1:58:00] be 13 in that section of the development

[1:58:02] code. Item 13, um, indoor storage units

[1:58:06] and luxury condo garages. And there's a lot of different there's A

[1:58:10] through O in here. I could go through

[1:58:13] every single one of these if you want me

[1:58:15] to, but um, like I said, there are

[1:58:17] limitations, 3 to 5 acres in size. Um,

[1:58:22] unless

[1:58:24] basically recommended by the planning

[1:58:26] commission and city council, you

[1:58:28] couldn't have another one within a mile

[1:58:30] of of uh an existing project.

[1:58:34] Um,

[1:58:35] can't have direct direct access to Main

[1:58:37] Street. Um, there's other things in

[1:58:40] there like no garage doors facing um a

[1:58:44] street.

[1:58:45] uh you can't live

[1:58:48] uh or have over overnight accommodations

[1:58:51] in these units. Uh no commercial vehicle

[1:58:54] repair. Um there's there's a whole list

[1:58:58] of things. There's parking requirements

[1:59:00] and different things like that.

[1:59:03] Um is that enough of an introduction to

[1:59:06] this project? You want to hear from the

[1:59:08] applicant?

[1:59:10] >> Yeah, let's bring him up.

[1:59:20] Hello. Thank you uh for for letting us

[1:59:23] come here. We're excited to be here. Um

[1:59:25] just one uh thing to add with

[1:59:28] >> Oh, great point. I am Nash Nielson with

[1:59:31] Stack Real Estate. So, real estate

[1:59:33] development company based out of Lehi.

[1:59:35] Um and yeah, we went and visited the

[1:59:38] planning commission a while back. Um got

[1:59:40] a lot of feedback on that. one one

[1:59:42] comment with this when discussing with

[1:59:43] Ryan um a lot of these restrictions

[1:59:46] really limit

[1:59:48] um self storage to this this site um

[1:59:52] based on these restrictions. So I know

[1:59:54] it sounds like sounds scary because it

[1:59:56] could be at other locations but not

[1:59:58] being able to um front main street that

[2:00:01] limits it pretty heavily. 3 to 5 acres

[2:00:04] were I think the only site in the BC

[2:00:06] zone that would meet that as well. So,

[2:00:07] it is it is um with being passed, it

[2:00:10] really does only affect this site. And

[2:00:12] that's that's if you read through these

[2:00:13] items, that's kind of where that's hit.

[2:00:16] And then another thing with that Ryan

[2:00:18] mentioned back when we were discussing

[2:00:19] this in November was they had done this

[2:00:21] in the past on another use in the B in

[2:00:24] the in the same zoning. Um I believe it

[2:00:26] was an automotive um property along Main

[2:00:30] Street that was kind of followed the

[2:00:32] exact same possible uh pathway there.

[2:00:35] So, um, with that, I think I could jump

[2:00:38] into our our presentation if that's all

[2:00:41] right.

[2:00:43] >> That's right.

[2:00:46] » Um, but I guess just to start, we uh we

[2:00:52] know that this property is a hot topic

[2:00:54] in in Alpine and it um has sat vacant

[2:00:57] for a while. And so, we've stared at it

[2:01:00] for a while and tried to figure out,

[2:01:01] hey, what can we do with with this

[2:01:03] property? is expensive property. It's

[2:01:05] also got existing infrastructure. So,

[2:01:07] how do you how do you reuse that? How

[2:01:09] does

[2:01:12] » how can that um be uh

[2:01:16] >> No, you're totally totally fine. So, um tried to come up with with what we

[2:01:21] could do. We do a bunch of different

[2:01:23] development being multif family retail.

[2:01:26] Um office is kind of the core that we've

[2:01:28] done in the past and also do self

[2:01:30] storage and and luxury garage condos and

[2:01:33] uh tried to figure out that and this seemed to be a potential fit here.

[2:01:38] So we reached out uh started having

[2:01:40] discussions went to planning commission

[2:01:41] and and got unanimous approval or

[2:01:44] recommendation for approval. Um and and

[2:01:47] since that day we received a lot of

[2:01:49] feedback. I think we got, you know, 60 some odd emails or so that were

[2:01:53] forwarded from you all from the

[2:01:55] neighbors and and citizens and we all

[2:01:57] felt the same of like when I heard it of

[2:01:59] self storage and alpine uh you know barb

[2:02:02] wire fence all that kind of stuff. I'm

[2:02:04] like yeah that how that sounds sounds

[2:02:06] pretty terrible. So that was something

[2:02:08] that we were like yeah okay we need to make sure that we do that the

[2:02:12] best job that we can in resolving all

[2:02:14] the concerns that we're receiving. So,

[2:02:17] we'll kind of go through what we've done

[2:02:18] since then. Um, so if you don't mind

[2:02:21] just kind of scrolling through these, first images are just aerials of

[2:02:25] the site, historical aerials that can be

[2:02:28] shown of just through the years of what

[2:02:29] has been going on here. Uh, we met with

[2:02:32] a lot of the residents uh that above the

[2:02:34] property that shared frustration with

[2:02:36] previous uses of this being industrial.

[2:02:38] You could stop stop right there. Thank

[2:02:39] Yep. Um, and so there was some concerns,

[2:02:43] I guess, just of what has been been

[2:02:45] done. and I know that the city's well

[2:02:47] aware of uh th those issues that have

[2:02:49] been done here. So, um so this is kind

[2:02:52] of where we've landed. So, the bigger

[2:02:53] piece of this is reusili reutilizing

[2:02:56] that industrial building, the

[2:02:58] rectangular building. The bones of that

[2:02:59] are in really great shape. Um and so we

[2:03:02] could take that and and what we would do

[2:03:03] is we'd add a mezzanine layer throughout

[2:03:05] the entire interior of that and do uh

[2:03:08] two floors of climate control self

[2:03:10] storage. Um those would likely be

[2:03:13] managed by a company like Extra Space

[2:03:15] Storage where we kind of out out um get

[2:03:18] give them the keys and say, you know,

[2:03:19] run run this thing as you do because

[2:03:21] they're they're really good at doing

[2:03:22] that. And then the remainder of the

[2:03:24] property is a luxury garage condo

[2:03:26] community, which these item these are for sale um for people to be able to

[2:03:31] use and put, you know, car collections

[2:03:32] in there and and RV boat um type. We

[2:03:37] also we have a guy that reached out that

[2:03:38] was interested in um debating on

[2:03:41] building a a structure next to their

[2:03:44] house and concerns with that or just

[2:03:45] buying one of these and so could be just

[2:03:47] used as a as as a garage. Um we will

[2:03:50] have guidelines that we'll go through.

[2:03:52] So maybe we can go to the next slide

[2:03:55] here. Um this this was an older version

[2:03:58] of that we first uh laid out. We wanted

[2:04:00] to discuss with many of the neighbors

[2:04:03] that had reached out of of our desire to

[2:04:06] put more landscaping around it. Um,

[2:04:08] especially those to the the north and

[2:04:10] the Hunter uh ridge circle. Um, this doesn't incorporate the wandering

[2:04:16] stones piece that's owned by Na Nathan

[2:04:18] and Amy Stone, which we are have since

[2:04:20] incorporated to this project as well.

[2:04:22] So, um, I envision a continuation of

[2:04:25] those landscape trees that are going

[2:04:27] along that. That was a conversation that

[2:04:29] we've had with them of hey we've we

[2:04:31] heard a lot of noise um you know late

[2:04:34] night deliveries uh smoke breaks all

[2:04:36] that kind of stuff that was going on at

[2:04:37] the site. Um um so we want to want to do

[2:04:41] our best to to limit that with our with

[2:04:44] our units. Uh we anticipate much quieter

[2:04:47] neighbor for for them. But in addition

[2:04:49] to that creating privacy trees that's

[2:04:51] something that we've um um agreed to do

[2:04:55] uh with them. Um, also along you'll see

[2:04:58] along the cemetery uh road on the right

[2:05:00] hand side next to the snow acis and um

[2:05:04] balance studio and the n the residences

[2:05:06] on the on the right side that we'd be

[2:05:08] adding trees along that that property

[2:05:09] the property line does go all the way

[2:05:12] kind of to where you see there. Um and

[2:05:15] then along 200 north we'd be adding um

[2:05:19] you know a good look of of landscape

[2:05:22] along that as well.

[2:05:23] go to the next next slide there. I'll

[2:05:27] try to hurry. Um with with this is just

[2:05:29] a look at what uh these units could look

[2:05:31] like and how they would be operated.

[2:05:33] Again, just an extension of the home for

[2:05:36] a lot of the Alpine residents. The phone

[2:05:37] calls that we've received with with

[2:05:40] interest in the site. A lot of them have

[2:05:42] uh have car collections and whatnot, but

[2:05:44] again, multiple different types of uses

[2:05:46] that they've debated on uh having.

[2:05:48] There's also a few people that have uh

[2:05:50] commercial units that they've leased far

[2:05:52] away outside of the the town that they

[2:05:54] like to get their stuff closer to to

[2:05:56] their house. Um, next slide, please.

[2:05:59] This is a look of an internal of climate

[2:06:02] control self- storage units. So, it's a

[2:06:04] bunch of roller doors. They vary in

[2:06:06] sizes between 5x5s to 10 by30s. Um, so

[2:06:10] these are it's a restricted access. You

[2:06:12] can only get in if you see that code. If

[2:06:14] you're if you're a paying customer, you

[2:06:16] can use your code and have access to the

[2:06:17] building. The access to that building

[2:06:19] will be between 6:00 in the morning till

[2:06:21] about 10 or 11 at night. Um there will

[2:06:25] be a person in a in an office that'll be

[2:06:27] in there from about 9 to about 5:30 or

[2:06:30] so. Um

[2:06:32] next slide.

[2:06:34] Uh this is just to show just to show the

[2:06:36] BC zoning and what you know uses that

[2:06:38] are allowed in here. We don't need to go

[2:06:40] through all these. I know you guys are

[2:06:41] aware of these, but just threw this in

[2:06:42] there just for a little bit more of just

[2:06:45] showing what could could be built on the

[2:06:46] property without having to go through

[2:06:48] the same process that we're going

[2:06:49] through with asking for uh relief with

[2:06:52] zoning. Um we can go ahead and go to the

[2:06:55] next one.

[2:06:57] Um with this, there's been concerns

[2:06:59] about what could be in these units and how are you going to make sure that

[2:07:02] this doesn't become an extension of what

[2:07:04] was in the past with industrial and

[2:07:06] everything like that. So just just to

[2:07:08] run through, uh no one's going to be

[2:07:10] living in these or sleeping in these. So

[2:07:12] no residential uses. Uh the the idea is

[2:07:15] not to have any customer traffic. So a

[2:07:18] business can't go in there and and

[2:07:19] operate um and sell uh units directly to

[2:07:24] customers and everything like that. So

[2:07:26] that's limited. Um just like in a town

[2:07:29] home community, you don't want your

[2:07:30] neighbor being loud and making a bunch

[2:07:31] of noise and messing things up. So that

[2:07:34] was um just some list of of of items in

[2:07:38] there. We can come back to that with any

[2:07:40] questions you have. Go to the next one,

[2:07:43] please. Thank you. And so I just wanted

[2:07:45] to show this as well. Uh there's various

[2:07:48] concerns throughout the city on on um

[2:07:52] why storage here and and a different issues. In summary, we kind of

[2:07:57] were looking at some of those of

[2:08:00] immediate neighbors. were very concerned

[2:08:01] with aesthetics, look and feel, very

[2:08:04] concerned with traffic, especially the

[2:08:06] residences. Uh there were a couple

[2:08:07] business owners that weren't as

[2:08:09] concerned of traffic. Uh concerned with

[2:08:12] noise and how that would impact business

[2:08:13] as well as uh you know just living next door. Parking. Parking

[2:08:18] historically has been a very large issue

[2:08:20] with this property. Um privacy uh you

[2:08:24] know what what you know people looking

[2:08:26] into backyards and stuff like that.

[2:08:27] Would that happen? Would there be

[2:08:28] windows and such? uh which we we will

[2:08:31] not have any windows that'll be directly

[2:08:33] looking into backyards. Uh property

[2:08:35] values, I think with with that um we've

[2:08:38] had I think you've seen the pricing on

[2:08:40] these. This is a luxury item uh for for

[2:08:44] owners, people that are buying that. I

[2:08:46] think this is only going to be more of a

[2:08:47] benefit, especially next door to um

[2:08:50] either an industrial building or a

[2:08:51] vacant

[2:08:53] industrial building. Um yeah, light

[2:08:56] pollution. Also, we're not a parking

[2:08:58] lot. We don't need to have uh lights

[2:09:01] spraying outside of the property.

[2:09:02] Everything's down lit inside internally.

[2:09:04] The only thing that would be outside is

[2:09:06] just landscape that makes the building

[2:09:07] look good at night. Um and then as you

[2:09:10] got a little bit further away,

[2:09:11] aesthetics was always a big issue.

[2:09:13] Doesn't matter where you live, they want

[2:09:14] to make sure that this was u um matched

[2:09:17] the look and feel, which we feel

[2:09:19] strongly as well. And we, you know,

[2:09:20] wanted to do a good job, and that's why

[2:09:22] it's taken us a couple months to come

[2:09:24] back here. Um but as you got farther

[2:09:26] away uh there were some concerns of is

[2:09:28] this the highest and best use to self

[2:09:30] storage belong in Alpine. Um this could

[2:09:33] be used for a little bit better

[2:09:35] opportunities such as housing or or

[2:09:37] retail something that's that that adds to the city. So if I can drive in

[2:09:42] and spend a little bit of money there

[2:09:44] that that was kind of what that member

[2:09:45] So it in in meeting with a few different

[2:09:48] members in their homes there there some

[2:09:51] of them would say I just don't want any

[2:09:53] traffic any increase in traffic. It's

[2:09:55] already crazy and I was standing on

[2:09:56] their porch and seeing you know right

[2:09:58] around the 3 to 5:00 mark where there's

[2:10:01] kids getting out of school that 200

[2:10:02] north gets gets pretty wild. And they,

[2:10:04] you know, one of them had had been been

[2:10:06] there for 50 years or so. It said, you

[2:10:08] know, you used to could play kick the

[2:10:09] can on the road at night and now

[2:10:11] obviously there's many, many cars that

[2:10:13] were going. So that was a big concern.

[2:10:15] And then, you know, if you go to there,

[2:10:17] there's another business owner that we met were just really hoping that

[2:10:20] retail could be their neighbor, you

[2:10:22] know. So very even immediately there

[2:10:24] were some some some differing concerns

[2:10:26] there. So we understand very difficult

[2:10:29] um property um with with uh but we we

[2:10:33] feel like we're a good solution uh to

[2:10:36] again to the traffic. We can keep going

[2:10:38] through our slides here. So again

[2:10:41] aesthetics was a concern. Storage is

[2:10:42] ugly. Doesn't fit our our our

[2:10:45] character. We are responding to that by

[2:10:48] an upscaled facade um based on some of

[2:10:51] the inspiration that we received from

[2:10:52] the town as well as just telling our

[2:10:55] architect, hey, let's let's do as good

[2:10:56] as we can and let's let's let's push as

[2:10:59] hard as we can to make this thing look

[2:11:00] good. It doesn't necessarily look like a

[2:11:01] self-s storage facility anymore in my

[2:11:03] opinion. So, one of our concerns is now

[2:11:05] that we're going to build this and make

[2:11:06] it look this like this, are we going to

[2:11:08] be able to have our customers know what

[2:11:09] we are and be able to get to our

[2:11:11] facility?

[2:11:12] Uh traffic kind of just chatted through

[2:11:14] that. Again, we're very very low trip

[2:11:16] generator. Uh noise. Uh we got CCNRs are

[2:11:21] going to prohibit uh noise and

[2:11:22] everything like that. We're not going to

[2:11:23] have a lot of employees, no customer

[2:11:26] traffic. Um there was also a concern of

[2:11:29] a lot of box trucks going on. A lot of

[2:11:30] self storage facilities do have box

[2:11:32] trucks and that being an issue. Um we

[2:11:35] will agree and something that we could

[2:11:37] add in here uh to the code that I do not

[2:11:39] believe is in there right now is that we

[2:11:41] would restrict leasing of U-Haul trucks.

[2:11:44] A lot of self-s storage facilities will

[2:11:46] park four or five trucks next to their

[2:11:47] building and lease them out as an income

[2:11:50] stream. And so we'd be willing to

[2:11:52] include that and just assure like that's

[2:11:54] not going to be a part of our business.

[2:11:56] Doesn't look good. It's it's loud,

[2:11:58] noisy. So, um something that's there. Um

[2:12:03] yeah, I think kind of touched on

[2:12:04] everything else. We can kind of move to

[2:12:06] the next one.

[2:12:09] Thank you. Here's just images that I I

[2:12:11] caught on Google Earth of historical

[2:12:13] traffic issues where there's just a

[2:12:14] bunch of traffic that was spilling over

[2:12:16] uh due to previous industrial use. Can

[2:12:19] move to next one. Thank you. Another

[2:12:22] picture of that just showing historical

[2:12:24] what the the neighbors have had to deal

[2:12:26] with. Next one, please. Uh traffic. This

[2:12:30] is a if you go to the IT, which is the

[2:12:33] Institute of Traffic Engineers, it's a

[2:12:36] it's kind of like building codes for the

[2:12:38] entire country type for engineers to be

[2:12:40] able to look up what is traffic for

[2:12:41] these type of uses. Um, you can punch in

[2:12:43] there, you can even ask chat GPT or

[2:12:45] anything of of hey, what what's the self

[2:12:48] if you build a 100,000 square foot of

[2:12:50] each of these different things, what's

[2:12:51] the traffic that would be generated? So,

[2:12:53] this isn't just my my word. This is a

[2:12:55] very specific code. Code 151 shows that

[2:12:59] we'd only have, you know, seven trips in

[2:13:02] an hour um peak hour AM and then 12 peak

[2:13:07] hour on this is like a Saturday. So very low traffic generator. So again,

[2:13:12] also reduces the need for parking for our specific use.

[2:13:16] All right. In comparison to other uses

[2:13:20] that um could go here.

[2:13:23] Next one there. Oh, yep. No, you're

[2:13:25] totally fine. These are some of the

[2:13:26] existing in the zone. So, some of the

[2:13:28] concerns we had of we want it to look

[2:13:30] good. Um, when we came here last time or

[2:13:32] came to planning commission, I didn't

[2:13:33] know exactly what um what to go off of

[2:13:36] because there were some varying things.

[2:13:37] We've had some great discussion with uh

[2:13:40] the the town and the city and and and

[2:13:42] many of you of Yeah. Here here's uh if

[2:13:45] you go to the next slide, here's some

[2:13:47] examples of what we what we'd like and

[2:13:49] what we'd envision. I know that there's

[2:13:50] a lot of work that that's kind of still

[2:13:52] in the works for uh the the uh the BC

[2:13:56] zone along Main Street about what you

[2:13:57] want that to look like. And so we we

[2:13:59] took that and I I think if you go to the

[2:14:01] next slide, this is kind of where we've landed. Now I I know I've

[2:14:06] also got a comment of like there's a lot

[2:14:07] of brown there. We're not married to any

[2:14:09] of these uh specific colors. This was

[2:14:12] just showing um there was a major

[2:14:15] concern of a long wall that looks like a

[2:14:17] prison. So, let's make sure that it's

[2:14:19] not just a long wall. There's two and

[2:14:20] four foot jogs in the building. As you

[2:14:23] go, you know, as you head west here,

[2:14:26] there's also elevation changes with

[2:14:28] different roof pitches. So, you can see

[2:14:30] multiple different, you know, elevation

[2:14:32] changes there. And then a little bit of

[2:14:34] dimension here on this corner because it

[2:14:36] seemed like this this corner is a big um

[2:14:39] opportunity for us to make it look

[2:14:40] really good. Um, one more picture there,

[2:14:44] I think. Yeah. So that's looking kind of

[2:14:47] in the other direction. So um the these

[2:14:50] uh lower level windows are spandre

[2:14:53] glass. So they will not be functional

[2:14:55] units or functional glass but they're

[2:14:57] you know we're adding them there because

[2:14:59] we felt like it needed to look just

[2:15:01] dress it up as much as we possibly can

[2:15:03] along that. This would be what we'd

[2:15:05] refer to as the primary facade which

[2:15:07] we've agreed to kind of wrap around on

[2:15:10] the west side along um the knot and pine

[2:15:13] business as well as wrap around on the

[2:15:15] other side to the um snow oasis and

[2:15:18] balance studio side. So that way as

[2:15:20] you're on 200 north and where you know

[2:15:23] majority of the traffic majority of

[2:15:24] people are going to see you're going to

[2:15:25] be able to look at this this type of

[2:15:27] facade. So um happy to answer any

[2:15:30] questions. Sorry, I got a lot of long

[2:15:32] longwinded there, but

[2:15:33] >> No, we'll start with Chrissy.

[2:15:36] >> Okay.

[2:15:37] great. Um,

[2:15:38] >> that those that was a really good um

[2:15:40] presentation. Very informative.

[2:15:43] >> Thank you. I didn't practice in the

[2:15:45] truck by myself at all. I promise. No,

[2:15:47] I'm just kidding.

[2:15:47] >> No, it it was worth it. Um, I had a a

[2:15:52] couple questions about the code, so I'm

[2:15:54] not sure I should address those to you.

[2:15:56] Do you want us to talk about code and

[2:15:58] the presentation,

[2:16:00] >> mayor? Okay. Um I'll start with the

[2:16:02] presentation then go to code because

[2:16:04] that's what we just heard was the

[2:16:05] presentation. Um the I really do

[2:16:08] appreciate the effort to address

[2:16:10] aesthetics. We um are in the middle of a

[2:16:12] Main Street gateway re redo and so uh

[2:16:16] that is not um has not come before the

[2:16:18] council or you know been finalized. So

[2:16:21] you're ahead of the game in that way.

[2:16:23] Um, I was of the mind to table this

[2:16:25] until we could get that all wrapped up

[2:16:28] so that you're compliant with our new

[2:16:30] view of what Alpine should look like.

[2:16:33] But, um, you've you've addressed that.

[2:16:35] And I don't know, we'll have to talk

[2:16:37] with, you know, our new planner and

[2:16:39] Shane to make sure that the wherever we

[2:16:42] end up with all of those things that

[2:16:44] it's going to look like the new alpine

[2:16:46] that we want to see. So, um, all of

[2:16:48] these pictures were very appreciative

[2:16:50] and they talked about massing and and, um, scaling and, you know, breaking

[2:16:56] up the walls and all of that in our new

[2:16:58] code. So, you you done a great job with

[2:17:00] that. Um, also referencing an an honest

[2:17:03] source about traffic because so much of

[2:17:06] traffic is perception. So, that was a

[2:17:08] very useful piece of information. Um, I

[2:17:11] don't know if you're here earlier, we

[2:17:12] were talking about how we generate

[2:17:14] income as a city through sales tax. Is

[2:17:16] there any sales tax generated from this

[2:17:18] property?

[2:17:19] >> Um there's there's a little bit from you

[2:17:21] know when when people are moving in the

[2:17:23] storage facility they would be using

[2:17:25] boxes and locks and stuff like that. So

[2:17:28] um but it is it is

[2:17:30] >> but we don't have a sales tax on leasing

[2:17:33] space, right?

[2:17:34] >> No, not in the state of Utah.

[2:17:36] >> Okay. Yeah, I didn't think so cuz I

[2:17:38] Yeah, we lease vehicles so I have to

[2:17:40] look up all the state laws anyways and

[2:17:43] Utah is very um yeah, we don't charge a

[2:17:46] lot of sales tax for that stuff.

[2:17:48] >> There's property taxes that will be

[2:17:50] these will be deedowned.

[2:17:52] >> Yes.

[2:17:52] >> Units. So there will be property taxes

[2:17:54] that will benefit majority school

[2:17:56] district but will fall to the city as in

[2:17:58] addition to the self-s storage facility

[2:18:00] also will you know I imagine our

[2:18:02] property taxes there will increase from

[2:18:05] what's

[2:18:06] >> from what yeah what it's currently

[2:18:08] there. Okay. Um and what was the other

[2:18:11] thing I was going to ask you about this?

[2:18:13] Can you hold up your map? Um, just for

[2:18:16] our use because it was so good with the

[2:18:17] circles going out. And now I'll just

[2:18:19] switch gears and talk about the

[2:18:21] ordinance how it's written

[2:18:24] >> the circles that go out. I don't

[2:18:26] remember. It's

[2:18:29] >> zoning

[2:18:29] >> because the first um while she's looking

[2:18:31] for that, it says that we uh an item Oh

[2:18:35] gosh, I lost.

[2:18:36] >> Thank you very much. So are these cons

[2:18:39] are these circles half mile then? I know

[2:18:41] these were resident concerns, but to use

[2:18:43] this as a visual. Okay. Because we had

[2:18:45] it in our um ordinance not to have

[2:18:47] anything within a mile.

[2:18:49] >> So, can you tell me is it the second

[2:18:51] circle out that we would have no other

[2:18:53] units falling outside that circle?

[2:18:55] >> Correct. Yeah.

[2:18:57] >> Um a little history. Um there has been

[2:19:00] proposed other storage units right by

[2:19:02] the Alpine Art Center. It's not. It

[2:19:05] never was. It never made it. It never

[2:19:08] made it out of council or um but so

[2:19:11] because of this ordinance, we would not

[2:19:13] have another one on that space because

[2:19:14] it's within the mile. Is that correct,

[2:19:16] Shane?

[2:19:18] >> Yeah, I think

[2:19:20] >> if I understand this correctly, that

[2:19:23] most outer ring would be one and a half

[2:19:26] miles from the site. Is that

[2:19:28] >> Yeah, the farthest out. So, it's it goes

[2:19:30] a half mile, mile, h mile and a half. So

[2:19:33] the middle the middle one is a mile.

[2:19:35] >> So it had to be outside the middle.

[2:19:37] >> So this is inside the middle. So that

[2:19:40] specific property had they the owner

[2:19:43] >> could not do it.

[2:19:44] >> Yes. They they would be excluded from

[2:19:46] another unit.

[2:19:47] >> That's correct. Is that the one from a

[2:19:48] couple years ago that wanted highdensity

[2:19:50] commercial? That was a different one.

[2:19:52] >> Oh, same property but yeah.

[2:19:53] >> Oh, same property.

[2:19:54] >> The property has been wanting to be

[2:19:56] reszoned to commercial more than one

[2:19:57] time. Okay. For different uses. similar

[2:20:00] to here. They come with a proposal, but

[2:20:03] it requires city council, but nothing's

[2:20:05] ever moved forward on that property. So,

[2:20:07] that would eliminate that because I was

[2:20:10] um

[2:20:12] proposed. So, we don't want to become a

[2:20:14] storage unit um hub, right?

[2:20:17] >> I I would say that I think that covers

[2:20:19] everything in the B the BC zone. So,

[2:20:22] that that alone would

[2:20:23] >> Well, that they were asking to be

[2:20:25] reszoned commercial and that specific

[2:20:27] piece. So, you're right. everything in

[2:20:29] the BC zone, but then people can always

[2:20:31] ask to be reszoned,

[2:20:32] >> right?

[2:20:33] >> Okay, good point.

[2:20:34] >> That was one. Um I I I appreciated E as

[2:20:37] well. You you've mentioned that. What

[2:20:39] was the um understanding of 720 units? I

[2:20:43] didn't understand why we need to put

[2:20:44] that in our ordinance. Was it based on

[2:20:46] massing or how are we coming up with

[2:20:48] that? Any with Ryan with no Ryan? We we

[2:20:51] don't know.

[2:20:51] >> I'm sorry. I can't answer that question.

[2:20:53] Okay.

[2:20:54] >> I'm not sure.

[2:20:55] >> Okay. So the seven and I also

[2:20:58] >> I'm I'm happy to answer it if you'd

[2:20:59] like.

[2:20:59] >> Oh, you knew. Oh, okay. Go ahead. I'm

[2:21:02] sorry.

[2:21:03] >> I'm I'll talk as much as you want me to

[2:21:04] talk to be honest with you. I'll just

[2:21:05] keep But um the building uh when we

[2:21:08] first had went to planning commission,

[2:21:10] the entire building was planned to be

[2:21:11] all self storage. Now, a portion of that

[2:21:14] is going to be for sale, like the very

[2:21:16] far west corner of that. Um but what we

[2:21:19] were taking was um with self- storage

[2:21:22] you going to lose uh corridors and

[2:21:26] elevators and some of those

[2:21:28] penetrations. So you can't rent that but

[2:21:30] you know you'll take that was about I

[2:21:32] think we'd have about 72,000 net

[2:21:34] rentable square feet and so divide that

[2:21:35] by an average unit size of 100. Majority

[2:21:38] of the units will be around a 10 x 10 10

[2:21:41] x 15ish some of them being smaller. So a

[2:21:44] rough number with that. Ryan asked me

[2:21:47] how many units do you think would be uh

[2:21:49] in the self storage facility and so

[2:21:51] that's where we came up with about 720

[2:21:53] will be a little bit less than that um

[2:21:56] now but um yeah

[2:21:59] >> yeah I think I I would want to follow up

[2:22:00] with Ryan I'm not sure why it needs to

[2:22:02] be in the ordinance but u maybe we just

[2:22:05] need a per unit per square foot or

[2:22:06] something I'm not sure it seems way too

[2:22:08] specific to be in the city ordinance but

[2:22:13] >> but we can talk to Ryan about it I won't

[2:22:14] have you speculate Shane kind of a

[2:22:16] density thing I guess but

[2:22:18] >> yeah it is

[2:22:18] >> it seems like a way max number to me for

[2:22:21] that building.

[2:22:22] >> Yeah. Yeah.

[2:22:23] >> Yeah. So yeah I'm sure there was some

[2:22:25] something Ryan can help me understand

[2:22:26] that better. That's okay. Um and the

[2:22:29] last thing was um can you help us

[2:22:31] understand two things when it says on um

[2:22:35] K unit shall not be used for commercial

[2:22:37] vehicle repair. So if people are

[2:22:39] restoring vehicles like it's for their

[2:22:41] own usage, they go to car shows or

[2:22:44] whatever or they're working on their own

[2:22:46] like you know a luxury car or exotic

[2:22:50] car.

[2:22:50] >> So that's okay. But what would qualify

[2:22:53] as commercial versus

[2:22:56] what's what's acceptable and not

[2:22:57] acceptable for car vehicle repair?

[2:22:59] >> If I was a garage and said, "Hey, bring

[2:23:01] your car in and charge me $5,000. I'll

[2:23:03] charge you $5,000 to do the work on your

[2:23:06] car." That's a commercial repair.

[2:23:08] >> Okay.

[2:23:09] >> So, but if I own the unit and I add some

[2:23:11] tools just like I would in my garage and

[2:23:12] I want to tinker on it and make some

[2:23:14] changes and stuff like that, I kind of

[2:23:15] that's where the commercial aspect kind

[2:23:17] of

[2:23:18] >> Okay.

[2:23:18] >> close those out.

[2:23:19] >> Okay, that is good. We do have a a car

[2:23:21] repair in the city and so um

[2:23:24] >> Yeah. Okay.

[2:23:25] >> Yeah.

[2:23:25] >> I just didn't want And then I did want

[2:23:29] to comment to just about on the code

[2:23:31] here. It says all storage shall occur

[2:23:34] entirely within the closed storage

[2:23:36] units. Outdoor storage is prohibited.

[2:23:38] Um, like I said, we are an old city and

[2:23:42] there were two lots in specifically that

[2:23:44] had an unbelievable number of vehicles

[2:23:46] being stored on them and it was against

[2:23:49] our city code, but it needed to be

[2:23:50] enforced and have them all removed. One

[2:23:53] of them is currently like in the process

[2:23:54] of being developed into senior living.

[2:23:57] And another one um was a few years ago.

[2:23:59] I I wasn't on city council, so I don't

[2:24:01] know what that process was, but having

[2:24:04] cars and junk stored out out of sight is

[2:24:09] a huge bonus for the city.

[2:24:12] So, um I I I greatly favor that one

[2:24:16] element right there. Number n, if we

[2:24:18] could enforce that on all residents, I

[2:24:20] can't imagine how some yards could get

[2:24:21] cleaned up. But nevertheless, this is

[2:24:24] not we don't need to do that or we can't

[2:24:26] do that. So, um there was that. And then

[2:24:28] lastly, I was uh very curious. I have

[2:24:31] three people that I know who are very

[2:24:33] much into exotic cars. They were unaware

[2:24:35] of your project, but super excited about

[2:24:37] it. They reached out to a couple people

[2:24:39] in their circle, and there's just been

[2:24:42] just a lot of positive about how, you

[2:24:44] know, um this is needed um and how that

[2:24:50] group of people just is is a very uh

[2:24:53] what do I want to say? They're like we

[2:24:56] talked about about the library, they

[2:24:57] benefit the whole community. They like

[2:25:00] allow people to drive away in their

[2:25:01] fancy cars when they get married or they

[2:25:03] bring their cars to the car shows and

[2:25:05] they're very community-minded people in

[2:25:07] general. So, I was excited to see that

[2:25:09] group of people be excited about this

[2:25:11] project specifically. So, I just wanted

[2:25:13] to share that with the council just um

[2:25:16] and last comment and then we're moving

[2:25:18] on to Mr. um Mr. Andrew. But um in

[2:25:24] reaching out to that group, I didn't ask

[2:25:26] for any solicitation, but the the fact

[2:25:28] that they saw stack on the name then

[2:25:31] they they really were very impressed

[2:25:33] with your prior projects that you've

[2:25:35] been working on. So that gave me more uh

[2:25:37] confidence that what we see is what we

[2:25:40] get and this isn't like a a bait and

[2:25:42] switch. So

[2:25:42] >> Well, thank you.

[2:25:43] >> You have a good reputation and I didn't

[2:25:45] even ask for that insight from the

[2:25:47] person I was speaking with. So I'm done.

[2:25:49] Thanks.

[2:25:50] >> Very kind. Thank you.

[2:25:52] >> That was good. Um, yeah, between uh the

[2:25:56] library and this, we've touched the

[2:25:58] heartstrings of a demographic of women

[2:26:01] and now a demographic of man cave men.

[2:26:04] >> Is that right?

[2:26:05] >> We got them all.

[2:26:06] >> Men like to read.

[2:26:07] >> Yeah, I like books.

[2:26:08] >> Oh, man. You see how many men were here

[2:26:10] for the library?

[2:26:12] >> You know how many men want to put a

[2:26:13] portion?

[2:26:14] >> We're not We're not We're not Mr. Doxy

[2:26:16] is going to be start making derogatory

[2:26:18] comments about gender. Okay,

[2:26:19] >> this is I I don't mean to downplay it.

[2:26:21] This is massively important. This is a

[2:26:23] hundred-year decision. That's why I'm

[2:26:25] weighing it so important.

[2:26:28] >> Uh, as it stands right now, um, it's

[2:26:32] very murky. Okay. Oh, actually, let me

[2:26:35] just back up just a hair because this

[2:26:37] came up four months ago. So, we've been

[2:26:40] doing four months of research and even

[2:26:41] at the very beginning, this was murky

[2:26:43] because we've got storage units and then

[2:26:47] we've got what we're what we're actually

[2:26:49] deciding on which is to change the

[2:26:51] Alpine code. It's not that we're

[2:26:53] approving or disapproving this project.

[2:26:57] We are changing the Alpine commercial

[2:27:00] zoning to be able to allow storage units

[2:27:03] in the business commercial zone. Okay.

[2:27:06] So, it's kind of like a backwards step

[2:27:07] to approving the project. That took me a

[2:27:10] while to uh really capture and but for

[2:27:14] some reason we need to address them both

[2:27:17] because you've got the project, the

[2:27:20] storage units, so the luxury condo

[2:27:22] garages, which would be the byproduct of

[2:27:24] approving this code.

[2:27:27] Uh, okay. Okay. So, so I've I went

[2:27:29] through the code and I'm going to bring

[2:27:30] that up a little bit later, but just in

[2:27:33] short and Chrissy and everyone like even

[2:27:36] if we were to do anything on this, this

[2:27:38] code is riddled with spelling errors,

[2:27:41] number errors, and things that are going

[2:27:44] to take a lot. This has nothing to do

[2:27:46] with you or stack or the storage units,

[2:27:49] just the code. So, we're talking like

[2:27:51] legislators right now. And I didn't

[2:27:53] understand this. When we're making a

[2:27:55] decision to change the code, there is no

[2:27:58] law that is telling us what to do. We

[2:28:02] only really have one Bible, and people

[2:28:05] get off track when they use their own

[2:28:06] opinions. It's the Alpine City Plan.

[2:28:08] This is what's supposed to instruct us

[2:28:10] on what laws to let happen. So, we're

[2:28:12] talking about the law. Um, this is

[2:28:15] legislative. So, we're creating law for

[2:28:18] what we want the identity and the look

[2:28:20] and feel of Alpine to be. You could kind

[2:28:21] of get down to the bottom of this as as

[2:28:24] a lawmaker, do we think Alpine should

[2:28:26] have this? Like that's basically because

[2:28:28] we're making a law to allow it. Does

[2:28:30] this fit in Alpine? That's like kind of

[2:28:32] what the real decision we're making. Um

[2:28:36] anyways, so the the code's just not

[2:28:38] ready. Like I read through it. It

[2:28:40] doesn't even spell luxury, right? It

[2:28:42] doesn't even put the number 13, right?

[2:28:44] It's supposed to be 12. You're saying

[2:28:47] you're going to add stuff to the code

[2:28:48] that's not even there. There's no way. I don't even know how if you were for

[2:28:53] against this you would even vote. And I'm not trying to persuade. I'm just

[2:28:57] saying I don't know how we vote on this

[2:28:59] in its current state. That's code. Let

[2:29:02] me get to the actual opinions and the

[2:29:04] residents and everything is make one

[2:29:05] quick comment. Yes, please. Please.

[2:29:06] >> So there are some typographical errors

[2:29:08] and it's not even numbered correctly. It

[2:29:10] should be it's under the dog.

[2:29:12] >> Right. Right. It's under the dogs. So

[2:29:13] >> that that happens quite often there.

[2:29:15] Yeah. It just it's a typographical error

[2:29:17] that those are all be fixed. It'll be

[2:29:19] reviewed by the attorney

[2:29:21] >> um before

[2:29:22] >> right and it's not just that there's the

[2:29:24] mile thing but I'll get to that in a

[2:29:26] minute but just

[2:29:27] >> and come in an ordinance format. So yeah

[2:29:29] it's

[2:29:30] >> okay

[2:29:30] >> and it's not even a up for a vote

[2:29:33] tonight.

[2:29:33] >> This is discussion only.

[2:29:36] >> on the agenda as a discuss how much

[2:29:38] sleep I've lost. Well, that's the new

[2:29:40] that's this new

[2:29:41] >> I would have had a better night just

[2:29:42] thinking this was discussion.

[2:29:43] >> That's new procedure that we talked

[2:29:45] about at the beginning of the meeting.

[2:29:46] >> Yeah. Bring up bring up your question.

[2:29:48] >> I apologize as I was trying to focus on

[2:29:50] the code and the residence. I missed the

[2:29:52] word discussion.

[2:29:53] >> You're totally fine. No problem.

[2:29:54] >> Okay. Well, I try to take it serious

[2:29:55] when we're making a decision that our

[2:29:57] great grandchildren are have going to

[2:29:58] get the consequence of. Um, so anyways,

[2:30:01] I I'll finish up and then it's up to you

[2:30:02] guys. Okay. Uh, thank you for that

[2:30:04] clarification and the those uh spelling

[2:30:06] and errors and things like that that we

[2:30:09] could help with. Um,

[2:30:12] okay. Uh,

[2:30:16] I would like to talk about two things if

[2:30:18] that's okay. Y

[2:30:20] >> and I think they would be helpful and I

[2:30:21] sounds like you're getting some of it as

[2:30:24] I always do. I do the same formula. Does

[2:30:26] this fit the identity of Alpine? Does

[2:30:28] this have um the consent of the

[2:30:31] governed? I don't choose everyone. And I

[2:30:32] choose the people who live and are most

[2:30:34] negatively impacted because as you saw

[2:30:35] with those circles, they feel very

[2:30:37] different about an issue. And I can

[2:30:39] almost get a yes to anything. If I go to

[2:30:41] someone 50 miles away from something and

[2:30:43] hey, do you guys want that jail in that

[2:30:44] city over there? They're going to I

[2:30:46] don't care. So I go to the people right

[2:30:47] next to it and they are the ones who

[2:30:49] protect their neighborhood the best. Um

[2:30:52] I went to two neighborhoods, okay?

[2:30:54] Obviously the neighborhood surrounding

[2:30:57] this project and then I went to other

[2:31:00] neighborhoods. Well, because they're

[2:31:01] right next to each other that already

[2:31:02] have these in place. Um, so maybe Heidi,

[2:31:05] would you mind bringing up a couple of

[2:31:07] the images? Because I didn't know what I

[2:31:09] was going to hear. And when I go to

[2:31:10] people, I do not frame things and I do

[2:31:13] not persuade them. I ask them, "Hey,

[2:31:15] this is being proposed. How do you feel

[2:31:17] about it?"

[2:31:21] » Oh, sorry. If you press the little box

[2:31:22] thing up in the top right, it'll show

[2:31:24] the image. But you can look at any of

[2:31:25] them. You can look at any of them.

[2:31:28] So, this is this is where I went and I

[2:31:30] tried to find um

[2:31:35] a similar situation and I wanted to see

[2:31:37] how it was in practice. Okay, you can go

[2:31:39] to the other ones. Um and oh yeah,

[2:31:42] that's fine. One of those you can go

[2:31:44] back or whatever. You can pause. I I

[2:31:47] don't know if it's playing like a loop.

[2:31:48] Wow, that was good.

[2:31:51] >> You can just leave it there. That's all.

[2:31:53] >> That's fine. You can kind of see them

[2:31:54] all. So, there's there's two. There's a

[2:31:56] storage unit just like this and then

[2:31:59] there's one that's actually just just like this. I don't know if you guys

[2:32:02] did it in Bluffdale that looks exactly

[2:32:04] the same. I don't know if it's someone

[2:32:05] else and

[2:32:07] >> someone else.

[2:32:07] >> Okay. And there people are renting them.

[2:32:09] They buy them and then they rent them.

[2:32:10] So I guess the algorithm got me and they

[2:32:12] started asking me if I wanted to rent

[2:32:13] them.

[2:32:13] >> Okay.

[2:32:14] >> The I didn't know you could.

[2:32:15] >> This one's in Bluffale. The one that you

[2:32:17] show me. That one they also uh the

[2:32:20] difference I guess between the two is we

[2:32:22] were not allowing businesses to operate

[2:32:24] out of them where this one does.

[2:32:26] So, I was looking through and my goal

[2:32:28] was to find out because I actually know

[2:32:31] the people who own this and I've talked

[2:32:34] deeply with them. I've visited with them

[2:32:36] and I understand the struggle on their

[2:32:38] end of being caught up in a situation

[2:32:41] that has gone on for a very long time.

[2:32:43] But then I wanted to hear from the

[2:32:44] residents and I shared and he actually

[2:32:46] appreciated what I was trying to do by

[2:32:48] going and visiting the residents. He

[2:32:50] actually said thank you because a lot of

[2:32:52] the things he didn't know. Anyways, the

[2:32:53] residents in Alpine and the residents of

[2:32:55] Bluffell have brought up some deep

[2:32:57] concerns that aren't addressed in any of

[2:32:59] this code. Um, they're just not

[2:33:01] addressed. So, would you like me to send

[2:33:04] those to him or would you like me to

[2:33:06] bring those concerns up?

[2:33:09] >> Okay.

[2:33:16] » Yeah, that's okay.

[2:33:18] So, um,

[2:33:20] like, okay, here we go. Let's bring them

[2:33:23] up.

[2:33:26] Uh, let's see. Under any condition,

[2:33:28] storage units are not considered a

[2:33:30] transitional or light intensity use.

[2:33:33] They should not be placed in locations

[2:33:35] that are adjacent to lighter intensity

[2:33:37] uses, such as a single family

[2:33:40] residential.

[2:33:42] Um, we're creating a plan. It says,

[2:33:45] "However, that plan does not contemplate

[2:33:47] the land north of City Hall. So, we're

[2:33:48] doing a plan right now for our gateways.

[2:33:53] It doesn't include any of this area, and

[2:33:55] yet we're about to make a decision that

[2:33:58] we have no plan for." So, this will

[2:34:00] essentially dictate the plan. And so,

[2:34:02] this resident is bringing up, why aren't

[2:34:04] you creating a plan before you're

[2:34:05] putting in big infrastructure into the

[2:34:08] uh into um this area? And he recommends

[2:34:13] waiting. is brilliant guy resident. I I

[2:34:16] can't even believe how brilliant he he

[2:34:17] recommends waiting to do a plan before

[2:34:19] you would do something like this. Um

[2:34:24] uh let's see the long connected building

[2:34:27] feels very heavy against the roadway. I

[2:34:30] experienced this when I went to Bluff

[2:34:32] and talked to residents and walked by

[2:34:35] them and lived by them sort of for a day

[2:34:37] with my family in the car like what are

[2:34:39] you doing? Shh. I'm I'm looking at

[2:34:41] storage communities.

[2:34:44] They think I'm nuts. Okay, so anyways,

[2:34:46] um

[2:34:49] it it's it's it's

[2:34:52] I don't it's borderline like being next

[2:34:54] to a jail or like a Holocaust camp or

[2:34:56] something. Sorry, I don't know how to

[2:34:58] say it. You don't I I I don't mean

[2:35:00] Holocaust. I mean Sorry. I I I'm not

[2:35:03] trying to be I'm not like basically my

[2:35:04] goal is to get you to try to compromise

[2:35:06] and then they have to be okay with it

[2:35:08] where they live. But but it it's big

[2:35:11] brick brrawy walls. It is not everyone

[2:35:15] when they run they all say we want to

[2:35:17] keep Alpar in Alpine. We want to you

[2:35:18] know preserve Alpine. I want to keep the

[2:35:20] but then they never do it. This is not

[2:35:22] it. And he's bringing it up that this

[2:35:24] like when I walked through there I am

[2:35:25] not in Alpine on this wall. I am not

[2:35:28] even in Bluff. I'm in I'm in

[2:35:32] I have no idea west west Salt Lake um or

[2:35:35] West Pro. Anyways, that's that was that

[2:35:38] was this resident as proposed.

[2:35:39] >> Can you pull up that facade? Do you have

[2:35:41] a picture of that? That'd be awesome

[2:35:42] just to look.

[2:35:43] >> Well, there's several. You can pick up

[2:35:44] pull up any of them.

[2:35:45] >> But um third or fourth one,

[2:35:47] >> but and yeah, and that leads to the

[2:35:49] other thing. I don't know how because

[2:35:51] I'm I'm jocking back and forth between

[2:35:53] the code we're possibly changing

[2:35:55] >> right there. So, it's on the left.

[2:35:57] >> Okay. I'm jocking back and forth between

[2:35:59] the code we're looking at potentially

[2:36:00] changing and the proposed

[2:36:03] storage unit facility. Okay. And I'm

[2:36:05] going to get to the specific residence,

[2:36:07] then finally the Bluffell ones, and then

[2:36:08] I'll be done, so I I won't take too much

[2:36:10] longer. Um

[2:36:13] the the um now I've lost my train of

[2:36:16] thought, but either way, yes, walking in

[2:36:18] there, it is not the nature of Alpine.

[2:36:21] It does not feel And then I talked to

[2:36:23] the residents. How is it living by it?

[2:36:25] How is it being by this? And they gave a

[2:36:28] lot of feedback. I'll explain um very

[2:36:31] shortly. But as proposed, the code

[2:36:32] change would allow storage units on any

[2:36:34] commercialized zone property in the

[2:36:36] city. Which which is weird because in

[2:36:38] our code, we're saying let's just make a

[2:36:40] limit of every mile, right? We're just

[2:36:42] saying every mile. Why even put that in

[2:36:45] if we're going to try to block it from

[2:36:46] any other location? Why not just say

[2:36:49] it's only in one location? Why like open

[2:36:51] the doors for someone to uh and it's

[2:36:53] only against Main Street? Does that

[2:36:55] include um Alpine Highway? Like I I just

[2:36:58] it doesn't make sense why we're even

[2:37:00] putting that in. So that's not a

[2:37:01] grammatical or a or a number error. That

[2:37:04] is an error in uh we haven't thought it

[2:37:07] through. Just like the 720 number, no

[2:37:08] one has thought that through and knows

[2:37:10] what 720 looks like versus 400. So

[2:37:13] anyways, as proposed, the city change

[2:37:14] would allow storage units on any

[2:37:16] commercialized zone property in the

[2:37:17] city. This with those small

[2:37:19] restrictions, this would allow storage

[2:37:20] units on the balance of the under

[2:37:23] undeveloped portions of Alpine City uh

[2:37:25] art center property. As such, the

[2:37:28] effects of this code change could have a

[2:37:29] far greater impact on the community than

[2:37:31] just the purple building location. In

[2:37:33] your land used authority role, you make

[2:37:35] decisions that will substantially

[2:37:36] outlive each of you. This is like that

[2:37:38] should be ingrained in cement or on a

[2:37:41] rock in our in our um in our uh hall

[2:37:44] here. This is not a transitional area. A

[2:37:46] specific proposal should not be the

[2:37:48] reason to make a decision because while

[2:37:50] some businesses succeed, others fail.

[2:37:52] This was my number one. I was the only

[2:37:53] resident at the planning commission.

[2:37:55] Like that that resident input that was

[2:37:57] me. You know how I said it doesn't match

[2:37:59] the Alpine identity? If you're close,

[2:38:02] you'll figure out who that was. I was

[2:38:03] the only resident and I didn't know it

[2:38:05] was coming up. And why would we be

[2:38:07] making code off of one

[2:38:11] project? That that seems so backwards.

[2:38:13] We should be making a universal code. So

[2:38:15] I think that the whole the whole path is

[2:38:17] flawed. Um that's one resident. There

[2:38:21] are 36 others. There were 64 and they

[2:38:24] all hit me up in the last day or two and

[2:38:26] most of their emails were copies of each

[2:38:28] other, meaning someone is telling them.

[2:38:30] These were individualized people. I had

[2:38:33] every business located next to this

[2:38:35] reach out pleading not to do it. The two

[2:38:38] on both sides, the one across the two on

[2:38:40] across the street and the one kitty

[2:38:41] corner. So, every business leader

[2:38:43] reached out. Um, dozens and dozens and

[2:38:46] dozens of residents reached out. I think

[2:38:49] you know where I'm getting. I cannot

[2:38:51] support this just like I told you when

[2:38:53] there are reasonable alternatives that

[2:38:56] will still pencil moneywise. Okay, we

[2:38:59] have a re Hold on. We have reasonable

[2:39:01] alternatives on the list that are

[2:39:03] permitted use does fit the identity of

[2:39:05] Alpine and does meet the positive impact

[2:39:10] of residents. I'm not talking about

[2:39:11] parks. I'm not talking about community

[2:39:13] centers. I'm not talking about

[2:39:14] nonprofits. I'm talking about profitable

[2:39:17] endeavors. And I've done the numbers on

[2:39:18] some and they do work. And I brought

[2:39:20] these up with the owner and they do

[2:39:22] work. And so that's where I'm missing

[2:39:24] the flexibility.

[2:39:25] >> Do you have a list of those? Because

[2:39:26] that would be helpful for us took a lot

[2:39:28] of work to do. I had to do numbers. I

[2:39:29] had to walk cemeteries. I had to walk

[2:39:31] housing lots. I had to see how many

[2:39:33] could fit. I had to use AI to figure out

[2:39:35] does this pencil I got up to $21

[2:39:36] million. So there is a way to make this

[2:39:39] profitable with permitted uses. And I

[2:39:42] have not received flexibility. I met

[2:39:44] with you guys in person and I didn't

[2:39:46] receive any flexibility of any other

[2:39:47] capacity that we could do that would

[2:39:49] uplift that area of alpine. I received

[2:39:51] basically a brick wall just like this

[2:39:53] one. No, this is what we do. This is all

[2:39:55] we do. So anyways,

[2:39:58] there's 36 more residents. I will

[2:40:01] respond to them. ones that live right

[2:40:02] next to it, ones that live all around.

[2:40:04] Concerned about everything from safety

[2:40:06] that like they're worried about how

[2:40:09] dense the hallways are, like meaning how

[2:40:11] this wall, you can't see anything that

[2:40:13] goes on back there. And this is the

[2:40:14] residence right next to it. They're

[2:40:15] worried about safety. They're worried

[2:40:16] about fire concerns. They're worried

[2:40:18] about you guys getting approved for this

[2:40:21] and then selling it to someone else that

[2:40:23] we don't know. But then the whole

[2:40:24] ordinance has basically opened the door

[2:40:27] and we are left with someone else. if

[2:40:30] you guys sell the project. Um, lastly,

[2:40:34] the residents from where this actually

[2:40:37] exists, and I sent that to you. I hope

[2:40:38] it was helpful. I did not know any of

[2:40:41] the concerns. Much of their concerns

[2:40:44] were, oh, and I'm sorry, I'll bring

[2:40:46] these up because these are questions.

[2:40:47] What should residents expect in terms of

[2:40:49] duration, noise, impact in the

[2:40:50] construction process? What measures will

[2:40:52] be in place to prevent excessive noise

[2:40:53] or disruptive activity? You've answered

[2:40:55] some of that. What hours will the

[2:40:56] storage units be units and garages be

[2:40:58] accessible? Will there be landscaping

[2:41:00] such as to? These are residents who

[2:41:02] specifically asked to ask. The

[2:41:03] renderings appear somewhat industrial in

[2:41:05] appearance. Is there an opportunity for

[2:41:06] improved design input including more

[2:41:08] thoughtful paint colors and additional

[2:41:09] landscapings to soften the look? Okay.

[2:41:11] Anyways, the ones that are most helpful

[2:41:13] the ones that are living there. So, I

[2:41:15] started knocking doors and asking them,

[2:41:17] uh, how is this to live by? And it went

[2:41:20] from, well, it's not the prettiest

[2:41:22] thing, and we're just glad it's not a

[2:41:23] super high-rise apartment building. And

[2:41:26] I'm like, man, we are so blessed that

[2:41:28] that's how they think. And and and it

[2:41:30] went all the way to I knocked on a door

[2:41:33] and he's like, it was a wife and she

[2:41:35] said, come in. My husband's on the

[2:41:36] planning commission of Bluell. And I was

[2:41:40] great. This guy knows the city lingo.

[2:41:42] First question he asked me, this is the

[2:41:44] first question he asked me. He didn't

[2:41:46] ask. He said, "Wait, you guys are doing

[2:41:48] storage units?" I said, "Well, it's

[2:41:50] being proposed. What do you think?"

[2:41:51] Because I don't want to I don't want to

[2:41:53] make him biased. Um, and he said, "Hold

[2:41:56] on. You're not changing your ordinance,

[2:41:58] right?" And I was like, "Well, yes, that

[2:42:01] is exactly what the proposal is." He

[2:42:03] said, "Okay, we did this and now we're

[2:42:05] trying to walk it all back because

[2:42:07] there's dozens of these coming in." Now,

[2:42:09] when he says dozens, they they

[2:42:10] compartmentalize and fragment. As you

[2:42:11] can see, these are two of them. Uh,

[2:42:13] these are two separate ones here in

[2:42:14] Bluffell. He says, "We're trying to walk

[2:42:16] it back, and we can't walk it back. we

[2:42:19] can't do anything about it because it's

[2:42:20] now it's open rain and we're trying now

[2:42:23] desperately to walk this back to gain

[2:42:25] some sort of control. I think a lot of

[2:42:26] cities are in this situation where

[2:42:28] they've lost control of their city. Um

[2:42:31] their next feedback was

[2:42:34] they never build enough parking and

[2:42:36] U-Hauls, which is interesting. You were

[2:42:38] talking about U-Hauls. U-Hauls are

[2:42:40] constantly there. The trucks dropping

[2:42:42] things off, leaving things. And I

[2:42:44] noticed from your design, it's very

[2:42:46] similar. there's not a lot of space for

[2:42:47] U-Hauls to get in there and like

[2:42:50] navigate and if there's three or four or

[2:42:52] two at the same time, there's no place

[2:42:54] for them to unload. So, what happens is

[2:42:55] it just ends up going on the street and

[2:42:57] it's there for many many days. So, they

[2:42:58] brought up the parking is not people

[2:43:00] using it. The parking is when people are

[2:43:02] loading and unloading. It becomes this

[2:43:04] constant transient thing. I don't even

[2:43:06] know how you load a portion there. Um,

[2:43:08] but and then they brought up uh several

[2:43:10] others that I can send to you. Um, which

[2:43:14] were uh very much in the realm of I'm

[2:43:17] trying to pull them up so I read them

[2:43:19] identically or or read them exactly.

[2:43:23] Um, but they were very much I have four

[2:43:26] months of notes. I'm sorry. They're very

[2:43:28] much in the realm of the sirens go off

[2:43:30] and no one knows who's to who to call

[2:43:32] because they have to be highly secure.

[2:43:34] That's why they kind of look like a

[2:43:35] jail. Um, and I don't mean that

[2:43:37] demeaningly. I just mean you don't walk

[2:43:39] around cities where things are so high

[2:43:41] and so beefy. Um, so they say the sirens

[2:43:45] go off, no one's there. They rent them

[2:43:47] out to other people. People use them as

[2:43:50] a segway to live in or to do basically

[2:43:53] high high density commercial housing. So those those are what I gained from

[2:43:58] them. The people who were for it were

[2:44:02] about six guys all about our age. And I

[2:44:05] know we're all have this thing wired in

[2:44:07] us to make a man cave and fill it full

[2:44:09] of all of our toys. I get it. I have

[2:44:10] that chip as well. But we're also have a

[2:44:13] chip to preserve a community, preserve

[2:44:15] America, preserve Alpine. And we're

[2:44:17] losing it. We're losing it. And this, I

[2:44:19] know, is hard to find that connection.

[2:44:22] But this is a piece of how we lose it

[2:44:24] because if you go to the communities

[2:44:25] that have these, they next put in

[2:44:27] highdensity housing, highdensity

[2:44:29] apartments. They lose their rural feel.

[2:44:31] They become very transient. This is

[2:44:34] basically a piece of the highdensity

[2:44:36] puzzle where people don't have enough

[2:44:37] storage at their home so they store

[2:44:39] everything in these units and it goes to

[2:44:41] this low ownership type of deep

[2:44:44] philosoph uh I'm going more deeper in

[2:44:46] this way of life that people are fleeing

[2:44:49] from in Arizona, Nevada, California and

[2:44:53] other parts of Utah. And so, you know,

[2:44:56] my personal opinion, well, this is what

[2:44:58] I would hope. This is the path forward.

[2:45:01] I I I see no for me. I see no path with

[2:45:05] this current code to approve it without

[2:45:08] drastic and I know we're not approving

[2:45:10] it without drastic fixes. So, we would

[2:45:12] have to work very much with the

[2:45:15] residents to make sure they're okay with

[2:45:16] it. Are you guys okay living with this

[2:45:19] code for the next hundred years of your

[2:45:21] life? That's who we need to get okay on.

[2:45:24] Okay. Um and then I think you might be

[2:45:28] able to get a compromise with them if

[2:45:30] you take out that big wall in the front,

[2:45:32] push it back because that is just so in

[2:45:34] everyone's face. It blocks mountains. It

[2:45:37] blocks everything. I mean, you're you're

[2:45:39] now in

[2:45:41] Chicago like like that. You got a church

[2:45:43] on one side alpine, you got a Chicago on

[2:45:45] the other side. You're like, what's

[2:45:46] going on? Um, and so I think if you can

[2:45:50] compromise with them, I think if you can

[2:45:51] get the residence and I looked him in

[2:45:54] the face and I sat down with him and I

[2:45:56] saw his pain, the owner, okay, I know

[2:46:00] what he's going through and having him

[2:46:03] on one side and the threats and then

[2:46:05] having uh, which who I deeply respect

[2:46:07] and love. I love the guy and my whole

[2:46:09] family. I love him. And then having the

[2:46:11] residents in Alpine on the other side is

[2:46:12] a terrible situation. And I know the

[2:46:16] consequences of this going one way or

[2:46:18] another. I've been very much told what

[2:46:20] happens based on my decision and their

[2:46:22] decision, the consequences on both

[2:46:24] sides, which are very heavy. Um, and so

[2:46:28] I am hoping, praying, pleading that you

[2:46:30] will work with the residents, change

[2:46:32] this to be something that they're okay

[2:46:33] with. I think you're

[2:46:37] 25% of the way there. If you can get 75,

[2:46:42] if you can address their concerns, which

[2:46:44] will cause you some pain and remove a

[2:46:47] lot of the bulk and massing that you

[2:46:50] have, a lot of the quantity that you

[2:46:51] have, you could reach, I think, an

[2:46:54] agreement with them. But until that, I

[2:46:56] can't ever support something like this,

[2:46:57] which is what I told you from the

[2:46:58] beginning. Thank you for your time.

[2:47:00] >> Okay, Brent.

[2:47:02] >> Thank you.

[2:47:03] Did you have any responses to anything

[2:47:05] that he said or would you like to just

[2:47:06] move on? See if

[2:47:08] >> we can keep moving. I mean, Ryan Ryan, I

[2:47:10] think if you want to jump on and explain

[2:47:11] some of the code thing, I think might be

[2:47:14] helpful if you want to jump on, but if

[2:47:16] not, we can keep moving.

[2:47:22] » Rain, are you muted or is he off again?

[2:47:34] Oh, it says the audio is off down there.

[2:47:35] Can you see on the Zoom?

[2:47:42] » Oh, okay.

[2:47:43] >> He might not be able to comment.

[2:47:45] >> And if he's if he's listening, the code

[2:47:48] specifics are the grammatical sparing,

[2:47:51] but also it's H. It's this.

[2:47:54] >> Oh, good. There you go.

[2:47:58] All right.

[2:48:04] It says he's on mute.

[2:48:05] >> He's on mute now.

[2:48:07] >> Oh, he wasn't before.

[2:48:12] » Speaker.

[2:48:13] >> Okay. Can you guys hear me now?

[2:48:15] >> Is that on speaker?

[2:48:16] >> Yeah.

[2:48:17] >> Turn this way.

[2:48:18] >> Hold on. Let me turn him up. Okay. Now

[2:48:21] talk.

[2:48:23] Can you talk,

[2:48:27] Ryan?

[2:48:29] He unmuted on Zoom.

[2:48:34] » All right.

[2:48:34] >> Can you guys hear me on Zoom?

[2:48:36] >> Is he on Zoom, too?

[2:48:37] >> No.

[2:48:39] >> Okay.

[2:48:39] >> It says I'm unmuted on my end anyway.

[2:48:42] >> Okay. Well, you just talk through my

[2:48:43] phone. That's fine.

[2:48:46] » Go.

[2:48:50] » Are you talking to me?

[2:48:51] >> Yes, we'll talk.

[2:48:53] >> No. No. Sorry.

[2:48:56] That's going to get annoying.

[2:48:58] I can hear my feedback. Um,

[2:49:01] no, I I just I didn't know if anyone had

[2:49:03] any questions. I'm happy to jump in and help with those. I will say I only I

[2:49:08] only heard bits and pieces of that. I'm

[2:49:10] just driving back from from Enoch. But,

[2:49:13] um, I only heard bits and pieces of

[2:49:15] that, but I I will say we did have

[2:49:18] several proposals come before these guys

[2:49:22] came in. Um, and they were all pretty

[2:49:26] impactful, high density,

[2:49:29] you know, multi- Anyway, they there was a lot of those that came in.

[2:49:34] At the end of the day, I think they met

[2:49:35] with a lot of the a lot of the former

[2:49:37] council and it was kind of like, well,

[2:49:38] we're not we're not comfortable moving

[2:49:40] that far yet or doing one of things like

[2:49:42] that. So, this is one that we got that

[2:49:45] could use the existing building. They

[2:49:47] didn't have to tear it down. Um, and

[2:49:50] yeah, so that that's kind of how we we

[2:49:52] got to where we are with this one. We

[2:49:55] did write it, so we took what they

[2:49:57] needed in there to make it work and then

[2:50:01] we tried to write it. So it was um like to protect or to safeguard some of

[2:50:07] the things that we we had concerns with storage units. Um, so that that's

[2:50:13] kind of how we got to where we are. It

[2:50:15] was that's that's really the only piece

[2:50:18] in Alpine that storage units like this

[2:50:20] would would really work. So that's why

[2:50:23] it's written the way that it is to kind

[2:50:25] of limit and this isn't the first time

[2:50:27] that Alpine or cities have have done

[2:50:30] things like that that hey this would

[2:50:31] work here but maybe not anywhere else.

[2:50:34] Um but yeah, sorry I'm rambling. Are

[2:50:37] there any questions or anything that I

[2:50:39] can help with on this? No, I mean I feel

[2:50:42] I appreciate the effort that you made

[2:50:44] because yeah, with all the restrictions

[2:50:46] that are put on the ordinance. I I agree

[2:50:49] with you with the lot size having to be

[2:50:52] at least three acres, maximum of five.

[2:50:55] Um, and then that you can't have one

[2:50:57] within a mile of an existing one. Um,

[2:51:00] with that being said, even though you've

[2:51:02] taken careful consideration, I do like

[2:51:04] Andy's idea of it not being um, a

[2:51:10] condition of use, but maybe an overlay.

[2:51:12] But in either one of those though, you

[2:51:14] still need to have you still need to

[2:51:15] come front of um, city council or

[2:51:17] planning commission to be able to get

[2:51:19] that granted. So, it's not just an

[2:51:22] automatic

[2:51:23] approval. Just because this passes, it's

[2:51:26] not an automatic approval. I do

[2:51:28] appreciate um you know what? I'm gonna

[2:51:31] go ahead and allow

[2:51:33] >> Yeah.

[2:51:33] >> Um Brent to go ahead and speak and we'll

[2:51:36] wait for Jess. Well, if Jessica's not

[2:51:38] back, we'll go on to Sarah. Go ahead,

[2:51:40] Brent.

[2:51:41] >> Yeah. I had the same comment, Mayor

[2:51:43] Andy. I appreciate your input and they they looked at it at the planning

[2:51:47] commission as well, and it's um I really

[2:51:49] appreciate that one. Your last concern

[2:51:51] was specific plan being considered

[2:51:54] versus code change approval only. But

[2:51:56] because this has to go through the

[2:51:58] conditional use permit, my understanding

[2:52:00] is that this isn't the endgame. If we

[2:52:03] change the ordinance, it doesn't mean

[2:52:04] they can change their architectural

[2:52:06] concept and and just pull one over on

[2:52:10] us. They they're still going to have to

[2:52:11] go through the conditional use

[2:52:13] permitting process and get plans

[2:52:15] approved that that address the gateway

[2:52:17] standards. They have to meet the height

[2:52:20] requirements, setbacks, everything else.

[2:52:22] So, is that correct, Steve?

[2:52:27] » Yes. I guess one thing I should point

[2:52:30] out is if you decide to approve a text

[2:52:34] amendment, that is a legislative

[2:52:37] decision.

[2:52:39] Once a legislative decision has has

[2:52:41] permitted this as a conditional use,

[2:52:44] then we're moving into the

[2:52:45] administrative decision arena. So even

[2:52:48] though it comes to the city council, the

[2:52:50] city council can't act as a legislative

[2:52:53] body and saying we don't like what

[2:52:55] you're doing here. All you can do is act

[2:52:59] as an administrative body and saying

[2:53:02] this is basically a permitted use, but

[2:53:04] we are going to impose conditions that

[2:53:08] mitigate the reasonably anticipated

[2:53:10] detrimental effects of the use. So it's

[2:53:13] not you got way more discretion on a

[2:53:16] text amendment than you would on a

[2:53:18] conditional use permit.

[2:53:19] >> So if there's something that we really

[2:53:20] want to see, we need to put it in the

[2:53:23] ordinance. Correct. Text amendment. So

[2:53:25] for example, meeting the Gateway

[2:53:27] Historic standards, which I think is

[2:53:29] already in there. That's probably the

[2:53:31] biggest concern that I've heard from

[2:53:32] residents is does it meet the feel of

[2:53:34] Alpine? And that's in there. So,

[2:53:36] anything else that we would identify

[2:53:38] that we absolutely want to have in there

[2:53:40] that

[2:53:42] this is the time to put that in, which

[2:53:43] is to Andrew's point.

[2:53:44] >> Well, I think I'd like clarification on

[2:53:47] that because this is outside the

[2:53:48] gateway. The gateway only goes to 200

[2:53:51] North.

[2:53:51] >> It's in the gateway.

[2:53:55] >> Ryan, is it in the gateway or out of the

[2:53:56] gateway?

[2:53:57] >> It says it in the ordinance, right?

[2:54:01] >> So, are you turned up, Shane? Are you

[2:54:03] turned up?

[2:54:05] because he can talk through.

[2:54:06] >> Does business commercial define the

[2:54:07] whole gateway?

[2:54:09] >> It's red.

[2:54:10] >> So I think

[2:54:12] >> I think it's

[2:54:13] >> Yeah, Ryan talk now. See if there can

[2:54:16] you clarify there. He is

[2:54:17] >> for some reason I thought it was south

[2:54:18] of He's talking.

[2:54:20] >> So anything in the business commercial

[2:54:21] zone is in the gateway historic

[2:54:25] standards would

[2:54:26] >> Oh everything

[2:54:28] >> in the bright red. Sorry, I can someone

[2:54:31] repeat what he said so I can hear.

[2:54:33] Everything in everything in the business

[2:54:35] commercial zone are you?

[2:54:38] >> Oh, he said everything in the business

[2:54:40] commercial zone is in the historic

[2:54:42] gateway,

[2:54:43] >> but this is mixeduse zone.

[2:54:45] >> It's business commercial. Currently, it

[2:54:47] is a business commercial zone which is

[2:54:50] designated by the color red. I

[2:54:51] >> mean, I thought it was I thought it was

[2:54:53] I thought the ordinance was pretty

[2:54:55] thorough um with the acreage law size I

[2:54:59] think one of the biggest concerns

[2:55:00] residents brought forth to me was

[2:55:03] initially based on a Facebook post that

[2:55:05] said, "Hey, the city's about to consider

[2:55:07] storage sheds. We don't want storage

[2:55:09] facilities in Alpine." And I reached out

[2:55:11] to every single one of those and just

[2:55:13] said, "Hey, you can talk to Stack, but

[2:55:15] they've talked to some of they've talked

[2:55:16] to the council members. Here is what the

[2:55:19] proposal is and why it's different than

[2:55:21] what you normally see along the freeway

[2:55:23] with orange garage doors and barbed wire

[2:55:27] chain link fences and and big neon

[2:55:29] signs. So that was

[2:55:32] much different than what they expected

[2:55:34] when I when I when I responded to them.

[2:55:37] And then also kind of explaining the

[2:55:38] zoning. A lot of times residents don't

[2:55:40] understand zoning concepts. Um

[2:55:44] >> so trying to explain that to them as

[2:55:45] well. to answer that question.

[2:55:47] >> But anyway, um here are a couple of my

[2:55:49] questions for you while you're here.

[2:55:51] >> Yeah.

[2:55:52] >> So, the customer parking was brought up

[2:55:54] as as a concern. Um I noticed and I

[2:55:56] listened to the planning commission

[2:55:58] discussion about having ample parking.

[2:56:00] It looks to me like other than your

[2:56:02] community center on the outside with

[2:56:04] those diagonal lots for people that

[2:56:07] might stop there to do whatever, most of

[2:56:10] the parking for accessing the storage

[2:56:12] units would be internal to the building.

[2:56:15] Yeah. So up on the if we I mean um if

[2:56:18] you go into the cemetery road you enter

[2:56:20] in the property kind of where that area

[2:56:22] is just to the north of the

[2:56:24] >> um

[2:56:26] >> to like them zip

[2:56:27] >> uh backwards. Sorry

[2:56:30] >> up.

[2:56:30] >> Yep. Right there. One more right there.

[2:56:33] >> Okay.

[2:56:33] >> Back back one. Sorry.

[2:56:35] >> That one.

[2:56:36] >> Thank you. Yeah. So if you look at the next to the big brown portion that's

[2:56:40] the self- storage facility. to the right

[2:56:42] of that. That's where the parking is.

[2:56:44] There's going to be about 10 stalls

[2:56:46] right there. That would be where loading

[2:56:47] is as well. Um and and so there's a

[2:56:51] facility that's similar to this. It's

[2:56:53] about a little over three miles away

[2:56:55] from here. That's um I'd say it's

[2:56:59] >> on Cedar Hills.

[2:57:00] >> Yeah. In Cedar Hills. We're about we're

[2:57:02] about twothirds the size of that one.

[2:57:04] has four parking stalls. It's a

[2:57:07] it's you know, so it's 120,000 building.

[2:57:09] Really big. And they don't have any

[2:57:10] parking issues. And the reason why and

[2:57:13] when we build these kind of all over the

[2:57:14] country and limit parking the only time

[2:57:16] we build more parking is when an

[2:57:18] ordinance requires it and it's you know

[2:57:20] we have the ability to do it and we so

[2:57:22] we put a couple you know more in than we

[2:57:24] need. We we're just such a low traffic

[2:57:26] generator that that we don't need the

[2:57:28] parking stalls. We we have enough

[2:57:30] loading room right there kind of out in

[2:57:32] that area. There are I I want to say 8

[2:57:36] to 10 stalls right there. One of them

[2:57:38] will need to be uh ADA accessible. also

[2:57:40] a handicap stall. And so that would um

[2:57:43] but yeah, we we're good on we're good on

[2:57:46] parking for the self- storage portion of

[2:57:48] that. Now, to access the the keep the garage units, you go through a gate.

[2:57:53] There'd be a gate between that to

[2:57:55] between that larger unit that says 2,700

[2:57:58] feet to the corner right there. Yeah.

[2:58:00] Right where your mouse is. There'd be a

[2:58:02] gate through there. You enter through

[2:58:03] that. That's a 50 foot wide uh area

[2:58:06] right there. Just larger than the street

[2:58:09] out front. you know, it's a w a wide

[2:58:11] access there. And then for parking, you

[2:58:13] can park in front of your unit. Likely

[2:58:15] they'd pull inside their unit or just be

[2:58:17] right outside their unit. There's plenty

[2:58:18] of room there for for parking. So, um

[2:58:22] you know, for for us to operate

[2:58:24] efficiently based on our experience in

[2:58:26] developing self storage, the parking

[2:58:27] that we have is sufficient.

[2:58:29] >> So, the only entrance to the self-

[2:58:30] storage portion would be on that east

[2:58:32] side.

[2:58:33] >> Correct. So, if if there was any kind of

[2:58:36] overflow traffic, if there happened to

[2:58:38] be 15 U-Hauls there one Saturday morning

[2:58:40] at the same time, which probably isn't

[2:58:42] very likely,

[2:58:43] >> right?

[2:58:43] >> Um the likelihood of them going out to

[2:58:46] 200 North and having to

[2:58:48] >> truck their their stuff all the way in

[2:58:50] is fairly remote, I would think.

[2:58:53] >> So, there will be a gate access gate

[2:58:54] right there where the cursor is and also

[2:58:56] on 200 North.

[2:58:57] >> Correct.

[2:58:58] >> The only people with access to that

[2:59:00] would be for the for the

[2:59:02] >> owners of those units. Yeah, correct.

[2:59:05] >> Um, one of the residents asked about

[2:59:07] screening and I saw on your AR on your

[2:59:09] plan that these are the residents to the

[2:59:11] north and I saw those historical

[2:59:14] pictures with all the vehicles parked

[2:59:16] there and everything else. Um we had a

[2:59:19] little issue of that with the

[2:59:22] parking um lot over by Burgess Orchard

[2:59:27] and the discussion on the on the com on

[2:59:30] the council about six foot fences versus

[2:59:32] 8ft fences landscaping trees. What is

[2:59:36] your plan to provide sufficient kind of

[2:59:38] a buffer there for them? So, we hired an

[2:59:42] a landscape architect that put those

[2:59:44] specific uh trees in there that would we said these these neighbors we we've

[2:59:49] committed to them verbally. You know, I know that that's not in the ordinance,

[2:59:52] but sat in their living room and said

[2:59:54] we're we're we're committed to to

[2:59:56] putting privacy trees there uh to kind

[2:59:59] of what what they they had actually um

[3:00:02] there are trees that were planted there

[3:00:03] that those residences are maintaining

[3:00:05] right now. So, they're paying to to keep

[3:00:08] those up. I believe it's the back of the

[3:00:09] MacArthur's. They may go all the way

[3:00:11] over to the Higgies and I think the

[3:00:13] Sonowskis are in this corner as well.

[3:00:15] So, there are a few trees that were

[3:00:17] planted there. We're saying we will add

[3:00:20] two or do whatever. Uh but but there are

[3:00:23] tree types here that it's showing um

[3:00:26] what the what are plan to be there. I'm

[3:00:28] definitely not a tree expert. So kind of

[3:00:29] outsource that to landscape architect

[3:00:31] and say the goal is to to provide

[3:00:33] screening and privacy there so there's

[3:00:36] you know noise and everything like that

[3:00:38] on that side. So

[3:00:39] >> okay thanks.

[3:00:41] >> Um

[3:00:44] we you talked about oh one note for the

[3:00:46] staff. I think we should add the

[3:00:48] ordinance if we choose to allow this to

[3:00:50] prohibit rentals of U-Hauls.

[3:00:53] >> Right. That would be one that we for

[3:00:55] sure would want to do and not leave that

[3:00:58] to the the uh conditional use permit or

[3:01:01] overlay zone.

[3:01:03] >> Yeah.

[3:01:03] >> Um as far as the CCNRs, the covenants,

[3:01:06] conditions, and restrictions that will

[3:01:07] be on these units limiting the hours of

[3:01:10] operation, you you mentioned the self-

[3:01:12] storage access would probably be between

[3:01:14] 6 a.m. and 10 or 11 p.m. What about the condos? The

[3:01:20] >> condos since they are owned and they're

[3:01:22] going to be, you know, expensive and

[3:01:24] they're going to house expensive

[3:01:26] property.

[3:01:27] um those will be accessed 24/7.

[3:01:30] >> 247. And your experience in these types

[3:01:32] of um developments, how are they used

[3:01:36] late at night? Because that's maybe one

[3:01:37] of the concerns of the neighbors.

[3:01:38] >> Yeah. I mean, it's just like if you

[3:01:40] think of in in a town home community or

[3:01:42] your neighbor, if your neighbors being

[3:01:44] loud or they're having any issues like

[3:01:46] late at night, you're going to you're

[3:01:48] going to elevate that that type of an

[3:01:49] issue. This is a very much gonna, you

[3:01:51] know, we're going to manage a very

[3:01:53] strong community of people that is, so

[3:01:55] if there's any issues, you'll have the

[3:01:57] owner's contact information. You'll have

[3:01:58] our as the as the manager of the

[3:02:01] facilities contact information if there

[3:02:02] are any of those issues of, hey, you're

[3:02:04] not you're disturbing your residential

[3:02:08] neighbors next door, your businesses

[3:02:09] next door, and everything.

[3:02:10] >> And they also have recourse to go to the

[3:02:12] police for basic nuisance laws just like

[3:02:14] any res any neighbor would

[3:02:17] >> I've got to just put a pause for a

[3:02:19] second. We have an ordinance that we

[3:02:20] normally don't go past 9:00 for our

[3:02:22] meetings. So, I need a motion to extend

[3:02:25] our meetings beyond this meeting beyond

[3:02:27] 9:00 p.m.

[3:02:29] >> I'll make a motion to extend the meeting

[3:02:31] beyond 9:00 p.m. until the business of

[3:02:34] the city is complete.

[3:02:35] >> Okay. Is there a second?

[3:02:36] >> I'll second. You got it.

[3:02:37] >> It's been moved by Councilwoman Smeuan,

[3:02:39] seconded by Councilman Rumler to extend

[3:02:41] the meeting.

[3:02:44] >> All in favor?

[3:02:45] >> I.

[3:02:47] >> Okay. Okay. So, as far as the CCR CCNRs,

[3:02:49] I'm very familiar. I I I was a land use

[3:02:51] attorney for a couple years before I

[3:02:52] switched careers. So, I've very familiar

[3:02:53] with CCNRs in the residential side. On

[3:02:56] the business side, who enforces those

[3:02:59] CCNRs or do you have a do you have a

[3:03:01] board of directors made up of the owners

[3:03:03] of the condo units?

[3:03:04] >> Yeah. So, we would have we would have a

[3:03:06] board of owners. So, um the specifics of

[3:03:09] that aren't ironed out exact. I don't

[3:03:11] have a sheet exactly of what that would

[3:03:12] be, but typically those are like 60% of

[3:03:14] the owners have to agree to some odd

[3:03:16] change and there would be some type of a

[3:03:18] management of those to make sure that

[3:03:20] those are being

[3:03:20] >> would there be any kind of city

[3:03:22] requirement to approve those CCNR

[3:03:24] changes? Because what I'm concerned

[3:03:25] about is signage and

[3:03:29] whatever those type of things that are

[3:03:30] going to be in these CCRs that prohibit

[3:03:32] certain uses that may be of concern to

[3:03:33] the residents. I just don't want the

[3:03:35] owners to be able to unilaterally change

[3:03:37] those without any kind of city review

[3:03:40] and approval, especially those things

[3:03:41] that are lead to aesthetics and things

[3:03:44] like that.

[3:03:45] >> Yeah. I think what we had done with the

[3:03:46] question with that with Ryan was that

[3:03:48] was included our CCNRs. We agreed that

[3:03:51] the CCNRs would be included in the

[3:03:52] ordinance somehow. So, so that was

[3:03:54] something that we would um before our approval we would hand over to to

[3:04:01] the city to incorporate. But signage is

[3:04:03] controlled by by city ordinance. So what

[3:04:06] else are you talking about then?

[3:04:08] >> Um if if we own or if we manage a unit,

[3:04:12] we don't want someone going and putting

[3:04:14] a big sign on top of their their portion

[3:04:16] of their building which is part of a

[3:04:18] community as well. So we would say,

[3:04:19] "Hey, you can't can't do that. Your

[3:04:21] stuff's inside your unit, not outside

[3:04:22] your unit."

[3:04:23] >> I think that is also um by city

[3:04:26] ordinance. Like you can't just put stuff

[3:04:28] up anywhere you want. like signs on a

[3:04:30] roundabout even though it's owned by the

[3:04:32] church. Like there's lots of ordinances

[3:04:34] controlling signage. So I'm not sure

[3:04:36] what what they're referring to.

[3:04:38] >> Is there anything you can think of that

[3:04:39] would be in the CCRs CCNRs that aren't

[3:04:41] in the ordinance that

[3:04:43] >> that would be potentially impactful for

[3:04:46] the residents nearby?

[3:04:48] >> Um the ordinance says no business use

[3:04:51] that would draw in

[3:04:53] >> council member. Could I just make a

[3:04:54] suggestion? if you are inclined to

[3:04:57] proceed with this with the text

[3:05:00] amendment and it does mention CCNRs. In

[3:05:05] my experience, u the city doesn't have a

[3:05:09] lot of leverage unless the city is

[3:05:11] either a party to the CCNRs or the city

[3:05:14] is an express intended third party

[3:05:17] beneficiary that can enforce the CCNRs.

[3:05:21] What often happens is that HOAs

[3:05:24] decide they just don't want to maintain

[3:05:26] the landscaped area even though that's

[3:05:28] part of their the approved covenants

[3:05:30] conditions and restrictions and then and

[3:05:32] then what do you do?

[3:05:33] >> They just say we'll give this over to

[3:05:35] you, you take care of it, city. So, um

[3:05:40] there there are some ways to to improve

[3:05:42] enforcement.

[3:05:44] Um,

[3:05:46] homeowners associations don't often go

[3:05:49] after their own members because they

[3:05:50] don't have a lot of money to go do that.

[3:05:53] So, so there are some things we could do

[3:05:55] if you decide to go that direction.

[3:06:00] >> Who who maintains the exterior uh

[3:06:02] landscaping? Is that

[3:06:05] the owner of the business? Not not the

[3:06:08] >> It would be an HOA. So, it' be us who's

[3:06:11] the manager of the HOA. And so we would

[3:06:14] maintain it.

[3:06:17] >> All right. So you have a you have the

[3:06:18] main storage facility and then you have

[3:06:20] the individually owned condos.

[3:06:22] >> Yeah.

[3:06:22] >> Two two separate uses,

[3:06:24] >> right?

[3:06:25] >> Yeah.

[3:06:25] >> So who who would maintain all this

[3:06:28] landscaping? That's the the the owners,

[3:06:31] the board.

[3:06:32] >> Yeah. But it would be it Yeah. We we are

[3:06:35] the we would be the management the HOA

[3:06:37] management company. So right now at

[3:06:38] Stack Real Estate, we have a property

[3:06:40] management company as well. So manage a

[3:06:42] bunch of um so we have a lot of

[3:06:44] experience in managing real estate and

[3:06:46] so it'd be an extension of that that

[3:06:48] would be in charge of u of keeping that

[3:06:53] via the HOA.

[3:06:57] Right. I I uh I appreciate your efforts

[3:07:00] to reach out to the residents um and

[3:07:02] asking us for

[3:07:04] um contact information of those who have

[3:07:06] reached out. As I mentioned, I think

[3:07:08] I've mentioned before, there was a

[3:07:10] Facebook post in November, shortly after

[3:07:12] the planning commission meeting that

[3:07:13] just referred to the project as storage

[3:07:16] sheds or storage units. And the 14

[3:07:19] people that contacted me

[3:07:21] >> shortly after that basically were

[3:07:24] thinking of what you typically see in an

[3:07:27] industrial area. And in my response to

[3:07:30] them and then forwarding your

[3:07:33] architectural concept plans last week to

[3:07:35] all those individuals who reached out to

[3:07:36] me before, I asked them if they were if

[3:07:39] they had additional concerns they would

[3:07:40] like to bring up before this meeting.

[3:07:42] And I had two people respond. One was,

[3:07:44] well, I saw what was there before with

[3:07:46] purple and then before that with the

[3:07:48] candy place because I've lived there a

[3:07:50] long time. I definitely don't want

[3:07:52] anything that brings traffic and more

[3:07:54] parking along the street. And I've had

[3:07:56] people talk to me about all the parking

[3:07:57] that took place in the church parking

[3:07:59] lot across the street. And I personally

[3:08:02] had extensive experience with that in

[3:08:04] the last I think we've been going to

[3:08:05] that church for the last nine years when

[3:08:07] they moved us from the one here by the

[3:08:09] roundabout. And on our nights with the

[3:08:13] youth, there were always, as you showed

[3:08:16] in your picture, cars and cars from the

[3:08:18] purple employees that were there and all

[3:08:21] along the street. And obviously I I

[3:08:24] would see think the residents were very

[3:08:25] concerned about that and now we're going

[3:08:27] to have one employee there it sounds

[3:08:28] like um and then the occasional people

[3:08:32] coming in. So the biggest concern to me

[3:08:34] from the resident expressed was traffic

[3:08:36] and safety anesthetics. And it sounds

[3:08:38] like the traffic and safety from these

[3:08:40] two residents that have replied is we

[3:08:43] would much rather have this business

[3:08:45] than some of the potential businesses.

[3:08:48] And what Ryan said briefly was

[3:08:52] prior to this proposal, the proposals to

[3:08:54] the city council before have been

[3:08:57] returning to industrial use, which the

[3:08:59] city council um voted down on a five to

[3:09:02] zero vote. We didn't want that kind of

[3:09:04] traffic in the area and trucks. And then

[3:09:06] the other proposals were mixed

[3:09:07] residential, retail use, high density

[3:09:10] that would have would have brought

[3:09:12] significant traffic. And you had the

[3:09:13] list of all the potential things that

[3:09:15] could be done on there. Not a lot of

[3:09:17] those would work with that existing

[3:09:19] building. What do you think? 43,000

[3:09:20] square feet of usable space. So, also

[3:09:24] considering that, um, for me, this seems

[3:09:27] like a very viable use of that property

[3:09:30] the way it is. The other person and

[3:09:34] Andrew referenced these questions. I

[3:09:36] would just like to pose some of these to

[3:09:37] you because they haven't been some of

[3:09:39] them haven't been addressed yet.

[3:09:41] >> Is what should residents expect in terms

[3:09:43] of the duration, noise, and impact of

[3:09:46] the construction process?

[3:09:48] >> Yeah, I understand that concern for

[3:09:50] sure. Um, we anticipate it to take us

[3:09:52] about 12 months to build. Um and we in

[3:09:55] speaking with all the neighbors, our our

[3:09:57] commitment is we'll do our best to keep

[3:10:00] it um as as quiet, communicate in

[3:10:03] advance with uh what whatever work is

[3:10:06] taking place. Uh we we talked to one

[3:10:08] neighbor who runs the the event center

[3:10:10] and their concern was what time of year

[3:10:12] are you going to be building that

[3:10:13] building? And our response is we don't

[3:10:15] know exactly the timing of when we'd be

[3:10:17] able to pull a building permit. So,

[3:10:19] because I don't know the time I'll be able to pull a building permit,

[3:10:22] I don't know when I would start that.

[3:10:24] But understanding their seasonal

[3:10:26] business that is next door is we would

[3:10:28] cooperate and communicate the best that

[3:10:30] we could so that if there's a way for us

[3:10:31] to phase it so it impacts them the

[3:10:34] least, we're committed to do that, you

[3:10:36] know, and so gave them my contact

[3:10:38] information and that's the commitment

[3:10:41] that I gave to them there. Um, but but

[3:10:44] for all residences in general, I think

[3:10:46] once we start construction, we're about

[3:10:48] a 12-month timeline. Um, again,

[3:10:50] depending on weather, if we have a

[3:10:53] winter, depending on how intense the

[3:10:55] winter is, those kind of things. So, um,

[3:10:58] but yeah, I think our commitment is we

[3:10:59] want to be good neighbors. We don't want

[3:11:00] anybody to be, you know, irritated with

[3:11:02] us every day. We'll have our contact

[3:11:04] information to everybody that is

[3:11:06] concerned. We'll have a superintendent

[3:11:08] that will be able to be in touch with

[3:11:09] them and communicate in advance with

[3:11:11] scheduling, all that kind of stuff, and

[3:11:13] we'll just try to get it done as quickly

[3:11:14] as we can. So, we're minimizing impact.

[3:11:18] >> Great.

[3:11:19] >> Yeah, you've you've already answered

[3:11:20] their other question, so I appreciate

[3:11:21] that. Um, I will say this is a a

[3:11:24] challenge decision is we have to weigh

[3:11:26] property ownership rights, and I've I've

[3:11:28] expressed this before in land use

[3:11:30] decisions. You have constitutional

[3:11:31] rights to use your property the way

[3:11:32] you'd like. the legislative branch can

[3:11:36] attempt to impose restrictions on that

[3:11:37] use that has been um limited by the

[3:11:40] judicial branch and we have zoning we've

[3:11:43] decided the prior city council has

[3:11:45] decided this is our commercial business

[3:11:48] commercial zone so it's already zoned

[3:11:49] business commercial that was the

[3:11:50] intended use as part of our master plan

[3:11:53] and the purposes of the zoning is I mean

[3:11:57] I won't go through them all I've said

[3:11:58] them before but you're required to do

[3:12:01] have the exact same setbacks as any

[3:12:03] other potential use. The height

[3:12:05] restrictions, you've said your plan is

[3:12:07] to have them 13 feet lower than what the

[3:12:09] maximum allowed would be. Is that still

[3:12:11] your plan?

[3:12:11] >> Uh yeah, I think the highest is is 35 ft

[3:12:15] in our setbacks. Again, we're not asking

[3:12:16] for any relief along 200 North.

[3:12:19] >> So looking at the other properties, not

[3:12:20] in Pine as one specific example, they

[3:12:23] have a very tall building, so they've

[3:12:24] probably maxed out their height or close

[3:12:26] to it and are on their setbacks. So,

[3:12:29] it's the same the same restrictions. And

[3:12:32] one of the biggest purposes of zoning is

[3:12:35] to separate

[3:12:37] industrial from residential to reduce

[3:12:40] noise, pollution, and traffic

[3:12:41] congestion. And again, looking at the

[3:12:43] variable options for this, especially

[3:12:45] the traffic and safety, the traffic and

[3:12:47] safety concerns that the residents have

[3:12:48] posed, this seems like a a very viable

[3:12:51] project for that for those purposes. Um,

[3:12:55] I hope everyone's listened to the

[3:12:56] planning commission. They had a a very

[3:12:58] good discussion about this. I'm not

[3:12:59] going to bring up everything they said

[3:13:00] when their decision to um recommend

[3:13:04] approval on a six to zero vote, but they

[3:13:06] did discuss the parking and traffic and

[3:13:09] the CCNRs that control limit limit

[3:13:12] access times and and those type of

[3:13:14] things.

[3:13:15] And one of the highlights was that and

[3:13:18] this is what I asked you in our a

[3:13:19] meeting several months ago is do you

[3:13:21] think this will be used by alpine

[3:13:23] residents? Is this filling a need for

[3:13:24] alpine residents? and your response then

[3:13:26] and some of the responses I've gotten

[3:13:28] and not just the emails that were cut

[3:13:30] and pasted from everybody else, but I've

[3:13:31] asked several residents what they

[3:13:33] thought about this proposal and the

[3:13:36] response has been has been very positive

[3:13:38] once they learn that it's not the

[3:13:40] standard

[3:13:41] storage facility that you that you think

[3:13:43] about when you first hear storage

[3:13:45] facility. And I didn't get much of a

[3:13:48] response from those 14 residents other

[3:13:50] than thank you for the explanation and

[3:13:52] we look forward to learning more from the developer. and I really

[3:13:55] appreciate you doing that. And I did

[3:13:56] receive some feedback on the positive

[3:13:59] nature of your interactions with them

[3:14:00] and your willingness to be flexible.

[3:14:05] >> All right. Uh let me just check my

[3:14:06] notes.

[3:14:10] » All right. I think that's it for me.

[3:14:13] >> Thank you. Um Jessica,

[3:14:17] » my first questions have to do with the

[3:14:19] 52 is it 52 individual condos?

[3:14:22] >> Yeah. So those will be separately deed

[3:14:25] and those will be separate owners.

[3:14:27] Correct. And so what does that look like

[3:14:30] if there isn't a compliance with the

[3:14:32] HOA? I know I've dealt with situations

[3:14:36] where individual owners

[3:14:39] don't comply and it's really hard to um

[3:14:43] have oversight.

[3:14:48] » Yeah. I think I think um again the the

[3:14:51] average purchase price on these is is

[3:14:53] steep and it is a it is they're buying

[3:14:56] this because it's it is a part of a

[3:14:57] community as well. So there is a little

[3:14:59] bit of just trust that's going to go

[3:15:00] into that element. But um I mean it is

[3:15:04] in our best interest if if someone's

[3:15:06] buying a unit and spending a decent

[3:15:09] amount of money on that unit that we

[3:15:11] protect that person by saying, "Hey, you

[3:15:14] know, this individual over here, we're we're highly incentivized to

[3:15:19] enforce the HOA ourselves." Um but but

[3:15:22] yeah, I think I think uh we we can

[3:15:24] between now and a couple weeks from now,

[3:15:26] we can figure out how to satisfy that

[3:15:27] concern some some way or another with uh proving the teeth in that a

[3:15:33] little bit more. So that that way

[3:15:34] >> because now we have 52 individual not

[3:15:37] accessory dwelling units but accessory

[3:15:39] units deeded and owned by 52 separate

[3:15:43] you know land property owners. And so

[3:15:46] speaking to you know your property owner

[3:15:48] rights it it changes

[3:15:51] the dynamics of it being a storage unit

[3:15:55] which is you know what has been proposed

[3:15:58] but it actually is partly storage but

[3:16:02] also partly again accessory units all

[3:16:06] individually owned. And in looking at

[3:16:09] that and considering it, um, it just

[3:16:12] seems like there's a lot of legal

[3:16:14] challenges that are unknowns. And so I

[3:16:18] was just asking also from a legal

[3:16:21] standpoint, what kinds of

[3:16:24] you again problems could that pose?

[3:16:27] Well, I believe I mentioned in in some

[3:16:30] situations

[3:16:32] HOAs just decide they are not interested

[3:16:35] in pursuing one of their members or they

[3:16:39] decide to dissolve because they don't

[3:16:42] folks don't like paying assessments and

[3:16:44] then they try to just the default is

[3:16:47] well the city will take care of this and

[3:16:49] that's

[3:16:51] sometimes that's a challenge. I've I've

[3:16:54] had that in some other communities where

[3:16:56] that happened. And um so

[3:17:00] as I as I mentioned, it's often

[3:17:04] helpful to have any amendment to the

[3:17:08] CCNRs

[3:17:09] have to go through for city approval,

[3:17:13] city consent to any amendment sometime

[3:17:15] or to dissolution of the HOA.

[3:17:18] >> So that's one way to do it. Um,

[3:17:23] and there's kind of a, you know, nothing

[3:17:26] is failsafe, but there are some things

[3:17:28] that you can do, as I mentioned, to kind

[3:17:30] of strengthen the city's ability in the

[3:17:33] absence of a strong HOA to take care of

[3:17:36] those issues.

[3:17:37] >> And did you say that's through making

[3:17:39] sure the code amendment would address

[3:17:42] those? That's one of the ways to do it

[3:17:43] to do so.

[3:17:45] Well, if the code if the text amendment

[3:17:48] says that CCNRs must be approved by the

[3:17:51] city or in a form approved by the city,

[3:17:54] then you can certainly require that.

[3:17:58] >> How about landscape maintenance? That

[3:17:59] type of put that language.

[3:18:01] >> That's all part of the CCNRs.

[3:18:03] >> So, that couldn't be part of the code

[3:18:05] that they have to maintain the

[3:18:07] landscaping.

[3:18:08] >> You can put it in there, but you

[3:18:11] Yeah, you can put in whatever you want.

[3:18:13] If you want to be that specific, you can

[3:18:16] do that.

[3:18:19] » Yeah. And so the instance I'm thinking

[3:18:21] about, it was like a million-doll

[3:18:24] property and it was in an an HOA and one

[3:18:27] of the residents just decided they

[3:18:29] weren't going to pay the assessment and

[3:18:31] it really held up the improvements of

[3:18:33] the entire project because, as you know,

[3:18:35] that money coming in takes care of the

[3:18:37] exterior of the property. And so if

[3:18:39] you've got one person that's not going

[3:18:42] to pay and then you're saying everybody

[3:18:44] else has to chip in and pay his share,

[3:18:48] you know, now we're talking about 56

[3:18:50] different owners

[3:18:52] um navigating that. So that's something

[3:18:54] to keep top of mind. I also when you

[3:18:57] looked at

[3:18:57] >> Let's address that real quick.

[3:18:58] >> Well, can I go because you went Yeah. So

[3:19:00] when you talked about traffic, you had

[3:19:02] talked about traffic again as a self

[3:19:04] storage. Do we have any traffic data

[3:19:06] around condos?

[3:19:09] Um, so two parts. Um, I I think on the HOA side of it, we'll agree to

[3:19:17] figure out how to to how to put a little

[3:19:18] bit more teeth in that, work with you

[3:19:19] guys to figure that out because I think

[3:19:20] we're mutually incentivized to make sure

[3:19:23] that that happens. So, I guess that

[3:19:25] side. Um, as far as that, uh, yeah, this

[3:19:29] these going to operate very sim because

[3:19:31] they're being used as self- storage

[3:19:32] facilities

[3:19:34] similar to a self- storage. anticipate

[3:19:36] traffic to be similar, you know, as far

[3:19:38] as usage. These type of units is it is

[3:19:41] storage in nature. So, you're not going

[3:19:44] to be having every one of these guys

[3:19:45] visit their units or these families in

[3:19:48] visit their units every single day. Um,

[3:19:51] and so in similar facilities like this

[3:19:53] that we've that we visited, their

[3:19:55] parking and their requirements that way

[3:19:56] are very similar. So, traffic also very low. Um,

[3:20:01] but yeah.

[3:20:04] Do you have any like places where you

[3:20:07] could do a traffic study or get us

[3:20:09] traffic information?

[3:20:10] >> Absolutely.

[3:20:11] >> On what that would look like?

[3:20:12] >> Yeah, we could do that.

[3:20:13] >> We could provide that.

[3:20:14] >> There's going to be improvements in the

[3:20:16] condos, correct? Running water. Can you

[3:20:19] speak to some of the improvements that

[3:20:20] will be inside the condos?

[3:20:22] >> Yeah, on average, the larger units that

[3:20:24] are 30 feet wide or so, I would imagine

[3:20:26] there's going to be a bathroom, so

[3:20:27] there'll be plumbing in there. There'll

[3:20:29] be a kitchenet, so like a small kitchen.

[3:20:32] um and then a mezzanine layer and so and

[3:20:35] HVAC or so. So they may go epoxy the

[3:20:38] floor, paint it, put some lighting, but

[3:20:40] that's about the extent of it. So it's

[3:20:42] restricted. No one can be sleeping

[3:20:43] there, all that kind of stuff. So but it

[3:20:46] could be could be a a half bath or

[3:20:48] bathroom in there. Yeah.

[3:20:51] >> So maybe more visits than just your

[3:20:53] storage unit possibly.

[3:20:56] >> Yeah. Yeah. But Yeah. Yeah.

[3:20:58] >> Okay. So that's just again about traffic

[3:21:01] and ownership. I wanted to move into

[3:21:03] Andrew. You had mentioned something you

[3:21:06] know a resident had said why don't we

[3:21:08] have a plan first and then look at what

[3:21:10] fits in our plan. We actually do have a

[3:21:12] plan. It's we've been working on it for

[3:21:14] almost three years now. It's called um

[3:21:17] the gateway corridor small area plan. I

[3:21:20] believe we secured a grant and it's like

[3:21:23] a I think a $90,000

[3:21:26] study and hundreds of residents in

[3:21:29] Alpine have been given their input.

[3:21:31] We've looked at this area and we

[3:21:34] designated this area, it's still almost

[3:21:37] across the finish line, but we did have

[3:21:40] um a designation for it as a transition

[3:21:42] zone because of the reason that we have

[3:21:45] commercial moving into residential. So

[3:21:48] if you look at the definition of a

[3:21:50] transition zone, it's actually where you

[3:21:54] the usage goes from commercial to a

[3:21:58] lower impact usage to then residential

[3:22:01] single family. So just when I look at

[3:22:04] this project alone and I consider

[3:22:06] commercial and then a lighter impact to

[3:22:11] a single family home.

[3:22:13] I don't view an industrial use as um and

[3:22:18] not just me but city planning doesn't

[3:22:20] view industrial use as a lighter impact

[3:22:23] from commercial. And so I see this in

[3:22:27] conflict with our plan for this area.

[3:22:31] It's a gateway historic and it's really

[3:22:33] the core and the heart of our community

[3:22:36] in a lot of ways. It's where the old um

[3:22:39] original school was built and a lot of

[3:22:42] the residents that live in Alpine today

[3:22:44] still went to that school. And so it's very um inongruent

[3:22:50] and not aligned with Alpine identity. So

[3:22:53] that's my thoughts on

[3:22:57] the gateway corridor plan because we

[3:22:59] identified it as a transition. Now

[3:23:02] again, there were some options for what

[3:23:04] you're looking at things like if this

[3:23:07] kind of improvement was put in a

[3:23:10] transition area. It is typically done

[3:23:13] with 30 to 50 foot setbacks. So it's not

[3:23:16] a never situation, but it's a situation

[3:23:19] where it needs to be compatible with its

[3:23:21] surroundings. I think you told me this

[3:23:24] has 15 foot setbacks maybe sometimes 19

[3:23:28] >> on the

[3:23:29] >> correct. Yeah. So along along the front

[3:23:31] road along 200 north there's a 15 foot

[3:23:34] frontage setback and then with the jogs

[3:23:36] in the building to kind of provide that

[3:23:38] relief. Some of those are as deep as

[3:23:39] four which would be 19 or so. Yeah.

[3:23:42] >> So again, reading about this, typically

[3:23:44] for a transition area, you would see a

[3:23:46] 30 to 50 foot setback for this kind of

[3:23:49] um industrial use if a city wanted to go

[3:23:52] that direction. Um,

[3:23:55] lastly,

[3:23:57] as far as bulk and massing, I think it

[3:24:00] was two or three months ago, we had

[3:24:03] taken a deep dive into our bulk and

[3:24:05] massing ordinances and we actually

[3:24:06] looked at um quantifying a 15% maximum

[3:24:12] allowable coverage of a lot in the

[3:24:17] commercial area or pretty much in this

[3:24:20] downtown area. And I think I saw that

[3:24:23] this covers 55% of the lot. So again,

[3:24:27] you know, kind of aligning with Andrew's

[3:24:29] message. Is this a no never? I wouldn't

[3:24:32] say that, but it needs a lot of work to

[3:24:35] hit transitional. I mean, to hit again,

[3:24:39] we were talking about a 15% requirement.

[3:24:42] >> I don't remember that 15 point. No,

[3:24:45] >> that's way extreme. Yeah, that that was

[3:24:48] what I believe went in front of planning

[3:24:50] commission

[3:24:51] >> 15%

[3:24:52] >> five is for schools

[3:24:55] >> it for bulk and mass

[3:24:58] >> no that's for schools specifically

[3:25:00] >> so I know Chrissy you've been working on

[3:25:02] bulk and massing this is covers 55%

[3:25:06] of the per

[3:25:08] >> I've been focused on residential to be

[3:25:10] honest with you

[3:25:11] >> okay

[3:25:13] so but in taking in that And and I think

[3:25:16] part of what's been guiding that is

[3:25:18] keeping the look and feel and preserving

[3:25:20] Alpine. And so I feel like bulk and

[3:25:23] massing I guess we've been looking at it

[3:25:25] as residential and schools but excluding

[3:25:29] commercial. Yeah. So that's a concern is

[3:25:32] that it covers 55%.

[3:25:35] Um

[3:25:38] let me see if there was any as far as

[3:25:40] questions go.

[3:25:45] I can't imagine,

[3:25:48] you know, if you, let's say you're

[3:25:49] looking at Main Street and looking at a

[3:25:52] project,

[3:25:53] um, like a commercial project that's

[3:25:56] going in, and let's say it's, you know,

[3:25:58] on a quarter acre, which is really what

[3:26:00] a lot of these lots are. Um, if you're

[3:26:04] saying that this is, what was it? 52%

[3:26:06] 51.

[3:26:07] >> It's 55%.

[3:26:10] I can't imagine a business going in

[3:26:12] there less than 55% of a quarter acre

[3:26:14] lot.

[3:26:16] So if you're going to look at the bulk

[3:26:17] and massing, let's do it all across the

[3:26:19] BC. Um, you know, for me it's let's be

[3:26:24] specific about it. And if you want the

[3:26:26] bulking massing to be less than that,

[3:26:28] then consider all the businesses that

[3:26:30] are in Main Street. Almost none of them

[3:26:33] would be compliant if you're requiring

[3:26:35] >> but our but they comply with our BC

[3:26:38] zoning.

[3:26:40] So that's the difference.

[3:26:41] >> Not all of them.

[3:26:47] » Again, um in looking at land use, it is

[3:26:51] you you're saying 100 years. I'm just

[3:26:53] going to go with 50 because I won't be

[3:26:55] here in 50. But it's a big decision and

[3:26:58] there's this is um

[3:27:02] I would say

[3:27:04] very very far from

[3:27:06] the alpine look and feel rural. Um

[3:27:12] you know fixing the density, you know,

[3:27:14] we don't just have what does it look on

[3:27:17] the outside, the exterior, the

[3:27:18] landscaping. There's a lot of other

[3:27:20] moving parts in this that seems um

[3:27:25] pretty far away from again protecting

[3:27:29] Alpine historic

[3:27:31] identity. And as all of the open houses

[3:27:34] we sat in and the hundreds of hours

[3:27:37] we've spent on this plan, I don't recall

[3:27:42] one resident saying we need storage

[3:27:44] units. So, I mean, I think it's great

[3:27:47] that you've identified a a niche and

[3:27:49] that some people would prefer to own a

[3:27:53] condo here, but I don't think it meets

[3:27:56] our identity.

[3:28:00] » Sarah,

[3:28:00] >> can I can I comment to that? Is that all

[3:28:03] right? Um, I think I think it's

[3:28:06] important, and this is just my position,

[3:28:08] that you need to compare it to what the

[3:28:10] likely alternatives for this specific

[3:28:12] site could be.

[3:28:15] And you know, so I think that that's more of what we're looking at of

[3:28:18] what could be here, which historically

[3:28:22] has been industrial.

[3:28:24] Um, highdensity retail, which we have

[3:28:27] experience with from our numbers of what

[3:28:30] we've done, doesn't pencil. There's not

[3:28:33] a way for us to incentivize a tenant to

[3:28:35] go on this small of a street and pay the

[3:28:37] rent that would requ be required in

[3:28:39] order to justify doing retail. Um, and

[3:28:42] highdensity housing

[3:28:45] also has been shot down and I think

[3:28:46] that's a heavy piece of this. So, we're

[3:28:48] comparing more of like what the

[3:28:50] potential options are here versus what a

[3:28:53] perfect scenario would be for this site

[3:28:56] stripping all the rest of that away. So

[3:28:58] that that that's I think an important

[3:29:00] element of this specific property and

[3:29:03] that was a conversation we had with the

[3:29:04] planning commission that was part of

[3:29:06] their decision of yeah not ideal but in

[3:29:10] this specific scenario it makes sense.

[3:29:12] So I think that's that's a just a a

[3:29:16] comment.

[3:29:17] >> Yeah. And just as a followup to that if

[3:29:18] I could um you mentioned the small area

[3:29:21] plan gateway quarter plan lower impact.

[3:29:25] >> What is the impact? I mean, if if retail

[3:29:28] is a better use there, you think that's

[3:29:30] less impact, that's going to create

[3:29:32] significant traffic and parking. That

[3:29:33] seems to be the one of the biggest

[3:29:35] concerns of the local residents. It's

[3:29:37] already a fairly busy street. And when

[3:29:39] it was busy during the purple days, it

[3:29:43] was chaos there. I mean, trying to get a

[3:29:45] parking spot in my own church parking

[3:29:46] lot um was often challenging. And there

[3:29:50] were cars parked all along the street. I

[3:29:52] would run along there all the time. And

[3:29:54] as you know, more cars, less safe for

[3:29:57] pedestrians and bikes. So, when you

[3:29:59] think of lower impact, that's one of my

[3:30:02] and this was mentioned by the planning

[3:30:04] commission by several of the planning

[3:30:05] commission members is that that's what

[3:30:07] they liked about this is the low impact

[3:30:10] to the neighborhood uh particularly with

[3:30:13] traffic and and that's why we didn't

[3:30:17] want industrial use. There was all these

[3:30:19] the trucks and the traffic,

[3:30:20] >> right? But so those those two are false

[3:30:23] assumptions. You're talking about an

[3:30:25] industrial use that no longer is allowed

[3:30:28] because it fell out of

[3:30:30] >> saying if it's a retail commercial.

[3:30:32] >> Well, wait, you compared it to the

[3:30:33] parking during the purple days. And so

[3:30:35] that creates an image that no longer

[3:30:37] will exist because that usage is no

[3:30:39] longer allowed. And that it's also a

[3:30:41] false assumption because I did get quite

[3:30:44] a few emails saying, you know, again to

[3:30:47] your point, if not this, then what else?

[3:30:51] That's our job as the overseers of the

[3:30:55] land use and the identity of our

[3:30:57] community. Like if not this, then what

[3:30:59] else? We have a whole list of things

[3:31:02] that are allowed.

[3:31:03] >> We have a whole community of people that

[3:31:07] want Alpine preserved. I don't know the

[3:31:10] answer. What else? But I can look at

[3:31:12] this and say, does this fit with the

[3:31:16] identity of Alpine? And so I don't see

[3:31:19] that we should make decisions,

[3:31:21] legislative decisions to fit something

[3:31:24] into a space just because

[3:31:27] that not perfect use has been revealed,

[3:31:30] but the use just hasn't been a fit yet.

[3:31:33] We're just not there yet. And that's

[3:31:35] actually fairly normal in this process.

[3:31:40] C

[3:31:40] >> can I speak to the transition zone?

[3:31:42] >> Can we have Can we listen to Sarah? It's

[3:31:44] getting late.

[3:31:45] >> Let's hear Sarah's um

[3:31:48] on this and she has

[3:31:49] >> Sarah has a twoour sermon.

[3:31:52] >> I'm not that longwinded. Um first of

[3:31:55] all, I appreciate how sensitive you've

[3:31:57] been to the residents. Um I love that

[3:32:00] you're keeping you plan to keep the

[3:32:01] historic monument. I mean, I just I

[3:32:04] appreciate that as a as a like a a

[3:32:07] partnership with the city. This I I

[3:32:10] think that you've made it really easy

[3:32:12] for us to communicate and get our

[3:32:14] questions answered. So, I admire that.

[3:32:15] Um, I just wanted to I just a few

[3:32:18] concerns. My concerns mostly are just

[3:32:20] with having a a co uh a code amendment

[3:32:24] in general. Um, but I do have just two

[3:32:28] really quick questions. Um, one was kind

[3:32:31] of already answered, but there are

[3:32:32] restrooms in the luxury condo. That that

[3:32:36] just for me is a concern because I know

[3:32:38] we're not allowing people to live in

[3:32:39] those, but I can see people trying to do

[3:32:42] that. So, that is a concern. Um, one

[3:32:46] other thought that I had is I'm just

[3:32:48] calling other storage units around and

[3:32:49] kind of figuring out. They like at

[3:32:52] Highland Hideway, they have an employee,

[3:32:54] their manager that stays there, like

[3:32:56] lives there on site year round. I'm just

[3:32:58] confirming that's not what you guys are

[3:32:59] planning on doing.

[3:33:00] >> Correct. We could also add that if if

[3:33:02] we're adding

[3:33:03] >> said like 9 to5 or something.

[3:33:04] >> Yeah, we don't we don't that that's a

[3:33:06] very um historically a very old school

[3:33:08] way of operating a self-s storage

[3:33:10] facility, but it's it's effective, you

[3:33:12] know, for for that. But we use cameras

[3:33:14] and so we got a lot of cameras that'll

[3:33:17] and then also our building is all

[3:33:18] enclosed in one building instead of

[3:33:21] multiple buildings kind of like that facility is. So in order to get in,

[3:33:25] you got to use a key code. It's the only

[3:33:26] way you can get a door to open. So, we

[3:33:28] don't we don't I don't feel like we need

[3:33:30] an individual that lives there. So, we

[3:33:32] can be willing to add that as a

[3:33:34] restriction of no on-site uh residence.

[3:33:38] Um

[3:33:39] >> I think that falls to our ordinance. You

[3:33:41] can't live in commercial property.

[3:33:43] >> Yeah.

[3:33:44] >> And and then my last question is just um

[3:33:46] I noticed there's a clubhouse. Can you

[3:33:48] just kind of explain like what do you

[3:33:50] foresee that being used for? Are there

[3:33:52] hours that that will be allowed to be

[3:33:54] utilized? Is it just for people that own

[3:33:57] the luxury condo units or anyone who has

[3:34:00] a a storage unit?

[3:34:03] >> Yeah, so it's just for the members that

[3:34:05] own a unit to be able to use uh in it

[3:34:08] would be uh like a a lounge type TV

[3:34:12] couches and a kitchenet type area for

[3:34:15] owners to gather, talk about their

[3:34:17] whatever they want to talk about, hang

[3:34:19] out. And then there'll also be a little

[3:34:20] conference room. So, if I owned one and

[3:34:23] I needed to have a meeting or something

[3:34:24] like that that I could do that quickly

[3:34:26] there, take a Zoom call uh just for just

[3:34:28] mainly for convenience. So, it's an

[3:34:30] amenity to the owners to be able to use.

[3:34:32] Um but yeah, no, if no self- storage

[3:34:35] unit uh renters would be using that.

[3:34:39] >> Okay. Yeah, that's just a concern I had

[3:34:41] just, you know, how late are these

[3:34:43] gatherings going to go at the clubhouse.

[3:34:44] But, um all my other questions have

[3:34:47] already been asked and answered, so I do

[3:34:49] not have any other questions. But Carla,

[3:34:51] when or Mayor Merrill, when he's

[3:34:53] finished, can I make a motion?

[3:34:54] >> Yeah. Um, so if there's no motion for

[3:34:57] this, it's just a discussion item

[3:35:00] >> for today.

[3:35:04] » Oh, yes. Yes. Yes. So, I I just wanted

[3:35:06] to conclude. Um, I'm sure

[3:35:09] >> I did have clarification about the

[3:35:11] actual ordinance because we're going to

[3:35:12] see it again with

[3:35:13] >> edit.

[3:35:15] So, yeah, hold on just a sec. So, along

[3:35:17] with everybody else, I've been receiving

[3:35:19] emails all day and this one um did stand

[3:35:23] out. It said um this is a resident Ryan

[3:35:26] Thcker. I love this concept and it

[3:35:29] solves a need for me. I'm already take

[3:35:31] talking to them about buying the largest

[3:35:33] unit for my car collection. Finding a

[3:35:35] safe area to store my collection that is

[3:35:38] close to my home is extremely difficult.

[3:35:40] Having a resource like this in Alpine

[3:35:43] would be a tremendous asset to the city.

[3:35:45] I also think the type of development

[3:35:47] partner matters. I've worked with stack

[3:35:49] on offices for my business for my

[3:35:52] business at Thanksgiving Point in South

[3:35:53] Jordan. In addition, I have worked with

[3:35:56] them on projects in multiple states.

[3:35:58] Integrity and who you partner with

[3:36:00] matters to me. Stack is a developer that

[3:36:03] keeps their commitments and every

[3:36:05] project they do of the highest quality

[3:36:07] and adds value to the city. And I do

[3:36:10] have to say of all the people that I've

[3:36:12] worked with in the last four years, um,

[3:36:14] you know, wanting to do projects in the

[3:36:16] city, I do appreciate your outreach

[3:36:19] effort because I feel like people that

[3:36:21] even if their recommendation is that

[3:36:23] they don't want it, they've appreciated

[3:36:25] your interaction and have acknowledged

[3:36:28] that. Um, I'm not, you know, so I do

[3:36:32] appreciate the efforts there. I'm not

[3:36:34] sure where this is going to end and I

[3:36:35] think I've been pretty honest with you

[3:36:37] that I saw it going either way. Um, so

[3:36:40] with that, let's You've got a last

[3:36:42] comment regarding the code.

[3:36:44] >> It's a question about the code. I feel

[3:36:45] like um Steve was leaning towards making

[3:36:48] a more putting more teeth um into I went

[3:36:52] over the code after you guys were all

[3:36:54] talking. I was paying attention to you

[3:36:56] too, but there's two times you have to

[3:36:59] res uh any applicant and in this case it

[3:37:01] looks like it's going to be you would

[3:37:03] need to resubmit something to the city.

[3:37:05] And one of them is if the site is um

[3:37:08] line item E um if the site is adjacent

[3:37:12] to residential uses, the applicant shall

[3:37:14] submit a screening and buffering plan

[3:37:16] for approval as part of the development

[3:37:19] review process. It does not designate

[3:37:21] who is the approval. Is that staff,

[3:37:25] Steve?

[3:37:27] >> Well, here's again here's one of the

[3:37:30] issues with the code. The way it's

[3:37:33] proposed is that the conditional use

[3:37:35] permit would would come before the city

[3:37:38] council rather than the planning

[3:37:40] commission or staff. So asking the city

[3:37:44] council to engage in an administrative

[3:37:47] decision-making process,

[3:37:49] it would be submitted obviously to

[3:37:52] staff,

[3:37:53] but that would have that would be part

[3:37:56] of the overall package.

[3:37:59] I yeah, I will just say um as part of

[3:38:03] the development review process and so

[3:38:07] ultimately that comes down to the land

[3:38:09] use authority in this circumstance which

[3:38:11] would be the city council as the

[3:38:14] ordinance is proposed.

[3:38:15] >> Okay. And e sorry I should have just

[3:38:17] highlighted also the other submit is L

[3:38:21] and but this designates specifically I

[3:38:23] wondered why they were different. The

[3:38:25] applicant shall submit a development

[3:38:27] agreement of and covenants. It's the

[3:38:29] CCNRs we were talking about for review

[3:38:31] and approval by the city council. So,

[3:38:34] one designates the city council and one

[3:38:36] did not. Can we just clean that up to

[3:38:38] make it consistent and be accurate to

[3:38:40] what is really going to happen?

[3:38:41] >> Sure. But

[3:38:42] >> thank you. But all I'm saying is I think

[3:38:45] there's another and you'd have to scroll

[3:38:47] to it, Heidi, but I think at the very

[3:38:50] end I think it says approval process,

[3:38:53] land use type, land use authority, city

[3:38:55] council.

[3:38:57] >> So

[3:38:57] >> Oh, down at the very bottom,

[3:38:59] >> the very bottom

[3:39:00] >> it's on the screen.

[3:39:01] >> So that's what I was saying. If you look

[3:39:03] >> part isn't talking about what we're

[3:39:05] doing now. That's talking about how it

[3:39:06] would be.

[3:39:06] >> So there'll be a process to bring it

[3:39:08] back

[3:39:08] >> next. Correct. And then the third thing

[3:39:11] just highlighted as you were making me

[3:39:13] scroll is isn't don't we have that

[3:39:15] anything going into the historic gateway

[3:39:17] goes back to planning commission?

[3:39:18] Jessica,

[3:39:20] >> remind me of that approval process.

[3:39:22] >> Again, this is why I think waiting until

[3:39:25] we have this final plan. We were going

[3:39:28] to look at that authority being

[3:39:30] different.

[3:39:31] >> Okay. But for now, just to understand

[3:39:33] what this is, if we don't we if we have

[3:39:35] things in and I'm sorry if Ryan's still

[3:39:37] on. If we have things in the historic

[3:39:39] gateway, doesn't it have a like a

[3:39:41] two-step process or am I misreplanning

[3:39:44] commission first and they're they make

[3:39:46] the recommendation and then city council

[3:39:48] has final on gateway historic.

[3:39:50] >> Chrissy, the whole thing you're bringing

[3:39:52] up what doesn't make sense to me is

[3:39:54] everything you've brought up would be

[3:39:56] for future storage unit proposals.

[3:39:59] >> Any storage unit.

[3:40:00] >> No, I know. But this is why none of this

[3:40:03] makes sense. The whole basis of this is

[3:40:05] that there's not going to be any other

[3:40:06] ones. they can't fit on a five acre lot

[3:40:09] or a under three or one mile away and

[3:40:11] we're putting in all these criteria that

[3:40:13] supposedly we're never going to have to

[3:40:14] use because there's only going to be one

[3:40:15] of these.

[3:40:17] It just makes no sense to me. We're

[3:40:18] like, okay, like we're writing something

[3:40:21] for something we're saying is never

[3:40:22] going to happen, but we're making all

[3:40:24] these rules with this one.

[3:40:25] >> Well, we did it for Burgess Orchards.

[3:40:27] Well, I just wanted to that was my

[3:40:29] thought too is, you know, just being

[3:40:32] concerned about

[3:40:33] >> when other businesses have come in and

[3:40:36] looked at changing conditional use and even to the extent of selling a loaf

[3:40:41] of bread, like council was very

[3:40:43] concerned about the impact that would

[3:40:45] have on our community. And so I I'm

[3:40:48] looking at this as the impact on our

[3:40:51] community. um you know, we just need to

[3:40:53] take it very seriously if we think just

[3:40:56] expanding selling bread is going to harm

[3:40:59] us. This probably could be pretty

[3:41:01] detrimental to our long-term future.

[3:41:04] >> I would just say back to my comments

[3:41:06] about understanding the process that we

[3:41:08] are trying we're trying to create new

[3:41:10] ordinances. I just want to be very clear

[3:41:12] about what are the steps and who gets to

[3:41:14] review what and maybe I don't understand

[3:41:17] all the um

[3:41:19] all the things that are going on behind

[3:41:21] the scenes because other ordinances

[3:41:23] apply but it would be great to have Ryan

[3:41:25] walk us through that at least um so that

[3:41:28] we know like is it going back to

[3:41:30] planning commission is it coming back to

[3:41:31] us what are those steps if this to your

[3:41:35] point I understand like we're talking

[3:41:37] about one but nevertheless the

[3:41:39] ordinances have to stand

[3:41:40] >> are going to come back ordinances will

[3:41:41] stand for 50 years as well as the

[3:41:43] building. So, they have to be clear.

[3:41:45] >> That's all I'm saying. You understand?

[3:41:46] >> Yeah. Okay,

[3:41:47] >> great points.

[3:41:48] >> Um, the only other thing I wanted to say

[3:41:49] about I didn't mention the transition,

[3:41:51] but I had the thought again, we have a

[3:41:53] lot of residents that have a lot of junk

[3:41:55] in their backyard and this is all

[3:41:57] enclosed. So, I thought this was a step

[3:41:58] forward, but as a residence, I store

[3:42:01] things and I have a garage. So to me,

[3:42:04] it's a good transition because I'm

[3:42:06] already now we're storing things for a

[3:42:08] fee and we're using a garage for a fee

[3:42:12] versus a commercial use. That's

[3:42:14] completely something that doesn't really

[3:42:15] happen in a residential area as is

[3:42:17] pointed out to me over and over again

[3:42:19] because of purchase orders. But

[3:42:20] nevertheless, I think it's a good

[3:42:22] transition. All right, that's my final

[3:42:24] comment.

[3:42:24] >> I have one last thing because it's

[3:42:25] related to what we've talked about and

[3:42:27] both Sarah and Andrew have brought this

[3:42:28] up and I just would like Steve your

[3:42:31] input.

[3:42:32] Um, it's it's fairly rare that an

[3:42:34] ordinance is perfect and sometimes they

[3:42:36] need amendment and sometimes we have

[3:42:38] unanticipated

[3:42:40] desirable uses like the orchard or the

[3:42:42] proposal for a farm stand that was

[3:42:44] denied but it was at least a proposal to

[3:42:46] expand their use there and have a farm

[3:42:48] stand. Um would you just explain

[3:42:52] briefly that is a standard practice to

[3:42:56] have ordinance amendments as new um new

[3:43:01] things come up in a city? This isn't out of the ordinary is it

[3:43:09] to amend your code as new as new

[3:43:12] >> processes come up or changes need to be

[3:43:14] made. Well, it's not it's not out of the

[3:43:17] ordinary for someone to request a text

[3:43:20] amendment to allow them to do what

[3:43:21] they're proposing to do if the ordinance

[3:43:24] doesn't currently allow it. That happens

[3:43:27] all the time. If somebody requests a

[3:43:29] reszone because they want to be in the

[3:43:31] business commercial or they want to be

[3:43:33] in a residential zone, those things also

[3:43:36] happen, but they require council

[3:43:38] approval as a legislative decision. So,

[3:43:41] yeah, I I don't know that it's out of

[3:43:43] the ordinary. I I thought where you were

[3:43:45] going with this, council member, was is

[3:43:48] uh

[3:43:50] if if we adopt an ordinance that's not

[3:43:53] perfect, can we later amend it if we

[3:43:56] need to?

[3:43:57] >> Well, both. Yeah, both. But I guess

[3:43:59] >> their concerns were

[3:44:02] is this the right thing? Is this

[3:44:03] something that we should be doing? But

[3:44:04] it's not out of the ordinary for this to

[3:44:06] happen. It's no pretty complex.

[3:44:09] >> That's what I was getting at. Sorry.

[3:44:11] >> Can I ask uh Thank you.

[3:44:12] >> Uh Mr. Doxy. Just a couple last legal

[3:44:15] questions given what the discussion was.

[3:44:18] Brent, you're and this involves with

[3:44:20] Brent what Brent was talking about.

[3:44:21] Brent is into um physical barriers for

[3:44:24] things. They just kind of override laws

[3:44:26] because they're physical whether the law

[3:44:28] is there or not. They stop or allow

[3:44:30] things. Um if these are constructed and

[3:44:34] built with a bathroom and a kitchen, can

[3:44:37] a future city council write code to make

[3:44:41] them livable spaces? Because if I'm

[3:44:43] looking at this design and no one told

[3:44:45] me it was storage units, it looks just

[3:44:47] like a apartment building. Could a

[3:44:50] future say they found a need, we have a

[3:44:53] need now, we want to make this very

[3:44:56] well, it would be high density. Can we make this high density approved?

[3:44:59] Would they be able to do that in the

[3:45:00] future as city council?

[3:45:02] >> Of course.

[3:45:03] >> Yes.

[3:45:04] >> Well, I don't know.

[3:45:05] >> But but that could happen with anything.

[3:45:07] the the council could decide do you want

[3:45:09] to have multifamily housing where there

[3:45:12] currently is single family housing.

[3:45:14] >> Well, can you not see that the jump is a

[3:45:16] lot smaller given that there's a

[3:45:17] bathroom, a small space and a kitchen in

[3:45:20] a area that would never be built that

[3:45:22] small. I guess the way I look at it is

[3:45:23] the intended use, which would be a

[3:45:27] storage area with like what this

[3:45:28] gentleman said to store his car

[3:45:30] collection. And that if you're going to

[3:45:32] go and work on your car, they're going

[3:45:35] to have to go to the bathroom unless you

[3:45:36] want people peeing on the street.

[3:45:37] >> No, I I understand, mayor. It's it's

[3:45:39] more like that. It's more like a not a

[3:45:41] very far leap to convert these into

[3:45:43] living spaces. That's all I'm trying to

[3:45:45] say. And want to know at what ease is

[3:45:47] that process to do?

[3:45:48] >> I think John McCay uses this term in

[3:45:50] planning commission. density right now.

[3:45:53] >> So what would it I guess the question is

[3:45:55] what would it take so we know what would

[3:45:56] it take to convert these to livable

[3:45:58] spaces?

[3:45:58] >> You would have to reszone for higher

[3:46:01] density housing. Right now the highest

[3:46:03] density you can have is quarter acre

[3:46:04] lots and with an overlay you can have

[3:46:06] eight per acre. This would be over what

[3:46:09] is currently allowed. So they would need

[3:46:11] a zone change.

[3:46:12] >> So it just be a a three vote a three.

[3:46:15] Well, another another way to look at

[3:46:17] that is I think the ordinance says

[3:46:20] proposed and I I confess that I haven't

[3:46:23] scrutinized it. I've looked through it,

[3:46:25] >> but the ordinance as proposed I believe

[3:46:28] says that this development and any other

[3:46:31] similar development uh that meets the

[3:46:33] criteria for for this purpose would be

[3:46:37] subject to a development agreement and

[3:46:39] CCNRs. Okay. So if the city wanted to

[3:46:43] put in the development agreement that no residential use, it's already

[3:46:48] proposed in the ordinance, but if they

[3:46:51] put that in the agreement, it would be

[3:46:53] much more difficult to

[3:46:54] >> Okay.

[3:46:55] >> So instead of just changing the

[3:46:57] ordinance in the future, they'd have to

[3:46:59] also amend the development agreement

[3:47:02] with the with the consent of the other

[3:47:05] party.

[3:47:07] >> Okay, let's wrap this up. Let's finish

[3:47:10] the discussions. Night is getting long.

[3:47:11] We still have two large items. Nash,

[3:47:15] thank you so much for your time. Again,

[3:47:16] I really appreciate your efforts. If you

[3:47:18] guys have any questions between now and

[3:47:20] a couple weeks, um you guys know how to

[3:47:22] get a hold of them. And then if you

[3:47:25] >> I'm around. I'm not hard to find. So, if

[3:47:27] you have any questions, we'd be happy to

[3:47:29] chat. I just, you know, just reiterating

[3:47:32] I think um this site is is a good use.

[3:47:36] We are excited to be, you know, taking

[3:47:39] it. We do a lot of development and a lot

[3:47:40] of different things. Um, so we've we've

[3:47:42] stared at this in a million different

[3:47:44] ways and we feel like this is the best

[3:47:45] use. We live close. We're excited to

[3:47:48] build something I think is good. So,

[3:47:50] thank you so much for your time.

[3:47:51] >> Appreciate it.

[3:47:52] >> Okay. Okay.

[3:47:53] >> Um, we're going to move on to action

[3:47:54] items, but I will

[3:47:56] >> Can I make a motion to move action item

[3:47:58] B ahead of action item A, so the very

[3:48:01] patient gentlemen here to discuss the

[3:48:03] fire station don't have to wait any

[3:48:05] longer? the four gentlemen.

[3:48:08] >> I'll second that.

[3:48:09] >> Okay. So, moved by um Councilwoman

[3:48:12] Blackwell, seconded by Councilman

[3:48:13] Rummler to move item B in front of A

[3:48:17] under um section six. Um can I get a

[3:48:21] roll call vote?

[3:48:24] >> Chrissy Hanaman, yes.

[3:48:26] >> Andrew Young, yes. Brent Rley, yes.

[3:48:28] >> Jessica Sme, yes. Sarah Blackwell, yes.

[3:48:30] Okay, we will be working on the fire

[3:48:34] station edition project budget.

[3:48:37] Gentlemen from

[3:48:39] Babcock Design

[3:48:41] Navigate and search please

[3:48:45] if you guys can come up to the podium.

[3:48:47] Um

[3:48:49] so this is the team that we've been

[3:48:51] working with. Um Chad Littlewood um from

[3:48:55] Babcock Design has been our designer and

[3:48:58] architect.

[3:49:02] And then now I'm forgetting everybody's

[3:49:05] name.

[3:49:06] Travis

[3:49:08] >> got Preston Reading from Nate.

[3:49:10] >> Navigate

[3:49:11] >> got Rich uh

[3:49:15] >> HCO

[3:49:16] and

[3:49:18] >> Blake

[3:49:19] >> from Webby. That's what we hear in our

[3:49:22] meetings.

[3:49:23] And uh yeah, we have Chad here. So, um

[3:49:27] we're kind of down to the final making

[3:49:29] some final decisions um so we can move

[3:49:31] forward and finalized construction

[3:49:33] drawings for the fire station. And um

[3:49:37] you know, because of cost, it was

[3:49:38] important that we bring this back to the

[3:49:40] council to make some final decisions

[3:49:43] based on um cost estimating that has

[3:49:46] been done. um as this project has uh

[3:49:51] moved forward and I would I would call

[3:49:54] this front row right here like a team of

[3:49:56] all stars. They've been awesome and

[3:49:59] they've done put a lot of work into

[3:50:01] costing this out and I think the best

[3:50:04] thing with the time is to turn the time

[3:50:06] over to them and they'll go through some

[3:50:08] things and explain what we're looking

[3:50:10] for tonight.

[3:50:24] It's a public meeting, so you shouldn't

[3:50:26] have back.

[3:50:28] Just like

[3:50:34] my name's Rich Hanskoff uh with CIRC um

[3:50:37] pre-construction

[3:50:39] >> estimating um web

[3:50:44] Blake uh assist me in that effort. Uh

[3:50:46] we've been working with uh Babcock and

[3:50:51] Nate and also

[3:50:53] Shane and the city uh in budgeting for

[3:50:57] the uh remodel in addition to the fire

[3:51:00] station. Uh we've taken a lot of effort.

[3:51:04] We love public safety, public safety

[3:51:07] projects. They're important uh to the

[3:51:10] communities that they're in. Um

[3:51:12] unfortunately there's always finite

[3:51:15] budgets that need to be met and um quite

[3:51:19] often the need far exceeds

[3:51:23] uh what the budgets are. Um the the

[3:51:27] process here is taking the the uh

[3:51:29] facility that we've already got

[3:51:32] and uh or that you already have and

[3:51:35] making it viable to be used for the

[3:51:39] foreseeable future.

[3:51:41] uh Chief U has a real need um in

[3:51:46] augmenting the facility and bringing it

[3:51:49] up to current standards um public safety

[3:51:53] standards that uh allow for the access

[3:51:57] and also for the crews to be not only

[3:52:00] comfortable but be successful in their

[3:52:03] mission.

[3:52:04] So in uh uh analyzing the project uh

[3:52:08] going through uh the project as it now

[3:52:11] is constituted and where we've come to

[3:52:15] we've spent an immense amount of time

[3:52:17] doing what I call value engineering.

[3:52:20] There was a program identified um using

[3:52:24] the app bay that is there converting the

[3:52:27] existing facility uh into a community

[3:52:31] center and then making a provision for

[3:52:34] the fire station or the fire house with

[3:52:37] the new dormitories, their meeting

[3:52:39] rooms, um the day rooms and their

[3:52:43] dormitories.

[3:52:45] Um right now the budget is um a little

[3:52:50] in excess of what had been issued as

[3:52:54] part of the RFP.

[3:52:56] Um we have looked at a number of

[3:52:59] elements to be able to try and reduce

[3:53:02] that amount.

[3:53:04] Um, and what Chad is going to be able to

[3:53:07] share with us is where we've come to in

[3:53:11] that design process and assisting in

[3:53:14] that uh budget.

[3:53:16] >> Sorry,

[3:53:17] >> budgeting effort. Are we able to go?

[3:53:19] >> Well, it's looks like a fun video game.

[3:53:22] >> Looks like a football.

[3:53:25] >> You can keep

[3:53:25] >> There we go.

[3:53:27] >> A playbook.

[3:53:30] And please um ask any questions as I go.

[3:53:34] I I know that what uh you're seeing

[3:53:37] there's a lot of information here. Um

[3:53:40] but we've tried to meet the mission of

[3:53:43] the fire station. I want to describe

[3:53:45] something to you that's really

[3:53:47] difficult. Um when you've got this

[3:53:50] finite budget and we've got a mixeduse

[3:53:55] fire station. Um, we we've got a a

[3:53:58] community center that's claiming a

[3:54:01] significant portion of the budget. And

[3:54:04] I'm not suggesting it's not a needed

[3:54:07] element. It it it's something that the

[3:54:09] community needs. There's a reason that

[3:54:10] we've designed it, but there have to be

[3:54:14] some choices between what's available

[3:54:18] and where it is spent. So whether we

[3:54:21] spend it on the community room or in the

[3:54:23] fire station, it's kind of hard to

[3:54:26] divide that

[3:54:28] other than don't do the community room

[3:54:30] or don't do the fire station in order to

[3:54:33] save some money. So those aren't real

[3:54:34] viable. So you'll notice that right now

[3:54:37] in the budget that you're looking at

[3:54:40] and there's a number of value

[3:54:43] engineering items that we can go through

[3:54:46] and and we can talk about the detail,

[3:54:47] but where I'd like to go is to the

[3:54:49] bottom line. If you'll notice, we have

[3:54:51] the current cost estimate saying that

[3:54:53] we're about $5.2 million.

[3:54:57] We've also, you'll notice in the green

[3:55:00] column accepted,

[3:55:02] we're saying that there are value

[3:55:04] engineering items that we're willing to

[3:55:06] change in the design to allow us to save

[3:55:09] money. And you'll notice that the ones

[3:55:11] that we've selected are eating a adding

[3:55:14] up to about $289,000,

[3:55:19] which is pulling the overall budget to

[3:55:22] 4.9.

[3:55:25] Now if you look at that some of those

[3:55:26] items for example

[3:55:29] 1B

[3:55:31] the design was planning on providing a

[3:55:33] standing seam metal roof over the entire

[3:55:35] building. This is hybrid. We're saying

[3:55:37] we're going to do portion. We're going

[3:55:39] to get roof but we're going to save

[3:55:41] enough that we can save a little bit

[3:55:43] money towards the total. Secondly, we're

[3:55:46] going to add some um well, that's

[3:55:49] actually in going the wrong direction,

[3:55:51] but we're going to add some additional

[3:55:52] glazing in the day room of the community

[3:55:55] center. We're going to save um epoxy

[3:55:59] flooring. We're not going to do that in

[3:56:01] the at bay in an attempt to save money.

[3:56:05] We're also going to um have the city

[3:56:08] purchase the generator on state contract

[3:56:11] so that can save the markup and not pay

[3:56:14] us for that. Also going to uh red reduce

[3:56:20] uh furring on CMU walls in the gymnasium

[3:56:24] area.

[3:56:26] Reduce uh wood wall panels on the gable

[3:56:30] ends.

[3:56:31] >> Can you explain what furring is?

[3:56:33] >> I'm sorry.

[3:56:33] >> Sorry. I just was curious what furring

[3:56:35] is.

[3:56:36] >> Furring is um you know when you have a

[3:56:38] cement wall or a concrete wall and you

[3:56:42] put wood strips on it and then you put

[3:56:45] the drywall on the face of it so it

[3:56:47] covers the brick up.

[3:56:48] >> So what we're saying is in the gymnasium

[3:56:50] area these guys are great with just

[3:56:52] being exposed brick

[3:56:54] >> and we'll just leave it exposed.

[3:56:57] Mhm.

[3:56:57] >> Um I think we talked about uh the idea

[3:57:02] that we would uh keep the existing let's

[3:57:05] see would wall panels uh keep the

[3:57:09] existing overhead door. Oh no, I'm

[3:57:11] sorry. Go down dorm sinks rather than

[3:57:14] sinks being in the dorm rooms

[3:57:15] themselves. The dorms have their own

[3:57:18] bathrooms. The sinks would remain in the

[3:57:20] bathrooms, not in the dorm rooms

[3:57:22] themselves. Go ahead.

[3:57:24] >> Sorry. Chad Littlewood with Batpack

[3:57:26] Design.

[3:57:28] I'm wondering if it's most helpful. I

[3:57:30] don't mean to interrupt, but I think in

[3:57:32] essence, we've been working towards a

[3:57:34] project and working towards a goal with

[3:57:36] integration of comments from both the

[3:57:37] council, the public, the city, the

[3:57:39] project team, etc. The budget came in

[3:57:42] during SDS, schmatic design, and now

[3:57:44] we're through design development DDS and

[3:57:46] we got an updated budget. The

[3:57:48] information that we got to get said

[3:57:49] budget, excuse me, estimate has grown

[3:57:51] exponentially. So, it's much more

[3:57:52] concrete and much more realistic.

[3:57:55] But because we want to be diligent and

[3:57:56] it's public money, we recognize that we

[3:57:59] came up with a number and there's things

[3:58:00] on the table that we wanted to bring to

[3:58:02] both the fire team and the project team

[3:58:04] to say, do we want to entertain this for

[3:58:06] saving additional costs?

[3:58:08] And so that's where we're at. And so

[3:58:10] even with the additional cost savings

[3:58:11] that we're proposing, there's decisions

[3:58:13] that go along with it because we

[3:58:14] recognize there's a bucket of need to

[3:58:16] have and a bucket of would want to have.

[3:58:19] The need to have needs to stay there.

[3:58:21] The want to have is up for conversation.

[3:58:23] So are these all would want to have?

[3:58:25] >> So these are all things that

[3:58:27] >> one through 19.

[3:58:28] >> If I'm speaking for the for the project

[3:58:30] team, there are a lot of people in this

[3:58:31] room. These are all items that the

[3:58:33] project team is comfortable proposing as

[3:58:36] um

[3:58:37] >> reductions,

[3:58:38] >> gaining additional dollars back or

[3:58:39] reductions. Exactly. With the one

[3:58:41] exception uh for council that we've been

[3:58:44] talking about the additional windows on

[3:58:45] that south side of the community room.

[3:58:46] That that's something that's not

[3:58:47] currently in design. That's an actually

[3:58:48] an ad for the project.

[3:58:51] >> And you'll notice go through those

[3:58:53] >> and and we can and you'll not notice

[3:58:54] even in the list in the rejected list

[3:58:57] you you can see there's a couple items

[3:58:59] we've just said that that's beyond what

[3:59:01] we want to do. In fact, during our work

[3:59:04] sessions, there were some ideas on some

[3:59:07] changes within the dorm rooms, and we

[3:59:10] determined that that was more than we

[3:59:13] would want to produce uh in saving.

[3:59:16] Well, not producing saving that's

[3:59:18] stepping further than we'd like to. The

[3:59:21] missionritical nature of this facility

[3:59:24] says that the firefighters need those to

[3:59:28] meet their mission.

[3:59:30] So, are we trying to trim 200,000

[3:59:33] $211,797

[3:59:40] » from the 5 million 211?

[3:59:42] >> Yes.

[3:59:42] >> Yeah. To get to $5 million. That's

[3:59:45] correct.

[3:59:45] >> Or we can add $80,000. We have 80,000

[3:59:48] basically if we want to hit 5 million or

[3:59:51] we can do a budget adjustment like we

[3:59:54] are doing later. I mean, what are all of

[3:59:57] our options?

[3:59:58] >> Yeah. Um Preston, do you mind just

[4:00:00] covering the other part of the cost just

[4:00:02] so it's all on the table here?

[4:00:04] >> Yeah, absolutely. So So there's there's

[4:00:07] kind of two buckets right here. Um

[4:00:09] there's the construction costs or the

[4:00:10] hard costs like we call them and then

[4:00:12] there's the soft costs which are kind of

[4:00:14] the administrative costs that um the

[4:00:16] owner typically handles. So that's like

[4:00:19] appliances, that's the architect's fees,

[4:00:21] that's our fees. Um, and so that bucket

[4:00:25] of money actually is about $900,000 that we currently have. So that would be

[4:00:30] on top of that 5.2 right now. So in

[4:00:34] excess, we're looking at about 800 is

[4:00:36] what we're looking at.

[4:00:38] >> So sorry, you're you're I was going to

[4:00:41] wait till the end, but just so he

[4:00:42] doesn't get up. So right now total that

[4:00:45] first page is 5.2 and then there's an

[4:00:48] additional 900 on the 5.2. So we're at

[4:00:50] about 6 something. 6.1 right about there

[4:00:53] >> total. Okay, I'll save the other

[4:00:55] questions till after.

[4:00:56] >> Yep. And again, that's that 5.2 is is

[4:00:58] currently our our construction costs and again through the design phase we

[4:01:03] had SD drawings or schematic drawings

[4:01:06] come out um that sent over to CIRC uh

[4:01:09] they gave us a budget and we went

[4:01:11] through and did kind of a deval

[4:01:12] engineering uh session. Actually we did

[4:01:15] multiple sessions there. We got we felt

[4:01:17] pretty comfortable at that stage. We

[4:01:19] continue with design. We got to design

[4:01:21] development and that was a couple weeks

[4:01:23] ago. That was sent over for another

[4:01:25] budget and those numbers came back

[4:01:28] unfortunately a little bit higher than

[4:01:29] what we were hoping.

[4:01:31] >> And please understand that that process

[4:01:35] is not the final bid. What we're talking

[4:01:38] about is managing the design and making

[4:01:41] sure what goes out to the market.

[4:01:43] Ultimately, we will go to the market and

[4:01:46] ask for subcontractor bids in every

[4:01:48] category.

[4:01:50] We'll have those um abstracts. We'll

[4:01:53] have the bid results. We'll share those

[4:01:54] with Shane and staff so that we're able

[4:01:57] to review it, make sure we stay within

[4:01:59] budget. Our experience has been very

[4:02:01] good. Currently, the market is um very

[4:02:05] favorable to owner. Uh contractors are

[4:02:08] very eager to get work. Uh price points

[4:02:11] are dropping.

[4:02:13] So we we feel very good about that

[4:02:16] process that we're going to be able to meet that. But the design was so

[4:02:22] close to what we had in budget, we felt

[4:02:24] that these cost savings measures were

[4:02:27] required.

[4:02:29] >> Yeah. So and again just to to kind of

[4:02:32] what we're looking at here the the the

[4:02:34] estimate or the budget that we have come

[4:02:36] back with and again that was with some

[4:02:38] contractor input or subcontractor's

[4:02:40] input. We're at 5.2. If we accept

[4:02:43] everything in that green column, which

[4:02:44] is 289,000, it gets us to that 4.9

[4:02:48] million, but there's still the the soft

[4:02:51] costs that we that we talk about. And

[4:02:52] again, that's that's the appliances,

[4:02:54] that's the administrative fees, um kind

[4:02:57] of everything that the owner is holding

[4:02:58] on on our side. Yeah. So, so that if we

[4:03:02] again, if we accepted all that, the 4.9

[4:03:04] plus the 900, we're sitting about 5.8,

[4:03:07] which is where Yeah. again. And and some

[4:03:11] of these items are are on the table,

[4:03:12] right? Um I think there's three of them

[4:03:15] specifically that I think Chad has some drawings that we can kind of take a

[4:03:19] look at to give you guys a better

[4:03:20] understanding of of what's going on. So,

[4:03:23] >> and just so I'm clear, like our budget

[4:03:26] was 5 million all in.

[4:03:29] >> Yes.

[4:03:30] >> With even the soft cost.

[4:03:31] >> Yeah. All in.

[4:03:32] >> Just

[4:03:34] that's what that's what was approved

[4:03:36] like two or three years ago. Pardon some

[4:03:38] of our questions because we're new.

[4:03:41] >> Yeah.

[4:03:42] >> But we're slightly aware, but I don't

[4:03:44] know what was approved in the past.

[4:03:46] Maybe Jessica or someone could uh

[4:03:48] explain to me.

[4:03:50] >> Yeah. Like very very early estimates. We had planned around um 5 million. Like

[4:03:56] in the current budget year, we have

[4:03:58] three million cash budgeted and then we

[4:04:01] were planning for about a $2 million U

[4:04:04] bond.

[4:04:06] And so, and then we do have a couple

[4:04:09] donations,

[4:04:10] >> right,

[4:04:11] >> that um

[4:04:12] >> the the bank and the really nice former

[4:04:15] mayor.

[4:04:15] >> Yeah. A family. And um so now we're just

[4:04:19] trying to kind of pair things down as

[4:04:22] much as we can and then see if you know

[4:04:25] if we need to there's a couple options.

[4:04:28] This project will we're in one budget

[4:04:31] year. we'll go into FY27 with

[4:04:34] construction and then even a little bit

[4:04:36] into into FY28.

[4:04:39] So, there's options. You know, we could

[4:04:41] budget some funds in a regular budgeting

[4:04:44] um from those next two budget years and

[4:04:45] still bond for u you know, $2 million

[4:04:49] for something like that. We're trying to

[4:04:51] get to a point where we can finish the

[4:04:56] design of the project so we can get it

[4:04:58] out to bid, hopefully take advantage of

[4:05:00] the um hungry contractors right now. Um

[4:05:04] but we just, you know, obviously the

[4:05:07] council's the decision makers on funding

[4:05:11] and so that's why we're back here making

[4:05:13] sure that

[4:05:14] >> how we move forward. So regardless of if

[4:05:16] we just say let's not do anything on

[4:05:18] this, we're still over 800,000. So

[4:05:21] what's that plan? Because to me, this is

[4:05:24] we I just need to understand what the

[4:05:26] plan to cover the 800. That's that's

[4:05:28] where there's some things here that we want to decide. Are they, you know,

[4:05:33] can we take these out or can we make

[4:05:35] these changes

[4:05:37] um to kind of do a little bit kind of

[4:05:40] the final value engineering

[4:05:43] and then um decide, you know, can we

[4:05:46] commit to um providing some funds from

[4:05:49] our next two budget years or is the

[4:05:51] council willing to bond for a little

[4:05:53] more than the 2 million originally

[4:05:56] planned for? or how we want to move

[4:05:58] forward.

[4:05:59] >> Shane, I'm still confused because I you

[4:06:02] and I went over the numbers and then we

[4:06:05] have these four items. So, if we if we

[4:06:08] approve the 5 or if we want to move

[4:06:10] forward with the 5.8, these are included

[4:06:12] or excluded. I'm still not following.

[4:06:17] They list four items just it's glazing,

[4:06:20] eliminate vestibule, community center

[4:06:22] mill work, and other miscellaneous

[4:06:23] items.

[4:06:25] Those are included or excluded from the

[4:06:27] 2.8.

[4:06:29] >> Shane, feel free to step in and go

[4:06:30] anything.

[4:06:32] >> Right now, excluding this document

[4:06:33] entirely, there is a design development

[4:06:36] set of drawings and information that was

[4:06:38] given to the contractor to to price as a

[4:06:40] budget. All that information came in at

[4:06:43] 5.2. That's everything that we're

[4:06:45] planning on, everything that we

[4:06:46] currently have. This is a list of

[4:06:48] information that could potentially

[4:06:49] remove costs from the 5.2.

[4:06:51] >> Oh, okay. So,

[4:06:53] >> so the the difference between the 5.2

[4:06:55] you're seeing and the 4.9 is simply the culmination sum of the accepted

[4:07:01] column of items that we could reduce.

[4:07:04] >> There's items in the blue category, the

[4:07:05] undecided category that we could take

[4:07:06] additional advantage of and take

[4:07:09] >> 61,000 additional from the project.

[4:07:13] >> Okay.

[4:07:13] >> And I apologize.

[4:07:15] >> Thank you.

[4:07:15] >> Too much detail.

[4:07:17] >> Okay. No, that's fine. Um no and to that

[4:07:20] point there's one item like I mentioned

[4:07:22] as an exception and I accepted the green

[4:07:25] column that actually is a additional

[4:07:27] cost to the 5.2 and that's the

[4:07:28] additional windows to the south with the

[4:07:30] structural

[4:07:32] um

[4:07:33] >> here at all.

[4:07:35] >> It is it's included it's just captured

[4:07:36] within that. So it's just making that

[4:07:38] 289,000

[4:07:40] sum within the accepted category not as

[4:07:43] powerful. It would be more in the

[4:07:44] neighborhood of 3 339.

[4:07:47] >> Notice the second item that has a 55.

[4:07:49] >> Oh, I see. I see the negative 50.

[4:07:51] >> There's negative.

[4:07:52] >> It's it's worth saying because you may

[4:07:54] be saying, well, there's there's two big

[4:07:56] numbers on the rejected column that are

[4:07:59] >> that are not being considered as what we

[4:08:01] should take forward.

[4:08:02] >> They've already kind of items 1B, 1 C,

[4:08:05] and 1 A. I said that backwards.

[4:08:06] >> Yeah. The top three are all regarding

[4:08:08] the roof.

[4:08:09] >> Yeah. So, it's

[4:08:10] >> it can't be all all of them. It's one or

[4:08:12] the other. Right.

[4:08:13] >> Well, mayor, do you want us to wait

[4:08:15] while they're

[4:08:15] >> present? So, sorry. Just hold on. So,

[4:08:18] >> if

[4:08:20] for being a spreadsheet girl, I don't

[4:08:21] know why I'm lost, but um line item two

[4:08:25] is a negative. So, that means you've

[4:08:27] removed it from the project.

[4:08:29] >> No, that's an additional cost instead of

[4:08:33] taking away. So, everything in the green

[4:08:35] column is taking away from the $5.2 2

[4:08:38] million except for the glazing in the

[4:08:41] community center. That's an additional

[4:08:43] cost

[4:08:50] » that's construction accounting. Yes.

[4:08:52] What's happening is we're tracking dedu

[4:08:56] >> that choice happens to be an increase

[4:08:58] not a dedu.

[4:08:59] >> Okay. So it's going the opposite

[4:09:00] direction.

[4:09:01] >> If I may,

[4:09:02] >> this is Blake Webster with CIRC. So this

[4:09:05] is a little more simplified version. So,

[4:09:07] first we have the construction costs at

[4:09:10] your 5.2 and as Preston mentioned,

[4:09:13] there's that 900,000 for your soft cost,

[4:09:15] right?

[4:09:15] >> And then there's your total of 6.1.

[4:09:18] >> And now, if we jump over to this other

[4:09:20] tab, this is our value engineering log

[4:09:23] where we are now deducting from that 5.2

[4:09:26] that construction cost and every

[4:09:28] accepted item is we are accepting to

[4:09:30] remove that from the project. So, it's a

[4:09:32] deduct. For example, if we so the 5.2 to

[4:09:35] we budgeted the full metal panel roofs

[4:09:38] everywhere. And if we chose to accept

[4:09:40] item 1B, I'm going to change that to

[4:09:44] accepted.

[4:09:45] >> It changes the So down here we have our

[4:09:48] current cost estimate, but now with the

[4:09:50] accepted item, it's now down to just

[4:09:53] over 5 million. So basically as we go

[4:09:56] through this sheet we mark down which

[4:09:58] items we have accepted to remove and

[4:10:00] it's going to reduce our cost and or we

[4:10:02] can choose to reject them and or choose

[4:10:05] >> one of the value engineering happened to

[4:10:07] be an increase it was an add of

[4:10:09] additional

[4:10:10] >> yeah okay

[4:10:10] >> that added glazing was requested and so

[4:10:13] that's it wasn't incorporated in the

[4:10:15] last drawing set but we understanded

[4:10:17] that it's going to be a necessary

[4:10:18] increase so that's a negative

[4:10:20] >> 1 A B and C what you what you've decided

[4:10:23] to do then is is use

[4:10:27] >> mutually exclusive,

[4:10:28] >> right? No, I understand that. So, what

[4:10:30] the all the what kind of roof are we

[4:10:34] going to have?

[4:10:35] >> You're gonna a hybrid.

[4:10:36] >> Great question.

[4:10:39] >> So, what we end up with is a hybrid roof

[4:10:41] system, standing seam over the day room

[4:10:44] and vestable, and we replace the roof

[4:10:46] over the app bay with asphalt and then

[4:10:49] the flat roof is so the markups. Uh

[4:10:52] yeah, that's great. But to give you an

[4:10:54] idea, when you look at the fire station

[4:10:56] right now, the way that it is, it's

[4:10:59] going to be re-roofed exactly as it is

[4:11:03] with those portions. The new portion of

[4:11:05] the building, we'll get some standing

[4:11:07] seam over the front entry and over the

[4:11:10] day room to give it some architectural

[4:11:12] flare.

[4:11:13] >> Standing seam being asphalt. I'm still

[4:11:15] stuck on the metal.

[4:11:16] >> Metal. Metal. Metal. Standing seam is

[4:11:18] metal.

[4:11:19] >> Okay. So we're getting metal roof on the

[4:11:21] new contractor

[4:11:22] >> and then everything else is remaining.

[4:11:24] >> So originally it was supposed to be all

[4:11:25] metal.

[4:11:26] >> That's what I thought was

[4:11:28] >> so to get the to get the cost down

[4:11:31] they're saying that okay

[4:11:32] >> because that was the biggest item and

[4:11:34] then the rest um these four items

[4:11:39] >> that's the

[4:11:40] >> we are removing those. But Shane, you

[4:11:42] brought these up to say we're removing

[4:11:43] this and we're okay unless we budget for

[4:11:46] and then we add them back and then we go

[4:11:47] up higher.

[4:11:48] >> Yeah. So okay,

[4:11:49] >> because you know that we these things

[4:11:51] are important to us.

[4:11:52] >> So no, my understanding was that the

[4:11:54] roof was going to be in the undecided

[4:11:56] the three that and council was going to

[4:11:58] decide which system they wanted to do

[4:12:01] knowing what the cost savings are and

[4:12:03] making that decision. I think the rest

[4:12:05] of them a lot of it I think um the

[4:12:07] glazing we heard that that was important

[4:12:09] so we said keep that in. Um, if you look

[4:12:12] at like um built-in for um the dorms, we

[4:12:17] said that needed to be kept in because

[4:12:19] even though it's an additional cost in

[4:12:21] the long run, they said that um one of

[4:12:24] the complaints is like, you know, if you

[4:12:27] just get a regular bed, they just break

[4:12:29] so easily that you just have to buy new.

[4:12:31] So, initially it'll be a cost savings,

[4:12:33] but you're going to have to buy it, you

[4:12:34] know, buy another one. And um they were

[4:12:38] saying that the one in Highland, how

[4:12:40] long has that fire station been around?

[4:12:42] >> 18 years.

[4:12:43] They haven't had any of the

[4:12:46] built-ins break. Um so to me, if in the

[4:12:50] long run, it ended up being cheaper to

[4:12:52] keep the built-in um beds and furniture

[4:12:56] for the dorm rooms.

[4:12:58] >> Okay.

[4:12:59] >> And then um the epoxy flooring, we ask,

[4:13:02] you know, the chiefs, is that important

[4:13:04] to you? What, you know, what does that

[4:13:05] look like? And um Cir came up with a

[4:13:09] solution where they would um they would

[4:13:14] kind of um we were going to patch and

[4:13:16] grind it

[4:13:17] >> in the app base or where the fire trucks

[4:13:20] park that obviously it's a concrete

[4:13:22] floor. It's old so there's some

[4:13:25] cracking. We'd route those. We'd recock

[4:13:29] those. We'd clean it. We'd get it up to

[4:13:32] standard. We just wouldn't cover it with

[4:13:34] epoxy. My experience with epoxy and app

[4:13:37] bas is it fails after about 5 to 10

[4:13:39] years anyway. So let's not spend money

[4:13:42] and create a place that you have to

[4:13:44] continually maintain and keep replacing.

[4:13:46] Let's get it down to good concrete

[4:13:49] surface that they can take care of.

[4:13:53] >> So these four items the glazing is would

[4:13:56] cost 50,000. And the eliminate the

[4:13:58] vestable it to keep it would cost

[4:14:01] >> nothing well would cost nothing

[4:14:03] >> above or below the 5.2.

[4:14:05] >> Oh, it's already included.

[4:14:07] >> Correct. To remove it would be a value.

[4:14:09] >> We've rejected that

[4:14:11] >> and the community city mill work is

[4:14:13] we're keeping in this cost.

[4:14:16] >> Okay. These are the things we're

[4:14:17] keeping.

[4:14:18] >> Chrissy.

[4:14:19] >> Okay.

[4:14:20] >> Did we not want to let them finish and

[4:14:21] then go one by one or

[4:14:23] >> Oh, no. I'm just trying. Well, we can. I

[4:14:25] just think it might delay if we okay

[4:14:28] interject on them.

[4:14:28] >> Yeah, it's it's good to wrap your hands

[4:14:30] around what the numbers mean and this is

[4:14:32] part of why there wasn't more detail in

[4:14:34] the staff report.

[4:14:36] >> It's kind of hard to explain on paper. I

[4:14:39] think it takes some verbal explanation

[4:14:41] here, but got it.

[4:14:43] >> I didn't mean to cut you off. It's just

[4:14:44] >> No, Andrew likes to go in order, so

[4:14:47] we'll wait.

[4:14:48] >> Okay. Can I Can I explain real quick?

[4:14:50] >> Yeah.

[4:14:50] >> And I'm fine to do whichever is best for

[4:14:52] the council.

[4:14:53] It's it's slightly confusing because

[4:14:54] there is a one master budget that says

[4:14:56] this is what the total is based on the

[4:14:57] drawings. But we're looking into the

[4:14:59] future and knowing that if that's the

[4:15:00] number that is when we do the final

[4:15:01] bidding, we're going to have a problem.

[4:15:02] So rather than address it when we have

[4:15:04] final drawings and there's been a lot

[4:15:05] more progress and work, we're trying to

[4:15:08] allocate determine the path forward now

[4:15:10] so we can make the progress forward more

[4:15:12] appropriately. So the numbers you're

[4:15:15] looking on the screen now are whatever

[4:15:17] column we decide to put them in to

[4:15:18] Mayor's Point will determine whether

[4:15:20] that 5.2 two goes up, goes down, or

[4:15:23] stays the same.

[4:15:25] >> That's the easiest way to put. So,

[4:15:27] everybody

[4:15:29] >> thing if you guys, this might bring all

[4:15:31] of this together just a little bit.

[4:15:33] Maybe not. Um,

[4:15:35] >> you talked about the the bidding,

[4:15:38] >> but can you just talk to the guaranteed

[4:15:40] maximum price and what?

[4:15:42] >> Yeah. So to share with you what we do in

[4:15:45] this process in construction management

[4:15:48] is giving the engineers and architects

[4:15:52] feedback in cost while they're

[4:15:54] designing. So Chad doesn't have to

[4:15:56] redesign and redesign and redesign to

[4:15:58] try and hit a budget. What happens next

[4:16:01] is we get him to a point that we're

[4:16:04] comfortable looking forecasting what the

[4:16:06] budget's going to be. He completes the

[4:16:09] design and then we go back out to the

[4:16:11] market to the subcontractors and bid the

[4:16:16] entire package

[4:16:17] >> competitively.

[4:16:18] >> We come back with bids, multiple bids in

[4:16:21] every trade category, concrete, masonry,

[4:16:24] framing, roofing, drywall. We have a

[4:16:28] complete comparison, multiple bids in

[4:16:31] each one that we share with Shane, with

[4:16:34] the team to see how the bid went. At

[4:16:37] that point, we get to a total. That's

[4:16:40] when we finally get to the guaranteed

[4:16:42] maximum price. We make recommendations

[4:16:45] on which trades are going to be ordered

[4:16:48] or awarded the contract. Again, in those

[4:16:51] same trades, it adds up to a total and

[4:16:54] that becomes the guaranteed maximum

[4:16:55] price. So, we're not suggesting that

[4:16:57] this is the guaranteed maximum price.

[4:17:00] What we're doing is we're assuring

[4:17:01] ourselves that we're forecasting enough

[4:17:04] budget to build what we bid.

[4:17:12] » Okay. Does everybody kind of understand?

[4:17:15] And if we do, we can move forward with

[4:17:17] questions.

[4:17:19] Are we ready for that point?

[4:17:21] >> Mayor, sorry to interrupt. Is there a

[4:17:22] value in seeing any of the diagrams that

[4:17:24] went along with some of these cost

[4:17:25] estimates to put

[4:17:26] >> Yes. I'm sorry. I didn't know if you had

[4:17:27] them or not. If you do, that would be

[4:17:28] >> I do if it's helpful. I didn't do them

[4:17:30] for everyone. I did them for the

[4:17:30] significant ones.

[4:17:31] >> That's great.

[4:17:32] >> I would like to see the roof if you have

[4:17:34] it.

[4:17:34] >> Absolutely.

[4:17:36] >> And then is the idea to go through each

[4:17:37] of those items one at a time and discuss

[4:17:39] them or

[4:17:41] >> not? Not every single one.

[4:17:43] >> Feel free to ask any questions of the

[4:17:45] full list and I'll go back to the list

[4:17:46] at the end to to have it as reference.

[4:17:49] Um, so pardon the crude colors, but it's

[4:17:52] just easy to distinguish. So if you're

[4:17:54] familiar, the the yellow massings on the

[4:17:57] page, those are the existing structure.

[4:18:00] The current plan right now, well, let me

[4:18:02] back up. The 5.2

[4:18:04] suggests that both the existing

[4:18:06] structure and all the new construction

[4:18:09] was to receive a standing seam metal

[4:18:11] roof.

[4:18:12] And councilwoman, that was for your

[4:18:14] question. It's a metal formed roof and

[4:18:16] the ridges all come together and the

[4:18:18] seams that slap up so all the sloping

[4:18:20] goes in one direction.

[4:18:22] >> What we're proposing now as a potential

[4:18:24] value item is that everything you see in

[4:18:26] yellow will be re-roofed with asphalt

[4:18:28] shingling. It's currently asphalt

[4:18:29] shingling and that all the new

[4:18:31] construction in the green would also be

[4:18:33] asphalt shingling much much less

[4:18:36] expensive formula form. And the blue

[4:18:39] items which would be over the main

[4:18:40] entrance vestibule and the day room and

[4:18:44] dining room of the fire station would be

[4:18:45] the standing seam to have a more

[4:18:47] elevated look.

[4:18:48] >> Excellent.

[4:18:49] >> Okay. I'm not going in order of the

[4:18:52] slides because they're slightly

[4:18:53] different, but just as a comparison,

[4:18:55] this is the current exterior elevation

[4:18:57] of the west elevation which is the

[4:19:01] community center. Uh this is the current

[4:19:03] addition glazing we're showing on the

[4:19:05] corner. This is obviously the vestibule.

[4:19:07] These windows are the existing punched

[4:19:09] openings that we're not changing.

[4:19:12] This is the Oops, excuse me. This is

[4:19:14] also the 5.2

[4:19:17] version of the of that south elevation

[4:19:19] of the community room center. You can

[4:19:20] see the vestule in the foreground there.

[4:19:22] Um those are existing punched openings.

[4:19:24] What we've been asked to do as a request

[4:19:26] is to increase those to what's shown on

[4:19:28] the page here with just added additional

[4:19:30] glazing there. Um, another item just to

[4:19:34] bounce on this page, both on the north

[4:19:37] facing and south facing elevation of the

[4:19:39] apparatus bay, the gable portion, which

[4:19:41] is, if you're not familiar, gable

[4:19:42] portion is essentially that triangular

[4:19:44] area below the roof. We're recladding

[4:19:46] that in a faux wood system on both north

[4:19:49] and south that's included in the 5.2. uh

[4:19:52] option was at least on the south side

[4:19:54] away from the the public facing street

[4:19:57] is that we would just keep that exposed

[4:19:59] material as it is now and refinish it

[4:20:01] with it's called ephus basically a

[4:20:03] stucco

[4:20:06] » that one,00300

[4:20:22] Good. Okay. Next couple items here.

[4:20:25] >> $15,300

[4:20:28] » was the savings.

[4:20:32] >> Okay. Small item here. This is the

[4:20:33] street facing uh north elevation. The

[4:20:37] day room and dining room kitchen windows

[4:20:39] here. In a previous design, it we felt

[4:20:41] it was important to increase the glazing

[4:20:42] there. What you're seeing in the

[4:20:43] background. What we're proposing if we

[4:20:45] need to is to decrease the size of the

[4:20:47] glazing to what would be shown in that

[4:20:49] red boundary. That price savings

[4:20:54] is $7,500.

[4:21:00] » And when you say glazing, is that

[4:21:02] literally like

[4:21:03] >> Sorry.

[4:21:04] >> Glass walls.

[4:21:05] >> Yeah. Windows.

[4:21:06] >> Thank you.

[4:21:08] >> Uh last couple here. The yellow area is

[4:21:11] what Rich was referring to previously in

[4:21:13] the apparatus bay. We had a price for

[4:21:15] that to fully replace or not replace but

[4:21:17] epoxy that entire floor and make it new.

[4:21:19] Um the new ve option would be to just

[4:21:22] patch and replace that as needed. So not

[4:21:25] a complete redo.

[4:21:27] Um this is I believe on the undecided

[4:21:30] column councilman just for the purpose

[4:21:32] of function.

[4:21:34] As it stands right now the community

[4:21:36] room center has an added new

[4:21:37] construction vestibule. My screen will

[4:21:39] update. There it goes. Um one of the

[4:21:42] items that's undecided just because it

[4:21:43] is such a functional change is to remove

[4:21:46] said vestibule. Um,

[4:21:49] we can talk semantics if need be, but

[4:21:51] there's some pluses and minuses, but I

[4:21:52] go to that that are beyond just cost.

[4:21:55] And then last, we talked about um some

[4:21:58] portions of the wall on the interior

[4:21:59] because the exterior new construction is

[4:22:01] all out of block. That's the structural

[4:22:03] element that's made out of it. Unless we

[4:22:05] fur it out, we'll have exposed block on

[4:22:08] the interior. Um, being the nature of

[4:22:10] the station and some of the functions,

[4:22:11] we're actually okay with that in some

[4:22:12] areas. So, we tried to strip it down

[4:22:14] where we could.

[4:22:16] So the red area there represents uh stud

[4:22:18] furring walls that would be removed from

[4:22:20] the project.

[4:22:21] >> That's the gymnasium area anyway. So

[4:22:24] that's where the correct exercise

[4:22:26] equipment is

[4:22:30] » representation

[4:22:32] >> that doesn't affect any of the um energy

[4:22:34] efficiency to remove the frame.

[4:22:36] >> No, because we've got the insulation is

[4:22:38] actually on the outside of the wall. Oh,

[4:22:41] >> the the way that the envelopes are

[4:22:42] working in buildings now that all the

[4:22:45] insulation is pushed to the outside of

[4:22:46] the wall, it's kind of interesting. It

[4:22:49] creates the

[4:22:50] >> the due point on the outside wall. It's

[4:22:52] more efficient.

[4:22:54] >> Interesting.

[4:22:54] >> Were you going to use as far as the

[4:22:56] vestibule?

[4:22:58] >> You said there were other considerations

[4:22:59] outside of cost

[4:23:02] >> in the architectural design. I Yeah, I

[4:23:04] think so.

[4:23:05] >> Just Oh, just as far as a aesthetics.

[4:23:07] >> No, not just that. So, in my mind, it's

[4:23:10] difficult taking an existing building

[4:23:11] that is what is there currently and

[4:23:14] trying to adapt it with that of an

[4:23:16] addition as well and not making it very

[4:23:17] obvious that it's a just an addition

[4:23:20] next to an existing building. We're

[4:23:21] trying to blend the two together. And

[4:23:23] so, that's one element of the community

[4:23:25] center that's new and upgraded to help

[4:23:27] blend the two. So, overall,

[4:23:29] compositionally, I think it adds

[4:23:31] something that is aesthetic. Um there is

[4:23:33] a functional and kind of warmth and uh

[4:23:36] comfort level that comes with having the

[4:23:38] vestule. If without it those doors open

[4:23:40] any type of weather kind of comes right

[4:23:42] into that large community room center

[4:23:44] without kind of a break from the window

[4:23:46] or from the weather.

[4:23:49] Um, and then this kind of gets in

[4:23:51] semantics, but right now the way we have

[4:23:53] it planned with the two separate

[4:23:55] openings within the vestibule, if you

[4:23:57] can see that on screen, those are

[4:23:59] identified based on existing openings to

[4:24:01] help minimize structural costs. There's

[4:24:03] not really a need to have two separate

[4:24:05] openings. So, we could look at something

[4:24:07] else. We could look at as glazing, but

[4:24:10] that's part of it. So, it kind of starts

[4:24:11] opening different doors of what we could

[4:24:13] do if we don't have the vestibule.

[4:24:15] >> Okay.

[4:24:16] Did I read that right? It's about

[4:24:18] $24,000.

[4:24:20] Is it really? Am I misreading that?

[4:24:23] >> Yeah. 23578.

[4:24:25] >> I rounded.

[4:24:26] >> That's correct. Yeah,

[4:24:27] >> that's correct.

[4:24:28] >> Thank you.

[4:24:29] >> And what is the community center mill

[4:24:30] work?

[4:24:33] It's along the east wall like kind of um

[4:24:36] like the c the built-in cabinets

[4:24:39] >> and bookshelves like kind of like for

[4:24:41] the history wall or um

[4:24:43] >> the TVs for the

[4:24:45] >> the TVs and then also for a staging area

[4:24:48] for on the very northeast

[4:24:53] set of mill work. It was um they

[4:24:56] designed a countertop to kind of stage

[4:24:58] the serving area for the lunchons.

[4:25:02] so that it wouldn't take more like we

[4:25:04] wouldn't have to bring out additional

[4:25:05] shles.

[4:25:10] » So, some of the comments that we've, you

[4:25:13] know, had from different council members

[4:25:15] through this last several months of this

[4:25:17] process is, hey, you know, we we really

[4:25:21] would like to end up with a building we

[4:25:23] want. And so,

[4:25:26] again, that's why we're back here. We we

[4:25:28] want to make sure that you get what you

[4:25:30] want. um and make sure that we're

[4:25:33] willing to pay for that product

[4:25:37] basically.

[4:25:40] >> Have you had that same discussion with

[4:25:41] our fire chief?

[4:25:43] >> Yeah. No, they've been in the meetings.

[4:25:44] >> Yeah, they've been

[4:25:45] >> both Chief Beck and Chief

[4:25:47] >> and he's he's getting what he wants and

[4:25:48] needs.

[4:25:49] >> Yeah, we they've agreed. We pulled out

[4:25:52] mill work and used wire racks and all

[4:25:55] kinds of different things and and

[4:25:56] they've been great through that process.

[4:25:59] Um yeah, not not looking for the Taj

[4:26:02] Mahal. They want functional. So I do

[4:26:06] feel it's worth advocating that I've

[4:26:09] designed half a dozen or more fire

[4:26:11] stations layouts and things like that.

[4:26:13] And in terms of a program and flow of

[4:26:16] plan,

[4:26:18] the fire chief has been really

[4:26:20] supportive of a minimal approach and

[4:26:22] making it as functional and compact as

[4:26:24] possible.

[4:26:26] >> Okay. And from the sidebar, from search

[4:26:30] point of view as well, we just completed

[4:26:32] uh our GMP amendment for um Spanish Fork

[4:26:38] um today. As a matter of fact, um

[4:26:42] >> Spanish fork fire

[4:26:44] >> and um

[4:26:48] he

[4:26:49] Chad's absolutely right. what chief's

[4:26:52] been able to do here has been very um

[4:26:56] accommodating.

[4:26:57] Uh understanding that what his mission

[4:27:00] is and what he needs has been really

[4:27:02] great to

[4:27:04] be uh cognizant of budget and where that

[4:27:09] needs to hit but also getting the base

[4:27:12] minimum for his operation and his

[4:27:14] mission.

[4:27:17] Where's the savings on the bay doors?

[4:27:22] Okay, keep

[4:27:27] » is that not on here?

[4:27:29] >> No. Because um

[4:27:30] >> one to to not replace them.

[4:27:32] >> No, no, no, no. Go going from um high

[4:27:35] speed to regular speed on the re-entry

[4:27:38] on the south side. I thought that was a

[4:27:41] >> We took that off. We had that

[4:27:43] >> originally. Okay. Yeah, originally we

[4:27:45] had uh highspeed on the exit door. So

[4:27:48] when they leave to go on call those are

[4:27:50] high speed but when they return it's

[4:27:52] just a normal

[4:27:53] >> regular right.

[4:27:54] >> We had given that some thought to have

[4:27:56] those high speed but because of the

[4:27:58] budget constraint we removed that and

[4:28:00] just went with normal

[4:28:02] >> speed on the re-entry doors.

[4:28:05] >> I remember the conversation happened but

[4:28:07] just at a different time than what

[4:28:08] >> Yeah. So there's a lot of things like

[4:28:10] that that we've already done that just

[4:28:13] seem to make sense with the

[4:28:15] circumstances and everything.

[4:28:21] » Okay. Do you have any questions,

[4:28:22] Chrissy?

[4:28:23] >> I don't have questions for them. I had a previous conversation with Shane. I

[4:28:28] wanted to share unless he's going to

[4:28:30] about the budget.

[4:28:32] >> Yeah. Yeah.

[4:28:34] >> But let everyone else ask their

[4:28:35] questions.

[4:28:36] >> Oh, okay. Where uh Brent, do you want to

[4:28:41] >> No, I don't have any further questions.

[4:28:43] Thanks for your thoughtful approach,

[4:28:45] Chief, and you guys on reducing costs.

[4:28:47] >> Jessica,

[4:28:50] >> mine relates to the budget. It's hard to

[4:28:52] decide where to go on these things

[4:28:54] without knowing

[4:28:56] >> how much funding.

[4:28:57] >> Yeah. Like I need to know the number to

[4:28:59] be able.

[4:28:59] >> So maybe we should talk about that now.

[4:29:01] >> Yeah.

[4:29:02] >> As far as what the bonding cost would

[4:29:04] be. So if we take out a $2 million bond,

[4:29:06] that's a annual fee. Uh it'll be What is

[4:29:09] the bond payment? Is it 150 or is it?

[4:29:11] >> Yeah. So, a 20-year bond at at 4% uh $2

[4:29:16] million is roughly 150,000 a year.

[4:29:21] That's that's a you know, ballpark

[4:29:23] number. Um, and I mean, just looking at

[4:29:28] this, if we were to cut 200,000 off

[4:29:31] somewhere, so it was a bond of 1.8

[4:29:33] million, that payment's about 134,000 a

[4:29:37] year. Um, so you're about roughly 16,000

[4:29:41] difference for

[4:29:42] >> But if you look at it how it would

[4:29:44] impact an average household. So if you

[4:29:47] go to $150,000

[4:29:50] and then you divide that by what we have

[4:29:52] 2,600 homes or is it close or is it

[4:29:56] >> 27? Probably

[4:29:57] >> 2,700.

[4:30:00] » Oh, they don't pay maybe.

[4:30:02] >> But they don't all pay the same amount.

[4:30:04] >> No, but it's a it's relative.

[4:30:05] >> I know.

[4:30:07] >> Uh, okay. Okay, I'm doing it by 2,700

[4:30:09] homes. Sorry. So, the numbers are going

[4:30:10] to be a little bit off. So, that's $55 a

[4:30:14] year per household or if you divide it

[4:30:16] by 12

[4:30:17] >> on average,

[4:30:18] >> that would be $463

[4:30:20] per month per household.

[4:30:24] >> And what you I mean, again, I'm I'm very

[4:30:26] averse to borrow. I'm very averse to

[4:30:28] borrowing money in my personal life. Um,

[4:30:31] but I have been educated about how

[4:30:34] sometimes it's appropriate to bond in

[4:30:36] government funding because it spreads

[4:30:37] the cost out to future res residents and

[4:30:39] not just the cost of the to the current

[4:30:41] res.

[4:30:42] >> Well, and you're only paying for it when

[4:30:43] you're using it, right? When you live in

[4:30:45] the city, if you leave, then you're not

[4:30:47] obligated for those bond payments.

[4:30:50] >> My concern is if we're bonding for this,

[4:30:52] are we potentially also bonding for a

[4:30:54] well and some of our water as well?

[4:30:58] >> Yeah. And so on that, I mean, if we bond

[4:31:02] for water projects, they're looking at

[4:31:04] our water funds. They're looking at our

[4:31:07] water rates and what we bring in and our

[4:31:09] water impact fees. And unless we do

[4:31:12] something totally different than we have

[4:31:13] done in the past for those type

[4:31:15] utilities, it really wouldn't. This is

[4:31:17] proposed as a sales tax bond. So, it'd

[4:31:20] be different different pots of money.

[4:31:22] >> Oh, okay.

[4:31:24] >> Yeah. Um just to I've talked to many

[4:31:27] people about water and they really uh as

[4:31:31] a policy we need to self-fund our own

[4:31:33] because it's an enterprise fund so it's

[4:31:35] business. So if we can't pay for our own

[4:31:37] business costs we're undercharging our

[4:31:39] users so it's completely separate. All

[4:31:42] the money is completely separate from

[4:31:44] this fire station. And so he did point

[4:31:47] out um Shane pointed out that would be a

[4:31:49] $150,000

[4:31:52] um line item in our budget because we

[4:31:54] don't have a sales tax bond, right? It

[4:31:56] would and it would be in the general

[4:31:57] fund. Is that what you were talking

[4:31:59] about?

[4:31:59] >> Y.

[4:32:00] >> So currently to pay for this fire

[4:32:02] station, we've had a $1 million line

[4:32:04] item for a couple of years. So, it's

[4:32:07] actually we'll we'll if we bond, we'll

[4:32:10] have like effectively at least $800,000

[4:32:14] to do something else with than the fire

[4:32:16] station.

[4:32:18] Or another option, Shane, you didn't

[4:32:20] bring it up, was we do have a fund

[4:32:22] balance. And so, um I think I've talked

[4:32:25] to you guys about this. If I haven't, I

[4:32:27] apologize, but we've been looking at

[4:32:29] what is an appropriate fund balance and

[4:32:31] how to measure it and how to what are

[4:32:33] benchmarks for it. And um by all

[4:32:36] measures we have a very very high fund

[4:32:39] balance which could be utilized for the

[4:32:41] entire delta here that we're talking

[4:32:44] about and we don't have to bond more

[4:32:46] than 2 million.

[4:32:47] >> Yeah.

[4:32:49] >> So those are like different like if we the plan was 2 million it's

[4:32:53] 150,000 ongoing and then we use fund

[4:32:55] balance to cover anything that is beyond

[4:32:59] that. So it's not I don't think there's

[4:33:01] like it's a straightforward we have to

[4:33:04] do one thing and that would all be

[4:33:05] decisions like that we'd have to get to

[4:33:07] make at the time.

[4:33:09] >> How much out of the current budget or

[4:33:11] through the bundance balance or bond

[4:33:13] >> or the bonding y

[4:33:15] >> and how do we balance that? I think we

[4:33:17] could probably do some of each.

[4:33:18] >> Yeah. Right.

[4:33:19] >> And then there's a few other little

[4:33:20] factors that we really haven't gotten

[4:33:21] into. There's a design contingency

[4:33:24] that's built in and

[4:33:26] >> we'll let you worry about that later. I

[4:33:27] mean, there's

[4:33:28] >> that's why it's there, right?

[4:33:29] >> Buffers in different places. So,

[4:33:31] >> there's different pots.

[4:33:32] >> Yeah.

[4:33:34] >> To me, um the the cost when when I sat

[4:33:37] down with Shane, I'm like, "Okay, how

[4:33:38] much is this going to cost to to bond

[4:33:40] and how much is that per resident?" kind

[4:33:42] of what Carla's calculation was like to Shane's point, I feel like the last

[4:33:47] time they built this fire station,

[4:33:49] Chief, is it 90s in the '9s?

[4:33:51] >> 96.

[4:33:52] So it's

[4:33:55] help help me with 30 years old and so

[4:33:58] every 30 to 40 years we might redo it.

[4:34:02] So we might as well enjoy like not enjoy

[4:34:04] but we might as well make it what we

[4:34:05] want because you know what I'm saying?

[4:34:08] It's going to last. Maybe not the

[4:34:10] hundredyear mark that that Andrew likes

[4:34:12] to use, but it's going to last. And so I

[4:34:15] feel like um it we we want we have we

[4:34:18] don't have any community center right

[4:34:20] now. we have some donations to make it. So, I do feel like there's

[4:34:25] resources available. Um, and I'm in

[4:34:28] favor of all the of keeping things

[4:34:30] rather than everything you you you

[4:34:33] listed. I think my math is coming out at

[4:34:35] 76,000 for these little things. I

[4:34:37] personally would like to revisit about

[4:34:39] the um the roof, but we're going in

[4:34:42] order, so I'll save that discussion.

[4:34:44] >> Okay. So, you were you stepped out, so

[4:34:46] we had to skip over you. Did you have

[4:34:48] any questions?

[4:34:49] >> Yeah. Well, no, we already went and so

[4:34:51] if you have any questions.

[4:34:52] >> Thank you. I'm sorry I missed parts. Um,

[4:34:56] I don't know if you guys want to close

[4:34:57] your ears for a little bit.

[4:35:00] >> Oh. Oh, man.

[4:35:02] >> Just let's be succinct.

[4:35:03] >> I am. I'm trying to be succinct.

[4:35:06] >> 10:35.

[4:35:06] >> Um,

[4:35:09] what's the square footage of this

[4:35:11] building that you're working on? 11,000

[4:35:13] or 7,000? I know it's hard.

[4:35:16] >> The addition or the new construction?

[4:35:17] >> The addition. I've got I'm amazed what

[4:35:19] AI knows. It knows who you are. It knows

[4:35:21] your business. It knows how much. It

[4:35:23] knows all the plans. It knows everything

[4:35:24] we're talking about right now.

[4:35:28] >> The addition is 5,400 ft. Yeah.

[4:35:30] >> 5,400 square feet. Well, I got that

[4:35:31] wrong. So, do you know what the price

[4:35:34] per square foot is right now that we're

[4:35:36] budgeting? Like,

[4:35:37] >> it's on one of the spreadsheets. So if

[4:35:39] it's regardless of what it is, I do want

[4:35:41] to clarify though because typically a

[4:35:44] price per square foot is a blended rate

[4:35:46] over the entire square footage of a

[4:35:47] building,

[4:35:48] >> right? I'm just trying to get ballparks,

[4:35:51] >> but it's it's necessary to understand

[4:35:52] with this type of building, we're not

[4:35:54] doing anything to the apparatus bay,

[4:35:55] which constitutes a huge percentage of

[4:35:57] the square footage of the building. The

[4:35:58] only we're doing to that is reskinning

[4:36:00] the exterior.

[4:36:01] >> Okay? So excuse you're counting the

[4:36:04] square foot of just the parts that

[4:36:05] you're actually building up, but not

[4:36:07] >> we have it broken down. So go ahead. Go

[4:36:09] ahead. But it's just important to

[4:36:10] recognize that the pardon

[4:36:11] >> if I missed it. Did everyone already see

[4:36:12] this? If you did, I can look it up.

[4:36:14] >> Yeah. So

[4:36:14] >> I have had it up there earlier.

[4:36:16] >> Okay. The remodel of the community

[4:36:18] center is worth $519 a square foot.

[4:36:23] >> Okay.

[4:36:24] >> The addition of the fire station is

[4:36:27] worth $643 a square foot.

[4:36:31] and the vestibule is worth $294 a square

[4:36:34] foot.

[4:36:36] >> Okay,

[4:36:39] » those numbers

[4:36:41] >> include

[4:36:43] everything that we've talked

[4:36:45] >> that's including the budget of this

[4:36:47] 5.9ish even with

[4:36:49] >> 5.2.

[4:36:50] >> Oh, that's the 5.2, not with the extra

[4:36:52] 800. So, it would push

[4:36:54] >> that doesn't include the soft costs.

[4:36:55] That's construction costs only.

[4:36:57] >> Oh, okay. Good clarification. Okay. So,

[4:36:59] those were some of the questions. Then

[4:37:01] some of the uh bigger things. I'm coming at this

[4:37:07] late. Okay. So, I don't know what's been

[4:37:08] approved and what is like nonchangeable.

[4:37:12] Um

[4:37:13] but uh

[4:37:16] I don't know why we're doing this. I

[4:37:17] guess I I just I don't know why we're um

[4:37:22] doing this when there are other things

[4:37:24] um that are so much more pressing. But I

[4:37:28] don't know if there's even anything to

[4:37:29] do about that. This has been decided

[4:37:31] long ago, I guess. Um,

[4:37:34] >> so right now, do you have specific

[4:37:36] questions? And then meanwhile, if you

[4:37:38] don't, if you want to start think about

[4:37:40] >> three questions about the undecided

[4:37:42] items.

[4:37:42] >> Yeah. Three questions. what we're going

[4:37:44] to be going over. Three questions would

[4:37:45] just be are we bringing this up because

[4:37:48] we have to decide whether to approve the

[4:37:51] larger budget because under my

[4:37:52] understanding this has already been

[4:37:53] approved right at 5 million

[4:37:56] >> or what I don't understand what has been

[4:37:58] approved

[4:37:59] >> the project has been approved and then

[4:38:02] rough numbers knowing that it was very

[4:38:05] early on in the stage rough numbers so

[4:38:08] we're saying hey this is how far along

[4:38:10] we are

[4:38:11] >> this is what the numbers are looking

[4:38:13] like

[4:38:13] >> is materializing And then, you know,

[4:38:15] we're hearing now that once they get the

[4:38:17] fully finalized plans, then they'll go

[4:38:20] through an actual round of bids. All

[4:38:23] they did here is to get preliminary

[4:38:25] numbers,

[4:38:25] >> right? No, I understand that. So, my

[4:38:27] question is, are we setting this up to

[4:38:29] approve this new number or just the next

[4:38:31] step? And then ultimately there'll be

[4:38:32] approval on the final bids, what you're

[4:38:34] saying. That's where we'll actually see

[4:38:36] >> for the final cost.

[4:38:37] >> That's where the development

[4:38:38] >> really. Yes. Yeah. Approve this. We can

[4:38:40] move forward with construction drawings.

[4:38:42] Okay.

[4:38:42] >> And then when the bids come in, then

[4:38:45] you'll approve

[4:38:45] >> almost every issue like so the the last

[4:38:47] comment is just like we love firemen, we

[4:38:49] love fire departments, we love

[4:38:50] libraries, we love everything. But

[4:38:52] there's like the swath of 65 year olds

[4:38:55] that some of them came to. They're just

[4:38:57] getting crushed. I know it's $50 or

[4:39:00] whatever 150 grand a year. That includes

[4:39:02] the um

[4:39:07] the interest as well, right? So, like I

[4:39:10] said, it's a rough

[4:39:11] >> I know that sounds small though, but

[4:39:12] it's not materializing small for

[4:39:14] everyone. They're getting choked out of

[4:39:16] their houses.

[4:39:17] >> Um

[4:39:18] >> I just want you to understand that like

[4:39:20] this is already in our budget because

[4:39:22] we've already been budgeting a million.

[4:39:24] So, this has no impact on our taxpayers

[4:39:26] like increase per se because we haven't

[4:39:28] voted to increase taxes,

[4:39:30] >> right?

[4:39:31] >> So, we're not we're using sales tax for

[4:39:33] this.

[4:39:33] >> And at the end of the day, it takes my

[4:39:35] raccoon traps and it destroys them. Next

[4:39:37] year's raccoon budget is I'm just saying

[4:39:39] like that's not that's not what we're

[4:39:41] talking about is like

[4:39:42] >> and honestly end of the day safety is

[4:39:45] very important to our

[4:39:46] >> res I know it's important.

[4:39:48] >> So yes and I've told you this before

[4:39:51] that originally we went into it thinking

[4:39:53] that we would do a remodel but we

[4:39:55] realized that we're out of compliance

[4:39:57] for a fire station that has full-time

[4:40:00] firefighters. Okay. And in order to be

[4:40:02] compliant

[4:40:03] and because we had the room, it was

[4:40:05] better to just do an addition and make a

[4:40:08] purpose-built fire

[4:40:10] uh firehouse living quarters

[4:40:13] >> as opposed to trying to retrofit and try

[4:40:15] to do everything because if you look at

[4:40:16] the costs, you know, we think we're

[4:40:19] saving money on remodeling, which we are

[4:40:21] for that community center,

[4:40:23] >> but it's not that much more to build

[4:40:26] something that is up to code, that is up

[4:40:29] to OSHA standards,

[4:40:30] >> that background for the fire people who

[4:40:32] most of their calls are for ambulatory

[4:40:34] calls for people that are 65 and older.

[4:40:37] That's most of their calls.

[4:40:39] >> And so that's the way I look at it is

[4:40:40] that's the number one priority in the

[4:40:43] city is the safety for our residents.

[4:40:45] This is helping facilitate it.

[4:40:47] >> Thank you for that background. It's

[4:40:48] really helpful and I appreciate all the

[4:40:50] work you did to make that happen. Last

[4:40:51] thing is uh I personally given and and

[4:40:54] the residents are now giving feedback.

[4:40:57] Uh they are not asking for this. They're

[4:40:59] not for this, but I see the background.

[4:41:01] Um, I personally would take the funds

[4:41:03] and just do fire mitigation.

[4:41:06] I don't I don't but but this has been

[4:41:08] decided before me. So, I'll just try to

[4:41:10] be as helpful as I can to keep the costs

[4:41:12] low. So, yeah, that's all. Thank you.

[4:41:14] >> Great. Okay. So, um did you have

[4:41:16] anything else? No, Brent didn't said he

[4:41:18] didn't have

[4:41:18] >> Oh, sorry. Last thing. I apologize. I

[4:41:21] apologize, mayor. The the um the going

[4:41:25] into extra year budgets. This was

[4:41:28] something I'm sorry that was brought up.

[4:41:31] >> How what what how do we go and this

[4:41:33] might be a legal question. How do we go

[4:41:34] about that? For example, I'll be on the

[4:41:36] city council for this term.

[4:41:38] >> Um and hopefully forever if if I do a

[4:41:41] good job, but um that's a joke. But uh

[4:41:44] can I make decisions that lock in budget

[4:41:47] years for future city councils for like

[4:41:49] years and years and years and years?

[4:41:51] >> Not for years and years and years, but

[4:41:53] bonding is Yeah. Once you lock into a

[4:41:55] bond, you're into it for 20 years for 20

[4:41:58] years.

[4:41:59] >> But as far as

[4:42:00] >> I'm talking about the two million

[4:42:04] years is to break it up so that there it

[4:42:06] could potentially free up money for

[4:42:09] other projects because this project is

[4:42:11] going is spanning over several

[4:42:14] >> years

[4:42:14] >> fiscal years. Right. Right.

[4:42:15] >> That we have the option to do that. We

[4:42:17] can't do it if if this project happened

[4:42:20] within one fiscal year. I don't see how

[4:42:22] we could justify spreading it out to two

[4:42:25] or three fiscal years, but because this

[4:42:28] project the way it started with the

[4:42:30] design phase, that's one part and then

[4:42:32] >> but yes, you can do that and that's not

[4:42:35] >> all right. The background's helpful.

[4:42:36] Thank you all.

[4:42:37] >> Okay, but Andrew, when we like decide to

[4:42:39] put in a park, we're forever paying for

[4:42:41] the water or maintenance of it. So, we

[4:42:43] make lots of decisions that will go on

[4:42:46] forever like we've talked about. So,

[4:42:48] yes, we encumber the future. I know the

[4:42:52] only reason I bring it up is because we

[4:42:54] create this budget and we'll do it every

[4:42:57] year, but we should go into it eyes wide

[4:43:00] open knowing that most of it's already

[4:43:02] gotten chunked out from last year's

[4:43:03] thing,

[4:43:04] >> right? And most of it is just for basics

[4:43:06] like

[4:43:08] >> public safety.

[4:43:10] >> Okay, let's move on. Just quickly, I

[4:43:12] would like to spread it out and then use

[4:43:14] some of our um emergency fund to to bond

[4:43:19] less go that model.

[4:43:22] >> The contingency fund, the fund balance.

[4:43:24] >> Yeah, the fund balance.

[4:43:25] >> Yeah.

[4:43:25] >> So, do we have less of a bond you're

[4:43:27] saying?

[4:43:28] >> Right. Right. I'd rather I mean and and

[4:43:30] I I didn't realize that this would be an

[4:43:32] impact on the taxpayers because if it's

[4:43:34] on our sales tax, is it our sales tax

[4:43:36] coming in? So why are they paying more

[4:43:40] taxes?

[4:43:42] >> Well, no, it all comes from the same

[4:43:45] person. Like at the end of the day, it

[4:43:47] all comes from Go ahead.

[4:43:48] >> I think the mayor was just trying to

[4:43:50] illustrate the impact, which is

[4:43:52] basically a 44 oz swig drink per month.

[4:43:56] >> Fair. Fair.

[4:43:58] >> You loved that joke. Too much. Too much.

[4:44:01] >> I think that's what she's trying to

[4:44:02] illustrate. Not that it was going to be

[4:44:04] that kind of a tax increase to them

[4:44:06] >> because I've been saying this isn't

[4:44:08] increasing your taxes.

[4:44:09] >> Right.

[4:44:10] Okay. I just want to make sure

[4:44:11] that when I'm firmly telling people that

[4:44:14] Yeah.

[4:44:14] >> that it is not increasing their taxes.

[4:44:17] >> Yeah. It was just a way to look at

[4:44:19] >> but it's not allowing them to ever go

[4:44:21] lower because we're locking in, we're

[4:44:23] bonding, we're going to need other

[4:44:24] stuff. Say there's an emergency.

[4:44:26] >> What you're doing is the sales tax it

[4:44:29] will be taking away $150,000. So right

[4:44:31] now, let's say we get a million dollars

[4:44:32] in sales tax revenue.

[4:44:34] >> In the future, we will only have

[4:44:36] $850,000.

[4:44:37] >> I'm really confident in prioritizing

[4:44:40] public safety. Like

[4:44:42] >> and sales tax revenue has been going up

[4:44:44] 8% every year.

[4:44:45] >> Exactly. As Mayor Frost told us, all

[4:44:48] this inhome ordering is going to save us

[4:44:50] all.

[4:44:51] >> You're right. I I'm on the board with

[4:44:52] the safety as well. Can I tell you one

[4:44:55] metaphor that I have to live with? In

[4:44:56] fact, I fly to DC to do it tomorrow.

[4:44:58] It's quick and it's important

[4:45:00] >> because we try to keep women safe and

[4:45:02] children every day. That's where I'm

[4:45:03] going to fight Amazon tomorrow, okay,

[4:45:06] for for the dirty dolls that they sell.

[4:45:08] So, we try to help people post problems,

[4:45:13] okay? And we find it is a hundred 50 to

[4:45:16] 100 times more expensive, more tedious,

[4:45:18] more hard than just doing prevention.

[4:45:20] Okay? That's the same with fires and

[4:45:22] safeties. And it's way less expensive.

[4:45:25] It's way better to do. And

[4:45:27] >> when you're talking about fire

[4:45:28] prevention, but most of their calls, 95

[4:45:31] I would say 90 to 95% of their calls are

[4:45:33] ambulatory,

[4:45:34] >> right? So

[4:45:35] >> how are you going to spend money to

[4:45:36] prevent ambulatory calls?

[4:45:38] >> Well, I gave you my whole presentation,

[4:45:40] but I got

[4:45:40] >> Andrew, let me fill in one little gap.

[4:45:43] >> Yes. Thank you.

[4:45:44] >> This is for retention and retaining the

[4:45:46] best staff that we can like

[4:45:49] >> to protect. Yes. To protect our

[4:45:51] residents. And so it's not about we need

[4:45:53] to do fire pretent prevention. That's

[4:45:56] like in a completely separate

[4:45:58] conversation. This has nothing to do or

[4:46:00] is not related to keeping our

[4:46:04] firefighters in a Did you say it's not

[4:46:07] compliant living condition?

[4:46:09] >> Right. The only reason it's related is

[4:46:11] because um at the end of the day, we

[4:46:12] want to help them. We want to make them

[4:46:14] safe and there's multiple ways to do it.

[4:46:17] So like I get we want to do the crisis.

[4:46:19] This is crisis control. We're paying for

[4:46:21] crisis control right now. a building

[4:46:23] that has a lot of very great experts to

[4:46:25] deal with crisis control. We need a

[4:46:28] little bit of funding and focus on the

[4:46:30] prevention side as well. And

[4:46:32] >> okay, but we're not having that in the

[4:46:33] budget discussion instead of a fire

[4:46:35] station discussion.

[4:46:36] >> I know, but the reason it's related

[4:46:37] because this money takes away from ever

[4:46:39] being able to do that type of thing.

[4:46:40] That's the only reason why it's related.

[4:46:41] >> Okay. So, let's Okay, you're done. Yep.

[4:46:44] >> Sarah, I think you're the only one that

[4:46:46] hasn't commented. just a comment like

[4:46:48] I'm just function over fashion and

[4:46:51] whatever is going to be longest lasting

[4:46:53] so I don't have to replace it is kind of

[4:46:55] where I stand and oh just one question

[4:46:58] on the floor you said the cement

[4:46:59] flooring you can just grind that down

[4:47:01] and then fill in the cracks and then it

[4:47:04] lasts longer than epoxy

[4:47:06] >> epoxy is just an over coating that goes

[4:47:08] over

[4:47:08] >> the over coat okay

[4:47:10] >> so the fixes we're doing would address

[4:47:12] immediately without putting in an

[4:47:13] overall encompassing new coat of epoxy

[4:47:16] over the for

[4:47:18] >> and epoxy is great. Don't get me wrong.

[4:47:20] It It's beautiful. I'd love to do it in

[4:47:22] my garage, too. But it becomes a

[4:47:24] maintenance issue. It

[4:47:26] >> And it's expensive. And it's expens.

[4:47:29] >> Okay. Chief, did you have a comment?

[4:47:37] » You're not It's not as slick.

[4:47:39] >> Yeah.

[4:47:40] >> Right. Because they throw down the

[4:47:42] whatever

[4:47:43] >> chips or whatever.

[4:47:45] Um, that's the advantage of epoxy, but

[4:47:48] the epoxy starts to come up, especially

[4:47:50] running these trucks over it. So, I

[4:47:52] mean, the the floor is 18 years old in

[4:47:55] Highland, and it looks about the same as

[4:47:57] it did five years into that station's

[4:48:00] life, and it it just starts to chip. It

[4:48:02] start it gets anything underneath it,

[4:48:03] and it starts it looks pretty rough.

[4:48:06] >> Thank you for that information. Um, are

[4:48:09] we going to go through each of these?

[4:48:10] >> Let's go through these items. Can we go

[4:48:13] back to the spreadsheet with Okay. As

[4:48:16] far as the roof systems,

[4:48:19] um, can you go do you have drawings of

[4:48:21] what those three would look like? I

[4:48:23] believe that

[4:48:24] >> all three.

[4:48:25] >> Um, and then I think let's get direction

[4:48:27] from council what you guys are. So, this

[4:48:30] is um I think this is the one that they

[4:48:32] were suggesting, right? That would saves

[4:48:34] the $168,000.

[4:48:36] Is that correct? So this is a new roof, over the entire station, but

[4:48:41] primarily asphalt with the blue areas

[4:48:43] being just standing seam, the elevated

[4:48:45] metal

[4:48:46] >> previously, which is contained in the

[4:48:48] 5.2 was it's all standing seam, all

[4:48:52] metal, which is a higher resiliency

[4:48:54] roof. There's more noise and stuff to it

[4:48:56] like that, but it's longer lasting,

[4:48:59] higher quality.

[4:49:00] >> Not quite all of it. If you look at the

[4:49:02] image to the left, there's a lighter

[4:49:05] yellow. That's a flat roof area that

[4:49:07] actually has a single ply roof. That's

[4:49:09] the w mechanical well where the rooftop

[4:49:12] units are.

[4:49:13] >> What's the life of a asphalt roof versus

[4:49:16] a standing seam?

[4:49:17] >> In Utah alpine, you're probably anywhere

[4:49:19] from 30 to 50 years

[4:49:21] >> or standing seam.

[4:49:24] >> And then asphalt, sorry,

[4:49:25] >> you can buy asphalt with warranties from

[4:49:28] 20 to 40 years.

[4:49:32] There's more wear and tear with the

[4:49:34] asphalt roof.

[4:49:34] >> Other than the lifespan, is there any

[4:49:37] advantage or disadvantage to the metal

[4:49:38] roof?

[4:49:40] >> I like aesthetics. So, I just was had my

[4:49:42] heart set on that metal roof.

[4:49:44] >> No, I thought the metal roof looked

[4:49:46] better, but I the one thing that I did

[4:49:48] consider is the noise also of a metal

[4:49:50] roof as opposed to an asphalt roof. A

[4:49:52] metal roof can be really loud in a

[4:49:54] rainstorm and especially hail more. You

[4:49:56] know, think about it if when you have

[4:49:58] hail hitting your

[4:49:59] >> I wish that was a problem. Yeah,

[4:50:02] >> it's not. Now,

[4:50:05] >> the only other u drawback with metal

[4:50:08] roof is snow retainage. Uh we'll put

[4:50:13] snow fences and snow cleat on the roof

[4:50:15] that will keep the snow on the roof

[4:50:17] rather than because it warms and then it

[4:50:20] slides off in an avalanche fashion.

[4:50:22] >> So, that's a disadvantage. a little bit

[4:50:24] of safety issue, but there's ways to to

[4:50:28] combat it with snow fences and and

[4:50:31] cleat.

[4:50:32] >> Mayor, are you looking for on that list

[4:50:33] which ones we want to remove?

[4:50:35] >> Yes. So, the very first one is the type

[4:50:37] of roof. This is option one. No, that is

[4:50:40] the hybrid, right? It's 1B that we just

[4:50:43] saw.

[4:50:43] >> What what's been documented is one

[4:50:45] what's been illustrated is 1B. What's

[4:50:47] captured in the cost is not here. It's

[4:50:49] all standing seam,

[4:50:50] >> right? Yeah. So, I was looking at the

[4:50:53] difference between the 165 and the 198

[4:50:55] and thinking it's only 3 uh $4,000 more

[4:50:58] for for a standing seam, but you don't

[4:51:00] even have standing seam as an option.

[4:51:03] >> No, a standing seam. No savings at all

[4:51:05] if you take those numbers out. It's just

[4:51:07] >> the 5.2.

[4:51:08] >> It's it's already built in the cost.

[4:51:11] >> The basis of the original cost.

[4:51:13] >> So, the numbers that you're seeing now

[4:51:14] are taking away from the 5.2.

[4:51:16] >> So, okay. Whatever the standing seam

[4:51:18] was, this is this much less.

[4:51:19] >> Yes. So the three other options

[4:51:22] >> are a deduct of somewhere between

[4:51:25] 166,000 and 198,000.

[4:51:28] >> Right. Right.

[4:51:29] >> Over having fullon standing seam.

[4:51:32] >> None of

[4:51:33] >> Yeah. For aesthetics that does seem very

[4:51:35] pricey. I agree. But

[4:51:37] >> it was going to look really nice.

[4:51:39] >> So all of these things can be removed

[4:51:41] and it still functions properly.

[4:51:44] >> Well, I'm on for just removing them. And

[4:51:47] if you ever want to get them later, you

[4:51:48] can get them later. and update stuff if

[4:51:51] you've got the money.

[4:51:53] >> One by one.

[4:51:53] >> Oh, sorry. Go.

[4:51:55] >> Okay. So, um, do you have the drawings

[4:51:57] for the other 1A and 1 C?

[4:52:02] >> I

[4:52:03] >> Well, I guess asphalt shingle that's all

[4:52:05] asphalt and no standing seam, but we

[4:52:07] thought it needed the element.

[4:52:10] >> Is the amount of st standing. So, um I

[4:52:14] think we, you know, the committee had

[4:52:16] agreed on the 165, but I really wanted

[4:52:18] input from council and what was

[4:52:21] important to you, but that is the price

[4:52:23] savings that's outlined. Um are you guys

[4:52:27] okay with the 165? Okay. Now, let's go

[4:52:31] to the only the added um glazing in the

[4:52:35] day room.

[4:52:37] >> Wait, really? Sorry. Really quick, just

[4:52:38] so I understand that, mayor. Um, you're

[4:52:40] saying the 165 that is our savings?

[4:52:43] >> Yes.

[4:52:44] >> Okay. Versus doing option 1 A which we

[4:52:47] would save more

[4:52:48] >> 198.

[4:52:49] >> So option A I'll just tell you. So

[4:52:51] that's leaving the existing

[4:52:54] A.

[4:52:54] >> We don't want to do it because they

[4:52:56] basically reached their life, right,

[4:52:57] Rich? Is that Am I right on that?

[4:52:59] >> No, no, it's opposite.

[4:53:01] >> The biggest savings puts asphalt on

[4:53:04] everything. No standing seam at all. The

[4:53:07] one that we picked puts it at the day

[4:53:09] room and at the entry and the

[4:53:14] >> the other one leaves standing seam on

[4:53:17] the apparatus bay.

[4:53:19] >> Okay. Yeah.

[4:53:21] >> Would it be helpful if we had Blake

[4:53:22] bring up kind of the the document where

[4:53:24] we can actually change the numbers so

[4:53:26] you can see the 5.2 And as we accept

[4:53:28] those items, you can see go down

[4:53:31] >> because this this is a little more

[4:53:33] confusing where we've already kind of

[4:53:34] accepted some of the items and some are

[4:53:35] undecided and some are rejected.

[4:53:37] >> And and Carla, when something is

[4:53:39] decided, yeah, or no, actually say the

[4:53:41] yes or no so Deian can put it on.

[4:53:43] >> Okay. So, we'll go through each item.

[4:53:44] Okay.

[4:53:45] >> You don't have to vote on it, but if you

[4:53:46] say Yep. That's a yes.

[4:53:47] >> Okay. So um we will we are um quick

[4:53:52] correct me if I'm wrong but we are

[4:53:54] accepting option 1B for savings of about

[4:53:57] what 16

[4:53:59] >> 165 on the um roof options

[4:54:10] » and any of these you could add them

[4:54:11] later if you wanted to if like you're

[4:54:13] like we want to do it and we got a bunch

[4:54:15] of cash sitting around you could always

[4:54:16] add them. I don't

[4:54:18] >> I don't know. Right now, we're saying

[4:54:20] no.

[4:54:20] >> No, I know. I'm I'm saying you can

[4:54:22] always do it later. You can say no to

[4:54:24] all of it and just

[4:54:25] >> We could do it in 40 years.

[4:54:27] >> Well, you can always epoxy the floor

[4:54:30] later. You don't have to do it all now.

[4:54:32] >> It's not all that simple. There are some

[4:54:34] that would there would be a tremendous

[4:54:36] amount of effort to take back so you

[4:54:37] could put the appropriate materials and

[4:54:39] steps into to get

[4:54:41] >> to your point. if they want there are

[4:54:42] some things they could some

[4:54:45] >> but as far as like glazing things like

[4:54:47] that roofing is not that means you're

[4:54:50] losing the roofing that you had you're

[4:54:51] going to spend money

[4:54:53] >> okay perfect let's go back up

[4:54:56] >> let's go up so we're accepting the 16594

[4:55:00] >> so you can see down below just keep your

[4:55:03] eyes on the these lower two numbers so

[4:55:05] we've accepted 1B

[4:55:09] >> and then we'll reject these two

[4:55:12] Good.

[4:55:13] >> Now you can see that we're moving in the

[4:55:14] right direction there.

[4:55:16] >> Okay.

[4:55:17] >> So you can

[4:55:17] >> Okay.

[4:55:18] >> No, keep going. You can drive.

[4:55:19] >> Okay.

[4:55:20] >> We'll let you drive. I'm not going to

[4:55:21] drive your computer.

[4:55:24] >> All right. So the next one is um the

[4:55:29] Let me see. Added glazing on the

[4:55:31] community center, not a VE. We've added

[4:55:34] that. Uh do we want to add that? And

[4:55:36] that's the additional glazing on the end

[4:55:39] of the existing building.

[4:55:42] >> Bigger windows.

[4:55:44] >> Yes, it's a bank of windows.

[4:55:46] >> You looked at me

[4:55:48] glazing.

[4:55:49] >> You know, I love big windows. Don't

[4:55:50] tempt me.

[4:55:51] >> I didn't know what glazing was. So the Y on this is it's the south facing

[4:55:56] side of the building and it will

[4:55:58] overlook the brand new sculpture park

[4:56:01] that's been you know built for us with

[4:56:04] all the landscaping. So it kind of feels

[4:56:07] like if we don't have windows that we

[4:56:10] can see it. There's two there's the

[4:56:12] existing windows that's a missed you

[4:56:15] know opportunity. I just feel like it's

[4:56:17] such a big area that the added windows

[4:56:19] and the natural daylight that just, you

[4:56:22] know, I don't want to be in a dark room.

[4:56:24] Um, to me it just kind of adds that

[4:56:27] value and yeah, it brings warmth to the

[4:56:30] room. What's the current size of those

[4:56:33] windows? Do you know approximately?

[4:56:35] >> I have to measure them as I think they

[4:56:36] were uh 30 in by 5t tall.

[4:56:40] >> Yeah. And these become

[4:56:43] they twice that size twice.

[4:56:46] >> It's basically that whole

[4:56:48] >> it's the $50,000 isn't the cost for the

[4:56:50] glazing. It's the cost of the structural

[4:56:52] upgrades because we're taking so much

[4:56:54] structural integrity out of that

[4:56:55] existing wall

[4:56:56] >> to allow for the opening.

[4:56:58] >> Yeah.

[4:56:58] We have to retrofit structural

[4:57:00] systems to allow those openings to be

[4:57:02] that big.

[4:57:03] >> You couldn't just add more windows next

[4:57:06] to it. I said that's what I said. just

[4:57:09] use on paper.

[4:57:11] There's a lot of stuff on the inside.

[4:57:14] >> Yeah,

[4:57:16] I think you can do that.

[4:57:17] >> This was explained to Councilwoman

[4:57:18] Shman, but in a as a as a very

[4:57:20] rudimentary approach, uh you can take

[4:57:23] 10% of existing square footage of an

[4:57:25] elevation to modify it without

[4:57:27] implementing the structural uh concerns.

[4:57:29] So, if you have a 100 foot wall and you

[4:57:31] change more than 10 square feet, you're

[4:57:33] into a structural change.

[4:57:35] >> Makes sense.

[4:57:37] >> Okay. So, um,

[4:57:40] >> so I'm all for the all the glazing just

[4:57:42] put over to, um,

[4:57:45] what does that mean? Rejected. We're

[4:57:47] keeping

[4:57:47] >> accepted. Yeah. If you're going to if you're in favor of

[4:57:53] >> added glazing,

[4:57:55] then

[4:57:55] >> we talked about it his rooms too on the other side. We just talk about

[4:58:00] windows all in one.

[4:58:01] >> Maybe. Sorry to interrupt, but uh that

[4:58:04] 500 that 50,000 is not included in the

[4:58:07] 5.2. So if you want to add that, it's

[4:58:10] going to be

[4:58:10] >> it's a plus.

[4:58:11] >> You guys do what you need to do with

[4:58:12] your spreadsheet to make sure that we

[4:58:14] get windows.

[4:58:14] >> Well, wait, hold on. That is not my

[4:58:17] view. So that's hers. So that's okay.

[4:58:19] >> And your view is not to anything, right?

[4:58:22] >> Well, no.

[4:58:23] >> It is to do all these savings and then

[4:58:26] as this plays out, if there's more

[4:58:27] money, do these later. Now, I understand

[4:58:29] what it's like to put in a window. It

[4:58:31] can be done. I'm doing it in my house.

[4:58:32] You can do it. So my my view is to So So

[4:58:35] I would say no to this right now just

[4:58:36] because we're already over budget.

[4:58:39] >> You say no. Let's see. Brent, where are

[4:58:41] you at?

[4:58:42] >> Uh we've discussed it before and we

[4:58:44] approved it before. I'm going to stick

[4:58:45] with that.

[4:58:46] >> So again, going back and adding windows

[4:58:49] later is going to cost you triple of

[4:58:53] doing it.

[4:58:53] >> You're right. But we were already over.

[4:58:56] >> Okay, Sarah. Oh my goodness. It's just

[4:58:59] so much money. have to say no. It's

[4:59:01] okay.

[4:59:02] >> Yeah.

[4:59:02] >> Okay.

[4:59:03] >> So, it looks like majority are wanting

[4:59:06] to accept the additional cost of adding

[4:59:10] glazing or windows to the community

[4:59:12] center. Um and then

[4:59:14] >> and the fire station, right?

[4:59:16] >> So, the fire station day, I believe.

[4:59:18] Yeah, I think

[4:59:19] >> that was the reduction, if you'll

[4:59:21] remember, Chad showed it reducing the

[4:59:24] height of those. That's only you guys

[4:59:26] remember savings to reduce the height of

[4:59:29] those windows.

[4:59:30] >> I don't think it'll look proportionate

[4:59:32] anymore. It was designed that way for a

[4:59:33] reason.

[4:59:35] >> I'm aesthetically I am I do care about

[4:59:37] aesthetics.

[4:59:38] >> If you're asking for my vote, I don't

[4:59:40] think that's worth the $700 savings.

[4:59:43] It's a

[4:59:43] >> $7,500 is fine.

[4:59:45] >> I say this in a lot of our meetings. You

[4:59:47] have to have a perception of

[4:59:49] >> some of these smaller items that we're de debating back and forth on. The

[4:59:54] dollar amounts are small, but the visual

[4:59:56] impact and the experience and the field

[4:59:59] of space is much bigger.

[5:00:00] >> So you say,

[5:00:01] >> you know what? Let's let's expedite

[5:00:03] this.

[5:00:03] >> We just do the the things Shane listed

[5:00:05] and then miscellaneous a bunch.

[5:00:08] >> I'm just So do we not want to go down

[5:00:11] this list that they have?

[5:00:12] >> No. Okay.

[5:00:13] >> I want to just get rid of all.

[5:00:15] >> Let's just say keep yes, no, yes, no. So

[5:00:17] keep

[5:00:19] >> keep the 7.

[5:00:20] >> And mine's easy. I'm just I know on all

[5:00:22] of it, but so you can go with the other

[5:00:23] ones.

[5:00:24] >> Wait, they rejected the 7500.

[5:00:26] >> That means we're keeping it.

[5:00:27] >> Yeah, that was

[5:00:29] kind of these are rejecting.

[5:00:33] >> Okay. Okay. Okay.

[5:00:35] >> The epoxy we're recepting

[5:00:39] the deduction.

[5:00:40] >> Yeah.

[5:00:41] >> Okay. And then city purchases the

[5:00:44] generator.

[5:00:45] >> Yes, we're accepting that. And then the

[5:00:48] drywall. Yes. The furring. Yes, we're

[5:00:50] accepting that.

[5:00:51] >> No furring

[5:00:52] >> wood wall panel gable ends only. Keep

[5:00:55] street facing.

[5:00:56] >> That's the south end.

[5:00:57] >> Mhm.

[5:00:59] >> I think I think anything that's the

[5:01:03] exterior of the building, we want it to

[5:01:05] look right,

[5:01:06] >> right? But I think we're thinking that

[5:01:08] people aren't really going to see it.

[5:01:09] It's like not on the street. So, it's

[5:01:11] >> Oh, yeah. All those people going to the

[5:01:13] storage units for their fancy cars are

[5:01:15] going to see that building. And we don't

[5:01:17] want it to look. Don't pretend you want

[5:01:19] >> We don't want it to look.

[5:01:21] >> Don't pretend you want that. It's got to

[5:01:23] like live up to the It has it on that

[5:01:25] side.

[5:01:26] >> It doesn't have it.

[5:01:27] >> Yeah. It's only on the south end.

[5:01:30] >> So on the north facing it's still there.

[5:01:32] >> Still be wooden.

[5:01:33] >> Thank goodness.

[5:01:34] >> Except do we do we not while we're doing

[5:01:36] this want to get any feedback? I mean

[5:01:38] this is their our residents money of

[5:01:40] what they would want and

[5:01:41] >> that's why they elected us Andrew.

[5:01:43] >> But we never tell them

[5:01:45] >> you have their voice and you're Great

[5:01:46] job with it.

[5:01:47] >> I accept.

[5:01:48] >> Okay. What's next? We've got existing

[5:01:52] >> existing Oh, yeah. What? We

[5:01:54] >> We gave up the wood on the inside.

[5:01:56] >> Yep. We did

[5:01:57] >> on the south end. That was accepted.

[5:01:59] >> Okay.

[5:01:59] >> Keep existing entry overhead doors.

[5:02:03] >> I'm I'm really sorry. I heard separate

[5:02:04] things.

[5:02:05] >> What is that?

[5:02:06] >> Oh,

[5:02:07] >> on on the item about the keeping the

[5:02:09] wood on the gabling. I heard that we

[5:02:10] wanted to keep the wood. Oh,

[5:02:12] >> I thought I think we're taking it off

[5:02:15] the south side.

[5:02:16] >> I Yeah, I heard that. Correct.

[5:02:18] >> They're going to get rid of the south

[5:02:19] side, but keep it on the street.

[5:02:22] >> Um, what was the overhead? Is that the

[5:02:24] bay doors at door?

[5:02:25] >> Yeah, keep the existing entry doors.

[5:02:28] >> Entry doors

[5:02:29] >> and we said

[5:02:30] >> and they're old.

[5:02:31] >> That That was a hard one for chief

[5:02:33] because we're remodeling his building

[5:02:36] and leaving 30-y old doors.

[5:02:38] >> So, that was the one that the chief said

[5:02:40] no. Right. Can you paint them?

[5:02:42] >> Do those are they functional or not so

[5:02:45] much?

[5:02:46] >> Those doors are only good for so many

[5:02:47] operations and they're

[5:02:49] >> quite a bit.

[5:02:50] >> It's not worth it. Quite a

[5:02:52] >> bit

[5:02:55] I would rather put 50,000 or 57,000 for

[5:02:59] doors than the windows. That's me

[5:03:01] personally. That seems more of a

[5:03:03] function thing for an emergency service.

[5:03:06] >> But but

[5:03:06] >> it's not functional as far as

[5:03:10] we're putting We're putting those new

[5:03:11] doors in,

[5:03:13] >> right? Okay.

[5:03:25] C can we just talk about the wood

[5:03:26] paneling going back because we talk

[5:03:28] about this part people wanted to save

[5:03:30] all that open space like people who use

[5:03:33] the square are not on the street like

[5:03:36] they come and play play lacrosse there

[5:03:39] or whatever and then we do the pet show

[5:03:40] there all the use of the park is not is

[5:03:43] in the interior. So, I I'm just going to

[5:03:46] request one more time you reconsider the

[5:03:48] wood on the on the south side

[5:03:50] >> here. Let's do a quick yes. No. Do you

[5:03:52] want to keep the wood

[5:03:53] >> because this is all uh functional

[5:03:55] without any of this? I'm just saying no.

[5:03:57] Let's do it later if we need. So, no.

[5:03:58] >> So, you're Yes. No, Brent.

[5:04:01] >> No.

[5:04:03] >> Yes. No.

[5:04:04] >> Okay. So, we're getting rid of the

[5:04:06] southside wood paneling. Sorry. Okay.

[5:04:08] So, we're on to the next. I really am

[5:04:10] hurt when Jessica

[5:04:12] >> doors

[5:04:13] >> again. They're 30 year old doors, 40

[5:04:15] year old doors.

[5:04:16] >> Let's replace them.

[5:04:17] >> Yeah. I mean,

[5:04:19] >> okay. So, that is

[5:04:20] >> We're building a new rejected

[5:04:22] >> eliminating the vestibule.

[5:04:25] >> The vestibule is the outer door frame

[5:04:27] thing, right?

[5:04:28] >> That's the vestibule on the community

[5:04:30] center,

[5:04:30] >> right? The doors.

[5:04:31] >> The addition the doors and the addition

[5:04:33] to me that seems like it has some energy

[5:04:35] saving. I understand,

[5:04:37] >> but I don't know if it's going to save

[5:04:39] $23,000 in energy cost.

[5:04:41] >> But Chad said we want to make the whole

[5:04:43] thing look uniform. Like this is the old

[5:04:44] part is the new. Like it's clearly an

[5:04:46] addition. Like we want to like tie the

[5:04:48] two pieces together.

[5:04:50] >> Clearly an identifier for an entrance as

[5:04:52] well, especially for public.

[5:04:54] >> Yeah, that's true.

[5:04:54] >> That's the entrance.

[5:04:55] >> Chrissy, let her know what you want and

[5:04:56] then I'll go.

[5:04:57] >> Oh, I I I thought that was clear. I I

[5:04:59] would like to keep the vegetable. No.

[5:05:01] >> Okay. Yes. No.

[5:05:02] >> Yes.

[5:05:03] Okay. I'm sorry. Doesn't matter

[5:05:05] what I say. Yeah.

[5:05:06] >> Sorry. Okay. Next.

[5:05:08] >> All right.

[5:05:08] >> Eliminate dorm sinks. Two drawer

[5:05:10] floating cabinet, floating sink,

[5:05:12] cabinet, quartz, counter.

[5:05:14] >> Whatever the chief wants, we do.

[5:05:15] >> Yeah.

[5:05:16] >> Can you explain that a little bit?

[5:05:17] >> He said, so in their dorm rooms right

[5:05:19] now, they have a sink.

[5:05:22] >> And um we're saying we can save $12,000

[5:05:24] because they don't really need a sink in

[5:05:25] their dorm room because there's what,

[5:05:27] three or four bathrooms. Across the hall

[5:05:29] is the bathroom.

[5:05:33] » To brush your teeth,

[5:05:36] >> shave you guys.

[5:05:44] » That sounds like function to me.

[5:05:47] >> No, because they have teeth.

[5:05:49] >> No, but they can do that.

[5:05:50] >> But are the bathrooms divided? So if

[5:05:52] somebody's showering or or

[5:05:53] >> Do people share a bathroom?

[5:05:55] >> But they're not divided. So the shower

[5:05:57] or toilet like once they're doing that?

[5:05:58] Nobody else can use it.

[5:05:59] >> So each of the

[5:06:00] >> same time.

[5:06:01] >> Go ahead,

[5:06:02] >> Chief.

[5:06:04] >> Oh,

[5:06:06] there's two bathrooms. At one point

[5:06:10] I don't know how many times I

[5:06:19] » Oh, I see what you're saying.

[5:06:23] » Like there's not a

[5:06:26] shower right now, but

[5:06:30] bathrooms, but we have

[5:06:33] so we can eliminate.

[5:06:36] >> Okay. So, what

[5:06:39] >> I Okay, so he says that it could be

[5:06:41] elimin.

[5:06:49] Okay. Um,

[5:06:50] >> meaning we're rejecting, right?

[5:06:52] >> Yeah.

[5:06:54] >> We're accepting. We're accept.

[5:06:55] >> No, we're accepting it.

[5:06:56] >> Accept. Yeah.

[5:06:56] >> Okay. We wanted something.

[5:06:58] >> And then they wanted

[5:07:02] >> item 11, eliminate dorm beds built in.

[5:07:05] That's one that I feel like

[5:07:08] we need to reject and keep because even

[5:07:11] though initially it'll be a saving and

[5:07:13] the long a savings, but in the long run

[5:07:16] it'll be an increased cost. But let's

[5:07:19] go. You're going to go first.

[5:07:20] >> So instead of a bed bed frame with just

[5:07:22] a mattress on the floor.

[5:07:24] >> Yeah. I don't understand.

[5:07:25] >> It's a builtin.

[5:07:26] >> I know. The but the other option is just

[5:07:28] to have a bed frame.

[5:07:29] >> Yeah.

[5:07:30] >> On the ground.

[5:07:30] >> So it would be a purchase a purchase bed

[5:07:32] frame like a furniture item. In this

[5:07:33] case, we're going to be building it in

[5:07:34] out of metal.

[5:07:35] >> You just do the little metal ones and

[5:07:36] the box spring and a bed mattress.

[5:07:38] >> That's what would be that's what would

[5:07:40] happen if you accept the

[5:07:41] >> Okay. This isision.

[5:07:42] >> They want a flowered head. What are they

[5:07:45] called?

[5:07:47] >> Headboard and a footboard.

[5:07:48] >> Okay. So

[5:07:50] yes or no.

[5:07:52] >> Are they keeping it?

[5:07:54] >> Yeah. So each shift has storage under

[5:07:56] the bed.

[5:07:56] >> So the bed would be fixed in the room

[5:07:58] because it would be a built-in with

[5:07:59] drawers underneath. So it' function as a

[5:08:01] dresser and a bed.

[5:08:03] >> And and how many of these are there? How

[5:08:05] much have they cost per per bed?

[5:08:07] >> There's six. They're 2,000 a piece.

[5:08:09] >> How much?

[5:08:09] >> Six of them.

[5:08:10] >> There's six dorms. So it's about $3,200

[5:08:12] roughly.

[5:08:15] » There is already built-in existing Well,

[5:08:17] not existing. There's planned

[5:08:19] >> built-in furniture to be going in that

[5:08:21] for their dorm, wardrobes, and their

[5:08:22] desks.

[5:08:24] So, it would make sense to keep that co

[5:08:26] cohesive and have all that be the same

[5:08:28] language, but also have be the same wear

[5:08:30] and same durability.

[5:08:32] >> I want to vote last on this one.

[5:08:34] >> Yeah.

[5:08:35] >> Two years. Okay. I'll vote first. No, I

[5:08:37] want Sarah to go first because she

[5:08:38] hasn't been able to say what is your

[5:08:40] vote on the beds.

[5:08:42] >> These these beds the the life of these

[5:08:44] beds is you're saying is better than

[5:08:46] like a metal.

[5:08:47] >> These are ones that chief was referring

[5:08:49] to

[5:08:49] >> 18 years. How many?

[5:08:51] >> They're forever.

[5:08:52] >> Frames can you buy? I don't know. I

[5:08:54] guess I I guess no.

[5:08:55] >> Okay. So, you

[5:08:56] >> the chief.

[5:08:57] >> You don't want that.

[5:08:58] >> I would like to keep the beds.

[5:09:00] >> I'm a no.

[5:09:03] >> I'm a yes. The chief

[5:09:05] >> voting with the chief.

[5:09:07] >> So, only two voted with the chief. The

[5:09:09] rest of you guys

[5:09:10] >> say if later on the chief really wants

[5:09:12] them, I would gladly.

[5:09:13] >> He wants them now.

[5:09:14] >> No. No. Hold on.

[5:09:15] >> How many?

[5:09:16] >> We don't know if it'll work.

[5:09:18] >> Basic metal bed frames. Can you pay for

[5:09:20] >> metal bed frames and dressers? Oh, it's

[5:09:23] dressers too.

[5:09:23] >> Yeah, it's built in storage you can

[5:09:25] store.

[5:09:26] >> What would they use if we say no? If we

[5:09:28] say no to this, what option do you have?

[5:09:30] >> They'll get a metal bed and some

[5:09:33] >> an IKEA plastic containers.

[5:09:36] >> All right, I'll change to yes.

[5:09:38] >> Okay, so looks like we are rejecting.

[5:09:41] Okay, next one. Um, eliminate community

[5:09:43] center mill work. That's $30,000.

[5:09:47] Um,

[5:09:49] so that you guys

[5:09:50] >> built in cabinets

[5:09:51] >> in the community center.

[5:09:53] >> It's the east of all the community room

[5:09:54] center that has the historic references,

[5:09:57] the televisions, the serving areas, the

[5:09:59] storage areas for the EOC conversion,

[5:10:01] etc.

[5:10:02] >> We don't happen to know someone in the

[5:10:04] community that is a woodworker, do we?

[5:10:07] >> I just

[5:10:08] >> We do, but I don't think they'll do it

[5:10:09] for free.

[5:10:09] >> So, I think that's a great price.

[5:10:11] >> Jerry Jerry Robertson.

[5:10:13] >> Okay.

[5:10:14] >> Did you want Okay. Did you want to

[5:10:15] start, Sarah? Okay. Chie,

[5:10:17] >> keep it.

[5:10:17] >> I'll be a No,

[5:10:21] >> Frank.

[5:10:26] » Yes. No. Yes.

[5:10:29] >> I was going to say no because I think we

[5:10:31] can find

[5:10:32] >> someone to do that.

[5:10:33] >> Oh, outside of the cost.

[5:10:35] >> Cohesive project. Oh, sorry.

[5:10:36] >> Free.

[5:10:37] >> No, no one's going to do it for free.

[5:10:39] >> We should try to find anyone who will do

[5:10:41] independent stuff for us.

[5:10:42] >> What else do we have? Sorry. Come back

[5:10:44] to that. Okay. After we Yeah, this this

[5:10:47] is going to be bid out and competitively

[5:10:49] bid. So, anyone that has a license to

[5:10:51] bid on this can and that includes anyone

[5:10:53] in the community.

[5:10:55] >> So, someone in the community wants to

[5:10:56] come in and bid for this during by all

[5:10:58] means they can like a volunteer. So,

[5:11:00] maybe we can if we find a qualified

[5:11:02] send. Okay.

[5:11:03] >> But you've you've already retained the

[5:11:04] services of a design team to do that

[5:11:06] design for it. You just need to retain

[5:11:08] the services of someone to build it and

[5:11:09] that effort is going to be bid out

[5:11:11] still.

[5:11:13] >> Good reminder. Thank you.

[5:11:15] It's still yes. No.

[5:11:18] >> My thought was, can we come back after

[5:11:20] we look at these other three?

[5:11:21] >> Okay, fine. Okay. What's the next one?

[5:11:23] Um

[5:11:24] >> there. Okay. Eliminate

[5:11:27] um storage room mill work. So instead of

[5:11:29] builtins, the storage room because it's

[5:11:31] a storage room. Um they suggested taking

[5:11:34] that out and using like gorilla gorilla

[5:11:37] racks. With respect, mayor, the next

[5:11:38] four items were all internal functional

[5:11:40] items from the fire department, and

[5:11:42] they've all agreed that they're fine to

[5:11:44] >> that they would accept those items and

[5:11:45] take the savings.

[5:11:46] >> Yeah. So, boom, boom, boom.

[5:11:47] >> That's helpful.

[5:11:48] >> Now, we're back to

[5:11:49] >> Let me Can we see the very bottom?

[5:11:51] >> Thank you, Chief. That was a

[5:11:53] >> Can you go down to the bottom, please?

[5:11:55] >> Since they

[5:11:57] can get back there,

[5:11:58] >> I think we did. Yes. And then, um,

[5:12:00] >> we did, right? Mhm.

[5:12:02] >> And then to Oh, they also said to

[5:12:04] eliminate the um to accept the um ADA

[5:12:07] benches.

[5:12:13] » Well, you still have to have a bench.

[5:12:15] So,

[5:12:16] >> I don't think you can be a fire.

[5:12:17] >> Okay. So, it's 49

[5:12:18] >> the bench in the bathroom

[5:12:20] >> and then it's $30,000 for the mill work

[5:12:23] >> workers comp.

[5:12:24] >> Okay. Now, we need to go back to the

[5:12:26] mill work.

[5:12:27] >> All right.

[5:12:28] >> Jessica, did you want to Yes or no?

[5:12:30] Since we deleted those other items, it's

[5:12:32] a yes on the mill work.

[5:12:34] >> Yes on the mil work to accept it.

[5:12:35] >> What do you think, Mayor?

[5:12:38] Keep keep it there

[5:12:39] >> to to put it into the red column.

[5:12:42] >> Yeah. So, you want So, you're

[5:12:44] >> I thought this was brought up by Chrissy

[5:12:45] and Jessica to begin with.

[5:12:48] >> So, mine wasn't Chrissy is that

[5:12:50] detailed. Mine is It can be simpler.

[5:12:52] >> Yes.

[5:12:53] >> It wasn't ever a $30,000. So mine was

[5:12:56] kind of a simple

[5:12:57] >> the way I looked at it is when we went

[5:12:59] over to Lehi and looked at their EOC

[5:13:02] because it's also a community room for

[5:13:04] them also is that you need they not they

[5:13:07] have cabinets but we not only need

[5:13:09] cabinets but they need to be lockable

[5:13:11] for certain things because you have

[5:13:14] various organizations that are renting

[5:13:16] that room or using that room and you

[5:13:18] don't want your radios broken. You don't

[5:13:20] want your equipment, like if we're

[5:13:22] having exercise classes, maybe all the

[5:13:25] yoga blocks go into one of the lock

[5:13:27] cabinets and you don't have to worry

[5:13:29] about kids going in there and taking

[5:13:31] them out and breaking them or whatnot

[5:13:33] that I feel like it's a necessity and

[5:13:35] it's a functional thing as far as what

[5:13:38] goes on top. It could be much simpler.

[5:13:40] So, what if we just gave ourselves a

[5:13:41] $20,000 budget and we could build what

[5:13:44] we need with that instead of 30,000 and

[5:13:48] then we'd have to work within that

[5:13:49] parameter.

[5:13:51] >> Can I suggest something?

[5:13:52] >> Yeah,

[5:13:53] >> we can do something in the drawing

[5:13:54] called a bid alternate or an allowance.

[5:13:56] >> So, we do what you're saying is hold an

[5:13:58] allowance

[5:13:59] >> and that dollars are just spent for the

[5:14:00] UT use to retain someone. But to my

[5:14:02] point earlier, you've already retained

[5:14:05] design team and expertise to have this

[5:14:07] designed out cohesively as part of the

[5:14:08] whole project. So we could do it as a

[5:14:11] build alternate where we design it, have

[5:14:13] those costs allocated separately. If you

[5:14:15] decide you want to take that on the GMP

[5:14:17] day when you have all costs come in, you

[5:14:19] can. If not, you put it aside.

[5:14:22] >> Okay, let's do that.

[5:14:23] >> Do we do that to the roof, too? Oh, just

[5:14:24] kidding.

[5:14:25] >> Yes.

[5:14:27] we could.

[5:14:29] I think she's the only one on the roof,

[5:14:31] so I'm sorry she's alone on that one.

[5:14:33] >> You could do the whole thing at it, but

[5:14:34] I wouldn't suggest that. But

[5:14:39] » okay,

[5:14:39] >> I dream big.

[5:14:42] >> So, I'm wondering if you could do because

[5:14:48] I think there is acknowledgement at

[5:14:49] least from the majority of council that

[5:14:51] there needs to be some kind of mill

[5:14:53] work. So, can you put a note in that

[5:14:56] it's a bit alternate, but with at least

[5:14:58] 20,000 to cover the locked um cabinets

[5:15:02] along the bottom half.

[5:15:05] Okay.

[5:15:09] I think we're good, right?

[5:15:14] » Yes.

[5:15:16] >> Rejected that.

[5:15:18] >> Okay. Is there anything else?

[5:15:20] >> So, we're at 4889 plus 900. Yes.

[5:15:28] » Oh, what about for the additional

[5:15:30] glazing that um Jessica asked for on the

[5:15:32] south end?

[5:15:33] >> That's captured in this because

[5:15:34] >> it is in the 50

[5:15:35] >> just reducing the savings by $50,000,

[5:15:38] not adding to it.

[5:15:39] >> Okay. But that's covering So that's

[5:15:41] covering all the glazing the additional

[5:15:44] that was not in your original. Okay. I

[5:15:46] just wanted to make sure because I

[5:15:47] didn't want it to be like, wait, what

[5:15:49] happened to that? Okay, perfect. And

[5:15:50] then later on, mayor, we can reach out

[5:15:53] to you guys to ask about the

[5:15:55] construction costs to maybe try to help

[5:15:57] with those.

[5:15:58] >> No,

[5:16:00] >> that's why we have them. That's what

[5:16:01] they're going to be doing. What we did

[5:16:03] now is what

[5:16:05] >> questions. Is that okay to ask

[5:16:07] questions?

[5:16:08] >> We've been here 5 hours and 15 minutes.

[5:16:10] Can I make a motion?

[5:16:11] >> Yes. Go ahead.

[5:16:12] >> Um, how do I come up with the number

[5:16:13] amount though, Shane? Help me with that

[5:16:17] >> with the total that he has. Can I just

[5:16:20] maybe help Andrew clarify his question?

[5:16:22] You were saying like if they know people

[5:16:23] if we know people that could bid for

[5:16:25] them. Is that what you're saying?

[5:16:26] >> There are probably some public questions

[5:16:27] they don't want to answer like margins

[5:16:28] and stuff and we can help. It'll help us

[5:16:31] with all this.

[5:16:31] >> Yeah, let's take that offline.

[5:16:32] >> Well, that's why I was asking how I

[5:16:34] contact them to ask them.

[5:16:36] >> Shane, will you help me fill in that

[5:16:38] number and I'll make the motion.

[5:16:39] >> Uh, is it

[5:16:41] >> Do you want the screen?

[5:16:42] >> I think I had four.

[5:16:44] >> He has it right here. 5.794. Is that the

[5:16:47] right

[5:16:48] >> uh just the number?

[5:16:50] >> What the heck is that?

[5:16:51] >> Yeah. 4889

[5:16:53] 602.

[5:16:54] >> Yeah, that's the current cost.

[5:16:55] >> Is that the number that we have now?

[5:16:57] >> Okay, I'm going to I'm going to round.

[5:16:59] Okay, so I'm going to do 5.9. That gives

[5:17:02] us an extra extra 11,000.

[5:17:05] >> Does that include the 20,000 for the

[5:17:07] milwork?

[5:17:08] >> Are we not talking about the total?

[5:17:09] >> Does this didn't take that out?

[5:17:11] >> We have not taken that out.

[5:17:14] >> So, yeah, to approve the total. Yes. for

[5:17:16] the

[5:17:16] >> I thought Yeah, I thought it was

[5:17:18] >> it's the total. This is just for

[5:17:19] construction, but we're going to do all

[5:17:20] of that.

[5:17:20] >> Can you show me that number one more

[5:17:22] time so I can read it into the minutes?

[5:17:24] >> So you could say not exceeding 5.9.

[5:17:27] >> Oh, we're not adding the 900,000 that

[5:17:29] he's been doing.

[5:17:30] >> We can't. That number would be

[5:17:32] >> 589

[5:17:35] 602.

[5:17:36] >> Okay. So if I not exceed,

[5:17:38] >> you're right because we need to make the

[5:17:40] provision for the $20,000 allowance for

[5:17:43] the community room. So he's doing that

[5:17:44] right now. And and while he does that

[5:17:46] there

[5:17:46] >> that's why I was going to round you know

[5:17:48] like you know what I mean

[5:17:51] >> not to exceed a certain amount.

[5:17:53] >> Yeah. Can I put not to exceed is it

[5:17:55] this? Is it the 5.8?

[5:17:57] >> Yes. Okay.

[5:17:59] >> 5 million. Okay. I'm going to make my

[5:18:01] motion.

[5:18:01] >> Yep. I move to accept the following cost

[5:18:04] strategies and have a target budget of

[5:18:08] 5,800

[5:18:11] and

[5:18:13] 20,000.

[5:18:14] No, 30,000 because we need the

[5:18:16] contingent. Okay. No, 5,820,000

[5:18:22] with a contingency of 10,000

[5:18:26] extra for mill work.

[5:18:29] >> It's 20,000.

[5:18:32] >> Oh, I thought we were guaranteeing the

[5:18:34] 20 and to go up to 30 you needed 10.

[5:18:36] >> You need 10. That's correct because you

[5:18:38] meant 20 back in.

[5:18:39] >> That's correct.

[5:18:40] >> Sorry.

[5:18:40] >> You are correct.

[5:18:43] >> You're the account.

[5:18:45] >> Okay. For the fire station edition

[5:18:48] community center project.

[5:18:50] We have

[5:18:52] a motion. I'm so tired. Is there a

[5:18:55] second?

[5:18:56] >> Well, just one question on

[5:18:57] >> No, we've got a motion. Let's I'm asking

[5:18:59] for a second and then we'll have a

[5:19:00] discussion. Okay.

[5:19:01] >> Okay.

[5:19:02] >> I'll second.

[5:19:03] >> Okay. We've got a motion by Councilwoman

[5:19:05] Haniman, second by Councilwoman Spewan.

[5:19:08] >> Did you have a question?

[5:19:10] >> Yes. Does this allot where the donations

[5:19:14] come into play or is it all just saying

[5:19:19] we are approving this for all city funds

[5:19:22] to pay for this or does it include

[5:19:25] >> this is

[5:19:25] >> at budget time? Will we will we look at

[5:19:27] all this and figure out where we move?

[5:19:28] >> It doesn't say where it comes from.

[5:19:30] >> No, it doesn't. We're not allocating.

[5:19:32] >> It allows them to move forward.

[5:19:34] >> Thank you.

[5:19:34] >> They need to move forward.

[5:19:36] >> Ask a question and clarify like we I

[5:19:39] mean we're down to the like just

[5:19:41] essentials, right? There's no other way

[5:19:43] we can cut things, right? We're this is as good as it gets

[5:19:47] >> for the luxury water beds and um remote

[5:19:50] control.

[5:19:51] >> Well, that was why I wanted to ask about

[5:19:52] the construction cost, the big five

[5:19:54] million that I is like a black box.

[5:19:57] >> It's I mean like we're going down to you

[5:19:59] know they're not having drywall. They're

[5:20:00] not I mean we're

[5:20:01] >> okay. I just I just want to make sure

[5:20:04] this it becomes scope.

[5:20:05] >> Do we cut out space? Do we cut out

[5:20:07] program?

[5:20:08] >> And we have to question the size of

[5:20:11] >> I I believe the best route Shane you can

[5:20:13] tell me differently but if you go

[5:20:14] through Shane there's there's a

[5:20:15] conversation that we can have that

[5:20:16] there's

[5:20:17] >> Yeah,

[5:20:17] >> sounds good.

[5:20:18] >> There's contracts that are separate

[5:20:19] between contractor and architect that

[5:20:21] I'm sure

[5:20:22] >> Shane loves when I reach out to him.

[5:20:26] Okay, so we've got a motion and a

[5:20:28] second. Let's proceed with a roll call

[5:20:31] vote.

[5:20:31] >> Chrissy Henman, yes.

[5:20:33] >> Andrew Young, no. Bren Remler, yes.

[5:20:35] >> Jessica Smuan, yes.

[5:20:39] » Sarah Blackwell, yes.

[5:20:41] >> Okay, motion passes.

[5:20:43] Okay, let's last item. Public hearing

[5:20:47] ordinance.

[5:20:48] >> Thank you for your patience.

[5:20:49] >> Oh, yes. Thank you guys. I'm sorry. Now

[5:20:51] all I can think about is let's get this

[5:20:53] done. Thank you guys.

[5:20:54] >> Thanks for coming.

[5:20:56] >> Can't wait.

[5:21:09] » So, we are

[5:21:10] >> $400 million bond.

[5:21:12] >> Oh, the school. Okay, we are moving on

[5:21:16] with um ordinance 2026-07

[5:21:21] » um adjustment for our midyear budget for

[5:21:25] fiscal year 2026.

[5:21:28] >> Yeah. So, this this is just kind of a

[5:21:29] cleanup um for our budget. Uh we have

[5:21:33] advertised the public hearing. So, that

[5:21:35] was noticed properly which the mayor can

[5:21:38] start as soon as I explain the four

[5:21:40] items. Um, the first one is we received

[5:21:43] the million-doll grant for street

[5:21:45] maintenance and so this is just bringing

[5:21:47] that into our budget because we

[5:21:50] overspent that knowing that we would be

[5:21:52] doing this at some point. We do have the

[5:21:54] funds. We received those in um December

[5:21:59] and we did the project last fall. Um,

[5:22:03] next one uh charges for services. We had

[5:22:06] a discrepancy

[5:22:07] in our um solid waste area where our

[5:22:12] revenue and expenses didn't match and we

[5:22:15] I I had a mistake in the GL that was

[5:22:18] listed on what went out the packet. I

[5:22:20] emailed late this afternoon and then put

[5:22:22] a copy on your desk that corrected GL.

[5:22:25] It just shows that coming from fund

[5:22:27] balance. In reality, it will just come

[5:22:29] from revenues through waste collection.

[5:22:33] >> Oh yeah.

[5:22:35] Uh yeah. Yep. So I there's the edit and

[5:22:39] then there's a clean clean copy on your

[5:22:41] desk.

[5:22:42] >> The third one um we we over spent class

[5:22:46] E roads just a little bit by 39,100.

[5:22:49] So that would be coming just from that

[5:22:51] fund balance.

[5:22:51] >> You mean 29,000?

[5:22:53] >> Um yeah,

[5:22:55] >> right.

[5:22:56] >> For some reason I think I had a mistake

[5:22:58] on the cover sheet.

[5:23:00] Um let me just look at my budget really

[5:23:03] quick. Well, one of them it's either the um packet or the form

[5:23:08] the exhibit A.

[5:23:09] >> Yeah, let me just look in here.

[5:23:19] » Yeah, 29100. It's over spent by 29,000

[5:23:24] and almost $2, but just rounded it to

[5:23:27] 29100.

[5:23:30] Um

[5:23:32] and then the fourth one, um last fall,

[5:23:36] uh we had a storm drain project that was

[5:23:38] finishing up and we got thinking they

[5:23:40] gave us such a good bid, we should get a

[5:23:42] price to do this other project brought

[5:23:44] at the council was approved. This is

[5:23:46] adjusting more funds from fund balance

[5:23:48] to cover that project that was

[5:23:50] completed. Um and that's those are the

[5:23:53] four items. Okay, we I'll open the um

[5:23:57] public hearing for our midyear budget

[5:24:01] adjustment.

[5:24:02] Is there anyone that would like to make

[5:24:04] a statement regarding our midyear budget

[5:24:06] adjustment?

[5:24:12] So um in the absence of any comments and

[5:24:18] lack of public I will close the public

[5:24:21] hearing

[5:24:22] and um I'll entertain a motion.

[5:24:26] >> We don't discuss it all before

[5:24:28] >> I you know I think let's start with a

[5:24:29] motion and then we can discuss

[5:24:31] >> to approve ordinance 2026-07

[5:24:34] including the proposed mid-year budget

[5:24:35] adjustment. Is there a second?

[5:24:38] >> I'll second.

[5:24:39] >> All second. Chrissy Hanimman.

[5:24:40] >> It's been moved by Councilman Rumler,

[5:24:42] seconded by Councilwoman Haniman. Let's

[5:24:44] proceed with um discussion or questions.

[5:24:48] >> I have none.

[5:24:49] >> Uh Shane, on the storm drain fund that

[5:24:51] 215, can you just briefly explain what

[5:24:54] that is only because I'm getting more

[5:24:56] into storm drains.

[5:24:57] >> What project we did?

[5:24:58] >> Yeah. Yeah. What what did the was the

[5:25:00] work they did?

[5:25:01] >> So, the extra work was over on

[5:25:03] Canterbury Lane. Uh we there's a very

[5:25:07] flat uh section of road over there that

[5:25:10] we continually had puddling water and um

[5:25:14] we just extended the storm drain up to

[5:25:17] catch that water and eliminate that

[5:25:19] problem.

[5:25:20] >> And am I right that was 215k to do that?

[5:25:23] seems like a lot to do that.

[5:25:25] >> It's a lot of money when you're digging

[5:25:26] through roads and asphalt and existing

[5:25:29] utilities and and everything. So, but

[5:25:32] they the price was excellent. We had bid

[5:25:34] that that little storm drain project

[5:25:36] thinking we might just get a handful of

[5:25:38] biders and seems like we had eight or 10

[5:25:41] biders. We had

[5:25:42] >> and that was like the low 219

[5:25:44] >> is very competitive. Um really good

[5:25:47] price and that's why we suggested doing

[5:25:49] this other one.

[5:25:50] >> That's a lot. Uh general fund class C

[5:25:52] roads the 29 grand that was is that the

[5:25:55] work we did that is making the roads

[5:25:58] putting that top coat on them. So that's

[5:26:00] from the top coat. It's it's a

[5:26:01] combination of overlays, sil coats, all

[5:26:05] of our different uh road maintenance,

[5:26:08] >> and it just went over the price for them

[5:26:10] to do all that everywhere.

[5:26:12] And then um the the general charges for

[5:26:17] services, the 28 grand, that was just

[5:26:19] the mishap on the uh um

[5:26:23] >> in the budget.

[5:26:24] for the uh um

[5:26:28] >> revenue versus expenses and garbage.

[5:26:30] >> Yeah, for the garbage. That's right. For

[5:26:32] the garbage. So, we just missed that.

[5:26:34] >> Y

[5:26:34] >> uh Okay, I think that's the only

[5:26:36] questions I had. Thank you. Okay, Brent,

[5:26:40] Jessica,

[5:26:42] >> no.

[5:26:43] >> Oh, last question. Sorry. I apologize to

[5:26:45] do that. Uh, and these were all projects

[5:26:48] you guys previously approved, right?

[5:26:50] That these

[5:26:52] uh

[5:26:54] projects and we're just like redoing the

[5:26:56] accounting. Right.

[5:26:58] >> Correct.

[5:27:00] >> When you do these,

[5:27:02] you approve them for a certain amount

[5:27:04] and then they just go over. So, is this

[5:27:06] why we have to do this? We have to

[5:27:08] >> we have to correct it.

[5:27:10] >> Some of these. No. Right. Like for the

[5:27:12] class C roads. Yes. That went over storm drain. That was an additional

[5:27:16] project that came to council

[5:27:18] >> and council approved it.

[5:27:20] >> Okay. And then we're just ratifying the

[5:27:22] difference in money

[5:27:24] >> because we didn't account for that in

[5:27:26] our budget right

[5:27:27] >> back then. But taking advantage of the

[5:27:29] labor force that's here and of the good

[5:27:32] pricing.

[5:27:33] >> It was suggested that we move forward

[5:27:35] with

[5:27:35] >> it. Is this all money that will go into

[5:27:37] the 2020 20 I'm sorry 2025 2026 budget

[5:27:40] or will this go into the 2026 2027

[5:27:43] budget

[5:27:44] >> current budget year

[5:27:45] >> that we're in right now until July.

[5:27:46] Okay. All right. Thank you. That's all.

[5:27:48] >> We're going to talk about fund balance

[5:27:50] more often but these are coming the the

[5:27:53] not the first one but the next three,

[5:27:56] right?

[5:27:57] >> Yep. So the fund balance acts as a

[5:28:00] contingency fund for unexpected things

[5:28:02] that happen during the year. Some things

[5:28:05] cost more, but some things were just a

[5:28:07] good deal and you didn't want to pass up

[5:28:08] like the sale item. So that that's

[5:28:11] exact. We're using the fund balance for

[5:28:12] exactly what it's designed to do is for

[5:28:15] unexpected things or contingency fund.

[5:28:18] So there's nothing really extra. It's

[5:28:20] because we have a fund balance to

[5:28:22] address issues that come along that are

[5:28:24] unexpected.

[5:28:25] >> Thank you.

[5:28:25] >> Yeah. Does that help?

[5:28:27] >> Let's proceed with a roll call vote.

[5:28:28] >> Chrissy Hammond. Yes.

[5:28:31] >> I only because I don't know the details.

[5:28:33] Andrew Young, no.

[5:28:35] >> Ran, yes.

[5:28:36] >> Jessica Sme, yes.

[5:28:37] >> Sarah Blackwell, yes.

[5:28:39] >> Okay.

[5:28:41] Um, ordinance 2026-07 passes. Um, let's

[5:28:45] staff reports. Chief,

[5:28:49] Steve Shane,

[5:28:51] >> I'm just going to send you an email

[5:28:52] tomorrow if it's okay.

[5:28:54] >> Okay. Right.

[5:28:55] >> Nothing. Jessica,

[5:28:58] >> I'm gonna CC everyone on the email that

[5:29:00] Shane's sending and add my email to it.

[5:29:04] >> Maybe that's what we should do because

[5:29:06] it's really late and if we go and talk

[5:29:08] then Andrew is going to be holding

[5:29:10] contempt for going over midnight. No,

[5:29:12] I'm just kidding.

[5:29:13] >> It's true. I I really am watching.

[5:29:14] >> Do you have anything?

[5:29:16] >> No,

[5:29:17] I do. Um I heard from the um sculpture

[5:29:21] garden they have really good updates. I

[5:29:23] will forward you the email. And

[5:29:26] reminder, if you'd like to come to our

[5:29:28] finance committee meeting on Thursday

[5:29:30] morning at 8 to 9:30, it's designed

[5:29:33] specifically for us really because uh

[5:29:36] we're going to be looking at budget.

[5:29:38] Andrew, you're going out of town and um

[5:29:41] what was the other thing we're going to

[5:29:42] do? Budget and just like our financials.

[5:29:45] So, I just want to verbally remind you

[5:29:46] of that meeting and we've already

[5:29:48] noticed it so you can all attend.

[5:29:50] >> Okay? I hope to see you there at 8:00 am

[5:29:52] to 9:30. We're gonna be right on time

[5:29:55] because our presenter has to be in

[5:29:56] Heber.

[5:29:57] >> Okay. Andrew,

[5:29:58] >> you uh Heidi, would you mind bringing up

[5:30:01] the image of the shingles on boxelder

[5:30:04] resident wanted to share with you the

[5:30:06] shingles on Did they already do it?

[5:30:08] >> No, it's not been replaced, but we're

[5:30:09] aware the fire

[5:30:10] >> if you just pull it up, they can see.

[5:30:12] While she's pulling that up, several

[5:30:15] folks have reached out about asking if

[5:30:16] the uh that one uh you understand those

[5:30:19] shingles that I guess they're flaking

[5:30:20] off and going into neighbors yards. So,

[5:30:22] they just wanted me to let you know. So,

[5:30:23] if we can be of any help, let us know.

[5:30:25] >> They've reached that 30 plus years of

[5:30:27] age and live their life.

[5:30:29] >> Chie loves us because it's

[5:30:30] >> Well, and in the future, do we do

[5:30:32] >> Hey, in the future for things like this, is something that you can schedule

[5:30:37] to meet with Shane on and we really

[5:30:39] don't need to. I was just I get them and

[5:30:42] I don't have time so I put them in a

[5:30:43] list and I say, "Okay, at the one point

[5:30:44] I can tell."

[5:30:45] >> I know. But this isn't something that I

[5:30:47] mean it's 11:30 at night. This is

[5:30:49] something that you can just shoot off to

[5:30:50] Shane and say, "Hey, can you take care

[5:30:51] of this?"

[5:30:52] >> Why? Okay. I wasn't going to ask him to.

[5:30:54] Okay. Yes, I understand. Um

[5:30:57] where was I? I Oh, several residents are

[5:31:00] asking to bump up the PI water date. I

[5:31:03] told them I don't know.

[5:31:05] >> Later.

[5:31:05] >> No, make it earlier.

[5:31:06] >> No, earlier.

[5:31:07] >> So, you're the council member overwater.

[5:31:09] You'll be included on a text with the

[5:31:12] other water committee from the

[5:31:13] irrigation company and Greg and myself.

[5:31:16] >> On what day?

[5:31:17] >> We'll be trying to schedule a meeting

[5:31:18] probably next week.

[5:31:19] >> Okay.

[5:31:20] >> To talk about

[5:31:20] >> I I tell them it's between the 10th and

[5:31:22] the 15th. That's correct. Right.

[5:31:24] >> It's several residents are asking for

[5:31:27] the pressurized irrigation turn on day

[5:31:29] to come earlier because they already

[5:31:31] want to start watering.

[5:31:32] >> And I told them I would let you know and

[5:31:35] I will do that more on emails. But I

[5:31:37] >> we talked about that as a water

[5:31:39] committee and we were told that that

[5:31:40] there was a legal agreement that we

[5:31:41] can't do it before April 15th. Are you

[5:31:43] saying that it's up to debate?

[5:31:45] >> We could we never have since the system

[5:31:48] was built. We've never

[5:31:50] you know it might be the 14th because

[5:31:52] Greg's in certain parts town. He's

[5:31:54] filling lines and things, but

[5:31:56] >> it's it's been the 15th every year.

[5:31:59] >> There's not there's not a legal

[5:32:00] restriction. Oh. Uh okay. really quick.

[5:32:04] Uh thank you Heidi for all the Alpine

[5:32:06] Days music suggestions. The followup on

[5:32:09] Smooth Canyon. I sent out an email but

[5:32:11] didn't get a response from anyone about

[5:32:13] the signs at uh Smooth Canyon Park um

[5:32:17] for the dogs that are biting people. Um

[5:32:21] >> Oh, no. We're like we said before, we're

[5:32:23] working on signage for all of our parks.

[5:32:26] It will be standardized and that will be

[5:32:27] >> right. But Don was like, "No, that won't

[5:32:29] work." So I was like, "Shane, let us

[5:32:30] know what would work for. It sounds like

[5:32:32] these can be listed anyway. Sounds like

[5:32:34] you know about it.

[5:32:35] >> Yeah, that that will be one of the

[5:32:37] >> You responded.

[5:32:38] >> Uh not to me.

[5:32:39] >> I thought it was a reply all.

[5:32:41] >> Yeah, I

[5:32:42] >> it's okay. I must have missed it. That's

[5:32:44] okay. The the last ones I can email. Um

[5:32:47] because you've heard of it with

[5:32:48] exception of um if if you want to work

[5:32:52] together on the fences thing, let me let

[5:32:54] me know. It's been there for a while.

[5:32:55] So, let me know if there's any problems.

[5:32:56] That's all.

[5:32:57] >> So, our our new person, our new staff

[5:33:00] member starts next Tuesday. Oh, there

[5:33:02] you go. Okay, thank you. That's all.

[5:33:04] >> Okay.

[5:33:04] >> Appreciate your time.

[5:33:05] >> Don't hate me. I'm sorry. Um, grand marshall is going to open soon and

[5:33:10] you guys decide on the grand marshall.

[5:33:12] So, um, if you want to submit, watch for

[5:33:14] it. But I just want you to know that is on this council that to decide.

[5:33:19] So, um, that's coming.

[5:33:21] >> Thank you. That's very important. I

[5:33:22] nominate Carla Merrell.

[5:33:23] >> No, no, no. I will entertain a motion to

[5:33:26] adjurnn.

[5:33:28] >> Uh, since we're adjourned. Oh, yes. I'll

[5:33:29] move to second.

[5:33:30] >> Okay. Is there a second? Okay. Moved by

[5:33:32] Rummler, seconded by Young.

3.24.2026 City Council Meeting

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