[8:40] and I'm texting. Uh, >> okay. It's 7 o'clock so many. Okay. Uh,

[8:47] first thing just a short announcement. Uh, Greg David passed away this

[8:53] afternoon. speak John David that's why he will not be joining us

[9:01] today this evening um let's just run around and quickly do an introduction

[9:06] because I know planning commission and city house don't always interact too

[9:09] much with each other so let's start with Mike Proctor

[9:14] say who you are and where what you do it's Mike Proctor I'm on city council

[9:22] and I do run an investment advisory US.

[9:33] I'm just joined planning commission and I'm recently retired. Would you like to

[9:37] spend some time with two grand? >> Brandon Moff council.

[9:43] I work as an engineer direct street. >> I'm Demian

[9:52] retired engineer. >> Well, Jordan, planning commission,

[9:58] retired architect and I have some real estate and some I have a farm and Jim

[10:03] and I was talking about that I did a little bit. I just not

[10:09] city council lived in Beller since 2010 and I work at Wildcat to start.

[10:15] I'm Jim Bage. I'm mayor and mostly retired

[10:20] » and I'll if you don't mind I have my staff introduce themselves so they know

[10:23] who who's. >> Yep. announce

[10:30] the development director and the staff person for

[10:36] » James Miller, facilities director and interim police manuction.

[10:57] Huh?

[11:02] BC. >> Ted Henry, city manager, proud employee

[11:07] for the last 10 years. And tonight we're here to or you want to queue it off,

[11:11] Jen, or you want me to? >> Oh, well, go ahead.

[11:14] » First thing on the agenda, try to keep to an hour is zoning code updates. I

[11:19] think we have somebody.

[11:23] » Thank you, mayor. Yep. I'm Kylie Jennings. Um, I work at PEC,

[11:27] professional engineering consultants. We serve as your guys' on call city

[11:30] planners and city engineers. Um, do a variety of things with the city. And

[11:34] tonight, we're going to work through a zoning and subdivision regulations

[11:38] update. This is the first workshop that we'll do with you all out of four.

[11:43] All right. So, are we ready to dive into it?

[11:45] » Yeah. I I will just say we are broadcasting to the public. It's mainly

[11:49] audio because I have her presentation on the the live stream. So just just be

[11:55] aware that um audio [clears throat] is going

[11:58] » and if you have any questions at all during this, please let me know. Um

[12:02] we'll do a little presentation um to explain what this project is. You guys

[12:07] will do some discussion amongst yourselves and then as a big group we'll

[12:10] go back to a presentation. We'll do one more activity and then wrap it up. Um,

[12:15] so my co-orker Lance Onto is also um your guys's on call planner and he's in

[12:21] Rose Hill right now helping them with something and is on his way as we speak.

[12:25] So he'll get here eventually. Um, but how did we get here? Some of you that

[12:29] were on council previously for any commission, remember that we just

[12:33] wrapped up the Bellair 2035 comprehensive plan. This is a

[12:37] comprehensive plan document. spent two years talking to the public um and

[12:41] working with you all um and we at that time the city council and planning

[12:45] commission through several workshops um we talked to several different

[12:49] stakeholder groups like the Lions Club, the Rotary Club, the tree board. Um

[12:54] we're at pop-up events at festivals here in Bair all gathering community input to

[13:00] give us the values and goals for Bair for the next 10 years for Belair 2035.

[13:05] So there's multiple values. We won't go through all of them. Um, one of them was

[13:10] economic development. Your value statement there is Bellair's

[13:13] non-residential environment will enhance the quality of life for all residents

[13:16] and visitors alike. Right. And one of those goals that's boxed to your goal

[13:20] number two is review and amend adoptive regulations to identify inconsistencies,

[13:26] improvements, and revisions. And then focus this review towards incorporating

[13:30] modern best practices for non-residential regulation tailored

[13:33] specifically to assist with the implementation of this plan. Sorry,

[13:36] that's kind of jargony, but that means do the projects that we are now doing.

[13:41] So, um you guys and same thing in housing. We had the exact same goal for

[13:45] housing as well as goal number six here, explore amending or redoing the zoning

[13:49] code, especially as it pertains to residential development. Um to ensure

[13:54] best practices are in place for the city, the developer, and the citizens.

[13:57] So, you all get to say hello constituents. We are doing exactly what

[14:01] you asked us to do. This is awesome. So what this project is that we're

[14:05] partaking on is the next best step for Belair and often the step that comes

[14:10] after a comprehensive plan update. So does that make sense where we're

[14:15] going right now? >> Yeah. Who who um was involved in the

[14:19] process of the comprehensive plan? You don't mind? Okay, that's what I thought.

[14:24] So most of you. Great. Okay. So before um we dive into Belair's

[14:29] zoning code specifically, we'll do a brief overview of what zoning is. So

[14:34] zoning 101, it existed all the way back in antiquity. For as long as humans have

[14:38] been alive, we have been organizing our space in some sort of order, right?

[14:43] There was a religious center, a commercial center, um a place where you

[14:47] know all the business happened. There was places where people lived and there

[14:50] was places where people played. There was outdoor things. Think of a walled

[14:54] city. Certain things were allowed to happen outside the wall, certain things

[14:57] had to happen inside the wall. They probably didn't have it written down in

[15:01] several articles on the MUN code website, but it existed and it was in

[15:05] some form happening. Um, then zoning, as we call it now, took a big shift during

[15:11] the industrialization period. So, um, people always kind of lived and worked

[15:16] in the same place, right? They didn't have to, we didn't have cars back then,

[15:19] so they didn't have to travel far to go to work. So work and home work together.

[15:24] Now industrialization comes about and we have all these factories and we realize

[15:28] that work and home together is very very bad for the human person. Um think of

[15:33] like the London the great smog of London and all of these uh pretty quickly

[15:38] escalating health problems. So that started a pendulum swing of we have to

[15:44] separate land uses. People need to live over here and work over here for health,

[15:48] safety and welfare. good idea until that pendulum swung and swung and swung and

[15:53] swung. We never stopped it and we said, "Okay, people are going to live here if

[15:58] they live in one house, but they're or a single family house. They'll live here

[16:02] if they live in a duplex or a triplex or quadlex. They live over here if they're

[16:05] in an apartment. The uh healthcare will be over here. Retail will be over here.

[16:11] The grocery store will be over here. And the factory will be over here." And so

[16:15] now no one can access the things that they need on a day-to-day basis. Right?

[16:19] So that is what 20th century um zoning has kind of swung towards. And we have

[16:24] some really good things that did happen um like really walkable cities, things

[16:28] that are, you know, uh just think of like our really historic neighborhoods

[16:33] um in Witchah, historic neighborhoods here in Melair, things that we all enjoy

[16:37] being in. And then some things that weren't good happened like just endless

[16:41] endless endless suburban sprawl, right? That is generally not great for the

[16:45] human spirit. So the modern goals of zoning are to take away this. So this uh

[16:50] dashed circle is like a a walkable radius, right? And we do sometimes live

[16:55] in this world where often now our uses are surrounded by parking lots on very

[17:01] large roads leading to the fact that no one can walk to anywhere that they need

[17:06] to go. And the goal is kind of shifting towards mixing those uses to make them

[17:11] um more usable so that you can maybe live, work, and play in one

[17:14] neighborhood. I think a lot about uh kids and elderly who cannot drive. How

[17:21] much how far can they go without a car in their day-to-day lives? Can they get

[17:25] any of their needs done in their day-to-day life? Right? There's kind of

[17:29] like a big uh some people are saying like, "Oh, kids these days can't can't

[17:33] handle anything. We were out till the street lights came on." Well, it was

[17:36] like different to be out till the street lights came on when you could go to the

[17:40] quick trip and you could go to the park and you could go to all these places

[17:42] with your friends. Um, and now you can't. Like I know growing up if I

[17:46] wanted to go to the store I had to cross a four-lane road um with cars going 45

[17:52] miles an hour, right? So that wasn't really part of an option. So zoning now

[17:57] today we're trying to get more into this area on the right where the environment

[18:02] that we're building is good for development for the human. Okay. And I

[18:07] know that's kind of a heavy statement and that's not that perfect, you know,

[18:12] combination of uses there isn't going to fit in every single um city, right? So

[18:18] the goal here is to make Belair's a little bit more oriented toward what the

[18:23] citizens want, what all what you all think is good for the next few years.

[18:29] Um, I will say that this is so we'll get to discussion, but real quick I want to

[18:35] note that this is not unique to Belair. Every city in America is trying to go

[18:41] through this zoning and subdivision regulation update, right? This is not

[18:44] something that it's like you guys are so behind. This is crazy. Um, at the same

[18:49] time, this is impressive that we're already making this next step, right?

[18:54] you guys just adopted the comprehensive plan and you're already starting on this

[18:58] next project, which isn't necessarily um common everywhere. So, it's really

[19:03] exciting. So, this is this is the next best step for citizens. Um and these

[19:08] regulations will be like continuing to evolve, right? Just like our knowledge

[19:14] of zoning, our knowledge of planning, the way we build houses changes, the way

[19:18] we design cities changes. So, now you guys will get to talk. Um, and we're

[19:23] going to do this kind of in groups. So, I think maybe each table could have a

[19:27] miniature discussion and then we'll discuss as a group. Um, you guys get to

[19:31] decide as a group what is the most important rule of your zones and

[19:35] regulations. I'll put a timer on my phone for like three or four minutes and

[19:40] then we will discuss as a large group. So, go ahead discuss amongst yourselves.

[20:10] What's the most stressful?

[20:32] That's part of it.

[20:38] » It's designed to

[20:53] availably

[21:11] don't know very Oh,

[21:37] It's very

[21:53] easy.

[22:08] Whatever.

[22:41] All of us coming down.

[22:57] There's always

[23:08] another

[23:21] Facebook.

[23:42] » Oh, yeah.

[23:59] I know

[24:03] something

[24:37] This is exciting. You guys are daddy. I love it. Um we are in a strict request

[24:42] to keep us under now but we're trying to starting

[24:46] let's start at the table you guys want or are you guys ready to what was your

[24:51] answer for the most important role of your code?

[24:55] » I mean I don't know if we had a collective answer but I just said to

[25:00] bring order and value out of chaos. >> Nice. Yes.

[25:04] » Yeah. I talked about how, you know, when I came to city council, I pretty much

[25:08] have this idea, hey, you know, property rights are king. You know, if you own

[25:11] the property, I want you to have maximum ability to do what you want on that. If

[25:15] you've got a problem with it or you form HOAs to kind of enforce, you know, we

[25:20] have different things in there, but minimize top down control. Um, but I

[25:25] hear from residents, you know, this feels like in black city, you know, is

[25:29] there a role that we should play in shaping or minimizing some of that? So,

[25:34] um, bring order with it and freeze it, but I

[25:38] don't always know, uh, what that should look like and how complicated that

[25:41] should be for >> our side of the deal.

[25:43] » Yeah, that is that'll be a core, we'll discuss that later is how do you balance

[25:47] personal property rights and maintaining an ordered city? Yeah, great. And your

[25:53] guys's job as elected employment officials. Great. I'm not envious, but

[25:56] that is very cool. Okay, this table. Yeah,

[26:01] » we we said just the most important role is so that our city can develop with a

[26:07] plan.

[26:13] » We didn't think it was fair. You did start with those ideas first.

[26:20] I think it comes down to um the citizens safety but also with the vision that

[26:27] they have for the city um and then staying on top of like what we are now

[26:34] as as things change and evolve trying to make sure that we're staying ahead of

[26:37] that so that the the quality of life is >> I think another one was our zoning

[26:44] regulations are there for a reason and it it

[26:50] to just change them or ask for changes just because you want to

[26:56] struggle with. >> Yes.

[26:58] » Why? >> Uhhuh. And so like are you asking why

[27:02] are we changing right now? >> No. Or

[27:04] » but why back on that? So we talked a little bit about making sure that the

[27:08] regulations are clear and I don't know the words predictable,

[27:14] right? But we don't want more. We would like less and less case by case and more

[27:19] and more structure. >> That's kind of a general rule. But also

[27:23] one of the things that we talked about a little bit too is being creative and

[27:27] having some option especially for variety of housing

[27:32] you chat about a little bit. >> I'm going to come back real quick. So

[27:35] what about the changes? >> So when people ask for changes, why do

[27:40] you need that change? Is it all financially driven? is that you think

[27:46] it's better if we do it this way. And so all of these documents, all these words

[27:52] we put in here were thought out. And if we just say, okay, here it is. And then

[27:59] somebody talk, I don't like this or I don't like this. I want to change that.

[28:04] » And they want to come in and do it. And and why why do you want to

[28:08] » not just I want to do it. >> Okay. Having reasons behind the variance

[28:13] request. reasons how those help citizens of Belair and the city.

[28:21] » Nice. Okay. Is there anything else in this table? Housing flexibility.

[28:26] » I think we wanted to see something. The code obviously we started with it public

[28:30] safety. >> Yeah. Knowing the separating isolating

[28:34] compartments from quiet from more safe areas maybe

[28:40] less safe areas. >> That's the role of of zone. I don't

[28:45] know. I'm not trying to bash on the because it's actually a pretty neat

[28:49] city, but if you've ever gone to Oklahoma,

[28:52] find something that's just different and and and that is um it's weird. There's

[28:59] houses next to businesses, next to fire, and it's just kind of weird. So, if you

[29:04] ever go there, just I've just noticed that.

[29:08] » Um so, trying to make those what you saying order of the

[29:16] right place, the right place to be separated by the right amount of

[29:20] distance or together or what. But Jim didn't know the connectivity and we

[29:24] talked a little bit about how subdivisions and zoning, you know, you

[29:28] build a subdivision, you build a subdivision and they're just kind of

[29:31] desperate. They're not connected. But we really do as we want to master plan our

[29:35] city need to be thinking about how do we provide for future connectivity knowing

[29:40] there's going to be some sidewalks to nowhere until we connect that but if

[29:43] there requirements for putting that in then eventually we'll start connecting

[29:47] them or the city might take a path if the side connect

[29:53] » awesome yeah

[29:57] it's it's also a balance of there's families that have been in the valley

[30:01] for decades So they they love why they're here and they don't always want

[30:07] the change. Um so it's it's a it's that balance of really trying to make sure

[30:12] that we're that they feel heard and that the reason they want to stay here is

[30:16] also >> defin

[30:20] we know how and I haven't had a chance to read that just

[30:24] 35 point fits in this play.

[30:30] Um, yes, I will come back to that in just a second to hit on what you're

[30:36] saying. That will be yes, the thing that we kind of tie in, right? We're not

[30:40] going to change the way Belair looks with the zoning regulation update. How

[30:43] do we tease it? How do we make it more flexible, more predictable for people,

[30:48] for citizens, so that people can not be out of shock when something new goes in?

[30:52] Right. So, yes, >> I just want to say one piggyback thing

[30:56] there. I agree with that. Um, I think it's important to see what strengths

[31:01] Belair has, what unique characteristics Belair has and and and and try to try to

[31:09] maintain those to some degree and not just be a meto city like, oh, we want to

[31:14] be like dirty, we want to be like God, we want to be like mates. No, look at

[31:18] what's made us really different >> and sure we maintain some of those

[31:24] special qualities. So that's if you got more nerds that that's what I I was in

[31:30] that thing. >> Awesome.

[31:32] » Yes. So So for some more context on with the comprehensive plan um so the

[31:37] comprehensive plan that's a legal requirement by the state of Kansas and

[31:40] by most states um to have in place before you can enforce zodia

[31:46] regulations. So you have to be able to tell a citizen we've thought through the

[31:50] next 10 years. We've looked at our utilities. We've talked to citizens.

[31:54] we've gathered all this feedback um and that gives us the legal right to say you

[31:59] cannot build a so and so on your residential plotted neighborhood. Um so

[32:06] the comprehensive plan is much more visionary in um just in its personality

[32:12] of a document. I guess if you can give a document a personality, right? It goes

[32:17] through we can come back to um one of these slides here.

[32:22] You have four value statements. There's only two of them here. Economic

[32:25] development and housing. Um but we can read this uh paragraph for housing here

[32:30] real quick. Retaining residents in Belair over the next 15 years will

[32:34] largely hinge on housing. If resident is able to rent or purchase a starter home,

[32:39] move into a larger home as their family expands, and then downsized during

[32:42] retirement, Belair will have served them well. City can proactively take steps to

[32:47] ensure that missing piece of housing stocks, the missing pieces of housing

[32:51] stock are incentivized and eventually built to keep citizens in Belair. Um, so

[32:55] those are the type of that's like the level that we're looking at when we're

[32:58] looking at the comprehensive plan, right? is like this is a thing that

[33:02] needs to be addressed and this is what we heard from your citizens that needs

[33:05] to be addressed as well as planners looking at the city. This is what we

[33:09] recommend. Um and then we list these goals. So you'll see they're pretty

[33:12] vague, right? Like goal number three is promote multiple housing types and

[33:16] densities of housing to ensure residents at all stages of life can remain in

[33:19] Belair. Goal four, support and encourage maintenance and redevelopments of

[33:22] underutilized and or deteriorating existing neighborhoods. Um because that

[33:27] this is a plan for the next 10 to 15 years. So this is the uh the workload

[33:33] basically of your staff here um and you all is how do we achieve these goals

[33:37] over the next 10 to 15 years. So many ways you can do that. Um this zoning

[33:43] regulation update is like the next best step to start to do that. Does that kind

[33:48] of give more context for that piece? And it's a little bit but this is on

[33:52] your website. Um it is a large document but there's a lot of pictures. So I

[33:56] would recommend working through it. um that is the comprehensive plan will be

[34:01] updated annually by the planning commission. So that is something that

[34:05] you guys will continue to review as being

[34:07] » just to kind of add to a little bit your about things that get requested changed.

[34:12] Some of that comes from our side too like we'll review a plan at planning

[34:15] commission or we'll review the city council and we'll go wait here's

[34:18] something missing here and we'll say hey we want to sidewalk there connection. So

[34:22] it goes both ways. But I think the intent of updating our zoning is so it's

[34:26] very clear what our expectations are of the developers and what we're providing

[34:30] our citizens. So that hopefully we have less and less and less of that over

[34:34] time. But also one thing I've observed is developers will come in and ask for a

[34:39] change and a lot of times I'll hear hey this is how Witchah does it or this is

[34:44] how and so they're used to developing in areas across the area and our code is so

[34:49] old and so dated that a lot of those little things have just not caught up

[34:54] and I'm not saying that everything Wita does or everything that Derby does is

[34:58] going to want to do but I think there is probably a decent chunk of the issues

[35:02] we're having are probably related to we're kind of on some of those things

[35:08] and that's what I've observed over the last several weeks since I've been on

[35:11] council when they have asked for adjustments or changes. It seems like

[35:15] it's rooted in it's kind of normal but you guys are different.

[35:19] » So how these aren't good I'm not saying get rid of all

[35:22] » there are good differences but there are four things that would totally be up if

[35:27] they were yeah >> press four. All right, if there are no

[35:30] more questions, we're gonna move on to your this is your second discussion

[35:33] question that you'll do on your tables again and then we'll move on with the

[35:38] evening. Um

[35:44] the next section,

[35:50] » what is the most common development oriented complaint you hear in Belair?

[35:56] » Yeah. No, this is small small groups first. I know what one answer is going

[35:59] to be. I know if anyone can come up with something other than duplexes, you can

[36:03] start

[36:25] Okay.

[36:55] When you start getting

[37:14] down, I mean, that's all

[37:24] that

[37:39] burning city.

[37:48] about

[38:07] you know

[38:13] what's

[38:22] Thursday

[38:25] night

[38:41] special.

[40:06] All right.

[40:10] » I hope that was some good. >> I'm sure you guys all want to hear these

[40:15] things. I'm interested in your guys's answers for this one, too. And the

[40:19] previous one, sorry. >> All right, let's start over here again.

[40:23] Come up with [laughter]

[40:31] your hand. it would be deeplexes idea like

[40:37] like on one hand you know and I feel this way too like but the bedroom

[40:41] community isn't such a slur to me because we're close to W 11 nice things

[40:48] to say you know like you've been here for 20 years you like a restaurant but

[40:52] you don't want all the hassles of restaurant or maybe more people coming

[40:56] up here that might cause other issues. So just that tension of how do you grow?

[41:00] How do you grow in an organic way where you're not putting your thumb on the

[41:03] scale maybe with incentives that don't make sense but at the same time there's

[41:07] an upper use in just

[41:15] so um we're not going to say the word [laughter] and but I think in some way

[41:21] it's a bit of a red herring and I want to go back to what we talked about when

[41:26] planning commission meetings what I gave you some homework because I know that

[41:30] there's these laws which just come down to

[41:32] Kansas that would make it difficult for us to do anything if you single out a

[41:36] certain type of house. But as I thought about it really I don't think people are

[41:41] necessarily complaining about a duplex. What they're complaining about is 200 of

[41:46] the exact same floor plan, exact same color side by side. And I think if even

[41:50] if those were million dollar single family homes, if they were all identical

[41:54] floor plan, all identical color side by side in the same subdivision, we'd all

[41:58] have the same complaint. So I think when you listen to what people mean versus

[42:03] what they say is the homogeneity, right? We all love variety. And I think

[42:09] one of the things I think people should look at is is there a way in that we can

[42:15] force the developers to have some kind of variety whether it's duplexes, single

[42:18] family homes, forplexes, apartments, I don't care

[42:23] regardless of residential type. We want variety. And so if we had that as

[42:33] goal number three or statement number three that would go back I'd like to see

[42:38] that driven out in the individual zone.

[42:44] » Yes, we will get to that next. >> So I think so not single out a type of

[42:49] residential property but we want variety.

[42:54] » Awesome. Yeah. Um, to go off of that, I live in a

[42:58] neighborhood that is filled with duplexes and I find a new one almost

[43:03] every month that I didn't know was there prior because of the design of the homes

[43:06] or I live in Riverside. So, you drive through and you never realize that's a

[43:10] duplex until you notice there's two addresses on the front. Where's the how

[43:14] they where are they going? So, yeah, it's a great a great comment.

[43:17] » I'll add on to that. I think also besides the variety, I think the mix,

[43:21] and we talked about this a little bit, the mix of green space, sidewalk

[43:25] accessibility, some of those things do get more cramped when you're just trying

[43:30] to fit as many duplexes as we can on that partial, you know, 40 acre lot. So,

[43:35] if we're thinking about making a requirement, it may needs to be more

[43:38] driven to our vision of how much green space do we need per acre or whatever

[43:44] metric we come up with. And maybe that can help drive a little bit of no matter

[43:48] whether it's duplex or a single favorite, it's going to have these

[43:50] things and that could help to y >> as we're saying that I was kind of

[43:56] thinking those same things. So I think you it's well well said the way you put

[44:00] it

[44:07] » as I am in uh the outside of I don't know exactly what I'm called but

[44:21] » but anyway those of you who have known me for a while know there are few things

[44:26] I talk house and one of them is lighting. Okay, those are the kinds of

[44:32] things that you look at I think in zoning from the standpoint of people

[44:38] from the outside looking at your city when they come in. example

[44:45] for part of the community. I live on Greenwood Road. If you come down 85th

[44:51] Street and Greenwood Road, people talk about the Christmas tree.

[44:57] You know what that is? That's a SEMA facility and it's all referred to as the

[45:02] Christmas tree. People talk about the duplexes. They all look alike. And then

[45:08] there's another issue that's coming about with this zoning too that we need

[45:11] to think about our whole society how we're becoming more geared towards even

[45:17] light pollution. You know, it used to be water pollution. It used to be, you

[45:23] know, soil pollution. Now we're looking at black pollution also. So this is what

[45:28] some of this thing of the zoning changes can do is to look forward and bring Bair

[45:35] into this concept of all the way around, you know, beyond the city limits.

[45:42] » Thanks. >> I got one thing I'd like to density

[45:44] versus green space and pocket. So the more dense populated and area it

[45:52] is, the more green space and pocket parks they need to be able to get out.

[45:57] Imagine living in Soviet Russia during the 1970s.

[46:03] You're in 20story building and there's a park outside. This whole room is the

[46:09] building and this is so we need to have a we need to put

[46:15] something in. It's been done in those cities where density

[46:20] per acre of major has to have so many

[46:28] feet of square feet or square yards of open space pocket parks.

[46:34] » And the pocket parks are so important for a neighborhood because where the

[46:39] kids go to they walk to the park and then they it's five tin the houses down

[46:47] where the parents go with kids where the parents they meet the other parents that

[46:52] neighborhood forms to cohesive identity.

[46:58] » Yeah, I I guess I'll let's say several of these concepts together. I

[47:03] know the question is is a little bit broader than what I'm about to say. I

[47:08] would say what I hear is reflexes. So that but I think um one thing that Brian

[47:16] mentioned and you got V mentioned I think what I would like to see is a

[47:22] variety a variety of lot sizes >> in in this in let's say one subdivision

[47:29] typical subdivision we need a variety of lot sizes you need

[47:34] a variety of housing types like talked about maybe they're not all good places.

[47:40] Maybe they're not all single family, but maybe a variety of living choices,

[47:44] creative living choices and a variety of green space. And even if there's two

[47:51] adults that wanted to share a nice green space and it was a special green space,

[47:57] maybe that that's an opportunity to save some of the financial burden often by

[48:01] developer. So, okay, this development, this 4 acres has to be green space and

[48:06] this 4 acres has to be green space. there could be a little bit space on

[48:11] shares. So I guess variety is

[48:20] thing I got brought up was what is our we said the key word but uh the second

[48:26] biggest thing is just not having sidewalks or sidewalks and this is

[48:31] usually an issue in older parks failure. It's obviously not as big an issue in

[48:35] our new subs because most of those can't say all most of them have sidewalks on

[48:40] at least one side. Some of them have it on both, but there are some new

[48:44] specifically duplex development that did not get sidewalks put in. So that's a

[48:49] problem in my opinion with the density. Uh so the other issue is just we we kind

[48:55] of a couple times of green space. I don't know if it's city parks. I think

[48:59] when I hear pocket park sets probably tends to lend itself to requiring an HOA

[49:05] supply that and us not taking on more city general budget to do that. But um I

[49:12] think it is probably the second biggest thing I hear is just not having enough

[49:16] connectivity, enough sidewalks, enough safe space to walk, bike

[49:22] and other timing under what said. Yeah, I agree. The city doesn't need anything

[49:29] more than the budget like five huge parks.

[49:32] » But you know, sometimes simplicity is fun. like maybe it's okay to have a

[49:38] green space because it can just be, >> you know, it doesn't have to have a

[49:44] $350,000 play set. It can just be gratitude

[49:54] what Tyler said. >> I'm gonna come to the staff table real

[49:57] quick. What do we think? I'm a little biased, but um I think in

[50:03] addition to um the zoning code related to housing and I know we talked a lot

[50:07] about the types of I'm worried about retail and commercial opportunities

[50:12] because oftent times when you have a little something it brings people into

[50:17] the city and when you only have houses of thinking, oh my gosh, I've got to

[50:21] drive 10 miles to get to a grocery store. I got it. So, I think retail uh

[50:25] the right kind of retail in the right kinds of places according to the

[50:28] comprehensive plan is going to be really important and I know that sometimes when

[50:32] you get a few a few more may come, right? And so, we're starting to see a

[50:36] little bit of that right now and I'm really excited about that. Um as long as

[50:39] it's the right kind and what people want and so I think um I think that's really

[50:43] helpful because I don't want to continue I don't want Belair to continue to rely

[50:47] on driving some other city all the time. I I appreciate having some of those

[50:52] conveniences in the city.

[50:57] » You do. You do. The reality >> it's not quite zoning related, but we're

[51:01] about ready and some of the new council members are going to experience their

[51:04] first bond issue. Pro special assessments are the main one I hear. And

[51:11] and and it's all tied together, guys. That's what's fun. It's uh it's

[51:15] interesting how citizens want one thing and then the other and then retail is

[51:22] another big one. >> The other thing when I'm talking is it's

[51:26] funny how why do people move to Valair? They want to look up at the sky. They

[51:29] want to go to their backyards and have that sense of I'm outside the city but

[51:35] also, you know, close to the city. So, how do we preserve that feeling of and I

[51:40] hate hate to say it, but you know that I'm out in the open but not out in the

[51:44] open and that's where we talk about lot sizes and and those types of things. So,

[51:49] those are the three things I get. >> Okay, thanks you guys. That was really

[51:55] informative, really good. Um, we are going to move on to project philosophy.

[52:02] Lance is going to take it from here. gets to all fun

[52:10] act and she says lance once you can be in there just deflate everybody's

[52:15] » conditions >> like a in parks and wreck the show it's

[52:18] a lot like cities there's the two finance guys and one of them like talks

[52:22] about all the good things they're going to do and then the other guys launches

[52:25] the budget >> welcome to another guy

[52:28] » so I'm generally the second least popular person at every party the first

[52:33] finance guys. So, at least I have you guys beat. So, I don't have to worry

[52:37] about paying, right? Say that jokingly because uh that is a point that I'm

[52:43] going to try to make. So, what we're trying to do here tonight is kind of

[52:47] what we've started with. Trying to get some of your guys's thoughts, ambitions,

[52:51] the things that you guys struggle with, start to kind of put some context around

[52:56] what this next version of your zoning code will look like. Um,

[53:02] the other part of what we're trying to do tonight is kind of ground you guys.

[53:06] So, we're all marching forward with this with the same goals in mind. So, what is

[53:11] this project going to do? What is this project not going to do? Are we going to

[53:15] be able to address every single thing that every person in this room wants to

[53:19] address? No. Uh, so what is our purpose? So, we're going to pause. We're going to

[53:25] talk about a little bit of that here in the middle and then we're going to get

[53:28] some we're going to hope we'll try to set some priorities so we can at least

[53:32] identify those really big ticket items that we have to make as part of this

[53:37] update. Again, we will not be perfect. This will not be a code that you guys

[53:43] adopt and never has to be touched again. That's how we get into the situation

[53:49] we're in now, right? where we've kind of got to reset, go back to foundations,

[53:53] figure out what's important, and figure out what we need to do just to make it

[53:57] work correctly. The one piece, and I caught most of that last thing that I'm

[54:02] not that's not on this section that I wanted to mention, I want to I want to

[54:08] remind everyone the difference between encouragement of and requirements and

[54:14] regulations. So just because we want our built

[54:18] environment, our city to look a specific way, uh there are different ways we can

[54:23] make that become reality or actuality. Some of that is through our requirements

[54:28] and our regulations. You must do this, right? Not everything fits a zoning code

[54:33] in that way. So not saying that this is applicable or not, but just to use an

[54:38] example because we've talked a lot about variety of lot sizes, variety of housing

[54:43] types, all those things, right? Can you write a regulation that requires that?

[54:48] We're going to find out, right? Uh but there are other mechanisms that a city

[54:52] can use to encourage that rather than just require that or have the

[54:57] regulation. So I want you to be thinking in that mindset, too. Not only are we

[55:02] talking about requirements and laws here within the zoning ordinance, uh, but

[55:07] even if it's not appropriated or does it fit well in a zoning ordinance, some of

[55:13] these ambitions and goals can live elsewhere. Uh, which we can talk about

[55:17] those as we go. So, I'm actually going to let Kylie

[55:22] explain that. I don't want me to have all the fun. So, I'll let Kylie explain

[55:26] this slide, then we'll get into the real stuff.

[55:29] » Okay. So this analogy is usually given um for time management, right? What are

[55:33] your rocks in your life? What are your pedals? What are your stay? So rocks are

[55:37] like I have to eat three times a day. Um me, I have to also snack like three or

[55:41] four times a day. Love snacks. Um I need eight hours of sleep and I need to hang

[55:46] out with my husband, right? That might be your rocks. And then your pebbles

[55:49] could be um I I like to cook. I like to um hang out with my neighbors. These are

[55:56] things that add value to my life, but they're not required for me to survive.

[56:00] And then the sand are things that are just now I have free time. What am I

[56:03] going to do? Right? I'm going to read a book or go outside. Um, so you pick

[56:10] where your things land. But that's basically what we're saying here is if I

[56:15] only read books and never eat lunch, then I will not continue to survive as a

[56:20] human, right? That would be putting my sand in before my rocks and my pebbles

[56:23] go in. So you have to put in your big things first that are the most important

[56:27] then the next important and then fill in around the rest. So for this project the

[56:32] most important thing is organizing the code right the zoning code currently

[56:36] does not flow in the most uh what do I want to say intuitive way right that the

[56:43] organization of this will be the rocks we have to get the right sections in the

[56:47] right place the right things in the right order and it has to talk well to

[56:50] the subdivision regulations and then the pebbles the next important thing we're

[56:54] going to look at are districts and uses so that's single family residential

[56:59] multif family residential um light commercial, heavy commercial,

[57:03] light industrial, heavy industrial, those types of uh zoning districts, what

[57:08] your piece of property is zoned and then what is allowed to happen on that piece

[57:12] of property. Those are the next level of importance. And then the final thing,

[57:16] the sand that fills in the jar um that we do absolutely last um is the

[57:22] regulations. So that is what we were talking about earlier like what is the

[57:26] uh recommended acre per density of green space for this housing development right

[57:32] how far do we want these street trees to be placed apart from one another what

[57:36] type of architectural facade do we want people to use on their buildings those

[57:40] are the sand things so that would be something that we have to shift our

[57:45] minds is away from wanting to fill out all of those sand regulations right

[57:50] because we say okay I know I want brick and limestone stone with the spots. Why

[57:53] can't we just write that as a regulation? We're not there yet. We have

[57:57] to start with the organization so that we can get there without just making

[58:01] things more confusing in the process. That make sense? Does that land? Cool.

[58:06] She's an analogy expert, so I give all analogies to her. How long is that gonna

[58:11] take? >> Two weeks now. No, I'm No. I I think a

[58:17] lot of the pacing of this project. So, we will cover all of these as part of

[58:21] this project. A lot of the pacing I'll have we'll have a better idea of

[58:26] following the end of this workshop and before our next workshop. next workshop

[58:29] which we'll talk about we'll be presenting actual districts and UC

[58:36] we'll see how close we are as a group to getting through that. So, I hate

[58:42] putting, but my goal is to have full draft zoning code in the minimal

[58:48] subdivision that we're touching by the end.

[58:51] That's the goal. And as Kylie knows, I'm meetings I'm in never go late. Projects

[58:57] never go beyond the deadline. >> And steering phase like yourself never

[59:02] request another meeting like

[59:10] Okay. So what hopefully this will look like at the end it will not we are not

[59:14] going to be submitting this to some national you know hopefully some

[59:18] national award there's not going to be a number of cities that are going to be

[59:22] like I want their code so what is successful for us at this stage of what

[59:26] we're trying to do as Kylie mentioned our code is not overly organized user

[59:31] friendly which means we have a lot of compliance issues development has a lot

[59:35] of risk that's unnecessary homeowners don't really know what to do it drags

[59:40] down staff time. So, they can't be proactive. They're very reactive. So,

[59:44] hopefully our code by the end of this is well organized. It's consistent. We've,

[59:49] as Paula can tell you, uh we often are debating conflicts in your code. It says

[59:55] one thing in one section and contradicts it in another section. We got to figure

[59:59] out what it says. So, organized, consistent. Uh we always give cities

[1:00:04] this as kind of the the process or the pathway. So we did your guys'

[1:00:08] comprehensive plan that can set those goals and those ideals. Now the zone

[1:00:12] goes next which is a tool to implement that comprehensive plan. So better it

[1:00:17] should be aligned with that comprehensive plan. So remember one of

[1:00:21] the reasons why we did comprehensive plan A is because it's not just us in

[1:00:25] this room that's saying we want our city to be this. It should be something that

[1:00:30] is reflective of the community consensus. So always should be relating

[1:00:34] back to the adopted comprehensive plan. If we can make this easier to either

[1:00:39] self administer or staff administer administer or for you guys on the

[1:00:44] planning commission to make decisions and city council to make decisions.

[1:00:47] That's what we want to do. So, we want to be necessarily strict and have heavy

[1:00:54] requirements where it makes sense from a community vision perspective, but those

[1:00:58] places where we want people can do business or we want they're going to do

[1:01:02] it for the code. We want it to be predictable and easy enough to do. I

[1:01:07] don't want anyone to say, I don't want to move to Belair. I don't want to build

[1:01:10] in Bair. I don't want to start a business in Bair because the process is

[1:01:15] too hard. And then uh again to use a different

[1:01:19] analogy, I'm not highly going to be nearly as good, but we're at the

[1:01:23] foundation phase, right? So we'll continue to add on and do renovations

[1:01:28] and maybe focus on one piece of the house, one room at a time in the future,

[1:01:33] but we got to get the framing, the foundation, everything ready. That's

[1:01:37] what success will look like for this phase hopefully by the end of the year.

[1:01:42] So what this project is and what this is not. So my goal is with this is just to

[1:01:48] make sure that we're being efficient with your guys' time and you guys

[1:01:52] understand what our role is. So when we get to the end of this uh it's a success

[1:01:57] for everybody. So this is a project to build a stronger foundation for you guys

[1:02:03] when you're making decisions on some basis. Um it will align with the 2035 or

[1:02:09] the ballet comprehensive plan. We will reorganize this. We'll modernize the

[1:02:14] structure to bring it up to best practice. We'll look at your zoning

[1:02:18] districts and your procedures, your definitions because right now they're

[1:02:22] kind of all over the place. They're usable, right? We use them on a daily

[1:02:26] basis, but we can definitely make this uh this work a lot easier. Our goal as

[1:02:31] planners when we write zoning regulations now is you shouldn't have to

[1:02:35] have a master's in planning to read with them. So, we try to use common language

[1:02:41] as much as we can. There are some terminology that genius what it is. Uh

[1:02:46] but if a homeowner can't understand it and they're constantly asking Paul of

[1:02:50] interpretations which happens uh I don't know how many times a day follow a lot

[1:02:56] » a lot. >> That means we we need to do a better job

[1:02:58] as a profession and writing this for people to understand. Uh and then

[1:03:03] that's the last. So what we're not doing we're not rewriting every single

[1:03:08] regulation in this country. I am not going to sit down and draft a brand new

[1:03:13] landscape code that specifies the the types of uh allowable species. We're not

[1:03:19] going to get into that level of detail. Um are there things that we can kind of

[1:03:24] pick the h maybe some high touch things? Yes, we're we'll be looking at lot sizes

[1:03:29] and maximum building heights and setbacks and all the things we typically

[1:03:33] think about uh for sure. But some of those hightouch unique items to to the

[1:03:40] city of Delair, we're not going to be diving into these. Those are the later

[1:03:44] additions or revisions. We do a good job organizing here. Then maybe phase two of

[1:03:49] this project is looking at your landscape, but phase three potentially

[1:03:53] looking at your parking. That one's got a little aspect next to it. We might

[1:03:57] talk real about that. every complaint that you've ever got with the issue

[1:04:01] that's been raised by a resident, a business owner, a developer or yourself,

[1:04:06] we don't we're not going to get into that level of detail here. It will not

[1:04:10] be perfect. The foundation, the organization will be perfect, but there

[1:04:15] will always be something to touch. We will kind of benchmark you guys against

[1:04:21] other communities. So, let's say we look at lot sizes, right? I want to know what

[1:04:25] Goddard and Vandover and Witchaw and Skicha and everyone's doing. Uh but

[1:04:31] we're not we're not aiming to be like anyone. We're also not aiming to be

[1:04:36] unlike anyone. We want you guys to have context of what is happening here, but

[1:04:42] we want those to be reflective of what you guys want to be as a city. So you

[1:04:46] guys are going to say, I heard Dodd's done this or I heard Derby's doing this.

[1:04:50] That's perfectly fine. We just have to make sure it's right for your nexus.

[1:04:56] You will find at the end of next year when you implement this, you will find a

[1:04:59] mistake. Somebody codes are complex, right? People will find something. I

[1:05:04] know. Believe me, it shocks us when people find our mistakes. This happens

[1:05:09] like maybe never forgets to me. But uh you guys will find things you want to

[1:05:14] keep. Maybe not even like a mistake, but something like, "Oh, I didn't really

[1:05:19] think that all the way through." So, that's just the way zoning codes work.

[1:05:24] They are living documents. They should be updated, reviewed every every year. A

[1:05:29] lot of times after a case, you'll recognize or question a resident will

[1:05:34] call like, "I've never really had to incorporate that or interpret that. I

[1:05:38] don't really like it." So, I just want to set that expectation. Now, there will

[1:05:41] be some of these things. So, we want to keep you guys at least to start at this

[1:05:46] higher level, right? The rock's not the same. Any questions about what this

[1:05:51] project is or what this project is not now that I've deflated everybody's So,

[1:05:58] I'm going to say this in like the most negative way possible clearance. Don't

[1:06:02] take it the wrong way. That's my stuff. Um, so are you telling us that, hey, we

[1:06:08] just heard your number one complaint to Europeans, but this project's not going

[1:06:12] to address that? No, we are looking like if those things if those things can be

[1:06:18] incorporated, we want now like that specific example like yes, we want to

[1:06:24] know the number of every complaint that's

[1:06:29] will address the number one complaint. We all pre-wesome

[1:06:44] variety issues. >> No, we will very much be looking at 90

[1:06:51] » and we'll talk a little bit more about how we get there towards the end. Yeah,

[1:06:55] I think it has to be data driven too because I think there's a perception

[1:06:58] that there is a ton of something and data just doesn't that so you do have to

[1:07:04] be cognizant of perception versus reality and then how do we overcome that

[1:07:09] as a part of this project too. you know, there there are ways to market

[1:07:13] that information out, right? It's just a decision we have to make as a city of

[1:07:17] how we're going to communicate, what our changes are, why they were made, and

[1:07:21] maybe some statistics on our housing inventory.

[1:07:25] » I think that's a good idea no matter what we do on a regular

[1:07:30] » what air is defines it better. >> I think it's to your point just for our

[1:07:35] notes. So we did look at uh existing land uses as part of the comprehensive

[1:07:41] plan. That's a year and a half ago year and a half or so ago that we pulled that

[1:07:45] data. So we can simply update that map and maybe we present that next

[1:07:50] workshop. We'll give you an update with land use because we'll be talking about

[1:07:54] land usees next. So we'll present it here and figure out really

[1:08:00] lance. One thing I I think we need to talk about is I've been to the uh

[1:08:07] planning and zoning and each and every time we have a board of zing

[1:08:14] landscape weave landscape off I think is a

[1:08:19] mistake. We have to have some baselines so we're not okay. We're gonna do this

[1:08:25] over here and this person wants to do this. I think it's it's a it's a mistake

[1:08:30] not to attack that. I generally agree that your guys's landscape code needs

[1:08:37] work. I think everyone in here would agree with that. The way that we have

[1:08:41] this project scheduled right now is we're going to take what's in your

[1:08:45] landscape code. We're going to reorganize it, make it fit within the

[1:08:50] the updated code. So, you're not getting rid of Mscape. The same requirements

[1:08:54] that are on developments for landscape and for houses will be there in the end

[1:09:00] uh as part of this project. Um, if we want to write and revise the landscape

[1:09:05] code because that's a completely different

[1:09:08] part of our brain subject matter expertise, we can definitely do that.

[1:09:13] That's not really my my goal is to take what we have and make it enforceable.

[1:09:20] » Yeah. Yeah. Little tweaks like that we certainly will be looking because we say

[1:09:25] 2 in somebody I want to put one. >> Yeah. Why you want to put one in? Well,

[1:09:30] that's not good enough. >> Well, that's why landscape specifically.

[1:09:34] I don't want to get off on landscape on my own. That's why it's so challenging

[1:09:39] because enforcement is a major piece of landscape code. You're going to have the

[1:09:45] greatest most extensive landscape code in the world, but if you don't have

[1:09:49] equal if you don't spend equal time thinking about how you're going to

[1:09:52] enforce the thing, it doesn't really matter so much. So, a lot of that is

[1:09:57] outside of the realm the realm of the community development department

[1:10:02] includes other departments. It includes budget and finance and all those things.

[1:10:06] But we will certainly look to improve on your existing landscape code. We will

[1:10:10] not totally remove as the the thing about landscape code is certificate of

[1:10:17] occupancy. >> That's

[1:10:23] until somebody wants a certificate of occupancy in November and they can't

[1:10:27] plant the landscape until next spring. >> Eight months. Yeah. That's like bring

[1:10:33] back to wrap this up pretty quick. I don't know if it's done through

[1:10:37] presentation but >> almost we have no more activity for you

[1:10:40] guys. So I will >> of course not the duplexes being

[1:10:47] » and talking about how heavyhanded we want to be because I don't I don't know

[1:10:50] it's really duplexes it's like cheap housing or or things that are going to

[1:10:55] look rund down or out of place. That's something that I'd like to talk about

[1:11:00] here. you know how talking about maybe having and how many requirements and

[1:11:04] facads and things like that that we don't care how many people fit in there

[1:11:12] » how do you agree neighborhood it's been 20 years we'll do something with the

[1:11:14] city right >> well I'll end the density is still an

[1:11:18] issue for me like we do need to get more defined off how many duplexes are we

[1:11:23] going to allow piece of l like can't we set that like maybe we don't agree with

[1:11:28] how many are being fed into a certain And there's nothing wrong with us saying

[1:11:33] I get [clears throat] your lot size variations but we can come up with what

[1:11:37] we feel comfortable allowing >> yeah like dirt it's black and white 40%

[1:11:44] of any type of vision can be duplexes so yeah so thatation that can happen

[1:11:53] » I don't want to prolong it but you're in a kind of unique position because you've

[1:11:57] worked with the city for a year or so Now, talking about the foundations,

[1:12:01] what's maybe one thing that you see in our code that we should think about when

[1:12:05] we're addressing in these meetings? Um, because you're very familiar with our

[1:12:09] code, but yet Lance travels throughout every city and runs these presentations.

[1:12:13] So, I'm just interested in your quick opinion.

[1:12:15] » Yeah. The biggest items for me working to implement your code on a daily basis

[1:12:21] is having a list of zoning districts that are functional that make sense that

[1:12:27] cover all of the different or different possibilities of development and within

[1:12:32] those zoning districts having a concentrated thought process in what's

[1:12:37] allowed and then when you get to a point to where use is appropriate. What are my

[1:12:42] setbacks? What is my maximum height? So just that basic that real basic

[1:12:47] understanding land uses where can I build it how do I build it mass and sus

[1:12:52] and those types of things uh are the biggest issues that we currently have

[1:12:56] with >> those are the foundational

[1:12:59] zoning 101ies what else if I said anything else

[1:13:04] » I think uses is a huge problem that's why you all see so many cases is because

[1:13:09] we at some point went down the laundry list versus the use list so right Now,

[1:13:14] Beller doesn't even allow restaurants >> anywhere in the city. You can't build

[1:13:17] » anywhere in the city. Restaurant without That's right.

[1:13:21] » So, that's an issue. That's a problem. >> Unfortunately, that was done on purpose.

[1:13:26] No, it was done on purpose when I first moved up here. They That was a source of

[1:13:30] pride for misplaced pride in my opinion, but that

[1:13:37] was a source of pride. They wanted to lock it down. So again, wrap yourself

[1:13:42] up. We are out of time. >> You guys are in charge. So you guys tell

[1:13:46] us okay

[1:13:50] » pretty brief individually. I'll give you 90 seconds so that we can wrap it up

[1:13:56] quickly. You're going to mark three priorities that you think we need to

[1:14:01] focus on for this.

[1:14:08] Sorry.

[1:14:22] [laughter]

[1:14:27] » Your call. >> Circle them, underline them, however you

[1:14:30] want to identify them on your paper.

[1:14:39] Does anybody need a pen? I think they already got one.

[1:15:16] keep them. I will take them at the end.

[1:15:20] » Yeah, I think what we'll do is then last three. Yeah, I know.

[1:15:27] » We're gonna have you guys try to find some commonality, but I think what we'll

[1:15:30] do is we'll just take them when you're done and then we'll go back and do some

[1:15:35] analysis and we'll just start next meeting with our next workshop with that

[1:15:40] uh to see where you guys agree. >> Well, then turns out I had a data

[1:15:44] question. Are you going back and if so, how are to see what kind of cases are

[1:15:48] you seeing >> to see a pattern of what people are

[1:15:51] asking for having to look at? We know I feel pretty confident

[1:15:58] anecdotally for the last year and a half, but before that we we haven't

[1:16:02] talked about it, but I think that's probably a really good idea.

[1:16:06] » So I told Paul and I talk about all the time if you've got a variance case

[1:16:09] that's the same variance case every time. You might want to change your ide

[1:16:15] if you can see data points and actually see our

[1:16:19] » things that we're constantly saying yes to that should be helpful. Well, and

[1:16:22] just a reminder, you've only had a couple of cases because up until

[1:16:27] recently, we haven't had a board of zoning appeals. So, you're those cases

[1:16:31] have not been bought, right? You'll you'll see more of the zoning change of

[1:16:36] uses, you know, those kinds of things. But as a BCA, you've not seen a lot of

[1:16:40] variance cases. So, >> you see other ones and see absolutely

[1:16:44] then you can decide does that fit our plan and then decide whether we want to

[1:16:48] adopt it. But it gives you more data points to actually help the kids to make

[1:16:52] their decisions off of. >> Oh, for sure.

[1:16:54] » That's a great point. So, one I'll just end here. So, the next workshop we have,

[1:17:00] we will be looking at those core building blocks. We will bring to you

[1:17:04] guys what we recommend are your zoning districts and we will be working through

[1:17:08] what uses are allowed in which zoning districts. So, we'll be digging in

[1:17:12] technically on the next workshop. After that, that's the foundation or the

[1:17:17] foundation. to the next workshop. So the third workshop will be looking at the

[1:17:21] regulations within those district groups. So lot sizes, max length, I set

[1:17:26] that more technical details. And then workshop four which to Ted I didn't I

[1:17:32] should have answered Ted's question with also this caveat is the other big piece

[1:17:37] is process and procedures that we have in our Z today need overhaul. So we will

[1:17:43] be looking at process and procedures and implementation in workshop four. You

[1:17:47] need more workshops. We'll travel down that road when we get there. Are all of

[1:17:51] these combined city council? >> Yes.

[1:17:54] » Okay. Would it be possible to have a single planning commission workshop?

[1:18:00] » I'm not opposed to it. I like it just to have you guys together sometimes because

[1:18:04] you guys work together, right? And you got to have that relationship.

[1:18:07] » So you get more Yep. There's two groups here once.

[1:18:12] » Yeah. No, I think we can definitely game plan that. I'm not opposed to it anyway.

[1:18:18] So, questions for me before the mayor kicks me out of those doors. [laughter]

[1:18:23] » It's always going to keep >> literally.

[1:18:27] If you have any questions, reach out. So, shoot them to Paula and Ted. They

[1:18:31] know how to get a hold of us. And just don't give out my personal information.

[1:18:34] Paul, >> I'm doing it.

[1:18:36] » You guys, >> I'm so doing it.

[1:18:38] » All right. Now you guys can have fun with the budget.

[1:18:42] » Thank you so much. That was really

[1:18:46] » just remember the buzzing

[1:18:53] question.

[1:23:46] Okay, let's continue the workshop with the uh presentation of the final draft

[1:23:51] of the 2027 budget, all funds. And I think Mr. Barry Smith is going to help

[1:23:57] us learn all about this. Thank you. >> Oh, yes. Good evening, Mayor Council. Uh

[1:24:02] tonight is the overall draft of the fiscal year 27 budget. Um we'll

[1:24:09] um review all the funds we've already presented. Um this time we'll also have

[1:24:13] the non- taxing funds included like streets, land bank, equipment reserve,

[1:24:17] bond and interest. Um the goal of tonight is just to receive comments and

[1:24:21] feedback and if there's anything else we need to change before our hearing on the

[1:24:25] first. [snorts]

[1:24:28] Just to recap with general fund, um, our 2027 valuation estimate came in at just

[1:24:32] over 142 and a half million, which was increased from about 130 million the

[1:24:36] year prior. [snorts] What does this mean for the

[1:24:39] city? At the same mill levy as last year, we'll generate um about 520ome or

[1:24:45] 514,000 more dollars in property taxes that we levy. our revenue neutral rate,

[1:24:51] which was if we didn't levy a dollar more than we did the year prior, would

[1:24:55] equate out to the 37.390 mills number there. So, if we didn't generate one

[1:25:00] more dollar of tax revenue than we did for this year in 26, that's what the

[1:25:04] overall mill levy would be at the end of the day.

[1:25:09] Here's a breakdown of the valuation estimate we received. breaks it out into

[1:25:13] real estate which is all real and personal property like businesses and

[1:25:16] commercials and residential housing personal property status assess

[1:25:20] utilities and which [clears throat] makes up our overall valuation. We had

[1:25:24] an overall increase of 9.66% um from 26 to 27.

[1:25:30] [snorts] So what's that mean? If we keep the same

[1:25:33] mill levy for a $250,000 house, the average increase of that 9.6% was 6.63%.

[1:25:40] So, the owner of a $250,000 home will roughly pay $70 more in taxes in fiscal

[1:25:46] year 27 than they did this year in 26. Um,

[1:25:52] and we last time we presented, we had those various various different

[1:25:55] calculation models and methods up there. So, that's what those other three charts

[1:25:58] are.

[1:26:01] So, I added in this slide for this presentation, which was the Epic Sports

[1:26:04] IRB that was recently um voted upon at our last meeting.

[1:26:09] This is a unique opportunity. I have never had this happen um during a budget

[1:26:12] cycle where an IRB sold midway through the year and not as planned at the very

[1:26:16] end of the year. So, I reached out to the county and figured out how they

[1:26:19] actually do this. And the appraisers's office, their answer was they'll take

[1:26:24] the total valuation of that property divided by 365.

[1:26:29] Whatever day is it sold, if there's 100 days left, they take that number times

[1:26:32] those 100 days, and that's what will come back on the tax roll for this

[1:26:35] budget cycle. So what does that basically mean? Well,

[1:26:40] that original valuation number I just talked about will actually increase to

[1:26:45] 146 million. Um, which will actually I miss I didn't update that one. It's 143

[1:26:50] million. The no value goes from 142 543 to 143 415. Since we've already set our

[1:26:58] cap of how many property tax dollars we can levy, that automatically pushes down

[1:27:03] the overall mill rate when it's calculated out. So, I calculated this

[1:27:08] based on a September 1st sale date, which I think it's going to sell this

[1:27:13] week or next. So, it actually be a little bit more. But even though our at

[1:27:18] our hearing our mill levy is going to be 41.003, 003 at the end of the year in

[1:27:22] November when those final taxation extra abstracts come out our mill levy should

[1:27:27] be around that 40.753 number and that's exactly how these IRB

[1:27:32] incentives are designed to work right when they come back on the tax role we

[1:27:36] absorb that into our property tax dollars which drives down the levy for

[1:27:41] everyone citywide especially residentials users since those are our

[1:27:45] highest tax base [snorts]

[1:27:48] don't hold me to that Exactly. It is an estimate. It's the first time I've been

[1:27:51] through this, but it should be hopefully it's pretty close to that number there.

[1:27:56] So, general fund, all of our revenues, what are those made up of? fines and

[1:27:59] fees charged for service, property taxes, sales taxes, um very small amount

[1:28:04] of those grants and other [snorts] once that revenue bucket um all the

[1:28:08] revenues come in that bucket tips over and that's how we pay for everything all

[1:28:12] of our city services that the general fund provides which is administration,

[1:28:16] wreck, PD, parks and facilities, planning and zoning and then all of our

[1:28:19] transfers to bond and interest our debt service payments etc. [snorts]

[1:28:26] Not much. Well, nothing has changed within all the departments. I can run

[1:28:30] through each one again if you want to or I can kind of skim back to the last

[1:28:34] slide of general fund. >> Yeah. If anybody wants to go through any

[1:28:38] of these details and just say so.

[1:28:44] » Okay. >> So, city manager, we're going to split

[1:28:48] an FTE um to assist with rec retention. We have some additional monies budgeted

[1:28:53] for engineering and legal services regarding Willon. It's there if we need

[1:28:56] it. If we don't need it, we don't spend it.

[1:29:00] [snorts] Um engineering on call engineering services are maintaining

[1:29:02] that PUC. Um added in some extra money for other additional engineering

[1:29:06] services, plan review for new subdivision developments, things like

[1:29:09] that. Of our finance department, we're g one

[1:29:13] of us can do the KUCPM course and we added that new waterwork software. We're

[1:29:17] going to continue that for 27. um governing body highlights here is

[1:29:22] just the annual chamber dues that we're gonna um start providing and then we

[1:29:29] increase hotel and travel because LKM will be in Kansas City next year for

[1:29:33] anyone that wants to attend. [snorts] Human resources actually had a slight

[1:29:37] deduction reduction from 26. [snorts] Um legal is going to get the

[1:29:43] other half that FTE we mentioned when talking about the city manager

[1:29:45] department. It's going to help with record retention. um sight increasing

[1:29:48] quantities and reducing contractuals for additional legal services.

[1:29:54] Question >> I don't I don't want to get hung up on

[1:29:57] details, but we're we're going to talk about the chamber in November, but

[1:30:00] that's just budgeted. >> Yeah. Yeah. Budgeted, I guess, would be

[1:30:03] the proper word. >> Sarah, if you need it, if we don't need

[1:30:06] it, don't got to spend it. [snorts]

[1:30:10] » Um court moving one part-time employee to full-time employee. um reduction in

[1:30:16] various items within the commodities, training, dues, memberships, supplies,

[1:30:18] and furniture. Um we're looking at the addition of that diversion project for

[1:30:23] 2027 and the utilization of code enforcement cases through municipal

[1:30:27] court start that process. >> Just just a comment on that. I'm kind of

[1:30:33] concerned about the amount of cases we're running through court and

[1:30:37] especially the continuitances. Um, I'm not saying change this, but I I

[1:30:43] do want to see us find a way to reduce that significantly because I that's

[1:30:49] expensive, especially continuences because every time you have continuous,

[1:30:53] especially if you had police officers had to come in or, you know, everybody

[1:30:57] has got to come back again and we're paying them every time they come. So we

[1:31:03] need to really work on on that and I know Mia and I have had some discussion

[1:31:07] about that but uh we need to see what we can do in that area. So,

[1:31:13] » and if I might not, you did great. Uh, the difficult part, too. And we can we

[1:31:18] can talk about continuations. That's kind of a separate matter and just the

[1:31:22] total volume as we grow. It's it's we really just, you know, the more people

[1:31:27] you have, the more cases tickets you're going to write and cases you're going to

[1:31:30] have as well. And I think that's part of the growing pains as well. I'm not I'm

[1:31:34] not saying we can't do measures to help reduce those numbers. It's just it we're

[1:31:39] really noticing that especially in um on the court and PD side is as we get

[1:31:44] bigger the more more tickets more uh misdemeanors and actually felonies as

[1:31:50] well. I think some of those too I'm not the expert at it but uh um it's um it's

[1:31:55] one of those things that's tough as you get keep growing.

[1:32:02] » Yes, I do I think Marie has done a fantastic job with Missile Core moving

[1:32:06] forward. Um, we actually received our draft audit today and I think we're one

[1:32:10] audit away from having any reference of Miss Pakort totally off there. So, kudos

[1:32:17] to Maria. Um, work with me on the internal control side of things, making

[1:32:20] sure everything's flushed out. Um, so just want to give Maria a quick shout

[1:32:25] out on that one. [snorts]

[1:32:29] Uh for police, no or we had an FT um full-time records clerk back in 26 27 no

[1:32:35] additional personnel were requested. Um just minor adjustments here and there to

[1:32:38] commodities contractuals moving forward. >> The pool um some increase for chemical

[1:32:45] costs at the pool and we also did include $35,000 for the coping repair

[1:32:50] next year at the pool.

[1:32:54] » Day camp. no significant changes for 2026. Um,

[1:33:00] recreation in general, increased the event planning line item to help with

[1:33:04] those events throughout the year. And for the capital projects, still waiting

[1:33:08] on getting that final direction on the rec center there. Um, when we get down

[1:33:12] to the CIP reserve fund later, we'll talk a little bit about the maintenance

[1:33:15] items for the rec center. [snorts] Senior services, no significant changes.

[1:33:23] Land development, the special assessments there, 42,000 of that will

[1:33:27] expire this year. So that's why you see our commodity line item there go from 79

[1:33:31] to 37 for 27. Uh 33,000 of that 37 will expire at the end of 35. So that's

[1:33:38] slowly going down as we pay off those special assessments. [snorts]

[1:33:42] This is where our land um debt service transfer comes from. So we bring in

[1:33:46] property tax revenues into the general fund. It gets transferred from the land

[1:33:50] uh department out of the general fund into our public building commission fund

[1:33:54] to make that debt service payment. So if you follow the money trail, that's where

[1:33:57] that's how that goes. [snorts] Parks. Um we added a facilities manager

[1:34:04] position back in 2026 as James Miller who's also here with us today. Um done a

[1:34:09] great job so far. correct quantities. We increased a little bit in playground

[1:34:13] equipment, replacement maintenance, vehicle equipment maintenance, um all

[1:34:16] those reoccurring items there. We moved all the capital items out to CIP. So the

[1:34:22] general fund for 27 is essentially strictly operating. The only really

[1:34:26] capital item in there is that pool coping for 27 [snorts]

[1:34:32] planning and zoning. We had $30,000 this year for the zoning code updates that we

[1:34:37] just had the workshop on downstairs. We reduce that to 7500 in 2027 for

[1:34:42] additional enhancements to the zoning code miscellaneous um engineering

[1:34:46] service needs which through PC and zoning code that's what that is

[1:34:53] for the facilities department here at city hall. We have that personnel

[1:34:58] placeholder for the compensation classification study for all general

[1:35:02] fund employees only. We budget that at 300,000 does not mean we'll spend that.

[1:35:07] Um, it just means we have room if the competence class study says we need to

[1:35:12] go that route. So, it's just sitting there if we need it. [snorts]

[1:35:16] This also handles the transfer to our CIP reserve fund. 415,000 100,000 to

[1:35:21] equipment reserve and 850,000 to the streets fund for the streets annual

[1:35:25] maintenance program. >> Can we go back a slide or two slides?

[1:35:29] Now, >> this one

[1:35:31] » we one more. So we had you had an engineering one where we pay PEC

[1:35:39] a retainer to do services for us,

[1:35:44] » but then I seem to see a bill every time we ask PC to do anything for us. What is

[1:35:49] the the money we pay them on a monthly a regular basis bias?

[1:35:56] » Sure. Um, [clears throat] so if you see a bill for and a lot of what you'll see

[1:36:02] on the AP ordinance might be related to inspection services for a certain

[1:36:07] project. So that means we contract them through a work order um that they'll

[1:36:12] inspect that particular project that's spread then spread on special

[1:36:16] assessments to the benefiting lot. What PC does for us on a monthly basis, boy,

[1:36:21] a lot. Um, one they we were talking earlier, Lance and Paula will review

[1:36:26] cases together. Um, I think they have a one once a week meeting. Um, that's a

[1:36:31] little bit of it. And we'll have all the reviews that we have for those

[1:36:36] subdivision projects they'll do um with under that MSA or that on call

[1:36:41] agreement. Um they also have um MS4 permit regulations that they handle for

[1:36:48] us that takes a load off an and her uh staff. Um we also have a general uh the

[1:36:54] traffic study you're going to hear next uh Tuesday from Tam Asure is done

[1:37:00] underneath that agreement. So these little little uh projects that I don't

[1:37:05] can't really give u uh that uh maybe take their professional traffic engineer

[1:37:12] five hours to do. We don't have to go out to bid or uh go out to a single work

[1:37:18] order. We just put it under that um that MSA.

[1:37:22] » So there's probably 20 other examples and I'll probably I can write I can

[1:37:26] write a good report on it if if you'd like, but those are the ones that come

[1:37:29] top of mind. >> Okay. [snorts] Thank you.

[1:37:33] » Another one of those is since we don't have a um GIS technician on staff,

[1:37:37] whenever a new subdivision comes online, they submit those GIS asbuilts with the

[1:37:43] um final asbuilt documents after construction's completed. Then PEC gets

[1:37:47] those uploaded to our GIS system for us. That's not the big thing to do.

[1:37:53] [snorts] >> Barry, while you're on that one, I did

[1:37:56] have a quick comment or question. No, the the next one. Uh, so we talked a

[1:38:01] little bit about moving Sky View Park forward.

[1:38:06] Where would that come from in this budget?

[1:38:08] » That would be the CIP reserve funds. >> Okay. So, that $415,000

[1:38:13] transfer is what would be covering at least part of that

[1:38:17] » if we move that forward. Okay. Yeah, I just wanted to clarify that.

[1:38:24] So here's just a brief overview of everything, all the highlights from each

[1:38:28] of those slides there. And then here's our overall revenues in,

[1:38:32] expenditures out, and change in fund balance. So the fiscal year 25 actual

[1:38:37] numbers are from our draft audit we just received today. Um, so through 2027,

[1:38:42] we'll be down to around 24.4% of our annual revenues.

[1:38:47] So I think we're sitting at a good spot there. [snorts]

[1:38:52] There's a note down there about the recent legislation. If they did pass

[1:38:56] that 3% cap this year, that would have caused a reduction of 355,000 in

[1:39:01] property tax dollars. So that reduction with all expenses in this budget would

[1:39:06] result in a deficit of 643 instead of 293 that it's currently at. This is just

[1:39:12] side note. [snorts]

[1:39:17] Utility funds. We went over this um at our last workshop or no regular council

[1:39:21] meeting um talking about water, sewer, storm, and solid waste. Water fund

[1:39:26] highlights. Um everything in here includes a 0% increase for 2027. We're

[1:39:32] adding in 75,000 additional for our personnel for the comp class study.

[1:39:37] maintaining our water tower maintenance at 75, water meter replacement program,

[1:39:41] GIS information input, uh maintain wish purchase, CCA operations, debt payments

[1:39:46] were adjusted, um included 75,000 for water sampling stations. Those are the

[1:39:52] blue water sampling stations you'll see outside along the roads now, which makes

[1:39:56] collecting samples a lot easier. Um as we grow, we'll get those installed

[1:39:59] around town, make that process very much more efficient. [snorts]

[1:40:04] Then also included is the 930,000 for water line replacements [clears throat]

[1:40:09] which was our 10-year CIP plan for that. Once again, these are just maintaining

[1:40:13] what we have. Nothing new, nothing additional at this point.

[1:40:18] So our change in fund balance there from 25 through 27, we are expected to be

[1:40:23] down around 27% of revenues.

[1:40:30] I do want to point out here, you'll see the capital projects line for 27.

[1:40:36] There's $ 1.92 million budgeted for that. And then down

[1:40:41] here, you'll only see a reduction of 700,000 in fund balance. That's because

[1:40:46] right now, currently, I have the 2026 waterline project also budgeted in 27

[1:40:52] because it's looking like it might roll over depending on the timing of 45th

[1:40:56] Street and that main replacement itself. So it's in there so we don't have to

[1:41:00] amend the budget next year. If we don't need to use it once again it

[1:41:05] won't be used

[1:41:11] as pursuer once again includes 0% increase for 27. We got the additional

[1:41:16] funds for the common class study 120,000 for chemicals. That's the chemical

[1:41:21] injections at the lift stations once we get that original or that main hole

[1:41:24] project up and going and completed. um 80,000 in system maintenance and

[1:41:29] repairs, CCUA payments were adjusted. Um the fence or wall around the Harding

[1:41:34] lift station. Um and then we're still working on refining that CIP plan

[1:41:38] longterm from there. But right now currently we do have that manhole

[1:41:41] project skated system all budgeted in there.

[1:41:45] [snorts] So from 25 to 27, those are our fund balance changes. Uh we get down to

[1:41:50] a 61% fund balance by the end of 27. still sitting in a pretty good position

[1:41:54] even with the 0% rate increases for water and sewer for 27

[1:42:00] solid waste. We just budget our accounts that we have that have trash accounts

[1:42:04] revenue in expenses out via the contract. Pretty straightforward. We did

[1:42:08] transfer an additional 100,000 from solid waste to streets since the fund

[1:42:12] balance could handle it and we're going to be sitting around 32% at the end of

[1:42:15] 27 >> and that's the rates on that are set in

[1:42:21] contract. So we don't have a we won't have a rate increase this year, right?

[1:42:24] » Correct. >> Okay. Thank you.

[1:42:26] » Whenever that is it July to June? >> June.

[1:42:30] » Yeah. So June. Yeah. I think that's when the first rate increase will take

[1:42:33] effect. [snorts] >> Storm water fund. We talked pretty

[1:42:38] extensive extensively about this um at the last meeting. Um our fund balance

[1:42:43] will be down to around 20,000 at the end of 2027. Um we workshop some ideas.

[1:42:48] We'll bring back uh some potential solutions to that later on.

[1:42:54] So non- taxing funds, where does the money come from for the streets fund?

[1:42:58] Comes from fuel taxes from the state and the county transfers from the general

[1:43:01] fund. [snorts] Land bank is just straight land

[1:43:04] sales. Bond and interest is transfers in from general fund, water fund, sewer

[1:43:09] fund. Equipment reserve transfer in from general water and sewer. And CIP is a

[1:43:14] transfer in from general. So these are all funds that are budgeted and the

[1:43:18] primary funds are just coming into these funds that are non-budgeted or non-

[1:43:21] taxing. SH's fund like I said relies heavily on

[1:43:24] the gas taxes from the state and the county. I think we're it's around

[1:43:28] 338,000 that we get from both state and county fuel taxes. Um and then the

[1:43:34] transfer from the general fund for the streets plan. So 27 we maintain those

[1:43:39] transfers. Um the fuel tax estimates surprisingly did increase for 27 about

[1:43:45] 19%. Um up from 26 or 25 expenditures the 2027 street maintenance plan 950,000

[1:43:53] pave street repair gravel repair snow and ice material and removal. Um

[1:43:59] currently working with our street [clears throat] maintenance plan

[1:44:02] individuals to get that continuous five-year plan rolling. I think Ted

[1:44:06] touched on that our last meeting about what next five years consists of

[1:44:11] fund balance there. Um get down to about 200,000 at the end of fiscal year 27

[1:44:16] which is about 14%.

[1:44:20] » Can you remind us again what the the target revenue or balance ending

[1:44:26] percentages? >> So in our comprehensive plan it's

[1:44:29] anywhere between 17 and 30. 17 would be >> so 30 is the high end

[1:44:34] » there. There's no official number. That's kind of our targets like right

[1:44:38] between 17 and 30. Yeah. >> Okay. Thank you.

[1:44:41] » That's I I wouldn't say this fund's different, but it's a unique fund in

[1:44:45] that it only handles streets and um I I think we would like to continue to

[1:44:50] bolster that to probably 17%, but we're we're comfortable it resting at 14

[1:44:55] knowing we have transfers available or any anything to bolster it up. But a lot

[1:44:59] of this expense is the street maintenance repair that we do on a

[1:45:03] yearly basis. So, we're pretty comfortable in the controls elements of

[1:45:07] this um fund. We're not quite relying on the state and county fuel tax

[1:45:12] distribution because it is >> 300,000 of a million

[1:45:17] » budget. I will say that just to keep it alive, I've been doing this for a long

[1:45:22] time and what fuel tax brings in doesn't nowhere near covers the the street

[1:45:28] maintenance uh that you need to do on streets. not a proponent of increasing

[1:45:32] it, but it hasn't changed since I think 1997. So, it's something that maybe the

[1:45:38] state legislators want to grapple with, but nothing kind of out of our hands.

[1:45:43] » I think they actually were toying with the idea of doing a holiday on that tax,

[1:45:48] but that it didn't go any worse. And I hope it never does because that I don't

[1:45:52] think they understand where that money goes. It's just kind of an interesting

[1:45:55] point and you know property taxes are 100% subsidizing the streets uh which is

[1:46:01] a fine process. I just want to make sure everybody understands that your your car

[1:46:05] taxes aren't really going to maintain the streets.

[1:46:09] » Okay.

[1:46:12] And then another point on that that percentage there, the streets fund, it

[1:46:17] doesn't have any um dedicated bills like debt service that we have to pay every

[1:46:22] year with just streets money. So that that threshold is a little more relaxed

[1:46:26] in this case. Now, if this a general fund or water or sewer, yeah, we would

[1:46:30] need to be getting that back up there within that range for sure. Um because

[1:46:34] we have those debt service payments for a long time coming out of those funds.

[1:46:37] So Barry, just to kind of restate that what you're saying is the control as you

[1:46:41] referred to really this is an annual fund that every year this body is

[1:46:45] approving. Yep, we're going to spend a million or we're going to spend 600,000

[1:46:49] or we're going to spend 1.5 depending on our priority. And that's kind of why you

[1:46:53] feel more comfortable because it's more project annual focused and less

[1:46:59] » we can change it a lot more than some of the other contractuals.

[1:47:04] » Yeah. And and this comes from the fiveyear street plan. So yeah.

[1:47:09] » Right. >> Yeah. Based on that plan, if four years

[1:47:12] from now we're going to need $1.3 million to do that annual plan, well,

[1:47:16] we'll track our spending. So we do have that within our means at that point in

[1:47:21] time. So it's going to eb and flow. [snorts]

[1:47:26] Land bank. Not much out of here. We just get some interest every year um and let

[1:47:31] our balance sit. We started off at 6.2 million25. Then we transferred out um

[1:47:36] the city portion of the base grant for the public works building. So that

[1:47:40] building is completely 100% paid for in cash. No debt service needed for that

[1:47:45] project. So great use of funds. Saved a bond payment for 20 years. Um by the end

[1:47:50] of 27, we're still sitting around a $3.7 million fund balance.

[1:47:57] An interest fund. This is just what pays our debt. It's funded by transfers in

[1:48:01] general fund water sewer. Um special assessments also go here and it goes

[1:48:06] right back out to pay the debt service for our annual payments.

[1:48:11] » Barry, I'm sorry I'm slow. >> If we go back to the land bank,

[1:48:17] um are there any restrictions on how we're allowed to use this money?

[1:48:24] » So that's a that's a fun loaded question. [laughter]

[1:48:28] um inside the land bank. Yes. But um the council always has the option to

[1:48:33] dissolve completely dissolve the land bank and transfer those funds into the

[1:48:37] general. That would be the the big uh the big swing. But uh pretty much you

[1:48:43] can use them for some economic development. Um there I'm losing the my

[1:48:49] mind on the state statute because we uh we just discussed it when we did that

[1:48:53] transfer for the public works, but it's it's relatively flexible in the type of

[1:48:57] needs that you would like to use that money on.

[1:49:00] » Okay. Thank you. >> What was the source of that funds where

[1:49:03] that where that money come from? >> That would be all our all the land sales

[1:49:06] we've done over the last 10 years. Yeah. >> Thank you.

[1:49:12] And this is the remaining amount from those sales. It's the remaining amount.

[1:49:16] Correct.

[1:49:22] » Interest payments. Equipment reserve fund. This is funded by general fund

[1:49:26] water and sewer. Our annual transfers there. The 400,000 comes in per year. We

[1:49:31] take that 400,000 in per year and budget out all of the equipment. I know it's

[1:49:35] really hard to read. Sorry. I tried to fit it all in there just to show it. Um,

[1:49:38] [laughter] but it has all of our admin, parks and wreck, parks, um, water,

[1:49:42] sewer, streets, uh, PD, fleet, and heavy equipment on the schedule planned out

[1:49:48] for 10 years. So, right now, as of what we currently have, we have a replacement

[1:49:53] plan for it over that time frame. And this will more than fund that program as

[1:49:56] we move across that 10ear period. >> And and we don't want to be here till

[1:50:00] 9:30, but um, this is kind of the Barry and Ted version. The James version is a

[1:50:07] lot more in depth and uh he could he could fill you with um tons of knowledge

[1:50:13] that we've even learned from this our new hire. I'm very very happy with James

[1:50:18] and what he's doing to just make us rethink the fleet maintenance

[1:50:22] completely. Um, I mean, we're talking [snorts] uh how much it costs per mile

[1:50:28] on on certain vehicles, probably proper fleet ma maintenance, but he's actually

[1:50:31] doing it and we're going to start implementing here and there uh to one

[1:50:35] save taxpayer money, but two, but have reliable vehicles uh at all times. So,

[1:50:41] um, again, I'll I'll let James take the podium at a later date when he's ready,

[1:50:45] but, uh, very impressed with his work and I think you'll see a lot of fruits,

[1:50:49] uh, and honestly, a lot of return on that investment we made this year.

[1:50:54] » Barry, one other thing I I didn't want to cut you off when you were doing that,

[1:50:57] but I did want to touch one more time on the land bank money. Um, just wanted to

[1:51:02] make a statement. One, thank you. And some of we all [clears throat] know

[1:51:05] this, but the fact that we were able to build the public works facility with the

[1:51:09] grant and do it with no debt is amazing. And I think that you guys deserve a lot

[1:51:14] of credit for staying on that and making it work. But also, we have to remember

[1:51:17] that the reason why we had those funds was because we borrowed a lot of money,

[1:51:21] bought a lot of land that, you know, generated that issue. But at

[1:51:26] least we put some of those funds back to use and paying for a facility that's

[1:51:29] going to benefit the city for decades. But I'll also

[1:51:33] say that I don't like the idea of keeping that money in that bank for too

[1:51:39] much longer. I'd like to see us put that back into the community in a way that

[1:51:43] could be a value proposition for our community and we can start benefiting

[1:51:47] from whatever that thing is in the in the nearer future. Um,

[1:51:53] this body has no control over what the next body might do, but that money could

[1:51:57] be spent any number of ways. Um, so I just put that out there that we need to

[1:52:02] be thinking about how we can put that money to use for the community.

[1:52:06] » Definitely. Yes, we need to.

[1:52:15] » So for 2027 out [clears throat] of equipment reserve fund, we have two PD

[1:52:19] responders um scheduled. the PD drone, the passenger van at the rec center, um

[1:52:25] computer replacements, the track Bobcat, new new Holland TLA or TL100A, um new

[1:52:33] mower, and that totals around 443,000. So that'll get us to a fund balance of

[1:52:38] right around 1.1 million in fiscal year 27.

[1:52:47] CIP reserve fund. Um, council member Dean, this is what we'll talk about the

[1:52:51] sky view park here. This fund's funded by the transfer from general fund of

[1:52:55] that 415,000 a year. It's 400,000 for the projects and we al always do the

[1:52:59] 15,000 for the sidewalk reimbursement grant. Um, if that is continued. Um,

[1:53:05] this fund it's it's like we were talking about with the

[1:53:10] zoning code updates downstairs. The CIP [clears throat] reserve fund, it's a

[1:53:13] living breathing document. It can change anytime we want it to change. Just

[1:53:17] because we have items up here that we want to talk about does not mean that

[1:53:21] they are set in concrete and then we must do them. It's a non-budgeted fund.

[1:53:25] We have no requirements to spend what we want out of here.

[1:53:30] So for based on our discussion last time, um we got Sky View Park going.

[1:53:35] It'll start here in 26. I don't know if it'll be done in 26, but maybe early 27.

[1:53:40] Um, we have 50,000 for engineering architecture for city hall and the rec

[1:53:44] center. We have an HVAC replacement for city hall. For the other seven units, I

[1:53:49] think it was um the sidewalk grant program still in there. And we have

[1:53:53] 100,000 for wreck maintenance repairs and then 150,000 for refreshing existing

[1:53:57] parks. With all those, at the end of 27, we'll

[1:54:02] have a fund balance of around 890,000.

[1:54:10] Barry, you might go back one slide and touch a little bit on what we're

[1:54:13] thinking as far as paying for some of the drainage improvements. Uh,

[1:54:17] » sorry, skip right over that. >> I think that's a really nice a good idea

[1:54:20] that we should touch on. >> Yeah. So for one of our recent projects

[1:54:26] um regarding a lot of drainage improvements was Voro Park that that

[1:54:30] project um there were definitely some overages along with the city portion

[1:54:34] that was guaranteed when we initiated those projects. So our total city

[1:54:38] portion of that project came out around 585,000

[1:54:42] overall all said and done. Um obviously storm water doesn't have the money to

[1:54:47] cover that cost now. So, what we're proposing is we'll take out a CIP um

[1:54:52] 335,000 of that out of CIP this year, then Storm Water will reimburse CIP

[1:54:58] those funds over the next two fiscal years.

[1:55:01] » I do that. >> So, essentially instead of bonding it

[1:55:05] and paying interest, we're >> we're using CIP funds, but we'll get

[1:55:09] paid back. So, it's it's more of a So, we're not paying interest on on

[1:55:14] money if we have some idle reserve that we can use.

[1:55:22] » Thanks, Ted. Let's skip right over that. >> Always better to borrow from ourselves.

[1:55:27] » You know, it's it made more sense and and we're getting ready to start

[1:55:31] [snorts] we're getting ready to finish audit season and go straight into bond

[1:55:35] season. So, we wanted to have that conversation tonight so you guys aren't

[1:55:38] surprised or what asking questions. We'll bring it back up when we roll that

[1:55:42] bond uh in the next couple months. >> Okay.

[1:55:46] » Um so yeah, that's what we the ideas we

[1:55:50] have presented for 2027. If those are all if we want to do all of those, then

[1:55:55] um that drops our fund balance down to that 890 611 number at the end of 27.

[1:55:59] Once again, this is just a plan. It's not set in stone. Anything that comes

[1:56:05] out of this fund will come before you for presentation and approval. Um it's

[1:56:09] not a blank check or anything like that. So

[1:56:16] we have there um >> I already have this all inputed in that

[1:56:20] state form I talked about last time. So this is the budget hearing notice that

[1:56:23] will be published in the paper on August 20th. Um this is what be sent out. It

[1:56:27] shows the actuals for 25, estimates for 26 and proposed budget for 27. It does

[1:56:33] say the mill levy is 41.03 003, which is what we filed on our intent to exceed

[1:56:37] the levy form we submitted to the county in July. So, we're all um up to code

[1:56:42] there. Um but once again, I do think that number will fall around to that

[1:56:46] 40.75 number when November gets here and those final

[1:56:51] numbers come out. I didn't realize I talk with my hand so much. Hang on a

[1:56:56] second. There there's a couple things we didn't talk about that was mentioned

[1:57:00] earlier and I I want to address a few of them. Uh we are looking at some health

[1:57:05] insurance uh options for our um for our uh employees. That's something that

[1:57:12] we're already budgeting for where where we're at right now. So any cost savings

[1:57:16] we'll we'll be able to discuss and and review with you. The other thing that

[1:57:20] didn't quite make it just because I I didn't think it um economic development,

[1:57:25] we've met with a few type of uh there's some outsourcing e economic development

[1:57:29] opportunities. um the value in that we can have

[1:57:33] discussions about it. I just didn't feel um right now $50,000 for, you know, some

[1:57:39] training and some different things didn't quite match up with me. It didn't

[1:57:42] make it to the main board. Um but that's definitely something that's always on

[1:57:46] top of our mind. I do my best to meet with everyone and uh honestly with all

[1:57:51] the housing and the growth we got going on that we're really starting to get

[1:57:54] recognized. So, how do we how do we steamroll that into more successes? and

[1:57:59] I'm I'm very open for that conversation and uh but it just didn't quite make it

[1:58:04] past the line for what we were looking at earlier this year. So that that's a

[1:58:08] little update on that, but always welcome to have that discussion with you

[1:58:19] » and that's just our remaining schedule. We'll um we're presenting the final

[1:58:23] draft today. We'll get it published in the paper on the 20th and then on the

[1:58:26] 1st we'll hold our revenue neutral rate hearing. We'll adopt the resolution to

[1:58:32] exceed the RNR with a roll call vote at the hearing and then we'll hold our 2027

[1:58:38] budget hearing and um have the item to adopt the 2027 budget. And the rest of

[1:58:43] that is just internal things. We'll publish it to the website. Then I'll get

[1:58:47] everything wrapped up in a nice bow and send it to Cedric County for submitt.

[1:58:53] That's all I got.

[1:58:57] If there's any questions or >> I I just had a couple of just really

[1:59:02] fast things. First of all, thank you guys. Back in May, hearing all the

[1:59:07] department heads, I'm like, there is zero nonsense in here. And we used to

[1:59:10] subtract out, you know, our land debt. This is a this is a tight ship you guys

[1:59:15] are running. So, thank you. Um, and it's cool about that IRB that we get that

[1:59:19] symbolic drop. Um, kind of painfree. Um, regarding the water 3%, I know we

[1:59:25] touched on the last workshop. >> So, you guys are comfortable with that

[1:59:28] knowing we might need a water tower. You know, even that even though that fund is

[1:59:33] high, you're comfortable doing the holding the line for now and with the

[1:59:38] intent we're going to go back and continue that 3% increase each year.

[1:59:43] » Yeah, I'm comfortable with the one year for sure. Um, now once we get ahead and

[1:59:48] get into the timing of when that water tower actually come, we may have to make

[1:59:53] a bigger adjustment one year, two years down the road and then drop back down to

[1:59:57] three. It just all depends on that timing and the overall cost and how we

[2:00:00] approach that.

[2:00:05] » Okay. >> But the the $100,000 difference isn't

[2:00:09] going to make a huge impact on a $3 million project if we get to that point.

[2:00:13] So, yeah.

[2:00:22] Once again, the water and sewer funds there, [clears throat] even though they

[2:00:25] are budgeted at the 0% increase, the expenditures is what really matters. So,

[2:00:29] when we normally do the water and sewer rates in November, it's fine if we do it

[2:00:34] then or don't do it then. Like, it's not going to affect what we have to have

[2:00:38] certified to the county for our budget. They're just worried about our

[2:00:41] expenditure side. If we do increase rates, then our revenues will just come

[2:00:44] in a little bit higher. If we keep it at 0%, then it should be pretty close to

[2:00:48] what we have on the board here today. >> So, this is th this doesn't tie us to a

[2:00:53] a no increase. If we decide later that we we need to do that. Okay. All right.

[2:00:59] That's good to know. I like I would like probably a little more finite analysis

[2:01:04] on that on the water fund because uh while I thought it was good idea, I

[2:01:09] wanted to see the numbers. and you say, "Well, it it worked on paper, but these

[2:01:14] are some things we didn't think about. We need to we need to think about

[2:01:17] those." So, >> and just a quick update, I'm meeting

[2:01:19] with the author of our master plan tomorrow at 9:00, 9:00 in the morning.

[2:01:24] So, I'll have some some of that information to you guys well before we

[2:01:27] need to actually make the official decision in November. I just think it's

[2:01:31] important we have these discussions now during budget season because a lot of

[2:01:34] times we'll get to November and say, "Oh, I gotta pass this resolution of 3%

[2:01:38] increase." We didn't talk about it. So, I'm glad we're having the conversation

[2:01:41] now so that we have an informed conversation when the fee schedule comes

[2:01:45] up. [snorts] >> Yeah. Thank you.

[2:01:51] » Okay. Any other questions or concerns with budget proposals

[2:01:56] because this is what's going to be what we're going to be asked to approve here

[2:02:01] in a couple weeks, right? >> Yes. Much more condensed, but yes, it

[2:02:04] will be. Yes. [laughter] >> But the entire state form will be in

[2:02:07] there to see every fund broken out. um how we need to report it and submit to

[2:02:10] the county. So, it'll all be in there.

[2:02:17] » Okay. >> Well, thank you very much. I know this a

[2:02:21] lot of work, but it's what you like to do, right?

[2:02:25] » Like I say, it's my most favorite 12 months of the year. So,

[2:02:27] » yeah. >> Thank you so much.

[2:02:31] » Okay. Well, that's the only issues on the agenda for tonight. So, uh, thank

[2:02:35] you everybody for taking time to to, uh, go through the planning, the zoning

[2:02:40] codes and with the planning commission and budgets, and I think we're good to

[2:02:44] go. So, everybody have a good evening. We'll see everybody next Tuesday.

August 11, 2026 | Bel Aire City Council Workshop

Transcript