[0:07] Why don't you go ahead and

[0:12] Good evening everybody. Um I'm glad you're all here. Um this is the

[0:18] September meeting of the Essex Energy Committee. A little bit hastily warned,

[0:22] but we got it in on time, but I forgot to send everybody invite. So, apologies

[0:27] for that. glad that you all could make it. Um, so we have a special guest

[0:34] tonight and I thought actually I guess what we'll do, let me just bring up our

[0:39] um minutes. Hi Gita. Um actually we'll just state for the

[0:45] record in attendance are uh Will Dodge the chair Sean McNamera who's the

[0:49] municipal representative Katie Shadic who's the vice chair uh our guest Dylan

[0:54] GM Batisa from Vermont Gas Ken Good now is new member uh Gita Ganon and online

[1:02] we have uh Natalie Braun um who's joining by phone and Rod Williams who's

[1:09] on via video and this meeting is being >> maybe it's being transcribed multiple

[1:14] times but one way or the other we will have minutes at the end of the day. So

[1:19] um so welcome everyone. Uh first thing I think we should do uh is approval of

[1:25] minutes from 812 which Natalie you were kind enough to

[1:31] produce. Um, everybody have a chance to look at those or anything? Anybody want

[1:36] to say anything about them such as move to admit or move to uh

[1:43] » approve? Move to admit. >> Okay. Any seconds?

[1:48] » Okay. Uh, all in favor? >> I.

[1:54] » And all opposed. Okay. Very good. Well, thank you. So,

[1:59] those are approved and we'll get those in Sean to um uh to make Yep. to make

[2:04] sure that those are recorded. Now, on the agenda, I had put work plan to be

[2:09] distributed in advance of meeting. But I think what I'm going to do um is instead

[2:15] go to our first item, which is actually we have it put in the meeting as

[2:19] president presentation from Spencer Dole at Vermont Gas, but instead we're going

[2:24] to let Dylan take the stage. And Dylan, you've been here before, so you know,

[2:29] you you know us >> reasonably well. And you were

[2:33] representing you were representing the town in the state legislature for how

[2:38] long was that? >> So I represented what when when we had a

[2:40] village in a town. >> That's right.

[2:42] » I represented a district in A2, which was primarily here in the village

[2:46] center, but this was part of the district. And so sadly I haven't been in

[2:50] this building in about five years because I'm now resident Wahwa of the

[2:54] city which is actually from my perspective sort of a lost opportunity

[2:57] for our community. But I'll set that aside for the moment. I don't want to

[3:00] get into the the turf wars. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I'm just gonna blow

[3:05] things up here. Um but nevertheless, I served four years in the legislature

[3:09] where I was actually primarily focused on education policy. And then um shortly

[3:13] after that COVID time started, I was actually a finalist to be a municipal

[3:17] manager uh in the state in another community and I was approached by

[3:21] someone who I didn't know that well, but the new president of Vermont Gas, Neil

[3:25] Lenderbilt, was interesting resume and government service and he had run

[3:29] Burlington Electric Department and he was brought into Vermont Gas at that

[3:32] time in part to try to think about if a company that primarily has served

[3:36] natural gas could operationalize some of the policy that we need to reduce

[3:40] emissions in the state. And so for the past five and a half years, I've been

[3:44] working as part of that team. And my um portfolio includes a lot of outreach,

[3:48] regulatory affairs, things of that nature. And actually, the primary reason

[3:51] that I'm here with you tonight, um I I want to be courteous of your time. So I

[3:55] wasn't sure if you had an amount of time because I we do have a regulatory um

[3:59] process underway that I'm seeking input on from this committee. All the input

[4:03] doesn't need to come tonight, but it's part of our integrated resource plan,

[4:06] which is a process that all distribution utilities in the state of electric

[4:10] utilities, uh, and in our case, the lone natural gas utility are subject to as

[4:15] regulated entities by the state of Vermont's public utility commission. So,

[4:19] every three years, we need to go around stakeholders and discuss with them um

[4:24] their objectives in terms of development opportunities, and we take a look at our

[4:28] resource um uh our resource allocation. So both supply for electricity and in

[4:34] the case of a gas utility gas supply and the needs of the region basically. So I

[4:39] I came here tonight to give you a quick update on that to give you a snapshot of

[4:43] what we're doing but also to hear from you about if there are priorities that

[4:45] you see um and you know not to steal my own thunder on this as I get going but

[4:50] um the integrative resource plan is not very uh exciting but I'll do my best

[4:55] with it. So Will, how much time do you want me to go for because I don't want

[4:57] to take a lot of your time. and you looked like you had

[4:59] » Well, I think I we'd love to see your presentation and then I think that we

[5:02] definitely have one priority in particular that we want to talk to you

[5:06] about. >> Okay, great.

[5:07] » Um, so excellent, but I think you can tell us.

[5:10] » Yeah. And I'll just say it says that it's not set up for sharing.

[5:13] » Oh, yeah. Yeah. I was just going to do you want to do that? The little triangle

[5:17] there. >> Actually, hit the triangle next to it,

[5:21] Sean. >> Sorry. Yeah, it's

[5:28] to cancel. Yeah. Now, yeah, multiple participants can share simultaneously.

[5:34] » All right, there we go. >> It's been a while since I've actually

[5:37] shared in Zoom, so hopefully I don't. >> Yeah, try that and see if that works.

[5:41] » All right, let's give this a whirl here and I'll It's looking promising. I'll

[5:44] make a go of it as best I can. All right, what do we got here? Great. That

[5:50] coming up yet? There we go. Sorry, I'm on like a I use

[5:55] a sort of a shared network for this just utility security that we go through. All

[6:01] right, just one moment. Here we go. I'm going to try to make this full screen.

[6:04] It might lag out a little, but fortunately, we don't need to worry too

[6:06] much about that. So, I'm providing you this update um on our activities as a

[6:12] regulated utility. As I said, and there's there's a lot of information in

[6:15] this slide deck. I don't know that I'm going to go through it all, but at the

[6:18] highest level, Vermont Gas, if you are a natural gas customer, you probably know

[6:22] us. We've served the region for 60 years. Um we have about 56,000 customers

[6:28] across northwest Vermont. That's Franklin, Chitten and Addison County

[6:31] with the bulk here in Chitten County. Um and what sets us apart a little bit from

[6:35] some of our peer utilities across the country is in addition to being a

[6:38] regulated distribution utility. In other words, a natural gas distribution

[6:42] utility. Um, we also are an energy efficiency utility and have for several

[6:46] decades provided services what we call behind the meter inside of customers

[6:51] homes and premises whether commercial, industrial, residential. We've been

[6:55] working inside of their homes servicing equipment and recently installing

[6:58] different types of equipment. So, this has been a long history that we've had

[7:02] and um what really sets us apart is that about 40% of our workforce work with

[7:06] customers every day. So, we're not just working in the right ofway with your

[7:10] public works department. We're working in different ways with different

[7:13] building stock. Um, quick overview here. I mentioned that we have about 56,000

[7:19] um, families and businesses that we serve in Northwest Vermont. We basically

[7:23] are taking all the premises that we serve. So, many of those might have

[7:25] multiple occupants. So, I won't get into that too much. Um, but to give you the

[7:29] snapshot, we operate about 900 miles of distribution infrastructure. That's the

[7:34] pipe under the ground that brings gas into customers homes. We have 118 miles

[7:38] of transmission infrastructure and through our energy efficiency work, we

[7:42] do about 2,000 efficiency improvements annually. Um, I'm going to skip past the

[7:47] I have a slide on a timeline that I'm going to go right past to jump ahead.

[7:51] Um, just to give you the the quick overview here. And I see my computer's

[7:55] lagging, but it will do its best here. Um, sorry, it might be my internet

[7:59] service, so just give me a second. I'm on a hot spot for reasons I don't know,

[8:03] but it'll eventually catch up. Um, in short, I'll I'll just share that since

[8:08] 1992, we have um done a portfolio of energy efficiency work that has

[8:13] facilitated 44,000 energy efficiency improvements. I'm

[8:17] going to skip over this slide. It'll eventually get there. Sorry, it's just

[8:20] lagged out. Um, and and those efficiency improvements, as you no doubt know, as

[8:24] an energy efficiency focused committee, save a lot of money.

[8:30] So, we have paid out incentives of over $33 million since 1992. And the

[8:35] cumulative gas savings that is the gas that we have not sold because of that is

[8:39] over $273 million. So this is big bucks when you break it down. The

[8:44] year-over-year savings that it grew to our customers are considerable. Um since

[8:48] 2016, that's when we became one of the state's energy efficiency utilities. We

[8:52] have served about 2,000 uh customers annually. And you can see some of the

[8:57] big numbers about how much we've saved. It's a significant amount of money and

[9:00] and reduced uh emissions. All of which is good for Vermont, its energy goals,

[9:06] and I'm sure those that you're looking out for here in the town. Um, my slides

[9:10] will eventually catch up here, but I'm about to show you a slide that includes

[9:14] a map of where our infrastructure is located. So, this is the gas

[9:18] infrastructure that we operate under the ground. It includes uh a transmission

[9:22] line which extends down south. And then there's all this distribution

[9:26] infrastructure as well feeding different businesses, you know, whether it's the

[9:29] Essex shops, uh, or up into different residential communities. Schools are on

[9:34] this list. Um, and of that, we have about 3600 customers. Uh, one thing on

[9:39] this that I called out to my colleague who put this together is incorrect. It

[9:42] says 18 residential units are weatherized since 2016. There's no way

[9:45] that's right. I think it's because when the two communities split, um, the way

[9:50] that they were cataloging the data, there must have been some sort of a data

[9:54] error there. I'm guessing that it's much closer to probably about 200 in the town

[9:58] that we've facilitated based on comparable community sizes. And we've

[10:02] done I do think the equipment upgrades is a little more accurate. We've done

[10:05] 128 of those types of upgrades. And then one thing I'll call your attention to

[10:09] here is that uh back at the start of the decade we in we started installing heat

[10:14] pumps. First heat pump water heaters then centrally ducted heat pumps which

[10:17] is an appliance that you incorporate into a furnace in an existing hot air

[10:21] system or uh you can use that for heating or cooling. And then also mini

[10:25] splits. We started the mini splits closer to 2023. And you can see we only

[10:30] had four heat pumps installed in Essex in 2024 through 25. So the ramp rates

[10:36] been a little slow, but what happens and what we're seeing now is there's this

[10:39] opportunity to market them particularly in summer. You know, people are thinking

[10:42] about heat pumps primarily for cooling, but of course for many they're very

[10:47] viable heating solution for their home depending on the building type. So we

[10:51] expect to see more rapid adoption and we're we're starting some new programs

[10:55] um and marketing to try to get the word out about

[10:59] » Hey Dylan. Yes. on that. I appreciate very much you saying that that

[11:03] correction on the residential units. Is it possible for you to send that final

[11:08] number to us because we are working on our energy plan and that would be a

[11:13] great stat to know to plug into that. >> Are you doing a town plan revision right

[11:16] now? I know we are under >> it's it is a standalone energy plan.

[11:22] » Or an enhanced energy plan, right? An act 176.

[11:25] » Yeah. So I will tell you um this is this is a good point of information to share

[11:30] with you. >> Some communities like to work directly

[11:34] with our efficiency team on program design for different types of outreach

[11:38] options that we can do. So, we've had really successful partnerships in

[11:42] particularly in the city of Burlington and the city of South Burlington who

[11:46] have adopted uh ordinances that actually focus on decarbonization,

[11:51] weatherization, um and other primary renewable heating type ordinances. So,

[11:56] they they've put in place actual policy at the municipal level. But the reason I

[12:00] bring it up is because some of those communities also have staffed up with um

[12:03] like an energy coordinator um or in the case of Burlington, they they actually

[12:08] have pretty robust building permitting. I know that's not the case in a lot of

[12:11] municipalities. Um but there are ways that we can share data with you that's

[12:16] actually a little more granular about the usage, the profiles of your

[12:20] buildings. And I don't want to overpromise, but our efficiency utility

[12:23] does have the ability to work with your staff or with your energy committee to

[12:27] get you a lot of information. So if you're working on a plan, we can

[12:30] certainly work on that with you. >> Okay.

[12:32] » Yeah. So lots of opportunities for collaboration,

[12:34] » right? >> Yeah.

[12:36] » All right. This is still lagging a little bit as my little device here

[12:40] tries to find the internet through the clouds. Um but we'll eventually get

[12:43] there. The the reason that I'm here tonight, first of all, I welcome any

[12:46] input or any questions you have. Um you know, municipalities are really

[12:50] important stakeholders in energy planning, increasingly so with the role

[12:54] of energy committees and different types of enhanced energy plans. some of the

[12:57] work going on with the regional planning commissions. But our integrated resource

[13:01] plan, as I've already previewed, it's essentially a 20-year roadmap for

[13:05] resource allocation. And traditionally, this process, which is overseen by our

[13:10] regulators, was really about how many customers are you going to add? In the

[13:14] case of electricity, it would be how many electric customers are you going to

[13:17] add, how much electricity can you procure, what does that look like in the

[13:20] future for your customers. Same in the gas system. At the simplest level, this

[13:25] process historically has been about how you meet new customers energy needs

[13:29] while balancing those um balancing the costs and then increasingly in the last

[13:33] couple decades, how are you going to mitigate environmental impacts. So

[13:38] recently we've been looking toward the state's comprehensive energy plan which

[13:42] is about to undergo a revision. They do that I think it's every six years. Um

[13:46] and I will share that in 2024 the addition that we put together of this

[13:50] integrated resource plan really trade changed from some of that traditional

[13:54] planning where we then began to focus a bit more on carbon reduction pathways

[13:59] which was consistent with state energy policy. Um this time around we're

[14:03] looking at that we're also thinking about resilience reliability and that

[14:07] relates to both physical infrastructure and cyber um which is probably no

[14:11] surprise to you if you've been following the news. Um, we're also really focused

[14:15] on geothermal development, which is something that we would be happy to

[14:18] discuss with you. I saw you have some information in your meeting agenda

[14:22] packet. So, lots to discuss there, and I'm happy to tell you about what we're

[14:25] doing. Um, in short though, what I'm here with you tonight is to ask you some

[14:31] feedback on these three scenario plans that we're presenting to you. All the

[14:35] feedback doesn't need to come tonight. You all could review it offline. Send an

[14:38] informal note to me. I'd be happy to take it. But essentially we are working

[14:42] through three planning scenarios for this edition of this planning process.

[14:48] The first is a baseline scenario where we're looking at the current state of

[14:51] policy. We continue to work on our existing um energy programs which

[14:56] include again natural gas delivery, installation and maintenance of heat

[15:00] pumps, energy efficiency incentives for weatherization and other things and now

[15:04] some geothermal work that we're doing. But we don't assume that there's a

[15:08] policy that's coming from the state that actually is mandating us to change

[15:12] considerably. So we would continue to provide these types of services. There's

[15:16] also um some existing programs that we get into and and I don't want to go too

[15:20] far um over my skis with the short amount of time we have, but essentially

[15:25] we we have a supply of natural gas that we need to clean up over time to lower

[15:30] the carbon intensity of the fuel that's in that pipe for distribution customers

[15:34] using a combustion based system. And so all of this in the baseline scenario is

[15:38] essentially looking at our planning and saying things aren't going to change

[15:42] that much except we're going to see new customers added because there's this

[15:45] huge p push to do development and add housing in particular. So that's

[15:50] scenario number one that we model and look at. The second is what we call a

[15:54] moderate gas reduction scenario. And this is where we continue to see more

[15:58] strategic electrification in the region and at the state level. Um, and

[16:02] continued adoption of renewable fuels in place of traditional natural gas. This

[16:07] focuses on a lot of hybrid heating setups where you're going to have heat

[16:11] pumps in play working in tandem with people who already have combustion

[16:15] systems. Um, it's also taking a look at really rapid construction of residential

[16:20] properties over the next 10 years in line with some of the state targets

[16:23] which are pretty rosy. I don't think it's going to move that quick. But

[16:26] nevertheless, this sees more electrification in the scenario and it's

[16:30] something that we model out to test what would happen to our existing gas

[16:34] customers if there was a lot more electrification.

[16:37] » The final scenario that we're modeling is the third one. This is a really

[16:40] significant decarbonization scenario in which we assume that no new residential

[16:46] construction will be using any form of combustion. It would all be electrified.

[16:51] So this is a scenario where we are assuming no new gas growth or any

[16:54] combustion growth in the state. But we're only modeling for gas in the

[16:57] region we serve. And it's assuming that these aggressive carbon reduction

[17:01] policies are implemented and that there state programs to support them at a very

[17:05] fast pace to keep up with all the new construction that's forecast. It also we

[17:10] look at here I won't get too into it but industrial and interruptible loads.

[17:14] These are the largest commercial and industrial loads like a global

[17:17] foundaries or you know maybe you have gl or something. it's sort of assuming that

[17:22] they can be um electrified over time as well which is can be quite challenging

[17:28] depending on the use of processed fuels and other high um demand technologies.

[17:34] So I present you these three and the most simplest terms I can think of is

[17:37] one is the status quo, two is the state getting behind more electrification but

[17:43] not banning things outright. Three is if you were to ban uh any form of

[17:48] combustion in the state and we're just going all electric. And so we present

[17:52] these scenarios and try to get feedback in part because we try to develop um the

[17:56] different models and scenario planning where we can go to regulators and say

[17:59] here's what we heard, here's what we have modeled for and here's what is

[18:03] reflective of stakeholder input. So I've been to about 12 communities before

[18:07] this. I've heard a range of opinions stretching from Swanton to, you know,

[18:12] down in Addison County, Vens. I mean there there's a whole range of opinions

[18:16] about what we ought to do in this space and I I don't want to put all this to

[18:21] you now but I have a series of questions but I I just wonder if before we leave

[18:25] these are there any of these scenarios that you see playing a role in Essex

[18:30] recognizing both the moment that we're in in terms of where state policy stands

[18:34] because candidly there is no thermal energy policy framework to move us

[18:39] forward right now. We had a clean heat standard lawmakers chose not to

[18:42] implement it. So we don't actually have a performance standard guiding reduction

[18:46] of greenhouse gas emissions in the thermal sector as we do in the electric

[18:49] sector with the renewable energy standard. So we're sort of operating

[18:52] without a clear statewide policy framework. On the other hand, we have

[18:56] communities like South Burlington and Burlington that are moving very quickly

[19:01] toward renewables policy >> which and then we have all this old

[19:04] housing stock that we're trying to figure out what do we do with it while

[19:07] we also bring online new housing much of which can be electrified. So I put that

[19:12] to you. Do any of these scenarios stand out? I'm I'm sort of all yours, Will. I

[19:15] don't know how you would want to run this, but I'm I'm just interested in

[19:18] feedback. >> Yeah. Well, oh, I'm just going to open

[19:20] it up to the floor. Do you have any thoughts about it?

[19:26] » Well, I'm I love my gas stove, so I can't keep it up. Yeah. So, I'm thinking

[19:32] moderate. Start with that. And that way um you're not completely

[19:40] making a huge change and bringing on new construction with electrification but at

[19:44] the same time keeping the rest of the infrastructure going.

[19:49] Um but I do like the idea of like um the in industrial intra loads but um I don't

[19:59] know with the with everything with electric charges going up these days I

[20:05] don't know how much of that is going to >> be accepted by the public at this point.

[20:12] It's going to be >> Yeah, I think

[20:14] » there's going to change coming in that yeah perspective.

[20:17] » I think you have to make a real case that the electric heating is

[20:23] is going to be more cost effective or at least competitive with the natural gas,

[20:29] » right? >> It's going up 5.5% again in October.

[20:32] That'll put it at 18.11% increase since 2024 till now.

[20:37] » Yep. >> And we're barely holding the grid

[20:39] together as it is. If everything goes electric, where are we going to get that

[20:44] electricity?

[20:48] » Natalie, any persp or Rod, any perspective from you guys?

[20:54] » I would say the moderate is a good aspiration.

[20:59] » Sorry, Rod. Can you speak up just a bit? >> Yep. Um, you know, I think the

[21:05] moderate's a good aspiration. Um, we need to obviously we need to do more

[21:09] than a baseline, but we need to be realistic about what we can accomplish.

[21:14] Um, and you know, while I'm sure some of us are interested in number three, we

[21:22] have to recognize what the the appetite is out there.

[21:29] » Thank you, Rod. Natalie, how about you? I'd be the one person of course that is

[21:36] leaning heavily toward scenario three uh being uh you know the person deeply

[21:43] concerned about um the climate uh what was the timeline on this is aspirational

[21:50] over how many years are we talking? >> Yeah, thanks Natalie. Uh so this is a

[21:56] three we update the plan every three years. We look out over we look out over

[22:01] a 20-year horizon for the modeling scenarios. But it's really interesting

[22:06] and and the state learned a great deal about this when it looked at a clean

[22:10] heat standard and when it's looked at other policy. There's an ordering of um

[22:15] steps to electrify existing housing stock. You know, sort of the loading

[22:20] order of steps. So, um all of that it's sort of factoring what is most cost

[22:24] effective upfront and what gets the most bang for your buck over a lifetime. And

[22:29] that's that's what the state has been trying to assess and and they do it

[22:32] through their efficiency programs as well as they look at the efficacy of

[22:36] weatherization, heat pumps, replacement fuels, replacement systems. It's all

[22:41] about what gets you the most bang for your buck over the long haul in part. I

[22:45] hope that's helpful. >> Yeah, it is. I just, you know, if if

[22:50] you're looking for a a um just a general taste of what folks are saying across

[22:56] the state, my guess is at least uh you know, I I I certainly hear what the

[23:01] other committee members are are saying. Absolutely. With regard to what is um

[23:06] you know, might what might be attainable. Um my my view is let's

[23:12] attain as much as we possibly can for decarbonization. Yeah. low emission, you

[23:18] know, low emission energy sources.

[23:25] » Yeah. I mean, I guess, you know, there's a part of me that really likes the push

[23:29] for like do as much as possible like Natalie was saying, but then I'm also

[23:33] realistic and what can be achieved and how do you have the most buy in um what

[23:40] works with the things that we already have. So uh one example is this kind of

[23:44] pushpull between making sure that we are doing the best for the climate but then

[23:49] also like how do you not do other things that are going to have kind of

[23:55] downstream effects. So like right now I could go out and I could buy like the

[23:58] most energy efficient car possible but instead I'm still driving a 20-year-old

[24:02] car because I also know that consumerism is horrible and I don't want this car

[24:06] that still works to just go in the trash >> um because that's also not efficient. So

[24:12] there is like how do we make new things as efficient as possible and then deal

[24:17] with the existing structures that we have to make them feasibly as efficient

[24:22] as they could possibly be knowing that some are just not going to be up to

[24:28] snuff. >> Yeah. Yeah. uh really good like there's

[24:32] excellent feedback all around and heard um and I will just share that it's it's

[24:37] really interesting because um I have had a number of discussions over the years

[24:42] about what to do with the gas system generally um and so I'll just call out a

[24:48] couple things about our system. So we are connected um through a Canadian

[24:51] pipeline. So all our supply comes from Canada. And what's interesting about

[24:55] that is that in recent years, we've heard about the grid in the Northeast in

[24:59] particular. You all are high you're high knowledge people. So you probably know

[25:04] in the energy space the electric grid um our utilities are obligated to um reduce

[25:10] the carbon intensity of their supply by buying credits and that's sort of an

[25:14] accepted conventional part of energy markets in the region. Um a lot of their

[25:19] supply is coming from New England. some critique that credit system because on a

[25:22] really cold winter's day or a really hot summer's day when there's high demands

[25:26] on the grid, they're using natural gas for electricity supply in part. Um, and

[25:30] you know, there's there's plenty of discussion that could go on around that.

[25:34] The thing about the gas system that's interesting for our customers being

[25:37] having Canadian gas, it's been really plentiful. Now, knock on wood, we have a

[25:40] trade war going on apparently, so who knows? But at this point, gas has been

[25:44] completely exempt under existing trade agreements with Canada. And so the

[25:48] energy supply constraints that we see in New England with the grid in general or

[25:53] with gas utilities in Massachusetts and other parts of the region, they don't

[25:57] exist for our system. Um, and so as long as that Canadian gas is flowing, we have

[26:02] that available. There's a question about equity. If you look, you might be

[26:06] familiar with the efficiency Vermont reports on energy burden. It's like it's

[26:10] a really great report. I encourage you to look at as you're doing your plan. It

[26:14] basically shows the statewide picture of energy burden and does a lot of analysis

[26:18] about what the factors are contributing to folks ability to afford the energy

[26:22] they consume in different parts of the state. And I will call out and I'm only

[26:26] doing this for information is that Northwest Vermont has benefited from the

[26:30] low comparative cost of gas on a dollar for-dollar basis. I think that some of

[26:35] the comments and discussions and critiques we have about that are well

[26:39] there's externalities when you use gas you know there's upstream emissions and

[26:42] all these other things and so what we have been trying to do is figure out

[26:45] well how do we plan with the existing policy in place and you know we have the

[26:49] global warming solutions act which had a 2025 target which you know jury's out on

[26:53] if we hit it 2030 it doesn't look like the state's going to hit it and then

[26:57] 2050 we have another one um I don't know how state policy makers are going to

[27:01] respond to that but all this is to say that Our planning scenarios are trying

[27:05] to take into account all these factors as we look at it and we think about well

[27:09] what would happen you know we have all this infrastructure in the ground with

[27:13] the gas system either transmission or distribution what would happen if you

[27:17] stopped using it you know who would be who would be the last people on that

[27:20] system paying for its costs and upkeep and this is a a concept in utilities you

[27:25] might hear about it's called the utility death spiral the concept that if you

[27:28] have con if you have consumers of one product all switching to another there's

[27:32] that existing system that needs to be maintained but fewer people support it.

[27:35] It's kind of we talk about it with social security as well when we think

[27:38] about paying out social security benefits. So all these are are the

[27:41] policy conversations we have with state regulators in this process. Um I just to

[27:47] be courteous of your time. I don't know that we should get into all of it but on

[27:50] the last slide of this presentation which will eventually switch over here

[27:54] for you. Um Will has this and could be shared. There's a series of questions

[27:59] about these scenarios and what might support your goals. I I don't think that

[28:03] I need to get all of your feedback tonight, but we would welcome any

[28:06] feedback if you sent it over. Um you you don't need to answer all these

[28:11] questions. I'd be happy to discuss it now. Do you prefer do it now? Um but

[28:15] essentially these are these are the questions that we are asking everyone.

[28:19] It's essentially do you do you is there a scenario that you that would support

[28:23] your goals? Thinking about your municipal planning goals or the goals of

[28:26] the region, the goals of your committee. Um, and then of course there's questions

[28:30] like, are there programs or products we should prioritize? Um, I'm guessing if

[28:34] you're an energy committee here in the town thinking about future growth, you

[28:38] might be thinking about, well, what is what is the option for strategic

[28:42] electrification for new development that's going to meet their needs and not

[28:46] um be too expensive for the developer or the eventual occupants. Um, so we have

[28:50] been looking at geothermal. It's a it's actually a really exciting part of our

[28:55] projects. I mentioned it earlier, but um just so you know, we have a pilot

[28:59] project with Champlne Housing Trust that we're going to be putting drills in the

[29:03] ground on very soon in Heinesburg where we're building a number of affordable

[29:06] housing with Champlne Housing Trust and they will be serviced by single system

[29:11] geothermal loops. Uh we're also working with a large developer in the region,

[29:14] O'Brien Brothers, and I would hope that there's more developers soon on bringing

[29:18] to market an all electric option for new development on single family homes.

[29:23] That's that's more of a boutique product in O'Brien's brother's home. Um, you

[29:27] know, this is this conversation sort of is started in the southern rim of

[29:30] Chipman County, but we have a product that they're going to be offering. They

[29:33] currently have an all electric home heat pump solution with solar panels on the

[29:37] roof, um, battery storage in the basement, heat pumps, uh, ductless units

[29:42] around the house, or maybe they're centrally ducted. I'm not sure. They're

[29:45] also going to be offering the geothermal option soon where we, Vermont Gas, would

[29:49] actually own and operate the underground loop. we would have an access charge

[29:53] that the owner of the home would pay to us and then they would own the interior

[29:56] ground source heat pump through their development. So that's an exciting

[29:59] opportunity for new housing that Chitten County developers might be more

[30:03] interested in than say Franklin County developers. Um so I just I put to you,

[30:07] you know, we don't need to have the full conversation tonight, but all these

[30:10] questions, you know, what are the barriers to your constituents here? You

[30:13] know, what might they look like? What might they be? Are there particular um

[30:18] needs for different types of energy burdened residents? uh might there be a

[30:22] different need for renters that you've seen or for bipok promoters? Um and you

[30:26] know again I think from our perspective we just want to make sure that we're

[30:29] effectively aligning with stakeholder goals because if we can all push in the

[30:33] same direction it's better. Um and so that's that's sort of the tenor of this

[30:37] conversation. If you have feedback happy to take it now will or we could we could

[30:41] do it offline. Whatever you think is best.

[30:42] » I'd like to ask you about something. >> Come on over. Yeah let's do it.

[30:49] Give the magic cloud a second as you say.

[30:51] » Yeah. And I'll ex out of mine. >> Do you know about this?

[30:55] » So is this the new development that you've all been looking at? Sort of the

[30:57] » 80 to 90 Main Street. >> And so this is the municipal during

[31:02] ARPA. You bought a bunch the town bought a lot of land for the purpose of a

[31:06] development. Is that right? >> A lot of land. And and the development

[31:09] is very poorly defined at the moment. But this is what we know that that it

[31:14] has. I'm just going to go up to kind of show it. easier what we know. So, you

[31:18] know, I think you know where this is, but basically this is like McDonald's

[31:22] over here. Okay. Then there's the the the Maple Fields. They used to be the

[31:27] Eer's RV and it was a gym for a while. All those things.

[31:30] » So, the idea is that we end up with multiple municipal buildings. I think

[31:35] that one is the town hall. I think number two is the library. And number

[31:39] three is the community. >> Parks and wreck. Yeah, that might be

[31:45] parks and wreck. We have number four, which is a massive fire station. Okay.

[31:51] But then and then we have a couple of other, you know, areas that are

[31:56] basically slated for potential future residential development.

[32:02] Uh there may be an athletic building of some kind over here. It's up to me. It's

[32:06] a curling rink, but really there being a resident. But regardless, the whole

[32:13] point is that this whole area could become kind of like a super development.

[32:18] » Yeah, >> we've been advised, we've been looking

[32:23] into now for since 2024, the idea of a geothermal network of some kind,

[32:29] something similar to what we had or what you know exists with um over at Beta and

[32:36] a number of other communities throughout the country. And the advice that we've

[32:42] been given is that basically for where everything is in the planning stages

[32:48] that there's not the ability now because the design is still so we don't know

[32:53] truly what the development is. But given where all those roads and

[33:00] paths are located, if we if the designers were to put in

[33:07] sleeves now right? As part of it, even though we

[33:11] don't know exactly where everything's going,

[33:14] that would at least enable you to do almost exactly or maybe maybe even

[33:20] greater than what you guys are already doing over in Hinesburg.

[33:25] » So, what we want to know is is that what is the best way to engage

[33:31] or to have Vermont Ga voice have Vermont gas engaged in something like this?

[33:37] » Yeah. Yeah. Well, first of all, uh this is the first step, right? Um so

[33:41] awareness, uh and I was so excited when I saw it on your agenda. We have a a

[33:47] small team of folks who have been focused on geothermal for about four

[33:50] years. And I'll just share, we proposed our first project down at Rutland

[33:53] Regional Medical Center. Yeah. At a facility down there, it was an

[33:57] interesting part of uh PUC case history and precedent. They basically said to

[34:02] us, "Well, you can't do this project even though it's not a gas project on

[34:05] your pipeline in that area. you can't go outside of your service territory to do

[34:09] this at this time. Um it was under a different commission. We then in recent

[34:13] years have worked very hard in Heinesburg and we we obtained the

[34:16] funding through the Biden uh administration era funding that was

[34:20] available to actually do a true thermal energy network with that but low there

[34:24] was a change in election and administration and that funding was

[34:27] clawed back before we could spend it. And so we've had to shift that into a

[34:32] series of single group homes. But the way that we thought about this is

[34:36] community scale geothermal. It's a question of you could do a series of of

[34:39] single loop projects um and they may serve multiple tenants. And you do have

[34:44] the ability over time to connect different geothermal systems if you

[34:47] choose to such as thermal energy network. But to your point, thermal

[34:51] energy networks they're finding nationwide that they're they're

[34:54] expensive in developed area where you're trying to retrofit them in part because

[34:58] there's all these remedial steps with existing buildings that cost a lot of

[35:02] money. This is that loading of um steps that I mentioned earlier. So it might be

[35:05] you have to weatherize, might mean you need to do extensive uh panel upgrades

[35:09] in the buildings. You might need to do different types of transformer upgrades

[35:12] around the community. Whatever it is, um the opportunity to do it, assuming the

[35:17] geology is good, so you're not on a bunch of ledge where it's going to be

[35:20] cost prohibitive to drill test wells and and get these loops into the ground. The

[35:24] opportunity to do it is really in a new development. We think generally it's

[35:27] just going to probably be a little more cost effective. So, I'd be happy to

[35:30] connect, you know, if it's planning, I don't know whom it is, but you know,

[35:33] anyone who wants to talk with our resident geothermal expert, um, Morvin

[35:38] Hood, who has really, uh, she was at efficiency Vermont for about 15 years

[35:43] before she came over. And she's led the utility conversation about this to the

[35:48] point where she's pulled together all these gas utilities to get them

[35:51] seriously talking about geothermal. And they now have a consortium of something

[35:54] like a 100,000 gas customers nationwide represented. and our staff person on our

[35:59] team is one of the co-chairs nationwide and we only have 56,000 customers. So,

[36:03] you know, we're able to pull a lot of cloud there. I will say there's a we are

[36:06] familiar with all the consultants working in this area. There are some

[36:09] Vermont based consultants. Um, we're also working with big national

[36:13] geothermal drilling companies. So what we're trying to do is figure out a

[36:17] scalable replicable geothermal model that works for single loop design for

[36:22] multif family and then potentially for a thermal energy network in a in a

[36:26] development opportunity and maybe it's this one right there's there's any

[36:29] number of things that we're looking at right now. So be happy to connect her uh

[36:33] to talk through some of the technical aspects of that and you know at a

[36:37] minimum I would think that whoever the consulting engineer designer is tech

[36:42] » yeah whoever they are I mean they're familiar maybe on some level with the

[36:45] systems um but you know it's a question of

[36:48] » I don't know at which level but Morgan would know when you want to do things

[36:51] like test wells and you know site feasibility to ensure that it's going to

[36:55] be worth the the value if you invest a bunch of money and I don't know if it's

[37:00] capital or how it's going to be going in realized over time or amortized. You

[37:04] just want to make sure that it's going to be viable to source the geothermal.

[37:07] » So is that conceptually that at every that at least at let's say every place

[37:11] where we'd be considering a sleeve, you do you know because there's a going to

[37:15] be a building nearby, you do a geotech at that location.

[37:18] » I it's highly dependent on what the building needs are. So I could foresee

[37:23] scenarios and I'm not an expert. I'm not a project designer. I'm not a geothermal

[37:27] expert. But I am aware that the opportunity with geothermal and these

[37:30] thermal energy networks is sort of waste heat recovery being part of a system

[37:34] where you might have a factory producing widgets and if you could draw upon their

[37:38] energy stream to provide some of the heat and keep that thermal load warm for

[37:42] that sort of service and then be pulling for cooling on the other side there's

[37:46] sort of an economies of scale that can be realized.

[37:48] » Yeah. Yeah. Right. Right. Curling rink actually might have a lot of good

[37:51] thermal loss there. >> Just saying.

[37:53] » Yeah. Yeah. But but I I would be happy to put you all in touch with Morgan,

[37:57] whoever the right person is, and she's a real expert and she can bring um

[38:01] resources along to help you in this direction. I think it's great. You know,

[38:04] I'm not surprised a lot of municipalities have been looking at

[38:06] thermal energy networks. We actually worked um over the last couple years

[38:10] with some of the proponents of thermal energy networks um who were working on

[38:15] legislation. They did get a municipal permission where a municipality could

[38:19] operate a utility for these. Starting utility is a big decision, right? Um I

[38:25] won't get into that or the particulars of that. We also, just so you know, we

[38:28] work very hard during the development of the uh CHIP program or the housing uh

[38:35] infrastructure improvement program that was recently adopted last year around

[38:38] this time. I was down before the the board that oversees the rules for that

[38:42] and urged inclusion of a community scale geothermal uh qualifier in there. It's

[38:48] not clear how they're going to operationalize it. So there's a lot of

[38:51] interest to maybe seek legislation to make clear geothermal could be uh

[38:55] permissible under the chip program. So all this is to say there are

[38:59] opportunities. It it's amazing because geothermal is not a new technology. It's

[39:03] been around a very long time. Um there's been good systems, there's been not so

[39:07] good systems, but it's waiting there to be captured. And it's just a matter of

[39:11] addressing the first cost. And the initial cost is a lot. Um, but on the

[39:16] other hand, you get all these life cycle savings over its life cycle, which is

[39:19] something in the scenario plannings, and I think it was Natalie's question, it

[39:22] sort of brings it to mind. It's like if you're thinking about long term and

[39:25] you're doing new development, there might be an opportunity here. But, you

[39:28] know, lease cost, you might find that if you want to go all electric, there might

[39:32] be other solutions that are more cost-effective upfront. Will they be

[39:36] over the lifetime of the project? We we generally think that geothermal is the

[39:39] most cost effective for heating and cooling over time. There's a lot of

[39:43] reasons for that. It's a lot better to have a heat pump in a basement that's

[39:45] probably pretty cool and relatively dry as opposed to out. Catching leaves this

[39:50] time of year or catching pollen in the spring. I mean, all these things are

[39:53] stressors on outdoor heat pumps. Doesn't mean they're good or bad. It just means

[39:57] that they're the reality of living in Vermont with crazy weather. Um, and so

[40:00] geothermal is sort of a captive system in a basement. It's really, it's kind of

[40:04] incredible depending how it's set up. There's also like there's ways to locate

[40:07] these systems where you have a loop and it's feeding a whole network down a

[40:11] street. So, >> yeah.

[40:12] » Yeah. All these options are on the table.

[40:14] » Great. Any other questions or comments for Dylan?

[40:20] My only quick take is that I think that I I feel as though I think this is a

[40:26] little bit similar to what Katie was saying, but my feeling is that the the

[40:30] need for the new residential construction that is mostly or

[40:37] completely efficient would far outset the fact that

[40:42] we have so much that is not. So in other words, a and we have a housing crisis.

[40:47] So I guess that's for me why I fall on two on you know yeah the scenario two

[40:54] but I also think that if you guys think about scenario two where six years from

[41:00] now or eight years from or you know nine years from now there's a way to unplug

[41:06] or you know take take the gas offline and replace it with geothermal or

[41:10] something else as the technology gets better. that's gonna, you know, then

[41:14] that's a then that's kind of a shortterm and a long-term win.

[41:17] » Yeah. Yeah. Great feedback. And I'll just share the really cool thing about

[41:21] geothermal. This might not be apparent. You know, you you might not think about

[41:25] the gas lines under the roads that we have and there's certainly some steel

[41:29] lines, but Vermont's system, it's really new compared to many municipalities. We

[41:32] have municipalities with structures well over 100 years old for gas

[41:35] infrastructure. In Vermont, a lot of it has been upgraded since the 80s. We're

[41:39] only 60 years old, but uh something like 80% of it is is polyethylene pipe. And

[41:45] 2inch polyethylene pipe is generally what they use for geothermal groups. So,

[41:48] you know, it's sort of this transferable skill set. We're familiar with pipes,

[41:52] we're familiar with things under the ground. We're familiar with heat pump

[41:55] systems, you know, radiant systems, boilers, furnaces, all the above. And so

[42:00] it's a really interesting opportunity for our workforce to begin developing

[42:03] knowledge of something that we know is going to be around in the future that's

[42:07] providing heating and cooling um without some of the environmental impact that we

[42:10] fully admit that our legacy product natural gas contributes to. So where it

[42:15] goes, I don't know. I mean, it's all a question of affordability right now.

[42:18] That's sort of in the foremost of people's minds when we hear from

[42:21] customers. So we have to do it in a way that's cost effective. I expect that for

[42:25] what it's worth, if you're plugging into all these conversations, the

[42:28] comprehensive energy plan that the state's going to be developing over the

[42:32] next year or so, really great opportunity to hear from municipalities

[42:35] thinking about the balance of what you're considering. And um there's all

[42:38] these great ways to plug in. I'll also just do a plug just so you're aware

[42:41] because we are a sponsor. The Energy Action Network Conference is being held

[42:45] at the Essex Resort this year. Yeah, it's going to be right down the road

[42:49] here at the farmhouse building out front and I think it's like a week or two

[42:54] away. So, if you haven't looked into it, if you're interested, it's still open

[42:57] for registration. >> So, it's right in your backyard. So,

[43:00] just a heads up. I'll be there and always a good group of, you know,

[43:03] thinking and lots of lots to learn in that setting.

[43:06] » Excellent. >> Yeah.

[43:07] » Great. >> I think that's all I have. I

[43:08] » That's great. No, that's exactly I think we got certainly got to show you what we

[43:12] wanted to show you, but I think um so if you'd like, why don't you leave? I have

[43:16] the presentation. I'll make sure it's circulated and if we have any more

[43:20] » comments and any of those questions, we'll get those back to you.

[43:23] » Yeah, you could just email it right over. Um,

[43:25] » and yeah, I appreciate the time. This I think this is my 13th municipality. I

[43:29] got like another 20 stakeholders that I'll be talking to.

[43:32] » Wow. >> Before the middle of next month, so it's

[43:34] fun. I get to do my tour and see different parts of the state.

[43:36] » And we'll we'll definitely want to contact your colleague and if you can

[43:40] send us that >> point about the about what you know, how

[43:43] many retrofiteds or how many >> Yeah. Let me get right on

[43:46] » installs. That will be great. >> Might take me a few days. What is your

[43:49] timeline for your report that you're >> We were already late on it. So,

[43:53] » well, there's no shame. There's a lot going on. I understand. I'm I'm the

[43:57] chair of our board of civil authority in Essex Junction and we're late on

[44:00] everything. So, don't worry about it. >> Just one last question. Yes. On sort of

[44:04] slightly related. Is there any talk in Essex Junction about an energy committee

[44:08] from what you can tell from just your knowledge of the municipal city

[44:11] government over there? >> It depends. Um, you know, I joined a

[44:16] » lawyer's answer. >> Yes. Yes. You're good at that, right? I

[44:19] I joined >> Sounds wrong.

[44:21] » Oh, good. Good. I joined one of the focus groups uh with the town, I guess,

[44:26] city plan uh renewal that we're doing with the regional planning commission

[44:30] and I joined the energy focus group and I asked about that and it's just a

[44:33] question of time and staff I suppose. And you know, candidly, not to get on my

[44:37] soap box, but I said at the beginning, I think that we are realizing the growing

[44:41] pains of a community that's half the size it was. I imagine everyone's

[44:45] realizing them. Sometimes it hurts more than others, but um there's less

[44:49] resources to go around for really important things, and we're finding that

[44:53] in the town you have a lot more infrastructure set up over time. So,

[44:56] I'll just say that I'm off my soap box. Well,

[45:00] » it's always great to have you both on and off the soap box. So, thank you so

[45:04] much for coming. Yeah, I'm gonna get out of here only because I have to get

[45:07] something else. But I'll follow up with you on these. Thanks for your time.

[45:10] Thanks for your service. >> Thank you, Dylan.

[45:12] » All right. Yeah, thanks for letting me back in 81. I think it's years.

[45:16] » Yeah. All right. >> Awesome. Good to see you.

[45:19] » Great. >> All right. Uh, anything more we should

[45:24] talk about there? I will circulate that um that list and then we can if there's

[45:30] any more maybe you know if folks want to add some question add some answers to

[45:35] that um I think that's a that's a good use of time. Um, okay. Switching to a

[45:40] couple of >> could I could I just say one thing?

[45:44] » Of course. >> Yeah. Uh, so I had a chance to meet with

[45:48] the run-on climate uh uh fellow and he with regard well actually I think we're

[45:56] going to get to this in terms of have we already now gone through the upper main

[46:02] um uh thermal energy pro progress? Have we moved it and already talked about it

[46:08] or are we gonna come back to that? >> No, we can talk about that next if you

[46:12] want. Um because I do think >> Germaine the conversation.

[46:17] » Yep. Okay. No, I'll wait till we get there. No problem. I was just going to

[46:22] comment on that. Yeah. >> Um

[46:27] so the next item on our agenda was community day and the election day info

[46:32] tables. So on community day, that's September 19th. Do I have that right?

[46:38] » I believe. So I sent that email. >> I'm sure you did.

[46:43] » With all the rules and regulations for setting something up.

[46:47] » Yeah. Okay. Hold on one second. Maybe I can.

[47:04] Okay. >> Elections table.

[47:07] » I saw the election table request. >> So the town's moderator, John Sonic, who

[47:14] handles all the election protocol. >> Yes.

[47:16] » Uh request at the table. As long as the committee stays within the rules

[47:20] mentioned in the policy that's attached, Greg will allow it. Um,

[47:27] if you had any other questions.

[47:32] » Yeah. >> To get some answers. Uh, I have the you

[47:36] have the policy there too. The >> I do. Yeah. The BCA politician policy. I

[47:40] think it was just like where you're set at the table and

[47:45] you know obviously you can't discuss >> right anything about the election.

[47:49] » Yeah. >> Absolutely. Yeah. It's a pretty

[47:54] straightforward policy. >> Yeah.

[47:57] » So is this going to be over at the Essex Middle School?

[48:00] » Exactly. >> Where table B?

[48:04] Last time that we did this, which I think was in 20

[48:10] have been 2020. >> No, we Oh,

[48:14] » I thought we did it last year. I thought we were there last year at

[48:18] » the election. >> Oh, I'm sorry. I'm on community day.

[48:22] Sorry, election. Nope, you're right. >> Jump back to community day. Sean John

[48:27] was right in pointing out that we did receive the the note, you know, the the

[48:30] the the background on the election table request.

[48:35] Um, so let's see.

[48:44] Let me just check one thing about that. Let's see. Yeah, they are welcome to set

[48:48] up outside on the walkway into the school. It would be fine for them. This

[48:53] is coming from John Sonic, I think. Yes. Who is the is

[48:59] he that he's the town he's on the board of civil authority and he's basically

[49:03] the guy who runs all the elections. He said uh it would be fine for them to be

[49:09] a little closer to the school that we normally allow since I assume they

[49:12] wouldn't be waving placards for a candidate or an issue on the ballot. And

[49:15] if they are in fact supporting something on the ballot, they just have to stay in

[49:17] the normal zone. I don't think they could be inside the school just because

[49:21] there'sn't a lot of room in there. We will have some pole workers in that

[49:24] vestibule area. Ah, and school is in session that day. So, that is different

[49:31] from what we had before. Last time we were in the hallway on the on the way

[49:37] into the gym. Do you think I should ask? Why don't I

[49:42] say we did this last time and as long as we keep that table pretty thin, wouldn't

[49:46] there be a way that we could be on the inside?

[49:50] » Can't hurt to ask. >> Can't hurt to ask. Why don't I ask? That

[49:52] would be my action item is to ask to see if there's any way that we can do it

[49:57] inside. >> Do we have

[49:58] » we do it on election day? >> We did I think back Natalie, don't do

[50:03] you remember wasn't that like 2018 that we did that? Um

[50:08] » boy, I Let's see. 336. It could have been that long ago. Yeah, it it really

[50:15] could have. Yeah, >> I remember we were giving out like lots

[50:19] of Vermont gas um you know, the the weather stripping and um and some info

[50:25] as well. >> So, long time ago,

[50:28] » it was a long time ago for sure. And maybe they're more nervous about it this

[50:32] year, but can't hurt to ask. why don't I ask and then we can make a we can make a

[50:36] decision on it on that basis because sitting outside it's just like bof

[50:41] however long and I also believe and again this is going back on memory to

[50:46] 2018 we were not there the whole day we were we picked like I think maybe the

[50:52] prime time sometime between like 4:00 and six o'clock and that's what I would

[50:59] propose to do again is just that we pick a pick a peak hour Do we know what we

[51:04] want to have on the table and be communicating a better?

[51:07] » Not yet. But that brings us back to September 19th because I think whatever

[51:11] it is going to be for community day, we should do the same thing at the uh at

[51:15] the election. >> Should we pose the three scenarios that

[51:18] the one just presented? >> We could certainly do that. We could

[51:21] say, "What do you think about the IRP?" and and put out a placard about that.

[51:26] » Oh, yeah. >> Or have a little vote. What we've done

[51:28] in the past is we've had jars and we've given, you know, ballots and let people

[51:33] kind of, >> you know, put in their vote, right?

[51:36] » Yeah. We had the bean count. >> The bean count, which was great. We did

[51:40] that to try to try to get our new name. >> Um,

[51:44] but I think beyond that for community day,

[51:49] let me just double check on that.

[52:04] Yeah. Community day Essex. Wait.

[52:13] » Community fall festival. >> Community fall festival.

[52:19] » Yeah.

[52:22] Uh September 19th, 11 to 4 >> at Boston Road Park. 11 to 4. Okay.

[52:28] » That's the one they set up in the soccer fields and baseball fields, right?

[52:35] » And I do think that we confirmed. >> Oh, you did.

[52:42] » I thought we did also. Yeah. >> Yep.

[52:45] » Yeah. Okay. >> Yeah. I definitely remember the whole

[52:49] scenario from last year. Yeah. So, you should be getting something from

[52:55] Nicole or Jen from Parks and Recreation. >> Yes.

[53:00] » Where I don't know if they have like a map of

[53:03] where people are going to be. If you just go

[53:06] set a table up and first come, first serve. I don't know how that works.

[53:10] » I think so. So, maybe what I should do, let me just check one thing on my end.

[53:15] Um, pass in. So September 19th is the

[53:22] Saturday. So in other words, it's not this Saturday, but it's the following

[53:26] Saturday. >> And you said 11 to 4.

[53:29] » Yeah. >> Okay. So maybe what I should do is I I

[53:33] will put that on everybody's calendar or unless you want to put it on your

[53:37] calendar right now, but send up a signup sheet so that we can, you know, pick

[53:43] times to to try to be there. And I think after that it's really going to be a

[53:48] question of what information do we want to have out?

[53:52] Um, and maybe if I can get a what I what I'm envisioning is that we should get

[53:57] info. I'm just brainstorming this now. So others by all means chime in, but I'm

[54:02] thinking some combination of Vermont gas um

[54:07] efficiency Vermont

[54:11] and probably stuff that we can make on our own. if it's the energy plan, you

[54:17] know, like a like a thing about the energy plan, about the IRP like you

[54:21] said, Gita, um

[54:28] our charter, if the charter is approved, because I did send that in to um you

[54:34] know, to the select board and I don't know when it is that they're going to

[54:36] actually hear on that, but we can at least we can at least talk about that

[54:40] with folks. And then who am I missing?

[54:46] CCR. Well, actually, I'm wondering about um

[54:51] VCAN now that I'm realizing that they're having this festival, this um

[54:56] » Oh, energy action network. >> Energy or Yeah, sorry. Energy Action

[55:01] Network.

[55:04] Bear with me for one second on that. What are the details there?

[55:12] Oh, that's the 23rd. Okay.

[55:20] Well, they actually always have a lot of good stuff, too. So, maybe we ask them

[55:24] for information as well. Like, they have all those charts. You know, I'm just

[55:28] looking one now. How far does $10 take you? Electric versus g gasoline

[55:33] vehicles. They have kind of great stuff like that that we can share with folks.

[55:38] Um,

[55:41] does that sound good to everybody or any any thoughts one way or the other

[55:48] maybe what we can do is um >> will sorry it's hard to know when to

[55:56] interrupt. Yeah. Well, just it would be helpful to know who who would be

[56:00] available to to work at the table. My my experience is you you're probably okay

[56:07] with just one person at a time given what I'm remembering about the traffic.

[56:13] Um but do we have folks available? I just curious. I know you were going to

[56:19] send around the signup sheet, but I'm just curious who's available.

[56:22] » Yeah, the n So it's the 19th from 11 to 4.

[56:29] I know I'm available. I'm happy to to take the first shift and kind of get

[56:33] some stuff organized. >> I'm available.

[56:38] » I'm available after two. After two. Okay.

[56:44] » Great, Rod.

[56:46] » Great. >> Yeah. So, we've got So, we actually have

[56:50] um four people. Okay. So, we've got plenty of folks who can can help with

[56:55] this. That's great. >> Yep. Okay.

[56:59] » Great. So I think in the in the interim what what maybe what I'll do is with an

[57:04] email I may um you know set out some delegate you know to delegate some of

[57:10] the let's go get some information from efficiency Vermont from etc like we've

[57:17] traditionally done in the past knowing that this is very new to Ken but I think

[57:21] everybody else we you know we've had it and Ken it'll be second nature to you

[57:26] once you once you see a lot of it So, all right.

[57:34] » Good stuff. Um, next item that I had on the agenda was

[57:41] Oh, yeah. The planning commission request about the energy plan. So, Sean,

[57:45] remind me about that again. >> So,

[57:50] they asked that we come and talk to them.

[57:53] » They want uh the board's work plans for the coming year. Yeah.

[57:58] » Uh any budget requests that you may have starting on July 1st, 27th.

[58:05] » Um >> did they want us to come meet with them?

[58:10] » So they will set an appointment up with the board. It looks like it will be

[58:15] either I don't think it's going to be the 14th because um I would hope that

[58:19] you had heard something >> before Monday. Yeah.

[58:23] » October 5th, October 19th, and November 2nd. Those are the dates that they will

[58:28] be going. The select board will be going

[58:32] over all the commissions and boards. >> I see. Okay.

[58:35] » Coming year. >> So, do we need to get back to them to

[58:38] say like we prefer this date? >> Um,

[58:46] » oh, I see. Yes. Let's see. Upcoming select board meetings are Monday,

[58:50] September 14th, October 5th, October 19th, and November 2nd. Please not

[58:54] there's a broader effort to improve communication.

[59:02] » I like the idea of November 2nd because it gives us more time.

[59:09] » Save the best for last, right? >> Yeah, maybe.

[59:15] » Um, so let's just But going through their bullets just quickly, they say

[59:19] they want to know your board's work plan for the coming year. I have that. I

[59:23] haven't sent it to you guys yet, but we could post it up on the board here in a

[59:26] minute. Does your board have any budget requests for fiscal year 28, which

[59:30] starts on July 127? I think the answer is we don't know yet. Uh what is working

[59:37] well on although I do think that maybe some component of that is going to be

[59:41] the research into the sleeves and the and the um geothermal as part of the um

[59:48] you know, as part of the upper Main Street project. though I I do have

[59:52] information on that. >> Okay.

[59:54] » Going off of one of the scenarios that they have for the buildings. It's

[59:59] 95,650T building.

[1:00:03] » Um and the different types of

[1:00:06] » Wait, sorry, John. That's the aggregate of all the square footage of all the

[1:00:09] buildings or is that just one specific >> of the the megaplex of all the buildings

[1:00:14] » of everything? >> Um okay.

[1:00:17] And typically that's how they determine how many wells they need to dig is by

[1:00:22] the square footage. So typically for a building that size it's going to between

[1:00:25] 20 and $50,000. >> Okay.

[1:00:28] » Um and that's the mobilization setup, drills, generating equipment. And they

[1:00:34] have to drill and cast for the for the BS. They're typically 300 to 500 ft deep

[1:00:40] at 20 to $40 per foot depending on if they're hitting rock, sand,

[1:00:45] » ledge, etc. Yeah. Um then they have to do uh what's called a loop installation

[1:00:50] and grouting. So it's like a high density polyurethane tubes that are

[1:00:56] loaded into the wells and then they do what's called a thermal response testing

[1:01:00] on on what's coming up >> circulating through that and that's how

[1:01:04] they determine >> how much you BTUs basically is that

[1:01:09] you'll be able to get out of those

[1:01:13] » um for this area of Vermont for that amount of square foot. How many wells do

[1:01:18] they think they need to drill? So, let's see. Anywhere between

[1:01:28] it was almost 500. Let me I I know it's in there somewhere. Wow. Thought

[1:01:34] » that is a lot.

[1:01:41] » I had a question too. Well, >> yeah. Yeah. In general, can some of

[1:01:47] those wells be under parking lots? Good question. I I can't imagine why

[1:01:52] they wouldn't, but I but I do seem I do feel like I mostly at

[1:01:58] least of the ones that I've seen, it does seem like most of them are out in a

[1:02:01] field somewhere. >> Yeah.

[1:02:04] » So, I don't know if if that is a product of they don't want to be under under a

[1:02:09] parking lot because of access like you access them again.

[1:02:13] » I don't I don't know.

[1:02:17] I guess it it depends on on what they run into for how many they're going to

[1:02:21] have to drill, but it it's going to be quite a few. I guess the exact number is

[1:02:27] not in here. >> Okay.

[1:02:28] » The reason I brought that up is um I'm I'm sure there's some kind of uh

[1:02:34] distance between wells. So, you can fairly rapidly figure out how big the

[1:02:39] field would have to be and then overlay that on top of the thing. it was 2/3 of

[1:02:44] that area there. That's >> no point.

[1:02:46] » Yeah. >> Right.

[1:02:49] Um but yeah, so then they do that that thermal test and it's it's expensive in

[1:02:57] the beginning, but you know over 10 to 20 years you could save millions of

[1:03:03] dollars and electricity. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

[1:03:06] » So it's a high cost, high payoff.

[1:03:11] Certainly something they should look into I think if they're gonna you know

[1:03:15] » so then okay so that might be so we'll come back to that a little bit but so

[1:03:19] that might be our budget request in part and then we have to go into the where

[1:03:23] where else can we find some grants for to supplement that

[1:03:27] uh okay then we have to find what is

[1:03:30] working well on your board and what could be approved plenty and plenty I

[1:03:35] would say what do you what do you want or need to be a more effective committee

[1:03:43] Okay, I'm just throwing out these questions here without putting out the

[1:03:46] answers. Maybe we should talk about this a little bit more next time. Um, but my

[1:03:51] just to say it out loud, what I think would be so much so helpful is if we

[1:03:57] could get more data from the treasures about like what, you know, where meters

[1:04:05] are, what we're, you know, like what we're paying, what we're paying

[1:04:08] annually, how much savings are we getting from the

[1:04:11] solar, all those kinds of things. You know what I mean? Almost like building a

[1:04:14] dashboard, >> right? So, I mean, we can I can give you

[1:04:18] every penny the town's spent on gas and electricity.

[1:04:23] » I have all of that. >> You do? Okay. All right. So, that may be

[1:04:27] » as far as as the credits for the solar. >> Yeah.

[1:04:30] » But I I don't I have all that information. Dan Roy, I believe, would

[1:04:35] he he deals with the credits and Yeah. paying. I think we should get I think if

[1:04:41] we're going to go meet with the select board on November 2nd, let's get that

[1:04:45] info because Andy Watts has been asking for that for years and I feel like we've

[1:04:49] never really delivered on that. Not because we I mean not because we I I

[1:04:55] feel like we have asked, but just make it a solid ask,

[1:04:59] » right? >> We have like what 60% or 40% that we

[1:05:03] could add more to the buildings to the credits. We could be getting more credit

[1:05:09] based upon what GB said then what do we know?

[1:05:12] » Right. I don't understand how it all works. I know there's 215 panels on top

[1:05:16] of the police station and >> yeah,

[1:05:19] » I get about $200 worth of saving. >> Can we get that or does that

[1:05:23] » I I think that's what we save on the electric bill. So on average police

[1:05:30] stations anywhere from 3 to 3500 a month. uh depending, you know,

[1:05:35] summertime we get >> sometimes a thousand dollars that's

[1:05:40] knocked off the bill, but I believe there's some credit stuff in the

[1:05:43] background that I'm I don't know how all that works,

[1:05:46] » right? >> Um

[1:05:48] » you could add more more of your accounts into the pool solar and get some of the

[1:05:52] credits the excess that you're generating,

[1:05:55] » right? >> You could apply to some of your builds.

[1:05:58] » Whatever we can do because like I just said, it's 18.11%. No, that's going to

[1:06:03] that's going to smart. >> It's not stopping.

[1:06:05] » Yeah, >> it's just going to skyrocket.

[1:06:09] » The more demand for electric, the higher it gets. Just the way it is.

[1:06:14] » Yeah. Well, and also I mean, you know, Dylan's quip about the trade war is not

[1:06:20] a trivial thing. I mean, if it gets if it got really ugly,

[1:06:24] » it could get really ugly for Vermont. >> Right.

[1:06:28] » Right. >> It will. I have to get going.

[1:06:30] » You got to get going. All right. Thank you, Ken. Great stuff. We'll we'll

[1:06:34] communicate on the rest of the of it by email. Okay. Really appreciate it. All

[1:06:38] right. >> Thanks.

[1:06:40] » Um, okay. So, and then the last question on this was stipens. How do volunteers

[1:06:44] feel about them? Are they useful in contributing? Have we gotten our

[1:06:50] only one person has ever asked me for a stipen?

[1:06:53] » That's fine. And that was if so if you want a stipen

[1:06:57] » at at each meeting I need to know who wants the stipen because I have to fill

[1:07:02] out paperwork for each person. So I >> I'm told that I that I don't have to

[1:07:08] announce that but I don't know how that works either to be honest with you. I

[1:07:13] know I have the saved. I just change the dates on it and send it. So if you want

[1:07:18] the stipen I I think it's >> 20 bucks.

[1:07:22] » No. I don't know. I want to say 90. >> Really?

[1:07:26] » I could be wrong. >> I I don't know to be honest with you. I

[1:07:30] can find out. >> Okay. Sure. Why don't you find out first

[1:07:33] and then we can go back to that. Okay. All right. So, we need to we'll need to

[1:07:39] respond to that then. But could do you want to just ask and put us on for

[1:07:44] November 2nd and that gives us a little more time to

[1:07:48] talk about this in October.

[1:07:54] Y.

[1:07:57] Now, as to the work plan, I'm just looking and it is just let me just look

[1:08:02] at what's on our agenda. What else is on our agenda for tonight?

[1:08:10] I think the right thing to do here because I did not get the work plan to

[1:08:14] everybody before this meeting is that I will I'll send that here. I can put it

[1:08:19] up right now. Give me one second.

[1:08:30] I just want to send work plan draft.

[1:08:37] Okay, there we go.

[1:08:42] » Oops. Bear with me. >> Yeah, Will, while you're looking for

[1:08:45] that, just two things. One is do we need the I I remember we used our popup tent

[1:08:52] for the community day. Does that sound familiar to folks?

[1:08:58] » It does. Is that back with you? >> Well, it is. The only thing is that it

[1:09:04] has a tear in it unrelated to its use last year and we're having somebody

[1:09:08] repair it. I think I can probably pull it in in time or get it back in time,

[1:09:14] but does anyone else have a popup that's available in case I can't?

[1:09:21] » That sounds like a no. >> I think it's a no unless unless Ken has

[1:09:26] one because no longer here. >> Yeah. Well, I'll just let's just figure

[1:09:30] we'll try to call ours in. So, the other thing is I I haven't heard Doy in the

[1:09:36] meeting. It's hard for me to know who's there. Am I right?

[1:09:39] » You are correct. And I was I was going to raise that issue, but go ahead and

[1:09:43] say what's on your mind about that. >> Well, you're probably going there too

[1:09:47] maybe. Uh Will is just around uh somehow celebrating DIY. So, I'll just leave it

[1:09:52] there and we'll get to it when we get to it. But yeah, I don't know when she's

[1:09:56] moving. Um so, just making sure we think of something there. I think that would

[1:10:02] be an important gesture. Yeah, understood.

[1:10:09] Um, and moreover, maybe actually Sean, one thing that we could do just right

[1:10:15] off the bat there is that in the past for members of the committee who've been

[1:10:20] on for more than a year, we've ended up with kind of like a certificate of

[1:10:24] appreciation from the select board or I think it

[1:10:28] usually comes from the select board. Um, and I think that that's definitely

[1:10:33] called for in the case of >> Doie.

[1:10:35] » I think we made it a year, but we were sort of like it just sort of depended on

[1:10:39] level of contribution. And she certainly qualifies.

[1:10:44] » She been how many roughly? >> Uh, at least five.

[1:10:52] » Quite a few. Yeah. Yeah, >> at least five. Maybe close to six.

[1:11:00] I I'm also thinking maybe a chance to sit down with her or something. I I

[1:11:08] don't know. I know Ga you had spoken about Well, anyway,

[1:11:12] » uh a gift possibly and if I'm remembering all this correctly. Yeah.

[1:11:17] It's just I think celebrating her in some um fairly intentional way would be

[1:11:24] I think good. Should we do that in the month of September, you think? Or maybe

[1:11:29] first week of October, something like that?

[1:11:33] » When is she moving? >> I there was no date she mentioned. It

[1:11:39] was like dependent on when she finds h housing,

[1:11:46] right? Contingent there.

[1:11:49] » But I was thinking put a basket together with Vermont stuff. since she's living

[1:11:55] out of state. >> Yeah. And and Keith, I know my initial

[1:12:01] response to that wasn't and I say go for it if you're I mean if everybody else

[1:12:06] agrees, I'm happy to contribute. >> Just bring in your best of you put it

[1:12:13] together. >> Yeah. If you put it together, we'll

[1:12:14] reimburse you all for it or you want input. But if you don't mind taking that

[1:12:19] as a charge, then >> great.

[1:12:23] any any kind of G like I'm extremely surprised she's not there now so it

[1:12:29] makes this conversation easier but do we want to try to schedule or make sure

[1:12:34] she's at the next meeting or how do we in terms of presentation

[1:12:42] » I'm starting to think maybe a a standalone event might be better easier

[1:12:46] to organize we don't have to worry about open meeting and all that right just to

[1:12:51] kind of say goodbye to her and But then if we can get the letter of

[1:12:55] recognition and then we can say something more formalized at the next

[1:13:00] meeting, that's probably the best way to handle this.

[1:13:03] » I'm looking legal analysis, but

[1:13:08] » yeah. Right. So that we would say something formal at the next meeting,

[1:13:12] assuming that she can come, but then have a a a um just sitting down at at a

[1:13:18] local restaurant or bar or something like that and um Yeah. having Is that

[1:13:24] what you're thinking? Okay. >> Yeah. And shooting the breeze with her

[1:13:27] » just thanking her for service.

[1:13:32] » So why don't we do that? I'm inclined on the on the work plan because you guys

[1:13:38] haven't had a chance to see this. It's very similar to the one that we talked

[1:13:41] about last time, but I don't think it hurts if we're going to have the meeting

[1:13:47] uh November 2nd for us to review, you know, to have you guys review this and

[1:13:53] make sure we're all in agreement on it before the or at the October

[1:13:58] meeting. and then we can just approve it, send it to them, go from there.

[1:14:05] That sound okay to everybody? It's a lot easier than trying to read it

[1:14:09] on screen just kind of given where we all are.

[1:14:13] So, um Okay. Um why don't then we Okay. So, regarding

[1:14:20] the energy plan though specifically, Sean,

[1:14:24] » I think um didn't Ann Jandice say that she was

[1:14:31] able to help just do some of the

[1:14:36] like touching up on that. Just see if I got that

[1:14:45] comment. No, I think that's what I think that's

[1:14:48] what I should do is get our current draft back to her to take a look at and

[1:14:53] probably copy um uh Catherine at the CDO as well to say

[1:15:00] here are our changes so that we can then get that

[1:15:04] » get that back to everybody. >> Okay.

[1:15:06] » Um Okay. So Natalie, why don't you tell us about you had some other progress as

[1:15:12] far as like the funding and the work that you were looking into for the Upper

[1:15:17] Main Street project. >> Will, it was more, you know, me meeting

[1:15:22] with the the run on climate fellow and his his strong feeling. I I I showed him

[1:15:30] he has the emails that Katherine sent with regard to the test um the utility

[1:15:37] sleeves and the the the test well etc. And he he just said that it is um well

[1:15:44] Dylan was touching on this that these pipes can last a hundred years, the heat

[1:15:49] exchange can last about 30 years and that to approach it anything other I

[1:15:56] mean if we were remotely serious about it to approach it anything other than

[1:16:01] toward the beginning of the project rather than after the fact is the thing

[1:16:08] that would financially make the most sense. Now, do I have all the numbers to

[1:16:12] back that up? But he said that it but then Debbie knew is going to be, you

[1:16:18] know, he was going to actually be talking with Debbie the day after I met

[1:16:22] with him. And uh but he said, "Boy, if you can get

[1:16:26] it off the ground at the beginning, um you know, above and beyond just the

[1:16:32] test, the test well, etc. That would be in the big scheme of things, hard as it

[1:16:39] might be to imagine this, the most economically logical.

[1:16:45] That is what I've learned. >> Right.

[1:16:49] Okay. That's very helpful. That's very helpful. Well, I'm inclined

[1:16:54] to get in touch with the the person that Dylan recommended the Vermont Gas.

[1:17:00] Oh, can can I'm sorry that does he said LN the LN consulting uh folks really

[1:17:08] highly regarded and >> okay

[1:17:12] » and and part of his job is also understanding how to influence policy

[1:17:17] makers. Um and he he said getting getting a the ear of or having a

[1:17:26] conversation with a couple of select board members would be really valuable.

[1:17:32] Um, and you know, Shannon Jackson comes to mind. And then in my infinite wisdom,

[1:17:38] I said, "And Ethan Morris," which was I don't maybe you all don't

[1:17:45] understand why I think that's so funny, but um anyway, but I you know, just in

[1:17:50] terms of talking with them individually or or or as a duo about um the possib in

[1:17:56] other words, not just landing it on them, you know, in at some other date,

[1:18:01] but but actually talking with them about it and trying to build a relationship

[1:18:05] around the consideration of this. >> Yeah,

[1:18:10] » he suggested that. Yeah, >> did you end up going to the Saturday?

[1:18:15] » I was gonna bring this up. One of the interesting things that I came away from

[1:18:19] that meeting after having spoken with um people from transportation and trails

[1:18:24] and conservation and then housing. >> And this just for everybody's just just

[1:18:28] to frame it. So, this is you going to the Saturday meetings that they have at

[1:18:33] the um at the >> Uncommon Ground.

[1:18:38] » Yeah. So, I went to the the breakfast recently.

[1:18:40] » Oh, the breakfast one. That's right. >> And then Yes. So, the the Saturday

[1:18:44] things will be coming up. But, um it's interesting how it seems like

[1:18:48] everybody's in like their little silos. So the housing people um so like Lois

[1:18:53] the the chair for the housing has like some really interesting fantastic ideas

[1:18:57] about how to address some of the housing needs. Then you have transportation

[1:19:01] talking about how do we best meet transportation needs for citizens of the

[1:19:05] town. Um and then um similar for for the trails but there's like an energy

[1:19:12] component to all of these things. So, it just feels like there's some like

[1:19:16] missing connection on how do we how do we make sure that any of those kind of

[1:19:22] projects that may be coming forth or when bigger things come through the town

[1:19:27] that has, you know, any sort of regulation on like new buildings or

[1:19:32] things like that. How do we >> how do we have input on that? I don't

[1:19:36] know if that's part of the kind of action plan is this kind of

[1:19:40] collaboration with with the other committees for things that may have an

[1:19:43] energy component to it or just stronger recommendations for regulation.

[1:19:49] » Well, that's very that's really important that you had that. I'm glad

[1:19:52] that you were there. Um yeah, I think I mean I think the

[1:19:57] newsletter helps the one that the town puts out because we can at least see

[1:20:01] that through that what other groups are doing. But um but yeah, I think more

[1:20:07] collaboration opportunities would be really good. And and is that breakfast

[1:20:11] meeting? Did they talk about that? So is that coming up? Is that this weekend?

[1:20:15] » So the the breakfast was last Friday. >> The breakfast was Friday, but then the

[1:20:19] one that they do at Uncommon. >> Yeah. So I don't I don't know if it's

[1:20:23] coming out this weekend or if it's next. But those are on Saturday.

[1:20:29] » Yeah. I have a feeling it might be this Saturday.

[1:20:31] » Yeah. >> Okay.

[1:20:35] Well, to just to Natalie's point, that might be a point to talk with some of

[1:20:39] those guys individually about,

[1:20:45] you know, about the need to be just to be hammering on this, taking the thermal

[1:20:50] geothermal more seriously. >> Yeah.

[1:20:55] » Okay. Well, great. Thank you both for those updates. I think that's great.

[1:21:00] Um, I had on my list the charter and I did send that just tonight to Greg Dugen

[1:21:06] and said, "Here you go. This took a long time for us to put it together, but here

[1:21:10] it is and we'd like your input and see if it can be approved by the select

[1:21:15] board." So, what I'm hoping, um, Sean, is that maybe that maybe they approve

[1:21:20] that on November 2nd if if that's when we meet with them.

[1:21:26] that will that's where they're going to discuss all of that stuff. So

[1:21:30] » yeah, perfect. >> Yep.

[1:21:32] » It gives enough time, but it also gives enough time that if Greg or is it Karen?

[1:21:36] If Greg or Karen wanted us to change something else on it or there's

[1:21:40] something else that causes a problem, they've got time to get it to us and we

[1:21:44] can get a we can get a track. >> Right. I I would send it once you find

[1:21:47] out what date you're going to be at. I would send it to Karen and Greg.

[1:21:50] » Yeah. >> Know at least a week or so.

[1:21:52] » Well, they have it now. Oh, they have Oh, that's why you just sent it. Yeah.

[1:21:56] So, that I would think that that's plenty of time.

[1:21:58] » Yeah. Okay. Good. Good. Good. Good. All right. Last item that I have. I have

[1:22:04] print copies of this, believe it or not. Take a look and I'll I'll post it up

[1:22:10] here on the screen in just a second. This is my not

[1:22:15] hopefully short but sweet take for the Essex um

[1:22:20] you know for front porch on the Essex uh experience story the

[1:22:26] exorter story right which is that story about Sun and Essex experience getting

[1:22:32] together so hold on Rod and Natalie and I'll put this up for you

[1:22:40] See, there we go. >> Now, do we have some data from them on

[1:22:45] how almost their savings? >> Not yet, but we could certainly ask for

[1:22:49] that. >> Yeah, that'd be good to get some stats

[1:22:52] on. >> Yep. Okay.

[1:22:57] So, this is what I have, which is which is very generic, but I agree with the

[1:23:01] suggestion that maybe we ask both of them. What's the What would be good to

[1:23:06] know is what the total kilowatt hour is between

[1:23:12] what's on the Essex Experience and what's on the Spawn Resort.

[1:23:18] » Yeah, you could you you could definitely get that because you're most utilities

[1:23:23] are obligated to provide that >> how much you're generating.

[1:23:27] » Oh. Oh, I see. Yeah. every month your your your bill should show how much

[1:23:33] you're generating and if if Experience gets a consolidated bill and

[1:23:40] um depending on how they're account set up, you should be able to

[1:23:46] get that information. >> Okay,

[1:23:50] I'm going to email this to everybody. So, how about we do this and say that

[1:23:54] because we're going to get that that information,

[1:23:57] but I'm just going to say please provide edits.

[1:24:02] Uh, and I will seek out from I think we should ask for it from Suncom

[1:24:11] the info on total KWH

[1:24:17] output savings etc. I can get that from Mike McCarthy, who I know pretty well.

[1:24:23] You probably know Mike very well, too. But he'd be a good person to get that

[1:24:27] from, I think. >> Yeah, that would be a good P.

[1:24:30] » Okay, so I'll send that now. There we go.

[1:24:46] Very good. That'll go out to everybody here in just a second. and I sent you

[1:24:50] the email on when that letter goes out. >> Okay.

[1:24:54] » Um,

[1:24:58] PS6 News Monthly Community, it is going out

[1:25:03] this Friday. I sent that to you on the 31st.

[1:25:06] » Oh, yes. >> But I believe it's

[1:25:11] the same Friday of every >> Oh, was it Friday? Wait, this is Brian

[1:25:17] comment. No, for >> this is for this letter you wanted to

[1:25:20] do. >> Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yes. Right. Right.

[1:25:23] Right. Pages, Facebook, all that stuff. >> Y

[1:25:27] this Friday. All right. Well, let me see. By noon on Thursday. Well, let me

[1:25:30] see if I I'll I'll email Mike tonight and maybe he'll be able to get back from

[1:25:33] there tomorrow. But if not this Thursday, then maybe we'll do it next

[1:25:37] for next Thursday. The next letter. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yep.

[1:25:42] Okay. Any other business to discuss this

[1:25:46] evening? I I'm sorry. I'm back with Die again

[1:25:50] because there's a dangling piece here. Can I not knowing her timeline, I would

[1:25:56] propose, shall I go ahead and check with Die and find a few times that she would

[1:26:02] be available in the late afternoon to early evening. I mean, just yell out

[1:26:08] your thoughts, find a few dates, maybe just put them out to folks. I'm happy to

[1:26:13] handle it. I I just Does that seem like a good approach or do folks want to say,

[1:26:19] "Oh, how about this in this state?" What do you think?

[1:26:24] » No, it is. Uh Natalie, I love it if you would mind wouldn't mind doing that. And

[1:26:29] in particular, it would be interesting to know what

[1:26:33] she's doing on the 19th because if we're all kind of around anyway and we're

[1:26:37] doing the info table, then maybe we do something in table.

[1:26:41] » Yeah. like right at the end. Oh, that's a

[1:26:45] great idea. I just was because I'm thinking that she would have some

[1:26:48] availability, but I don't know and I know that time passes and then we would

[1:26:52] lose our opportunity. Great. >> Let me talk with her and I'll work on

[1:26:59] » Yeah. celebrate a little later that afternoon.

[1:27:02] » Oh, that sounds like a terrific idea. Okay, I'll get back to everybody with

[1:27:06] what I learn and we'll go with that option. and maybe

[1:27:11] one other possibility if that doesn't look good for her. Okay, great. Thank

[1:27:16] you. >> Give me a date to

[1:27:19] » to build build a a gift basket. Thank you for doing that.

[1:27:24] » Excellent. All right, everyone. Well, that that was

[1:27:28] good. I'm glad we had I'm really glad that we had Dylan. It's always great to

[1:27:30] have guest speakers. If any of you have in mind other guest speakers, you know,

[1:27:35] definitely let me know because I always got to charge them.

[1:27:39] » Good stuff. >> Thanks for Dylan. He reminded me that

[1:27:42] there's a meeting today. >> That's right. And told us and told us

[1:27:45] that the EN meetings in our backyard. I think everybody gets those

[1:27:52] um emails, but if you don't get those from them, let me know if you're

[1:27:57] interested in that. And I I think I'm going to go ahead and assuming I can

[1:28:00] make it, I'll go ahead and register because it's literally a block from my

[1:28:06] house. >> When is it? 23rd.

[1:28:08] » 23rd. I have I'm very worried that I have a wedding or something that day.

[1:28:14] The night >> in town.

[1:28:16] » Yeah. I don't know. But anyway, we'll take a look at it. So, all right.

[1:28:21] Hearing no further business. Can I get a motion to adjurnn?

[1:28:26] So moved. Okay. Second.

[1:28:30] » Second. >> All right. All in favor?

[1:28:33] » I. >> I. All right. Thank you all. Good to see

[1:28:37] you. >> Bye-bye.

[1:28:40] » Take care. Bye. Bye. >> Bye.

[1:28:43] » All right.

[1:28:48] Script is being generated.

Energy Committee Meeting - September 9, 2026

Transcript