[0:00] meeting to order if you will stand with me and say the pledge of legion

[0:08] i pledge allegiance to the flag of the united states of america

[0:13] and from the republic for which it stands one nation

[0:17] under god indivisible with liberty and justice

[0:24] okay and i'll go ahead and give the invocation

[0:27] our heavenly father we are so thankful for this time that we have together we

[0:31] thank you for allowing us to take a moment during this busy holiday season

[0:34] to be able to conduct business of the city

[0:37] please help guide and direct our discussions so that they fall into the

[0:40] will that you have prepared for our lives and the lives of the

[0:43] people in our community amen thank you

[0:49] all right uh citizens to be heard

[0:56] all right seeing as how i don't believe there is anyone who has anything to say

[1:00] we'll go ahead and move on to chapter 13 streets and sidewalks

[1:08] so we'll go ahead and start with article one sidewalk so page

[1:12] i guess 13-1

[1:16] all right did anyone have any thing on this section that they would like to

[1:20] discuss or any corrections i guess in 13-10

[1:27] uh that rate of one inch to four feet that is an ada compliant

[1:33] number

[1:37] yes i believe that uh it's two percent grade

[1:40] i believe one to four is the appropriate uh the appropriate grade i can

[1:48] verify with garrett to make sure but i know so it's a two percent grade it's

[1:56] all very powerful

[2:06] okay okay were there any other comments over

[2:11] this page

[2:17] i didn't have any okay you know to the uh best of your

[2:23] knowledge if all of this is still accurate

[2:27] i mean um yeah i guess if it's accurate if this is how

[2:31] things are conducted yes okay and we

[2:40] i don't believe this particular section um references our sidewalk program that

[2:47] we have but uh that'd be the only other thing

[2:53] that's more of a

[2:56] policy decision based on budgetary funding uh more

[3:00] than it is uh but then i'd recommend being law

[3:03] so i think that's why i leave that out thank you okay so go ahead and turn the

[3:09] page to 13-2 there is not much here and i did not have anything

[3:14] changing this did you all have anything on this page i did not

[3:18] i did not okay so go ahead and move on through

[3:22] that three or four two remote removal of snow and

[3:25] or ice

[3:30] i didn't have any marked on this page

[3:34] yeah i didn't either chris do you know uh the ksa that it references if it's

[3:38] supposed to have the e at the end of that there

[3:41] or um i didn't know if the e was supposed to

[3:46] be bracketed or if it's even supposed to be there

[3:52] i am not entirely sure so i will check and verify that that is the

[3:58] correct normally uh those will be bracketed but i'll i'll

[4:03] check into that and

[4:06] okay sounds good was there anything else or oh

[4:16] commissioner cole do you have anything for this page oh sorry what chris

[4:20] uh i was just gonna say the the last section there

[4:24] a removal uh of these of snow and ice

[4:31] so this is one particular section that similarly we have rarely enforced

[4:38] um it's something that i think does make a lot of sense in some

[4:44] aspects especially in downtown districts and areas that are

[4:47] heavily traveled uh if we if you know we were to have

[4:52] you know sidewalks heading to all the way to the high school all the way to

[4:55] the elementary school that were heavily utilized for

[4:57] pedestrian traffic and they weren't cleared of snow we

[5:03] could have kids walking on the street etc currently we don't have a ton of

[5:08] that but it is something that according to

[5:12] city code we should be enforcing and one of those things that as we've

[5:18] discussed discussed on some other things in the

[5:20] past would you prefer us to start enforcing it more strictly

[5:25] to be in compliance with code or would you prefer to remove it

[5:29] i would like to one way or the other either strike it

[5:33] or start forcing it because i don't like having things in the book that we don't

[5:37] enforce but it's been one of those things that's

[5:41] do we really go after somebody to you know remove their snow this

[5:50] instance

[5:54] i mean i would i would agree i think that if it's going to remain in here

[5:57] that it's something that would need to be used i kind of wonder though if i

[6:02] mean before it's actually removed by the city i'm assuming that

[6:05] there would be a notice given to the [Music]

[6:08] individual at the house correct

[6:14] well and if it was something to where um enforcement action

[6:22] to where we need to go and take care of it

[6:28] there is no notice provision in here given

[6:33] more than likely what we would attempt to do uh

[6:36] you know we haven't really done this before but we couldn't give 10 days

[6:40] notice like we do for weeds because the snow is going to be gone

[6:42] and all eventuality for uh by that time frame but if it's not

[6:49] taken care of within the appropriate time frame then we would probably

[6:52] try to place place a door hanger something to that effect and give

[6:57] 24 hours or something along those lines and then we would come in and take care

[7:00] of it um you know if we wanted to to

[7:05] do that my suggestion would be that we probably add that type of

[7:08] language to the code to say what that term that period of notice is going to

[7:14] uh is going to be um and certainly that's something i can you know touch

[7:18] base with terry on to try to figure out you know what he might think

[7:22] would be um how to word that but

[7:26] i i think the key is you know as it says you know

[7:29] the first section the owner or occupant of any lots

[7:32] a budding any public sidewalk which all sidewalks are are public unless they are

[7:37] you know going right up to your door uh if they're going

[7:41] you know parallel to the street then it's a public sidewalk and so

[7:45] that particular sidewalk should be clear of snow or ice within

[7:52] six hours from the time of the snowfall or ice storm

[7:55] according to this code and again you know it's just six hours um

[8:02] you know that's that can be tough to i mean we certainly can exercise

[8:08] discretion um but you know if this if the sn if it

[8:12] stops snowing at 2 a.m uh there's going to be a lot of people

[8:15] who frankly don't have time do not get up at 6 a.m to go shovel

[8:20] their sidewalks so that way kids can walk to school on

[8:23] their sidewalks but they'd be in violation of code if

[8:26] they don't because they wouldn't have it shoveled before

[8:29] they got home from work you know within you know before school

[8:32] started and should we take care of it should we issue them a ticket

[8:36] i would i would say we probably give a little bit more time than that

[8:40] um for them to take care of their own sidewalk uh

[8:43] you know kids may have to trek through through snow for a little while uh

[8:47] unfortunately but i think we need to give some reasonable time frame at least

[8:52] that was my question was the six hours being able to get it completed in six

[8:57] hours because as you said a lot of people still go to work

[9:00] if there's a few inches of snow on the sidewalk

[9:04] and if you leave if you leave your home at 5am you're not going to be out there

[9:10] shoveling it before you leave

[9:17] yeah i agree i also think it's important to define

[9:22] public sidewalk in this section as well so that everyone knows

[9:26] who it applies to and which sidewalks they are to be paying attention to to

[9:34] clear okay so if we use bridget's house

[9:40] and that would mean the sidewalk that runs in front of your house

[9:45] right into the side probably on elm yeah on the east side right

[9:49] yeah that's what i mean i i think if you were somebody getting up and going to

[9:52] work in the city or just going to work here

[9:55] i don't know that six hours would give you time to get up

[9:58] you know to be able to get up and get that completed so maybe it's

[10:05] that's a lot of sidewalk

[10:10] yeah i agree i think that i mean i don't know since

[10:14] the idea is to try to clear it as soon as possible should we extend it to

[10:18] within 24 hours i mean the other thing the other

[10:24] question i have should there be a difference between

[10:27] downtown area and maybe bridget's house you know maybe

[10:32] that time frame looks a little bit different i don't know

[10:35] maybe not maybe it's the same

[10:47] i wouldn't think you'd have as many people you know walking by your

[10:51] and you live on a busy street but even on a day like that i wouldn't think

[10:54] you'd have as many people walking by as there may be people down

[10:56] in the downtown area paying bills running errands

[11:00] going to post office those kinds of things

[11:12] my only thing by leaving it in there um where they're strictly enforced or not

[11:18] it just it may give them a little bit of

[11:23] insight that ms if somebody falls in front of your business or your your

[11:29] house and it's a public sidewalk

[11:33] you probably got some liability if you made no attempt to

[11:36] to to get it off there so by leaving this in there it just

[11:40] i guess it just kind of throws it down a little bit that it is

[11:44] it is something that needs taken care of

[11:48] now chris from what i can tell this section the way it reads under a

[11:52] it's defining public sidewalk as a sidewalk within a business or industrial

[11:56] zone or um if there have been a business or

[11:59] commercial use within the past 12 months so i don't think that would necessarily

[12:02] apply to a residential area if i'm reading this

[12:08] correctly on the six-hour time frame right sorry sorry

[12:16] what you said greg my someone was calling me and it muted my phone

[12:19] so on the six-hour time frame you're talking about it looks like it would

[12:23] only apply to those um sidewalks and business or industrial

[12:26] zones as it's a clarification to one and two specifically two

[12:32] well both of those

[12:36] yeah i think after after rereading it i i would concur

[12:44] that i i think you're right and that

[12:49] it's it's only referencing commercial or industrial lots

[12:57] for that time frame

[13:01] so that may not be you know necessarily an issue for say you

[13:04] um for your house in an uh in a residential district it'd really

[13:10] be anybody who's zoned i1 b1 b2

[13:15] um or even if they're not zoned that way but they are

[13:20] their use is commercial or industrial it would still qualify there or if it's

[13:26] been commercial or industrial within the past

[13:29] 12 months it would still qualify as needing to be done

[13:35] from public sector removed from public sidewalk right and i can see

[13:39] why it's in a business zone the time frame

[13:42] you know might be a little more important or a little shorter because

[13:45] that's i mean the idea is to that people be

[13:48] frequenting those businesses so they need to clear their sidewalks

[14:02] you know i would think having something in there

[14:06] to instead of just a hard six hours maybe making it um

[14:12] within if you wanted to leave six hours to say within six hours

[14:17] uh or if you know somehow phrase it if it's overnight

[14:22] uh within the first two hours of daylight or something like that i mean

[14:26] if if it stops snowing at you know at 10

[14:29] o'clock it's you're not going to expect somebody

[14:32] to get to be out there between 10 and 4 a.m 10 p.m and 4 a.m to get a

[14:37] shovel to be in compliance um even if it is a business zone you

[14:41] know right six hours after sunrise of the following

[14:48] day in the the a2

[14:55] you're right i'm just losing my mind here

[15:00] i even read that exact sentence okay

[15:05] okay so should we ju i mean do we feel okay with leaving this section the way

[15:09] that it is i think since it just pertains to

[15:13] business as their commercial purpose yeah i would favor of leaving it exactly

[15:18] the way it is so the only thing that it talks about on

[15:21] the private property is just where you can and cannot

[15:26] get rid of the piles of snow correct okay thanks

[15:31] and so i would say it's probably okay for now if you want to exempt

[15:38] residential areas from these from these provisions um the only thing

[15:43] i would say is if in the event that we ever do

[15:46] get a you know we're hoping to at some point

[15:49] have a safe route to schools grant and get uh better access via sidewalks

[15:55] to both the elementary school and the high school

[15:58] in the event we that ever becomes a reality

[16:02] it might be something at that point to try to designate those routes

[16:05] as snow has to be removed within a certain time frame at least along these

[16:09] routes to try to make sure the kids can can

[16:13] safely get there right but also yeah i would think if it

[16:18] was to the school even though the property

[16:22] would be owned by the city a lot of it the school would

[16:25] probably work hand-in-hand with you getting some of that removed

[16:31] well i mean i would i mean you're talking about

[16:34] it could be a distance all the way to you know i mean all the way across town

[16:40] down cleveland street or you know

[16:44] down maple or well maple's a business district anyways but

[16:48] but i was thinking more more in residential areas that that would be

[16:51] um a sidewalk route for a lot of kids to to walk to school that you know

[16:59] it probably give more than six hours but a time frame in which you know within a

[17:05] 24 to 48 hours that residences along that route are expected to have

[17:11] uh snow removed but we're not in that situation right now anyway so

[17:15] that's probably future discussion but i'll just throw that out there for maybe

[17:20] future future thought kind of going off of lawrence

[17:26] the city of lawrence where i lived at for six years

[17:30] is there any designation of the amount um or um what

[17:37] uh what guidelines we need to put in there or

[17:42] whether there's just the dusting or if there's an

[17:44] inch where they need to you know clear their sidewalks or put

[17:51] out some sand or ice melt i i don't know if

[17:56] that needs to be included in there or not but it is included in

[18:01] the city of lawrence's ordinance

[18:06] that's probably a good point uh we don't want to run into uh

[18:13] to issues with you know somebody complaining because well soto didn't

[18:19] shovel their their sidewalk in front of their

[18:21] business when it was just a dusting but technically

[18:24] a violation of the law type thing you know we could certainly use discretion

[18:27] but if you wanted to try and make it black

[18:29] and white um you know that wouldn't be bad to say hey

[18:33] if we get two inches or more of snow that this is applicable

[18:39] or whatever you if you want to leave it alone then that's fine too but

[18:43] that could be an issue at some point what is the depth of snow that lawrence

[18:48] uses cody

[18:54] um

[19:18] and certainly in some cases if you if we do get a decent amount of ice uh

[19:24] before snow it's actually better to try to

[19:27] leave the snow on top than try to take the snow off and

[19:31] then you're just left with a sheet of ice and

[19:33] that you can't really break through a lot of times and so

[19:36] it's safer to leave the snow in place good point

[19:44] the bad thing is if you get like an inch or two inches of snow and it gets

[19:48] gets all walked on and compacted that it's going to be a slick situation uh

[19:55] i personally would be for leaving it and not

[19:59] not calling out so many things um just for the fact that if it's say two

[20:05] inches it's going to get compacted and then it's going to be more

[20:11] maybe even slicker and be there longer

[20:17] yeah i would i would tend to agree that um

[20:20] since those are i mean the idea was to try to catch those people who

[20:24] those areas that are most frequented by people that clearing any amount of snow

[20:28] and ice would be important just for the safety of the people so i'm

[20:32] okay with leaving it um just to include all snow and ice

[20:40] in the event we run into issues in the future you can always revisit it

[20:44] yeah okay so i think that with that in mind knowing that this

[20:49] section regarding snow and ice to be removed

[20:53] is geared specifically towards business and industrial zones

[20:57] that would mean that the removal may be made that is made by the city that also

[21:00] pertains to those business and industrial zones

[21:03] so i would say you should probably just go ahead and keep that section since the

[21:07] idea was to try to regulate those areas and you need to have some

[21:11] mechanism of enforcing that

[21:19] so in terms of uh in terms of notice you know it will then we'll go in and

[21:26] take care of it if they don't uh would you have a general thought

[21:30] process on what you'd like to see time frame wise there

[21:35] we start enforcing this you know if we start come january february we start to

[21:39] get significant snows and we have people

[21:42] that aren't compliant we can go and take care of it but you

[21:46] know when you guys start getting phone calls if those if those come just

[21:50] kind of want to have an i be on the same page with hey let's try

[21:53] to make sure we give you know six hours notice or 24 hours

[21:58] notice or whatever you'd like to see

[22:03] i i mean just the way this is written it sounds as though they become out of

[22:06] compliance after six hours so that's at least when first

[22:10] notification should occur if even possible

[22:14] um it should happen as soon as that time frame has passed i mean

[22:21] as far as i'm concerned but i don't know what you all

[22:25] in the think how many times would you say

[22:29] that this ordinance probably wasn't followed

[22:35] that people weren't able to to get that completed

[22:40] so i would say there's probably a number of

[22:50] when we get a decent snow that this is probably not followed

[22:57] well the majority of the time you're going to have some businesses

[23:02] some properties that that are compliant but for instance according to this code

[23:07] even the uh the sidewalk in front of

[23:11] uh denise's cafe should be shoveled it's a

[23:15] downtown district it's a public sidewalk it's you know and

[23:19] in the past really nobody's been maintaining that property nobody's been

[23:24] maintaining the vacant lot around you know beside it so but those areas should

[23:28] be shoveled and so in the event somebody wants to walk

[23:30] along that sidewalk according to our code that needs to be done

[23:34] um so in those specific situations that's probably pretty consistently in

[23:40] the past that this code has not been followed and we

[23:44] can start to enforce it and realistically

[23:48] will be the ones shoveling the uh just like we're the ones in a lot

[23:52] of cases that have been mowing the vacant lot there um with denise's

[23:58] hopefully with the new owner that they'll go ahead and get out there and

[24:00] get the sidewalk shoveled be my hope but i know the the challenges we're

[24:06] gonna run into especially on some of these

[24:08] vacant properties is gonna be uh rather extensive with regard to

[24:13] getting people to comply with this so we're gonna have some time

[24:16] invested in and taking care of it ourselves until we get people

[24:21] on board with okay same thing with code enforcement with regard to

[24:25] nuisances and mowing their grass etc you know once people get hit with the

[24:33] you know the 75 an hour bill from the city a couple times they figure out

[24:37] i'm going to hire somebody for 20 bucks an hour to do it because because it's

[24:41] it's costing me money to have this to not need to be in compliance but

[24:45] it'll probably take some some of those situations to happen before people will

[24:49] get the picture that we're serious since we haven't enforced it regularly in the

[24:53] past how many how many places how many

[24:58] business do you think that the city would would end up having

[25:03] to do this because it doesn't just snow on monday through

[25:06] friday you're going to have weekends so you're going to have to bring employees

[25:09] out pay overtime or whatever

[25:13] if it's after hours right true um and

[25:19] you know that's a challenging situation um

[25:23] especially with regard to you know some of those that we attempt to make notice

[25:29] on and um can't make can't complete

[25:33] making notice uh you know there are properties in town that are owned by

[25:38] somebody who lives in in texas who we can't ever seem to get a

[25:41] hold of uh and so you know trying to actually

[25:46] provide that notice that hey you have you know here's your

[25:49] it's been six hours this isn't taken care of it's a saturday

[25:52] you need to get this taken care of we're gonna come back on sunday and take care

[25:55] of it for you if you don't and you know we don't hear anything

[25:59] certainly um and realistically in that scenario

[26:03] the only thing we're going to be able to do is

[26:05] unless we have a phone number which in most cases we don't will be to tack

[26:09] notice on the door uh of the of the property or in

[26:12] the case of a vacant lot um you know try to attach to a stake in

[26:16] the in the uh in the lot or something and then

[26:20] we're going to be out there in many cases on uh on a

[26:25] saturday or sunday racking up overtime for

[26:29] uh a vacant lot there so unless you want to try to address it a little bit

[26:33] differently you know i mean you could change it to

[26:35] where you know it says something along the

[26:38] lines of unless it's a you know not being utilized at the

[26:43] moment but it you know that there are businesses on the other side of that uh

[26:48] on the east side that are in operation you have the

[26:51] watershed um business down there there's i believe

[26:55] still a uh picture studio that on that end that

[27:00] over the weekend if they want to walk up to the mexican restaurant and

[27:04] they can't or they have to walk out in the street because of all the snow or

[27:07] ice and you know they get hurt you know we

[27:11] if we're going to enforce it in my mind you know we need to try to enforce it

[27:14] across the board but it will there will be a lot of challenges with regard to it

[27:20] sorry my computer won't get there [Music]

[27:28] but to answer your question

[27:32] three inch accumulation of snow uh snow plowing that's snow plowing

[27:37] operation i don't know what it was for down to

[27:41] answer your question jody before my computer went dead

[27:44] i don't know what uh what the um minimum accumulation was for downtown or

[27:52] residential but i just knew that there was

[27:56] some kind of some kind of minimum to where

[28:03] uh residents or businesses were um required to remove the snow and

[28:10] apply sand or some kind of ice melt and i do apologize my computer went dead

[28:18] on me there but okay thanks

[28:23] i wonder if we touch upon it in the uh town talk that uh i mean

[28:29] the time frame is already in there that it's six hours after sunrise the

[28:33] following day and if that's not completed at the time

[28:38] the city can come in there remove it and bill them and don't notice no no

[28:45] this is the notice that they got six hours after the

[28:50] the next day after the sunrise to get it accomplished and if they don't have it

[28:54] done and the city crews are caught up to the point where they they

[28:58] can they can knock it out and send them a bill

[29:01] i don't i don't know if we need to give notice it's already it's in here

[29:08] i'm just wondering what that does to the city employees when it's on the weekends

[29:12] or a holiday or you're still asking them to get out

[29:16] there if it isn't done

[29:20] well i'm thinking like like denise's for example

[29:25] even if it's a weekend they're going to be out there with their blades

[29:28] so like a blade on about a lot of things like a skid loader uh

[29:35] and probably not the whole from their building front to the street

[29:40] needs to be removed just so there's a three foot strip of clear so they can

[29:44] walk from one property to the next so really they could just set their

[29:48] blade up up there and drag it back to the street

[29:51] a couple swipes and they they probably have it done and they're going to be out

[29:54] there doing snow anyway of course they're

[29:57] wanting to get it removed in lots of lots of area and not want to dink around

[30:01] with individual properties but

[30:06] you know what i'm saying they're going to be out anyway and i think a lot of

[30:09] that they could do with the machine okay mr weiner do you think that's a

[30:15] that's doable

[30:18] i i think so uh you know i certainly there will be situations if

[30:25] uh you know it's not much

[30:30] if we've already plowed the street let's say um

[30:33] then go home or or whatnot and they you know streets are okay but say you

[30:40] know the person's property is is not because you know now they're

[30:43] success stop snowing six hours has completed uh

[30:48] streets are okay but now we need to come back in for this scenario that could

[30:52] be an issue at that point um you know and that could be an operational

[30:58] challenge finding somebody to come back in

[31:00] for specifically you know one or two properties that need to be

[31:04] shoveled my guess is initially we're probably going to see more than that

[31:07] because again i i expect that it's going to take

[31:10] a little while to get people up to speed with okay this is what we're

[31:14] going to start doing even if we put it in town talk

[31:17] um until we actually enforce it i have a feeling that there's going to be a

[31:20] number of businesses that don't expect it to actually happen um or

[31:25] you know vacant properties owners that don't expect it actually happen

[31:30] but um but i do think you know in those cases we'd be paying time and a

[31:36] half uh to have somebody come out on a holiday

[31:38] um you know same situation that's okay you know you're gonna get extra pay to

[31:43] come out and and take care of this scenario

[31:46] we should still cover our costs with regard to that

[31:50] that time because the current rate is 75 dollars an hour

[31:54] i know we talked about

[31:57] on on weeds and whatnot in the past about having that be a tiered structure

[32:04] and that might be something we look at here as well for

[32:07] uh for this if you're interested in that that hey you know first time

[32:11] is x cost second time is x third time is is higher so that way it's you know if

[32:18] people are just using us as a snow removal service

[32:22] eventually they're going to decide hey it's

[32:26] not economical to continue to rely on the city to do this so

[32:29] we'll hire somebody to do it and and that way

[32:33] the city doesn't have to any longer but um

[32:36] but we should cover our cost if the bill gets paid

[32:39] a lot of cases the bill is probably not going to be paid

[32:42] same thing we run into with weeds and everything else will apply to the

[32:45] property taxes and in a lot of cases we're not going to

[32:49] see that money because it'll go to a tax sale and it'll

[32:53] sell for pennies on the dollar and you know we're not going to get our back

[32:56] taxes and our assessments on that but at least we we have cleared the uh

[33:03] the area made it safe for for pedestrian travel and

[33:07] you know we've we've enforced our code as the commission

[33:10] sees fit so i think that's the that's the goal chris i would imagine

[33:15] with businesses you might have a little bit different

[33:18] circumstance there where they will be more likely to pay the fine that's

[33:23] assessed to them than just a residential homeowner who

[33:27] has you know overgrown weeds i suppose there

[33:30] it seems like there's more of an impetus to pay than with maybe a

[33:34] resident i i would agree i was thinking more

[33:38] along the lines of the the vacant lots um for instance the nieces that you know

[33:43] in that particular case we had years of back taxes

[33:46] um we mowed that vacant lot there and and

[33:50] you know we had sunk costs in there because every time we we invested any

[33:53] kind of time or resources into that um you know we didn't get any money back

[33:56] on that and none of those bills got paid and

[33:59] that's the same general location that we're talking about now but

[34:02] thankfully there's a new property owner there and that may be a different

[34:04] scenario moving forward hopefully that we won't even have to mow it we

[34:08] won't have to uh to scrape the sidewalk but you know if

[34:12] there's a similar scenario uh at some point you know it's for

[34:16] instance the chamber players you know they own the lot down there by

[34:19] patriots bank hopefully they're able to get over there and get

[34:23] that shovel but you know is that something to where that

[34:27] volunteer organization is going to be able to find somebody or pay somebody

[34:32] um to get out there within six hours of the snow stopping within six hours of

[34:35] sunrise to get their portion of that sidewalk

[34:46] shoveled i guess if nothing else you have a

[34:50] little bit of leniency on weekends with the wording of removal may

[34:54] be made by the city so if you wanted to wait until the

[34:57] next business day then that's possible i was also kind of con well not

[35:00] necessarily confused but questioning what the section on section

[35:05] 203 when it says whatever enforcement action

[35:08] well in addition to whatever enforcement action may be taken in the municipal

[35:11] court so are there additional um enforcement

[35:14] mechanisms that we have i mean is that referring to fines that

[35:18] the court can assess or yeah so as anything in your code book

[35:25] if it doesn't specify otherwise is subject to the general penalty in the

[35:28] code which i believe is a thousand dollar

[35:30] fine or 30 days in jail up to either of those it could be a 10

[35:35] fine or you know 12 hours in jail or but the judge has

[35:39] discretion so it could be that the court levees a

[35:43] fine in addition to the city removing the

[35:47] snow and ice and billing for our time okay thank you

[35:56] i think maybe what you were talking about or referring to

[35:59] might be in the traffic section that talks about

[36:03] 500 or 30-day penalty maybe not that might be

[36:08] something else well and there are sections that deal

[36:14] with specific um specific fine amounts

[36:18] but anything that doesn't list a specific fine amount

[36:22] the violations of this code are subject to the general penalty

[36:28] um which i believe is in the very first chapter under general provisions i think

[36:35] it's 1 117 where it addresses

[36:40] um whenever any offense is declared by any provision of this code

[36:44] absent a specific or unique punishment prescribed

[36:47] the offender shall be punished in accordance with this section a fine of

[36:50] not more than one thousand dollars imprisonment imprisonment in jail for

[36:54] not more than 179 days or both such fine and imprisoned

[36:59] imprisonment not to exceed amd above so it's the judge

[37:04] can do either of those if there's not a specific penalty spelled out so if you

[37:08] wanted to afford a fine

[37:12] less than that or more than that you would need to specify

[37:17] in here

[37:21] okay thank you

[37:31] all right so do we want to go ahead and just move forward with the way that it

[37:35] is and see how enforcement goes

[37:39] for this and then you all can work to adjust it if need be

[37:45] i prefer to leave it myself

[37:52] okay i am going to leave it if um mr weiner feels like it's

[37:57] it's workable because there's nothing worse than having a code and not

[38:02] following it so i i agree with him we either follow it

[38:06] or we let it go so i guess i'm asking him

[38:10] do you believe this is one that we can follow

[38:14] and because it's going to involve probably city employees to

[38:17] to get some of that done i i think we can and we can certainly

[38:22] um you know work with people and try to put something in town talk to to

[38:27] increase awareness of it i i do expect

[38:35] probably the biggest ones that we have challenges with

[38:39] uh that are going to be i think significant challenges will will likely

[38:44] be like the uh the chamber players property

[38:47] down there because

[38:50] you know they're not there every day you know we're gonna have businesses

[38:54] that are there every day um that you know can have somebody go out and

[39:01] shovel the sidewalk or hire somebody to to take care of that for them they're

[39:04] generating income off of their business front

[39:06] but when it's vacant property like what the chamber players has there

[39:10] um that could be a challenge for an organization like that

[39:13] to uh to either find the volunteer to take care of it

[39:17] or to uh or to pay somebody to do that i i anticipate that to be an issue but

[39:24] you know we can have that conversation with them and say hey this is going to

[39:27] be an expectation moving forward and

[39:30] hopefully they'll find a way to comply chris i think sorry

[39:36] go ahead i was just going to say i think i think that the problem would be

[39:41] is if i owned property or a business that butted up to people who didn't

[39:48] you know what i mean who didn't shovel that so

[39:52] i wanted to come to my business are going to have a hard time tracking

[39:56] through all of that so very true i think it will be tough for

[40:01] them but i do think probably it needs to apply the same

[40:06] and there are people that you know park down there along that

[40:10] uh stretch of the sidewalk all the time and walk to the bank

[40:14] or you know to wherever so that's what i was thinking about

[40:18] yeah and if i ran the bank i'd want to make sure that everybody

[40:22] had access to get in and out of there get in and out of my business

[40:27] so yeah

[40:33] okay then if we are good with this section then we can go ahead and move on

[40:36] to article three

[40:41] tree advisory board now chris did this even exist not as far as i'm

[40:47] aware i talked to terry about this and um he doesn't

[40:53] need your recommended removal but we're not sure when the last time that this

[40:57] board existed okay so we'll just go ahead and remove

[41:01] it unless there's a desire to keep it

[41:07] okay sounds good then let's consider that struck from city code

[41:12] i article four trees and shrubbery chris do you feel like most of this when

[41:21] you're reading through it as um something that has been

[41:27] enforced or i guess it refers to the city forester

[41:31] who would be our city forester

[41:36] well i played the role of city forester here about a

[41:39] a year ago or you know a little over a year ago i guess

[41:42] when we were trying to figure out what to do downtown with the uh

[41:47] with the shrubs that were planted in that median there on 5th street

[41:53] that was somewhat challenging and trying to figure out

[41:56] okay well to comply with our planting procedures here there is a decent amount

[42:00] of work to be done um and so we did at least in that case

[42:05] make sure that that those rules were were followed

[42:08] um with regard to the uh you know other trees that have been

[42:13] planted in the city and i i can't really speak to you know

[42:17] historically if things have been done um

[42:23] taking this into account i do know that we run into issues at times

[42:28] especially with trees uh in the in the right of way or in the easement

[42:33] between these between the sidewalk and city street

[42:36] we have utilities there um a lot of times trees will

[42:40] at some point they will get to a height that interferes with our with our power

[42:43] lines um they can bring down poles in a storm

[42:47] and lines um likewise you know if we end up

[42:51] with issues with our uh with sidewalks they can bust up

[42:55] sidewalks that soak in trees on the other side but

[42:58] but they as well a lot of times we'll get into our sewer lines

[43:01] um and cause challenging situations with regard to our sewers

[43:07] because they'll find any little any little bit of water and

[43:11] work their way inside that sewer line if there's a minuscule crack

[43:16] so that would be my biggest concern would just be

[43:19] trying to make sure that we minimize or eliminate trees within the

[43:26] within the right-of-way uh certainly you know would love to see more as many

[43:32] trees as possible in town but when we get in that area that makes it

[43:37] challenging for our utilities as well as for future utility growth uh

[43:41] you know if we need to build a new line when we have to take out trees that

[43:46] not only is more more resources to do with regard to taking trees down it also

[43:53] upsets people because they could have a 60 year old tree that's been there and

[44:00] they don't like it when we come in to tuck their tree down just because we

[44:04] want to put on a new water line mr weiner on 13-404

[44:12] planting procedures the third the third line

[44:16] all the way to the end you just have a little where it says plan

[44:20] and then a space yeah yeah i figured you already caught that

[44:25] but i thought i would let you know thank you

[44:33] if i recall like gosh i don't know what's way back 25

[44:37] 30 years ago i thought they had a tree that's been a tree advisory board i

[44:42] thought they purchased trees and sold sold trees but i was thinking that those

[44:46] trees had to be the way i recall it that they had to be

[44:50] planted in the easement which never made much sense to me that that's

[44:55] just a future headache but that that's the way i recall that that

[44:59] thing worked that they could purchase trees i think somewhat cheaper but they

[45:04] had to be planted in the easement the way the way

[45:06] i remember now this is way back so i don't know but

[45:12] if it was like that i always that's what my interpretation of it was and i always

[45:15] thought boy that's a bad plan for 10 20 years down the road

[45:21] yeah i i certainly am a fan of trees but just not in the easement

[45:28] and you know it is nice say on the you know fourth avenue

[45:32] um there in the median you know having some trees

[45:36] but you know trying to make sure we have the right type of trees in those

[45:39] situations that our roots are going to go down and not

[45:43] spread out uh you know as well as you know trees

[45:46] that aren't necessarily going to become incredibly massive uh we don't want

[45:52] roots tearing up streets and curb and gutter and everything so

[45:57] you know the right type of trees if we are going to plant have things planted

[46:01] in in between sidewalks um

[46:06] it's it's important that the trees conform to kind of what our

[46:09] what our goals are because who right now is in charge of

[46:17] the planting and pruning and removal of trees

[46:22] so if there we don't really have any type of process

[46:27] if somebody wants to plant a new tree there is no tree permit

[46:30] that you have to come into and get a permit for a

[46:35] you know a tree that you want to plant

[46:40] we in terms of removal of trees if it's a situation to where somebody

[46:46] has a tree on uh in between the easement uh or in the in the easement in the

[46:52] right-of-way and they want it gone in most cases they want the

[46:57] city to come take care of it and if it is dead dying causing problems

[47:03] etc in most cases we will go ahead and do

[47:06] that and in some cases if if we notice it

[47:11] even if the property owner hasn't said anything about it but it it

[47:15] is dead and dying um and we'll go ahead and take it out

[47:18] because at some point that's going to come down and

[47:21] it's better to come down controlled then come down

[47:24] in a storm when we've got a whole bunch of mess to clean up or

[47:27] [Music] you know on top of somebody's car or

[47:31] into a house or whatnot so so we do try to be proactive in that

[47:35] regard but in general that's at the discretion of

[47:39] the of the public works director um or the or the streets foreign

[47:44] in the absence of the public works director here for the past couple years

[47:47] uh kind of left those decisions to former west stein but you know they're

[47:54] certainly uh jason's a lot more knowledgeable as

[47:57] well as phil phil uh phil burris our our parks

[48:00] direct director has some experience with regard to um

[48:05] to arborist uh situations a lot more knowledgeable than i am

[48:10] so uh kind of rely on staff to assist in making those determinations of

[48:16] is this tree healthy or is this tree one that

[48:20] realistically needs to go

[48:24] i noticed that it says the city forester shall be appointed by the city manager

[48:30] so um i guess according to this your job would be to

[48:36] try to figure out who you want to be your city forester and let um

[48:39] i don't know designate them just for the sake of this article unless you want

[48:45] it changed so

[48:50] you know i guess the way i've been doing it thus far has been

[48:54] i haven't really appointed anybody to that role officially so it's just

[48:58] like last year it was myself so um like we like it is phrased in some

[49:05] other chapters um in this one it might

[49:09] be good to say the city manager or his designee

[49:13] shall be the the the city forester and you know in a lot of other cases

[49:20] it i've clearly defined already hey this person is doing this

[49:24] job even though it says city manager or designee this is a situation where it's

[49:28] a little bit the opposite where i don't really have anybody to do this

[49:32] specific job so i've kind of taken it on in the rare instance that

[49:36] we've had it but i've relied on advice from from

[49:40] staff as appropriate so at some point if we

[49:44] have somebody that feel like hey that person is

[49:50] is a trained arborist or knows a heck of a lot about trees you know probably

[49:54] appoint that person city forester but um at this point i either don't have

[49:59] that person that would be willing or has the time or

[50:03] they haven't made themselves known to me because they

[50:07] may want to avoid the city forester role

[50:17] well i think it shall be appointed by the by the city manager or

[50:21] designee that ought to take care of it on a case-by-case basis and

[50:25] and it can get accomplished

[50:29] yeah so having like the city forester or doesn't mean she'll be appointed by the

[50:33] city manager

[50:36] or his designee

[50:39] i think would take care of it on the probably the rare case that's needed

[50:44] okay yeah i agree

[51:05] okay so did anyone have anything else on

[51:10] 13-5

[51:17] no but we don't we don't have a street tree permit per se

[51:24] um no not at least that we have permits for about everything else but

[51:29] not that i've came across um that's not to say that

[51:34] we couldn't make one and and start requiring that if

[51:37] if that would be something that the commission would like to see um

[51:41] you know my personal preference would be if if you want to allow

[51:45] uh trees within the easement you know i here it says no tree shall be

[51:53] planted where the clear space between the urban side was less than 10 feet

[51:56] um if it's a situation to where say the curb and sidewalk are 20 feet

[52:02] apart in that case technically a tree would be

[52:05] allowed there [Music]

[52:08] in that instance i think it might be beneficial to have a permit

[52:12] process to say okay we'll allow it you know code allows it but we want to

[52:18] have a permit process so that way we can help you

[52:21] allocate where that tree is going to go um

[52:24] and make sure that you know well we have utilities

[52:28] you know here and so we want your tree to be

[52:31] set back at least far enough that it's not gonna we don't anticipate it being

[52:34] an issue here you know a previous community i was

[52:38] with people ended up planting a whole row

[52:41] of bradford pear trees in conjunction with some cedar trees

[52:46] right underneath our power lines and that wasn't an issue for 10 years

[52:55] then we had to come in and lop off the top

[52:59] of all these cedar trees because they were getting into our power lines and

[53:03] we upset those people and you know i i would rather avoid that scenario if we

[53:09] could i guess one thing it would do would be

[53:13] maybe give them some guidance on the types of trees if you put a

[53:19] say a weeping willow 10 feet from the street

[53:23] it's not going to be that far down the road before that tree is going to be all

[53:26] over the all over on the street

[53:39] so i say we don't have a permit but um you know given that

[53:46] these planting procedures called for certain things

[53:49] um you know i when we had this scenario last year i

[53:55] made a permit um that was if i recall correctly i

[54:00] think just on a sheet of paper you know we didn't have any kind of formal

[54:02] documents so i said well this is the the street tree permit

[54:07] but um you know we certainly could make something a little more formalized if

[54:12] um you know we want to try and do this a little more frequently

[54:17] and if there was a desire to say all right

[54:20] within these parameters say a permit will be required

[54:25] uh i do think that that would be beneficial

[54:29] as you said to at least try to help provide some guidance on

[54:34] you know what trees to utilize as well as you know where might be the best

[54:37] place to put those we're in the uh creative mode

[54:43] uh of late and so i think we could probably whip one of them up pretty

[54:47] quickly if we had to travis has been creating

[54:52] stuff all day really

[54:58] all right that sounds that sounds great so then if um

[55:02] travis is interested in creating that for the city then i guess we can leave

[55:06] it in the code

[55:10] very well

[55:15] okay is that all 413-5 uh the only thing that city attorney saw

[55:21] lander mentioned when i went over this section of code with

[55:24] him was um that he recommended looking at both

[55:28] prairie village and lenexa's tree policies i thought they were pretty

[55:33] pretty good policies i haven't had a chance to

[55:36] look at those yet but i'll try to look at those as well

[55:38] and if i see anything that looks to be beneficial i'll try to bring

[55:44] that back for your your consideration okay

[55:48] that sounds good thank you

[55:52] okay we'll go ahead and move on to 13-6

[56:05] um the only thing i've seen in 13-405 uh third sentence last word

[56:14] whatever that word is is it spelled right

[56:22] the deleterious or whatever is that right i don't even know where it

[56:28] is well i think that is what it's supposed

[56:35] to be because it's also there in the uh

[56:39] a couple words previous to that

[56:46] charge of gas or other substance deleterious tree line

[56:50] but yeah we can get that addressed and certainly we can

[56:56] use a probably try to find a synonym for that

[56:59] that's a little bit clearer to the to the layman

[57:02] because i don't think many people are going to understand what deleterious

[57:05] means i don't

[57:14] harmful

[57:19] there you go that's a lot better i didn't have anything else marked here

[57:28] so long as this all is something that you currently

[57:31] practice

[57:35] yeah the biggest thing uh that we run into currently

[57:39] is really the the tree trimming i'm trying to make sure that people keep

[57:43] their trees trimmed back in a lot of cases they don't and so

[57:48] you know that's a situation to where we'll come in and we'll take care of it

[57:54] uh and then we run into challenges at times we are in the

[57:59] process of trying to make sure we notify people

[58:02] that hey in this situation because it's been

[58:06] allowed to grow like this for so long we'll take care of it this time but from

[58:11] this point forward we're gonna expect you to maintain the tree and keep it

[58:16] trimmed back from um from becoming an issue if it becomes an issue again in

[58:20] the future then you're going to have to take care

[58:22] of it or you know we'll take care of it and bill you for it

[58:26] but you know we're trying to work with people and

[58:29] at least get it into compliance initially and then moving

[58:33] moving from that point forward i do think that

[58:38] in section 13-407 uh second to the last line the section

[58:44] within five days five days is pretty pretty short notice

[58:50] to get things done especially if you got to hire somebody

[58:53] to get it accomplished in five days is probably nearly impossible

[59:02] so do you think 10 is more reasonable i sure think it would be a lot better

[59:07] okay okay that sounds good jody does that sound good with you

[59:14] yeah i was just trying to think of a happy compromise if we left it at

[59:18] five but i was able to show you in good faith that i had somebody coming out

[59:24] with you know i already had an appointment with somebody that would

[59:27] come out and help me would you want to leave it at the five

[59:30] so you're not going back and forth with five days ten days

[59:34] eight days but it's five day at least in five days

[59:38] in good faith i've made contact with somebody

[59:41] that will take care of the problem i don't know if that's how floor if that

[59:44] hurts it so in most cases what we currently do and grant we haven't had a

[59:51] lot of these issues with with tree trimming

[59:53] uh this point but similar scenarios with weeds notices or

[59:57] you know nuisance violations etc uh if somebody has

[1:00:01] you know we we've provided notice we give them 10 days in most cases

[1:00:05] and they call us and say hey i need a little bit of extra time

[1:00:09] i've got my uncle coming you know next weekend

[1:00:12] you know so i need 15 days instead of 10 because you know my leg is broken i

[1:00:17] can't move my yard or whatever the case we're willing to work with people as

[1:00:20] long as they communicate with us and they

[1:00:23] you know we know that they're working on it so you know

[1:00:26] we do try to be flexible and work with people but

[1:00:29] you know in in the cases in which we give notice and don't

[1:00:33] hear anything at all then it's okay we go in on the 11th day or as soon as we

[1:00:38] can thereafter and take care of it and you know if you're not going to

[1:00:43] communicate with us let us know you're going to you're that you're

[1:00:46] actively working on it that's when it really is a hard deadline and um

[1:00:51] and certainly if you know somebody it's a situation to where they abuse it

[1:00:55] and it's happens consistently that um they ask for an extension we give them

[1:01:01] an extension and it still doesn't get done

[1:01:03] then it's okay the next time it happens i'm sorry

[1:01:07] it's ten days because you know we worked with you the last three times

[1:01:11] and in none of those cases did you ever get it accomplished we had to do it in

[1:01:16] every case so

[1:01:20] are most of those cases ten days then rather than the five

[1:01:24] ten days is the more customary number yes

[1:01:27] okay and then maybe it's not a bad idea to change it to ten

[1:01:35] that would be more consistent

[1:01:47] are there any other comments between both 13-6

[1:01:51] and 13-7

[1:01:57] um on 13-408 and i don't know i just got marked under

[1:02:04] the last sentence or upon any private grounds

[1:02:14] that was right away public park or upon any private grounds

[1:02:31] you know i don't know there definitely needs to be some

[1:02:35] some notice given i mean i think just to trump on somebody's

[1:02:38] property and start whacking up their trees uh

[1:02:42] better tread lightly

[1:02:47] so the way the way that i understand it is um they would have noticed so like in

[1:02:51] the trimming instance since that's um where an

[1:02:54] authorization is made for it it gives that person notice of 10 days now

[1:02:59] that we just changed it but it seems as though there should be

[1:03:02] notice um [Music]

[1:03:04] to the person of any violation before the city forester will go in and

[1:03:09] actually start cutting things i mean the only

[1:03:13] thing i can think of if it's private grounds would be if it is violating

[1:03:16] something like it trees are growing into electric lines

[1:03:19] at least that's the way i read it chris is that kind of how you understand it

[1:03:23] yeah it just needs to

[1:03:27] stay out of city utilities essentially and i do think there's provisions in

[1:03:31] there uh for you know if it's got uh the

[1:03:35] what is it the ash borer you know the the various tree funguses

[1:03:39] or um insects that can be infectious and kill a whole swath of you know a

[1:03:45] whole community of trees um that at that point the city forester

[1:03:49] could say hey this even though it's on private property

[1:03:52] this tree needs to go or else you know the entire the entire town's

[1:03:56] trees could all die so we're gonna basically kill this tree

[1:04:00] quarantine it because you know we're trying to get rid of the

[1:04:03] virus before it spreads well maybe you could just put a mask

[1:04:17] 13-408 it needs to be i think something needs to be spelled out in there that

[1:04:23] that notice be given to the the property owner

[1:04:28] so we don't just wheel in there and and do something and they're just completely

[1:04:32] shocked that their tree got removed you know up by their house or something

[1:04:43] or upon any private grounds it's i think that next that next section

[1:04:50] there as authorized we're not going to go upon private

[1:04:54] grounds to to do anything unless it's authorized by

[1:04:59] the article and the and the article authorizes what

[1:05:03] areas we have that authority to um to do any kind of removal or trimming

[1:05:09] etc so we already should have provided notice and whatnot due to the provisions

[1:05:18] required in that in those other and those other sections

[1:05:27] which would basically be the east

[1:05:32] well in oh it also says uh

[1:05:39] every owner of any tree overhanging any street or right of way within the city

[1:05:43] shall trim the branches so that such branches should not obstruct the light

[1:05:46] and so forth so even if that tree is not within the easement

[1:05:50] even if it's on their side of the sidewalk

[1:05:54] they're still required to keep the branches trimmed

[1:05:57] so as not to obstruct the light or obstruct the view of an intersection

[1:06:00] etc a weeping willow you know if it's a massive weeping willow and

[1:06:05] and stretches a long ways uh you know sidewalks only let's say eight

[1:06:11] foot from the curb and whipping willows right there that

[1:06:14] weeping willow can can droop down into the street and that's not allowed

[1:06:19] it has to be a foot above the surface of the street

[1:06:24] and so we could come in there even though that weeping willow is a private

[1:06:28] tree but it is overhanging the city street

[1:06:32] city right-of-way and it is out of compliance if it is

[1:06:36] less than eight eight feet uh above the street surface

[1:06:39] so we could come in there and trim that if they don't take care of it

[1:06:43] themselves they should take care of it themselves

[1:06:46] that would come in 10 days notice so they would be notified

[1:06:50] yes so that's what you just changed currently it's five but

[1:06:54] you're saying we would have to provide 10 days notice if we wanted to

[1:06:59] to go in there and take care of it ourselves because the private property

[1:07:02] owner hasn't good enough as long as they get notified

[1:07:09] and and get a chance to protest it or comply with it

[1:07:14] yep okay was there anything else over these two pages

[1:07:22] nope okay then we'll go ahead and move on to 13-8 article 5

[1:07:28] numbering of buildings does anyone have any

[1:07:35] questions or comments on this section

[1:07:46] i did not okay

[1:07:53] okay um then we'll go ahead and go to i didn't either so

[1:07:56] uh commissioner cole did you have anything on this i didn't

[1:07:59] thanks okay yeah all right so article 6 street lighting

[1:08:03] [Music] this first page 13-9

[1:08:11] i didn't have anything marked on this page yeah i did not either

[1:08:16] commissioner call i don't have anything marked i didn't know if there was

[1:08:22] anything on the city side that they is there anything on that page that

[1:08:26] concerns them

[1:08:30] i don't have any concerns on this on this page

[1:08:33] okay all right then uh 13-10 is the section continued i'm assuming

[1:08:40] everyone's probably okay with this as well i am

[1:08:45] okay

[1:08:49] my only thought would just be um might look to on whereas f says

[1:08:57] of not less than 250 feet in residential areas and

[1:09:01] trying to increase street lighting um to try and you know improve the

[1:09:07] the lighting of our streets uh you might also

[1:09:10] consider the same type of thing for e um you know

[1:09:14] f sets a minimum we might also want to try to set a minimum

[1:09:18] for um for some of these for for some lighting i know you know

[1:09:23] personally i feel like a lot of our street lights

[1:09:26] are a little bit dark especially in some of

[1:09:30] our more well-traveled areas you know

[1:09:32] downtown maple street you know you go to some other

[1:09:36] communities and it just feels a lot more well-lit um and

[1:09:40] especially in the commercial areas and even in the

[1:09:42] residential areas i still feel like it's you know i have a street light right i

[1:09:47] have a street light in my yard and i still feel like that's that's not

[1:09:52] very bright um you know i would look to rather than

[1:09:55] being a strict 9 500 lumens or 25 000 lumens

[1:09:59] you know maybe we set that as a minimum and you know if we have an opportunity

[1:10:03] to say hey let's uh improve the uh

[1:10:07] the lighting along maple street or downtown district you know

[1:10:11] as we go i wouldn't necessarily try to swap them all out

[1:10:14] you know at once but you know as a bulb goes out maybe we

[1:10:18] instead of 25 000 lumens we make it you know 27.5 or something downtown

[1:10:25] i think that's a good idea i think that it should be a minimum as opposed to

[1:10:28] just the standard

[1:10:33] sounds good to me okay uh so we will go ahead and move on

[1:10:47] to 13-11 article seven police agreements

[1:10:52] since we were just um dealing with the police agreement

[1:10:56] our i'm assuming that most of this probably looks good chris or you would

[1:11:00] have had a chance to look at that then do you know anything that needs to be

[1:11:04] changed based on our recent conversations no other than

[1:11:09] you know there are some words that have hyphens in them

[1:11:12] that aren't necessary but um i did speak with terry about it and he felt like

[1:11:18] this whole article article seven isn't needed

[1:11:22] um but that it doesn't hurt to leave it in so it's really up to

[1:11:26] the commission whether you want to keep it in the code or

[1:11:29] or remove it we do have the the police agreements that we do individually with

[1:11:34] the the various companies that we have these agreements with

[1:11:37] so if you decide to remove it you know all those will stay in effect

[1:11:41] and if we do future ones we'll similarly do those agreements with them as well so

[1:11:47] leaving it in the code doesn't hurt us but it also

[1:11:50] doesn't really serve much of a purpose so this uh

[1:11:54] right now it doesn't guide and direct your police agreements at all

[1:11:59] so we essentially i mean if you wanted to leave it in to try to

[1:12:04] make sure that they were all uniform or had the same provisions we

[1:12:10] could certainly do that to try to make sure hey

[1:12:12] that way they're all uniform um but to be frank what we do is we take uh the

[1:12:20] standard standard police agreement that we already have and we essentially

[1:12:24] you know change the names of hey this one is quickcom

[1:12:27] and this is our agreement and it's you know

[1:12:31] currently three dollars a a year per poll and and

[1:12:34] terry and i are working on obviously trying to get that increased but

[1:12:37] um but the the agreements are all basically just a

[1:12:42] template that we utilize and so in the event that we have

[1:12:46] um future agreements that come come by it'll just follow that same template

[1:12:51] would be the idea right when i'm looking at this right now it

[1:12:56] looks like it i mean it specifies a lot of things you know like

[1:12:59] people can't just connect whatever they want to your polls i mean it seems like

[1:13:03] it i don't know would be prudent to keep it

[1:13:07] based on it not just being about the agreement itself but

[1:13:12] it has a little bit more than just that and i i don't know if that's addressed

[1:13:16] somewhere else or why he would think it's not necessary so

[1:13:20] i do believe it was on well was it

[1:13:25] in

[1:13:28] 13-706 seems like something that should be in there

[1:13:34] yeah and i was thinking that we had another section here that addressed

[1:13:38] that in particular um in terms of poll attachments that were

[1:13:44] not approved type situations that might be in utilities but um but

[1:13:49] anyways i i can verify that and then let you know um and

[1:13:55] like i said there's no harm in leaving it in certainly so if you

[1:13:59] just want to continue to leave it in that's perfectly fine

[1:14:02] i'm just thinking if someone connects something to one of your polls

[1:14:05] isn't this where you'd get the enforcement to say um that's against our

[1:14:09] code it certainly does give us that i was

[1:14:12] thinking that there's another area of code that is duplicative of that but

[1:14:16] uh if i'll all look for that and if i find

[1:14:21] that then we can address that as well okay that sounds good

[1:14:26] i think so too i think we should leave it until we find it

[1:14:29] either in a place because i i think it does

[1:14:32] i have a lot of specifics that would be helpful

[1:14:39] that sounds good in that that brings us to the end since you had mentioned the

[1:14:44] hyphens uh that are misplaced i mean you also

[1:14:47] notice the 13-12 one at the very top but yeah so i guess

[1:14:52] we'll just uh wait to hear if um this is addressed elsewhere and

[1:14:57] with that we have finished the section so does anyone have any other comments

[1:15:02] or questions over the streets and sidewalks section

[1:15:05] before we go to our second citizens to be heard

[1:15:11] i do not okay i don't have any questions uh is there a plan or a date

[1:15:18] to go forward with the traffic

[1:15:23] i didn't know if we talked about that or is that something we can talk about it

[1:15:26] tomorrow night as well but just to kind of know and

[1:15:29] advance what we're going to be covering so i can review it again i've read

[1:15:33] through it but i would think that whenever um yeah i

[1:15:38] don't i don't know if we will get one and

[1:15:39] i mean before the end of the year at least for me to be involved so

[1:15:42] i mean if we do want to try that that's fine with me but it would be just that

[1:15:46] one section the traffic section

[1:15:52] um but yeah we can discuss it tomorrow if you all think that you have any days

[1:15:55] we can just see if we do before the end of the year

[1:15:58] and then you'll have to take over

[1:16:03] dumping cody's yeah well at least we've done you know a good

[1:16:10] portion of the work so that's right no one could have

[1:16:14] predicted there would have been uh well that coveted would have happened

[1:16:18] the year 2020 would have happened this way

[1:16:20] yeah i know i do i'm sorry no go ahead chris i was gonna

[1:16:26] say i do appreciate uh all of your efforts to

[1:16:30] uh to go through this this has been a heck of a lot of work and

[1:16:34] certainly especially here in the last few months we put a lot of meetings and

[1:16:38] a lot of time into into moving further on this so i i do

[1:16:42] appreciate all of your efforts and and getting us to where we're at so

[1:16:47] thank you very much not a problem it's something i rather

[1:16:51] enjoy i still have everything that we have yet

[1:16:54] to come noted so if you need any help i'd be more than happy to attend

[1:16:59] the meetings whenever you do discuss it we welcome you to do that

[1:17:04] yeah so all right um without any other comments here are

[1:17:09] there any citizens who would like to be heard

[1:17:14] all right seen that okay good then saying none i will go ahead and make a

[1:17:18] motion to adjourned right here a second oh second all right it's been moved and

[1:17:23] seconded all in favor say aye aye aye all right

[1:17:28] thank you so

Special City Code Workshop 12.21.2020

Transcript