[0:18] Good afternoon. >> Good afternoon.

[0:20] » All right. I think we go ahead and get started.

[0:27] Uh through here the August meeting minutes.

[0:35] » I'll make a motion to accept them. >> I'll second that.

[0:43] » Uh any discussion or do you want a moment to review?

[0:47] You weren't here then. >> Uh no, I did I did read them. Am I

[0:50] allowed to vote on this if I'm not there?

[0:52] I can, right? >> I smart would abstain.

[0:55] » Yeah. >> I'd like you to abstain.

[0:57] » Okay. >> Okay.

[1:01] Uh any other discussion?

[1:04] » I'm good. >> Okay. All those in favor?

[1:06] » I. >> Uh

[1:09] Mike, you're going to abstain. >> I'll yes, politely abstain.

[1:16] » Uh I'm telling you rather.

[1:20] Mike, you will abstain. Uh Prospect

[1:27] Farm, I spoke with Rick Davis uh yesterday morning and he will be up

[1:35] there at the end of the month. >> End of September?

[1:38] » Yep. Um

[1:42] and kind of just doing the similar thing. Um I don't know

[1:46] » [snorts] >> I have not heard if

[1:53] » Michael? >> Yeah, if Michael is going to be out

[1:56] there before or something. >> I'll talk to Michael

[1:58] tomorrow. >> Okay.

[2:00] » [clears throat] >> He called me today.

[2:01] » Does he have stuff that he's already cut?

[2:04] Or trim that needs to be moved before Rick gets up there?

[2:07] » There is I I haven't There was. Some of it got moved. I haven't seen the

[2:13] extent of it, but I think that he was in the game

[2:16] either when Rick was up there with um the equipment, it would be easier just

[2:20] to load it on the equipment and pull it out.

[2:23] » I would agree. >> Yeah, I'll talk with Michael tomorrow.

[2:26] He called me today. I was just going >> And some of it he may not be able to mow

[2:30] it that close to the tree anyway. >> Right.

[2:32] And And wasn't it last year that

[2:35] someone did groundwork, hand work? >> Yeah, Rick did.

[2:38] » Okay. >> Yeah.

[2:39] » I don't know if he said that out loud. >> He did.

[2:42] They did it. Last year

[2:44] in particular, it seemed like they did an excellent job.

[2:46] » Yeah, I I made sure I >> Yeah.

[2:48] » told him how much we appreciate it. >> Yeah, it was excellent.

[2:52] They really set the precedent like for Michael to go and see him go up there

[2:56] and see that.

[2:58] I can mow with this.

[3:04] » Okay.

[3:08] Um

[3:12] Other than that, I don't have anything.

[3:17] On prospect is >> I'll touch bases with Ian, who's the new

[3:20] ED, just to make sure that he and Silas know that they're responsible to mow.

[3:26] Yeah, but feel then to check the water bars coming down from Hall's Ledge.

[3:30] » Okay. Yeah, that was my only other >> Yeah.

[3:32] » question. And I'm a little delinquent, but uh

[3:36] one of the volunteers wants to get some signs out for the old

[3:40] um cellar holes that are on trip. I needed just find some time to

[3:45] do the background so that we have the right information to put on those signs

[3:48] to put up there. >> There used to be

[3:51] little plaques. >> Yeah.

[3:54] » I don't find >> There's There's one at the orchard, but

[3:56] I don't think there's any plaques left on the sites [clears throat] there.

[4:00] » Well, there actually there should be a a write-up.

[4:03] » Yeah. >> There's already like a

[4:05] » I just need to look at it. >> With a spreadsheet and write up all the

[4:08] the like the jazz we pulled together for each of the different locations and then

[4:12] we voted on how we were going to

[4:15] do the wording. >> Do they want to put them like on the

[4:18] higher ones as well? Like the one that's there up by

[4:21] Hub's Loop or just like the lower ones? The orchard

[4:23] » All All of them. The only one that they really don't have

[4:27] any that I've seen any history on is you know where the orchard trail is of

[4:31] course the other way is the forest service.

[4:33] » Mhm. >> There's a cellar hole off

[4:36] on that access road to the log landing. I don't think anybody's ever determined

[4:40] what that's what what the history of that site is.

[4:46] » What site was that? >> When you go out on the what we call the

[4:50] spur >> Harter Spur

[4:52] » Yeah. I wonder if Dexter Harding

[4:56] did that interpretive trail with students like years and years ago. I

[5:00] wonder if that was part of it. >> Maybe he didn't go that high.

[5:03] » I don't think he I don't think we went that

[5:07] far cuz I did a a number of walks with Dexter, Lucy and others.

[5:13] And um

[5:18] we did the full boundary of Prospect. And bushwhacked down

[5:25] to um Fallen Leaf Road.

[5:28] And I just I can't I can't pull up the

[5:31] » I think if you look at the forest management plan, it has that one as

[5:34] unknown. >> Mhm. Okay.

[5:37] » I I'd have to go back and look, but that's my recollection.

[5:40] » That's fun. That's good.

[5:42] » I think the other five are are tagged as new.

[5:45] » Yeah.

[5:49] » And I There's a little bit of that history now as preface for this book as

[5:52] well.

[5:55] » I was trying to see where you had

[5:59] I'll look on the Google Drive >> Yeah, I

[6:01] » There might have been a folder. >> I I think you're right. I just haven't

[6:05] had time to go back and look.

[6:09] » How do you access that? >> I can send

[6:12] » I'll send >> you can If you can resend that.

[6:14] » I will share it.

[6:17] » That's about as far as I get. >> Okay.

[6:31] » Okay. Anything else for Prospect Farm?

[6:39] Okay. Jackson Falls, I met with the select

[6:43] board at their last meeting and presented

[6:48] the uh

[6:49] drawing uh plan drawings and the uh cost estimate.

[6:56] Um They said it looked

[7:00] interesting and might support having a public

[7:03] meeting for to to discuss it and also we discussed sort of the funding of it and

[7:10] um I think they were leaning towards the

[7:13] Conservation Commission trying to find

[7:16] some of that out of funds that we have

[7:19] available to us and I think that can be part of our

[7:23] discussion public meeting or if you want to uh

[7:27] discuss that now. I

[7:30] There is the I mean we have funds in the in the money market account

[7:37] which I think would be more appropriate than using the land use

[7:41] » Yeah. >> change. I would agree with you.

[7:42] » Mhm. Um

[7:46] » Do you know how much residual we have in the wildcat fund?

[7:51] Because that one, if I recall correctly, we had to still maintain the the

[7:54] principal like the 12K. >> Yeah, it's

[7:58] I I I think we've done a good job of spending most of our

[8:01] balance every year, so but I can check on that.

[8:09] » Is there a I mean, I know it was a quote based on

[8:12] what we asked for, so it's probably what it costs, but

[8:16] for the sake of conversation, is there something in between?

[8:19] I don't know. Was it 86,000? >> It was 86.

[8:22] » I'm just wondering like if is there

[8:28] discussion that we could have that's like, well

[8:32] » Well, I could be only less stable. >> You know, I mean, I could be getting a

[8:36] truly about stabilizing the thing cuz 86,000 for

[8:40] what if that doesn't engage at all and they're just like,

[8:43] what? And then I'm like, well, there's just other things that

[8:46] I mean I don't know. I'm just throwing it out

[8:49] there. >> Um

[8:54] Yeah, I think part of that could be if it were to be opened up

[8:58] for a bid a bid process. So, if we were to request bids and use this as our

[9:04] » Mhm. >> as the plan sort of our baseline and see

[9:06] if other people would feel comfortable doing that work or if there's

[9:10] other options. >> Yeah, I was afraid we were going to get

[9:14] asked that question like someone like just like, well

[9:17] didn't you >> It's enough money, I think, that the bid

[9:21] process would kick in.

[9:25] The other [clears throat] thing is for the public meeting

[9:29] have as much of the money answered as you can. Where

[9:35] » [clears throat] >> Excuse me. Where would come from? How

[9:38] much? Just so those are the questions that

[9:41] people are really being they're interested in having good, solid

[9:47] answers. >> Do we think the head of water resources

[9:50] ideology would be willing to come? >> Yes, I think he would.

[9:55] » Yeah, so I I asked him if he was available to come. I think if we

[9:58] schedule the public meeting to occur with our next meeting in

[10:03] October, he's available for that. >> Awesome.

[10:06] » Um so I I guess if we just want to say

[10:10] schedule the public meeting at 7:00 or 6:30 and

[10:17] » I would suggest that we schedule it maybe on a night that we

[10:20] have our conservation commission meeting.

[10:23] » Yeah. Yeah, so next October 5th. >> Yeah.

[10:26] » Uh and and Sean is available that night, so

[10:29] » Let's go with it. >> Okay. I just checked my schedule.

[10:35] Um >> I think if we put it out for bid that uh

[10:39] we we should we should be clear that we're looking for somebody with

[10:42] experience because you can get anybody that can bid to go on and do the job.

[10:47] Of which

[10:49] I mean, this is the one that was recommended to us. I did do a background

[10:53] check. >> Oh, yeah. I don't know. I don't have a

[10:54] problem with it. I think people are just cynical and

[10:57] you know, somebody just doesn't like the idea and that's the first thing they

[11:00] throw at you. >> And I don't think there's

[11:03] a fast track here for because it's enough money that I think people

[11:08] would like to know. I think we can pick our contractors.

[11:13] » Yeah. >> Who we want to

[11:17] consult with.

[11:20] » To uh Dick's point, should we try and figure out the

[11:24] partitioning of the money tonight or can we do that by email between now and

[11:30] next month? >> Uh I think we can have a

[11:34] discussion now and >> Yeah.

[11:37] » Uh I don't have

[11:40] uh a current balance for the money market

[11:44] account, but the last time I talked

[11:48] uh to Julie, there was probably enough to cover the full amount.

[11:54] But, I don't know if that include if that was

[11:57] uh I don't know how those funds were

[11:59] separated and if that included land use

[12:04] or if that's in a separate account. >> Mhm.

[12:07] » And all those So, uh I can I can verify that with with Julie.

[12:12] And Bob uh Bob Thompson said I mean, we don't need to

[12:18] Well, I guess that's the question is do we ask do we want to ask the town

[12:23] to help pay for this or do we believe in it enough that it

[12:28] it needs to be done and we don't just spend that

[12:32] money.

[12:34] » Or I don't think we should just spend the money

[12:36] » I don't think we should just spend the money without consulting the town, but I

[12:40] think that in the presentation to the town, we say, "Look,

[12:46] we've got the funds or we've got, you know,

[12:49] a large chunk of the funds. We think it's important work

[12:54] and we would just like the, you know, the town to give the go-ahead

[12:59] for the interest to whoever shows up at the meeting, interested parties,

[13:04] uh to say, "Yes, we want to do this."

[13:09] » Yeah, I guess >> [clears throat]

[13:12] » I thought about the money and did it that

[13:15] much, but maybe with that should we discuss the things that we

[13:20] feel like

[13:23] that money could be better spent on or items that

[13:28] we feel like the residents or

[13:32] the town would be less willing to help us

[13:36] do.

[13:39] You know, with our with money. Like if if we can get the town behind

[13:43] something like this, it would be great to not take the money that

[13:47] we have to do it. >> But I I think going back to Dick's

[13:50] point, I think Dick is right. We're going in to make a

[13:54] a proposal as to how we think it should be done. After we get input, we might

[13:59] change what we did, but that's the function of the town meeting.

[14:03] And my recommendation would be to go in and say that, you know, the estimated

[14:07] cost is, you know, roughly 80,000, whatever it was,

[14:12] um, you know, with inflation, it may be as high as 90,000.

[14:16] Conservation Commission will put in half of it. We're retaining the other half

[14:20] because we do have other needs that will come, including potentially more work at

[14:24] the falls. And we need some input from the town.

[14:28] And so we because then it would become a vote of the town at the March meeting.

[14:33] So we're asking the town to come up with 45,000.

[14:37] » Right. Yeah, I like that idea. >> That's I I think, uh,

[14:41] diplomatically, that's the way to Mhm. approach it.

[14:45] » Yeah, I just didn't want to have it be like,

[14:47] we have 86,000. Like who's going to vote and go like, yeah, you know what, I'll

[14:51] give 10 bucks. Like there's >> That's not the end-all, be-all for the

[14:55] Jackson Falls. >> No, but I guess, you know, my point

[14:59] would be is this how our money that we have in our accounts is supposed

[15:03] to be spent, it should be spent. As soon as we start doing it, we kind of

[15:07] set a precedent on anything that happens related to anything like that. Like, oh,

[15:12] Conservation Committee has money, they pay for that. I'm just I'm not saying

[15:15] that's right or wrong. I'm simply saying,

[15:18] is that how our money, and the way that we get money, is that

[15:22] the best way to >> The only place that

[15:24] » take our money out, how do you get it back?

[15:26] » Uh the only place where I think that makes a difference would be if we need

[15:30] to also tap into current use fund. In which case the RSA is specific about

[15:36] what that money can be used for or not be used for.

[15:38] » Mhm. >> And that's

[15:40] we can't change that. >> And the RSA says we cannot

[15:43] » I believe it says we can, but I I'd want to go back and read it again as to just

[15:48] simply tell you what I think. But my my take is because it's on town

[15:52] property a conservation project, but we should check that.

[15:58] Because if we're making an offer to cover something for which we don't have

[16:02] the full funds in the money market, then we can't take it from that, then we we'd

[16:07] essentially be in a bind. So we can look up the RSA.

[16:13] » And we have a town driver right here today.

[16:19] If she would like to have input in this discussion.

[16:25] » What? Into Jackson Falls? No.

[16:33] » Um Did you hear the question?

[16:35] » Well, we have the public here. >> Did she hear the question? Rephrase the

[16:38] question.

[16:42] » I'm listening. >> I hear

[16:45] No, we're just wondering how the public will react to

[16:50] uh the idea of spending, you know, $90,000

[16:56] uh for bank stabilization

[17:00] at Jackson Falls. >> I would

[17:05] love to have an opinion and know about it and understand it. Knowledge will

[17:10] speak. >> That's a serious thing.

[17:14] » From like Yeah. >> Well, we're projecting to have uh an

[17:18] October meeting on the subject.

[17:23] » Penny, the the challenge is

[17:26] the town did a little bit of work years ago

[17:29] in moving some of the boulders, but we're getting the erosion. When they

[17:32] redid the bridge, >> Yeah.

[17:34] » it's probably going to increase the erosion a little bit more because the

[17:37] piers, I mean, the the abutments that go out are going out

[17:40] further. They couldn't follow it. But it is If you've been down there,

[17:44] it's chewing away, and it will cut through where all the trails are. So

[17:49] there's a need to hire a professional that comes in and And we've had a plan

[17:52] already developed by a hydrogeomorphologist

[17:56] » Yeah. >> to essentially restructure what was done

[17:59] before, but probably done better because before it was the town just came in and

[18:03] moved it. >> Right.

[18:04] » And, you know, they they did a decent job, but that's not what they're

[18:07] professionals. So the estimated cost, we already have

[18:12] it from somebody who does this kind of work. It's 80-some-odd thousand dollars

[18:17] to go in and sort of restructure to help prevent

[18:20] further erosion. That's That's basically what's what's at stake.

[18:24] » And give my people the opportunity to learn and understand.

[18:28] » Yeah. >> And get behind the project is

[18:31] » Which is the part you need >> I guess my only other

[18:37] funding source because this may be something that there would be

[18:43] grant funding that seek out, but I don't want to make

[18:49] making a decision contingent on finding finding grant money. And then that would

[18:54] What portion of the budget would that offset? Like our commitment would be

[18:58] half whatever balance remaining covered by

[19:03] grant money and the town. Does that seem like a logical

[19:08] » That would be a good structure there. It

[19:13] » would be. If we could find that money.

[19:16] » Well, and that's kind of when we when when when Emily and I were going through

[19:21] the FEMA process, this would be the kind of project that they would have given

[19:26] funds for. 2 years ago.

[19:30] But >> And we can pursue that, but I think what

[19:34] you need is still for the town to vote because

[19:37] you you I mean essentially you've got a pool right now.

[19:41] All we need is one more big storm and stuff is really going to be damaged. So,

[19:45] if you're just sort of chasing potential that you have no idea where

[19:49] the potential is. If the damage is greater than the cost

[19:52] to repair is going to be a lot higher than what we're looking at currently

[19:56] right now. Um normally under scenario like that is

[19:59] the town will vote it in if we get the grants, then the town doesn't need to

[20:03] spend it. >> Right.

[20:04] » But to get people's hopes up and have no idea even what grants you can chase.

[20:10] » Right. >> Chasing at this point is a little bit of

[20:12] pie in the sky. >> Right. Well, and I I think presenting

[20:15] [clears throat] it as a we would like to have this work done next fall.

[20:18] » Yeah.

[20:21] And there's urgency to it.

[20:24] » Okay.

[20:28] Um I don't know if we if I missed this, but did [clears throat] they ever do the

[20:34] I just hate that I have this question be asked and us not be able to answer it

[20:37] because we use it as a reason for rational behind why the

[20:41] erosion's going to get worse. Did they ever

[20:44] show the engineering of the modeling of the change in the

[20:48] wall? Like I still can't believe that

[20:53] all this stuff happens and we don't know what that looks like.

[20:57] Like how how do you design something around this situation?

[20:59] » damage is already been done before they even did the bridge replacement from the

[21:04] last two major flood events. So, you know the potential for that to

[21:09] happen without even the bridge replacement. So, it's an interesting

[21:13] question, but it's it may increase that potential, but we

[21:17] know we're not talking about potential. We know what's happening when we get

[21:20] major events. >> And I think where the

[21:24] work is occurring is further down

[21:28] » Yeah. >> the the river. So, it

[21:31] we're not going directly impacting that particular thing.

[21:34] » Mhm. >> No, it's just something something that

[21:36] we've used as a like a catchphrase to say that why we

[21:41] have to be aware of it. It's just like it comes up all the time with the change

[21:45] of the channel and all this thing. I'm just asking.

[21:49] If someone was asking us again like that the person in the room that says

[21:51] » Mhm. >> Well, did you What's the Is that

[21:55] happening? Is this really going to happen? What's the extent? What did the

[21:58] town do? Did you guys research it? How did they get away with doing it without

[22:01] it being researched? Has it been Do we understand?

[22:05] » I think you got some pretty simple answers there because the big rocks that

[22:08] were moved out there before they moved, you're seeing the erosion channel that's

[22:12] already cutting through where the bench is out there.

[22:18] You know, it's it's not hypothetical. You can go down and take a look as to

[22:21] what's happening. >> No, I'm not saying that. I I know that's

[22:24] not hypothetical. >> And that happened before the bridge

[22:26] replacement. >> Yeah.

[22:30] I guess I would just be careful using the change of the bridge

[22:34] in the conversation if we don't know that that's

[22:38] » I would avoid that

[22:40] aspect and just say we're dealing with what's happening.

[22:45] » Right. I mean, I'm not saying it to be argumentative as much as the person in

[22:49] the room who would find the thing to push the button.

[22:51] » Cause it's it's nature nature happening. >> But, I I think we have to be feel

[22:58] comfortable answering the question. We don't know

[23:03] if this will solve any problem that a 200-year storm or something will

[23:10] just overtop.

[23:13] » Yeah. Probably most likely slow down the damage that the 200-year storm

[23:18] Yeah. >> Right. I

[23:19] » Yeah. Best case scenario. >> I mean

[23:24] And and I guess that could be a question we ask Shawn is that

[23:27] you know, what what level of storm protection is this

[23:32] up to?

[23:35] I But I'm I'm certain he's not going to guarantee

[23:37] » Yeah. >> I don't think he could either.

[23:39] » How could anybody expect that? I mean, Madison got what?

[23:43] 7 in in >> Yeah.

[23:45] » an hour or something crazy in some areas.

[23:47] » Yeah. So then it just

[23:49] » Other areas got four. >> And it just becomes a decision by the

[23:52] town, by the people of the town, like is it worth putting this money in and they

[23:56] have to decide is it worth it not knowing like how much do you value

[24:00] » the vaults. Exactly. >> And

[24:02] and that should be >> the discussion.

[24:05] » is okay, we this chunk of money

[24:09] is it worth it to What are we going to save?

[24:12] » Yeah. >> Well, the town made a decision a long

[24:14] time ago because there was a proposed hydro plant there. Which is why it got

[24:18] put into the wild and scenic. So the town obviously valued

[24:23] the Jackson Falls or wouldn't have gone through that whole effort.

[24:29] » It's what Yes, I I Yeah.

[24:33] The town is interested in Jackson Falls. >> Do you think that we should invite

[24:40] DOT to the discussion because >> Well, this money that we're

[24:46] proposing to spend

[24:51] what percentage is, you know, is it going to

[24:54] save 75% of the erosion? is it going to save 50%?

[25:01] Is it going to save 90%? Uh is it going to be a washout

[25:06] in a another

[25:09] major flood year? >> I guess you could say the other one if

[25:13] you spend $115,000,

[25:16] does that get you to the next level where you feel like he's like that would

[25:19] stop >> everything.

[25:21] » You know, I mean >> The one The one thing is pretty clear

[25:25] that it will happen because you can see where it is. Just the trail comes down

[25:29] and it's really close all the way down. Uh if you want to protect your trail, it

[25:35] gives people access from the upper part to the lower part of the the falls in

[25:39] the upper part of the falls there. Um

[25:42] you have to do something with that right bearing buffer.

[25:47] If you're willing to give up a trail that connects those pieces, then

[25:53] But other nature do what it's doing and if it wants to go toward the road so be

[25:56] it.

[25:59] » I wonder at what point would DOT actually get involved where they're like

[26:03] » I think DOT gets involved on a different issue and that is is we Once we finalize

[26:08] some of this, we put together the final proposed Jackson Falls Management Plan,

[26:12] cuz DOT is probably going to be necessary relative to the parking

[26:16] because that part of Route 16 B is actually state road. It is not town

[26:22] road. >> No, I guess you My point is let's just

[26:24] say that like if we did nothing

[26:28] and it takes out the the trail and then after the trail

[26:32] it keeps coming. At what point would DOT say, "Okay, that's

[26:37] too far. We need to stabilize this."

[26:40] » It's a theoretical question. I don't know how we could answer that.

[26:42] » Well, that's what I'm saying. Should DOT be involved? It's like well maybe DOT

[26:46] should be involved because the conversation is about

[26:48] » Well, the state of the state >> comes the road.

[26:51] » But But right, the state will be involved anyways because there's a

[26:54] required permitting because what I mean >> involved in a like actual

[26:58] meeting >> We just chunk the money cuz

[27:01] » That's right. >> Yeah, that's correct.

[27:02] » They can stop, you know, we can put the band-aid on now or we could not put the

[27:06] band-aid on, but if no one does anything and it goes after the road, DOT's

[27:10] definitely going to do something. They're going to put a band-aid on it.

[27:13] What I'm saying is, do we say, "Hey, we want to do the band-aid?"

[27:19] » Yeah. >> You there like

[27:20] » But I But I I think we're looking at if there's erosion at that level, the

[27:26] DOT needs to come in. We're We're talking about something that's totally

[27:29] different.

[27:32] Cuz that's gas funds. >> Beyond the right of way

[27:37] I think they'd be Mhm, it's not ours.

[27:40] » Mhm, it's not town property, right? >> Yeah, no, I I get that.

[27:43] But I I guess that would be Is it wise to spend money if

[27:51] we don't solve the problem and then it becomes DOT's problem?

[27:55] And we have now those funds have been wasted rather than

[27:59] waiting for the inevitable catastrophe where someone else has to step in and do

[28:04] something. >> it like really right or I mean I'm just

[28:06] just just >> Yeah, or they just or they just throw a

[28:09] bunch of crushed rock down there and and the path is gone.

[28:12] » Yeah. >> Cuz that'll take care of the road, they

[28:14] don't care about the path. >> True.

[28:17] » We know that the path is a true risk. The road is hypothetical risk.

[28:23] » Yes. >> Then we can hypothesize

[28:27] total disasters where it takes the road and the houses.

[28:30] Um I I think we're

[28:33] going a little bit far here right now in getting too concerned about the 0.01%

[28:40] issue in front of us as opposed >> That could be a hundred years down the

[28:43] » Yeah, cool. >> Yeah.

[28:45] » Really? For >> All right, yeah, or I mean you could

[28:48] just set the road back.

[28:52] Or that we may get enough salt in there from something that is still building

[28:56] up. >> Yeah, that's what I mean. You just don't

[28:58] know. I'm just throwing it out there.

[29:03] » Well, I guess we

[29:06] feel good. We can schedule a public meeting. We can have We can ask these

[29:10] questions to to Shawn.

[29:14] » I I We got to go back to Mike's question.

[29:18] » Yeah. >> Which is did we agree on how we would

[29:21] propose the funding? >> Well, I think Ben's going to

[29:26] look into what we have available. I mean, you could email it to us

[29:33] uh if you wanted to take a shortcut before the next meeting

[29:37] so that we would have you know,

[29:40] good information in front of us for that.

[29:44] » But, I don't think an email vote is legit.

[29:47] » I I just think to get the balances. >> Okay.

[29:51] But, if we're going to vote on what we're proposing here today per Mike's

[29:55] question, we have to vote in public. We can't vote

[29:58] via email. >> No, no. I wouldn't

[30:01] Just to get information before we vote.

[30:05] » Your concern is that we have to have how we're paying for the say, if we pay for

[30:10] half up front, we have to agree that we're we're

[30:14] reporting that from before our October meeting

[30:18] so that >> I I'll make a motion as follows,

[30:21] that um we will propose that the Conservation

[30:24] Commission will um put in 45,000

[30:29] for the project. And the remainder

[30:33] would be a request from the town to put in up to 45,000

[30:37] because they will need to vote on it as an article.

[30:40] And the Conservation Commission will pursue to determine whether there's any

[30:45] grant funding to reduce the cost of both the Conservation Commission and the

[30:49] town. We will pursue.

[30:55] » Can I ask a question on that? What if the town says no?

[31:00] Could it come up with the other? >> And decide We have to decide what we're

[31:03] going to do at that point. >> If you cuz you didn't say up to us,

[31:08] right? You said 45, so it could be

[31:11] » Okay, 45. >> Yeah.

[31:14] » And if when we take a look at the funds we

[31:18] can't, we don't have sufficient, we can't do it. You'll still be meeting,

[31:24] but we're going to run into a problem here because we have to tell the public

[31:27] what it is and post what it is

[31:30] before that meeting so that they can see it in advance.

[31:33] » Right, in fact, they need to know the amount that isn't covered.

[31:36] » Correct. And my my my So, I put that motion out. I'll need a

[31:40] second, then I'll come back and try to remedy that problem.

[31:46] » So, the proposal is the Conservation Commission pay 45,000, remainder to be

[31:51] paid by town via warrant article. >> Well, we'll have to say up to because

[31:55] the town will not vote on an open-ended number.

[32:03] » Up to >> I'd be flabbergasted if it did.

[32:11] » And we think we have 45 in the money market that we can spend.

[32:15] » Well, if it turns out that we do not, we will know before, and then we would

[32:21] actually take a look at holding the public meeting in November so that we

[32:25] can come back and do it properly. >> Okay.

[32:40] » So I made the motion.

[32:46] I'll second that.

[32:51] » Okay. >> So

[32:55] This is just saying that we'll come up with 45,000 up to 45,000 dollars to

[32:59] cover it. >> And we're asking the town for the up up

[33:03] to another We're asking for 45,000 from the town expecting the cost to be

[33:09] approximately 90,000. And that has a little bit of built-in

[33:14] cost overrun which many construction projects do. We have a bid just not

[33:19] unusual in a bid you could have a cost overrun.

[33:21] » Mhm. >> Yeah, there is a a contingency around

[33:24] that. >> 15%

[33:26] » And I think Brian, to your your question about what if the town says no, I think

[33:30] that probably tells us something. >> Right.

[33:32] » Yeah, if people are like we don't want to spend 40,000 dollars to save this

[33:35] trail. Yeah, I think that's >> I just didn't My concern was that we had

[33:39] committed ourselves to the full >> Got you.

[33:41] » by saying like well, they didn't come up with [clears throat] it, so we are. I

[33:43] just >> Got you.

[33:44] » That's normal. >> Well, I think that's after we

[33:47] » Yeah. >> before we had a

[33:48] you know, a hearing

[33:51] would uh give us direction of whether to

[33:55] say hey. >> Because because what what you have Brian

[33:58] in front of you is if you go and tell the town well, if you vote no, we'll

[34:02] fund the rest of it, but then you burn up the rest of your money for which you

[34:05] probably need for other projects there. >> Mhm.

[34:07] » Uh then [snorts] you have no money at all.

[34:09] » Mhm. >> And they will vote for that. I mean,

[34:11] that's what everybody would vote for is let them pay for the whole thing.

[34:13] » Exactly. Yeah. >> And then that puts us in a bind because

[34:17] we're expected to manage up here, but we have no funds to manage.

[34:20] » Right. >> We we don't want to do that.

[34:23] I wouldn't >> I wouldn't either.

[34:28] » Okay. Any other discussions or

[34:33] Ready to vote? Okay. All in favor?

[34:36] » I. >> I.

[34:37] » Opposed?

[34:40] » Okay.

[34:46] » It's a lot of money. Everything costs lots of money.

[34:50] » For construction projects, I don't think that's out of line.

[34:53] » Oh, no, no, no. I don't either. No, I don't Yeah, I don't either.

[34:55] » And I did check with Yeah. Folks as I as I mentioned before because

[34:59] I I was the chair of the committee with

[35:02] them in the negotiation. I've seen a number of these funds and I've seen what

[35:04] the the cost are for these kinds of things. This is

[35:08] You know, you you're hiring a specialist.

[35:10] » Right. >> Okay.

[35:12] » Um And he's a one He's a small operation.

[35:16] more information >> a big firm

[35:19] or someone to quote off of.

[35:23] » How do they get that information? >> They have two other people I think like

[35:27] what the state has just just crossed my mind. I'm like

[35:31] Let's ask them. But

[35:33] obviously have to be after the fact.

[35:38] » And we don't have to cross that bridge. >> I just didn't read I haven't seen

[35:41] anything that I would be like, "Oh,

[35:44] that's what you'd be working on."

[35:47] » Um Yeah, I'll I'll research that.

[35:55] Okay.

[35:59] Any >> But I would also point out when we go to

[36:01] the town is not only that we're paying at 45 but

[36:04] we've already spent and paid for the engineering. It's not like we're out of

[36:08] the blue. We've already spent 18, 19,000 on the engineering.

[36:15] » That's part of the presentation. >> Yeah, I'd just like to look at that.

[36:21] the engineering everything

[36:33] » Okay. Um

[36:35] moving on. Grazing?

[36:39] Anything? >> Uh

[36:42] only that I met with the new executive director at

[36:46] ski touring and was going to bring up the cuts then with him, but we had a

[36:50] really long meeting about other things, so I'm planning to follow up about the

[36:54] future sheds with him. >> He will struggle because

[36:59] with with the time for this fall. I can tell you that right

[37:02] now. >> Yeah, I didn't Yeah, I got that

[37:04] impression. >> Working with the forest service and

[37:06] getting the bridges qualified and through is has been a nightmare with

[37:11] the forest service. >> The town's done a great job keeping it

[37:16] accessible >> Yeah.

[37:17] » to all the areas that they're mowing. It just

[37:19] seems like they really I remember he was talking about poison

[37:22] ivy and >> Yeah, I was back there the other day and

[37:24] it seemed like poison ivy is I don't know. Like

[37:27] » And then they've been really on top of the mowing. It's I know a handful of

[37:30] people guests, just random people who've said they've been out on the mystery

[37:35] house loop like I didn't believe it. I was like, "Really?"

[37:37] » And Nessel Nok is really signed >> Oh, yeah.

[37:41] » a lot of that. Yeah, it's a combination of the Jackson snowshoe trails.

[37:44] » Yeah, they really have. They've been They've had horses on on trails out

[37:49] there. >> I Yeah, horses on them.

[37:51] » I walk it frequently. >> 20 years now.

[37:55] » It's a neat trail system, actually. >> It is.

[38:01] Community garden? >> Well, irrigation still isn't

[38:05] functioning. >> Okay.

[38:08] Since the >> Since well, they cut the lines when they

[38:14] set the tank out there. But we had a hose and a wrench.

[38:18] But what's happened is I think the one of the valves must be gone in the in the

[38:23] timer. And the box that's buried. So, I think

[38:28] we're going to need a new timer for the hose, hook it up,

[38:32] and then maybe and still use the hose above ground, but the town guys have

[38:36] gotten in the habit now of like the hose up

[38:40] up to the library, so I can bring it back.

[38:43] Yeah, so I've got to call the gym. And um

[38:47] I guess we'll send it to the gym. Um

[38:50] the loading. >> Jim, I know.

[38:53] » Yeah. Cuz it's been

[38:55] I've been asking for a couple of years now.

[38:57] » Yeah, I mean seems kind of weird that >> I know.

[38:59] I think I need to get a new I think I need to stop by.

[39:03] » You could just go to the swap. >> Yeah.

[39:05] » You just say what you had before and >> All right.

[39:08] » what was taken away and >> I can do that.

[39:10] » I mean >> Yeah.

[39:11] » They got a fire station out of it. >> Yeah.

[39:14] » You could get >> It was so funny they

[39:15] » your water line back. >> in two places. Apparently, they replaced

[39:18] the line, but nobody hooks it up. So, we're kind

[39:21] of like I can't even do what you try to stop me from doing.

[39:25] I think it's going to have to be cut. I'm not sure.

[39:27] » Yeah, I mean it seems like >> Yeah.

[39:30] » I don't know what that is. >> At least we've been having water this

[39:33] year, so it hasn't been past credit. The library was good because they let us use

[39:36] their timer. >> Mhm.

[39:38] » So, then at least we you know, we made it needed so we could use the timer and

[39:42] put the hose out, which came in handy cuz we had water in

[39:45] the garden for the spring.

[39:48] Yeah. >> Okay.

[39:50] » natural water >> Okay.

[39:53] Um Wildcat River, so our last month of

[39:58] river monitoring is well all happening in September and then

[40:02] the data will be submitted to the state and they release their report later in

[40:09] the fall. That that will come their final report

[40:13] will come out I think

[40:17] usually in December. I think that's when it came out last year.

[40:21] And then we've received a letter

[40:26] to the commission. It was submitted to the town.

[40:30] Is that what you're here to discuss?

[40:34] I also received a letter from >> even know if if it was on the agenda or

[40:37] not. I just wanted >> We read it.

[40:39] » Is this the the annual one? >> No, there's there's one from Anne

[40:43] » Garland. >> And then

[40:45] I also received the letter you had sent. So

[40:48] if you'd like to have that included in the our meeting minutes.

[40:52] » Sure. Sure.

[40:54] And the letter can be shared, of course. I know the select board has it on their

[40:59] agenda for the 15th. >> Okay.

[41:02] » And they're hoping DES they will pass the DES fee there.

[41:08] » Okay. Can I ask if this Penny's letter is similar to or is it the same

[41:12] situations as or different? >> No, it's it's more general.

[41:17] » Okay. >> How is it that the water gets diverted

[41:21] into the pond and then it doesn't go anywhere? Because it's dry from where

[41:24] the pond is. >> Um no. Well, if you recall the letter

[41:27] that we sent to DES, we raised a number of issues.

[41:32] Issue number one was the water withdrawal rates in the winter for snow

[41:35] making. The second one that we raised was

[41:39] the main channel is actually what's the water's being

[41:44] diverted So we've raised that issue with DES.

[41:48] Um and then the third issue that we raised

[41:51] was with sediment. And the sediment issue is actually both the state and

[41:55] town. I know at the What's the one selectman

[41:59] meeting before? I can't remember which one.

[42:01] The selectmen have now cited Black Mountain.

[42:05] Um but they have given them sort of a caveat that if they clean up their act,

[42:09] then the fines won't be in place. But the fines are basically 200 bucks and

[42:13] 700 bucks for the first and then 500 bucks a day afterwards or thereabouts.

[42:18] Um so we've raised all three of those questions in the response that we sent

[42:23] back to DES at that time. Um

[42:27] The one thing that I would note is and I hope Anne

[42:33] is and I have gone back and taken a couple

[42:36] of those and taken some pictures as well. There's no question that the

[42:40] that the main channel is actually pretty much dry. There's a few pools in there.

[42:46] If you have a heavy rain then it overcomes the new burn that he's built

[42:50] there, but to me that's illegal what he's got going on. We've raised the

[42:54] issue with DES. We know that there's illegal stuff going on between them and

[42:58] DES now. We're not because it is legal, I don't

[43:03] think we've seen some stuff, but I know the selectmen have said that they've

[43:05] gotten some correspondence back, but I don't know what the correspondence has

[43:10] been between DES and the selectmen. But the issue that's raised here about

[43:14] the diversion I think is correct. The only warning I would give is this

[43:18] means that somebody walked on Eric's property to take these pictures. That's

[43:22] illegal. >> Cuz it's posted. I saw that.

[43:26] » Yeah. Uh it doesn't change the fact when you're going into

[43:29] um sniffing on somebody's property, you need the permission to do it. I took

[43:33] some photos, but it was at a I took those photos from Route 16

[43:38] in the right-of-way. I did not and you can get a better picture of the way that

[43:41] this was done, but but that is a challenge that individual could have

[43:46] from Eric that would be problematic for this individual.

[43:50] And I don't know whether your pictures were taken on it his property or not,

[43:53] but you do want to be careful about doing that.

[43:57] That's my advice.

[44:03] » Um I'm going to be going to guess

[44:05] » Even if the town wants to go, they have to alert the DES, I believe, has to

[44:09] alert that company here. >> What if you're a guest at the end?

[44:12] What if you're a guest at the end? Maybe Ann stayed.

[44:16] » Um >> I'm just saying anybody could stay there

[44:18] and get pictures all you want.

[44:26] » He's got big He's got a lot of lawyers. >> I My pictures also include

[44:32] um extreme turbidity

[44:36] from Davis Stream Brook. Um and very clear photos of Davis Stream

[44:42] Brook mixing with >> Okay.

[44:45] » Great Brook in the color, you know, during rain events. So, we've got the

[44:48] turbidity from Davis Stream Brook and then there's the normal tannic acid

[44:53] color water coming down from Great Brook. It's quite

[44:58] obvious as well as photos of the stream coming in by the

[45:03] ranch house, but Yes. >> I have other photos.

[45:07] » But this is I mean, it's a legitimate question

[45:10] what's in this letter. The reasons I say that is we put that

[45:14] into DES as a major concern. >> Can One One of the things under the

[45:19] their dam permit is that it was always supposed to be

[45:25] the dam the the water isn't supposed to be

[45:28] the level of the pond for kayaking and swimming and all that is

[45:32] supposed to be lowered during the summer. It says it in that.

[45:38] » I I don't I mean, yeah, I um I don't know because of You know, when

[45:43] we first moved here, we all used to swim up there.

[45:46] And then the bacterial level, from what I understand,

[45:49] got so high. That was probably because of who raised pigs that were right up

[45:54] there, logging and so on, which is not atypical when we get runoff from animals

[45:58] that um And so, then that would have I believe

[46:01] the there was shut down by DES because of the bacteria count.

[46:05] And that would have been in the '80s. They used to all swim up there. You guys

[46:10] swam up there. We never Yeah. Um I don't

[46:14] I'm not familiar with what you're talking about, so I can't.

[46:17] » It's mentioned multiple times if you go look in the folder

[46:21] for Whitney's for that property that they bought.

[46:24] That it says quite explicitly that the dam level is supposed to be lowered in

[46:29] the summer. >> That could be. Um and then it's a

[46:33] question of whether that is a requirement that is between them and DES

[46:37] or whether that is just an internal policy. If it's an internal policy and

[46:42] now that Eric has bought

[46:46] it, he could change the policy at will. I don't know what

[46:49] » Yeah, it it was it's listed on the DES information.

[46:53] » I I'm not familiar with that, so I can't.

[46:58] » Folks, I have to go.

[47:02] » You have a quorum. So you can still vote.

[47:05] » You want to >> Yeah, vote me out.

[47:09] » [laughter] >> See you later.

[47:11] » I appreciate the time. >> Thank you.

[47:13] » Thank you. >> All right. Our next meeting will be at

[47:17] the regular time. >> Which Which also, Dan, when you're

[47:20] taking the water samples right at the bridge,

[47:23] um you want to make sure that you're doing

[47:26] it in the road right of way, not on his property.

[47:29] » I'm aware about his property, so >> I only say that because of

[47:38] And he was as you know, he got pretty adamant with us about who flagged the

[47:41] wetlands, which we were all clueless about, but

[47:46] » Um Yeah, so I I think

[47:55] I don't know.

[47:58] I You know, the other thing we could do is just contact DES and just tell them

[48:02] that we've continued to observe that that byway is still dry all summer

[48:07] outside of you know, a major rain event and

[48:12] we'd like an update on how how it's proceeding. I mean, it would be a

[48:16] question. >> So, you're concerned about dam safety?

[48:22] » It was cited as an issue that could be pursued separately from the

[48:29] uh letter of deficiency.

[48:33] » It's ranked as a non-hazardous dam. Um

[48:37] I think your your greatest threat if that thing burst would be number one is

[48:42] you get a settlement load, which is pretty typical when that happens.

[48:46] Um how much damage? Probably the first

[48:49] place that would see the damage would be Eagle Mountain, of course, would be my

[48:53] guess just from the bottom of water. If he ex- and I I I'm going to guess that

[48:58] he's probably going to need to do this, but I'm just guessing, is he's probably

[49:02] going to try to increase the volume of that so that he can do snow making in a

[49:06] more legitimate way and I suspect that's what is between him and DES now as he

[49:10] tries to get up to DES's um

[49:14] Obviously, if you have more water stored there, then you may move from a

[49:17] non-hazardous to a hazardous situation. But usually hazardous is based on how

[49:25] much water is there. If the thing breached, how much would go?

[49:30] But he does not have an emergency spillway on that, for example,

[49:34] on that dam, which is why when it was filled, it was going over the back.

[49:38] » There is a bedrock spillway. >> On the dam?

[49:42] » Yes. >> Whereabouts?

[49:45] » As you're facing down. >> So, you got the dam and then on the

[49:48] left-hand side? >> Left side is an overflow.

[49:52] » Then the question would be if it's earth then it's pretty problematic. Usually a

[49:57] overflow would be smooth. So that it would not erode when the

[50:00] water is going through it. >> I'll inquire.

[50:05] » Yeah. I don't My recollection from swimming

[50:08] here is there is no real overflow. There There might be

[50:13] something that allows it to vent there but if it's earthen

[50:16] um water moving through earth, we know >> very well

[50:20] » very quickly. But usually on dams it's going to be

[50:22] something that structurally is not going to erode when it's being done.

[50:32] » Um all right. Well

[50:38] » But we could write a letter to DES and just say, you know, we have continuing

[50:41] concerns there. Um the main channel still continues to

[50:44] be dewatered. And we'd like an update.

[50:48] » What When is that select >> Select the 15th.

[50:55] » I mean I I think

[50:59] select The select board has requested DES attend that meeting, correct? So I

[51:03] think that would be the time we have that discussion, so.

[51:11] » But I don't know when I'll be available.

[51:17] » Yeah. Yeah, they have requested

[51:21] that DES attend at a select board meeting on the 15th at 3:30, so.

[51:27] I I'm not sure if I'll be able to be there but I will make an effort.

[51:31] So thank you.

[51:34] Um And and your letter and and I I'm I'm

[51:38] going to assume that Anne's letter cuz it was also select board

[51:43] uh submitted to the select board will be presented at that meeting.

[51:50] » You want to talk to Anne Garland, right?

[51:53] » Who's Anne Garland? >> Yeah, on the pictures.

[51:58] » Um selectmen meeting is at 3:30.

[52:00] » Yes. >> All right,

[52:03] Seth Tyler. >> There will be a Zoom option.

[52:09] » It's my wife's property, that's it. I'll see how excited she is about it.

[52:12] See if Anne first selected it. >> Stevie Nicks.

[52:16] » Uh yeah, I got the perfect present for you.

[52:21] » Um anything else on Wildcat River?

[52:28] Okay. Um

[52:35] letters will be going out to easement

[52:40] holders this week.

[52:45] Have you been out to overlook it all? Have you seen all of the logging that is

[52:49] » No. No.

[52:51] » That's >> I was going to say

[52:53] » It's Yeah, Burgess Highland. >> Yeah.

[52:55] » There's Yeah, I I It's posted. I looked at the permit. It's just logging.

[53:00] » When did it start? >> Uh it's been going on maybe like 2

[53:03] weeks. >> Okay, that's the trucks that have been

[53:04] coming down. >> Yeah, it's

[53:08] » Huh? >> Yeah.

[53:09] There's been a couple a couple of the easements that we monitor. They've had

[53:12] So, several of them have had some some logging

[53:15] » going on. >> But the conservation easement

[53:17] » allowed them to do the logging. >> With a lot of logging.

[53:20] » The first time they cut heavy, and then they cut heavy probably

[53:24] » Well, just something to tend to over there.

[53:27] » Yeah. >> The lower section of the Burgess section

[53:29] that comes by our house was logged pretty hard

[53:32] » Yeah. >> at one point.

[53:33] » Yeah, that was I don't know, that was 10 15 years ago

[53:37] now.

[53:44] » Yeah. Anyway, just so you're aware.

[53:47] » Yeah. You can see it's posted right by the fire pond.

[53:50] » Mhm. >> But read the easement first.

[53:54] » But if it's allowed >> Yeah, yeah. And it's following

[53:57] you know, proper then, so be it.

[54:03] Um Do you have any thing for wetlands or

[54:07] Dundee Forest

[54:10] » Do you have any updates on the resource inventory?

[54:13] » Yeah, um I'm a little behind, but I'm mostly

[54:17] there. I just I wanted to raise a couple questions here.

[54:21] First off is the assessment that was done by Upper

[54:25] Saco Valley Land Trust the best that I can tell was basically an update that

[54:29] was done in 2022. This does rely on the New Hampshire Fish

[54:34] and Game's State Wildlife Action Plan. Which is a premier tool that a lot of

[54:39] those use. The State Wildlife Action Plan was

[54:42] updated in 2025. So, it is actually relative to looking at lands relative to

[54:49] wildlife value and so on and so forth. And when I look at Upper Saco Valley

[54:54] Strategic Conservation Plan and they are having a meeting I think in September or

[54:59] so. >> Yeah, September 24th.

[55:00] » Yeah, September 24th. And I'm going to check I may just check with Kate before

[55:05] then. Um

[55:07] their priority areas do not reach up as high as Prospect Farm area. Whereas when

[55:13] you look at the State Wildlife Action Plan, I'm just giving this as one

[55:16] example. Um this is what I've been trying [snorts] to just overlay. I mean,

[55:21] these are tools in the end we decide what we think is is best for the town.

[55:25] Um for example, the 100 acres that sits up

[55:29] at Prospect that's the private parcel to them

[55:33] is rated as real high within State Wildlife Action Plan, which makes all

[55:36] the sense in the world. Because upper Snake River doesn't

[55:40] priority area doesn't reach up quite that high.

[55:44] It doesn't flash the same way. So, there's a few things

[55:48] in there that's a little bit of cross talk. And if you remember when we got

[55:51] the prospect management plan approved by the

[55:53] town, we had actually made a recommendation

[55:56] that that definitely should be a priority area. And we know that that was

[56:01] contested years ago. We don't need to go through all of that.

[56:05] So, there's a couple of those things that I'm just trying to chase out

[56:09] and and and get squared away. I think, you know, they

[56:13] getting this like the soils maps and the geology, a lot of that stuff is just

[56:19] you go to the state GIS, which is basically what upper Snake River Valley

[56:23] is. And we we can put those in. It would be almost a rehash of what was

[56:27] out there before because a lot of that hasn't really changed in a big way.

[56:32] But then it gets around to what are the recommendations that we make. I mean,

[56:36] you can explain the situation that's out there. And let me give you just

[56:41] a few scenarios to take into consideration that we don't need to

[56:45] decide on today, but for example, Jackson has a problem

[56:49] that's it's looking for more housing. At the same time, you want higher water

[56:53] quality. You have steep slopes. You have, you know, soils that can't take a

[56:58] lot of septic systems. So, the town has a soil base

[57:01] uh septic

[57:04] as opposed to like 1 acre is and and you know, and my

[57:08] recommendation on that one would be is you'd either recommend that the town

[57:11] still maintain that strategy. The same thing, the town has a river conservation

[57:17] plan and it has stuff about what's supposed to be enforced relative to

[57:21] sediment runoff with construction, etc. Um we know that the town was a little

[57:26] bit slow in implementing the sediment control of the black. I mean, they're

[57:30] into it now. Um and that's partly because we raised

[57:34] another raised the question with the town as to

[57:37] we can't enforce this, but you do have a law on the book and it needs to be

[57:40] enforced. So, our recommendation is in the

[57:44] in the natural resource would be here here's the conditions you have.

[57:48] A number of these things the town had was preemptive in developing a park.

[57:53] They had to do that to get the the wildcat into the wild and scenic. It

[57:58] had to demonstrate that it had some you know, money in the game as well as

[58:04] just getting a a designation with nothing

[58:07] else attached to it. So,

[58:10] those you know, the two parts would be and I think for the most part the town

[58:14] has you know, good zoning

[58:17] out there. It's a matter of making sure that those

[58:20] don't get changed because they can get changed. If your master plan sends you

[58:24] in a different direction, then it becomes problematic. You can see

[58:29] this in the housing commission that's looking at why can't we open up the

[58:32] forest land for housing. I went through this when they were

[58:37] trying to put the bypass in around North Conway and the route

[58:40] they were going to do was try to when you when as a town when you plan poorly,

[58:45] then you look at whoever else's lands are available. They were going to put

[58:49] the bypass around the mole mountains through our forest because there's

[58:53] nothing there. That was only a result because the town had done poor planning

[58:56] up to that point. You have to be very careful and particularly with this

[59:00] administration of opening up Pandora's Box about

[59:04] uh you know, starting to sell off forest service land to meet a need out there.

[59:11] The these are the kinds of things that it's not hypothetical anymore. I know

[59:15] that the housing commission is is exploring with the the forest service

[59:19] county use some of the land which is

[59:24] Well, if you look at out west the current administration is willing to

[59:29] sell off national parks, BLM land, forest reserves. The list is long. I

[59:34] mean, they basically want to privatize everything that's that's publicly owned.

[59:40] So that'll be part of what we need to discuss as we get into recommendation

[59:44] section when we get there.

[59:47] The resource base, I think most of you know it.

[59:51] The soils, the slopes, and so on and so forth.

[59:55] So that's and I will I don't know what

[1:00:00] people have other thoughts real quick because I'll try to put in some draft

[1:00:04] recommendations and then we'll need to be

[1:00:06] discuss those and so on and so forth before we finalize

[1:00:11] the resource inventory.

[1:00:17] And some of it, like what Upper Saco has, is it's been

[1:00:22] they run it through a formula. So you don't actually have the base

[1:00:26] data, but I can access like slopes and soils and that sort of stuff. And some

[1:00:32] of it they have, but some they do not. But it's the same database that the

[1:00:36] state weather action plan would be using as well.

[1:00:48] » So areas be um

[1:00:52] highlighted as areas as of high interest to them in terms of

[1:00:56] as a result of the natural this natural inventory?

[1:01:00] » Oh, yeah. And then same thing is if you want to preserve water quality,

[1:01:04] you have to be careful about, you know, your zoning laws relative to what kind

[1:01:08] of development, how, where it's going to take place, which is the septic, the

[1:01:12] suburban runoff during construction, etc.

[1:01:16] And the town has fairly decent zoning that's

[1:01:21] » What about trails and that sort of thing?

[1:01:23] » The trails were put in and Mike, you were going to do the cultural part and

[1:01:26] give it to me. >> Yeah, so I did

[1:01:28] uh I did contact historical society to see if they had

[1:01:32] just something already existing. And they came back and said, "All of our

[1:01:37] things are in storage and we don't have time right now to answer your question."

[1:01:41] » And there is some stuff out there actually that's online.

[1:01:45] » Uh I was going to

[1:01:47] » In the historic district. >> Oh, yes, right, right. And that's what I

[1:01:49] kind of That's mostly what I was like looking for if they just had something

[1:01:53] easy that was translatable that like mapped out the historic district. Um and

[1:01:57] when I asked that question, they basically said,

[1:02:00] "We're just we're busy moving the building." Or I

[1:02:03] guess the building was already moved at that point.

[1:02:04] » It's a small town. Sure. >> Yeah, they're they're they're busy. So,

[1:02:06] I was going to uh I was going to ask again um

[1:02:11] to see if they just had something easy and digital.

[1:02:14] Um now that it seems like they're getting

[1:02:17] » Well, I'll go back and get them to the finish line.

[1:02:22] » I'm happy I'm happy to help.

[1:02:25] » And we do have what you what you've got here, what they did for the town

[1:02:30] in their original, which was not the 2022, but it was the

[1:02:37] was derived from pre-2020. They they cuz the 2022 was an update.

[1:02:43] And I believe what the town has on record here

[1:02:46] in their resource inventory was from the inventory

[1:02:50] They didn't have >> Yeah, this is this is something else,

[1:02:52] but yeah. >> Yeah.

[1:02:54] For the cultural component, what would be most helpful? Something text-based or

[1:02:58] something map-based? >> Um

[1:03:01] » Or both? >> Maps, you know, it's like pictures worth

[1:03:04] a thousand words. But I think also text-based. We we do

[1:03:08] have a historic district here in town. Um the other stuff that's probably of

[1:03:13] interest is um

[1:03:16] you know, we have a number of historic buildings like the Ham House, etc., that

[1:03:20] are not in the hit in the historic district.

[1:03:24] » Mhm. >> And you know, that's the function of an

[1:03:27] inventory is to list out what the town has.

[1:03:31] » I know when you go up Green Hill Road, you have to go up and climb Iron

[1:03:35] Mountain. That was last little funky building

[1:03:38] that's half dilapidated was one of the original schools. They used to be six or

[1:03:42] eight schools. That's past that building.

[1:03:45] » Yeah, maybe I'll ask Ann Killian as well. Yeah, I think she

[1:03:48] would be a good resource for that. >> And Alice Pepper's book is a good

[1:03:53] » Mhm. >> summary of a lot of that.

[1:03:55] » Mhm.

[1:03:58] Um Okay.

[1:04:00] Um

[1:04:03] Looks like we're moving along there.

[1:04:07] I I I'm

[1:04:08] like looking at the I've seen various

[1:04:14] versions of this and like Eaton's research it they they have it all on as

[1:04:22] a as a website, but it's just using all of those

[1:04:27] land trust resources and then state state maps.

[1:04:30] » Yes. >> They're they're not generating a lot of

[1:04:33] new stuff, so >> No.

[1:04:35] » So, you didn't see nothing. >> And actually she she sent uh

[1:04:38] she has sent to me and I can cookie cut out

[1:04:43] the Jackson. What I can't cookie cut out, but I'm not

[1:04:46] sure that we really need it is if you threw it into GIS, you could actually

[1:04:51] start to generate some statistics, but a lot of that stats exist that haven't

[1:04:56] changed that much. You know, like what percentage is slopes

[1:05:00] greater than X percent, etc. >> Mhm.

[1:05:03] Yeah, I mean they the

[1:05:07] Maybe I'll reach out to them and see if they have a hard copy version of this

[1:05:10] because they do have some narrative narrative

[1:05:12] » I've already I'll get back in touch cuz I've already communicated

[1:05:15] » Great. >> communicated with Kate.

[1:05:20] » All right. Um I just have a couple of other small

[1:05:23] things. There's a volunteer fair October 22nd at um

[1:05:33] I can't remember if it's

[1:05:37] at the library. Yeah.

[1:05:41] to bring uh

[1:05:45] volunteer organizations in Jackson and I think

[1:05:48] kind of use it as a recruitment drive. Didn't really generate

[1:05:51] anything from it, but if anyone's interested in

[1:05:55] participating on that, it's October 22nd at the Whitney Center.

[1:06:00] So.

[1:06:03] See if we can get additional members or just

[1:06:09] more visibility. And then

[1:06:15] the library will also be working with um

[1:06:20] New Hampshire Saves to have a winterization energy saving workshop in

[1:06:25] November. I said I would would help promote, so.

[1:06:31] » When is that again? November 7th? >> 17th.

[1:06:33] » 17th.

[1:06:36] Through the library. So. >> How do you help

[1:06:40] » Promote that? >> Whatever they want

[1:06:43] » Is telling the people >> Tell Tell the people.

[1:06:46] » They'll They'll go out in our community minutes.

[1:06:51] Um That is That is everything I have for

[1:06:54] tonight. >> Uh I have one quick new business thing.

[1:06:57] » Oh, okay. >> And that is I had uh

[1:07:00] someone that lives in town uh concerned about some work being done at with next

[1:07:06] to theirs. Um a lot of

[1:07:08] uh material sediment. It's a building on a

[1:07:11] steep slope. And uh after it rains, uh a lot of that material coming down onto

[1:07:17] their property, coming down into the road.

[1:07:20] Um so they

[1:07:23] We're This is um up Jackson Highlands on a

[1:07:28] Northampton Ridge. And so I recommended uh talking to the

[1:07:33] town inspector, maybe writing a kind of a formal letter, that

[1:07:39] sort of thing, taking pictures from the road.

[1:07:42] Um and so the person

[1:07:45] um I don't think

[1:07:47] they said that they had uh seen the town inspector there and

[1:07:53] briefly mentioned things, but hadn't seen any changes, and then they'd sent

[1:07:56] me some pictures. So I said I would

[1:08:00] bring it to the meeting and um

[1:08:04] I went up and looked at one point, but I don't really know what I'm looking for

[1:08:09] as well as someone like Brian Wood or perhaps Ken. So um

[1:08:14] » Yeah, if you want to call me leading >> Yeah, I might be able to give you give

[1:08:18] you the address and >> I think But for greater efficiency, they

[1:08:21] actually should be bringing that to the town because

[1:08:25] the town has ordinances and it has policy.

[1:08:29] We We cannot enforce anything. The town is responsible for both

[1:08:34] checking on those and enforcing those things. So the pictures should actually

[1:08:37] be going to the town. >> Yeah, I think I think she was

[1:08:41] » I mean, it's good to alert us so we can support, but that's it.

[1:08:43] » Yeah. >> Um

[1:08:45] » I think Yeah, I think she was maybe looking for some help as to whether or

[1:08:48] not what was being done was you know, against town codes and things

[1:08:52] like that. But yeah, no, you're right. Um

[1:08:55] » You can go read the zoning laws. It's all

[1:08:58] pretty straightforward, actually. >> Yeah, but it's hard for people to dip

[1:09:01] People off and I've never known anyone dip their toe into the

[1:09:05] I don't want to be the person pointing the finger. They just By doing that, the

[1:09:10] hope is that maybe

[1:09:12] you'll tell somebody. And this is just happening cuz it's

[1:09:15] supposed to happen anyway. >> Yeah.

[1:09:17] » But we have like what like what Ken said, we have those things in place.

[1:09:21] How long have I been on the board, Pam? How long have you been on the board? How

[1:09:24] often have you seen the things that we talked about at

[1:09:27] company meetings be enforced or and then they black

[1:09:33] » Plan is a little different because >> Well, somebody could draw a

[1:09:37] » DES is required to notify us and to get our input.

[1:09:43] » Right. >> And that's what we were talking about

[1:09:45] all along.

[1:09:49] » Well, I mean >> And I think it's good if people are

[1:09:52] spreading it out. You should go tell the selectmen, but I think it's good if you

[1:09:55] tell your neighbor and tell someone that's on the board that tell the

[1:09:58] selectmen that's on the board that just get the word out.

[1:10:01] » Yeah. I'm I'm friendly with this person. I just think they felt more comfortable.

[1:10:04] » Yeah, and that's how I usually find out my information. People just

[1:10:08] » But you can point out this I mean, on the chapter and verse we put

[1:10:12] in that letter to DES relative to what the town's zonings are.

[1:10:16] » Mhm. >> Because we also sent that to the town

[1:10:20] the same time. >> Okay.

[1:10:25] » Um just so I make sure we don't forget

[1:10:28] about this. We are going to be hold holding a public

[1:10:33] meeting to discuss this plan on October 5th.

[1:10:38] I'm going to say

[1:10:41] 7:00, 6:30 or 7:00 p.m. is that?

[1:10:45] » We should probably shoot for 6:30 and that way we can just have our meeting be

[1:10:49] shorter. If we do 7:00, it's a long meeting and then another

[1:10:52] » Yeah, okay. >> I mean, I don't want to

[1:10:54] » 5:00, yeah, 5:45. I mean, we can

[1:10:58] If if if it's preferable, we can do that prior to holding the meeting.

[1:11:06] With that >> It might be harder for people to make

[1:11:08] 5:30. It can be tough for everybody. It's

[1:11:11] » Okay. So, public meeting October 5th at 6:30.

[1:11:15] » I think that's fair. >> And then we've got to have something

[1:11:18] that they can look at in advance.

[1:11:25] I would suggest that we make the

[1:11:29] design plans the response to the request.

[1:11:38] We would be discussing and I think that there was an emotion

[1:11:41] that we're recommending

[1:11:45] as a conservation commission to move forward. The conservation commission is

[1:11:48] going to put up X dollars. I think we said 45. And um

[1:11:53] we would be that this public meeting would be also

[1:11:57] to see the town put in the remainder.

[1:11:59] » Mhm. >> And so that people come with some

[1:12:03] knowledge. >> Mhm.

[1:12:05] » I always hate walking into a meeting of which I'm

[1:12:08] trying to catch up to speed. >> Right.

[1:12:10] » So, you put it on the notice and refer people to

[1:12:14] the website. >> Yeah.

[1:12:16] » So, what you're saying? >> Yeah.

[1:12:19] » Otherwise, you're going to be pulling up

[1:12:23] the picture and so on and so forth. >> Yeah, I think you want to have the

[1:12:26] information out there and make sure it's I think almost worse is when

[1:12:30] you think you have all the information only to find out you go to a meeting

[1:12:33] that has moved ahead of the last information I left you. So, you

[1:12:38] go there thinking you're going to discuss something that's already been

[1:12:40] decided and you're >> Right.

[1:12:42] » This is what I thought this was for. >> Yeah, I I think the only

[1:12:48] guidance that I've gotten from the New Hampshire Association is that it is

[1:12:56] we don't go into the meeting with a decision already locked in with the

[1:13:00] place. >> Mhm.

[1:13:02] » Uh for that purpose. So, I will get the notice out on e-news and include

[1:13:09] uh the design plans and the quote.

[1:13:15] Yeah, and so we'll do that. >> And the Conservation Commission

[1:13:19] would be putting up 45 and they would be

[1:13:24] a vote by the town whether we would put up the other 45. It's a sounding board

[1:13:28] if everybody came in and said great idea.

[1:13:30] Then you probably have a good chance of getting it passed if everybody showed up

[1:13:34] and said this terrible idea. >> So, that'll go out on e-news ahead of

[1:13:38] time. >> Mhm.

[1:13:38] » So, it's another this is like this is your first sounding board.

[1:13:42] And we'll see who shows up.

[1:13:45] » Okay. >> And if you can send me any engineering

[1:13:47] stuff, that'd be awesome. If you have that. If you have it.

[1:13:51] » And the only I'll ask if there's any additional

[1:13:55] materials. >> Yeah.

[1:13:56] » Um okay. So, I guess we just need to have a motion to

[1:14:00] » And say that Shawn will be there. >> Yeah.

[1:14:02] Yeah, that's Shawn will be there.

[1:14:06] A motion to schedule a public meeting for this at 6:30.

[1:14:10] » I'll make the motion. >> Is there a second?

[1:14:13] » I'll second. >> I'm going to say Pam.

[1:14:17] » Getting on the board. >> Pam's getting on the board. It's quick.

[1:14:19] » All right. All in favor?

[1:14:21] » Aye. >> Opposed?

[1:14:23] » I'll abstain from that. >> [laughter]

[1:14:26] » No. Okay.

[1:14:30] » And then our next meeting will be October 5th, regular time.

[1:14:36] And is there a motion to adjourn? >> Wait, may I make a comment?

[1:14:40] » Oh, I'm sorry. >> Public comment?

[1:14:42] » Any additional public comment? >> Any?

[1:14:46] » Thank you. >> Motion to adjourn.

[1:14:49] » I'll second that. >> Uh all those in favor?

[1:14:53] » I. >> Opposed?

[1:14:56] » All right. Thank you, everyone. >> Thanks, Ryan.

[1:15:00] » Thank you.

[1:15:02] » Thanks, Benny. >> Thanks. Thanks for coming.

[1:15:05] » Ben, when you send in your view app, do you put in any other comments because

[1:15:10] you >> Do you have the address?

[1:15:11] » Yeah, this property. >> Um it's going to take me a minute to

[1:15:14] figure that out. >> I don't have the exact address. I tried

[1:15:16] to >> I tried to scroll down with the number.

[1:15:19] » I don't have the address off. >> Yeah, let's turn this

[1:15:21] » Get out. >> Yeah.

[1:15:23] » Cuz there's one quality and there's one quality.

[1:15:26] » Um it just would be an observation.

[1:15:29] » Since it's not a test site, >> it's a it's above and below that.

[1:15:33] » Um

[1:15:36] there wouldn't be >> That's true.

[1:15:39] » There's a general comment >> on the Insta.

[1:15:43] » Insta.

[1:15:47] » Oh, that's

Conservation Commission 9 2

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