[0:58] Recording in progress. >> Good evening. It is August 25th is

[1:05] special meeting of the Lewisville City Council.

[1:11] Can we get a roll call, please?

[1:15] » Mayor Lee >> here.

[1:18] Uh, Council Member Hamilton. Oh, sorry. Uh, Mayor Prom Hamilton

[1:23] » here. >> Council member Dickinson

[1:28] » here. >> Council member Fe

[1:32] here. >> Council member Hefner

[1:36] » here. >> Council member Coopermanman

[1:39] » here. >> And council member Kern present.

[1:46] If you'd join me as able for the pledge of allegiance. Great.

[1:53] Pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the

[1:58] republic for it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and

[2:04] justice for all.

[2:11] » Welcome all. Um we have tonight uh several things on

[2:17] the agenda but the first one is joint meeting with uh library board of

[2:24] trustees. So welcome to the meeting all of you. Um, I think before we go any

[2:31] further, probably good to introduce ourselves to you, uh, and you, uh, to

[2:39] us, even though we've met before. Um, so perhaps we can start with you,

[2:45] Jamie. >> I am Turn this on. Good evening. I'm

[2:51] Jamie Drain. I've been a resident of Lewisville for nine years and on the

[2:56] library board of trustees for eight years now. Way back, this is my last

[3:01] time here. I hearken all the way back to the day when council members used to

[3:05] come and sit in on our meetings. And I would like to say this is an auspicious

[3:09] board to be related to because our most recent mayors Chris and Ashley were both

[3:14] our representatives to the library board. So politically, I I just want to

[3:19] point that out.

[3:24] And then hi everyone. Uh my name is Ally Benz. I've been living in Lewisville for

[3:28] about three years now. Um and I've been this is the second year that I've been

[3:32] on the board. Um I don't have nearly the credentials that you do uh in terms of

[3:36] the uh history year, but I am happy to be here.

[3:41] » Hi, I'm Jean Baker. Um I am the newest um board member here. This is my first

[3:47] year serving and I've lived in Lewisville for eight years now.

[3:54] » Hello, my name is Cheryl October. Um, I've been on the board three years I

[3:59] guess and I'm actually the superior representative. Um, very very pleased to

[4:04] be here and to meet all of you. >> Good evening. My name is Laurel Cole.

[4:10] Um, I have lived in Lewisville for six years now. This is my fifth year on the

[4:15] board and my third year as chair. Um, and we're so happy to be here tonight.

[4:22] » Great. Go ahead. >> Hi everyone. I'm Samma Fox. I'm the

[4:25] deputy city manager. >> Hi, I'm Diana Langley, city manager.

[4:29] » Uh, Judy Kern. I'm W 2 representative. >> Caleb Dickinson, ward one.

[4:36] » Deb Fehey, W two. >> Crystal, mayor.

[4:42] Barbara Hamilton, w three. >> Josh Coopermanman, ward one.

[4:47] » Dietrich Hefner, W three. Thanks for coming.

[4:50] » Brandy Cummings, director of cultural services.

[4:55] » Right. I think um the first thing on tap tonight is presentation.

[5:01] Um not sure how how are you handling is one person doing the presenting or

[5:05] multiple? We're all going to share what we value about the Lewisville Public

[5:10] Library tonight. And Brandy has a slideshow up there that she will be

[5:14] driving as as we talk uh this evening. >> Um I did want to mention we are missing

[5:20] three board members this evening. Um Carol Burkett was our alter alternate

[5:25] representative from Superior and she is moving out of state as of this summer.

[5:29] So we will be working with the town of Superior to find a replacement for her.

[5:34] Heather Wigan has served for almost three years now and she is also moving

[5:38] out of state very unfortunately. She's been a really wonderful member of our

[5:42] board. And Alan Halpern, this is his second year serving and he is out of

[5:46] town just this week to celebrate a family member's 90th birthday. So I

[5:50] believe Brandy sent an email to you all of a statement from him. He wishes he

[5:55] could be here but wanted to send his thoughts as well.

[5:59] Okay. So last year I was here last spring presenting to all of you and I'm

[6:05] so happy to be joined by the board this evening and it's not just me. Um but

[6:10] last year we had quite a laundry list of things that we were wanting to

[6:14] accomplish as a library board and we wanted to support uh your master plan

[6:19] and your priorities. We have worked on some of those things but we've also

[6:24] faced a few obstacles in the last year and a half. Um, we have onboarded a new

[6:31] director. Not an obstacle, but a wonderful opportunity. Um, and we're so

[6:35] glad that Brandy is here. It's been a long day. Um, and we only

[6:42] meet once every other month. So, you know, maybe that's something we can

[6:46] discuss in the future about maybe meeting a little bit more, maybe monthly

[6:50] with all that is on our plate. Um we have also learned more from the state

[6:56] libraries and also dug into state statute and uh city statutes as well

[7:02] about more of our responsibilities. Um so it's really been a learning year for

[7:06] us. Um we have put together or Brandy has put together matters pertaining to

[7:12] budget for us. That's not something we have done in the past is really advise

[7:16] her on budget areas and really get more in involved in those details. Um, we

[7:22] have also been updating library um, policies, which we did a little bit uh,

[7:27] with Sharon, the former director, but Brandy seems to have more of a master

[7:30] plan and we're going through and making sure all the the policies are relevant

[7:35] and applicable to libraries today. Um, and we've also learned that we need to

[7:40] do some of our own education. So, that's been fun, really learning what our

[7:45] responsibilities are as um, a board of trustees of a Colorado library. So, it's

[7:51] been a great year for us and we're so glad that Bry's here leading the way for

[7:55] us. Um, in our last meeting, I brought up the

[8:00] idea that the we as a board really felt that the library was a core service here

[8:04] in Lewisville. Now, granted, we are not water, we are not sewer, we are not

[8:08] police, we are not fire. However, in our our last meeting, Brandy brought up the

[8:14] the idea of a core quality of life service and that really resonated with

[8:20] us. You'll hear from all the board members tonight about how we really

[8:24] connect to the library and we feel it's really the living room of the city of

[8:28] Lewisville and it means many different things to us and also to our fellow

[8:34] residents in Lewisville and Superior. So, we're hoping tonight to share some

[8:38] stories about what we value at the library, but also show you some numbers

[8:42] about how we think other residents value the library as well. Um, I think

[8:48] everyone who walks into the library can see the value right away of our

[8:52] beautiful building, the outstanding collection that we have, the beautiful

[8:56] community spaces. I mean, the library really speaks for itself. Um, but I

[9:03] think when you hear from us tonight, you'll hear about some of the other

[9:07] values that maybe are unseen when you walk through the community doors. Um, I

[9:12] wanted to share a personal story to start us out with that I moved to

[9:16] Lewisville with my two-month-old six years ago. And if you recall, um, that

[9:21] was like six weeks into CO. That was kind of a scary time to have a newborn.

[9:26] Um, but as he grew and we learned a little bit about COVID and the library

[9:31] reopened, the library really offered me as a stay-at-home mom who was so

[9:35] isolated at that time, a community. Sorry.

[9:41] Um, we saw people and, you know, we made friends and I made mom friends

[9:47] and it was just we go to Tuesday story time, Friday music time and that's how I

[9:53] started to feel connected here. My kids are older. We still come. The library is

[9:58] one of their favorite places. Now they read to a dog,

[10:02] which is amazing. My six-year-old is reading to a dog. Um, but the library

[10:09] has really fostered not only that sense of community, but a love of learning and

[10:13] a love of reading. As an as an educator and a mom, there's nothing better.

[10:21] » Sorry.

[10:25] Yeah, that's something to follow up on.

[10:29] Thank you. Um, it just happened a very auspicious evening. You perhaps heard

[10:36] that Dolly Pardon passed away today. Um, and I just heard an interview where it

[10:42] was stated that her single from her perspective, her single greatest

[10:46] accomplishment was starting the Imagination Library. Um, and that's

[10:51] because of the value she learned. She knew growing up uh in a family where her

[10:57] parents were illiterate how important reading and access to books was. I feel

[11:04] the same way. I moved here to Colorado almost four years ago now and

[11:11] I felt immediately to get involved in community. I wanted to work with the

[11:16] library. Why? Because the library as this goes back more than 200 years, the

[11:24] concept is it's the foundation for democracy. It's the foundation for

[11:29] community. Democracy will not work in an illiterate society.

[11:35] We can teach children how to read in our schools, but to give all of our

[11:40] community members access to all of the books and resources that they need to be

[11:46] educated and aware and um also to stimulate new ideas, curiosity,

[11:55] partnership with others in the community, a deeper level of knowledge.

[11:58] The library is absolutely essential in any community in this country and I'm

[12:05] just so happy and so pleased to serve and that I was welcomed here as a a

[12:10] newcomer from another state um to join and to represent my community of

[12:15] superior as well. Thank you.

[12:21] Okay. Well, um, my library story is kind of similar to Laurel's, um, in that I am

[12:27] the mom of a 5-year-old boy. Um, and when I first moved to Lewisville in

[12:33] 2018, the first week I was here, I got a library card. It's one of the first

[12:38] things I did and started using the library the way most people do, checking

[12:42] out books. Also used the library of things to check out, you know, state

[12:46] parks, passes, things like that. Um once my son was born, you know, once he got

[12:52] to be a little bit older, it was, you know, the became the center of our

[12:56] universe. Basically, we're here at least once a week. Um not just for checking

[13:00] out books, but you know, for story time, like Laurel mentioned, for the events

[13:04] that are put on throughout the year. Last year, my son got his Halloween

[13:08] costume at the Halloween costume exchange. Um, and particularly,

[13:14] you know, at a time when the cost of things is just going through the roof,

[13:19] it's it's so nice to have a place that provides quality, enriching programs um

[13:26] for for young people um of all ages, not just for little kids, but you know, for

[13:31] middle schoolers and adults, too. Um it's nice that we have a place where we

[13:36] can meet up with friends and you know we don't have to worry about um you know if

[13:41] everybody can afford to you know go to a museum or something like that we can all

[13:46] get together you know get books for our kids hang out in the play area and then

[13:51] you know if we feel like it hop on over to Sweet Cow or something like that. Um,

[13:56] but it is such a huge part of our lives and um, like Laurel mentioned, I have

[14:02] made friends hanging out at the library. My son has made friends. It truly is

[14:06] like the town center for us. Um, and just being able to go there and use it

[14:12] the way you normally would, a library, but then also you've got the wonderful

[14:15] town of Lewisville right outside the door and so many great things to do

[14:19] afterward.

[14:26] I'll echo a lot of what's already been said. Um, for me, I have always been

[14:31] very passionate about my community. I believe very strongly in giving back.

[14:34] Uh, when I was in undergrad and then grad school, a lot of my focus was on

[14:40] um, uh, national and international politics. And for the longest time,

[14:45] that's what I wanted to go into. But then as I uh went into internships, as I

[14:49] sort of explored what that looked like and given the uh everchanging landscape

[14:55] um at the federal level, it it felt unmaring. It felt like it was difficult

[15:00] to make a change at such a great and grand scale. And I happened to uh start

[15:08] getting involved more in uh local organizations, nonprofits, and really

[15:12] feel the impact that you can have on a small community. uh how you can maybe

[15:17] not change the world uh but you can brighten up your corner of the world. Um

[15:21] and so that's part of the reason why I actually started working at the Denver

[15:24] Public Library um four years ago uh was to give back to the community and to

[15:30] work for an organization that I was so passionate about and that I saw doing so

[15:35] much good. And then when I moved to Lewisville um out from Denver um I

[15:41] wanted to still be involved in the community that I was now in. So while I

[15:45] still work for DPL, it felt very important to be attached to this library

[15:49] and to care about uh the way in which the library reaches community as one of

[15:54] the last free third spaces that we have. I think it's so important that we have

[15:58] this community center and cultural center and a way to meet one another and

[16:02] talk to each other without the need to be anything other than yourself. Um and

[16:08] the library gives back so much, not just in terms of books, though that's

[16:12] fantastic. and as an avid reader, I very much make use of it. Um, but in all the

[16:16] other services that it provides, um, with programming, with computers, um,

[16:21] with just a way to not feel so isolated in an increasingly isolated world. Um,

[16:27] and so I'm just very happy and proud to be here today and to talk with all of

[16:31] you. So, you'll find that I'm going I've been

[16:35] given the task of talking about library funding, which is fairly appropriate.

[16:39] Um, I like my numbers and I like to see what a community values financially. One

[16:46] of the reasons that I made the decision to buy a house in Lewisville was because

[16:50] I went to the library and I saw the quality of this library. I brought my

[16:54] son here and saw where your funding goes. And I said, "This is the type of

[17:00] community I want to be in." Clearly a learned community. Clearly one that

[17:03] values their library. Um, and that was indeed the main reason that we decided

[17:08] to buy our house in Lewisville instead of Lafayette, instead of Boulder,

[17:12] instead of a lot of different locations. The other thing that drew us was not

[17:16] just the library itself, but the fact that it was right in the middle of

[17:19] downtown. I knew that we could go to the library and then go get a cookie at Moxy

[17:25] or go get Sweet Cow. Um, and I think I I want to highlight that for a lot of

[17:31] folks in Lewisville, the library is part of a stop downtown. It is a part of a

[17:37] bigger package. And I want to make sure we keep that in focus. It's a heart of

[17:41] our community, but also the heart of our business community.

[17:52] Okay. So, just to kind of start us off here, um this is a snapshot of um just

[17:59] some numbers from uh January through June of this year. Um as you can see, we

[18:06] are increasing in in just about every way in terms of um visitors, checkouts,

[18:14] um people signing up to get a library card for the first time. What stands out

[18:19] to me about this is the program attendance um increased by 49%.

[18:25] In this first six months of this year, that's pretty wild in my opinion from

[18:30] last year. Um and just goes to show, you know, something a lot of us talked about

[18:34] is um the library being more than just a place to check out books, kind of a

[18:40] meeting place, a place for people to get together, have community. Um, you know,

[18:45] you said it really well, Ally. Um, in an increasingly isolated world, finding a

[18:49] place to get together, um, that's free. And so, um, people are using these

[18:55] programs and they're really loving them and they're coming regularly and they're

[18:59] bringing their friends. And so, I think it just goes to show that's a really

[19:02] important service that's not a traditional library service that that

[19:06] we're providing here. Um and of course you know um just the increase in

[19:13] checkouts, unique digital users, you know this is all going up. People are um

[19:18] reading books and coming to see us at the library.

[19:26] » Next slide.

[19:30] So, as you can see from this next slide, which describes how the library is

[19:35] staffed, these extraordinary services are offered to the to the city of

[19:42] Lewisville um 7 days a week. And those services um are being offered when

[19:52] we compare to other communities and other libraries with a surprisingly

[19:57] small number of staff. There are 32 people who work in total at the library.

[20:03] Only 20 actually 19 plus 3/4 of another person um are full-time for seven days a

[20:11] week. And um there are quite a few part-time and volunteers that make the

[20:17] library um work as as we know it. 22 are part-time. And you can see the number of

[20:24] volunteer hours and volunteers um that contribute to the library as

[20:31] well. Um 70 hours per week. That means the library is open to students after

[20:38] school. It means it's open on weekends. It means it's open in the evenings.

[20:43] Truly making it accessible to everyone at some point um in time during the day

[20:49] as well as on the weekends. Um so I I think that's that's what we have

[20:56] to share so far about the staff.

[21:01] So I hope I don't need to harp too much more on how libraries are such a

[21:05] foundational cornerstone to our community. um they help uh connect

[21:09] people to each other and to needed resources. We serve around 22,000 folks

[21:13] in Louisville and about 13,000 in Superior. But I think what we lose when

[21:19] we look at these aggregate totals, these large numbers, is uh we forget the

[21:24] individual folks and the folks that are most in need. It's very easy to

[21:27] generalize what someone in Lewisville or Superior looks like, acts like, or

[21:32] wants. But I wanted to dive into some of the data surrounding marginalized and

[21:36] vulnerable populations within our city. Uh so first around a quarter of our

[21:42] service population is under 18. Um compared to the national average of

[21:46] about 20% um Lewisville has a large child population. Uh the library serves

[21:51] our young community through early childhood education uh story times and

[21:54] distinct spaces for children and teens. Um, as I hope you all noticed with the

[21:58] 49% increase in program attendance for the first half of 2026 compared to 2025,

[22:03] uh, the programming is very very popular with children and families. Um, I also

[22:09] want to talk that about how 4% of um, our households uh, within Lewisville uh,

[22:15] do not have access to internet. While that does sound like a small percent uh

[22:21] as we shift towards an increasingly um digital infrastructure uh for our basic

[22:26] needs, what that means is that about 900 people a month may experience undue

[22:31] barriers in doing something as simple as paying their utility bills. The way that

[22:36] they go to access uh those resources to be able to pay for their electricity,

[22:41] their gas, uh is to come to the library and use our public computers. And you

[22:47] can see with our um data for PCs uh that they are incredibly high demand.

[22:51] Additionally, it's not just computers that the library provides, but staff

[22:54] time to help those folks. Um I have worked in the past with people that uh

[22:59] have struggled with digital literacy. I have sat down with someone that has uh

[23:04] tried to pay a medical bill uh and they did not know uh their username or

[23:09] password to their health portal and they did not know the password to their email

[23:12] to be able to reset that health portal. It was a very long and frustrating

[23:17] conversation with a lot of fear. And what our staff do is they're able to sit

[23:22] down and help those folks and make sure that they don't feel alone. And without

[23:27] PCs, without staff, uh without that help to combat that digital literacy, we have

[23:32] a lot of folks that are in very vulnerable positions, especially older

[23:36] folks. I also want to highlight that around 5%

[23:40] of people in Lewisville are at or below the national poverty line. And while

[23:44] this number is significantly lower than the national poverty line of 12.2%, that

[23:49] statistic is pretty misleading. The poverty line is set at the national

[23:53] level, not at the local level. Um, and does not account for the additional

[23:56] costs of high cost of living areas, which I hope you all know Boulder County

[24:00] is a high cost of living area. Um, if you look at uh what the federal poverty

[24:06] level estimates that you need, it says that a single person can comfortably

[24:10] live off of $16,000 a year and that an adult with one child can survive off of

[24:15] $21,000 a year. Um, that's not the reality in which we live. Uh, using the

[24:21] MIT's cost of living calculator, it's estimated that a single person in

[24:25] Boulder County needs to make $56,000 annually. A single adult with one child

[24:30] needing child care needs to make $113,000

[24:34] annually. And a single adult with two children needs to make $156,000

[24:39] annually. Uh just to meet basic food, housing, and childare needs. Uh to do

[24:44] some quick math, that's about 426 times higher than what the federal poverty

[24:48] level says. Um, so using those statistics in Lewisville, it is

[24:52] estimated that 58% of single adult households with children under 18 in

[24:57] them are at or below the cost of living that they need to survive in this

[25:02] county. Um, if the library has to reduce or eliminate programming for children or

[25:07] its support services for adults, that can absolutely be annoying or

[25:11] frustrating to a married couple with children that are in private school. But

[25:15] for a single mom working multiple jobs, that is going to be lifealtering because

[25:19] that family cannot afford to pay for alternatives. The services that are

[25:23] provided at the library cannot be met anywhere else for free or for an

[25:27] affordable cost. Um, so I hope that you can hear that

[25:32] it's vital that these communities continue to receive services uh catered

[25:36] toward their unique needs and the library is fortunately very uniquely

[25:40] equipped to provide many of these services. However, I think that there's

[25:44] an immense opportunity here for all city services and departments to work

[25:47] together um to prioritize that care for all of our residents because no one

[25:52] deserves to be forgotten or overlooked.

[25:57] Thanks, Ally. So, I told you I'd be back to talk about

[26:01] funding. Here we are. Um I don't think it'll come as a surprise to council that

[26:05] the library funding comes from four main sources. Those four that you see right

[26:10] there. Our total operating budget is just over

[26:14] 2.2 million. The city of Lewisville provides the bulk of that funding at

[26:19] 76%. The town of Superior provides 20% of our funding. Um, serendipitously that

[26:26] happens to correspond with the usage of the library by Superior residents. Uh,

[26:31] they have about 20% of our library cards and usership. Just so happens to work

[26:37] that way. The Lewisville Public Library Foundation supplies us with a grant

[26:42] every year. This fluctuates based on what they bring in. The number that you

[26:47] see there, the $73,000, which makes up 3% of our budget, is about $20,000

[26:52] higher than what we typically receive from the library foundation. This is

[26:57] because they received a very large uh grant uh or a very large donation um

[27:03] from a resident last year. So typically we do not see that level of funding from

[27:08] the foundation. The state of Colorado grant to libraries that fluctuates

[27:12] slightly based on our um our citizenship numbers. So if our citizenship numbers

[27:19] go up, that number goes up slightly, but it should stay fairly constant.

[27:24] I also want to let give you an opportunity to compare our library

[27:28] funding and where our money goes to a similar size um library and population.

[27:36] So Lafayette's library, you can see that um their operating budget, they spend

[27:42] 75% of their budget on personnel. We spend a higher amount at 86%.

[27:47] We are staffing our library. We're using our funds to keep programming and bodies

[27:52] um in our library and keep things going. We spend a great deal less on operations

[27:58] than corresponding sized libraries do. We make very efficient use of the

[28:03] funding that we have.

[28:08] All right. Thank you Jamie and Ally and Jean Cheryl. Um so our priorities

[28:14] um our first priority is to represent uh every citizen of Lewisville in Superior

[28:19] and to ensure the highest level of library services and as you have heard

[28:24] from us all tonight that is really important to all of us as board members

[28:28] and we we love supporting Brandy and everything bless you that she's been

[28:33] doing for the library. Um, so in our role as the board of trustees, we

[28:39] support staff as they work to complete, finalize, and implement the strategic

[28:43] plan. We're very excited to hear what Bry's team has compiled in our next

[28:47] meeting in September and to help her and her team move things forward. Um, we

[28:53] also are here tonight providing meaningful information to city council

[28:58] uh to help you with your citywide decisions.

[29:01] Um, as I mentioned before, we also review policies uh to make sure our

[29:06] library is up to date uh with national policies, state policies, and city

[29:11] policies uh so that we can provide the best services to all residents. Um, and

[29:18] we need to ensure ongoing alignment with Colorado library law, which is has been

[29:23] one of our our big learnings this year, as I mentioned earlier.

[29:29] All right. So, we just had a couple of discussion points, but you know, we're

[29:32] also here to open conversation. Um, you know, we'd love to hear what you all

[29:37] think about the library being um a core service when we talk about the quality

[29:42] of life here in Lewisville and love to hear what you feel are the priorities at

[29:47] the library as, you know, we start to hear about the strategic plan and all

[29:51] the feedback that Brandy and her team um has gathered. Um so I guess I'll pause

[29:57] here and open for comment or questions. >> Sure. Um why don't we uh take just

[30:06] briefly if people have clarifying questions for you about the presentation

[30:09] and then we can um address some of the questions

[30:14] um that we've got. Any questions about the presentation?

[30:19] Yes. May prom.

[30:23] » Thank you. um appreciate the presentation and you all sharing your

[30:28] personal stories about connections to libraries as well. Um two clarifying

[30:34] questions. The first one is Ally, the data you presented on our community. Can

[30:39] you all help me understand what survey that came from?

[30:45] » Absolutely. So that comes from the American Community Survey. Um it happens

[30:49] every uh year. Um, usually best practice for data is to pull 5-year aggregates.

[30:54] Um, so that's what we did for 2025. Um, it's basically the annual equivalent of

[30:58] the census. Um, it's considered highly valid.

[31:02] » Okay. Thank you very much. Um, and then my other question is I wanted to um

[31:08] unpackage a little bit more the statistic regarding program attendance

[31:12] and the 47% increase. Can you help me understand what is behind driving that

[31:20] increase? >> Absolutely. Thank you for the question.

[31:22] Um, looking at national trends, when we see economic factors that downturn for

[31:27] the everyman, so John Q public, um, we're starting to see some of those

[31:31] recession indicators show up in our programming. Typically, if we look back

[31:35] to LA public libraries in 2007 to 2008, similar program attendance results show

[31:41] up, but also as a visitor attraction and an economic engine for tourism in

[31:46] downtown Lewisville. I think we pull in higher numbers for some of our programs

[31:50] there that also influence that. Looking back at 2025, there was a time frame

[31:54] where the library was closed um for the carpeting and remodeling project. those

[32:00] programs were shifted to other locations which could also have an impact. But

[32:04] looking programtogram, month-to-month aggregates rather than just an

[32:08] overarching six-month um those program attendance did not fluctuate greatly

[32:13] outside of increased attendance at the things that we're doing. So a good

[32:18] example would be the um which is not in this poll, but the summer reading

[32:22] carnival, which is an annual event we host each year on French Street. This

[32:26] year it saw um just about 1,800 attendees and last year it was 1,200. So

[32:32] we're continuing to see percentage growth in almost every program we do.

[32:36] » Okay, that's really helpful. So is it fair to say that that increase is in

[32:43] part driven by increase attendance in existing programs, not necessarily

[32:49] addition of a lot of new programs. >> Correct. We haven't increased the number

[32:53] of programs we're doing. In fact, in um in line with 2025 six month, we are

[33:00] about 20 programs less than we did in January through June of 2025 for the

[33:04] same snapshot. >> Okay, that's really helpful. Thank you.

[33:11] » Others? Yep. Council member, >> thank you for asking those questions,

[33:14] Mayor Prom. They were mine as well. Uh and thank you all. Really appreciate you

[33:19] being here and and I agree. Um interesting to hear your connection to

[33:23] the to the library. Uh this is probably more for the director. So same thing

[33:27] with the programming. I was curious is the att the increase across the board on

[33:32] every type of programming or is there like a heavier lean toward um young and

[33:37] children's programming is it seems like that's a a really popular item.

[33:42] » Yeah. Nationally, public libraries are definitely known for their bread and

[33:46] butter being how we serve families with young children and how we serve an aging

[33:50] population. We are um gratefully seeing increase across programs at all levels.

[33:55] In fact, with a higher growth percentage for our adult programming um especially

[34:00] looking for those sort of midday focused at senior community opportunities.

[34:04] » Okay. Interesting. Thank you.

[34:08] » Yes, Council Fee. I'm going to continue on with this topic. Um, I'm wondering

[34:15] when you have an increase, which sounds pretty significant in attendance, how do

[34:22] you staff or manage those larger events? >> It's a great question. Thank you. Right

[34:28] now, we are relying on volunteer labor for that core operation. We are far

[34:33] exceeding our ability for our volunteer capacity to help us manage those rooms

[34:36] and those larger events. And so it does take a little bit more finagling.

[34:40] Sometimes it's pulling me off of whatever I'm working on to come be

[34:44] another body during a tie-dye program or a bubble festival um or even a very

[34:49] interesting science program. So we are doing our best to be as responsive and

[34:53] flexible as possible and nimble within the restraints of our staffing.

[34:58] » All right. Well, thank you and thank you for what all of you do.

[35:02] » Council member Cooperman. Um,

[35:06] I was also going to ask a qu questions about the the program number uh

[35:10] increasing, but I'll ask a very different question. Um, I'm just

[35:14] curious, how does the library foundation raise most of its funds?

[35:19] » It's a fantastic question. Thank you. So, the library foundation currently

[35:22] operates two major fundraisers uh per year. One being Colorado Giving Day um

[35:28] which will come up in November. They give run that through the Colorado Gives

[35:32] platform. Otherwise, they do a targeted summer reading program sponsorship. Um,

[35:38] traditionally, they have relied on unsolicited donations. As we work closer

[35:42] with the foundation to set up some of those structural and foundational

[35:45] policies, procedures, and processes much like the board has spoken to, we hope to

[35:49] see a more concerted and targeted effort in fundraising. The large challenge is

[35:54] that we are competing in a community with many wonderful organizations. Um,

[35:58] and we're fighting for some of the same dollars. Yeah.

[36:02] Thank you. >> Other questions?

[36:07] Um I have a couple um about the library

[36:12] snapshot in particular. Um I guess I'm one of the things I was

[36:19] curious about is um there's you know you've broken it

[36:23] down into um full-time

[36:27] uh employees, part-time, and then volunteers.

[36:32] um as well as volunteer hours. But just the numbers of those three um full-time,

[36:39] part-time, and volunteers, how do those compare with other libraries say in

[36:45] Colorado and if you know and same thing nationally?

[36:50] » Yeah, I appreciate the question. So looking at the front range and

[36:53] especially within our consorcia, so Lafayette, Longmont, Loveland, Boulder,

[36:58] um Westminster for some things, we tend to leave Boulder out because they're the

[37:02] big guy, so it's hard to compare ourselves to them, right? We are more

[37:07] heavily staffed by part- timerrs than any of our comparable um neighbors.

[37:12] Lafayette is our large our most similar in service size. And so if we flash back

[37:17] to the January presentation, we have about 120 less staffing hours than

[37:23] Lafayette does for the same number of open hours to the public. So we are

[37:27] staffed 70 hours per week open to the public 58 because we need opening

[37:31] shifts, we need closing shifts, we need processing, things like that. So um

[37:36] looking at the same number of staffed hours, we're about 120 hours less than

[37:40] our regional peers. Nationally, public libraries have always been served by a

[37:45] combination of professional, full-time, part-time staff. Um, I would say that we

[37:50] are probably still lagging behind a bit with a stronger part-time presence than

[37:54] a full-time presence, specifically in our professional librarians.

[38:01] » That's helpful. Thank you,

[38:07] » Council Member Dickens. Just curious because I didn't see it in

[38:11] here if you guys are um

[38:15] what role you guys might be playing in you know what is the revamp of front and

[38:20] center and what I see as sort of the outdoor library for much of the year

[38:26] like obviously street fair and farmers market and things are are known as

[38:30] popular events there but I think there's a lot of intention on making that space

[38:35] sort of you know hopefully feel like the outdoor

[38:39] portion of the library and I'm wondering if you guys are involved at all in

[38:43] conversations in that direction, if you have excitement towards it, if it's kind

[38:46] of like news or how Yeah. how you feel about the the redo of the Steinba Plaza.

[38:55] » Yeah. Can I hop in? I've been working the winter festival in particular for

[39:00] the first f first light Friday um for the last eight years and I think our

[39:05] revamp of our patio area has kind of allowed more um participation. I mean I

[39:13] think our numbers in our art Friday are up dramatically. It makes us more a part

[39:19] of those happenings to have that outdoor platform to have the shading. Thank

[39:24] goodness. So, it's not so terribly hot there. Um, I think all of the citywide

[39:31] events become the library becomes more part of them because of what we've done.

[39:35] And I also have to say I think all the artwork that has been added around that

[39:40] area, it's it's such a draw to folks. I mean, I I don't know if you've seen, but

[39:44] little kids are always stopping and pointing things out and talking about

[39:47] the squirrels and the books and and all the different things. um both as a

[39:53] volunteer at the library and as a citizen. I love the combination and what

[39:57] it's done for us and I'm thankful that money was put aside for that.

[40:01] » Thanks Jamie. Um Council Member Dickinson, as far as the front and

[40:04] center project, the board has not been engaged on that project as it hasn't

[40:08] moved past LRC yet. While we have had conversations about hopes of activating

[40:12] that space, we recognize that again our restraint is in budget and staffing

[40:16] resources. We hope that as that design comes to fruition, we're able to find

[40:20] ways to continue to activate it as we do now, not overstretching past our

[40:24] capacity.

[40:28] » Yeah, I think that's my hope and concern, right? This great opportunity

[40:32] for more programming and like more programming, how do we do more, you

[40:36] know? So, I think it's it's a yeah, it is an opportunity and uh and potentially

[40:42] a problem area as well. I just wanted to add toss out um even

[40:48] before your your comments um that it all depends on volunteerism,

[40:55] the the outdoor programming, the in town programming,

[41:00] it depends on the number of volunteers and their particular interests as well.

[41:07] » Um why don't we move to some of your questions? I I I want to start by kind

[41:13] of maybe well hitting hitting the first one. What

[41:19] are council's top priorities? I think you've laid out some some good

[41:22] priorities. I I want to and this is don't take don't take this negatively.

[41:29] This is a question or this is kind of a comment that I have about about what the

[41:36] boards generally do and frankly what we do. Um what we do is we hit policy

[41:45] broadly um and we when we're doing our best work I think leave the operational

[41:51] stuff to the staff who do terrific job and you know that Brandy does. Um so a

[41:59] couple of the priorities that I looked at here um particularly the first and

[42:05] the last that is sort of supporting I supporting staff as they work to

[42:12] finalize a strategic plan, encouraging teamwork and shared success. I think to

[42:17] the extent that's like moral support, we're all for that. And I know that

[42:21] that's um um an issue. Ensuring ongoing alignment with the Colorado Library law

[42:29] is really more um more the director's role. Um but I I do wonder on the middle

[42:38] two um when we talk about um kind of

[42:44] priorities I I am in interested in whether you feel like you have good

[42:51] opportunities to present or provide information

[42:57] through staff to us

[43:02] » to that. Um, so as I mentioned at the beginning of our presentation, uh, we

[43:06] have learned more about Colorado Library Law and part of the way we have shifted

[43:11] our bimonthly meetings is that Brandy makes a budget presentation to us now.

[43:17] Um, so we see every line item and what the library is spending um, you know,

[43:23] across the board um, not only personnel but with programs and technology and um,

[43:29] the New York Times subscriptions. Um, so it's been interesting for us. You know,

[43:34] I'll speak for myself being on the board now for five years. We we didn't do this

[43:38] before. We didn't get this detailed level um of library operations. So, you

[43:45] know, Brandy has bounced ideas off of us and said, "Hey, you know, I need to cut

[43:50] my budget by 3%. What is this is what my team and I are thinking. You know, can

[43:56] you give me some feedback on that?" So, you know, I I feel that we're a good

[44:00] sounding board for her and we can give her, you know, some feedback on that.

[44:04] Um, and really get into the weeds a bit about how much it costs to to really

[44:10] operate a successful library.

[44:17] » Um, we should probably take public comment before we go into council

[44:24] kind of ask. It doesn't look like we have any

[44:27] » public comment. >> Okay. All right. Then back.

[44:42] » Questions about priorities. I know that that's a question we get from every

[44:47] single um board and commission. Yeah. Council

[44:53] member Coopermanman. Um, actually, I'd ask like to ask a follow-up question

[44:57] first. Um, sort of coming off the mayor's comments and questions. Um, so

[45:04] right, you're called the library board of trustees rather than say the library

[45:07] advisory board. >> Um,

[45:11] I'm just not I don't remember from our statutes and s and such, but is is the

[45:16] library board of trustees more formal than an advisory board? And could you

[45:22] clarify that for us? Yeah, that's a fantastic question. Thank you. So,

[45:26] public libraries are governed by state law. Part of our state law in Colorado,

[45:30] um believe it's statute 249 outlines what a library board of trustees is

[45:34] charged with. That includes things like budgetary oversight. Um typically hiring

[45:39] and some sort of performance management of the director. Um things like policy

[45:44] and and including up to like our budgetary discretion. So, if we were to

[45:49] make major changes, they have input in all of that. So public libraries also

[45:53] operate as an odd entity in throughout Colorado because you can be a municipal

[45:57] library which we are or a district which is a special taxing district as a

[46:01] municipal library. Typically there is a joint agreement between the board and

[46:06] the municipality about who's governing the library director who's overseeing

[46:10] their performance who's doing the hiring and firing there. Um but a lot of the

[46:14] dictation of policy approval um lies with the board of trustees as a more

[46:18] formalized body than an advisory board. And I don't know if anyone from the

[46:24] board would like to sort of comment on, you know, whether I mean, you said

[46:28] you're learning a lot about how uh library law works in Colorado and so

[46:33] forth. So, I don't know. Do you have any thoughts or concerns about how you're

[46:38] functioning as a board of trustees currently or or not or I don't know.

[46:44] » I can speak to that. So, uh, in the past, um, prior to Brandy coming on

[46:51] board, I don't believe that we were meeting our full duties and

[46:55] responsibilities, um, as a governing board. Um, there were certain things

[46:59] that, uh, slipped through cracks. So, it's been a lot of restructuring,

[47:03] ensuring that everyone has been trained on what they need to do and what they're

[47:08] responsible for. And I think that we're moving towards a much better state of

[47:12] being able to be not just a group of people that meets um bimonthly and talks

[47:16] about how much we love the library, although that's great, but also actively

[47:20] is informing the governance of the library um and uh serving as uh

[47:27] responsible leasins um both to you all and uh to the community as well.

[47:32] I'm actually going to hop in off what Ally just said and and point out having

[47:36] seen the transition when Brandy came on and and been for such a great deal of

[47:40] time, this board is more involved with a lot of the detailed decisions and serves

[47:46] more of a role of representing our fellow citizens um than we did before.

[47:50] I'll give you a small example that may seem like nothing. Brandy came to us

[47:55] talking about an issue of needing to um have folks empty out the the study rooms

[48:04] 10 minutes 10 15 minutes early and make that a library policy that we start

[48:09] shoeing people out not exactly the best words. Sorry Brandy.

[48:15] We kindly ask our patrons to exit the study rooms 15 minutes early

[48:22] because our staff is is limited and they need to be able to clear the library out

[48:27] on time. We need to find ways to maximize our staff our staff usage.

[48:34] But this is something she brought to the board and said, "Is this reasonable?

[48:38] What things do you think should be put in place along with this? How should we

[48:41] address this with our patients? With sorry, I'm a nurse. With with our

[48:45] patrons, what policies do we need to put in

[48:49] place? What announcements should we make? All of these details the board

[48:54] addressed. This is not something that would have happened before. Our role is

[48:57] very different than it used to be. I'll pop into uh based on my past

[49:04] experience. I formerly was serving on a school board for 10 years. Um, and then

[49:11] as as a dean in higher education, I oversaw three libraries. So, I had a

[49:16] sense of the way boards are expected to work in a variety of

[49:21] settings. And previously, I think with no criticism directed to toward any

[49:28] given person. Um, the board wasn't in compliance either with state law or what

[49:35] would generally be expected by other boards. um to public serving

[49:41] organizations. And so I'm I'm very grateful to see the changes that have

[49:46] occurred in the last year and it's been I think a little bit of a

[49:51] surprise to all of us as members how far off we were in terms of the state law

[49:57] and compliance. So that's when we've said a big learning curve, that's what

[50:02] it refers to. you know, >> add to that, too. I feel like as a

[50:07] volunteer, it gives me more of a sense of purpose and I I know, you know, what

[50:11] direction we're going in, you know, so Bry's kind of steering the ship and, you

[50:15] know, we can help her correct course as needed. But, um, going in every month,

[50:20] it's like, okay, this is what we're doing. And it it feels more purposeful

[50:25] and also that my time is more valuable and it's it's really um, sorry,

[50:31] respected and and valued. So, all sorts of positive uh changes and

[50:36] I think we're on a really great trajectory and a great path moving

[50:40] forward.

[50:46] » Go ahead. >> I'm going to kind of follow up on this a

[50:50] little bit. Um, I'm wondering with some advisory boards, they're not allowed to

[50:54] accept donations from the public, um, and then specifically use them for their

[51:01] priorities. As a licensed board, are you a 501c3?

[51:08] Can you accept cash and no? >> It's a fantastic question. Thank you for

[51:14] allowing me to clarify, >> so yes, the library board of trustees is

[51:17] not an independent 501c3. They are an appointed body by this body, this

[51:22] elected body. Um, but our foundation is, so the library foundation is an

[51:27] independent 501c3 which acts as the philanthropic arm for the library which

[51:32] we are able to direct gifts to whether that be cash, goods or artwork.

[51:37] » And do those two boards interact and cooperate?

[51:41] » Yes, quite deeply. >> Let me speak to that. So myself or

[51:45] Cheryl, the the vice chair, we attend every meeting so that there's great

[51:49] collaboration and, you know, we can make sure that we're sharing what we're

[51:53] working on as a board and the foundation can ask us, you know, any questions that

[51:57] they may have. And then once a year we have a joint meeting. So that's planned

[52:01] for September 10th. Um, and it's it's really great to sit down with everybody

[52:05] who loves the library, is working hard uh to make sure that our library is the

[52:10] best it can be. They're a wonderful group and uh they meet monthly.

[52:18] » Thank you. So um first it sounds like then based on the discussion that the

[52:24] board of trustees parieties priorities yeah

[52:31] » um aligns with your duties as is spelled

[52:37] out um in a variety of different uh documents. So, I'm going to move on then

[52:41] to the discussion points that you all have up here um and kind of give you my

[52:47] my viewpoint on those. So, as far as you know, council's top priorities for the

[52:52] next year, and I'm going to blend that one and two kind of together uh for for

[52:57] for me, you know, one of the top priorities we're discussing through the

[53:02] budget cycle is maintaining the assets that we have and taking care of what we

[53:08] have. Um, and I think that naturally extends to the library as well for all

[53:14] the reasons that you beautifully told us about. It's a really important asset

[53:18] that we maintain. Um, as far as um, you know, goals and

[53:25] investments and such, I would say we're going to start discussions about our

[53:30] work plan for next year. So, that could help inform the direction that you all

[53:34] go in maybe with some of your work. Um, the thing that stands out to me that's

[53:42] going to hopefully be happening soon is the front and center project. So, I I

[53:46] would really like to be able to lean um on you all to help us ensure in

[53:52] coordination with with director Cummings that the library, you know, still

[53:57] remains accessible, how you're going to do your programs, everything else. Um we

[54:00] I think we talk a lot about how it impacts the businesses but equally it

[54:06] impacts you all as well in your work right. Um and then for three and four

[54:12] about partnering and collaborating more. I think you have a phenomenal director

[54:19] who does a great job partnering and collaborating with you all and then

[54:23] bringing that information to us. So, I fully put my trust in Director Cummings

[54:29] to continue to do that because I think that's the the really from my point of

[54:33] view, the best way for us to partner with you all is through her expertise,

[54:38] her strategy and visioning, which I wish I could channel some of that myself. Um,

[54:44] I think honestly is the most impactful way to achieve three and four. So, I

[54:48] hope that's helpful and I'll open it up to my fellow council members.

[54:52] » Others? Yes. Council member Hefner.

[54:57] » Yeah, thank you. Thanks. Thanks to all of you for coming and and sharing in the

[55:00] presentation. I I agree with everything. Um my word three colleagues said I I

[55:06] would add, you know, on the sort of taking care of what we have front. I I

[55:09] do think that's really important. The other thing we've all been working hard

[55:13] on is we just finished our comprehensive plan for land use and we'll be

[55:18] implementing that with a development code rewrite. you know, and depending on

[55:22] who you ask, I think one of the outcomes of that is going to be we're hoping to

[55:27] get open Lewisville to to more and different

[55:31] kinds of people than necessarily live here now. And, you know, assuming we're

[55:36] successful in some of those efforts, uh your role in the library's role will be

[55:41] more important than ever and and hopefully we can continue to drive the

[55:46] um wonderful growth in in program attendance and circulation and

[55:49] everything else. Um, and so on that note, I think that's one one thing to

[55:54] come and and another reason to keep up the good work, but really appreciate all

[55:58] all the effort and all Bry's effort and um the the library is one of our gems of

[56:03] the city and whether it's a core service or not, I'll I'll leave for others to

[56:06] decide, but it's um I always think about what are the things that would, you

[56:10] know, if they went missing, everyone would notice and certainly on that list.

[56:14] Um so, thank you. Um, we have just a few minutes, but are

[56:20] there other council members want to weigh in on these?

[56:25] » I think council member or member Tan did a wonderful job of explaining I think

[56:32] encapsulating what certainly I said or want to say.

[56:36] » Yeah, I I would absolutely echo um what council members Hamilton and Hefner uh

[56:42] just said. I just wanted to add um I mean on point point number two um

[56:50] I would say like what one of the things we're looking from for for from you uh

[56:56] is advice on that. I mean I I feel like you all are much more um qualified to

[57:04] to advise on where right where we need to invest or or not to invest for the

[57:08] library. Um, and so I would say, uh, sort of in line with number three, you

[57:13] know, you should really feel free to provide us with that information. Um,

[57:17] and you know, I for one am happy to have conversations about that or I think, you

[57:22] know, if you just want to send us memos or emails or anything like that, um,

[57:26] we're always welcome. So,

[57:31] » yeah, I agree. Um, the mayor prom stated everything so well. I won't try to

[57:36] restate. Um, I just wanted to see if you guys hear some of the same things that I

[57:41] do. Do you hear from the senior community at all the the members who

[57:45] come in and need especially books and the access or lack thereof to like new

[57:51] like the newest like novels that are out especially in large print or newspapers

[57:57] in large print because what I've what I have been hearing is the only access is

[58:01] a digital one and I find that that is not actually typically used by our

[58:06] senior population. So I was just curious to see if that was something that you

[58:09] guys have heard as well. Yeah. So, looking at patron feedback specifically

[58:13] in our senior population, we do hear quite often um a frustration or a

[58:18] dissatisfaction with the large print collection. Um our print collection

[58:22] budget is is remarkably restrictive and because we need to invest in the items

[58:27] that are most highly used, we try to lean into our consorcia as best we can.

[58:32] The real the realities of our beautiful library is that the footprint is

[58:36] relatively small. So we have about 82,000 items in our collection. Of that

[58:40] maybe 5% is large print for a colle this size and with a growing aging

[58:46] population. Our goal um internally so under staff's direction is to grow that

[58:52] to a 7% of our collection. However, print newspapers becomes a whole

[58:57] different world. Um, as the print publishing world continues to struggle

[59:01] in an increasingly digital age, we do see increasing costs in print

[59:05] publications that just aren't feasible with with some of our budget

[59:09] constraints. So, when we start to have to compare like what priority do we

[59:13] meet, whose needs do we put where, um, that is why we're turning to things like

[59:17] the strategic plan, which is engaging the entire populace to be able to help

[59:22] identify some of those sort of shared values and shared priorities. So yes, we

[59:26] do we do hear some of those echoes. Um and we are looking for creative ways to

[59:30] stretch what we have and meet those needs to the best of our ability.

[59:34] » Thank you, director. >> If I may, just real quick, is that also

[59:38] something that you guys share with the foundation since they're responsible for

[59:42] helping to do some fundraising that that might be targeted type of fundraising

[59:46] and there's specific organizations that maybe they would be able to communicate

[59:50] with to raise money when it's something specific for that? I don't know.

[59:54] » Yes. So the foundation is aware of library needs. We have um monthly

[59:58] meetings with them where we check in on our goals and priorities. They've also

[1:00:01] been a part of the strategic planning process. Their fundraising currently has

[1:00:05] focused on programmatic things like the summer reading program which could not

[1:00:08] happen without fun foundation support. Otherwise, the bulk of their gift that

[1:00:13] they give us every year does already go to collections. Our collections budget

[1:00:17] is about 50,000 less than our surrounding communities from our

[1:00:20] operating budget from the city. And so we do rely on subsidy from the

[1:00:24] foundation. And as that is a variable and unreliable source of money depending

[1:00:28] year after year, we have to make some of those decisions on a on a less um

[1:00:33] strategic visionary base year-over-year. >> Thank you.

[1:00:36] » If I could add a little bit um representing the superior community, I

[1:00:41] can guarantee you that the senior community um is very very interested in

[1:00:46] the library and what resources are available. they are primarily interested

[1:00:52] in ebooks and our collection is very small um relative to other libraries. So

[1:00:59] it's not unusual to have a wait list of 82 people or even sometimes over 200

[1:01:04] people for a given book. Um so that's one of the strongest areas of senior

[1:01:10] interest. >> I agree. I buy my ebooks because I can't

[1:01:14] rent them. >> Thank you very much for getting

[1:01:17] together. Um, one thing I do encourage you, and I think you've heard it a

[1:01:21] couple of times, is um, watching budget and giving us input is the way we get,

[1:01:31] uh, good good input from the boards and commissions. And I hope you'll, you

[1:01:36] know, continue to to work with um, the director on that and on um, on the work

[1:01:43] plan which is coming up too. If you're interested in making, you know, some

[1:01:48] suggestions, we're getting close to finishing the budget, but there will be

[1:01:52] a a a draft um budget that comes from our city manager um the the first. We're

[1:02:00] going to have to shut um down because we've got other um things coming. But

[1:02:05] please, if you have questions, thoughts, don't hesitate to get in touch with us.

[1:02:09] But I think working with Brandy is, as we've said, the best thing um we can do.

[1:02:16] » Well, thank you all for your time this evening and thank you for having us here

[1:02:20] and thank you very much for your feedback. I appreciate it.

[1:02:23] » Thanks. >> Thank you.

[1:02:27] » Do you need a minute to set up? Um are we are we headed back upstairs here? Are

[1:02:34] we >> okay?

[1:02:38] I'm going to use a quick

[1:02:43] Why don't we plan to come back in a couple of minutes things are set.

[1:06:41] on

[1:06:58] on and we're ready for um our item B which is discussion and

[1:07:05] direction on the draft cross guide book that's um Parks Recre open space guide

[1:07:12] book. Um and um why don't we start with the presentation.

[1:07:24] » Sure. Thank you, Mayor. Adam Blackmore, director of parks, wreck, and open

[1:07:28] space. Thrilled to be with you tonight. Um in our rough estimates, closing in on

[1:07:33] our 30th public meeting related to this specific project. Um as we we move

[1:07:39] forward. So, it's it's very exciting uh with that amount of engagement and and

[1:07:44] time spent with the community, with our elected officials and our boards uh to

[1:07:48] be able to present to you and I'll highlight in all air quotes a draft um

[1:07:53] guide book which includes a 10yearish 10 plus year long range plan uh for the

[1:08:01] entire department as well as what would be our first um city's trail system plan

[1:08:08] uh referenced in um areas as a trails master plan. And so the drafts you have

[1:08:13] tonight um as I mentioned, they're a culmination of um what would be four

[1:08:19] plus years of work. Um, one one of the first items when I started with the city

[1:08:24] nearly four and a half years ago uh was a high demand from the community to have

[1:08:29] um some more concrete direction and some understanding of where this version of

[1:08:33] Lewisville sits as it relates to priority uh for resources, priority for

[1:08:38] amenities um and all the ins and outs um of what's

[1:08:42] valued in this community throughout our very broad uh very highly used

[1:08:47] department. And so, um, you know, we've gotten to this point, um, with the

[1:08:53] drafts. Uh, we are currently in, we're right in the middle of, uh, potentially

[1:08:59] one of our last, if not our last full community engagement periods. Um, we're

[1:09:06] seeking some guidance on if we're on the right track tonight from city council as

[1:09:10] well as um feedback that would be relevant to uh just any public input

[1:09:16] process as well after uh you've had a chance to review the drafts. Um so I

[1:09:22] would just I'm I reiterate that because we do still have uh three two and a half

[1:09:26] three-ish weeks left of public comment to gain. Um, we have had some pretty

[1:09:33] robust comments thus far through our engaged Lewisville site. Um, which I

[1:09:37] would encourage, um, anyone who hasn't done that to go and review the draft

[1:09:40] plans, but also review the litany of supporting documentation that's gone in

[1:09:44] to help uh, get us to where we are, but also any comments. We've had comments

[1:09:49] from typos that will inevitably, no matter how many times we read it, be

[1:09:53] found um to uh more substance and substantive feedback that we can

[1:09:58] certainly take into consideration as we work to refine these to a plan that can

[1:10:04] uh proudly be brought before you hopefully in October uh for adoption.

[1:10:09] And so tonight, Brian's going to go through um a brief presentation for you.

[1:10:15] So, if you're unaware, Brian Weber is our planning and project manager for

[1:10:19] PROS. He's uh wearing a ton of hats, as has been mentioned through our budget

[1:10:23] presentations over the past few months. He's also juggling a um incredibly high

[1:10:28] workload while trying to uh crank out a really high quality product I think is

[1:10:33] before you tonight uh to guide the department moving forward. And so, Brian

[1:10:37] will go through his um his presentation. We're happy to take any feedback um as

[1:10:44] it fits into refinements. Uh Brian will touch on a few things that we've already

[1:10:48] kind of heard as it relates to formatting and some content uh that

[1:10:52] we're going to be relaying back to our consultant. We'll meet with the

[1:10:55] consultant later this week. Uh DTJ is our primary consultant, but we have subs

[1:10:59] for all of the divisions uh outlined in the plans you see before you tonight,

[1:11:03] including the trails plan. Um and then once the public engagement period has

[1:11:08] ended midepptember uh again we'll take all of those comments which we'll seek

[1:11:13] some direction tonight on how you would like to see us utilize those um comments

[1:11:19] and hopefully again in October get you a final plan. So without further ado, I'll

[1:11:24] turn it over to Brian to go through a brief presentation on kind of where we

[1:11:27] are and how we got here.

[1:11:32] » All right. Thank you, Adam, and thanks to council for having us at this special

[1:11:37] meeting to review these plans. Um, really foundational for our department

[1:11:42] and our future and, um, worthy of as many discussions as possible. So, as a

[1:11:48] quick recap, um, we started almost two years ago developing our RFP, uh,

[1:11:54] request for proposal for this project. um that came before our advisory boards

[1:12:00] as well as council prior to being posted. Um fast forward now to August of

[1:12:05] 2026 and here we are with draft plans um under public review. So it's been quite

[1:12:12] a process um for us to get to this point. Um and that included really a

[1:12:18] foundation of robust community input. Um, so over really the past 14 months or

[1:12:26] so, um, as Adam mentioned, we've had over 20, uh, closing in on 30 now, um,

[1:12:33] meetings with various aspects of the community, whether that's advisory

[1:12:38] boards, uh, popup events out at our, um, trail heads or parks, rec center,

[1:12:45] um, opportunities for people to provide input on, uh, surveys, both residents

[1:12:51] and an open link survey um as well as um through open houses. So, we've had a

[1:12:59] number of opportunities for people to engage and had great response to those

[1:13:04] opportunities. Um we've looked at a variety of plans and policies, uh

[1:13:09] existing conditions, things that kind of frame the plans that you see today, as

[1:13:14] well as getting uh guidance from a variety of consultants on the team. um

[1:13:19] everything from trail and kind of transportation experts to ecological

[1:13:24] u consultants, survey experts that helped us draft and

[1:13:28] implement the survey itself and then DTJ as our lead consultant kind of hurting

[1:13:33] everything and structuring the process itself. Um, another thing that has been

[1:13:39] ongoing is obviously the budget and planning process specifically this year

[1:13:43] as we look at um the 27 and 28 and on capital improvement planning um as well

[1:13:51] as feedback from staff. So, not only our superintendent of the various divisions,

[1:13:57] but field staff as well. Um, and so really what this plan comes down to is

[1:14:02] we're trying to establish a clear framework um, and a set of priorities

[1:14:06] for how our department can move forward. The intent of the plans um, lots of

[1:14:14] terms out there that can be kind of confusing, but ultimately a long range

[1:14:19] plan, a trail system plan, we would put them in the category of strategic level,

[1:14:24] highlevel plans. Um, we're looking to, hence the name guide book, we're looking

[1:14:30] to establish a direction for our future and kind of guide the way. Um, help us

[1:14:35] to prioritize knowing that we can't possibly accomplish everything that

[1:14:40] every single person wants us to do. Um but looking at kind of the communitywide

[1:14:47] um high level, how can we get kind of the most bang for our buck

[1:14:52] in investments um with limited resources and kind of define the outcomes that the

[1:14:57] community as a whole desires and then develop a framework um for

[1:15:03] action that we can really implement so that we're not just talking about big

[1:15:07] ideas and lofty goals, but we're trying to break that into a series of steps

[1:15:12] that we can actually take to achieve these things. Um, identifying priority

[1:15:16] level, time frame, staff position responsible, etc. That being said, uh,

[1:15:22] we do want our goals and strategies to be actionable, but we by no means have

[1:15:28] all of the answers, um, or can these plans provide all of the answers. um one

[1:15:34] for unforeseen challenges or shifting priorities, but just the level of

[1:15:38] detail, meaning if we talk about a certain amenity, we don't have it

[1:15:42] designed, right? So, we don't know exactly how much it cost um or even

[1:15:47] exactly where it goes um within the community, but we're just identifying

[1:15:51] that um some of these things like a recreation field for example

[1:15:58] um are an amenity that's been desired by the community and highlighted through

[1:16:01] this process and something that we need to um carve out resources for going

[1:16:06] forward. So, um, we don't have all the details today, um, on, you know, exactly

[1:16:12] how things will be implemented. Um, but we do want to make sure that we're

[1:16:16] heading in the right direction and pursuing the right, um, direction and

[1:16:20] priorities. In terms of, um, kind of where we stand

[1:16:25] as staff, uh, I think one of the things that we appreciate the most about the

[1:16:31] direction that these plans have gone is that they're broken down by division. So

[1:16:36] looking at parks, the recreation and senior services, open space, Cole Creek

[1:16:42] golf course and the trail system which weaves between parks, open space and

[1:16:48] kind of public right away. Um each division has its own unique needs.

[1:16:55] In some cases has its own funding sources, has its own um governing

[1:17:00] documents in some cases such as the city charter. So we really need to focus at

[1:17:05] the division level and these plans um allow us to do that. Uh there also is a

[1:17:11] sentiment from the community to um continue what we're doing right maintain

[1:17:17] what we have build on what's working. So that to say, we're not starting from

[1:17:21] scratch, right? There's been a number of um things in process for a long time

[1:17:26] that we want to look to continue to leverage and continue um to build on the

[1:17:31] success of things that have been done and and are ongoing. Now, more than

[1:17:36] anything, it's grounded in community input. Um so we had great response from

[1:17:40] the community to help provide us direction. At the same time, we're

[1:17:44] trying to balance lofty goals, big picture ideas with the u realism of like

[1:17:51] where do we stand, you know, as a city financially, what can we achieve, what

[1:17:56] resources do we have? Um, and trying to strike that balance between goals that

[1:18:01] inspire us and pull us forward and elevate us to a next level, but don't go

[1:18:07] so high that we could never achieve them, and we're basically setting

[1:18:10] ourselves up for failure. So I think we're striking um a good balance there

[1:18:15] as well. Combined with that is uh guiding

[1:18:20] decision- making, right? We we can't say yes to everything and every person. Um

[1:18:25] and so we can use this document as a foundation for those decisions going

[1:18:30] forward for where we can say yes, where we unfortunately do need to say no, um

[1:18:35] and how we can best focus our resources. I think it's interesting timing coming

[1:18:40] to adoption here um with where we are in the CIP process for the next couple

[1:18:46] years and kind of balancing the community input of

[1:18:52] maintaining what we have the realism of kind of where our budget is projected to

[1:18:58] be and the goals and objectives that this plan sets and I think that there's

[1:19:02] a nice synergy there um between this plan how it informs terms um CIP

[1:19:08] planning going forward and also what's desired by our community of maintaining

[1:19:12] and leveraging existing assets. Um so I think we're in a good place there. And

[1:19:16] then more than anything um the way that this document set up that I've not seen

[1:19:22] before is there is a big booklet, right? There's literally hundreds of pages to

[1:19:28] read through. But the spine and the foundation of that is an action matrix

[1:19:33] that establishes the goals, strategies, and action items for each division. And

[1:19:38] that's something that we can not only use for implementation, but we can use

[1:19:42] that in ongoing fashion. Meaning that we can update that, we can track progress,

[1:19:47] we can literally cross things off the list as they're done. We can shift

[1:19:52] priorities and time frames um more easily based on budget cycles. So it's

[1:19:58] not just a document that is intended to sit on get adopted and sit on a shelf.

[1:20:03] It's a document that we can use on an annual basis um and really be a living

[1:20:09] and working document um to guide us and not be 10 years from now with another

[1:20:16] consultant going oh yeah back in 2025 and 2026 we did this. This action matrix

[1:20:22] is something that we can actively use on a year-to-year basis. So, uh, staff are

[1:20:27] feeling good about, um, what we have, the direction that we're headed, and,

[1:20:32] um, the idea of, you know, building on what

[1:20:36] the community, um, input, uh, what the community has told us over the past 14

[1:20:41] months. So, in terms of input, um, tonight, there's a number of ways to

[1:20:46] kind of try to tackle all of the content that was put before you guys and a lot

[1:20:51] of questions to kind of stew on as you go through things. But ultimately, it

[1:20:55] really boils down to kind of this central question at the bottom, and

[1:20:59] that's, you know, do we feel that the long range plan and the trail system

[1:21:03] plan are setting the right strategic vision for the department and each

[1:21:07] division going forward? Um, as we look at a fiveyear and 10-year outlook, uh,

[1:21:13] some of the things that we've heard so far, um, in terms of kind of refinements

[1:21:18] that are desired prior to adoption, um, this idea of kind of connecting the

[1:21:23] dots. So, we have the long range plan, we have the trail system plan, each one

[1:21:27] has an appendix with additional uh, very thorough documents. So, how can we

[1:21:33] better connect the dots and strengthen the plan so that a lot of that

[1:21:36] foundational work, specifically the needs assessment and the community

[1:21:40] engagement summary is kind of more um legible in the plans itself brought more

[1:21:46] to the to the forefront of those documents um to understand kind of the

[1:21:50] context and the driving force. So, we've heard that from some people um in kind

[1:21:56] of looking back to the earlier stages of the project and how do we uh make sure

[1:22:00] that that information is present in the final plans. Um at the same time, kind

[1:22:06] of looking forward uh with capital improvement planning, how do we make

[1:22:10] sure that it's clear in these plans um how the capital improvement planning

[1:22:15] will be informed by these plans? what are some of the um key priorities coming

[1:22:20] out of these plans that will show up in future capital requests, etc. Um and

[1:22:26] specifically with the trails plan, how it relates to the transportation master

[1:22:31] plan that public works overseas, the comp plan um with community development,

[1:22:35] and how is the trail system plan kind of finding its home between those documents

[1:22:41] um building off of them, being informed by them, and anticipating the future

[1:22:46] changes. uh specifically with the comp plan that it kind of is projecting for

[1:22:50] Lewisville's future. Um and then also kind of the prioritization. So um

[1:22:58] recognizing that each action item um and strategy kind of has a high, medium or

[1:23:04] low and then has a time frame one to fiveyear, 5 to 10 or is it something

[1:23:10] that we're doing in an ongoing fashion? um that those are things that um we can

[1:23:15] get input on as well and kind of easily tweak to meet um you know what what

[1:23:21] council thinks is the best direction um for us. So with that, um just a quick

[1:23:27] recap, next steps. We're in public comment till September 13th. Um seeking

[1:23:31] direction on kind of what happens after September 13th with the feedback that we

[1:23:38] receive um through the website, through email, um from this group, from our

[1:23:43] advisory boards who are also discussing this plan at August and September

[1:23:48] meetings. Um, and really our goal is to try to make these refinements,

[1:23:53] incorporate the input, and be able to come back in October with a document um,

[1:23:57] that we feel is ready for adoption and and get the thumbs up that this is the

[1:24:03] direction that we'd like to see the department go um, for the next decade.

[1:24:08] So, with that, I'm happy to try to answer any questions. I know there's a

[1:24:13] lot to digest with all of these plans and appendices and all the things, but

[1:24:18] um if there's questions we can answer um feedback we can incorporate or things

[1:24:23] that we can try to find an answer to, happy to discuss.

[1:24:30] » Good. Um we will start with um council questions. So who would like to kick off

[1:24:38] on this one?

[1:24:42] No questions at all. Wow.

[1:24:48] Okay. Um, we can go to public comment. I I actually I've got a couple of

[1:24:54] questions myself, but yes, member Goerman.

[1:25:03] Um, let's see.

[1:25:08] Um guess some a couple of smaller

[1:25:13] questions. Um so on the there's the a map that shows

[1:25:19] all the open space properties and it has the different designations of types of

[1:25:23] open space. Are those currently established or are those suggestions?

[1:25:32] So, um that

[1:25:37] » um I can try to find it.

[1:25:46] » Yeah, I forget.

[1:25:58] Yeah, I think I know that you're talking >> 45.

[1:26:05] » I'm off. I think I know the map you're talking about and that map reflects uh

[1:26:10] the recent results of vegetation survey that was done by open space staff. Um

[1:26:16] that is one of the reports um that you can link to in the appendix and is

[1:26:20] available um on the engage website. All of the different appendix um appendex

[1:26:26] items are there to read kind of that full report.

[1:26:29] » But my understanding is that >> as a result of the vegetation study,

[1:26:34] they correlated the types of vegetation um to different classifications. And so

[1:26:41] in areas where they found more native species, less weeds, etc. that warranted

[1:26:48] being um the highest like preserve level. Things that were more like smooth

[1:26:53] broom, undesirable vegetation were in the lower. So that map basically

[1:26:59] reflects classifications that were informed by the vegetation survey data.

[1:27:05] So it's kind of a snapshot of where things sit today.

[1:27:10] » Okay. But it's not like a formally adopted in some sense.

[1:27:14] I mean like we haven't said like >> No, it's meant to reflect current

[1:27:20] snapshot using the veg survey. We do have designations and mapping for each

[1:27:25] property as it's came through council's review or OSAB's review historically

[1:27:31] that we've been using for guidance as it relates to um infrastructure

[1:27:35] improvements or the way that we manage the properties. But that specific map I

[1:27:39] think is talking to just a snapshot of the veg survey.

[1:27:46] » Okay. Um and then another question about a map.

[1:27:52] Um so there's a one of the trails maps showing existing

[1:27:57] um conditions. Again, it seems like it shows some bicycle lanes but not all the

[1:28:03] bicycle lanes. So, I was wondering, you know, is the is it supposed to is it

[1:28:09] supposed to show all bicycle lanes or are there certain ones that have been

[1:28:15] emphasized or like there are there actually ones that are sort of

[1:28:17] designated as parts of trails? I'm just not sure. Yeah. So, we wrestled quite a

[1:28:24] bit with the classifications and try to how to best adapt

[1:28:29] kind of industry standard or national standard trail classifications to

[1:28:35] Lewisville. >> Um,

[1:28:38] » it's interesting because for instance in trails planning there's this idea of a

[1:28:42] regional trail. >> In an industry standard, a regional

[1:28:45] trail would be something more like Highway 36. you have this, you know,

[1:28:50] consistent width of concrete that goes between jurisdictions, but then we have

[1:28:55] the Cole Creek Regional Trail, which is anything but Highway 36, right? So, we

[1:29:01] we kind of looked at these breakdowns of like what what does it mean for

[1:29:05] Lewisville? So kind of where we landed was we do have these regional

[1:29:09] connections. We do have secondary connections and then we also have um

[1:29:14] this this idea of kind of street routes and those are things that are more in

[1:29:17] the public rightway. >> Specifically for the bike lanes. That's

[1:29:21] something that I think we should go back and look at that exhibit and kind of

[1:29:27] with a fine tooth comb say are we showing these accurately or not? Um and

[1:29:31] double check that. In terms of the trails planning, we are considering more

[1:29:35] of the street routes um being part of the system, not just like a bike lane in

[1:29:41] the road, but more of something where you have um kind of like a separated

[1:29:45] bike lane. So, if you think along >> like the north side of Cherry Street

[1:29:50] over by Heritage Park, um there's like a a concrete path on the north side of

[1:29:55] Cherry. Um that's kind of a street route trail, right? Um but not like just a

[1:30:01] three foot wide section of a lane, so to speak.

[1:30:04] » Yeah. >> Okay, that's helpful. Um

[1:30:12] okay.

[1:30:15] And uh maybe um

[1:30:20] » I don't know. Maybe that's all for now. Thank you.

[1:30:22] » Okay, member Kern.

[1:30:26] » Great. Thank you. Uh first off, appreciate like this is huge amount of

[1:30:31] work. I know that I've mentioned this to you guys before, but I thought in a very

[1:30:34] public setting I would I would offer that as thanks because I think this is a

[1:30:38] big project. Um so I I had a question about it's under the open space and it's

[1:30:45] I think in the details of the action plan that we're kind of talking about

[1:30:50] page 114 Chris to help you find it. Um and I think it's under the open space

[1:30:57] 2.3 it has a mention of wildfire mitigation in with vegetation management

[1:31:03] practices and ecological restoration. And then in 231 it's it like it talks

[1:31:11] about um incorporating resource protection measures uh into project

[1:31:15] designs implementation and then aligning projects with operational activities and

[1:31:20] adopted plans. Is there something like this one in also the parks area because

[1:31:25] I know we also have to do this on that kind of like unerrigated parks I think

[1:31:30] I'm saying that right out on irrigated parks land um and is this enough

[1:31:36] information I mean given given like the the importance of this to the community

[1:31:42] to I guess since this is going to be a staff document to make sure that future

[1:31:46] people for the next 10 years or more understand like what a high priority

[1:31:51] this is my concern is where it's living and how small it is and I just wanted to

[1:31:57] see if if it felt the importance to you because as I read this it doesn't strike

[1:32:02] me as it's high level

[1:32:09] for us it is to your point though I think if there's

[1:32:14] a way to make it more prominent or to highlight the language we can certainly

[1:32:19] consider that in the final draft for future people that would be reading this

[1:32:24] or implementing it. Um, you know, I do think

[1:32:29] and I'd have to go do a a word search of sorts, but we did take the feedback from

[1:32:34] the April meeting specific to reinforcing that message. Um, and

[1:32:39] incorporated that pretty substantially throughout the document and all aspects

[1:32:45] really. Um, so I think that for what we're trying to implement and in the at

[1:32:50] least the short term, it's definitely got a high level of priority. Um,

[1:32:57] yeah, I'll I'll leave it at that. I I think for us it's good, but you know, we

[1:33:01] can certainly consider ways to ensure that number one, it is in parks and

[1:33:05] number two that it's highlighted. >> Yeah. And there is mention of it in

[1:33:10] parks and golf also. um this idea of fire mitigation. I think the how it fits

[1:33:17] into specifically open space with the concept of lands management of as we do

[1:33:23] these restoration projects as we increase um the percentage of native

[1:33:27] grasses get rid of things like smooth broom that that is supporting fire

[1:33:32] mitigation um and managing those fuels. So

[1:33:37] my understanding from discussion with open space staff is that the fire

[1:33:41] mitigation falls under those um the land management and kind of it's all the

[1:33:48] goals are all they all align I guess if that makes sense. So as we restore

[1:33:51] native grasses we have better habitat we're more resilient against wildfire

[1:33:58] kind of all goes hand inand together. Um, so that's why I think you see it

[1:34:03] kind of nested under that broader goal about the resource management.

[1:34:07] » Okay. >> Um, but yeah, the feedback's good. It's

[1:34:10] important. >> Thank you. I appreciate it.

[1:34:16] » Other questions?

[1:34:20] » Okay. Um, I want to follow up on one of the

[1:34:23] questions that council member Coopermanman asked, which is, um, when

[1:34:30] if and when we adopt this, probably when we adopt this in some form

[1:34:38] on as to that figure 11. Um, what are we going to be adopting

[1:34:47] and what are we not going to be adopting? Are we going to be I mean is

[1:34:52] that going to set in priority I guess your

[1:34:59] um future activity? Is that what we're talking about or is there some something

[1:35:05] different than that?

[1:35:12] » So the way I understand it is I mean everything in the document would be

[1:35:17] adopted. um the key aspects in terms of priorities or future goals and

[1:35:24] objectives really comes down to that matrix. So looking at the the goals,

[1:35:30] strategies and action items for each division,

[1:35:33] priority level, time frame, etc. So if there's something for instance that

[1:35:40] we have as a low priority happening 10 years from now and council thinks it

[1:35:44] needs to be a high priority happening one year from now like that feedback's

[1:35:50] great because that's going to you know trickle into CIP planning and um

[1:35:56] staff focus etc etc. So I think that's you know the type of feedback from a

[1:36:02] high level um now of like do we have the right goals, strategies, action items

[1:36:08] and are we thinking about this the right way in terms of the priorities based on

[1:36:13] input from the community. >> Okay. Um

[1:36:22] got a couple of >> I think Adam has a thought too. I was

[1:36:27] just I was going to maybe highlight something. Not that anybody asked, but I

[1:36:31] would. It's a it's a huge component of the the plan that we were kind of able

[1:36:36] to work with the consultant and especially OSAB. I appreciate uh Vice

[1:36:41] Chair Dorsy being here this evening and the trails plan specifically as a a

[1:36:46] framework and a rubric for how to start addressing the social or undesated trail

[1:36:51] issues throughout our system. And there will be a direct tie-in to that with the

[1:36:56] figure 11 uh classifications based on current recommendations for what that

[1:37:01] that's going to look like in the trails plan. Um so there's definitely a tiein

[1:37:06] that impacts day-to-day maintenance and future larger scale investment.

[1:37:12] Okay. Um, another question I had relating to

[1:37:17] the I guess it's trail 18. Um, and I I think um if I'm recalling

[1:37:27] one of the um emails that we received suggested

[1:37:33] perhaps running that along 96. Um, and I guess I was interested if you

[1:37:41] have any thoughts about that um whether that's um something that was

[1:37:49] evaluated um and what your thought is around that.

[1:37:55] I'm not suggesting thorough. I'm just interested in what your thinking process

[1:38:00] was around that. >> Yeah. So, the intent of the maps was

[1:38:06] really to cast out ideas and see um what are potential connections that could be

[1:38:13] made in the future. We had a trails workshop last November um that involved

[1:38:19] a variety of stakeholders from different um kind of perspectives and and realms

[1:38:23] within the city. Um and some of that came out of that um workshop of you know

[1:38:30] opportunities for new connections. I think that trail in particular uh

[1:38:34] relates to the Red Tail Ridge and that kind of emerging development and how

[1:38:39] that might shift um circulation patterns around the city as

[1:38:45] well as the um uh the what do we call it acquisition

[1:38:50] sorry drawing a blank of the Paradise Lane properties um and how that kind of

[1:38:56] extends um to the north. So there's an opportunity there. Um I will say that in

[1:39:03] the prioritization of the different trails,

[1:39:08] the feedback that we got that specific trail was not a high priority. So we

[1:39:13] asked for instance the OSAB group um and trails task force of these you know

[1:39:19] 20some different potential trails which are your top five. Um that trail was not

[1:39:25] in the top five. So from that standpoint, I don't think that

[1:39:29] particular trail is something that we're looking at as a a high priority item. It

[1:39:34] was more captured on a map for the purpose of conversation and feedback

[1:39:39] collection and where the community interest is in not only that connection,

[1:39:44] but 20 others around the city. Um in addition to underpasses, regional trail

[1:39:51] connections, you know, there's some different layers to that mapping um that

[1:39:54] was done. So that's kind of where that trail falls in the the bigger picture.

[1:40:00] » So tell me if this is right that u that's sort of a that's in the category

[1:40:06] of things to be determined later. It's not something that we would be if we

[1:40:13] adopted this we would be adopting that particular piece of it. I'll I'll go

[1:40:19] back to the slide a couple PowerPoint slides again about what the intent of

[1:40:22] this plan is. Right? The intent of this plan is to set strategy with clear

[1:40:27] understanding that investment. We'll reference back to this when we make

[1:40:32] project recommendations, infrastructure recommendations,

[1:40:35] maintenance, infrastructure needs. It's not intended to be overly

[1:40:41] prescriptive. It's pretend it's intended to showcase

[1:40:46] an incredibly high amount of public feedback that we were able to attain

[1:40:52] that leads us to saying what we say we think the community would like to see

[1:40:56] implemented out of this plan. But every one of those implementation items,

[1:41:00] especially related to items like the budget that council would be approving,

[1:41:05] uh would have the same public engagement that any other project or planning

[1:41:10] process would have. Good. Thanks. Um, any other questions? If there are any

[1:41:15] more questions, we'll take public comment.

[1:41:21] » Um, first up is Matt Jones, followed by Cindy Bedell.

[1:41:45] that on now. Uh Matt Jones live in Lewisville. Thanks for the opportunity.

[1:41:50] I'm going to be talking about open space tonight. I appreciate there's a lot more

[1:41:53] in the pro plan than that, but I'm talking about open space.

[1:41:57] And you know, I'll remind you that the city charter and the standards as

[1:42:02] preservation and protection is a priority. I can read it to you if you

[1:42:06] want me to read the language. You probably know it.

[1:42:09] And this the language that sets up the land classifications areas.

[1:42:14] A lot of places in the plan you see the word balance between recreation and

[1:42:18] ecolog and environmental protection. And it's phrased a lot of different ways. I

[1:42:22] don't know why, but it is. This plan is not even balanced between

[1:42:30] environmental protection and recreation. It is way out of balance. And in part

[1:42:35] because there have been a lot of decisions over the years that put it in

[1:42:39] that place and there's a prime example that so you

[1:42:43] should be projecting right that's what the charter says or constitution says

[1:42:48] not even balancing but balance isn't even happening that's how out of whack

[1:42:52] this is a good example is the land classifications you have them currently

[1:42:58] uh that the new ones have when we put this together when we these land

[1:43:03] classifications went into I I was part of that. We wanted roughly equivalent

[1:43:10] property acreage in these things. And if you look

[1:43:14] at the map, preservation, the most protective category is at 6%.

[1:43:22] Protections at 30%. Those should be at 50% or somewhere near that. And they

[1:43:27] should each be about 25%. And I'll tell you where the most one of the most

[1:43:31] glaring examples of where this is a problem is in the land classifications

[1:43:38] with in the Cole Creek. You can look at Dutch Creek area and Cole Creek.

[1:43:43] They used the vegetation mapping for eastern cottonwood flood plane woodland

[1:43:53] and only use part of it.

[1:43:57] flood plane's a repairarian area, right? It's huge, huge miss. It should have had

[1:44:04] the whole part of that vegetation type at a minimum. And then you should

[1:44:08] overlay environmental protection criteria

[1:44:14] uh and use that such as repairing areas of the highest value wildlife habitat

[1:44:20] you have. That was all supposed to be in in a preservation category in the 2001

[1:44:28] in two two inventory. It was that way and it's not. That should all be

[1:44:33] protected and it should be 25%. And that's relative importance. Uh the other

[1:44:40] thing I would mention is the trail connection you were talking about. I

[1:44:44] would take that trail off the map. >> Off the map.

[1:44:49] » Mr. Jones, your time is over. >> Okay.

[1:44:53] If I've done a lot of trail planning in my life, that one wouldn't even make the

[1:44:57] list because of the environmental impact. You can read my letter. Thank

[1:45:00] you. >> Thanks.

[1:45:03] » Next up, Cindy Bedell.

[1:45:13] » Oh, hi. Can you hear me? Yeah. So, I'm Cindy Bedell. I live in war I and um

[1:45:19] first of all I want to thank the open space parks and recck department for

[1:45:23] everything they do. It's a wonderful amenity and I really enjoy it. Um one of

[1:45:29] my concerns is bright flood lights from properties bordering open space that

[1:45:35] impact wildlife, bird migration, and evening human walkers and bike riders.

[1:45:41] As you probably know, city council was presented with a possible dark sky

[1:45:45] ordinance in the past which was not passed.

[1:45:49] That ordinance did include something about residential light trespass on open

[1:45:54] space. The dark sky lighting information that used to be on the city of

[1:45:59] Louisville website didn't make it to the new website. And I'd like to see that

[1:46:04] put back up so that people who are interested can learn more about dark

[1:46:08] night sky lighting and very simple measures that can be taken to preserve

[1:46:12] our dark skies. Just um light fixtures that point light down amber and the

[1:46:19] appropriate wattage. It's all that's really needed. Um but a lot of people

[1:46:23] have these super bright flood lights that are on motion detectors. So I walk

[1:46:27] at night in Coyote Run and they just turn on and blind me, you know, and then

[1:46:32] it's very bad for the wildlife. What and when these thousands of new housing

[1:46:36] units go in that's called for in the new comp plan, especially the many planned

[1:46:41] for west of McCaslin, our dark night sky over open space is going to be greatly

[1:46:46] impacted. Right now, many of us go to Davidson Mesa to view planetary events,

[1:46:52] night photography, dark night sky, and all of that is going to be lost without

[1:46:59] measures to protect the dark night sky near Davidson Mesa and other open

[1:47:03] spaces. And again, um, I've studied this a little bit about dark skylighting and,

[1:47:10] um, the measures can be very simple and especially with new builds, I would

[1:47:14] think it wouldn't be that more cost prohibitive just to put in fixtures that

[1:47:17] point down, have some measures in place about wattage and, you know, amber

[1:47:22] lighting instead of bright light. So, I don't think it's very expensive,

[1:47:26] especially at the new build. So, I'd really like to see something about light

[1:47:31] trespass and light trespass mitigation measures on open space um addressed and

[1:47:38] included in the um pros plan. Thank you. >> Thank you, Cindy.

[1:47:47] » Any others? >> No, there's no um thanks. Um let's take

[1:47:54] it back to council. I want to do a little bit of framing on this one. Um,

[1:48:01] first I others can speak to this obviously, but I think I speak on behalf

[1:48:09] of all all the council that this is a monumental effort and we really

[1:48:14] appreciate all the work that's gone into this by staff and by the community. Um,

[1:48:21] I was, um, you know, I I I looked at the community

[1:48:28] engagement and and we've talked about this a bit and I thought it was a really

[1:48:34] good example of community engagement following on to the

[1:48:40] uh, comp plan, but it's actually more community engagement than in the comp

[1:48:46] plan. And um I I really appreciate that. I think that's this is you know uh open

[1:48:54] space and parks are huge as assets to the city and we all want to protect them

[1:49:00] not just because the charter says we have to protect the open space for

[1:49:04] example but because it's critically important to who we are.

[1:49:10] Um, and it's worth maybe reminding us based on some of the the stats there

[1:49:18] that we have 34 parks, 173 acres of parks. That's um

[1:49:25] about what 8.2 to 8.5 acres um per thousand. Uh that's below the average uh

[1:49:35] nationally and it's below the average in our peer communities

[1:49:41] um by a pretty significant amount. Um but

[1:49:47] uh it is those are very important to us and especially as we attract um families

[1:49:53] and so forth. We're going to that's an important concern in this on open space.

[1:49:59] I I think it's important to recognize that although there are 675

[1:50:05] acres of city-owned

[1:50:09] open space, there's, you know, 2,000ish acres that are owned not necessarily by

[1:50:18] um the city, but others as well. So, um, and we're second only to Boulder County

[1:50:25] and that, I mean, it makes me very proud, but it also,

[1:50:30] you know, certainly informs the the process. Um,

[1:50:37] you know, the north star for certainly for open space is charter, as Matt Jones

[1:50:42] said. I um we can talk in just a minute about that piece, but it's pretty

[1:50:50] important. The two documents are going to be community documents though they

[1:50:55] have been um drafted with respect to this wide community input and I am uh

[1:51:04] confident in the staff and the work that's been done that um

[1:51:10] the content is consistent with that um input. Um these are drafts.

[1:51:18] Um, we're not making a decision tonight. Um, I think you heard a little bit in

[1:51:24] terms of what we're deciding on, what we're not eventually, but um, there's

[1:51:29] more time for community input and there will be, um, that. So, um, I think

[1:51:35] that's a pretty important thing for us to

[1:51:38] to think about and I think there, as I understand what staff is looking for,

[1:51:43] we're looking for some uh guidance on forward direction

[1:51:47] and that's what we're here for. So, with that in mind, what kind of comments to

[1:51:54] Yes. Council member Dickinson, what do you have?

[1:51:57] » Yeah. Um, you know, I I liken this to the comp plan. Um I think I've said in

[1:52:03] in other moments that you know something this big is like it's everything and

[1:52:08] it's nothing, right? Like it's this really really really important document

[1:52:12] and in the end it isn't what we actually use on a on a daily basis. It's a

[1:52:18] guiding light. Um and so it's very important we get it right and then

[1:52:22] there's a lot of work to do after its eventual adoption um to think about like

[1:52:27] yeah what where's the money actually coming from? which specific project is

[1:52:31] actually being funded and when. But I think this is an awesome um

[1:52:37] uh draft and an awesome plan. I think one of the things that's really clear to

[1:52:43] me and I just, you know, as as a council person, I've actually been on council

[1:52:48] for nearly seven years and yet I take almost in my mind no credit for what we

[1:52:56] have as a community when it comes to the parks, the open space, uh our

[1:53:00] recreational facilities, all those things. It it for the most part predates

[1:53:05] my time on council. And and I think, you know, that's just a really cool story

[1:53:11] as, you know, this is this is my turn and I'm here and what I think is being

[1:53:16] asked of me is don't screw it up. We've done a really really good job over the

[1:53:21] last 20 years, 30 years, 40 years. Uh we have incredible open space, incredible

[1:53:26] uh bike paths, amazing parks and playgrounds and pools, and incredible

[1:53:31] rec center. um all these amazing things. A golf course that I love I love to play

[1:53:37] at as well. There's so many wonderful things that we have that you know it's

[1:53:43] not to say that we don't have our own goals but I really like this idea of you

[1:53:48] know taking care of what we have because we've done such a good job of creating

[1:53:55] it and and having it. And I say we as in all the people that came before me, not

[1:54:00] so much me. Um, I I think we've done a great job and I think this plan is

[1:54:07] thoughtful and I like how you guys um I think the conversation we had the other

[1:54:12] day is uh less dreaming and more doing like we have all these things that we

[1:54:18] want to do and all these things that we need to do and this plan is a little bit

[1:54:23] more uh oriented towards you know divisions getting their jobs done,

[1:54:29] divisions doing what they need to do over the next 10 years to to preserve

[1:54:33] what we have. Um, take care of what we have and and that's not just preserving

[1:54:39] open space, it's preserving our incredible rec center, preserving our

[1:54:43] other incredible things. So, I think it's great. Um, and I I'm I know it's

[1:54:50] still in draft form and I think similar to the comp plan, it's so much bigger

[1:54:54] than the seven of us, right? This is a living public document that so many

[1:54:59] people have had input on. So many departments, so many um boards and we

[1:55:04] are another one of those groups that is really important just like so many other

[1:55:08] groups are really important. Um I don't currently have you know any certainly

[1:55:13] nothing substantial uh to to change. I I think it's really

[1:55:18] well done and I think we've gotten a lot of positive feedback uh both directly,

[1:55:22] you know, people speaking to me and indirectly through comments I've heard

[1:55:25] from all sorts of people, talking to all sorts of people. But, um I I think you

[1:55:29] guys have crushed it so far. It's not done. I'm excited to hear other

[1:55:32] people's, you know, continued feedback and to see what the next iteration looks

[1:55:35] like. But super impressed.

[1:55:40] » Others. Yes, Council Member Her. >> Yeah, thanks. Um, you know, I know I've

[1:55:45] shared a lot of my feedback directly with staff. Um, it I think there's a lot

[1:55:53] of things to like in here in terms of the amount of community input. I think

[1:55:57] we have a lot of really good sort of statistical information about what

[1:56:01] people asked for, sort of what what does the wish list look like in terms of what

[1:56:05] people want. I think there's a lot of great descriptive information about what

[1:56:10] um conditions are like now. um especially in the trails plan. And I

[1:56:14] think there's a lot of that good information

[1:56:16] um the vegetation survey the existing condition the needs assessment the the

[1:56:22] thing that I struggle with is I look at the action items and a substantial

[1:56:28] majority I mean well more than 50% feel re just really generic like let's align

[1:56:35] our budget with our priorities you know let's let's assess our needs and then

[1:56:39] figure out what to do about our needs and it I don't know that it's going to

[1:56:45] be at a point for me where it's like oh let's go back and tweak those I think

[1:56:49] it's kind of past that point now and so the thing I'm struggling with and I

[1:56:53] guess my question to all of you is and I think that the mayor was getting at this

[1:56:57] a little bit with his questions or something similar is what does it mean

[1:57:01] if we adopt this as a plan right I mean a lot of the things in here to me are

[1:57:06] like they're great wish list items they're great best practices like we

[1:57:09] should align our budget with our priorities I agree with that and and

[1:57:12] certainly wouldn't reject that idea. At the same time, it doesn't The last time

[1:57:17] we were in here with a consultant, he said, "This is going to spell out what

[1:57:20] we're doing in year one and year two and year three, and it's going to be

[1:57:23] specific actionable items and that sort of checklist to check off." I I don't

[1:57:28] totally see that here and I'm struggling a little bit with how sort of how we

[1:57:34] adopt this as a plan when at least in my mind it it sort of doesn't quite rise to

[1:57:40] the level of a of a plan that we could implement in a meaningful way while at

[1:57:44] the same time it has lots of value in terms of what does the community want,

[1:57:48] what are good practices for managing open space and parks and recreation. Um,

[1:57:53] so that that's where I'm at and certainly don't want to discount all of

[1:57:57] the work that went into it. I know there's a tremendous amount of work and

[1:58:00] community engagement and I think the most valuable thing we got out of it is

[1:58:03] the results of the community engagement and the research into things we might

[1:58:08] do. Um, I I just would hate to be sort of locked

[1:58:13] into saying these are all things we're we're going to do. like if we did all

[1:58:17] the high priority and ongoing items, it would far exceed

[1:58:21] our wildest dream of available resources. So, um I think that's my

[1:58:27] piece. Thanks all. >> Other comments? Yes, Council Member Fee.

[1:58:35] » I'll just build Well, sorry. Um on what Councilman Hefner just said. I think

[1:58:41] that this is this isn't a plan. It's a guide book. And so this is just going to

[1:58:48] guide us to the right plan and to the right outcomes without specifying

[1:58:55] because we don't know what will be the best decision two years from now. This

[1:59:01] is going to guide us and say, you know, look at this and look at that and go

[1:59:05] this way, but we need this isn't the plan for what we're actually going to

[1:59:10] do. And so I think it's it's been wonderfully put together and it does

[1:59:16] have the priorities of of the public and the council and so we're just moving

[1:59:23] forward in this direction and we can change whenever we want.

[1:59:29] » Do you mind if I just is your proposal we take like long range

[1:59:34] plan out of the title? Well,

[1:59:40] um I'm not sure. Well, this is the pros

[1:59:45] guide book.

[1:59:52] » Yeah, but the sort of the core document is called the the long range plan,

[1:59:57] » right? But this is kind of guiding us to a long range plan.

[2:00:04] So, I'm not sure exactly.

[2:00:09] » I don't think we need to be that specific

[2:00:12] » in in what what the book says >> because it's just saying we're going to

[2:00:17] go in this direction. These are our priorities and these are the order in

[2:00:22] which we would like to do things but it's not what we're actually going to

[2:00:26] do. It's just possibilities and a guide. That

[2:00:32] » that's helpful. I think I agree. Okay.

[2:00:41] Um yeah. Um I guess first of all I I sort

[2:00:47] of share um Council Member Hefner's concerns. Um I I do think though that

[2:00:53] Council Member Fehees comment helps to delay that to some extent. Um

[2:01:00] I wanted to make a few more specific comments.

[2:01:03] Um, so reading through

[2:01:08] um both the trails and the and the pros um plans or whatever you might call

[2:01:13] them. Um so you know

[2:01:19] we have our guiding principles, we have uh goals, strategies, action items, but

[2:01:26] then we also have places where there are themes and where there are priorities

[2:01:29] and where they're recommendations and where there are challenges and

[2:01:32] opportunities and next steps. And I I just feel like it's kind of it needs

[2:01:39] to be less confused or less uh or or somehow these things need to be

[2:01:44] condensed. Um like because a lot of I mean if you if

[2:01:50] you go to a page with some priorities or if you look at the challenges a lot of

[2:01:54] those are reflected in the goals or the strategies or something like that. And I

[2:01:59] I just find it's rather confusing to, you know, to have like read the goals,

[2:02:04] but then in next steps it's like, oh wait, wait, like there are these next

[2:02:07] steps, but they're not aligned with the goals. Um, and I just feel like there

[2:02:11] could be a lot more clarity in how we present um all of those different

[2:02:15] things. Um, and you know, a little aspect of that, like I think the the

[2:02:22] challenges is very nice. um especially like how it really seems to have come

[2:02:27] out of feedback. Um it the opportunities just feel a little silly because they're

[2:02:32] just like the the opposites of the challenges. So it, you know, it's fine,

[2:02:36] but uh I just feel like it's a little a little silly. Um so that's one comment.

[2:02:44] Again, something I brought up um yesterday with staff um which kind of

[2:02:51] feeds into that general comment um you know we on engage Lewisville you can go

[2:02:57] look at all the survey results um and and such in full. Um I don't know if the

[2:03:02] idea is to include those as appendices in the guide book or not. Um that might

[2:03:07] be a nice idea. Um, but I would just like to reiterate I I feel a little bit

[2:03:12] like it's reading the the plan the the two plans by

[2:03:18] themselves. It's a little hard to understand how the community feedback

[2:03:23] sort of directly uh flows into all the goals and

[2:03:28] strategies and so forth. So, um I don't know if that could be clarified in in

[2:03:33] some way. I think that would be helpful too.

[2:03:36] Um okay. And then um

[2:03:44] a little bit more specifically than that. So um

[2:03:51] let's see. Um I'll just go through a few different comments. Uh there's talk

[2:03:57] about parking facilities at I think both trail heads and open space

[2:04:03] properties and parks maybe. Uh but I didn't really see anything about bicycle

[2:04:07] parking at those locations. Um

[2:04:13] let's see in terms of the um the map with the ideas for trails and so forth.

[2:04:20] Um I I mean I that's I think that's a great

[2:04:24] part of the trails plan. I I would just see and and in that section there is an

[2:04:30] introductory paragraph that you know sort of explains um

[2:04:36] the the context for those maps. Um I I would just think about making it more

[2:04:41] explicit like on the maps themselves like these are ideas or you know just to

[2:04:46] just to be very clear like these are ideas that our community has about where

[2:04:51] we could do these all the improvements but you know they still have to then go

[2:04:55] through that whole kind of process that you lay out in the plan. Uh just make

[2:05:00] that more explicit than it is at the moment.

[2:05:04] Um let's see.

[2:05:08] Um and then what else did I Oh, so then to

[2:05:14] go back to the um the map with the open space designations.

[2:05:19] Um so on the one hand that map is like based on the vegetation survey is really

[2:05:24] informative. Um, I guess what I might like to see is, you know, since we have

[2:05:31] established management designations, I feel like

[2:05:37] that that should be shown maybe somewhere and then like you could show

[2:05:42] the information from the vegetation survey as like informing

[2:05:47] I don't know like possible changes to that or something like or something

[2:05:51] around like that. But, you know, since we do have formally adopted management

[2:05:55] practices for the open space, I feel like that needs to be stated like those

[2:05:59] things are not going to be changed unless the council makes a new decision.

[2:06:04] Um, and so it just needs to be clear that what's being shown in that other

[2:06:08] map is like uh information from this survey that we did. Um,

[2:06:14] okay, a couple other comments. Um, let's see. Um,

[2:06:24] what was I going to say? The there was a suggestion in some of the

[2:06:29] letters we got um about the open space goals and whether or not they should be

[2:06:34] prioritized. Um, you know, on the one hand, I

[2:06:38] understand why the goals are not prioritized. Uh, but then on the other

[2:06:42] hand, like it is established in the charter sort of what the priorities are.

[2:06:46] And so, I do feel like we should I don't know what the best way to do it

[2:06:51] is, but we should we should take that prioritization from the charter and

[2:06:56] somehow imprinted on those goals. Um, that's one comment. Um, I know I'm just

[2:07:03] kind of skipping around, but um an another one um related mostly to parks

[2:07:11] um and maps of parks. Um, so there's a very nice map that shows all the parks,

[2:07:17] kind of the main parks. Um, I actually think it would be really helpful if we

[2:07:21] have it to show those like smaller park segments in some other map, the rights

[2:07:27] of ways and things like that. Um, I don't know. I I think that's useful

[2:07:32] information. Um, not not crucial though. Um, but then another there's another map

[2:07:39] that shows places sort of for potential park development. Um, and on that I had

[2:07:46] two comments. one um kind of related to the previous

[2:07:50] comment like are there it might be nice to know if there are smaller parcels

[2:07:56] uh that could still see some kind of park development um but are not

[2:08:01] highlighted there. Uh and then the other thing is um kind of coming back to a

[2:08:06] comment that council member Heftter made in the the first section of the meeting

[2:08:10] today. um you know like we're expecting to see residential development in

[2:08:15] various places in the city and it might be nice to say something about having

[2:08:20] park facilities in those places uh on that map. Um

[2:08:26] okay. Um

[2:08:33] Okay. Um maybe I have one more comment um about the golf course. Um

[2:08:42] there was I don't know maybe maybe this didn't come out in the community

[2:08:46] feedback but there was nothing that sort of addressed like the golf course as a

[2:08:50] municipal golf course or or not very directly I felt like and I was just

[2:08:55] wondering like did we did we get any feedback about like you know this being

[2:09:01] the community's golf course a municipal golf course rather than some other type

[2:09:06] of golf course and I don't know if that came through or not um I thought it

[2:09:11] might be interesting if there were something around that. Um

[2:09:19] okay. Yeah, those are some comments. Um I

[2:09:22] think that's all for now.

[2:09:29] » Mayor, if I may. >> Yes.

[2:09:30] » Um comments. Thank you, Sam. It's important

[2:09:36] to reflect that um you know as these comments are made, we take these unless

[2:09:43] we hear otherwise as direction from all of council that you want us to make

[2:09:47] these changes. And so it's helpful as these comments come up to get

[2:09:51] clarification from council as to is there a majority support for some of

[2:09:57] these requests? uh because the next steps would be for Adam and Brian to

[2:10:02] take this and then make these modifications.

[2:10:05] And also um you know, we we appreciate these comments. I think that's part of

[2:10:10] the direction that they're looking for tonight as well as as we obtain

[2:10:15] additional public comment, as we obtain additional council comments, because

[2:10:18] you'll continue to review these and have comments like how do you want us to take

[2:10:22] this in? And if if staff's goal is to bring this back in October, is that a

[2:10:28] realistic goal or do we need to take these comments,

[2:10:33] bring it back again because there's probably going to be additional comments

[2:10:36] and then say where are we drawing the line on this or are we just bringing

[2:10:40] this forward as the best bet of what it reflects from a community standpoint and

[2:10:46] then also from a council standpoint. And then just one other thing that I really

[2:10:50] want to to highlight and um Brian if you could go back to this slide the plan

[2:10:55] intent. Um

[2:10:59] the intent of this was to gather input, establish direction and set priorities.

[2:11:03] As we've noted, we've had tremendous community input on this. We'll continue

[2:11:07] to have community input on this. Um this is as much as this has been an outward-f

[2:11:12] facing process. this once this is moves forward, it's going to be more of an

[2:11:18] inwardfacing implementation document. And so, you

[2:11:23] know, staff wants to make sure that it represents council and the community's

[2:11:26] priorities because it is it really is going to be a great decision tool. And

[2:11:32] some of the things that we talked about like yesterday is as we receive requests

[2:11:37] from individuals like for specific recreational amenity and you might get,

[2:11:42] you know, sick people that submit an email to council, but when you look at

[2:11:46] the survey results, we received two survey results for that item, but we

[2:11:49] received a thousand results for another item. That helps council and staff um

[2:11:54] determine what projects move forward. And to council member Hefner's point,

[2:12:00] um, you know, this document, while initially intended may have been to

[2:12:06] outline more details related to projects,

[2:12:09] I think we're at a good point. I trust staff to take this the next step in

[2:12:14] terms of development of project, particularly with the challenges that we

[2:12:17] have with our budget and the CIP and capital funding and figuring out

[2:12:22] prioritization based upon the funding available. I would not um while the

[2:12:28] consultant is helpful, I would not rely on the consultant to make those

[2:12:32] recommendations or decisions. I would rely on staff to do that. And so I just

[2:12:37] want to say that um I I'm very appreciative of staff and how you've

[2:12:42] gotten it to this point. Um, and it is very valuable. And when I hear staff

[2:12:48] say, "This is what we need for the next 10 years to be able to operate this

[2:12:54] department and be able to present options to council that are supported by

[2:12:58] statistically valid information and supported by a lot of input from the

[2:13:02] community. That means a lot. And um, you know, I I

[2:13:10] truly appreciate all the effort. I appreciate council's input on this. I

[2:13:14] appreciate the public comments and as you noted, tonight is not adoption. We

[2:13:19] will continue to make these changes, but it is important for staff to understand

[2:13:25] what are the specifics of what you would like to see in the next round that comes

[2:13:29] forward so that we're making sure that we're using our time most effectively.

[2:13:33] Thank you. >> Um, you anticipated me. I haven't made

[2:13:39] my comments yet and I want to try to bring together and try to summarize some

[2:13:44] of the things that I hear so that we can move forward and answer some of the

[2:13:50] questions that you've raised manager because I I think those are really

[2:13:54] important particularly pra practical questions about how we proceed. Um I I

[2:14:02] really wholeheartedly think of of council member Cooperman's

[2:14:08] just uh um observations and recommendations are terrific

[2:14:16] and um maybe to the point I I think part of this is that is difficult is what's

[2:14:25] always difficult in this which is the level of specificity

[2:14:29] and the level of generality that we bring to this. Um, and you know, almost

[2:14:35] all of the comments, uh, you know, kind of wrestled with that. Um, I I I agree

[2:14:42] especially with if we can kind of clean up the many different descriptions

[2:14:49] and reference points of um planning strategies, goal,

[2:14:54] priorities, challenges, strategy, you know, next steps. It I think it'll read

[2:15:00] better for the public, for us. I think we can uh that'll provide a good lens in

[2:15:08] in which to see this in a way that I think it's harder now. Um I don't think

[2:15:15] you know I'm mindful of the timing in the process because we're not going to

[2:15:20] redo all this. We're just not. And this is a and not nobody's suggesting that. I

[2:15:27] mean, uh, I saw your eyes get very big there for a second, Adam. Um, we're not

[2:15:33] going to do that. We don't have the resources, but we have an extraordinary

[2:15:37] product to work with. These are, in my mind, the things I'm talking about are

[2:15:41] tweaks. And frankly, I don't think I've heard anything from any council member

[2:15:46] that is uh anything. But um I I think from my perspective it may be

[2:15:55] good to distinguish more between

[2:15:59] um the policy direction and the more granular projects. Um I don't know how

[2:16:06] you do that. I don't know that you necessarily want to put them in a you

[2:16:10] know in an appendex. I that may be too much. But I think linking them to the

[2:16:16] goals and and linking them to the public comment a little bit more tightly will

[2:16:24] be, you know, a I think a better result at least for me. um

[2:16:32] on on parks particularly it it would be nice uh as I think was mentioned to

[2:16:39] think about have some information reference to the kinds of things that

[2:16:45] we've we've uh decided or um the direction we gave in the comp plan we

[2:16:53] know certain parts of the city particularly west of Mccasin are going

[2:16:57] to develop over some period of time or at least we believe that it will and we

[2:17:02] certainly are encouraging that but it might be nice to understand you know

[2:17:08] some thoughts on that and how at least have it referenced so it's not out there

[2:17:14] um and you know to uh Matt Jones point

[2:17:20] before I think it's always critical to be looking at what I call the guiding

[2:17:26] star which is the uh charter I I don't think anybody disagrees with that. And I

[2:17:31] do believe that staff has done a a good job with that. I think it may uh based

[2:17:37] on what you've heard may be worth fleshing out a little bit more. Um I'm

[2:17:42] not going to try editing any of that and I'll leave that to staff's good

[2:17:48] judgment. Um, I really do appreciate the degree to which you've worked with so

[2:17:54] many different boards, commissions, people, uh, you know, in all of the

[2:18:01] public engagement. And I think we just need to to bring that out. Um,

[2:18:07] I think to summarize,

[2:18:11] um, and I would like some feedback on these, um, because they are they're

[2:18:18] different points, right? They're not I I didn't hear a lot of conflict. You may

[2:18:24] disagree with me on the level of specificity. We may disagree a little

[2:18:28] bit on that. Um, I think there were some just questions about uh how the document

[2:18:36] is written which I think you've taken in and I don't know the are going to be

[2:18:41] really things that we really need to debate too much here. I think all of the

[2:18:46] comments that were made about um you know a revision of it were were pretty

[2:18:52] good in in terms of just language and organization.

[2:18:57] Um uh

[2:19:01] you know I I think um

[2:19:06] one thing I certainly heard was the need to establish connections between

[2:19:14] um the a little bit better than than perhaps was done between um the

[2:19:21] vegetation survey and the the open space app

[2:19:28] um and um address you know perhaps a little bit more what the decisions were

[2:19:37] internally to get to that point. Um uh I think we talked a little bit about

[2:19:43] you know parks where parks might be uh built. I think we talked a bit um

[2:19:52] about maintenance. I I heard that coming particularly from council member um

[2:19:59] Dickinson um that it's really important to address

[2:20:04] um and maintain what we have and do it well. Um

[2:20:10] I I don't think it ought to be in there in the language, but don't screw it up.

[2:20:14] It is not a bad thing. We've got a really good um sense of I think we've

[2:20:22] done pretty well on open space and there's a lot of there's some

[2:20:26] disagreements around that but I do think um we need to build we are building on

[2:20:32] that and I do appreciate uh affirming that. Um,

[2:20:39] a couple of other um

[2:20:45] things. Um, and I may have mentioned this, but just

[2:20:49] sort of the the distinguishing between policy areas that council

[2:20:57] really needs in there and has talked about

[2:21:01] as opposing

[2:21:06] as a main issue. I mean, we're going to be adopting the whole thing. So I I

[2:21:11] don't want to minimize but I think distinguishing

[2:21:14] um the major policy goals from uh the more granular projects and so

[2:21:21] forth is something I've heard from several folks. Um

[2:21:29] let's see those are those are the main things that

[2:21:34] I've heard but I am I don't first I don't know there any people agree with

[2:21:41] the way I've the ones that I've stated are should be in there, but two whether

[2:21:47] I've left something out. Yeah. >> Council.

[2:21:52] » Yeah. So, I guess I think about it in a slightly different way. Um,

[2:21:59] which is it's been, you know, the better part of two years of engagement. I am

[2:22:04] reluctant to insert ourselves directly into the editing process. I I think this

[2:22:09] is all in my view this is all useful feedback um to staff and they should

[2:22:15] sort of think about it and chew on it and consider whether it it makes sense

[2:22:19] and whether there's sufficient remaining resources to accomplish the feedback if

[2:22:24] it does make sense. Um I I don't know that I'm especially comfortable sort of

[2:22:29] directing fine grain adjustments at this point and and the one that I think I

[2:22:36] the most of them I don't necessarily object to. I just don't want to sort of

[2:22:39] write from the dis. The one I do think might be a problem is sort of

[2:22:44] substantial reorganization to try and collapse the recommendations and

[2:22:48] opportunities and all, you know, action items into a more better organized

[2:22:54] format. Like that would be nice, but as I understand it, we've run through

[2:22:59] almost all of our $400,000 budget for this. And I I don't want to send a

[2:23:04] consultant back to rewrite the whole report to organize it differently. Um,

[2:23:10] even though I mean I I think I share the quibble about I, you know, council

[2:23:13] member Coopermanman said it very well that there's like a lot of different

[2:23:16] action items and recommendations and things sort of scattered about and it's

[2:23:21] difficult to follow them. I I also don't know if it's the best use of our

[2:23:26] remaining dollars to try and fix that. So,

[2:23:30] back to sort of the the bigger picture, uh, my preference would be to let staff

[2:23:35] continue through the remaining engagement window. consider this input

[2:23:39] as part of that engagement window. Um, and then I I I really don't know and

[2:23:46] others may feel differently like I don't know that I necessarily want to adopt

[2:23:49] this as a council plan per se. I I think maybe we receive it as like you know the

[2:23:56] plan the plan that we have um we receive it from staff and say this is this is

[2:24:02] good work and important work that you'll be able to use in the future. But I

[2:24:06] don't know if I'm at the point where I want to, you know, sort of do a

[2:24:08] resolution saying this this is the plan for the city. Um, and so in that vein, I

[2:24:14] I'd prefer to let staff just continue doing the engagement they've done.

[2:24:19] » Let me clarify one thing. Just I said I I think I'm not interested in the staff

[2:24:26] doing a rewrite either, and I'm not sure council member Coopermanman was. Um but

[2:24:33] you know these are I think suggestions. There's a few suggestions. Um and

[2:24:40] certainly the budget for this is we don't want to blow it. We've already

[2:24:44] spent plenty of that. We don't have very much left. Um and we do you know we

[2:24:50] trust you in terms of taking the input that you've had and you decide what you

[2:24:56] want to do with it. Um I think the the suggestions have been useful but um and

[2:25:03] I I think it's interesting it's an interesting question about

[2:25:07] whether we adopted or not. I I'm

[2:25:14] um these it includes policy level um recommendations and I think not to um

[2:25:23] not to adopt some form of it is uh

[2:25:29] I think a real problem. I I understood that there may be parts of it that you

[2:25:35] don't want to adopt, but I mean I I think that's what staff has presented,

[2:25:41] what we have directed them to come up with the has been spent in terms of the

[2:25:45] consultant and the public process. I think it would be irresponsible

[2:25:51] not to see that process through. Um but um

[2:25:59] anyway, I'll I'll leave others to kind of debate that, but I it's an it's an

[2:26:04] important point. I just uh I think what it may augur for is more time for staff

[2:26:11] to work on things as much as they expect as opposed to trying to push this too

[2:26:17] fast you know to the October deadline which I don't know is a you know it's

[2:26:24] not a hard and fast deadline especially given

[2:26:29] you know the time that has been spent but others

[2:26:35] Yes, ment >> I have a question for my W three team

[2:26:40] member. Um, help me to understand from your point of view

[2:26:47] the difference between adopting it as for council adopting it versus it being

[2:26:54] a staff document. Walk me through that. >> Yeah. So I mean I I think of it as are

[2:27:00] we signing off sort of that these are the right set of recommendations and

[2:27:05] priorities that have been sort of informed by our

[2:27:10] input and at least what I'm looking at

[2:27:13] especially with respect to the long range plan less so with respect to the

[2:27:16] trails plan it's it's more of just a sort of a summary of a lot of

[2:27:21] information and so to sign off on it as a plan and

[2:27:26] thinking about 10 years into the future when most of us, probably all of us,

[2:27:29] won't be sitting here and some proposal comes forward and it's

[2:27:33] like, well, that's in the plan. We should go do it. Um, there's like this

[2:27:38] plan could justify almost any idea. It's it just speaks in such broad

[2:27:44] generalities that I would rather have it as a as a tool than a plan. And maybe

[2:27:48] it's just a semantics thing. Um, I think about like for example the the

[2:27:54] police strategic document that was presented to us which was really a

[2:27:58] police department ideas that weren't substantially

[2:28:03] informed by us on a policy basis. It was just sort of brought to us as here's

[2:28:08] some ideas we have and we're presenting it to you and um this is all interesting

[2:28:12] information. And I think we heard it and said that's great. we've received your

[2:28:16] strategic document, but I don't think we adopted that as our plan. Um, I think I

[2:28:22] think we did a similar thing with the sustainability plan where there was some

[2:28:25] question about does this really reflect the sort of costbenefit analysis we were

[2:28:30] interested in. Um, and I think we received it but didn't necessarily adopt

[2:28:34] it as a formal plan. I may be misremembering that, but I know there

[2:28:37] was discussion. Um or maybe it was the decar plan,

[2:28:41] » the community decar. >> Community decar plan. Um

[2:28:47] and so to me, like I think this these documents have a lot of value in so far

[2:28:52] as they're informative. I think they have a lot of value in so far as the

[2:28:56] information is persuasive, but as I I think of a plan as something different,

[2:29:01] like here's how we're going to go about our business. This is what we intend to

[2:29:05] do. um you know and even the best laid plans you end up doing something

[2:29:09] different but I don't see this like we I don't see this as something we could

[2:29:13] just say okay let's go execute the plan um because to the level of generality

[2:29:20] thing it's just a lot of it's a there's a lot of plans to make a plan there's a

[2:29:26] lot of best management practices uh there's a lot of things we're already

[2:29:30] doing but I don't see sort of a an actionable

[2:29:35] set of priorities and I I also you know to the extent I had comments earlier I

[2:29:39] just don't see those comments really reflected

[2:29:45] » others council fee

[2:29:50] » I'm wondering about the same kind of thing um and instead of calling it our

[2:29:56] long range plan we could just call it our guide book our

[2:30:02] pros guide book for what we would like to see but it there is no requirement

[2:30:09] there's no timeline there's and it's up for discussion and changes

[2:30:15] at any point >> that's a long title

[2:30:21] » um others

[2:30:26] » yes may >> so I'm I'm I would like to hear from the

[2:30:32] city manager and other staff about um council member

[2:30:39] Hefner's thoughts around adoption versus um not.

[2:30:46] » So, Adam, are you okay with me taking this first?

[2:30:50] » Okay. Um I think if council chooses not to adopt

[2:30:56] it, it's going to create confusion within the community as to whether or

[2:30:59] not this is council supported.

[2:31:07] We have other plans within the city that are not council adopted. There's a storm

[2:31:11] water plan as you know there's the decarb plan. But I think that that has

[2:31:16] also created questions within the community of like well you created this

[2:31:20] plan but why didn't council adopt is this your official plan or is this just

[2:31:26] staff's plan? and some fresh staff. I think it'll be confusing too because as

[2:31:31] there's um inquiries from the community or we are uh referencing this plan to

[2:31:37] say why we're not putting something forward as a recommendation then that

[2:31:41] could be challenged in terms of well this wasn't adopted by council so does

[2:31:44] this represent council's feelings on this too. Um

[2:31:50] you know so that's Adam do you have anything to add on that or Samma as

[2:31:54] well?

[2:32:01] I would add that I think while I respect the comments, I think that from a staff

[2:32:07] perspective, there is specificity in the draft. I

[2:32:12] think we've heard that there's a desire to tie more specificity

[2:32:17] into the final product to kind of align with where we got from a scope of work

[2:32:21] or maybe be more clear. Um, we're we're big fans of the matrix. I think the

[2:32:28] matrix can be refined. It's specifically outlining what we consider to be the

[2:32:33] goals and future action items with priority listing of where that would

[2:32:38] fall based on available resources. Um, you know, I also I also think to the

[2:32:45] point earlier that I was I was going to chime in on, I think there's real

[2:32:49] validity to the comments we've heard tonight about making it easier to read.

[2:32:54] And I think that's really helpful for us. I don't think we have to rewrite it

[2:32:58] to reformat it in a way that combines four or five of those areas of focus

[2:33:03] into more of the executive summary upfront. Here's what this is going to

[2:33:06] say. And then you get into the charts and the graphs and the other things

[2:33:09] behind it. Um, so that's that's fine. Um, you know, for for me I I I think it

[2:33:16] may be a bit of semantics, but I do think to city manager's point

[2:33:22] there and and in our industry, right? So I'm just speaking for how other

[2:33:26] communities go about doing this process with people in my role sitting in this

[2:33:30] chair is there is real there's real value to adopting

[2:33:35] the document from a support standpoint from a you know I think it can be

[2:33:40] anecdotal it can have comments that are associated with it about interpretation

[2:33:45] um it's it's similar to the resolution that accompanies parks and recreation

[2:33:51] month for example and and aligning with that designation I think it kind of

[2:33:55] reinforces to staff and to the mayor's point

[2:33:59] earlier about the level of community engagement even exceeding that of the

[2:34:03] city's 20-year plan. Um the the value of that community's input through the

[2:34:11] adoption process. That being all said, we're here to serve at the pleasure of

[2:34:15] the council and the city manager. And so if it's supported and it's

[2:34:20] » Yeah. Yeah. I would support director Black and Manager Langley as well in

[2:34:23] that it's really helpful for us as staff to have council adopting these because

[2:34:28] we we have clarity for the community for staff in what council supports. Now,

[2:34:32] these plans are living breathing things and I think that Brian has done a really

[2:34:36] good job of explaining that this will continue to breathe. I recognize that

[2:34:40] some of these things are subject to appropriations, right? We can't do all

[2:34:45] of these things all the time, but this will help guide staff when they're

[2:34:49] bringing forward CIPs, when they're balancing projects, and knowing what the

[2:34:52] community has decided as a priority. And having that council support and

[2:34:56] community support through this robust process and the board and commission

[2:34:59] support really helps them use this as a tool to do all of those things.

[2:35:05] » Thank you. That's um very helpful. I I hear Council Member Hefner's concerns

[2:35:14] and comments. My takeaway is

[2:35:18] it's really important that it's an adopted document.

[2:35:23] I really don't have any interest in workshopping tonight with council what

[2:35:27] the title is or what we're going to call it or anything, but I think maybe you

[2:35:33] all can take that offline um and maybe workshop it a little bit,

[2:35:39] but I hear you that what I'm hearing is it's really important that it's an

[2:35:44] adopted document is what I'm hearing. So, thank you for enlightening me on

[2:35:50] your thoughts and staff for for sharing your thoughts on that as well.

[2:35:54] » Others who haven't spoken.

[2:35:58] » Yes, Council Member Kern. >> So, can do you mind if I like segue off

[2:36:03] of this for a moment and just go to actually something that's in here

[2:36:06] combining trails and the guide book? Thank you. Is that okay? So, one of the

[2:36:13] things that you guys had mentioned in here was providing trail connections to

[2:36:18] parks, and there is one map that has uh like the parks numbered so that it's

[2:36:25] easier to see where they are on the map and then have a reference sheet. is

[2:36:30] would it be helpful or is it possible because I I would find it helpful if one

[2:36:35] of those trails plans actually had these numbered 34 parks with it so we could

[2:36:42] see where those connections were. And you it mentions I think throughout

[2:36:48] because I I I agree actually with Council Member Heapner. I really um

[2:36:52] think that the the trails guide book is particularly well put together. Um, but

[2:36:58] that was the one thing that I went I was going back and forth between the two

[2:37:02] plans to try to match that up and thought maybe I'm missing something and

[2:37:06] I would just bring it up with you guys. You had said like take a little you

[2:37:10] asked us the other day like look at it in a little bit more detail and I

[2:37:13] realized oh that that is the one thing I couldn't find. So um I appreciate that.

[2:37:17] Thank you for the indulgence.

[2:37:22] Anybody else who hasn't? >> Unless of course nobody agrees and then

[2:37:25] they should not listen to me at all.

[2:37:35] » Yeah, I don't think you have actually on this issue.

[2:37:39] » Um I don't know. I mean,

[2:37:42] I guess we never maybe made it explicit in our previous conversations, but I um

[2:37:50] I I just sort of assumed all along that we would eventually this would come to

[2:37:55] us and we would vote on whether or not to adopt it. Um

[2:38:00] so, um

[2:38:05] I don't know. I I I do like the sort of the certainty that uh a formal adoption

[2:38:10] would give to staff. Um I think um I don't know, maybe I just need to

[2:38:17] think a little bit more about um that question, but I at the moment I I do

[2:38:22] think it would be helpful to our staff if we considered it for adoption.

[2:38:32] » I agree. I think that uh staff needs the assurance that uh we're supporting what

[2:38:39] they've done and the public needs to know that we're supporting what the

[2:38:45] staff has done. So I would also support um

[2:38:50] supporting the long range plan.

[2:38:58] Um, I I guess I want to I want to push this a bit because I'm

[2:39:06] very concerned about where we are right now. I think we can take a vote about

[2:39:11] how we do it. We've given direction on this

[2:39:16] uh for some time now. There could be a question of course whether you followed

[2:39:22] the direction or not. Uh I happen to think you did. Um generally there's

[2:39:28] things that we all u disagree, you know, probably disagree with. It sounds like

[2:39:34] the trails plan. Everybody I haven't heard anybody complain about that. So

[2:39:39] that one it would be awfully odd in my view to accept the trails plan or and

[2:39:46] and not do the same with the pros plan. I think it would be equally bizarre to

[2:39:52] all agree on the trails plan and not adopt it. But um how much have we spent

[2:39:58] on this? What is the budget for it and how much have we spent?

[2:40:02] » It's a $400,000 total budget, 300 for the long range plan, 100 for the trails.

[2:40:08] We have 14,000 remaining in contingency and 5,000 contractually obligated.

[2:40:14] » I mean, when I say it's irresponsible, I that's what I mean. I can't imagine

[2:40:20] anything I I certainly haven't done anything in for in 14 years on council

[2:40:28] where we had an idea and and I don't think there was any question that we

[2:40:33] were headed toward adoption where we just said a month left to go

[2:40:41] maybe not. Um I I do think that that you know among other things it leaves staff

[2:40:47] out to dry but I also think more importantly because we are deciding how

[2:40:53] to move forward um I just don't think that's a a very

[2:40:58] wise thing um on there you know I can speak to one thing that council member

[2:41:06] Hefner mentioned the I think I think it was mentioned about well the the the

[2:41:13] sustainability action plan or at least that was kind of the illusion. I think

[2:41:19] the sustainability action plan was adopted by council because I did it. It

[2:41:23] was part of that. Um and when we've changed it, it was changed by council.

[2:41:29] So um you know others the transportation plan I mean you know go on and on about

[2:41:36] the plans that we've had. Now you can distinguish between them. I I suppose I

[2:41:42] my view is fix it. Don't mix it.

[2:41:48] I don't think it's good to throw the baby out with a bath water. Not at this

[2:41:52] point. Go ahead. So, mayor, if to to try to move this along,

[2:41:58] um what I'm hearing, so there's some specific recommendations for map

[2:42:03] changes, clarification on the map, trying to make some connections between

[2:42:08] um the action items, priorities, and the public input, refining the executive

[2:42:13] summary to make it more robust. Move the matrix up to the executive summary to

[2:42:17] identify um these action items. look at nomenclature to see if we can try to

[2:42:22] kind of make it more condensed or um easier to read. Um I think those things

[2:42:28] are all achievable. Um to address some of of council member Hefner's concerns,

[2:42:35] I would like to take a step. We have a CIP meeting um in September um where

[2:42:42] we're going to do further refinement of the CIP. We have a meeting I believe

[2:42:46] this week with pros related to CIP. I would like to take a step to let us kind

[2:42:51] of work through the CIP and see if we can't somehow make a connection with

[2:42:56] that. Um, so you can see that we are taking this plan and implementing it,

[2:43:02] applying it to the CIP. Um, it may not be part of the document, but you can see

[2:43:07] how we're applying it. And then so just leaves a couple of specific items that

[2:43:12] that I need direction on to move forward. One being specific to trail 18.

[2:43:17] So if you remember as part of the comp plan process there was conversations

[2:43:22] there was input received related to this good hue ditch trail connection which is

[2:43:26] trail 18. So I pulled up the comp plan um one of the figures and it says uh

[2:43:32] good hu ditch trail connection is conceptual only future evaluation will

[2:43:36] occur outside this plan eg trails master plan and will consider ecological

[2:43:41] agricultural and legal constraints. So, the comp plan says that this trail

[2:43:48] um will be, you know, considered as part of the the trail's master plan. So we do

[2:43:55] need direction at some point as to if you would like to have this connection

[2:44:00] removed from the plan, if you would like further consideration of this trail 18,

[2:44:05] if you would like further clarification of the trail 18 to say, you know,

[2:44:10] additional feasibility studies will need to be required before um this is

[2:44:15] conceptual only. You know, kind of similar to the language that's in the

[2:44:19] comprehensive plan. So that's that's one of the specific items. Um,

[2:44:24] and then we've heard, you know, through some of the emails received today, we'll

[2:44:28] condense those. Um, give you some themes from the additional public comment

[2:44:32] that's received, note how we've addressed it. The other thing that I

[2:44:36] want to point out that I, you know, hear clear from council member Coopermanman

[2:44:40] in terms of this and some of others of you related to this open space map

[2:44:46] that's based upon a vegetation survey versus a map that is the actual um like

[2:44:51] council designated classifications. We can address that as well. And just to

[2:44:57] note that that's based upon a vegetation survey. So I think a lot of these things

[2:45:01] can be addressed. um we do need specific direction related to trail 18 and if you

[2:45:07] would um give us some time to go back and kind of digest all of these comments

[2:45:13] and come with a recommendation to move forward

[2:45:16] » if um the council is inclined to both give you the what you need and

[2:45:26] the staff to go back and do the reworking.

[2:45:30] that time is going to have to slip. I mean, based on where we set it, right?

[2:45:36] This is not going to get done or is >> I think it's to be determined. Okay.

[2:45:41] » Um, you know, some of this information exists already. And so, from a mapping

[2:45:46] perspective, it might be additional paragraph that's added to the map. Um,

[2:45:51] or it might be taking a map from another source. I'm looking to Adam and Brian. I

[2:45:55] think we need to have more conversation as to if this is going to make the

[2:45:59] timeline slip. Um, some of these things are pretty straightforward to address.

[2:46:04] Others we already knew were going to take a little bit more time in terms of

[2:46:07] moving u things into the executive summary. So I I would I wouldn't not

[2:46:13] ready to say that it's going to slip right now. We need to review it more.

[2:46:18] » It's fair enough. It's premature. That's what I'm hearing. Um

[2:46:25] well, why don't why don't we take the um the smaller, if you will, it depends

[2:46:31] whether it's a small or big issue, but it's not the the big issue that council

[2:46:36] member Hefner made. How do people feel about the uh that trail 18? Yes,

[2:46:44] » thank you. I think um there's a desire for from the community

[2:46:50] to have connection. Um and I would be in favor of of making

[2:46:57] sure it's clear like we did in the comp plan that it's conceptual and additional

[2:47:02] due diligence would need to be had before anything were to be implemented.

[2:47:06] But I do believe people want a connection between RTR and downtown and

[2:47:10] other places within our community. Council

[2:47:16] member. >> Yeah, I would agree, but I would I would

[2:47:18] also say that that includes 17, 18, and 19. All three of which are heading south

[2:47:24] and are in the like the the the uh necessary to be expanded and evaluated.

[2:47:31] I think all three could use greater evaluation as to the mayor prom's point

[2:47:35] um as we develop red tail and see where those needs really lie. It could be that

[2:47:41] it is greater access from a multi-use wide path along 42, quicker, easier to

[2:47:47] get to the hospital or the businesses or what have you versus a recreational

[2:47:51] trail. And I think that would be that would require a lot more evaluation than

[2:47:56] we should be doing tonight.

[2:48:03] Um, I mean the

[2:48:07] staff can correct me, but you know, the way that I look at that map with the

[2:48:11] possible future connections is like we went out to the community and we asked

[2:48:16] them where they want to see connections and then we tried to summarize that and

[2:48:20] this is the summary of that engagement. And so like I don't have any problem

[2:48:26] just showing that. I just would want to be very clear like this is the status of

[2:48:31] that map. Like these are th these are things that are ideas that our community

[2:48:35] had. Um but you know to move forward with any of them we'd have to go through

[2:48:40] that process of figuring out you know should you know should we actually go

[2:48:46] through with any of these council >> just to make that very clear

[2:48:50] » could I just could I just read from the plan and see if this solves the issue.

[2:48:55] Uh, the proposed trail improvements are for consideration purposes only, each of

[2:48:59] which will require further evaluation prior to final approval. All proposed

[2:49:04] trail system improvements will undergo a thorough staff review and city council

[2:49:08] approval prior to implementation. Evaluation criteria may include

[2:49:12] connectivity, safety, ecological protection, maintenance cost, and staff

[2:49:16] resource ability. >> That sounds good. Put that in there.

[2:49:19] » That seems like a seems like a good disclaimer to me. Does that solve your

[2:49:23] uh issue on that? Um to the larger point um I guess at this stage I mean I think

[2:49:29] we've had good discussion about whether to adopt

[2:49:34] uh this or whether we're heading to that direction whether people ultimately

[2:49:39] choose to vote for it or not. Um is the direction to bring back a plan? I

[2:49:48] mean, in terms of something council would adopt as opposed to just receive,

[2:49:58] » we are we going to vote on it and adopt it as a as

[2:50:01] » as mayor. Can I ask one clarifying question? I think also within

[2:50:07] » that conversation is the conversation for what

[2:50:10] » staff would be bringing back to you next as a whole. So based on the conversation

[2:50:15] tonight, is there a desire to have another bite at the draft apple or

[2:50:21] adoption or supporting or whatever we're going to call it when it gets to its

[2:50:24] final stage? Is there a stage that we should be considering that happens

[2:50:29] between that? >> I guess I had understood that we wanted

[2:50:34] to get it back, but um is that a hand up or is that a thumbs

[2:50:42] up? and a merit >> I think uh the city manager had proposed

[2:50:48] earlier that we continue on the path forward of adoption of a document and

[2:50:53] she's planning through CIP conversations to bring examples back to us of how the

[2:50:59] document is going to be used to plan um so that was my understanding of the path

[2:51:05] forward is we're still planning for adoption

[2:51:08] » as as opposed to bringing back one more and then making a final decision on

[2:51:14] adoption. >> Well, I think we are now blending

[2:51:17] together two separate things. So, the question you asked was, are we going to

[2:51:22] adopt the document or are we going to receive and file? And I think the city

[2:51:26] manager earlier had proposed we move forward with adoption because she thinks

[2:51:31] she can show us how it's being used as a plan through some CIP conversations with

[2:51:36] staff. And then Adam just director Blackmore just asked I think a separate

[2:51:41] question which is between that point and now is there another meeting where we

[2:51:47] want to go into more detail about the document so I think there's two right am

[2:51:52] I hearing there's two separate things here

[2:51:58] » put that way um first yeah go ahead

[2:52:04] » I'll just say on the on the second question for my money, the time is

[2:52:08] better spent um having staff continue the continue community engagement

[2:52:13] window, focus on that process. That that's who we really want to hear from.

[2:52:17] Um and I'm sure to the extent any of us have additional comments on the draft,

[2:52:21] we'll share those. But that that's just my view.

[2:52:26] » Yeah, go ahead. >> Yeah, I would support both adopting when

[2:52:30] we're done and uh not having another bite at the draft apple.

[2:52:41] Fair enough. I keep I I I keep trying to find places where you where staff might

[2:52:47] want another chance to come back. I I think that it sounds like

[2:52:52] we want to keep moving toward uh one to get the public input, two to keep

[2:52:59] working toward a draft that or a draft that we come back ultimately for

[2:53:05] adoption. Um and that

[2:53:10] you know we will see the changes after when we are on that path.

[2:53:17] Any thumbs up, thumbs down,

[2:53:21] » thumbs up, >> thumbs up.

[2:53:25] » Okay. Does staff have the direction that it

[2:53:30] needs?

[2:53:34] » I think so. >> Okay. But from our side,

[2:53:38] » we'll try to um incorporate some pretty intentional

[2:53:44] effort into when we provide that plan for adoption, how this feedback has been

[2:53:49] incorporated and we appreciate the comments.

[2:53:51] » Okay. If council members have additional

[2:53:55] thoughts they want to share with staff, fine. We'll have thoughts from the

[2:54:00] public most certainly and look forward to that good discussion. Um thanks

[2:54:08] uh for working through this with us. Tough discussion but a good one. Um

[2:54:15] right I think uh the next part is uh see

[2:54:21] appointment of council committee for potential amendments to city manager

[2:54:25] employment agreement. Um I think um those who are working on the

[2:54:33] uh evaluation of municipal judge and the prosecutor are um I venture to

[2:54:42] say not going to be those who work on this next

[2:54:46] » Mayor if I may yeah >> just make a brief presentation on what's

[2:54:50] in your packet here. So this is um staff requesting C is council to appoint two

[2:54:55] council members to serve on this committee to review and recommend

[2:54:58] council potential amendments the employment agreement for the city

[2:55:00] manager. As you pointed out this came up after the city manager's review which

[2:55:04] happened very recently and council directed staff to follow up. We do have

[2:55:08] two council members who have volunteered to be on this committee and that is

[2:55:12] Mayor Pertam Hamilton and council member Hefner. So if council is supportive they

[2:55:16] could make a simple motion to appoint these two to the committee.

[2:55:20] All right. I spoke too soon. Go ahead. Council,

[2:55:24] » I was just gonna say I'll make a motion. >> Okay.

[2:55:29] » Second. >> As long as they're willing.

[2:55:31] » Um, all in favor? >> I

[2:55:52] So moved that we journ second. >> I I

[2:56:04] fall apart in dry air and therefore needed to be used almost immediately

[2:56:08] after being mined. At first, the coal was only

City Council Meeting

Agenda

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