[0:00] Good evening. I would like to call the

[0:02] July 13, 2026 Hillyard City Council

[0:05] Committee of the Whole meeting to order.

[0:08] Would the clerk please call the role?

[0:10] >> Mr. Betts

[0:11] » Mr. Betts

[0:11] >> here.

[0:12] » here.

[0:12] >> Vice President Katon

[0:14] » Vice President Katon

[0:14] >> here.

[0:15] » here.

[0:15] >> Miss Parker Jones

[0:16] » Miss Parker Jones

[0:16] >> here.

[0:17] » here.

[0:17] >> Miss Razul

[0:18] » Miss Razul

[0:18] >> here.

[0:19] » here.

[0:19] >> Mr. Teter is excused. Miss Vermillion

[0:22] » Mr. Teter is excused. Miss Vermillion

[0:22] >> here.

[0:22] » here.

[0:22] >> And President Cole

[0:23] » And President Cole

[0:23] >> here. Council has copies of the June

[0:26] » here. Council has copies of the June

[0:26] 22nd, 2026 committee of the whole

[0:28] meeting minutes. Are there any changes

[0:30] or corrections?

[0:33] Hearing none, these minutes are approved

[0:34] as submitted. There's one item of

[0:36] business on tonight's agenda, which is

[0:38] an update and discussion on ebikes and e

[0:41] scooters. Um, with that, I'll turn it

[0:42] over to city manager Roush.

[0:44] >> Thank you, President Cole. We're going

[0:47] » Thank you, President Cole. We're going

[0:47] to get this presentation queued up here.

[0:49] I'm trying something a little bit

[0:50] different. I can drive if uh it's Nope,

[0:53] you're good. We're um I've used

[0:55] PowerPoint in the past, but this is a a

[0:57] different kind of a tool called Prey,

[0:59] which uh is a little bit more animated

[1:02] in some respects, but um I'll walk you

[1:05] through actually. Could you hit your

[1:07] escape key, please?

[1:09] Thank you.

[1:12] Let's go back here real quick.

[1:15] There we go. You got to get to the part

[1:17] that actually shows the title. So, um, I

[1:20] wanted to provide council and the public

[1:22] with just an update on sort of where we

[1:24] are in this conversation with respect to

[1:26] ebikes, ecooters, and let's say

[1:29] microobility devices. It's a pretty

[1:31] broad um, umbrella. So, of course, you

[1:34] know, just to help illustrate the point,

[1:35] we have here a picture of said example

[1:38] of said device uh, which is an e

[1:41] scooter. But I think the first and most

[1:43] important place to start in this

[1:44] conversation is to really define our

[1:46] terms. So there's a term all over our

[1:48] code, micromobility, and you'll see this

[1:51] term other places as well. And that

[1:53] immediately in my mind at least conjures

[1:55] questions like micro micro what? Because

[1:58] a micromobility device can uh

[2:01] encompasses a wide range of things with

[2:04] wheels. Some of them have pedals, some

[2:07] of them don't. Some of them require

[2:09] human power, some of them don't. and our

[2:13] um our staff and our attorneys uh in in

[2:16] consultation collaboration with other

[2:18] municipalities as well have helped to

[2:21] pull together a matrix of some examples

[2:23] of what these kinds of vehicles look

[2:25] like. And so to start out here, of

[2:27] course, we have the very familiar

[2:28] bicycle

[2:30] as well as a class one and two ebike,

[2:32] which those are the bikes that generally

[2:34] go less than 20 m an hour with a motor

[2:36] assist. A class 3 ebike uh generally

[2:39] will go up to I believe it's 28 m an

[2:42] hour. And then you have all sorts of

[2:44] other devices on wheels. Those could be

[2:45] skateboards, rollerblades, scooters,

[2:49] electric skateboards, electric versions

[2:51] of all of these things, golf carts, high

[2:54] and low speed, motorized bicycles and

[2:57] mopeds, miniature motorcycles. Uh we

[3:01] have here shared and rented microobility

[3:03] devices. If you've ever been, I think

[3:05] Cincinnati has some, the the Lime

[3:08] bicycles or I know out in DC they're

[3:09] popular as well. Personal assisted

[3:12] mobility devices, just the devices that

[3:14] folks are using to get around every day.

[3:16] And then I've got down here at the

[3:18] bottom things like Emotos, uh, which are

[3:21] available on Amazon, which are are kind

[3:23] of a, um, a not well-defined, uh, mashup

[3:28] of some of these things, too. You can go

[3:29] out and and buy them from Costco or

[3:31] Amazon, for example. Or another thing

[3:33] that's not listed here would be things

[3:34] like a hoverboard that have maybe one

[3:36] wheel or like a segue. You can rock them

[3:38] back and forth and go from there. I

[3:41] think the the main idea here though is

[3:43] that that's a lot of different kinds of

[3:45] vehicles and a lot of different

[3:47] permutations of wheels and motors and

[3:49] etc. that are all being used on our

[3:52] infrastructure. And so we have the I

[3:56] think the great advantage of living in a

[3:58] community that's been very diligent

[3:59] about building infrastructure for

[4:01] different kinds of uses. So everything

[4:03] from you know um nature trails. I have a

[4:07] couple from Hillyard proper but we have

[4:09] some nature trails, gravel trails,

[4:10] shared use paths. Uh this of course is a

[4:13] good example of some some kids riding in

[4:16] town. Some of these connect to parks

[4:18] like Hillyard Station Park. um other

[4:21] other folks are using bike lanes and

[4:23] shoulders of roads to commute to and

[4:25] from work. So you got a lot of different

[4:27] kinds of vehicles moving through and in

[4:31] our community on a lot of different

[4:32] kinds of infrastructure. And then we

[4:35] think about who's actually riding them

[4:37] and that's a lot of different kinds of

[4:39] people and a lot of different kinds of

[4:40] sets of circumstances. So, um, I was out

[4:44] actually Saturday. I went from my house

[4:46] down and just kind of went exploring a

[4:48] little bit and went all the way south

[4:50] and hopped into Columbus on Robert's

[4:52] Road. And so, you've got ballards and

[4:54] really protected lanes out there. But

[4:56] while I was out, I saw kids on scooters.

[4:59] I saw family cycling. Um, I saw folks

[5:02] running errands on on these kinds of

[5:04] devices, too. So, there's a lot of

[5:06] different contexts whether it's for

[5:08] exercise or recreation or trying to get

[5:10] to a place um or kids just out and about

[5:13] in the community that people are using

[5:16] these vehicles,

[5:18] which is sort of a long-winded way of

[5:20] saying this is a lot of stuff being used

[5:22] throughout the community in a lot of

[5:25] different ways. And so when we tend to

[5:28] hear feedback about this issue, we tend

[5:30] to hear that feedback from a wide

[5:32] variety of angles

[5:34] um about, you know, how people are using

[5:36] it and and then generally what the some

[5:40] questions about what the current rules

[5:41] and regulations about these vehicles

[5:43] are. So I want to give staff a lot of

[5:45] credit. Andrea and her team, Lety, Dan,

[5:48] Chief, um, everybody's been kind of

[5:50] knocking their heads together trying to

[5:52] kind of sort of synthesize on some level

[5:55] what the current rules and regulations

[5:57] say when it comes to these vehicles and

[5:59] how they should be used in the

[6:01] community. And Community Relations built

[6:04] a little web page, and if folks haven't

[6:06] seen it yet, it's right under the um the

[6:09] big menu under residents, there's ebike

[6:12] safety down here. Uh but in a nutshell,

[6:15] the goal of creating this web page was

[6:18] to just sort of outline a snapshot about

[6:20] currently speaking in our current codes

[6:23] and ordinances and how those intersect

[6:24] with state law today,

[6:27] what kind of are the rules about how

[6:29] these can be operated and where. So I

[6:31] won't go through and read you this

[6:33] entire web page, but I'll kind of hit

[6:34] some of the highlights here very

[6:35] quickly, which is that um there are

[6:38] multiple sections of our code that

[6:40] address where and how these vehicles can

[6:42] be used. One of the most um one one of

[6:46] the bigger sections I should say is

[6:47] chapter 373 which involves the traffic

[6:50] code and there's a whole section about

[6:52] ebikes, mopeds, scooters and these kinds

[6:54] of of vehicles. There are other sections

[6:56] of our code that talk about specifically

[6:58] with parks and how these things can be

[7:00] used in parks. But for the time being, I

[7:03] think it's instructive to just kind of

[7:04] look at the traffic code pieces of this

[7:07] and to think about how the traffic code

[7:10] currently defines them. So, we just

[7:12] talked about what a broad spectrum of

[7:13] vehicles this can include. Um, our

[7:16] definitions tend to focus on ebikes and

[7:19] then other microobility devices, if you

[7:21] will. So, we we follow the same

[7:25] classification structure as the state.

[7:26] So, everything from a class one to a

[7:28] class 3 ebike. um other a a any other

[7:32] vehicle um is a it is a low-speed

[7:35] micromobility device if it weighs less

[7:37] than 100 lb, if it has handlebars, and

[7:40] if it's propelled uh by a motor or human

[7:42] power. But you'll notice like even in

[7:44] that definition, the requirement that it

[7:46] has handlebars sort of excludes some of

[7:48] the vehicles that we've talked about or

[7:50] that we've seen out in the community.

[7:52] So, I think there are opportunities

[7:53] coming our way to look at this

[7:55] definition and how we're defining things

[7:57] that are maybe a little bit more

[7:58] encompassing than what's currently in

[8:00] the code.

[8:02] As far as where folks can ride, the the

[8:05] main idea here is that class one and two

[8:08] ebikes, which if you will are the slower

[8:10] versions, um can go on streets and they

[8:13] can also go on shared use paths. If you

[8:15] go if you have a fast ebike, a class 3

[8:17] that can go up to 28 miles an hour, you

[8:20] can keep th you can ride those on

[8:21] streets and shared use paths, but that's

[8:24] where some of our extra requirements

[8:25] start to kick in. You're supposed to be

[8:27] 16. You're supposed to wear a helmet um

[8:29] because the bike can do more.

[8:33] You um are currently allowed to ride on

[8:35] sidewalks if your motor is not engaged.

[8:38] And um and as far as that you excuse me

[8:41] as far as the other regulations here go

[8:43] um the generally speaking ebikes,

[8:46] scooters, motorized vehicles are

[8:49] prohibited in parks including Hillary

[8:52] Hillyard Station Park and first

[8:53] responders park um unless you are in a

[8:56] bike lane. So if you're in HSP, you're

[8:58] supposed to basically stay in that bike

[9:00] lane as you're progressing through.

[9:03] Again, the only age and helmet

[9:04] requirement that we have right now to

[9:05] speak of is being 16 to operate a class

[9:08] 3 ebike and that you have to wear a

[9:11] helmet. But I will say that throughout

[9:13] this code, if you go through and look at

[9:15] it, there are all sorts of reminders

[9:19] candidly throughout the code that riders

[9:21] have responsibilities as well. So,

[9:22] you're allowed to take these vehicles

[9:24] out onto certain kinds of

[9:25] infrastructure, but you're supposed to

[9:26] be yielding to pedestrians. You're not

[9:28] supposed to be riding dangerously. So,

[9:31] at night, um, you know, or like trying

[9:33] to get too close to people, u, you're

[9:35] supposed to yield to pedestrians, those

[9:37] sorts of things. If you're riding

[9:39] recklessly or unsafeely, the code

[9:41] already provides that we can stop you,

[9:44] intervene, have a conversation, and talk

[9:46] about how you may be violating the

[9:47] current code.

[9:49] Um,

[9:51] so one of the things that we have done

[9:53] to try to remind folks about what the

[9:55] current rules are is to replace some of

[9:59] the signs out at at Hillyard Station

[10:01] Park. And here's a good example of a of

[10:03] a snapshot of one of those signs that

[10:04] was replaced.

[10:06] Um, we have taken some other steps that

[10:09] I'll get to here in just a couple of

[10:10] minutes. But the main idea is we're

[10:13] trying to create an awareness,

[10:14] especially at Hillyard Station Park and

[10:16] at first responders, that splash pads,

[10:18] for example, are not the intended

[10:21] infrastructure for scooters. Um, trying

[10:24] to create those spaces where pedestrians

[10:26] can congregate and feel safe in those

[10:29] areas without having people buzz

[10:31] through, buzz by, or otherwise create

[10:33] disturbances.

[10:37] So, I'm going to come back to this web

[10:38] page here in just a second, but this uh

[10:41] we have some feedback here that we'll

[10:43] get to, but I think the main idea is

[10:45] that reflecting on sort of what that

[10:47] current code says today, I think it

[10:50] captures pieces of what vehicles are out

[10:53] there and where they can ride, but it's

[10:54] not necessarily as encompassing as maybe

[10:58] um it could be, especially given where

[11:00] the market's going and how many of these

[11:02] vehicles come and go for sale on the

[11:05] internet and everything else.

[11:09] Give me one second here. All right. When

[11:12] we think about who's using these and

[11:14] where and in what context, anecdotally,

[11:19] um I will I would submit that a lot of

[11:21] the feedback that we get about improper

[11:24] usage tends to be on in the younger

[11:26] crowd. in the crowd that's out kind of

[11:29] out of the house, you know, especially

[11:31] now that it's summertime. Um, they're

[11:33] out visiting the parks. They're doing

[11:35] other things. They're using this, yes,

[11:36] to get from point A to point B. But a

[11:39] lot of the behaviors that I that we have

[11:41] heard about or I should say I've heard

[11:42] about have tended to involve, you know,

[11:44] somebody younger than 18 who's just

[11:46] getting too close to infants and

[11:48] toddlers on splash pads. Um, or who is

[11:51] who's maybe not paying as much attention

[11:53] as they should on a sidewalk and getting

[11:54] too close to somebody who's coming out

[11:56] of a business. those sorts of things. I

[11:59] don't know that the issue has been with

[12:01] commuters as much or with uh folks out

[12:05] uh you know wearing the Lycra trying to

[12:06] bust out miles on a on a weekend ride.

[12:09] Um certainly you know um interactions

[12:13] happen between all of these groups and

[12:15] pedestrians and other users of trails

[12:17] and the roadway. Um, but anecdotally,

[12:20] most of the feedback I think that we've

[12:21] gotten in the last since I've been here

[12:23] the last couple of months has been about

[12:25] the kids.

[12:27] So, what do we do about that? First

[12:29] thing is we replaced all the signs in

[12:31] Hillary Station Park. As I said, um, the

[12:34] police department has two SRO's who have

[12:37] been on bike patrols all summer long,

[12:39] and we've had a concerted effort of

[12:41] trying to engage with the kids out on

[12:44] these devices as we've seen them. Uh, I

[12:47] want to give Rita's a shout out because

[12:49] they gave us several hundred coupons. It

[12:51] was 500 plus um that we meaning the

[12:55] police department and some staff in R&P

[12:58] have proactively passed out to kids on

[13:01] these devices who've demonstrated good

[13:03] responsible behavior. We've passed out

[13:05] all the coupons that we were given. So,

[13:08] we've done quite a lot of engagement on

[13:10] the on the carrot end of things just to

[13:12] try to visit, remind, educate um what

[13:15] good writership looks like and how to

[13:18] operate on this infrastructure in a way

[13:20] that's responsible and doesn't make

[13:21] people feel uneasy.

[13:24] At the same time, one of the ordinances

[13:26] that will come before you this evening

[13:27] for a first reading uh involves some

[13:30] very straightforward changes that we

[13:32] could make to the code to chapter 373

[13:35] that I think are a first cut at um at

[13:39] trying to get ahead of this issue in a

[13:41] way that will let us be more proactive

[13:43] in the future. Uh so, for example, one

[13:45] of the one of the uh provisions of this

[13:47] ordinance would require helmets for any

[13:50] rider who's under 18 regardless of any

[13:52] vehicle that they're on. So if an

[13:54] officer or somebody in at R&P who's out

[13:56] working downtown sees a kid without a

[13:59] helmet, that creates a backing in the

[14:01] code for them to have a conversation to

[14:02] say, "Hey, it is a code requirement that

[14:04] you need to be wearing something if

[14:06] you're clear if they're a minor." The

[14:08] second thing the ordinance would do is

[14:10] clarify that parents are responsible um

[14:13] at the end of the day for the actions of

[14:14] their minor children. So, the ordinance

[14:16] would prohibit a parent from recklessly

[14:19] um in enabling their child to go out um

[14:22] and operate one of these vehicles in a

[14:23] way that endangers somebody. And the

[14:26] third thing is it would create the

[14:28] ability for the police department to

[14:29] impound these vehicles if they're being

[14:31] operated in a reckless manner. And what

[14:33] that would look like potentially is

[14:35] let's say a child maybe is warned or

[14:37] something and they continue to misbehave

[14:40] on the device. The police department

[14:42] could take it and hold that until a

[14:43] parent or guardian came to come pick it

[14:45] up. All of these changes I think are

[14:48] geared really at a at a broader issue

[14:51] which is starting a conversation in the

[14:53] community not just about what our code

[14:55] says but what about our expectations are

[14:58] as a community of each other. So to the

[15:01] extent that yes, there's an enforcement

[15:03] element here, there's an there's a piece

[15:05] of this that might require um police

[15:09] officers or R&P staff to have

[15:11] conversations. That's important. And

[15:12] it's important that we have the backing

[15:14] in the code to do that. But I also think

[15:16] it's important to equip our parents and

[15:18] to equip the schools and even the kids

[15:21] that are out operating these vehicles

[15:23] with something that just demonstrates

[15:25] what our understanding about responsible

[15:27] wrership looks like in this community.

[15:29] Um, and that we're going to we we

[15:31] believe that these things are important

[15:33] and have codified them in the code as a

[15:35] way of saying here's here's a base

[15:37] expectation

[15:38] candidly in a way that we do kind of for

[15:40] drivers as well. You know, we we

[15:42] establish speed limits. We all agree

[15:44] we're going to adhere to those. Um, does

[15:46] everybody all the time? Absolutely not.

[15:48] But the point is we've agreed that in

[15:51] general these are the principles by

[15:52] which we're going to drive our cars.

[15:58] So what's coming next I think is the the

[16:01] ordinance that before you is that is

[16:03] before you this evening later on is sort

[16:05] of the first blush at things that I

[16:07] think we could do relatively quickly. We

[16:10] could get to a second reading then in uh

[16:12] late August get that on the books and

[16:14] then start to do messaging and education

[16:17] from there. I do think there's a bigger

[16:19] conversation here when we zoom

[16:21] [clears throat] out and think about sort

[16:23] of the problem in general, if you will,

[16:25] which is that there's a piece of this

[16:27] that involves how are we defining these

[16:29] vehicles in the first place. Um, is it

[16:32] and and I think some of this really

[16:34] depends on trying to get a sense from

[16:36] the community about what feels

[16:38] intuitive.

[16:39] Uh, because I don't know, I'm speaking

[16:42] only for myself. I don't know that

[16:44] there's much of a difference between a

[16:45] set of rollerblades and a skateboard,

[16:48] you know, or or a scooter necessarily.

[16:50] Um, maybe an e scooter that can go a

[16:53] little bit faster is is something else.

[16:56] But where I'm going with that is

[16:58] depending on how folks intuitit this and

[17:01] think about it. Um, we should try to

[17:03] modulate the code so that it meets

[17:06] people uh where they where they are in

[17:09] terms of how we're thinking about this.

[17:10] In other words, does it make sense to

[17:12] make distinctions for every one of those

[17:14] categories in the code if folks by and

[17:17] large think of all these things as one

[17:19] big bucket of vehicles regardless of the

[17:22] flavor if you will. So how we define

[17:24] micro micromobility devices is one

[17:28] thing. The second thing is to think

[17:30] about where these devices are being

[17:33] operated and to get some feedback, I

[17:35] think, from the public about what the

[17:38] expectation is or ought to be. Um, in

[17:41] other words, if it makes more sense to

[17:44] to permit some kinds of vehicles to go

[17:46] in some places but not others, for

[17:48] example. Um, I don't know that, you

[17:52] know, permitting, just as a parent, I

[17:54] wouldn't want my kid taking an e-cooter

[17:56] on a an unpaved, very narrow nature

[18:00] trail. You know, it makes more sense to

[18:02] keep it on maybe a sidewalk or a shared

[18:04] use path. Um, but there are maybe

[18:06] certain kinds of infrastructure that

[18:08] it's more important to prioritize

[18:10] pedestrians, for example, or something

[18:12] like that. So thinking about that and

[18:14] also trying to balance that against I

[18:16] think the reality that we have a very

[18:18] strong network of different kinds of

[18:21] infrastructure that people are using to

[18:23] commute to shop to go do recreational

[18:26] things. And so we want to weigh these

[18:28] things effectively where we're enabling

[18:31] people to go do that to save car trips

[18:34] um you know to be healthy when they're

[18:36] out and about and and doing their

[18:37] business but also accommodating

[18:39] different kinds of vehicles that may go

[18:41] across that infrastructure. The third

[18:43] thing is what speed, operation limits,

[18:47] or what reckless behavior, if you will,

[18:49] might look like. And to try to gain a

[18:52] sense of that in order to help to help

[18:55] bake that into the code as well, so that

[18:57] we're giving, I think, everybody in the

[19:00] community if a sense of what what

[19:03] recklessness is, what too fast is on a

[19:06] sidewalk versus a shared use path or a

[19:08] road. Um, and really to gather that

[19:11] feedback from as many different kinds of

[19:13] groups as we can. So, we, you know, we

[19:16] have a list of HOAs, for example, that

[19:18] we can do some outreach to. Um, I had

[19:21] the good fortune of meeting, I think

[19:23] it's, um, it might be Bill with the

[19:26] cycle shop that's moving into downtown

[19:28] Hillyard. Um, and had a great

[19:30] conversation with him when I first

[19:31] started a couple months ago about this.

[19:33] So trying to get feedback from those

[19:35] stakeholders is important as well as our

[19:37] boards and commissions. So at last

[19:40] month's ESC meeting had a great

[19:42] conversation with the team there about

[19:44] this very issue and balancing the

[19:46] sustainability elements of this with the

[19:48] safety and and other concerns that

[19:50] people have. Um ARPAC or any of the

[19:52] other groups that we have trying to ga

[19:54] gauge those that feedback and those

[19:56] perceptions I think helps round out the

[19:58] conversation.

[20:00] online feedback is important and I'll

[20:02] come back to this page briefly. Um

[20:05] Andrea graciously built in we'll call it

[20:07] an informal survey. So there are some

[20:09] comment boxes and these are live right

[20:12] now so folks can go out and share some

[20:14] thoughts about these exact questions. Uh

[20:17] what how should we be defining micro

[20:19] mobility devices? Are there any kinds of

[20:21] vehicles we should be excluding? Are

[20:23] there places these vehicles should never

[20:24] go? uh what speed limits or behavior are

[20:28] appropriate based on the kinds of

[20:29] infrastructure. And we can ask these

[20:31] sorts of questions um of course to folks

[20:34] that fill out this form online, but also

[20:36] to all these other groups and

[20:38] potentially even do some sort of an

[20:39] in-house uh we could do an event at the

[20:42] well or a world cafe or something like

[20:44] that where we have an evening where

[20:45] people can come out, give their thoughts

[20:47] and opinions and gather all this

[20:48] feedback together.

[20:50] I think the idea then would be to take

[20:52] some of that and to really analyze it

[20:54] and step back and look at it and see

[20:56] what key themes come out of that. Um,

[20:59] and to then take that feedback and to

[21:01] start to tee up other suggested code

[21:04] changes that the community might want to

[21:06] see.

[21:07] Uh, so that could mean more detailed

[21:09] code updates. maybe an update that

[21:12] actually goes ahead and redefineses

[21:14] microobility across all of our code

[21:16] sections and seeks to unify the traffic

[21:18] pieces with the parks pieces and

[21:20] everything else. The other thing I think

[21:22] we we are intending to look at through

[21:25] this conversational lens is how we

[21:27] operate our own special events. So, I

[21:29] was at uh celebration last week. It was

[21:32] very crowded because we had a Taylor

[21:34] Swift cover band. They did an excellent

[21:36] job. Um, but there were kids there on

[21:39] scooters and a couple of times I didn't

[21:41] see anybody do anything that in my own

[21:43] view I thought was too reckless, but

[21:44] they were kind of zipping in between

[21:46] pedestrians every now and then. And I

[21:49] think that creates questions like should

[21:51] we develop rules that say something like

[21:53] when the city is sponsoring an event at

[21:55] Hillyard Station Park, you have to walk

[21:57] a device through the park just during

[21:59] that event window. Or maybe we require

[22:02] things like a corral. So you have to

[22:04] park the device at a designated area.

[22:07] It's like checking your luggage. You get

[22:08] a tag, you can come pick it up later.

[22:10] Those kinds of things are things we

[22:12] could think about.

[22:13] We also take that feedback then and and

[22:15] design or develop some educational

[22:18] outreach materials that we can use to

[22:20] round out how we're talking about it

[22:21] online, but also to engage the schools

[22:23] and our other partners in the community,

[22:25] other businesses um just to help get the

[22:28] messaging out about uh what the what the

[22:31] evolution of rules might look like uh in

[22:34] terms of where these things can go and

[22:36] how they should be operated.

[22:40] At the end of the day, I think the goal

[22:42] is to get to a place where we've had

[22:44] this conversation across all these

[22:46] different dimensions. And we've looked

[22:49] at that feedback and come up with

[22:50] something that's more well defined in

[22:53] terms of what the community expectation

[22:55] is about what these things are and how

[22:56] they should be used. We can bake those

[22:58] changes into our ordinances, into our

[23:01] codes. Um, and that allows us then to

[23:04] clarify the messaging and the education

[23:06] pieces about what is legal, what is not,

[23:10] what the enforcement expectations are,

[23:12] what we can reasonably accomplish in

[23:13] terms of enforcement.

[23:15] And then I can also take that, we as

[23:18] staff can take that and carry that

[23:20] forward uh, in terms of our

[23:22] conversations with other regions and

[23:23] with the state. Later this week on

[23:26] Thursday, the Dayton region is meeting.

[23:28] a lot of the cities and city managers

[23:29] over there are gathering together to

[23:32] come up with um they're having a

[23:34] basically a series of short meetings to

[23:36] develop a model ordinance if you will

[23:39] for how ebikes, emotos and vehicles like

[23:42] this can be regulated. Um I'm not sure

[23:45] I'll be interested to see where that

[23:46] goes because everybody's codes are so

[23:48] different. I don't know that one

[23:49] ordinance is going to capture all of

[23:51] this in every community. But I think a

[23:53] set of principles about how we talk

[23:55] about it, how we define it, how we

[23:57] communicate it is something that's

[23:58] really relevant. So I intend to take the

[24:01] outcome of this conversation and stay

[24:03] plugged into that one. And then we can

[24:06] carry the common themes of all of that

[24:09] forward over to the state house. So,

[24:11] there is a bill that was introduced um

[24:13] this session, HB948,

[24:16] which as currently drafted would require

[24:19] basically almost a driver's ed or some

[24:21] education that would have to be

[24:23] performed in order to ride some of these

[24:25] vehicles. And it would also task ODOT

[24:28] with creating a task force to look at

[24:30] additional statewide regulations that

[24:32] might make sense. But I think there are

[24:34] other things that we could potentially

[24:36] advocate for or with other regions

[24:39] suggest to the legislature that might be

[24:41] helpful. So a statewide education

[24:44] requirement I think certainly has uh

[24:46] some legs. It would be difficult if we

[24:49] had one set of education standards and

[24:51] Upper Arlington had another and Dublin

[24:53] had a third set and Gehana didn't

[24:55] require any at all. And then as a parent

[24:58] I would be really confused as to what

[25:00] I'm supposed to do. Um, the other thing

[25:02] the state could help with, candidly, is

[25:04] sales and what vehicles are even allowed

[25:06] to be sold in the state of Ohio. Uh,

[25:09] because some are being sold right now

[25:10] that are not defined at all in our in

[25:12] our code or in the state code. Uh and

[25:15] then the third piece of course would be

[25:16] a licensing registration piece

[25:18] potentially where um if especially if if

[25:21] ODOT is looking at how to register these

[25:25] vehicles or require some type of license

[25:27] especially if they can go really fast u

[25:29] that would provide a level of

[25:31] consistency statewide that would be I

[25:34] think more efficient more effective than

[25:35] we could be on our own as well.

[25:38] So to boil all that down, I think that

[25:41] when we look at the forest of vehicles

[25:42] that's out there and how we try to get

[25:44] ahead of this issue, uh what's before

[25:47] you this evening is sort of the first

[25:49] bite at that apple and trying at least

[25:51] to get a a bit more clarity about safety

[25:54] standards, the parental role in some of

[25:56] this, and then our ability to impound

[25:58] these vehicles um if they're really

[26:01] being misused. And then I think what's

[26:04] coming over the coming weeks and months

[26:06] is really a conversation with our

[26:07] community that crosses all those other

[26:09] dimensions and that we will take that

[26:11] feedback in, distill it down and then

[26:14] bring you a set of recommended changes

[26:16] to our codes um and keep that

[26:20] conversation going as far as what that

[26:21] looks like both here across you know the

[26:25] western and central regions of Ohio and

[26:27] then out at the state legislature as

[26:29] well.

[26:30] So, I know I've just talked non-stop for

[26:32] like 25 minutes. [laughter]

[26:34] Um, but I am certainly happy to answer

[26:37] any questions that you have. I think the

[26:39] feedback question for you all from staff

[26:41] this evening would be, um, does that

[26:43] plan make sense in your view? Would you

[26:46] prefer a different kind of an approach?

[26:48] Um, or are there elements of this that

[26:50] you want us to pay particular attention

[26:52] to as the process unfolds?

[27:03] Um, I I like the plan. Um, you know, the

[27:05] the community feedback, just getting

[27:07] folks together to try to um distill

[27:10] everything before we actually apply some

[27:13] additional rules. I I do like that a

[27:15] lot. Um, I do have a couple questions

[27:17] though. Um, in the in the in the slide

[27:20] set here, it said it seems to indicate

[27:23] that

[27:25] it says class one and two may be

[27:29] operated on streets

[27:31] except for the freeway and shared use

[27:33] paths. I'm I'm assuming that also that

[27:36] includes the the scooters, class one and

[27:39] two. Um, are are they allowed on the

[27:43] sidewalks? Um, you know, and it's it's

[27:46] something about ebike ebikes may be

[27:48] operated on sidewalks

[27:51] when

[27:53] uh using pedal power only, right? And

[27:55] that makes sense because that that's

[27:57] part of the problem. you've got folks,

[27:58] you know, zipping down um the main

[28:01] street sidewalks where, you know, I

[28:04] happen to know someone who's a barber in

[28:06] the barber shop there. And he said

[28:07] there's so many times people almost get

[28:08] hit as they're opening the door and kid

[28:11] whether it's one of those motorcycle

[28:13] looking ones or even just a scooter

[28:14] that's zipping along at 20 or more miles

[28:16] per hour, almost hits an elderly

[28:19] gentleman, you know, who just got his

[28:20] haircut,

[28:21] >> right? Um,

[28:23] » right? Um,

[28:23] so the the ebikes are supposed to be

[28:26] pedled if they're on the sidewalk, as I

[28:28] understand it. What about the scooters?

[28:30] I mean, because I I'll tell you what, I

[28:31] I I happen to live on Heather Ridge

[28:33] Drive where there's one of those u the

[28:35] speed monitoring devices that tells you

[28:37] what your speed is. And I just c saw a

[28:39] kid that just is zipping down the middle

[28:42] of the road, you know, actually behind a

[28:45] vehicle. And it uh it u it said that he

[28:49] was going 25 miles an hour. Um so what

[28:54] what do they do? I I don't know if you

[28:55] can just push those along like a regular

[28:57] scooter or

[29:00] >> Yeah, I think some of them you don't

[29:02] » Yeah, I think some of them you don't

[29:02] have to power them at all with your

[29:03] feet. You can either twist the handle or

[29:05] there's a button that'll just make I

[29:07] mean it'll it'll shut off.

[29:09] >> Um but

[29:10] » Um but

[29:10] >> if they're on the sidewalk, is that too

[29:12] » if they're on the sidewalk, is that too

[29:12] fast for a sidewalk? because you've got

[29:13] little kids, you know, I happen to have

[29:15] grandkids who ride their bikes on the

[29:17] sidewalk, five years old, and and there

[29:19] have been many, many occasions where

[29:20] these kids have just zipped right around

[29:22] them and

[29:23] >> uh kind of scared of them.

[29:25] » uh kind of scared of them.

[29:25] >> Yeah, I think that's I think your

[29:26] » Yeah, I think that's I think your

[29:26] point's well taken. And those things are

[29:28] heavy, too. Um and so you we've got a

[29:31] situation where people can take vehicles

[29:33] that have some weight to them and and

[29:35] especially on a sidewalk, which is

[29:37] narrower. Um there's less room less room

[29:40] to maneuver, right? Um, one of the

[29:43] things I think though too as well to

[29:44] build on that point is that, you know,

[29:46] even if I'm riding a pedal powered bike

[29:48] that has no motor on it, if I'm if I'm

[29:51] careening down a sidewalk at 20 25 miles

[29:54] an hour, I can do a lot of damage, too.

[29:57] you know, it's in in terms of the some

[30:00] of this I think boils down also to how

[30:03] fast to your point and where um because

[30:06] if folks are writing them in a way that

[30:08] is reckless um or too quick based on the

[30:12] design of either the sidewalk or the

[30:14] path, that's really where these

[30:16] opportunities to have really bad

[30:18] accidents kind of come into play. I

[30:20] would say the difference though between

[30:21] the the pedal powered regular just

[30:23] regular bike and these bikes is that

[30:27] >> it requires some effort

[30:29] » it requires some effort

[30:29] >> Yeah.

[30:29] » Yeah.

[30:29] >> to go 20 miles an hour on a bike.

[30:31] » to go 20 miles an hour on a bike.

[30:31] >> That's fair.

[30:31] » That's fair.

[30:31] >> But these, you know, I my wife and I

[30:34] » But these, you know, I my wife and I

[30:34] were were actually riding down the

[30:36] sidewalk, you know, just pedaling along,

[30:38] probably doing about six or eight miles

[30:40] an hour. And this a young young kid

[30:43] about 12 years old said asked if he

[30:46] could pass. He was on a one of these

[30:47] scooters. He passed us and I'm telling

[30:50] you within 10 seconds he was 100 yards

[30:53] ahead of us

[30:54] >> just I mean he was he was polite and

[30:56] » just I mean he was he was polite and

[30:56] everything like that but they they can

[30:57] go really fast and it requires really no

[31:00] effort

[31:01] >> to do that

[31:02] » to do that

[31:02] >> right

[31:04] » right

[31:04] >> no that's a fair point and I think that

[31:06] » no that's a fair point and I think that

[31:06] that is something that we I would look

[31:08] at least to get some feedback on part of

[31:10] the enforcement challenge becomes as the

[31:13] as the motors get smaller

[31:15] >> and they get you know kind of woven into

[31:17] » and they get you know kind of woven into

[31:17] the chassis of the device, it becomes

[31:19] more and more and more difficult for

[31:21] somebody, for an officer, whoever else

[31:23] to even know whether it's whether it's

[31:26] motorized at a glance. Um, and so that's

[31:29] where I think it's the multi-dimension

[31:31] part of this comes into play. There's a

[31:33] piece of this that probably does

[31:36] probably does rely on is it motorized or

[31:38] is it not? Um, there's also a piece of

[31:40] it that's just in terms of educating

[31:42] kids about how much damage they can do

[31:44] if they are going too fast. Um, that

[31:46] speaks to this too. So

[31:48] >> yeah, it it is a conundrum. There there

[31:49] » yeah, it it is a conundrum. There there

[31:49] are a lot of strange moving parts to

[31:52] this one. It's going to be difficult for

[31:53] us to to to tackle and but I appreciate

[31:56] your work and the work of all all the

[31:58] staff uh for taking it on.

[32:01] >> Thanks. [clears throat]

[32:04] » Thanks. [clears throat]

[32:04] >> Um yeah, I have a couple comments. I um

[32:07] » Um yeah, I have a couple comments. I um

[32:07] I've had people talk to me about kids on

[32:11] the bikes and the speeds that they go

[32:12] and um the people that have talked to me

[32:15] were not concerned about themselves.

[32:17] They were only ever concerned about the

[32:19] kids, which I find um helpful and

[32:21] interesting in this whole thing that's

[32:23] so confusing. Um but I also wanted to

[32:26] make sure that we we think about

[32:28] pedestrians in all of this, you know,

[32:30] and and how quickly can they possibly

[32:32] get out of the way. Um, and so while

[32:36] you're looking for more input, I've I've

[32:37] written some notes about other places

[32:39] and other people's that that we should

[32:41] include and when we're doing having

[32:43] these discussions.

[32:44] >> Excellent.

[32:45] » Excellent.

[32:45] >> Thank you.

[32:45] » Thank you.

[32:45] >> Thank you.

[32:49] » Um, so first of all, thank you very much

[32:50] for all the work that you all have put

[32:52] into this so far. Um, one of the things

[32:54] I'm really curious about is have we

[32:56] engaged with Hillyard City Schools to

[32:58] talk about how it's impacting them in

[33:02] their property? like when kids are

[33:04] riding to to school or from school,

[33:06] things like that. I mean, have we

[33:08] engaged with them yet? I mean, I heard

[33:09] you kind of say we're going to do an

[33:11] educational outreach, but I feel like

[33:13] they are a huge partner that we need to

[33:15] start with at the at the very um

[33:17] beginning of the conversation because

[33:20] that those students are going to ride

[33:22] those scooters or those ebikes on our

[33:24] sidewalks, our roads, and then they're

[33:25] going to end up at the school and then

[33:26] leave. And so, I think it would be

[33:30] really important that we engage them

[33:31] now. So, I don't know how have we done

[33:33] that yet.

[33:34] >> So, we had at the last meeting of the

[33:36] » So, we had at the last meeting of the

[33:36] township schools and city um Dave

[33:39] Stewart was there and I did ask him if

[33:41] they had any data or metrics about how

[33:42] many kids were writing these to school

[33:44] or just the general patterns that they

[33:46] had seen and my recollection is he did

[33:48] not have much that was readily

[33:50] available. He said they had much better

[33:51] statistics about pedestrians and actual

[33:54] walkers, but that that was a

[33:56] conversation that we should absolutely

[33:58] have. And so, um, to your point, I I

[34:01] intend to keep that going and to keep

[34:03] them pretty close as this continues to

[34:05] unfold.

[34:06] >> Well, and I I also would wonder if they

[34:08] » Well, and I I also would wonder if they

[34:08] haven't

[34:09] >> maybe got gotten enough of a sense yet

[34:11] » maybe got gotten enough of a sense yet

[34:11] because the number of scooters and

[34:13] things that I've seen this summer

[34:15] compared to previous summers, it has

[34:16] just exploded.

[34:18] >> So, it may just be like they're just a

[34:20] » So, it may just be like they're just a

[34:20] little bit behind. So, I think it's

[34:22] really important that we keep them in

[34:24] the loop there. Um when we're talking

[34:28] about the helmet piece,

[34:30] >> um why would we want to become more

[34:33] » um why would we want to become more

[34:33] restrictive than what like is currently

[34:37] being required?

[34:39] Like why I mean I get safety. I get that

[34:42] we want to do that, but is that going to

[34:44] be as enforcable? Is it going to

[34:47] potentially create an equity issue like

[34:50] for some parents if they have they may

[34:52] not be able to get the helmet for their

[34:55] kids or the or if we're going to hold

[34:56] parents liable. Kid left the house with

[34:59] a helmet but they were caught downtown

[35:02] without a helmet and now we're going to

[35:03] hold a parent liable for this. So I I'm

[35:06] I'm a little concerned about making a

[35:09] broad sweep of saying now everyone needs

[35:11] to have a helmet if they're under the

[35:12] age of 16.

[35:15] I think that's a fair point. I think two

[35:17] two responses to that. One would be in

[35:20] terms of the equity piece. U one of the

[35:22] things that we've talked about is trying

[35:23] to engage other partners to look at

[35:26] something like a bike rodeo or a helmet

[35:28] giveaway or some other ways that we can

[35:30] connect folks who might not have access

[35:32] to that resource to be able to to get

[35:34] them one. Um and so that's certainly

[35:37] something that we will keep plumbing.

[35:39] Um, as far as the uh the requirement

[35:42] itself, I think that um at least

[35:46] speaking for myself, and I don't know,

[35:47] Chief, you're welcome to weigh in on

[35:48] this if you'd like, but um when we're

[35:51] thinking about an officer's ability to

[35:53] sort of approach or to engage that the

[35:56] helmet is an immediately visible thing

[35:58] that you either know that they're

[35:59] wearing one or they're not. And so if

[36:01] the behavior is maybe a little bit uh is

[36:04] it reckless or no, do I have the backing

[36:06] in the code to to start a conversation,

[36:09] if they're not wearing a helmet and

[36:11] that's a clear requirement in the code,

[36:13] it just creates some backing for anybody

[36:15] that wants to enforce or to engage that

[36:17] child. Um it doesn't mean they're going

[36:19] to get a citation. It doesn't mean we're

[36:20] going to go after the parents

[36:21] necessarily. It just means that that's

[36:24] an expectation that's been codified and

[36:25] then that way you start a conversation

[36:27] from there. Um but you know to your

[36:30] point um every place does it a little

[36:32] bit differently. So I know our draft

[36:34] ordinance I think we we went with age 18

[36:37] just because that's you know the age of

[36:39] majority basically. Some of our

[36:41] neighbors I think are age 16. Um and I

[36:43] don't want to put words in Thaad's mouth

[36:46] but I believe that if council wanted to

[36:48] change if council wanted to change the

[36:51] age would that require another first

[36:53] reading or we could they could basically

[36:55] move to uh to adjust that now. correct

[36:57] >> that could be amended now without having

[36:59] » that could be amended now without having

[36:59] to do a new legislative process.

[37:04] >> Could I chime in on that?

[37:07] » Could I chime in on that?

[37:07] May maybe not required necessarily for

[37:09] just regular bicycles, but for the

[37:10] ebikes that can go 25 miles an hour in

[37:13] the scooters because I mean I think

[37:16] there's there's quite a difference on,

[37:18] you know, a kid riding around on a bike

[37:19] probably going 6, eight, maybe 10 miles

[37:22] an hour on a bike, whereas these

[37:24] scooters, like I said, I've seen them

[37:26] going 25 miles an hour,

[37:28] >> right? uh where if you know you wreck

[37:31] » right? uh where if you know you wreck

[37:31] you wreck on well you're going 25 miles

[37:33] an hour and it's going to mess mess you

[37:36] up.

[37:38] >> I'm not sure if that answered your

[37:39] » I'm not sure if that answered your

[37:39] question though, but the a Campbell Soup

[37:42] version would be it becomes another way

[37:43] to engage. You know,

[37:45] >> I appreciate that it is a very visible

[37:47] » I appreciate that it is a very visible

[37:47] piece. I see Chief who's nodding his

[37:48] head back there. So, I appreciate that.

[37:50] Um, I guess the way the language is

[37:52] written makes me worried that then we're

[37:54] going to have parents receiving

[37:57] misdemeanors for their stu for their

[37:59] children not wearing the helmet. And I I

[38:02] I do want to hold our parents

[38:04] responsible. As parents, we should be

[38:06] responsible for our children. But I just

[38:08] also I know kids are kids and they they

[38:11] you know sneak out of the house when the

[38:13] mom and dad says always wear it, but

[38:15] then they go and mom and dad aren't

[38:16] aware that they weren't wearing it and

[38:18] then they're they're finding themselves

[38:19] with a misdemeanor. It feels

[38:38] » good evening. Um, one of the things that

[38:39] we do now and and we always stress is is

[38:42] we issue warnings. We do a written

[38:44] warning and we record that information.

[38:46] um a lot of lower level misdemeanors,

[38:49] things that are are not violent, but uh

[38:51] something that we feel that a warning

[38:53] will handle. Um that's the route we

[38:55] normally take to begin uh an enforcement

[38:58] action with. I I would perceive that

[39:01] that's the type of um of action we would

[39:04] take for something like this as well. Um

[39:06] if we catch someone without a helmet on,

[39:08] we may stop, we may engage, we may

[39:10] educate, we may issue a written warning,

[39:12] and all that says is, "Hey, you violated

[39:15] this

[39:16] don't do that again. Uh we have that

[39:18] information. If we happen to uh

[39:20] re-engage with that kid some point in

[39:21] the future, we have that information. We

[39:24] may issue a citation at that second

[39:26] point or, you know, we may try and, you

[39:29] know, a little stronger um messaging uh

[39:32] to them. But yeah, I I I don't see us

[39:35] see a kid without a helmet, they're

[39:36] going to get a ticket.

[39:38] >> How would you ensure that the parent was

[39:41] » How would you ensure that the parent was

[39:41] aware that they received a written

[39:42] warning? Um

[39:44] >> because I know my kids wouldn't have

[39:45] » because I know my kids wouldn't have

[39:45] told me.

[39:48] >> Yeah. I mean, yeah, I mean that that is

[39:51] » Yeah. I mean, yeah, I mean that that is

[39:51] tough. Um I I would say the other thing

[39:53] that we have still is we have our

[39:55] diversion program with with uh

[39:57] juveniles. Um so that doesn't mean they

[40:00] may get a ticket, but we may hold on to

[40:02] it if they can complete a safety program

[40:03] or something that there's a way to that.

[40:05] That that way a parent is being

[40:07] notified. But um that would be

[40:08] secondary. I would start off with the

[40:10] written warning first.

[40:11] >> Okay. And if I may, with regard to the

[40:14] » Okay. And if I may, with regard to the

[40:14] par parental responsibility, one thing

[40:16] that's in that uh proposed section is a

[40:20] standard of of recklessness on the part

[40:22] of the parent. So it's not a strict

[40:24] liability offense. Um, when one of the

[40:27] officers, if an officer were to write a

[40:31] citation under this code, there would

[40:32] have to be some additional

[40:35] attendant circumstance that they would

[40:37] articulate to say why they believe the

[40:39] parent was reckless in this case with

[40:42] allowing their child to violate a a

[40:45] provision of this ordinance. So I think

[40:48] that even in a you know a ticket happy

[40:52] scenario, you wouldn't have parents just

[40:55] getting citations left and right. It

[40:57] would have to be a

[41:00] a relatively

[41:01] bad circumstance showing some knowing

[41:06] indifference or indifference to a to a

[41:09] known threat uh that the child would be

[41:12] out violating the ordinance.

[41:16] Not to belabor the point to but I also

[41:18] think on some level the the proposed

[41:20] ordinance is really intended to put

[41:23] tools into the toolbox and but as a

[41:26] practical matter we don't have enough

[41:28] officers out you know out and about on

[41:31] patrol to to go site every parent whose

[41:35] kids not wearing a helmet. You know it's

[41:37] it's more about creating those

[41:38] mechanisms for an officer to have a

[41:40] conversation if one needs to be had. Um

[41:44] and and sure if there's um I mean I mean

[41:48] I suppose that if uh a a an individual

[41:52] or a child was being reckless and they

[41:53] were warned and they kept doing it and

[41:55] kept doing it and of course then we

[41:57] would have other tools empoundment for

[41:59] example to then have a parent come by

[42:02] and grab the vehicle so we can talk to

[42:03] the parent directly. Um it's more about

[42:06] creating that that system so that we can

[42:10] have a conversation at a series of

[42:11] levels. um rather than just passing out

[42:15] citations necessarily.

[42:22] » Thank you. Thanks for all the work you

[42:23] guys are doing. I know this is um a new

[42:25] thing for all of Hillyard and all of the

[42:26] city. Um just a couple things that I

[42:29] just crossed my mind and when especially

[42:31] when Kathy was saying about um the

[42:33] schools. Um, I know we have this uh

[42:36] safety town program which is teaching uh

[42:39] kids about uh safety around uh you know

[42:41] on on their bikes and and around town.

[42:44] Um I I could see something like this

[42:46] needed with the ebikes and having a

[42:49] program if you plan on riding your bike

[42:51] your ebike to school and of course we

[42:54] have to have a place to store them. So,

[42:56] we kind of have to know um in

[42:58] conjunction with the schools how this is

[43:00] going to um be um how if you know how

[43:04] prevalent this is going to be this

[43:06] school year. So, I think that if if I

[43:08] don't know if it's too late now to have

[43:10] a program like Safety Town, but hey, if

[43:13] you plan on riding your ebike to school

[43:16] this school year, uh we'd like to have

[43:19] like a session with you and to go over

[43:22] some rules and regulations and where you

[43:24] can ride it. I think if we tell people

[43:26] where they can ride it as opposed to

[43:27] where you cannot ride it, I think that's

[43:29] a little bit more positive way. And then

[43:31] so they can say, "Okay, I know I can go

[43:32] here and this is where I can ride it."

[43:34] Um, and the kids would know this is how

[43:36] they can get to school, maybe a path.

[43:38] And if they can't think of a a path that

[43:40] is, you know, permissible to ride their

[43:42] bike, then I think we have to address

[43:44] that, too. And having our our trails to

[43:47] trails really connected is important,

[43:48] especially if these ebikes are going to

[43:50] continue. Um, so I I mean those are just

[43:53] some options I thought that we can um

[43:56] propose to uh the kids that are that own

[43:59] these. Yeah,

[44:01] >> that's great feedback. That's exactly

[44:02] » that's great feedback. That's exactly

[44:02] what I would intend to talk to Mr.

[44:04] Stewart about

[44:05] >> the school district is how do we start

[44:07] » the school district is how do we start

[44:07] to weave those conversations together?

[44:09] >> Yeah. And I don't know if it's too late

[44:11] » Yeah. And I don't know if it's too late

[44:11] to have a program like that for these

[44:12] kids or in the summer. I don't know.

[44:14] >> Yeah. I'd have to ask him. And I on some

[44:16] » Yeah. I'd have to ask him. And I on some

[44:16] level though I think that your point's

[44:18] well taken. anything that we can do um

[44:20] particularly if council were to advance

[44:22] the ordinance this evening about helmets

[44:24] like that would be a pretty easy thing

[44:25] to begin messaging um any other more

[44:28] detailed stuff um may we we may message

[44:31] later in the year but we would at least

[44:33] have that conversation going and have a

[44:35] pipeline to get the message out.

[44:36] >> Yeah. Thanks.

[44:41] » Thank you again. Um, I had a question

[44:45] about, [clears throat]

[44:46] um, when you started the the

[44:48] presentation, we were reading off of the

[44:51] website, which was talking about class

[44:53] one and class 2's having a maximum speed

[44:55] of 20. Um, but I did a little checking

[44:58] today and um, apparently they go up to

[45:01] 28 miles per hour, the class ones and

[45:04] class 2s and some of them actually

[45:08] are allegedly able to go faster is what

[45:11] I saw online. Um, now I spoke with our

[45:14] local bike shop. He said bike shops are

[45:17] only allowed to sell one and two. Um,

[45:21] but you know people can easily buy

[45:23] online. So, I'm sure we're getting a

[45:25] wide variety of um speeds on those

[45:29] bikes.

[45:31] >> Yes, council member. So, the the

[45:33] » Yes, council member. So, the the

[45:33] definitions for those devices where the

[45:35] 20 for class one and class 2 and the 28

[45:37] for class 3 that was set by state law um

[45:40] that basically every city in the state

[45:42] has copied. The state law also requires

[45:45] a sticker on those devices. So, if it's

[45:47] a true class one or class 2 device,

[45:50] it'll have a sticker on it. and those

[45:51] are maxed out at 20. The class three is

[45:54] what's maxed out at 28 and has a little

[45:57] higher safety precautions under state

[45:58] law and Hillyard law right now. But I

[46:02] have also been reliably told from the

[46:04] law enforcement community that people

[46:06] can mess with the governor on the

[46:08] devices to make them go faster, but

[46:10] that's not a legal way to operate those

[46:12] devices.

[46:13] >> Council, this Joe Bachelor, he's

[46:15] » Council, this Joe Bachelor, he's

[46:15] >> Oh, I'm sorry.

[46:17] » Oh, I'm sorry.

[46:17] >> He's an attorney.

[46:18] » He's an attorney.

[46:18] >> This this is my colleague Joe Bachelor.

[46:20] » This this is my colleague Joe Bachelor.

[46:20] Um he has become our resident expert at

[46:24] FBT Gibbons on um micromobility devices

[46:28] of all kinds to either his delight or

[46:31] chagrin depending upon uh the moment we

[46:34] catch him.

[46:35] >> Awesome.

[46:36] » Awesome.

[46:36] >> Joe's been Joe, you were instrumental in

[46:38] » Joe's been Joe, you were instrumental in

[46:38] helping to pull together some of the

[46:39] Matrix information that we showed this

[46:41] evening. So yeah,

[46:43] >> it's a fun time.

[46:46] » it's a fun time.

[46:46] >> Okay. So, so if I go to a local bike

[46:48] » Okay. So, so if I go to a local bike

[46:48] shop, I and

[46:53] Thank you.

[46:55] Um, I would

[46:58] find that these bikes only have a

[47:01] maximum posted speed of 20. Correct.

[47:04] >> Yes. If the store is selling it how

[47:06] » Yes. If the store is selling it how

[47:06] they're supposed to under state law.

[47:08] Yes.

[47:09] >> Okay.

[47:09] » Okay.

[47:09] >> And the difference between the one and

[47:11] » And the difference between the one and

[47:11] two is the two helps you get to 20

[47:14] regardless of whether you're pedaling or

[47:15] not. the class one you have to pedal to

[47:17] get the assist to get up to 20.

[47:20] >> Okay.

[47:21] » Okay.

[47:21] For specific questions on the

[47:23] legislation, do you want to wait until

[47:25] the actual meeting to do those?

[47:28] >> I don't have a strong preference. We

[47:29] » I don't have a strong preference. We

[47:30] have a little bit of time now. I think

[47:31] we can go ahead and if you've got them.

[47:33] >> I I do.

[47:33] » I I do.

[47:33] >> Yeah, that'd be great.

[47:35] » Yeah, that'd be great.

[47:35] >> Okay. Um

[47:39] um

[47:41] uh

[47:43] under 373.04

[47:46] in the legislation, it's talking about

[47:48] turning a certain direction. I'm sorry I

[47:52] don't have that up the um letter B, but

[47:58] when I was reading it,

[48:01] I was thinking which direction are you

[48:03] talking about? Are you talking about

[48:04] turning, making a right turn? Are you

[48:06] talking about making a left turn? And

[48:08] that was again 373.04B

[48:21] is in boy.

[48:25] This is where um

[48:29] you can move moving from the right side

[48:31] of the roadway if a dedicated turn lane

[48:33] is present. Was that the section you're

[48:35] referencing?

[48:36] >> Yes, that letter B. Uhhuh.

[48:39] » Yes, that letter B. Uhhuh.

[48:40] >> Um.

[48:43] » Okay.

[48:43] >> Is that currently how a bicycle can

[48:45] » Is that currently how a bicycle can

[48:45] operate

[48:46] >> right

[48:47] » right

[48:47] >> now? I mean, I ride bikes and if you are

[48:48] » now? I mean, I ride bikes and if you are

[48:48] riding along the right side of the road,

[48:50] if there's a lefthand turn lane, you can

[48:52] move into that turn lane, you have that

[48:53] right to do that. That That's exactly

[48:55] right. And that black text is current

[48:59] law under our ordinances.

[49:01] >> Right. Right. No, I realize that I've

[49:02] » Right. Right. No, I realize that I've

[49:02] never read our text. Understand.

[49:05] >> This is my first time. Um.

[49:07] » This is my first time. Um.

[49:07] >> Yes. And when I was re reading it, I was

[49:09] » Yes. And when I was re reading it, I was

[49:09] picturing a left turn lane, but I wonder

[49:12] if we can clarify that in in here so

[49:15] that we all understand what we're

[49:17] talking about versus

[49:19] a right turn or

[49:23] >> Mhm. Yeah. Yeah, I think that's

[49:24] » Mhm. Yeah. Yeah, I think that's

[49:24] absolutely something that we can look

[49:25] at. I mean, part of this conversation, I

[49:27] think, is about, especially when it

[49:29] comes to how vehicles are being operated

[49:30] in the roadway, which is like what this

[49:32] section is dealing with, making sure we

[49:34] have a clear understanding of that in

[49:36] general. So, I'm happy to add that to

[49:38] the list.

[49:39] >> Letter C, right below that, um it talks

[49:42] » Letter C, right below that, um it talks

[49:42] about um

[49:45] to writing more than to a breast. Um,

[49:50] and I know it's been my experience out

[49:52] on the paths that if you ride more than

[49:56] two a breast, um, you're taking up the

[49:59] whole path and

[50:02] we're not allowing for people coming in

[50:04] the opposite direction.

[50:08] So I think the exception there would be

[50:11] you're only allowed well according to

[50:13] this code off the cuff um you're not

[50:17] supposed to ride more than two a breast

[50:19] unless you are on a path that is

[50:21] specifically dedicated to

[50:24] uh set aside for the exclusive use of

[50:26] bicycles or ebikes or motorcycles. I'm

[50:29] not aware that we have any

[50:31] infrastructure like that that is

[50:32] exclusively for bicycles. a lot of our

[50:34] our shared use paths accommodate

[50:36] pedestrians

[50:38] >> um and other users as well. So I think

[50:40] » um and other users as well. So I think

[50:40] in general the prohibition against two a

[50:42] breast would apply everywhere.

[50:48] » Okay. So it's not like we're saying sure

[50:51] you can do three or four a breast or

[50:53] >> correct because we don't have any like

[50:55] » correct because we don't have any like

[50:55] specifically dedicated bicycle paths.

[50:58] All of the paths are shared use paths

[51:00] for bicycles um and pedestrians.

[51:02] >> Okay. All right.

[51:07] » It's only Well, that's the other thing,

[51:08] too, is this uh this section title

[51:10] governs um primarily the roadways

[51:12] >> on roadway. Okay. So, not a shared use

[51:14] » on roadway. Okay. So, not a shared use

[51:14] path. Got it.

[51:15] >> All right. That makes sense. Um

[51:20] then I I don't know. I thought I kept

[51:23] reading letter F and I wasn't quite sure

[51:26] what that was saying. If you could

[51:28] clarify, someone could clarify that.

[51:35] Is that just saying you have to yield to

[51:37] the bicycle?

[51:39] >> They're there.

[51:40] » They're there.

[51:40] >> So it is

[51:42] » So it is

[51:42] So if you're turning,

[51:45] yes, you have to yield to the bicycle.

[51:48] Um

[51:50] obviously so you don't cut off and hit

[51:53] the bicycle or t-bone the bicycle.

[51:56] the the last the very last um phrase

[51:59] provided that the person is not passing

[52:02] stopped vehicles on the right side and

[52:05] is not visible to turning traffic.

[52:07] >> I believe that that is trying to make an

[52:09] » I believe that that is trying to make an

[52:09] accommodation for

[52:12] if the if the bicycle rider is riding in

[52:14] such a way that they're not making

[52:16] themselves visible. So, if you have

[52:18] parallel parking on a street and if

[52:19] there's room where the um or if you have

[52:23] a

[52:25] stopped traffic on a street and the

[52:27] bicycle is on the right side and is not

[52:29] visible, then this law is not going to

[52:31] hold the turning vehicle

[52:34] responsible for not yielding to that

[52:38] bicycle rider who has put themselves in

[52:41] a position not to be seen.

[52:43] >> I see. Okay. All right. That makes

[52:45] » I see. Okay. All right. That makes

[52:45] sense.

[52:47] Um, do do we require any kind of hand

[52:50] signaling like if you're riding on the

[52:52] roadway from

[52:55] from bicyclists?

[52:58] >> I believe in general it is a best

[53:01] » I believe in general it is a best

[53:01] practice.

[53:04] » Yeah, I don't I don't know that there is

[53:06] a specific requirement in the code. I

[53:08] would need to look. But um as somebody

[53:10] that just registered for Pelatonia, I

[53:12] can tell you they're very upfront about

[53:14] observing the rules of the road and

[53:16] general courtesy and etiquette. Um so

[53:18] there's a lot of conversation out there

[53:19] about best practices, but I would need

[53:21] to look [snorts] in our code

[53:23] specifically.

[53:25] >> Okay.

[53:26] » Okay.

[53:26] Um,

[53:29] so

[53:31] if I'm writing on a shared use path and

[53:34] I I was looking at letter H on this one,

[53:37] um, I don't have to wear a helmet then

[53:39] if I'm on a shared use path.

[53:41] >> No, the uh the the section here H is

[53:44] » No, the uh the the section here H is

[53:44] would basically require anybody that's

[53:47] on a roadway operate operating a bike,

[53:49] ebike, or any one of the devices that

[53:51] we've talked about to be wearing a

[53:53] helmet if they are under age 18. There's

[53:55] a similar code change, I believe it's in

[53:57] the next section that governs um similar

[54:00] rules on shared use path. There's a

[54:02] almost a copy paste of that blue section

[54:05] H that would also require helmets for

[54:07] any riders of these vehicles uh if they

[54:10] are under age 18 on other

[54:11] infrastructure.

[54:13] >> Okay, great. Um

[54:17] » Okay, great. Um

[54:17] under the section 373.10 10 electric

[54:21] bicycles. A2 said highway

[54:26] and I was wondering

[54:29] should we have it say roadway versus

[54:31] highway? I don't know. I think of a

[54:33] highway as like a freeway or a higher

[54:36] speed road. Um 37310 A2.

[54:42] >> Kelly will answer this one.

[54:43] » Kelly will answer this one.

[54:43] >> Okay. Good evening, council members. So

[54:45] » Okay. Good evening, council members. So

[54:45] that language is consistent with exactly

[54:47] what OC describes it. And so at this

[54:51] point we're just going with what the

[54:52] description of OC. But what was

[54:54] discussed this evening is we believe

[54:56] that there will be changes given the

[54:58] feedback that we get over the next few

[55:00] months that this section regarding the

[55:02] operation of class one, class 2, class 3

[55:04] on roadway on electric bic or on shared

[55:07] use pass will be um will be changed.

[55:11] Currently class one, class 2 and class 3

[55:14] the way our code is currently written

[55:16] are allowed on shared use paths on

[55:19] roadways everywhere. We are getting back

[55:21] to where Ohio revised code is that pulls

[55:24] class 3 bikes a little bit away from

[55:26] that. So that's why the use the word

[55:30] highway was used because it matches OC

[55:33] and so we're starting at that baseline

[55:35] and then we will further evaluate it

[55:38] moving forward.

[55:39] >> Okay. Thank you.

[55:43] That's it.

[55:47] » Okay. Oh, yeah. Go ahead.

[55:49] >> Um, thank you for putting all those new

[55:52] » Um, thank you for putting all those new

[55:52] signage up. That's that's makes it very

[55:55] clear. Um, you know, who's not allowed

[55:58] to be riding around uh in Hillyard

[56:00] Station Park. But my my I'm wondering,

[56:02] are we going to put that same signage in

[56:04] some of our other parks?

[56:07] >> I think that's a conversation that we

[56:08] » I think that's a conversation that we

[56:08] can certainly have. happy to evaluate

[56:10] that and look at it. I it um the con the

[56:13] convenient thing about HSP is that it's

[56:15] very contiguous. Um I would just want to

[56:18] be really deliberate about how I'm I'm

[56:20] thinking of a much larger park like

[56:22] municipal park for example with where

[56:23] you have a lot more trails running

[56:25] through there. Um trying to kind of

[56:27] regulate and then sign where we do and

[56:30] don't want other vehicles could be a

[56:32] much bigger endeavor. Um but I think

[56:34] your point's well taken. It's something

[56:36] to

[56:36] >> my my example is um just at Heather

[56:39] » my my example is um just at Heather

[56:39] Ridge Park,

[56:40] >> my neighborhood.

[56:41] » my neighborhood.

[56:41] >> Um I was down there with my my grandson.

[56:44] » Um I was down there with my my grandson.

[56:44] There a bunch of other little kids there

[56:45] playing on the equipment. Yet there were

[56:47] these kids who came in with with uh you

[56:50] know they were probably 8 n 10 years

[56:52] old. They were on electric scooters in

[56:55] amongst the playground equipment riding

[56:57] around it around and round and I kept

[56:59] having to tell my grandson, "Don't get

[57:01] on the slide right now because there's a

[57:02] kid zooming around right there." I'm

[57:04] just talking about like a sign posted

[57:06] right right in front of the the

[57:08] playground equipment at our parks to to

[57:11] keep them out of there.

[57:12] >> Yep.

[57:13] » Yep.

[57:13] >> You know, just to keep the little ones

[57:14] » You know, just to keep the little ones

[57:14] safe.

[57:14] >> Yep. We can look at that, too. And that

[57:16] » Yep. We can look at that, too. And that

[57:16] actually brings up one other final point

[57:17] just with respect to infrastructure,

[57:19] too. We have had um some feedback about

[57:23] maybe looking at something like a bike

[57:24] park or a skate park or some other sort

[57:26] of destination that kids may want to go

[57:28] to. Um, I think that's also a

[57:31] conversation to be had in the sense that

[57:33] um, it, you know, a bike park is is

[57:36] probably more of like a BMX, not

[57:38] necessarily a motorized kind of

[57:40] endeavor, but to the extent that kids

[57:42] are looking for places to do little

[57:44] jumps and do other things, whether

[57:46] they're on a scooter or a skateboard or

[57:47] whatever, um, I think that's also part

[57:49] of the conversation, too, about maybe

[57:51] creating a destination point or a focal

[57:53] point for them to direct some of that

[57:55] energy.

[57:57] So,

[57:58] >> all right. Well, thank you so much. Um,

[58:01] » all right. Well, thank you so much. Um,

[58:01] I I do think this is the right approach.

[58:03] I like that it's collaborative, that

[58:04] we're working iteratively as a council,

[58:06] as a community um as we further define

[58:09] what safety means for all of us. So,

[58:12] yeah, looking forward to next steps and

[58:13] thank you all so much for all your work

[58:15] as a team. Um, items for discussion.

[58:18] Does council have any other items to

[58:19] discuss this evening during this

[58:21] committee of the whole? Seeing none, u

[58:24] Mr. Roush, do you have any additional

[58:26] city manager updates for this committee

[58:27] of the whole?

[58:28] >> I've probably talked enough, but I

[58:31] » I've probably talked enough, but I

[58:31] appreciate your time and it's good

[58:32] feedback for all of us. So, thank you.

[58:34] >> All right. I would entertain a motion

[58:36] » All right. I would entertain a motion

[58:36] and a second to adjurnn this meeting.

[58:38] >> So, move.

[58:39] » So, move.

[58:39] >> Second.

[58:39] » Second.

[58:40] >> All in favor say I.

[58:41] » All in favor say I.

[58:41] >> I.

[58:42] » I.

[58:42] >> Oppose. Same sign. This meeting is

[58:44] » Oppose. Same sign. This meeting is

[58:44] adjourned. We'll begin a regular meeting

[58:46] around 6 p.m.

Committee of the Whole - Jul 13 2026

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